True Anon Truth Feed - Episode 176: Lyndon LaRouche: The Assassin's Creed Aired: 2021-08-18 Duration: 01:06:43 === Cute Socks Threat (03:21) === [00:00:00] Check out this fucking sap. [00:00:02] What is it's a blackjack? [00:00:05] What's a blackjack? [00:00:07] It's a I only know the card game blackjack. [00:00:10] Yeah, yeah. [00:00:11] I'm not sure which came from. [00:00:12] I assume some form of this has existed for a long time, but it's a leather thing kind of shaped like a rattle or something, like a paddle. [00:00:21] Yeah. [00:00:22] It's like a baby paddle. [00:00:23] Well, not a baby paddle. [00:00:24] That's not a sound. [00:00:25] Not a baby paddle. [00:00:26] No. [00:00:27] It's got a little strap here for the old hand to slip into and is filled with a lead ball. [00:00:33] Why? [00:00:36] Well, okay, let's use context clues here. [00:00:39] Are you like going to hit someone with it? [00:00:42] I don't want to hit anybody with it. [00:00:43] Why do you have that? [00:00:44] To hit someone with it. [00:00:45] It is a blackjack for hitting people in the head with to knock them out. [00:00:48] Oh my God. [00:00:49] It's also called a sap. [00:00:50] Here I'm the sap because I don't want to hit anybody in the head. [00:00:55] Listen, I will, if you ever insult Liz, my Liz, I will come to your house, sneak up on you stealthily, hit you in the back of the neck with this just one time and knock you out while I rifle through your possessions. [00:01:11] But just really softly because you don't want to hurt anybody. [00:01:13] Yeah. [00:01:14] Yeah, true. [00:01:14] I'm going to read your journal. [00:01:16] I'm going to look at, I'm going to Google your psych meds. [00:01:19] You're going to tweet their diary, live tweet their diary. [00:01:22] Now that is a threat, if you ask me. [00:01:25] Yeah, yeah. [00:01:25] I'm going to take some of your socks and do and put them on, get them all sweated. [00:01:29] But not tell them. [00:01:30] Don't tell them which socks. [00:01:32] You put them on and then you put them back. [00:01:34] Then I'm going to suck your dick. [00:01:59] Before I say hello to everyone, I got to say, God bless the person who wrote in and asked us to bleep out the profanity. [00:02:07] Because I don't know how you would do that. [00:02:10] I mean, I think that Young Chomsky could figure out lots of things, but we would just speak around using profanity in such creative ways that I think it would be impossible to make the show family friendly. [00:02:27] I apologize to the man that wrote in. [00:02:30] I think it was a man that wrote in. [00:02:32] Ada, it took me like, I would say 120 episodes to realize that Young Chomsky bleeps. [00:02:38] Because I was like, why does he bleep swear words sometimes? [00:02:40] He only bleeps them when I swear at you. [00:02:42] I know. [00:02:43] I think it's so cute. [00:02:44] It's not cute. [00:02:45] No, I look like a pussy. [00:02:49] Exactly. [00:02:50] You do look like a pussy saying that to me. [00:02:53] Don't say that to me. [00:02:54] You know what? [00:02:54] You want to look like a man? [00:02:55] Don't speak to a woman like that. [00:02:57] Hello, everyone. [00:02:59] Hello. [00:03:04] I'm Liz. [00:03:06] I am the lion of Kabul. [00:03:08] Brace, we are, of course, joined by Sheikh Young Chomsky, and we are Talbanon. [00:03:15] That didn't really work out so bad. [00:03:17] So well. [00:03:17] Can I tell, okay, can I tell the listeners something? === Lion of Kabul (05:53) === [00:03:21] Go ahead. [00:03:22] This morning, I awoke from slumber from a little notification on the old Tronon group chat. [00:03:33] Little Brace Belden wrote us a message this morning that said, hey, do you guys mind if I DM the Taliban from the podcast? [00:03:43] So, okay, first of all, I wrote that at like a pretty, I wrote that like 10 p.m. last night or like 11. [00:03:48] I got a new time zone, baby. [00:03:50] I don't know. [00:03:50] Yeah, yeah, true. [00:03:51] But so it wasn't like I was like at 6 a.m. being like, what are they thinking? [00:03:56] But yeah, I mean, it's like, I don't like them or anything. [00:04:00] You know, I just feel like I did, I did do that, by the way. [00:04:04] I think we both said no. [00:04:06] Oh, I didn't. [00:04:08] Well, when I woke up this morning, there was like 40 messages in there and I'm only reading the ones that are immediately. [00:04:13] I just never scroll up. [00:04:14] Not my problem. [00:04:15] If you guys have something important to say. [00:04:16] Here's your problem. [00:04:17] It's actually, that's the, if there's a definition of problem, that would be it. [00:04:21] That would be the only problem. [00:04:21] The definition of problem actually would be me having you on my back. [00:04:26] Well, good thing I'm not on your back. [00:04:27] You're looking right at my face. [00:04:29] Well, we've kind of cats out of the bag on that. [00:04:32] We're doing an Afghanistan episode. [00:04:33] Nah! [00:04:38] Much like the government of Kabul, we were taken by, actually, you know, I kind of saw this coming. [00:04:42] I was hoping that they would wait. [00:04:43] Maybe you just saw it coming. [00:04:45] They announced that they were withdrawing troops for six months. [00:04:48] They give a six-month warning that the U.S. was bouncing. [00:04:52] Everyone knew the Taliban was coming. [00:04:54] I know, but once, I'm going to say I saw it coming as of like a week and a half ago when they just started handing towns over to them without like firing a shot. [00:05:00] Yeah, yeah. [00:05:01] That's, yeah. [00:05:03] Yeah, I think the U.S. officials looking aghast are, you know, doing a little acting themselves. [00:05:09] Exactly. [00:05:10] I mean, you would have to be a fucking more, I mean, they, the, the, famously, uh, the, the defense of this was never going to go very well. [00:05:20] I mean, I think that has been basically the consensus of everybody from all parts of the, uh, the political spectrum on this. [00:05:26] And that turned out to be true. [00:05:27] In fact, it turned out to be truer than most people thought. [00:05:30] And obviously there were some deals made, which I would love to see the details of. [00:05:36] But president. [00:05:37] There's wheeling and dealings all over the place. [00:05:40] Yeah. [00:05:41] Yeah. [00:05:41] Continued wheeling and dealing. [00:05:43] The president has left the country. [00:05:46] And I spent a long time last night looking at his family's social media likes. [00:05:53] Yeah. [00:05:54] And I found one. [00:05:55] Highly educated family. [00:05:57] Highly educated family. [00:06:00] Daughter, actually, the movie she made actually looks kind of good. [00:06:02] I would like to see it. [00:06:04] Oh, yeah. [00:06:04] She has a movie out. [00:06:06] She was supposed to be giving a talk at the Roxy Theater, which is like a really small theater in San Francisco where I once got in a fight in front of Rocky Erickson at. [00:06:15] Really? [00:06:16] Yeah, I got in a fist fight with Max Retard right in front of Rocky Erickson. [00:06:22] That's a nickname. [00:06:23] Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. [00:06:24] But so she was supposed to give a talk about her movie on Afghanistan at the Roxy the night that Kabul fell in person. [00:06:31] And I really wonder if that happened. [00:06:33] Great timing. [00:06:34] But yeah, look, it's, you know, I got to say, nobody seems particularly like people, people have no idea what to say about it. [00:06:45] And yet everyone's saying everything. [00:06:48] Yeah. [00:06:49] There's takes all over the place. [00:06:51] I've seen some very insane, weird defenses of the Taliban, which is like, I don't understand that at all. [00:06:59] I don't know. [00:07:00] I don't want, here's my thing. [00:07:02] I don't want to hear what anyone has to say about Afghanistan. [00:07:05] Well, I'd like to hear what the Taliban have to say about it. [00:07:07] Well, I'd like to hear what you say, actually, Brace. [00:07:09] I'd like to hear your opinion about things. [00:07:11] But yeah, I'm not liking a lot of the commentary. [00:07:18] I don't know. [00:07:19] I find something very, I find the whole thing very depressing, I gotta say. [00:07:22] I mean, I think what's gonna happen is that like, I think the Taliban has probably changed to, I mean, has changed to some degree since the last time they took Kabul. [00:07:32] This time, I think all the foreign embassies, most, well, I shouldn't say that. [00:07:36] I think many of the foreign embassies will stay open. [00:07:38] I think that instead of receiving just like weird barrels of like money from the Saudis in Pakistan like last time, they'll probably get maybe significant infrastructure infusions from China. [00:07:53] But yeah, I mean. [00:07:54] Well, yeah, it's a total vacuum. [00:07:57] I mean, Russia and China are going to have to step in where the U.S. is stepping out because that's how it works. [00:08:01] You know what I mean? [00:08:03] Yeah. [00:08:04] It's not exactly. [00:08:07] I mean, that's just, that's like the, that's just the case and how it works when world power, you know, waning world power or whatever, exits the occupation like that. [00:08:20] Yeah. [00:08:21] I will say in the 1980s when the Chinese government, the revisionist Chinese government was funding, funding Maju Hadin groups instead of the Maoist groups. [00:08:34] They made a serious mistake, I thought, but possibly long benefit in the future. [00:08:39] I'm one of those guys who are like, the Chinese think in terms of centuries, not any effect. [00:08:44] People love saying that. [00:08:45] No Chinese guy is thinking in terms of centuries. [00:08:48] Nobody in the world is thinking in terms of centuries. [00:08:52] If you look at the Atlantic, that is like the one thing you love to say. [00:08:56] Yeah. [00:08:56] Well, I also like to say the dragon rises. [00:08:58] So, in the case of Afghanistan and possible, you know, maybe they'll, maybe they'll add a debelt and road. [00:09:06] Yeah. [00:09:06] The dragon rises. [00:09:08] Anyways, we will hopefully be getting the Taliban on the show as soon as possible. [00:09:12] But that's not why we've gathered you here today. === The Dragon Rises (05:03) === [00:09:15] I was just trying to think, oh, we haven't really gathered them here, but we have. [00:09:18] They're all listening. [00:09:19] Hello, everyone. [00:09:20] Well, we put in, what's that shit that someone was telling me about this the other day? [00:09:24] It's like they put it in commercials, like silent binaural sound or something. [00:09:28] What? [00:09:29] Some shit. [00:09:30] It's like they commercials or companies put in like a subsonic or whatever sound in the commercials. [00:09:37] Like Manson. [00:09:41] Sure. [00:09:42] Did he do that? [00:09:44] I think he just played the doors really loud. [00:09:47] Oh, yeah. [00:09:47] And backwards. [00:09:49] Yeah. [00:09:50] But we put in sounds that you can't hear that make you feel hungry when you listen to the podcast. [00:09:57] Dogs can understand it, though. [00:09:59] Well, it's half our listenership. [00:10:02] So we're not here to talk to you about binaurals or bisexuals or bilateral relations between Afghanistan and China. [00:10:10] We're here to talk to you about, I'm trying to think of a byword for this, or a byword. [00:10:16] We're here to talk to you about one of the most important men in a biennial in American history. [00:10:24] Actually, one of the, definitely not the most important men in American history, but a fascinating figure and somebody whose life, I think, in work reflects on what we do here and what a lot of people that we associate with do. [00:10:38] Then that man is Lyndon LaRouche. [00:10:43] Lyndon LaRouche. [00:10:44] I feel like, you know, it is true. [00:10:46] It's weird to say that he has had a big influence. [00:10:49] And yet I do think that he has. [00:10:52] I think a lot of his kind of worldview has kind of diffused through, I don't know, a kind of like paranoia political culture that we definitely, you know, take a part of, I think, like you say, but I do think we are not LaRouche. [00:11:08] No, I mean, so I was, I was talking to a, uh, to a former LYM, that's LaRouche Youth Movement member the other day, a guy I actually met before. [00:11:18] And he was telling me, Me is like, yeah, like I got into it through Webster Tarpley, uh, you know, appearing on Alex Jones's show. [00:11:26] And through Webster Tarpley, I got, you know, I found LaRouche videos, and LaRouche seemed like in 2008, a really smart guy. [00:11:32] So, LaRouche, I think, is fascinating to me because he really embodies something that I think we encounter a lot in our work. [00:11:41] And I think a lot of people who do similar sort of shows that we do or research that we do probably encounter a lot too in both their work and in sort of how they view things, which is that he really embodies like this man with a really thin membrane between what's real and what's maybe real. [00:12:01] And then the sort of interplay, the dialectic between those two that goes on with LaRouche sews up into a pattern that is sometimes decipherable, sometimes indecipherable. [00:12:13] But it's, it's, he is somebody who has, I think, had actually a pretty wide influence. [00:12:17] And I have always sort of thought of him as a kook who maybe occasionally stumbled on a few good ideas, but really had no impact. [00:12:26] Yeah, crank, like a guy mimeographing newsletters in his room. [00:12:29] And you know, he had the magazine and everything like that. [00:12:31] But you know, he's like the head of the organization that has the guys at train stops, the Obamas with the Hitler mustaches. [00:12:36] Yeah, yeah, yeah. [00:12:37] All the tables everywhere. [00:12:38] I sometimes call the kind of what you're what you're kind of gesturing towards, um, intellectually and physically, I should say, as racist want to use lots of hand motions. [00:12:50] Wow, anti-Semitic, anti-Semitic. [00:12:55] I sometimes call it Confucianism, which is this kind of like I think the only way to kind of describe it will be as we kind of go through LaRouche's life and like you said, and his work and his organization. [00:13:12] But it is this sort of like, it's like a Marxism without class forces or a kind of like populist humanism that it's like, it's very, it all sounds right, but it's also something's off and not quite on the money. [00:13:33] Like, I don't know, it's really hard to explain. [00:13:35] And so it kind of like throws people in all directions. [00:13:40] But also then you can understand, like you mentioned, the guy you talked to that he got into it in 2008, right? [00:13:47] Like, I remember that time totally with, you know, there were all those kind of like young people on the right getting into Ron Paul. [00:13:56] And there was all this kind of like, you know, I think the kind of like Occupy stuff was starting up and still some like leftover rage about the Iraq war and during the Bush years. [00:14:09] And it was all kind of like this, this sort of like young alt, I don't know, kind of like frustrated liberal movement looking for something. === LaRouche and the Left-Wing Space (11:16) === [00:14:18] And at that moment, like a lot of people would find LaRouche or would find Ron Paul. [00:14:23] And it kind of like crossed over or crossed, excuse me, crossed paths a lot, you know, at that moment. [00:14:31] And I see some of that still today. [00:14:35] Absolutely. [00:14:36] Like when we say the crank thing, like I know that everyone who's ever been to like in any kind of like left-wing space, however we want to say that, like knows what the old crank is and who that person is or people. [00:14:51] And they would definitely, you know, they'll definitely cross-fest with the LaRoucheites for sure. [00:14:59] Yeah, I mean, LaRouche stuff is, I think we'll probably get more into this maybe in the second episode, but like, you know, LaRouche people, LaRouche himself died, I believe, the ripe old age of 96 a couple of years ago, which is for a guy who since the early 70s has claimed that some of the top assassins in the world are after his ass, he really outwitted and outlived all of them. [00:15:21] Much like Castro. [00:15:22] Yes, yeah, yeah. [00:15:23] He outlived Castro. [00:15:25] I think. [00:15:25] I don't actually remember what year Castro died. [00:15:28] I don't know. [00:15:28] Maybe around the same time. [00:15:29] We could look it up, but you know what? [00:15:30] I'm not going to. [00:15:32] Nope. [00:15:33] But yeah, he, I mean, LaRouche's people are still around. [00:15:38] Obviously, without their sort of North Star of LaRouche, they are, you know, less cohesive than they used to be, but the organization still exists. [00:15:47] And more importantly, like the way that LaRoucheites operate is that they believe themselves sort of like, I mean, they were a vanguard organization, but not in the way that you might think. [00:15:58] They specifically self-selected and selected members who were part of what they viewed as like an intellectual elite, these golden souls that they called them. [00:16:08] And so many of their members are pretty good at talking. [00:16:11] They're pretty smart. [00:16:12] They're able to disseminate a wide swath of information, not necessarily sensical information, but information in a way that might maybe sound really smart or sensible. [00:16:23] I mean, basically what it is, is there are a lot of organizations that are filled to the brim with what we might call sueds. [00:16:32] I would say people who love a name drop. [00:16:34] Yes. [00:16:35] Can you name drop Heidegger, Plato, Schiller, Mozart, Bakunin, Kojeve, and the and British banking families? [00:16:52] Yes. [00:16:53] You might be ready to join the LaRoucheites. [00:16:56] Yes. [00:16:56] Yeah, absolutely. [00:16:58] And so, you know, like I, when we, when we first started like talking about this episode, I was kind of just clicking around on the internet and sort of like, you know, the, I was, there was like a, uh, like a YouTube channel or whatever, like a left-wing YouTube channel I saw from Australia that had, you know, a good amount of tens of thousands of followers. [00:17:15] And they were like, oh, we have this guest on to talk about Australian relations with China. [00:17:19] And I was like, this guy looks kind of weird. [00:17:21] And I looked him up. [00:17:22] And, you know, he's a LaRoucheite. [00:17:24] And that happens. [00:17:25] You know, they are present in media. [00:17:27] They are written about in China daily quite often. [00:17:31] They have a pretty big organization still called the Schiller Institute, rather. [00:17:36] Although a lot of those people should be institutionalized that sort of markets itself, well, we'll talk about it later, but you can look it up. [00:17:44] And you wouldn't even know necessarily that it's like, I mean, you know, those with a eye, a keen eye, might pretty quickly realize that it's a very crank type organization, but it presents itself very professionally. [00:17:55] And that's their whole thing is that they are professionals. [00:17:58] They are a sort of different breed of revolutionaries. [00:18:02] And they are indeed. [00:18:04] They self-style as revolutionaries. [00:18:07] And, you know, we are going to talk about Lyndon LaRouche and we're going to talk about some of Lyndon LaRouche's views because there isn't really a way to talk about one without talking about the other. [00:18:34] Have you ever met a Lyndon? [00:18:36] A male. [00:18:37] Have I met a Linden? [00:18:39] Like a name, like someone named Linden? [00:18:43] You know, I only know Lyndon LaRouche and Barry Linden. [00:18:47] That's the only time I've ever encountered Linden. [00:18:49] What is Barry Linden? [00:18:50] It's a movie. [00:18:50] I've heard someone say, okay. [00:18:52] Is it a Conan brothers movie? [00:18:54] Kubrick. [00:18:55] Stanley Kubrick. [00:18:56] Never heard of it. [00:18:57] I mean, I've heard of it, but I literally thought that was a Conan Brothers. [00:19:00] That's really good. [00:19:01] Not going to see it. [00:19:02] Very pretty. [00:19:03] Yeah, I have not met a lot of Linden's. [00:19:05] I haven't also met a lot of LaRouche's either. [00:19:07] That's a little Cajun name for me. [00:19:08] I don't know if I can, you know, I try not to. [00:19:12] The Cajuns freak me out. [00:19:13] I feel like they'll feed me to some kind of reptile. [00:19:16] They've written in a lot before saying they do that. [00:19:19] So I don't know why you guys are both shaking your heads. [00:19:22] You should see the emails I get. [00:19:25] But yeah, I have never met a Linden. [00:19:28] He's all, you know, so let's talk. [00:19:30] Let's talk about this fucking loser. [00:19:31] Okay. [00:19:32] By the way, he also went by Lynn for a really long time. [00:19:34] In the organization today, there are still, everyone calls him a Lynn. [00:19:38] You only call him Linden LaRouche to people outside the organization. [00:19:41] And I got to say, that's kind of like being called Gretchen. [00:19:44] That's a girl's name. [00:19:46] That is a girl's name. [00:19:47] Yeah, but I do like the move of having an in-group name versus out-group name. [00:19:52] Yeah, that's, you know, it's a good way to signal, oh, someone calls him Linden. [00:19:55] You know, they're not part of the in-group. [00:19:57] I mean, you guys both call me boss, sir. [00:20:00] And see Mr. CEO. [00:20:02] So yeah, it's kind of like an in-group. [00:20:04] We call you boss baby. [00:20:05] Yeah, I'm the boss, baby. [00:20:07] That's no, you're just the boss. [00:20:10] So let's cut this right now. [00:20:11] So I'm going to say a racial slur and we'll be forced to cut it unless you. [00:20:15] Okay, let's talk about this little fucking freak. [00:20:18] I am realizing now I put possibly too many notes on this man's early childhood because I started looking up his father a lot, which was basically a dead end, except he's weird. [00:20:27] His name was Hezekiah? [00:20:30] No, that was his father's pen name, Hezekiah. [00:20:33] People, listen, I don't know what you Christian types are up to, but everyone's always like, I'm Ezekiel, Hezekiah, like marsupial fucking freakazoid or whatever. [00:20:45] No one's, what is that, Quaker? [00:20:48] It's he's a Quaker. [00:20:49] I mean, I associate that stuff with Mormonism, but I mean, Quakers are, you know, that's another weird little thing. [00:20:54] Lyndon LaRouche was born in 1922. [00:20:58] He died in 2019, by the way. [00:21:00] He was born in 1922. [00:21:03] He was old. [00:21:04] He was old as shit. [00:21:06] And you might notice that I put in some of the notes here a little British crown connection. [00:21:11] He was born in a town called Rochester, New Hampshire, named for the brother-in-law to King James II. [00:21:16] So possibly some early signs of LaRouche's later political leanings. [00:21:21] Viparidian, yeah. [00:21:23] Anyways, his family moves to Lynn, Massachusetts, which is, I don't, I mean, maybe that's where he got the name later. [00:21:32] I mean, I don't know. [00:21:33] But his parents were both Quakers. [00:21:35] And have you ever met a Quaker? [00:21:39] Young Chomsky's shaking his head. [00:21:41] Yes. [00:21:42] You met a Quaker? [00:21:42] I think I have. [00:21:43] But I also grew up. [00:21:44] We grew up on the West Coast. [00:21:45] That's an East Coast thing. [00:21:46] Quaker's an East Coast thing. [00:21:47] I grew up there in Philadelphia. [00:21:49] Yeah. [00:21:49] A lot of Quakers there. [00:21:51] So in San Francisco on, I think, 7th Street, it was right where I used to, like a block from where I used to buy speed. [00:21:58] There was a friend's like, yeah, like they had like a friend's. [00:22:02] I used to live right by a friend's house. [00:22:04] Was it a friend's house? [00:22:06] Friends? [00:22:07] Yeah. [00:22:07] Meeting house. [00:22:08] Friends meeting house. [00:22:09] Yeah. [00:22:09] Yeah. [00:22:10] I don't know. [00:22:10] It's witchcraft to me. [00:22:12] But his dad basically was a LaRouche, Lyndon LaRouche Sr. was his name. [00:22:18] And like you mentioned, he did go by Hezekiah. [00:22:22] No, Hezekiah. [00:22:23] Hezekiah. [00:22:24] Hezekiah. [00:22:24] You can pronounce names however you want. [00:22:27] Hezekiah. [00:22:28] Can you pronounce? [00:22:29] Actually, you know what, Liz? [00:22:30] You know what? [00:22:31] Pronounce this entire name for me. [00:22:33] Pronounce this entire time. [00:22:34] I'm just trying to think of how you say the middle name. [00:22:36] I don't know. [00:22:36] Hezekiah Makiah Jones. [00:22:41] Hezekiah Makaiah Jones. [00:22:43] So another way to pronounce that would be Hezekiah Makaja Jonas or Jones. [00:22:49] No Spanish. [00:22:50] Anyways, he used that Hezekiah pseudonym to, as a Quaker, write very anti-Semitic tracks. [00:22:56] And basically, he was a crank, you know, and it was, I guess, harder to print pamphlets back then. [00:23:01] So maybe he didn't have his money. [00:23:02] But he got kicked out. [00:23:04] This guy was such an asshole. [00:23:05] He got kicked out of the Quakers. [00:23:07] His son hated Quakers after that. [00:23:09] LaRouche was a annoying child who was called Big Head. [00:23:13] Yeah, you brought that in the notes. [00:23:15] They called him Big Head, but then you wrote, He appears to have a normal-sized head. [00:23:20] Yeah. [00:23:21] A little background on this. [00:23:22] I did, I think, a little too much research for this episode, this pair of episodes. [00:23:26] No, no, no. [00:23:27] I think that was a good detail. [00:23:30] Yeah, I looked at a lot of pictures of LaRouche as a kid to see if he had a big head. [00:23:34] It looks pretty normal to me. [00:23:35] That's good. [00:23:36] Yeah. [00:23:37] But he said his earliest, I believe his first enemy that he names in his autobiography, which I read. [00:23:47] Well, I read most of it because he gets into really long tangents. [00:23:50] Yeah, he does. [00:23:50] It's kind of not readable, in my opinion. [00:23:54] I believe his first enemy he said was, and let me see if I'm recalling this, off-top, John Dewey or John Locke. [00:24:02] Well, those are okay. [00:24:05] I think it was John Locke. [00:24:08] John Dewey is the Dewey Decimal System guy, right? [00:24:10] Yeah, yeah, yeah. [00:24:11] Yeah, well, maybe he did some other stuff too. [00:24:13] I believe it was John Locke, his first enemy, and he says Kant was his first peer. [00:24:19] Anyways, his dad gets expelled from the Quakers in 1940. [00:24:22] Lyndon LaRouche follows shortly after, but he's still somewhat of a pacifist. [00:24:26] And so when World War II starts, because of the British crown and the Zionists tricking Hitler into. [00:24:33] Oh, sorry, no, I read too much LaRouche. [00:24:37] That's that is they LaRouche LaRouche believes now, although possibly not at the time, that the British Zionists and the Royal Crown tricked Hitler into doing World War II and being anti-Semitic. [00:24:50] Yes. [00:24:51] So that's actually a fairly common. [00:24:53] That's such a great, like, you know what? [00:24:55] That it's like someone dared someone to figure out a more anti-Semitic angle to World War II and was like, how can we make the Holocaust more anti-Semitic? [00:25:05] Well, it's like the Holocaust happened. [00:25:07] Yeah. [00:25:08] The Jews did it. [00:25:11] Like, it's, yeah, it's pretty, it's actually pretty impressive. [00:25:14] Yeah, that's that's you know, tip of my hat. [00:25:17] Actually, no, not tip of my hat. [00:25:18] No, tip of my notes. [00:25:20] Yeah. [00:25:21] No, he, yeah, he is, he is, he is, I will say, innovatively anti-Semitic, yeah, which we'll get to later. [00:25:28] No word, by the way, in his biography, it does not appear that he interacted with a single Jew before the late 1960s. === Labor Party Debates (15:25) === [00:25:35] It is totally unclear. [00:25:36] In fact, it doesn't seem like he ever might have. [00:25:40] Certainly never mentions it. [00:25:41] But he spends a little while in a like a work camp, not like a prison camp, but he got drafted and he was a conscious objector because it was religion, blah, blah, blah. [00:25:51] He gets turned on to Marxism there. [00:25:52] And he says that's why he joined the army. [00:25:57] Non-combatant, which means he is a medic, I believe, or like a medical orderly or supply guy at one point. [00:26:05] And he goes to India. [00:26:07] In India, he meets the head. [00:26:10] He says, this is a lie, by the way, but it is an insane lie. [00:26:14] He says he meets the head of the Indian Communist Party, Paran Chand Joshi, and tries to convince him to go on a general strike and uprising against the British. [00:26:22] He is a 23-year-old man in American army uniform. [00:26:27] To be fair, I could see him saying, like, oh, you guys should do this, because it sounds like something a 23-year-old who just discovered Marxism would say. [00:26:37] Like, hey, have you guys just, wait, like, can't you see him just being like, hey, what about like a general strike, dude? [00:26:45] You could like overthrow the British with like a general strike. [00:26:50] Yeah, I've been on general strike like eight times in the past two years and nothing ever happens. [00:26:56] People love making a little flyer that says like with like a burning cop car or like a bunch of like general strike. [00:27:03] General strike August. [00:27:04] Yeah. [00:27:05] It doesn't happen. [00:27:06] I mean, I feel like probably an average of five people just call out sick that day. [00:27:11] And like, sorry, I'm sick. [00:27:14] I mean, your brain like, I'm going on a general strike. [00:27:17] Yeah, totally lame. [00:27:19] But he says by the time he left that meeting, he was a full-blown Trotskyist. [00:27:24] So that's how, you know, the meeting went well. [00:27:27] I'm sure you could all guess what happens next. [00:27:29] He comes back to America, goes to college for like two months with a major in physics, but drops out because he says everyone else in college is too stupid, which this is all sounding very like a little too eerily familiar. [00:27:43] Yeah. [00:27:43] Oh, you think that? [00:27:44] Because of my college career? [00:27:46] No, it just, it sounds like many a young man that has crossed my path. [00:27:51] Yeah. [00:27:52] Oh, yeah. [00:27:53] Yeah. [00:27:53] Wow. [00:27:54] Interesting. [00:27:55] We will talk about this after the show, but very curious. [00:28:02] He, yeah, he's like, these fucking idiots. [00:28:04] You know, a lot of college dropouts become Trotskyists. [00:28:07] And perhaps we should be investigating that time, that, you know, pathway. [00:28:12] Also, some of y'all don't even have, some of y'all sleep on a mattress on the floor. [00:28:16] And then I, you know, I want to be clear about something. [00:28:19] When I was, when I moved into a house, an apartment in the tenderloin when I was like 19 for like six months before moving back to my old apartment. [00:28:26] And there was a girl whose room I was moving into who left her mattress, which was, by the way, on the floor, not even a little thing under it, just a mattress on the floor. [00:28:36] You told me this. [00:28:37] Yes. [00:28:37] We were moving her mattress out and a dead baby rat fell out of it. [00:28:45] So I don't want to hear you ladies be like, men don't have bedframes. [00:28:49] You don't have a bedframe and you're sleeping with a dead baby rat, child killer. [00:28:55] How do you know it was a baby rat? [00:28:57] Because it was so small. [00:28:59] It was a small rat. [00:29:00] No, it was a, I know it was a baby rat. [00:29:03] Yeah, because I also felt paternal feelings towards it. [00:29:07] What I don't want we can talk about this after. [00:29:10] So he decides to join the bastion of American intellectualism and in stark contrast to his later anti-Semitism, a bastion of American Judaism, the Socialist Workers' Party, the largest Trotskyist party in the United States. [00:29:28] What do you have to say about the Socialist Workers' Party, Bruce? [00:29:31] You know what? [00:29:34] I wasn't around in the 40s. [00:29:36] I'm sure you guys had a great time. [00:29:40] And I, you know, I do think that the post-war strategy, I think that Stalin should have declared war on the United States immediately after World War II ended. [00:29:49] So I don't think actually Trotsky saw that. [00:29:52] But so I, you know, I'm sure there were a lot of wonderful people who had a wonderful time. [00:29:59] Weird. [00:30:00] They're all in the CIA. [00:30:03] Yeah. [00:30:04] I mean, he, you know, he seems embarrassed in his autobiography. [00:30:09] He says something like, oh, everyone must be thinking I shouldn't have joined the Socialist Workers' Party. [00:30:15] Well, you know, you'd be right because I shouldn't have. [00:30:17] And he kind of goes on a whole thing about it. [00:30:20] At this point, he also mentions something about Lenin that I often hear like repeated in kind of like Confucianist circles, which is that Lenin was, you know, had figured out the ties between like the Russian aristocracy and the Russian ruling class and, you know, London, the banking families, the Rothschilds. [00:30:39] And this is a connection, you know, that LaRouche will continue to make throughout his career. [00:30:45] These kind of like, he's big, he's very, very against the, what he calls the finance world, the high finance families, the Rothschilds, the bankings, and whatever. [00:30:55] And there is, this is the thing that we'll kind of like continue to repeat. [00:30:58] Like there's truth there, but then there's also a lot of fiction as well. [00:31:02] I think something that gets lost in a lot of this, I'm trying not to use the word discourse, but the discourse or whatever, like, you know, talking about families like the Rothschilds or something is that obviously there's a lot of people who like pin everything on the Rothschilds and take this really anti-Semitic like bent where they are basically the center of power in the world, which is, you know, ridiculous. [00:31:22] That isn't to say that the Rothschilds are good or aren't involved in conspiracies. [00:31:27] It's just like you can always kind of tell a bug, you know, if someone's like big, one of their main goals is something to do with just specifically the Rothschilds, that's generally not a great sign for their mental state even. [00:31:43] But that's not to say, like, I want to be clear, that's not to say that the Rothschilds aren't bad and up to evil shit and have been up to evil shit for a long time. [00:31:51] It's and that's, that's sort of like, I mean, that's really kind of part of the LaRouche story is like taking these little kernels and then just supersizing them into something that's just, it's not real. [00:32:02] He also, however, says in his biography, something which I haven't looked into, but will claim is 100% real, is that Bakunin was enthralled to the Rothschilds and the anarchist movement as a whole. [00:32:13] Excuse me, and the anarchist movement as a whole was used by the Rothschilds to basically spread dissent in countries that could not ill afford it. [00:32:22] I looked into this slightly, and I guess that Bakunin did have a Rothschild connection through the populist novelist Alexander Herzen. [00:32:31] So that's something that LaRouche does a lot. [00:32:36] He's like Murat, for instance, was a British agent, he says, because Murat lived in London for like six years as a doctor. [00:32:44] And so he draws these like very firm lines between things that are definitely not firm at all. [00:33:09] So as you can imagine, he writes a lot in the Socialist Workers Party. [00:33:14] In fact, he writes a whole lot. [00:33:18] And that's mostly what he's remembered for, is just constantly writing things for like their internal debate, you know, newsletters and all that kind of stuff that most people didn't really understand. [00:33:28] He moves to New York City at this point. [00:33:31] You know, he spends, I think, a few months as an industrial organizer in Lynn and then moves to New York to shack up with a chick. [00:33:37] He gets really into reading about cybernetics. [00:33:39] He loves Marvin Minsky, a little friend of the pod. [00:33:43] And then eventually in the mid-60s, which is the height of crankery, well, one of the main peaks of crankery and the many peaks he does. [00:33:53] He links up with one of the top British cranks, a guy named Jerry Healy, a notorious sexual predator from the Workers' Revolutionary Party, after briefly being in this, LaRouche was briefly in the Spartacists and tries to create a new Trotskyist party in Canada, but it's too annoying for the most annoying people in the world. [00:34:15] Can you explain the Spartacists to our listeners? [00:34:18] This is a funny lesson, yes. [00:34:21] And left crankery. [00:34:23] The Spartacists are like, I think most, probably more encountered than other crank groups because they actively will go to any kind of meeting or like public event, even if it's not like really related to politics that much. [00:34:37] Like they're just, they're everywhere, even though there's like 10 of them. [00:34:41] But they are a, I would say, the funniest Trot sect because A, they endorsed ISIS, which was insane. [00:34:48] Bold move. [00:34:49] Bold move. [00:34:50] And I got to say, props for it. [00:34:53] Only the U.S. was bold enough to join them in their endorsement of ISIS. [00:34:57] Yes, yeah, yeah, exactly. [00:34:59] Trotskyist working with the State Department once again. [00:35:02] But no, they are, they are. [00:35:04] I mean, American Trotskyists are, I think it's different in other countries, but in America, there is a long history of very micro-sect crankery, and the Spartacists are emblematic of much of that. [00:35:17] I mean, you could say that there's micro-sect crankery of any political persuasion. [00:35:21] There's just a lot of Trotskyist parties. [00:35:24] And the Spartacists, for instance, when we did a union drive at Anchor, we'd have these parties and they would come to the parties that we would have to get support from people and like the general public. [00:35:32] We'd be handing out stickers and they would tell us that we were like basically like sellouts. [00:35:38] But they were in IBEW. [00:35:40] And I'm like, you're in a like right-wing union. [00:35:42] Like we're joining the longshoremen. [00:35:44] Like it was bizarre. [00:35:47] You know, I think we got enough Trotskyists. [00:35:49] Yes. [00:35:50] Yeah. [00:35:50] Yeah. [00:35:50] We don't try to. [00:35:51] Hey, we should form a new Trotskyist party. [00:35:54] I think we're okay. [00:35:55] They do that all the time. [00:35:57] Well, that's exactly what old Lynn was thinking in the late 60s because he's party-free. [00:36:02] He's partied out and he's teaching. [00:36:04] No, it's the late 60s now, the heady years of the SDS. [00:36:08] Smoke a little dope, let your hair down long, you know, get into heroin in three years, have a kid, but it's like all fucked up because there's like heroin and then eventually die in like 78. [00:36:24] But in the heady years of the late 60s, he is teaching at the Free University of New York classes on economics and Marxism. [00:36:31] He meets members of the SDS. [00:36:34] There's like a lot of people at this time who are like, that's the best class I've ever had on Marxism and economics. [00:36:42] Just like, oh, God. [00:36:43] But I guess he was like very popular. [00:36:45] And for a lot of these young kids in the SDS, they were like, oh, this guy's like a bit older, but he was like very genteel, not crazy crank, but like kind of cozy, older guy who was just like teaching at the free university, seeing what the kids are up to, blah, And he was able to really recruit a lot of kids out of that, especially when the SDS splits. [00:37:10] Yeah. [00:37:10] So I actually read a couple of nights ago a pretty in-depth history. [00:37:15] I have no idea who compiled it. [00:37:16] It was on a site called Yumbo. [00:37:18] A really in-depth history of like, excuse me, are you or does someone you know know Yumbo? [00:37:23] Yeah, yeah, I know. [00:37:24] Reminding me a lot of you because I'm like, that's a Liz-ass word, Yumbo. [00:37:28] Yumbo? [00:37:28] Yeah. [00:37:29] I have seems like something there's Liz words. [00:37:31] Yeah. [00:37:32] Yumbo is a Liz word. [00:37:33] Yumbo? [00:37:34] Yumbo. [00:37:35] I think of more, but there's been Liz words for sure on here. [00:37:38] Peacock. [00:37:39] Peacock. [00:37:39] Well, yeah, Peacock. [00:37:41] Yeah. [00:37:41] Washington, D.C., which I think you made us coach. [00:37:44] That's how Liz says Washington, D.C. [00:37:46] No, actually, my friend Nick said it once, and then it was always stuck in my head. [00:37:51] And so then I repeat it on the podcast. [00:37:52] Now it's going to be stuck in everyone's head in Washington, D.C. [00:37:55] Well, this is before LaRouche moves to near Washington, D.C. [00:37:59] But he is so he gathers around him during the SDS split members of the Progressive Labor Party, like younger members of it who were disaffected with the organization, sick of the split, all that kind of stuff. [00:38:12] And a lot of high school students and, you know, just generally people who were sick of the internal fighting and all the factualism within the SDS. [00:38:22] Everyone is so sick of factionalism. [00:38:25] Yeah. [00:38:26] They should have had a ban on it, but they did not. [00:38:30] So after the SDS splits, he starts something called with one of the worst names I've ever heard in my life. [00:38:36] The National Caucus of Labor Committees. [00:38:39] What does that mean? [00:38:40] No, see, you think it's a bad name. [00:38:42] Now, that's interesting because when I was reading all of this, this is what I thought. [00:38:46] I said, huh, now that's a good name because everyone would see that and be like, that sounds official. [00:38:52] That sounds very like placating. [00:38:55] That's not, that's not abrasive. [00:38:57] That's not like, you know, cool, whatever. [00:39:00] It sounds official. [00:39:01] It sounds like, yeah, you know, it could be anything. [00:39:04] And it kind of was actually. [00:39:06] Yeah. [00:39:06] I mean, that's true because after that, like in the 80s, people just started naming their organization like M Power with all capital letters. [00:39:13] He stood for something. [00:39:14] It was like, that was like the big trend. [00:39:16] I mean, we talked a lot about this kind of similarly when we talked about Rothbard when we did those episodes on the Koch brothers and libertarianism. [00:39:24] And there was like this kind of like same thing where everyone was like, huh, let's see how I can like squeeze in under the radar our kind of like cranky, weird little organization with the like most bland, like, you know, whitebread sounding name ever. [00:39:40] No one will notice. [00:39:42] Well, that's the thing I think a lot of modern people on the left kind of get wrong is they don't understand the importance of being normal in front groups, which are something that people really being normal especially is a very controversial thing. [00:39:55] But yeah, so he starts the NCLC, which, okay, there is like a list of like 60 LaRouche front groups. [00:40:05] I mean, everything from panic to like, I think the committee to investigate child abuse in Nebraska. [00:40:12] Yes. [00:40:12] You know, there are a million front groups. [00:40:14] The Labor Party became the vehicle, but we'll basically probably just call the group the NCLC from here. [00:40:19] Yeah, yeah, yeah. [00:40:20] It's all the same thing. [00:40:21] Yeah. [00:40:22] If you ever like for some of our older listeners out there, you might remember seeing the Labor Party on the like on your ballot when you went to go vote. [00:40:33] It would be like Lyndon LaRouche, the Labor Party. [00:40:36] He just named his party the Labor Party, which also very smart. [00:40:39] Well, I mean, it's, it's a tactic that other people have used in other countries too. [00:40:43] I think the Bahamas has a right-wing Labor Party, and I believe Brazil definitely has a right-wing Labor Party. [00:40:49] Here's the thing. [00:40:49] If you want to start a new party just called the Labor Party in the U.S., just you added a U or just two O's, the Les Bour party. [00:40:59] Yeah, Les Bour party. === Les Bour Party (02:47) === [00:41:00] Maybe, you know, people will laugh and say, oh, that's funny. [00:41:03] Yeah, yeah, exactly. [00:41:04] Yeah, yes. [00:41:05] Or make the L, like make it all lowercase and make the L actually into an I, a capitalist. [00:41:10] Or the L backwards, and it'll look like, ooh, that's kind of maybe crazy. [00:41:15] Well, but backwards L. [00:41:18] The backwards L was the centerpiece of the Ron Paul Revolution campaign. [00:41:25] But so he, so, okay, the group immediately gets pretty cultish, although there aren't a great amount of details on exactly how, but he starts, you know, it is definitely based around LaRouche. [00:41:38] But at this point, it is a Marxist group. [00:41:41] Like, there is no bones about it. [00:41:42] Like, this is a left-wing socialist group who is trying to do a revolution in the U.S. Not really sure where they fall on like the denominator. [00:41:50] Well, they're not actually trying to do that, but that's, you know, not, they, they seem to be kind of non-denominational. [00:41:58] Like a universe, like universalist church or whatever. [00:42:01] Yes, yeah, yeah. [00:42:02] Like they don't, or it's Mino, Marxist in name only. [00:42:07] Yes, yeah. [00:42:08] Yeah. [00:42:08] And so like, it's not like, they're not like a Maoist group. [00:42:11] They're not like a, you know, which would make them a, you know, you want to start a cult, start a Maoist one. [00:42:16] Yeah, come on. [00:42:17] But, you know, it's, it's sort of just like the LaRoucheian Marxism, you know, because they think of him as this great Marxist economist. [00:42:24] Yeah, yeah, yeah. [00:42:26] But he starts writing some pretty weird stuff about how, you know, left proto-fascists will take to the streets, how the capitalists are literally brainwashing people, which, you know, true. [00:42:38] And how his followers must become Prometheans, which is very much an inkling of what's to come. [00:42:45] What is a Promethean? [00:42:46] So I actually don't know if I've ever like heard a proper definition of Promethean, although I've seen a lot of people use it, especially a lot of like on the environmentalist tip. [00:42:56] But it is a sort of like, you know, anti-austerity, anti-like reactionary, very like forward thinking, forward-moving progress. [00:43:07] Kind of like we, you know, we have the capabilities, the kind of like humanist progressivism that isn't like utopian in a real way, but really like grounded in a kind of like the capabilities of society and kind of like going forward towards, you know, reaching our full capacity as a kind of, as a human race. [00:43:30] What a beautiful description of LaRouche and his organization. [00:43:33] Because that is precisely, well, that's what he's trying to do. [00:43:36] His whole thing, I mean, as he later admits, is to try to attract the grad students, essentially. [00:43:42] I mean, it's, he makes no, literally, he says that he makes no bones. === LaRouche's Insane Revolution (13:43) === [00:43:47] He makes no, no, you got to keep that in. [00:43:49] He makes no bones about it. [00:43:52] Uh, he is unlike every left-wing organization that pretends otherwise, LaRouche is straight up. [00:43:58] He's like, I want the most uh insane people in my organization. [00:44:03] I want people who love school to do a revolution. [00:44:06] Uh, and so that's really what he's, I mean, his whole thing is he wants this sort of intellectual vanguard by his side. [00:44:14] But they do a lot in the real world as well, as we'll see. [00:44:19] Um, but you know, at this point, he's kind of got some members that are like, This is this is not working out. [00:44:25] This guy is very weird. [00:44:26] I'm leaving, and so he needs to steal them, to steal them for battle, to steal them for the war to come for humanism has its final victory over the forces of anti-humanism, which I feel like I could have said that in a cooler way, but I didn't. [00:44:41] Uh, so he had a two-pronged approach for breaking down these little fucking grad students. [00:44:46] Uh, one is he was going to introduce them to the concept of identity politics, and sorry, wrong notes. [00:44:54] Uh, one, he was going to uh strip them of their egos, and which that's a classic move, and also in this context, I'm like, okay, maybe that's fine with me, maybe you can still do that. [00:45:07] Yeah, okay. [00:45:08] Uh, and the second one was steal them for war. [00:45:13] Wait, social war unclear, so okay, when we probably talk more about this in episode two, but basically, if you know the plot of Assassin's Creed, yeah, you were saying this to me last night. [00:45:26] I want to tell you, I do not know the plot of Assassin's Creed. [00:45:31] I only know it because I had to. [00:45:33] Okay, listen, long story. [00:45:35] It's not a long story. [00:45:36] I actually don't know most of the story. [00:45:38] I just know that in the Assassin's Creed universe, there's like two ancient forces, one of which is the Templars, and I think the other one is the Assassins. [00:45:48] Young Johnson's. [00:45:48] Oh, kind of like a national treasure. [00:45:51] Yeah, yes, yeah, yeah, who've existed for millennia and have been secretly at war behind the scenes. [00:45:57] They've had high-profile members of society as secret members. [00:46:00] Yeah, yeah, yeah. [00:46:00] Yeah, absolutely. [00:46:03] And they live presumably by the Assassin's Creed. [00:46:07] Which, what is there a printed assassin? [00:46:09] Do we know what the actual print is? [00:46:10] What is these? [00:46:11] I think it's like nothing, everything is permitted, nothing is forbidden, or something like that. [00:46:18] No, that's no, no. [00:46:20] Young Chomsky is misquoting DeRay Meckeson or McKesson, however you pronounce it, because one time DeRay, famous BLM activist, tweeted, what is it? [00:46:32] I thought he tweeted about Doritos. [00:46:34] The two boys I work with are Googling. [00:46:36] One is Googling Assassin's Creed, and the other is Googling DeRay. [00:46:41] Oh, no, it is a quote. [00:46:43] It is a quote from from the Assassin's Creed, but DeRay tweeted out, nothing is true, everything is permitted, and then hyphen the Assassin's Creed. [00:46:57] So I guess that's the Assassin's Creed. [00:46:59] That's an insane creed. [00:47:00] What does that mean? [00:47:01] Everything's permitted. [00:47:03] I don't want these guys winning. [00:47:04] Are they the good guys? [00:47:05] So they're saying that nothing is true, meaning like the world is a lie, therefore everything is permitted. [00:47:13] I'm an assassin. [00:47:14] This is my creed. [00:47:15] These people are fucking devils. [00:47:17] Yeah, they're assassins. [00:47:18] Anyways, this is actually basically LaRouche. [00:47:22] That's actually an incredible example of what LaRouche believes in. [00:47:26] Like LaRouche is probably the world's most foremost proponent of the Assassin's Creed because his whole thing is that throughout history, there was like a split between Plato and Aristotle and followers of both. [00:47:39] And they've been waging a hidden, but like not like a secret, like it's a secret war, but like they know they're fighting it, like conscious agents of this war between the two philosophies. [00:47:49] No, I have to say that this strikes me as you dropped the word sued before and someone viewing the entire world as a war between like Platinus and Aristotelians feels like the sootest thing I've ever heard in my life. [00:48:08] This is the suitest thing. [00:48:09] That is like, no, but I really mean that. [00:48:12] It's like, that is like, you know. [00:48:16] Yeah. [00:48:16] Well, that's what LaRouche believed. [00:48:18] And he believed because of that, that nothing is true and everything is permitted. [00:48:43] So he starts berating his followers publicly and like calling them, I think, LaRouche, I got to say, if you want a guy to call you gay in the early 70s, join the LaRouche organization because this guy will call you that constantly. [00:48:57] He is driven a little insane because his girlfriend runs off with a young member of the LaRouche organization to England. [00:49:08] And he refers to his number one enemy. [00:49:10] Exactly. [00:49:11] You can't lose the girl to England if you're Lyndon LaRouche. [00:49:15] And this is, I mean, I hate to attribute anything to this because I can't psychoanalyze the guy, but I'm attributing a lot to this. [00:49:24] Sure. [00:49:25] A tribute away. [00:49:26] So they go to England. [00:49:27] LaRouche's, and this is in the early 70s. [00:49:29] LaRouche's old lady and a young man, a guy 10 years her junior, a MILF hunter, you might say. [00:49:36] And so they go to England to start an NCLC chapter out there. [00:49:42] He calls them back for a conference prior to the conference or prior to flying back. [00:49:47] The guy had viewed a movie called, I wrote down the name, but I can't. [00:49:52] What is the movie? [00:49:54] Trinity. [00:49:54] And I tried to look it up and I just found Westerns that didn't seem to match. [00:49:58] But it's a movie about a woman luring a guy, a young man to his death at the hands of a paternal figure. [00:50:04] By the time this guy, Chris White, gets to America on the plane, he's dragged off screaming that the CIA had programmed him to kill Lyndon LaRouche. [00:50:13] Well, Lyndon locks him up in a room for two weeks and deprograms him. [00:50:20] There are recordings that were got by the, I believe, actually LaRouche gave to the New York Times to prove his innocence, which basically sounds like they're just torturing the guy. [00:50:30] Yes. [00:50:30] And so after that, the tactics become a lot crazier internally on NCLC members and he starts using essentially brainwashing cult tactics. [00:50:41] I mean, not essentially, like absolutely. [00:50:43] Yeah, like quite literally. [00:50:44] Literally, like to the letter, you know, public berating, constant like love bombs, constant like, you know, you know, this, this sort of like putting people as outcasts and then bringing them back in when they agree with him more. [00:50:56] I mean, it is truly like the start. [00:50:58] He's like, language tricks. [00:51:00] 100%. [00:51:01] Yeah. [00:51:02] And then he also is like, listen, guys, we need to beat the shit out of the communists. [00:51:06] Yeah, this is a weird turn. [00:51:07] So remember when we said that he, you know, was ostensibly a Marxist? [00:51:13] Yes. [00:51:14] That's out the window. [00:51:15] It's well, yeah, yeah. [00:51:17] It's, it's, it's basically, it's, it's confusing because he doesn't really like, he, he says, he talks about this in political terms, internally, but not on Marxist terms, really. [00:51:28] Yeah, yeah, yeah. [00:51:29] Like he's like, we need to get hegemony, but like he doesn't talk about really like an ideological struggle. [00:51:34] He's just like, we need to beat the shit out of these guys. [00:51:37] Yeah. [00:51:37] I mean, he really like fully, I mean, the program is to attack and break down the Communist Party. [00:51:44] Yeah, it's called Operation Mop-Up, which is a fantastic name. [00:51:48] And it's the LaRushites' first and to this date, only organized foray into nun-chuck-based violence. [00:51:55] And I'm not joking there. [00:51:57] They primarily use nun-chucks. [00:52:00] Those are the ninja weapon of two chucks connected by what you call a nun, which is a piece of chain or rope. [00:52:07] So the LaRushites basically, their goal is very simple. [00:52:11] It is to beat the shit out of communists all up and down the East Coast and Midwest. [00:52:16] And specifically the Communist Party, although it's later, you know, extended to the Trotskyist parties, including his former party, the Socialist Workers' Party. [00:52:24] And they just disrupt all their meetings, go to their bookstores and beat the fuck out of everybody with nunchucks, which is, I got to say, incredible. [00:52:32] I mean, could you imagine being at some meeting and some guy's like, well, at the party congress, they were saying, and then just like 30 insane, rabid 25-year-olds who think of themselves as golden souls come in and just wallop you and everybody you know with nunchucks. [00:52:47] I mean, it would be like a fever dream. [00:52:49] Yeah, it was like pretty intense. [00:52:51] It was really like they put people in the hospital. [00:52:53] Yeah, yeah, yeah. [00:52:54] This was a thing. [00:52:55] This was like a big thing. [00:52:57] This is one of the things that LaRoucheites are actually most known for. [00:53:00] And he, yeah, it's, it was a, I mean, it's a long story, but you can imagine like they did this all over. [00:53:07] In fact, it led to a temporary alliance between the Trotskyists and the Communist Party in New York City to protect the CP member for the member that was running for mayor, which is a pretty rare occurrence. [00:53:18] And eventually a LaRoucheite gets put up on felony charges in Boston and then LaRouche declares victory and says he's won. [00:53:25] He's beaten the entire left and has achieved hegemony. [00:53:30] He also keeps telling members that they must destroy the Communist Party within themselves. [00:53:35] Like that's like where all their doubt and fear and ego is, is the Communist Party. [00:53:41] Yeah, classic move. [00:53:43] And he really, after this, I mean, a bunch of people leave and the people that are left are in, like basically like kind of broken souls from this. [00:53:51] And Dennis King's really excellent book on LaRouche. [00:53:56] There's a passage here. [00:53:57] And Liz, would you mind reading this about ego stripping? [00:54:00] Yeah. [00:54:01] So he says, I am going to make you organizers by taking your bedrooms away from you, he announced. [00:54:09] Hey, meaning LaRouche. [00:54:11] What I shall do is to expose to you the cruel fact of your sexual impotence. [00:54:17] I will take away from you all hope that you can flee the terrors of politics to the safety of, quote, personal life. [00:54:24] I shall do this by showing to you that your frightened personal sexual life contains for you such horrors as the outside world could never offer you. [00:54:32] I will thus destroy your rabbit holes, mental as well as physical. [00:54:36] I shall destroy your sense of safety in the place to which you ordinarily imagine you can flee. [00:54:41] I shall not pull you back from fleeing, but rather destroy the place to which you would attempt to flee. [00:54:49] Liz, can you imagine being like 25 in like 1973? [00:54:54] Oh, it's so fucked up. [00:54:56] Dude, I don't even know what I would. [00:54:57] I would just be like, what are you saying to me? [00:55:01] Yeah, there was a lot of groups like this, though. [00:55:03] But this took a different bend. [00:55:06] Well, like a lot of groups, it took the fascist bend. [00:55:09] Yes. [00:55:10] Yeah. [00:55:11] And, you know, so at this point, LaRouche is, and by the way, if you can hear screaming in the background, that's just my neighbor. [00:55:16] Don't worry about it. [00:55:17] They're just doing it a lot. [00:55:19] So at this point, LaRouche starts announcing that people are trying to kill him. [00:55:24] Think the first recorded instance of this was he said there was a CIA-KGB joint operation that was going to take him out in 1973, which is pretty, pretty cool. [00:55:34] And then he announced he was the number three person on the Red Army faction hit list, which not sure how he got onto that. [00:55:42] And, you know, is the CIA starts playing a heavy factor in this. [00:55:48] And he accuses anybody criticizing him of being in the CIA. [00:55:53] Yeah, classic, another classic move. [00:55:55] Yeah, exactly. [00:55:56] And his whole thing, too, is that the CIA brainwashes you, which, of course, you know, the CIA can brainwash you, but it's also a really convenient foil for if you don't want anybody to say anything bad about you. [00:56:08] You can be like, uh, actually, the CIA told him to say that it was weird. [00:56:12] I told him his dick doesn't work. [00:56:14] Yeah, I've seen that used many a time on Twitter.com about you. [00:56:20] So after this, you know, it's 19, it's mid-70s, right? [00:56:24] You know, punk is coming on. [00:56:26] We got disco in a few years. [00:56:28] Heroin's really big. [00:56:30] Girls are pretty hot at this point. [00:56:32] I feel like mid-70s, girls are looking like that. [00:56:35] This is a good time for girls. [00:56:37] Chicks are looking at it. [00:56:38] Chicks are pretty universal throughout time, but like everything else, peaks and valleys. [00:56:43] Peaks and valleys. [00:56:44] And mid-70s, huge peak. [00:56:47] Mid-70s or early 80s. [00:56:48] Oh, I mean, I love a late 70s to early 80s. [00:56:52] That is like my vibe. [00:56:53] That is peak girl for this girl. [00:56:57] That is like peak vibe. [00:56:58] Yeah, yeah. [00:56:59] Girl vibe. [00:57:00] Yeah. [00:57:02] I mean, let me just say, David Lee Roth, I'm sure you had a fantastic time and I admire you, sir. [00:57:10] I think we're thinking of different times, but no, David Lee Roth was early 80s. [00:57:15] Yeah, but I'm just thinking of different aesthetic, I think. [00:57:17] Oh, yeah. [00:57:18] Well, I mean, David Lee. [00:57:20] But you know what? [00:57:20] Universal. [00:57:21] Universal. [00:57:22] So you might be like, damn, chicks are about to get really hot soon. [00:57:26] And, you know, I should probably get out over this whole like weird thing I've been doing. [00:57:30] Like, get out of this cult. === It's A Very LaRoucheian Type Of Fascism (02:44) === [00:57:31] But if you're Linden LaRouche, you're like, damn, I should become a Nazi. [00:57:35] Like, fuck around with it a little bit. [00:57:37] And this is where Liz's, so Liz is the inventor of a term called Red Brown Alliance. [00:57:43] Oh, my God. [00:57:44] No, this is where things get tricky with talking about LaRouche because I think it's really tempting for some people to be like, he's red-brown. [00:57:52] He's a little bit communist and a little bit fascist. [00:57:55] But looking at that through that lens is that's no, that's the wrong way to look at it. [00:58:02] For LaRouche, there is, you are part of the assassins or the Templars. [00:58:07] It doesn't really matter what you're like, if you're racist or anything like he will use whatever he can to make sure that the Neoplatonics win this, which is his version of the Assassins. [00:58:21] Yeah, he's beyond left and right, beyond good and evil, for sure. [00:58:25] Yeah, he saw the dialectic. [00:58:27] Yeah. [00:58:29] You know, the dialectic was resolved, and that resolution is Lyndon LaRouche. [00:58:34] So his fascism isn't necessarily like what you might term like solely pro-white or anything like that. [00:58:40] Like it doesn't really look like, I mean, because he does have a little bit of fascism on deck. [00:58:45] It's more just. [00:58:47] It's a very LaRoucheian type of fascism. [00:58:49] And so, you know, he talks about, like many people, I think in the early 70s, talking about organizing the ghetto youth. [00:58:56] But like when he talks about it, he's just racist about them. [00:58:59] Like he's like, we're going to, like, he's basically like all of everything he says. [00:59:03] He's like, we're going to organize these people to, you know, whatever, overthrow the government. [00:59:06] But he's like describing them in like insanely racist terms, like openly racist ones. [00:59:12] His newspaper, New Solidarity, uses the N-word judiciously, which in the N-word there is not new in New Solidarity is the one you're thinking of. [00:59:22] And also they declared war on Amiri Baraka. [00:59:25] Yeah, yeah, yeah. [00:59:26] He was basically like convinced that like drugs turned black people into psycho killers. [00:59:33] Yes, yeah, yeah. [00:59:35] And that was like, you know, the point. [00:59:38] Could you actually read this from this pamphlet? [00:59:42] Do not clip this. [00:59:45] You could be white. [00:59:46] You could be black, said an NCLC leaflet circulated in Manhattan. [00:59:51] This summer, you'll be walking down the street with your family and a cruising car will pull up beside you. [00:59:55] A group of young black men will jump out of the car and surround you. [00:59:58] As they close in on you, you may notice that your eyes show no emotion. [01:00:02] Their pupils are pinpoints. [01:00:04] Your throat will be slashed. [01:00:06] Your wife will be stabbed. [01:00:08] Your children's heads will be smashed against the pavement. [01:00:11] The attackers will be grinning or laughing. === Passing Of Information (06:27) === [01:00:15] So, I mean, Jesus Christ, you know, another classic move from LaRouche. [01:00:22] Classic 12-dimensional chess from LaRouche here. [01:00:26] But actually, it is, well, actually, it's kind of just regular two-dimensional chess. [01:00:30] He is making both overtures to, by the way, NCLC at this point had like a lot of black members, like a good, like probably more percentage-wise than like a lot of modern left-wing groups while they were passing out these forms. [01:00:46] And the way that a lot of people, like I, I mean, I read interviews with ex-members sort of justified this themselves. [01:00:52] Like, well, he's talking about the other ones. [01:00:53] Like, he's talking about the brainwashed people. [01:00:56] He's not talking about us. [01:00:56] Like, we're part of the golden ones. [01:00:58] Right, right, right. [01:00:59] In-group, out-group. [01:01:00] Exactly. [01:01:00] And this is the same way a lot of the Jews in his organization felt after he sort of switched targets in a couple of years. [01:01:07] So they also began a long association around the mid-70s with a guy named Roy Frankhauser, who is the grand dragon of the Pennsylvania KKK. [01:01:17] And honestly, looking at his record, almost assuredly an FBI asset. [01:01:22] Oh, 100%. [01:01:24] Yeah. [01:01:25] Like, the thing is, like, a lot of people think CoenTelpro, all that FBI, like, you know, when they went off to left-wing groups, it was only about left-wing groups, but the feds were infiltrating basically any kind of group like this and turning in members. [01:01:38] Like, you know, they had a formula and it worked really well. [01:01:42] So LaRouche also, I mean, we'll get to this in the second episode, but LaRouche, which is, this is like the, there's a lot to get into on that. [01:01:52] But LaRouche hires Roy Frankhauser as a security consultant, which he does quite often. [01:01:58] And Frankhauser starts dangling a CIA connection he has named Mr. Ed, like the talking horse, to. [01:02:07] You know, that was the song that my dad would sing to me when I was a baby. [01:02:11] I would go, daddy, sing horse C, sing horse C. [01:02:14] And then he would sing the theme song from Mr. Ed. [01:02:16] And that would be the lullaby for me to go to sleep. [01:02:18] That's very sweet. [01:02:21] Remember? [01:02:22] Hello. [01:02:23] I'm Mr. Ed. [01:02:29] I don't. [01:02:30] I don't think I've ever seen Mr. Ed. [01:02:31] I just. [01:02:31] With the peanut butter. [01:02:33] They gave the horse peanut butter so that he didn't. [01:02:35] To make him Jew. [01:02:36] Yeah, yeah, yeah. [01:02:37] I will say, great trick. [01:02:39] I had a burned DVD of every episode of Lancelot Link, Secret Chimp. [01:02:44] Lancelot Link, Secret Chimp. [01:02:50] What? [01:02:50] What is that? [01:02:51] It's an insane show. [01:02:53] Monkey show? [01:02:54] It's a monkey show. [01:02:55] Although it's probably monkeys. [01:02:58] But no, it is. [01:02:59] This was when I was in my early 20s. [01:03:01] However, I've rewatched every episode in the past year. [01:03:03] It's incredible. [01:03:05] Anyways, so Frankhauser basically makes up or says he makes up. [01:03:12] And this is where I differ from a lot of people who study LaRouche or where we, I think Liz and I are both in agreement on this. [01:03:18] Frankhauser says he has a CIA contact that he later says is just his friend that he says pretended to be. [01:03:26] I actually think it was real. [01:03:29] Like, you know, in a court case, he later admits that he made it all up and that like it was just his friend that would meet with LaRouche and all this stuff. [01:03:36] But I think it was real. [01:03:37] And I think that like, cause he would pass messages from LaRouche to look into certain things or to start talking about certain things. [01:03:43] And I think this actually happened throughout all of LaRouche's career. [01:03:46] Yeah. [01:03:46] So to be clear, like as you said about with Coventel Pro that, you know, people maybe are only familiar with the infiltration of like left-wing orgs, but it was obviously happening with KKK, I mean, extensively. [01:04:01] They were also trying to infiltrate guys like LaRouche's organization. [01:04:07] And as we kind of will like detail in the next episode is this kind of passing of information back like goes both ways. [01:04:18] In fact, goes both is quite porous, this relationship with the U.S. government. [01:04:25] And LaRouche, like basically like, it becomes like a whole different entity at this point or starts to starts to kind of like lay the groundwork. [01:04:35] And really like, um, he starts to build what I think can only be called like one of the largest private intelligence agencies in American history. [01:04:46] Yeah. [01:04:46] And this is where that membrane that I was talking about earlier is starts to shimmer in the light and starts to become very easy to put your hand through and reach reach onto the other side. [01:05:01] Maybe a little oily. [01:05:02] Yeah, a little oily. [01:05:03] Exactly. [01:05:04] It looks like an octopus's skin or like mine after I'm done dancing at the club in a biza. [01:05:12] So yeah, we will, we will, there is a lot more to talk about. [01:05:15] I mean, we got we got everything from the Franklin scandal to Jimmy Hoffa. [01:05:20] But yeah, there is there is a lot more in the second episode. [01:05:24] And well, fuck you. [01:05:26] I guess we'll see you then. [01:05:48] Well, Brace already said the outro, but they're making me say it. [01:05:51] So now I got to say it again. [01:05:53] I'm sorry for saying fuck you. [01:05:55] I feel bad about that now. [01:05:57] Are you saying it to me or to them? [01:05:58] Because if you're saying it to me. [01:06:00] Oh, okay. [01:06:01] Actually, I don't know. [01:06:02] Let's see how nice you are to me. [01:06:04] Yeah. [01:06:04] Well, you know who does know? [01:06:05] Young Chomsky, he's going to decide. [01:06:07] Well, right now, it's an unattributed fuck you. [01:06:10] Like it doesn't have a direction yet. [01:06:11] And it really depends on the behavior of the next like minute and 30 seconds on who that gets targeted to. [01:06:17] So like the missile's up, but the thrusters haven't fired yet. [01:06:20] And it could either go to China or Russia. [01:06:21] So do you want to be China or do you want to be Russia? [01:06:24] Wait, which are you a hawk against? [01:06:29] Be nice to me and maybe you'll find out. [01:06:33] I'm Liz. [01:06:34] My name is The Hawk. [01:06:36] We're joined by producer Young Chomsky and the podcast is called True About. [01:06:42] We'll see you next time.