Jan. 25, 2019 - Freedomain Radio - Stefan Molyneux
29:44
4289 HOAXED: EVERYTHING THEY TOLD YOU IS A LIE! Stefan Molyneux Interviews the Directors
www.hoaxedmovie.comStefan Molyneux interviews Scooter Downey and Jon du Toit about the new Mike Cernovich production "Hoaxed"We all know the feeling of logging onto the Internet and reading fake news stories. The latest fake news story is that Joy Reid’s computer was hacked by time travelers. Fake news is a simulation, that is, an artificial construct of reality. What we know as “the news” simply isn’t true.Hoaxed will break through the media Simulation.Hoaxed is a crowd-funded documentary produced by Cerno Films. Cernovich’s last film about free speech included icons like Alan Dershowitz, Candace Owens, and Scott Adams. Hoaxed, if you can believe it, has an even greater cast. (Adams is in Hoaxed, too.)Hoaxed has two directors hard at work editing 100+ hours of interviews with 25 luminaries.Including:Anthony ScaramucciCassie JayeAlex JonesGavin McInnesJordan PetersonLauren SouthernStefan MolyneuxScott AdamsMike CernovichTim PoolJames O'KeefeHawk NewsomeLuke Rudowski▶️ Donate Now: http://www.freedomainradio.com/donate▶️ Sign Up For Our Newsletter: http://www.fdrurl.com/newsletterYour support is essential to Freedomain Radio, which is 100% funded by viewers like you. Please support the show by making a one time donation or signing up for a monthly recurring donation at: http://www.freedomainradio.com/donate▶️ 1. Donate: http://www.freedomainradio.com/donate▶️ 2. Newsletter Sign-Up: http://www.fdrurl.com/newsletter▶️ 3. On YouTube: Subscribe, Click Notification Bell▶️ 4. Subscribe to the Freedomain Podcast: http://www.fdrpodcasts.com▶️ 5. Follow Freedomain on Alternative Platforms🔴 Bitchute: http://bitchute.com/stefanmolyneux🔴 Minds: http://minds.com/stefanmolyneux🔴 Steemit: http://steemit.com/@stefan.molyneux🔴 Gab: http://gab.ai/stefanmolyneux🔴 Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/stefanmolyneux🔴 Facebook: http://facebook.com/stefan.molyneux🔴 Instagram: http://instagram.com/stefanmolyneux
I am officially running for President of the United States, and we are going to make our country great again.
So help me God.
Congratulations, Mr. President.
How do we explain how this is possible?
How did this happen?
Since election day, questions have been raised about the role that false news stories distributed online played in the final result.
There's been a lot of talk lately about fake news.
Fake news.
Fake news.
Pope sites and hyper-partisan blogs.
A threat to democracy.
All media is narrative.
And we are in a war of narratives.
I think it's interesting to have someone like Mike doing a documentary about fake news because it's owning a term that has been directed at him.
Until it happens to you, you can't really understand how powerful the fake news is.
People who have been printed in the media a lot can start to identify who's fake news.
I've been lied about repeatedly.
My friends have been lied about.
Because they know their true story more than anyone.
I don't have to frame them.
I just have to talk about what they've done.
We are told by the media what the world is.
We are told what is right, what is wrong, what to believe, who to love, who to hate.
I think that the media will gin up controversy to create an environment of discontent.
There are people on both sides who just want us to go to war.
Congressman Steve Scalise has been shot.
The suspect was upset over the election of President Trump.
Falsehoods have consequences.
That's what makes them false.
Like, that's unbelievable.
I don't understand why I haven't heard of this.
In a way, the media is designed not to inform you, but to keep you uninformed.
I have over 3,000-4,000 friends on Facebook.
I've never seen that story publicly.
So as soon as they introduced the idea that news could be fake, it was turned against them almost immediately.
Now we're in a war with them to determine who's the real fake news.
Hi everybody, Stephen Molyneux from Freedomain.
I'm here with two guys I love to work with and whose work you are going to love to consume.
They are the directors of the incredible new movie about fake news, reality, truth, wisdom, suffering, and breakthrough to clarity called Hoaxed.
You can find the movie at HoaxedMovie.com.
That's HoaxedMovie.com.
It's up on the screen.
It's down in the links in the description bar or the low bar.
HoaxedMovie.com.
I'm talking about Scooter Downie and John Dutoy.
Thank you guys so much for taking the time today.
Thank you, Stephen.
So, let's start with the big picture view, the satellite view, if you will.
What is the movie about and why should people watch it?
The movie is about fake news.
I don't know if you've heard of that term, fake news.
It's been popularized by this guy, Donald Trump.
But yeah, the movie looks at the media, the way in which propaganda works, how humans are manipulated by our overlords, and also just the philosophical questions of what is truth and how do we as humans understand and know truth.
And John, how would you add to that?
Yeah, I would just say that it's a movie that looks at how the media basically constructs this false reality that a lot of people live in, and they make their decisions based on this reality, and they basically live their lives based on lies.
And obviously, that's not good for society, as you can see, just by looking at what's going on today.
So that's something that we want to help rectify, and we do that by sharing the truth.
And, you know, so people can break that false reality in their lives and search for truth.
So, Mike Cernovich is the producer, so when he first came to you with the project, let's do a film on fake news, you must have had some perception of fake news.
I mean, those of us who've been written about or who've had much engagement with the media, if we're not hard leftists, know what this is all about.
You had an idea about fake news to begin with, and how did that change over the course of interviewing people, putting the footage together, and making the movie?
Well, you know, for me personally, I've known for years now that the news media is biased.
It's fake.
It's, it's, it's basically, you know, it's, it's all about their narrative that they want to push on people.
So I haven't watched the mainstream news for years now.
So when we, when we started making this film and doing the research, I just got re, I got I just got re-angry, I guess.
It's not really a word, but I just got pissed off all over again, basically.
Re-energized in your rage.
Re-energized.
Re-energized, but in sort of an angry way, because you just see the lies are so blatant and it's so obvious.
Once you know how they operate, it's so obvious when you see it.
You turn on CNN, you see Don Lemon.
He's basically more like a preacher than he is a newsman, right?
Yeah, so that just showed me again how important this film really is.
Alright, and Scooter, did you want to add anything to that?
Your journey through the forest of fake news?
Yes, it was very similar to John.
I think as well, one of the main things that I learned is that it is a lot more organized than you would think.
Certainly a lot of it has to do with the cultural environment that The news organizations have their, you know, 90% of the journalists vote for Democrats in elections.
So there's a cultural pressure.
But what I learned mainly from making the movie is that it is a lot more manufactured.
It's a lot more organized by different political factions.
What we see in the news is a result of a lot of people that have an agenda.
It's not just bias.
It is not just It is deliberate political warfare.
Now, during the process of making the movie, I mean, whenever you get involved in a subject like I did something on Poland, you have this idea going in, you have this idea going through, and then you have this idea on the other end, which is probably closer to the accurate thing.
How did your perceptions of fake news change over this time frame?
It's interesting because You know, I actually have known for a long time that the news is, it's fake, you know, it's, it's just, um, you know, it's, it's basically they have an agenda that they, you know, that they want to push and it's just more narrative.
And, um, so I've known that for a while.
So I actually have not been watching, you know, the mainstream news for a few years at this point, but once we started editing this film and we had to do research, you know, I, I just got really pissed off just by the lies that are out there.
And it was just crazy.
And yeah, I mean, it's something I think, you know, if, if, you know, this film is meant for, you know, for normies, right?
For people who still, you know, watch the, you know, the news at six o'clock, that's where they get their information from.
This film was made for them.
And, you know, our hope is that they will just walk away from the mainstream news media and, you know, or not necessarily just walk away, but at least watch it with, You know the understanding that there's an agenda behind what they're seeing.
Well it's funny too because a lot of the ideas that come out of sort of the postmodern left is that you know reality is subjective and history is written by the winners and they kind of turn the past into this manufactured reality or they call it sometimes manufacturing consent.
But somehow that entire paradigm seems to vanish In the present, with news in the present, that people need to understand that, yeah, people have opinions, they have perspectives, they believe that they're fighting a big fundamental moral cause which allows them to bend the truth in the service of what they perceive to be the good.
It's kind of funny how, when I was studying history, oh yeah, the past is subjective, there's a lot of filtering, there's a lot, but the present, turn on the news man, you just see the facts.
Yeah, it's odd because Everyone knows that history is just a partial picture of what happened, because we have limited sources, but then all of a sudden, yeah, now, oh well, now we know the truth, and it's just, it's ridiculous, and yeah, the film is designed to, like, we've shown the film to people on the left, and they disagree with a lot of the stuff that's in the film, but
The presentation is such that it's like you're deriving general principles about what the media does, no matter if it's Fox News or if it's CNN.
And so I think everyone should come out of the film with a desire to seek the truth above all else.
That's that's really what I what I hope.
Yeah.
You know what we have?
We have Scott Adams in the film as well.
And, you know, he is a master of framing.
Right.
So he's in the film and that's what he talks about is framing.
And one of the things that he says is that if you're first, if your view of an event, if you're first out of the gate with that, it's very persuasive, right?
So with the news media, I mean, for how many decades now, they've had a monopoly on being first, and not just being first.
You know, they are basically the only ones who have their version of events out there.
Right.
So it's I think, you know, with the advent of the new media and being online and everything that is starting to break down now.
And that's what we're seeing, I think, at this stage.
There's an interesting dismantling of narratives that's happening in real time, and I've been doing this for like 11 or 12 years.
Back in the day, it took quite a while to undo a narrative that really began to accelerate with things like Trayvon Martin, and now we can see with this Covington High School debacle, with Nathan Phillips, the native activist, and what went on there.
It's really now sometimes only a matter of hours until the dominant narrative begins to disintegrate under the weight of its own contradictions and empirical evidence.
Do you think that can be more accelerated?
Do you think this film will help people to participate more in that process?
Well, once you understand the magic tricks that are happening, it does inoculate you from some of the BS that you see.
The Covington story is really interesting because they weren't just framing the issue in a misleading way.
There wasn't just bias in what they included and did not include.
It was literally the exact opposite of what they were saying.
Everything about the story was false.
And that was what I think is actually unique about that.
It's not... It is unique in that it was such a major screw-up.
That's why they are saying there was a rush to put this stuff out there.
Because they were so thrilled by this narrative.
It fit their narrative and they immediately just wanted to push it because it tickled all of their good places.
And so they wanted to put it out there.
But I find it unique in that it was not just wrong in certain parts.
It was the complete and exact opposite, which is actually more rare than the norm.
There's usually a kernel of truth in a story.
This had literally no kernel of truth at all.
Well, if we take Colonel to be a military analogy and the guy claiming to be a Vietnam vet, that's not even true for the Colonel aspect of things.
Sorry, John, you were going to say.
I was going to say, I mean, I think this is a watershed moment, really, because, you know, so many people just saw, you know, the lies, you know, in real time, basically, and it's lies because You know, the mainstream news, I mean, we know that they follow people like Mike Cernovich, you know, who is our producer.
They follow people like, for example, Ali and then there was Cassandra.
And they were basically saying, like, hang on, this story is fake right from the get go.
And they were doing the research and they were saying something's not right here.
You know, the New York Times is lying, all this stuff.
Right.
And these outlets and these journalists, they follow these people.
And they didn't say anything until, you know, it was such a backlash that they started, you know, to say, oh, well, you know, uh, we didn't know, you know, blah, blah, blah, blah.
And, and, you know, and then they started, um, you know, then it started, you know, basically retracting their, their lies.
So it just shows you that, you know, it's not just an honest mistake.
It's dishonest.
And, and I, a lot of people saw it this time.
And I think this is like.
It's a watershed moment.
You actually had to fast forward through a whole bunch of stuff to get to the meat that you wanted to promote a particular narrative.
It wasn't like some new video emerged after the fact.
It was all available from the very beginning.
So let me ask you this.
When you were interviewing the people in the film, and there's lots of wonderful people in the film, did you get a sense of What fake news does to individuals?
I'm thinking about Cassie J and Scott Adams.
I talked about it a little bit and of course Jordan Peterson has had his slings and arrows of outrageous language as well.
Did you get a sense of some of the personal damage that the craters in people's happiness that is left by some of these airstrikes of language?
Absolutely.
When you see when somebody has been the target of Fake news and, as they say, weaponized outrage.
It takes a huge toll on you and what I think is important for the viewers to take away, and this isn't really something that's in the film, but something I've been thinking about, which is When something like the Covenant thing happens, if you know this person, if you are their friend, or even you just support them, like if something happened to you, Stephan, has the media ever written anything false about you?
I don't know.
I don't know.
I'd have to check.
The important thing is to immediately show support and counter the lies with truth.
Because when you're in those moments where you're being swarmed and the mob is coming after you, Uh, to have friends back you up is, is the best.
And, you know, as we know from, uh, the gospel, usually people start scattering like sheep, uh, when, when the, when the mob comes for you.
And so that's something that isn't really in the film, but something I've been thinking about.
Well, it's funny because when you do get attacked in this kind of way, there is of course this desire that the enemies have to drive your friends away from you.
They say this right in the Alinsky thing, right?
To polarize, to isolate, and to radicalize in terms of people's perceptions of you.
And I think people do have this temptation, I've been susceptible to it too, where you say, I'll just take a step back.
I'll do the next one.
It's going to calm down.
But it's just inch by inch you lose ground.
And inch by inch you lose supporters.
And inch by inch you end up not having people who are going to cover your back if you're not willing to cover other people's back.
Yeah, it's so important.
And that's the thing too.
What I really liked about your last thing on Poland is, I think it's about halfway through, You sort of come to this realization that, you know, we need community.
It's important.
And, um, that's, that's what we need now, you know, and, and, and that's what we need, you know, when, you know, when the media attacks, one of us, we have to rally around that person.
And, and, and we, we have to fight back with the truth.
We have to find back with the right information and we not, you know, and it's, it's not just an act, you know, it's not just, um, you know, just saying, oh, this is wrong or whatever, but we, we have to do it skillfully as well.
And if people like Jack Basobic with his 4D warfare and that kind of thing, we have to wisen up on how to fight back properly.
I think the film is one part of that as well, actually.
Scooter, did you want to add anything to that?
No.
Now, let me ask you this.
Over the course of making the movie, Did you find that your perceptions shifted?
And which ones do you think shifted the most over the course of making the movie?
Two things jumped in my head.
One is I was, similar to John, my contempt for the media grew from making the film.
So I was in the same starting position.
So it's a lot, the problem is a lot worse than what I thought.
And the, The second thing is that even if you get somebody who's reasonable from the left to talk to you, for example, we talked to Hawk Newsome in the film, who's the leader of Black Lives Matter in New York.
It's still, we're at that point where the dialogue between the two sides, it's That window, I feel like it has closed in a way.
The hope with the movie is that it will be able to open up a dialogue, but where I'm at right now, I just don't, I see the dialogue happening in the war, but I don't see the information war, but I don't see there being a way for us to bridge, I don't know how to bridge that gap.
Because they won't sit down and talk, you know?
Like, you can't have a conversation if the other person doesn't want to talk to you.
Like that's the reality.
And so that's kind of where I am right now.
Yeah.
What I've, you know, um, in, in, in the process of making this film, I, um, it, it, it just become more clear to me how, you know, it's so organized, right.
This has been going on for decades.
It's not a new phenomenon.
Right.
So you basically have a problem that, um, you know, it's going to take at least one generation to fix.
Right.
And it's kind of a sobering thing to realize because, you know, we're at a pretty low, you know, yeah, like we're at a pretty low point right now in the culture.
Because if you go back to the 60s, you know, there was a lot of Marxist influence in the colleges.
And that's when we started to basically infiltrate the news media as well and all these institutions.
And now so many years later, you see the effects of that.
now we're saying, oh, we have to do something about it.
Well, it's kind of a little bit too late, probably.
I am kind of pessimistic about the future of the culture right now.
But that's no excuse to, you know, to not do anything, basically, right?
So, you know, you don't want it to become a self-fulfilling.
There's nothing that can be done, and therefore you don't do anything, and therefore there's nothing.
I think we all, those of us who are good with language, who are good communicators, really need to work as hard as possible to try and bridge this gap.
Because, you know, if it does turn into flames and chaos, that's terrible.
But I don't want that to be on my conscience that I could have said something or could have done something.
Maybe the best we can hope for is a clean conscience when things collapse at the moment, but that clean conscience is really, really important.
It is.
Absolutely.
It's the worst thing right now, just to sit back and let it go to waste.
We have to do what we can.
We have this funny thing now, of course, conversations like this, movies like this, the work that Mike does, and I do, and Scott does, and Cassie J., and Jordan Peterson, and Scaramouche, all of those people.
Do amazing work.
And now, of course, the big next move, and this may affect the film as well, is the attempt to shut down conversations that the mainstream media finds inconvenient, right?
And this weaponization of fake news against the media, right?
The media invented it to attempt to go after alternative media.
And it was very quickly, as the wonderful troll in the movie talks about, was quickly owned and weaponized and turned back against the mainstream media.
They are, of course, I just saw this Microsoft now is starting to put these, oh, this guy's real news, this guy's fake news and so on.
And Breitbart's been shut out of the party.
So the next move, of course, and it's been going on for a while, is to try and silence voices that contradict the mainstream media narrative.
And it's so weird because everyone knows that when Coke is talking about Pepsi, it's not an objective conversation because if you buy a Pepsi, you're not going to buy a Coke and vice versa, at least not at the same time.
And when the mainstream media writes about the alternative media, it's direct competition.
And yet there seems to be this, well, you know, why would they lie?
It's like, billions of dollars at stake.
Yeah.
No, it's really tough because it's not an even playing field, right?
Because you basically have this new form of government, which is, you know, these big tech companies.
They really, um, I think they need to be regulated.
I know a lot of conservatives don't like that kind of speech, you know, but I think it needs to happen because there's, there's no alternative that's really viable.
And, um, if, if they can control the conversation, then, you know, we're, we're not going to win this thing, right?
The reality is we have to, we have to build, I mean, there's the kind of the, uh, the common thing you see on Twitter is, Because now they're actually with financial institutions are also getting in on the game and blocking people from being able to get PayPal, you know, use PayPal.
And the refrain is like, well, what are we supposed to do, like build banks?
And but the reality is, yes, we have to build every alternative institution.
Like that's that is the the call, because they're going to they're going to isolate.
They're going to they're all of these institutions are being converged.
And the only option for us is to build alternative institutions all across the board.
There's nothing that we can't... If we think of it like that, and we think of it as a big project, then I think that we can do it.
But we can't just be like, oh, it's not just one thing that we have to build.
We do have to build everything.
Yeah, it's like an only society, basically, right?
And that's almost like a separation from existing institutions.
And that does not, again, and I understand what you guys are saying, it doesn't bring the conversation any closer.
And the big question for me, as it is for everyone these days, is like, well, has the time for arguments passed?
I mean, is reason and evidence?
And I think that this film is a big, powerful message to say to people on the left and on the right, you know, we're all lied to.
You know, which one of us benefits from being lied to?
Think of all of the people who are literally going through Physical illnesses and ailments because they're so stressed about Trump and his perceived Nazi empire, or they're so stressed about what Ocasio-Cortez was talking about, 12 years until the end of the world, you know, that really stresses people out.
And the toll that people are paying in their sleep, their peace of mind, their physical health, their relationships, we're all being lied to.
And if we can all start to borrow a way towards the truth, I mean, we're all so much better off, and trying to wean people off these lies is kind of tough, but there's really quite a pot of gold at the end of that rainbow.
Yeah, no, it's absolutely worth it.
We need a strong society, and that's the thing, too.
If people are stressed and they're not eating right, they're sick all the time, I mean, it just weakens society at a fundamental level.
And I mean, you know, if you just look at what's going on now, you can see what the results of that are.
So yeah, absolutely.
We, we have to, we, we just have to keep going, keep going like soldiers, you know, and, and, uh, and not worry too much about like, if this is going to work or not, but yeah, we just have to keep going.
So yeah, I see it.
I was just saying, I see it in terms of, we have the torch of civilization and we have the torch of truth and The future is uncertain.
It's very dark.
The only thing that we need to focus on is passing the torch on to the next generation.
That's what I see our role in at this point.
We have to keep that fire going and pass it on.
That's our duty.
And that's what everyone's duty is on Earth.
So let's do this.
Let's close with where to get the movie and what you want people to do the moment they finish watching the movie in a practical sense.
It's going to be available on Vimeo.
And we will, you know, as soon as it's ready, we will drop the link on Twitter, on YouTube and whatever.
And yeah, once you finish watching it, go online, talk about it.
You know, throw down the link.
Do, you know, if you have a blog, write a review, that'd be awesome for us.
And, you know, it doesn't have to be, you know, like if you have like, you know, if you have like real criticisms at the film, Please share those as well.
We want to get that conversation going.
The more people talk about it, the more people will see it.
So absolutely, just share, share, share.
And talk about it with people too.
You've got dinner conversation material right there.
And people don't actually have to have watched the movie, right?
You can just start bringing up some of the points and get people's thoughts about propaganda and falsehoods and truth and narrative.
These are all fascinating topics.
We all think about it from time to time, even if we're not sort of in the biz.
So, discuss it with people, raise interest in the topics, because that also helps raise interest in the movie as well.
And the purpose of the movie is to get people talking about the truth, which is the one thing that we really, really need the most of in society.
And Scooter, what would be the best outcome for you when people watch this film?
The credits have faded, they're sitting there with goosebumps and sweat running down their face, they've been mind-illuminated like a supernova.
What do you want them to do?
I want them to applause, I want a standing ovation, and I would like them to send Stefan donations.
No, seriously, I would like, yeah, the conversation needs to happen, so I would like people to just talk about it.
Like, that's literally, I mean, it's something you talk about a lot, you know, we have to use our language, we have to use our words, we have to talk to each other, so I would just Yeah.
Encourage everyone to just go out and talk to you.
What's great about a film is that it's easy to share with someone and be like, you know, people are willing to watch.
Normies are willing to watch movies.
So I would think about your family member or a close friend who's just, you know, just kind of Going along with everything.
Show them the film and be ready to talk about it.
Is there going to be a hoaxedmovie.com?
Is that going to plug people into the Vimeo?
Yes, it will.
Okay, so hoaxedmovie.com, I'll put the links to all of that below.
I wish you the very best with the movie and just want to remind people, whether you like it or whether you don't like it, it's interesting, it's provocative, it's powerful, it's got some great thinkers in it.
You really need to share this information.
Because if you dislike it and you share it, somebody may reinforce your dislike and maybe that'll be good for you.
Maybe they'll challenge you.
And we tend to sharpen as mental swords on whetstones, not on air or water.
So, I really, really strongly encourage people, grit your teeth.
If you think it's going to be a problem to sit through it, just give it five minutes.
Give it ten minutes.
It will grab you by the seat of your pants and take you on a hell of a journey.
And please, please share the movie and get engaged in conversations with people.
Because the alternative to conversation It's frankly the end of civilization.
Don't mean to make everyone panic but that's kind of what civilization is.
It's the willingness to talk rather than escalate and this movie helps drive that.
So I of course want to thank you so much for this conversation today.
Thank you so much for the massive amount of work put into the movie.
There is also an accompanying book if you're interested more in the detail of the interviews in the movie.
And of course thank you for letting me participate and it's hoaxedmovie.com Don't even bother finishing the outro to this.
Just go and we'll put it up on the screen.
We'll put it in the links.
HoaxToMovie.com.
Share it on Twitter.
Share it on Facebook.
Share it on Instagram.
Share it wherever you can get your hands on a keyboard or a thumbscreen.
And thank you so much, guys, for today.
Thank you.
Stefan, thank you so much for being part of the film as well.
You play an amazing part in this film.
And I think people are going to see a side of you that they don't normally see.
We'll see your legs, which is unusual.
Everyone thinks I float on tentacles, but alright.
