Brad and Dan begin by recalling their episode from the eve of Trump's first impeachment, when the quoted a number of Evangelical leaders threatening/predicting civil war if Trump was impeached. Then, it seemed hyperbolic. Now, it is terrifying. They relate this to the prevalent "cosmic war" motif among various White (Christian) nationalists: from the Proud Boys to White Evangelicals and QAnons. Brad talks about the Q Caucus (Madison Cawthorn, Lauren Boebert, and Marjorie Taylor Greene) and the likelihood that they will at some point pull a gun on the House floor. They finish by answering three questions 1) should the Republicans who voted to impeach lauded? 2) what is the difference between the Capitol siege and the BLM protests? 3) What to say to those who claim big tech censorship is at unfair to conservatives?
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Axis Mundy Welcome to Straight White American Jesus.
My name is Brad Onishi, Associate Professor of Religious Studies, Skidmore College.
Our show is hosted in partnership with the Kapp Center at the University of California, Santa Barbara, and I'm here today with my co-host.
I'm Dan Miller, Associate Professor of Religion and Social Thought at Landmark College.
It's good to see you, Brad.
Good to see you too.
Another momentous week.
I put a call out on Twitter last night, like, what should we talk about today?
And honestly, just like last week, if we wanted, we could do a seven hour marathon.
I hope that someday this podcast is syndicated on network television and that instead of friends marathons, Dan, that people just spend their Saturdays cozied up on the couch with straight white American Jesus marathons.
You know, I mean, do you think that that's a possibility?
What do you, I mean, am I, you know, I don't know.
Is that something I can hope for?
I don't know.
Maybe it's something you can hope for.
I can just say that I have a look that's well suited to a non-visual medium.
So, you know, maybe they can listen to it, but have a, you know, we have a, you know, a streaming service that has like an aquarium thing that plays on your TV.
So maybe if they watch a calming aquarium while we talk about the country burning down around us, it'll work that way.
All right.
Well, yes, that sounds okay.
I like this.
It's funny.
There's some people out there who are laughing, having a great time.
There's other people who are fast-forwarding right now, like, just get to what you're supposed to talk about.
So let's do it.
You ready?
We, this week, just got more and more fallout and details about the January 6th insurrection.
There's so many things related to Christian nationalism, QAnon, white evangelicals that we can talk about.
So we're going to do our best to jump in.
Dan, I want to start, though, by framing our discussion today with reference to a show we did back in 2019 during Trump impeachment number one.
He has now been impeached a second time, first president in history.
But on the eve of impeachment number one, we did a show called Evangelicals, Impeachment and Civil War.
And one of the things we talked about is, is that there was this uncanny echo coming from the evangelical world that went like this.
If you impeach the president, There may be violence or civil war.
And the thing we talked about, Dan, way back then, what feels like a lifetime ago, is that evangelicalism in particular, and most Christian nationalists in general, including folks who adhere to QAnon, etc., reduce the world to a binary.
Us and them, good and evil, here and there.
And they use that binary to make harsh in-group, out-group decisions.
If you do that, You end up with a worldview that is always on the precipice of civil war.
Because if you upset the world enough, you see it as basically like it's us against them.
And it's either we take action, or we lose our livelihood, we lose our country, we lose whatever it is.
So, Dan, if you go back to the tape of our podcast, I quoted Robert Jeffress as saying this on the eve of impeachment number one.
I don't want to make this prediction this morning, but if the Democrats are successful in removing the president from office, I'm afraid it will cause a civil war-like fracture in this nation from which this country will never heal.
Franklin Graham, our country could begin to unravel if an elected president is thrown out of office because of lies and the media.
It could be a devastating thing.
We're in very dangerous territory.
I would encourage all the politicians to look very carefully at where we are, and first of all, make sure that the truth is told.
At the time, Dan, we were really hesitant.
We were like, look everyone, we are going off the data, we're going off the evidence, but this probably sounds hyperbolic.
Yet, violence seems possible, okay?
And at the time, these guys seemed like sort of, you know, empty threat type folks.
Oh, if you do this, I might do that.
Looking back, Dan, with the lens that we have now of January 6, they look like people who are making Real active threats.
Like, look, it's a nice country you have here.
I wouldn't want anything to happen to it.
I mean, look, I don't know.
I mean, if you do this, I can't control them, guys.
I'm sorry.
I can't control anybody.
There might be unrest.
There might be civil war.
I don't know.
I don't know.
We'll just have to see.
Like, it really feels like that mobster kind of talk, okay?
At the time, Dan, I quoted a piece at Fox News that, again, I think was supposed to be sort of laudatory and positive.
But looking back, it's so damning.
So here's Miranda Devine on Fox, October 2019.
Check this out, Dan.
This is scary looking back on this.
The American people chose a barbarian for president because they knew only a barbarian could drain the Washington swamp.
Judging by the President's unchanged approval rating since House Democrats launched their impeachment inquiry, not to mention his record donation takeoff, the back of it, Trump fans are with him for the long haul, no matter how boorishly he behaves.
If the swamp gets in the way, Trump bulldozes over it.
Supreme Court?
Tick.
Taxes cut?
Tick.
Regulations slashed?
Tick.
Jobs up?
Tick.
Military rebuilt?
Tick.
ISIS stopped?
Tick.
Paris Climate Treaty scrapped.
Tick.
Border strengthened.
Tick.
Wall built.
Half tick.
Okay?
She calls him a barbarian and says no matter how boorishly he acts, they'll stay with him.
Including, we now know, if he says, We have to be tough and march to the Capitol, and we'll never succeed without being strong, which might mean you have to storm in there and cause incredible amounts of violence, end the lives of police officers, so on and so forth.
Dan, why does this happen?
Because when you reduce the world to us and them, civil war, cosmic war, are always right at your fingertips.
We called it a year and a half ago, Unfortunately, tragically, it has come to bear.
Thoughts on this?
I mean, there's more from Franklin Graham that we just got last night.
There's a lot to say here about radicalization and media.
So, what do you think?
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