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Dec. 5, 2023 - Stew Peters Show
01:12:43
Don’t Bring your Kids to The Hospital: Lawyer who Fights CPS warns Parents against Medical Kidnapping, Forced Child Vaccinations and more
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Welcome everyone to Shots Fired with Deanna Lorraine.
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now, so grab a cocktail, a mocktail, glass of water, glass of wine, whatever you do to unwind.
Hang out with me for the next hour as we go over the top news of the day.
We got two very interesting guests for you today.
One is an attorney, Sean McMillan, who specializes in suing the very corrupt Child Protective Services.
Yes, he sues them and he oftentimes wins.
He's very successful at it and he takes clients who have no idea what the hell just happened to them.
Their world just turned upside down when their child was taken away from them by CPS under false allegations.
And then takes them through the system and hopefully wins.
So we're going to talk to him in a moment.
And then we're also going to talk to a young girl who goes by the name of Austin Scholar, who talks about how you have the different solutions of schooling and education, how you can get a much better education by not going through the traditional public school setting, the liberal Marxist school setting.
So we'll talk about all that and more in just a minute.
Stay tuned.
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Welcome back to Shots Fired.
Well, we know that I've been covering CPS and its evils and monstrosity for quite a while and we've heard from many a mother who has had a horrible tragic case of their child being ripped away from their loving arms and their loving and supportive home and thrown into the cold foster care system by very cold-hearted evil CPS agents and they never get them back.
CPS kind of reminds me of that huge monster octopus on the Little Mermaid.
Bad example.
But once they get you into their tentacles, it seems like it's almost impossible to get out of them.
It seems like they just got you in.
Once they're in your life, you have to fight for every breath to get your children back.
And it is a very evil system.
It's a very monstrous system.
And I love this guest right now that I came across on X, attorney Sean McMillan.
Since we all hate CPS, we can be excited about this guest because he's an attorney that specifically specializes in suing CPS and in tough CPS cases where children have been ripped away from their parents for no good, valid reason.
And he's had a lot of wins.
He has a terrific YouTube channel where he actually videotapes his depositions with CPS agents and with parents, and it's really fascinating.
Would you raise your right hand for me, please?
You do solemnly swear that the testimony you're about to give and the cause now pending shall be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?
Yes, I do.
Thank you.
Good morning, Ms.
Pender.
Have you ever had your deposition taken before?
No.
Okay.
You should definitely check out his YouTube channel.
Really interesting stuff.
So we're going to go a little bit deeper today into who these CPS agents really are.
Who are these social workers that hide behind these CPS agent labels that take away children from loving families and breakup homes?
What is the system really?
And can people even trust them?
And what are parents' rights?
So, Attorney Sean McMillan, long introduction, but thank you so much for joining Shots Fired.
And thank you so much for this being your fight, this being your work.
Yeah, absolutely.
Thank you for having me.
I have been watching you for a while.
Actually, I followed you a while ago.
And I'm really happy, I want to say, that you are covering this issue and these issues and paying attention to it.
Because one thing that I run across in my practice is most people out in the community, they think that Child Protective Services is a great agency and that the workers are doing, you know, a hard job.
They're doing God's work for all the right reasons, protecting children.
And it's just not true.
And it's hard to convince people of that until they see it themselves or they're in it themselves.
So that's one of the kind of uphill battles that we face in our cases when we're addressing a jury is you have to get over that community belief that these are good, honest people.
At least the ones I run across are not.
Yeah, that's what's so crazy.
And that's why I frequently have CPS stories on my show.
A lot of people might think, why is this really newsworthy or relevant?
Because these are the types of real threats happening to America that were very distracted by things like the war on the news and the border crisis.
But this is an actual threat to real American families and parents.
That they don't even really realize is a threat.
And they need to be aware.
They need to also be aware of what would happen if this happened to them.
So it's really important that we cover it.
Attorney Sean McMillan, tell us how you started getting into this specialization.
How did you start getting into this work to fight the evil CPS? That's a long story all on its own.
I'll give you the very short...
A nutshell.
Yeah, the nutshell version.
Up until about 2005, I had a very vibrant, lucrative commercial practice going.
I did a lot of work with business entities, trademark copyrights and patent work.
I tried a lot of cases for other attorneys.
And I had one repeat customer who had a weird case that she needed somebody to try up in Orange County in California.
I'm in San Diego.
And I looked at it and it was against CPS. The allegations were that the social service agents were lying about mom and she lost her kids because of it.
I thought, oh my God, you know, that sounds like a bullshit case.
But, you know, she could pay an hourly and it was one more trial.
Early in my career, I was just working hard to rack up jury trials.
So I thought, you know, I'll go ahead and do it.
And I got into it.
And I just took a very conservative approach.
I told you a little bit earlier that Most people think that these so-called social workers are good people doing God's work for all the right reasons.
That was my attitude, too.
So I put up a very conservative case, and I didn't really realize...
The gravity of the situation until we got into the defendant's case.
And then I was just stricken by a very, very, very deep sense of betrayal to my client, to her experience, her story, her life, really.
And, you know, we had a positive verdict.
That's good.
But it was a tough case.
And it was one of the first of its kind in the country.
There was no law to follow at the time, so we sort of had to make it up as we were going along.
And, you know, when I got home, it was a five-week trial.
And at that point in time, my kids were really young, seven and nine, about the age that her kids were when they were taken.
So it hit me really, really, really hard.
Yeah.
Yeah, you know, even talks about it today is kind of tough.
But anyway, what I did is I scrapped my practice.
I was just going to quit and said, you know, just forget it.
I'm not in the law for the right reasons.
And I started looking around at medical schools and other things to do.
And my wife, she works in the business.
She came in and said, what are you doing?
And I told her, she said, well, don't do that.
I mean, you found something that is really meaningful to you.
Why don't you just hang in there, give it a year.
If it turns out that you really, really don't want to do it, then yeah, you know, go do something else.
So, you know, we talked about it.
I thought, yeah, that's fine.
And so I did scrap my commercial practice, and that was tough.
It's economically tough.
And I started doing only cases where we were suing Child Protective Services.
And it just sort of grew from there.
That's crazy.
I mean, when I watch your depositions, and I wish I had the time to watch all of them, because they're really...
There's a lot.
Yeah, there's a lot, and they're really interesting.
And you know your stuff.
You know the right questions to ask these CPS workers.
Let me ask you, on the whole, what kind of people are, quote, Child Protective Service workers?
Well...
I mean, I have my own opinions, but what would you say the majority of those that you run into?
Actually, well...
That's sort of a tough question because it's like with cops.
The vast majority of police officers, I'm sure, are great people, but then we see these outlier situations on the news that cause all these problems.
I don't know if Child Protective Services is the same way or not.
What I can tell you, and I've deposed hundreds of these social workers now, what I can tell you is Pretty much every single one I've run across I believe to be In their heart, truly a mean-spirited person.
I do not believe that they're in the position that they're in for all the right reasons.
In fact, I think they're there for the wrong reasons and that they use their position of power to, you know, oftentimes exact revenge on a parent maybe who's not sufficiently deferential the first time they meet the particular worker.
And that is a repetitive theme in all of my cases.
If you don't bow your head And kowtow to these people when they knock on your door.
Their only means of escalation is to take your child.
And that's a problem.
And a deeper problem is that this is all funded by the federal government and state governments as well.
They chip in their piece.
But a big piece of it comes from Title IV-E and IV-D of the Social Security Act.
And it's massive money.
People don't understand how massive it is.
I can tell you, for example, County of Los Angeles, we had a case back in 2016.
We're actually going through her depositions right now on the YouTube channel.
It's Raffalina Duvall.
And what we learned there through discovery was $2.6 billion a year.
is being funneled at least back in 2016 was their budget being funneled into that child protective services I guess you could call it a business because it really is.
It is.
Yeah, that's what's fueling all of this.
There's this massive amount of money and the only way they keep that flowing is based on kids in the system.
That is the measurement, the matrix to drive the funding.
So, you know, they go out and grab kids for a lot of bad reasons.
Would you say that, first of all, how much training, formal training, have these CPS workers had in social work?
Are these people that are actually skilled in social work?
Well, just so we're all clear on this, they call themselves social workers.
Right.
And every state is a little bit different.
So some states, some counties may actually require that their agents have a license.
I can tell you in California, it is not required.
So when they say, oh, I'm a social worker from, say, San Diego County.
Well, they're not a licensed clinical social worker.
They're not even a, you know, licensed family therapist.
typically what they are is they'll have either a B.S. in social science or maybe if you're lucky an MSW, a master's in social work.
But again, that is not a legal requirement.
Many of the people that you'll see being examined, for example, on the YouTube channel in these depositions, they just have a B.A. in something, maybe sociology.
And many of them don't have children of their own.
They haven't raised kids.
They don't know what it's like when you have a sick baby or some other problem.
Yeah, that was another question.
Do you find a pattern?
Does it seem like a lot of these CPS caseworkers do not have children of their own?
Yeah, yeah.
Many, many, many.
And yet they're taking children away.
I mean, yet they're somehow qualified to take children away from mothers.
How can they?
That's insane to me.
Well, I take umbrage, great umbrage at your use of the word qualified.
I think most of them, at least, again, the ones I run across, I wouldn't have them qualified.
You know, taking care of a pet, let alone making decisions about a kid.
They do seem mean-spirited.
They seem like they're lacking an actual heart or a soul.
I mean, these people, and it seems like a pattern, like you said.
Right.
And, you know, on the converse, it's not just that they're incompetent in dealing with, you know, parents and families and children or maybe where there's a problem in the family.
It's not just that they're incompetent in that sense.
On the other end of the scale, you know, we have to recognize as a society, there are children out there who do need help.
They're in bad, tough situations.
Right.
But the system does not competently deal with those kids either.
If you follow the news out here in California, and I think I've seen stuff like this happening all over the country, where the social workers don't get involved where there really is a need.
They'll have 60, 70 reports of horrible things happening.
They'll leave the child there and the child ends up dead.
So it's on both ends of the spectrum where the system is utterly failing.
In one instance, it's the families that are getting sort of hammered, and in the other instance, it's the children who really do need help.
And I think the solution to the problem really is a complete and total overhaul, both of the judicial system where we've set up kind of a counterintuitive system to deal with these issues.
In most states, you don't get a jury on termination of parental rights, you don't get a jury trial, even though your parental rights are fundamental and protected under the Constitution.
And then we go and give massive funding to go out willy-nilly grab kids.
So there's more money that comes in if we grab a bunch of kids who may or may not need help to the exclusion of dealing with the very few children, very few children who actually do need to be rescued from a tough situation.
There's no money in that.
These children, I watched one of your depositions, and I think this probably happens in a number of times, but where you asked the CPS agent, social worker, are you familiar with the rights of parents?
And they said, oh, we've taken lots of extensive training on the rights of parents.
Weeks of training.
And all you asked was, okay, well, what is one of those rights?
Tell me a little about some of those rights.
And she just kept saying, I don't know.
I don't understand the question.
I can't tell you what those rights are because I can't really pigeonhole them.
Well, you just took a bunch of training on the rights of parents.
What are they?
So is one of the rights, let's just get this clear, the right of the parent to live with their own child and not have their biological child taken by the government?
Yes, that is one of the most fundamental rights that a parent has.
It's called the right of familial association.
And basically to encapsulate it all sort of in a little nutshell.
And there's plenty of Supreme Court case law on this.
In fact, I'm doing a brief right now on a summary judgment motion.
It's Santoski.
Is the, like, leading case.
And basically what the Supreme Court tells us repeatedly, and the Ninth Circuit echoes the same thing, as does the 10th, the 7th, the 11th, that parents have a fundamental right to make intimate decisions about family.
And that includes the decision to even have kids, first and foremost.
Secondarily, the decisions about how you're going to raise those children.
And so long as You know, the parent isn't doing something to, like, really dramatically harm the child.
The state has no interest whatsoever in intervening in the family decision-making process.
And that includes medical decisions.
That includes educational decisions.
That basically includes everything that you would think would be integral to family life.
So, yes, parents have a constitutional right under the 14th Amendment To raise, nurture, support, and do what they really want with their kids, so long as they're not really deeply harming the children and physically harming.
Remember, the rule is that a social worker cannot lawfully remove a child from the custody of its parents Unless at the time of that removal, that worker is in possession of specific and articulable facts to show that the child's in immediate danger of suffering severe bodily injury or death.
So it's got to be really serious before they can just come in and grab your kid.
And that's only the first part of the test.
It's a two-part test.
The second part of the test is, and there is no lesser intrusive means of averting whatever the specific injury is that the social worker is concerned about.
So it's really a stringent standard they have to meet before they come in and just grab your child.
The problem is, and the rub is, That they don't know that.
And I'm not sure they even care because that throws a wrench in how they get their funding and everything else.
If they can't just go in and grab kids, then their budget starts to shrink, the number of kids in custody starts to shrink, and that starts causing structural problems for the various agencies.
So would you say that then on the whole that they don't follow that stringent marker, that they pretty much grab kids willy-nilly and not meet that criteria of imminent danger of physical harm?
No.
In fact, this is the thing.
I run a really, really busy practice.
And I never imagined when I dumped my commercial practice that I'd even be able to survive doing this work.
I thought that one case was an outlier, but I could do what I can to change things.
It turned out that there is so much of this going on that I can't help everybody who calls.
I turn away like 200 calls a week, and it's not because they don't have good cases.
It's because we're only three guys here, and we can't help Everybody, which is kind of why we started doing the YouTube stuff, because there's a lot of parents that can't find attorneys.
There's not a lot of attorneys that do the work.
And we do what we can to help those people.
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So would you say that these CPS agents on the whole and the system, they're more so not going to people's homes looking for evidence of Them being a healthy home and we should, you know, our goal is to keep the children with the parents, but they're more looking for evidence or to falsify evidence to remove the child from the home.
And they're almost on a mission, like hunting for children to find, to remove from their home and throw into the foster care system.
Well, you have to remember the federal legislation that drives all of this.
It requires that, or at least shows a preference for, you know, keeping families together and to the extent that a child is, you know, removed from the home to reunify those families.
At least ostensibly, that's the way the legislation is written.
What ends up happening in practice, because again, there's no significant funding stream for reunification services.
There's no significant funding stream to keep the kids family maintenance, to keep the kids in the home, where the money really starts to flow.
is when we get a case and the child's removed.
So there's kind of like, even though the legislation has a good trajectory in mind, or the legislators had a good trajectory in mind, the implementation is driven by this funding dynamic where if we don't get as many kids in the system this year as we did last year, our budget shrinks.
And then next year we've got a smaller budget that we have to deal with.
So there's always this kind of perverse incentive to go out and grab kids.
And for the social workers that I deal with, what happens with them generally, this is a repetitive pattern, Is that they don't have any way to escalate.
They don't have any way really to force a parent to...
Sorry, they don't really have any way to force a parent to comply with their wishes other than to go to court, get an order, or remove the child.
It's not like police where they can first talk to you and show you their badge, then they have a stick, and they've got mace, they've got handcuffs, they have gradations of escalation that they can follow before something really bad happens.
Social workers don't have that.
So the first time a parent, you know, stands on their rights, Some of these social workers don't take kindly to that.
They'll just take your kid.
And then they'll make up shit about you in order to keep your kid.
And I get a lot of those.
We call those judicial deception cases.
We get a lot of those cases too.
Wow.
So, and that's the thing.
I mean, it seems like there's a pattern of the social workers either signing off on things that the parents did that were false or fabricating the falsities and then the judge signs off on that and that sides with the social worker typically.
I mean, there's a lot of false accusations against these parents and it just goes, it's almost like they're all working hand in hand, right?
Well, it can seem that way from the outside.
You have to remember, though, that the judges, generally speaking, are going to rely on what the social workers tell them, and they're entitled to do that under the law.
So the social workers have a tremendous amount of power.
They control the flow of information to the judge, and the judge has to make these important, critical family decisions based on the evidence he's given.
If that evidence is false, Generally, the judges make the right decision based on what they're fed.
And if they're fed honest information, they'll generally come out with the correct answer.
The problem is, When the social workers lie, the judge is not getting correct or honest information.
That's where the whole judicial deception conundrum sort of comes into play.
Right.
So tell us, why do you think that the judges side more with the caseworkers than with the parents if the parents are saying these allegations are not true?
Well, because first of all, the caseworkers are in the courtroom and will be in the same courtroom with the same judge all the time, like every day.
The caseworkers on average, at least out here, will have between 60 and 80 families that they're working with.
Wow.
Yeah, it's a lot.
It's too much.
You can't do, even if you're competent, which I don't agree many of them are, but even if you're competent, you can't handle that much work competently.
But these people are in court with these judges, you know, day in, day out, week in, week out.
It's typically the same attorneys, the same social workers, and they kind of develop a rapport And the judges are entitled under the law to accept the social worker's report into evidence, even though it's chock full of hearsay, double hearsay, all kinds of stuff.
They're entitled to accept that into evidence and make decisions based on it.
are entitled to cross-examine the social worker as to the contents of the report, but they're not necessarily entitled to pull in the witnesses that the social worker claims they spoke with and examine those witnesses.
Now, sometimes a judge will let that happen, and you'll see that happen in cases, but it's not necessarily a requirement.
So essentially, the judge is going to be left with The social worker's report, which is typically sworn, you know, it's evidence, and it's admissible.
And then whatever the parent says, and the judge, you know, they have no relationship with the parent.
It's just one more parent along a string of parents that's coming through.
Wow.
And the law allows them to rely on the worker and make their own credibility determination.
So...
I mean, that's how these judicial deception cases work is you never attack the judge.
If you attack the judge, you will lose that case.
Yeah, what you do, you go into it with the presumption that the judge made the correct decision based on the facts he or she was fed by the worker and you attack the worker.
Interesting.
So what should a parent do if, because now I'm hearing about all these medical kidnapping, essentially, cases with CPS, and a child falls and bumps his head at home, not a big deal typically, or falls from a bike or something, and then mother brings him to the hospital, and then all of a sudden, CPS is involved.
Because they want to investigate child abuse or something.
So what should a mother do in that situation, especially if they bring their child to a hospital because of sickness or because of a bump or something?
And then the CPS investigator asks, so has this child had all their childhood vaccines?
But let's say that this is a person who doesn't want to vaccinate their child with all their childhood vaccines.
I've heard of these now children getting taken away then as another excuse to throw them into the CPS system.
Yeah, absolutely.
That is happening.
I have a case going on right now in the Southern District of California, where the vaccination of the child behind the mom's back actually didn't give her notification, didn't tell her anything about it, didn't have consent, didn't even have a court order.
And the agency went and vaccinated the child.
And that's front and center right now.
I have briefing on that.
And, you know, frankly, It's sort of a difficult question on the vaccination issue because the government, at least according to the Supreme Court authority that hopefully someday will change, the government has a legitimate interest In mandatory vaccinations for certain illnesses.
And that's sort of been, you saw this during the big COVID thing.
How they were coming out, you know, virtually mandating.
I mean, they didn't actually mandate.
They just made it very difficult for people who refuse to get vaccinated.
They made your life very, very difficult.
And there was pushback from that, you know, from the public in general.
But there's law out there to support that sort of behavior.
And we'll see what happens in this case that I have going on right now in San Diego.
I feel pretty positive about it.
The judge at our last hearing, she was pretty hostile.
To the county's position that once they have the child in custody, they can do whatever they want to the child medically.
And there's just no law to support, you know, that extreme of a position.
Just because your child is taken from you temporarily, until your parental rights are terminated by a court order, you know, with a full trial, full hearing, You still maintain educational rights.
You still maintain medical rights.
You're entitled to be involved in medical decision-making for your child unless your parental rights are terminated or there's a court order specifically cutting off those rights, which is very, very rare in most of these cases.
Even my Munchausen cases where there's an accusation of Munchausen by proxy, it's now a factitious disorder imposed on another But in the DSM-5, but even in those cases, you don't typically see the court saying, cut off the parent completely, they don't get to know what's going on, they have no involvement, nothing.
It's very, very rare for a court to do that.
But the agency will do that on its own.
I've got a couple of cases right now where that's the issue.
And do you see that, do you see also a rise in CPS workers accusing the parents of Munchausen by proxy or one of the parents of Munchausen by proxy and using that as an excuse to take their child?
You know, I can see how from, you know, the outside, from the media perspective, you might perceive it as a rise in the incidence of Munchausen accusations.
But from where I'm sitting, it's been a problem for a long time.
And the reason for it, there's a good reason for it.
Munchausen by proxy, you can't test for it.
You can't do a blood test or genetic test or anything and say, oh, they've got Munchausen.
It doesn't work that way.
What it requires is a process of elimination, a multidisciplinary team to eliminate All the diagnostic possibilities for the child's ailment Or malady.
And only after you've eliminated everything else do you look at Munchausen by proxy.
And we actually have a deposition on this issue in Raffalina Duvall's case.
It'll be coming up sometime in the next week or so.
It's Dr.
Charles Sophie.
He's the, or was at the time, the medical director for DCFS. That's Los Angeles County's version of Child Protective Services.
He's the medical director for DCFS. We went into pretty good depth on this whole Munchausen thing.
And, you know, it's a 1 in 100,000 diagnosis.
So if you have 100,000 parents, and it's usually the mother, who are, you know, accused of Munchausen, 1 in 100,000 of those will be real.
So that tells you how exceedingly rare it is.
Right.
So when you have these counties, I was reading an article about some, maybe it was in New Jersey, where there's like 40 parents who had been accused of and had their children taken away based on the accusations of Munchausen.
And it's like, holy crap, man, that's an epidemic.
It's one in 100,000.
You know, there's got to be something in the water.
And so that's the problem with the Munchausen diagnosis is it's easy for CPS to bring a parent in.
And in that system, you're guilty until proven innocent.
How are you going to prove a negative on something like that?
That's so great.
And that's what it seems like the whole system is.
You're always the parent is on the defense and they're trying to prove these accusations are false.
And it's very, very hard to do that, especially when the CPS workers just got everything filled out.
Right.
And I'll tell you what that whole set up.
The way that system is set up is antithetical to the American system, the fundamentally American constitutional system of jurisprudence.
In any other context where a fundamental right is implicated, you are presumed to be innocent.
It's the state's burden to come in and prove that you're guilty.
Not so when you're in juvenile dependency court.
Wow.
So, gosh, I wish that we had an hour or two slotted because there's so many different questions I want to ask you from just the different stories that you've encountered and everything.
But one really important question that parents need to know before we leave is, what should a parent do if CPS comes knocking at their door and they say, hi, we have a complaint and we want to investigate with you and your child.
What should you do?
What can you do?
First and foremost, and this is just my perspective, you talk to five different attorneys and you'll get 15 different opinions.
Yes.
But just based on my cases, my clients and what got them sucked into the system where some of them lost their kids for years, Always, first and foremost, be polite, be respectful, and recognize that, yes, you absolutely do have rights, and you're not required to necessarily do everything they want you to do.
Okay.
And you can be firm in that.
But always, always, always be polite, civil, and respectful.
The number one cause for most of my clients, the number one cause for them to have lost their children initially is they stood on their rights.
They said, no, no, you know what?
I'm not going to talk to you.
You're not coming in my house.
You don't have a right.
Go get your warrant.
Well, I can almost guarantee you, if you're not sufficiently deferential, if you're not polite, if you're not civil, that worker, they have no other way to escalate other than to take your child.
So that's the number one thing.
So you have to let them in?
You have to let them come in the house and investigate?
You don't necessarily have to, no.
But there's a way to do that that's not going to get their back riled.
And there's a way to do it that's just going to piss them off.
So what I'm saying is always keep in mind that these people have a tremendous amount of power and You should be afraid.
I mean, I was afraid.
I can tell you when I first started doing this work, my kids were six and nine.
My wife's from Taiwan, and I got 10 grand in cash.
We got open airplane tickets.
And her plan, we had passports for the kids.
The plan was, if I even smelled those people sniffing around, she gets the kids, she immediately takes off, go to Taiwan, I'll stay here and deal with whatever the outfall is.
That was our plan until they turned 18.
Even I was afraid.
That was my business, suing these people.
Do you have to surrender your child if they say, we're here to take your child away?
If they don't have a court order to remove your child, They do not have lawful authority to do that.
And what ends up happening, a lot of times they'll come with police, and the police will sort of like, you know, be the muscle.
And ostensibly, the police are there to keep the peace if things get out of hand, and sometimes they do.
But that's the way they'll do it when they don't have a warrant, is they'll show up with cops and take your child.
Or they'll, if it's a baby, I've had this happen several times, they'll have you come meet them at their office just to talk, just to talk about what's going on, and oh yeah, by the way, bring your child with you, and then they'll lock all the doors, and they're at the office, at the CPS office, they'll remove the child just on their own.
And that happens.
I've had five cases where that happened.
So that's another thing.
If they want you to meet, fine, go meet them.
But don't bring your kids with you.
Yeah, exactly.
Not unless there's a court order.
If there's a court order, you got to do what you got to do.
But when there's a court order, remember, the social worker had to commit to a position under oath to get that court order.
And that's the next place where we get a lot of cases.
They lie.
They'll lie in their warrant application.
They'll lie in their detention report.
And the outfall of that, obviously, the judge issues an order and your child's taken.
But in those cases, you have recourse.
You prove the lie.
That's insane.
Wow.
I wish we had more time to go through some of your specific cases and everything, but we unfortunately have to wrap up.
But Attorney Sean McMillan, you've been really enlightening, and it's disgusting to see this rabbit hole, this monstrosity of what Child Protective Services really is most of the time to American families.
Tell everybody again where they can find you and follow your work, and we'll have your YouTube showing up on the lower thirds the whole time as well.
Okay, cool.
Yeah, it's Caps and Stim's Law is, I think, the name that my son actually runs the YouTube channel.
It's sort of a way for him to get into law and get interested.
Cool.
Yeah, it's very cool.
It was effective, too.
He's totally getting into it.
Now he wants to go to law school.
But...
Anyway, yeah, it's Caps and Stems Law, and that's on YouTube.
Then we also have a Patreon channel where we post all of our work product, all the public dockets, discovery, you know, form interrogatories, special interrogatories, all the discovery stuff that you would need to do, the motion practice.
It's mainly there to help parents who can't find attorneys, because there's not many that do it.
And they can get on there and see the work that we've done, how we did it, how it's structured.
And some of that stuff you can even use as templates.
Many of the stories are the same, so they can actually kind of change the names and bang, there's their complaint.
But yeah, so that's Patreon and that's pretty much it.
Okay.
Well, thank you.
Thank you so much for your fight.
This is a really important fight.
This is a really powerful fight, especially for parents in America who love their children.
And their biggest nightmare is getting their children taken away under false accusations and for no valid reason.
I mean, that's really every parent's worst nightmare.
So thank you for Working in this space and for this being your fight.
Well, thank you for having me on and thank you for actually sort of shining a light on this because, like I said before, most people really don't know and aren't paying attention to, you know, what's going on.
Well, we have all this other distraction out in the world.
You know, Rome is burning and nobody seems to really care.
Exactly.
So what you're doing here is important.
Thank you.
Thank you, Sean.
Thank you so much.
Attorney Sean McMillan, follow his work and watch those depositions on his YouTube channel.
I'm telling you, really fascinating stuff, really.
It will make your stomach turn a lot of times, but it's good.
Thank you so much.
We'll be right back, guys, right after these messages.
Don't go anywhere.
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Welcome back to Shots Fired.
Well, today we're talking all about how to protect our children, which is supposed to be the next generation, our children from the Marxist madness that is happening everywhere and the corruption and the garbage indoctrination that's happening at our schools and in our families.
We just talked to a CPS attorney who has been suing CPS. For breaking up families and taking away their children.
So today I want to talk about a different angle of this because it's really important.
So parents, listen up.
If you have a child in traditional public school, or even Catholic or private school for that matter, You really should take a second look at that, because today, what they're teaching at public schools, as we know, it's not reading, writing, and arithmetic.
It's not how to be a good person.
It's really about how to turn your child into a radical Marxist socialist activist.
So today I'm joined here by a teenager herself.
She goes by the pseudonym Austin Scholar online.
And I came across her work because she is all about taking different approaches to the traditional education system.
I personally prefer to homeschool when my children get that age.
And I think anything pretty much other than the traditional school system is probably good.
But I'm really interested in hearing her advice and what she's been up to and her solutions for the The traditional Marxist approach that, again, has been turning children into rabid revolutionists.
So thank you, Austin Scholar, for joining Shots Fired.
How are you?
Of course.
I'm good.
How are you?
I'm good.
Thank you.
I came across your ex-account, and I couldn't help but notice how educated and intelligent you seem to be.
Tell everybody how young you are, if you don't mind us asking, and then we'll go from there.
Of course.
I'm 17 years old.
Okay, 17 years old.
And when I read your Twitter account, you seem just so educated and so bright.
You seem like you have your head screwed on straight and you have great values.
Tell us what your journey has been from, you know, sort of the traditional school to where are you now, basically?
What is your solution that you've been doing now?
Of course.
So I haven't had a teacher since the fourth grade.
Instead of a teacher, I've learned my academics exclusively through online adaptive educational apps.
Okay, wow.
Yes.
So you see, I love your Twitter handle.
It says, teen at a high school but with no teachers.
Writing about education and how to help your kids thrive.
I tell you what your teen is thinking so you don't have to guess.
Yes, yes.
So I have used these adoptive apps to learn all of my academics.
And, you know, I've gotten a 1600 on the SAT. So it kind of is a bit of a validation that learning in this alternative way is super, super beneficial.
And it can really help any kid excel.
Yeah, absolutely.
So is this considered homeschooling?
What would you consider this?
Of course.
I go to an actual physical school building, but every student has their own learning journey and their own learning path.
And so we all have our own place in our education, but we all work together to support how we're doing.
If I'm stuck on an app, on a question, I ask one of my peers for help.
We have no academic teachers at the school I go to.
I go to Alpha High Which is part of the broader Alpha School community.
And we use two-hour learning to use in order to learn our academics, which is basically helping students use the right adaptive apps and, you know, the right process in order to learn all of the academics in just two hours every single day.
Wow.
Okay.
So first of all, when did you start going to this type of school?
Fourth grade.
At the end of my fourth grade year, I switched from a traditional Catholic private school and transitioned to Alpha.
And what made you decide to switch schools?
I think a lot of it was just the frustration with the lack of adaptivity and the lack of true understanding that classrooms had.
It was primarily just focused on getting kids through lessons, moving them through regardless of how much they actually knew.
And so it's really the adaptivity and the mastery that you can get from using these online apps That is what makes tour learning and this model so successful.
Hmm.
Yeah, that's really interesting because when you think about, when I think about, let's say, teaching my toddler the ABCs or accounting, He can surpass most children his age because I spend some quality time with him every day teaching him that.
And we go at his own pace and his pace happens to be very fast.
And if he was just stuck in a classroom setting learning these things with, you know, 30 other peers or more, Then they would have to go at the pace of the entire group.
And it's like you said, sort of the teacher would probably be checking things off the list, but is it really personalized learning and attention and at the pace they need and in the learning style they need, right?
Yes.
And a lot of it is just, it's really hard to teach A class of 30 students who are all at completely different levels and places in their learning journey.
Some kids are going to be super far ahead and other kids are going to be struggling a little bit because they haven't learned the foundations that they need to learn a specific lesson.
And so a typical class is really only helpful for 20-25% of the students in the class, most of the students really aren't getting anything out of the lesson.
And teachers are just stuck teaching to the median.
And that is just, it's really sad.
It's hard.
And that is the problem that adaptive apps really solve.
So it's two hours a day.
You go to this and you go to a classroom setting with all these peers.
Is this basically, and do you have extracurricular activities with peers, too, or sports or things like that for socialization?
Yes.
So we kind of call it a WeWork because we all basically just work together in a shared space.
And on our laptops.
But like I said, it is still a very collaborative environment.
You know, we ask for help from each other.
And because we can do our academics in just two hours every day, that frees up four hours in the afternoons to really, you know, learn life skills that traditional schools just don't have the time to get to.
So for K-8, they spend the afternoons doing life skills workshops.
And so there are kids in the Grit Workshop.
There are a bunch of tiny kids learning how to solve a Rubik's Cube, knowing how to juggle, just doing like things that really take grit and they really just stick to it.
There are also kids As you kind of transition to fourth, fifth grade who are already doing the Harvard Business School simulation and beating the scores of what actual Harvard Business School students are getting.
And it's really just because we have these four hours of afternoons for kids to spend Learning these, like, critical life skills.
And so that is, these kids are going to be unstoppable when they, you know, when they finish the school system.
And in high school, we spend our afternoons doing a masterpiece.
And that's what Austin Scholar is for me.
It's an Olympic-level ambitious project that I have four years of afternoons to complete.
And so I'm working to grow my newsletter To reach millions of parents.
And that's my goal.
It's ridiculously ambitious.
And it's really hard to achieve.
Not a single other person at this school building knows how to reach a million parents through a newsletter.
But that's what I have to figure out.
I have to figure out how to go out and achieve my goal through all of the life skills that I learned in my previous years of education.
17, yeah, or 16 years old.
I definitely wasn't learning a lot of life skills.
I was trying to fit in and, you know, you're so worried about the peer pressure of being in the popular crowd or the not popular crowd and the pressures of going to parties and All of these things that you're focused on in school instead of actual life skills, too.
I wish I knew how to build credit back then or budget or save money or grow wealth.
These are the kinds of things I had to learn later in life.
How to build a business, marketing.
I mean, those are actual life skills that would be great to know instead of just, I just had to take this trigonometry class because I need to check off a box in my sophomore year of high school, right?
Right.
Right.
And you guys have the time to do all those things because you're only in a school setting, quote unquote, for two hours a day.
Yes, yes, that is really the gift that we are given with this two-hour learning.
Yes, being able to learn faster and better and master the concepts are great, but it's really the life skills and the time that we free up that is what's so valuable about this school system.
And then are you guys caring about being concerned with popularity, cliques, and things like that at the schools that you go to?
Yeah.
So Alpha is a really small school.
We call it a startup school.
So there are actually only 35 kids in the high school.
And these are all kids that I have been friends with since fourth grade.
We've been through this...
Radical, ridiculous education system, educational experience for like we've grown up together and we've experienced all of this craziness together.
And so we're all pretty close and it's It's a lot less about being popular because when you've been friends with these people for so long.
And so I think that's another thing that this alternative education system is really great for is for creating bonds with people that you really can't get at a traditional school.
And so I think that You know, it's significantly less about being popular and, you know, making sure that you're in the right clique, saying the right thing, you know, that you've joined the right club or whatever traditional school things are.
And it's a lot more about just continuing to support these people that I've grown up with.
Yeah, absolutely.
And now it's not even focus on the popular crowd as much as it is what gender am I today, right?
What sexuality am I today?
Are we doing Pride Week?
Are you participating in Pride Day today?
I mean, there's so much, so many new social issues that have been added to the plate.
Forget about just reading and math and writing.
Or any life skills.
No time for life skills after talking about and focusing on what gender you are today.
So tell me, when you talk about adaptive apps that you're using to learn these needed skills, such as to pass your SATs and things like that, what are some examples of adaptive apps, if you can tell us?
Of course.
So the main one that we use right now for K-8 is called IXL. You basically take a placement test and IXL will give you lessons based on how you score on the placement test.
And the thing about IXL is you have to get every lesson to 100.
You can't get to 80 and just continue on because that's not mastery.
You haven't fully learned something.
If you can't get past 80 on a lesson.
And so that's really the, that's a core part of using these apps.
So that K-8 is a lot of IXL. We use CommonLit and Newsela to practice reading comprehension, Khan Academy for more specific math and Science questions.
But then as you move to high school, we have kind of a different set of apps.
We use Newton Alta.
It is the hardest, most rigorous course that you could possibly imagine for each subject.
We do continue through IXL. If we haven't finished that, we use NuZella.
And then, for the students who are really able to continue to grow past traditional high school courses, we use Outlier, in which you get college credit for completing a course.
The thing about when you're in high school is you've learned how to learn on your own.
And so for lots of like extra AP courses that there isn't an app for, it doesn't necessarily matter that there isn't a specific app for because we've learned how to learn on our own through these last, you know, years of our education.
Okay, that's cool.
Would you say that most of your peers are ahead in most subjects, ahead of those peers in your traditional public school?
Yes.
Reading, writing, most subjects?
Yeah.
I think it's very clear to see, especially in the lower school, because there are these, like, kindergarten, first, and second graders who are already on sixth, seventh, eighth grade math.
Okay.
Amazing.
And scoring in, you know, high school level reading comprehension, where their biggest problem is that the actual content of, like, there are these kindergartners who are at the level where their reading passages are tackling difficult topics like death and, you know, these big topics that these young kids can't grasp yet.
And that's the biggest problem.
So when you're at that level already, when you're so young, it's really just...
It's really, really remarkable how quickly these kids are able to move through content.
I'm particularly lucky because I've done this education for so long, I have been able to finish all of high school math and English In my junior year, so that this senior year, I can really do independent studies, do a few college courses, and really just dive into my interests.
Yeah, your interests, your passions.
Yeah, my passions.
You know, I love English, lit, and math, and so those two subjects I'm able to spend a lot more time on than I would have in a standard school because I've, you know, I'm able to learn, I was able to learn faster, have more time, yes.
Yeah, you have more time to focus.
I love this tweet that you posted on X. High schoolers can do anything.
My classmates and I just spent 48 hours doing this.
Creating a four-week online course on how to have a 75% chance at getting into an Ivy League school with speaker scripts, exercises, breakout rooms, etc.
That's amazing.
Most 40-year-olds can't do that.
Making a 30-page second brain with all the best information and experts in the field.
Making 100-plus marketing videos for TikTok and Instagram, creating a landing page and email capture system, writing a book, creating a chat GPT to calculate admission chances, and so much more.
This is pretty cool.
I mean, the things that you guys are creating are, again, way light years beyond what your typical peers are creating most likely at schools.
Yeah, we spent this last weekend really kind of testing the limits of what we're able to do.
There were seven of us and we were able to really dive into all of the really crazy things that we're doing in our masterpieces in general and apply it to this workshop that Alpha is going to produce called How to Have a 75% Chance of Getting into an Ivy.
And Not only did we learn a lot about college admissions, but we were also able to really practice building a business and creating, like my younger sister, she spent 48 hours creating literally more than a hundred marketing videos for TikTok and Instagram.
And she grew She grew a hashtag to over 300,000 views in 48 hours.
Wow.
It was incredible.
And that's just, it's just really shows how, how much these high schoolers are capable of doing.
Yeah, so I, as a parent, I have one concern.
And this is one of the reasons why I would want to homeskill my children is because most schools now, public schools, private schools, et cetera, have gone very digital and they give the students laptops and tablets, et cetera, starting from kindergarten.
Or sometimes younger than that.
And it's so digital that I would want to...
I'm really worried about having my child have access to a smartphone all the time, a tablet all the time, the internet.
I don't want them accessing YouTube.
I don't want them accessing porn.
I don't want them having all this unfettered access to the internet and to technology.
I would rather have them outside playing or learning in an organic way and not have access to potentially very evil...
System out there and information.
So how do you, that's my one, I mean, the schooling system sounds really great, but yeah, that's my one concern.
How do you stay protected from that?
Do you guys talk about that?
Is this a concern?
Yes.
Well, all of the computers, they're school computers.
They're completely 100% tracked.
You know, anything that could be remotely concerning is flagged and sent to admin.
You know, we have, even though the tracking is primarily used to You know, track and assess the kids' learning and detect anti-patterns, see if they're actually rushing through the contents, giving questions.
Even though that's the primary focus of the tracking software, it does flag any content that Is, could be concerning as well.
But I guess, I guess because it's teaching you, it's teaching you the skills to be resourceful online and to, you know, to use the internet, to learn and everything.
Is that something that a lot of kids that you've seen at your school, then, you know, they go down different rabbit holes that are dark or, of course, they understand that this is like, this is Do they have the values, I guess, and the discernment, would you say, to not go down those capital?
I think the biggest thing about it is that, you know, we all have, we have a relationship with the internet and with social media that is one of being able to learn.
And, you know, really, it's a lot more productive than, you know, any of my, how any of my friends at traditional schools view the internet and its capabilities.
I don't see it as addicting in a negative way, I guess.
No.
What my classmates and I are able to To do is view the internet as a tool.
And especially with all this AI stuff, one of our mottos is that the internet empowers us.
It gives us AI and the internet gives us superpowers.
And it's more of a gift that we are able to use to learn and improve ourselves instead of kind of this abyss where anything can happen.
Okay, that's good.
Yeah, that's my concern.
Of course.
You know, I guess the addiction to technology, and is that something that stifles you guys?
Or it sounds like a lot of you, like you said, you use it in a more empowering way than children at most schools who just use it every chance they get on their breaks, and it's more of a...
Of course.
...a negative addiction.
Yeah, my friends and I play cards during...
We do Pomodoros during the morning time for our learning sessions.
We play cards during breaks.
Okay, that's cool.
Physical cards, not card games on apps.
We have a bunch of card decks and we play physical cards.
Okay, that's cool.
All right, cool.
Well, any last words?
Tell everybody again where they can find you again and follow you.
You've definitely been enlightening.
It's always interesting to hear other solutions to whatever this Marxist traditional school system is that has gone down the road.
Dawn down the toilet.
And obviously the numbers show, I mean, the literacy rate has gone down the toilet.
Everything is so bad.
So it's great to hear other solutions.
Yeah.
So Austin Scholar on Twitter or on Substack, austinscholar.substack.com.
Okay, perfect.
Check out her Substack, check out her work and follow her.
Thank you so much again, Austin Scholar.
We appreciate you.
We'll have you back on again.
Of course.
Thank you so much.
All right.
Thanks.
Alright guys, we'll be right back right after these messages.
Don't go anywhere.
All right, that's all the time we've got for today.
Thank you so much for joining Shots Fired.
Remember, twice a week, Tuesdays and Thursdays at 8 p.m.
Eastern Time, right after the Stu Peters Show.
In the meantime, follow us on social media, especially Gab, Telegram, Truth Social, and Getter, at Real Deanna Lorraine, and on Twitter, for all the latest in controversial posts, Deanna for Congress.
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