Sept. 1, 2017 - Freedomain Radio - Stefan Molyneux
40:54
3810 Western Civilization's Last Stand | Alex Jones and Stefan Molyneux
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Stefan Molyneux, am I wrong or have we reached, I believe, the beginning of the true heart of the quickening and the real moment of danger as well?
Well, we've reached the point where we have to stare into our screens, stare into our cameras and say, look at me!
I'm the media now.
The only reason that Pelosi and others are turning against Antifa is because alternative media has been relentless in pointing out How violent they are, how destructive their ideology is.
And so originally, of course, a free press was supposed to restrain the growth of government power.
Now you need the alternative media to restrain or try and control the corruption of the mainstream media.
That's been our job, and this is one of the first great victories we've achieved.
See, that's why you're so much better than I am, anyways, because you just came out and said, new media forced it out, has more viewers, showed their frauds, they just lost a major war, force-feeding us wannabe vampire meth-head armies as heroes, as Captain America...
When if anybody's fascist like Red Skull, it's them.
They've got this ass backward and are projecting who they are onto us.
And this is a spectacular victory that not just Pelosi, but leftists everywhere, from CNN to the New York Times, are now quickly jettisoning their anti-Fasoros army.
Well, there's this amazing lack of a time lag these days, Alex, in pushing back against false narratives.
Because in the past, you would create a demonic enemy.
You'd say, well, they're the worst human beings possible and therefore we have to restrict their free speech.
And the pace of pushback would be so slow that the laws would already be on the books by the time the blowback occurred and everyone realized they'd been bamboozled.
And they've been taught to hate someone so that free speech restrictions could be put in place that would then be turned against them.
But now, with alternative media, with Twitter, with Facebook, with YouTube, with the immense reach that you have and other people have, we can push back against these restrictions on free speech right away.
And we can talk about the intolerance of the left and their attacks upon peaceful demonstrators.
So we can defuse these bombs before they roll under the bed and put us all up against the ceiling.
Stefan, what's incredible is...
You're not left-wing. You're not right-wing.
I don't speak for it, but I've been watching it for years.
I know that. You're just common sense.
So am I. And we're almost synced.
And the media keeps asking, how is Trump?
How is Molyneux? How is Jones?
How is Watson? How are all these people, like, synced?
Are we communicating? And they think we are.
And they're asking, who's directing us?
Common sense is directing us when we have hundreds of videos around the country of mobs of scumbags beating up men, women, and children screaming Nazi when some of the folks they're beating up are black.
And are women. It's not that we're not directed like them.
We're organic. And they keep attacking us like they still have their superiority.
They keep operating arrogantly like, hey, MTV Awards.
You had 2 million viewers this year.
You had 4 million last year.
We have videos every day with 2-3 million views.
Most of our videos, 50,000, 100,000.
Tens of millions of views every couple of days.
Don't you understand?
We are destroying you.
Well, I think they do understand that.
You know, there's an old saying that says any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.
I would amend that with the new media, Alex, to say any sufficiently advanced common sense is indistinguishable from collusion.
It looks like we're colluding because we have common sense.
I mean, scientists don't collude.
They just all follow the rational scientific method.
And that's how, for the most part, they try to adjudicate their disputes.
Mathematicians are not in collusion.
They're just following objective and rational rules.
And so it looks like magic.
Because we're not ideological, but we are rather common sense based.
And it tells you everything you know about them that they don't get that.
They've got to be directed because everything they're doing is nonsensical.
They have, of course, an agenda.
They wish to control people.
They wish to control your thoughts.
They wish to sow irrationality into you to harvest like an evil demon seed to harvest from your errors and from your corruption they have sown.
They wish to harvest the fruit of government power.
I don't have an agenda other than I care passionately about the truth.
I'm willing to be corrected. Reason and evidence is the way to go.
Debate, conversation, and research is the way to go.
I don't have an agenda like I want people to do something.
I need them to do something.
I want them to avoid irrationality.
My Ten Commandments center around the thou shalt nots.
Rather than thou shalt, which is much less restrictive to say to someone, don't do something rather than do something specific.
They have an agenda. They're always being run by that agenda.
And whenever you have a thirst for power, the first thing to go is any honesty, common sense, and integrity.
And we're really seeing that now because now we have something to compare the media to.
We have something to compare them to, which is the more honest media, the independent media, the media that answers to the people rather than the powers that be.
I've got to put together a news report, or you can, or we all should.
That simply shows clips of Antifa doing horrible, vicious things and then shows CNN and MSNBC and at least 20 videos I've seen the last three weeks.
Endorsing them and saying, when it's time to be violent, when violence is for peace, when violence is good, what is Antifa?
And to watch these operatives, most of them CIA and others, promoting, just like they promoted the Arab Spring, violent anti-freedom, anti-open society scum, being able to go out and preemptively attack folks after they've been labeled So here's the $64 trillion question, Stefan. When is CNN going to say that they don't support Antifa?
When are they going to call them out?
They keep asking Trump to come out and distance himself and repudiate the Nazis, which he's done hundreds and hundreds of times.
Even when he does, they say he hasn't.
So when is CNN that has actually endorsed the Antifa scourge When are they going to repudiate a group they've actually endorsed?
Well, I think everybody knows the answer to that, Alex.
They're going to repudiate Antifa when they can reframe Antifa as some right-wing extremist organization.
As long as they're anywhere centered on the left, they're going to have to dodge that because now there's no such thing as the memory hole.
You know, in 1984, the government controls the technology, the government controls the media, and when anything inconvenient happens or the government is caught in a contradiction or a hypocrisy, they just flush it down the memory hole and away it goes deep into the rear view over the curve of the earth.
Now, there's no memory hole because stuff that people wrote a year ago, five years ago, ten years, can be resurrected and now you can juxtapose Antifa being violent with people in the media and people in politics supporting them.
And this lack of a memory hole, this immediacy of pointing out hypocrisy is an incredibly powerful weapon to point out the agenda that's driving these people.
They have no idea for consistency.
They have no plan for consistency.
They want their drug of power and they'll tell any lie to get it.
But at least the lies now can be exposed, which means Everyone can see the addiction for what it is.
Well, that's right. Gruber said, who helped write the Obamacare scam with the Republicans to rip people off, bipartisanly.
I don't want liberals and others to support it when it's an admitted scam.
He said, thank God you have no attention span.
Thank God the public's so stupid in six different videos.
And it's true. Folks kind of had a goldfish mentality for a while, at least some people.
But now because there is no memory hole, no furnace into which yesterday's news is dumped and then the new reality of history's actors as, you know, Karl Rove, that whole thing is in trouble because Drudge or yourself or others go and show.
Here's where they said you could keep your doctor and it was free.
Here now they're saying it doubles your prices.
Or, you know, here they are...
Over here telling you that they know there's WMDs, and here they are telling you they never told you that there were WMDs.
So they've got that huge problem in that we can just go back and show how they're counting on us having no memory, but we do now because the memory hole has been blown to pieces.
The Iraq War. Don't you wonder, Alex, if the alternative media had been as strong back then, in 2003, if it had been as strong then as it is now, I genuinely believe America would not have performed that disastrous invasion, that act of brutal imperialism and destruction.
I genuinely believe that Libya may not have been destroyed.
The gateways to the migrants of Europe may not have been destroyed.
If social media Was as strong then as it is now.
Now, because it is as strong now, we may see, we may have seen the last of the horrifying imperialistic unjust wars.
We may have seen- Well, they admit, I mean, Britain first led the deal along with Senator Paul and also Senator Cruz to not be Al-Qaeda and ISIS's air force and for the first time broke and said we're not gonna be a part of this invasion of Syria so that stopped that and we now know Sutherland and the UN and the EU wanted to dynamite the Middle East to then flood Europe with all these Islamicists As a really political arm of domination.
So we now see the imperialization of the Middle East was actually to be used in the final takedown of Europe and the United States.
And now the whole globalist master plan, in their own words, is on fire.
They admit globalism is in cultural retreat.
People are against it, but still they're force feeding it.
How do you predict this collision is going to look?
It depends how well we can maintain our platform, Alex.
As you know, the whole goal of certain elements within the left, and the globalist elements as well, their particular goal is to get us to shut the hell up.
Now, they can't interrupt our passion, they can't stop our eloquence, they can't stop our research, they can't stop our facts, and they sure as hell can't rebut our arguments.
So what they're doing is they're hoping to unplug the studios.
They're hoping to find ways that we can be deplatformed, and which is such a confession of helplessness.
If I'm a boxer and I'm terrified to get into the ring with some guy, it's because I think I'm going to lose.
So they have no answers.
So they're looking to unplug the cameras.
They're looking to unplug the lights and have us go completely dark.
It really depends on how well we can navigate this particular de-platforming issue, which is the very biggest issue, I think, going on at the moment.
No, you're right. As usual, 100% on target.
Everything goes dark. So how do we raise the alarm?
Because they've been slowly titrating and censoring, and the listeners would go do something, and lawsuits are filed, and we beat them back.
But now people are so used to the censorship, they're kind of just almost accepting it, and it's what, 500% what it was a year ago?
I mean, it is exponential.
Well, the real danger here, in my view, Alex, is not even the external censorship.
It's the self-censorship.
Yes. Everyone out there who has these platforms who says, well, you know, demonetization and ghettoization and all the stuff that's being done for objectionable content.
And of course, if we have decent schools, people would be able to handle even the most corrosive content with intellectual agility and certainty.
My concern in particular is that people internalize the censorship and try and avoid these problems.
And I'm not going to do that. I don't think you're going to do that because you haven't so far as far as I've ever known you.
So the important thing is don't let them get in your head.
Don't let them shut you down internally.
Don't try and pick a safe and easy route because that's surrendering without a fight.
That's desperately what they want.
These are all supposed to be flares shot into people's faces to get us all to look away from the light.
And we have to resist that and continue speaking the truth and deal with the consequences that arise.
Well, I'm proud of Paul Watson, yourself, everybody, myself.
First, it was 50% demonetization, then 76% for everybody.
It's all an algorithm. They admit it.
Now it's 95%.
And now Facebook goes, we're not going to let conservatives or libertarians advertise.
That was announced yesterday.
And their Jihad Watch and all these groups are being kicked off PayPal.
The rebel media has been taken down in Canada.
I mean, it's really ultra intense, and I agree with you.
They're trying to get the little guy to self-censor.
They're trying to get the big guys to self-censor.
They're trying to get a Joe Rogan scared to have me back on.
That's not happened, but they did, you know, try to delete his stuff or block it or not let it be seen or...
You know, basically just, you know, threats.
This is happening to everybody right now.
And here's the problem. We give in to this.
The globalists know they're incredibly unpopular.
They want to bring in real authoritarianism now because they understand that if they beat us in this phase, we're just going to come back.
So they're going for all the marbles.
You have a perfect storm of old dinosaur media, the corrupt corporations, the big multinationals, the out-of-touch government people who are now admittedly saying We want an Antifa army to beat you up.
We want to kill Trump.
We want to arrest our opposition.
We want to go like brown shirts and beat folks up everywhere and pour coffee on Alex Jones.
They're turning, as you said, desperately to the authoritarianism switch.
And that's why we've got to understand we're very close to beating them.
This Antifa admission of them being a criminal gang...
Shows they're distancing themselves now, knowing that intimidation didn't work, knowing we're not backing down.
So what do we do next to really let the troops know we're entering the thick of the critical juncture of this deciding war right now?
I think patience and I have gained new respect over the years for the idea of having some compassion for your enemy.
One of the things that has struck me, I just had a very long conversation with somebody who had left Antifa, who had left the extremist violent movements, and we talked about the reasons why, how he got into it and how he got out.
It's a very, very important conversation for people to listen to.
But one of the problems is that in government schools, in most of the media that's aimed at children, you just get one view.
One view. You never encounter anything different.
Now then you get on social media as an adult or you start looking at alternative media and this new information comes in and it feels alarming.
You're kind of programmed to react against it badly.
I think that we also have to be sensitive to trying to recognize that these people have been programmed.
And deprogramming them is not always a matter of yelling, although I've certainly done my fair share over the years.
No, you're right. It's a cult then. It's a cult.
How do you approach it? Right.
Well, I think that you have to show some compassion for where they've come from and some sense of how their soul, their reasoning, their humanity has been stripped from them by the corrosive sandblasting and propaganda they get all from the media, all from the mainstream media, from schools, all the way from kindergarten through to postgraduate and doctorate degrees.
It's a relentless amount of propaganda that is hard to stand against and it's hard to step out of.
Because then you feel really disoriented and it's very painful to realize how much you've been lied to over the course of your life and where you actually stand in relation to the truth and virtue.
And so I think we need to be somewhat delicate in this operation and approach these people as, in a sense, wounded against their permission and against their will and a little bit more treatment and a little bit less aggression.
I'm sort of reminding myself of that every day because I think that Jesus' commandment to love your enemy may, in fact, have more power here than I've thought in the past.
Well, exactly. You've got to know when to hold and know when to fold and when it's the right time.
If they're coming at you with a hatchet or whatever, you've got to, you know, obviously get out of the way or stop them.
But if they're just screaming at you, that's my problem is I've run the gamut when they're screaming F.U. Nazi to running up saying, talk to me, tell me, but they'll never talk.
They'll never articulate, literally almost never just screaming Nazi F.U. Die, die, die.
And... Then when they're getting violent, and when I finally get a few of them to talk to me, they actually then shake their head and don't know what to do.
When you say, I'm a human.
You've been lied to. What they said, I said, I didn't say.
Do you understand that the big banks, you know, that control the Republicans, too, are against Trump?
He's not perfect. But why does the mainstream media hate him?
You know the corporate media is the power structure.
Why are you so committed to this?
Why have you bought into this hype?
A few of them you can actually get through to.
And I think those conversations are essential because people hit because they can't speak.
People scream because they can't reason.
And I think we're all born with the capacity to reason.
I mean, as a father yourself, you know your kids are very rational.
If you give them the space and capacity to debate and reason with you, they take to it like fish to water.
They have had their capacity to think and reason and use words and debates and language stripped from them by a very, very corrupt educational system and a media system.
We have to try and find a way to restore their humanity for their capacity to reason, not to agree with us.
I don't want anyone to agree with me.
I want us to face together the truth and reason it out.
But the globalists want to end debate.
Stefan Molyneux, come back. We'll talk about your book, The Art of the Argument, Western Civilization's Last Stand.
Stay with us. You know, we have a lot of amazing guests on, and this is one of them that I really should just shut up.
But he gets me really excited with what he's saying so true that I start jumping in.
But we've got to get Stefan Molyneux, who's got his own show, reaches tens of millions a week, on with David once a week, you with once a week, next week when you launch your show, and with mine, because...
He's just so on target in his history, his research.
I've done a lot of history research, and I even learned a lot of stuff from him.
But when he writes the book, The Art of the Argument, Western Civilizations Last Stand, which I haven't read.
It just came in yesterday. I mean, it really is true.
Stefan Molyneux is one of the best debaters out there.
But it's because it's logic and common sense that he's saying you cannot disagree with it.
And I can't think of when he's been wrong.
So, I mean, I think we can really say we have certain experts that know more about intelligence operations or military operations or this or that.
But just in general sense, I think Stefan Molyneux is one of the smartest people, if not the smartest we interview.
We've got to get him more involved with the Infowar.
That means I could get on the telephone with him and talk about it.
But we're launching a larger platform to AM and FM stations.
A lot of big things are happening.
Infowars is exploding.
Because of that vacuum, and the enemy knows that.
They had a bunch of articles just last week going, Paul Watson, Alex Jones, Stefan Molyneux, he was listed.
These are the people that are beating us.
We've got to ban them on YouTube.
And like he said earlier, Owen, what an incredible admission that, oh, they're destroying us.
And they're getting our, quote, followers to follow them.
No one's following us.
We want everybody to be free.
That's what Western civilization is.
It's not a skin color. It's what took us out of the Dark Ages into this, was thinking.
Stefan Malinu is...
I don't know what his opinion is on things because he just presents facts.
He just provides a centrist point of view that you can't debate because it's factual.
Whereas someone like me, I'm a very opinionated debater.
You can pretty much make a fair judgment where my opinions lie.
But Stefan does a great job of remaining central.
Cutting right to it.
They're losing because we have independent media.
That's why they're now repudiating Antifa, which, again, if we don't celebrate this victory, no one will even know it's a victory because as patriots, we're always moving forward to the next issue, not celebrating our laurels.
And now Dianne Feinstein is coming out and kind of giving Trump some fair critique, saying that he's doing a good job.
So you're seeing some politicians perhaps having to come around.
Well, they know it's blowing up in their face, which again, we're in a war.
We have to celebrate our victories more.
Stefan, I mean, don't we as just free thinkers, as common sense folks, I don't call us conservative, Shouldn't we celebrate our victories more?
Is this not a big victory, a turning point that they're having to kind of back off Trump?
Not that Trump's perfect, but as a figurehead.
I think so. And I think there is a great sense across the world, Alex, that we are at the end of a particular era of expanding state control, of expanding state power and state regulations and so on.
And the fact that Donald Trump is in there cutting a lot of regulations and doing a lot to help free the market from its constraints is one of the reasons why job numbers are up enormously, more than a million since he took office.
And we've got economic growth that has outstripped anything.
That mostly happened during the Obama era.
So people are actually seeing the facts.
There are people out there who are bold in their predictions, who say, if we get more free market, we can have a soft landing in all this deficit and debt.
We've got to transition people off their dependence on the government.
And we either do that because the government runs out of money, in which case we have god-awful revolutions in the streets, or we find a way to stimulate the free market and draw people, lure people away from dependence on the state to independent, productive lives.
And we know that that's what works.
The other stuff, Venezuela and North Korea, doesn't work.
You always end up with pot-bellied psychos running everything.
Your book, for radio listeners, The Art of the Argument, shows a burned-out New York City.
Well, that's what's already happening in Venezuela.
They're three years into starvation.
Almost all the pigeons, flamingos have all been eaten.
All the farm animals have been eaten.
They're in total collapse level.
Talk about your book, The Art of the Argument, Stefan Molyneux, because I can't wait to read it and where folks get it.
Well, of course, Alex, you know how much writers hate to talk about their own books, you know, but I'll find a way.
I'll find a way to try and make it happen.
So in the front of the book as well is The Thinker.
And The Thinker, of course, is part of this sort of destroyed landscape because this is what happens if we don't think.
We all have to make decisions.
We have to make decisions individually.
We have to make decisions collectively.
And by the way, if people want to go to artoftheargument.com, they can get a nice easy way To get there, we've got Kindle at the moment.
I've read the audio book. It's going through the process and the print book will be out very shortly.
So I appreciate people's patience on that.
The idea, the basic foundational thing is we either speak, we reason, we all submit to something larger than ourselves.
Because they want to get their minions into a total unthinking system.
Right. And so I'm aiming to give people the skills to have productive debates.
I want to engage with the left.
I want to engage with people who strongly disagree with me.
I want because we both end up better.
You know, if you and I are debating about the best way to get to Vegas, whoever is right gets us both to Vegas.
We both get what we want.
You shouldn't hold on to your position.
You should hold on to the truth.
You should submit your angry will.
You should submit your ego to the truth.
We all benefit thereby.
And we're either going to reason with each other or it's going to come to bike locks and fists and suppression of free speech and violence.
And guess what? If you look at our crowds versus their crowds, you know who's going to win a physical war.
We don't want to prove ourselves physically defeating a bunch of meth heads.
No, it's tragic. And we can bring people to the table of conversation, to the table of civilization.
Or, another part of the book is very important, in how to expose sophists.
So there are some people who want the truth but don't know how to get there.
And this book is aiming to give them the tools to get there.
And there are predators that know this who are beyond sophists and sycophants who want total control and want serfdom, so they're sabotaging intellect and critical thinking and common sense and the rising tide, rising all ships.
How do you deal with those people?
Identify, isolate, ostracize.
They need to be shown for who they are, which is a perilous task.
When you call upon society to recognize the language parasites, those who use words to pave the way for violence, those who use language to pave the way for guns and blood, they need to be identified, they need to be shown for who they are, and they need to be ostracized and isolated from the social discourse.
There are some that you can cure.
There are some who will only be disease carriers in the general conversation, and they need to be isolated.
Why do they tend to recruit dumber and dumber people Because I know there's a conspiracy of power.
People collude. But it is true.
A lot of it is just ineptitude, arrogance, and greed.
Those people get together, and then they become more and more decadent.
They hand power onto their subordinates, and then it just gets more and more accelerated like Rome.
Pelosi and Waters, I mean, they don't even know what planet they're on, but they're arrogantly calling for war and attacks and violence.
I mean, it's just ridiculous that I've read about that in literature, and I used to think, oh, that's exaggerated.
But the longer I live, I realize, no, literature is just images of real things people saw in their times.
Well, of course, less intelligent people are very susceptible to emotional manipulation.
And now, I also wanna say people who were less skilled in the art of intellectual self-defense, the art of the argument.
And you can quite easily fill those people with venomous, bottomless, I dare say, satanic hatred.
And then when they're filled with all that hatred, you simply point at an enemy and those shock troops, and this has happened from the French Revolution onwards, it's happened in Weimar, it's happening in Venezuela.
You get less intelligent people who have fewer intellectual skills, you fill them full of hatred, you pour all of your venom into them, and then you unleash them on your enemies, and that silences people who might otherwise disprove your arguments.
And then you divide that group again and play them off against each other over and over again.
That's a real... British Empire, Roman Empire formulaic.
Well, it's amazing what he just talked about, the hatred that these people are filled with.
It is very real.
And you can see it when we go do these videos.
I mean, it's sad, Stefan. I don't know if you saw the videos that we shot yesterday, but...
I go down here to cover Trump.
It's getting worse. It's getting worse.
You go out there and for two hours running the camera live, it's every minute is the most frothing, crazy, sad, but also ridiculous behavior.
I don't even say one word to these people before they start chanting they hate me.
They act like Looney Tunes characters.
They chant death to America.
And that's why I think the subtitle of your book is so imperative, Western Civilization's Last Stand.
It's almost a cryptic message because these people have no arguments.
And that's the entire point.
All they have is hatred. So in that logic, they've already fallen.
Well, I don't want to put words in Stefan's mouth.
Do you agree they're getting worse, those that aren't coming out of it, that the cult programming, the ghost dance is getting more intense?
Because it seems to be getting more intense to me.
Oh, without a doubt. And without a doubt, I guarantee you, I guarantee everyone out there, this escalates until we push back.
This is going to continue to escalate until it's Cambodia, until it's Pol Pot, until it's some sort of horrifying Cuban-style or North Korean-style dictatorship.
There is no end to the thirst for power over other human beings.
There is no point at which you say, okay, that's it, I've got enough power.
What's wrong with me? I can't stand power over people.
Push back now. What's wrong with us, then?
I can't stand power over people.
Everybody knows. I want everybody to be empowered doing their own deal.
What's wrong with us, Stefan, that we don't want to run people's lives?
Well, see, here's the thing. You have a dangerous disease, Alex, called empathy.
And what you do is you say, well, you know, I don't like to have a gun put to my head and be told what to do or else, so I'm pretty sure other people don't want that either.
And if you have that basic empathy, then it's really, really hard to control others.
Empathy is one of the great natural resources of the world that is entirely underestimated.
And if you have it, you don't seek power over others because you know how it feels to be bullied or to be controlled, or you can imagine it and you recoil from it.
Instead, I want people just to commune and all of us together and their attributes with my attributes.
We have a great party. But if you look at the response that even some of the quote-unquote left is having to their own, I think that the hate and the vitriol is starting to scare away some of their own.
Oh, that's a good point. Everywhere we go, from Dallas to Austin to L.A., they start fighting with each other now and will just randomly beat up their own people now, Stephan.
Well, people are really identifying where things have gotten.
You know, there's a lot of preparation.
It takes decades of preparation to produce this kind of concentrated hatred with little conscience, with sadistic qualities, with aggressive qualities, and a complete willingness to use violence in the pursuit of a very ill-defined intellectual end.
And so I think people are looking at this as the tip of the spear and saying, okay, how much is back there?
How much is wrong in our culture?
How much is wrong in our media?
And particularly, how much is wrong in academia?
That so many people are coming out of this.
We generally think, oh, well, you know, people are violent.
Well, I guess they must be uneducated and so on.
These are people in colleges.
These are people who've gone through a lot of education.
And I think this is really pulling up a pretty horrifying situation.
People are turning the lights on saying, wait a minute, if this is happening now, what are the steps that led up to it?
And how can we stop these dominoes landing on them?
A lot of historians and sociologists are concerned that when you have a crazy leftist, kind of Bolshevik, globalist funded thing like this in other areas, you tend to get a fascist backlash, which turns out to be something basically as bad when the people that do produce decide, okay, we're going to clean this up. That tends to get co-opted as well.
So how do you balance that when you're fighting for your life When they're so radical, you stare into the abyss, you become the abyss.
Like Nietzsche said, how do we not become something like them?
Well, of course, if you've got some crazy guy running at you with a bike lock swinging, philosophy isn't really going to help you much.
There is no words that are going to be some sort of security guard around you.
And of course, our whole goal is to avoid that kind of stuff, Alex, of course.
And the way that we do it, we have the option now to not have the sort of right wing death squad helicopter joke backlash against the left because we have now a true free market in information.
The Internet has given us finally As a species, as a humanity, as a civilization, we finally have the capacity to have people push back, not with weapons, but with words.
And so my goal, again, the whole point of the book, theartoftheargument.com, is to give people the skills, the ability, the language in a tightly reasoned and entertaining package so that we don't have to escalate to another blowback situation, to a Weimar-style aggression from the right.
I'm gonna make sure your book gets hand-delivered to Trump.
Well, I would appreciate that.
Well, I'm not bragging about my contacts.
We don't talk about them. We don't know how we're getting.
It's not just Roger Stone.
But I've got ways, and I'm going to get your book to the president.
I mean, he's already clearly aware of what's going on.
This is the type of book he'd really read.
And I guess your title is a little bit of an ode to Art of the Deal.
No, no, that's a complete coincidence.
I will maintain that. No, I'm sorry.
Yes, of course, that had something to do with it.
And if we don't give people language, they're going to start picking up swords in response.
You know, there's only so much that people can stand being physically aggressed against and beaten down before that.
I love it.
He always finishes my question before I ask it.
I don't want violence, but if somebody hurts my family, if they keep pushing, once the switch, I mean, when they're on TV saying, with the former CIA deputy director saying, we're going to kill the president once we plunge the economy for the next two months, he's trying to hurt the economy, he's trying to hurt my family, he wants to kill my president.
I know, as a figurehead, he means he wants to get me, and it starts turning areas on my brain.
Stefan, I don't like, you know, getting very cold, very militaristic.
That's in all our family histories, but I'm not just good at business and life and everything else.
I start turning on the switches to be the killer.
And I'm not saying I'm going to start killing people, but don't they understand what they're opening up here?
Well, I don't think they do, Alex, because it's been a long time since, I guess, Europeans, and I've said this for years, Europeans, very nice, very, very nice people give you the shirt off their back.
Until they're not. And then they're really, really not.
And I think of this in, you know, the Britain, England in Germany, England versus Germany versus Hitler in the 1930s.
It was like appease, appease, appease.
Let's try and find the nice way out.
Let's try and be reasonable. Let's try and negotiate.
And then at some point it's like, okay, I guess we're just going to have to bomb Germany back to the stone age because Europeans very, very nice until they're not.
And then they're really, really not.
And I really want to avoid that if at all humanly possible.
And I think we can avoid it now.
And that brings us to North Korea.
I mean, the Clintons gave them the missiles.
I don't want to demonize the Clintons.
It's always them, the missiles, the reactors.
And now he's firing it over Japan.
They can see the missile going over and crashing and threatening to nuke everybody.
And you see Putin evacuating eastern Russia.
They've never done that. And the word is, Russia is reportedly going to stand down if Trump hits North Korea.
Which is good. Well, it is an astonishing and terrifying situation, of course.
And it feels like this loop, you know, back when you and I were, I guess, younger.
I'd like to say young, but younger.
When we were younger, there was this loop of like, well, Russia's going to bomb you.
There's all this nuclear stuff going on.
And it seems like we keep pulling back from that.
And then, you know, there's always a new jerk in the universe who's going to make things more difficult.
But Russia was never firing missiles and doing stuff like this.
And we're the ones, our elites are the ones that actually, Russia didn't give North Korea the stuff.
No, that's right. I mean, I don't have a lot to say about what should happen geopolitically.
I don't have access to the military information that other people do, but I will say this.
North Korea It was a communist country.
And now it's morphed into the usual nightmare freak show of totalitarianism and concentration camps that this does.
What we can do, of course, is look at this as we can look at Venezuela, where people are breaking into zoos to eat the animals.
We can look at that and say this is the end result of collectivism.
This is the end result of central planning.
This is the end result of expansions of government power, in particular, over the economy.
They come for your stuff and then they come for you.
And so I want us to look at North Korea and say what a horrifying situation.
We're still early days in the West.
It's getting later as we move forward.
We need to find and dig out this ideology, argue against it, and discredit it.
Once and for all, we need to discredit this collectivism before we're all gone from the planet.
I was about to say, how do you do that?
It's like discrediting cancer.
Do I need to? I mean, I remember just five years ago, whenever Sean Penn was still worshipping The Venezuelan dictator Hugo Chavez is saying America should be like this.
It was already a hellhole. They'd eaten all the zoo animals two years ago.
I mean, it's way beyond all that now.
We're going to come back from break and talk about all this and get Owen's take on it.
How do you discredit Cuba?
How do you discredit North Korea?
How do you discredit the Soviet Union?
Again, it's like discrediting gonorrhea.
You know, you really don't want gonorrhea.
You really don't want brain cancer.
You know, you really don't want to stick your hand in a garbage disposal.
But we have to do it because every idiot walks over and says, I wish we had free health care like England.
I'm like, people with money in England come over here because they got to wait for it.
I mean, you people are idiots.
Communism is a damn nightmare!
Owen Troyer is our guest.
Riding the shotgun with Stefan Molyneux, The Art of the Argument, Western Civilization, Last Stand.
The new book is available. You know, it's available on Amazon.
More and more I'm trying to order stuff directly from people on their own shopping carts, their own sites.
Amazon is funding anti-gun, globalism.
They own the Washington Post.
They're trying to destroy the country. But I don't care where you get it, because, you know, it's like using a smartphone to shoot a video.
Yeah, it's a device that spies on you, made by slaves in China.
We admit that. We're not hypocrites, but we're using it for good.
But I guess karmically, we admit that there, you know, is some bad in it.
But wherever you get the book, get the book.
Where's the best place to get the book, Stefan Molyneux, where we don't get it from Amazon?
The Art of the Argument.
Well, artoftheargument.com is the gateway to the book, and we're trying to get it to as many places, of course, as possible.
And by the way, let me say, I want to buy 5,000, 10,000 of them.
I want to really, I haven't even read the book.
I know it's going to be excellent. Everything you do is excellent.
I want to sell this book at M4 store.
Well, that's very kind. Thank you.
And I just wanted to ask your listeners for a favor, of course, if you buy the book, and I think you should.
I think it's a great book. I poured everything I've got in 35 years of debating and philosophy.
I poured everything into this book to try and give people the tools they need to win these debates.
If your listeners can go and buy the book, even if you don't have time right now, you can read it later.
Buy it now. Because, of course, if you buy the book, it gets pushed up on the bestseller list.
It gets visible to more and more people.
It causes a chain reaction.
It causes a chain reaction.
So everybody should buy the book, read it, because I've already been reading it, I can't wait to read it.
And then also donate it after you read it to the library, so hundreds more will read it.
These are all aggressive information warfare tactics that are peaceful that we use.
And every little bit is like drops of rain.
We're about to break the dam.
We're so close. And I think one of the things as well is it will help you be more skeptical of the education you received.
Because once people read this book and they understand how easy it is to make a really great argument, how compelling it is to make a really great argument, and how powerful it is, then what you'll do is look back and say, okay, I read this book in a couple hours.
I'm now armed to the teeth intellectually.
What was going on during the dozen years that I was in government schools?
You know, it really, I think, will give you a sense of how much was taken away from you, how much of your humanity and your birthright and your capacity to reason that is the only thing that makes us human, how much was stripped from you that might make you angry.
I don't mind that. I hope it'll make you effective.
Well, we're in an information war, and we've all got to have these tools, and I think I know how to debate, but it's all about logic.
I'm going to read the book this weekend.
I'll carve out four or five hours, stay up late, maybe pour a scotch or something, and I'm going to read the whole thing.
Stefan, do five more minutes with us.
The new book, The Art of the Argument, Stefan Molyneux.
Amazing. We had a huge victory if you just joined us.
Pelosi, the Democrats, are having to desert Antifa, saying they're a gang, they're horrible, they're evil, because the images of them spitting on people, beating up women, children, is blowing up in their face.
So some sanity is being shown by the captains of the Democratic Party, which is a good thing.
Their arrogance, their spoiling for war, seems to be dented a little bit, but still they have creepy guys like Phil Mudd of the CIA, former deputy director, saying, oh, we're going to kill the president the next two months.
We're going to plunge the economy.
We're going to screw everything up, cause riots, and then kill him.
Now, maybe behind the scenes, the decision has been made not to kill him or to back off for now.
Maybe it's because the president's starting to go their way a little bit on Afghanistan.
I don't know. Stefan Molyneux, what do you think is really going on here?
Well, they're trying to see everything that they can get away with.
And, you know, Trump is something that really came out of, I guess, right field, you could say, an unbought president with, in a sense, nothing to lose.
And this is not the next step on anyone's career ladder if you've got a successful TV show and a beautiful wife and a great family and a good business.
So he really was a surprise.
And they, I think, are very shocked At the groundswell of support.
They've lost control of the narrative.
Trump is the social media president.
It was people who broke down the media lies about him and communicated directly to the people who got him into the White House.
So they're facing both Trump and social media.
They can de-platform social media, but that's limited as well because of the Sprysand effect.
You know, if they ghettoize some video, there are already lists on Twitter and other places of I think they're trying to do everything they can to get away with it, but they don't have enough power to go full totalitarian as yet because of the social media and because of people's growing awareness of things.
So I think they're going to have to hold back on anything too drastic.
And this, of course, is the time where we need to strike hard with as much reason and evidence as possible and show no mercy to the false narratives.
And with him admitting they want to ban us, that automatically makes us the avant-garde counterculture, which we already were.
We're fighting the power structure.
We're bringing back the renaissance that is still the most advanced human system.
The real progress they're trying to suppress when we're really the progressives and they aren't.
One of the crew members, Matt, brought up the quick question, a final comment from you on this.
Antifa, the left, they want to say words are hateful, like mother, father, because they know we're winning with words.
So they want to claim the nonviolent path of debate is violence.
And now they're banning conservatives, even speaking at Berkeley because Antifa attacks.
So they're moving forward with claiming violence is good, but words are bad.
Well, they don't want us to have solidarity.
There's collectivism, which is imposed by the state, which is a disaster.
But then there's solidarity.
Every time I come on the show, I just looked it up.
2010, Alex, was the first time we did a show together, seven years ago.
And every time we do a show together, people are like, oh, you guys shouldn't be talking.
It's all the people from the left. Of course we should be talking.
We need allies. We need to stand together in this.
So they want to divide us. Don't have a family.
Don't have any connection.
Don't have friends. Stand alone because they know they can knock us down.
They know they can knock us down if we stand alone.
If we stand together, We are virtually invulnerable.
But if we stand alone, you know, it's the old thing.
We either hang together or we hang separately.
And they want to separate us and ready the nooses.
And that's in the Facebook documents where they said, our average person's a liberal alone.
We want to keep them more alone.
So they only interface with our virtual reality bots.
This is the beginning of the matrix.
And we are blowing it wide out of the water.
And this is what I love about the title of your show, Infowars.
That is an apt and perfect description of where we are.
And it is us who wield words who stand between the population and guns.
It is the words that are gonna defuse the guns or nothing.
That's right. CNN's calling for Trump's death, but telling him to stop using Twitter and shilling outrage over and over again, like we're going to pavlovally clap our hands like seals and say, yes, you're right.
No, good job using the Twitter.
Get the book, folks, The Art of the Argument, Stefan Molyneux.
Stefan, thank you so much.
Can't wait to read your book and can't wait to get you back up.
