Freedomain Radio - Stefan Molyneux - Granny was a DRUG DEALER! CALL IN SHOW

April 3, 2026 - Freedomain Radio - Stefan Molyneux

02:21:43

Granny was a DRUG DEALER! CALL IN SHOW

Stefan Molyneux hosts a call-in show where a successful business owner details his trauma, including his grandmother's drug dealing and her introduction of violent criminals into their home. Despite threats of death and sexual abuse, the caller admits to self-sabotage and fear of abandonment rather than anger toward his mother. Molyneux challenges this silence, arguing that unresolved maternal betrayal prevents healthy relationships, urging the guest to confront his family to finally resolve his "failure to launch." [Automatically generated summary]
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Transcriber: CohereLabs/cohere-transcribe-03-2026, sat-12l-sm, and large-v3-turbo

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First Listener Message 00:03:00
	All right.
	Do you want to start off by reading your message?
	Do you want to jawbone it?
	What's your pleasure?
	I don't remember the message that I'd wrote to you.
	Do you want me to read it?
	Sure.
	Okay.
	Have you listened to call in shows before?
	No.
	What issues would you like to talk about?
	Increasing buildup of hate towards society, self hate based upon my access to all the right tools and opportunities, but the self sabotage is out of control.
	I am, I guess, in my 40s and a successful business owner of decades with two divorces and four children.
	I show up for everyone but myself, and my mind keeps going a direction of self termination or making the front page.
	I consume eight hours a day during the week of audiobooks and podcast videos, etc.
	I have the intention, but consistently fail to launch unless it's fathers.
	Does that seem familiar?
	I have the right person, right?
	That is correct.
	All right.
	All right.
	Well, tell me how you found me without having listened to call in shows before.
	Well, I listened to you a long time ago.
	I guess your first days of the internet, as you would say.
	And I've just been hit and miss with different media, and I kind of get busy and find something interesting and go that path and go that route and kind of run its course and start something and not complete it, find something else, run for a couple miles, then get something flashy, going off in another direction kind of thing.
	But somehow it just hasn't crossed my mind.
	My radar in a while and it did recently.
	And I was like, Yeah, I haven't been involved in anything you've done in a while.
	It seems crazy to me that I haven't.
	How did that pop back in your head?
	Was it a dream?
	Was I clothed?
	Just kidding.
	Sorry, go ahead.
	Right.
	No, it was on Rumble actually.
	And I typically just look at stuff that I type in and was interested in and kind of listen to that.
	And as a suggestion, your name popped up.
	I think it was someone had been speaking about you, and I was like, Oh, yeah, your name just rung a bell again and went to the locals platform and just quickly, yeah, yeah, absolutely love your content and decided to subscribe right away, like not think about it, just let's do this.
	And signed in, got on, and I was like, Well, no, I don't want any rest of this other stuff that's on here.
	I just want to make sure that you were getting every dollar.
	So I was like, Well, the freedom, freedom, main.
	And kind of canceled the subscription, went to your specific platform, just your content on it.
	And just a side note here through the emails and the subscription and cancellation of the first one, et cetera, your support team is amazing.
Family History Revealed 00:15:15
	Quick prompt responses.
	Like, I can't say enough nice things about it.
	So, kudos to you and your team.
	That was great.
	I appreciate that.
	Ironically, that's partly what you're donating for.
	So, thank you.
	Yeah, no, it's just a hit and miss out in the real world, right?
	And usually wait for responses and they come quick.
	I really appreciate it.
	Well, I tried to hire everyone who had the thickest possible accent, but they were just unavailable because they've all been hired elsewhere.
	But I'm glad that worked out.
	Thank you.
	Yes.
	Yeah, I'm really good with people asking questions.
	I seem to go off on tangents or I don't know where to start.
	Childhood.
	Tell me about your childhood.
	Okay.
	Well, I've come from a single mom.
	I never met my dad until I was 13, but up to that point, I would say that I was raised with a bunch of single moms that had men coming and going.
	All the women have chased the men away in the family or could be stepdads, et cetera.
	My grandma was kind of a protester of sorts, politically active and whatnot.
	Always a really hard worker.
	She always had three or four jobs.
	So I kind of was babysat and with family, et cetera, for a lot of my childhood.
	I would see my mom, of course, and I have fond memories, but pretty absent.
	Um, moved around quite a bit.
	I was up late having some wine with my mom a number of years ago, and we were kind of counting all the places we've lived, and I think we hit up around 50 or so.
	And, um, kind of had a chuckle about that.
	I was a go getter.
	Uh, my mom was kind of like a black sheep, whereas I would be as well.
	Uh, the other, all my other cousins and stuff in the family are, uh, Metis.
	I'm one of a few of the white kids in the family, I guess.
	So I was always.
	Sorry, what do you mean by that?
	Like all my aunts were interested in natives, indigenous population, and decided to breed with them.
	My mom, my dad is white, Scottish.
	So I was.
	The running thing is you're just a white boy.
	My grandma would always seem to favor the Metis kids over me.
	It was more interesting, or it was the topic of the day, whatever.
	And the fact that I was my mom's child, I was treated the same as my mom.
	So within that, I always felt like I had to prove something.
	I'm sorry, your grandparents were Metis or?
	No, white.
	Yeah, yeah, so they were white.
	So it was just a generation like your mothers who preferred the indigenous population for.
	Dating and mating, and so your siblings are like half Metis, is that right?
	Yeah, step siblings and so on.
	Okay, got it.
	Yeah, so my mom was always very proud.
	She was told to give me up and all the things that she fought pretty hard to have me.
	She had me when she was a pretty young teen, fought to have me and kind of her prized possession.
	And I was raised to be pretty proud, overachiever.
	She wouldn't accept low marks.
	Had to always card.
	I was kind of raised old school with manners and such.
	These and thank yous and the old be seen and not heard was what the grandparents would say.
	Not that there was a grandfather, it was just all women that I was around.
	And sorry, were there any male authority figures at all?
	No, there were boyfriends and stuff that were in the picture here and there.
	They were undesirable male figures in my life.
	There was a couple growing up that I liked, but they had to go away.
	And there were quite a few that I didn't like that were either criminals or violent or just non desirable of that nature.
	And how were you disciplined as a child?
	My mom was never about hitting, she never liked that.
	So if I acted out, I was.
	I was taken out of the situation.
	You know, I go to your room, you'd be crying and whatever else, and try to come back out of your room.
	My mom would be like, No, no, back in your room.
	And until you can tell me what you did wrong, then we can have a conversation about it, you know, after I've calmed down and whatever.
	And that was her approach for the most part.
	Some of the people that looked after me, some of them were violent, either verbally aggressive towards me or physically violent.
	She was never around to kind of witness that.
	Sorry, what did you experience in what way?
	One of them was an ex con.
	He was Metis, or I guess he's native.
	I shouldn't say Metis native.
	And really, really violent as far as throw me up a flight of stairs, kind of break furniture.
	If you breathed the wrong way, if you acted out of sorts, he would let you know that you were, either verbally or he would be over top of you and.
	I remember we used to play Nintendo.
	I was excited.
	I got the NES one and we're playing Super Mario, and he could never jump at the right time.
	And I remember I chuckled once because I was having fun.
	And he stood up with that controller and he just, how can I say, in the palm of his hand, he sent it through the coffee table.
	And they're like, there's not a word in the house because you don't know if you're getting it.
	Just freak out all of a sudden like that.
	I remember him, he'd hold a knife up to my mom.
	I was sent away one summer while he was out doing robberies and some stabbings and stuff, just so my mom could get a handle on it and grab the boys and kind of find this guy and deal with him.
	Okay, sorry.
	I'm a little confused here.
	What was this guy doing in your household?
	He's the type of individual that would hunt you down.
	No, no.
	What was he doing in your household in the first place?
	My mom had begun dating him.
	Your mother dated a violent criminal and put him in charge of the children or you?
	It was just me at that time.
	I'm sorry, how old were you at this age?
	I think I was like nine or 10.
	So your mother dated a violent criminal and put him in charge of you from time to time.
	Yeah, when my grandma wasn't available to babysit me.
	I don't care who's available.
	I'm just trying to understand the facts here.
	This is shocking.
	Do you get that?
	Do you understand what this is like to hear from the outside?
	Not really, no, actually.
	It's just what it was.
	No, it's not what it was.
	Gravity is what it was.
	These are choices.
	Your mother chose to date a dangerous, violent, stabby, thieving, fucking criminal.
	Bring him into the house with the child and then put him in charge of the child.
	Quick question.
	You have four kids.
	Have you ever done that with any of your kids?
	No, sir.
	So I'm just going to have to denormalize this for you.
	This is messed up almost beyond words.
	Yeah, yeah.
	I can see how people could have their feelings about it for sure.
	If one of your children were to call you up and say, hey, Mom got a violent criminal to babysit us and erect the house.
	What would you say to your child?
	I'll be right over.
	What else?
	What would you think about what your ex wife had done?
	It'd be infuriating, I guess.
	Yeah, for sure.
	I definitely wouldn't allow it to continue.
	Would you consider it wrong for one of your ex wives to bring a violent criminal around your children?
	Correct.
	Okay, good.
	I just wanted to make sure I wasn't losing my mind there completely.
	All right.
	So that's what I mean by denormalizing it.
	Would you allow for the violent criminal to be around your children from that point onwards?
	No, of course not.
	All right.
	So why are your children worthy of this kind of consideration and protection, but you as a child were not?
	I'm not sure.
	I don't.
	I remember it.
	I was just trying to survive, and her happened to work three jobs, and she was trying to support my cousins and her sisters.
	So, I mean, she was kind of like the bank of her siblings, I suppose.
	At one point, she wanted him gone immediately, of course, but like a parasite, you couldn't get rid of this guy, you had to match his level of violence.
	I remember that she had to wake me up in the middle of the night and we'd have to sleep in the car or find a hotel room because he was on a rampage and we had moved and he'd find her and we're running again.
	And I got to a point where it seemed somewhat expected or it was normalized that this is what's happening and this is how we can be safe.
	Don't leave the school till I pick you up, or, you know, things like that, that nature.
	She didn't willingly want to be in that situation.
	It happened.
	I'm sorry, what?
	Hang on, hang on.
	How?
	So, you were, your mother was in her mid 20s when she was dating this guy?
	Late 20s?
	Yeah, I guess.
	Yeah.
	Okay.
	So, what do you mean she didn't want to be in the situation?
	She opened her legs in her bed for him, to be frank.
	Hmm.
	Yeah, leading up to him being there, one of the guys that I really liked had to leave because he wouldn't leave the motorcycle gang that he was a part of.
	So my mom's like, I can't raise a kid around that.
	And I remember he was gone and we had to move.
	Sorry, why did this guy move?
	Just a place they were sharing, and then my mom couldn't afford to live or have a place by herself or whatever, and it seemed easier with childcare and stuff to move in with my aunt and my cousins.
	And so we moved.
	And yeah.
	And then after this guy had shown up, it seemed really nice at first, and he had some kids and whatever else, and then all of a sudden he just.
	He went Indian for better lack of terminology.
	Sorry, what do you mean, all of a sudden?
	He was an ex criminal.
	I didn't know that at first.
	No, I know you didn't know that.
	It's your mother's job.
	She knew that.
	Yeah.
	Right.
	I guess you've been around criminals for a while, I guess.
	I mean, they've always been there, or people like that.
	Have you ever heard the term hebristophilia?
	No, sir.
	Well, it means being sexually attracted to violent criminals or criminals.
	Your mother had a fetish for criminals, which puts you and other children in extreme danger.
	Why do you think your mother was so attracted to violent, dangerous criminals?
	I would draw a correlation between her childhood and being victimized and then living on the streets for a bit as a teenager when she left when she was 13, 14.
	I would assume that just the lifestyle that those types of individuals just would have been around and they would just be commonplace is what I would think.
	Sorry, your mother spent her teen years homeless?
	Yeah.
	I mean, she left her mom's place.
	Because of being, you know, abuse and not getting along or whatever else.
	And I've seen that.
	So tell me a little bit about the circumstances of your mother's childhood that you know of.
	Her mom, my grandmother, was an alcoholic and would always have parties and kind of lived a hippie lifestyle.
	She has four other siblings and they would basically look after themselves in a sense.
	I mean, Grandma would help and do her thing, but she was pretty ornery as a human.
	And so she was what?
	Ornery?
	Ornery.
	Sorry, got it.
	Yeah.
	And violent and abusive verbally, mentally, physically.
	And my mom just kind of got tired of being the black sheep and thought it would be easier to live on the streets being that.
	Other family members didn't want to take her in at the time or couldn't.
	She did live with my great grandma for a little bit, but that didn't work out for whatever reasons, I guess.
	So my mom took a chance and hit the streets.
	And then she went through some atrocities as far as like rape and just violence you'd meet on the streets, I suppose.
	And at some point, she found a group of friends and then she was able to.
	Kind of bounce couches, I believe.
Mother's Past Exposed 00:03:12
	Met my dad, and then my dad got her pregnant, but didn't want anything to do with it.
	At first, she had me, and she told him that you're going to have to smarten up because he liked to sell drugs and he was living with his mom.
	And my mom said, You know, you got to clean up or whatever else.
	I've got a son, or you've got a son, and you've got to make a choice.
	And his choice was to not be a father.
	He had actually, within that time frame, there, my mom had found out that while she was pregnant, he was having a relationship with her best friend.
	At that point, she basically wrote him off, and he never cared to contact or be a part of our lives.
	I think you said you met him when you were 13, right?
	Yeah, I always thought it was kind of odd because growing up, you know, you go to school, of course, and you see men and dads and whatnot.
	And I always had boyfriends around me, but I never had a dad.
	And I think I was 12 and a half.
	I think I was getting ready to get high school.
	And I was sitting with my mom.
	I was like, Do I have a dad?
	Of course, you have a dad.
	You want to meet him?
	And I was blown away.
	I was like, Are you fucking kidding me?
	Like, in my head, I was like, Are you fucking kidding me?
	You know where my dad is?
	What the fuck?
	Why would you keep that from me?
	Right.
	And so I asked her, I go, Well, sure.
	What do you know about him?
	And she goes, Well, not a lot.
	I think he does construction and I think he still lives in his family house or whatever else.
	And, um, I kind of got excited because you have these ideas of what your dad will be like, right?
	I'm like, is he like Richard Gere?
	Or, you know, he's wearing a suit and tie until, of course, she had snuffed that out with his.
	He does construction.
	But at some point, I was like, oh, this might answer why I am the way that I am, you know, kind of fill in some missing puzzle pieces.
	So I eventually met him, and it's kind of funny because I was really nervous and pretty introverted by that time.
	I was hiding in the corner of the couch and we had to walk in our house.
	He'd walk past the opening and I'd see him and he walked past.
	He didn't see me.
	And I remember that I was disappointed because he looked like all the others leather jacket, long hair, and sat down, looked over at me and says, Oh, shit, there you are.
	I was going munchkin.
	I was like, I'm fucking taller than you.
	What do you mean, munchkin?
	Oh my God.
	And yeah, crazy, crazy.
	What happened with him from there?
	He's a real smooth talker, you know.
	Oh, your mom's done really well with you, et cetera.
Verbal Abuse Details 00:03:20
	And this, that, and the other thing.
	And quickly I said, Mom, you've done a great job with him.
	Do you want to get back together?
	First, like within the first paragraph of meeting this guy, my mom told him right where to shove it.
	And he was talking all big, whatever else.
	And yeah, we can hang out and whatnot.
	And we did a couple times.
	I was having a few things go on at school, and I could do a trunk of his car.
	He showed me how to deal with some problems, showed me some tools, and that's just kind of person and personality he was.
	Sorry, how to deal with some problems.
	He showed me some tools.
	That's got a sinister, almost Sopranos vibe to it.
	What do you mean?
	That's exactly what it is.
	That's exactly what it is.
	Oh, I like how to hurt people who were giving you trouble at school.
	Yeah.
	Okay, like a crowbar or a knife or what was he talking about?
	Yeah, I got definitely some bats, a couple bats, crowbar, or a pipe, sorry.
	And yeah, just things of that nature.
	You know, just kind of, I think, trying to be like a macho man, like this is how we deal with things and trying to be tough kind of deal.
	And did you take his advice?
	Oh, no, I never touched anything out of his trunk, of course.
	And I didn't have to deal with people that way.
	I've been a lot smarter after.
	Dealing with everyone else up to that point on how to protect myself and stay out of certain situations and use your brain a bit better than seeing the criminal system.
	Okay.
	So let's just back up.
	And I'm sorry about all of this.
	It's horrible.
	I mean, this is like tales out of hell itself.
	I just want to be clear about that.
	So, really?
	Oh, yeah.
	This is hell.
	You were raised in a level of hell that's very near the bottom.
	Now, your mother chose to leave and be raped as a child in the streets than be home.
	I gotta think that's more than verbal abuse.
	At home?
	Yeah, her home.
	Oh, yeah, I'm sure it was.
	I'm sure it was.
	Do you think there was sexual abuse involved?
	Have you heard anything like that?
	Yeah, there was.
	Just that's one of the reasons my mom had left is because, you know, the people, the frequent people coming and going had abused her.
	There were instances where You know, a stranger would be in her room, kind of deal, and she'd be called a liar.
	Oh, you mean he would sexually assault her?
	Yeah, like everyone would be drunk at some party or something, and somehow they would have entered her room and did something, and my mom would have said something and would have been called a liar, and you're a piece of shit.
	And then, yes.
	So she felt safer on the streets.
	Than with the child predators her mother was bringing home.
	Correct.
	Fuck.
	I mean, you sound surprised when I refer to this as hell.
	Yeah, I just.
	I don't know.
Feeling Vulnerable Now 00:05:20
	I mean.
	I mean, what do you feel about my response?
	I don't know how to feel about it.
	Like, it's like I've learned.
	I feel that.
	I've got a pretty good set of tools and I've had some unique experiences, and I've got a level of strength from my experiences.
	And I've had conversations with my mom, I don't think I would have changed my childhood because I don't know what I would be without it.
	Well, aren't you full of rage and hatred of the world and self destructive?
	Yeah.
	And I think some of that.
	Yeah, well, that's not great, does it?
	Yeah.
	And I think that stems from not feeling.
	Secure or not secure, but vulnerable because I'm not doing what I should be doing for myself.
	So it's almost like you're backed into a corner and now I'm really aggressive because I feel very vulnerable.
	What do you feel vulnerable about?
	I'm vulnerable in the way that.
	Financially, I'd put myself in a position up until last year where I could have lost everything and there was no rhyme or reason for it.
	I feel very vulnerable in the fact that maintaining my level of health is within my control and I've done nothing about it.
	So, to be a provider and a strong father, I just like it's not there.
	And if I, the best explanation I could give you is.
	Right now, in my house, I live alone.
	In my house, I have a store.
	I've got new gym equipment.
	I like building cars and stuff.
	So I got new car parts.
	I've got tools.
	I've got food.
	I've got clothes.
	I got all of these things.
	It's new, relatively new.
	And I see it every day.
	And I want to go work out.
	So the best way I can describe this is you really want to do this thing and you're trying to get to it, but there's cellophane.
	Over the doorway.
	Several raps.
	You just can't get to it.
	You just like, it's so much effort.
	And as I'm going to do it, it gets to a precipice.
	And then you're just yelling at it.
	You're just screaming at whatever it is you're trying to do because you want to do it so bad, but you're not.
	And it's frustrating because listening and Listening to people like you, or I remember like getting things done by David Allen.
	And I've got all the paperwork here.
	I've got the file folders.
	I've got the whiteboards.
	I've got all of these things.
	And some preliminary work through the years trying to figure that out.
	And it comes down to well, is it because you feel guilty for succeeding?
	And you don't want to get to a level of success that your family is not.
	Happy or they pick away at you, andor is it you don't feel you deserve it, or you're throwing it in the face of the people you know?
	Is it I'm doing it because of vanity?
	Do I even want this stuff?
	Do I even want to do these things?
	Do I even want to be that person?
	I have all of these thoughts that go through, and I can never pinpoint.
	That fracture in my program.
	And I feel like I've always been missing something because there's people that just love to do it and they excel in those areas.
	And I want to, I have the tools, I have the time, you know, the knowledge, all of those things.
	It's just, sure.
	And then, when you fill your head with media, you know, political nature, et cetera, that I feel hopeless and I'm too late.
	I've given up for everybody else.
	I've bought the homes.
	I've bought the cars.
	I've given my time.
	I'm the person that people call.
	I show up at any time of day.
	I help you move on a moment's notice.
	I fix your things.
	I donate doing these things and filling my cup, and you get a sense of accomplishment because not necessarily you're a hero, but it's like, okay, yeah, that's looked after.
	It's not in the back of your head, or the back of your mind, sorry.
	And I come home sometimes and I close my door and I go to my room and I just go to bed.
	I'll go to bed at 6 30, wake up at 3 34, get ready, start my day.
Financial Success Story 00:02:36
	Go solve my customers' problems, moment notice, not be told what a job is, show up.
	I'm really good at solving it with the minimal material time.
	My whole life, I've just been like a last second situation where I'm doing book reports, two in the morning, hand in at nine.
	And I've almost thrived on that procrastination and leaving it to the last minute and pulling it out of the bag and getting it done and getting 100%.
	Or putting out that fire.
	And I don't really get a thrill out of doing it.
	There's so much anxiety and stress and frantic nature about it.
	And leading up to it, like, I mean, right now I've got, I probably got $60,000 in invoicing of done jobs waiting just to be invoiced so they can pay me.
	And for the amount that I love money and for what it provides, It's almost like I don't like the fucking money.
	I remember growing up and watching Pretty Woman and trying to figure out who I want to be when I grow up because I remember just watching movies and consuming that.
	So my whole life growing up, I just thought it was a movie and action stars.
	But anyway, so Pretty Woman, I thought I really like the way he talks.
	I want to be in acquisitions and mergers.
	I want to be a lawyer.
	Oh, that's your Richard Gitter thing you mentioned.
	Yeah.
	Right.
	And then I liked Alex P. Keaton, you know?
	And I have amateurs.
	Yeah, I have these ideas of what the kind of men that I wanted to be or afford me the opportunities and whatnot.
	And here I am.
	I mean, I'm making good money.
	I mean, I'm making probably that kind of money.
	And what the fuck am I doing with it?
	Handing it away, giving it away.
	I'm not collecting it.
	That's what your mother did too, right?
	She worked three jobs for everyone else.
	Yeah.
	I mean, I hear some sob stories from other guys, you know, on job sites, et cetera, and what they pay.
	And I mean, I'm just under 30 grand a year for child support.
	And I've got two adult children.
	That's why it's lower.
	And, um, oh, so it was like 60 K at one point, something like it was ridiculous.
	I mean, ridiculous.
	It's, it's a whole business model.
	What a farce.
	Pardon my French.
	So yeah.
Child Support Reality 00:07:52
	Um, I don't know.
	I think, uh, even growing up as a kid, I remember going to different schools and stuff.
	And I was, I was pretty, long hair.
	I remember kids always bug me.
	Are you a boy or a girl?
	Kind of thing.
	And I would kind of take it, I would take it until one day I didn't.
	I put a pencil in the back of one of the students' shoulder blades over it.
	And another time there's a girl that I liked and really fond of her.
	She had a classic Shakespearean name, as you can imagine.
	And I thought that she liked me.
	And this kid I thought I was friends with decided to hawk her up.
	I decided this was grade five or something.
	And I didn't like it at all.
	I was not impressed.
	And I remember we had a fight in the playground, and I brought a knife to school.
	And I showed him this knife, and immediately this mom just came out of nowhere and by my hair, dragged me into the office and threw me in front of the principal and sat me down.
	And it was a pretty serious situation, of course.
	And he goes, What are you doing here with this, et cetera?
	And I said, Well, I'm allowed to have it.
	He goes, Are you now?
	Tell me about that.
	Why are you allowed to have this?
	He goes, Well, it's for protection.
	Oh, protection.
	What are you protecting yourself from?
	I said, From thieves and people like so and so?
	Hmm.
	My mom said I'm allowed to have that.
	I boldly remarked in his face.
	And he goes, Really?
	He says, Is that a fact?
	I said, Yeah.
	So if I called your mom right now, she would say that you're allowed to have this knife.
	And I was like, Yeah.
	And now he goes, I think maybe he had an idea of the situation I was in, of course, being an adult at that time, maybe.
	And he goes, Well, tell you what, you can have this back when your mom comes to school to say you're allowed to have this night.
	I said, Deal.
	And he let me go.
	There was never a phone call, nothing like that.
	And that was that.
	Where I got it from, no idea.
	I can't remember.
	Why did I think I could have it?
	Well, everyone else had one on their belt, their chain wallets and whatnot.
	It's kind of normalized.
	And I don't remember thinking I'm going to use it.
	And it's just like watching G.I. Joe at the time and cartoons.
	And it just, ah, so stupid when you think about it.
	But when you try to analyze where you would have got that notion from, And then to be premeditative about it and show up, and that kind of crazy, actually.
	Sorry, I don't want to.
	If you've got more to say, I'm happy to hear.
	I was just there's, sir, there's just so much.
	I just don't even know where to go from there.
	Okay, got it.
	All right.
	So, your mother, did you hear any stories about her on the streets?
	As a teenager, she kind of went into how being assaulted had affected her.
	She didn't enjoy the course.
	It was hard, really hard for her.
	What I learned about it was who I thought were family and what family kind of was supposed to be.
	They never really helped her, which I thought was kind of odd.
	And especially like her uncles, they really had no patience or desire.
	And so I kind of learned that that was just what our family kind of was.
	And I never really knew them because, like I had said, all the men were gone, they just went away.
	Um, so I could, I could understand that there would have, would not have been any help.
	And it's not like her sisters were in a position to, to help being that she's the one that was always helping them.
	Um, I had no desire to, well, as a kid, you know, like, I'm going to run away because I'm not getting my way kind of deal and pull out that card.
	And she goes, yeah, let me pack your stuff, put it by the front door.
	And, um, yeah, if you think you can do better somewhere else, then have at her.
	And quickly as a kid be like, well, wait a minute here.
	You're not supposed to do that.
	You know, so you kind of rearrange your thoughts in your head like, well, there's got to be a better way to get what I want than saying I'm going to run away.
	I never knew that she ran away after that point.
	My mom's always very tight lipped about the non desirable parts of her life until I was like in my teens and you start having conversations about things going on at school or trying to work through a couple of those episodes with that one idiot.
	And kind of get an understanding that she did fight pretty hard.
	And contrary to your initial assessment, I always felt like she really tried to show up for me.
	She'd work whatever she could to get me what I wanted.
	We had like going through school, I was always like an honor student, elementary all the way up.
	And we'd get it where I'd pick something beginning of the year.
	And by the end of the year, If I reached the level that we agreed upon, she would get me what we agreed on, you know, like the Nintendo, BMX, skateboard, whatever.
	And school was really easy.
	So I always thought that I was getting a better end of the stick on that one for sure.
	Through junior high, it was kind of the same thing.
	I went through a few different junior highs just for it was easier to get to school based on where we were living in the city at the time.
	High school.
	I had to switch schools at one point just because of gang activity.
	All my friends were going to a different school.
	Didn't want to be the exposed nail in that particular school.
	So I went where my friends were.
	And then they all got kicked out for nefarious activities.
	So I was now in a school I couldn't leave.
	Made the best of that.
	My student council.
	Was a teacher's aide, excelled at all of my classes to a point that I would just skip some exams, et cetera, and help mark on a deal.
	I would take liberties in working in the guidance office to give myself some lockers so that I could start selling some weed and cigarettes.
	And if I ever got called the office, then I could stash it and not have a problem.
	I was making all my awards in shop class, like actual awards, because I basically was garnering them.
	Uh, I also had, uh, two jobs after school throughout the week.
	So I could have the nice clothes that I wanted and the cars that I liked.
	My mom still wasn't able to give a lot, give more.
	So I just stopped.
	I said to mom, no, I got this expensive clothes and my cousins needed more growing up because my aunts were still breeding.
Attention Seeking Behavior 00:02:48
	And, uh, yeah, graduated valedictorian.
	How long did you deal with the drugs for?
	Maybe a year.
	It got kind of boring.
	It was just everyone's always in your business.
	And I grew up with addicts and idiots, and you just, I was doing it just to do it.
	Like, I had two jobs.
	I think maybe I liked the attention, or I liked reading people, getting away with things.
	A pretty good petty thief at the mall in junior high.
	So just kind of stepped up to that opportunity presented itself.
	Then, yeah, why not?
	Everyone wants the product.
	I have access to it.
	So, sure, I'll try it for a bit.
	That's just, yeah.
	I said earlier that I was pretty introverted by the time I was getting to junior high and just shy, of course, coming out of.
	Where I was, as far as my body type, long hair, kind of nervous, and grade seven, being picked on.
	So, of course, you get a little bit, a little angry, or you try to be a little bit more distant.
	And I discovered Desmond Morris and, oh, yeah, human zoo and, yeah, naked age.
	Yeah.
	Oh, I loved it.
	I loved it.
	Because I was always quiet growing up as a kid, per se, just you would.
	You'd be in a room of adults all the time and you'd hear things and be privy to adult conversation, you know, just the way they move, talk, act, et cetera.
	And I loved it because I thought maybe it could give me an edge through my school years and trying to figure out kind of girls and how to fit in with other kids.
	And I think maybe I went a little too far because I ended up being more of a.
	Of an observer than getting in and being a part of something.
	So I was always more of a pop in friend and never liked guys, but could not stand dudes.
	I always, always be with the girls.
	I just raised by women.
	It just seemed like it was easier.
	I knew the conversations, I knew everything, how to be that way, I guess.
	Found common company just hanging with the girls.
	Everyone thought that maybe I was gay through a high school kind of deal.
	Wasn't, wasn't.
Observer Not Participant 00:03:43
	And yeah, that was kind of funny too.
	You'd read all the teen magazines, figure out what they're talking about, hair products, makeup, and a valuable resource, I would say Desmond Morris was for sure.
	Right.
	Okay.
	Is there anything else?
	I mean, obviously, I want to get some feedback in.
	Is there anything else that you wanted to mention that's on the top of your mind?
	No, I just don't want to ramble and kind of waste your time.
	I'm really not going to.
	No, no, leave that up to me.
	That's fine.
	I mean, I can say what I need.
	Okay.
	Yeah.
	Sorry, go ahead.
	I was just going to say that through high school, there's a couple of times when I had to be pretty violent to protect my mom, I think.
	I'm not, I think I did.
	Like what?
	Uh, we had, uh, my mom got sick and was hospitalized.
	And, um, this guy that, uh, I don't know if she wasn't really dating him, but he was trying to date her kind of deal.
	He let me take his truck to school and, uh, kind of like be the big man, like all the men growing up, like, oh, I'm the big man.
	And here's a new G.I. Joe.
	And yeah, I'll buy you some ice cream.
	Oh, if they want us to date your mom.
	Oh, yeah.
	Yeah, exactly.
	Turned it into a bit of a racket.
	And, um, Fucking simpletons.
	It's at any rate, he broke in and stole a bunch of my mom's jewelry and whatever else.
	And I kind of got blamed for it.
	My mom thought I had had a party, right?
	Well, she was hospitalized.
	And I was like, I've never had any party.
	Like, that's out of character for me.
	I don't like people in my space.
	Anyways, found out it was this guy, and I was appalled that he did what he did.
	And I kind of had a feeling that he was POS.
	So, I had made keys to his truck.
	And one night, on the lookout, cruising around, we found out where Buddy was and waited for him and beat the shit out of him, stole his truck, stripped it.
	So, I watched the cops and your friends.
	And how old were you at this point?
	Must have been 17.
	Okay.
	Yeah, and then where we dumped it, we watched the cops staking it out because of.
	Kind of a joke.
	My mom was going to be like, send them pizza.
	They look pretty cold out there.
	And it felt great to finally get back at a piece of shit.
	You know, it wasn't, it's not a good moral character and it's not virtuous.
	But after all those years to come across someone like this and then to be a child.
	I'm sorry, I missed.
	So, oh, because he stole your mother's jewelry, right?
	And do you know why he did that?
	I mean, because she wouldn't go out with him?
	Because he's a criminal thief, I guess, convict.
	Uh, opportunity presented itself.
	He knew where she was in the hospital.
	He knew that I was in school.
	Um, probably had a drug addiction, right?
	Right, yeah, and uh, yeah, okay, okay.
	And so, you and your friends, and I mean, how bad did you beat him up?
	Uh, he was pretty scared.
	I didn't, he never got hospitalized, nothing like that.
	But uh, you know, he could pull cues that he took from my mom.
	Remember competition ones?
	That was in a few pieces.
	Yeah.
	I mean, he bumped and bruised pretty good.
	Okay.
	And did he ever figure it out?
	Oh, yeah.
	He knew.
	He locked eyes with him.
	He knew who it was 100%.
	Ah, okay.
	And did you ever have to do any violence with regards to the drug dealing?
Understanding the Gap 00:15:32
	Oh, no.
	Okay.
	All right.
	Is there anything else that you wanted to add?
	No, I don't think so.
	Okay.
	And what would you like to focus most on?
	What would you consider the most success we could get out of this combo?
	I've taken that just coming out of hibernation, you know, spring's on its way, and just a fresh perspective.
	I really value your input.
	I've been utilizing your platform nonstop.
	Here for about a month now that I'm back into it.
	And yeah, I'm just trying to work back and figure out like that missing piece where I want to do for myself and be motivated for me.
	Or am I just not seeing something?
	I think so.
	And how blunt a person do you like to be?
	How blunt do you want me to be?
	Oh, I mean, whatever you think you need to do, sir.
	Well, I mean, it's up to you.
	Some of it's going to be a little tough.
	Okay.
	All right.
	So, are you ready?
	Absolutely.
	Okay.
	Has your mother ever taken any therapy or mental health services to deal with the severe trauma, which I imagine is worse than wartime, of being raped on the streets as a child?
	Not to my knowledge, no.
	Now, her mother is still in her life or was when you were growing up, is that right?
	Yes.
	Okay.
	Do you know if she ever had any criticisms of her mother or voiced her criticisms to her mother about how badly she was treated?
	Because she ended up being raped on the streets as a child.
	They've had some heated conversations for sure.
	Okay.
	Has your grandmother taken any responsibility for being such a terrible parent that her child ran away at 13 or 14 to be raped as a child in the streets?
	I never, to be clear, she's passed away now, but.
	Sorry, when?
	Yeah, I assume so.
	Sorry, but when she was alive?
	Based on how she treated me, I don't think that she would have, no.
	What do you mean?
	I would get phone calls, like when I get my report card or something, and she would call me up.
	My mom would be somewhere in the house, and I'd answer the phone and talk to, you know, talk to grandma, whatever else.
	And she'd be like, half drunk or whatever.
	And she'd be like, you piece of shit.
	You think you're so fucking good, et cetera, about having like straight A's and whatever else.
	And just really demean your accomplishment to a point that it's, Dirt.
	And it got to a point, most times I know it was coming, and I would just put the phone down and walk away, you know?
	And one time my mom, like, picks up the phone.
	She's like, who's on the phone?
	I said, it was Grandma.
	What would she want?
	They're telling me what kind of piece of shit I am and explained to her the conversation.
	And my mom just called her right back and laid into her, gave her what for kind of deal.
	This is one of the few times that she could catch it, you know, just shortly after it had happened.
	And I assume that changed precisely nothing.
	Um, no, she, she kind of gave you dirty looks here and there, but she never was vocal about it after that, that altercation with my mom.
	Okay.
	And then, then, then, of course, as a teen, then, of course, as a teenager, uh, I became useful, you know, like I, I can do things or pick things up or be self-sufficient.
	So, uh, being that my mom's always been the giver, well, get to help out or, Pardon me, French.
	Yeah.
	Sorry, I just let my name slip there.
	That's right, I'll check it out.
	Okay.
	All right.
	So your grandmother died about as horribly or about as horrible a person as she'd lived, right?
	Yeah.
	Okay.
	So she never took responsibility, never apologized for anything.
	She had one conversation with my mom because I asked my mom about it and because I never understood her growing up.
	Like, why is she so angry and and and Sorry, your mother was so angry.
	No, my grandmother.
	Well, it's your grandmother's so angry.
	Sorry, guys.
	Yeah, because when they were living in the province over, she was married and he was cheating on her and then left her in the middle of farm country in the middle of winter with five kids and with no money, no nothing.
	And so it was like it was a pretty tough situation and a hard go, I guess, for her.
	And She became increasingly jaded as I'm sure these kids and these mouths to feed created a bunch of disdain.
	But my mom had explained kind of how she got to that point, and I could sort of understand where the anger and resentment grew.
	I still couldn't understand how it was okay to be that way to her kids and to play favorites on her grandchildren like she did.
	There was no excuse for it.
	Respected her.
	And when she was, she had a home invasion done on her.
	And I got blamed for it from the time when I was selling.
	Sorry, this is Joe's grandmother?
	Yeah.
	Okay.
	What do you mean?
	And she, there was a home invasion, and then it came in, took her money, and took her product, and she swore it was me.
	She could have sworn it was me that did it.
	Sorry, took her product.
	So, grandma was a drug dealer, too?
	Okay.
	Sorry, sir.
	Your size.
	It's a lot, yeah.
	Definitely.
	And how long ago did your grandmother die?
	Ah, gotta be, wow, 10 years.
	So, your grandmother was a criminal who brought child sexual abuses into the orbit of her children.
	It had happened.
	Okay, it's a statement I made, correct or incorrect?
	Correct.
	Okay.
	And do you know what she did when your mother was forced to run away because her mother kept bringing these?
	Child abusers into your mother's room or house.
	Did my grandmother acknowledge why my mom left?
	That's the question.
	Well, I assume she called the police and said, My daughter has run away.
	And then the daughter would, I assume the police found your mother or looked for her.
	And then if they found her, they would ask her, Why did you run away?
	And she would say, Because there are these horrible men who come into my room at night, et cetera, et cetera, that my mother brings into the house.
	And then you get child protective services all over the place, and maybe it gets cleaned up a little.
	That did not happen, no.
	The police were not called.
	So your grandmother brought these evil molesters into the house with her children, and when your mother ran away, she did what?
	To my knowledge, good riddance.
	You think, like, this is how I'm going to do it?
	So her 13 or 14 year old little girl runs away to get away from the molesters, and your grandmother says, good riddance.
	To my knowledge, correct.
	Well, okay.
	We can only go to your knowledge.
	Of course, we're not omniscient and we don't have drones following everyone.
	Okay.
	And what do you think of that?
	I think it tracks.
	I think.
	No, no.
	What do you think of it?
	I don't mean in terms of accuracy.
	What do you think of it?
	I know my mom never would have done that.
	So obviously, I would never do that.
	What do you think of it?
	Not what do you compare it to?
	Let me try another tack.
	Let me try another tack.
	Do you have daughters?
	Yes.
	Okay.
	So imagine one of your ex wives, this is purely theoretical, of course, but imagine one of your ex wives brought a babysitter over.
	The babysitter assaulted your daughter.
	Your daughter ran out into the streets and got raped at the age of 13.
	How would you feel?
	What would you think about that?
	Oh, it'd be horrible.
	I would be wondering why you didn't come to me.
	I would be serious.
	I would become enraged.
	Thank you.
	Okay, good.
	We've contacted some moral center.
	Okay, good.
	It's a bit of a reach.
	It's a bit of a reach.
	Okay.
	At what point did you find out that your grandmother was a criminal who brought child sexual assaulters, drove her child out, and didn't even call the cops?
	How old were you when you found that out?
	It must have been around when I would think late teens.
	Okay, so like 30 years ago.
	What was your relationship like with the woman who did this to your mother for the 20 years she was alive after you found out?
	I didn't really have one with her.
	Of course, being family, you would come together at some functions and whatnot.
	I would try to be cordial.
	I would only typically be there because of my mom.
	I wouldn't just out of the blue visit or call up grandma and You know, have a beer and shoot shit.
	It was everything I've done related to the family is to, uh, for my mom, just to keep things simple and easy.
	And yeah, I'm not, I don't really have strong ties to the family.
	What would you want to do to someone who got your little girl attacked and assaulted in this way?
	You, what would I do?
	What would you want to do to someone who drove your little girl out into the streets and got her attacked and assaulted in this way?
	Oh, well, I'd become unhinged.
	I think the person that drove her out, I'd probably bounce their head off a wall.
	I would call the police, of course, afterwards.
	No, I say, yeah, what would you want to do?
	I mean, you and friends beat hell out of a guy who just stole some fucking jewelry.
	Oh, yeah.
	So, but yeah, I mean, I probably have a special place in my basement for an individual that's going to hurt that child.
	Right.
	So that was your mother.
	And that was your grandmother.
	Help me understand how you're cordial and pleasant towards a woman who did that to your mother.
	I believe it's because my mom was still cordial and pleasant to her mother.
	So?
	So, I feel I just, for the interest of keeping the peace with my mom, that's what I would do.
	I wouldn't go out of my way to hang out or anything, but if she was around or I had a baby, I would.
	Okay, so you get the difference here, right?
	Someone does it to your child, you want to do whatever medieval stuff would be done.
	Someone does it to your mother, you're cordial.
	This is the gap.
	Right?
	So I'm a universal moral guy, as you know.
	I'm a moral philosopher, right?
	Correct.
	Now, anger is a very healthy part of virtue.
	We cannot be virtuous if we cannot be angry.
	That's pretending you're peaceful because you have no claws.
	So, this is what I'm trying to understand the gap between if it was done to your kid.
	Could you ever be cordial with whoever did that?
	Would you ever break bread with them and make small talk and be pleasant?
	Absolutely not.
	So help me understand.
	I believe it's not.
	It can't just be, don't give me because it's what your mom wanted.
	Because that's kind of bullshit, right?
	I mean, I can't believe you always did everything your mom wanted, did you?
	No, no, I didn't.
	Okay.
	So it's not because it's what your mom wanted, something else.
	Okay.
	Well, I would say it's.
	It starts at the three months after birth when my mom couldn't leave the hospital and unpassed around to people to try and take care of me while she gets better.
	I think it's the babysitters, the violent men.
	I think it's the time not in the home.
	That doesn't explain.
	Hang on, hang on.
	Sorry to interrupt.
	That doesn't explain why you wouldn't be angry.
	That might explain why you'd be more angry at the people who brought this about.
	Because maybe I'm just not that connected to my mom.
	Well, hang on.
	Hang on.
	But earlier, and listen, please, I'm not trying to catch you out or play some sort of silly games here.
	I'm just trying to put these pieces together because you're giving me quite a complicated puzzle and I'm just trying to assemble it in a coherent way within my mind.
	So just if you'll forgive me for asking these questions.
	But earlier, you were saying that you were having a chuckle with your mom about the 50 places you moved.
	Correct.
	So your mom's still in your life, right?
	Correct.
	And you have pleasant chit chats and joke around with your mom, right?
	I do.
	So if you say, maybe I'm not close to my mom, I mean, she's still around.
	You're pushing 50, so you're close.
	Okay, I agree.
	So this is the parts that I'm having trouble putting together.
	So can I ask a question?
	Of course.
	So what does it mean if I can just.
	So, people have done me wrong that I thought were close, and you don't exist to me anymore.
	Like, I could step over your body and not think twice.
	I mean, like, I've got a disposition about me that I know I'm inherently different when I enter a room and people notice.
	I'm very, very still, emotionless, and I don't overreact.
	Very quiet.
	Well, you may just have a way out.
Emotions Stay Subdued 00:02:23
	Go on.
	And just being like subdued.
	Like I've got a stranglehold on some of my emotions when I want to.
	Does that play a part in, is it more of a, I don't know.
	If she was okay with it, then I'm okay with it.
	Well, that means that, hang on, but that goes back to saying that you do what your mom wants, which is not true.
	I'm sure you had tons of fights with your mother when you were growing up.
	I don't know about tons.
	I was pretty obedient.
	Well, sorry, but there were things that you did that your mother didn't want you to do, and so on, right?
	And I'm sure you had some conflicts with your mother as a teenager.
	A couple.
	I was pretty slick.
	I mean, I didn't.
	I mean, I was doing a bunch of things that nobody knew.
	And I never wanted to embarrass my mom.
	I've always dressed well, P's and Q's, like just.
	I never wanted her to feel ashamed.
	I. Very proud, and I always had that kind of mindset.
	I mean, my actions spoke differently.
	Sorry, when you say very proud, what do you mean?
	I'm just doing more than the people I grew up with, just as far as accomplishing tasks.
	Sorry, I'm sorry to interrupt.
	What I'm trying to understand is when you said that, very proud, do you mean you wanted to be proud yourself, or you felt proud yourself, or you wanted your mother to be proud of you?
	I wanted my mom to be proud.
	I wanted her to feel that her life was worth something and that she could do something right.
	You wanted to please your mother.
	I did, yeah.
	Why?
	Uh, the struggles growing up, the frustration, some of the pain, um, feeling lost.
	She would, I could look across and you could see that distant look as she's trying to figure how we're going to do, get out of this next thing.
	And I never wanted to be a hindrance.
	So I always.
	There you go.
	There you go.
	No, that's it.
	That's it.
	That's it.
	Okay, well, we'll bookmark that.
	I just want to ask a couple more questions and I appreciate your patience.
Dangerous Men Arrive 00:12:13
	So, you said that there were a number of dangerous men, criminals, violent men that your mother brought into her bed.
	Is that right?
	Yeah.
	There were men like that.
	And how many, roughly, would you say, of these violent men, the guy who smashed your Nintendo controller, the guy who stole her jewelry, other guys who were dangerous or violent, how many?
	Trooped through your mother's bedroom when you were a child?
	I would say three of them were violent.
	Well, that you knew of.
	And how many men would you say your mother dated from when you were a baby?
	I know you can't remember that.
	Maybe you've heard stories until you became an adult in your late teens.
	One sec here.
	Five?
	Maybe six?
	Okay.
	And how long did these relationships last on average?
	Probably a couple years.
	I mean, one went longer.
	He was a solid dude.
	He was, so he was, I wouldn't categorize him as untoward.
	Yeah, two plus years for each one.
	I mean, I can't really, the really violent piece of shit.
	You just couldn't get away from that guy.
	I don't think it really was a relationship that lasted a year and a half.
	Betcha.
	We had to move to two different places and he went with us.
	You mean he followed you or lived with you?
	Lived with us.
	I don't think my mom was scared for her life.
	He broke her arm.
	We were living in these places where you can see through the stairs, and he'd hold a knife at her throat at the kitchen table as he tells her what he's going to do to her, et cetera.
	And just scared.
	She just fucking scared.
	And what happened to that relationship or what happened to him?
	How did you get away?
	I was sent away for the summer to go to BC to be with my aunt and my cousins.
	And her and my aunt's husband and a bunch of other people were searching the city for him to end his life.
	And he just so happened to go on a spree of violence.
	The cops got to him before they did.
	So you had family members, men and women, who were hunting to kill him, but he went on a violent spree and went to prison.
	Is that right?
	Yeah.
	As far as I know, he's still out there.
	Out there being alive or out there in prison or?
	Alone.
	Okay.
	So it wasn't like he went away for the rest of his life for murder or something?
	No.
	No, they saved that guy's life.
	Okay.
	And then you never heard from him again.
	No.
	Okay.
	So, did your mother ever find a relationship that stuck?
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	She's been in one now for 15 years.
	One before that was like five.
	Okay.
	But only three of the men were violent.
	Is that to your knowledge, right?
	Yeah.
	Okay.
	Like, and because being into drugs and stuff like that, they were.
	I'm sorry, they had the propensity for violence, they were into drugs and stuff, or or like biker gangs.
	So, you know, so obviously violent, they weren't like some Patrick Bateman character, like, they were obviously violent, and she chose them with that full knowledge, right?
	I would assume so.
	Okay, one of them was military, so yeah, you definitely okay.
	Now, what does your mother think of her parenting if you've ever discussed it?
	She is, she's ashamed and she's sad.
	Some of the stuff I never told her had happened, like him throwing me up flights of stairs or telling me what he's going to do to me or breaking things around me kind of thing.
	Sorry, what did he say he was going to do to you?
	Oh, he was just going to kill me.
	Got me.
	One day I couldn't get my algebra right and he put his fist through her glass kitchen table.
	And I didn't know what to do.
	It just, he's like, I just froze because you don't want to move.
	And yeah, he's like, well, get the fuck out of here before I cut your head off.
	So you try to go around him because you can't move, you're so scared.
	And you kind of go around and you make your way to the hallway.
	And as soon as you look to the top of the stairs where you're going to go, you know, like some cat that's trying to slink away, he is right behind you and tosses you up a flight of stairs.
	And then you quickly hit the wall at the top, and then you quickly run into your room and just don't make any noise.
	And you lived with this for years?
	Yeah, I wouldn't tell my mom that.
	I didn't want her to freak out and then he would kill her or something, you know, like very unpredictable individual.
	And I'd watch kind of the stuff that he wanted to do and hear the things that he would say.
	Oh, you were saying like what he wanted to do to your mom if she did something he didn't like, like he'd just kill her or torture her or something, right?
	Okay.
	Yeah, we're going to move, and that ain't going to fucking happen.
	You're not leaving this house.
	You'll never leave this house again.
	So then I think I would have to be there so that she could go to work.
	I wasn't allowed to go to my grandma or anyone else because maybe that's her way of trying to separate.
	You know what I mean?
	I'm almost like a hostage, maybe.
	That's how I would interpret it.
	You had to stay home so she didn't end up leaving the house in a rolled up carpet and pieces or something, right?
	Yeah, or like she could call the cops on him or something.
	You know what I mean?
	Like, I was kind of collateral.
	Like, you're going to come back home because your son's here.
	Oh, he wouldn't let you leave so that she'd have to come back.
	Okay, got it.
	Got it.
	Or vice versa.
	Okay.
	All right.
	And what about the other two guys who were violent?
	What were they like?
	One of them I really liked, military guy.
	I really respected him.
	I thought he was.
	I respected him because he took me out and took me under his wing and on the back of his bike, cruise around, show me how to do things, you know, be in military, dress me well, treat me with just the attention kind of thing.
	And I think a lot of my.
	My programming is from him as far as the way that I move.
	I'm sorry, but was he violent?
	I thought we would.
	I mean, I asked about the violent guys.
	This is separate, that's different, but how was he violent?
	Being part of a motorcycle gang and we were near the end of the relationship, he was a little weird in the head.
	So, as far as dressing up and fatigues, he would kind of stalk me a bit.
	He'd teach me how to clear rooms.
	How to follow people.
	Make sure to clear rooms.
	I don't mean to laugh, but it's like I assume you don't mean tidying up there.
	No, clear.
	Like, yeah, yeah, yeah, clear.
	Yeah, make sure that there's nobody alive in there.
	Yeah, and we'd play little war games that way.
	We'd take pictures, he'd have me handcuffed, and we'd be banned.
	I'm sorry, he'd have you handcuffed?
	What do you mean?
	Like, I mean, I know what you mean, but for what end?
	Like, just like I remember the one is like a happy birthday, my mom's name kind of behind us, and there's a banner, and just something you'd expect from a lifestyle of like a biker gang kind of thing.
	There's always lots of weapons.
	Sorry, I don't understand the last birthday thing.
	I'm sorry.
	Like, you go to like a bunny roast, or if you've got like La Raza MS 13 kind of thing, and you've got like a banner behind you, so there'd be like the Union Jack there, holding up a bottle, happy birthday kind of situation.
	I know it's not, it's definitely normal.
	But what were the handcuffs about?
	I just, I don't know.
	I just, that's what he had in his head.
	He thought was like, was he teaching you how to get out of handcuffs or something?
	No, like I was handcuffed to him, right?
	Like we were handcuffed together.
	But why?
	I think I would have had a ball.
	I don't know.
	That's just where his mind was.
	Was he mentally deteriorating with the drugs, PTSD?
	I mean, I guess you wouldn't know, right?
	I wouldn't know.
	Maybe PTSD of some type, maybe.
	I was like seven.
	And so, I mean, certainly unsettling, stalked, and so on.
	Was there more explicit violence that he did towards the end?
	Not that I had witnessed.
	I'm sure they had some fights because he didn't want to leave the club.
	And being in the military, I think that just the distance and stuff, but I never witnessed it.
	There was some yelling, but I never saw him put a hand on her.
	And what was this?
	You said you were stopped a little bit.
	What does that mean?
	Just teaching me how to cover my tracks.
	So one night I came home and the front door is open a little bit, I remember.
	And so now I know game on.
	So when I got home from my friend's place, down the street or something, because I was like eight, eight something.
	And anyway, so you get in and the house is total silence, lights are on.
	And now I know that.
	Where to go in the house, how to start to clear rooms, and get to the end, and he's not in the house.
	So I thought maybe he just wasn't there, but I wasn't sure, but I could feel that someone was there.
	So I went to the safest spot in that basement there so I could see from the door, the hallway, the landing.
	If he was going to come out, then I knew where he was.
	Right.
	And it's kind of like a game.
	And that guy was above me the whole time.
	I don't remember the basement exactly, but he was a.
	Quite a walk in the ceiling?
	What does that mean?
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	He was above me.
	I was like, what?
	My mind was like.
	You had like K-notes at the age of eight?
	Yeah.
	I was just like, my mind was blown, like the realm of possibilities of what a person could do and how you could hide.
	And it was really interesting at that point.
	I mean, admittedly, a little psycho.
	100%.
	But I mean, I think maybe without that, I could have been seriously fucked up when the next guy came along.
	Oh, like he was training you for the truly loco guy down the road.
	Okay.
	Right.
	Yeah.
	It's like a progression of fucking craziness.
	Okay.
	But please tell me the third guy wasn't worse than the second guy.
	No.
	He was a bodybuilder, a wrestler.
	Hello, Roy Grinch.
Family Money Struggles 00:15:09
	Anyway, go on.
	Sorry.
	Yeah.
	And he'd sell cocaine.
	And he had a situation there with some guns.
	Really, really loved my mom.
	My mom was just kind of, she was really off put or something.
	I don't know.
	I thought he was a decent guy.
	I mean, he had a routine, looked good.
	I mean, he talked well, seemed to smile.
	You know, I wasn't really a happy, smiley child, but I mean, I would smile if he was smiling.
	You know, so that was kind of nice.
	But he eventually had some things go down and was shotgun and violence, and then eventually had to go to prison.
	Sorry, he eventually, okay, sorry, I don't mean to be too curious, but that's had some things go down with a shotgun.
	What does that mean?
	Some turf war, maybe.
	I don't, oh, he was in a gang as well, and he was like a heavy or a hitman or no?
	Just a thousand?
	He was selling, and maybe he was just in the wrong territory.
	And then he had to defend himself.
	And there was a large scale police operation, and he was taken down.
	You mean sent to jail or killed?
	Yeah, sent to prison.
	Okay.
	And then he was killed.
	He had the shotgun and was defending himself.
	And then everyone was arrested.
	Yeah, not at my house or anything.
	No, no, I get it.
	Somewhere on the turf war.
	Yeah, okay.
	Yeah.
	And how long was your mom with him?
	A few years.
	So, why?
	You mentioned the other family members needed her money.
	Like, if she's got all of these guys who have all this cash around from their drug deals and so on, why did she need to work three jobs?
	Just minimum wage.
	It's one of those things where you're only allowed to work so many hours at certain places, maybe.
	So, you got to have three jobs to make that money.
	No, but she's got guys helping pay the bills, right?
	She would never allow that.
	What?
	Didn't they not live?
	Hang on, but didn't they live with you?
	Yeah.
	Maybe they pitched in.
	Some of them didn't pitch in because the typical male of that genre is a piece of shit and doesn't pay.
	But she didn't want to owe anyone.
	Hang on, hang on, hang on.
	So she had the lowlifes, the criminals, and so on in her house, and she paid all the bills for them.
	I wouldn't say all the time.
	I don't know, sir.
	I just know that my mom was really, she didn't want to owe anyone anything.
	So you weren't paying her way for nothing.
	That they chipped in for medical?
	But hang on.
	But they would chip in, I assume, at least to some degree, half the household expenses, right?
	Maybe not covering you, but they would chip in for rent and food.
	I would hope so.
	So if they were chipping in for rent and food, then her costs go down by close to half.
	So why is she working?
	Three jobs?
	I don't know.
	That's just how I remember it.
	And she's working three jobs and she's got these guys home with you all day because they don't have regular jobs, right?
	Not just guys.
	I mean, when living with her sister and stuff, you know?
	So the guys would be over all the time, but they didn't live there because my aunt and her kids are in the house.
	Oh, so the guys didn't live with your mom?
	Not 100%.
	Some of them, no.
	Okay.
	I mean, not 100% is very vague.
	And again, we don't want to get into details.
	Okay.
	You just have guys, you know, they hang out because they're fucking losers.
	Right.
	Parasites.
	Yeah.
	And how old were you when your mom kicked into the 15 year one?
	Well, I was in my 20s.
	Oh, so long after parenting, she got a better guy.
	Okay.
	And why were these guys with your mom?
	What was attractive about her?
	Probably being a workhorse.
	Parasites go to a favorable host.
	Yeah, workhorse.
	I mean, she's a work the bars.
	So you meet fucking winners at bars for sure.
	I would just assume that maybe they thought she was easy prey or laugh and made a joke a second, being a waitress, bartender.
	You get a bunch of knobs that want to latch on and don't leave you alone and tell you sweet not things.
	Lie their face off, you know.
	Was she attractive?
	Like in her prime, one to 10, where was she sitting?
	She's probably an eight, eight or nine.
	I mean, she's pretty rare at those circles, right?
	Yeah, I mean, she was wearing fur coats.
	A couple of my aunts were strippers.
	She was wearing fur coats.
	I'm sorry, I'm not sure what that means if somebody's working minimum wage jobs.
	Yeah.
	I guess when you think about it now, it doesn't necessarily track, but yeah, she definitely didn't look like any of the other moms I went to.
	Saw at school, that's for sure.
	And did she ever have any other kids?
	She's had a couple miscarriages.
	Okay.
	All right.
	But I'm the only one.
	Okay.
	Yeah.
	Her only biological.
	All right.
	Now, how did your relationship go with your mother in your 20s?
	Like her, I worked quite a bit, two or three jobs.
	I lived with her a bit here for a year or two.
	And then I need my own space because the rest of the family was falling on hard times as usual and decided to invade the house.
	I wanted my own space.
	So I moved out.
	I'm sorry, how old were you when you moved out?
	Well, I moved out as soon as I was 18 when she lost her house.
	We had to move just right after I graduated.
	So she was not dating anyone at that point?
	She was, yes.
	Oh, okay.
	But he couldn't help her keep the house.
	No, it, it, It's actually a funny thing if you get a second mortgage on a property, and if the person you're paying, like the builder, and you can't actually pay them because they just up and disappear, especially out of country, legally they can foreclose on the property and take it away.
	So my mom had all this money saved up but couldn't pay the bill.
	And lawyers, everyone else, she was trying to get help to like.
	Remedy this and her property was foreclosed on.
	She was paying the first mortgage, but this dude, this builder, who did it to the three other properties on the same street, they all lost their homes.
	So we had to move.
	And her boyfriend at the time, they kind of moved in together out of our house into a different place.
	And I went to go live with my best friend, who was a Jesus freak, because I wouldn't go to church.
	I couldn't stay there.
	And then I moved in with my dad.
	Your biological dad.
	Yeah.
	Wow.
	Twist ending.
	Okay.
	Oh, twist midpoint.
	Sorry.
	Oh, there's, we got, I got stories for days, Sarah.
	This won't be the last time we talk.
	Okay.
	And if you could, I'm sure we've got a lot to talk about, but if you could tell me about these two marriages briefly.
	And again, we can talk about it another time in more detail, but I just want to get to your anger in the present.
	First marriage, I tried some online dating.
	I was living with my best friend's basement and then working all the jobs and kind of being really, really shy.
	I'd never really dated girls and tried this online dating thing.
	And I got a free play of message five people, and she was one of them.
	And I kind of went out and met her.
	She was 10 years older than me.
	And how old were you?
	I think I was 25 or 24.
	And kind of went out because she just lived on the outside of the city.
	I went out and hit it off kind of deal.
	And as I couldn't keep my dick in my pants.
	Within a month and a half, being so excited, got her knocked up.
	She was.
	Well, kind of like your dad, except this woman was twice your mom's age.
	Yeah, absolutely.
	And then I was excited.
	And she was, of course, she's been through university.
	She's got a career, her own condo.
	I don't really like picking gum out of bartards' hair.
	So I thought like this was a shortcut to living the exact opposite life that I grew up around.
	And I'm kind of a little bit.
	Taking gum out of Barkhart's hair.
	I feel like that's six.
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	Girls in their 20s trying to club just wasn't my scene.
	I worked at the clubs, but dealing with alcoholics and drug addicts and everything else, I just didn't have patience for.
	And this woman was completely opposite with a good family.
	And no.
	No, no, don't believe it.
	Sorry.
	I'll go with you to being handcuffed by an army guy in the biker gang, but women with good families don't get knocked up by very damaged young men with terrible families.
	Well, I'm not saying she wasn't damaged.
	I'm just saying her family seemed really nice and big family, really tight knit.
	Yeah, upstanding citizens.
	Why is she getting knocked up in her 30s?
	That's very dysfunctional, right?
	Oh, yeah, I'm sure.
	So something had to be wrong.
	Uh, she was, uh, socially retarded, much like I kind of was.
	I was really good at playing and being a chameleon.
	Um, I think we kind of were a matched pair at that moment in time.
	I thought that I was hitting a shortcut for life and moving forward.
	She thought she hit it up with a young stud, happened to get knocked up, and she wasn't about to terminate the pregnancy.
	And we were married four months later.
	Yeah, four months later.
	And did her family vet you at all?
	What do you mean, like just like interact?
	No, vet you.
	Like if you, you know, when one of your little girls decides she wants to settle down, don't you go have some conversations with the boy, the young man, right?
	And find out what he's all about and whether he's a good fit.
	Because, you know, they're talking about merging families here, right?
	So it's kind of important to vet the family you're going to merge your family with.
	Absolutely.
	As far as merging the families, it didn't happen until the wedding day, but.
	No, no, but you're doing it anyway because you're going to have dual grandparents.
	It's going to be family gatherings.
	I mean, it's not just you and the girl getting together, it's two families getting together.
	No, I understand what you mean.
	I'm just saying that my family didn't meet their family till the wedding day.
	I was over there quite a bit in staying with her.
	So I was close to her family daily leading up to the wedding four months later.
	But her dad was an alcoholic.
	Her mom was.
	Kind of exact opposite, really nosy and prissy, and they're all university educated and had long term careers.
	And liked my demeanor.
	I was very polite.
	Seemed.
	They didn't ask you anything about your family.
	Sorry, did they ask you anything about your family?
	Nothing really stands out.
	I'm sure it was general conversation, but I mean, what does your mom do?
	Or, you know, what do you do for work?
	I think it was more about what am I doing?
	You know, who is this man and what do you do?
	And we just have those conversations.
	And at that point, I was in an apprenticeship and, uh, Okay, and I'm sorry because we've been talking for almost two hours.
	I asked for quick stuff on your wedding, on your marriages.
	We haven't even got to the first wedding yet.
	I don't have four days, right?
	So, how long were you married for?
	10 years.
	10 years.
	Okay.
	And you had two kids there.
	Is that right?
	Correct.
	Okay.
	And what broke it up?
	Just the career, hours, work, time in, having a couple of acreages, tending to that, keeping customers happy.
	Sorry, whose work?
	Hers, yours, both?
	Of my business.
	She was still, perhaps the marriage, she was a stay at home mom.
	And so I'd have to put it in quite a few hours.
	And it just kind of got to a point where she wanted to do other things.
	And I didn't want to take the risk of losing business and not being able to support the family.
	And we grew distance.
	And then she said, I want out.
	Okay.
	I probably would have stayed because I didn't want to leave my kids.
	But she was pretty adamant that I leave.
	Okay.
	And looking back in hindsight, do you think it was you or her or both, or what do you think the real issue was?
	I would say I know what I did wrong.
	I think it was both.
	I think that we both weren't honest with ourselves and we could have done things a lot differently.
	Maybe if we were more vocal, or I remember she told me to go seek help and therapy for some of my stuff that happened in the In my past, which I did, and just to talk to somebody, I get bounced around by like a few therapists who keep passing on to the next one because they can't help or whatever.
	And when it comes to our marriage issues, she didn't want to do it because she didn't think that there was a problem from her.
	So, even though she was raised with an alcoholic father.
Expressing Anger Now 00:15:27
	Okay, and then, sorry, go ahead.
	So it just seemed one sided.
	And at the point, we weren't talking, you know, how relationships kind of break down and just going through the motions, paying bills, doing the thing.
	And one summer, she's like, yeah, I'm done.
	Did she ever complain that you were emotionally unavailable?
	Yeah.
	Yeah, she did.
	And do you think that's true because you said you feel distant from your own emotions?
	Yeah, there's a good portion of I'm deep in thought.
	Or, I'm just, you're running ragged all the time.
	So you just relax and you're just sitting there, and then someone comes in, What's wrong with you?
	You're like, Well, nothing.
	What's wrong with your face?
	I'm like, Well, it's my face.
	I'm sorry.
	Hello to you too, kind of thing.
	I didn't really, I knew she had insecurities.
	I knew that she was angry.
	And we just never really communicated that well.
	Okay.
	And what about the second marriage?
	Was a girlfriend that I had before my first marriage.
	And I was just kind of messing about online, just kind of being lonely and trying to get into social media again and see, you know, like see what's up and car clubs and whatever else.
	And their name popped up.
	And I was like, oh, hey, how's it going?
	I apologized to her for breaking up with her years ago because I did it over the phone.
	That came about because I was career driven.
	And she wanted me to move in while she partied.
	And I'm like, no, I need a career.
	So I'm going to go work on the rigs.
	And you can stay here and party.
	But I'm not moving out of the basement to move into a party house and end of the relationship.
	But, anyways, fast forward, she's now a different human.
	Kind of reconnect and kind of hit it off.
	And we were together for about 10 years as well.
	How long ago did you have your second divorce?
	Four years ago, it was signed.
	I was never really accepted into the family.
	She was a traitor by my account.
	And I tried to stay for my.
	Did you say traitor or traitor?
	Slater, like betrayer.
	Yes.
	Okay, got it.
	And when did you first notice the emotions that you wrote to me about?
	Just sort of the chaos, the anger, the self destructive stuff, the sort of bouncing around, angry at the world, hating yourself.
	Like when did you first notice those emotions popping up or being around?
	About halfway through the second marriage.
	Okay.
	So that would be 10 years ago?
	Yeah.
	Okay.
	Got it.
	All right.
	And are they getting worse or better or staying about the same, these chaotic emotions?
	They stay about the same.
	I mean, I'm quick to anger because of people in traffic, or I'm angry at myself because I just shut down and don't do anything, or I'm staring at a house full of unfinished things.
	Okay.
	So when you are discussing your sort of history with me, do you think that you might have reason?
	To be angry at how you were raised?
	Yes.
	Okay.
	Do you experience any anger?
	Do you experience that about how you were raised?
	No.
	Okay.
	And why do you think if it would be just or right or fair to be angry at how you were raised, which it is, it would be, why do you think you don't experience it?
	I don't think I'm angry at how I was raised because I had a sense of freedom.
	I think I could do what I wanted to do.
	I really didn't.
	Nothing was really out of reach if I wanted it.
	It was presented to me.
	It was exciting.
	Man, you could talk some tripe, brother.
	Oh my God, you could talk some shit.
	Oh my God.
	I mean, you had a guy telling you he was going to kill you, breaking your mother's arms, a guy stalking you, handcuffing them to you.
	What do you say?
	You could do whatever you wanted.
	You had freedom.
	You were under threat for years.
	Like life, death threat.
	I mean, if somebody was at school threatening to kill your children, would you say to them, no, no, you're free.
	You've got nothing to be upset about?
	I don't know why it doesn't register.
	Like, man, you could talk some shit.
	And I say this with due respect.
	Like, good for you, man.
	I appreciate you trying to get that past me, but that's a hockey buck about the size of a dinner plate.
	That's just how I feel about it.
	I just don't, it's never really that one guy just, I feel rage.
	Oh, good.
	Okay.
	So that, that's a form of anger, right?
	It's like a, like a revenge kind of thing.
	Okay.
	So are you ready for the rubber to hit the road?
	This is going to be a little tough.
	Just so you know.
	Oh, yeah.
	Just do her.
	All right.
	Who is responsible for the violent men being in your life?
	Uh, my mom.
	Your mother.
	That's right.
	And, and all of the adults around, right?
	The adult.
	Like I was going to say family, but ultimately my mom.
	Right.
	So all the anger and rage and revenge that you feel towards these men has its source in who?
	Who are you really angry at?
	It would have to be the person responsible.
	Your mother.
	Right.
	Now, what is the maximum level of anger you have expressed as an adult towards your mother?
	Not a lot.
	Okay.
	So one to 10, one being a mild irritation, 10 being like, I don't know, yelling full voice.
	What have you got to with regards to your mother?
	Say that again, sir.
	Sorry.
	So, from one to 10, like one being mild annoyance, 10 being, I don't know, full voiced yelling, what number would you say is the maximum you've gotten?
	Like one, five, 10, two.
	Two.
	Okay.
	Three.
	All right.
	And how often have you gotten angry and expressed that anger towards your mother?
	It just is a couple of times.
	Okay.
	Who else is responsible for your childhood?
	Me?
	No.
	No, we're never responsible for our childhood.
	We don't choose what family we're born into, right?
	We just try and survive whatever we're born into.
	I guess that'd be my donor.
	Your father, right?
	Yeah.
	Okay.
	Your father as well, right?
	He should have, he knew your mother was very unstable, right?
	Yeah.
	Okay.
	So he should have checked in.
	You can't just walk away, right?
	Right.
	And there were other adults as well who should have helped out, right?
	And shouldn't have just mocked you for being a white guy.
	Right.
	Now, you and I both know that if anyone did 0.01% of what was done to you to one of your children, you'd be murderous.
	I'm not saying you would kill someone, but you would want to.
	I would.
	I would.
	But yeah, correct.
	Okay.
	So this is the disconnect.
	Where does all the anger go that you feel towards how you were raised?
	If you don't feel it, where does it go?
	To everyone else.
	To everyone else.
	Where does it go?
	Well, I keep most of it inside, I guess.
	I self internalize it.
	Okay.
	So, anger not applied to its proper object goes to other objects of convenience.
	So, I mean, the typical example I'm sure you've seen this cartoon the boss yells at the dad.
	Does the dad yell back at the boss?
	No.
	No.
	What does he do?
	He goes home, and what happens?
	He'll take it out on his family.
	Yeah.
	He'll yell at his wife.
	Now, if his wife is scared of him, does the wife yell back at her husband?
	No, she yells at the eldest child.
	The eldest child yells at the youngest child.
	The youngest child kicks the cat, right?
	Right.
	So if you feel angry, but you cannot express your anger, or you won't express your anger, it goes to a convenient object, like the psycho who smashed your Nintendo controller or put his fist through the table because you weren't getting the math, right?
	It's a convenient object.
	It's like if you put a dam on a river, it doesn't stop the flow of water.
	It just pushes it elsewhere, right?
	If it, if it can flow around or whatever it is, or it just gathers up if you build a really high dam, right?
	But it doesn't stop the flow of water.
	It just shapes, reshapes it.
	So what happens to anger that we don't feel towards its proper object, which is why I was probing so hard about how you could just break bread and be cordial to your grandmother who horribly abused your mother and your mother who horribly abused you.
	Well, are you allowed to get angry at your mother?
	Of course.
	Okay, were you allowed to get angry at your mother when you were growing up?
	Okay.
	What would have happened in your mind's eye, or what did you fear would happen if you expressed anger at your mother?
	Because you were certainly allowed to express anger at other people, right?
	You got into fights, you beat up the guy with your friends who stole your mother's jewelry, and so on.
	So you absolutely could express your anger.
	But what would have happened if you'd have gotten really angry at your mother and said, Stop bringing these lunatic psycho assholes into the house?
	What would it be?
	I would have been maybe reprimanded, or maybe I would have been scared I would see her less than I already do.
	What would she have done if you had said that?
	Would she have said, you know what?
	You've really got a point.
	I've got to figure this stuff out because this is not good for you, and it's certainly not good for me.
	Would she have been reasonable about it?
	I think so.
	I don't think so.
	You knew her very well.
	And are children born being honest with their upset?
	In other words, do babies cry?
	Yeah.
	Right.
	So we are born having a full channel to express our upset, right?
	Yeah.
	And you certainly could express your anger in other circumstances and situations.
	Why could you not express your anger towards your mother?
	What did you fear would happen if you expressed your anger with your mother?
	I don't know.
	I just never was, ever had outbursted like that with her.
	Maybe she would have.
	But you understand that you had every reason to, right?
	She kept bringing these dangerous lunatics who could have fucking killed you.
	And threatened to, she brought these men into her house and had sex with them and kept them around to your understanding.
	Now, of course, as adults, we can look back and say her child, but I'm talking about your childhood understanding.
	Right.
	So, is it fair to say you had reason to be angry with your mother for not choosing a better father for you?
	This long haired doofus who's like, hey, what did he call you?
	Pipsqueak squirt?
	No, it was something else.
	Munchkin.
	Munchkin.
	Thank you.
	Thank you.
	Hey, Munchkin, what's up?
	Right.
	So, she bought these.
	She had a sad sack of a dad for you.
	She brought army guy.
	She brought weightlifting guy.
	She brought psycho guy.
	Well, they're all kind of psycho, right?
	And this was years and years and years of your childhood, right?
	It was my childhood.
	Yeah.
	So you got really good reason to be angry with your mother and your grandmother, right?
	So why not express it?
	And please understand, I'm not criticizing you.
	I think it was very wise that you didn't express it, but you have to know why.
	Why didn't you say anything?
	Why are you willing to say anything?
	To beat a guy up with your friends for stealing some stupid jewelry, which doesn't really matter, but a guy who threatens your life, you can't even get angry at him.
	Well, him, obviously not, because he'll fucking kill you, but why can't you get angry at your mother for bringing this lunatic into your house and leaving you alone with him for a lot of time?
	Because she's working three jobs and he's kind of hanging around like a lazy lout, right?
	So you got reason to be angry with your mom.
	Why did my childhood have to be so fucking terrifying and dangerous because you like banging criminals?
	It's selfish on her part.
	If she's got a fetish for criminals, she shouldn't bring them home.
	Everybody knows that, right?
	That's not subtle.
	That's not complicated, right?
	It's not quantum physics.
	So, you have every reason to be angry at your mother who indulged her sexual tastes in violent men, which we can have some sympathy for, obviously, right?
	I mean, she was sexually assaulted as a teenager on the streets and sexually assaulted at home by these creepy men that.
	But so we can have sympathy, but we can also say she knows exactly what it's like to be on the receiving end, so she should make sure she never reproduces it for her own children, right?
	Right.
	So she had responsibility there too, as well as we can understand the trauma.
	But I'm not a Domino's guy.
	I'm not a determinism guy.
	The fact that these things happened to your mother could have made her very protective, not put you in the same fucking danger.
	Or maybe even worse, danger.
	Right?
	So, why was it impossible to express any anger towards your mother?
	Because if you had expressed anger, let's just play this one out.
	If you had expressed anger towards your mother, and said, Mom, Whatever you're doing with these men, stop it.
	Get them the fuck out of the house.
	They're going to get one of us killed.
	I don't care what makes you tingle, Mom.
	You've got to stop this shit.
	You've got to.
	And if you don't, if you don't get these men out of the house and stop bringing more in, I'm calling the cops.
	I'm calling Child Protective Services.
	I'm getting somewhere else.
	Right now, if you put your foot down with your mom, and again, this is a pure fantasy, right?
	What was your fear?
	Of being abandoned?
	Well, that's what I'm asking.
	You had a reason for not doing it.
	We need to know what that reason is.
	Otherwise, your behavior is incomprehensible.
	And it's not incomprehensible.
	We just don't know the reason.
	Because social services would take me away from my mom, like they did to my cousin.
	Okay.
	So let's say you were facing down a guy who was threatening to murder you, if I remember rightly.
	He said, I'll cut your head off, right?
	Yeah.
	Okay.
	Help me understand your mother took to the streets to survive her hellscape.
	Why is social services worse than a guy threatening to saw your head off, ISIS style?
	I don't know.
	I know, but it's an interesting question, right?
	Yeah, I don't know why.
	I'm just not.
	I don't know.
	Okay, let me try another one.
	Let's game this one out.
	So, we'll call the truly psycho guy who threatened to cut your head off, let's call him Bob.
	All right.
Fear of Violence 00:14:38
	Now, if you had gone after Bob threatened to saw your head off and smashed the table, threw you up the stairs, if you had gone to your mom and said, get him out, what were you concerned would happen?
	What might have happened now with a dull understanding looking back?
	What might Bob have done?
	Bob would have been your mom said, Bob, you're out.
	My son won't put up with our relationship.
	He would have killed us.
	Right.
	So, one of the reasons you didn't get angry at your mom because he could have killed you, set fire to the house, and taken off for the prairies, right?
	Correct.
	Okay.
	So, you did not get angry at your mother for fear of murder, right?
	Or he might murder her, kidnap you, whatever, right?
	I mean, and for those, you know, for people listening to this later, like, this is not theoretical, this is not paranoid.
	This is real stuff.
	Because, I mean, he went on a violent spree later after being hunted by your family, right?
	Yeah.
	Or in the process of being hunted by your family.
	Okay.
	So, what about Soldier Boy, the military guy who kind of lost it towards the end, who was in the gang, the motorcycle gang?
	If he, a highly trained killer, who was spider walking above you in the ceiling in some completely ring based crypto manner, What might he have done if your mom kicked him to the curb?
	And he said, Well, why?
	And she says, Oh, my boy here doesn't want the relationship.
	He's scared of you.
	He thinks you're a dangerous lunatic.
	Then what happens?
	He left.
	Yes.
	It wasn't because I said it, but she, he was a danger.
	And she said, Pick one.
	And he picked the other.
	And he left.
	Sorry, pick one?
	I don't know what that means.
	Well, pick your lifestyle of.
	Of bikers and violence, or pick my son and I, and he picked violence.
	Okay.
	That was your mother being assertive.
	Now, so he could have been gotten out if you'd gotten angry with your mother, right?
	Correct.
	Now, he was the first, Bob was the second, Weightlifter Guy was the third.
	Do I have that right?
	Yes.
	Okay.
	What about Weightlifter Guy?
	What if.
	He, with the drug dealing, the cocaine, does not help people make very good decisions.
	Cocaine guy, weightlifter guy, steroid guy.
	What if your mother had tossed his ass out on your say so?
	He was clingy, but he wasn't allowed back.
	And I think he would have respected her wishes because he never came back and he never did what the other guy did.
	Right, he went to prison.
	Maybe that's why he didn't come back.
	Sorry to be annoying.
	But ultimately, yeah, because after doing eight years, almost 10 years.
	Okay, so from a child's perspective, was it very dangerous to get angry with your mother?
	She was never violent to me, so I could have.
	It wasn't dangerous.
	My mom, I didn't feel danger.
	With her?
	Well, a danger for children is not violence.
	What is the greatest danger for children?
	Abandonment.
	Right.
	We can survive being beaten up.
	We can't survive being abandoned because children cannot survive in the wild, right?
	And even if we were to somehow survive in the wild on our own, we can't reproduce because there's no other people around, right?
	So our genes fear abandonment and rejection worse than violence.
	Yes.
	So I'm sure that you were afraid of violence towards your mother.
	And you were afraid that these psychos would be violent towards your mother.
	And of course, the death of a parent starts every stupid Disney film and also is akin to a death threat against a child.
	But the real danger for children is maternal abandonment, maternal rejection.
	Right.
	So if you'd have said to your mother, you cannot date because all the men you choose are terrible and you owe your child security, which you cannot provide because.
	Your romantic desires, to put it as nicely as possible, run in extremely the wrong direction.
	So you have to swear to me that you will stop dating.
	No guys for you.
	Put down the hormones, take a step back from the bed, and take a cold shower for the next 10 years.
	If you say to your mother, choose between sex and dating and me, what would she choose?
	Or what were you afraid that she would choose?
	And we have evidence for this, by the way.
	We have proof, actually.
	What did your mother choose knowing it was bad for you?
	Let me know if we're still on.
	Oh, did his Bluetooth run out of power?
	Well, that's a shame.
	Hopefully he will return.
	Are you there?
	Yes, I'm here.
	Can you hear me?
	Did you hear what I said?
	I did not.
	Go ahead.
	Oh.
	Well, she would have just chosen more of the same.
	Right.
	So your mother was choosing sex with criminals over your safety.
	She was willing to put your life on the line to satisfy her sexual desires.
	That is the most horrifying kind of rejection that you could have.
	Like you could understand some godforsaken situation, you know, some Le Miserable situation where some woman has to become a prostitute in order to give her child food and so on, but she didn't need to do that.
	This was lust.
	And again, tormented, tortured, terrible childhood, but I'm talking about your view and perspective as a child.
	As a child, how did you explain to yourself, I'm not saying you do this consciously, how did you explain to yourself why your mother was bringing these brutal sex toys into the house?
	Why would she do it?
	Why would she put your life at risk?
	Why would she bring these men home?
	What were your thoughts or feelings about that?
	Why?
	Why are these men here?
	Why are these terrifying, violent, dangerous, horrifying men in my mother's bed?
	Why are they in my house?
	I don't know.
	I know you don't know, but as a child, the greatest danger in your life, which could have easily ended your life, Was brought home by your mother.
	Why did you think at the time?
	What was the reason for these men being in your life, threatening your life?
	There was no rhyme or there's no logic to it.
	I don't know.
	I just was surviving.
	Okay.
	If your mother had loved you, would she have brought these men home?
	I guess not.
	I mean, your mom says she loves you.
	No, no, I don't care what she says.
	Anyone can say anything.
	I'm a chameleon.
	Oh, look, I'm still the same color.
	All right.
	If your mother had loved you, would she have brought these men home?
	If I loved my children, I won't bring that person home.
	If your mother had loved you, sorry to be annoying, if your mother had loved you, would she have brought these men home?
	If your mother had loved you, would she have made sure that men she brought home were safe around her children or her child?
	Sorry.
	If she loved me, yes.
	If your mother loved you, would she ask you, Hey, how's it going with Bob?
	Are you guys doing okay?
	What's happening?
	Is he good to you?
	Does he treat you well?
	If your mother had loved you, would she have asked or given a shit about what your experience was of her psycho boyfriends?
	You've gone quiet again, unless you're saying something I can't hear.
	Sorry, sorry.
	It was never a topic.
	Okay, that's very abstract.
	I'm sorry to be annoying.
	I know, I just, we never had the conversation.
	If your mother had loved you, would she have made sure you were safe by asking you questions after bringing these dangerous criminals that she knew were dangerous criminals home?
	Yeah.
	Ergo, she did not love you.
	Simple as I'm an empiricist.
	I don't care what people say.
	By your fruits.
	Shall ye judge them?
	Your mother did not love you.
	That's why you couldn't get angry at her.
	Because love is the container for anger.
	My wife and I love each other.
	We can get angry with each other knowing it will not disturb our love.
	And in fact, not being honest with each other will harm our love.
	Because the only reason we're not honest with people is because we are frightened of them.
	Right?
	The boss yells at the man.
	The man doesn't yell at the boss because he's frightened of getting fired, right?
	We are not honest with people and we can't get angry with them if we're frightened of them.
	And your mother was terrifying.
	Not only did she not love you, she brought home rabid animals to growl and threaten and snap at you continually.
	She was the source of terror, death threats.
	Danger, handcuffs, stalking, threats, and the incipient scent of murder in the air.
	So, you couldn't get angry at her because her indifference to you and her satanic lusts were putting you in mortal danger.
	And she knew that.
	And she didn't care.
	And you wonder why you have anger at the world?
	The world is easier to get angry at than your mother.
	You know who else is easier to get angry at than your mother?
	Yourself.
	Yourself.
	It's safer.
	It's safer.
	That's why I asked, What does your mother think of her parenting?
	Has your mother ever apologized for terrorizing you with the feral products of her devilish lusts, for bringing in men who threatened to murder you?
	Because at the very beginning, do you remember saying to me, Oh, yeah, my mom and I were just laughing the other day.
	Haha, we had to move to 50 different places.
	Do you remember saying that?
	Yes.
	Do you see how disconnected that is from the actual reality of the situation?
	Yes.
	Why can't you get angry at your mother now or for the past 30 years since you became an adult?
	I don't know.
	Well, if you think about getting angry with your mother now, listen, and please understand, I'm not saying what you should or shouldn't do.
	I'm just talking about it as a mental exercise.
	If you think about getting angry at your mother now, or if she was on this call and I was talking to her in this manner, what do you feel when you think about being honest with your mother?
	I think about being honest.
	I'm absent of emotion and I feel I'll be trying to convey precise moments of our history.
	Okay, let me ask it a different way.
	Did you teach your children that honesty is a virtue?
	Yes, I've always been very honest and wanted the same.
	Okay, so you teach your children to tell the truth, right?
	Right.
	Have you ever said to your children something like this?
	I don't care how bad it is, I'll be more upset if you lie to me.
	I've said that, yes.
	Sure.
	So tell the truth to me no matter what.
	I will be the most upset not at what you tell me, but if you lie to me.
	Does that make sense?
	Correct.
	Okay.
	Do you like it in business when people con you or lie to you or steal from you or don't pay their legitimate bills?
	Yeah, it's not a.
	Not a nice thing to do.
	It's a bad thing, right?
	So it's very important to tell the truth.
	The worst thing to do is to lie, right?
	That's what you tell your children.
	I mean, if you put a dent in the car, I want you to tell me.
	If I find out about the dent in the car and found that you lied to me, I would be more upset at the lie than the dent in the car or knocking over the lamp or breaking the fridge or whatever happens, right?
	Right.
	The worst thing is dishonesty.
	Now, what if your children don't actively lie to you, but hide things and lie by omission?
	Still lying.
	It's still lying, and you would rather them tell the truth, right?
	Yeah, I've always tried to create a very safe space to just tell me.
	So, telling the truth to your parents is very important, and lying either directly or by omission is one of the worst things, right?
	Right.
	So, why do you not tell the truth to your mother about the negative experiences you had as a child?
	Is that not lying by omission?
	Uh, yeah, I've omitted.
	I just, yeah, I don't, uh, maybe it's about trying to make her feel worse than she already does.
	Well, then you should tell your children that.
	You should say, listen, if you can imagine a scenario where you telling the truth would make me feel bad, I really want you to lie to me.
	Is that what you tell your kids?
	No, of course not.
	Okay, so let's not make up this nonsense with your mother.
	Why don't you tell your mother the truth?
	I don't know.
	Sure, you do.
	No, no, you're a smart guy.
	You've listened to me off and on for a while.
	You know why.
	I'm not saying you know consciously.
	What is the feeling that comes up?
	Let's say.
	I had your mom's number.
Honesty With Mother 00:15:54
	I should have faked this.
	No, I wouldn't do that.
	I got your mom's number to patch your mom in, man.
	We're going to get your mom in on this conversation right now.
	And we're going to tell her everything that happened to you as a child.
	And we're going to get these fucking corpses out of the ground and deal with them in the sunlight.
	When I'm dialing, beep, beep, be To your parents, it's the most important thing because that's what you told to your kids.
	So, if you have no fear and there's no negative emotion in doing it, you would have already done it so you wouldn't be a rank hypocrite by doing the opposite of what you tell your children is the right thing to do.
	So, that's bullshit.
	I'm not saying you're lying.
	I'm just saying that deep down, that's bullshit.
	If it meant nothing to you to tell these things to your mother, you would have told them just on principle.
	Let's try that again.
	Beep, Right?
	Mom's here.
	And I say, listen, Mrs. So and so, we're going to talk about what happened to your son because there's a lot you don't know about, man.
	The boys, the men that you brought home threatened his life, threatened to murder him, destroyed property, stalked him, taught him how to kill people at the age of eight.
	You brought home some serious fucking lunatic woman, and they fucked up your kid pretty bad.
	And we're going to talk about it.
	And what do you feel if I were to say that to your mom?
	A bit of relief.
	Fantastic.
	Then you should go and talk to your mom about this stuff.
	Because if it's going to make you feel relief and there's no negative emotions, you should get it off your chest.
	You can't do it.
	I mean, she's old now, right?
	Well, no, she's not that old.
	Sorry.
	Keep forgetting how young she was as a mother.
	So, you know, you could get this done.
	So, why haven't you?
	I believe it's the situation of her health.
	And you've had 30 years.
	Yeah, I just, I don't know.
	30 years, you've lied to your mother.
	Just say it.
	30 years, you've lied to your mother, right?
	And you've withheld the truth of your experience and you've withheld from her the consequences of her actions.
	Why?
	And please, I'm not accusing you.
	Like, this isn't a why did you do this terrible thing?
	I'm genuinely curious why would you lie to your mother for 30 years?
	I'm thinking, sir.
	I'm trying to dig deeper.
	Would you like the answer?
	I would like your assessment, yes.
	Sure.
	The answer is, and you're quite right, you're quite right and wise to call that an assessment, not an answer.
	But I'll call it an answer because I'm pretty confident.
	Could be wrong, obviously.
	I could be both confident and wrong.
	That's philosophy.
	So the reason you haven't had this conversation is your mother really, really, really doesn't want to have this conversation.
	And you obey your mother.
	For fear of death by her boyfriends or abandonment by her.
	You comply with your mother.
	That's why I was asking earlier about how could you break bread with your grandmother who put your mother through this kind of hell and drove her out into the wilderness of the streets and the assaults and all of that at the age of 13 or 14 and didn't even call the cops.
	How could you break bread with such a fucking monster?
	Your mother really doesn't want to have this conversation with you.
	And you obey your mother.
	Just as when she says, treat my mother well, treat your grandmother well, don't bring anything up, don't talk about anything, don't criticize her, you're like, okay, okay, okay, mom, okay.
	To survive, you lie.
	I say this with no shred of judgment or criticism.
	I'm simply pointing out the pattern.
	It's like me saying, to survive the bear, you run.
	Right?
	That's not a judgment.
	That's just a fact.
	To survive the shark, you get the fuck out of the water.
	To survive your mother, you lie.
	Because your mother has had 30 years to bring this topic up and she sure as shit doesn't want to.
	So you don't bring the truth up with your mother because your mother doesn't want the truth and you have to obey your mother or die.
	El Murta, right?
	You have to shut your mouth.
	That's very blog.
	Yeah.
	Snitches.
	That's very blog.
	Snitches and wind up in ditches, right?
	So it's like a crime family.
	Well, it is kind of a crime family.
	You're in a crime family.
	You were born into a crime family.
	That's true.
	So does the mafia want you to testify?
	Nope.
	What happens if you try?
	You die.
	And it doesn't change later.
	So silence is what is needed.
	To live and not die.
	And of course, biologically, we're programmed to live or not die.
	Or to put it another way, of course, all those children who were like, well, I'm going to tell the truth no matter what, they did not make it to adulthood at nearly the same rate as the children who shut the fuck up and swallowed it all.
	Correct.
	Your mother subjected you to years of torture and terrorizing and death threats and violence and stalking and running for years and years and years and years.
	That was her choice.
	She was an adult.
	That's why I asked earlier.
	She's 25 when Bob Psycho came along.
	So she was an adult.
	She has access to all of the Western resources, shelters, psychologists, social workers, child protective services, the police, all of whom would have lined up to help her.
	But nope, she chose to continue to have sex with satanically evil men at the expense of her child's.
	Sanity, security, self esteem, and any sense of safety whatsoever.
	Didn't matter.
	Suck it up, kid.
	Mommy likes the bad boys.
	Has she ever apologized for what she brought into the house and put in power over you?
	Yes.
	Okay.
	What has she said?
	Amongst talking about moving the 50 plus times, whatever, and brought up some of his rage and.
	All of the events, and she says, I really apologize.
	I didn't know that, not that it affected you that much, but she apologizes for being in that situation.
	What does that mean?
	Sorry, I don't understand what that means.
	I mean, she.
	You would say, you'd say to your kid, hang on, if there was an earthquake, you'd say to your kid, I'm sorry you were scared, but you wouldn't say, I'm sorry about the earthquake because you didn't make the earthquake, right?
	But your mother brought this guy in, knowing he was a violent criminal.
	So.
	What did she apologize for?
	I think it was just a general apology for me having to go through that.
	Okay.
	So, did she ask you what it was like for you to go through that?
	Did she inquire as to what it was like for you?
	Okay.
	Yeah, sorry, this shit went down.
	Man, it was tough having to move all that time.
	That's bad.
	Sorry about all of that.
	That was rough, man.
	Right, but no questions, no curiosity, right?
	And no true responsibility.
	I did that to you.
	I brought these guys in.
	That's on me.
	I can feel the weight lifting in my stomach and shoulders if your mom took responsibility, genuine responsibility.
	You were just trying to survive a shitty situation that I made for you, kid.
	I brought these lunatics in.
	I had real problems that I didn't address.
	I should have addressed them.
	And your childhood got completely screwed up with these violent psychos I kept inviting into my bed.
	And there's no excuse for it at all.
	And I'm really sorry.
	And I'm sorry that you demanded, I'm sorry that I demanded that you treat your grandmother well, who did me as horrifyingly a set of evils as has ever been done to anyone.
	And I made you be pleasant to her.
	And I'm sorry that I spent 30 years not asking you about this because that puts a hell of a burden on you.
	And that would be the beginning of a conversation that would last for months.
	Did you see what I mean?
	Yes.
	You've got one 5% apology in 30 years.
	Is that right?
	Yeah.
	That's nothing.
	It's almost worse than nothing.
	I'd actually would have preferred, personally, I would have preferred if she hadn't apologized at all, because then at least you could say, well, she doesn't even know that she has anything to apologize for, but she does.
	It also means that her current partner of 15 years.
	Has never heard these stories and said, Holy shit, balls, man, we got to talk to this kid.
	I mean, not that you're a kid, but we got to talk to this man.
	I mean, you've never asked him his perspective of it.
	You've never asked him how he handled it or he dealt with it or what happened to him.
	So he's messed up too.
	I mean, I guess they don't fight.
	Maybe he's not a criminal, but he's still messed up.
	Doesn't have any empathy.
	Can I let you down a little bit there?
	He's.
	He's an alcoholic as well.
	Oh, God.
	Yeah, okay.
	Yeah, okay.
	Well, listen, I mean, I'll just tell you this straight up, man.
	These feelings will persist until you have a conversation, until you put the responsibility where the responsibility lies.
	You didn't invite these men into your mother's bed.
	You didn't invite these men into your life.
	Your mother is, and again, we can look at her childhood, we can have sympathy, but I'm talking about your perspective as a child where you don't know any of this stuff.
	And your mother is still being selfish because it is chaotic and unpleasant for you that she has an alcoholic.
	As a partner, right?
	Or a husband.
	But she doesn't care.
	She gets the sex, the security, the money, whatever it is.
	She doesn't care.
	What has she done to benefit you emotionally over nearly five decades?
	I don't mean materially, emotionally.
	What empathy has she shown?
	What curiosity has she shown to you in almost 50 years?
	I mean, well, I've gone through my life struggles just as someone to listen.
	Like, I want to tell her things about my marriage, but I mean, Other than that, I mean, there's been no therapeutic release.
	I'm going to, it's not therapeutic release.
	Nobody's asking her to be Carl Jung.
	I'm just talking about asking you about your childhood.
	I mean, I don't know you from Adam.
	I don't, hang on.
	I don't know you from Adam.
	We spent over two and a half hours talking about your childhood.
	I mean, you've had 30, you've had, I mean, almost 50 years, or we could say since you were an adult or since you were a kid, you've had 40 years, 40 years to do what we just did in two and a half hours.
	If that didn't happen, it's because she doesn't want it to happen.
	She's desperate for it not to happen.
	And if parents don't take responsibility for how they screwed up the kids, the kids self attack.
	Her not having this conversation means you get to self attack and feel chaotic and have a very tough time pair bonding and forming relationships.
	And this is why I asked earlier about the emotional availability.
	Because your mother won't take responsibility, you are disconnected from your emotions because you're still protecting her, which means shielding yourself from your own primary experiences.
	As a child, and all the thoughts that you've had since.
	So, you have to stay distant from yourself in order to appease your mother.
	This screws up your relationships.
	There it is.
	That's right.
	That was it.
	That makes sense.
	And that she's still doing it to you.
	That makes sense.
	Now, you said she's got health issues.
	I mean, is she on death's door or what's going on?
	I think so.
	She's deteriorating pretty quick and advanced osteoarthritis and found a spot in her lung.
	She can't move.
	Very well.
	Like a spot, like a tumor?
	Yeah, she said cancer twice, and this might be another situation.
	Was she a smoker?
	Did she take the Vax?
	No.
	Okay.
	She's not still smoking, is she?
	Oh, of course.
	Oh, she's still smoking.
	Okay.
	Of course.
	That's like, I've always thought that when my mom passes and she doesn't feel any more pain, I can relax.
	Well, I haven't talked to my mother in 30 years, and my father's dead.
	It is not the distance that gives you the peace, it's the honesty.
	It is worth listening.
	I can't tell you what to do.
	I can only tell you what I would do in your shoes.
	And of course, that is not any kind of perfect action at all, right?
	I'm not any standard by which people should say, do this, right?
	I'll just tell you what I would do and what I have done.
	My mother is poorly and sickly and so on.
	I just probed for the conversations.
	I just started talking about the past, right?
	And I started talking about some of my experiences.
	And, you know, it's funny.
	I shouldn't laugh, but it's been so long ago now.
	This is like, Close to 30 years ago.
	My mother is, oh, she's just so frail, right?
	She's just, oh, she's sickly, she's frail, but oh my God, you cross her, what do you think comes out?
	Oh, just evil.
	Well, there's a lot of energy there suddenly.
	Woo!
	Let me tell you this, man.
	She's like a laser.
	Burns through tank hide with that.
	I mean, yeah, if you ever want to cure my mother's dysthymia, just contradict her.
	And full ferocity kicks into action and she gains the superpowers of 10 Supermans.
	Superman?
	Superman.
	Right?
	So you could just probe a little.
	Remember this guy?
	Holy crap, he was crazy.
	What was he doing in her house?
	Like, why was he there?
	I don't understand.
	Well, I met him and blah, blah, blah.
	But didn't you know he was in a gang?
	Like, just think, like, you're not immediately saying, wait, guy threatened to kill me and, like, threw me up the stairs and, you know, like, just try to understand what he was doing there and don't let her bullshit you.
	Yeah, that military guy, you knew he was in a gang.
	The steroid guy, you knew that he was a coke addict.
	Like, help me.
	What would they do?
	Oh, it's so long ago.
	What does it matter?
	It matters to me.
	I mean, if we can do a quick role play on that, or you can just take the suggestion as a whole.
	But I would say, you know, I mean, asking her a couple of questions isn't going to kill her.
	I wouldn't go in full tilt boogie, and I wouldn't go in with, you know, full emotional intensity because, you know, you want to, you know, you don't want to jump on the ice.
	You want to give it a couple of toe thrusts first, right?
	Correct.
	But see what it's like when you have some questions of your mother.
	See how she handles it.
	She might be relieved to talk about it.
	It might be something that she's tormented about that you can release her from before she dies.
	It might be a very good and healthy thing.
	Well, I think that the truth and honesty is healthy no matter what.
	If she can handle it, fantastic.
	Man, you guys can have some really great conversations that is going to dial down this kind of inchoate anger that you've got floating around, free floating because it can't find a place to land.
	And if she can't handle it, if she gets ferocious, if she gets avoidant, if she gets angry, if she storms out, if she bursts into tears, if she becomes self pitying, pulls all the manipulative chameleon bullshit, then you'll just realize that you didn't talk to her because she won't accept any truth or reason.
	And then that can give you some peace too that now you know why.
	Now you know why you never brought the truth up.
	Does that make sense?
	Absolutely.
Healthy Truth Telling 00:03:14
	All right.
	Well, I'm invested now, man.
	I hope you'll keep me posted about how it's going.
	Yeah.
	Well, like I said before, like, don't talk to me again.
	This is, I respect all the work that you do and subscribing monthly and just the access to everything you have online is moving in a direction of filling my head with proper input versus current media, et cetera.
	Yeah.
	And the next time that we speak, it will definitely be a paid engagement because I value your expertise and I think you deserve it.
	Well, I appreciate that.
	And listen, I just really want to say, brother, I'm sorry for the whole family tree.
	I am.
	I am incredibly sorry since I'm talking to you about all of this.
	I mean, you're a father, I'm a father.
	I mean, you're four times the father I am.
	I only have one kid.
	But I was pretty ferocious about child abuse in the past, but now I've been a father for 17 years.
	Plus years, I'm even more ferocious because I imagine all of this happening to my daughter.
	I'm sure this is why I brought your children into it.
	It's so wrong what was done to you as a child.
	I'm so sorry you should never have had to face any of that level of violence.
	And listen, I have no doubt that it gave you some good skills.
	Absolutely.
	Absolutely.
	It gave you some good skills.
	I think there are slightly better and more peaceful ways to achieve them, but it gave you some good skills.
	It obviously gave you some toughness, robustness, and so on.
	But I don't want you.
	To go through the next 30 years of your life and end up close to 90 or close to 80.
	Yeah, I mean, yeah, close to 80 having not been loved.
	I really, really want you to be loved.
	But in order to be loved, you're going to have to stop attacking yourself.
	You can't love someone who attacks themselves.
	And in order to stop attacking yourself, I think you need a direct conversation with your mother, if that makes sense.
	And I just really wanted to say how sorry I am.
	So sorry.
	And now I'm interrupting you.
	Go ahead.
	Yeah, I just, why, why, I reached out because the therapist that, That have been bounced around and no one has an answer, or they know the next best person that can best handle a situation.
	And I reached out because it's a now or never feeling for me.
	And I've met a wonderful woman.
	I've got so many possibilities, I've got so many skills.
	And I just, this failure to launch is killing me.
	Right.
	And hard.
	It's difficult to, because you can't put a finger on it.
	Being distant from my emotions to protect my mom is a big, it's a war of words, and being able to put them in the proper order is the game at hand.
	And thank you for achieving that this round.
	All right.
	Well, big hugs, brother.
	Keep me posted.
	And I absolutely wish you the best.
	And no matter what happens, even if we never talk again formally, I hope you'll drop me a line and let me know how it's going.
	But of course, I'd always be happy to chat again.
	Absolutely.
	Thank you, sir.
	Take care.
	Good night.
	Good night.

Chapters

00:00:00 First Listener Message
00:03:00 Family History Revealed
00:18:15 Mother's Past Exposed
00:21:28 Verbal Abuse Details
00:24:49 Feeling Vulnerable Now
00:30:09 Financial Success Story
00:32:45 Child Support Reality
00:40:37 Attention Seeking Behavior
00:43:26 Observer Not Participant
00:47:10 Understanding the Gap
01:02:42 Emotions Stay Subdued
01:05:06 Dangerous Men Arrive
01:17:20 Family Money Struggles
01:32:29 Expressing Anger Now
01:47:56 Fear of Violence
02:02:34 Honesty With Mother
02:18:29 Healthy Truth Telling