True Anon Truth Feed - Episode 83: The Permanent Uncle & His Colony of Righteousness (Part 1)
Aired: 2020-07-15
Duration: 01:29:57


=== The Spider Network Cue (14:48) ===

[00:00:00]  The spider.
[00:00:01]  Listen, Jung Chopsky, I need you to do something.
[00:00:03]  I know I'm telling you this is the intro to the episode, but the way this works is I record something and then we edit it and then release it.
[00:00:10]  So this isn't an impossible ask.
[00:00:12]  But what I need you to do is at some point, it doesn't have to be this point, but at some point, we are going to need a song for the Spider Network.
[00:00:27]  Or like a sound cue.
[00:00:29]  Yeah, some kind of like, you know, I saw a spider just yesterday climbing over on my couch, hurtling toward me, and I thought about the spider network.
[00:00:39]  That is the one way, Fel is if you ever are getting chased by a woman, just what I do is I keep a pocket of spiders.
[00:00:46]  One pocket of my dungarees has spiders, and I throw them out behind me like a ninja throws caltrops.
[00:00:52]  And that's caltrops are like a smoke store, a thing you buy at smoke stores for to fight against pursuers.
[00:00:59]  And it'll stop a basically cripple a city's economy.
[00:01:04]  I screamed so loud.
[00:01:06]  I'm not going to lie.
[00:01:07]  So loud when I saw it.
[00:01:09]  Darted across the room, started crying.
[00:01:11]  I can't handle spiders.
[00:01:12]  It's why I hate fascists so much, which we're going to get into in this episode.
[00:01:17]  Do you know what I do whenever girlfriends have asked me to take care of a spider problem for them?
[00:01:22]  What?
[00:01:23]  I take the spider, pretend that I killed it, and then I let it go.
[00:01:27]  Oh, that's nice.
[00:01:28]  You should.
[00:01:29]  You should just say, goodbye, buddy.
[00:01:30]  Go outside now.
[00:01:32]  let it go in their purse.
[00:01:56]  Welcome to Truanile.
[00:02:01]  We haven't done one of those in a while.
[00:02:03]  That's nice.
[00:02:04]  Welcome, welcome, welcome.
[00:02:06]  One of what?
[00:02:09]  Where we do the funny voice, where we go like, Truana.
[00:02:12]  Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
[00:02:14]  Let's bust one of those out in here.
[00:02:16]  I'm so excited for this episode today.
[00:02:18]  You're always excited.
[00:02:19]  By the way, I'm Liz.
[00:02:21]  My name is Brace, and we are joined, of course, by the producer, Jung Chomsky.
[00:02:25]  Not our producer, Jung Chomsky.
[00:02:26]  The producer, Young Chopsy.
[00:02:27]  It's a different one.
[00:02:28]  We replaced him.
[00:02:31]  he's like a European house DJ.
[00:02:33]  We are getting into some, yeah, so Bray said this is his favorite stuff and it's true because we're talking Nazis.
[00:02:43]  Mm-hmm.
[00:02:44]  We're talking more Nazis.
[00:02:46]  And specifically, well, specifically, a certain little village down in the Bavarian part of Chile.
[00:02:55]  And this is, of course, part three of our, this is part three, right?
[00:03:00]  I don't fucking know.
[00:03:01]  I think this is unofficial.
[00:03:03]  So who knows?
[00:03:04]  Yeah, yeah, true.
[00:03:06]  Of our unofficial, unauthorized, and totally illegal sub-series.
[00:03:11]  The Spider Network.
[00:03:13]  Yeah, we're talking your favorite thing.
[00:03:15]  We're talking esoteric Nazism.
[00:03:17]  We're talking my favorite thing, Latin America.
[00:03:21]  Let's just get into it.
[00:03:22]  To episode three.
[00:03:37]  I'm kind of sounding like I'm doing ASMR here.
[00:03:41]  Welcome to episode three of our Spider Network sub-series.
[00:03:46]  Today we have with us, deep from his bunker somewhere in the Midwest, I can't remember which state, we have Michael S. Judge from the Death is Around the Corner podcast and a notorious freak.
[00:03:59]  Michael, how are you doing?
[00:04:01]  La Arania Internacional.
[00:04:04]  I will say, no, I don't think that.
[00:04:06]  Calling you a notorious freak sounds dark.
[00:04:07]  You're just a regular freak.
[00:04:08]  Yeah, just a regular freak.
[00:04:10]  See, I'm here for a dialectical synthesis because on every other podcast, people in the comments go like, oh, you guys are so bad at pronunciation.
[00:04:20]  You guys are even worse than Felix, which is like the low bar.
[00:04:23]  And on my podcast, they go like, oh, you're tryhard who says everything right.
[00:04:28]  So I'm going to say everything.
[00:04:30]  You'll have plenty of opportunity with that.
[00:04:32]  Yeah, we're going to, we'll synthesize me saying everything completely strange, apparently.
[00:04:38]  Brace not knowing what language is what, and you saying everything perfect.
[00:04:43]  Yeah, but one thing I should say.
[00:04:44]  Don't call it Spanish.
[00:04:46]  I was about to say, like, I didn't know that these were, so I was like reading this Colonia Dignadad stuff, not to a little spoiler alert there.
[00:04:52]  And I was like, whoa, German and Spanish are separate?
[00:04:56]  I thought the whole thing was just like the European thing.
[00:04:59]  Like all those languages were just kind of the same language, different dialects, but they understand each other, I think.
[00:05:05]  You learn something new.
[00:05:07]  I think if you're involved with the Nazis, you can just talk to other Nazis.
[00:05:11]  Yeah, it's like a mind-meld sort of situation.
[00:05:14]  So is this our third episode about the Spider Network, Liz?
[00:05:18]  I think so.
[00:05:19]  That's what we're calling it, by the way, in case people listening or new listeners don't know what we're talking about.
[00:05:26]  Do you want to explain a little bit what we call the Spider Network?
[00:05:29]  Yes, and then I'll probably have Michael jump in and talk a little bit about it too.
[00:05:33]  But what I, yeah, what we call the Spider Network is the actual post-war order that, by the way, morphed into what we have today.
[00:05:44]  Everything we're talking about today did not exist in a vacuum.
[00:05:47]  It was not a discrete event unconnected from any others.
[00:05:50]  What happened in the past is directly precedented what is happening today.
[00:05:56]  It's all the same world.
[00:05:57]  And that gets a little difficult to think about with this kind of stuff because you're like, oh man, Nazis, South America, the CIA, blah, blah, blah.
[00:06:04]  Like, no, we are living.
[00:06:06]  We aren't even living in this world shadow.
[00:06:08]  We are living in this world.
[00:06:11]  Yeah, that's kind of how I think of it.
[00:06:14]  I mean, that was very unspecific, but basically, it is the network of ex-Nazis.
[00:06:24]  Christ, how to explain this.
[00:06:25]  So when America defeated Germany or helped defeat Germany, instead of smashing Nazism, it absorbed it.
[00:06:32]  And then America's sort of process of globalizing this merged ideology of fascism and capitalism and became this kind of globe-encompassing shadow state.
[00:06:48]  And that is what the series is about.
[00:06:51]  Yeah, that's what we like to call the spider network.
[00:06:55]  I just actually just read the other day that between 1949 and 1970, the German Ministry of the Interior never had less than 50% Nazi Party members in its leadership positions.
[00:07:11]  Yeah, yeah.
[00:07:12]  I mean, when I talk about absorbing, I mean literally absorbing.
[00:07:16]  A lot of people that come up in this episode were either members of the Nazi Party, members of parties that were modeled after the Nazis, and quite a lot of them worked with Western intelligence agencies, specifically the CIA, but also just like literally officials from Western governments that had no problem interacting with them and using their services.
[00:07:42]  Absolutely.
[00:07:42]  And I think if I could sort of be a little tangential here, that one good way to look at it, one good heuristic to make sense of all the stuff we're about to talk about, is the official post-World War II narrative versus the actual one.
[00:08:01]  And the official one, the kind of Francis Fukuyama story, is that, you know, on VE Day, every Nazi and fascist mysteriously disappeared.
[00:08:10]  They all just vaporized, except the ones who went to the Nuremberg trials and justice was done.
[00:08:16]  And then for the next, you know, 40 odd years, it was a conflict between liberal capitalist democracy, you know, evil Soviet authoritarian communism.
[00:08:28]  And we won because essentially God was on our side.
[00:08:32]  And from that point on, there is nothing left to history but the inevitable spread of liberal capitalist democracy.
[00:08:40]  One of my favorite things about that asshole Fukuyama is that three weeks after September 11th, he wrote a public letter saying, hey, you know, real tragedy.
[00:08:52]  Sorry for the families, but I'm still right.
[00:08:56]  I'm not wrong.
[00:08:58]  Everything is still going to happen the way I said it would.
[00:09:01]  So that's kind of the official story.
[00:09:03]  And I think the real story since World War II is about what you could call shadow states or paranational entities that usually begin with some kind of national affiliation and then detach and become essentially their own governments.
[00:09:22]  And for someone in the United States, the CIA would be the most obvious and the most accessible because the CIA, you know, we're taught to think of it the same way we think of the Department of the Interior, for example, that it's just another government agency that just performs a role.
[00:09:40]  And that's not true at all.
[00:09:42]  Since Alan Dolis took over the CIA in 1953, it has essentially become a shadow government.
[00:09:51]  It has become an organization with its own motives, its own means toward achieving those motives.
[00:09:59]  They may or may not reconcile with the motives of the rest of the executive branch or whatever.
[00:10:07]  And I think the best point of comparison for the CIA would be the SS.
[00:10:14]  It's a really similar organization in that the SS began as just a security service for the highest members of the Nazi Party.
[00:10:22]  And it eventually came to set up sort of mirror organizations for every single facet of the German government until it was a separate government virtually unto itself.
[00:10:35]  And it was the one that Hitler trusted and relied upon much more than the actual German government because...
[00:10:41]  Oh yeah, even the army.
[00:10:43]  I mean, his relationships with the Wehrmacht deteriorated from basically day two.
[00:10:49]  And he really did only rely on the SS for basically everything, for foreign policy, which way superseded the regular foreign office of Germany.
[00:10:57]  Absolutely.
[00:10:58]  Absolutely.
[00:10:59]  Anytime there was something important, the Waffen-SS were the people he wanted to deal with because fanatical devotion to the Nazi Party and to Nazi ideology was baked in at the ground level.
[00:11:09]  Whereas, you know, the normal German government was still full of people who were just bureaucrats.
[00:11:15]  And when Nazism came along, they kind of went, you know, whatever.
[00:11:20]  And the CIA would be the most obvious of these organizations to an American, especially an American who.
[00:11:27]  I mean, I'm guessing anyone listening to this show will know about all kinds of things they've done in Central South America and Africa and Southeast Asia and so on.
[00:11:36]  But organizations like this exist all over the world from Le Cercle, the group you guys have talked about, the reactionary Catholic group that takes in people from all over Western and Southern Europe in particular.
[00:11:52]  I didn't know this until recently, but the people who ran Margaret Thatcher's campaign in Britain were Le Cercle.
[00:11:59]  Yep.
[00:12:00]  Yeah, they were a group called SHIELD that were basically a detachment of Le Cercle.
[00:12:05]  And P2, the Paul Gandadoua Lodge in Italy that you've talked about, which was kind of an omnibus collection of all kinds of neo-fascist currents in Italy.
[00:12:17]  And I think really notably in the disguise.
[00:12:21]  Well, I don't know if you haven't wanted to call it the disguise of a Masonic Lodge.
[00:12:24]  Yeah, yeah.
[00:12:25]  And I don't think almost anyone outside of Italy understands how insane it is that Silvio Berlusconi ran that country for almost 20 years.
[00:12:36]  Can you explain why people wouldn't understand that?
[00:12:39]  Well, the P2 Lodge was, I mean, there had been neo-fascist currents literally since the moment the fascism officially ended in Italy, you know, since the mid-40s.
[00:12:52]  And various fascist organizations like the Agiente Press, for example, that was part French and part Portuguese and part Italian, and the groups founded by people like Stefano della Chia, who will be coming up to today's episode, by the way.
[00:13:12]  Yeah, and Guido Giannetini and a million other people sort of coalesced into the P2 Lodge, which ran all kinds of operations from neo-fascist terrorism during what are called in Italy the Ani di Piombo,
[00:13:31]  the years of lead, during which the official story is that extremist left and right groups, groups like P2 on the right, and then groups like the Brigadier Rossi, the Red Brigades on the left, were attacking each other and so forth.
[00:13:46]  But the further we get away from it historically, the more it looks like the right-wing groups may have done almost all the actual terrorism and assassination and then blamed it on the left as something part of something called the strategy of tension, which I'm sure we'll talk about later.
[00:14:04]  And so there was the outright street terrorism, assassination of politicians.
[00:14:11]  Trade station bombing.
[00:14:13]  Train station bombing, yeah.
[00:14:14]  But there was also heavy media ownership and media involvement and coverage of these events.
[00:14:19]  They were in control not only of the events themselves, but of how they got covered in the Italian press.
[00:14:25]  There was deep involvement with the banking sector and in particular the Vatican Bank.
[00:14:32]  Most people, when they hear P2, the thing they probably think of first is Roberto Calvi and the Banco Ambrosiano.
[00:14:41]  And P2 was laundering money for the CIA.
[00:14:45]  P2 was laundering mafia money.

=== P2 And The Vatican Bank (02:20) ===

[00:14:48]  I personally, I don't know how you guys feel about this, but I think there's an excellent chance that P2 was involved in the Marc Dutru affair in Belgium.
[00:15:01]  And for listeners who may not have heard of that, Dutru was a guy who kidnapped a lot of children who ended up raped and murdered.
[00:15:10]  And when he was arrested for it, said he had been doing it for various right-wing elements within the Belgian government and Belgian high society.
[00:15:19]  And one of the elements he named was P7.
[00:15:24]  And P7 was another Masonic lodge in Belgium, which existed as a front to filter money to P2.
[00:15:32]  People who didn't want it to be known that they were giving money to P2 sent it through P7.
[00:15:38]  So the combination of Dutru's involvement with P7 and the fact that various P2-involved people have been caught up in sex trafficking and child kidnapping scandals since then.
[00:15:53]  Not a lot of people know.
[00:15:54]  I was raised very Catholic, so I kind of have an eye on the church at all times.
[00:16:00]  And the election of this last pope, Pope Francis, the one all the liberals like, he wasn't supposed to be the pope.
[00:16:08]  No, no, he wasn't.
[00:16:10]  Yeah, the only reason he's the pope is that the guy they wanted got caught in a mafia-connected sex trafficking scandal right before the papal election.
[00:16:21]  And Pope Francis or Jorge Maria Bergoglio, his pre-papal name, he's got one long.
[00:16:29]  So they thought, we'll let this guy be Pope for like nine months and then he'll die.
[00:16:34]  And then we'll elect the guy we actually wanted.
[00:16:36]  Yeah, that was a whoops.
[00:16:38]  Yeah, and he just keeps living and living.
[00:16:41]  So the fact that Silvio Berlusconi, a guy who is up to his neck in all this, you can literally go online and see his membership card in the propaganda due a lodge.
[00:16:53]  It's insane that he was ever the president.
[00:16:56]  It's as if the presidency of the United States were held for 20 years by a joint presidency of Donald Trump and Otto Scorseni.

=== Nation States and Proving Grounds (14:51) ===

[00:17:09]  Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[00:17:10]  It's fucking nuts.
[00:17:12]  Or it's like if HW was somehow more cartoonish and garish.
[00:17:19]  Yeah.
[00:17:19]  Because he himself, you know, like, I still think it's totally insane that we had director of the CIA become the president.
[00:17:26]  That like should never, that was like a crossover event that should have never happened.
[00:17:31]  It shouldn't be illegal.
[00:17:33]  He shouldn't be allowed to run for president.
[00:17:36]  I love the way that you started this by saying that these, the way to think of these, you know, organizations, and again, we're going to get more into this, is as detachments that they eventually detach from kind of from their host.
[00:17:50]  They're like parasites in this way, right?
[00:17:52]  But they attach and become like something they weren't intended to be.
[00:17:58]  And, you know, HW kind of like crossing over from, you know, what people colloquially call the deep state, shadow government, however you want to call that.
[00:18:07]  Sometimes I find that like maybe those aren't even the best ways to put it because it sounds like it's something that undergirds everything as opposed to this sort of like, as you say, detached, extraneous, like nebulous.
[00:18:23]  I think of it as lattice work.
[00:18:26]  Like, or like, you know, when you see commercials for like Verizon or one of these companies, and they'll show they have cell towers all over the world, and they have connections between the cell towers.
[00:18:36]  It's every country, every place, exactly, those maps.
[00:18:39]  This is how this works too.
[00:18:40]  Like, any one of those things that you mentioned, or any of the one of the things that we'll talk about today, too, connects to basically every single other one.
[00:18:50]  And whenever you say something like that, whenever you are like very sure of yourself and tell people, no, these things connect, people automatically think that you're like crazy or something, that you have one of these, you know, boards with the pins and the yarn going from here to there.
[00:19:05]  But like this is in black and white, all existed and all exists.
[00:19:11]  Like this isn't something that we're, this is no conjecture.
[00:19:14]  This isn't like something we're making up.
[00:19:16]  This is all reported, happened.
[00:19:18]  Many, many people died.
[00:19:21]  And it faded further, sort of, it more merged.
[00:19:25]  I think that one of the things that changed is that that world and sort of our world became pretty much the same world.
[00:19:34]  And that's kind of what we're living in now.
[00:19:36]  We're living, it's like they created like, you know, through that lattice work, they created sort of the landscape for a new earth and then descended to ours.
[00:19:45]  And now we just live in like a world that we don't even know, or a lot of people don't even know.
[00:19:50]  You don't even walk around and think about is a world created by this.
[00:19:53]  And it's the world that they wanted.
[00:19:56]  Yeah, I mean, the way we're taught history is essentially with nation states, everything before the era of the nation state is kind of vague.
[00:20:05]  Yeah.
[00:20:07]  Then you get to nation states.
[00:20:08]  Purposely, purposely, by the way.
[00:20:10]  Right, absolutely.
[00:20:11]  And as soon as nation states are established, we're taught each one of them as like, you know, what in philosophical terms would be called a windowless monad.
[00:20:19]  Yes.
[00:20:19]  You know, it's got nothing to do with anything else.
[00:20:23]  It's not interconnected in any way.
[00:20:25]  And history is just sort of these like, you know, sock'em bopper robots smashing blindly together.
[00:20:32]  They're slugging it out.
[00:20:33]  I'll left to the jaw.
[00:20:36]  My block is locked off.
[00:20:38]  You can rock'em sock'em with the rock'em sock'em robots by Marx.
[00:20:42]  Yes.
[00:20:43]  But something like to talk about this idea of detachment, Liz, that one of the biggest, most profitable military contractors on earth, Executive Outcomes, what a horrifying name by the way.
[00:20:56]  Yeah, totally horrible.
[00:20:58]  I mean, talk about the SS.
[00:21:00]  Yeah, Executive Outcomes was started by this guy, Aben Barlow, essentially to reconstitute the security state and the Gestapo in South Africa during the apartheid era after apartheid fell apart.
[00:21:18]  He could see apartheid coming, and so he hired as many veterans as he could of the South African Bureau of State Security, pardon me, which was kind of like their CIA, and the, again, another horrifying name, the Civil Cooperation Bureau, which was their Gestapo, and turned this state apparatus into a private company.
[00:21:44]  And one of the key points I think to make about all of this, one of the sort of detached shadow state entities that people least like to talk about is Nazism.
[00:21:58]  Because the Third Reich never ended.
[00:22:02]  It never stopped.
[00:22:04]  What happened was that the people canny and slick enough to detach from the nation state ended up reconstituting the Third Reich on the level of a shadow state or a paranational entity.
[00:22:21]  It went from being a thing with geographical borders and an alleged political and bureaucratic hierarchy to this kind of malleable, semi-porous, multinational, motile organization that didn't necessarily have the same leaders at any given time, that wasn't necessarily involved in the same national interests at any given time.
[00:22:48]  And something, well, I don't want to get too far ahead of myself, but one of the things these shadow states need is territory in which to experiment.
[00:23:04]  Territory in which to play exactly proven grounds, places to play out their ideas and to demonstrate to potential clientele, yes, you know, we can do X.
[00:23:16]  And so certain states essentially created by the CIA, like various dictatorships in Latin America, they weren't just dictatorships because that was more convenient for American policy or because these countries had natural resources that we wanted.
[00:23:34]  They were also proving grounds.
[00:23:36]  Exactly like you're talking about.
[00:23:38]  They were places where these organizations could be given tasks and assignments and we could sort of sit back and go like, oh, okay, interesting.
[00:23:47]  And these places often included interface points where various sort of post-national shadow state entities could exchange materials and personnel and money and ideas.
[00:24:04]  And that I think is kind of what we're generally building toward here.
[00:24:10]  Yeah, one thing before we get into in more detail these sort of proving grounds, which I think that's such a great way to put that, I just want to pinpoint something you said that I think is very interesting.
[00:24:22]  You brought up, you know, the nation state and philosophically the monad, right?
[00:24:29]  And I just want to say, like, just to add to that really quickly, that the reason why, you know, that history and that narrative persists is because liberalism as a philosophy, as an ideology, requires a subject that is thought of as a monad, that we are all sort of enclosed individuals, monads with no social or familiar or any other kind of political or any kind of other bond to each other.
[00:24:58]  And the only way that we exist with one another is through a negotiation, through a contract with each other in a marketplace.
[00:25:07]  That's how liberalism demands the world be seen.
[00:25:12]  And so it's not a coincidence that the history we're taught, whether it's how we started this episode on the kind of official narrative of post-war, you know, with, you know, the United States, of course, being the subject of history there, but or the,
[00:25:27]  you know, the way we say, well, we don't really know anything about before the nation state, it's kind of hazy, but then the nation-state emerges and this is this new thing, is because that history, you know, that has to be told that the world has always been governed by,
[00:25:42]  you know, monad entities, the nation-state or individuals negotiating with each other in a global marketplace or in a social marketplace or a political marketplace, various rights or disagreements or what have you as a way of reifying The liberal world order.
[00:26:00]  Yeah.
[00:26:00]  So this is, this is all, you know, we always make a joke about, you know, we're all eating from the trash can of ideology, but this is a perfect example of exactly why trying to understand how something like, you know, a claim that we're making in this episode that the Third Reich never ended, which sounds possibly totally absurd and insane, is actually true is because you have to kind of break away from this governing, you know,
[00:26:29]  liberal ideology and liberal history narrative in order to understand actually a sort of the kind of different story that we're trying to tell of how the contemporary world order has emerged.
[00:26:42]  Yeah, this is exactly what Marx was talking about in that famous sack of potatoes analysis.
[00:26:47]  Yeah, exactly.
[00:26:48]  Totally.
[00:26:48]  Yeah, that, you know, we are educated to behave like a sack of potatoes in that if you pour more water into a bucket of water, you don't have two water.
[00:27:00]  You know, you just, it becomes one new thing.
[00:27:05]  Right, right, right.
[00:27:06]  A sack of potatoes, it's just a bunch of separate potatoes.
[00:27:09]  They don't add up to anything new.
[00:27:12]  They're bumping against each other and sometimes bruising, but like nothing else.
[00:27:15]  Right.
[00:27:16]  We are taught to think of history in essentially that way.
[00:27:36]  On that note, let's jump in because we mentioned proving grounds.
[00:27:41]  We mentioned, you know, we kind of teased like, oh, we're going to get into that later in the episode.
[00:27:45]  So we should just get into it all right now.
[00:27:48]  Previously in this sort of like unofficial series, we had mentioned various colonies that were set up.
[00:27:57]  I guess you could call them colonies that were set up post, you know, post-World War II.
[00:28:03]  We had mentioned Colonia Dignidad, which we're going to get into, but that's not the only, that's not the only one or the only instance of this sort of, you know, I don't know.
[00:28:15]  I want to say just like, I think of it as like a bunch of rats scattering the gloves.
[00:28:21]  Like something was like a trash can.
[00:28:23]  Like it was like the Soviets knocked over the Nazi trash can and all the rats scattered.
[00:28:29]  There's a reason they call them rat lines.
[00:28:31]  Yeah, totally.
[00:28:32]  One thing I wanted to mention before we get into this is that, well, while we're getting into this, actually, it's a good little segue in here.
[00:28:39]  Is that in our last episode about the Veil Prophet, I talked a little bit about some comparisons between sort of these post-Confederate organizations and the Free Corps.
[00:28:49]  And one thing, and we also touched on, or rather I guess touched on, that one of the one of the sort of progenitors of the Vail Profit Society was a guy who had at one point fled to Mexico to a Confederate colony.
[00:29:06]  And there were a ton of Confederate colonies, not a ton, but there were a handful, actually.
[00:29:10]  That's the opposite of a ton of Confederate colonies in South America.
[00:29:14]  It was a lot.
[00:29:15]  Yeah, I mean, which is, I mean, 20,000, for instance, ended up in Brazil, where they still, basically their descendants still live today and essentially kind of LARP as Confederates in this little village they have.
[00:29:30]  And also, I found out that one of the members of Osimiutantes, his dad was a Confederato, which is kind of funny.
[00:29:36]  Wow.
[00:29:37]  There's two ideas.
[00:29:38]  That's kind of a bummer.
[00:29:39]  Yeah.
[00:29:39]  Well, I don't.
[00:29:40]  It doesn't mean he's a Confederate.
[00:29:41]  No, I know, but it's just like very strange.
[00:29:44]  Well, it's also like when you think about how slavery was actually ended in Brazil.
[00:29:49]  Oh, God, I know.
[00:29:49]  It's like 20 years, 23 years after it was ended in the U.S.
[00:29:53]  Well, officially, but it was still going on.
[00:29:56]  Literally still happening today.
[00:29:57]  I was going to say 23 years ago.
[00:29:59]  Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[00:30:01]  But not even.
[00:30:02]  There's two others I wanted to mention, though.
[00:30:04]  One is Nueva Australia, which was a group of Australian sort of utopian socialists led by this fucking reporter.
[00:30:17]  Raising the eyebrow here named William Lane, who is like a big prohibition guy, which actually respect for that.
[00:30:22]  They moved to, I believe, Paraguay and broke up over race mixing and drinking laws.
[00:30:28]  He wanted none of the first and quite a few of the latter.
[00:30:33]  Are you telling me that something involving Australia was racist and light-freaking?
[00:30:38]  It's incredible.
[00:30:39]  It's incredible.
[00:30:40]  I mean, a group of Australian communists literally moved, I mean, they called themselves communist, moved from Australia to fucking Paraguay and were racist.
[00:30:49]  It's like, dude, you already live in a colony that you can be as racist as you want it.
[00:30:55]  I mean, this is a total side note, but it's weird to remember how many people sort of latched onto ideas of communism or socialism in the era before Marxism was kind of the universal definition of that idea.
[00:31:09]  And how many utopian societies there were with very different definitions of utopia.
[00:31:14]  Yes.
[00:31:15]  I come from one of those.
[00:31:17]  I am here, specifically here, because one branch of my family moved from Germany to be part of a Christian anarchist commune.
[00:31:28]  No shit.
[00:31:28]  Wow.
[00:31:29]  Yeah, run by like a charismatic German preacher.
[00:31:35]  And there were, Missouri is a weird state in a lot of ways.
[00:31:40]  Yes.
[00:31:40]  And there were communes and utopian groups all over the state.
[00:31:46]  Part of the reason Joseph Smith came here is because there was essentially nobody to stop him.
[00:31:52]  And still, you can find cities all over the state with made-up Mormon names.
[00:31:56]  There's a city called Nauvoo, not very far from here.
[00:31:59]  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

=== Molesting Charismatic Preacher (07:24) ===

[00:32:00]  Yeah, just they just made shit up.
[00:32:03]  I think Jesse James, or no, Butch Cassidy, I think's dad lived in Nauvoo at one point.
[00:32:08]  I was just talking about him.
[00:32:10]  Yeah, Jesse James lived right around where I am at this moment.
[00:32:15]  Among other places.
[00:32:17]  There's another colony I want to mention too, also run by Germans, although none of these people seem particularly charismatic.
[00:32:23]  And I think the type of religion that they practice we would probably find strange and terrible.
[00:32:28]  But it's called Nueva Germany, or excuse me, Nueva Germania, also in Paraguay.
[00:32:34]  And this one was established by a guy named Bernard Forrester, who is married to, you'll never guess, Nietzsche's busted-ass sister, Elizabeth, who famously, famously anti-Semitic, insane, like, I think cripplingly anti-Semitic would be a good way to describe her.
[00:32:55]  So they left because they thought Germany and Europe had become too soft on Jews.
[00:32:59]  Mind you, this is in 1887.
[00:33:02]  They're like, they're too nice to Jews here.
[00:33:06]  They brought 14 families with them to Paraguay.
[00:33:09]  A bunch of them immediately died of lockjaw.
[00:33:13]  A lot of other people just left.
[00:33:15]  The remainder of the people had to deal with a leprosy outbreak.
[00:33:19]  Elizabeth fucking books it.
[00:33:21]  She goes back to Germany to eventually join the Nazi Party.
[00:33:24]  Hitler would actually go to her funeral, I believe.
[00:33:28]  Bernard basically swindled the rest of them that were there, which, by the way, as a Jew, maybe that's why you left Europe, Bernard, is because you couldn't handle the competition.
[00:33:39]  Took the rest of their fucking money, got crazy in debt, and then bam, off himself with strychnine at a hotel in Assunción.
[00:33:47]  I'm the dumbest guy in Germany, but I'm the smartest guy in America.
[00:33:53]  It's incredible.
[00:33:54]  It's incredible.
[00:33:54]  I mean, can you imagine like these fucking like frail, like just German racists going up the river, Hearts of Darkness style in Paraguay, and then getting to their horrible like little spot they picked out because these people were not farmers and then immediately dying of lockjaw.
[00:34:08]  I don't even know you could die of lockjaw.
[00:34:10]  Can you just not try to?
[00:34:15]  So what we're talking about today is a little place called Colonia Dignidad.
[00:34:18]  And when Michael mentioned a charismatic German preacher, that raised my eyebrows a little bit because we are also dealing with a charismatic German preacher.
[00:34:28]  This one named Paul Schaefer.
[00:34:30]  Ladies and gentlemen, Paul Schaefer, come on over.
[00:34:34]  Now, Paul Schaefer, born, I think, 1921.
[00:34:38]  He, you know, when he grew up, joined the Hitler Youth as a teenager, eventually tried to join the SS, could not, possibly due to the fact that this guy was so fucking dumb that when he was a kid, he tried to untie his shoe with a fork and through a completely predictable set of events, ends up literally poking out one of his eyes.
[00:35:00]  He, I think, later told people he lost it as a war wound, which to be clear, I would also do.
[00:35:06]  I would not tell people the real story there.
[00:35:09]  Because that's some like gummo shit.
[00:35:11]  Yes.
[00:35:13]  So people, so a lot of histories I've read of this guy.
[00:35:16]  Some of them claim that he was in the SS or that he had served in the Eastern Front.
[00:35:22]  That is a lie.
[00:35:23]  He actually, or I think that people were probably just confused, he spent the war as a corporal in the Wehrmacht in occupied France in a medical unit.
[00:35:32]  So I think he was in just a field hospital.
[00:35:35]  Anyways, World War II ends.
[00:35:38]  This guy is, like many of these scumbags, lost.
[00:35:43]  And he's wandering around and he gets really into this branch of evangelicalism, evangelicism?
[00:35:51]  That's how you pronounce it?
[00:35:52]  Evangelicalism.
[00:35:54]  Called the Evangelical Free Church, which I'm not super familiar with, but apparently spawned a lot of weird people.
[00:36:02]  According to Steve Snyder, their advice upview, he was heavily influenced by a guy named William N. Braanahan, who is a healer that also very much influenced our good friend Jim Jones, who at the end of his life said he was a prophet.
[00:36:14]  He believed in something called annihilationism, which is, I think, means there's no hell.
[00:36:19]  You're just annihilated, which I'll be honest with you sounds better than hell.
[00:36:22]  Like if I was going there, does sound better.
[00:36:26]  There's like more than a couple interesting comparisons here with Jonestown.
[00:36:32]  Yeah, absolutely.
[00:36:34]  Listen, listeners out there, if any of your friends starts getting really into religion, any kind of religion, I don't care what kind of religion, but they start getting really into religion and they're like, hey, I'm going to move to Uruguay.
[00:36:47]  Tell them not to.
[00:36:48]  Yeah.
[00:36:50]  If your religion requires relocation to South America, the batting average on that is like zero out of 100.
[00:36:58]  Yes, he has an incredible kill-death ratio.
[00:37:01]  Yeah.
[00:37:02]  Don't go to Guyana because your prophet decided that that's where Christ is coming back.
[00:37:10]  For that matter, don't go to Utah.
[00:37:12]  Yeah, yeah.
[00:37:13]  I've been there.
[00:37:14]  It's not a pleasant place.
[00:37:15]  I'd rather go to Guyana than Utah, although under tourist circumstances only.
[00:37:20]  So in 1954, he hooks up with this guy named Hugo Barr and sort of gets trained as a preacher.
[00:37:27]  And he starts wandering around sort of as like a – so Schaeffer starts wandering up and down Germany playing acoustic guitar, you know, sort of a Dylan-esque figure if Dylan was really into evangelical Christianity and also molesting children.
[00:37:44]  Well, it – It may be the devil or it may be the Lord, but you're going to have to serve somebody.
[00:37:51]  So this guy sets up a home for war widows and children in about 1960 and then immediately gets accused of molesting the children there.
[00:38:02]  Like, I think only months pass before people are like, yeah, he's raping my kid.
[00:38:06]  His record of child molestation, I was just going to say, is really sort of remarkable in its scope.
[00:38:13]  I mean, officially, he's importing children from halfway around the world and shit.
[00:38:19]  This guy wants to molest children more than any other child molester I've ever heard of.
[00:38:25]  Yeah, like we, you know, I think I've probably described Epstein before as like one of the most prolific child molesters sort of in recent history, but I'm almost positive that Schaefer has him beat by like a lot.
[00:38:37]  Yeah.
[00:38:37]  And Epstein had, he had it comparatively easy.
[00:38:40]  He had jets and shit.
[00:38:41]  This guy's a lunch pale, you know, nine to five child molester.
[00:38:45]  This guy's got one eye.
[00:38:47]  I mean, not one eye.
[00:38:50]  So he starts really like entering into a refrain, which he'll keep up for most of the rest of his life, which is that communism is going to come to the rest of Germany, that only his specific brand of Christianity can save people's soul, and that Germany, sort of pre-modern Germany, which, by the way, here's another little tip for listeners out there.
[00:39:13]  If anyone you hang out with starts idolizing pre-modern Germany in any way, maybe they're just like, I like the pastoral landscapes of, you know, the fields of Bavaria.

=== Otto Scorzeni's Mercenary Ventures (09:56) ===

[00:39:25]  I would edge away from them.
[00:39:27]  I think runes are cool.
[00:39:29]  Yeah.
[00:39:30]  If you know a rune guy, don't hang out with the rune guy.
[00:39:35]  So he, of course, starts getting investigated about 1961 by the public prosecutor in Bonn, and he splits to the Middle East, which I have been unable to find out where he was there or what he was doing there.
[00:39:51]  But also not a good sign.
[00:39:53]  Several conflicting reports about what the hell was going on, but I haven't seen any actual documented proof of what the guy was doing.
[00:40:01]  I mean, it should be noted that around this time, like Otto Scorzeni was floating around various countries there.
[00:40:08]  I think he had already set up the Paladin Group, sort of his mercenary firm.
[00:40:14]  But I know at one point they were training the security services of Egypt, basically modeling them along the lines of the Gestapo.
[00:40:22]  Yeah, I think that was in about 55.
[00:40:25]  Paladin Group's history is kind of hard to trace because it actually existed for like 10 years before it was incorporated and had a name.
[00:40:32]  But I think it was mid-50s that they trained Nasser security forces.
[00:40:36]  And then like 1960 or so was when Skorzeni brought the Green Berets over for special training in Spain.
[00:40:47]  To be clear, like the Green Berets, who later fought very famously and brutally in Vietnam were trained in that type of warfare by Otto Scorzeni, the completely unrepentant, I would actually say rabid Nazi who was basically like Hitler's Rambo.
[00:41:06]  I guess while we're talking about this, should we talk about Sofindus for a minute?
[00:41:11]  Yes, so we were talking earlier about the way the SS kind of mirrored the functions of all the different departments of the German government.
[00:41:23]  And one of them was a service called the Ausland Sigerheitsdienst, which was the foreign security service.
[00:41:32]  It's kind of like their equivalent of a CIA type group.
[00:41:35]  And in 1938, when the Nazis invaded Poland and the war really got going, an Ausland SD agent named Johannes Bernhardt realized, like, shit, we could lose this war.
[00:41:50]  I mean, there are a lot of people who are going to be fighting against us.
[00:41:53]  This was before the pact between Yeshislav Morotov and Jochim von Ribbentrop.
[00:41:59]  So they thought, you know, maybe Russia's going to attack us immediately.
[00:42:04]  And he got in contact with these guys in Spain because there was a Germany to Spain network that the Nazis had used to smuggle weapons to the Spanish fascists during the Spanish Civil War.
[00:42:18]  And he got in touch with these guys again and said, hey, what if we use these same networks to smuggle money?
[00:42:26]  Because if we lose this war, I don't want to get my shit taken away from me.
[00:42:30]  And this was not just the accumulated wealth of the Nazi government, but this is after mass confiscation of property from Jews.
[00:42:40]  And mass confiscations of artwork and national treasures.
[00:42:43]  Right.
[00:42:44]  And gold risk.
[00:42:44]  Absolutely.
[00:42:45]  Yeah.
[00:42:46]  So they've got an enormous amount of both money and stuff worth an enormous amount of money.
[00:42:53]  And they start this group called, in Spanish, the Sociedad Financiera Industrial.
[00:43:00]  Ooh, you've got a lisp there.
[00:43:03]  Sí.
[00:43:04]  Ifcathilian, mi amor.
[00:43:07]  The Industrial Finance Society, which is usually referred to by the acronym SOFINDUS, which in English spells, so find us.
[00:43:17]  I know.
[00:43:18]  That, by the way, people will dispute me on this.
[00:43:22]  But that is, I'm reading through that through the lens of synchronicity.
[00:43:28]  Yeah, oh, come on.
[00:43:29]  It's got to be.
[00:43:30]  And one source I looked at said that during 1944 alone, just in terms of gold, not cash, not bank accounts, not art, just gold, Sofindus smuggled out in a single year the equivalent of almost $21 billion worth of gold.
[00:43:52]  So, yeah, we're looking at tens and tens of billion dollars, tens of billions of dollars a year for seven years, eight years.
[00:44:01]  So, an enormous amount of money.
[00:44:04]  And then, when the war ends and the Nazis have obviously lost, Sofindus moves from the business of smuggling money to smuggling Nazis.
[00:44:14]  And one of the Nazis who used the Sofindus rat line was Otto Skorzeni, who lived, as far as I can tell, pretty much peacefully the rest of his life in fascist Spain.
[00:44:27]  And I even discovered a part he founded, he kind of invented the modern private military concept.
[00:44:35]  It's basically like the first really like of what we know of as a PMC today.
[00:44:41]  His group, the Paladin group, was basically like the progenitors of it.
[00:44:45]  They were the inventors of it.
[00:44:47]  I not to use the word progenitors twice in an episode.
[00:44:50]  But, you know, imagine I said a different word there.
[00:44:54]  They worked with the CIA, they worked with the special forces.
[00:44:57]  And I even found that at one point, Otto Skorzeni was the official European sales representative for the American company Armco Steel.
[00:45:09]  Yep.
[00:45:09]  He was just completely, unashamedly out there announcing where he was and what his name was.
[00:45:18]  He was married to Jean-Mars Schacht's niece, too, right?
[00:45:21]  Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[00:45:22]  Like anyone could have discovered where he was at any point.
[00:45:25]  But I suppose because he was in fascist Spain and because he'd worked with the CIA and the American army, no one was interested in arresting him.
[00:45:35]  By the way, he also worked.
[00:45:38]  Israel has a reputation for having gone after Nazis after World War II.
[00:45:44]  But one person who was not on that list was Otto Skorzeni, who did work with Israel, who had, by the way, of course, full knowledge with who he was and what he had done.
[00:45:56]  Yeah.
[00:45:57]  I don't know that this is true, but I have heard allegedly that two Israeli, I don't know what agency they would have been part of, maybe the Mossad, a male and female agent were sent out to arrest Skorzeni at a bar that he frequented by pretending that they were a couple and they wanted to have a three-way with him.
[00:46:18]  Whoa.
[00:46:20]  And they convinced him, yeah, we want to go back to your house and have a three-way.
[00:46:24]  So they go back to his house and they think they're about to arrest him.
[00:46:28]  And then from behind him, they hear the click of a gun.
[00:46:31]  And, okay, so how did you figure out who I was?
[00:46:35]  And that's how Scorzeni ended up working for Israel.
[00:46:38]  And to be clear, like, Scorzeni was like a real-life James Bond type.
[00:46:42]  Like, he was extremely wily.
[00:46:44]  And by the way, this is an anti-James Bond podcast, so I don't mean that's a comparison.
[00:46:50]  Blofeld, the villain from James Bond, is based on Otto Scorzeni.
[00:46:54]  Yeah, right?
[00:46:56]  Yeah, the guy with the scar who pets the cat.
[00:46:58]  The name Scarface comes from Otto Scorzeni.
[00:47:01]  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
[00:47:02]  He got them dueling, I think.
[00:47:04]  Yeah.
[00:47:04]  Well, it's every basic, if you look at a portrait of any German who was born sort of pre-World War II, if they're from the upper classes, they have very oftentimes tasteful scars sort of crisscrossing their faces.
[00:47:17]  And those were signs of basically like manhood and virility that they got while dueling at their fucked up schools that they went to.
[00:47:24]  You know, it's like all British upper class people were sort of brutally molested at their private schools.
[00:47:30]  And all Germans were also probably happened to them as well, considering what we know now about sort of post-World War II German history and, let's say, rather extremely liberal attitudes towards pedophilia.
[00:47:45]  But their sort of equivalent to that was just stabbing each other in the faces with rapiers.
[00:47:52]  And one time I was telling an ex-girlfriend of mine about that, and she didn't believe me.
[00:47:56]  So I showed her a photo of German like duelist guys.
[00:47:59]  Yeah.
[00:47:59]  And then she was like, oh, dude, that's so hot.
[00:48:02]  So certainly still works.
[00:48:04]  Fellas, if you're out there, you're young, you're virile, start dueling your boys.
[00:48:08]  It's a totally safe thing to do during COVID.
[00:48:11]  Duel to rest.
[00:48:37]  So back, back to Schaefer, right?
[00:48:40]  So we last saw him.
[00:48:41]  He's in the Middle East with a couple of his lieutenants.
[00:48:44]  Somehow in here, he meets the Chilean ambassador to Germany, who I read didn't know exactly what the deal was with Schaefer in terms of child molestation and sort of tells him very excitedly about how there's a lot of land in Chile, totally ready to homestead.
[00:49:02]  I think right now we should get into a little background on Chile and Chile's relationship to Nazism because Chile, much like a sort of select few other South American countries, and then eventually basically every South American country, definitely had like a pretty robust relationship to Nazism and really in general to Germany.

=== Prussian Influence on Nazism (09:25) ===

[00:49:21]  I mean, one of the big things that I've run into a lot when reading about Germany, even before this, is that a lot of sort of the upper classes there and certainly a lot of their military men were trained by Prussian army instructors who went there sort of, I can't remember which war it was after, I think after the Franco-Prussian War.
[00:49:39]  They split Germany and went to Chile and taught at military academies.
[00:49:44]  They taught at high schools.
[00:49:45]  And from that, we actually have Nazi parties emerging pretty early on in the 20th century.
[00:49:50]  Explicitly called the Nazis, N-A-C-I-S.
[00:49:54]  I'm sure you can correct my pronunciation, but.
[00:49:57]  That was correct.
[00:50:00]  There's an interesting just sort of quirk of history in this that during the huge waves of migration from Europe to the United States in the 19th century that were caused by things like the 1848 revolutions and the massive agricultural famine that preceded that, we had all these national immigration quotas.
[00:50:24]  And so lots and lots of people got turned away from attempting to immigrate into the United States.
[00:50:30]  A number of South American countries, and particularly Argentina and Chile, had very open immigration policies because they had enormous amounts of kind of unworked but usable land and were interested in bringing in as many immigrants as they could.
[00:50:47]  So you'll find, for example, there are tons of people from Argentina who consider themselves Italian, who have Italian names, who speak Italian.
[00:50:58]  And partly because of that, there was a base of support for both fascism and Nazism in South America and in the southern cone, Argentina and Chile in particular, because there were so many Europeans there already when those movements started in the 20s and the 30s.
[00:51:19]  And in Argentina in particular, of course, you had the rise of Juan Perón.
[00:51:26]  And I mean, he was sort of, I think Peron is a very interesting precursor to Trump in a lot of ways.
[00:51:33]  And he sort of didn't exactly have a political philosophy.
[00:51:37]  Yeah, a lot of people call him a fascist, but I think that's untrue.
[00:51:41]  And like, certainly a lot of sort of the left-wing Peronists would also disagree with that as well.
[00:51:47]  Yeah, yeah, Peronism.
[00:51:48]  Peronism is like almost its own.
[00:51:50]  That is like its own thing.
[00:51:52]  Yeah, I don't think you can pin down Peronismo enough just to call it fascist.
[00:51:57]  But he definitely did like the Nazis.
[00:52:00]  Oh, yeah.
[00:52:01]  Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[00:52:02]  He definitely was willing to harbor ex-Nazis and to bring them in during the war on visits of state.
[00:52:10]  Right.
[00:52:11]  While the United States were at war with them.
[00:52:14]  So Latin America and particularly the Southern Cone are kind of ready-made for Nazis and fascists wanting to escape Central Europe.
[00:52:26]  Yeah.
[00:52:27]  And with Chile in particular, they actually, the Nazis there in 1938 tried to do a coup and take over the country.
[00:52:35]  This was, I have read about a lot of coups in my life.
[00:52:39]  And usually one of the things you want to do when you do a coup is you got to take over the radio station.
[00:52:44]  You got to take over, obviously, where the politicians are.
[00:52:46]  And you probably got to figure out something about the barracks in the capital.
[00:52:50]  What these guys do is they take over the social security building and then immediately all get shot.
[00:52:58]  Cut it by 1.1%.
[00:53:00]  Yeah.
[00:53:01]  I'm not sure.
[00:53:01]  Maybe they were appealing to the older people there.
[00:53:04]  I'm not entirely sure.
[00:53:06]  I don't know.
[00:53:07]  There was a guy I wrote a lot of notes about and who I've known about for a while, but got much more deeply interested in while researching this episode named Miguel Serrano.
[00:53:15]  This is, I don't, I haven't really figured out a way to work it in, so I don't think we will.
[00:53:20]  We'll probably do another episode involving this guy.
[00:53:22]  But just real quick about Serrano, and he's a good, I don't couldn't say he's emblematic of Chilean Nazism because he certainly has many different characteristics than a lot of those guys.
[00:53:33]  But he was a Chilean guy raised by Prussian teachers.
[00:53:36]  After, I'm not going to get into his beginnings, but during World War II, he is a Nazi in Chile.
[00:53:43]  He is not a member of the German Nazi Party.
[00:53:44]  He's a member of a local Nazi party.
[00:53:46]  Starts talking to a guy at the Italian embassy and an SS member attached to the German embassy who turn him on to the occult aspects of fascist ideology.
[00:53:57]  He starts mixing it with esotericism, Nazism, with esotericism, Nazism, Hinduism, and Kundalini yoga.
[00:54:07]  He eventually joins a strange sort of order who swore allegiance to, I quote, a mysterious Brahmanical elite supposedly based in the Himalayas who were essentially perfect Aryans.
[00:54:23]  And he had this crazy view that, well, I actually wouldn't even want to call that crazy.
[00:54:28]  He had this view that Hitler was the god Wotan, and he was here because of Kali Yuga.
[00:54:36]  And he was like part of a perfect divine being.
[00:54:39]  You might think that this would get him laughed out of, you know, whatever beer hall there was in Chile.
[00:54:45]  No, not.
[00:54:47]  He and his friends, of which at this point there were a lot, would they would sit down and sort of cross their legs and this is during World War II, commune with Hitler on the astral plane because that SS man at the embassy had told them that, yes, the war is fought in the air, on the earth, and in the water.
[00:55:08]  But it's also fought in the astral plane.
[00:55:10]  This is a member of the SS who was selected to go to Chile told him that.
[00:55:14]  After World War II, this guy goes to all these different spots.
[00:55:18]  By the way, does not believe that Hitler died.
[00:55:20]  His master had told him that he had a vision of Hitler after his death and that he was in the hollow earth, which also, of course, could be the bunker, which he blew his brains out in.
[00:55:30]  Perhaps.
[00:55:32]  He definitely killed himself there.
[00:55:34]  Anyways, this guy eventually becomes sort of a leading, well, I don't know, leading, but a big Jungian, friends with Herman Hess, and eventually the Chilean diplomat to, or excuse me, ambassador to Yugoslavia.
[00:55:47]  In Austria, which is insane in the 70s.
[00:55:51]  Anyways, he split.
[00:55:52]  He split after Andy came to power.
[00:55:54]  But that is like a guy who came from the milieu of the country, which we are talking about, right?
[00:56:01]  This is a country incredibly friendly to these ideas.
[00:56:04]  It's worth mentioning that there have been various strains of not even Nazism per se, but what you might call esoteric Hitlerism in Latin America ever since World War II.
[00:56:18]  And one of my favorite writers, Roberto Bolaño, is Chilean.
[00:56:24]  And if you ever want to sort of see a fictional account of this stuff, he wrote an amazing book called Nazi Literature in the Americas, which is, it's a fake dictionary of fictional North and South American Nazi and fascist novelists and poets and polemicists and all kinds of other shit.
[00:56:47]  And he lands at least once on like every bizarre strain of kind of post-World War II, like esoteric fascism or mystical Hitlerism or whatever else, you know, managed to survive in these odd little pockets, particularly in South and Central America.
[00:57:04]  In India as well.
[00:57:06]  Yes, yeah.
[00:57:07]  Yeah, that's one of the big strains came from there from a German, but but in India.
[00:57:11]  I don't know what it is, but when for some reason, when you mix Nazism with yoga, you get some like, that is like one of those dialectical processes that like you can't predict.
[00:57:20]  It's like the philosopher's stone or whatever.
[00:57:22]  It turns it into something completely insane.
[00:57:26]  Yeah, yeah.
[00:57:27]  Anyway, so Schaefer gets to, Schaefer gets to Chile and he buys a big ass fucking ranch south of Santiago, excuse me, south of Santiago that was called El Lavadero, and he starts a non-profit.
[00:57:41]  That is the thing that you need to keep in mind during all of this, is that during the entire time this is running, until like the mid-90s, in fact, I actually, until the mid-90s is what I assume, but it literally could still be a non-profit today.
[00:57:56]  I just looked this up.
[00:57:57]  No shit, it's a tourist resort.
[00:58:00]  Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[00:58:01]  Yeah, Via Bavaria.
[00:58:02]  Yes, it is.
[00:58:03]  It is.
[00:58:03]  I've seen some very weird YouTube videos of travel bloggers going there.
[00:58:10]  Anyways, this thing is 4,000 acres, fucking huge.
[00:58:14]  Eventually becomes 37,000 acres.
[00:58:16]  And it's surrounded on one side by really tall mountains, which is good if you want to have a compound.
[00:58:21]  Mountains are good.
[00:58:22]  And on the other side by a very fast river, also very good.
[00:58:27]  And he starts something called the Society.
[00:58:29]  All right.
[00:58:29]  I'm going to say this and then you're going to have to correct me.
[00:58:32]  Sociedad Benefactora y Educational Dignidad.
[00:58:38]  Sociedad Benefactora y Educacional Dignidad.
[00:58:42]  Okay, well, I can never...
[00:58:43]  Beautiful.

=== Nuclear Bomb & Climate Pressure (03:12) ===

[00:58:46]  Anyways, he gets around 300 settlers to come over the next three years.
[00:58:50]  So this is from 61 to 63.
[00:58:53]  And he really gets them to come by having his guys back in Germany tell them that a Soviet attack is coming.
[00:58:59]  A Soviet attack is coming.
[00:59:00]  And I think people living now, including myself, don't really grasp how paranoid people were back then about how the threat of nuclear war and the threat of a Soviet invasion.
[00:59:11]  And he really played on those fears.
[00:59:13]  Yeah, I mean, nuclear war itself is so surreal that, especially if you're living in a world where that has only fairly recently become a reality at all.
[00:59:22]  Yeah.
[00:59:23]  He's like, if someone tells you there's going to be a nuclear explosion that takes out the entirety of Central Europe, your reaction, I think, would kind of be like, why not?
[00:59:32]  This shouldn't be possible anyway.
[00:59:34]  How the fuck do I know that's not going to happen?
[00:59:36]  I don't think that people our age actually understand.
[00:59:39]  I mean, even in America, how omnipresent the threat of like nuclear holocaust was.
[00:59:45]  And like, I mean, I talked to my mom about that all the time.
[00:59:50]  She grew up, you know, she's a military brat and for some of that time was down in Florida during the Cuban Missile Crisis.
[00:59:57]  And like, you know, they just were like, I mean, every day you've got drills for in case of nuclear bomb, everyone get under their desk, which, okay, pause on that for a second.
[01:00:11]  But also, it's like, you know, I mean, everyone thought up until the fall of the Soviet Union that, you know, an atom bomb could be dropped at any given moment.
[01:00:20]  And I don't think that people, you know, our age, like appreciate that kind of existential pressure that filled and was so easily manipulated, not just in America, but abroad.
[01:00:32]  I would argue, though, that the COVID stuff gives us not a taste of that necessarily, but it's a similar flavor, right?
[01:00:39]  Like this sort of omnipresent sense of dread that we have and that we can do basically nothing about.
[01:00:46]  Or climate change.
[01:00:47]  Yeah, yeah.
[01:00:48]  I was going to say climate change because to me.
[01:00:50]  It's an interesting gift.
[01:00:51]  Climate is an interesting comparison, I think.
[01:00:54]  I think the COVID is almost like the inverse because in the case of the nuclear bomb, it's not happening anywhere, but could happen at any time.
[01:01:03]  Whereas in the case of COVID, it's happening everywhere, but everyone to go on living sort of has to believe that's not going to happen to me.
[01:01:13]  Right, right, right.
[01:01:14]  It's like an inverted.
[01:01:15]  Yeah, They're kind of, you know, yin and yang, as long as we're talking about youngins and esotericism and shit.
[01:01:24]  So let's talk a little bit about what was going on in this colony.
[01:01:28]  So you've got this psycho preacher from Germany.
[01:01:30]  He's got about 300 followers out on this farm that he's building.
[01:01:35]  And things get pretty weird pretty quickly.
[01:01:39]  They start, first of all, they start adopting Chilean children, which, by the way, again, my third bit of advice here.
[01:01:47]  If your boy is like, hey, I started a farm in a remote part of Chile and I'm adopting children, again, don't hang out with him anymore.
[01:01:56]  Stop doing it.

=== Adopting and Abducting: Colonia's Dark Secrets (02:19) ===

[01:01:59]  Yeah, not only adopting children, but using his hospital to abduct children.
[01:02:07]  Yes.
[01:02:08]  Yeah.
[01:02:08]  So let's talk about what they had there quick.
[01:02:10]  They had a factory, which, by the way, it turned out later they were making arms and chemical weapons in.
[01:02:16]  Yeah.
[01:02:17]  They had a hospital, which it was sort of famous for.
[01:02:20]  They had a restaurant, literally a rest stop, like side of the highway restaurant you could go to.
[01:02:26]  They had, of course, a ton of different like, you know, grain milling, et cetera, like a big working farm.
[01:02:32]  And the thing is about the farm is that you had to work about 16 hours a day for no pay, which doesn't seem great.
[01:02:39]  And also, Schaefer would molest your child.
[01:02:42]  That's the other thing here, is that basically every boy who was at Colonia Dig to Dad during this period, and in fact, during the entirety of its existence, was molested by Schaefer.
[01:02:53]  And he was notably very, very against his adult subjects having children.
[01:03:00]  Yeah.
[01:03:01]  Which, I mean, I'm sure had something to do with his bizarre religious beliefs, but I wonder to what degree it may also have had to do with their protectiveness about children if they had had them.
[01:03:13]  Yeah, I wonder.
[01:03:14]  My thing is that I think I was reading something like only 30 kids were born through this entire era that the colony was active.
[01:03:25]  And they were all basically sequestered away from the mothers in the hospital at the colony, which was actually quite large.
[01:03:32]  um by all accounts i'm actually like a very good hospital which is kind of a strange little thing but um but that my sense or you know my uh let's say feminine instinct is that he understood that if the women were were burying children that they would uh probably you know women will do anything to protect their kids and
[01:03:57]  And he would not have been able to continue, you know, what was an essential part of his operation.
[01:04:04]  But, you know, the kind of twist to that, which is interesting, is always like, okay, so he didn't actually see this as a kind of religious experiment that was going to continue past his death because like they weren't actually like reproducing members of the colony.

=== Chicago's Influence in Chile (15:25) ===

[01:04:18]  Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[01:04:20]  And that brings up the fact that, as we just mentioned, that this large and well-supplied hospital, he would invite Chilean families from the poor countryside to bring their children there and then abduct the boys to molest them.
[01:04:36]  And that he also adopted boys from orphanages in Germany to molest them.
[01:04:43]  And the very existence of the hospital calls up the weird excellence of their resources.
[01:04:50]  Right.
[01:04:51]  How they had all this shit and where it came from.
[01:04:54]  Well, one thing is that I found reported a couple of places, including I think in Lavenda's book, is that they had excellent plastic surgeons.
[01:05:04]  And that, combined with the fact that this was a meeting point for many of the people who had escaped Nazi Germany during the rat lines, really makes you think about a couple of things.
[01:05:15]  Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[01:05:15]  Yeah.
[01:05:16]  This was when I was when I was talking about interface points earlier between those, you know, between all these shadow state entities, this is exactly what I was thinking of.
[01:05:25]  Yeah, absolutely.
[01:05:27]  The kind of place where they meet and trade.
[01:05:30]  So he continues basically unmolested up until the 1970s when it appears that Allende is going to be elected president.
[01:05:40]  And during that time, he comes into contact with a group named Patriot, Patriot e Libertad, who have as a member one Michael Townley.
[01:05:51]  And by the way, this is before Pinochet, or excuse me, before Allende gets elected, before Pinochet takes over for him.
[01:05:59]  Patriot e Libertad start basically rustling up trouble, knowing that Allende is going to be elected.
[01:06:05]  Once he is elected, they start really going crazy.
[01:06:07]  I mean, there's assassinations, there's kidnappings, there's bombings.
[01:06:11]  And they are joined by the son of a Ford Motors, I believe, executive, who we talked about, I think, a little bit on our podcast with Stephen Snyder.
[01:06:19]  Yeah, you mentioned named Michael Townley.
[01:06:23]  And yes, Michael.
[01:06:24]  Yeah.
[01:06:26]  Please go talk about him.
[01:06:28]  Yeah, in retrospect, you know, now that we know that Pinochet was going to follow, Patria y Libertad, they're kind of like the stormtroopers, you know, in advance of Pinochet.
[01:06:41]  They kind of prepare the way for him.
[01:06:44]  And this guy, Michael Townley, shows up, and he's got all kinds of conflicting things going on.
[01:06:50]  In addition to having been the son of a motor company executive in Chile, he is working for the CIA, but he is also deeply tied to a group that we are going to have to talk about in some horrible terms called the DINA, the Dirección de Intelligencia Nacional, which under Pinochet, it means basically the National Intelligence Directorate.
[01:07:18]  And they're kind of a combination of a foreign intelligence service like the CIA and like Gestapo.
[01:07:24]  Yes.
[01:07:26]  He works for them and for the CIA at the same time.
[01:07:30]  And he is a very frequent guest at Colonia Dignidad, where he is involved in all sorts of evil projects, including the assassination of a number of important figures from the Allende regime.
[01:07:45]  He first tries to assassinate a guy named Carlos Pratz, who was a general.
[01:07:53]  He was the head of Chilean armed forces under Allende, who then he serves as defense minister and interior minister and had a number of other jobs as well.
[01:08:04]  He fucked up, actually.
[01:08:06]  He didn't kill Carlos Pratz, but the Dina did kill Pratz when he was in exile in Argentina in 74.
[01:08:15]  And I guess do you want to talk about Orlando Letelier in this connection?
[01:08:24]  I think we talked about it in the Snyder episode, but Letelle was an official in Allende's government that had to flee, obviously, after Pinochet took power.
[01:08:36]  I believe he was actually arrested and kind of like beaten around, put on a prison ship.
[01:08:40]  And then he was allowed to go to America.
[01:08:42]  The think tank that he worked for is still around, but I can't remember its name.
[01:08:46]  But it had national and I'm sure policy in the title of it.
[01:08:50]  What's remarkable about Letelier was not just that he was killed in the United States by agents at Dina, that he was fucking blown up in DuPont's circle in DC, but that When we talk about Pinochet's Chile, this is something that really, really was born home for me, you know, doing research for this episode.
[01:09:12]  There were, of course, all kinds of countries in Central South America with CIA-backed tyrannical authoritarian regimes.
[01:09:19]  But Chile really, really became, as you put it, the proving ground.
[01:09:25]  I mean, more than any other place, this is where they tried out every experiment, everything they were interested in.
[01:09:33]  And one of those major experiments was a group of people called the Chicago Boys.
[01:09:38]  Sure.
[01:09:39]  Yeah.
[01:09:40]  Everyone knows I'm a big, big fan of these Chicago Boys.
[01:09:44]  I can't believe Al Capone was at Colonia Dignity.
[01:09:48]  No.
[01:09:49]  I can't believe the band's Chicago.
[01:09:57]  Yeah, I figured Liz would know about this.
[01:10:02]  Well, Liz, you want to explain the Chicago Boys?
[01:10:04]  The Chicago Boys are, I mean, that's sort of a, you know, catch-all term for a group of Chicago school economists who were basically, you know, when you talk about, when, you know, everyone throws around the term neoliberalism, right?
[01:10:23]  We don't need to get into my feelings about that.
[01:10:27]  But when we, there are actually specific, and it sounds crazy, but regional strains of neoliberal economic theory.
[01:10:35]  And you have the kind of ordo-liberals in Germany.
[01:10:39]  You have the Austrians and the two schools in America, one being in Chicago and one being at George Mason University, excuse me.
[01:10:48]  And, you know, so the Chicago boys were sort of deputized to basically try out, you know, we say proving ground, but Chile became basically an experiment in total neoliberal economic revolution.
[01:11:05]  I mean, I would call it, where it was, you know, we've talked in the past about shock therapy in Russia, which is sort of a like kind of like second coming of what they had tried out in South America in terms of how quickly you can introduce like devastating market economy into a country.
[01:11:27]  And that's what Chicago was bringing into Chile and doing it, you know, at the behest of, you know, obviously the American government, but also business and corporate interests.
[01:11:39]  Absolutely.
[01:11:40]  I mean, it was really like if they let Milton Friedman just run a country.
[01:11:45]  Yeah, absolutely.
[01:11:46]  Or yeah, bring in Hayek and let him go wild.
[01:11:50]  Yeah, and this is kind of incidental, but one of my favorite facts about them is that when they predictably destroyed the economy of Chile, someone asked Milton Friedman, like, hey, they did everything you said and it's a fucking mess.
[01:12:04]  And Friedman said, yeah, it wasn't free market enough.
[01:12:07]  Oh, they didn't go far enough.
[01:12:10]  Yeah, yeah, that's the whole thing.
[01:12:11]  That's the whole thing.
[01:12:11]  It's actually, you know, and that's when, I mean, you know, if we, let me, I'll just say this for a second.
[01:12:16]  That's when, you know, law becomes quite important for neoliberal revolutionaries or counter-revolutionaries, however you want to call them, situate them, in that the law then becomes the essential tool for perfecting, you know, the equilibrium of the markets, that without restructuring the law, and I'm going to call back and say this is again why I maintain that, you know, Elizabeth Warren is a neoliberal through and through.
[01:12:46]  But through using the law as a tool to restructure the entire nation around the market, this becomes the like required development in neoliberal governance through the 20th century.
[01:13:00]  Yeah.
[01:13:01]  And I mentioned this because part of what's remarkable about the assassination of Orlando Letellier is that he was an economist on top of his government post.
[01:13:12]  And part of what he was doing in DC was trying to demonstrate to the world free market economics and austerity are not going to fix anything for anyone.
[01:13:23]  They're just going to destroy my country if you let these people get away with this.
[01:13:28]  And trying to move not just Chile, but sort of economics for impoverished, disadvantaged nations in general toward more of a kind of like New Deal Keynesian sort of economics.
[01:13:47]  And part of the reason they blew his ass up was that.
[01:13:50]  Right.
[01:13:50]  It was not just that he was opposing their particular regime, but that he was saying, no, there's a way for the third world to get out of poverty.
[01:13:59]  And no one wanted him telling that.
[01:14:02]  Yeah.
[01:14:02]  And it's not a coincidence that another massive part of this, of the neoliberal revolution, and it was dictated again by, we'll say the vanguards at George Mason University, which was education reform in order to stifle and eliminate like heterodox economic views that could be then disseminated through the world.
[01:14:28]  I mean, particularly in economics and political science, the entire scientific turn in the academies, the sort of social sciences, away from anything more holistic and towards a kind of Straight science mathematics was, you know, in due part for stifling all this kind of dissident activity against what this project was trying to do, right?
[01:14:56]  I mean, these are all, you know, we talk about lattice, like, this is all part of it.
[01:15:01]  The way we're talking about history earlier, you know, the way they teach it to us is these monads that something like, you know, the assassination of a Chilean diplomat may seem kind of like recondite to most people.
[01:15:11]  Like, why do I care about that?
[01:15:13]  But then you look at that and put it in the context of, say, Greece in 2008 or us in 2008.
[01:15:20]  So wait, wait, let me, let me, let me say this about Greece too.
[01:15:24]  We were talking about earlier about, so find us funneling that gold, that gold out of Germany.
[01:15:30]  Well, when the Nazis took over Greece during World War II, the first thing that they did, or one of the first things that they did, was they had their puppet government or the puppet government they installed in Greece basically send them, drain the treasuries, send it all to Germany.
[01:15:46]  Basically war loop, but legal, right?
[01:15:49]  Because, well, I mean, you know, what is the law?
[01:15:53]  But it was officially sanctioned or whatever.
[01:15:56]  Yeah.
[01:15:57]  That money, of course, was never returned, right?
[01:16:00]  Right.
[01:16:00]  And so during Greece's economic crisis, the Greek government tried to get some of that money back.
[01:16:10]  They're like, well, you never paid us war reparations, right?
[01:16:13]  Like, you are one of the reasons that our country is impoverished.
[01:16:17]  And we'd like that money back.
[01:16:19]  And of course, the Christian Democratic government of Germany said no.
[01:16:25]  Yeah, you'd like to see Angela Merkel's face when someone says, hey, can we have the Nazi gold back?
[01:16:31]  Yes.
[01:16:33]  The thing that's undermining your economy here.
[01:16:37]  Incredible.
[01:16:37]  Yeah.
[01:16:38]  Well, I will say too, like, the thing that connects this also to Colonia Dignidada, another thing there is that from reports, basically like the front rooms at Colonia Dignidad, the rooms that they showed to reporters, well, actually, not to reporters.
[01:16:53]  They didn't let reporters there until the 80s, but the rooms that guests saw actually had pictures of the leaders from the Bavarian Christian Democratic Party, like the Bavarian local or whatever.
[01:17:08]  I think it's actually like somewhat semi-autonomous from, well, not semi-autonomous, but like politics work differently in Bavaria than the rest of Germany, as far as I know.
[01:17:18]  And they had pictures of their presidents there.
[01:17:41]  So before we get too ahead of ourselves, I think we should go back to what Michael said about how there's these nexus points.
[01:17:49]  Because I want to list just a few of the people who came by Colonia Dignitat in the 60s and then later the 70s.
[01:17:56]  I mean, we have, like we mentioned, Michael Townley.
[01:17:58]  We have Pinochet himself, who came a year after he entered power.
[01:18:02]  We have Gerhard Mertens, who was a member of Scorazani's unit during World War II, who actually participated in the raid on Gran Sasso, which rescued Mussolini, and then later became one of the most notorious arms traffickers in the world, who not only worked directly for the Army of the United States and the CIA, but by the way, this is an SS man, an unrepentant SS man.
[01:18:27]  It wouldn't matter if he was repentant.
[01:18:28]  He was in the fucking SS.
[01:18:30]  Who would come and every time he stayed at Chile, he would go up to Colonia Dig to Dad.
[01:18:35]  And they, yeah, I mean, all these things are connected.
[01:18:40]  I mean, Michael Townley met Pinochet in the company of Stefano Dellachai, like you mentioned earlier, at fucking, and brought Prince Valerio Borghiz, who, like you talked about, the fascism in fucking Italy, who had tried to actually, he was the fucking, like, I mean, the black prince, they called him.
[01:18:57]  He was during World War II, the head of Italy's frogmen, the basically the, and I, you know how much we hate these in this podcast, the Navy Seals of Fascism.
[01:19:08]  Well, the first fascist Navy SEALs, unlike the, just like the new ones.
[01:19:12]  I was going to say the explicitly fascist Navy SEALs.
[01:19:16]  And they all met up at fucking Franco's funeral.
[01:19:19]  And so like, we have this giant nexus of people surrounding this.
[01:19:23]  Yeah, it's funny because it's like at some point it starts to feel almost lynchian where it's like these like locations of different black lodges throughout the world.
[01:19:33]  I was just going to say, it is the black lodge because among the other, I keep thinking of Norm McDonald going, all the stars are here.

=== Part Two: Mengele's Legacy (09:03) ===

[01:19:43]  And what I'm thinking of, Joseph Mengele.
[01:19:47]  Exactly.
[01:19:48]  The angel of death himself.
[01:19:50]  Joseph Mengele.
[01:19:51]  And the other thing, too, about Mengela, too, is that there is a town in Brazil, which this has been disputed, but I mean, this is not disputed.
[01:20:00]  This town has a 10% twinning population.
[01:20:04]  That means that 10% of the births there are births of twins.
[01:20:09]  For comparison, in the surrounding areas, in fact, the surrounding neighborhoods, the twinning population is 1.8%.
[01:20:17]  And that is one of the places Joseph Mengelo was allegedly called home after World War II.
[01:20:23]  Of course, famous for his experiments on twins in the campus.
[01:20:27]  Yeah, it's fascination with them in general.
[01:20:28]  And I believe, didn't Scorzani go to Colonia Dignidad at one point or another?
[01:20:34]  I wouldn't be surprised.
[01:20:35]  Yeah.
[01:20:36]  I mean, I would be surprised if he hadn't.
[01:20:40]  I mean, the way Colonia Dignidad worked is that if you were a Nazi and you were visiting Chile, you would go there and stay.
[01:20:48]  Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[01:20:49]  Like, without a doubt.
[01:20:50]  I read a CIA cable earlier about, it was actually from the 80s when they were looking for Mengele, even though he'd been dead for about four years.
[01:21:00]  I'm sure whoever wrote this report just wasn't clued on the fact that the CIA definitely knew that.
[01:21:04]  But this is about Miguel Serrano.
[01:21:06]  This is a CIA cable.
[01:21:07]  Serrano was in contact with Von Senger, who was, I looked him up earlier, hard to find information of him on him, but was a part of Vlasov's volunteer army, sort of the turncoat Russians that the Germans made into their own pet Russian army, who never actually were able to fight.
[01:21:23]  I believe they had basically like one small battle and then all surrendered.
[01:21:28]  According to further confidential information, Serrano was in contact with Von Senger in connection with a purchase of a real estate in Chile, which was meant to be a rest home for right extremists.
[01:21:41]  It later goes on to say about Colonia Dignidad, how they all visit there and hang out there.
[01:21:46]  So, yeah.
[01:21:47]  And I know some members of the thing we alluded to before, Le Cercle, which is basically not a group in itself so much as kind of a combination, a meta group of a bunch of other groups of various European reactionary Catholic organizations.
[01:22:03]  Somebody once said it's the Catholic version of the Bilderberg group, which seems about right.
[01:22:08]  And there was a guy, we mentioned Agente Press before.
[01:22:14]  And Agente Press was this bizarre setup that posed as a press organization like the AP or Reuters, that kind of thing, but was actually essentially a fascist mercenary army.
[01:22:28]  Yes.
[01:22:29]  And the guy who ran it, no one knows what his real name was, but he was known variously as Yves Gayou and Yves Guerin Serac.
[01:22:40]  And I've heard him called Gaillou more frequently.
[01:22:44]  I'm pretty sure Yves Gayou was at Colonia Dignidad as well.
[01:22:49]  Yeah, so I think the thing is about Dignidad, and that, you know, is so important at this moment as we're kind of moving through this history, is that it is this nexus point.
[01:23:00]  And then as you were kind of saying earlier about this sort of like detachment, you know, how these organizations or organs, institutions detach from their like original purpose, that also happens with Dignidad.
[01:23:16]  And it becomes an essential institution in not just the, you know, the coup against Allende, but also in the complete, like the legitimation and continued like rule, dictatorship, Pinochet.
[01:23:38]  And it becomes like a kind of essential, you know, basically a death and torture camp for Pinochet and any kind of Chilean dissidents.
[01:23:49]  Yes.
[01:23:49]  And a key point in the expansion of particular Latin American dictatorships.
[01:23:55]  Yes.
[01:23:55]  Like Pinochet in Chile or Jorge Rafael Videla in Argentina to the continent-wide Operation Condor.
[01:24:04]  Right.
[01:24:05]  This essentially consolidates all of them via the CIA into one body.
[01:24:10]  Yeah.
[01:24:10]  So when we talk about, you know, we're going to have to go into a part two about this because we're already running long.
[01:24:16]  So this is probably a good stopping point just to say that like we're sort of detailing, you know, I know this has been kind of a wide-ranging conversation and it touches all these different kind of crazy histories, but, you know, that it's such an insane case because you've got this, you know, the dispersion of the Nazis and post-war into South America.
[01:24:44]  You know, this sort of colony, this bizarro, you know, fucking molestation farm for this one Nazi freak becomes an essential nexus point for what will reshape the entire South American continent over the 20th century or the rest of the 20th century.
[01:25:09]  And what I guess what we're trying to suggest as to bring it back to what we talked about to start the episode is that this is not a coincidence, that there is a thorough line from these developments of post-war and what happens with the Nazis and how they get reassimilated into the fabric of global governance and what we witness through,
[01:25:33]  you know, with American and global corporate involvement, of course, in the overthrow of, you know, social democratic, in the case of Allende, you know, governments for proving ground purposes of neoliberal revolutionaries and counter-revolutionaries.
[01:25:54]  Absolutely.
[01:25:55]  Yeah.
[01:25:55]  Absolutely.
[01:25:56]  This is all tactically designed to enable both the first world takeover of the third world, basically what I would call the third world war.
[01:26:07]  Yes.
[01:26:08]  The third world war has already happened.
[01:26:09]  That happened.
[01:26:10]  Yeah.
[01:26:10]  That was it.
[01:26:11]  And also to enable the violent turn away from any kind of socialism or even mild social democracy toward what we would call neoliberalism.
[01:26:23]  Yep, absolutely.
[01:26:25]  Well, Michael, thank you so much for joining us.
[01:26:27]  This is literally my favorite subject to talk about.
[01:26:32]  I know, I can't wait to do part two.
[01:26:33]  I'm already like, fuck, we have so much to get into.
[01:26:36]  Yes.
[01:26:36]  So the thing is about part two is if you thought this first part was weird and dark and fucked up, everything gets 10 times worse.
[01:26:46]  And we get to see an appearance from Friend of the Pod, Kissinger.
[01:26:52]  Henry Kissinger is going to show up.
[01:26:54]  Kissinger has actually been involved in like several events that I've named so far.
[01:26:58]  I know, I know, but he gets real, real closely involved in this.
[01:27:02]  Yeah, he gets in real deep.
[01:27:04]  Before we finally go, you want to hear my Kissinger?
[01:27:07]  Yes.
[01:27:08]  I think we inherited a tragedy.
[01:27:12]  And I think we extricated ourselves with honor from this tragedy.
[01:27:18]  How is that man still alive?
[01:27:21]  He can't die.
[01:27:22]  This will do it.
[01:27:23]  This will do it.
[01:27:24]  He's physically incapable of dying.
[01:27:25]  This will do it.
[01:27:26]  I've been battling Miguel Serrano on the astral plane and Kissinger on the Corporal album.
[01:27:33]  You know that Greek myth where the Cumian Sybil wishes for eternal life, but she forgets to wish for eternal youth, so she just like rots and decomposes, but she's still alive.
[01:27:43]  It looks like Kissinger is doing that.
[01:27:45]  Like he's actually been dead for like 25 years.
[01:27:48]  Wait, I actually have a theory on that that we got to get.
[01:27:51]  All right, remind me of that when we start part two because I have something on that.
[01:27:56]  We can connect that.
[01:27:57]  That is perhaps a rathenal-esque.
[01:28:00]  Okay.
[01:28:01]  Okay.
[01:28:02]  All right, Michael, get the fuck out of here.
[01:28:04]  Let's talk.
[01:28:06]  Let's talk soon.
[01:28:07]  I really would love to do part two of this as soon as possible.
[01:28:10]  Yeah, thank you guys.
[01:28:11]  Probably like a week or something.
[01:28:13]  Yeah, whenever you're ready.
[01:28:15]  Thank you guys so much.
[01:28:15]  This was a lot of fun.
[01:28:16]  It was so much fun.
[01:28:17]  Thank you.
[01:28:18]  absolutely i feel bad that we had to kind of like cut that short but man we're already at like an hour 30.
[01:28:41]  That's okay.
[01:28:41]  I want to do two parts anyways.
[01:28:43]  I should have.
[01:28:44]  Oh, I was going with the outro.
[01:28:45]  Yeah.
[01:28:46]  Oh, shit.

=== Recording For You (01:10) ===

[01:28:47]  Sorry.
[01:28:48]  Well, let's just keep going, baby.
[01:28:50]  I thought we were just talking.
[01:28:52]  I didn't know.
[01:28:53]  I do like just talking to you.
[01:28:54]  By the way, by the way, this conversation is being recorded for you.
[01:28:58]  I was going to say, California is a two-party recording state, which I know, which I know, because when I tried to be a private investigator, turns out that you can't just record people and then sell the footage to their husband or wife or whatever to prove that they're not cheating, even though they hadn't hired you and that they just live together and have a happy marriage.
[01:29:18]  Turns out you can't do that.
[01:29:19]  And I got a lot of trouble for it.
[01:29:21]  So you don't want that to happen to you, baby.
[01:29:23]  Oh, God.
[01:29:25]  Well, we're recording.
[01:29:26]  We're recording.
[01:29:27]  Okay.
[01:29:28]  Did I, I'm supposed to tell you that.
[01:29:29]  So now you've been notified.
[01:29:31]  So you can't say shit, man.
[01:29:33]  I got to notify you of something.
[01:29:37]  I'm not gonna know.
[01:29:38]  Because you were rude to me.
[01:29:40]  It's pretty, it's pretty.
[01:29:41]  Here, I'll message it to.
[01:29:42]  I'll message it to not to you, to him.
[01:29:47]  This is stupid.
[01:29:48]  Okay.
[01:29:48]  All right, let's get out of here.
[01:29:49]  My name is Brace.
[01:29:51]  I'm Liz.
[01:29:51]  We are, of course, joined by producer Young Chomsky, and we will see you next time.
[01:29:57]  Bye-bye!