True Anon Truth Feed - Episode 251: Freaky Tales to Tell for a Fright
Aired: 2022-10-26
Duration: 01:27:53


=== Sharing Middle School Secrets (02:52) ===

[00:00:00]  So, when I was 17, I was friends with/slash sort of had a crush on this girl named Gloria.
[00:00:06]  Wait, real quick.
[00:00:07]  Yeah.
[00:00:08]  Just FYI to our listeners because I just want to set them up.
[00:00:12]  This is not a similar story to like what we just did with the Synonym series.
[00:00:16]  No, It almost sounded like you're like, hey, I want to tell you a story.
[00:00:20]  Very different.
[00:00:21]  No, no, no.
[00:00:22]  I'm telling Liz this story.
[00:00:24]  Yeah, she's not heard this story.
[00:00:26]  You guys are just eavesdropping, which, to be fair, is actually pretty rude.
[00:00:30]  But Liz is very scared of scary things.
[00:00:33]  Yeah, I don't like them.
[00:00:34]  And so I have not told you the story until today.
[00:00:37]  But I was friends with this girl named Gloria and kind of had a crush on her.
[00:00:42]  You know, I don't know if you guys did this, but like when you were like young, this is more like a middle school thing for me, but I also kind of happened with this girl, is we'd like talk on the phone a lot, but then at school did not really interact a whole lot.
[00:00:54]  I feel like that was like a kind of common thing.
[00:00:56]  I don't know.
[00:00:58]  But as the semester progressed, we kind of like, this was like my last year of high school.
[00:01:04]  We kind of got closer and closer.
[00:01:06]  And then eventually, like, I'd stay the night at her house, but I wouldn't like sleep in her bed.
[00:01:09]  Like, nothing would happen between us.
[00:01:10]  I would kind of just like sleep on the floor of her bedroom.
[00:01:13]  And like, I mean, her parents were like not really around.
[00:01:16]  But I remember one day she came to school and she had this like big pimple.
[00:01:25]  And I was, you know, she was like, talk about it.
[00:01:28]  And you know, when it's, you know, if you're a guy, you kind of ignore when women talk about that kind of stuff.
[00:01:33]  But it did get bigger and it did get to be quite large, to be honest.
[00:01:38]  It was like the size of a quarter.
[00:01:41]  And a couple days later, I was, actually, I think it was like about a week later, I was staying at her house, sleeping on the floor, and I woke up and it was the morning, and she was screaming in the bathroom.
[00:01:54]  And of course, I got up and like ran in there, thinking that's going to be like my, you know, valiant knight in shining armor kind of moment.
[00:02:01]  And the pimple had burst, and thousands of baby spiders were crawling all over her face.
[00:02:06]  This is such a lie.
[00:02:08]  You know what?
[00:02:09]  I want to say I called it a lie.
[00:02:12]  I did.
[00:02:13]  I've been shaking my head for like 10 minutes because, by the way, also too long.
[00:02:16]  I know your stories.
[00:02:17]  That's not.
[00:02:18]  I know that story.
[00:02:19]  I know the way you construct your little cranks.
[00:02:22]  This is fake.
[00:02:23]  This is fake up.
[00:02:24]  You don't know about me and Gloria.
[00:02:25]  The spiders were real, Liz.
[00:02:27]  No.
[00:02:28]  Debunked.

=== Mea Culpa Together (02:52) ===

[00:02:53]  Hello.
[00:02:55]  Am I a podcast host or am I Dracula?
[00:02:59]  Wait.
[00:03:00]  Whoa, wait, real quick.
[00:03:02]  Hello, Brace.
[00:03:03]  I'm Liz.
[00:03:04]  Yes, You, yes.
[00:03:08]  What is this?
[00:03:08]  Every time, every time I, after the cold open, start talking about something, you're always like, hold on, we have to introduce ourselves.
[00:03:15]  Guess who started introducing himself?
[00:03:17]  And then someone else tried to go somewhere else.
[00:03:20]  Anyway, I'm Liz.
[00:03:22]  We are, of course, joined by the scariest producer in Transylvania, old Chomsky.
[00:03:30]  So old he was born in the Egypt times.
[00:03:35]  And the podcast is called Buanon.
[00:03:39]  Booana.
[00:03:40]  You like that one?
[00:03:40]  Boo Nan?
[00:03:41]  I thought about that earlier during our interview.
[00:03:43]  You know what?
[00:03:44]  I want to get this out of the way first.
[00:03:47]  If you had purchased the True Non Halloween costume, we're so sorry to anyone that was offended by that.
[00:03:57]  I understand that it did look like a sort of not-so-great groups costume, but we were trying to do like a ghost thing and just want to say I'm sorry to everyone who was offended by that.
[00:04:09]  It's sort of just like we weren't thinking.
[00:04:11]  And the conical hat, it was kind of like a dunce, like you're a stupid ghost.
[00:04:15]  And you know what?
[00:04:16]  Maya Culpa.
[00:04:18]  Maya Culpa.
[00:04:19]  That's nice.
[00:04:20]  Let's have a little mea culpa together.
[00:04:21]  Ready?
[00:04:22]  Yeah, yeah.
[00:04:22]  Maya culpa.
[00:04:25]  That's true.
[00:04:27]  Wait, Brace, real quick.
[00:04:28]  Yeah.
[00:04:28]  It is the year 2022.
[00:04:30]  Yeah.
[00:04:32]  2020 boo for you because you do switch ems for Halloween.
[00:04:37]  Yeah.
[00:04:38]  Where you're either Austin Powers or Dracula.
[00:04:42]  Or Dracula.
[00:04:42]  Which year is it?
[00:04:44]  Is it?
[00:04:44]  So it's a Dracula year.
[00:04:46]  Interesting.
[00:04:46]  But you know what?
[00:04:48]  We go on tour in like five days and there's no Dracula costume.
[00:04:52]  Which is a perfect segue to say, you know, there's still tickets available, Brace.
[00:04:56]  So great of you to mention that.
[00:04:58]  Only for three shows left.
[00:05:00]  Philadelphia on the 3rd of November.
[00:05:03]  I think I'm.
[00:05:04]  You know what?
[00:05:05]  You always correct me during this, and I'm always correct.
[00:05:07]  It is the 3rd.
[00:05:08]  Yeah, it's the 3rd of November.
[00:05:11]  At the Union Transfer, there are still tickets available.
[00:05:14]  Our second LA show on 11-16, 2022, that's the 16th of November.
[00:05:20]  There you go.
[00:05:21]  At the Terra Grant Ballroom, still tickets available.
[00:05:23]  And our final show of the tour at the Great American Music Hall in beautiful Scam Francisco on the 26th of November, 2022.
[00:05:34]  There are still tickets available.
[00:05:35]  Yeah, also, you should come to that one because that's the hometown show for us.
[00:05:38]  Exactly.
[00:05:39]  That's our triumphant return.
[00:05:40]  We're going to burn the whole city down.
[00:05:42]  In fact, I think the mayor is going to show up.

=== Jack Wagner's Paranormal Beat (15:26) ===

[00:05:45]  So I'm a little freaked out about returning to San Francisco.
[00:05:48]  Why?
[00:05:49]  Well, so when I was younger.
[00:05:53]  Oh, no.
[00:05:53]  Here's my.
[00:05:54]  No, this wasn't high school.
[00:05:55]  This was like, I was like early 20s during this.
[00:05:58]  You and Gloria, huh?
[00:05:59]  No, it wasn't Gloria.
[00:06:00]  This was Michael, but spelled like Michelle that I used to hang out with.
[00:06:08]  We were doing, you know, like the farm near like Potrero?
[00:06:12]  No.
[00:06:13]  There's like a farm.
[00:06:14]  They actually used to have punk shows there in the 80s, but there's like a.
[00:06:16]  Oh, that spot?
[00:06:17]  The like crazy industrial spice?
[00:06:19]  Yeah, no, but was featured in.
[00:06:21]  Yeah, yeah, but there's like crops and stuff over there.
[00:06:23]  Yeah, yeah, but featured in the great series that Yankomsky produced early this year called Kevin.
[00:06:27]  Yes.
[00:06:28]  Exactly.
[00:06:28]  Yes, precisely.
[00:06:30]  Also home to, I think, Target Video.
[00:06:34]  Did you add a lot of videos from there?
[00:06:36]  But, you know, classic sort of spot, but there's a farm there.
[00:06:39]  And me and Michael worked on that for like six months during the summer of like 2010.
[00:06:45]  Right, right, the big crop summer.
[00:06:47]  Exactly.
[00:06:47]  And there was a scarecrow there that kind of just had like to, you know.
[00:06:53]  To scare the crows.
[00:06:53]  No, well, yeah, but not only a crows in San Francisco.
[00:06:55]  It's more like to scare like crackheads and stuff like that.
[00:06:58]  The crows of San Francisco.
[00:06:59]  And yeah.
[00:07:00]  And, you know, early 20s, you know, I was drinking a lot.
[00:07:03]  Michael also drinking a lot, kind of like not doing so great emotionally.
[00:07:07]  And we kind of beat the shit out of the scarecrow.
[00:07:10]  And we beat it and beat it and beat it.
[00:07:13]  Like really just like every time frustration at work, we'd take it out of the scarecrow.
[00:07:19]  I stopped working there.
[00:07:21]  I was replaced by a guy named Jose, and he and Michael kept working there, kind of did the same thing.
[00:07:28]  Jose would beat it.
[00:07:29]  And I didn't hear from Michael for a couple weeks.
[00:07:33]  Later that, I think it was the next spring.
[00:07:35]  And I went back to the farm and he and Jose's skin was on the roof.
[00:07:43]  And the scarecrow was dancing up there.
[00:07:47]  So I called the police and he was arrested.
[00:07:49]  It was a pretty big trial.
[00:07:51]  I mean, it was the first scarecrow to ever be executed.
[00:07:56]  And we don't even have to.
[00:07:57]  We don't have the death penalty.
[00:07:58]  No, the police just shot him.
[00:08:01]  It was really horrible.
[00:08:02]  Oh, my God.
[00:08:03]  So to our listeners out there who are like, what are these two jokers doing?
[00:08:07]  Yeah.
[00:08:08]  It's Halloween season, baby.
[00:08:10]  Ooh, the autumn.
[00:08:12]  And if you're listening to this, months ahead of, you know, months in the future, which to you is now and we're in the past, which, damn, think about that.
[00:08:21]  That's crazy.
[00:08:24]  It was Halloween when we were recording this.
[00:08:27]  Yes, well, close enough.
[00:08:29]  Time.
[00:08:29]  It was Halloween season.
[00:08:31]  The season.
[00:08:32]  Do you have a favorite Halloween movie?
[00:08:34]  Not of the series Halloween, but just in general?
[00:08:38]  Practical Magic.
[00:08:40]  What's that?
[00:08:41]  What?
[00:08:42]  With Nicole Kidman and Sandra Bullock, Sandy.
[00:08:44]  Oh, it's classic.
[00:08:45]  Does it pass them back to a test?
[00:08:47]  It absolutely does.
[00:08:48]  Then I'll watch it.
[00:08:49]  And yeah, it's very, like, I'm less into spooky.
[00:08:54]  I don't like scary, but I love cozy.
[00:08:57]  And so for me, the autumnal mood is more buttressed.
[00:09:02]  It's buttressed better.
[00:09:04]  For me, the autumnal mood is buttressed better.
[00:09:08]  Yes.
[00:09:09]  This is a wild Liz episode, by the way.
[00:09:11]  Just to get some stuff that kind of, you know, help cosify.
[00:09:16]  So, you know, me, I'm on the couch.
[00:09:18]  I'm layered up.
[00:09:19]  I'm in like 18 sweaters.
[00:09:20]  I got all the throws.
[00:09:21]  All the throws are thrown on the couch.
[00:09:23]  Yeah.
[00:09:24]  I've got like six mugs.
[00:09:25]  Yeah.
[00:09:26]  There's a pile of cinnamon buns, hot and toasty right out the oven.
[00:09:31]  I've got, you know, 18 Meg Ryan movies.
[00:09:33]  I've got practical magic.
[00:09:35]  I've got jack-o'-lanterns outside, but they're not to spook.
[00:09:38]  I'm there giving treats to the local children very gently and telling them their costumes look absolutely adorable.
[00:09:47]  Interesting.
[00:09:48]  I don't watch scary movies.
[00:09:50]  Okay.
[00:09:50]  Mine's cruising, because like, what if Al Pacina was gay?
[00:09:54]  Yeah, that's pretty spooky.
[00:09:55]  Young Thompson, do you have a favorite spooky movie?
[00:09:59]  Scary October EV movie even?
[00:10:01]  I don't really go for that kind of thing.
[00:10:03]  Yeah, see?
[00:10:04]  Okay, you guys are crazy.
[00:10:05]  I love spooky movies.
[00:10:06]  I don't like to be scared.
[00:10:07]  I mean, I think being a horror movie person is like too close to being a rockabilly person for me.
[00:10:13]  Absolutely.
[00:10:13]  You know, I don't.
[00:10:14]  Let me say the shiny.
[00:10:15]  The shiny.
[00:10:16]  Yeah.
[00:10:17]  That's a winter spooky movie.
[00:10:19]  I went to that place.
[00:10:20]  I'll give it to you.
[00:10:20]  To the place where they filmed it.
[00:10:22]  To Overlook?
[00:10:23]  I went to a place in New York.
[00:10:24]  It's in Colorado, right?
[00:10:25]  Yeah.
[00:10:26]  Yeah, then I went to it.
[00:10:27]  I went to the movie?
[00:10:27]  I don't know.
[00:10:28]  No, I went to it.
[00:10:29]  I've been to a crazy, scary place in New Paltz that looked like it a long time ago.
[00:10:33]  I would say my- But they filmed it in the bottom of the Biltmore, which is in downtown LA, which is where they used to have the Oscars.
[00:10:41]  Really?
[00:10:42]  That's where the photo, I think, is from.
[00:10:45]  My favorite scary, actual scary movie, gotta be.
[00:10:51]  I'm also too scared.
[00:10:52]  No, the excitement.
[00:10:52]  I don't think so.
[00:10:52]  Yeah, I was scared to say The Exorcist.
[00:10:55]  Because my parents took me to see it when I was like 11 when I got re-released.
[00:10:58]  And then the lady peeing on the ground made me scared.
[00:11:01]  Because I was like, incontinence can come to children?
[00:11:04]  Do you think that movie, okay, which is scarier?
[00:11:07]  Exorcist or poltergeist?
[00:11:09]  Never seen poltergeist.
[00:11:11]  What?
[00:11:12]  Yeah.
[00:11:13]  Oh, come on.
[00:11:16]  It's scary?
[00:11:17]  Yeah.
[00:11:18]  Oh, I'm thinking of paranormal activity.
[00:11:20]  I also haven't seen that.
[00:11:21]  Oh, no, that's the security camera one.
[00:11:23]  That's the one they're like, oh, my God, what if you saw crazy shit on the names of the world?
[00:11:27]  It's like where babies are weird.
[00:11:29]  Yeah, I know.
[00:11:29]  They're always talking and shit.
[00:11:31]  Do you think babies can see ghosts?
[00:11:33]  Fuck yeah, dude.
[00:11:34]  I was talking about, we were talking about this the other day.
[00:11:36]  Babies always are looking at ghosts, dude.
[00:11:38]  Yeah.
[00:11:38]  Well, I don't think it's ghosts.
[00:11:40]  It's energy that they're understanding.
[00:11:42]  I think their third eye and plenty of other eyes are open.
[00:11:45]  The soft spot on their head.
[00:11:46]  Once your head hardens up.
[00:11:47]  It's a horrible civilization forces it closed.
[00:11:50]  That's why I always do crazy shit in front of babies so that when they're older, they don't fucking, they're like, that must have been one of those ghosts I saw.
[00:11:56]  Totally, totally.
[00:11:57]  Classic prankster.
[00:11:58]  Classic prankster.
[00:11:59]  We're talking about all this and more with good friend Jack Wagner.
[00:12:04]  He's got a new podcast out.
[00:12:06]  Oh, he prefers if we say Jack Wagner, by the way.
[00:12:09]  Yeah, no, he's certainly.
[00:12:10]  That's house style.
[00:12:11]  Yeah, house style is Jack Wagner.
[00:12:13]  But yeah, Jack Wagner is here to talk with us about what, Liz?
[00:12:20]  Spooky, scary, paranormal, the absolute, energy fields, the open-ended and confusing universe and how we make sense of it all.
[00:12:31]  And I want to be clear, if you're skeptical, you know the word I'm trying to say, skeptical about any of this stuff.
[00:12:37]  Brace is just trying to rhyme, really.
[00:12:39]  If you're skeptical about it, fuck it.
[00:12:41]  I would be.
[00:12:42]  The skeptical.
[00:12:43]  Honestly, the real scariest thing is my skeptical.
[00:12:48]  The real scariest thing is, you know, I did a conscious hip-hop album in 2011, right?
[00:12:53]  What was it called?
[00:12:56]  Ethereum.
[00:12:57]  No, it was called Erudite.
[00:13:01]  Erudite, the motherfucker.
[00:13:02]  And after the goddess of being a little rapper.
[00:13:04]  Rapper is very good.
[00:13:06]  No, but if you are skeptical about any of this, I'm going to be real with you.
[00:13:10]  It is kind of sexist to be skeptical about this stuff.
[00:13:13]  I firmly believe that.
[00:13:15]  So even if you don't believe it, if you ever want to ever, ever, ever, if you want a little glory of your own, who, by the way, I made that up.
[00:13:23]  I know.
[00:13:24]  I wasn't talking to girls on the phone in fucking.
[00:13:27]  I had a girlfriend.
[00:13:28]  She wasn't in high school.
[00:13:29]  That's crazy.
[00:13:30]  What's up?
[00:13:31]  Spiders come out of her face.
[00:13:32]  Spiders coming out of her face.
[00:13:33]  I put spiders on women's face.
[00:13:34]  You know how people say you eat 25 spiders a year?
[00:13:37]  You think he's putting them in your mouth?
[00:13:38]  Yeah, dude.
[00:13:39]  I'm going in there every night.
[00:13:40]  And you know what they call you?
[00:13:41]  What?
[00:13:42]  Little gin.
[00:13:43]  Why do they call me?
[00:13:45]  Little gin, exactly.
[00:13:46]  Yeah, I put a little gin in there too.
[00:13:48]  No.
[00:13:49]  And I'm like, all these references, dear listener, all these references, they're going to make sense and more.
[00:13:56]  Once you hear a great interview, which, by the way, if you say anything mean about me and what I think about the world on the internet, don't do that.
[00:14:03]  Be nice.
[00:14:04]  Yeah.
[00:14:06]  and let's start the interview.
[00:14:22]  I first met Jack Wagner six years ago, on this very day, pre-Halloween.
[00:14:31]  I was taking a stroll by myself, well, accompanied by my footman, through the spookiest cemetery in Los Angeles.
[00:14:39]  The palm trees there had blackened leaves, fronds, really, and skeleton hands crawled from the ground in a goofy but creepy way.
[00:14:49]  As the day grew overcast and a Drizzle started drizzling on my skin, making me wet and moist like a dewdrop, dew-dappled leaf in the morning.
[00:15:00]  I began to weep.
[00:15:02]  And then I looked down and I was weeping blood.
[00:15:05]  But also, the blood wasn't even my blood.
[00:15:07]  It was the blood of the scariest ancestor that I have, Dracula.
[00:15:13]  All of a sudden, I heard a tap on my shoulder that I also felt.
[00:15:17]  And I turned around, but there was no one standing there.
[00:15:21]  And I realized it was actually somebody who reached their hand around me and did the trick tap.
[00:15:25]  That's a classical move.
[00:15:26]  And I turned around and Jack Wagner was standing there, completely naked, also dappled with dew.
[00:15:35]  Not in a state of tumescence.
[00:15:37]  And I said, Jack, so nice to meet you.
[00:15:39]  My name is Brace.
[00:15:40]  And he said, I already know that.
[00:15:44]  The goblin told me.
[00:15:46]  And soon, in so many three years from now, you and Liz and Young Chomsky will start a podcast.
[00:15:53]  And three years hence from then, I shall return atop my witchy steed and join you.
[00:16:01]  Welcome, Jack, to the podcast we have with us today.
[00:16:04]  Jack Wagner, descendant of the famous Nazi composer himself.
[00:16:09]  That is not true.
[00:16:10]  Okay.
[00:16:10]  Well, that's what I, you know, that's, you know, two sides to every story.
[00:16:14]  And the host of Other World Podcast.
[00:16:18]  Yeah, Otherworld.
[00:16:20]  Simple.
[00:16:20]  Not Otherworld podcast.
[00:16:22]  Just Otherworld.
[00:16:23]  Podcast.
[00:16:24]  But it is a podcast.
[00:16:26]  It is a podcast.
[00:16:26]  It is a podcast.
[00:16:28]  Thank you for that introduction, Brace.
[00:16:30]  I have, I thought about how funny it would be if, like, you know, the pod's going well.
[00:16:35]  I've been developing goodwill with the audience.
[00:16:37]  I thought it'd be so funny if I just completely ruined everything going for me if I started reporting like stories about jack-o'-lanterns and Frankenstein.
[00:16:47]  Star wolves.
[00:16:48]  Yeah.
[00:16:48]  You won't believe it.
[00:16:49]  Last night I saw ooze dripping down my wall.
[00:16:53]  So I have a question about that, actually, because, well, we should say, first off, welcome.
[00:16:58]  We're so excited to have you here.
[00:16:59]  You have a new podcast out.
[00:17:01]  It's such a delight and such a fright.
[00:17:05]  Ooh.
[00:17:05]  And I'm going to be doing a lot of those during our spooktacular episode that we're doing here.
[00:17:12]  But seriously, folks, when we talk about the supernatural, we aren't talking about Frankenstein.
[00:17:22]  We're not talking about Dracula.
[00:17:23]  We're not talking about werewolves.
[00:17:25]  Okay.
[00:17:26]  Right?
[00:17:27]  Well, yeah, sure.
[00:17:29]  But I do think that there is like some like, I want to clarify then what we're actually talking about when we talk about the super, when we're in the supernatural space, which your podcast occupies, what are we really talking about here?
[00:17:46]  I mean, I kind of like I say my so my podcast is all first-hand encounters.
[00:17:52]  And when I ask people for these stories, I say something paranormal, supernatural, or unexplained.
[00:17:57]  So basically, like what I cover is really anything that's sort of outside of the bounds of, I guess, current scientific explanation.
[00:18:07]  And I guess outside the bounds of like what a normal journalist would be able to report on and fact check.
[00:18:14]  You know, something that just doesn't quite fit, but from a person, like an eyewitness that I trust.
[00:18:20]  And usually stories that come down to, okay, either this person is just lying to my face and they're an incredible liar and also an amazingly creative person, you know, and story.
[00:18:34]  That's usually how I know people like aren't lying is like, all right, if they're making this up, they should just write a book because they would be Stephen King level storyteller.
[00:18:43]  But yeah, either that or they're not crazy and they saw this and what happened, you know, or maybe something that we'll eventually understand down the road.
[00:18:54]  But so I know that's kind of broad, but that's, I guess, the closest thing that I can in defining this.
[00:19:02]  I don't understand any of it.
[00:19:04]  I'm definitely not an expert.
[00:19:06]  I want to say that right away.
[00:19:08]  I'm not an expert at all.
[00:19:10]  I'm just, I, you know, the podcast is about first-hand experiences.
[00:19:14]  So I'm not a historian of this stuff.
[00:19:16]  Like, I'm not, yeah.
[00:19:18]  It's not one of those podcasts where I just read Wikipedia pages or whatever.
[00:19:22]  Yeah, totally.
[00:19:23]  Like, I don't want to ramble too much, but I've always been interested in this stuff.
[00:19:28]  And I've just never been able to listen to or watch anything that covers it because it's either somebody reading Wikipedia or like it's just not filtered enough.
[00:19:40]  They have like too many people on that are clearly mentally insane.
[00:19:44]  Yeah.
[00:19:44]  It's, you know, I don't, I don't want to write people off, but like sometimes it's just very obvious, even submissions I get.
[00:19:52]  Or they're just taking so much that it's like, you know, they're not, they have no discretion with it to the point where it starts to sound like fiction.
[00:20:00]  Yeah.
[00:20:01]  You're listening to it or watching it and like, oh yeah, this is fiction.
[00:20:04]  Even like some of the ones that I do like, recently when I'm listening to it, I'm like, oh yeah, like a lot of this is just made up.
[00:20:14]  It's like a storyteller and it's sort of accepted as storytelling.
[00:20:18]  You know what I'm saying?
[00:20:19]  Where it's sort of like one of those where it's like a true story, but it's like a tall tale.
[00:20:23]  But for me and probably you guys, when I hear stuff like this, at the end of the story, it's never the end for me.
[00:20:31]  I just have a million more questions.
[00:20:33]  So that's kind of what I'm trying to do.
[00:20:35]  I mean, there's so much, so many of the kind of like narrative shows that cover a lot of these sorts of stories, whether they're like firsthand or retelling historical events or whatever, whatever, like you're saying, reading Wikipedia stories.
[00:20:49]  Like the production on it, it can be so corny and it can be so heavy-handed that it even adds to the sort of like the dramatization of the whole thing and it makes it seem even more ridiculous than sometimes some of these stories already feel because they're they're so difficult to believe that people could be having these experiences and so I think like on your podcast,

=== Locking Up Disrespectful Jinn (16:28) ===

[00:21:11]  you know, you have people come on and basically tell these firsthand experiences that they've had with these like like you say unexplained phenomenon and what's great is that you get to kind of hear it from these people's mouths and it isn't kind of like mediated by some sort of like theatrical production or whatever.
[00:21:29]  And so you can really like, I mean, I'm sure you do, like you say, a lot of filtering out of like, you know, telling, you can tell when some of these are like these tall tales or these like ridiculous kind of stories.
[00:21:39]  But I do think it's very affecting to hear just so many different people that have these very strange experiences.
[00:21:46]  And so I'm wondering, can you like maybe walk our listeners through before we kind of get into sort of unified theories about the supernatural?
[00:21:53]  Because I know Bryce and I have some that we want to run by you.
[00:21:56]  Like, can you just walk us through a little bit of maybe like some of these kinds of stories that people are coming on and talking about?
[00:22:03]  Okay, well, it's all over the place.
[00:22:06]  I obviously get a ton of ghost stories, haunted houses, almost too much, I would say.
[00:22:14]  Oh, a lot.
[00:22:14]  I mean, Jack, to be fair, a lot of people have died.
[00:22:17]  Yeah, it's 2022.
[00:22:18]  Yes.
[00:22:18]  I'm sure you've been.
[00:22:19]  I'll say, I mean, I might have to get fact-checked on this.
[00:22:23]  Pretty sure most people who've ever been alive at this point dead.
[00:22:26]  So obviously there's a ton of ghosts, dude.
[00:22:28]  Don't be a dick about it.
[00:22:31]  I mean, so a lot of those, I mean, my favorites are the ones that are kind of in between in a way that's just like, I mean, okay, so the first episode is about this woman from Australia and her nephew, actually.
[00:22:46]  Her nephew moves into this house.
[00:22:48]  He's like forced to move back to the family farm where like all their cousins kind of live.
[00:22:52]  And like, you know, basically it's like this in the middle of nowhere.
[00:22:56]  And on this big piece of property, all the aunts and uncles and so forth have houses kind of in like a, almost like a, you know, an old family plot of land.
[00:23:06]  And he, him and his friends hear like footsteps walking behind them when they're going up the driveway and they get kind of spooked, but they mention it to their aunt.
[00:23:14]  And then all of a sudden he hears all these wild stories from when she lived in the house.
[00:23:19]  And one of them, the wildest, like the wild one she tells me is that they're coming home and they like, basically this white orb light like opens up in the street.
[00:23:31]  That's the best way I could describe it.
[00:23:32]  It's about the size of a person.
[00:23:33]  And she says it's this really bright white light.
[00:23:36]  And inside, there's like this guy dressed like a gentleman, she says.
[00:23:41]  The whole family sees it.
[00:23:43]  And she describes his limbs as being broken.
[00:23:46]  He's kind of like, the way I understand it, sort of like a marionette laying on the ground or something.
[00:23:52]  But she sees this man and like they're about to pull in their driveway.
[00:23:54]  It's like in front of their car.
[00:23:56]  Her kids are like two years old.
[00:23:59]  And she's like, mommy, what's the white man doing?
[00:24:03]  Her husband sees it, bolts out of the car, which is the funniest part.
[00:24:07]  He bolts into the house and later she finds him under the covers, like whimpering.
[00:24:12]  So she, this man abandons his family.
[00:24:16]  Yeah, that's maybe the most shocking event.
[00:24:18]  No, no, no, no.
[00:24:19]  Like, so she is, I mean, it's a funny story too.
[00:24:21]  She's telling me she's like horrified, but also like immediately distracted because she realizes her husband is a coward.
[00:24:27]  And it's like a relatively new marriage.
[00:24:29]  So she instantly is distracted.
[00:24:31]  Like, she has to get her kids into the house because she doesn't know what's going on.
[00:24:35]  Then she confronts her husband for being a coward.
[00:24:37]  Like, what?
[00:24:38]  You just left us?
[00:24:40]  He goes under the covers?
[00:24:42]  Yes.
[00:24:42]  And then, and like, he's like, yeah, and being like, nothing happened.
[00:24:46]  I didn't see anything.
[00:24:47]  Nothing.
[00:24:47]  There's nothing out there.
[00:24:49]  And so she goes back out and the guy's still there.
[00:24:51]  He steps out of the orb, kind of turns into something else.
[00:24:54]  And then he goes back to being a human form, sort of like the way I understand it, she kind of like shakes.
[00:25:02]  And then he's like fixed.
[00:25:04]  He's not broken anymore.
[00:25:05]  She kept calling him the broken man.
[00:25:07]  And then he's standing there.
[00:25:10]  She says that he seemed embarrassed.
[00:25:13]  He had like an embarrassed look on his face.
[00:25:14]  Well, his limbs are hanging from it.
[00:25:16]  I mean, he's all dangle-wingle.
[00:25:17]  Like, that's what he's doing.
[00:25:18]  You weren't supposed to see me, Rocky.
[00:25:21]  And then he took off running into their property and kind of just disappeared.
[00:25:26]  And then, but get this.
[00:25:27]  So she tells this to her, her grandma, who's still alive living on the property.
[00:25:32]  And she's like, oh, that sounds like Murray Jacobs.
[00:25:36]  That sounds like Murray Jacobs.
[00:25:38]  That was like my husband's friend.
[00:25:39]  He used to come over every day after work.
[00:25:41]  He lived on the street.
[00:25:42]  They would come over and they would have some drinks and then he'd go to his family.
[00:25:45]  And during the Great Depression in Australia, he jumped off a building and killed himself.
[00:25:50]  Broke all his limbs.
[00:25:51]  Broke all of his limbs.
[00:25:53]  And I know this sounds like this probably, it's such a good story that sounds like a tall tale, but this woman telling me it, and it's very vivid.
[00:26:02]  There's witnesses.
[00:26:03]  And well, you know, they say that experiences with the supernatural or the unexplained, like that a lot of those experiences are there for us to like reveal something to us or for us to come to understand something.
[00:26:17]  So I feel like she really found something out about her husband with that situation that she could be.
[00:26:23]  Well, that's what I love about doing this.
[00:26:26]  Yeah.
[00:26:27]  Like I'm not, I'm not like a big, like, oh, let's get scared type of guy.
[00:26:32]  But when I started doing this, I started doing this kind of by accident.
[00:26:35]  But what I found is that I just really like these stories because there's usually some element in it that adds a whole different spin.
[00:26:43]  Like for that story, it's the husband part.
[00:26:46]  Like, that's what makes it a good story to me, where it's like, oh my God, this they, I mean, they get divorced over this.
[00:26:52]  Like, she leaves him.
[00:26:54]  Holy shit, she leaves him because he was a freighty cat?
[00:26:56]  Because, dude, can you imagine a guy?
[00:27:00]  And she has a newborn baby in the car.
[00:27:03]  He dips.
[00:27:04]  Yeah.
[00:27:05]  No, but how do you imagine?
[00:27:06]  I just have to come back from that.
[00:27:07]  Imagine she's a bad person.
[00:27:07]  And she has to walk the kids inside while this ghost is standing there.
[00:27:12]  So she has to get them out of their car seats and like carry them in the house.
[00:27:16]  Yeah.
[00:27:17]  They are.
[00:27:19]  So there's that.
[00:27:20]  Then I do one with a woman who I think she doesn't know what it is, but she basically receives these messages that turn out to be from recently deceased people and they want her to pass on a message to their family member.
[00:27:35]  She didn't know that that was the case.
[00:27:37]  She just thought she was seeing crazy stuff.
[00:27:40]  But like, each time she feels really, she says that she feels physically uncomfortable until she tells the person.
[00:27:47]  But each time it's, it's been a specific message for them.
[00:27:51]  And like the person.
[00:27:53]  Oh, very clearly.
[00:27:55]  But interestingly enough, she still doesn't quite like, she doesn't know the terminology.
[00:28:01]  And those are my favorite type of people too, where like, where they don't even know, like, they don't know what they're saying.
[00:28:06]  Yeah, because it's like, it's so honest.
[00:28:07]  They're just trying to describe something that you're familiar with, but they don't know what it is.
[00:28:12]  So, I mean, like, she's describing something appearing in her third eye, basically, but she doesn't have like, you know, she doesn't know about this stuff.
[00:28:20]  So that adds to it.
[00:28:22]  She's not familiar with the chakras, yeah.
[00:28:24]  A little bit, maybe, but, like, not, she still doesn't know what's happening to her.
[00:28:27]  But that was one.
[00:28:28]  I do one about a jinn, which is like an Islam, Islamic.
[00:28:33]  I've heard kind of, it's just like a soul.
[00:28:36]  Some people look at it as like, it's pretty universal, like, you do not mess with this.
[00:28:41]  But yeah, it's kind of like from what I was told by this person, like, there's just jinn everywhere living in like another dimension, basically.
[00:28:53]  There's like families of jinn.
[00:28:54]  They're like souls.
[00:28:55]  They're bigger than us.
[00:28:56]  Interesting.
[00:28:56]  I don't know.
[00:28:58]  So have you yourself had any experiences?
[00:29:01]  A little bit.
[00:29:02]  What kind of like got you involved in this?
[00:29:06]  I don't know.
[00:29:07]  I always like, I mean, I did, I tried to do a documentary on it when I was like 15 because there was like a haunted theater in my neighborhood where the bands would have shows.
[00:29:16]  And I just always heard like, oh, that place is haunted.
[00:29:20]  And I had to do a video for like a school project.
[00:29:23]  So I tried to do a documentary on that.
[00:29:25]  And that was sort of interesting, but also I got scared.
[00:29:29]  Was it a venue for straight-edge hardcore bands?
[00:29:32]  There was a lot of different, it was one of those where it was like every single child band would play at this place, you know.
[00:29:39]  Gotcha.
[00:29:40]  Oh, like local bands.
[00:29:42]  Yes, yes.
[00:29:43]  I don't know how many big ones came through.
[00:29:45]  But yeah, so I kind of got scared off by doing that.
[00:29:47]  I was sort of like, uh, I don't want to mess with this stuff.
[00:29:53]  But then my mom lived in a house that we think is haunted.
[00:29:58]  It wasn't scary, but it's not that interesting, honestly, in comparison to my other stories.
[00:30:03]  But it was weird.
[00:30:04]  I think I maybe told Brace about this.
[00:30:06]  Essentially, we had all hear somebody making food at night in the kitchen.
[00:30:10]  And I just, I think we all assumed that it was another member of the family.
[00:30:14]  But then until we had like a conversation where everybody was like, no, fuck no, I never go in the kitchen.
[00:30:21]  That's a cinematic moment of like, that's not.
[00:30:23]  It was scary.
[00:30:24]  I didn't do it.
[00:30:24]  You didn't do it.
[00:30:25]  Yeah.
[00:30:25]  Everyone's pointing at each other.
[00:30:27]  And then my mom had, I mean, she lived, like, I would only visit, but she had had more severe experiences.
[00:30:32]  Like, she came home and every single drawer was opened.
[00:30:37]  Like, she thought somebody broke into the house.
[00:30:39]  Like, it was pretty, it was honestly horror movie vibes.
[00:30:43]  It sounds like the plot of a movie.
[00:30:44]  I guess like the kids in the neighborhood would be out in the yard a lot and she's like, what are you doing?
[00:30:49]  And they, I guess she realized that it's like a house, you know, like people in the neighborhood know about it.
[00:30:55]  Oh, really?
[00:30:57]  Yeah.
[00:30:58]  So, but I don't know.
[00:30:59]  It was never like.
[00:31:00]  Did she still live there?
[00:31:02]  No, she moved.
[00:31:04]  Do you remember the abandoned, what was it?
[00:31:06]  I think the VA hospital in San Francisco?
[00:31:08]  Oh, yeah.
[00:31:09]  When we were younger, we all used just to, Jack, there was like a big old abandoned hospital in SF that was like obviously abandoned hospital, very scary.
[00:31:20]  My friends and I used to go there a lot.
[00:31:21]  I did not like going there.
[00:31:23]  That's crazy.
[00:31:24]  I thought we were going to get in trouble because I heard a rumor that there was motion sensors on the fences.
[00:31:29]  And my friend did get arrested there.
[00:31:31]  So I was like, I don't really like this.
[00:31:33]  But there were spectral motion sensors.
[00:31:35]  Exactly.
[00:31:35]  Well, some of my friends would go down there and like lock themselves or not lock themselves, but like put themselves in like the morgue things and stuff like that.
[00:31:42]  Oh my God.
[00:31:43]  No, that's no thanks.
[00:31:44]  Psycho.
[00:31:45]  Dude, psycho stuff.
[00:31:46]  I just smoked that little gunja.
[00:31:47]  That is one thing I do not do.
[00:31:49]  I still don't know like what I believe about any of this stuff, but that's a lose-lose situation to me.
[00:31:55]  If those shows aren't real, you're in trouble.
[00:31:57]  No, that adds to that.
[00:31:58]  That's like even more back to like the TV shows and kind of like why I made Otherworld is like all of the shows about it that are like reality, first of all, they never find proof.
[00:32:09]  How could they?
[00:32:09]  They have like a huge fucking camera crew.
[00:32:11]  It's like, that's not the circumstances I think you would find it.
[00:32:14]  But the other thing is that they're in like, they're behaving in a way where it's like, if you believed in this stuff, you would not be doing this.
[00:32:20]  Absolutely.
[00:32:21]  You clearly do not believe in it.
[00:32:22]  You're going in the worst place in the world and acting like a dick.
[00:32:25]  Yeah, it's also just disrespectful.
[00:32:27]  Yeah, it's like you must not believe.
[00:32:30]  Right.
[00:32:31]  Right?
[00:32:31]  Like, why would you put that kind of shit?
[00:32:33]  Like, I just think if there's even a little inch inside you that has doubt that maybe this, you know, we can talk about the layers of that.
[00:32:43]  We should in a second of like whether it's ghosts, whether it's spirits, whether it's jinns, whether it's other dimensions, whether it's past lives, whether it's future lives, whatever, whatever.
[00:32:52]  Like if there's just like the tiniest, tiniest little bit of you that is like doubtful that maybe some of that does exist and that we're not kind of just floating alone in this world and that's all there is, then like don't be disrespectful.
[00:33:09]  Don't be rude to like all of that energy.
[00:33:12]  Like treat it with like, you know, be nice.
[00:33:15]  Don't go fuck around in a morgue and like lock yourself in.
[00:33:18]  I don't believe in it.
[00:33:18]  Yeah.
[00:33:19]  You don't mess around with this.
[00:33:20]  And Brace, we're not criticizing you, but like there's a lot of people.
[00:33:23]  But maybe your friends.
[00:33:23]  Well, listen, no, Hey, listen, I'll never lock my ass in one of those fucking things.
[00:33:30]  I don't want to get locked in anything.
[00:33:31]  It's not even about the ghost.
[00:33:33]  We're anti-locking it.
[00:33:34]  True, non-time.
[00:33:35]  Not lock your ass.
[00:33:35]  I will say, Liz, counterpoint.
[00:33:39]  It's true that you should respect it, right?
[00:33:42]  You know, and treat this with some gravitas, you know, if you believe in ghosts and all that kind of stuff.
[00:33:47]  On the other hand, I do find many ghosts themselves to be disrespectful.
[00:33:53]  Yes, well, that's the classic prankster ghost.
[00:33:55]  I think there's different types.
[00:33:56]  There's a lot of those, though.
[00:33:58]  But I do think that that is a ghost's right.
[00:34:02]  Interesting.
[00:34:03]  So you think it's okay for, I mean, I guess they're boring.
[00:34:05]  Once you've moved on and yet have not moved on to the second, because you're kind of in limbo, right?
[00:34:10]  That's sort of the idea with ghosts.
[00:34:11]  They're in limbo.
[00:34:13]  It's like, perhaps you got to work out the prankster, the prankster options.
[00:34:19]  It's like you have this opportunity.
[00:34:20]  I mean, look, I'm imagining Brace as a ghost.
[00:34:23]  Oh, I'd be so good at it.
[00:34:24]  First of all, he pranks constantly.
[00:34:27]  Oh, my God.
[00:34:27]  Starting with the smallest, I mean, we're talking about Mr. Gaslight here.
[00:34:31]  I mean, this would be...
[00:34:32]  I'd eat every sock in your house.
[00:34:34]  It would be incredible.
[00:34:35]  You know what?
[00:34:36]  I'm actually looking forward to it.
[00:34:37]  But you have to kind of exhaust the prankster energy.
[00:34:43]  That's why I think the ghost has to exhaust the prankster energy so it can move on.
[00:34:46]  That's like one point.
[00:34:47]  My whole thing is this.
[00:34:48]  Let me tell you guys.
[00:34:49]  I mean, maybe we're getting ahead of ourselves here, but let me tell you guys my theory on ghosts.
[00:34:52]  Okay, let's get into it.
[00:34:54]  You know how in ghost shows and stuff like that, they're always trying to like get the ghost to come out because, you know, like, like be like, oh, here's like a letter from your, you know, your beau who died before you come back in the Civil War.
[00:35:07]  You know, I do think there is something to that.
[00:35:09]  You have to make a ghost feel some kind of intense emotion in order for it to become corporeal, corporeal, to become more real.
[00:35:22]  And so you can do that by like pissing it off, by making it horny, by making it laugh, by making it angry.
[00:35:27]  By feeling an intense emotion.
[00:35:29]  Exactly.
[00:35:30]  Yes.
[00:35:30]  However, what a lot of these ghost hunter shows, hunter in name only shows, do is they don't understand is that at that point, you draw your weapon and you fire.
[00:35:42]  And you can shoot a ghost at that point because they're more real than they were.
[00:35:46]  They're visible.
[00:35:47]  It doesn't make sense, dude.
[00:35:49]  I feel like you're really on a good track there.
[00:35:51]  If you believe it, though, I'm telling you, a lot of it is about belief.
[00:35:54]  And if you believe it and that ghost sees that you believe it and that you draw in that 38 special, lining those fucking lining those fucking side post up and just blasting that motherfucker, that ghost will not bother you anymore.
[00:36:06]  You can shoot ghosts.
[00:36:08]  No, but I'm saying is you need to get ghosts out of this realm into the next realm.
[00:36:12]  I could tell that Brace is talking about a child ghost.
[00:36:14]  No, this is another ghost of a warrior I'm talking about.
[00:36:17]  This is only for other warriors.
[00:36:18]  Wow, he's been in the limbo for a while.
[00:36:21]  Exactly.
[00:36:21]  Yeah.
[00:36:21]  Well, there's warriors still important today, even.
[00:36:25]  Okay, but in all seriousness, what's your theory on the supernatural?
[00:36:29]  Like, do you believe in this stuff?
[00:36:30]  Yeah, I originally wanted to go through and have you see what you guys do.
[00:36:33]  Let's do that, let's do that.
[00:36:34]  Let's do it.
[00:36:34]  Let's do it.
[00:36:36]  Let's do a little lightning round.
[00:36:37]  10 is complete belief.
[00:36:39]  I would say, okay, 10 is complete belief.
[00:36:41]  Like, you couldn't, as much as you believe in gravity.
[00:36:45]  Like, it's not even yours.
[00:36:46]  Let's not assume anything.
[00:36:48]  That's true.
[00:36:48]  It's about gravity.
[00:36:50]  As sure as, you know, okay.
[00:36:52]  Zero being, it's completely made up 100% fiction.
[00:36:57]  I'm going to be completely honest with you.
[00:36:59]  I am going to forget what these numbers stand for, and I'm just going to tell you my opinion.
[00:37:02]  Zero, Liz, Zero.
[00:37:03]  Let's start with Wiki Gervais style skeptic.
[00:37:07]  10?
[00:37:08]  Literally any woman in the world believe.
[00:37:11]  Okay.
[00:37:12]  Fedora, zero.
[00:37:14]  Yeah.
[00:37:14]  But Joshua Tree, 10.
[00:37:16]  Yes, exactly.
[00:37:17]  Precisely.
[00:37:17]  Okay, that's fine.
[00:37:18]  I understand the scale.
[00:37:20]  Okay.
[00:37:20]  Let's start with ghosts.
[00:37:22]  I'm going to be very general.
[00:37:24]  General.
[00:37:25]  Ghosts.
[00:37:25]  General.
[00:37:26]  10.
[00:37:26]  Ghosts.
[00:37:27]  10.
[00:37:27]  You believe in ghosts?
[00:37:28]  Yes.
[00:37:29]  Okay.
[00:37:30]  I'm going to go with a 6.
[00:37:34]  Okay.
[00:37:34]  No what?
[00:37:35]  You know what?
[00:37:36]  I'm neutral.
[00:37:37]  5.
[00:37:39]  Let's go.
[00:37:39]  Samantha Centrist.

=== Sasquatch & Simulation Theory (15:12) ===

[00:37:40]  Sasquatch.
[00:37:41]  Sasquatch, interesting.
[00:37:43]  We did an episode on Sasquatch.
[00:37:45]  We did.
[00:37:45]  I can't remember what I said about that.
[00:37:46]  I think it was a Christmas episode.
[00:37:48]  I think my Sasquatch belief is at a seven.
[00:37:52]  I'm giving that.
[00:37:53]  But wait, do we differentiate between Sasquatch and Bigfoot?
[00:37:57]  Or is that the same thing?
[00:37:58]  Yeah.
[00:37:59]  Is Sasquatch, Bigfoot same?
[00:38:00]  I thought they were the same.
[00:38:01]  A Yeti is not the same.
[00:38:03]  No, Yeti is not the same.
[00:38:04]  You know what?
[00:38:04]  I think we covered this with the episode.
[00:38:06]  We did.
[00:38:06]  I believe.
[00:38:07]  But that was, you know what?
[00:38:08]  That was like two years ago.
[00:38:09]  Okay, I'm going to say Yeti eight.
[00:38:11]  Sasquatch five.
[00:38:14]  Okay, I'm going Sasquatch zero.
[00:38:16]  That motherfucker's fake.
[00:38:17]  I would have encountered him.
[00:38:18]  I spent a lot of time in various woodland places.
[00:38:22]  I just think the Americans.
[00:38:23]  I'm going Yeti 10.
[00:38:25]  Yeah, Yeti's definitely.
[00:38:28]  Definitely.
[00:38:29]  I don't want to go down the rabbit hole of Sasquatch, but I do love those stories.
[00:38:32]  And also for me, that's kind of an easy one because I think it's very possible.
[00:38:36]  Like, if Sasquatch existed, like, the laws of physics wouldn't be altered or anything.
[00:38:42]  Yeah, totally.
[00:38:42]  It's just like, okay, there's like a new primate.
[00:38:46]  Yeah, it's just like, oh, damn.
[00:38:48]  That's bigger than a bear.
[00:38:50]  We didn't discover the gorilla until like the early 1920s, early 1900s.
[00:38:56]  It was like formally discovered by the Western world.
[00:38:58]  They didn't know there were a lot of people.
[00:38:59]  Wait, hold on.
[00:39:00]  What?
[00:39:01]  Yeah.
[00:39:02]  I mean, dude, that's like a good example I use.
[00:39:05]  You just found out about gorillas in the West?
[00:39:07]  In early.
[00:39:09]  And mind you, I'm not a historian.
[00:39:10]  I might be off by a little bit, but it's a good example I like to use that the British colonizers would go over there and hear stories.
[00:39:18]  Like the African people were like, yeah, there's a gorilla.
[00:39:20]  Yeah, no shit.
[00:39:21]  The gorillas exist.
[00:39:22]  And like, we see them all the time.
[00:39:24]  And they are like, oh, yeah, these savages are, you know, making stuff up.
[00:39:28]  You know, like, this is just rumor, blah, blah, blah.
[00:39:31]  I see.
[00:39:31]  And that's how we treat people that live.
[00:39:33]  Yeah.
[00:39:34]  It's interesting.
[00:39:35]  And now it's just normal.
[00:39:35]  It's like a lot of western areas that say they've seen Sasquatch.
[00:39:39]  I mean, I'm real with you.
[00:39:40]  If there was a Sasquatch, I would have encountered.
[00:39:43]  You know, Bigfoot is the California one and Sasquatch is Canadian, right?
[00:39:47]  I think so.
[00:39:48]  That seems right to me.
[00:39:49]  But I got to say, I've encountered a couple of Sasquatches in my time, particularly Beauty Bar, like 2011.
[00:39:58]  I got to tell you.
[00:40:01]  I think northern Canada's got some very dark secrets.
[00:40:04]  There's probably dark secrets.
[00:40:06]  There's something up there.
[00:40:06]  I will say this.
[00:40:08]  If you told me there was a Sasquatch living in the northern provinces of Canada, like in the far north, way up there where the real U.S.-Russian war is happening.
[00:40:18]  Exactly.
[00:40:19]  I'd be like, nah, why not?
[00:40:22]  So, you know, how about UFOs visiting Earth?
[00:40:30]  And by UFOs, I mean alien intelligent life.
[00:40:37]  We're breaking some true and on rules here.
[00:40:39]  But Truanon rules are meant to be broken.
[00:40:40]  Not true.
[00:40:41]  That's because that's the exception that proves the rule.
[00:40:44]  Exactly.
[00:40:44]  So we're exceptioning that proves the rule rules.
[00:40:46]  You said that we would never talk about aliens on this show, although we did do a very good early.
[00:40:51]  We won't get too deep on it because as soon as you get into the government aspect of it and the releases, it gets really complicated.
[00:40:56]  But do you think there's also something like I'm going so, okay, wait, all sorts of things.
[00:41:03]  Let's start with this.
[00:41:04]  Do you think that there's other life outside of Earth?
[00:41:07]  Yes, 10.
[00:41:07]  100%.
[00:41:08]  10.
[00:41:08]  Okay, 10.
[00:41:10]  Do you think that at any point the other life forms have either contacted us or visited in any capacity?
[00:41:19]  Have they been to Earth?
[00:41:21]  Eight.
[00:41:21]  I'm going to say eight.
[00:41:22]  Okay.
[00:41:23]  Well, wait, wait, wait, wait.
[00:41:24]  I'm going to say six on physically been to Earth.
[00:41:28]  Okay.
[00:41:28]  But I'm going to say eight on like communication.
[00:41:33]  Wow.
[00:41:35]  I'm going to say, you know what?
[00:41:37]  This is one I've grappled with for a long time.
[00:41:40]  But we're talking real aliens, right?
[00:41:41]  Not like other dimensions?
[00:41:43]  No, real aliens, like blorbos.
[00:41:45]  Like greys.
[00:41:47]  Yeah.
[00:41:48]  Well, although if you get deep enough into it, I think it might be.
[00:41:52]  It's like the same thing, right?
[00:41:53]  When you kind of like get that far.
[00:41:56]  Well, we can talk about it.
[00:41:57]  Okay.
[00:41:58]  I'm going to say I refuse to answer this question.
[00:42:01]  What?
[00:42:02]  No, you've got to answer the question.
[00:42:03]  All right.
[00:42:04]  I'm going to say gut feeling zero.
[00:42:11]  Okay.
[00:42:12]  God, this guy.
[00:42:13]  You're running under the covers right now.
[00:42:15]  That's fine.
[00:42:16]  Believe me, I'm, you know what?
[00:42:18]  I just started, I just started reading this book, Dreamland, about UFOs.
[00:42:22]  It's really good.
[00:42:23]  Okay.
[00:42:24]  So we'll see if I change my mind after I get past the first chapter.
[00:42:28]  Okay.
[00:42:29]  So as a person who's reporting this stuff and like I'm hearing these stories like back to back to back, every single topic, I'm like, fuck no, I want this to be not a part of my life.
[00:42:40]  I'm not going in person to anything haunted.
[00:42:43]  Totally.
[00:42:44]  Actually, I'll make an exception, like, because I thought about this a lot.
[00:42:47]  Like, I really am not down to go do this.
[00:42:50]  It's not, it's a lose-lose for me.
[00:42:52]  Like, if it's real, lose-lose.
[00:42:55]  The only exception is if somebody really needed help and I was like able to bring somebody to help them, I would probably do that.
[00:43:00]  But that's the only exception.
[00:43:03]  But I wouldn't go for fun.
[00:43:05]  But so I was saying, all of it, I'm like, fuck no, I want nothing to do with it except for UFOs.
[00:43:11]  I would love to see a UFO.
[00:43:13]  Well, that's the only thing.
[00:43:15]  You guys know my buddy Walker from hardcore band Crazy Spirit.
[00:43:21]  He fucking, he saw a UFO dead sober like a few months ago, I think.
[00:43:26]  What it look like?
[00:43:27]  And upstate.
[00:43:30]  He described it like a bunch of lights in the sky moving in a way that was not physically possible.
[00:43:39]  Interesting.
[00:43:39]  And like, he was like, he even cut me off and was like, it wasn't a drone.
[00:43:45]  Like, it wasn't a drone.
[00:43:46]  Yeah.
[00:43:46]  Drone technology has really fucked with our ability to talk and think about it.
[00:43:50]  Everybody else there was, I think, like an acid, except for him.
[00:43:56]  That sounds awful.
[00:43:57]  Yeah.
[00:43:58]  But yeah, yeah.
[00:44:00]  But he was the one who saw it.
[00:44:01]  Yeah, So interesting.
[00:44:03]  I don't know.
[00:44:04]  But, you know, I believe him.
[00:44:06]  So I don't know.
[00:44:07]  I don't know where that puts me on the spectrum.
[00:44:09]  I'm really like thinking about my question, about.
[00:44:11]  You know, if we like, how we want to talk about what UFOs our aliens are like, do we need other dimensions?
[00:44:15]  Do we know, maybe it's all one the same?
[00:44:18]  That's what I'm saying.
[00:44:19]  I mean, I think maybe if we want to talk about the absolute, we can kind of and that's the crazy thing, like I don't want to go.
[00:44:24]  I told Brace that my notes, if you saw them, would look like I took DMT and like had a manic experience last night and just scribbled stuff down.
[00:44:32]  But um yeah, I've just been.
[00:44:34]  You know I pretty much listen to any interesting story I get and what's weird is that you know they're from all different cultures and then you start to see little patterns between them.
[00:44:43]  You know I love and only recently have I gotten to like some places where I'm like oh, this might be something that kind of connects it all.
[00:44:51]  Like there might be and you know what.
[00:44:53]  Like I don't think this needs to be magical or scary, like I think the exciting thing to me is that maybe one day we'll learn something, we'll we'll kind of start to understand this stuff and maybe this won't be scary at all, maybe it'll be just normal if we understand it.
[00:45:09]  I think it would.
[00:45:10]  I think it would still be scary.
[00:45:11]  It'd probably still be scary, but maybe okay, maybe it would be scary.
[00:45:15]  But yeah, I think if you were like hey brace, actually aliens are actually extra dimensional beings that are coming here from using technology and really something beyond even the scope of what we would call technology to visit us, I'd be like yeah, that's definitely scarier than the spaceship thing.
[00:45:34]  Yeah, that's definitely scarier than that.
[00:45:35]  You know what freaks me out?
[00:45:36]  I this just popped in my brain just when we were talking about scaries is like I think the idea of the universe being a simulation is like the most absurd thing I've ever heard in my entire life and is so like narcissistic projection on a level that I can't even that I can't identify anything with right.
[00:45:53]  But it trips me out that some of the like richest craziest, like scientific techno capitalists in the world like have devoted their entire life to proving that that's true and they believe in it like so much.
[00:46:05]  Yeah, that gives me pause, you know, I don't think it's like yeah, and I don't know I'm not a simulation person.
[00:46:12]  I think that's like yeah narcissistic, like why would, if it was like a matrix type situation.
[00:46:16]  It's like why?
[00:46:17]  Yeah, believe me, like we have spent time in a simulation before, mostly involved us getting chased by 11 year old boys.
[00:46:25]  What you don't remember, femboy hooters oh, you mean in the metaverse?
[00:46:31]  Yes, Oh my God.
[00:46:33]  Yeah.
[00:46:34]  I mean, yeah, I don't think so.
[00:46:36]  But I mean, there's definitely some stuff I'm working on and exploring that'll come on later in the show that might be things that I barely even understand.
[00:46:45]  And that's kind of what I was talking about with the CIA documents, Brace is like, and Liz, I think you might be interested.
[00:46:52]  Yeah, let's talk about the gateway process.
[00:46:55]  So what is, so can you explain to our listeners what this is, the gateway process?
[00:47:00]  Okay, I'll.
[00:47:01]  I'll try my best.
[00:47:02]  This is new to, this is sort of new stuff to me.
[00:47:05]  And it's, I'm also going to avoid spoilers that will like ruin my episodes when they come out.
[00:47:10]  But this will be part of the show later.
[00:47:13]  And so anyway, the gateway process in 1983, the U.S. Army, I believe, was conducting these experiments.
[00:47:22]  You've probably heard some version of this.
[00:47:25]  They've tried it a few times throughout history to kind of use psychics for warfare.
[00:47:30]  And this was not psychics, to be clear.
[00:47:33]  They're trying to do something different.
[00:47:35]  They're trying to use mages.
[00:47:37]  Yeah.
[00:47:38]  They're trying to use classic Tolkien wizards.
[00:47:41]  No.
[00:47:44]  They were basically working with this place called the Monroe Institute to try to figure out if they could essentially understand astral projecting and figuring out what it is that, if it's real and like what it is and how they could replicate it for military purposes.
[00:48:05]  Yeah.
[00:48:05]  So the idea behind astral projection is that you can, it's usually through a sleep process, right?
[00:48:12]  That, I mean, theoretically, that there's a kind of like sleep, that you kind of like kind of go into like a deep consciousness state where you can project your own consciousness either into another space in the current timeline or most likely into another dimension in a different timeline.
[00:48:32]  With the idea being that the universe is actually kind of made up of a layer, imagine like a, I don't know, a layer cake or everyone likes funnel cake, right?
[00:48:46]  Layers and kind of, you know, tiers or, I don't know, circles, right?
[00:48:53]  Of different times and spaces, different dimensions that there are dimensions kind of layered through and that you can kind of astral project into other one and other dimensions.
[00:49:05]  And yeah, the CIA, the US Army, they were conducting a bunch of research into this.
[00:49:11]  And it's funny because if you look at the like, I mean, the Monroe Institute is like still around.
[00:49:16]  I mean, like people work with it.
[00:49:18]  It has courses on all of this stuff.
[00:49:20]  It's not too far away from transcendental meditation practices.
[00:49:26]  I was going to say that, yeah.
[00:49:27]  But it is a bit more intensive.
[00:49:29]  It's different.
[00:49:30]  I would say it's like a third cousin.
[00:49:32]  It's all related to the same things.
[00:49:34]  But, okay, so let me give you a little background.
[00:49:36]  And I don't want to spoil it too much, but a couple big stories I have.
[00:49:40]  Most of my show is like little stories from people.
[00:49:43]  I haven't released any of the crazy episodes yet, but a couple of the big ones that like I've been working on for a while.
[00:49:49]  One of them involves this clairvoyant is like the best.
[00:49:54]  She doesn't even call herself that.
[00:49:55]  The woman we talked about?
[00:49:57]  I told you about this person.
[00:49:58]  Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[00:49:59]  And she's read, she's read me.
[00:50:01]  I'm surprisingly very skeptical, even though I don't sound like it on the podcast, but she's read me, like people I know.
[00:50:05]  It's like kind of wild.
[00:50:07]  It's wild.
[00:50:08]  She's got, it's not worth describing.
[00:50:11]  It'll take too long.
[00:50:12]  But anyway, she had like this awakening.
[00:50:18]  And I've talked to her at length about what happened to her like eight years ago.
[00:50:21]  And essentially, she describes it as like, okay, imagine like we're all like light bulbs with energy, like a little dim light bulb.
[00:50:30]  Imagine if one day it's like you're like a Tesla coil and it's just like fucking like beaming into you, like scattering like energy, just like shooting out of you uncontrollably, receiving information.
[00:50:41]  Like she just basically happened to her one day where she had this like awakening.
[00:50:46]  And she, she's described all this in her own words to me.
[00:50:49]  And we've talked at length, but it didn't get spooky to me really until I stumbled across these CIA documents and read about their research.
[00:51:01]  And I'm reading it and I'm like, this is exactly what she's described to me in her own lived experience.
[00:51:07]  And she doesn't know about the CIA papers.
[00:51:09]  I told her about this.
[00:51:10]  And what they're researching, like she's described to me verbatim.
[00:51:15]  And what they're trying to do is what happened to her.
[00:51:18]  And it's pretty interesting.
[00:51:19]  And Liz, your description of the dimension stuff, I'm going to try to have a smarter person eventually than me, than me explain it to me, the gateway process, like what they're thinking.
[00:51:28]  But I think I would think of it instead of like the layers.
[00:51:32]  It's actually not that weird when you think about it.
[00:51:35]  Like, so animals, a lot of animals can see different light waves than us.
[00:51:39]  Like, you know, I think spiders can see ultraviolet.
[00:51:43]  A lot of them, and we're discovering more all the time.
[00:51:47]  So like, so they fundamentally see creatures differently than us.
[00:51:51]  Like there's certain animals that have stripes that are only visible in ultraviolet light or infrared.
[00:51:57]  And other animals just literally see the world different.
[00:51:59]  They could see things that we don't see because we can't see ultraviolet.
[00:52:03]  So theoretically, you know, another way to look at astral projecting is that it's possibly inherently something that we could do that we've just forgotten how to do or distract ourselves from it.
[00:52:21]  Yeah.
[00:52:21]  And then once it's, once you can do it, it's sort of like, I think projecting, in my understanding, is almost like a confusing word because it's more of like receiving, you know, like the stuff's already there.
[00:52:36]  I love that.
[00:52:36]  You're just all of a sudden able to see it, if that makes sense, or understand it.
[00:52:42]  And it's not that ridiculous.
[00:52:46]  It sounds really heady, but and they it's it's even weirder reading like how they think it would happen.

=== Learning to Turn Off the Left Brain (04:26) ===

[00:52:53]  So like, so transcendental meditation, basically you're learning to turn off your left brain.
[00:52:59]  Yeah.
[00:52:59]  You're like trying to put it to sleep.
[00:53:01]  That's what you use.
[00:53:01]  I've, I kind of fell out, but I used to do this.
[00:53:04]  I have my ADHD is too bad.
[00:53:07]  Yeah, like sitting still for.
[00:53:09]  Oh, yeah.
[00:53:09]  I almost went.
[00:53:10]  I've like I did it because of David Lynch.
[00:53:12]  Like, you know, me too.
[00:53:13]  I almost did it because of David Lynch too.
[00:53:15]  I was listening to the audiobook version of learning to, is it called Learning to Fish or something?
[00:53:20]  Yeah.
[00:53:20]  And I highly recommend that because he narrates it.
[00:53:23]  And then just listening to his voice is so entertaining.
[00:53:25]  Literally.
[00:53:25]  And I used to live like not that far from the TM spot in Los Velas.
[00:53:30]  And so I know.
[00:53:32]  And I'd be like, damn, I should go.
[00:53:33]  I'm always hanging out there trying to talk to girls.
[00:53:36]  So when you do that, you're basically learning to turn off your left brain, which controls like executive function, like, you know, decision making, kind of like the computer of your head.
[00:53:48]  You know, it's all of the intelligence, I guess.
[00:53:51]  And the right brain is obviously a creativity, emotions, blah, blah, blah.
[00:53:56]  So you kind of like use this mantra to turn off the left brain and just sort of like, you're essentially trying not to think at all.
[00:54:04]  And when you attach, when you like hook a brain up to, what is it, like an EKG or whatever?
[00:54:12]  What is that machine?
[00:54:13]  Yeah.
[00:54:13]  They've done this to people that are meditating.
[00:54:16]  And basically their left brain like does kind of go dark.
[00:54:19]  So that's TM.
[00:54:22]  Hypnosis, I believe, is like turning off the left brain and a little bit of the right brain and like tapping into specific areas like that light up.
[00:54:31]  And then this is all to say that the gateway process, you're doing this type of meditation that they say takes years to learn, but you're doing a type of meditation that your heart rate, and I'm sorry to anybody smarter than me that's listening and getting annoyed, because I'm not a scientist, but your heart rate.
[00:54:50]  Everyone's smarter than you listens to this podcast.
[00:54:53]  Your heart rate reaches this rhythm, like asyncopated rhythm, essentially, that our heart normally beats at a chaotic rhythm.
[00:55:01]  It's all over the place, you know.
[00:55:03]  But you reach this level of meditation where it actually is like steady, reaches a steady tempo, and your blood starts flowing at an even rate.
[00:55:10]  It's no longer like crashing into each other.
[00:55:12]  It's like a consistent flow and your heart's your heart's beating at a consistent rate and it starts to affect your like brain fluid, I guess.
[00:55:23]  This is from the CIA documents.
[00:55:26]  I don't know anything about this myself, but that essentially you're doing this in a way that's able to activate a certain part of your brain that can then perceive this stuff.
[00:55:36]  And a spooky thing is that it was also mentioned that like this same thing can accidentally happen to people who are like being hit with acoustic waves in the same pattern.
[00:55:49]  Yes.
[00:55:50]  So I've heard that like you, this can happen to truck drivers and people who work on AC ducks.
[00:55:55]  Well, one of the big things with the Monroe Institute, when I was like reading up about them, and this is, I thought about Young Chomsky a lot because what they were talking about is that they were kind of trying to stimulate a lot of these processes through like, what is it?
[00:56:09]  Bioral?
[00:56:11]  Is that how you say it?
[00:56:11]  Binaural.
[00:56:12]  Binaural beats.
[00:56:13]  Beats, but then they had, they said that they had like way more that they're like, that's old technology.
[00:56:19]  Yeah.
[00:56:19]  They were, they're like, but we can't really talk about the ones that's like proprietary, but that they have these like insane sound systems and that like move sound all over the place to kind of stimulate this process.
[00:56:32]  Yeah, they have headphones that I guess produce like an electromagnetic pulse instead of sound waves.
[00:56:40]  And I don't really understand binaural beats.
[00:56:43]  I mean, I first heard of that because it would be like some shit you would download it on Kaza when you were a kid.
[00:56:48]  Or like, remember eye dozer?
[00:56:51]  I do know.
[00:56:51]  Do you know?
[00:56:52]  No.
[00:56:52]  Oh my gosh.
[00:56:53]  You guys don't know eye dozer?
[00:56:54]  Yeah, it was like, oh my God, I can't believe you haven't heard this.
[00:56:58]  Okay.
[00:56:59]  So eye dozer was like a thing in the early 2000s.
[00:57:03]  And it was like high-quality audio files that would supposedly scientifically engineer to replicate certain feelings of like drugs and things like that.
[00:57:13]  So you would download a dose and it would be like cocaine.
[00:57:16]  Cocaine.
[00:57:17]  DMT acid.
[00:57:19]  And then I think the big one.

=== Encountering Mind-Blowing DNA (15:29) ===

[00:57:20]  And I was like, that thing's happening.
[00:57:22]  The big one is hand of God or something like that.
[00:57:24]  And people would have like these crazy stories of like, but the funny thing is that it's like, you know, you're supposed to do it on really good headphones.
[00:57:32]  Like, I think if you even believe the science of this, you need like next level sound systems.
[00:57:37]  Well, I listened to some of the Monroe Institute tapes.
[00:57:40]  Yeah.
[00:57:41]  And didn't work.
[00:57:43]  I'm the world's worst meditator.
[00:57:44]  Actually, you know what?
[00:57:45]  Oh, yeah.
[00:57:45]  I can be okay at it, but yeah, my brain's a little bit different.
[00:57:48]  It's tough.
[00:57:49]  It's a really tough skill to work.
[00:57:51]  And there's like tones and stuff they play during that.
[00:57:55]  The woman I'm working with, like that kind of is the genesis of this, really fascinating lady that I love, but it's funny.
[00:58:03]  She tells me, and she believes that everybody can do this, that it's like, you know, she's not, she says, like, I'm not special.
[00:58:09]  Everybody could learn to do this.
[00:58:10]  Everybody could do this potentially.
[00:58:12]  But it's funny because she does occasionally teach these like classes where she'll try to teach people to do it.
[00:58:18]  And I went to one of them.
[00:58:19]  It did not work.
[00:58:21]  But what's interesting is that you do see like you see everybody trying it and then you see her do it.
[00:58:26]  And like no matter, no matter where you sit on skepticism, you're watching and you're like, okay, she's doing something.
[00:58:34]  Like something is happening right now.
[00:58:36]  Yeah.
[00:58:36]  And then there's also this other element where like seeing the difference between her and the other class, it's kind of like Michael Jordan trying to teach a class on how to dunk to like kids.
[00:58:46]  And he's just like, all right, you grab the basketball and then you dunk.
[00:58:49]  You just jump up and put it in the which, to be fair, is how you do it.
[00:58:53]  I'm going to be honest.
[00:58:54]  Yeah, no, it's just step one, step two.
[00:58:56]  Absolutely.
[00:58:57]  You just, you know, there's some limitations.
[00:58:59]  You know, I can, just as an aside here, I can, I can dunk.
[00:59:03]  Yeah, you're like Mike.
[00:59:04]  Yeah.
[00:59:04]  I've seen you.
[00:59:05]  You just have seen me.
[00:59:05]  Yeah.
[00:59:06]  Yeah, you have too.
[00:59:07]  Yeah.
[00:59:07]  Ever since you got the Chad Extendo surgery.
[00:59:11]  Yeah.
[00:59:12]  So, I mean, I think it makes sense.
[00:59:14]  We might have lost people.
[00:59:15]  I don't know what your audience is like.
[00:59:17]  No way.
[00:59:18]  And if we did, good riddance.
[00:59:19]  But I mean, I think it makes sense because the stuff that you have to, like, I think for the skeptics that are still hanging on listening, I mean, when you think and you understand that, like, the way that we measure everything in the universe, right?
[00:59:33]  Not to get like all like, I don't know, whatever, like science person or whatever.
[00:59:39]  I'm not a science person.
[00:59:40]  But, you know, it's like time is, time is just a, you know, arbitrary measurement of energy that's in motion.
[00:59:48]  Everything in the universe is in motion, right?
[00:59:50]  And we, we kind of like force these markations in order to make sense and organize and narrativize that constant chaotic movement of energy, right?
[01:00:02]  And put some limitations on it in order to kind of like, you know, force it into a way that we can understand and make sense of the world.
[01:00:11]  And so for to like kind of open that up, right?
[01:00:15]  Or like dissolve those boundaries to be able to kind of understand and absorb the like totality of the universe and of being.
[01:00:24]  And that means like in our world in this dimension, in the other dimensions that we can't see, like you say, in like these ultraviolet or inaccessible energy fields, like to me, it makes sense, right?
[01:00:37]  Yes.
[01:00:38]  And like the point you make about animal, I mean, I'm sure that there's like actually a lot of our listeners are going to be like, I haven't talked crazy like this in a while.
[01:00:45]  Oh, no.
[01:00:46]  It's been a minute.
[01:00:47]  But like, I actually do think that people can communicate with animals and like that you can like become and learn like very sensitively how to be in tune with like other species.
[01:01:00]  And I don't know, I think that you can access and like and like that your intuition can be like a muscle that you that you train and that you really like work at and that that can be like part of it.
[01:01:14]  I mean if we're talking intuition, I have probably the greatest intuition of any man alive.
[01:01:19]  This is 100% talking about intuition.
[01:01:21]  Like, that's all this is basically.
[01:01:23]  Because, like, even if you believe the Monroe Institute stuff, like you're not, these aren't, you're not becoming like gods.
[01:01:32]  You just are getting some, like, even the best people.
[01:01:35]  It's, it's kind of still just like scattered info that they can even barely make sense of sometimes.
[01:01:40]  Yeah.
[01:01:41]  So we're not like superpowers, you know?
[01:01:43]  It's like we're still very limited, but it's mostly intuition.
[01:01:47]  And that's like essentially would be the step one of understanding this stuff.
[01:01:53]  And I think that's probably like the most relatable thing is just intuition, like how you know something to be true before it happens or something like that.
[01:02:02]  And I don't know.
[01:02:04]  I think this it definitely, there's probably people listening be like, yo, what kind of, what kind of reefer are they smoking?
[01:02:10]  None.
[01:02:11]  We don't do that here.
[01:02:12]  Dude, I know.
[01:02:13]  We literally just smoked weed.
[01:02:14]  Liz and I smoke probably an ounce a day.
[01:02:17]  I think like is that a lot?
[01:02:18]  Yeah.
[01:02:19]  I think it's like, I don't even know.
[01:02:22]  Now, after getting into this stuff, like, I'm just curious.
[01:02:25]  And honestly, some of the biggest scientific breakthroughs have come from people that at first, everybody thought they were completely insane.
[01:02:32]  DNA is the first thing that comes to mind.
[01:02:35]  I still think that's pretty crazy.
[01:02:37]  Yeah.
[01:02:37]  Oh, you're a DNA denier?
[01:02:39]  No, I'm just over here.
[01:02:40]  That'd be so sick.
[01:02:41]  Liz only believes in RNA.
[01:02:43]  She thinks DNA is fake.
[01:02:45]  My thing with all this stuff is like, this is also what I think about some of the crazier conspiracy theories because I'm just like, what do you got to lose?
[01:02:52]  Dude, just get into it.
[01:02:53]  Who cares?
[01:02:54]  Yeah.
[01:02:54]  Chill out.
[01:02:55]  Google it all.
[01:02:55]  Open your mind, man.
[01:02:57]  It's based.
[01:02:58]  I mean, I'm thinking about this stuff all based in reality.
[01:03:00]  It's like, you know, I don't find this to be nonsense.
[01:03:03]  And what's funny is that, you know, I was like, this was just not a factor in my life before.
[01:03:10]  Like, you know, it's your whole life.
[01:03:12]  We know about that.
[01:03:13]  Yeah.
[01:03:14]  It's not like I'm like a diehard, but what's funny now is like nothing pisses me off more than like the Neil deGrasse Tyson type people that message me.
[01:03:24]  And it's like, like one person, I got one the other day.
[01:03:27]  I don't mean to put this on blast, but I almost get first and last name.
[01:03:30]  Put it out there.
[01:03:31]  Yeah.
[01:03:31]  And email address.
[01:03:33]  And it's not that bad.
[01:03:35]  Somebody was like, okay, I was down with maybe you talking about like spirits and residual energy or whatever, but like gin, like, that's fucking stupid.
[01:03:47]  I can't believe you're entertaining stuff from a made-up religion and like blah, blah, blah.
[01:03:51]  And it's like, yeah, like made, like, it's a hardcore like.
[01:03:54]  So which religion that's not made up?
[01:03:55]  I know, right?
[01:03:55]  Like, yeah, like, there's one.
[01:03:57]  Bro, everything's made up.
[01:03:58]  What do you, we made it all up?
[01:04:00]  Like, what's not made up?
[01:04:02]  Except for thank you.
[01:04:04]  Yeah.
[01:04:05]  It's not going to say that.
[01:04:06]  It's funny when you like encounter those types of people and it's like, all right, like, where do you guys draw?
[01:04:11]  Like, where's the line for you?
[01:04:13]  You're on board with spirits, but like, not another culture.
[01:04:18]  Like, this is literally the same thing, but observed from a different culture.
[01:04:23]  Yeah, we see that all the time on the podcast where people be like, oh, well, I was with you with the Epstein thing, but then, you know, I don't know.
[01:04:30]  You mentioned Hillary Clinton and Huda ate a baby.
[01:04:34]  Huda.
[01:04:35]  I mean, Huda Amedine?
[01:04:38]  I gotta say, we're talking number system zero to ten.
[01:04:42]  It's just funny.
[01:04:43]  I mean, and on the browser trip, the Hillary eating babies definitely throws a curveball variable into what I'm talking about.
[01:04:52]  But with this stuff, it's like the close-mindedness is like, yeah, it's just, it's kind of frustrating.
[01:04:57]  I mean, I don't need people to believe anything, but it's just, it's just funny to encounter that type of person.
[01:05:02]  It's like, all right, like, whatever.
[01:05:04]  And I think this is maybe a good place to wrap it up.
[01:05:06]  But I think the, you know, the thing is, is that when people are sending messages like that, it's sort of like, okay, well, you can be skeptical in your own, like, I don't know, like, like, you're not doing a show that, like you said, that's just reading Wikipedia articles or like debunking things with Neil deGrasse Tyson, the world's biggest bore and worst dinner party guest.
[01:05:28]  He ate everything when we had him over.
[01:05:30]  It's just a bad way to live your life.
[01:05:32]  But you're also just people have these experiences.
[01:05:35]  And so it's like, you're being an asshole about like this person had this insane, unexplained encounter with a broken man.
[01:05:43]  And then her husband runs to the bed.
[01:05:47]  Like, you have to give some of that weight.
[01:05:49]  This was something that changed this person's life for better or worse.
[01:05:53]  This isn't like.
[01:05:54]  Yeah.
[01:05:55]  Yeah.
[01:05:55]  And so I don't know.
[01:05:56]  I think that when it comes to this stuff, believe women.
[01:06:02]  That's what I was saying.
[01:06:04]  I mean, Liz, every person, every person I talk to, it's the same story.
[01:06:09]  They're like, they all say the same thing.
[01:06:10]  And that's kind of what I'm exploring with this show, but they all say the same thing.
[01:06:13]  I didn't believe in this stuff till it happened to me is the number one.
[01:06:16]  Totally.
[01:06:16]  The other thing is that they'll always say, I still don't believe in this stuff, really.
[01:06:21]  And then I'll be like, wait, what?
[01:06:22]  Like, why?
[01:06:23]  You just told me you saw a vivid ghost.
[01:06:25]  They're like, okay, yeah, I mean, that did happen.
[01:06:28]  But I mean, it's, it's this weird cognitive dissidence.
[01:06:31]  And I don't blame people.
[01:06:32]  That's something I'm exploring with the show is that when people do encounter this stuff, it's so mind-blowing and upsetting almost that they would rather just, you know, as soon as you have a look onto the other side, you kind of just want to go back to your simple life.
[01:06:48]  And I understand that too.
[01:06:49]  I mean, I've had a moment myself where I was like, dude, I don't want my, I liked my old life.
[01:06:55]  I don't want to experience that.
[01:06:57]  Like, so I'm just going to try to bottle it up and just forget about that.
[01:07:02]  Like, because it opens up too many questions, right?
[01:07:05]  Like, it opens up too many questions.
[01:07:07]  But that's the thing.
[01:07:08]  It's like people don't believe this stuff until it happens to them.
[01:07:11]  And then as soon as it does, you realize like, oh my God, I want to forget this because I liked things when it was simple.
[01:07:17]  Spooky.
[01:07:18]  Would you guys live in a house that someone had recently died in?
[01:07:22]  I would try to avoid it.
[01:07:24]  I mean, look, the housing market is so crazy right now.
[01:07:28]  It's true.
[01:07:29]  Yeah.
[01:07:29]  I don't think that renters or anyone has that many options.
[01:07:35]  I would try to avoid that.
[01:07:37]  Yeah, I'm not sure.
[01:07:38]  It depends on the death.
[01:07:40]  All right.
[01:07:40]  So my buddy, won't mention him.
[01:07:45]  Won't mention his name rather because I didn't ask him, but I'm sure he wouldn't mind.
[01:07:50]  He sublet his apartment to a like kind of techie guy like 10, 12 years ago, I think, in Brooklyn.
[01:07:59]  Went on tour.
[01:08:00]  While he's on tour, gets a call from his neighbors like, hey, I think there's a dead body in your apartment.
[01:08:05]  Flies back to New York.
[01:08:07]  There had been a dead body in the apartment.
[01:08:09]  The body had melted.
[01:08:12]  Melted?
[01:08:13]  Someone, baby.
[01:08:14]  Been in there for a while.
[01:08:15]  Wait, Bodies melt, Liz.
[01:08:17]  I've seen it.
[01:08:17]  What do you mean, melt?
[01:08:19]  Bodies kind of just melt.
[01:08:21]  So rot.
[01:08:22]  Yeah, kind of.
[01:08:23]  Advanced disintegration, probably.
[01:08:25]  Yeah, it had decomposition.
[01:08:27]  I told you about my experience with the dead body.
[01:08:29]  Yes.
[01:08:30]  Which is.
[01:08:31]  Yeah, we didn't get to your ghost stories yet or whatever you have.
[01:08:34]  Oh, yeah.
[01:08:34]  Well, we will.
[01:08:36]  Okay.
[01:08:37]  The guy had leaving Las Vegas style gone out with duster.
[01:08:45]  Cases of dust off.
[01:08:47]  And had overdosed on dust off and then melted into my friend's couch and his floor.
[01:08:53]  No way.
[01:08:54]  He stayed in the apartment.
[01:08:55]  Got rid of the couch, but I guess he just put a rug over the stain.
[01:09:01]  I couldn't do that.
[01:09:02]  Is this owned or rented apart?
[01:09:03]  San Francisco's sword.
[01:09:04]  This is a rented apartment.
[01:09:05]  Oh, definitely Switch.
[01:09:07]  Yeah.
[01:09:08]  I think he had a good deal.
[01:09:09]  I mean, it's tough.
[01:09:11]  You know?
[01:09:13]  That's so funny.
[01:09:14]  I mean, I do hear those.
[01:09:15]  Those are the other types of story I really like is where like somebody experiences something horrifying and then they kind of stick around.
[01:09:21]  Like one of my favorites, and I'll probably put this out again.
[01:09:23]  This is like an old interview, but this guy told me a story about this girl who he dated that like freaked him out.
[01:09:28]  She was weird from the jump, but then she also said she had some weird spirit stuff going on.
[01:09:33]  And he woke up and eyewitnessed like one of the craziest poltergeist type situations.
[01:09:37]  What?
[01:09:37]  What happened?
[01:09:39]  He said he woke up thinking somebody broke in the house and he hears like basically a person like destroying.
[01:09:45]  He described it as like a person destroying the bathroom.
[01:09:48]  Like he thought it was like an angry ex-boyfriend or something.
[01:09:51]  And he's like ready to go in there and be a tough guy.
[01:09:54]  And she's like, stop, like, like give it light.
[01:09:57]  Like, imagine a bright white light.
[01:09:59]  Imagine a bright white light.
[01:10:01]  And then like the fans start spinning or something, like shit's happening in the room.
[01:10:04]  Crazy.
[01:10:05]  And he's getting more scared of her saying this shit.
[01:10:08]  She's like, she's like, imagine a bright white light.
[01:10:12]  Imagine a bright white light or something like that.
[01:10:14]  Oh, my God.
[01:10:14]  And he wakes up and then he goes into the bathroom.
[01:10:16]  Nobody's in there.
[01:10:17]  It's fucking destroyed.
[01:10:19]  And like, I think he bolts out of the house or something.
[01:10:22]  Like, he eventually talks to her.
[01:10:23]  And like, it's apparently something that happens to her a lot.
[01:10:27]  And then, so, anyway, at the end of the story, he's like, so, dude, like, so, but the funniest part is he's like, he's like, dude, so, like, we, we've ended up breaking up a few months later.
[01:10:36]  And I'm like, wait, a few months later, and he's like, yeah.
[01:10:40]  And I'm like, I'm like, wait, you didn't, like, end it there.
[01:10:43]  And he's like, well, dude, like, she was really hot.
[01:10:46]  Classic, classic, stupid.
[01:10:48]  I mean, same thing happened to me.
[01:10:50]  I was laughing in his face.
[01:10:51]  I'm like, bro, you were going back there to Smash?
[01:10:54]  And he's like, you got to understand, dude.
[01:10:57]  I mean, same thing happened to me.
[01:10:58]  Liz, one time I was in Presidio.
[01:11:01]  I don't know.
[01:11:02]  You've been to SF, right, Jack?
[01:11:03]  Yeah.
[01:11:04]  You know, like the Presidio, like the kind of like green area.
[01:11:06]  It's technically Federal.
[01:11:07]  Yeah.
[01:11:08]  Were you at the Pet Cemetery?
[01:11:09]  No, I wasn't.
[01:11:09]  Although that is a great place.
[01:11:11]  If you are in San Francisco, great place to go on a date is the Pet Cemetery.
[01:11:14]  Yeah, Classic, dude.
[01:11:16]  But I don't think, is that technically the Presidio?
[01:11:18]  That's like underneath the freeway.
[01:11:19]  Isn't it kind of Presidio in my head?
[01:11:22]  It's beneath the regular graveyard.
[01:11:23]  Anyways, I'm walking through, not walking through the Pet Cemetery, not walking through the graveyard, just walking down the streets.
[01:11:28]  People live there in the Presidio trying to get to the PresidiGo bus.
[01:11:32]  And I meet a girl there, or there's just like another girl walking on the street that I talk to, get her number, and notice she had this kind of like choker on.
[01:11:44]  And, you know, crazy enough, we hang out, we go on a date, we go to Beats Burgers.
[01:11:50]  You just pick up that girl?
[01:11:52]  Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[01:11:53]  And, you know, we start, we start necking, and I try to take her choker off.
[01:11:57]  She's fake.
[01:11:59]  Head falls off.
[01:12:00]  Oh, my God.
[01:12:02]  I was excited where this was going.
[01:12:04]  No, I wouldn't talk to you.
[01:12:07]  Wait, but do you not have any real ghost stories?
[01:12:10]  I have not ever encountered.
[01:12:12]  My friend Trent's house when I was younger, we thought was haunted, but it was also just because his stairway was really dark.
[01:12:20]  That was, and I think the dark stairway kind of scared me.
[01:12:23]  But he said, I think he said he saw a ghost.
[01:12:25]  I should hit him up about that.
[01:12:27]  I have, no, you know what?
[01:12:31]  I haven't really.
[01:12:32]  I mean, I told you, I said this on the show before.
[01:12:34]  Like, I stole basically everything from Graham Parsons Memorial in Joshua Tree.
[01:12:41]  Like, I stole his entire shrine, all of the cigarettes and money and alcohol people left there because I needed it.

=== Waking Into Paralysis (09:27) ===

[01:12:49]  But no ghost from there.
[01:12:52]  And I was staying in the room that he like died in or like stayed.
[01:12:54]  I don't think Graham Parsons hangs out there.
[01:12:56]  I think everyone's too fucking annoyed.
[01:12:57]  He's in heaven because he's a hell of a band up there.
[01:13:00]  He's like, oh my God, my fans are such fucking losers.
[01:13:03]  Why do they wear all these hats?
[01:13:04]  The grievous angel.
[01:13:06]  But I, you know, I have not really.
[01:13:10]  No, I don't actually really get scared.
[01:13:12]  I mean, Leon Secret, so how could you get scared?
[01:13:16]  Yeah, I know I know secondhand ghost stories, but no, I once saw a really scary spider.
[01:13:22]  Yeah, so you can't get scared of classic Halloween decor type stories.
[01:13:27]  Like I said, I do think it would be so fucking funny to like ruin my podcast by doing stories about like somebody who sees a jack-o'-lantern floating in the street.
[01:13:36]  So, Liz, you teased this at the beginning.
[01:13:39]  You have encountered ghosts.
[01:13:40]  Yeah.
[01:13:41]  You've actually never told me this.
[01:13:43]  Okay, so this was like maybe I can't remember, maybe like six or seven years ago.
[01:13:49]  It was around Thanksgiving.
[01:13:51]  Yeah.
[01:13:52]  And I was visiting my friend who lives on Bainbridge Island, which is outside of Seattle.
[01:13:59]  You have to like take the little ferry boat there.
[01:14:02]  And she lived, I mean, she still lives there, but in a different place.
[01:14:06]  But this was like, it was like a very secluded little house.
[01:14:10]  And her room was on the second floor.
[01:14:14]  I was staying in a room kind of like off the kitchen on the first floor.
[01:14:18]  And there were like windows all around.
[01:14:22]  It was a very cool room.
[01:14:23]  It was like you walk in, the bed was right on the left, and then there was just sort of like three walls of windows.
[01:14:28]  So the bed was facing a full wall of window, almost like an enclosed porch or something, but it was like actually a bedroom.
[01:14:35]  And it was in that kind of like Pacific Northwest, like, you know, there's kind of like green pottery everywhere, walnut, and it's very like.
[01:14:43]  Pacific Northwest.
[01:14:44]  Yeah.
[01:14:45]  A little like arts and craftsy.
[01:14:49]  Anyways, very cozy.
[01:14:51]  But I was staying there and it was like the middle of the night.
[01:14:56]  I woke up and I looked.
[01:14:59]  I think it was like one or two o'clock in the morning.
[01:15:04]  And I woke up and I couldn't move.
[01:15:06]  Like I had this weird feeling like I couldn't move.
[01:15:10]  Like I, and it wasn't like I was being like pressed down or held down, but it was like my brain couldn't get my arm, like my body to move.
[01:15:18]  Yeah.
[01:15:18]  Yeah.
[01:15:19]  Like the connection, the mind-body connection was frozen.
[01:15:23]  And I started freaking out because that's like doesn't make sense as a feeling.
[01:15:28]  And I look over and at the foot of the bed, there is an old woman sitting.
[01:15:35]  Oh, God.
[01:15:35]  She's sitting at the end of the bed, like facing the window to my left.
[01:15:40]  Yeah.
[01:15:40]  And I just, it was, it was the craziest.
[01:15:45]  I was like gasped and I couldn't, like, I couldn't scream, which, by the way, is like something that I think about all the time, which is like, oh my God, in this moment, I couldn't, like, my body couldn't scream, which is a very scary feeling.
[01:15:59]  And I just was like, and I remember reaching to like try to touch it.
[01:16:05]  And at that moment, it kind of turned to look at me, but it was this like shadowy figure.
[01:16:12]  I mean, you have to understand, like, so with the windows, it was like pitch black blue.
[01:16:16]  The star, there's so many fucking stars because there's no lights out on Bainbridge Island.
[01:16:21]  Like, it's just pitch black.
[01:16:23]  You're just right up in the sky.
[01:16:25]  That's all you're seeing.
[01:16:26]  And it kind of like, I was like trying to reach out for it, but it's like really fucking dark in this room.
[01:16:34]  I like can't breathe.
[01:16:35]  It kind of turns.
[01:16:37]  And then I just like closed my eyes, opened them, and it was gone.
[01:16:40]  And I jolted out of bed and I ran up to my friend's room where she and her dog were.
[01:16:47]  And I like creaked open the door.
[01:16:49]  And then I was like, what the fuck am I doing?
[01:16:50]  I'm not going to wake my friend up.
[01:16:51]  Like, this is insane.
[01:16:52]  What just happened?
[01:16:53]  I don't know.
[01:16:53]  And then I'm just like running through my head.
[01:16:55]  And I'm like, I don't know what to do.
[01:16:56]  I don't know what to do.
[01:16:57]  And I just like got back in the bed and I was just sitting there like, and I was like saying out loud, like, please go away, please go away, please go away.
[01:17:05]  And I was like, so scared.
[01:17:06]  And then I finally fell back asleep.
[01:17:08]  But I remember it so, so vividly.
[01:17:10]  And it was this woman who like was like crone looking.
[01:17:15]  Like, I don't know how to describe it, like dark, crone-ish, like, um, like a Whistler painting.
[01:17:21]  Like, that's what it looked like.
[01:17:23]  Yeah.
[01:17:24]  I'm opening fire.
[01:17:25]  Yeah.
[01:17:26]  I mean, it was just like sitting there calmly and I couldn't, and I couldn't scream.
[01:17:32]  That's all I remember.
[01:17:33]  And oof, ugh.
[01:17:34]  That is very spooky.
[01:17:36]  And I will say that that does sound a lot like sleep paralysis.
[01:17:39]  How much do you know about sleep paralysis?
[01:17:41]  Yeah, I do, but I know.
[01:17:44]  And then the other thing that it could, and I don't mean to be to poo-poo, because I don't think this is poo-pooing anymore, but like it could also be hypnagogic hallucinations, something I used to have.
[01:17:57]  It's related to insomnia, but you used to hallucinate in the middle of the night, Jack?
[01:18:01]  Yeah, I thought I told you that.
[01:18:02]  I would wake up.
[01:18:04]  For me, it was in the morning.
[01:18:05]  And I think that's like hypnopompic hallucinations, it's called.
[01:18:08]  It might be the other way around, but my sleep was so bad that I would wake up and have waking hallucinations while I'd walk around for like a minute.
[01:18:14]  What?
[01:18:15]  It was fucking insane.
[01:18:16]  For me, I would see my house on fire.
[01:18:18]  Like it would be a realistic fire starting in my home.
[01:18:21]  Like it would start.
[01:18:22]  Jesus.
[01:18:23]  I would usually see it like I would see smoke billowing up from like one of the doorways and then like Boy Scout mode kind of kick in.
[01:18:31]  I would like literally, I'm awake.
[01:18:33]  So I'm like doing this stuff.
[01:18:33]  I'd like go feel like put my back of my hand up to the door, like feel it, like eventually start like fighting a fire.
[01:18:41]  And then I would, it would just disappear before my eyes.
[01:18:44]  But so upon the diagnosis of this, I started going on these forums and like I realized I was lucky because other people saw really fucked up stuff.
[01:18:53]  And one of the things people saw would be like an old woman in the corner of their room.
[01:18:56]  Interesting.
[01:18:57]  Yeah.
[01:18:58]  But, you know, so I would, so, so that's one of the things and sleep paralysis that makes me like I've never had that before or any kind of insomnia.
[01:19:08]  Well, yeah.
[01:19:09]  And I mentioned that in like one of the episodes, and I also say that like, I didn't think this was paranormal ever, because like to get to that point, you have to, you really fuck yourself up.
[01:19:20]  Like, it's not like that was just all of a sudden.
[01:19:24]  This was like a year of me knowing like, I am not living right.
[01:19:27]  I feel like shit every day.
[01:19:29]  I have, I'm dizzy when I drive.
[01:19:31]  Like, I can't, like, it's painful experiencing for a free vision.
[01:19:36]  Like, it's bad.
[01:19:36]  Like, so, yeah, I never thought it was paranormal.
[01:19:40]  But then, sleep paralysis too is like, it's one of those things that I used to write it off as not paranormal, but then somebody recently pointed out to me, like, yeah, they don't know what it is.
[01:19:51]  He's like, science just named it.
[01:19:53]  They don't know what it is.
[01:19:54]  Like, they just gave it a name.
[01:19:55]  They're like, oh, it's sleep paralysis.
[01:19:57]  They still don't know what it is.
[01:19:58]  I mean, there's some interesting theories about it, but you never know.
[01:20:02]  I mean, I don't know.
[01:20:03]  I just remember that happening.
[01:20:05]  Or scary.
[01:20:06]  Or it has nothing to do with anything.
[01:20:08]  And it's just like you just saw some kind of spirit.
[01:20:11]  Or maybe it's something where like, sort of what we were talking about.
[01:20:14]  Or like a waking dream or something.
[01:20:17]  Yeah.
[01:20:17]  Or, or Liz, like, and not to get too heady, but when we're talking about the gateway process type stuff, so, and I mean, this is, I know this is like kind of a little much, but part of me wonders, like, are there just kind of like these moments or states that we could briefly get into where we're just seeing things that we, that are there, but we normally can't see them, right?
[01:20:44]  Like we're talking about the folded dimensions and where it's like, maybe you reached this rhythm or state when you were kind of relaxing and going to bed where you all of a sudden were able to see something that your brain normally isn't able to see, right?
[01:21:01]  That's, I like that.
[01:21:02]  That's comforting.
[01:21:03]  That's it's more comforting.
[01:21:07]  Because I think that means that there's a sort of like we have an ability in us to be much more sensitive than we can even comprehend.
[01:21:17]  And I think that's like a very beautiful word.
[01:21:19]  Like thinking about that and what that kind of like potentials there, I think are very, very heartening.
[01:21:25]  Maybe it's not, and maybe it's not even like a layer of reality.
[01:21:30]  Maybe it's like an enhanced intuition where you're like picking up on just the fact that somebody used to live there that looked like or I don't know.
[01:21:39]  Maybe it's some distortion.
[01:21:40]  It was a creepy woman, but I have no idea.
[01:21:43]  I have no idea, but it's like, it could be so many things.
[01:21:47]  I know I'm definitely sounding like I'm smoking the reefer again.
[01:21:51]  No, I love it.
[01:21:52]  I'm very open in a lot of ways.
[01:21:55]  Because in some ways not.
[01:21:56]  And I want to hear your other story, but like the amount that I get, that's why I started doing this because I was doing it for fun.
[01:22:03]  I was like, let's get a funny ghost story to tell on you, but still.
[01:22:07]  And then I asked people, I'm like, hey, does anybody have a spooky story?
[01:22:09]  And I got hundreds of terrifying submissions about like serious eyewitness things, crazy stuff.

=== Keep Finding Crazy Stuff (02:28) ===

[01:22:17]  I talked to a listener that got human trafficked, non-paranormal, but like it escalated to the point where I had to start this.
[01:22:24]  And now in the last, honestly, that article that just came out really amplified it.
[01:22:29]  But like all of a sudden, like all these people that are close to me in my life that are just what you call very hyper normal people, I would say, have come forward being like, oh, yeah, I have like seen this crazy thing that was on your show.
[01:22:45]  I've never talked to anybody about it.
[01:22:47]  And I'm having like family friends who are the most normal people of all time telling me like, oh yeah, I saw like this demon one time.
[01:22:55]  And just like, and it's just wild because it's like, it's funny just what people kind of keep to themselves, right?
[01:23:02]  And then never talk to anybody about.
[01:23:05]  There's so much of it.
[01:23:07]  So many people are seeing this stuff that it's like, all right, something's happening.
[01:23:11]  Like something's going on.
[01:23:13]  This is such a huge population.
[01:23:15]  Even if we're, even if these people are crazy, we're all crazy in the same way.
[01:23:18]  So maybe we need to figure that out too.
[01:23:21]  Right?
[01:23:22]  Well, I think that's a fantastic place to wrap this bad boy up.
[01:23:26]  Okay.
[01:23:27]  Yeah.
[01:23:27]  Where can everyone, everyone can listen to the podcast?
[01:23:30]  Where?
[01:23:31]  Wherever you find podcasts.
[01:23:33]  It's called Otherworld.
[01:23:35]  Maybe you could put a link to it in the description if you're feeling nice.
[01:23:39]  You know what?
[01:23:40]  We are going to do that.
[01:23:40]  We're going to do that.
[01:23:41]  Yeah.
[01:23:42]  So this is the first season.
[01:23:44]  I'm actually calling it season zero.
[01:23:47]  I was supposed to do, I was originally going to do like six episodes, but it's a lot more than that now.
[01:23:52]  I think I have like 17 already recorded.
[01:23:54]  Oh my gosh.
[01:23:55]  Fantastic.
[01:23:57]  And there might be more, but I'm going to have to draw a line at some point.
[01:24:01]  Like seriously, because I kind of keep finding some stuff.
[01:24:05]  And yeah, I'll have to draw a line at a certain point.
[01:24:08]  Be like, all right, this season's done.
[01:24:10]  Well, we're so excited.
[01:24:11]  And we know our listeners are going to keep an open mind and they should check it out.
[01:24:14]  We'll put a link in the show notes.
[01:24:17]  And Jack, thank you so much for coming.
[01:24:19]  Thank you.
[01:24:20]  Thanks for having me.
[01:24:21]  I hope they don't think I'm crazy.
[01:24:42]  Wow, Brace, I learned a lot.
[01:24:44]  Me too.

=== A Dog and a Scurrying Rat (03:08) ===

[01:24:45]  And it really reminds me of a story that happened to me when I was younger.
[01:24:53]  Well, okay, I'm trying to remember the plot of Scary Movie too, and I can't right now.
[01:24:59]  Did it have a plot?
[01:25:00]  Oh, no.
[01:25:01]  My favorite story.
[01:25:02]  So, by the way, listeners, Liz has never even heard of, let alone read, any of the scary stories to tell in the dark books.
[01:25:09]  Yeah, I don't even know what that is.
[01:25:10]  So, I've been trying to repeat them all day as if they happened to me to scare her.
[01:25:14]  But one of the- But I sussed them out real quick.
[01:25:16]  My favorite story from those books is a story that is just literally not a scary story, but it's told in that way.
[01:25:24]  It's like a couple went to Mexico and purchased a dog, a rare breed of dog, from a dog vendor in Guadalajara.
[01:25:34]  They bring it back, and it's the dog acts funky.
[01:25:36]  He's like always sniffing around on the trash and like scurrying.
[01:25:40]  He's like more scurrying than walking.
[01:25:42]  But you know, he's a short-haired chihuahua.
[01:25:44]  And they're like, all right, you know, that's just like it's a unique dog.
[01:25:47]  It's the kind of dog you buy in Guadalajara.
[01:25:50]  And then one day, I can't remember what else happens in the story, but like someone looks at the dog and it's like, actually, you just got a big ass rat.
[01:26:01]  I feel like that's vaguely racist.
[01:26:02]  No, yeah, I kind of do too, because I'm like, no, Mexican is going to sell you a rat.
[01:26:07]  However, I will.
[01:26:08]  Who would think that a rat is a dog?
[01:26:11]  Yeah.
[01:26:12]  I don't know.
[01:26:14]  I mean, you know what?
[01:26:15]  I bet I could trick someone into thinking a rat is a dog.
[01:26:18]  I think I could do that.
[01:26:19]  You think you could?
[01:26:20]  I got a big enough rat.
[01:26:22]  I could do that.
[01:26:22]  You know what's the type of guy you don't see anymore?
[01:26:24]  The guy who performs the rat.
[01:26:26]  Yes.
[01:26:26]  Well, so there was in San Francisco a guy who had the dog.
[01:26:30]  The dog and the rat.
[01:26:31]  And yeah, so those who have never seen it, it was a dog.
[01:26:33]  This was crazy.
[01:26:35]  Cat on top of it.
[01:26:37]  And then on top of that motherfucker.
[01:26:39]  A rat.
[01:26:40]  And they drove him out of San Francisco because they said he was drugging the dogs or drugging the animals.
[01:26:45]  I gotta be real.
[01:26:46]  You think he was?
[01:26:47]  Yeah, he probably was.
[01:26:48]  I thought they were just all friends.
[01:26:49]  A rat is just chilling with all the garbage in the city.
[01:26:54]  Man, it doesn't really make much sense.
[01:26:55]  Yeah.
[01:26:57]  But it's true.
[01:26:57]  You don't see a lot of like traveling guys, rat performers.
[01:27:01]  No, I did.
[01:27:02]  This is not a joke.
[01:27:03]  I did lose my virginity to one of those people who had a rat like scurrying around their sweatshirts.
[01:27:08]  Remember those people when you were younger?
[01:27:10]  She had a hairless rat.
[01:27:11]  She also had a bald ass head herself.
[01:27:13]  You and the bald woman.
[01:27:15]  I mean, I was 14.
[01:27:17]  All right.
[01:27:18]  Well, dear listeners, have a happy Halloween.
[01:27:22]  And remember, don't cook with too much garlic or I'll suck your D. My name, of course, is both the doctor and the monster Hitler.
[01:27:38]  I'm Liz.
[01:27:39]  And of course, we are joined by producer Young Chomsky.
[01:27:42]  The podcast is called Bruanan Master.
[01:27:52]  And we'll see you next time.