Freedomain Radio - Stefan Molyneux - What To Do When You Are BETRAYED! X Space
Aired: 2026-04-19
Duration: 01:39:41


=== Why Calling Nutritionists Fails (07:17) ===

[00:00:00]  All right, good evening, good evening.
[00:00:03]  My friends, mes amis, mein Freulein, a Frau's.
[00:00:10]  Hope you're doing well.
[00:00:11]  It's Fan Molyneux from Free Domain at the tasty location of FreeDomain.com slash donate if you would like to help out the show.
[00:00:21]  It would be deeply, humbly, and oh so gratefully appreciate it.
[00:00:26]  Don't forget, we've got a couple of spots that have opened up.
[00:00:31]  Fredomain.com slash call.
[00:00:34]  Book your public call ins.
[00:00:35]  They're free.
[00:00:37]  And your private call ins.
[00:00:39]  They're not free.
[00:00:41]  And bring the power of philosophy to help build your life in the right direction.
[00:00:48]  I actually had a caller this morning, a lovely young woman who has reversed some minor depression slash anxiety I had about the power of philosophy because I've had a whole bunch of callers recently.
[00:01:04]  I'm going to say quite upfront that they're mostly men.
[00:01:08]  Manly men.
[00:01:09]  And the callers have been saying, basically, I'm going to paraphrase, something like this Hey, Steph, great show, man.
[00:01:16]  I've been listening for 15 years.
[00:01:19]  Now, let me tell you all the ways in which I've ignored your advice and helped me fix this big mess.
[00:01:24]  That is what has been occurring.
[00:01:26]  This treasure, this gem, this glory of a young lady, instead called me up and said, Hey, Steph, I've been listening to your show for quite some time.
[00:01:37]  And I didn't just listen like it was just pass through brain syllable based entertainment, but I, in fact, did listen.
[00:01:45]  She met a great guy, a rational guy.
[00:01:49]  Settle down, she's got a baby, and she's like, How can I make sure that my 30s are great as well?
[00:01:55]  And we had a great conversation.
[00:01:59]  So remember, remember the 5th of November, and also remember that philosophy is much better at prevention than it is at cure.
[00:02:11]  If you haven't heard this analogy before, a philosopher like myself, we're like nutritionists and some diet and exercise folks.
[00:02:22]  So, if you're overweight and you call the nutritionist and you say, Hey, what should I do?
[00:02:26]  The nutritionist will say, Eat better.
[00:02:30]  And the exercise guy will say, Get your move on, get your groove on.
[00:02:34]  And that way you can avoid, I don't know, a heart attack or diabetes or something, a heart disease or something.
[00:02:44]  If you just flip through the books of nutrition and you watch people exercising but don't actually change your life, And then you have said heart attack in this analogy, there's really not much point in calling up the nutritionist and saying, Oh, oh, oh, help me.
[00:03:05]  I'm having a heart attack.
[00:03:07]  Help me, nutritionist.
[00:03:09]  I mean, what's the nutritionist going to say?
[00:03:11]  They're going to say, Well, you may not be having the heart attack if you'd listened to me 10 years ago, but right now, because you are having a heart attack, you're just going to have to call 911.
[00:03:23]  You're just going to have to get an ambulance, get yourself to the hospital.
[00:03:27]  And they will do unspeakably horrible and holy things to you in order that you can hopefully survive.
[00:03:35]  Listen before it's too late.
[00:03:36]  Philosophy is about prevention, not so much cure.
[00:03:42]  Or, to put it another way, the less you listen to preventative philosophy, the more infinitely more likely you are to end up in a situation in which philosophy cannot help you.
[00:03:56]  So, freedomain.comslash call.
[00:03:59]  You know, I don't want to toot my own horn.
[00:04:02]  I mean, I'm going to.
[00:04:03]  I don't want to, but I'm going to.
[00:04:06]  But I can't even tell you, I can't even tell y'all the number of people.
[00:04:14]  Who have called me over the last 21 years?
[00:04:17]  That's right.
[00:04:19]  This show can now drink in all 52 states.
[00:04:23]  The number of people who've called me and said, Oh, man, I wish I'd called you years before.
[00:04:29]  Because they say, Well, you know, you listen to me say you should date and marry for virtue, not just lust.
[00:04:37]  Lust is fine, but it should not be the main dish.
[00:04:40]  It's a little dash of cayenne pepper on the side, which is great.
[00:04:44]  But don't just eat cayenne pepper.
[00:04:46]  You both get sick and it won't actually contain that much nutrition.
[00:04:50]  And then people get married to the wrong person based on lust.
[00:04:58]  And then they call me and they say, My relationship is a mess.
[00:05:02]  Oh, but I have kids because of lust.
[00:05:05]  And I say, Well, why didn't you call me when you were dating and we could have gone through the red flags together?
[00:05:11]  No!
[00:05:12]  Why would you want to do that?
[00:05:14]  Just call me.
[00:05:15]  When she's going all Latina on you and throwing a saucepan at your head every time you disagree.
[00:05:20]  So, freedomain.com slash call.
[00:05:24]  Don't delay.
[00:05:25]  It's free.
[00:05:26]  I listen, I can't do better than free.
[00:05:28]  I can't afford to pay people to call me, and that would feel a little odd, a little strange, a little strange.
[00:05:35]  I can't do better than free.
[00:05:37]  You have access to a great problem solver, a bewitchingly delightful conversation partner.
[00:05:45]  It will be probably the most important conversation of your life.
[00:05:49]  And it's free.
[00:05:50]  From the comfort of your own home, you can gain access to a great philosopher to prevent problems from arising in your life, or at least navigating the problems that have arisen because you haven't or previously did not listen to the aforementioned great philosopher.
[00:06:06]  So, freedomain.com slash call.
[00:06:08]  Don't hesitate.
[00:06:10]  It's very easy.
[00:06:12]  All you need is an hour or two.
[00:06:16]  A phone and some whiskey.
[00:06:19]  All right.
[00:06:20]  So we've got our friend Richard is on the line.
[00:06:24]  If you would like to talk, just raise your hand.
[00:06:27]  I certainly have some topics.
[00:06:28]  Hey.
[00:06:29]  But I'm happy to chat.
[00:06:30]  Hello.
[00:06:31]  Hey, how are you doing?
[00:06:32]  Well, thanks.
[00:06:32]  How are you doing?
[00:06:33]  I'm okay.
[00:06:34]  Thanks.
[00:06:34]  Oh, just a quick I'll toot your horn.
[00:06:38]  No problem.
[00:06:39]  It's going to cost you some sats.
[00:06:43]  All right.
[00:06:44]  My question for you.
[00:06:47]  I've noticed in a number of your call in shows, it seems to be like a real point of resistance for people to criticize their parents.
[00:06:57]  It seems to be sometimes it takes hours or over an hour of struggle with a call in in order to persuade the person to even attempt or even acknowledge that it's a permissible thing to criticize one's parents, especially as an adult.

=== Shaking Up Tribal Survival (13:28) ===

[00:07:17]  Of course, as a child, that's something different.
[00:07:20]  I was just wondering if you have any thoughts on where that pressure comes from.
[00:07:27]  The irrationality of it is it an evolutionary pressure?
[00:07:31]  Or I'm interested in your thoughts on where that comes from because it does seem to be fairly ubiquitous and a real point of resistance for a lot of people who do call in for help, especially those people who have been listening to your show for.
[00:07:48]  Sometimes a number of years and still have this high resistance?
[00:07:53]  Sure.
[00:07:54]  I think that's a great question.
[00:07:56]  And it's very easy to forget how brutal the past was.
[00:08:01]  Yeah.
[00:08:02]  Very easy.
[00:08:03]  I did speeches in Australia in 2018.
[00:08:10]  And these were all scholarly sourced articles on how absolutely vile, violent, brutal, and hideous the Aboriginal culture was in Australia.
[00:08:23]  And this is all of the land acknowledgments, the indigenous, like we have this, we've been sold this noble savage bullshit by Marxists, right?
[00:08:30]  And the purpose of it, of course, is to make white people, and in particular white males, to make us feel like we're just the worst people in human history.
[00:08:39]  And we, you know, Graham Greene did this in this pretty wretched movie, Dances with Wolves, where it's like he's just this cool, funny, neat guy.
[00:08:50]  And they all lived at one with nature.
[00:08:52]  They smoked the peace pipe.
[00:08:54]  They were just beautiful, wonderful, satchine, little feather accepting.
[00:08:57]  Marlon Brando's Oscar for The Godfather, and they just were so natural and wonderful, and so on.
[00:09:05]  And it's all absolute false.
[00:09:08]  They were murderous, cannibalistic, genocidal, primitive, savages, right?
[00:09:14]  And it is because, of course, if current white Western Christian European civilization is brutal and hideous relative to the peace, plenty, and beauty of the past, then it's a downgrade.
[00:09:28]  But of course, white Western Christian civilization, at least compared to indigenous tribes, primitive indigenous tribes throughout the world, is a massive and total upgrade.
[00:09:39]  But they can't have that.
[00:09:40]  They have to have you demoralized.
[00:09:42]  And demoralized means that you took these lovely, wonderful, lamb like creatures and dashed their heads against the rocks for the sake of your naked, capitalistic, imperialistic, white skinned greed.
[00:09:54]  It's just standard demoralization stuff.
[00:09:57]  But, I mean, if I remember rightly, 40% of the children in the Aboriginal community were killed.
[00:10:06]  You look at the Aztecs, human sacrifice was rampant.
[00:10:11]  Thousands of children sometimes would be slaughtered and they would be tortured first.
[00:10:15]  Yeah, yeah, for sure.
[00:10:16]  Yeah, because their God actually fed on the tears and pain of children.
[00:10:20]  Yeah, yeah, it's horrific, right?
[00:10:22]  Yeah.
[00:10:22]  So children throughout almost all of human history were completely disposable and their lives hung by a thread.
[00:10:32]  And food was scarce, protection was scarce, there were more children often than resources.
[00:10:39]  And so the way that I look at it is simply what are the genetic pressures?
[00:10:44]  What are the evolutionary pressures on children?
[00:10:48]  And the evolutionary pressure is the children who displeased their parents did they have a higher or lower chance of survival?
[00:11:00]  What do you think?
[00:11:00]  Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[00:11:02]  I agree with that.
[00:11:03]  Yeah.
[00:11:03]  Sorry, I asked you a question.
[00:11:06]  Yeah, I agree with that.
[00:11:07]  Yeah.
[00:11:07]  With what?
[00:11:08]  I asked you a question.
[00:11:09]  Can you hear me?
[00:11:11]  Yeah, I can hear you.
[00:11:12]  Yeah.
[00:11:12]  Okay, sure.
[00:11:13]  No, no, I agree with that.
[00:11:15]  Okay, let me try this again.
[00:11:16]  I was trying to get your participation, but you didn't catch the question.
[00:11:21]  So, the children who disagreed with their parents for 99.99% of human history, did they have a higher or lower chance of survival?
[00:11:32]  If they disagreed or agreed with their parents?
[00:11:34]  If they disagreed with their parents.
[00:11:36]  Oh, no, much.
[00:11:36]  Much lower.
[00:11:37]  Yeah, much lower.
[00:11:38]  If you displeased your parents, you didn't get the extra food.
[00:11:42]  They might be the last to protect you when the wolves come.
[00:11:47]  They might not wrap you up warm when you're cold.
[00:11:49]  They might put you a little bit further out away from the fire.
[00:11:53]  Like you had to stay close to your parents and you had to please them.
[00:11:59]  And if you didn't please them, well, you had a lower chance of survival and even a 1% less chance of survival when we're talking about millions of years of evolution.
[00:12:11]  Is a massive difference.
[00:12:14]  So, we are programmed to swallow and absorb our parents' wrongs and not foundationally to criticize and overturn them.
[00:12:27]  And even if we survive, right?
[00:12:30]  So, let's say that we survive.
[00:12:32]  We disagree with our parents.
[00:12:34]  We think their gods are foolish.
[00:12:35]  We think their superstitions are rancorous.
[00:12:37]  We think that their prejudices are ridiculous and they are fools.
[00:12:41]  But our parents have the general beliefs of the tribe as a whole.
[00:12:45]  So, even if we were to fight our way, Through all of that, and we were to survive the disapproval of our parents, well, then we go out into the mating market in our teens, right?
[00:13:00]  Early, mid teens, we go out into the mating market.
[00:13:02]  And what do the women's parents or the girls' parents think of us?
[00:13:07]  Because everybody knows everybody else's business, right?
[00:13:08]  It's a pretty small tribe.
[00:13:10]  What do they think of us?
[00:13:11]  Well, yeah, they're going to judge you on how you view your parents.
[00:13:18]  Of course.
[00:13:18]  Yeah.
[00:13:19]  And if you have disagreed with your parents, if your parents are hostile towards you, is a woman, a girl, is she going to be more or less likely to choose a male whose parents are hostile towards him?
[00:13:33]  No.
[00:13:34]  Is she going to be more or less likely to choose?
[00:13:40]  Less likely.
[00:13:41]  Less likely.
[00:13:42]  And why would she be less likely to choose him?
[00:13:46]  Well, because he's going to represent a threat to any further.
[00:13:53]  He's going to represent a threat to the tribe, and therefore she's going to view him as a threat to it as a partner.
[00:14:00]  Well, in what way does he pose a threat to the tribe as a whole?
[00:14:05]  Because he's disagreeing with his parents, and therefore it's likely that he's going to represent a threat to her if she hooks up with him, right?
[00:14:16]  Well, I wouldn't necessarily say that.
[00:14:18]  You could be right.
[00:14:19]  The place that I would go to would be if she has.
[00:14:24]  Four parents instead of two, she gets access to twice the resources, twice the land, twice the money, twice the protection, and so on, right?
[00:14:35]  So if he's alienated from his parents, right, this is why when men separate or go no contact with their parents and they go out into the dating market, they're very hesitant to talk about this because if the women would be like, oh, but she's your mother.
[00:14:51]  And women have an instinct to stay away from men who have alienated their parents, A, because That means that they're rebels and that's going to be tough for their own survival and the survival of their own sons and daughters if they were to hook up or marry such a man.
[00:15:08]  But also, they just have half the resources because you need people to watch your kids.
[00:15:13]  You need people to give you food and shelter when you're pregnant, when you're breastfeeding, when you're children a little.
[00:15:20]  And of course, women throughout our evolution spent their entire post pubescent lives dealing with babies, infants, and toddlers.
[00:15:32]  Right?
[00:15:33]  They spent from 20 or 15 to 40, they spent 25 years having their own kids.
[00:15:38]  And by the time they are infertile or their fertility has dropped off a cliff, they're dealing with grandchildren.
[00:15:45]  So, for our entire evolution, women were evolved to deal with babies, infants, and toddlers.
[00:15:51]  And then, as the children got older, often at least the males would move over to the males of the tribe to learn the hunter stuff, to learn the war stuff, and all of that, which is where there would be these brutal.
[00:16:03]  Hazing rituals and maturation rituals that would kill a good number of the kids.
[00:16:11]  So she needs a lot of resources.
[00:16:14]  She's spending her entire life dependent upon the goodwill of family and kin and clan.
[00:16:19]  And if you are alienated from your own parents, that's a huge red flag for a lot of women, not just from the cultural standpoint and the belief system standpoint and the ostracism standpoint, but just.
[00:16:33]  She has access to half the resources because she's not getting two families for the price of one, which is why women tend to be somewhat hesitant and hostile towards critical criticism of parents.
[00:16:47]  So, for a wide variety of reasons, the genes to criticize parents did not make it very well, if that makes sense.
[00:16:58]  Yeah.
[00:16:59]  But then, sorry, but then that begs the question why are they here at all?
[00:17:03]  Well, you successfully bridged that chasm, right?
[00:17:13]  You found a partner who looked to you, and you have rejected somewhat your parents, and yet she somehow chose you as you chose her.
[00:17:28]  So somehow you've bridged that.
[00:17:30]  Well, but of course, my wife is a trained mental health professional, so she deals with reality and morals and all of that.
[00:17:38]  That's her training, that's her entire gig.
[00:17:41]  So that's a sort of different matter in general.
[00:17:46]  So, the question is like, we've evolved to not have a tail, we've got that little stub, but it would be like people being randomly born with a tail.
[00:17:55]  So, why do you think the genes of criticizing parents have survived at all?
[00:18:00]  Well, that's a good question, isn't it?
[00:18:02]  You know, what's your answer to that?
[00:18:05]  My answer to that is that you need people in society to shake shit up from time to time.
[00:18:15]  Like, if you look at evolution as a whole, evolution occurs because of randomness.
[00:18:20]  Like, there's mistranslation of dreams, misinscribing of genes, and randomness comes in.
[00:18:26]  And most of that randomness is either neutral or negative, but occasionally that randomness is good.
[00:18:33]  And so, in society, if you end up with a society, I'm thinking like in particular East Asian society, Japanese and Chinese and so on, if you end up in a society where criticism of elders is not allowed at all, then those societies tend to stagnate.
[00:18:52]  And then they're taken over by societies that allow at least some small amount of criticism of existing systems.
[00:19:00]  If there's too much criticism, like the French Revolution, you end up with chaos and murder.
[00:19:04]  If there's not enough criticism, you end up with stagnation.
[00:19:06]  You get taken over by a more robust and energetic tribe.
[00:19:10]  So society is like the body and I'm like the mutated gene.
[00:19:15]  I obviously like to think advantageous and all of that.
[00:19:18]  But the reason why, at least in the West, I think we have a good mix of stability, conformity, And rebellion.
[00:19:27]  Yep, 100%.
[00:19:28]  So I think that the reason why people like me are around is because we need some random mutations to challenge society in order to make sure that it stays creative and not just stable.
[00:19:43]  Because organisms that are too stable never evolve, and organisms that are too unstable don't survive.
[00:19:50]  So you need mostly stability and a little bit of nonconformity.
[00:19:55]  And that's how society progresses, in the same way that that's how evolution progresses.
[00:19:59]  Progresses.
[00:20:00]  Like in terms of human intelligence, there's thousands of genes that each contribute a little bit to a higher intelligence.
[00:20:09]  And if it provides evolutionary advantages, particularly in cold climates, then it would be selected for that.
[00:20:16]  And in some communities where they allow the most intelligent to have the most children, you can get a third of an IQ point every generation, which is really, really something.
[00:20:26]  And so, yeah, so I would say that we have to have our rebels, otherwise, we stagnate completely.
[00:20:32]  And the internet has allowed.
[00:20:35]  For rebels like myself, and I think philosophers obviously like myself, to have a voice where formally we would have been mostly silenced.
[00:20:44]  Yeah, for sure.

=== Philosophers Wandering the Streets (14:56) ===

[00:20:45]  Absolutely.
[00:20:47]  Yeah, the breadth of communication has expanded exponentially, I guess, right?
[00:20:53]  Really.
[00:20:53]  Yeah, for sure.
[00:20:55]  So, how do you, how do you, how do you, what are your views on explaining callers that have listened to you for a decade or longer?
[00:21:06]  And still struggle with understanding what it is you're talking about.
[00:21:10]  What do you mean by understanding?
[00:21:12]  I'm not disagreeing with you.
[00:21:13]  I'm just not sure what you mean.
[00:21:14]  Do you mean by putting it into practice in their own lives or understanding the general concepts?
[00:21:19]  Well, there's a combination of both those things, right?
[00:21:21]  Yeah.
[00:21:22]  I mean, I'm just listening.
[00:21:23]  I'm not going to point this one cooler out.
[00:21:27]  I don't want to call this person out, but the latest episode I listened to was this guy who's in his late 40s and had called in with asking you for advice on should he or should he not.
[00:21:39]  You know, have a family.
[00:21:41]  And I was just like staggered.
[00:21:43]  And especially when he said he'd been listening to you for like 15 years or more.
[00:21:47]  And it was a very, very interesting conversation you had with him.
[00:21:51]  But I was left with this impression that, wow, you know, it took two and a half, almost two and a half hours to get him to the point of realizing a very simple fact of being allowed to criticize his parents, essentially, you know.
[00:22:07]  And yeah, so it seems like an uphill battle, I think.
[00:22:13]  Okay, so what you mean is that people can listen, but putting it into practice in their own lives is very tough.
[00:22:22]  Yes.
[00:22:22]  Well, it is.
[00:22:24]  And I would be the last person to criticize that.
[00:22:27]  I was studying philosophy for almost 20 years before I put it into practice in my own life.
[00:22:32]  And then I didn't even want to.
[00:22:34]  It wasn't like I had some, well, I've got to live with more integrity and I've got to actually put these values into practice.
[00:22:39]  It wasn't any of that.
[00:22:40]  I just stopped being able to sleep.
[00:22:43]  Right.
[00:22:43]  And so I, with great humility, and you've heard me say this a million times in call in shows, I'm not speaking from any particular point of reverence or superiority or anything like that.
[00:22:54]  I didn't even want to put the values into practice in my own life.
[00:22:58]  I just had to because I was sleepwalking through my life and therefore I couldn't sleep at night.
[00:23:03]  And so when I went to therapy, I realized that.
[00:23:08]  I was reading philosophy.
[00:23:09]  I was arguing philosophy.
[00:23:10]  I was thinking about philosophy.
[00:23:12]  I just wasn't doing actual philosophy.
[00:23:16]  I was reading a bunch of diet books.
[00:23:18]  I was memorizing a bunch of recipes.
[00:23:20]  I was arguing about food content.
[00:23:23]  I wasn't actually changing my diet.
[00:23:26]  And so, I mean, I try to give people a shortcut into putting philosophy into practice in their own lives, but we have a great deal of resistance to putting philosophy into practice in our own lives because.
[00:23:40]  Those who actually lived rational philosophy in the past often didn't live more than a month or two.
[00:23:46]  Yeah, yeah, for sure.
[00:23:48]  Yeah.
[00:23:49]  Interesting.
[00:23:50]  For me, at least, there's an interesting kind of phenomenon that occurs is because we can point the point, like you just did, you pointed back to the place in time when essentially you woke up.
[00:24:04]  It's not exactly a perfect phrase, but your conscience became activated or reactivated, and then you became aware of.
[00:24:13]  Or the, you know, where your present state of being.
[00:24:17]  But that's an interesting thing, isn't it?
[00:24:19]  Because you can't really, how do you formulate that?
[00:24:24]  You know, like my example was, like you have these call in shows and people calling in, and they've listened to hours and hours and hours of your content, but they still haven't arrived at that place where they wake up to something unless they have a good conversation with you at this point.
[00:24:40]  And then you can somehow help them get to that place.
[00:24:46]  But it's an interesting, for me, it's an interesting thing to think about where you can state, oh, I was completely unaware of all this stuff, and then suddenly you become aware of it.
[00:24:57]  And that's an it.
[00:24:58]  I don't know if you find that interesting in humans as a role.
[00:25:01]  Like, how do we help?
[00:25:04]  How can you help a person get to that place?
[00:25:07]  Some people do and some people don't, right?
[00:25:10]  You mean the place of actually living philosophy rather than just thinking about it?
[00:25:14]  Yes.
[00:25:15]  Well, I would not fault the average person for this.
[00:25:21]  And let me ask you a question.
[00:25:23]  There are thousands of philosophy professors around the world.
[00:25:27]  Now, of the philosophy professors around the world, how many do you think are actually living philosophy in the Socratic sense?
[00:25:39]  And how many do you think are generally sophists who are sucking at the government titty, making a bunch of money?
[00:25:46]  You know, you can make $200,000, $300,000 a year.
[00:25:49]  You only have to work eight months of the year, maybe 10 to 15 hours a week.
[00:25:53]  Every five years, you get a year off for a tasty sabbatical in the Bahamas.
[00:25:57]  So, of the philosophy professors, Who should be living the most moral lives, the most robust lives, the lives where they most challenge those in authority?
[00:26:06]  How many philosophy professors, people with PhDs in philosophy, how many of them do you think are living with the toughness and focus of Socrates, say?
[00:26:19]  I would probably point it at like 0.0001%.
[00:26:25]  Yeah, I don't know any of them.
[00:26:28]  And of course, I've invited both free market professors and professors of philosophy to say look, Socrates and Aristotle and Plato, sort of the three, quote, holy men of early philosophy, they did not run to the government and get a bunch of government money, and they didn't run to the government and get a bunch of government protections.
[00:26:49]  They talked to the people and took money voluntarily.
[00:26:53]  Socrates famously would talk philosophy with you, and he would only ask on occasion that you buy him some lunch, which is kind of my approach.
[00:27:03]  Right?
[00:27:03]  I mean, seriously, I'll talk philosophy with anyone, and a tip or a donation or whatever is welcome, but it's not required.
[00:27:12]  Yeah, yeah.
[00:27:13]  I've never charged money to talk to me if people don't want to pay.
[00:27:19]  Like if they want to keep it a purely private conversation, that's a different matter because then it doesn't do much good for the world.
[00:27:24]  As a whole.
[00:27:25]  So, but yeah, I've never said to someone who wants to talk to me, you have to pay.
[00:27:29]  It's always been free.
[00:27:31]  And I don't run ads and so on.
[00:27:33]  So, I am in the modern world the closest guy to Socrates that is.
[00:27:43]  I use simple terms.
[00:27:45]  I bring philosophy to the people.
[00:27:47]  I was struck many years ago when I read that Socrates never used the word epistemology or metaphysics or metaethics or, you know, or anything like that.
[00:27:57]  He just spoke the common language of the people and he tried to gain consistency in people's thinking, rational consistency in people's thinking.
[00:28:08]  And so, as far as speaking to anyone and everyone about philosophy and working on rational consistency and empirical evidence and following reason wherever it goes and not charging people, but I still got to live, so freedomain.com slash donate, I am the closest thing to Socrates in the modern world.
[00:28:29]  By that, I'm not saying I'm as good a philosopher as Socrates.
[00:28:33]  I mean, that's obviously for history to determine.
[00:28:36]  I think in my work on peaceful parenting and in my work on UPB, I have done better.
[00:28:42]  But of course, it's the old argument that if I've seen further, it's because I stand on the shoulders of giants and all of that.
[00:28:48]  So.
[00:28:50]  So, I am the closest thing.
[00:28:51]  Now, every philosophy professor worships Socrates.
[00:28:56]  And so, and you could say, look, but you can't teach people by just wandering around the street and asking people for money to talk philosophy.
[00:29:05]  Okay, okay, whatever.
[00:29:06]  That's fine.
[00:29:08]  But with the internet and with the success of what I do, the ability to emulate Socrates has now been put into the hands of every philosophy professor in the world, the thousands and thousands of philosophy professors.
[00:29:22]  And if you have tens of thousands of philosophy students, professors, hundreds of thousands probably around the world, all told.
[00:29:28]  And they have the example, of course, of priests.
[00:29:30]  You can go in and listen to a priest, and you don't usually have to pay.
[00:29:34]  And they will talk about ideas and virtues and the good and all of that and honor.
[00:29:41]  And so the people who have trained and studied and love Socrates and worship philosophy and so on, you can't get them to give up their government goodies.
[00:29:55]  And take to the streets.
[00:29:57]  Peter Boghossian does it with his street epistemology and so on.
[00:30:00]  But for the most part, it's very rare.
[00:30:03]  And he turned into another rabid anti-Trumper and wasn't really thinking at all in that sense.
[00:30:08]  So not consistent.
[00:30:10]  But even philosophy professors who have decades of studying and reasoning and they have their own heroes, right?
[00:30:20]  And you can't get them to emulate their heroes at all.
[00:30:23]  So I try not to get too upset with the average person who doesn't live philosophy for a long time, A, because neither did I.
[00:30:29]  And B, because even those trained in philosophy are so easily bought and paid for by the satanic state that criticizing the average person for not living philosophy when the trained and professional philosophers won't ever do it either, to me, would be unjust.
[00:30:50]  Yeah, that's a really good answer to that question.
[00:30:55]  You know, I mean, yeah, we live in a strange world, really, right?
[00:31:01]  All these so called philosophers out there really, you know, if they can't use five syllable words, they don't utter a word at all.
[00:31:08]  Well, and physicists and mathematicians and biologists and doctors have made staggering advances over the last few hundred years.
[00:31:20]  And philosophers, after 3,000 years, have still not agreed on a universal definition of truth and virtue.
[00:31:35]  It's pathetic.
[00:31:37]  The progress made in philosophy is almost more obfuscation than clarification.
[00:31:43]  Philosophy has not advanced at all since its inception in its core mission.
[00:31:51]  Its core mission is.
[00:31:54]  To define truth and virtue.
[00:31:59]  And truth isn't even the most important.
[00:32:01]  Truth is only necessary insofar as it serves virtue.
[00:32:04]  Because physicists try to come up with true and valid theories, as do biologists and geologists, and doctors try to come up with when they say this medicine will cure you, they can be reasonably sure that it's a true statement.
[00:32:16]  And so there's lots of people who are in pursuit of truth.
[00:32:18]  Mathematicians want their valid and accurate theories, and engineers want to be able to say if I build this bridge, it's going to stay up.
[00:32:24]  That's a true statement, and so on.
[00:32:26]  So lots of people are after the truth.
[00:32:28]  But only moral philosophy, and moral philosophy is the essence of philosophy, has advanced in what way?
[00:32:36]  Say, ah, yes, well, no, but moral philosophy got rid of slavery.
[00:32:40]  Nope, that was Christianity.
[00:32:42]  That was the Quakers and, in many ways, the Protestants.
[00:32:46]  And even if we were to say, well, but you see, philosophy, there was slavery in Aristotle's time and there isn't slavery now, it's like, well, it hasn't spread universally in the way that physics has, number one.
[00:32:56]  And number two, we just have soft slavery now.
[00:33:00]  Because we hand over children to the state, which funds their indoctrination by force, and they're born into more than they can ever make in their lifetime's worth of national debt and unfunded liabilities.
[00:33:09]  So we just have a soft slavery now.
[00:33:12]  Say, ah, yes, well, but stealing is wrong.
[00:33:15]  It's like, well, no, that again is largely religious.
[00:33:18]  And inflation is a form of theft, and philosophers have yet to roundly condemn it as a whole.
[00:33:25]  And they have not dislodged statism, and they did not address child abuse, which is the foundation of.
[00:33:31]  Most of the evils in the world.
[00:33:32]  So, philosophers' reluctance to define universal morality and to deal with the problems of political power and the problems of child abuse is a giant stain on a profession that until recently was an ignoble avoidance of truth and virtue.
[00:33:52]  And now you've got all these philosophers like, oh, is AI real intelligence?
[00:33:56]  It's like, you wankers.
[00:33:58]  You absolute spineless fucking wankers.
[00:34:02]  What matters is the non aggression principle and property rights and the protection of innocent children.
[00:34:09]  That's what matters.
[00:34:10]  And philosophers won't touch that shit with a 10 foot pole.
[00:34:13]  And they won't even do it like they could say, well, Steph did it.
[00:34:16]  You know, boy, look what they did to him.
[00:34:17]  Yeah, okay.
[00:34:18]  It was a little rough at times.
[00:34:20]  I'm not going to lie.
[00:34:22]  But now you could do it because I've already carved my way through the ice for you.
[00:34:27]  You know, I could understand when podcasting first became a thing.
[00:34:31]  You know, man, I was making some good money.
[00:34:34]  As a software executive, I had an expense account.
[00:34:38]  I had a free car, made good coin, got to travel around, do cool things, make speeches, meet cool people, work in cool technologies.
[00:34:47]  It's a pretty sweet gig, man.
[00:34:48]  It's a pretty sweet life.
[00:34:50]  And I gave all that, took a massive pay cut just to pursue philosophy.
[00:34:56]  Why won't philosophy professors do the same thing?
[00:35:02]  I don't know, other than they are weak court toadies who exist to drive people away from philosophy.
[00:35:12]  See, that's what moral philosophers are there for.
[00:35:14]  That's what philosophers are there for as a whole.
[00:35:17]  Philosophers exist to drive people away from philosophy.
[00:35:22]  Philosophers exist in the academic sense to make people think philosophy is useless, analytical, boring, irrelevant, confusing, opaque, and pointless.
[00:35:36]  It doesn't provide any useful, actionable items.
[00:35:40]  It can't even identify evil.

=== Defining Sickness Beyond Voodoo (07:15) ===

[00:35:42]  My God, it would be like 3,000 years of medicine and they still couldn't define what a sickness was and what a cure was.
[00:35:51]  It's barely beyond fucking voodoo checking intro dancing for the rain witch doctory.
[00:35:58]  It's really, really sad.
[00:36:00]  And so I try not to get too mad at people who don't live philosophy because philosophers, for the most part, have spent.
[00:36:10]  3,000 years not practicing philosophy and, in fact, trying to drive people as far away.
[00:36:15]  Like, why does the government pay philosophers?
[00:36:17]  I mean, the government hasn't offered to pay me, not that I would take it, but they certainly haven't offered to pay me.
[00:36:22]  In fact, other than a couple of dangles some years ago, nobody's offered to pay me anything.
[00:36:28]  Why are governments happy to fund philosophy departments in universities?
[00:36:35]  Because A, they pose no threat, but that's not enough to get funded.
[00:36:40]  And B, They make philosophy look so pointless and useless that people stay far away from it.
[00:36:48]  And it wasn't really until the internet allowed people like me to bring our voice to the public square that philosophy became relevant and powerful at all.
[00:36:56]  At all.
[00:36:58]  I mean, 1.5 billion fewer assaults on children because of what I've done.
[00:37:02]  Hundreds of thousands of children born to people who otherwise wouldn't have had children.
[00:37:06]  Peaceful parenting.
[00:37:08]  UPP.
[00:37:09]  A definition of free will has yet to be overturned.
[00:37:13]  Stuff that matters.
[00:37:15]  Stuff that can change your life for the better.
[00:37:18]  I turned away from hedonism and towards the consistent practice of rational virtues.
[00:37:24]  They're not paying me, but they're pouring hundreds of millions of dollars around the world into philosophy departments because those philosophy departments make people's eyes glaze over.
[00:37:36]  Can you imagine?
[00:37:37]  Most people, you know, I went, I had to have a little, some stitches the other day.
[00:37:44]  And I went in and, you know, I'm chatting with the guy because I'm a chatty guy.
[00:37:50]  And he's like, Oh, what do you do?
[00:37:51]  I said, Oh, I run a philosophy podcast.
[00:37:54]  And he was like, Oh, philosophy.
[00:37:57]  And he said, Isn't that kind of useless?
[00:38:00]  And I said, Yeah, I actually completely agree with you until I came along.
[00:38:05]  And so we had a good conversation about philosophy, but you get that kind of view.
[00:38:11]  Like, imagine if you're at some dinner party and you sit down and you find out the guy next to you has a PhD in philosophy.
[00:38:19]  Are you expecting an interesting evening of challenging?
[00:38:22]  An interesting evening of challenging and worthwhile conversation.
[00:38:26]  You think he's some specialist who knows something about some little known French philosopher from the village of Montauil in the 15th century, and he's going to have absolutely nothing of value.
[00:38:38]  You'd rather sit next to a comedian.
[00:38:40]  You'd rather sit next to an actor, because often actors are very good storytellers.
[00:38:44]  I mean, that's kind of their job, right?
[00:38:46]  You'd rather sit next to somebody who had traveled a lot.
[00:38:50]  At least they could then tell you some interesting stories of their travel.
[00:38:54]  But God help you, if you're sat next to a philosopher, it's like in the movie Bill and Ted's.
[00:39:00]  Excellent adventure, I think it was.
[00:39:01]  I can't remember.
[00:39:02]  Well, Bogus Journey, one of the two, where they bring Freud and Socrates back among other people.
[00:39:08]  And Freud actually says some intelligent things about Ted's mom and things like that.
[00:39:13]  And Socrates just looks completely spaced out.
[00:39:17]  And Socrates picks up some dust and lets it go in the air.
[00:39:22]  And then Keanu Reeves' bill is like, Whoa, yeah, we're dust in the wind, dude.
[00:39:30]  Yeah, we're dust in the wind.
[00:39:34]  And it's like, that's the view.
[00:39:36]  I know that's contemporary, sort of populist thing, but they wouldn't say that about Albert Einstein and physics, right?
[00:39:42]  So, dust in the wind, man.
[00:39:44]  Yeah, that's deep.
[00:39:46]  And I can't remember the last time society has faced an ethical emergency, which, by the way, society faces every single day of its frickin' existence.
[00:39:55]  When was the last time society had an ethical problem?
[00:40:00]  And you saw a moral philosopher on TV.
[00:40:04]  We got to put out the bat signal.
[00:40:06]  We got to put out the Socrates signal.
[00:40:08]  It's a toga and a laurel wreath.
[00:40:12]  We got to shine the Socrates logo.
[00:40:14]  We've got to get the philosophers in here.
[00:40:17]  If you want physics explained, you get some physicist on the show.
[00:40:21]  Biology, same.
[00:40:23]  Economics, well, God help you, mostly voodoo, but still somewhat the same.
[00:40:27]  When was the last time you saw anyone in the mainstream media?
[00:40:32]  Say, we have a moral dilemma as a society.
[00:40:36]  We'd better get a moral philosopher in here because, Lord knows, we pay these guys hundreds of millions of dollars a year around the world.
[00:40:42]  We've got to get a moral philosopher in here, man, so he can explain things to us and make the case clear and brush away the cobwebs and blow back the fog and reveal the truth.
[00:40:53]  Never happens.
[00:40:54]  I can't honestly remember any time that I have turned on the TV.
[00:41:00]  There's a big problem.
[00:41:02]  Moral philosopher or philosopher has come to save the day.
[00:41:06]  Nope, they just hide out in their ivory fucking towers, sucking up government blood money and spouting useless scholastic cobwebs back and forth to each other and not helping the goddamn world in any foundational way.
[00:41:19]  So, yes, I don't particularly mind that the average person doesn't live philosophy because God knows the philosophers don't.
[00:41:27]  All right, well, I appreciate the opportunity to ranty rant.
[00:41:33]  And, Ansley, I appreciate your patience.
[00:41:37]  If you would like to tell me what's on your mind, I would be happy to answer any questions or objections you might have.
[00:41:45]  All right.
[00:41:46]  So, like, certain things on my mind would be in terms of philosophy.
[00:41:51]  A lot of people aren't based, I figured.
[00:41:54]  Like, people might say, all right, well, they'll have ideals that are of value, but it doesn't mean that they necessarily walk the walk.
[00:42:03]  You know what I mean?
[00:42:04]  And it's like ideas definitely have to be defended and fought for.
[00:42:10]  And a good example of this would be like, let's say if we were to take libertarians from 1776, well, they were a lot more ballsy than, like, let's say libertarians today that are, I don't know, I guess too scared to even walk on a lawn or something.
[00:42:26]  So it's, you know, like something like I personally think about in a way.
[00:42:33]  Like back then, it's like what 3% of the population were like Timothy McVeigh in a way.
[00:42:40]  When it comes down to that, in terms of like the overall power dynamics, you know, I think about this in certain interesting aspects because it's like, all right, well, we own, like, how many guns does America own?
[00:42:55]  Yet it's like, well, we don't really fight the elites.

=== Lockdowns as Signal Proxies (05:45) ===

[00:42:58]  It's like lockdowns still happened in 2020.
[00:43:01]  But you look at someplace like Solomon Isles, Nepal, Sri Lanka, they literally overthrew their own communist governments.
[00:43:09]  So.
[00:43:10]  And they did that like not nearly being anywhere as armed as the US.
[00:43:16]  So it's like, I think that it's not even just the philosophy part, but people just need to grow a pair.
[00:43:22]  So, in order to like then defend those ideals, like just having ideals, like that's one thing.
[00:43:27]  Like, I'll say this before hearing about David Friedman wasn't like an ANCAP, but after he could like provide those types of examples of like different legal systems from our own, like that's one of those things that like.
[00:43:41]  Generally changed my mind as well as like lockdowns in 2020 happened.
[00:43:46]  Then it wasn't like, all right, well, this hypothetical legal system is better.
[00:43:50]  It's like, no, fuck the state in that respect.
[00:43:52]  So it's.
[00:43:54]  So you want other people to take up particular risks?
[00:43:57]  Yeah.
[00:43:58]  Yeah.
[00:43:59]  No, listen, it's great.
[00:44:01]  I hear what you're saying.
[00:44:02]  It's great if other people take on all the risks and you and I get to reap all the rewards.
[00:44:08]  I mean, that's pretty sweet, right?
[00:44:11]  I mean, like, hey, I've taken risks.
[00:44:13]  The feds came knocking on my door before.
[00:44:16]  After I raided the Capitol.
[00:44:17]  Oh, on Gen 6?
[00:44:20]  And did you get arrested?
[00:44:22]  Okay.
[00:44:23]  So you didn't do anything they felt, and they were looking for scapegoats, in my humble opinion.
[00:44:29]  So you didn't do anything that they considered particularly objection worthy, right?
[00:44:34]  I mean, they didn't have any clear evidence on me.
[00:44:36]  I mean, what they did do is they did go after like signal proxies and like tour bridges.
[00:44:42]  So I don't know what that means.
[00:44:44]  Sorry.
[00:44:45]  So signal proxies.
[00:44:47]  So you've heard of a signal.
[00:44:49]  It's like a cell network that it's an app that Snowden recommends.
[00:44:54]  Okay.
[00:44:55]  Oh, like, oh, a communications app called Signal.
[00:44:57]  Okay.
[00:44:58]  So the word Signal means a lot of other things too.
[00:45:00]  But okay.
[00:45:00]  Yeah.
[00:45:01]  So they went after Signal.
[00:45:02]  Okay.
[00:45:02]  They went after people who were communicating over Signal, right?
[00:45:06]  Well, but they interviewed you and then they didn't pursue anything, right?
[00:45:11]  I mean, they accused me of assaulting a cop and I just straight up told them to their face, like, I never assaulted a cop.
[00:45:17]  Then they left me alone after that.
[00:45:19]  So it's.
[00:45:20]  Well, I assume it's because they didn't have any evidence.
[00:45:26]  I'm sorry, is that right?
[00:45:27]  Okay.
[00:45:28]  And listen, I'm not crabbing at you or anything like that.
[00:45:32]  I'm glad you weren't arrested.
[00:45:34]  And I've had a run in or two myself.
[00:45:38]  And so on January the 6th, there were people who were attempting to protest as they viewed it an illegitimate transfer of power because they disagreed with the validity of the 2020 election.
[00:45:57]  Well, yeah, it was pretty clear the communist Chinese rigged that thing.
[00:46:02]  There's no way, like, especially after lockdowns, there's no way Joe Biden won that thing.
[00:46:10]  Well, listen, I mean, there's no point at this point relitigating the 2020 election.
[00:46:15]  I've already said that, I mean, the election was swung fairly decisively by the suppression of the Hunter Biden laptop story.
[00:46:24]  So, I mean, it was also, you had like a whole bunch of different mail in ballots.
[00:46:28]  It's like, oh, yeah.
[00:46:29]  And I know the theory, which is that they, yeah, they needed the lockdown so that they could get the mail in ballots.
[00:46:34]  And I get all of that.
[00:46:35]  So, but like, what's more like shocking is just like how cowardly people really are, like, in a way.
[00:46:42]  I mean, like, and I also think helped was like the whole We Was Kang's riots during 2020, which was that, all right, well, the right generally, like, if you have them saying, oh, well, to fund the police, now you're trying to get like a huge chunk of the right.
[00:46:58]  I meant of like, let's say the Jukons, all right, the center.
[00:47:02]  The what?
[00:47:03]  It's like the what?
[00:47:04]  To like back the blue.
[00:47:05]  Sorry, the what?
[00:47:06]  All right.
[00:47:06]  So the neocons, the Jews, the Zog that generally want a police state.
[00:47:12]  As, like, part of the narrative.
[00:47:14]  That way, people don't just rebel and start shooting at cops as the Second Amendment would.
[00:47:18]  Hang on, hang on, hang on.
[00:47:19]  So, hang on.
[00:47:20]  So, I mean, most people wanted a police state.
[00:47:23]  It seems odd to target a particular ethnicity because most people were very happy to comply with lockdowns, and a significant portion of people were very happy to inform on their neighbors.
[00:47:32]  So, the sort of wanting tyranny and hoping that you'll be in charge of tyranny is kind of.
[00:47:37]  Okay, hang on, hang on, hang on.
[00:47:39]  So, you're going to have to use some self restraint and try not interrupt me when I'm in the middle of a thought.
[00:47:44]  Okay.
[00:47:44]  So, yeah, most people seemed to be quite keen on tyranny and they enjoyed informing on their neighbors.
[00:47:51]  And if you had three cars in your driveway, they'd call the cops.
[00:47:54]  And if you were out there walking, you'd call the cops.
[00:47:57]  I saw some video, I think it was in 2020.
[00:47:59]  It was a British guy bicycling through the neighborhood and he was going at high speed and he passed a woman on a remote country lane and she said, Not social distancing.
[00:48:07]  And he just laughed at her because it's like guys going by faster than any virus could ever travel.
[00:48:13]  Now, the people who did protest the election.
[00:48:19]  In 2020, they were hammered pretty hard.
[00:48:25]  Would you agree with that?
[00:48:26]  I mean, they were thrown into jail into pretty wretched conditions.
[00:48:30]  Sometimes they weren't allowed access to lawyers for what seemed like quite a long time, and the net was cast pretty wide.
[00:48:37]  And would you agree that the protests were hit pretty hard?
[00:48:41]  Yes, I will agree with that.

=== Investors Need Clear Answers (14:04) ===

[00:48:43]  However, there's still plenty that you could do in terms of actions.
[00:48:47]  But this is another area where I'll say so many people, they just.
[00:48:51]  It's more like people are cowardly.
[00:48:53]  Like, I'm pretty sure plenty of people, you would have more guides in general, especially.
[00:49:00]  Like, let's say, yeah, you still had mask Karens, don't get me wrong.
[00:49:06]  But plenty of people were against lockdowns in general.
[00:49:09]  Like, do you have people that do open up their businesses against lockdowns?
[00:49:14]  I mean, yes, like, are there a bunch, is there a bunch of like regulatory BS in that respect that would happen?
[00:49:20]  Yeah.
[00:49:20]  But, you know, like, hey, it's like, I still want to some of those businesses.
[00:49:24]  So it's, It's like laws are only as good as whether they're enforced or not.
[00:49:31]  No, no, I understand that.
[00:49:32]  I get that.
[00:49:33]  Okay, so you matter?
[00:49:35]  Do you have kids?
[00:49:36]  No, I'm 29 right now.
[00:49:39]  I don't have any kids and I don't plan on procreating until I have at least eight figures.
[00:49:45]  You mean like a million, say, wait, 10 million?
[00:49:50]  It's like really plannable.
[00:49:51]  No, no, I'm sorry.
[00:49:52]  I just don't.
[00:49:53]  I'm just trying to hang on, hang on, hang on.
[00:49:55]  I'm just trying to understand.
[00:49:57]  I'm not trying to interrupt you.
[00:49:58]  I just.
[00:49:59]  So when you say eight figures, right?
[00:50:01]  Six figures, 100,000, seven figures is a million.
[00:50:04]  Eight figures is you want at least $10 million before you have children?
[00:50:09]  I'm sorry.
[00:50:10]  You want tens of millions of dollars per year as income before you'll have children.
[00:50:14]  Yeah.
[00:50:16]  And how are you going to achieve that, do you think?
[00:50:19]  I mean.
[00:50:19]  I have my own crypto projects.
[00:50:22]  Okay.
[00:50:23]  And how close are you to your goal?
[00:50:26]  Not close at all.
[00:50:27]  I probably need an additional tens of thousands in infrastructure.
[00:50:32]  I need to hire a few cryptographers and at least a few developers.
[00:50:37]  It's not the easiest task that I've told myself to do.
[00:50:41]  Well, I wouldn't say that trying to get tens of millions of dollars.
[00:50:45]  Sorry, go ahead.
[00:50:46]  I have over 40 plus failed prototypes or whatnot.
[00:50:50]  Okay.
[00:50:50]  Yeah.
[00:50:51]  So, I mean, I would say that by definition, trying to make tens of millions of dollars per year is a difficult task.
[00:50:57]  I will absolutely agree with you on that.
[00:51:00]  And so, what's been your highest income in any given year?
[00:51:05]  Okay.
[00:51:06]  And how long have you been working on this project?
[00:51:09]  Past few years, I would say.
[00:51:10]  Honestly, it's been a bit on and off.
[00:51:12]  I had the idea in like 2022.
[00:51:15]  I mean, like, I've had other entrepreneurial ideas and ambitions.
[00:51:21]  It all comes down to, like, honestly, the tech.
[00:51:23]  It's, you know, I consider myself pretty creative.
[00:51:27]  But it's honestly just like having a team of people as well, like, having the funds to get it off the ground.
[00:51:34]  Well, have you put together a prospectus?
[00:51:36]  Have you put together A package that you could give to investors to get them to invest?
[00:51:44]  To some degree, I would say.
[00:51:46]  Not anything that's like, I wouldn't say a working minimum viable product, but I mean, like, could I have like a few different fronts?
[00:51:56]  I would say.
[00:51:57]  I'm not like a.
[00:51:58]  Okay, so listen, listen, if you want to be in the business world, you have to answer questions directly.
[00:52:04]  All right.
[00:52:04]  Right.
[00:52:05]  Because everybody knows when you're bullshitting.
[00:52:07]  Like, you know, when you see a politician who's just not answering the question.
[00:52:10]  Okay.
[00:52:11]  And listen, I'm trying to help you here, right?
[00:52:12]  I have, as you may or may not know, okay, I'm still talking.
[00:52:16]  So I have, as you may or may not know, some expertise and experience in raising money to start businesses.
[00:52:22]  Do you know that I have that expertise?
[00:52:25]  Not exactly.
[00:52:25]  I didn't know that you were an investor in that respect.
[00:52:28]  No, I didn't say I was an investor.
[00:52:30]  I said I have expertise in raising money to start businesses and, in particular, tech businesses.
[00:52:36]  Like I co founded a software company and got the initial round of investment with, obviously on my own, right?
[00:52:42]  But with others.
[00:52:43]  I have some experience I've presented to investors and raised funding for businesses and so on.
[00:52:50]  So, my point is that if you want, I can give you a couple of minutes worth of advice that would be quite invaluable to you for free to help you get your goal off the grant.
[00:53:01]  Well, no, it doesn't sound like you particularly want to.
[00:53:03]  I don't want to corner you.
[00:53:04]  If you want to do it yourself, that's totally fine.
[00:53:06]  I mean, don't get me wrong.
[00:53:07]  Like, I could definitely use all the help I need.
[00:53:10]  I mean, like, would the advice not be something I've previously heard or not?
[00:53:14]  I'm open to it.
[00:53:16]  Okay, what advice have you previously heard?
[00:53:20]  Well, what advice have I heard?
[00:53:24]  Besides making it more clear on my ideas, I haven't yet pitched it to you.
[00:53:30]  I'm not sure what that answer is.
[00:53:32]  Okay.
[00:53:32]  So I'll just put it out to the general public as a whole, and maybe you can find some value in it.
[00:53:39]  Let me ask you this How much money do you need to pursue your project?
[00:53:44]  Most conservative estimate, I would give it maybe $80,000.
[00:53:49]  Okay.
[00:53:50]  And do you have any track record that you can point towards that might reassure investors that if you give you $80,000, that You'll know what you're doing.
[00:54:03]  Like you'll be able to run a business or something like that.
[00:54:06]  Any track record?
[00:54:08]  I've had like previous projects and applications that I've gotten to a pretty good area just using a few different classmates on when I was in school.
[00:54:20]  But it wasn't like a full business.
[00:54:24]  Okay.
[00:54:25]  Now, $80,000 comes to you.
[00:54:28]  Let's say you get the money tomorrow.
[00:54:30]  How long does that fund your project for?
[00:54:34]  I could fund it for if I hire roughly a few engineers.
[00:54:40]  It could last, I'd say, in terms of infrastructure, that could last a few years.
[00:54:45]  But in terms of developers that are actively working on my team, a few months.
[00:54:51]  Okay, so $80,000 buys you a few months of engineers who I assume you need.
[00:54:57]  Now, can you build what you need with a couple of engineers in a couple of months?
[00:55:02]  Okay, that means it's easy to reproduce.
[00:55:05]  It should be, yes.
[00:55:06]  I mean, with the right mind.
[00:55:08]  So easy to reproduce is a problem.
[00:55:10]  Do you know why?
[00:55:12]  I mean, I wouldn't call it easy.
[00:55:14]  It's easy if it's a couple of engineers and a couple of months.
[00:55:19]  I mean, when I say a couple of engineers, I don't mean like, all right, is this a sort of landing page that could be done within a day?
[00:55:27]  I'm not sure what you're talking about.
[00:55:29]  What I'm saying is that, let's say you have three engineers and it takes you three months to produce something that you hope will get you an income of tens of millions of dollars a year.
[00:55:37]  Is that right?
[00:55:38]  Yeah, that's possible.
[00:55:39]  Okay.
[00:55:40]  So if you're talking about nine months worth of human labor, right, three engineers in three months, and it means that you don't need to train these engineers, they don't need to be super specialized, they don't need to be super brilliant.
[00:55:54]  They would be specialized.
[00:55:55]  Okay.
[00:55:56]  So they would be specialized, but not in your project.
[00:55:59]  So it means anyone could throw $80,000 at your idea and make tens of millions of dollars a year.
[00:56:06]  I mean, any investor could throw that at me, but like they would kind of need my mind in order to.
[00:56:12]  Like, see it through, though, I'd say.
[00:56:14]  Well, not necessarily, because once you build the prototype and you start advertising it, other people will try and take over your idea if it's going to be making tens of millions of dollars a year, right?
[00:56:24]  The thing is, there's also a huge degree of risk that I would say most other people aren't willing to take.
[00:56:30]  Okay, I feel like we're not even having a conversation here.
[00:56:33]  Hang on.
[00:56:34]  Hang on.
[00:56:36]  So, if someone can put together a business that makes tens of millions of dollars a year, By spending $80,000, then that's not a huge risk unless it only has a very tiny chance of succeeding.
[00:56:52]  I wouldn't consider it a huge risk.
[00:56:55]  Okay.
[00:56:55]  So, and I agree with you.
[00:56:57]  So, if you build a prototype, let's say it's ABC.com, right?
[00:57:02]  ABC.com, whatever, right?
[00:57:04]  You build your prototype or whatever it's going to be.
[00:57:06]  And then you have to start selling it.
[00:57:08]  So, you have to advertise it and so on, right?
[00:57:10]  Is that fair?
[00:57:12]  Honestly, yeah, I would say it could be on the market like within, like, say within like, like by the time I really got it to that stage.
[00:57:23]  Sorry, you said within, and then by the time I got it to that stage, I'm not sure within, I need a timeframe.
[00:57:28]  It was in like a few months, yeah.
[00:57:30]  Okay.
[00:57:31]  So you get your product out into the market in a few months, and then other people, when they see your product, they will say, holy crap, I could build something like that in a couple of months.
[00:57:43]  And it's going to make tens of millions of dollars a year.
[00:57:45]  I'm just telling you what investors will tell you.
[00:57:48]  Because investors are skeptical, obviously.
[00:57:50]  Number one, like it would take quite a while to raise that capital.
[00:57:54]  Number two, no, it wouldn't.
[00:57:55]  No, it wouldn't.
[00:57:58]  Because if Microsoft sees your product or IBM sees your product or whoever sees it, take that risk though.
[00:58:04]  Like it would be a huge liability for them as well.
[00:58:08]  I'm sorry, are you legitimately telling me that you know how Microsoft and IBM and other big corporations make their business decisions and that for them, spending $80,000 to create a business that's going to pay them tens of millions of dollars a year is an unacceptable risk to them?
[00:58:24]  I mean, the risk isn't just, all right, would I lose this money?
[00:58:27]  The risk would be, you know, it would be, say, at least.
[00:58:34]  Can I ask you something?
[00:58:35]  It may sound like a bit of a side quest.
[00:58:38]  Do you take any drugs?
[00:58:42]  Not recently.
[00:58:44]  How long did you take drugs for?
[00:58:47]  I've never been addicted to drugs.
[00:58:49]  That's not what I asked.
[00:58:50]  Actually, I have, but lithium.
[00:58:52]  Okay, so what drugs did you take and for how long?
[00:58:56]  Let's see.
[00:58:57]  What drugs did I take?
[00:59:00]  Every single drug I've ever taken.
[00:59:02]  So you've taken a lot.
[00:59:03]  Well, just roughly.
[00:59:04]  I mean, is it weed?
[00:59:05]  I've never taken anything super addictive.
[00:59:07]  Like, have I ever experimented and tried Suboxone once?
[00:59:15]  Like, a few years ago?
[00:59:16]  Have I ever.
[00:59:18]  In order to treat tremors after falling and hitting the lower back part of my skull, I was reading about some neuroprotective aspects of amphetamines that could upregulate dopamine receptors in order to treat tremors.
[00:59:31]  So I was like, all right, you know what?
[00:59:33]  I'll try that.
[00:59:34]  Okay.
[00:59:34]  I'm not talking prescribed or medicinal drugs.
[00:59:36]  I've tried DIHEXA, and that's an experimental brain growing peptide a few times.
[00:59:41]  Okay.
[00:59:41]  But you don't, you've not used marijuana or anything like that.
[00:59:46]  I only used marijuana when it was illegal.
[00:59:48]  And right now it's legal.
[00:59:50]  So that's like, A decade ago.
[00:59:53]  Okay.
[00:59:54]  Okay, well, listen, my advice to you, you are not in a state in terms of answering questions clearly to build much investor confidence.
[01:00:05]  And I'm not saying that, I mean, maybe your idea is great.
[01:00:08]  I don't have any way of knowing.
[01:00:09]  And I'm not going to ask you about the content of the idea, of course.
[01:00:12]  But what I would say is you should read some business books.
[01:00:16]  You know, you can get lots of business courses online, investment courses and MBA courses, and you can read stuff and you can even get AI to design you a course.
[01:00:27]  These days, pretty easily on how to get investors to take you seriously.
[01:00:32]  Because I'm just telling you right now, from my experience in business, and I've been an entrepreneur for like 30 years and I've grown two companies pretty successfully.
[01:00:41]  So you're not in a position at the moment to have the kind of clear answers that you need to have in order to get investment.
[01:00:49]  And if you have a great idea, you kind of owe it to that great idea to get money and to invest.
[01:00:57]  To get the investment.
[01:00:58]  Stefan, I'm more in the position where I would rather look for loan sharks and I can't snitch on myself.
[01:01:07]  Okay.
[01:01:08]  All right.
[01:01:08]  Well, listen, I appreciate your time.
[01:01:09]  I wish you the luck with your business.
[01:01:12]  And I certainly wouldn't recommend getting money from loan sharks.
[01:01:15]  Otherwise, he's going to be calling me next from the hospital.
[01:01:17]  All right.
[01:01:18]  A name.
[01:01:19]  What is on your mind, my friend?
[01:01:21]  How can I help?
[01:01:23]  Don't forget to unmute.
[01:01:25]  Hello, hello.
[01:01:27]  While we're waiting for him, so if you have an idea, and I've written one year business plans, three year business plans, five year business plans, and so on, you need to have cash flow.
[01:01:40]  You need to say, here's how I'm going to get a talent.
[01:01:43]  You need to have income expenditures.
[01:01:45]  You need to have a sense of a reasonable sense of when your investors can expect to get their money back and what sort of you have to have market competitive analysis.
[01:01:54]  Like you need to know your stuff.
[01:01:56]  If you're going to ask people to hand you $80,000, and it's actually a kind of funny coincidence because.
[01:02:04]  I actually was asking for a similar amount of money way back in the day when I was co founding my first business.
[01:02:11]  So I thought it was kind of interesting that he was looking for that kind of money.
[01:02:14]  I guess things have got cheaper in the meantime.
[01:02:17]  Zach, thank you for your patience, my friend.
[01:02:19]  If you would like to unmute, let's see how I can help you.
[01:02:25]  Hey, can you hear me?
[01:02:26]  Yeah, go ahead.
[01:02:28]  Okay, great.
[01:02:29]  I just wanted to compound on the first speaker and just sing the praises of the private call ins.
[01:02:37]  If anybody here.
[01:02:38]  Has anything big going on in their life, really just do it.
[01:02:44]  It's just been so beneficial.

=== Trauma and Human Frailty (13:08) ===

[01:02:47]  Thank you.
[01:02:47]  And the last call in that I did, I've been kind of working through this anger that I've had towards people in my life.
[01:02:59]  And I had a question on.
[01:03:03]  So I just had this thought today of I can point at something and say, you know, at the more obvious things like, Verbal abuse or physical abuse, and I can say that is a source where I can be angry at.
[01:03:18]  But I had this thought today of these abusive people in my life.
[01:03:22]  There's also things that they didn't say, and that I just had this thought today, and it's just sparked a lot more anger of the things that they didn't say.
[01:03:33]  You know, just for example, you know, the last call that we had, I was talking about an ex that I had.
[01:03:41]  Nobody in my life, none of my friends, my past friends, my family, none of them said anything or raised any concern about this person's values or this person's virtues or anything like that.
[01:03:52]  So that's kind of been sparking this to me.
[01:03:54]  So could you explain more about what people don't say in these types of relationships?
[01:04:02]  Am I making any sense here?
[01:04:04]  Yeah, I think so.
[01:04:05]  I think so.
[01:04:05]  This is sort of my famous story about how I was going to marry the wrong woman until a friend of mine's girlfriend just happened to make a passing comment that woke me up to the danger that I was facing.
[01:04:15]  And none of my friends or family said a damn thing about incompatibilities with the woman I'd proposed to.
[01:04:23]  Is that sort of what you mean?
[01:04:25]  Yes.
[01:04:26]  Okay.
[01:04:27]  Well, I was thinking today actually about trauma and there are some people who experience trauma.
[01:04:35]  Who recover.
[01:04:36]  And then, of course, there's a lot of people who experience trauma who don't recover.
[01:04:40]  And I think one of the differences is that let's sort of take an example of a woman.
[01:04:46]  We'll call her Sally.
[01:04:48]  And Sally is a very kind, perhaps over kind woman.
[01:04:52]  She takes care of her family, she takes care of her parents, she takes care of people in the neighborhood, and she just gives and gives and gives.
[01:05:01]  And then, unfortunately, she's in a car accident.
[01:05:05]  And she is disabled for a certain amount of time.
[01:05:09]  Now, I don't know if you've ever had people like this in your life.
[01:05:13]  I used to have someone in my life when I was younger.
[01:05:16]  And we'd have plans.
[01:05:19]  And if something would happen that would interfere with the plans, he would just get annoyed.
[01:05:28]  He would just get annoyed.
[01:05:30]  So, you know, if we were supposed to go somewhere and I happened to sleep funny or wake up with a big headache or something like that, and I'd say, you listen, man, I'm.
[01:05:38]  I'm sorry.
[01:05:38]  Like, I just, you know, I don't want to go to the beach right now because if you've got a big headache, the brightness of the beach and all of that is not fun.
[01:05:45]  I've never had migraines.
[01:05:46]  And I don't know, once every couple of months, I'll get a headache.
[01:05:49]  And he would just be annoyed.
[01:05:50]  It wouldn't be like, oh, man, I'm so sorry about your headache.
[01:05:52]  You know, like, let's obviously wait until you feel better.
[01:05:55]  And it would just be like, oh, come on, just pop some Advil, man.
[01:05:58]  Come on, just come, just do it.
[01:06:00]  And that sort of aggression is, and that lack of empathy.
[01:06:04]  And it's like, well, you're inconveniencing me.
[01:06:09]  With your natural human frailties and problems.
[01:06:12]  And so Sally is in a car crash and she's kind of disabled, and her kids, her husband, they're all annoyed.
[01:06:23]  When are you going to feel better?
[01:06:24]  Are you sure you can't do anything?
[01:06:26]  You know, and they just kind of stomp around.
[01:06:29]  And I think the real trauma doesn't come from the car crash and it doesn't come from being injured or disabled for a time.
[01:06:35]  The real trauma is when you can't provide resources.
[01:06:41]  Or Sally can't provide endless resources to those around her, and she realized that she's surrounded by selfish people.
[01:06:49]  And she has, you know, when we're kind to people as a whole, when we put extra resources into people, we listen to their problems, we give them advice, and sometimes it doesn't go on for a long time.
[01:07:00]  We like to think, or I think it happens in our mind, that we are depositing resources.
[01:07:06]  And sometimes in relationships, you deposit resources, and sometimes you need to withdraw resources.
[01:07:14]  And so Sally has been helping people and giving to people and being nice to people and all of that for years or maybe decades.
[01:07:24]  And then she needs people to give her resources to be helpful, to be thoughtful, to be gentle, to be caring, to be supportive.
[01:07:32]  And they do nothing.
[01:07:35]  In fact, they just appear to be irritated that she's not the friendly, cheery, smiley domestic robot that takes care of everyone.
[01:07:44]  Now, maybe Sally has kind of brought that behavior about by constantly.
[01:07:48]  giving, giving, giving, and not asking really for anything in return.
[01:07:53]  But if you've ever been in the situation where you need something back and there's nothing, it's kind of grim and it's kind of brutal.
[01:08:04]  And so I think a lot of trauma that happens, happens not because of the thing itself, but what it reveals about the people in your life.
[01:08:16]  So I've been pretty positive, pretty cheery.
[01:08:20]  I've had robust mental health for most of my adult life.
[01:08:25]  And then when I had my insomnia, People just got kind of annoyed.
[01:08:30]  Why are you so tired?
[01:08:31]  Just take some sleeping pills.
[01:08:32]  And I didn't take any sleeping pills.
[01:08:34]  I didn't want to take sleeping pills.
[01:08:35]  I didn't think that was the right approach.
[01:08:36]  And I sure as hell didn't want to become addicted.
[01:08:39]  And I don't remember a single person, and I had insomnia for like 18 months.
[01:08:45]  It was brutal.
[01:08:45]  And I don't remember a single person sitting me down and saying, Come on, man, what's really going on?
[01:08:50]  Like, this is unusual.
[01:08:52]  This is unlike you.
[01:08:53]  You're normally very positive and very peppy.
[01:08:55]  But instead, people were like, Oh, I didn't sleep again.
[01:08:58]  Oh, my God, just deal with it, you know?
[01:09:00]  And there was just this sort of irritation and impatience and frustration with me actually needing some resources back.
[01:09:10]  I mean, I'm a pretty helpful person, I'm pretty generous.
[01:09:14]  Person.
[01:09:15]  And I think for a lot of people, the tough stuff in life is not what happens to you that's negative.
[01:09:24]  The tough stuff in life is what happens to you that's negative and what that reveals about reciprocity in your relationship.
[01:09:33]  So, of course, when I was coming up, I was one of the, I was pretty much the earliest successful libertarian or freedom loving ANCAP podcaster and so on.
[01:09:43]  And I helped a lot of people get their careers started.
[01:09:45]  And I was happy to do that.
[01:09:46]  I'm, A very big one to have competition and more people in the space.
[01:09:49]  I think it just improves everything and everyone.
[01:09:53]  I mean, if I want to be the best tennis player, I want to be in a tournament with 500 people, not a tournament with three people.
[01:10:00]  So then, when I was deplatformed and everyone just kind of despawned and ran away, and now, of course, I've been reading.
[01:10:08]  Should I name names?
[01:10:10]  Probably not, at least for now.
[01:10:12]  But I've been reading about a lot of dysfunction in the dissident, non leftist.
[01:10:19]  A lot of dysfunction, a lot of under the table payments, a lot of drug use, a lot of sleeping around, a lot of betrayals, a lot of backstabbing, and so on.
[01:10:29]  And so it probably was not the end of the world that people didn't knit themselves to me with the foggy, shining bonds of reciprocity.
[01:10:42]  So when people don't say stuff, you know, people are happy to receive your charity, they're happy to receive your resources, they're happy to receive your help.
[01:10:49]  And in the relationships I have that are good and sustainable, I make deposits by helping people.
[01:10:56]  And then when I need help, I can draw upon those deposits and we exchange values and so on, right?
[01:11:03]  I mean, my wife obviously has stuck by me in very deep and powerful ways despite a life of, you know, not insignificant adversity at times.
[01:11:13]  And I'm immensely grateful and humbled by that love and devotion.
[01:11:18]  I mean, I know I've earned it, but I've earned a lot of things in my life.
[01:11:21]  People have been.
[01:11:22]  Pretty loath to pay their bills at times.
[01:11:25]  So, in terms of what people don't say, what is your life like?
[01:11:31]  It's a very interesting experiment, right?
[01:11:33]  What is your life like if you're not scampering around providing value to people?
[01:11:38]  What is your life like if you stop doing the Me Too stuff that I was talking about recently and you actually see what people bring to you?
[01:11:51]  It's the old question of are you loved?
[01:11:55]  If you're really down, are you loved?
[01:11:58]  If you're unwell, are you loved?
[01:12:00]  If you're feeling nervous, are you loved?
[01:12:02]  If you're tired, maybe a little grumpy, are you loved in those times where you're not providing resources to people?
[01:12:12]  And it's the old question of the wealthy guy if the wealthy guy isn't spending money on his friends, are they still his friends?
[01:12:19]  There's a great old song about this nobody wants you when you're down and out, or nobody loves you when you're down and out.
[01:12:25]  Eric Clapton did a really good version of that, I think, in his unplugged album.
[01:12:31]  When in your pocket there's not one penny, well then, as for friends, you don't have any.
[01:12:37]  Or that other song, Senator Connor covered it in her 20s and 30s jazz album.
[01:12:47]  Get out of here, says the woman to her man, and get me some money too.
[01:12:52]  You had plenty money in 1922, you let other women make a fool of you.
[01:12:56]  Why don't you do right like some other men do?
[01:12:59]  Get out of here and get me some money too.
[01:13:04]  Are you loved if you're not providing resources but are simply yourself?
[01:13:11]  And a lot of people are just pillaging.
[01:13:14]  They're just take, take, taking.
[01:13:16]  And there's an insecurity for a lot of people who are chronic givers, like our eponymous aforementioned Sally.
[01:13:23]  There are a lot of people who are kind of nervous that if they stop providing value, other people will just dump them.
[01:13:33]  And move on to someone else who's providing value.
[01:13:36]  You know, like if the girlfriend of Leonardo DiCaprio happens to pass a quarter century, she's not providing youthful beauty and value, and therefore he will dump her and move on to someone else.
[01:13:51]  If the woman isn't providing beauty, if she gains weight, if she gets stretch marks, if she gets saggy, as she ages, right?
[01:13:58]  And so what people don't say, I think, is often quite important.
[01:14:02]  Do they care about you?
[01:14:03]  Do they think about what's best for you?
[01:14:05]  Do they think about.
[01:14:06]  How to protect you?
[01:14:07]  Do they watch your back?
[01:14:09]  You can't go to war with someone who doesn't watch your sex, who doesn't watch your back.
[01:14:13]  It's very dangerous to go to war with people who aren't covering your back.
[01:14:18]  Because we have hunter eyes, right?
[01:14:20]  We don't have prey eyes, which are side to side.
[01:14:22]  We have hunter eyes, which are straight on.
[01:14:25]  And particularly men, we tend to, I say overfocus, we tend to significantly focus on things as a whole to the exclusion of all other things.
[01:14:37]  I remember once being so deep into writing a scene in a novel that I didn't realize a fire alarm had gone off.
[01:14:45]  I'm like, wait, wait, what is that sound?
[01:14:48]  And everybody was like streaming out and like, pack up your laptop, man, there's a fire alarm.
[01:14:54]  Didn't even notice.
[01:14:54]  So we can tend to overfocus and we need people to watch our back.
[01:14:57]  One of the reasons why male lust is so high is because we're supposed to have people to watch our back and punch us in the nads if we're chasing a crazy woman on a bed off a cliff.
[01:15:09]  So we're allowed to have huge amounts of lust, 17 times the testosterone, crazy amounts of lust.
[01:15:16]  We're allowed to go crazy with lust because we have relatives and friends to smack us into our senses.
[01:15:23]  And if you don't have those people to smack you into your senses, It's very easy to chase a crazy woman in a bed off a cliff and fall forever.
[01:15:35]  So, yeah, the people who don't talk to you, the people who don't watch your back, the people who don't care enough about you to bring you perspective, to bring you back to reason.
[01:15:46]  If you don't have those people in your life, then you have to be guarded against your emotions in life as a whole, which means you don't get to live very richly or deeply or love very strongly.

=== Freedom Breeds Inequality (15:09) ===

[01:15:56]  Does that make sense?
[01:15:57]  And I'm hoping that's got something to do with what you were talking about.
[01:16:03]  I think we did.
[01:16:04]  All right, let's try a name.
[01:16:06]  If you would like to return and unmute.
[01:16:09]  Hey, yes, can you hear me?
[01:16:10]  Yes, sir, go ahead.
[01:16:12]  Hey, I got a softball for you today.
[01:16:14]  Pleasure to speak with you again.
[01:16:17]  I wanted to ask you about a couple of things that I've heard you say in the past.
[01:16:21]  They're arguments that I agree with.
[01:16:23]  And I'm just wondering if you could talk on it.
[01:16:25]  So the first thing that I've heard you say in the past was that freedom breeds inequality.
[01:16:33]  And I agree with that.
[01:16:35]  I think the more free we are, the more different decisions we make, the more some people are going to succeed and some are going to fail.
[01:16:43]  And then I've also heard you say in the past that, you know, whatever the problem is, the answer is more freedom, right?
[01:16:51]  And I think that's fine too.
[01:16:53]  I think we need that, whatever the problem is.
[01:16:55]  I do think that we need more freedom in that respect.
[01:16:59]  Now, one of the common questions that I've heard and a lot of the Democrats left are kind of railing about is how do we solve the problem?
[01:17:08]  Of income inequality.
[01:17:10]  And I'm thinking that that question is kind of circular, I guess, in this regard, because if the answer to the problem of income inequality is more freedom, then the answer to solving income inequality is to breed more inequality, because freedom breeds inequality.
[01:17:30]  So it's kind of circular.
[01:17:32]  And I wanted to ask you if this thought is so much to say that income inequality is not actually a problem.
[01:17:41]  It is not actually a problem.
[01:17:43]  It is not something to be fixed or addressed because that's what freedom breeds.
[01:17:49]  And I was wondering your thoughts on that.
[01:17:52]  Well, the left will always talk about income inequality, but they never talk about inequality of political power.
[01:17:59]  So, for instance, central banking is the ultimate example of income inequality.
[01:18:05]  Central bankers, licensed and protected and given monopoly by the state, can type whatever the hell they want into their own bank account, which no rich person can do.
[01:18:14]  Elon Musk cannot type whatever he wants into his own bank account.
[01:18:17]  He cannot create money out of thin air.
[01:18:19]  And if he were to try, he would go to jail for counterfeiting.
[01:18:24]  So if people really care about income inequality, then they should want to get rid of central banking.
[01:18:30]  Now, do the Democrats ever talk about getting rid of government-controlled monopoly currency cartels?
[01:18:38]  No, of course not, because they want that money printing so they can buy votes.
[01:18:42]  They want that money printing so the government can pretend to be providing value in the same way that if a guy's printing $5 bills in his basement, he can pretend to be contributing to paying off the cost of a pizza that everyone's ordered.
[01:18:57]  So, they don't care about income inequality.
[01:19:01]  If they genuinely cared about inequality, they would look at the biggest inequality there is because all differences of income are mere differences of degree.
[01:19:11]  A poor person has $1,000 or $100, a rich person has $1 million or a billion dollars.
[01:19:17]  It's just a difference of degree.
[01:19:19]  But political inequality is a difference in kind and it's a moral opposite.
[01:19:25]  Some people claim to have the moral right to initiate force.
[01:19:30]  And fraud and counterfeiting in order to have political power.
[01:19:36]  They can initiate the use of force.
[01:19:38]  Now, Phil Spector was a guy who was charged with murder and so on.
[01:19:43]  And even wealthy people, if they commit crimes, can be charged with murder and so on, right?
[01:19:50]  And so we're all subject to the law.
[01:19:55]  I mean, to varying degrees, and you are able to hire a better lawyer if you're wealthy and so on, but you're still subject to the law in general.
[01:20:03]  Assuming you're not politically connected or on the left, in which case you're not subject to the law really at all, because the media doesn't whip the crowd into a frenzy to demand that you be prosecuted.
[01:20:14]  And so, if people really cared about inequality, they would care about differences in kind, particularly moral, rather than differences in degree.
[01:20:25]  In other words, they would care about murder more than they would care about people being taller or shorter or having clearer skin or less clear skin or Nicer hair or less nice hair or blue eyes or non blue eyes or whatever people might find attractive.
[01:20:39]  Because those are all just differences in degrees of attractiveness.
[01:20:43]  Being murdered, though, is a difference in kind with a moral element.
[01:20:47]  So being wealthier is not immoral, assuming that you have not used force or fraud to get your wealth.
[01:20:53]  It's just a difference of degree.
[01:20:55]  The man who honestly earns 20 bucks an hour is just a difference in degree to the man who earns $1,000 an hour, some lawyer, $1,500 an hour, whatever it is, right?
[01:21:04]  Assuming that they're both honorable people, it's just a difference of degree.
[01:21:08]  But the person who's been murdered and the murderer, that's a difference in kind that's moral, that you've been murdered or a rape victim or something like that.
[01:21:18]  And so differences in degree are not nearly as important as differences in kind with moral elements.
[01:21:26]  In other words, having more or less money is just dialing up and down the money in the bank account, assuming you've earned it.
[01:21:34]  Whereas being murdered is a black and white, absolute moral opposite.
[01:21:42]  And so if people cared about quote inequality, they would care about those with the legal right to print money in particular, to counterfeit and to plunder, particularly the poor, because money printing by the government is the most regressive tax imaginable because the first people to get a hold of all of that printed money get it at full value.
[01:22:02]  And then by the time it gets to the poorest among us and those on fixed income, it's lost 50, 60% of its value.
[01:22:09]  And so the rich get the money at full value and the poor get the money at half value or less over time.
[01:22:15]  And those who save get their savings pillaged, and so on.
[01:22:18]  So, if people really cared about inequality, they would look for political power, which has a moral dimension and is an absolute opposite that some people have the legal right to print money, and other people who create money out of thin air go to jail.
[01:22:35]  That's the real inequality.
[01:22:37]  But the left doesn't care about that, and even the right seems sometimes to focus on it or sometimes not.
[01:22:43]  But that's where I think the real inequality is in political power.
[01:22:48]  With the moral dimension, not on just more or less money.
[01:22:51]  Thank you.
[01:22:52]  That is a brilliant answer.
[01:22:55]  Something that you said earlier, and I'm going to mute myself because I'm going to have to step away, but I just want to hear you speak on this, please.
[01:23:03]  When you say Elon Musk, and I want to include Jeff Bezos, they can't create money out of thin air.
[01:23:12]  I was wondering if you could speak to the morality of Jeff Bezos, say, running Amazon.
[01:23:20]  And receiving government subsidies in the billions.
[01:23:27]  And the reason I ask is because a company like Amazon is doing pretty well for itself and it's receiving essentially billions out of thin air from an entity that is trillions in debt.
[01:23:41]  And I'm just wondering the morality of that exchange.
[01:23:43]  And so I'm going to mute, but thank you.
[01:23:45]  I just want to hear.
[01:23:46]  Well, hang on.
[01:23:47]  Just before you mute, if you can indulge me for a second.
[01:23:49]  So if you had to guess, would you guess that Amazon?
[01:23:54]  Has paid more in taxes or has received more in subsidies?
[01:24:02]  I'm not sure, to be completely honest.
[01:24:05]  The key talking point that I usually hear is when you look at their financial records, you don't find that they pay any taxes.
[01:24:11]  No, no, that's false.
[01:24:13]  I mean, that's no, no, yeah.
[01:24:15]  So they're talking about, yeah, of course.
[01:24:16]  I mean, so sorry, go ahead.
[01:24:18]  I agree, but I agree.
[01:24:19]  But the thing that I would like to add on when I was thinking about this and to answer your question is, Let's say that Amazon hires an employee for $100,000, right?
[01:24:30]  Or $50,000.
[01:24:32]  Each time that that employee gets paid, taxes come out of that.
[01:24:38]  But I felt like that was to the individual.
[01:24:40]  So I guess I don't feel that Amazon is paying those taxes.
[01:24:43]  So maybe you can enlighten me on who is actually paying the taxes in that exchange.
[01:24:48]  Sure, sure.
[01:24:49]  Okay.
[01:24:49]  So Amazon pays taxes, pays payroll taxes, pays social security taxes.
[01:24:54]  Just in America, it pays.
[01:24:56]  Taxes, sales taxes, it pays property taxes on all of its giant warehouses, just to name a few.
[01:25:05]  And it pays, of course, an army of accountants, which it needs because of the complicated nature of the tax system as a whole.
[01:25:13]  Does that sort of make sense?
[01:25:15]  Yes, but when Amazon pays sales taxes for inventory, don't those sales taxes get passed on to the end consumer at the end?
[01:25:24]  Because we pay tax too, right?
[01:25:25]  So it kind of washes.
[01:25:27]  Okay, so this is from Grok.
[01:25:31]  Amazon has paid far more in taxes overall than it has received in government subsidies.
[01:25:39]  So I'm just seeing if there's any summarized with net numbers.
[01:25:46]  Let me just see here.
[01:25:47]  I mean, I think that would be shocked if that wasn't the case.
[01:25:51]  Summarized with net numbers.
[01:25:54]  Okay, subsidies received 11.6 to 12. Billion dollars.
[01:26:00]  Taxes borne in one year, $28.4 billion.
[01:26:05]  Taxes borne paid directly by Amazon, corporate income taxes, employer payroll, property, etc., $28.4 billion in 2024, $25.19 billion in 2023.
[01:26:16]  Taxes collected and remitted, mainly sales taxes on behalf of customers or sellers, plus employee withholding, $80.53 billion.
[01:26:25]  So total tax contribution borne and collected, $2024, $108.93 billion.
[01:26:32]  And since 2000, they've received $11.6 to $12 billion, right?
[01:26:39]  So they're doing 10% of their entire subsidy.
[01:26:45]  Sorry, let me sort of rephrase that.
[01:26:48]  They have received back in subsidies over 26 years 10% of their current tax burden per year.
[01:26:56]  So is that a good deal for them?
[01:27:00]  You see, zero, yes.
[01:27:02]  Yeah, so if you were to say to Jeff Bezos, if you were to say, listen, you don't have to pay any taxes anymore.
[01:27:12]  You don't have to collect taxes on behalf of the government.
[01:27:14]  You don't have to pay payroll taxes, property taxes, social security taxes.
[01:27:19]  You don't have to provide government enforced health care for workers and so on.
[01:27:24]  You don't have to pay any taxes or any regulatory fees.
[01:27:28]  And in return, you won't get a single penny of government subsidy going forward.
[01:27:33]  What do you think he would say?
[01:27:35]  If they didn't have to pay any of that, I think that they would take the no taxes.
[01:27:38]  You think?
[01:27:40]  On what basis would they not do that?
[01:27:43]  Well, that was the thing that I was trying to figure out, I guess.
[01:27:47]  So, say, like a payroll tax, right?
[01:27:51]  Is Amazon paying that?
[01:27:54]  I guess is my question.
[01:27:55]  Because if I go and file my taxes, which I think it's deadline day, hope everybody's filed, if I underpay, Amazon doesn't recoup me.
[01:28:05]  I'm responsible for that.
[01:28:06]  So that's kind of an individual burden as opposed to Amazon itself.
[01:28:09]  Is that not right?
[01:28:11]  I'm not sure what you mean.
[01:28:12]  Sorry.
[01:28:13]  So when I get my paycheck, I have a lot of taxes taken out.
[01:28:18]  And so that impacts my bottom line of what I get working for the company.
[01:28:24]  And so that's money taken from me by the government and impacts my gross pay.
[01:28:30]  I'm sorry, my net pay.
[01:28:32]  Oh, yeah.
[01:28:33]  So I understand what you mean.
[01:28:34]  Sorry, deductions at source is not Amazon paying the tax.
[01:28:36]  Okay, I get that.
[01:28:38]  But I'm sure that you know that when it comes to your taxes, that Amazon has to pay.
[01:28:46]  And I think it's something like this.
[01:28:48]  So I'm sorry if I'm getting this wrong.
[01:28:50]  I'm not an expert in this.
[01:28:51]  But I think that corporations have to pay an additional tax.
[01:28:56]  Towards your retirement benefit over and above what you're paying.
[01:29:00]  Oh, I didn't know that.
[01:29:02]  Well, you know what?
[01:29:03]  Let me not speak out of my armpit.
[01:29:07]  It's been a while since I've had to run these kinds of numbers.
[01:29:13]  So let me just double check on that.
[01:29:16]  If I, since obviously I want to be accurate.
[01:29:19]  And again, this is going to be grok.
[01:29:21]  So I say in the US, US.
[01:29:24]  Let's capitalize that.
[01:29:25]  So it's not in the US.
[01:29:26]  In the U.S., do employers pay extra taxes for Social Security?
[01:29:37]  I think they do, but again, let's check.
[01:29:42]  Yes, in the United States, employers pay an additional matching portion of Social Security taxes on top of what is withheld from the employee's paychecks.
[01:29:51]  Social Security tax rate is 6.2% paid by the employee, withheld from their wages, and 6.2% paid by the employer.
[01:29:58]  Total combined rate, of course, is 12%.
[01:30:00]  0.4%.
[01:30:04]  So they do pay.
[01:30:05]  Yeah.
[01:30:06]  Yes.
[01:30:07]  Taxes do American employers pay?
[01:30:13]  It's nice to know when I have these very vague memories of things that they actually turn out to be correct.
[01:30:18]  I'm like, come on, AI, tell me that I've got a memory.
[01:30:20]  That would be nice.
[01:30:23]  Okay, so the main taxes American employees, employers, sorry, pay in the US.
[01:30:30]  Payroll and employment taxes, the biggest ongoing cost.
[01:30:33]  These are the core extra taxes employers pay on top of employee wages.
[01:30:37]  Medicare, Part of FICA, who pays?
[01:30:39]  The employer only, matching 1.45%, no limit on all wages.
[01:30:45]  Federal unemployment, or FUDA, employer only, 0.6%, first $7,000 per employee per year.
[01:30:52]  Our state unemployment varies by state, 0.5 to 5%, and so on.
[01:30:58]  And of course, they withhold federal income taxes and so on, and state income taxes.

=== Deferred Taxes on Amazon Losses (07:41) ===

[01:31:05]  Our business level taxes, not tied directly to payroll, are paid by the company itself, not per employee.
[01:31:12]  Federal corporate income tax, 21% on taxable profits for C corporations.
[01:31:18]  State corporate income taxes, 0%, states like New Hampshire, with no corporate tax.
[01:31:23]  I think, sorry, no income tax.
[01:31:24]  States with no corporate tax to 8 to 11 percent in high tax states like New Jersey, California, and so on.
[01:31:29]  Property taxes on business real estate equipment, etc.
[01:31:32]  Sales and use taxes if the business collects and remits them.
[01:31:36]  Excise taxes on specific goods or industries.
[01:31:40]  So here's an example one employee earning $100,000 in a typical state.
[01:31:44]  Employer's extra payroll taxes $7,650 plus $42 plus $500 to $2,000.
[01:31:52]  Total extra cost to employer after $9,000 to $12,000 per $100,000 before benefits, insurance, Etc.
[01:31:59]  So that is something else.
[01:32:03]  Okay.
[01:32:03]  How much do employers, do U.S. employers, do U.S. employers pay for health care for their employees?
[01:32:18]  And it's a lot.
[01:32:20]  This comes out of the Second World War, of course, which I've talked about before.
[01:32:24]  So, average premiums and employer share 2025.
[01:32:29]  Single individual coverage, total annual premium, $9,325.
[01:32:34]  Worker contributes $1,440, about 16%.
[01:32:38]  The employer pays $7,885.
[01:32:40]  So, that's a lot.
[01:32:44]  Family coverage, total annual premium, $26,993, which is insane, by the way, but that's a topic for another time.
[01:32:51]  Worker contributes $6,800.
[01:32:53]  Employer pays $20,100.
[01:32:57]  $43.
[01:32:59]  So that's, I mean, is that a tax?
[01:33:02]  Well, kind of, because the government is creating such powerful monopolies in healthcare that the costs are just nuts and through the roof.
[01:33:08]  So, yeah, employees have to pay a lot.
[01:33:11]  Does that help at all?
[01:33:13]  It does, yeah.
[01:33:15]  And I'm thinking across the board, you know, it wouldn't be just Amazon that's subject to paying those taxes.
[01:33:22]  It could be small mom and pop, it could be small business, things like that.
[01:33:27]  I know at the end of the day, Those small businesses might not have the leverage to, quote unquote, pay zero federal income taxes on their tax return.
[01:33:39]  But I guess you could still make the argument that Amazon, as large as it is, is still providing multitudes in value because it's so much larger.
[01:33:48]  And so, is there any moral question, even though they still pay those taxes and everybody pays those taxes, that a company that large, a company that profitable, should?
[01:34:01]  Morally receive those subsidies?
[01:34:03]  Because it kind of is, again, it kind of is taking money and receiving it out of thin air if they're getting it from the government.
[01:34:09]  They got to fight for those subsidies.
[01:34:11]  I understand there's a little bit of work to be done there, but is there any moral concerns of a company like Amazon receiving those subsidies outside of the argument that, oh, yeah, well, they pay more in taxes, anyways?
[01:34:26]  Well, let's say that, let's take a sort of an extreme example.
[01:34:30]  So let's say that there's a mafia in your local community and you run a store and the mafia shakes you down for five grand a month.
[01:34:40]  And then let's say that the mafia is holding a barbecue.
[01:34:46]  Is it immoral to stop by and pick up a burger?
[01:34:49]  No.
[01:34:51]  Why not?
[01:34:52]  They're having a barbecue.
[01:34:55]  You're probably invited.
[01:34:56]  You pay them for protection.
[01:34:58]  They offer you service.
[01:34:58]  And so if they're having a barbecue, I'm like, go get a burger.
[01:35:03]  Right.
[01:35:03]  So that's the general argument or idea.
[01:35:08]  Okay.
[01:35:11]  So I asked how does Amazon pay zero in federal taxes?
[01:35:15]  So there were just a few specific years, 2017 to 2018, when its current federal corporate income tax was zero.
[01:35:23]  In the recent years, Amazon has paid billions in federal income taxes.
[01:35:27]  So 2025, current U.S. federal income taxes were $1.2 billion, down sharply from the prior year due to new tax rules.
[01:35:36]  So, 2024, current U.S. federal budget, sorry, federal taxes were $9 billion.
[01:35:43]  2023, total provision was $7.12 billion.
[01:35:48]  And Amazon's global effective tax rate has typically been in the 13 to 24% range in recent years, not zero.
[01:35:56]  Now, why was it sometimes very low or zero?
[01:36:00]  Well, so Amazon spends heavily on warehouses, data centers, service delivery infrastructure, and AI and cloud equipment.
[01:36:06]  The tax code allows immediate or accelerated expensing.
[01:36:09]  100% bonus depreciation in certain years.
[01:36:12]  So that's large deductions.
[01:36:14]  Now deferring taxes to future years.
[01:36:17]  Heavy 2025 AI cloud investments amplified this effect, dropping the 2025 US tax bill considerably.
[01:36:24]  Amazon pays many employees with restricted stock units.
[01:36:27]  When the stock vests, the company gets a tax deduction for the market value at vesting.
[01:36:32]  And that's a big deal.
[01:36:34]  I've done these kinds of defenses when I was in the business world.
[01:36:38]  I would create and submit the research and development tax credits.
[01:36:42]  So, Amazon qualifies for substantial federal RD credits.
[01:36:47]  These directly reduce tax liability.
[01:36:49]  Amazon had years of losses or low profits in its growth phase.
[01:36:53]  These losses could be carried forward to offset future taxable income.
[01:36:57]  I'm sure you know about that from investments and so on.
[01:37:00]  And so, I won't, you know, the statutory rate is 21%, but there are ways in which, according to the law, it's able to reduce it.
[01:37:09]  It doesn't mean it pays no taxes, it means the taxes are deferred or it's doing.
[01:37:13]  Economically valuable RD.
[01:37:15]  I mean, I remember getting audited in the business world by the government for the submission of the tax credit.
[01:37:24]  And I had to prove that it was real RD and not just general development.
[01:37:29]  And I remember having quite a contentious and exciting meeting for an entire day, day and a half, or something like that, where I had to vigorously defend the tax credits research.
[01:37:44]  Papers that I had submitted to the government.
[01:37:47]  And it was, yeah, it was quite exciting.
[01:37:50]  So it's not that they don't pay any taxes.
[01:37:54]  It's quite a different matter.
[01:37:56]  And it's sort of like if you lose a million dollars in your stock trading and you can carry those losses forward and then you make $500,000, then you don't pay any tax on that.
[01:38:04]  Say, oh my God, he didn't pay any taxes.
[01:38:06]  It's like, well, yeah, because he lost a million dollars.
[01:38:08]  So that's the way the tax system is.
[01:38:10]  And we can sort of make the case for or against that.
[01:38:12]  But it's not that, I mean, the Amazon doesn't pay any taxes.
[01:38:15]  I'm not, of course, accusing it.
[01:38:16]  It's just a leftist talking point.
[01:38:18]  Just designed to whip up hatred and hostility towards the wealthy, right?
[01:38:22]  Like, I mean, to say, oh, we're going to tax the rich.
[01:38:24]  It's like, you know, that the rich pay almost all the taxes already, right?
[01:38:28]  So, this tax the rich stuff is just low rent class baiting.
[01:38:32]  Again, I'm not putting you in that category, but just as a whole, this idea that Amazon doesn't pay any taxes is just to make people feel resentful and hostile and justify further pillaging, I assume.
[01:38:43]  Yeah, I agree with that.

=== Taxing the Rich is Bait (00:54) ===

[01:38:47]  And yeah, this conversation has been incredibly helpful.
[01:38:49]  So, thank you for squaring that away.
[01:38:51]  I appreciate your time and I'll let you move on.
[01:38:53]  Thank you so much.
[01:38:55]  My pleasure.
[01:38:56]  Thank you very much.
[01:38:57]  And I think, yeah, we've had a good old hour 45.
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