June 6, 2025 - Freedomain Radio - Stefan Molyneux
04:59
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| Time | Text |
|---|---|
| Okay, if there is a God, what is the purpose of life? | |
| Well, in the Christian tradition, the purpose of life is to engage in voluntary, upward, self-sacrifice, so that the kingdom of heaven can be established on earth. | |
| So you're trying to make it to heaven and avoid hell? | |
| Yes, that's a good way of thinking about it. | |
| What is the purpose of heaven? | |
| Do you understand? | |
| At minimum, it's the opposite of endless suffering. | |
| How about that? | |
| Okay. | |
| And so should we... | |
| I don't think that that question is relevant to the concept of heaven, because happiness is the end goal of human activity as a whole, or at least self-satisfaction. | |
| And so it's like saying, if you're trying to get home, what's the purpose of trying to get home when you're home? | |
| Well, the purpose of trying to get home when you're home is no longer valid. | |
| It's been shed like a So what's the purpose of getting home when you're home? | |
| Well, there is no purpose of getting home when you're home, and there is no purpose to heaven, because it's already infinite pleasure. | |
| not try to achieve infinite suffering on planet earth and if we can achieve infinite suffering on planet earth without avoiding it if we can do that without god and that does that defeat your claim well if we can avoid infinite suffering on earth without god *phew* Yeah, except that it doesn't. | |
| You circumvented my initial definition, because I said that, by definition, God was the unified source of morality. | |
| Wait, the unified source of morality or the unified basis for morality? | |
| Ah, source and basis are not the same thing. | |
| Basis is a foundation. | |
| Source is a passive, like the source of a river is a passive entrance. | |
| All right. | |
| If we engage in a moral exercise People are saying there is a God. | |
| It's more specific than that. | |
| Well, so let me ask you this. | |
| So if there is a God and there is a moral code and it doesn't come at your benefit, are you going to follow it? | |
| Wait, what? | |
| Sorry, I lost this thing there. | |
| Is a God and there is a moral code and it doesn't come at your benefit, are you going to follow it? | |
| And there is a God. | |
| It's more specific than that. | |
| Well, so let me ask you this. | |
| So if there is a God and there is a moral code and it doesn't come at your benefit, are you going to follow it? | |
| Well, of course, because the benefit is your soul. | |
| So your, for the atheist, means you as an individual mortal being. | |
| Your, for the Christian, is your soul. | |
| And the purpose of your soul, if it's massive suffering to get to heaven, then that's just like a little bit of dental drilling to save your teeth, right? | |
| Are you going to follow it? | |
| Well, for the Christian, yes, because it gets me to heaven. | |
| Freedomain.com slash donate to help out the show, by the way. | |
| I haven't even really been keeping track of donations, but I don't think they're flowing in, and I'm working fairly hard here. | |
| It depends on how you define your benefit. | |
| If it's going to come at your expense, would you still follow it? | |
| If God came down and said, here is my moral code, and you should follow it, but even if you follow it, you are still going to end up in hell. | |
| Are you going to follow it? | |
| Okay, so these are theoreticals that just don't make any sense at all. | |
| Here's my moral code: so God says If God came down and said, here is my moral code, and you should follow it, but even if you follow it, you are still going to end up in hell. | |
| No, because God can't do that, because to punish people for following virtue would be immoral, and God can't do that by definition. | |
| Are you going to follow it? | |
| Well, that was the question that was put to Job and to Christ, right? | |
| Because they were required to... | |
| They were required to withstand trials that would break anyone and maintain their upward orientation regardless. | |
| And they did that with the motivation of believing that this omnipotent, all-loving God would somehow turn it into a benefit. | |
| So they still did it solely for their benefit. | |
| Hang on, hang on. | |
| Let's define benefit. | |
| Like, if I did something for your sister, would that be to your benefit? | |
| Like, how are you defining your benefit? | |
| Do you mean one of your whims gratified now? | |
| Or do you mean you and everyone you love and know over some reasonable span of time? | |
| So when you're talking about whims, I think you're talking about something that's more dopamine. | |
| When you're talking about morality, you're talking about something that's more serotonin and more ultimately satisfying. | |
| So now we're into biochemistry. | |
| Excellent. | |
| Instead of being programmed by the Ten Commanders, it's now programmed by dopamine and serotonin. | |
| Okay. | |
| You and I agree on a lot. | |
| I mean, when it comes to talking about how men should be masculine and things of that nature, you and I are 100% in agreement. | |
| We just don't agree on the justification that God is the only thing that provides morality. | |
| It's not a justification. | |
| It's a definition. | |
| What's the difference then? | |
| Between a definition and a justification. | |
| I mean, it's ultimately psychologically the same thing. |
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