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Oct. 25, 2018 - Freedomain Radio - Stefan Molyneux
54:56
4232 A Honduran Tells the Shocking Truth About the Caravan
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Yeah, why don't you just read your email and let's go from there.
Say again? Oh yeah, I think I wrote, I think I spoke to you like after the elections, right?
Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's right. And I used to get into arguments with people over there because they were upset that Donald Trump got elected.
Okay, so for those who haven't heard it, just give us your backstory and where you're talking about and all that.
Okay, I was born in Honduras.
And actually, I went to Honduras after the 2016 elections.
And, you know, I just wanted to take a break.
And then when I got there, people were upset that Donald Trump had won.
Because they, for some reason, they had some kind of entitlement to this country.
And I'm from Honduras.
I am not saying...
I'm not disparaging my people, but I know my people.
And I used to argue with, I said, why are you upset about this president?
That's not your president.
You know, Orlando, you know, that's his name, is your president.
If you're going to be upset with somebody about your condition, it has to be with your president, not with Trump.
You understand? So I used to get into these big arguments because everybody was upset, you know, and...
It was the New Year's.
They were burning effigies, the flag and everything.
So I was like, I was surprised that these people were so upset because I haven't been there in Honduras for like five years.
So I got to see a lot because, you know, actually at that time when I left New York, I was living in Brooklyn, I almost felt that it was sort of the economy was dead.
But when I got to Honduras, it felt very vibrant.
I was like, wait a minute.
It's more life. I feel more life.
People buying, selling, and everything, right?
Right. And I said, I was like, wait a minute.
I almost want to move here because it feels like more life.
More life. Because everybody was selling and buying in the Christmas time, of course.
And I was like, wait a minute.
This is so weird. We're over there.
The economy was tanking after Obama was coming out of office.
And it was like malls being built, McDonald's, you have all these boutique shops over there opening, malls, like two, three malls.
And I was like, what's going on here?
This is just so weird.
Right? Did you ever figure out what's going on there?
Well, I... I started, you know, I was questioning because I actually, my mom lived, you know, build a house in the suburbs, like in a mountain.
And she moved there because, you know, it was a lot of fresh because of San Pedro Sula.
I'm from San Pedro Sula. That's where the caravan came from.
I say, wait a minute, what's going on there?
And I actually don't have too much contact with people there.
Only my mom. My mom doesn't know much, but you know, people talk.
And I remember that...
I had to go with my mom.
I want to give you an example how things are over there so you can gather background.
I remember my mom had to change.
She had some apartments she rents over there and she had to cancel the electric service.
We went to the office.
And she said, no, you have to come back.
You have to bring your, what do you call it?
Title of your house, your bills, and everything.
Everything is just so proper.
Like in here, I called a company.
I said, I want to have electric service.
I just come here and hook it up, right?
Oh, is it like a lot of bureaucracy, a lot of paperwork, a lot of overhead?
Yeah, well, what happened is, I'm going to give you this.
What happened is, I always tell my daughter that it's a default state everywhere.
Everybody has a default state.
The false state in my country, in a lot of countries, is misery, like poverty.
So everybody's taking from somebody, right?
Everybody's taking either way.
So my mom has some chickens in the neighborhood.
I'm giving an example.
And for some reason, they disappear.
They never, you know, it's like nobody says my mom's chickens.
So everybody's covering themselves because they're expected to be It's the kind of place where you can't leave your bike outside for 10 minutes because it's going to go, right?
Yes. So it's very like that.
Actually, when I went back, you should see the houses.
They look like prisons because they have the concertina wires.
It's like in South Africa.
They've got high walls.
Sometimes they have broken glass or barbed wire on the top.
They've got the metal grills or bars on the windows.
You're surrounded by a bunch of thieving, crazy people.
I'm giving you the background of actually how it is.
I think it's a lot of thorough world countries, actually.
I really don't understand.
It's just this. I'm going to take from you because you don't have peace.
You have to lock everything up.
This is the environment.
That we have there.
Even rich people, rich people that don't even enjoy their wealth because they have to be, you know, with bodyguards and the cars have to be, what do you call this?
I forget this car, you know, secure, the metal, you know, and the glass.
It's like the little clamp on the wheels and stuff like that because, you know, you turn around and like your stereo is gone and, you know, like everything's ripped out and the glove box is open.
Actually, you will not see a car parked on the street after midnight, after like 9 o'clock.
You will not see it. You can't park on the street.
Now, has that changed a lot from when you were younger?
Yes. Yes.
It's a completely different game now.
It has to do with the gangs because there's two rival gangs there.
And so some people prefer one over the other because even the police, you know, they're like, there's no Police is just like, actually, they work for the gangs at night.
It's just so weird.
Well, the gangs kind of run things, right?
I mean, it's probably similar to what goes on in Mexico, where you get silver or you get lead, right?
Like, you either take a bribe or they're going to put a bullet in your head.
And that tends to make people favorable to what the gangs want, right?
Yes. So, actually, some people say, I'd rather have the gangs than the police.
It's just a weird thing.
Because I don't really understand how they started, because actually the gangs for me that I've been here, it was just too fast and furious.
It was not even that organic.
Wait, what do you mean?
I mean, I get the references, I'm just not sure how to put it together in my head.
Yeah, what happened is that, I mean, usually when you have crime, it just starts a little bit at a time, right here and there.
But this is just like, it came out, it was not organic.
It doesn't seem, to me, it doesn't seem organic.
Oh, it wasn't like a slow growth in crime.
It's just like, switching the light on, just boom, right?
Yeah, it's too fast.
So people started, you know, I do remember what I used to, when I came here, I came to the States like in the 80s and I used to romanticize.
I want to go back because people were like more, you know, it was sort of like you romanticize.
When you leave your country, you romanticize about what you left behind.
Oh yeah, I know the feeling.
I know the feeling. That's right.
And then so you want to be here, but you want to be there.
It's just so weird. And then so I remember I used to say, oh, when I was, when I was, you know, when I won, let's say I returned after like 10 years.
And after 10 years, everything changed.
The gangs, the people were so different, more materialistic, right?
Yeah. And so I think everything started, because like I said, I said in the, in the email that I sent you, That a globalism is part of the reason this is happening also.
And on top of that, money, drugs, cartels.
Because, actually, I don't know if you remember, like, what, four months ago, they closed down a bank in Honduras.
This guy was laundering money left and right from the cartels.
And actually, he's here in New York.
So they closed banks and a lot of companies that he had.
But the point that I'm trying to say is that when I went back, there's a whole bunch of malls.
And I'm talking about well-built malls.
There's like four malls.
I'm like, where did these malls come from?
And then there's a whole bunch of people buying and selling in the malls.
And I said, what I noticed too was that there's a lot of groups, like consortiums.
Of businessmen, they form these groups.
They call them groups. You know, they get all together and they say, we're going to build this, we're going to build that.
And I remember I went to find out something about property and the city office, you know, the property records, it was in a mall from the city.
And I said, what is this city office doing in a mall?
And I'm talking about whole floor.
And what happened is that a lot of people, you know, with this money laundering, they get into these groups, right?
Business groups, consortiums, right?
And then they pull them all, and then these same people want to rent in the mall from the city.
You know, they go run for, what do you call, majors or councilmen, and then it's like a whole, it's like a business.
It's basically like here, like a Corporatocracy.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. So a lot of the money has to end up in sort of semi-honest places.
So they try and get it in through real estate and this kind of mall building and that kind of stuff, right?
So that's what they're trying to do.
And that's, I guess, where a lot of this sort of new real estate stuff is coming from, right?
Yes. And so...
The point that I'm trying to say that globalism and all this money, because they have made properties go high, you know, like in Costa Rica.
Basically, I think people can't even buy their own property.
Like people who were born there can't even pay property too much in Costa Rica.
Because since you have a lot of people moving in and buying property, you know, you already have the high bar of value.
And so a lot of people are just renting or squatting, right?
Yeah. So what happened is that I think that there's a new marketing that came there because I know that marketing is just very hard.
So what happened in marketing is that they paint a picture of...
You can get this.
And actually, when I was there, there was not even credit cards.
Now there's a lot of people getting credit cards, right?
I don't even know how that works.
Somebody's pushing some money through.
That's what I'm saying. And it doesn't seem organic.
It doesn't seem organic to the country.
Well, and I'm sort of thinking about the soft border on the south of the United States.
As we know, there's fentanyl and opiates and lots of drugs coming through from these cartels through this open border in the South of the US. And I'm just wondering if some of the drugs or the drug money is originating from or coming from Honduras or has some relationship to it.
Because if you say it's changed a lot, well, what's changed the most over the last 20 years, say, in America, is the border has just basically collapsed.
It's a walkabout thing.
I mean, they've got, well, they're apprehending like 40,000 people a month, a month, crossing this border.
That's just the people they apprehend.
Who knows what the numbers are that they don't.
And I'm just wondering if it has something to do with this open border and just drugs flowing in and then being bought by people often on the welfare state money and so on.
And that's just where a huge amount of money and opportunity is being scooped up that's feeding or fueling the Central American gangs.
Yeah, I just read in the newspaper a while ago, they were closed a lot of those, what do you call those, airstrips?
Yeah, yeah, yeah. I don't know what they're called, but I know what you mean.
Yeah, the airstrips, you know, where they land.
And I remember that time when I went to Honduras, because I was watching, you know, I was like, I seem, everything is just so different from five years that I didn't go.
You know, I used to travel back and forth.
Now I don't because everybody's here for my family.
And so I remember I went to, I don't know if you ever heard this, Mayan ruins in Honduras.
We have a cousin over there who told me that the major over there offered him a job, because he has a truck, to carry things, you know?
I'm thinking drugs. So it's like the politicians are...
Basically, they go into politics because somehow they have access to money from the government or from the taxpayers, and they use...
The police for the benefit, for drugs.
It's just like a big corruption.
Now, what has changed, though?
What has changed the most, do you think, for the average person in Honduras?
I mean, there's a reason why I've heard estimates from 7,000 to 14,000, even more.
There's a reason why people are willing to try and make this trek.
So how do you think life has changed from when you were little in Honduras to now, to the point where people are just freaking out and bugging out?
It has to do a lot with, I say, internet.
It has to do a lot that people have come in a lot and when they go back, they go and flaunt.
Like, they're rich and they rub it in.
And then people are like, okay, I want that too.
And a story that I wanted to tell you is that I know my mom lives in a mountain.
There's a lot of poor people around her.
And if you go and see those people, most of them have the latest phone.
I didn't even have my latest phone.
It's like, I don't care about phone, but if you go and see them, they live in a brickety house, but they have the latest iPhone, the latest Samsung.
Oh, and they're watching like music videos and saying, that's paradise, which I can see that it kind of is, right?
You know, but you know what?
There's something also there, because I just like two weeks, I was talking to my mom and I was within the Honduran newspaper.
And in the capital city, they had an office.
Can you believe this? I was like, wait a minute, what is this?
They had an office of the migrant office, I call it somehow like that.
Because in the office, this is probably where this caravan started.
There is an office there.
And I said, what is a migrant?
Because in there they tell you about what benefits you have as a migrant here, immigrant.
It's called the immigrant office.
And I was trying to find it before.
I said, let me find that two weeks ago in the newspaper.
I said, why is there an office there to tell people the benefits that immigrants have in here?
Do you understand? Well, do they mean immigrants?
Because that's a very lengthy process, right?
It's like a decade or whatever, right?
So do they mean immigrants to the U.S. or do they mean just show up at the border and claim asylum?
No, I'm talking about illegal people who are here.
How are you going to know your rights?
Basically, some people are already there telling you how you can, you know...
Manage the system here.
Do you understand? Oh, yeah, no.
I mean, there was a pamphlet some years ago that the Mexican government had about, you know, here's all the things you need to do if you're apprehended at the border.
You can ask for this. You can ask for that.
You can get a lawyer. You can demand this.
And I guess this is the same kind of thing.
Yes. Okay. And so this, I saw it, like, I had to find it.
And I told my mom, I said, Mom, do you see, you know that I saw this article?
Once in a while, I try to, you know, take a peek of what's going on over there.
And I said, Why is this office, is there an office in Tegucigalpa, the capital, telling immigrants that they should go there and then they can learn about their rights?
That's what they said, their rights as an immigrant in the States.
Except they're not immigrants. Oh my God!
They're not immigrants. Okay. Yeah, well, yeah, whatever, you know.
Aliens. Why is it touch ground here?
Even if they're here and they touch ground here, these are your...
So they already come educated from there with, you know, how to manage the system.
And also what to say, right?
What to say to make sure, like, I'm fleeing persecution, not I want a job.
Yes. So there's all these manufactured stories that are handed out, these sort of like choose-your-own-adventure books where the end result is being able to stay in the States.
Listen, Stefan, we know, like even people, if you talk to, well, you wouldn't be able, but if I talk to a Latino, they would know, they would know by what's going on, the reality of it.
Yes, there are people there that are really, you know, they're like, okay, I wonder, when they say, because a lot of say the American dream, I say, what American dream?
We're going there for the American dream.
And I don't want to disparage people coming for a better life, but most people...
I know the immigrant of the 80s or 90s is not the same immigrant, whatever you want to call it, of today.
It's not the same.
And even when I talk to people, they say the same thing.
Because all this...
Globalization, you know, because by now we're supposed to be under globalization and Hillary.
We're supposed to have no borders.
So all these people get educated from that time.
Like all this, you know, Oh, they were waiting.
This is why they got so mad about Trump, because they were waiting for Hillary to just throw wide the borders and say, come on in.
Because in the schools, I really don't know.
I wasn't there. But in this, there's something about these people were so upset when Trump won.
I was like, I was like, why are you upset?
Why are you upset? Do you understand the bigger problem that we have in America for you to be upset over here that Trump won because you're not going to be able to cross?
Because some people say, well, I'm going to go to the States.
It was next door.
They were going to Walmart.
Why do you do that?
Because they feel entitled.
Do you understand? It's an entitlement.
That a lot of people have.
No, but isn't there any kind of thought about the American taxpayers maybe not being so keen on funding all this stuff?
Or is it, well, the gringos took the land from us and we're taking it back?
I mean, what's the thought pattern here?
Listen, I was watching YouTube because I'm like, well, let me see what these people are talking about.
A lot of people are talking about That it was Trump, even in Mexico, in Honduras, it was Trump who created this...
Trump who created what?
Oh, Trump who created the problems in Honduras?
Yes, that's what they're saying!
And I know they were saying it here, but I was looking at this guy, even from Mexico, you know, people from Mexico, there's people who do YouTube videos, like they look like journalists for sure.
They will say, no, this is Trump who created this camera for political purpose because on November 6th, everybody knows about the election.
And guess what? Even in the newspaper in Honduras, they're talking about Trump can't do that because of positive commentators.
I'm like, oh my God, there's people in the newspaper.
Oh, so in the newspaper, they're saying, well, Trump can't deploy the military.
Yeah, the military. I think that he can, because if you consider it an invasion, which I think it is, then he can use the military.
The whole point of the military is to keep people from crossing your borders.
At least that was the original point.
So saying he can't do it.
He can't deploy the troops against American citizens in American soil, as far as I understand it.
But yeah, if there's an invasion, he kind of can.
So my point is that Somebody in the...
Because those newspapers are liberal.
I could tell that. Oh, you mean the Honduran newspapers?
Yeah, most of them are.
Because, you know, it's the same owners of the groups that I'm telling you.
All this is like a big net.
It's just like, you know, Hillary, Clinton, Obama.
Everybody just knows each other.
You could tell it's just the same people.
The same people here, you know, are probably...
If you will ask me, they will probably be Democrats.
Because over there in Honduras, it's the same political system.
We have the liberals and we have the Republicans in their own country.
In their own country. And then even all these people are like, wait a minute.
Why are you telling Americans that we should feed these people?
The country is a sovereign country because they say that their country is sovereign, but America is not.
I'm like, wait a minute. What is wrong with you guys?
Why do you claim that America is a sovereign country for some reason is like he just got to loot, you know?
And I get upset because why do they feel entitled and even the people that are having a commentary on YouTube, why don't Trump just let him in and just let him eat, you know, and then just keep him there for like a few and then just send him back?
Are you out of your mind?
Well, I mean, if you look at Colombia's reaction to all the Venezuelans pouring across the border, they're not very happy, are they?
No, that's what I say.
Listen, but you see, I don't know.
We have a saying, Honduras, you know, when you tip the hat, you want to tip the hat with somebody else's hat.
Right? That's what we say.
You know, like when you say hello, you say, you know, I gave you this.
You want to say, you know, you give him that.
But I said, well, why don't you invite them to your house?
Invite a few of them to your house and feed them.
Oh yeah, it's called virtue signaling, which is where you want the government to take care of people, but you're never going to put them up in your own house or spend your own money.
Yeah, and then I see these people because I'm like, wait a minute, this is just, to me, this is like a phenomenon.
And I went to the Honduran YouTubers and this guy is like, I know my people.
In Honduras, being poor...
I'm going to tell you how it is, Stefan.
Being poor in Honduras is worse than death.
It's like you're a piece of crap.
I lived there.
I grew up there. The rich people treat you like you're just...
You know, like a doo-doo.
Really, you know, and I'm sorry to interrupt, but this is something that I've seen in Latino culture, and I don't want to put it all in one big blob, but it sort of reminds me of some aspect of Indian culture as well.
It's like really materialistic.
If you have the money, you're a big guy, and if you don't have the money, you're nothing, and that's kind of different in the West as a whole.
Yeah, and so what happened here, I'm going into sort of the psychology of it.
So, what happened, like, you don't want to feel like crap, then you want to get, you know, the ghetto fabulous term, right?
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
It's when you've got all your money in unproductive status symbols and not things that actually will make you money in the long run.
Because somehow you don't want to feel like a piece of crap, so you want to be toe-to-toe with the rich people.
At least I have a phone, right?
At least I have a phone, and look, I can front.
I mean, a lot of people...
I'll tell you a story. I knew my friend.
We grew up together.
And when I went this year, you know, the kids had the latest phone, but they're about to get evicted.
Do you understand? I do.
I do. I'm trying to give you the psychology of the people that are coming.
It's like the sneaker thing. It's like I don't have food, but I've got some really great kicks, you know?
The projects here, you see Mercedes-Benz, where are you living in the projects?
Right. Right.
You understand? Yeah. Well, because you want to show off to people, right?
You want to show off to the people you grew up with.
Yeah. So a lot of the mentality, I'm not saying everybody because there's always exceptions, but the mentality that I see of these people, that's what it is.
Get a fabulousness, right?
Because actually, you know, I was reading an article.
You know how many people left? 47 people left their jobs, right?
In Copan, they were doing those expensive cigars.
The guy was saying, wait a minute, not everybody's starving to death like they're claiming.
46 people left the company to come to the caravan.
Wait, they quit their jobs to join the caravan?
47. I shouldn't laugh because it's terrible, but that's insane.
But do you understand?
Do you understand? That's the mentality.
Because somebody told them, and they want to go to California.
Do you understand? That's where they want to go.
They don't want to go anywhere. They want to go to California.
Why? What's the reasoning there?
I mean, obviously, it's nicer than Minnesota for the weather, but what's the reasoning for California, Sarah?
The government, the governor of California.
You know, everything free, free school.
Oh, the sanctuary cities, and we won't turn you over the ice, and we won't cooperate with the feds.
All these people know from there.
And I haven't researched the guy.
His name is Irineo.
I haven't researched the guy because I think it's the same guy who brought the caravan up here.
And so I told my mom that this was, you know, Soros usually.
But they always say, you know, when they want to make some kind of operation, they say, who do we have there in Honduras that can help us with this, right?
So I know the opposition, you know, because I know the president who said that Orlando said, okay, the opposition is the one who is egging this on.
And yes, I could see that.
I could see that because when I went to...
He's more conservative though, right? So he's saying that it's the leftist opposition, like your equivalent of the Democrats who's egging it on?
Yes. The guy who's...
Actually, he was running around with Chavez.
That should tell you a lot.
Oh, God. He's the one who was running around with Chavez.
Right. You know who that is?
Do you remember the coup?
The Celaya, the guy who they took out of the presidency?
Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's him.
That's him. That's him who is...
I'm sure he is the one who had...
Because even... They just had the elections like a year ago.
It was the same thing that he created with the Democrat mobs here.
They said that they would not let this guy govern.
So they're just creating this big mess all the time.
Like, he lost the election, so he's not going to let him govern.
Well, it's the same thing that they're doing with Trump, with the Russia conspiracy theory and investigations and all that.
It's like, okay, you can win, but we're going to try and cripple you as much as possible so you can't get anything done.
Yeah, so he wouldn't.
He wouldn't. He had a protest.
Just like in here. Same thing.
And I think that he probably has some connection with the Hillary thing.
Because you're... I think they wanted to make the whole Latin America Venezuela.
They had like the little group, so they wanted to do it.
Look, look at Nicaragua.
Look at Nicaragua.
Nicaragua is going to hell now.
Before it was even better than Honduras.
Well, you've even got a lefty in Chile now, right?
I'm sorry? I think there's even a lefty, this woman who's in charge of Chile now is more on the left.
But I know Evo Morales.
What's his name? Not Ecuador.
What's the other? Bolivia. He's got a leftist big time.
So this is supposed to have been peppered with leftists, chavistas.
Everything free.
Everything was free. The same thing.
The same thing, Estefan.
It's just, you know, in the proportionate, of course, to the country.
Right. Now, do they ever think that if everyone from Central and North America goes into America that it's just going to turn it into Honduras 2.0?
But it's true.
You know what? I moved to out of Brooklyn because I said it's a state of mind.
It's a state of mind. Being...
You know, it's a state of mind.
You keep this mentality because there's a mentality that you're born in poverty.
But even when you come to America, you don't try to get away from your own people and see, okay, what is America about?
Because I did it. And actually, I moved to the servers because I said, wait a minute.
I want to know what Americans do that is so different than what we do.
Because if you stay in the group, you create another, like you say, a 2.0.
You're not doing anything different.
You're with the same people doing the same thing.
It's just like you might as well stay in Honduras.
Well, you're not going to get a lot of welfare and health care and education in Honduras of the same quality, right?
No, you're not even close.
So my point is that once you hear...
Then your mentality should just shoot to American.
To, like, what are these people doing that is so different that we cannot do there?
That's my curiosity.
I'm like, wait a minute. There's something here.
And I'm still, because it's a state of mind.
And it's in your DNA, Stefan.
It's something weird.
Because even I am trying to figure.
I'm here. I bought a fixer-upper.
And I'm here. I want to get away from anybody else.
That is because I want to immerse myself into the real culture of people, what people, American people are like, right?
Because you don't get a taste if you're talking to your friends and you don't get a taste.
You just might as well stay in Honduras, except that it's like a little satellite Honduras here.
Well, okay, but here's the thing, right?
So I've seen studies that say, I think we touched on this last time we talked, Sarah, but I've seen the studies that say that the average IQ in Honduras is like in the low 80s.
Now, If you're a smart person, obviously a very smart person, if you're a smart person and there's just not quite as many smart people around as you'd like, it can drive you a little crazy.
And what you want to do is you want to escape to some place where there are more smart people around, more curious people around, so you can have better conversations, so you can have a sense of a future, and so you don't have everything stolen every time you put it down, because that's kind of like a low IQ behavior.
Yeah! I just wonder how many, like after years of emigration from Honduras, from Guatemala, from other places, I'm just not sure how many, like one of the things that happened is the West, like North Canada, Europe, the United States in particular, kind of scooped up all the smart people from Central America.
And I'm just not sure like in terms of like what's happened to the society.
I'm sure there's a lot to do with the drug war and there's a lot to the foreign aid is really, really bad.
The remittances are really bad because that way the governments don't have to face the needs of the people.
In fact, the government want to ship everyone to America so they can get remittances coming in.
But also, I think that just more and more smart people have left these countries and and who's left behind?
Well, not anyone who can run it very effectively, if that makes sense.
Well, No, actually, there's a lot of people.
Actually, the people that leave the country are not, because if you're well off of it, you don't want to move.
I thought you said earlier that they didn't really enjoy their wealth because they got to worry about being robbed over there.
Yeah, but still, you know what happens?
Because even my brother, one time, he's, you know, he's American.
He wasn't born here.
My mom, you know, brought us through a visa.
So he basically grew up here.
He went to high school here.
No, I think he came here when he was 13.
In any case, he said he wanted to go back because in here you're not nobody.
But in there you can float your wealth, whatever you have, even if, you know, proportionate.
And then people sort of look up, because actually when you go, I remember, I was just like, wait a minute, what are these people looking at me?
When you go to a place in Honduras, this is so weird, people, it's very weird.
The first thing that they look at you is your shoes.
What do you mean? Because they're trying to get you.
They're trying to get you.
Because by your shoes or the way you carry yourself, they gauge you because they say, okay, she has money.
I'm telling you, Mr.
Stefan, this is just so weird because I even used to do it, you know, when I was there.
But I felt because, you know, once you live here, you have this different air to you.
And so the first thing that they look at you is your shoes and they start scanning you from the bottom up.
Yes. Because they get a fabulousness, right?
Because they gauge you to see how they're going to treat you.
You get it? Yeah, yeah.
So whether you are someone who can give them an advantage or whether you're not, in which case they'll just kind of ignore you, right?
It's sort of like a caste system.
It's in the DNA. This is nothing that people met.
It's just how it is there.
As soon as you come, I remember I went to the doctor's office and you could feel people scanning you from the shoes up.
And it's like, yes, seriously.
But this is not just here.
This is just all Latin America.
I'm giving you sort of like a sample.
That's how it is. And so it's this mentality of, you know, you just want to place yourself where you are.
If he has nasty shoes, ugly shoes, okay, he's like me.
She's like me. You understand?
You want to see where you fit within life.
The whole society by gauging you.
And it's a quick gauge. It's not, you know, a stare.
It's just like you basically know.
So what happened is that it's the same thing of Gator Fabulous here.
It's like when you want to weigh your $300 Nikes because that's a status.
You understand? It gives you status.
So this is why you want to be Gator Fabulous.
Even though you don't have the money, when you pull out the phone, you want to make sure people look at it.
Because, you know, it's like, okay, you know, I'm not like you.
You don't pour. You know, I have the fun, at least.
Right? Yeah, I mean, there's no point having a status symbol if nobody sees it, right?
Yes! So you have to rub it in.
And this is what happens when people go back from here to there.
And this is why you have this caravan coming, because a lot of people, you know, when you hear people, this is what they say, right?
Well, I hear people, you know, the government takes care of the babies over there, blah, blah, blah.
So they know. You understand?
Because if you're over here living off the government, you have to rub it in.
You have to throw it back to somebody else.
The government's paying me.
And so people hear all this.
You get it? People hear all this, but they don't understand that somebody's paying.
When people say, oh...
They should let the caravan come in.
Do you know who's paying for all that?
They think it's just the United States.
They have a pot of gold somewhere.
It's magic. Seriously.
It's magic. There are unicorns that crap gold directly into the Federal Reserve basement and it just gets shipped out without causing any inflation whatsoever.
It's magic. When you hear these people talk...
They don't ever think that people are paying taxes for this, or whatever.
It's the people.
No, for some reason, when you hear them talk, they say, that's a rich country.
What the hell is, why can't they give what they have?
It's like, wait a minute, these people are working to pay.
A lot of Republican people, you pay taxes, they don't even want to bother with welfare or nothing.
They'd rather starve. Now, do you think this has anything to do with the midterms?
It's hard to escape the timing of this, that these, you know, these people who claim to be walking, but every time I see them, they're sort of stopping to walk for the photo ops, and then they're jumping in a flatbed truck and racing towards the border at 80 miles an hour.
So do you think this has, like, it's going to put Trump in a difficult position for the midterms?
Yes. As soon as I heard that, I said, oh my God, it's the midterm.
It's the midterm, stupid.
I said that even when I have a Twitter, it's like, oh my God, it's the midterm.
Right? And then you have, are you coming to work with two, three kids?
Usually when people come to work, they leave the kids behind because they're coming to work.
You have two, three kids, you're not coming to work.
You're pregnant. What the hell are you doing with kids?
You're coming for an anchor baby.
Yes! No, you're not coming!
And you know what? What happened is that even when I was there, and I used to get into arguments with people.
Yes, there are poor people, and there are people who need, right?
But look at these people who left their jobs, and that's probably just a few of them, right?
They left their jobs because they heard about the American dream.
And the American dream is the welfare.
That's their American dream.
It's the American dream for them, the American nightmare for the taxpayers.
So I'm like, come on.
When I comment on YouTube videos, a lot of people like my – because I'm like this.
I'm like, I'm going to tell it to you up front.
I'm not going to have – even when I have my Twitter account – You know, I have, even Trump was talking about nationalists.
In my Twitter, I kind of said, I'm a Latino nationalist.
I'm proud of it. Who cares?
Because that's how I am. You know what?
Come here and tell me that. They used to tell me, you're a racist.
I don't care what you call me.
I used to tell them. Who cares what you call me?
I'm just telling you what it is.
You know, I used to go to a fabric store and when Trump, because I got on his train.
As soon as he, I read his books.
Like 10 years ago.
I don't remember too much, but I did read them.
And I was like, oh my God, this guy.
And so I remember I went to a fabric store in Brooklyn.
And he was talking about, oh, what do you think about Trump?
I said, I'm voting for him.
I said, what? The Spanish guy.
What? He's racist.
I'm like, what? What are you talking about?
He's racist. Why?
He doesn't have a right to defend his country?
He doesn't have a right to defend his people?
Why? You know, because that's what I said.
They probably wish they had a president like that.
Why don't you get your own Trump?
Right? Basically, it's like some kind of jealousy or something.
Not jealousy. I know why they're crying about it.
Trump's election, for a lot of people, as you know, Sarah, he just stands between them and the free stuff they want.
So they don't like him. And they call him names.
But it's got nothing to do with an objective analysis of his idea of race relations.
It's just like, hey, that guy's standing on my lottery ticket.
I want him to move. I'm going to yell words at him until he moves.
I can pick up the lottery ticket.
Actually, I even got into an argument with my friend because I was like, listen, I left my umbilical cord in Honduras, I said.
I left my umbligo. I left it there, but this is the country that fed me.
I mean, what am I going to defend?
If I was there, I'd probably be coming in the caravan.
I don't know. I don't know, but my father was very I don't know, maybe also because there's not many people getting married, especially poor people.
Most of the people that are here, they don't get married.
Marriage is like something very strong.
The people that get married are people that are higher class.
Poor people don't get married.
So that has a lot to do with the mentality.
It's just like anything goes, whatever, you know, who cares?
It's just weird.
Nobody got married over there.
I don't know about here too much, but I didn't see people getting married.
They just got pregnant and stuff.
I was reading this New York Times thing about this girl coming across with her husband.
She was 17.
She had a two-year-old son.
She had the birth of 15.
She got pregnant when she was 14.
It's like, she's not coming to work.
No, it's a mayhem over there.
And the thing is that they take the cue from Hollywood, from all these artists, from Mexican artists.
So they all want, you know, everything, it's just like here.
But over there, they want to copy everything.
So, you know, a lot of people having surgeries and all this, like, wait a minute, why these people look so weird?
But they just want to copy.
I call it ghetto fabulousness.
Yeah, yeah. You just want to copy because you want to know that you're in style and a lot of people don't have the money.
You used to just have to compete with the other people in the neighborhood but now with the internet you've got to compete with everyone in the whole world.
If you're a good looking person maybe you used to be the most beautiful girl in the village and that was wonderful and you were like the queen of the village but now you've got to compete with...
Every single beautiful person in the universe because – and every single wealthy person is right there in the palm of your hand on your cell phone and it drives people a little crazy because we used to just have this local competition.
Now the globalism is you can see how everyone lives.
You can see how everyone has opportunity and you just can't stand it whereas before you wouldn't even have known.
Yeah, and I was noticing too, it's just that you have this boutique style things coming up with it.
I said, wait a minute, who's going to be buying all this stuff?
And then what happened is, I always call it...
Oh, do you mean in Honduras, this boutique style?
Yes. Yeah, it's boutique style like cookie stores.
Like right now, they just open a meat store.
They just sell high quality meats.
And I'm talking about... You know, from Japan and all.
Like, who's buying this stuff?
You know? And then it was hot.
People with all that nicely laundered money.
Now, do you have any predictions about...
What might happen? I mean, this is the big October surprise, right?
There's always one. And if this doesn't work, I guess the next one is these mailed out bombs and stuff.
But what do you think is going to happen?
I mean, they're obviously pretty committed to getting in.
I mean, they don't make these kinds of journeys without a really strong desire to get in, right?
Well, no, Stefan, there's a lot.
I was reading that 3,400 people went back.
34. Oh, they've already turned around?
But that'd be replaced by more, I assume, right?
Yeah, because you know what?
And Trump, this is what I'm telling you what Trump is trying to do.
Do you remember when Macy's, they had like a protest in Macy's last time and then Macy's took the merchandise?
Oh yeah, the ties, right?
Like they cut his ties that they were selling, the Trump ties, right?
Yeah. So what he said is that, don't worry, they're going to get tired, right?
You know, they're just there for a little bit and then they get tired.
You understand? Yeah. That's he knows that these people are just because They're going to get tired.
Like, right now, I was looking at it, there's a lot of people, like, tired, right?
And so what happened is that...
And probably these people, there's some of them, like, two or three...
There's, I think, two caravans coming, like, you know, like a relay caravans.
Oh, my God. Yeah, there's one that started, and then there's, I think, a smaller one, but yeah.
But Trump is expecting these people to get tired, and they're going to thin out, like last one.
But... Since these guys learned from the last one, I think that they're going to have like, you know, come on, let's go.
We could do it. You get it?
Yeah. So they're not going to reach all of them here, especially, you know, there's like, I think there's like a thousand of them that stayed in Mexico because there's a request of asylum and they stay there.
I think Mexico gave them asylum and they're going to thin out.
Right? Because you're coming with all, you know, and then you start missing people.
You're sleeping on the streets.
And they said there's some of them sleeping in hotels and stuff.
Like, what? What are these people getting their money from?
You know, they're staying in hotels and I see people giving them food.
I said, yes, I know.
I understand that people want to be like a lot of Christians, right?
And a lot of people are... Yeah, yeah.
But I think that somebody's paying them to give the food and then all of a sudden you have this picture, oh, they're getting fed, you know, by the people.
But I think somebody's, you know, let's give them some food.
You know, I'll give you $500, give all these people some food or whatever.
That's what I think. This is my view.
Right? But in the newspaper, oh, you know, You know, the Mexican people are, you know, empathizing with the parents.
Spontaneous outpourings of generosity.
No, no. I'm telling you something.
We Latinos are very, like, pirañas.
Seriously. I am saying...
Can you break that out for me a little there, sister?
Pirañas? What are you talking about?
Pirañas? You know what?
You know what? You know what?
I'm a veteran. I haven't spoken Spanish in a long time, English for a long time, so I have this fake accent.
Piranhas is the fish that eat each other.
Oh, piranhas. I get it.
No, that's not your fault.
It's because I can't speak Spanish, so I got no problem with that.
That's fine. We are the first ones to tear each other apart first.
It's not even that.
It's that We know a con when we see one.
Sometimes, you know, I know there's some people that are, you know, I see the guy, I saw a guy over there being interviewed.
He's like, yeah, I could tell that that guy, he could very well come and work hard, whichever way he came through.
But a lot of them just come for probably working as a dealer.
Because I had a neighbor, my mom had a neighbor.
You know, I told you my mom lived in a lot of, you know, she built a house in the mountain and there's a lot of people that squatted over there, they took land.
So this guy was saying, well, I have my friend, I think I'm going to go to the States because I have a friend over there who's working, you know, selling drugs and he's doing very good.
So I think, so you understand?
There's all kinds of these little plans, right?
Even get from the government or Do whatever kind of business, you know, side business or anything, but work hard.
There's probably a few that are like, okay, I really want to go, you know, build a house.
Because I told you that globalism had made property prices in Honduras very expensive.
Even I go, like, let me see how the prices are.
And these guys are selling a house for a million dollars.
I'm like, when the hell are you going to get a million dollars for that house?
Because somebody... Laundering money, you understand?
Yeah, yeah. So what would you say, I mean, if you were Trump, right, what would you do with this problem?
With the caravan?
Yeah. No, I would just turn him back because I think I would turn him back because I told you that the immigrant of today is not the same immigrant of 20 years ago, even probably 10 years ago.
It's not the same. I think after, not Obama, but after...
I think they've been getting schooled or since people haven't been getting through with no consequence, you get spoiled.
And so you get entitled.
You understand? When you spoil a child, you get entitled.
And so I think...
I know you asked me before, what do you think is going to happen?
Oh, I told you that they're going to get tired.
But... Some of them are gonna try to jump it and probably gonna have like a little, in the border they're gonna have like a scripted, something scripted.
You understand? Like kids.
Yeah, this is the audition of your life, right?
To know what to say. Yes.
Yeah, because that's what you can, basically that's the reason, right?
Nobody, these people don't care.
You know, all these people that are, I seen this guy on a YouTube channel, oh my god, why is Trump doing that?
Like, and I see him Like I said, we know our people.
So I see him. I could tell.
I already gauge him.
I already scan him. I say, he's a niño bonito.
He's like a rich guy.
It's like a Hollywood people, right?
Virtual signal. I say, wait a minute.
Have you fed anybody in Honduras over there that you're talking that we should feed them?
No. You won't even feed anybody.
These guys were not giving a piece of bread to nobody over there.
Driving in their Infinities or Lexus.
Actually, didn't I tell you that they look at you like a piece of crap?
Do you understand? Do you understand?
And these are the same people who are saying that we, the United States, are supposed to feed all these people.
I'm like, how hypocritical.
Let me ask you this too.
I mean, so there are these stories, this idea about Honduras or the data.
It seems to be that Honduras is like really violent.
At the moment. Have you heard much about this from your mom or from other people that you may know back there?
Is this something that people are experiencing?
I mean, you talked about the stealing earlier, but the violence as well.
I've heard quite a lot of stories about that.
Well, this guy, the new president, you know, he's got reelected, actually.
He's like a Trump over there, you know, in a little way.
He's the Republican, let's say, right, of Honduras.
He's the right, the right wing.
He built, actually, he's the one who kept the crime under control.
So while these people talk about, oh, we're running for crime, I don't believe it.
The problem that he has done, I think he has taken, this president has taken some kind of book from the Obama era or something.
He probably read some kind of book.
He's overtaxing a lot of regulation, so a lot of people can't even start their own.
That's for sure. He ruined a lot of people.
I know I hear a lot of people, even when I was there.
I'm like, this guy was welding his dye, and I said, what are you going to do with the company?
Well, you know, I don't want to start anything because this guy is asking for too many papers, you know, to start a business.
Remember I told you when I went to the office?
Yeah, I remember that, yeah. So they killed the bureaucracy.
You know, it's a lot of...
Because he's overtaxing people.
I think the tax over there is like 15%.
15% for cell tax.
Right, right. So he's overtaxing people.
So he overwhelmed these people with taxes and overregulation.
Because I know he took...
When I went there, I said, wait a minute.
Why is this country smelling like Obama era?
Everything is regulated out of, you know...
He's over-regulating.
So a lot of people don't even can start their own business.
You know, I'm talking about small business.
So I'm reading right here right now.
Look at this. So it's doing something because I know Trump put him to shame with, you know, we're going to take the aid, right?
So right now he's saying he's going to create 1,500, you know, 1,500 jobs.
Right. And he's going to start fomenting the small businesses.
You understand? Because the opposition put him to shame.
Because they keep laughing at him.
And yes, he overtaxed people.
And he's been doing, like you were asking about the crime.
He's been, actually, I don't even know who was building these prisons because it almost looked like American prisons.
I think he came and brought some architect or something because he built like five prisons.
So the crime is not as high as even my mom says.
My mom says, no, this guy has the crime is a little bit under control because, you know, he created new laws for Stealing, they used to get on the buses and steal from people on the bus and kill the worker and all this mess.
Yes, it's true, but now he's keeping it under control.
So the problem, the big problem that I see on this caravan is, I call it ghetto-fabulous caravan.
Because that's actually the problem.
The ghetto-fabulousness.
Because they want to live up to...
Beyond their means. I'm trying to think if I dare name the show Ghetto Fabulous Caravan.
I'm not sure.
Listen, I'm going to call it there, but listen, will you keep in touch if you hear more information about this?
It's going to be such a big story over the next couple of weeks, so I'd really like to stay in touch.
If you find out more information or get more information about it, if you could keep me posted, I'd really, really appreciate that because I do want to keep people informed about the stuff that, you know, your expertise, your language skills, your cultural skills...
Give you access to a bunch of stuff that a lot of my listeners don't have access to and I'd really like to help bridge that gap if that's alright.
Oh my god, did I help?
I don't know. I feel like I was all over the place, Estefan.
It's a big story. You know, it's a big story.
So I'm glad to get a lot of different perspectives on what's going on.
So yeah, I hope you'll keep in touch.
If you get new information, let's talk again before the midterms and keep people up to date on how you see things.
Okay, Estefan. Nice to help.
I want to make sure I don't want to disparage, but there's a lot of stuff like that now.
Yeah, no, I appreciate this perspective.
I haven't seen it anywhere else, and that's what's valuable about these calls.
So stay in touch, and thanks so much for the call tonight.
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