June 14, 2016 - Freedomain Radio - Stefan Molyneux
03:34:08
3319 My Shocking Experience at a Donald Trump Rally - Call in Show - June 10th, 2016
Question 1: [2:18] - “My girlfriend and I attended a Trump rally in California and witnessed the violence first hand. We are now seeing threats of violence against Whites emerge on social media from friends of ours who have gone full blown Hispanic-Supremacist.”“We have seen firsthand the effects illegal immigration has on our community. Our schools are flooded with low-IQ Latino students who choke the resources of our State and yet face dismal graduation and employment rates.”“We have seen the violence spike in our home town as the White population has been gradually replaced with low skilled immigrants who lack the work ethic and community building skills that made California a once great State.”“We no longer feel comfortable wearing our Trump gear in public, and for us, ‘White Flight’ is increasingly becoming what seems the only choice if we ever want to start a family. What can we do in our daily lives to protect ourselves and still try to fight back against the invasion that threatens our home? Are we justified in moving if we feel the violence against Whites escalates? We are split on whether or not we have a duty to stand and fight for California. Finally, if the worst happens and Hillary Clinton is elected president, what is the next step for our movement?”Question 2: [1:28:34] - “My son will graduate from High School next May at 16 1/2 years old and is very set in going into the U.S. Marines as an infantryman. He has been interested in and studied on his own military history, equipment, tactics, etc. since early grade school and likes the type training, knowledge, community, and experience that the Marines ‘claim’ to provide on-the-job. He is my only son and I do not want him to pursue a job that has a high chance of him getting wounded or killed given my view of the current direction of the U.S. and world. How I might change my son’s desired path?”Question 3: [2:25:26] - “Could the migrants be the equivalent for the modern leftist political empire that the barbarian mercenaries where to the Roman Empire? What effects do you think they will have on the native Europeans (particularly the Swedes and Nordic people's) when they turn on their former masters?”Question 4: [3:01:21] - “Why is it that most atheists seem to have a hostile attitude towards theists? It seems as though almost every renown atheist's sole purpose is to destroy religion; Christianity in particular. What is the source of most atheists' belligerent attitude towards religion?”Freedomain Radio is 100% funded by viewers like you. Please support the show by signing up for a monthly subscription or making a one time donation at: http://www.freedomainradio.com/donate
A boyfriend and girlfriend called in who were at a Trump rally in California and saw some pretty staggering levels of violence and policing and helicopters following people.
And we talked about immigration, illegal immigration, what might be going on.
And whether they should stay or not.
And it's a very powerful conversation.
I really appreciate their honesty and directness in calling in.
Second caller is a distraught father.
His son, 16 and a half years old, is very close to being able to go into the army.
And he wants to go into the U.S. Marines, wants to be an infantryman, and doesn't even care if it's America or Russia or any place that can get him onto the combat field and shooting at people.
And he wants to know how this came about.
He's not that way inclined, neither is the mom.
And as we went forward, it sort of became pretty clear how this might have come about and came up with a solution that he agreed to that might work.
We'll keep you posted if we hear back about that.
Now, third caller, we were going to talk about Rome, the fall of Rome and modern parallels, but he was so, well, he identified so much with the Young man, that was the topic of the last call, that we talked about that instead and how he was able to turn away from wanting a life in the military.
And the fourth caller, he wanted to know why atheists seem to be so hostile towards theists.
He said, you know, it seems like the atheists, they want to destroy religion and Christianity in particular.
Why are atheists so belligerent towards religion?
Now, please listen to this one.
Because I arm Christians against atheists in a way that may be surprising and startling, but which I think can actually help really, really save the world.
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All right.
Well, up first today, we have Nick and Morgan.
They're a couple that attended one of Donald Trump's California events and wrote in after experiencing some of the protests outside.
So welcome to the show, Nick and Morgan.
Hi, Stefan.
How's the sound quality?
Sound great.
How are you doing?
Great.
Hoping to kind of read off what I had prepared here and then we can get started.
Read away.
All right.
Stefan, my girlfriend and I have been tuning in for about six months.
We have seen the disillusion of law and order in our home state of California and would like to give you an in-situ analysis of what we have witnessed happen to our great state.
Recent legislation is pending the governor's signature in California that would extend Obamacare coverage to illegal immigrants.
This comes after existing law already provides for Medicaid subsidies to minors regardless of immigration status.
Currently illegal immigrants can purchase private health insurance in California, so this law is just step one in a two-step process to eventually subsidize illegal immigrants under Obamacare.
We attended a Trump rally in San Diego, California, and witnessed the violence firsthand.
We are now seeing threats of violence against whites emerge on social media from friends of ours who have gone full-blown Hispanic supremacists.
We have seen firsthand the effects illegal immigration has on our community.
Our schools are flooded with low IQ Latino students who choke the resources of our state and yet face dismal graduation and employment rates.
We have seen the violence spike in our hometown as the white population has been gradually replaced with low-skilled immigrants who lack the work ethic and community building skills that made California a once great state.
We no longer feel comfortable wearing our Trump gear in public and face the agonizing decision of either illegally concealed carrying a concealed carry weapons permit is impossible in our county or staying home in fear or possibly leaving the state that we were both born in and love.
For us, white flight is increasingly becoming what seems the only choice if we ever want to start a family.
My girlfriend is the daughter of a first-generation immigrant from Ireland.
Her father painted houses and did landscaping to provide for his family in the beginning and later started his own business.
He has now passed and never became an American citizen, though he was a legal resident and he always remained quintessentially Irish.
This really brings to heart the notion of whether immigrants can truly integrate into their adopted nation.
Because of this, she has the opportunity to become a citizen of Ireland and thus the EU. This is something we have discussed earnestly, but looking at the situation in Europe, is it just out of the frying pan and into the fire?
Our question is, what can we do in our daily lives to protect ourselves and still try to fight back against the invasion that threatens our home?
Are we justified in moving if we feel the violence against whites escalates?
We are split on whether or not we have a duty to stand and fight for California.
Finally, if the worst happens and Hillary Clinton is elected president, what is the next step for our movement?
Thank you.
Well thanks Nick, thanks Morgan.
There's a lot in of course what You've written.
The first thing I wanted to mention is I'm not going to advocate you do something illegal.
So concealed carry, that's your decision.
But let's talk about the San Diego rally.
I mean, the San Jose rally, of course, is where people heard the most of this kind of stuff, aggression or violence going down.
What did you guys see in San Diego?
Well, so I'd like to give you kind of just a two or three minute, just a little summary of what happened.
And so there's been four rallies in California, Costa Mesa, Anaheim, San Diego, and San Jose.
San Diego was the least violent of the three.
So sorry about that.
But we did see violence.
And so I'll just give you the play by play.
So we got down there to San Diego, around 930 in the morning.
There were no protesters when we got there in the morning.
I think they were all still asleep or something.
We went in and we waited in queue for about two hours.
They let us in at 11.
Donald took the stage at around 1.30 and gave a really great speech.
Sarah Palin was there, a few others.
I really want to contrast the...
The sense of nationalism and belonging that we felt in the rally versus the...
really just the fear and the hate and everything we felt when we left the rally.
Of course, when we left the rally, how many police officers would you say were in the vicinity, Morgan?
I don't know.
Three, four hundred?
Yeah, I mean, basically...
Three or four hundred?
No, hundred, Stefan.
I wish we had taken a picture and had the impressions to do that, but...
They had...
An article I read, there were 18 different police groups, local, state, and federal, that were there helping out.
So there was quite a few people.
And I don't know if that has something to do with the fact that we have a Republican governor who took...
Mayor.
Mayor, sorry.
Mayor, who took that event very serious in San Diego and ensured that we had...
A lot of police available to help keep everyone safe.
Right.
That's kind of my thought on it because, you know, we do have a Republican mayor versus the Democratic Hillary supporting mayor in San Jose.
But, you know, there were hundreds of police officers in riot, tactical gear, riot gear, you know, combat shotguns.
And there were about 30 people arrested.
People were pepper sprayed.
But What happened when we left the rally is, you know, there was basically just a flanking line of police officers that guided us around the corner of the building away from where the protesters are.
And what we did is we went back to our car and we wanted to go and look at the protesters.
Of course, when we got out there, I should have mentioned this, there were hundreds of protesters when we got out of the rally around, I don't know, 3 p.m.
And You know, I would say it's probably about 80% Hispanic, 10% white, maybe 10% black, just to eyeball it.
But, you know, we saw everything you've seen on the media.
We saw Trump as Hitler.
We saw, you know, kill Donald Trump.
We saw, you know, make California Mexico again, you know, stuff on Hispanic supremacy.
You know, the whole gambit just of anti-American, anti-white people.
Stuff coming from them.
So but what we did is so we wanted to go and kind of see the protesters firsthand.
And we had to wade again through dozens and dozens of police that were blocking off the area.
But we made the decision to take off our Trump gear hats and all that stuff and put in the car because we didn't want to be targeted.
And honestly, I think that that plus the massive police presence, unlike anything I've ever seen in my life, is the only reason there wasn't more violence.
Because when we actually got to the line of protesters, again, they were surrounded by, you know, literally cops, practically arm-in-arm, just a huge line of them.
But, I mean, these people were angry.
They were screaming, they were shouting, they were throwing things, they were shouting at the cops, they were, you know, saying, fuck Donald Trump.
I mean, that was pretty much their chant.
Fuck Donald Trump, fuck Donald Trump, fuck the troops.
You know, we saw one guy was wearing his...
He was wearing a military t-shirt and we saw people throw stuff at him.
And, you know, we kind of walked around this, and what we saw is basically a clash between the Bernie or the anti-Trump supporters and the Trump supporters, and they started throwing stuff at each other.
I don't know who started it, though I have my suspicions.
We also saw something burning in the middle of this crowd of, again, hundreds of protesters.
I don't know if it was an American flag or a Trump hat we didn't see, but we definitely saw smoke.
Oh, they've also set fire to Trump effigies as well.
Yeah.
And again, we didn't see it because it was literally buried so deep in this crowd of hundreds of protesters, but they were absolutely setting something on fire.
And the first thing we saw actually when we walked was a young Hispanic kid wearing a Bernie shirt, running and crying, and he had been pepper sprayed.
You know, his eyes were all messed up and he was Trying to find some water.
And then it was about five minutes after that that there was something of a little mini-stampede when the police started to pepper spray the protesters there.
And that's when we decided to leave.
Because we were up against the train tracks that separate the convention center from the street they had cordoned off for the protesters.
And we kind of had a moment where there was hundreds of people charging at us and past us.
And we decided to leave and go back to our car and from there leave the rally, or leave the protest rather.
But yeah, we absolutely saw fights and we saw people get arrested and the police were using a loudspeaker, a helicopter was using a loudspeaker to try to disperse the rally.
And it was just nuts.
I mean, I went to Ron Paul rallies in 2012.
And it didn't compare at all to the kind of job that Trump did.
But, you know, I was also at UC Davis when, you know, the whole Occupy Wall Street thing was going down.
If you remember the story in 2011 of the police officer that pepper sprayed those kids, you know, I was there for that.
So, I mean, I've seen this stuff before, but it's so much worse, Stefan.
And I guess what we're trying to get out of this call is to just kind of educate your viewers.
You To the people in Wyoming or Montana or Iowa or Ohio or New York or somewhere where they don't have these problems yet, we just kind of wanted to discuss a little bit the changing demography of California and the changing culture and then ask you about your thoughts on possibly leaving our home and possibly our country.
Right.
When you say that it was different from what you saw in Occupy Wall Street and other protests, in what way would you call it different?
How did it strike you as different?
Well, you know, I mean, look, there's an American tradition of protesting.
There's an American tradition of political action that isn't always, you know, just sitting and drinking tea.
But when it crosses over into violence, it just kind of makes you think of, I mean, looking at some of the elections that go down in South America, and I followed some of those things, and some of the political violence is not an American tradition.
Political speech is, but political violence is anathema to everything America's about.
And, you know, just comparing seeing college-age kids who were pissed off, and perhaps rightfully so, about things at the time, and They had signs, they were chanting, but they weren't screaming, they weren't threatening violence.
We see every single day on Facebook and on Twitter and whatnot, people threatening to assassinate Donald Trump.
I'm going to kill Donald Trump if he tries to come up in the city, stuff like that.
I believe it's reaching a critical mass where it's just a matter of time before someone is actually killed.
So far, people have been hurt, but I don't think anyone's died.
The palpable anger That we felt the absolute hatred It was just blind, unfiltered hatred towards us because, I don't know, because we were white, because we were Trump supporters, because we were dressed nice.
I don't know what it was.
Well, it's not because you're white because if Bernie Sanders had been there or Hillary Clinton had been there, they probably wouldn't have been at those riots.
It's not because you're white.
There would have been lots of white supporters at Clinton or Sanders rallies and they would not have been facing the same threats, right?
Well, it's a good point.
And I mean, it kind of seems like, I mean, the pathological, and you've talked about this a lot, but the pathological altruism that afflicts white people in America or in all the Western world right now, it's kind of at a point where it's like if you don't sort of cuck yourself before the left, they will hate you.
But as long as you're willing to just say, you know, just ridiculous, nonsensical and racist things in favor of non-white communities, you kind of get a pass.
Wait, what do you mean racist things in favor of non-white communities?
I'm not sure what that means.
So, you know, saying things like, you know, the white people got to go.
And this is stuff I see all the time.
You know, white people have to go.
We had our time in the sun.
But, you know, at the end of the day, all we did was just rape the resources of Africa and Asia and South America.
It's karma!
I'm sorry, go on?
It's karma.
Yeah, it's karma.
You get a lot of this karma stuff.
Like no one ever says to the Japanese, well, Hiroshima and Nagasaki atomic bomb drops were karma for what?
The rape of Nanking plus the attack on Pearl Harbor.
They don't say that's karma for them, right?
But for white people, anything bad that happens to white people, well, it's karma, which is a low IQ way of saying, fuck you, I don't care about the ethics, right?
Yeah, no, you're absolutely right.
And it's a double standard unlike any I've ever seen.
And I mean, obviously, a lot of people are aware of gender double standards and things like that.
But the racial double standard that's emerging, or perhaps not emerging, but maybe reaching a wider audience, I mean...
What worries me is that white people, they're about 50-50 on this.
I feel about half the people are kind of waking up and they're recognizing that we need in-group preferences and we need to be consistent.
But so much of the hate speech, it's coming from white people against other white people.
Sure.
I mean, the greatest racism against whites comes from whites.
Yeah, it does.
There's a few other thoughts.
Morgan, do you want to add Anything to that?
You know, we were also hoping, Stefan, to maybe share a couple of California...
Wait, wait.
She was...
Did she want to ask me that?
Oh, I'm sorry.
She was shaking her head.
Sorry.
The only thing...
We didn't really talk...
I mean, we talked about how the protesters at the rally were significantly Hispanic, whereas inside of the rally...
And this was also Memorial Day weekend...
There was a very...
I was actually surprised at how diverse the people that we met in there were.
We saw...
You mean in the audience at the Trump rally?
In the Trump rally, yeah.
I mean, there was a big group of Chinese Americans for Trump.
There was girls in hijabs and...
There was a very big military presence for veterans.
And, I mean, the veterans, they were Hispanic, they were Black, they were Indian from all over.
And what surprised me was because this event was...
Specifically to recognize veterans, there's a big area grouped off for veterans.
There were signs spreading positive messages, remembering our veterans and stuff like that.
And that outside in the San Diego community, which has a very large military community, that there were people protesting, not just Trump, but also saying negative things about the military and throwing things at No, say it.
It's fine.
It's just...
That was really upsetting, and I don't understand what's driving that, necessarily.
Like, what the troops and the police have to do with Donald Trump, I don't see, and I don't see...
Well, who do you think's going to be deporting?
Yeah.
Yeah, no, that's...
I mean, it's going to be cats with guns.
I mean, let's not kill ourselves, right?
I mean, the deportation orders, should Trump get elected, and should he follow through on that?
I think we know it's not going to be the human resources manager from the Department of Motor Vehicles.
It's going to be big guys with firepower, right?
Yeah, and you know, just a thought on that is because, and maybe it's my own pathological altruism at play, but I mean, part of me, I want to empathize and understand where these people are coming from.
And, you know, I mean, I kind of thought, I was like, look, if these people do truly believe that Donald Trump is the next Hitler, that he's going to have a genocide against Hispanics or, you know, whatever they fear, I mean, then Then perhaps they're justified in how they act.
If I thought that Hillary Clinton was going to kill all the white people, I would be perhaps violently protesting myself.
Well, hang on.
Before we get to that, Nick, you told me about your experience.
Morgan, I don't know if you're some Xena warrior-style seven-foot-tall Amazon chick or something, but I've got to think that for a woman, there is something more sinister even about that kind of mob.
Um, I mean, I don't...
I grew up in San Diego, and I'm used to people.
I got...
Being angry, the...
And...
What am I trying to say?
So there's quite a few gangs.
Surprisingly, I don't know if people realize that, but in San Diego, the city I grew up in, I've seen violence.
There's been quite a few shootings in my neighborhood.
I had a knife pulled on me when I was in middle school by one of the Hispanic gangs in my area.
And I... I mean, I don't like violence, but I don't think it affected me anymore because I was a female, necessarily.
Alright.
I just wanted to check in on that.
I mean, if I was, I don't know, a lot of women are shorter and slighter and so on, and not necessarily specifically female or anything sexual, but just they look bigger to smaller people, and I was just wondering if that had an effect.
Yeah.
I mean, definitely.
If someone, when people come up to me, I'm absolutely, I'm uncomfortable with With that, but I can't lie and say that I haven't...
I've been hit in high school by females.
She's pretty tough, Stefan.
I mean, she'll fuck you up.
I don't want to say...
No, don't say that.
I'm just saying I've been in a handful of fistfights, unfortunately.
It's not something I'm proud of, but I have had to defend myself, and I know that I can.
And I am 5'9".
I don't know.
So I'm a guest.
So that's nine foot tall and heels, if I remember rightly.
Yeah.
All right.
I just was curious about that.
Now, guys, as far as empathizing with where the protesters are coming from, we can definitely do that.
I mean, I think it's...
First of all...
There are a lot of people who think that white people are wealthy because other people are poor.
Yeah.
Right?
So whites have very high income.
Whites have achieved a significant degree of civilization.
And that's why you always hear from Poorer people.
Here I'm going to just say poorer in intellect, poorer in...
I don't just mean broke.
I just mean, you could say disadvantaged by nature, disadvantaged by circumstances, whatever it is, right?
But whenever people look at the edifice of Western civilization, they say, that was stolen from us.
It's mine.
Welfare is Robin Hood for a lot of people.
Welfare is taking back what was taken from, right?
And of course, for a lot of Mexicans, I mean, the white conquest of southwestern states, California, a couple other states, well, that's just a brief incursion that needs to be driven back, right?
Sure.
And we're seeing a resurgence.
I mean, I just want to say we absolutely loved your video on Judge Curiel.
It was literally the best reporting on the issue I've seen, and I've been looking this up for weeks now.
I mean, you got every single point in there, so great job.
But, you know, the La Raza, it's a real thing here in Southern California.
Yeah.
There are people here that do want to drive out the whites, that want to kill the white people, and reclaim.
I mean, that's sort of what it is.
They want to reclaim what they feel was stolen, not recognizing that, I mean, if We're good to
go.
You know, these people, they're not, you know, I've been to Mexico, I'm organized.
I mean, they're not leaving the beautiful tropical climate and the beaches and the rolling hills.
You know, I mean, they're fleeing a corrupt government that doesn't work and that's dominated by the cartels and they're leaving a sick, cancerous society.
Yeah.
And then coming here, and what's so unfair, Stefan, is, you know, again, it's an 80-20 rule, like with many things, but, you know, we have Hispanic friends.
We know Hispanic people that are high IQ, smart, hardworking, you know, based, if you want to look at it that way.
I mean, conservative, so to speak.
But those people are hit very hard because...
They left.
And I feel the same way about Muslim immigrants that we know.
But they fled their third world country to get away from the other third worlders.
And now it's coming with them and destroying their community.
And we've seen our neighborhoods in California get wiped out.
And we've seen what happens when you go from an 80% white city to a 50% white city to a 30% white city.
And we've seen...
We've seen the civilization that Hispanics build, and it's not a very good one, at least not compared to what we had before.
Yeah, I mean, the founder of, we didn't have this at the time, and thanks for the very kind words about the presentation, but Mike should take the lion's share of that credit.
But the founder of Judge Curiel's legal group, whites should go back to Europe, California to be Hispanic state.
That's That's what he wanted.
Yeah, we read that.
And I've read other things that guy said, even worse things about violence, promoting violence.
And it's, you know, what do you think about the double standard of how...
Well, hang on, hang on.
Before we get onto that, let's just do a little bit more of the sort of understanding where they're coming from.
So, because IQ... Can't be talked about.
And by this, I'm not talking about race and IQ in general.
I'm just, we can't talk about degrees of intelligence.
I mean, I just did a great interview with Dr.
Doob.
He likes to be called the guy who criticizes a common core.
And he's saying, you know, there's this, everyone's got to end up in the same place, in the same.
When I was a kid growing up, There were three streams.
There was basic, advanced, and I can't remember, super or something like that.
And, you know, you'd kind of get channeled into one or the other.
Now, you know, whether that's right or wrong, there was a general recognition that there was a bell curve of ability, and you tried to identify people and put them into the right stream.
You know, and the top ones was, I mean, kind of platonic, kind of republic, in that old republic of Plato.
But there was this general idea that there were smart people, there were medium people, and then they were not so smart people.
That's kind of gone away, hasn't it?
That has gone away.
That has gone away.
Now, even if we take sort of ethnicity and IQ out of the equation, that has gone away.
And so, if you are not smart, if there's no general...
No sense of the bell curve, and no reinforcement of it, then what happens is, less intelligent people tend to rate their own abilities extremely highly.
It's just one of the Dunner-Kruger.
Dunning-Kruger effect.
Yeah, people who are bad at stuff think everything is easy.
So what happens is smarter people tend to have self-doubt because, you know, I mean, the number of things I don't know is staggering, astonishing, right?
And I know that.
I need to focus on the things that I can do well and recognize that there's not a lot out there that I can do well.
I've got a couple of things I'm good at.
And so what happens is normally this, in a free market, this changes as a whole because more resources flow to the smarter people.
Which makes up for their self-doubt.
Because they have more resources, but they have self-doubt.
Fewer resources flow to less intelligent people, which means even though they're wildly confident and idiots, they don't have as much sway in society per capita.
Does that make sense?
Yeah, actually, that's a really good point.
Yeah.
Good.
Then let me see if I can do another one then.
Please.
Okay.
So, but of course, with the vote, right?
I mean, that changes.
Then the vote of less intelligent, very self-confident people are worth the same.
So, there's a reason.
It's in this sort of radical democracy that we have.
This one person, one vote.
And, you know, some illegal immigrants, one vote.
That is something that has...
Flattened out.
This is why there can't be a bell curve.
Because as soon as you get the bell curve of intelligence, like we get the bell curve of height or hair or attractiveness or whatever it's going to be.
As soon as you get the bell curve, then this radical egalitarian democracy starts to look really ridiculous.
Like you give the same vote to someone who's dependent on the state, who's not very smart and who doesn't ever read a book.
You give the same vote to someone who's got, you know, a PhD in political theory or whatever, you know, whatever you can come up with that makes them more of a specialist.
And that doesn't make any rational sense at all.
Now, the free market, again, takes care of this by constantly shuffling resources to those who are the most productive in serving people's needs in society.
So, you know, it's constantly moving things around.
And that's why you don't tend to get aristocracy in a free market.
You get it in the...
In democracies and late-stage democracies, you get this weird inverted thing where the least intelligent have become the aristocrats and the most intelligent have often become the slaves.
It's this weird inverted pyramid.
Because the least intelligent are using the state to hoover up resources from the most productive.
And so it's bad enough when you've got, you know, the pyramid at the top enslaving everyone else, but when you flip it, I mean, at least the first one is somewhat sustainable.
The bottom one doesn't last for more than a couple of generations at best.
And so they have been told these...
Oh, the other thing I wanted to mention too is that less intelligent people are often highly social, highly sociable.
Smarter people are often less comfortable around organizing society, networking, you know.
And it's not obviously a one-to-one, but there's some...
Relation around that.
Smart people tend to think, whereas less intelligent people tend to have allegiances.
And they have allegiances to that which is most obvious, which for many people is the tribe, is the race, is the country.
And for those on the left, it's the class, right?
At least that's who they pretend to have their sympathies with.
So all of these sort of factors combining, this land was stolen from us, And white people stole stuff from us, not just the land, but the wealth.
And listen, it's not like Mexicans don't have anything to complain about with regards to U.S. interference in their country.
That's true.
You know, like the war on drugs is bombing, used to, I mean, they'd bomb the hell out of, like sometimes with crop dusters, sometimes with more virulent stuff.
They bomb the hell out of people's crops.
And then those people can't farm.
And so they gotta go somewhere.
They gotta live.
They gotta eat.
You know, and so there is stuff to complain about.
Like, I've said this a million times before.
The Muslims have a shit ton to complain about when it comes to Western foreign policy.
Well, nothing's black and white.
Well, that...
So we're just talking causes here, right?
Yeah.
So...
this massive interference in other countries' affairs that the Western countries, and in particular America, in particular in Central and South America, is, I mean, it's bad in the Middle East, and it's bad there too.
So they have stuff to complain about, but you have a whole bunch of people who are being told, and we know from the combination of European ancestry and mestizo, right, which is sort of the native culture,
I mean, mestizo is the blend, right, between the natives in Central and South America and often the Spaniards, but sometimes others, that the mestizo, according to the general measurements, lower IQ, but they're being told that the rich people, the white people, stole everything from you.
And you're perfectly justified in getting it back.
And you're being told, of course, that the only reason you're doing badly is not just because they stole from you in the past, but because they hate you in the present.
The white people hate you in the present because they're racist and they don't even know it and they have privilege and all that, right?
So you put all of this together and this, of course, is one of the basic, as I've again mentioned a million times on the show, that the communist plan is to rile up minorities against minorities.
The whites and then of course in the 1965 Immigration Act to change the source of immigration from Europe to basically third world countries because Democrats needed the votes because the evils of communism had been exposed and they couldn't really make a good case for socialism or communism anymore.
So this plan and this does tie into legitimate guilt that people had at the time about the way blacks had been treated.
The combination of slavery and Jim Crow and a variety of other things was not good.
It was all government programs.
But rather than shrink the government, they tried to use the government to solve the problems caused by the last government program, which we never ever see, but it showed up once in human history.
Just kidding.
It's everywhere for those who don't know my sarcasm.
So, combine that.
They deserve to be there.
They...
Can have everything the whites have if the whites will just go away.
This is really, really important to understand that this is the genuine thinking.
That they look at California and it's a rich state.
It was.
I mean, obviously been bleeding off a bit of human capital for the last 40 or 50 years.
But it's a rich state.
And it's a stable, relatively stable state.
And the government is relatively not corrupt.
And it's beautiful.
City of Angels.
And they look at that and they say, all of that is stolen from us.
And if the white people leave, we will make it even better because we won't be stealing from anyone.
And they genuinely believe that if they move...
I mean, this again, this is just a certain kind of mindset.
It's a subset of this group.
But they genuinely believe that if they move into the seat of power in California, they'll make it even better, even more fair, even more just.
They don't, because of the Dunning-Kruger effect, they don't understand...
That in general, all that will happen when they get into power is they'll turn it back into Mexico.
Like all the way.
All the way.
And in fact, it will be even worse than Mexico because at least to some degree, Mexico is propped up by renumerations coming in from people earning and on welfare in America, right?
Sending billions of dollars back to Mexico.
Mexican government, I think, gets even more money.
Mexico gets even more money from remittances from immigrants, legal and illegal, than it does even from the sale of its oil.
And so, given the mindset, and given that Donald Trump is, in their mind, of course, a racist who hates mestizos, And who wishes to round them up at gunpoint and herd them back over the border because he wishes for Californians to keep the goods stolen from their people.
I mean, you sort of put all of that together.
They're perfectly in the right.
They're only trying to reclaim what was stolen.
They'll do a better job of running California than the whites.
The whites hate them, and Donald Trump is going to round them up and drive them over the border by bayonet.
And...
That is, I mean, there's more that could be said, but, you know, I want to make sure we have a conversation here.
But as far as where they're coming from, I think that would probably be somewhere close to it.
And of course, they've received all of this narrative over and over again from a wide variety of media outlets and maybe their religions, religious leaders too, I don't know.
Yeah, no, I think that was a very clear analysis of the problem.
And as you've said many times, it's like, look, if you can't diagnose the problem, you're not going to be able to fix it.
I mean, you're just going to be shooting in the dark, hoping to hit something.
Now, you had something else, and I'm sorry to have interrupted you, and whether you can remember or not, I don't know, but you had something else that you wanted to mention prior to me going into this.
Well...
Do you want to go more?
No, I don't.
Well, you know, one thing I wanted to ask you, Stefan, so, you know, I was raised to be colorblind.
My father's a good Minnesota boy, and he taught me to be colorblind, to judge people on their actions and on their words, you know, not on their skin color, even their political allegiance.
And I'm still at the point, and I've had this big transformation over the last year of watching your show and getting the facts on race and IQ and some of the problems with racial egalitarianism, but I still treat everyone the same.
I still treat individuals as individuals and judge people based on that, but what I'm sensing in myself, what I know your audience is sensing, what I suspect you're sensing, what I feel as the cultural zeitgeist is Is a rise in,
they'll call it racism, I would call it in-group preferences, but do you have any thoughts on that, on sort of the cultural shift that we're seeing in the United States, partially as a result of Donald Trump, partially as a result of other things,
but it seems to me there's this rising, there's a rising white consciousness that's been suppressed for about 30 or 40 years now, and So many people are getting involved in Trump's campaign in one sense or another, and I believe it's because they're kind of recognizing a bit of the lie we've been told, right?
I mean, I studied psychology in school at the university level, and I was taught, you know, that the IQ tests are either bullshit or all of the...
I'm truly biased.
Yeah, or yes, exactly.
You know, as if the Raven's progressive matrices, which are, you know, just patterns you identify, as if that could be...
I don't understand the argument there.
But basically, yeah, the tests either don't work or don't measure anything, or there's this magical thing called EQ that, you know, I don't know what it is, but EQ seems to make up for...
According to the liberal narrative for low IQ, but I think you hit the nail on the head on saying that even if we take race and culture out of the equation, look, there's no respect for intelligence anymore.
There's no value placed.
There's value placed on education, but I'm sure you in the audience can see the distinction between education and intelligence.
Well, education, I mean, because they have...
Allowed a wide variety of groups from all ethnicities with lower IQs into colleges.
They have dumbed down the curriculum to the point where I'm not sure.
Education in the arts, I think, is actually harming people's capacity to think.
I mean, I've used some, like, if they've got a PhD or, sorry, if they have some sort of undergraduate degree in some really squishy lefty social justice warrior nonsense, I assume that they have less of an ability to think than the waiter at the local Arby's.
Or the waiter at the local Denny's.
Arby's, no, waiters.
And there is sort of an example that...
People who studied economics in college knew less about economics a year or two after they graduated than people who never studied it at all.
Yeah, that's a good point.
There's so much in higher education.
I mean, in the STEM, it's less so, but still there.
But in the arts, I mean, there's so much misdirection and programming and brainwashing, I would argue these days, that it's harmful to people's thinking.
Morgan, do you have any thoughts?
Because I graduated college a couple years ago, but Morgan's actually still in school.
Do you have any thoughts on...
Well, I don't know.
I was a theater arts major for quite a while.
And that was just sort of...
Wait, hang on.
Hang on.
Hang on.
Nick, you're involved with a woman who directly comes with drama.
No, I'm kidding.
I'm kidding.
Want some drama?
I'm here.
All right, go on.
But I... I don't know.
I definitely...
What are you studying now?
Well, now I'm studying...
I'm getting my bachelor's in accounting.
So it's a little different than theater.
But I was studying theater, musical theater specifically, for about four years.
Who's your favorite...
What's your favorite musical?
Well, Sutton Foster is my role model.
Thoroughly Modern Millie is one of my favorite musicals.
I was Millie a few years back, and I like to tap dance.
Anyway, I don't want to go on.
Let's do a duet!
But I definitely...
She's bright red right now.
She's blushing.
I definitely enjoyed the arts, and I mean, I did a Shakespeare conservatory for two years, and...
But I don't think those are the classes that I had issues with, not the actual art classes.
It's more like I took a female studies class.
And right off the bat, I just got a horrible vibe from my teacher who pushed, on the very first day of school, pushed the victim idea.
Of how women and minorities, and I looked around and everybody was a woman, and there were a few minorities that were males.
And the token white guy looking to get laid.
There wasn't even a token white guy.
There wasn't even one.
He's into danger.
Danger gives him a hard on.
Because that's a dangerous place to dip your wick, I'll tell you that.
But I ended up...
You know what?
I didn't choose it.
She'll say.
Anyway, go on.
But those few classes that I had signed up for thinking, oh, I remember considering myself a feminist three, four years ago and wanting to take this class to fulfill a requirement and just out of interest.
And within the first two weeks, realizing this is not where I want to be And the agenda that my teacher is pushing does not align with anything I see as educational or even correct.
So I stopped taking those classes.
Well, yeah.
And I mean, the basic reality behind that is whoever you exploit, you have to dehumanize.
Yeah.
I mean, this is why the slaves are considered to be subhuman and dangerous and violent.
And because...
There's a lot of exploitation of white males in current society.
White males pay a huge lion's share of the taxes, and women and minorities are taking taxes out.
And so women and minorities need to dehumanize white males in order to exploit them.
And whoever you exploit, you also must control through hatred.
And you must teach them to self-loathe.
And this is general human farming, but I just wanted to sort of mention that has a lot to do with, I think, what goes on there.
Yeah.
When there's definitely...
I feel that white people, unfortunately, even females that I know, but I have all brothers.
And...
And do you like that?
My brothers?
Yeah.
Yeah.
I love my brothers.
Okay, so it's a little hard for you to get into the patriarchy, exploitation, rape culture stuff, right?
Absolutely.
I love my brothers.
And...
It just seems that their success, they don't get to take credit for any of their successes, and it's just assumed that somebody handed something to them, and it just isn't celebrated as much.
But there is white privilege.
It just has two letters.
There is white privilege.
And above white privilege, there's East Asian privilege.
And above East Asian privilege, there's Ashkenazi Jewish privilege.
It's called IQ. Sorry, it's just nobody's fault.
The only thing that I can say to cultures who don't have it is, just think of how much suffering white people and East Asians had to go through in order to have less intelligent people weeded out of the gene pool for the last 75,000 years.
It wasn't a fun ride, but that's the outcome.
So, I mean, they're sort of grasping at something.
Like, there's some unreal magical advantage that these people have.
And it's like, well, yeah.
I mean, there is black privilege in certain fields as well.
And there's Asian privilege in certain fields as well.
Not just to do with IQ, but just to do with reflexes and so on, right?
And there's white IQ, Northern European IQ, when it comes to powerlifting.
And, you know, you go on and on and on, right?
So, there is a kind of white privilege.
It's just...
It's not cultural, you know, if that makes sense.
We talked to John Entine about that.
People can watch that stuff.
But sorry, go ahead.
No one, you know, I don't hear anyone talking about the NBA or the NFL. You know, I don't see anyone talking about the underrepresentation of whites, Hispanics, and Asians in basketball.
I mean, that's...
Well, if they do, yeah, but if they do what they say, a lot of them is, well, you see, because blacks barred...
By white privilege from going into intellectual fields, they are forced into the ghetto of student athleticism.
You know, whatever it is, right?
Yeah, you can always create a narrative.
I mean, human beings are fantastic at creating narratives because narratives are so profitable.
I'm going to shoehorn this in just because it's really important and I'm sorry to use you guys for this, but there has just come out of political science one of the Jaw-droppingly epic corrections.
It's called the epic correction of the decade.
And I'll just go over it very briefly.
Please do.
The American Journal of Political Science...
So a couple of years ago, this journal published a finding which liberals just basically had ooky-cookie orgasms over.
And it was supposed to be scientific evidence that conservatives are more likely to exhibit traits associated with psychoticism, such as authoritarianism.
I remember that.
And tough-mindedness.
Yeah.
And the supposed authoritarian personality of conservatives might even have a genetic basis.
So maybe we could treat that genetically.
Nothing about race and IQ, which hopefully we could treat genetically.
But, you see...
The conservatives are just so psychotic and authoritarian, right?
Which is why conservatives are always trying to inflict free speech restrictions on every other...
Oh wait, no, that's people on the left, right?
So anyway, I won't get into much detail.
We'll put the link in the low bar of the video and in the notes to the podcast.
So basically...
They said people in higher neuroticism tend to be more economically liberal.
What is intriguing about this relationship is that it's in the opposite direction of what past theories would predict.
That is, neurotic people are more likely to support public policies that provide aid to the economically disadvantaged.
And the authors regret that there is an error in the published version of correlation, not causation.
The relationship between personality traits and political ideologies.
The interpretation of the coding Of the political attitude items in the descriptive and preliminary analyses portion of the manuscript was exactly reversed!
Was exactly reversed!
Reversed!
Reversed!
How is that possible?
How is that?
Like, that's like for years, sending out beer bottles with the wrong arrow around for the twist off, and nobody, like, just nobody notices.
And of course, it was not checked, because it fit the liberal narrative and so on.
I mean, this was used, I read this years ago, oh, you see, this shows conservatives are psychotic and crazy and authoritarian and all that.
And of course, the liberals were like, yeah, we always knew that.
Those bastards, right?
It's like, oh, I'm sorry, it was completely the opposite of what was published.
How is that even remotely possible?
Don't these people have any vetters?
Isn't there supposed to be a peer review process for all?
No, it goes with the narrative.
Send it through!
So I just wanted to mention just how, and of course, do you hear a lot about this?
Well, you know.
I guess on certain Twitter feeds, but it's not going to be mentioned.
And of course, because it's on the left, the correction will be ignored and the study will still be cited in its original format forever and ever and ever.
But anyway, go on.
Well, I think two problems with that that I see.
One is you had a gentleman on maybe a month or two ago that was, I believe, a PhD student or maybe a professor at that point, but he discussed fraud in academia.
This is something I've done a lot into, but it Look, I mean, the degree to which, especially in the social sciences, that just data manipulation, data wrangling, not publishing studies that are adverse to the narrative you're trying to craft.
I mean, this idea that, oh, it's in a research paper, so it's legit.
You really have to go through and read the paper and look at the author.
Because a lot of times, look, you can run an experiment or you can manipulate a data set to get Whatever outcome you're trying to get.
And what I've noticed in my personal life is so many people engage in the appeal to authority of either, well, I have a master's in this, so I know what I'm talking about.
Or, well, I read this in a study, so it must be true.
And there's no critical thinking in terms of like...
Breaking that down.
And a lot of people I've talked to, they don't even admit that there could be a liberal or cultural Marxist bias in current social science research.
So I think that's very – I want to look that up when I get off the call.
But that's interesting because I remember being taught that in my classes, all about the F scale and all that with – And, you know, the idea that there is neuroticism and all this with conservatives.
And it seemed to me at the time counterintuitive to what you actually experience in your life.
But, well, look, if it's in a paper and you don't – you just blindly accept that anything that's published must be true.
Well, it also – sorry.
It also goes into something that Vox Dei talks about in a great book called Social Justice Warriors or SJWs Always Lie.
Yes, the three laws.
Which they always project.
So all of the hatred and intolerance and aggression that is in the heart of the left, which you guys are, you saw manifested in San Diego, and we see manifested wherever Milo Yiannopoulos goes to speak and other people and so on.
Well, they think, they genuinely think that that's somehow on the conservative side.
They genuinely believe that what they want to do is what the other people are doing.
Well, Stefan, you're a little older than we are, obviously, so you'll perhaps remember a time that I even remember being 26.
Ah, Noah!
Yes!
Wouldn't that be on his arc?
Boy, that was a lot of breath-holding and bubbles!
Sorry, I could do that for a while for no reason whatsoever.
Do you remember when the left had the moral and intellectual high ground?
I think that the left has had some moral and intellectual high ground.
The left was very critical of the war in Iraq.
And the left is very critical.
As I've always said, the left is fantastic in many ways on aggressive foreign policy.
They're very good on imperialism.
And they're terrible on domestic policy.
The right is very bad on imperialism and very good on domestic policy.
And if you could get these two together, which is philosophy or Libertarianism has some good aspects that way and so on.
But the left in particular areas, you know, were they right to bring up race relations?
They sure were.
You know, there were some challenges, to put it mildly, and things that needed to be addressed.
But the problem is that, in general, the solutions that the left comes up with for legitimate issues tend to be worse than those issues.
Whereas the right at least...
The solutions that they come up with for their legitimate issues, actually, no, that tends to be pretty bad, too.
Like if they, you know, because then it's like, well, let's go blow up more of the Middle East.
I mean, so because both the left and the right, in general, outside of the right's criticism of economic policy domestically, the left is really good at liberalizing social policies, right?
Like they have drugs against the war and drugs and so on.
And they're against the military-industrial complex.
And the right is much better...
At economic liberty, domestically, but very bad with foreign policy, in my opinion.
So, but because they're generally statists, then they ignore, for the most part, the areas where they could minimize the size and power of the state, and they work to expand the size and power of the state where they feel that their particular bugaboos are, right?
So the left is always trying to raise taxes, and the right is always trying to raise military spending.
And they focus less on, the right focuses more on raising military spending And aggressive foreign policy than it does on reducing government interference in the economy, whereas the left focuses more on raising taxes and strangling more people with red tape and controlling more people's movements and censorship and so on than they do on liberalizing drug policy and other things where, you know, I can certainly see very strong arguments for it.
So they have, I think that they've got some moral high ground, but it's all just, you know, there's this I mean, I'm sure it's a real thing in mythology, but when I was younger, Dungeons& Dragons, this thing called the Will of the Wisp, or Will of the Wisp, and it would just lead you into the swamp and lead you into the fog, and then you'd die and it'd feed on your psychic energy as you died or something like that, if I remember rightly.
And so what the left and the right do is they say, look, here's a terrible problem.
We've got a great solution.
And then you're like, okay, great.
So I'll vote you into power.
And they're like, thanks!
And now we're just going to work on expanding state power where we see fit.
Because, you know, if you reduce state power, then you get rid of goodies you can give to people and you get enemies, right?
Expanding state power, you almost never get enemies.
But reducing state power, you're going to immediately – you can see this, right?
I mean reducing – like enforcing immigration laws is going to do something to people that harms their particular interests in the moment.
So they're going to react violently and aggressively.
And so I think that there are times where the left has conceptual moral high ground just as the right does.
It's just that because in general they're so focused on the state as the solution and the expansion of state power where they think it's most befitting.
Like for the left, it's reducing income inequality and pretending that we're all the same.
That's sort of the radical egalitarianism of the left requires a massive and brutal state.
But so does imperialism on the right.
So it is a challenge and that's why, you know, we either learn philosophy or our history is...
Our futures are shaky at best.
So, look, if you had asked me a year ago what my political ideology was, I would have told you I'm an anarcho-capitalist.
And I, in some ways, would still perhaps identify as that.
But I guess what I've seen in the last year is, you know, you can only build that sort of a society with a certain type of people.
And, you know, when I look at, you know, communist ideology and, you know, the idea of the rise of capitalists leads to revolution and blah, blah, blah...
I almost have this idea that perhaps nationalism, conservative nationalism, maybe even fascism is what some would call it, but I'll call it conservative nationalism, but perhaps nationalism can lead to the type of society that adopts libertarianism, and in turn that could eventually lead to an anarcho-capitalist society that I feel people like you and me would sure love to live in, but recognize it's impossible in the current year.
Do you have any thoughts on that?
No.
No, it's only my last work.
Why would I have any thoughts on it?
the question is which ones to put forward at the moment.
In order to get a free society, we need peacefully raised children.
Now, in order to, like, cultures are not at the same level.
Of development with regards to compassion for children, to put it mildly.
To put it mildly.
So there are some cultures, like Sweden, where they outlawed in the 70s, I think it was, they outlawed spanking.
And there are other cultures with genital mutilation of boys and girls running rampant.
Mexico has a very child-hostile culture, a very brutal on children culture.
And it's not all about IQ, but it's not unrelated to IQ. In a low IQ society, aggression is a strength.
And empathy is a weakness.
So if you live in an aggressive culture, raising your children peacefully is setting them up to fail in many ways, right?
Because they're going to get taken advantage of, bullied, pushed over.
They'll never eat any lunch because other kids will get their lunch money or whatever.
Now, if you live in a more child-tolerant, child-friendly culture, which the West has been struggling towards, and I refer people to the work of psychohistorians, psychohistory.com, I've got The Origins of War and Child Abuse and so on, which I've read as an audiobook, and people can get at freedomainradio.com, written by Lloyd DeMoss, read by me, with his permission.
And the West, for the past couple of hundred years, has been staggering and struggling its way forward to more child-friendly culture.
aspects of things.
And so, you're going to have to create a free society somewhere.
And where do you want to create it?
Well, you want to create it in an environment with the most child-friendly people around.
Now, if you're going to bring in people with an IQ of 85 who've all been raised brutally, is it going to be easy to get them to a child-friendly state?
No.
No, it's going to be, I would argue, at least in any reasonable time frame, completely impossible.
Not just hard, impossible.
Now, if you already have, like, if you wanted to create a free society, you would try and go to the most child-friendly society and work to improve their parenting.
You wouldn't go to the least child-friendly society and start from there, right?
That just...
Wouldn't make any sense.
You want the tallest people with the most athletic ability in your basketball team.
That's how you make the teams, right?
Yeah, I think that's a good point.
So, you know, if you want to do, like Mexico, where a lot of the states in Mexico have a, quote, age of consent of 12, God help you, if you search sexual abuse in Mexico in your favorite search engine, it's horrendous.
And there's a saying in India, it's like, what do you call a girl who's a virgin when she's 12?
Well, a girl with no male relatives in the house.
It is a brutal culture for children around the world.
And so the goal of creating a free society, a stateless society, which remains my goal as much as it ever was, means that You have to have the most child-friendly cultures aggregated together, and America is slowly becoming a more child-friendly culture.
Outside of immigrants from the third world, it's becoming a more child-friendly culture, which is why violence up until the recent Ferguson effect has been declining in America, like hugely, enormously.
It's what we don't often see.
But as spanking has gone down, just as I predicted more than a decade ago, as spanking has gone down, as aggression against children has gone down, oh, look, violence has also dropped enormously across the board.
So, if you want a free society, you need a geographical area with a child-friendly culture.
Now, in a free society, there is a natural...
Security in that child unfriendly cultures will really not succeed in a free society.
They're too volatile.
They're too aggressive.
They're too traumatized.
They're too damaged.
They won't succeed.
And so they'll either find a way to adjust or adapt or they'll go back to wherever they came from.
So right now Given the progress that America was making, listen, I don't think it's all accidental.
I mean, psychologically deep, deep down in the sub-basement of the human soul, I don't think it's accidental that just as childhood is beginning to improve, the powers that be are inviting massive amounts of traumatized people into child-friendly societies.
See, I don't think it's an accident that as violence goes down in America and other countries where more child-friendly child-raising practices are occurring, I don't think it's an accident that governments who become more and more unnecessary and more and more irrelevant and they have less and less to sell.
If people start raising children well, Those children will not become criminals.
They will not become violent.
And therefore your fear of criminals and violence diminishes enormously.
So then when you say, well, we need this government to protect us, from what?
Terrible families are not now these hellish ovum factories churning out through satanic vaginas, super predator after super predator after God knows what, right?
And so, I don't think, if you look at Sweden, well, Sweden was becoming a more and more peaceful society, and more, you know, and so it's like, oh, well, we need all this government for what?
Ah, well, now you see, bring all these problems in, and now, look, you need us now, don't you?
You're in danger now, aren't you?
And again, I'm not saying it's a conscious thing, this is just what those in power do.
You know, that the...
The people who want to sell you a soft drink will put those lovely little beads of ice sweat on the outside of it and stick a picture of it in a bucket of ice and just, you know, you start producing saliva when you look at it because they wish to stimulate a demand in you.
Well, governments are no different.
Governments are going to sell you protection and if your society is becoming more peaceful, they're going to have to do something to sell you your protection.
And the other thing, too, is that So paying for all of these people to come in, paying for them to come in.
You know, the income that someone from Iraq can get in Germany is like more than 10 times higher.
Than when they could get working.
So why won't they come?
I'm sorry?
I said, you know, if they can make more on welfare than they can working, why would they not make the journey?
Oh, I don't blame them at all.
Makes perfect sense to me.
Just as it makes perfect sense for people to be coming across the border into America.
It makes perfect sense.
See, here's something really, really important to understand about the welfare state.
If you have a smart population, let's just say you've got a population of Japanese, Chinese, Chinese, Well, they're smart.
Now, welfare is not a good deal if you have an IQ over about 85 or 90.
It's a bad deal.
Because if you don't take welfare or you don't take unemployment insurance or you don't go on disability or whatever, then you'll make more money going through and getting a job and all that, right?
In general.
So it becomes a bad, bad deal.
So what happens is welfare states are set up in smart countries Where only a small percentage of the population in making a rational calculation on taking welfare, only a small section of the population will do better on welfare than going to school and getting a job or being an entrepreneur or whatever, right?
And so when you first put the welfare state in, there's really not that many people.
We're going to benefit from it.
So in a way, it kind of does target the most needy and it does target those who kind of need help.
Now, of course, they were being helped by charities and better and so on.
But nonetheless, when you first put the welfare state in, there's not that many dumb people who are going to benefit better from the welfare state than they will from working, right?
I mean, if you're, you know, I've got a whole presentation on the truth about the welfare cliff.
Which you can look at, but...
I've watched it.
It's excellent.
Yeah, so, I mean, the people that I knew who were digging ditches and who were waiters and so on, well, for them, going on the welfare state, it's not, you know, it's either net not that much of a loss, or it's net positive.
But in an IQ 105 society, there's not that many people with an IQ 85 to 90.
Ah, but...
But when you start bringing in populations, and look, we can chalk it all up to environment if we want.
It doesn't matter whether it's genetic or not.
But when you get a lot of people coming in with IQs in the mid-80s, they know deep down that they do much better on welfare than they ever will in the free market, especially because they don't speak the language, don't have the culture, don't write.
And especially when people like the president of Turkey, head of Turkey...
Says that integration is a crime to people coming from his country into Europe.
And so you change the entire calculation of the welfare state when you have wave after wave of lower IQ people.
And again, you can toss out IQ if you want completely and just replace it with unskilled.
It doesn't matter.
If you go to a country, you can't speak the language.
There's no welfare state.
You can't speak the language.
You don't have any job skills that people need.
I mean, you might couch surf for a little while, but at some point, you know, you either have to really buckle down and learn the language and get some job skills, or you gotta go home.
And that's the way it worked in America in the 19th century.
A third of the people who came to America said, sucks, I'm going back.
And so, right now, with regards to immigration, to me, this has nothing to do with the free movement of people at all.
Anymore than if you pay someone to throw a fight that has something to do with honest sportsmanship.
Because people are being bribed massively by the government to come into a country which guarantees that the lowest IQ people have the highest incentive or the lowest skilled people have the highest incentive to come in.
And so immigration right now is a big giant government issue.
Fix.
It's a big giant government program.
People are being paid enormously relative to their local opportunities.
They're being paid enormously, being bribed to come into a country and being bribed to stay.
Now, why?
Because, well, Mexico wants to send its people so they'll send money back.
Because it's nothing a government loves more than getting money without having to provide services.
I mean, if you could open up a restaurant where people would pay you for meals and you didn't have to serve them a meal, you'd make quite a lot of money.
Of course, only in the world of the state can this be even remotely possible.
But the Mexican government wants to send its people, of course.
It doesn't take more than a moment's thought to realize their particular self-interest in this.
They don't have to provide roads.
They don't have to provide healthcare or electricity or water or anything because people are over there shipping money back.
Which they can tax, which they can get a hold of, which they can identify, which they can target.
It's wired.
They've got records.
They know where it's going.
Boom!
Beautiful.
Beautiful.
I'm opening a hardware store and people are going to pay me a million dollars a month.
Are you going to sell them any hardware?
Nah.
They're just still going to...
I mean, this is the course, right?
I mean, who wouldn't want that business model?
I was going to say, you look at Mexico, I did some research on this before the show and for other things I'm doing, but Mexico only spends about 11% of its GDP. The government only spends about 11% of its GDP. You compare that to almost 30% for America, and you look and there's virtually no social services in Mexico.
Virtually all the money is being spent to fight the cartels.
Yeah, I mean, to be fair, of the 11% that they spend on providing local services, about 9% of that is cremating all the headless bodies rolling off the highway.
So, yeah, it's a challenge.
But, I mean, I would almost look and say, look, the remittance payments, which I wish I had the number in front of me, but I know it's in the text of— $8.6 billion!
Yeah, I was going to say, in the tens of billions.
But that, in many ways, that is the social security insurance for the state of Mexico.
And then you look, Morgan, do you want to talk a little bit, because I know you're passionate about it, but about the abuses of the healthcare system in California?
Oh, I just wouldn't...
So one thing that probed us to email you actually last week was with the Obamacare, um, the, what is it?
Like the vote, whatever requests the state of California has put in to allow illegal immigrants to enter the Obamacare exchange.
Yeah.
And so it's allowing them to enter the marketplace.
Um, And it was just very frustrating for me to, when I read that, that our state had passed it, and it was just waiting on the governor's signature, because I personally, when Obamacare came out, I was like, yay!
I... My premiums will go down.
I'm young and I have no pre-existing conditions and I'm so excited for this program and I applied.
The year I applied, I made $17,000 the previous year.
Wow, that puts you in like one-tenth of one percent of theater graduates.
Do you still have both your kidneys?
Sorry, go ahead.
Well, I worked full-time all through school.
But...
And I live in San Diego, where the rent is crazy high.
I mean, I think I was paying $1,600 a month for a one-bedroom apartment with Nick.
And I didn't have a lot of extra money.
And my insurance actually went up from $150 to almost $300 through Obamacare.
And I was receiving notes.
Was it a small one-bedroom?
Pretty small.
About 700 square foot.
I've got to tell you, relationships take a big hit when a woman has to be face-to-face with a lot of man farts.
So that's why you need space, you need windows on either side of the room, you need a good ventilation system, because otherwise it's like, wow.
This is what I'm going to live with for the next 50 years.
Scratch, scratch.
Anyway, sorry, go on.
The big thing with that, so I personally, I didn't benefit.
I was not subsidized.
This was not a better deal for me.
I was actually subsidizing other people, which I'm not totally against helping other citizens out that have pre-existing conditions.
I have a close friend that has diabetes and his premiums went down.
And I don't mind paying a little bit to help other people out, but this marketplace is already a subsidy for citizens.
But I talked about this with Steve Camarota.
I mean, a lot of Obamacare was passed because immigrants, and particularly illegal immigrants, can't afford health care.
So the Democrats want to keep the illegal immigrants and the immigrants in the voting system.
So, of course, they have to get them health care.
Otherwise, they might actually go back to Mexico and try and get some health care.
Well, it's a massive subsidy.
It's easily, right?
Yeah.
It's a massive subsidy because of the pre-existing condition clause.
And when we researched this and looked into it, what we found is two things.
First off, minors in the United States are eligible for Medicaid, regardless of immigration status.
So we already have, right now, before this bill even gets signed, we already have Free healthcare, so to speak, for minors, regardless of immigration status.
But what's more is an illegal immigrant can purchase private healthcare insurance, just not on the exchange.
But the prices are virtually the same.
We looked it up.
And that's why we believe that this bill in California is just, it's phase one and a two-step process to eventually start subsidizing.
Oh, don't worry about it.
Government's going to run out of money.
Seriously, I mean, Paul Ryan's big mail-out to his entire constituency is, sorry, Grandma, you're going to have to go get a third job because I just sent your Social Security to Puerto Rico to bail them out because I'm such a free market objectivist.
I just thought a massive transfer to a largely welfare-dependent sunny place is the best thing to do with the money you might have otherwise used to upgrade from cat food to dog food.
Yeah, what a fucking disaster that will be.
But I guess that kind of leads into the big question, Stefan, is you're right.
As long as we keep using other people's money and it goes, it is what it is.
Anyone who's studied history knows eventually governments run out of money, they print money to try to make up for that, or they start foreign wars to try to make up for that, and it inevitably collapses, and it leads to a lot of people dying.
And then the other part of that is anyone that's studied history knows that, look, despite the pathological altruism suffered by white people, when white people do eventually get pissed off, they tend to get really pissed off.
And Terrible things happen.
And anyone knows that if there is a race war or a big struggle, whites will obviously be victorious in the U.S. No, I mean, but that's true, though.
And so, I mean, I guess that's our question.
And we're seeing California crumble.
The wages don't look good.
The houses don't look good.
The neighborhoods.
I mean, there are no-go zones in San Diego County where police won't go because there's a Yeah.
not to go.
Oh, but that's sorry.
And that's why in San Jose, the police were told to stand down.
Because they know there's footage everywhere, right?
They know everyone's got a cell phone camera, and they also have the strong suspicion that if they attempted to arrest people or control the lefty mob or the anti-Trump mob, that it would have escalated and people might have gotten really hurt or, as you say, maybe killed, and that would be a defining kind of Kent State moment for the right.
So they were, you know, very smart, as you know, in that sort of neutral evil kind of way, that they're very sort of smart to not provoke the mob, because that way, there's not this god awful footage of what looks like a war zone.
And that avoids provoking the K response of the conservatives, although it happened to some degree, and it may escalate from there.
So let's just end up with the question of what to do.
I still think there's time to inform and to educate and to share knowledge and information.
And through that process, we can hopefully avoid any escalation of aggression on either side.
I'm not sure how much money I'd put on it, but that's where I'm coming from.
Because once it escalates, my job is over.
I mean, my job is, I mean, I'm a philosopher.
I'm a thinker, not a fighter, right?
I mean, as a philosopher, my job is to provide reason.
And once it escalates to combat, I am useless as tits on a ball.
So that's not, you know, so it may be optimism or wishing to stay in the conversation, but I genuinely believe that there's a time, because of the internet and because of conversations like this, there's time so that people can wake up.
And...
I've also made this case before, you've heard it before, but I feel like I can't make it enough, that there's something unique and great about the West.
You know, the child-friendly cultures that are evolving, the women egalitarian cultures that have evolved, maybe gone a little bit too far the other way, but there is something unique and wonderful about the West, and that's why people come.
That's why people come to the West.
They want the West to be the West.
That's why they come to the West.
Like, you don't go from Scotland in February...
To the British Virgin Islands and bring cold Scottish rain and clouds with you and walk around like you're just in...
You go there because you want some sunshine.
Where you come from is not warm.
And so you go to visit places or you go to live places because you evaluate them and you like what they are.
And then you go there.
And to destroy what the West is, is to betray the people who've worked very hard to get there.
From every...
Ethnicity, every race, I mean, people that work hard to get there, to the West.
And so the West doesn't have the right to self-destruct no matter what, but also out of regard to the immigrants and what they've sacrificed and the dangers they've gone through and all of that.
So the West has to at least stay the West or continue along the path of the West, which is separation of church and state, equality before the law, stuff that we've lost track of and we need to resurrect.
Now, as far as what you guys should do, Obviously, if you guys get married and have kids, which I hope you do, then I don't think you can send them to government schools very easily or if you have any other alternatives or choices or options.
And I did just read this great study today that in England they did a study of thousands of women and found out that six out of seven housewives are very satisfied with their lives, but less than half of the working women surveyed were happy with their lives.
So I just sort of wanted to point that out, that being a housewife seems to be a pretty good ticket to happiness.
And, you know, if that's the case, maybe unschooling or homeschooling or whatever it's going to be, private school or whatever.
So, I wouldn't put yourselves in any danger.
And look, if you're in a situation where you feel afraid to walk the streets, that's no way to live.
Now, does that mean you have to leave the state?
I, um...
Wouldn't necessarily say so, because not all the state is the same.
The demographics have a wide variety over the state of California.
Oh yeah, it's worth a plug.
Freedom Project and Dr.
Duke, you can find it at fpeusa.org for homeschooling.
I haven't gone through their curriculum, but I like the man enormously, so I just take that for what it's worth.
But yeah, I mean, if you can't leave the house because you're scared, that's kind of like a prison, right?
And so you don't have to leave California, but I don't think that's much of a fun way to live, is it?
Well, it's not.
I mean, in our daily lives, it's not too bad.
I don't think we necessarily feel day to day in the neighborhood we live in that we're in danger.
Look, I don't want to tell you exactly where we live, but...
We live in a city that is predominantly white that's right next to a city that's predominantly Hispanic.
There's about a 40% difference in average income between the two and about a 4 to 1 crime ratio between the two.
And so it's just areas in our community where it's just really sick.
It's a bad culture.
But I don't want to look like a huge pussy here.
We're not necessarily cowering in fear, but we do want to get married and we do want to have children.
We want our children to grow up in a society and a culture where they're shielded from some of the shit that we saw, especially that Morgan saw as a child.
Yeah, you don't want your kid having a knife pulled on him, right?
Yeah.
What do you even say to that?
What do you even say to that?
When I grew up in Los Angeles...
You guys know you're backing off from what you said, right?
Which is fine.
But you said, we're no longer feeling, you know, face the agonizing decision, staying home in fear or possibly leaving the state, right?
So I'm only, you can back off from it now, which is kind of annoying, because I'm just going with what you told me earlier, right?
Oh, no, it's fine.
Well, then what the hell are we talking about, right?
I mean, this is, oh, you may sense where the direction is going, like by the time you get married and have kids or whatever, right?
Yeah, and I mean, like, at the rally, you know, we definitely felt some stuff.
And I mean, there are moments, but...
And going out in the evening, I mean, our local In-N-Out has private security out front.
And there's just, there's certain times when we go out at night that it is not safe.
And my mom grew up in Los Angeles, and that's where I was born.
And we moved to San Diego because this was the nice city.
And we were leaving a lot of the BS that my mom had grown up with and had to deal with.
And now, even she's not, I mean, it's turning into what she left in East L.A., And it's just, where do we go from here?
At some point, there's nowhere left to go.
And I don't know that we're there yet.
But so, you know, I mean, if you feel relatively comfortable in your neighborhood, then keep doing what you're doing and talking and sharing and informing people and so on.
And if you, you know, if you start to fear leaving your house, then, or you start to feel nervous.
And you know, the other thing, too, I mean, I hate to put it this bluntly, but wait till November.
Yeah.
I mean, that's what we're saying is that, you know, depending on what happens over the next couple of months, it could kind of simmer back down and there could be a real sea change or it's going to get really ugly.
And we know that we're kind of in an area where if it gets ugly, we'll sort of be in the middle of that.
So I think that's kind of where we're coming from.
So yeah, I mean, I think it does depend a lot on what happens between Trump and Hillary Clinton.
Yeah.
Yeah.
All right.
So those are my suggestions.
I'm going to move on to the next caller, but I really, really appreciate the call.
It was a great pleasure to chat with you guys, and I hope that you will keep us apprised of what's going on.
We definitely will.
Hey, Stefan, I just want to plug you real quick.
Everyone should go to freedomainradio.com forward slash donate and give you some money to keep you going because you do.
I've watched a lot of almost all your videos and Stefan, I'd love to see you do a video on marriage if you haven't already and I've missed it, but I would love to hear your thoughts on marriage and how to be a good husband or how to be a good partner.
I would love to hear your thoughts on that someday.
That is a great thought and a great idea.
Thank you very much, Nick and Morgan.
A great pleasure to chat, and I'm sure we'll do it again soon.
Thank you, Stefan.
Take care.
Take care.
Alright, well up next we have Derek.
Derek wrote in and said, So
that is a very interesting question, and a very...
A challenging question, right?
I mean, he loves all things war-y, right?
Yeah, he does.
And this is from the very beginning, I think, very early on?
Yes, I mean, he used to, you know, study lots of medieval history, swordsmanship, archery, tactics, that kind of stuff.
And, you know, also, you know, he had a I mean, I remember back in grade school he got in trouble because he was reading about German military history, you know, in his liberal elementary school.
They didn't like him checking out a book like that.
So it's been going on for a long time.
It's just a passion and an interest.
He watches YouTube videos on, you know, it used to be like swordsmiths and things like that, but then over the past, I don't know, four or five years, it's turned into more modern military technology.
You know, he could tell you the make and manufacture of every gun in World War I, that kind of stuff.
Right, right.
What has his childhood like been overall?
It's been a pretty peaceful childhood.
Now, that said, I am divorced.
The main reason is, you know, my wife and I just have different views on raising kids.
I believe there should be some structure, and she comes from a place where she didn't really have a good childhood, and so she didn't view it that way.
But they had a fairly peaceful, happy childhood growing up.
I even asked them, you know, My memory is not the greatest.
Did I ever spank you?
He couldn't come up with the time that he remembered me spanking him, and I couldn't either.
I did smash one of his little toys one time, and that was the most dramatic thing he can remember me ever doing when he acted up.
And Derek, how old was he when you got divorced?
He was nine.
And what was his mother like as a parent?
Well, his mom is a very, very loving person, but she always kind of wanted to be his best friend and so never really She was always the playmate kind of mom, not really the, okay, you have to do your chores, or this is not more of a teaching parent, but more of the friend side of it.
Her biggest issue is she doesn't know how to say no to anybody or anything, and that certainly goes true for her kids also.
And how long was the marriage, I guess you could say, in trouble for before you got divorced?
Well, you know, we knew early on that we clearly had some differences of raising kids once we had kids.
But I would say in trouble, we didn't really have any, you know, heated arguments or anything of that nature, but we knew it wasn't going in the right direction for, I'd say, two years, maybe three years.
But we kept trying anyway.
If she's not able to say no to people, then why didn't she just take what you said and not say no to it, like what you wanted her to do as a parent?
Okay, well, I would say she could say no to me.
Ah, okay, that's an important distinction.
Yes, it was never explicit though, okay?
It was always, it was always she would, it always seemed to, and this was one of the reasons that, you know, leading to the divorce, it was always that she seemed to have no problem doing things that other people wanted to please other people,
whether it was, you know, external people, actually even strangers, Um, but when it came time to doing something that I wanted, she would never say she wouldn't do it.
She just wouldn't do it.
All right.
Okay.
Okay.
Um, did you, uh, so when she would sort of, I guess you could say passive aggressively does not do the stuff she didn't want to do rather than say no.
Did you I'm not saying in front of your son, but did you confront her on that or how did that play out?
Yes, I did because it would, you know, frustrate me to be honest and Usually, you know, I'd say what's going on here and trying to rationalize with her, but usually she would just be quiet in those situations And then what?
Or just say, you know, I'm sorry, you know, the answer was I'm sorry and And then, you know, basically the same type of thing would then happen again.
Right.
So he wouldn't obviously see you having much effect on his mom, right?
Yes, yeah.
You know, he's a smart kid, and so I assume he'd realize that too for a while.
He certainly realizes that now, you know, now that he's older.
He clearly, distinguishingly sees the problem, knows his mom's issues with not being able to say no to anybody, including strangers.
He's 100% aware of it now.
Well, again, she has no problem saying no to people, maybe strangers, but not, but in her own family, right?
Yes, yeah.
And was there a final straw?
Within the marriage that happened, or was it just a slow, like, sand-through-the-hourglass thing?
Well, it was sand-through-the-hourglass, and, you know, I always just wanted to be married once, didn't want to give up kind of thing.
You know, she was, I would say, more willing to give up much earlier than I was.
You know, I would say, okay, you need to find somebody that's, you know, better suited to Your style or your parenting style or something like that.
And, you know, I always thought we could figure out a way to make it work, but then in the end it was just constant frustration.
And I could see explicitly that she was doing things for my friends' kids that she wouldn't even necessarily do for our kids or complete strangers.
You know, and that to me just wasn't pretty...
What do you mean?
Well...
Kids would come over, the kids would bring kids over, and she would literally treat the kids, give our kids stuff to those kids, spend money on strangers that maybe we could have spent on the family, things of that nature.
And was she working?
No, she wasn't.
Oh, so she was spending your money on other kids and strangers that could have been used for the family?
Early on, she had a hard life growing up.
She didn't really grow up with her parents.
And she did, starting at age 16 until we met, she did work jobs her whole time.
So when we got married, I wanted her to not have to work and raise our kids.
And does he have any siblings?
Yes, he has an older sister, three years older.
Right.
I'm guessing she's not that martial?
No, not at all.
Right.
Okay.
So, he's very keen.
Like, next summer, he really wants to go and enlist, right?
Well, yeah.
He'll turn 17 in a year and a half.
And, you know, at that point, the U.S. will take him in the branches, so...
If I say no, he would wait until he's 18 and probably do it on his own.
We've gone around the world looking at other countries, hopefully other countries with less active military, and most countries besides the U.S., you can't go in unless you're a citizen.
Now, one of the exceptions, of course, is Russia, which you would love to go in also, but I don't think that would be much less of a chance of him getting in combat.
Yeah.
Right.
So I'm going to just ask you some frank and blunt questions and hopefully it will make some sense.
So he knows that he's going to be a paid killer, right?
Yeah.
I mean, yes.
I mean, that's not like he's not like under any illusions that, you know, it's like really tough sports, right?
Yeah.
I make him watch every movie I can that doesn't necessarily show military action in a good light.
We watched Benghazi where private military contractors get killed.
We watched Ukrainian liberation documentaries that show people that it's a tough life that can get you killed.
Yeah, so he's aware of it.
Well, no, because...
I get that he can get killed, and I also get why that's obviously the most important.
But even if he doesn't get killed, he'll be killing other people, likely.
Yes.
Yeah, and that disturbs me, and I don't understand where this mindset comes from that it doesn't disturb him as much, if that's what you're going towards.
Who is his, you know, clearly if he's keen on the military, you know, and again, do you want me to be as blunt as I can?
Because, you know, this is very, very important stuff.
Sure.
Okay, good.
So, because he's into the military, he's got a model of masculinity that's not exactly tied up with your identity, right?
Yes.
I mean, if he wants to take guns and assert himself by shooting whoever his leaders tell him to, then he's got to yearn to have an impact on the world where you couldn't even have an impact on his mom, right?
Yeah.
So it could be that he's really thirsting for some example of masculinity, and he may be bouncing out of some of the sort of passive, helpless stuff that he may be getting from you with regards to masculinity.
Does that make any sense?
It's possible.
I mean, when I lived in the States, I used to be an avid gun owner, and he's shot my guns, and he's mad at me for having sold them when I left the U.S., No, I'm not talking about gun ownership.
What I'm talking about is you could not be assertive as a man and as a father and as a husband in your marriage, right?
Yes, I wasn't as strong as perhaps I should have been, yes.
I'm not trying to say that, because it doesn't sound like there was any capacity for you to be strong.
Because if people are that passive-aggressive, well, you can't pick them up and move them around, right?
Yeah, that's true.
Right?
So, I mean, just from what I'm, you know, obviously you were there and know, but what I'm getting a sense of, Derek, is like, it was just like pushing a piece of string, you know?
Yes, correct.
There's no capacity.
Okay.
So...
A son, as you know, looks at his father as the model of sexual success.
And if he wants the life his father has, he will model himself after his father.
If he doesn't want the life his father has, he will not.
Is there any possibility, Derek, that he wants the opposite of the life that you had?
Yes, there is, because he's quite explicit about not wanting a cubicle job.
I could never get him interested in entrepreneurship or programming, which is my background.
So, yeah, that could very well be the case.
So what that means is he wants kind of the opposite of his mom.
Because if he lives the life that's opposite from you, maybe what's going on in his mind is if he lives the life opposite from you, he's going to get someone opposite to his mom.
Yes, definitely.
What are his feelings towards his mom at the moment?
Well, I would say he certainly loves her, but he doesn't interact with her much.
She doesn't interact with him much, even though he goes over to her house three days a week.
When I ask, you know, what do you do there?
Maybe they watch a show together, but pretty much he stays on his I'm sorry to interrupt.
So they don't really interact much.
What does he love about her?
And love is a form of admiration, which means there must be some series of things about her that he admires.
Wow, good question.
I honestly don't know.
I know he knows she's a kind person, but I think that frustrates him more than anything else because he sees how people take advantage of her in her daily life.
Ah, so you see, if you're kind, you lose.
And he, like most young men, full of testosterone, wants to win.
Yes.
So if mom loses and dad's kindness loses, how do you win?
Mm-hmm.
Well, what's he coming up with?
Yeah.
Got it.
Good perspective.
Never thought of it that way.
Okay, so given that state, anything I can do to get him on a less violent career path at this point?
I don't know yet.
I'm still spelunking this maze, right?
So I don't know any of that yet.
Okay.
But does he express frustration at either you or his mom with regards to how your lives are or how your ways of being are?
Well, he doesn't like living in this country.
We're in Southeast Asia, because that's where his mom's from, and I didn't want to separate the kids.
But he thinks that everybody here is boring because he has a pretty unique personality and even his teachers at school said that and it's true.
He hates the political correctness of his school.
It's gotten him in trouble a couple of times.
So he definitely would like to go back to the U.S. or go to live in Any place from Russia to England, things of that nature.
No, I get it.
He doesn't care who gives him permission to shoot.
I get that, which is more troubling in a way because it's not nationalism then that's driving him.
Exactly.
It's not a nationalistic thing.
Yeah, I get it.
So is his mom...
I don't know.
Give me the race mix here because you said you're in Southeast Asia because of his mom.
She's Chinese.
She's Chinese and you're...
I'm from Texas.
That doesn't...
You're white?
Yes.
Yes, that's true.
Lots of people who are from Texas.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
That's true.
All right.
So he's a biracial kid, right?
Yes.
And how is that working out for him in terms of feeling connected to a group?
Well, he definitely doesn't feel connected to the majority of people here.
You know, he goes to private, or he's been going to private school here.
The previous one in junior high through ninth grade, they were mostly white, but his current one, they're not mostly white.
So I think he does feel isolated in that sense.
Although he does have, you know, friends that are mixed and it doesn't seem to be an issue with him at all.
It's more the fact of maybe their attitudes than their race.
Yeah, I mean, just, you know, one of the challenges, we are a tribal species, and it's not obviously everything, but it's not unimportant whether we feel like we fit in somewhere.
So you were married to the Chinese woman when you were in Texas, right?
Well, actually, we lived in California for most of our marriage.
Okay, okay.
And so she was, I guess, sort of a cliche, right?
More subservient.
Yes.
Chinese woman, and that was attractive to you, the subservience.
Why was that attractive to you?
I don't know that necessarily the subservience was attractive.
I mean, I'll be honest.
Yes, it was.
No, come on.
No, come on.
The big thing that you've told me about her is that she's subservient.
Okay, but it was the looks initially, okay?
She's pretty, right?
Yes, and I would say that...
In the marriage, I wish she would have been more of an equal partner.
Yes, but you knew she was subservient before you got married to her, right?
Well, I didn't know her that well before we got married, to be honest.
Okay.
See, this is why I'm not giving any answers yet, because we're still still looking.
I think I saw something in the shadows there.
Let's head that way.
So, how long did you know her before you got married?
Physical presence together, 11 days.
Okay.
All right.
Eleven days!
Let me just make a note of that.
All right.
You want to break that out for me a little bit?
Yeah, basically, you know, met her on a business trip here.
Fell in love.
Had to go back to my U.S. job after six weeks.
Came back and got married while I was here after a short period of time.
I was always looking for somebody...
I was always looking for somebody that had a golden heart like my grandmother, and she seemed to be the first person I'd ever met like that.
I'm going to assume your grandmother's not from China.
No, she's not.
Okay, okay.
And how pretty was she, Derek?
On a scale of one to ten, my view back there was she was definitely out of my league in the eight, eight and a half.
And what did you rate yourself as?
I would say I would rate myself as five and a half, six.
All right.
So you traded up to looks and she traded up to what?
Citizenship?
Whiteness?
I mean, what was her deal?
I think she traded up to security.
She didn't even work out quite as well as she was hoping then, did it?
Yeah.
Right.
Right.
And how long were you married for?
17 years.
Holy crap.
Yeah.
Tough decision.
Wow.
That's a bit of an inverted pyramid to sit on 11 days, but...
Well, I work hard to make it work, you know.
And then when you got divorced, she went back to China.
Yes.
We came here together.
No, I get that.
And so she was in America for a long time, but then when you got divorced, She went back to China and you followed her?
Yes.
Why?
No, literally we all came over together.
Right.
Oh, was that before you got divorced?
No, after.
Oh, after.
Okay.
Right after.
And why did she want to go?
I mean, she'd been in America forever, right?
So why did she want to go back to China?
Well, she had family here.
And to be honest, it's Taiwan, not China.
Okay.
Sorry.
Sorry.
Right.
Yeah.
This was the only relatives she had outside of my family.
So had she not made any particular social connections during the years and years that she was in America?
No, she had some friends there.
I would say one friend was a pretty good friend, but I don't think many friends were real deep.
Let's leave it at that.
I would say that's Fairly accurate.
Right.
Okay.
So, who divorced who?
I would say it was pretty equal.
It was pretty equal.
Like I said, she'd wanted to do it long before I did.
But in the end, I gave up.
So she wanted to divorce long before you did?
Yeah.
She didn't explicitly say divorce, but she said you can do better than me kind of thing.
Right.
Okay, so Derek, if I were to ask your son, give me an example of your father being assertive in a way that you admire, what would he say?
Good question.
He would probably say, well, he insists on me doing my schoolwork and being on time for things and sticking to my word.
I think that's more nagging than it is.
Would he have an example of assertiveness outside of telling him to do stuff?
Because kids usually don't experience that as assertive.
They experience that as nagging, which, you know, I'm not saying you don't ever have to do it as a parent.
No, no, no.
That's true.
Assertive.
Well, when he was growing up, I built my own house.
And so I had to deal with a lot of people to get things done and, you know, coordinating stuff and dealing with contractors and making things happen for that.
So maybe that would be an example.
And how old was he when you were doing that?
Oh, started when he was, like, one.
Are you kidding me here?
No.
You want me to, like, he'll remember stuff that happened when he was one?
That's his big example of you being assertive?
No, no, no.
It took a long time to build a house on your own.
So he grew up in a house under construction for, you know, the first seven years of his life.
I'm not sure that he would view that as you being assertive.
Okay.
Because, you know, that's...
That's you taking forever to get something done.
Wouldn't it be from the standpoint of a kid?
Perhaps.
Yeah.
Okay.
All right.
So let's maybe take that one off the table.
My dad took seven years to build a house.
I don't know that that's going to be something he'll really admire.
Maybe in every good reason in the world.
I'm just saying from the point of view of a kid.
Anything else?
Well, he doesn't see me at work.
I'm the one that always had to get things done around the house.
So...
If he doesn't see me at work, then all he can do is, you know, see me nag.
Maybe that's what it comes down to in order to get things done around the house.
So maybe not a lot of examples then.
Well, counterexamples is what you're giving me, right?
Mm-hmm.
All right.
What would you say is a clear example of assertiveness then in a domestic environment?
Well, having, you know, saying, this is what I want, and finding a way to achieve it.
Like, however you, I want to go and do X, and your family says, well, I don't want to, and say, okay, well, you know, two days ago, everybody wanted to do this, and I did that.
And three days ago, everybody wanted to do this, and so now it's my turn.
So no, I'm not going to just be here as the oil that facilitates everyone else's preference, but if I don't have any particular desires that I can achieve in this family, even against other people's wishes, guess what?
I'm going to stop trying to achieve anyone's other wishes that I don't want to do.
So I would say that I was the only one in the family that did that.
I did all the vacation planning, I did all the domestic planning, I I was the one that forged forward on everything.
My ex was just a follower, which was one of the disappointing parts of my marriage because I wanted a more partnership.
Right, so that's not being assertive, right?
You don't need to because she'll just follow along, right?
That she'll just follow along.
Yes, that's true.
Yep.
Okay.
Assertiveness is when other people like...
When there's conflict a little bit, yes.
Agreed.
Yeah, like if I'm working on a presentation and I say, oh, I think I need to do some more reading, and I go and sit down and read, I'm not being assertive because nothing...
If there's a bear in the way, okay, then I'm going to have to be a little bit assertive.
But, okay.
So he...
So...
He's used, in a way, to seeing men in charge, but also men being followers.
Right?
Because you were not able to assert yourself with your wife, probably because of cultural or personality differences or whatever, or histories.
Well, mostly because I didn't have to, right?
Because she...
No, no, that's not, no.
Because you wanted her to raise your son a certain way, and you couldn't get her to do it.
On that aspect, yes.
Right.
Right.
She would usurp it more than...
Yeah.
Okay.
Right.
So he's used to...
He's used to seeing men not have authority.
Mm-hmm.
Like around the house, right?
Yeah.
And do you have authority when you're in the military?
Well, I... That's what I tell him.
You know, I... But you modeled not having authority for him for 16 years.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Well, I also tell him, you know, he's going to get into a situation where he's going to have to do what people that even he will assess, you know, of less intelligence than him, order him to do.
What's the emotional connection?
Doesn't sound like he's got much of a one with his mom, like he goes over and they just watch shows together, which is just a bullshit way of not being with each other.
What's this emotional connection?
Because, you know, the challenge here You really are going to have a tougher time shooting people if you have empathy, right?
I'm not saying everyone who is in the military doesn't have...
I know it's more complicated than that.
But if you're willing to just join any army so that they'll let you shoot people and break things, I wouldn't necessarily think that there's an overabundance of empathetic connection there.
Yeah, and I've talked to him about this a little bit too, and I haven't been able to pull out what that desire is.
What the desire of what?
Of why it doesn't bother him that he might be hurting people as a profession.
No, no, no.
Not might.
That's the job.
Yes, yes.
It's like saying that my job may involve talking from time to time.
It's like, no, that's the job.
Right.
He views it as cool tactics and equipment, is what he will tell me, that he likes the environment of...
And he says this, and this goes back to what you said, the leadership training that he would get.
So it is some of the assertiveness training, so to speak, that he finds attractive.
And...
I've yet to get him to speak about why would the killing be a good or a bad thing, you know, to express a strong emotion about that.
Yeah, so he is so hungry for male leadership, he's willing to kill people to get it.
Is there any military history on either you or your wife's family side?
My grandfather, which he never knew, was in the military and that's about it.
So I'd say no.
Right.
Could be some genetics involved for all I know.
No, don't think so.
Okay.
I think I've got enough to give a few ideas.
Obviously, as you know, I don't tell people what to do.
Because there's no point.
And I don't know.
But I'll give you some thoughts about it, alright?
Appreciate it.
Now, empathy in certain...
Yeah, go ahead.
Well, you know, I have like a year and a half left.
I've decided to go back to homeschooling for his final year just to be around him more.
And to get him out of the PC environment, which he doesn't really care for.
He likes his friends there, but he doesn't like the school.
So I do have some time that hopefully I can do something effective.
Are you taking time off from work, or how does that work?
I'm semi-retired.
I did okay, so I can spend the time with him.
Okay, all right.
In certain Asian cultures, empathy is not maxed out.
Let's put it that way, right?
Yeah, I know.
I've watched the talk.
The guy from Hong Kong pointed out some excellent stuff about that.
It's so true.
Right.
So there may be Whether it's genetic or cultural or environmental or coming through his mom's whatever, right?
I mean, if his mom's kind of not there, if she's more there for other people or strangers than she is for her own family, if she flails and fades and washes away when there's any kind of conflict, which is not unknown among certain Oriental cultures or Asian cultures, then he doesn't have connection, emotional connection.
And that can be a challenge, as far as my amateur understanding goes, that can be a challenge towards the development of empathy.
I think that he is most likely to be frustrated at what he may perceive as a lack of leadership from you.
I mean, you followed your wife to a country he doesn't even want to be in after she divorced you, basically.
That's not an excess of leadership.
Is that fair to say?
Yeah, I did it because I didn't want her to be lonely, and I think now it's 1,000% a mistake.
Okay, well, you can fix that.
Yeah.
Whatever you can do, right?
So you did it to serve your wife's...
Needs.
Or your ex-wife's needs.
Okay.
All right.
And so he's in another country, so he can watch TV with his mom.
That's not a very compelling reason for uprooting, I would assume.
Well, I certainly didn't expect her to be so passive about the situation.
But yes, you're right.
No, no, no, no, no.
Oh my God, Derek.
Don't even try.
Don't even try.
After you were married to her for 17 years and were incredibly frustrated at her passivity, you cannot possibly, with a straight face, tell me that you had no idea she'd be this passive.
Well, I didn't think she wouldn't engage with the kids.
That's like literally saying, wait, she's still from Thailand.
No, no, I didn't think she wouldn't engage with the kids to the degree that she isn't.
Because she was doing it a lot before?
I would thought that she played with him, yeah.
You know, she did more before, yes.
And what does she think of him wanting to go into the military?
Well, apparently she didn't even know this until I told her about a week and a half ago about me having this conversation with you.
She didn't know that her son was really interested in the military?
Yep.
Well, no, she knew the history of his interest in military stuff.
She didn't know he had as a career goal right now to go into the military.
And how long has he had this career goal for?
Well, he's always had this strong interest, but we talked about things.
Up until about eight months ago, if you asked him what he wanted to do, he said a prison shift.
It was partially just to get reaction out of people, entertaining.
But then the whole aspect of the prison bothered me, so I had him start doing some of the cooking and thinking about it, things of that nature.
A prison chef?
A prison chef, yes.
A prison chef?
Yes.
Which also has the nature of, you know, you're the authority person around a bunch of people that have to do what you say kind of thing, you know, which is what bothered me about it.
Was he been watching Orange is the New Black or something?
Holy crap.
No, no.
I don't know where it came from.
I mean, suddenly, you know, he'd watched Gordon Ramsay.
He admired Gordon Ramsay for many years, okay?
So the chef part of it, I know, Oh no, it's not because he's a chef.
It's not because Gordon Ramsay is a chef.
It's because Gordon Ramsay is very, very assertive.
Yes, he is.
I've never watched the show, but I've occasionally seen the promos, right?
But he is a screaming, slamming, red-faced, choleric, wild-haired demon of get-do-it-my-way, right?
Yep.
Right.
Right.
And that's what he's hungry for.
Yeah.
It is.
Who would he say that he, like, who did he tell that he wanted to be a prison chef to?
Anybody who asked.
You know, in school, the teacher said, what do you want to be?
A prison chef.
And this was a case for about two years.
Because it's funny, because it's like the Gordon Ramsay thing, I mean, the Gordon Ramsay is like, you know, testosterone plus, as far as I can, right?
Yeah.
But...
The prison part is fascinating.
It's like, I want to be a chef, right?
Right, right.
And the funny thing is, Gordon Ramsay actually made a show that we just saw like six months ago for the first time, even though it's an old show, that he goes into prison to show people how to be chefs in England.
But I don't think my son got the inspiration from that because that was just a recent discovery.
Yeah, I mean, I got to think that...
I don't know, obviously, but...
It would seem to me that he's an angry guy.
Because saying, I want to be a prison chef, I mean, that kind of made you guys feel that good, right?
Yeah.
But, you know, the interesting thing is he doesn't exhibit any anger emotions.
You know, like when you say an angry guy, people would not be around him, even me.
I never see him hardly express much anger about things.
Mmm.
Anything.
So he doesn't have a temper?
No, not really at all.
Right.
Does he date?
Uh, no.
He, until, say, last October, he never even expressed any interest in girls.
And then last October, I mean, you know, at the time he was 14, so that's okay.
He'd gone to, you know, Christian schools, and so it wasn't like, you know, the way it is in the U.S. and some other places where that's a big thing.
He has girls, he has friends, but he hasn't dated yet.
And I know that he's only, as far as he's told me, liked one girl.
Right.
Yeah, I mean, saying prison chef is just a way of really startling people, if not shocking them, right?
I mean, that's a very unusual...
Yeah.
Okay.
All right.
Yeah, I mean, he may not be expressing his anger because he's planning on joining a profession where he gets to act it out, right?
Perhaps.
perhaps.
What is the most disciplined thing that he's been involved in so far?
Has he done martial arts?
Is there anything that he's done where there's discipline involved?
Sure.
Well, for his 12th birthday, he wanted a drill and steel wire.
So I got him this so that he could make chain mail.
So he made the whole, you know, headdress, chest chain mail thing, which I didn't think you would have the patience for, but he did in the end.
You know, it's an amazing amount of work.
After that, about 18 months ago, he started doing Brazilian Jiu Jitsu.
And even to the extent that he paid for it out of his own pocket.
And he's pretty disciplined with it.
You know, he...
Right, so defense and attack, right?
Armor and Jiu Jitsu.
Yeah, exactly.
Okay.
And where did he get the money for it?
You said he paid for it himself.
Well, I've given him an allowance.
His...
Chinese New Year's red envelope thing, you know, he gets money for birthday and stuff like that.
He can't work here yet, so...
Right, right.
Right.
But has he...
I guess, I mean, before he joined, he could try it out, right?
I mean, there are, I don't know, ROTC things or...
Part-time things that he could try out, right?
Well, the interesting thing is, you know, there's compulsive military service here, and actually we got him an opt-out on that because he has no interest in this military.
He thinks they're a bunch of wimps, which is, you know, comparatively, I guess it's true.
But In the past, I said, you know, when he had an interest in swordsmith and stuff, I said, okay, then you're going to sit down and you're going to write letters to all the people who are your admirers who do, you know, sword making.
Maybe you can get an internship or something like that.
But now he's saying, oh, Dad, that would take way too long.
So his idea of the military is to go in and do his four years service and then be either, you know, a private military contractor or a maritime security guard, things of that nature.
When I say, look further down the road, he thinks, well, maybe non-commissioned officer if I stay in, but you know, he's 15, he's not looking that far down the road.
Right.
Well, it sounds like that's what he really wants to do.
And it also sounds like he's drawn towards a military where he's really going to get to do some damage, right?
I mean, if he goes to Russia or America and, you know, stuff goes the way it goes or in other directions, then maybe he's frustrated at the military and the country he's in because he doesn't think they'll get to fight.
Well, actually, when I ask him about that, it's more the training and the level of training such that he could get a follow-up job after the military.
You know, if you're in Would he have any objection to the basic reality that all of his training and all of his weaponry and all of his pay and in the future his pension
It would all be paid for through coercion, through taxes, through people who wouldn't necessarily voluntarily do it themselves.
Yeah, I've talked to him some about this, because, you know, I've been a lifelong libertarian bent, and it doesn't bug him as much, of course, as I wish it would.
Yeah.
And, you know, I've also pointed out, I said, okay, well, you know, things may or may not change with the election if Donald Trump gets in, and we You know, shrink the U.S. military and shut down the empire overseas.
And there's going to be less job opportunities and more of a flood of competition in the field that you're interested in.
Yeah, when you're 15, I don't know about that.
It has.
Yeah, I don't think that's not going to do too much.
But that said, I mean, he does, you know, we talked about, okay, well, what if you go in the Air Force and, you know, things of that nature.
And he goes up and he looks at the different...
Flying helicopters was a possible interest, and so he went up and looked at the different branches and how many helicopters they had and what kind and what's the likelihood of them actually getting the best training and things of that nature.
So he looks at it a little bit, but like I said, he's young.
But there is a definite interest, at least in what he says, in the training aspect and the quality of training as opposed to the end result of what you're going to be doing with the training.
What about offering him something like, you know, the army will, I don't know around the world, but I think in America the army will pay for your education in return for commitments afterwards?
And what if he were to pursue something that would be, whether it's through the army or not, that would be of value educationally and do some part-time army stuff where you didn't necessarily have to have a huge commitment afterwards?
Would there be any chance that he would do something that would enhance his value as a private contractor down the road without going straight into the army but maybe going through the educational route?
Well, I've tried to explore some of that aspect of it.
He doesn't have a huge interest in going to college.
And so that type of education aspect, there's nothing pulling him there.
The other part that there may be some things which I want to explore is there are all kinds of private training for this type of operation courses that you can go through.
So maybe, you know, a heavy bribe in that direction.
However, almost all of them have a minimum age of 18.
And so there's absolutely nothing we could do until he reaches 18 and whether he would postpone, you know, asking me to let him go in at 17 or if he's already 18, just doing it on his own.
I don't know.
And how does he do in school?
What do you think his smarts are like?
He's a...
B student in a college prep school.
So he's not, you know, he's not a dumb kid.
That said, he doesn't have, you know, great habits on learning anything he's not interested in, of course.
So he will spend hours and hours and hours and hours forever on stuff he's interested in and researching.
Military history would have been a, you know, a great career choice if you could make a dime in it.
Oh, no.
You can make money as a military historian.
Well, I've told him about when he was interested in swordsmith.
A friend of mine, I said, he makes a lot of money at it.
When you're good in the field, you can make a lot of money at it.
What is swordsmith?
Making swords?
Yes.
Well, Gwyn Dyer and other people are authors who have done fantastic stuff.
And I had him read that book.
Yeah, if he really wants to do damage, theory is better than bullets, right?
I mean, the military theories, fourth generation, fifth generation warfare, and so on.
If he really wants to sort of help a military, and he's got smarts, then being out there, you know, humping 150 pounds of gear, and so on is, that's grunt work, right?
That's lower rent stuff, if he really wants to do damage.
But it sounds like he really wants to be out on the battlefield, rather than figuring out the best way to deploy the resources that the military already has.
Perhaps.
I'm not sure if it's out in the battlefield 100% or just to be able to play with the stuff.
Yes, I know playing with the stuff kills people, but...
No, no, no, I know that.
But what I mean is that if he's smart...
Then the military may in fact guide him towards something where he can use his brains rather than his brawn, which is not to say that infantrymen are dumb or anything like that, but if he's really smart, in other words, if when he applies himself, he might get beyond a B, that the military might actually move him somewhere that would use more of his brains than his brawn.
Yeah, and I think his laziness is coming back at him there because he doesn't really want to commit to a four-year college in order to be ROTC. You know, direction.
Right.
Right.
Well, it's late in...
There's no magic solutions here, as you're aware, right?
I mean, there's no magic wand here, Derek.
I mean, it's late in the day because, you know, next, like in 6 to 12 months, he can go and start the process, right?
Right.
So it's kind of late in the day.
As far as, you know, if he wants to go and do it, He's gonna go do it, right?
He's almost an adult.
And there is something that he might want to read.
I've got it as a podcast earlier, War is a Racket.
Okay.
By a retired US Marine Corps Major General and two-time Medal of Honor recipient.
And he was a commanding officer of the Gendarmerie during the United States occupation of Haiti, which lasted from 1915 to 1934.
He retired from the Marine Corps.
He made a nationwide tour in the early 1930s giving a speech, War is a Racket.
He wrote a longer version as a short book.
I actually first read it as a kid.
It was in Reader's Digest.
Okay.
And it's worth, you can get it online, but basically this is what he says.
He says, War is a racket.
It is possibly the oldest, easily the most profitable, surely the most vicious.
It is the only one international in scope.
It is the only one in which the profits are reckoned in dollars and the losses in lives.
A racket is best described, I believe, as something that is not what it seems to the majority of the people.
Only a small inside group knows what it is about.
It is conducted for the benefit of the very few, at the expense of the very many.
Out of war, a few people make huge fortunes.
So the degree to which soldiers are the pawns of some pretty malevolent people, and that their destruction is used to generate profits for a small group at the top of a particular oligarchy, is not unimportant.
Now, you know, again, that may not be enough to say to his What was the author's name?
His Smedley Butler.
That's a terrible name for a guy who's so great.
Smedley Butler.
Yeah, war is a racket.
You can find it pretty easily online.
Henry Kissinger, obviously a famous dude, said military men are just dumb, stupid animals to be used as pawns in foreign policy.
He is not going to achieve...
Look, in certain situations...
The military is essential.
I am not a pacifist.
So, but the degree to which the American military has been used to disrupt and destroy and undermine the Middle East is shocking and brutal and woefully and woesomely destructive to the native population.
Hillary Clinton, who supported the Murder, overthrown murder of Muammar Gaddafi in Libya.
He was dragged through the streets.
He was sodomized with a bayonet and then killed.
And he was the guy who said, if you kill me, migrants are going to swarm to Europe.
And the degree to which American lives have been spent in order to undo fragile structures in the Middle East, And cause the rise of savage ideologies and barbaric practices and world-shaking dislocations of people.
That is not honorable work.
There can be honorable work in the military, don't get me wrong.
In my view, that is far from honorable work.
That is allowing naivety, bloodlust and orders To hack at the foundations of Western civilization.
And he has no control over how he is used morally, how he is used violently once he signs.
Yep, I know.
Once you sign, you can work to get out, and I did an interview years ago with a fellow who can help with that, with people who change their minds once they're in, but it's tough.
So if he wants masculinity, if he wants independence, if he wants authority, if he wants assertiveness going into the army, that's not going to do it.
You are not going to get much of a chance to be assertive in the Russian army.
You are going to be a pawn in the hands of one balding ex-KGBA head, right?
Now, I know that you've talked to him about all of this, Derek, so the only thing that I would suggest...
Is that if he can get a good, assertive male therapist, and you could make that a condition of supporting him going in, and he could explore, and he could say, listen, if he's going in for the wrong reasons, that's kind of a one-way ticket, right?
This is how I would say it to him.
You know, I'm your dad.
I want what's best for you, and it's really, really hard for me to understand how the military is what's best for you, but...
I don't want you to go in for reasons that you turn out to later regret.
I don't want you to regret after you sign and after you've signed your life over to this military-industrial complex, I don't want you to regret it.
Now, I have made the case, but I can't make a case strong enough for you, which, you know, you're your own mind, your own thoughts, and you're on the cusp of adulthood.
But I do want someone to check you over.
You know, in the same way that they give you a physical before you go into the military, I want to have A therapist talked to you and maybe I can also talk to the therapist at times as well.
Find out what's going on.
Maybe it's all for good reasons and then at least my conscience will be clear.
But we need to know why you want this.
It doesn't come from me in particular.
It doesn't come from your mom in particular.
Maybe it comes from your grandfather who you never knew.
I don't know.
And I recognize, son, that this is something you've been interested in forever.
This is something that is part of your nature.
And That is who you are, and I'm not gonna try and undo who you are because I'm your father.
I had a biological and environmental role in creating or producing who you are, not that you're mine, but I need to know for myself, and obviously for you, I need to know the why.
If there's the good why, I'll find it a lot easier to live with.
If there's a bad why, You'll find it a lot harder to live with.
Because you'll have signed up and I won't.
And once you pass through that door, there's not really any turning around.
So that would be my particular speech to say, let's figure out what's going on here.
If the therapist says, oh yeah, he's perfectly suited for the military, and if that's what you want to do, well, you're an adult, right?
I don't have to approve of what you do in order to still love you.
Just as you don't approve of everything that I do, but hopefully still love me.
And that would be sort of my way of trying to figure out what might be going on for him.
Okay.
Appreciate it, Steph.
All right.
Would you let us know how it goes?
Okay, sure will.
All right.
Thanks, Derek.
And I appreciate you calling in on such a tough topic.
Was it at all helpful what we chatted about?
Yeah, it went the direction I thought it would go with, but you've given me some food for thought and an approach at the end here, which I hadn't thought of, and I'm searching for an approach to get through to him.
Okay, as long as there's a next step, we can keep putting foot in front.
Okay, well, I hope it works out, and thanks so much for calling in.
Alrighty, take care.
Take care.
Alright, well up next is Josh.
Josh wrote in concerning the fall of Rome and some modern parallels.
He said, Could the migrants be the equivalent for the modern leftist political empire that the barbarian mercenaries were to the Roman Empire?
What effects do you think they will have on the native Europeans, particularly the Swedes and Nordic peoples, when they turn on their former masters?
That's from Josh.
Hey Josh, how you doing?
I'm well, how are you?
I love you.
Oh, hey, before we dive into this topic, can we talk about the last call for just a second?
Because I was that kid.
Like, that is me that you were just talking about.
Well, shit, you know what?
Let's do this.
Let's talk about the last caller, or his kid.
And I promise you, I've been working on a fall of Rome thing.
Let me do my fall of Rome thing, and then you can call back in after I do that.
Not obviously tonight, but I've got a fall of Rome presentation in the works.
Okay.
So let's put that one on hold so I don't end up reading a bunch of notes, which I'm going to do better in a presentation.
So, but let's talk about this.
And the reason I said I love you is because I get to talk history.
Oh, yeah, that's the thing is, yeah, I love history, too.
I wanted to go into, like, the parallels between the Roman army and its progression and then the political combat that is the Western political system and its progression.
I mean, if you look at how the Roman army evolved and how it looked at soldiery, and then you look at how the political combat in the West has evolved and looking at voters, it is unbelievably similar.
But...
Here's a little thing, right?
So the Huns, you know, came out of Mongolia and pushing everyone westward.
The Visigoths got trapped between the Huns and the Germans.
Squeezed between scorn and the spear, the Visigoths panicked, and not a few tried to push their way into Roman territory.
Facing a surge of frantic immigrants, the Roman Emperor Valens had little choice but to relent and let them in.
Once inside the boundaries of Rome, the Visigoths found safety, but at the same time a new and in many ways more dangerous foe.
As newcomers to Roman civilization, they were ill-equipped to live in a state, run on taxes, and mired in the complex language of legalities, and thus were made easy prey for unscrupulous, greedy imperial bureaucrats who cheated and abused them.
Very quickly the Visigoths found themselves bound in something heavier and more constricting than chains, the gruesome coils of red tape, and they responded as any reasonable barbarian would.
They demanded fair treatment, and when their pleas went unheard, they embarked upon a rampage.
Well, with me, it even goes farther back than that, because if you look at the founding of the Republic when they threw off the Etruscans, the Roman military model was you had to be a citizen and you had to bring your own equipment.
You had to own land, because the idea was that you had to have an investment in society to fight for it, because otherwise, why are you here?
But then the other problem was that the...
Roman military was very aristarchal.
You had to be noble, and just because you're noble doesn't make you the best of military commanders.
That all changed when the Romans got in a little bit more than they could stand with the Lombardi.
And they were getting their butt kicked left and right.
And what they turned to was a man who came up through the ranks, Marius.
And he had the Roman military reformer.
He said, look, no, no, no, no.
Anybody can fight for Rome.
I don't give a damn if you own land or that.
What it is, you've got to be willing to fight.
And, you know, so then they take anybody and it was the state that equipped them.
And it was you get military service and at the end you get some land and you become a citizen.
This is like a cash cow gold mine.
It's the equivalent of, in the 1900s, immigrants coming to America of, what, I can be free and work?
Hell yeah, I want to come and do that.
So then that was the new Roman military model.
But then, you know, of course, Rome went into larger statism, and then it decayed.
And now the military just, it got too big for the military to manage.
The military became more ineffective, just like everything else in Rome.
And then nobody wanted to go into the military, but they still needed it, the bureaucrats.
So what did they turn to?
They said, well, hell, we'll just hire barbarian mercenaries to come and police our empire.
Just like now, if you look in Europe especially, well, hell, we'll just bring in migrants to vote for us.
It's the same damn thing.
Well, the barbarian underneath Marius We're good to go.
Took on a lot of their ideas on trade.
With the Egyptians, they learned a lot of building techniques from them.
But the idea was, no, no, no, you bring your good stuff, you can bring your own thing, but you're Roman.
And everybody wanted to be Roman.
Well, now you just had a bunch of barbarians where they're like, I want land and money, and I think that you Romans are a bunch of pussies to begin with, but hey, you pay.
Well, then the money dried up, and they went, well...
They didn't have any care about Rome, so they sacked it and burned it.
Because why?
Rome ran out of money.
So now these people who are coming here now, now sure, I'm sure there's some among them who want to adopt the West, but they don't give a damn about the West.
They say, yeah, we'll vote for you, you give us free stuff.
But the second the free stuff dries up, it's just going to be exactly like, and then you will have my namesake, I'm Hungarian, you will have the burning and the pillaging of the Huns.
And I'm kind of reminded of a quote by Genghis Khan Where he said, a wrathful and terrible God sent me upon you because you have been sinful.
Now, with the Mongols, they didn't believe in like the Christianity idea of sinful, like as in, you know, you ate meat on Sunday.
It was more, you're weak.
You are divided.
You're not strong.
We are stronger than you.
Being weak is a sin in our eyes.
And if you hadn't been so weak and pitiful and God-awful...
I would have never come to conquer you.
And it was also Genghis Khan that said, I wish to have one set of rules upon all the lands so that everyone may live in peace and calm and ease.
Now, that's kind of the difference between the Mongols and a lot of other conquerors is that the Mongols just wanted power, and it was just one power structure.
They didn't impose an ideology.
Same with the Romans.
But when you go with Islam or a lot of other ideologies, communism, The power is an afterthought.
They just want to impose an ideology.
Because with the Mongols and the Romans, the idea was if we don't impose our structure or our power on you, you're going to do it to us.
We don't give a damn about you.
We don't care what you do.
It doesn't matter.
The point is either we're in control or you're in control.
Therefore, we will be in control.
With Islam and communism, it's no.
We care.
We want to impose our views on you.
The power is just how we do it.
So that's just the parallels that I see.
Yeah, and these are not my words.
This is just from the notes and stuff I've gathered on the web, but this is a pretty good quote.
Increasing pressure from people outside the empire, the much maligned barbarians had compelled the Romans in later antiquity to let more and more foreigners inside their state.
Since most of these spoke a language based on common Germanic, the Romans referred to them collectively as Germans, even though they actually represented a wide array of nations and cultures.
These newly adopted resident aliens were assigned to work farms or were conscripted into the Roman army in numbers so large that the late Latin word for soldier came to be barbarous or barbarian.
They're actually called barbarians to make fun of their language.
They say, ba-ba-ba-ba-ba.
That's why they're called barbarians.
And where these barbarians met resistance, they sneaked or pushed their way inside the empire and in such profusion that Rome was fast turning into a nation of immigrants.
This begs the question, then, why so many foreigners lived in And even more wanted to live in Rome.
Why did barbarians in such numbers press to invade an empire in which they were treated as second-class citizens, no matter how hard they worked and collaborated?
The answer is easy.
The Roman Empire in that day was a far safer place to live and offered much better accommodations than the wild world outside its borders.
Roads and aqueducts and baths and amphitheaters and even taxes looked good.
When one is gazing in from outside where poverty, blood feuds, disease, and frost reigns supreme.
Mild Mediterranean climate of southern Europe cannot be discounted as a factor in the barbarians' desire to infiltrate sunny Rome.
But there was an even more impressive reason, lurking beyond the borders of the empire, something anyone would want to avoid if at all possible.
The Huns!
You know, so anyway, yeah.
Well, we'll talk about this.
I'll do the presentation and we'll chat about it afterwards.
But if you are...
If you are someone who has wisdom to offer the last dad, I'm all ears.
Okay.
Well, just everything that he was describing about his son, I'm just hearing again and again, okay, that's me, that's me, that's me, that's me.
His interest in the military, if he was anything like me, It's more about wanting to be different.
Because you hear him say that, you know, with him, it's kind of a multicultural thing that he doesn't fit into predominantly white schools, or he just kind of seems like a bit of an outsider, but he's obviously not dumb when having a B average and a very intelligent level school.
The reason he has a B average is because he doesn't care about any of that stuff because he's interested in making ring mail and things like that.
When I was his age, I actually made a Roman shield out of just steel because we owned a steel shop because I thought it was cool.
I didn't care about all the boring things that my public school was drowning on about.
I could sleep through class, not study, get a B or a C average with zero effort.
So that's what I did.
Those were the things that I was interested in.
And what it is, when you talk about taxation and those things being supporting, that's how he's going to be supportive, that doesn't matter.
Because you see, the whole time in school, all the teachers, all the kids that he doesn't fit in with, and I'm sorry if that gentleman's listening, you You're all sheep.
You didn't stand up to his mom.
They don't stand up.
They're the other.
It doesn't matter what happens to them.
Are you going to go and kill people?
Probably, but that's not the point.
Are there going to be people who are going to be paying for your salary by force?
Who gives a damn what happened to them?
They don't matter.
I have as much in common with them as I do a cow standing in a field.
They don't matter to me.
And if you don't have it grounded in real strong moralism that you've had from the beginning of the non-aggression principle, which I didn't, that doesn't matter.
It's like saying, well, you know, that cow who made that steak that you're eating probably doesn't appreciate that.
I don't give a damn.
It's a cow.
So there's that.
And what you want to be is you want to be special.
You want to be a badass.
You want to be what's known in the Special Forces community as high speed.
With me, I was coming out of high school in 2007.
Sorry, sorry to interrupt.
But high speed in the special forces, that refers to verbal fluency in philosophy, doesn't it?
That's the toughest and mean it?
Never mind.
Okay, go ahead.
Sorry.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Absolutely, yes.
Yay!
Yes, of course.
But in 2007, when I was getting ready to graduate high school, I didn't have an interest in college because I just saw it as a continuation of high school, which I hated because I didn't fit in with anybody.
But...
I wanted to be in force recon with the Marines, or I wanted to be an Army Ranger.
And the thing is, I wanted to be infantry.
The idea of getting shot at and all that, that was awesome to me.
Because the thing is, if I wanted to do anything but that, I'd go to college.
You don't go to the military to learn telecommunications.
You don't go to the military to do any of the things that you can do in the civilian world.
You go to the military to have cool equipment, guns, and bullshit up.
That's why you go to the military if you're like us.
And if people die in the process, well, It's probably for a good cause.
And if it's not, who gives a shit?
It's just, I want to do what I want to do.
People die every day.
Society can't pretend like they actually really care.
Otherwise, there would be a real anti-war movement.
I mean, the big disenfranchisement came from me when after 2008 happened and every Democrat suddenly turned a blind eye to things being blown up.
There's an internet meme going around that's got a picture of a milk carton and a hippie on it.
It says, missing anti-war Democrat, last seen 2008.
But anyway.
Like once Bush exited, so did their moral outrage, right?
Yeah, exactly.
So you just sit back and you say, nobody really gives a shit, so why shouldn't I just do what I want to do?
And what he wants to be is he wants to be that badass.
I mean, you know, he doesn't see, and I'm sorry if the guy's listening, he doesn't see you as a badass.
He sees probably the popular kids as cool because they have a social interaction that he just can't do.
I couldn't do it.
So what's the next best thing?
You have really, really cool equipment and you do stuff that everybody else is afraid to do.
Like with me, I'm a firefighter.
When I first went into it, there was a lot of thing of, oh, you run into burning buildings when other people are running out, that takes great courage, yada, yada, yada.
Well, yeah, okay, well, now you're special.
And you're special because you're willing to take risks.
So it, boom, instantly gives you something that you want.
And also, too, there's a camaraderie among it.
The idea of the military, there's a camaraderie of, we go out and we, brothers in arms.
Well, and there are lots of people, lots of people in the military, of course, who look back on their time as the military as the time when they were closest to others.
Oh, absolutely.
Yeah.
But I would have went into the military, but the whole thing was, like I say, it was the surge going on.
And the absolute thing that I did not want to have happen was I didn't want to just go into basic for, you know, eight to ten weeks and then go to just some infantry department.
Platoon and then be stuck in some foxhole in Fallujah with a bunch of idiots that don't know what they're doing.
I just, my thing was, is I want to have a shot right away at being some type of special forces.
And the recruiter told me that I would.
Luckily for me, my cousin was a recruiter for the Navy.
I went and talked to him and he went, no, if you look at your, what they're saying there, that's total bullshit.
You'll have an opportunity after two deployments.
That's what it is.
So in other words, they lied to me.
I got mad and didn't do it.
Very, very lucky that I didn't, even though I considered it again later because I just wasn't happy with my life.
But the most important thing that I can say to this is it's actually what I was going to say to everybody who is really most people I listen to talking, calling into this show.
You can tell...
They're uncomfortable talking in public.
You can tell.
They're just uneasy.
I don't mean to insult anybody or that.
They aren't like yourself or myself in that you'll speak, and if people get upset, the idea that it's a problem doesn't even enter my mind.
I don't give a shit about what people think.
I never have because I never fit in with people to begin with, so I don't have that fear of social disapproval because I never had it to begin with.
But the main thing that I can tell...
Well, and I'm sorry to interrupt, and I don't want to interrupt your flow, but for me, it's also, and this may sound hokey, but genuinely how I feel.
It's out of love.
You know, like, we don't love people by withholding the truth that we see from them.
We don't love the world by withholding facts that it needs to digest.
People say, oh, how can you say these things?
It's because I love the world, and I want the world to be a better place.
I want me to be a better person, and you can't ever achieve that in any sustainable way, individually, or socially, or globally, by withholding the truth from people.
I know, I know, I get that.
I actually hate those kind of guys, but it is, when we withhold the truth from people, It's because we hate them deep down.
It's because we have contempt for them deep down.
And it's because we're afraid of them deep down, which all of these things are kind of mixed in together.
But if you actually genuinely act from a place of love, I want to help.
And I know, I know for a simple basic fact that the only way to help people is tell them the truth.
Now, if I have lots of evidence for the truth, I'll say it's the truth.
If it's my opinion, I'll say it's my opinion, which is the truth that it's my opinion.
But I do love the world enough, for he so loveth the world, that he is willing to tell it the truth and to be corrected where necessary.
So it is not just I have no fear of social disapproval or anything like that.
It's just that we all have the fear and we all have the love.
And it is, of course, the hope that the love overcomes the fear to the point where we're willing to tell people the truth, even if they dislike us for it.
See now, just to give you another idea of it, with me, I am the exact opposite of you, but it's kind of funny that we do the same thing.
I have absolutely just disdain and hate for the world.
I kind of view the world as we're on the Titanic and we're heading towards an iceberg and I am literally surrounded by like sheeps and water buffaloes.
And I'm just sitting here going, no, no, no, no, steer left.
No, no, no, steer left.
God damn, you stupid friggin' animals.
If I could, I would just let you all sink.
I don't care.
I'm a millennial.
I've been born into trillions and trillions of dollars of debt and all the other horrible things.
Screw you people.
But unfortunately, I'm on the same boat as you.
And damn it all, now I have to take time out of my one life away from my family that I love to save you retards.
I wish that I could get into a lifeboat and just watch you all crash and burn because that's what exactly you've tried to do to me before I was even born.
But unfortunately, that's not an option.
So here we are.
But that's just me.
No, no, I get it.
We're two different generations.
It bothers me that I have to save idiots as well as myself and good people.
But, you know, that's just the way it is.
We're all in the same boat.
Yeah, and also, too, it's kind of funny, too.
The last time you and I spoke, you asked me if I considered being a father, and now I am.
My son's two months old.
So you are right.
Hey, congratulations.
Thank you.
Thank you.
So now you can hate the world even more because your son's even more in debt than you are.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Well, hopefully my son will never have to pay a dime of the debt, because hopefully it'll collapse long before he enters the workforce.
But that's only wishful thinking.
All born babies are afflicted with SIDS, which is sudden infant debt syndrome.
But anyway, okay, back to with me again in that.
So that's his mindset right now, is that he wants to be exceptional, different.
And how do you do that?
By becoming a high-speed merchant of death.
And does it matter that you're doing things that are, quote, immoral?
Well, the whole world's immoral to begin with, so who cares?
I don't care.
That's the mindset.
These are the things that changed it for me.
And these are actually the things, too, that I suggest to every single person, as I just spoke of before, where if you are socially awkward, you're scared to speak out, one, take up, and this is going to really hit people for a loop, take up guard things.
Seriously, because what it does, it does two things.
One, an actually very, very practical thing, and two, an almost spiritual thing.
It's one thing.
When you put work, effort into something, you watch it grow, you watch it live, it lives or dies because of you, and it takes effort, skill, And a thought process, it changes you.
It's almost, I mean, it's like a mini version of being a father to me, almost.
It's just as I watched my son grow, even over the first two months, and I was shocked at how much of a personality he was born with, my goodness.
But it's the same thing, only on steroids, for when you become a father.
So that's a big thing I can say right there.
And also, it gives you something to where you You know what it is to create something.
You know what it is to have value in the world where you aren't just willing to walk away from the sinking ship and say, fuck it, who cares?
So that's the first thing.
The second thing is, it's a very, very good thing to know how to grow your food.
That's nice to know.
The next thing is, is I heard him say that he was into Brazilian jiu-jitsu.
I was going to tell everybody, you want to get into a martial art, but do not get into things like that because I've done Brazilian jiu-jitsu.
It's very technical.
It's like playing chess, but physically.
What I suggest, and that's for anybody who wants to be more assertive, take up boxing.
Because this is what's going to happen in boxing.
You're going to learn how to train.
You're going to work really, really hard.
You're going to learn what it is to have more confidence in yourself.
Then you're going to step, because they're going to train you for a while before they let you spar.
Then you're going to step out into the sparring ring.
You're going to go up against somebody who's way better than you.
And they're going to punch you in the face.
You're going to fall down, your bell is going to get rung, and your nose is going to bleed.
You're going to taste your own blood.
And in other words, it's absolutely everything that you were afraid of when you first went into boxing.
And then what happens next is, you pick yourself up, you wipe your nose off, you realize it's not that bad, and you go back to it.
And in fact, if you really dedicate yourself, I mean, it'll get to the point where getting tagged good You actually kind of laugh and it's enjoyable.
You taste your own blood.
And that's the way it is, especially when I hear people in Sweden call in, Germany call in.
You just hear this defeated, scared.
It's just like when I see somebody step into the gym for the first time.
They're scared.
They're scared.
They're afraid of getting hit.
These people are afraid of being hit, and I can tell by listening to them, they've never really been hit in the world of ideas.
They've never been punched in the face and had the worst possible thing happen.
Well, like I say, is that once you've done it for real, like you've actually tasted your own blood, the idea of having some crybaby who you don't respect to begin with at all saying mean things to you, you'll enjoy it.
Well, no.
I mean, listen, much though I like the movie Fight Club and much though I want to dance over the topic of Concussions and getting your brain hurt and stuff.
To be fair to the people in Europe, it's not that they're afraid of mean people on the internet.
They're afraid of being arrested.
They're afraid of saying things that are true.
That's only because they were afraid of the mean people.
So because they're afraid of the mean people, they've let the mean people set up all these laws?
Yeah, exactly.
Again, like I say, if you'd have taken that punch in the face early on, now hey, now you're in the situation where, yeah, you do face more significant risks.
This goes back to Genghis Khan.
You are now inviting these horrible hordes because you were sinful, because you were weak, because you were afraid, because you lost what it was to be strong.
And now, this is how you get reformed.
If I get somebody who comes into the gym and they've worked out before, they've even been the type that they aren't afraid to get into a fight.
If push comes to shove and they've done it before, well, they get to pick it up a lot quicker.
But if you've got somebody who's done nothing but sit on the couch and eat Cheetos and they decide they really want to do it, well, they're in for a lot harder go.
So are you saying that the braver...
Hang on.
I mean, this may have worked for you, but I've got to push back a little bit because I've not noticed that all the bravest people on the internet are all boxers.
Well, I'm not talking about the internet.
I'm talking about in real life.
It's easy to sit there and shitpost.
I'm talking about when you go...
Like with me, I go to the...
I work at the fire station.
Do you think in a government...
That there are people who are a little bit pro-statist or a little bit, you know, like, there's two types.
You have the Democrats in there who want to get everything for free for public workers, and then you have the Republicans who, the real question of foreign policy is how much of the Middle East should be turned into beaded glass?
Like, are we talking all of it or just, like, about 90%?
Like, those are the two mindsets that you deal with.
And the long story short is that these people are also firemen because firemen is basically the idea is this is what people that work there.
Do you barely function in civilized society?
Are you damaged from something in your life?
Go and become a fireman.
You will fit in perfectly.
So, I mean, I've had people throw stuff at me, scream, yell.
I mean, that's just normal.
But the whole thing is, is like I say, is if you're going to do this in public discourse, if you're going to go to a Trump rally, If you're going to, in your life, talk to people, get ready for people to get really, really mad.
And this is also, too, like what I've talked about before with me.
I'm married to a black woman.
I am much more comfortable around black culture than I am white culture.
Because the thing is, my best friend is from Haiti.
And him and I have talked in the past, and he says, you're the first white person to ever speak to me with respect.
And what he meant by that is not as in the multicultural hugs and kisses where we all get along, but the point where I would look him in the face and say, fuck you.
You know, he'd talk about, you know, the rape and pillage of white people and that.
And I said, yeah, you got a legitimate issue there on some stuff, but I don't want to hear it.
Shut up.
I'm not going to listen to your crying.
No.
I mean, you know, I'm not in the mood for it.
And that I gave him the respect of, I will treat you just like anybody else.
I'm not like a Republican who's just going to say you're a recipient or the white person who's afraid of talking to you because they're going to be called a racist.
And I'm not also the social justice warrior who's going to coddle you and treat you like a child.
I mean, this guy came from the wars of Haiti, and he says, no, you treat me like a man.
And that's what a lot of minority cultures can't stand about white people, is that you're afraid to offend people.
No, they're full grown adults.
And what's more too, they've, nine times out of ten, people who come from minority cultures, they are not Um, came from coddling.
They didn't come from a bunch of people who sat down and said, oh, I completely understand where you're coming from.
Oh, let's work this out.
No, they come from people who aren't afraid to stand up and say, screw you.
And that's what they respect.
Because when you try and give them weasel words, they think you're trying to manipulate them.
They think that you're that guy who's trying to hustle them.
Well, you know, it's funny because, um, I, I speak pretty frankly about race on this show.
And according to, I don't know, a significant proportion of people, that makes me a racist.
And therefore, of course, other races and cultures and ethnicities should have nothing to do with me.
However, as you've probably noticed, we get a huge number of blacks and Hispanics and other ethnicities calling in.
Yeah, exactly.
Because here's a place where I can be honest and other people can be honest.
We had a show that just turned out that way.
It was all, quote, minorities in one of the recent shows.
I don't know if it's out or not now.
I talk frankly about single moms.
What do we get?
Tons of single moms calling in.
Because they can actually get and have an honest conversation, which is what everybody...
Really, who's got any honor and decency and courage wants is an honest conversation.
If Muslims call it, honest conversations about the pluses and minuses, the good and the bad, the right and the wrong, the genetic and the environmental, the moral and the challenge.
I mean, we have, like, honest conversations.
And I got to think as far as, like, I don't know, libertarian-minded shows and so on.
We get a lot of...
People who wouldn't normally be part of a libertarian conversation calling in, I think it's great because they know that I'm not – I'm going to treat them as people who are responsible, as I want them to treat me.
I'm going to tell them what I think without putting myself through some Ronald McDonald taking a – Baguette, sideways, crap on a toilet, kind of facial grimacing of political correctness, just honest conversations, and that I'm going to treat them with the respect of honesty and curiosity as well.
And, I mean, it's very much against what people would think would be the case, but if you're honest with people, they'll want to talk to you no matter what your race and ethnicity is, or gender, or marital status, or what.
Exactly, and it's just, like I say, it's just like, It's just, that's the thing of really what's more too white.
I just don't feel comfortable in vast swaths of white culture, whether it's, you know, more conservatives, because they're so afraid to talk about anything controversial, because they're just, they're beaten down by words.
And how do you respect somebody like that?
I mean, from a deep level, you talk about, you know, love of being able to show people respect.
It's really, really difficult.
And then it just, then when you come to the other extreme of it is, it's just...
It's basically a mindset of, I think you've said it before, the 40-year-old cat lady who's just completely detached from reality and views all these other people who are darker than them as children.
And that's the most unbelievably disrespectful thing you can do to a person.
I mean, it's really, it's disgusting to me.
Because like I say, my son is half and half.
And the idea that people are going to just look at him and be like, oh, You know, you're just a victim.
It's disgusting to me.
As a father, you never want people to take away moral agency from your children.
Because that's so bad for them.
It's so bad for them.
And this idea that we just take away moral agency from entire groups of people and, well, you know, these Hispanics had to attack Trump supporters because Trump supporters were doing X. It's like, my God, that's so horribly racist.
Well, they have no choice, you see.
They saw someone pointed a shirt with a picture of Donald Trump, so of course they had to.
And it's like, are you kidding me?
That's just unbelievably racist.
And then, like, I talk to people all the time, too, is that now wait for things to get really, really bad.
I mean, really bad.
I'm talking about as in civil strife.
Now, the left, which personally, I think politically, the left is about done, personally, because when they run out of money, that's a separate conversation.
But they have that mindset that these minority groups, they are like children, are like animals.
I think it's you that said, you know, wave the red flag and the bull's going to charge.
And right now, it's really, really big on maternally.
They view them like cats or dogs.
Which is, again, why I find it so disgusting.
But let things get bad.
Let things start to riot.
Let a lot of bad, really, really bad things happen.
Well, now all of a sudden, they're still going to have that racism.
They're still going to view them as an animal, but now it's going to be like a chimpanzee or a bear that's attacking.
Well, you guys were great for when we needed your votes, but now that voting doesn't matter anymore, and we're trying to establish leftist totalitarianism, Well, your role's been played.
And I think, what's more too, you're starting to see in the black community, a lot of people are starting to really get wise to smell that these white liberals don't give a shit about us because now they're all jumping ship to the Latino populations and just whatever they need to say in the moment.
And you're starting to see a big divide, at least where I am.
It's starting to get pretty ugly, actually, because you're starting to see a lot of groups of them just saying, no.
It's less ugly than the alternative, right?
Oh, yeah, absolutely.
Personally, I just wish that a large enough population of the United States or even Europe would just stop paying taxes.
I really wish that would happen, because then I think all this could be averted.
Because if you get 1% of the U.S. population to stop paying taxes, that's 3 million people, or twice the number of people who are actively incarcerated or in the justice system.
And if all of them said, let's just say Hillary's elected, and Trump and Bernie are both, just blatantly, Banana Republic-style forced out.
Well, then you can say to both of them, this is a good enough reason to not pay taxes.
So among libertarians, the right and the left, you can just get 3 million people to say, nope, not doing this.
Well then, at that point, there's no way that they could enforce that.
You can't prosecute three million people who all demand their day in court.
Justice system grinds to a screeching halt, and then once you see a whole bunch of other people who are working, the workers, the makers, and the takers, the makers are saying, well, shit!
I cannot pay taxes, and they can't do nothing to me.
I'm going to go down to my income tax, my job, and I'm going to put down 99 for dependents.
I'm going to try and pay as absolute little as I possibly can in income tax.
And then when the government tells me at the end of the year I owe them, I'm going to say, no, I'm not paying you.
Come get me.
Well, once enough people see that, then what's more too, you can also, where they can't do anything, then at that point, you'll probably start seeing stores saying, well, we're not going to charge income, sales tax.
That's going to be our way that we can get more business and you won't do nothing to us.
It's just that that's what I would love to see happen because quite personally, I mean, you've been doing the reason and evidence and the argument for 10 years, and it's only gotten worse.
I've come to the conclusion I'm also a window washer.
That's my business.
And I wash a lot of restaurants, and I'm among good people, but of the lower IQ spectra.
And if you can sit there and talk to them about reason, evidence, facts, yada, yada, yada, they don't give a shit.
I mean, very few will, but ultimately they don't care what's in it best for me.
But what they really respond to is giving them somebody to hate.
So if you go into any of those communities and say, well, look at what the government's done to you.
Look at your education system.
Look at the, as Diamond and Silk said, the vote plantation you live in.
They don't give a shit about you.
They're your enemy.
You know, not white people, not Hispanics, not black people, not business owners.
No.
It's the damn bureaucrats.
Those are the ones that own them.
Well, and there's something, Hillary Clinton put out this delete your account thing to one of her stuff.
I mean, it's so lame.
Anyway, but So this is from Breitbart.com.
Twitter users blasted Hillary Clinton Thursday, calling her a liar who stole billions in donations meant to rebuild Haiti because she doesn't give an F about black people after her social media minions posted a tweet attacking her.
And it's like, so this kind of stuff coming out where, you know, if...
And there's a lot, of course, of Latinos and even Muslims and even blacks who are very keen on Donald Trump.
And that is...
You know, if the Democrats start to lose that narrative, it's going to be it for them for quite a while.
So, listen, man, I appreciate the chat.
I got one more caller to get to tonight.
So, let me do my thing on the fall of Rome, which I've always had a special fascination for.
It should be out pretty soon.
And then you'll call back in.
We'll talk more about it.
Sounds great to me.
You have a great evening.
You too.
Thanks, man.
Alright, up next is Joe.
Joe wrote in and said, Why is it that most atheists seem to have a hostile attitude towards theists?
It seems as though almost every renowned atheist's sole purpose is to destroy religion, Christianity in particular.
What is the source of most atheists' belligerent attitudes towards religion?
That is from Joe.
Hey Joe, how you doing?
Hey Mr.
Molyneux, how you doing?
I'm well, thank you.
That's good.
I used to be young and say, Mr.
Molyneux is my father, but no, can't do that anymore.
Have you experienced this yourself personally?
Yes and no a little bit.
I'm quite vocal about my beliefs on the internet, sorta.
And what are your beliefs?
I'm a Christian.
Well, I saw her faith, and I'm a believer.
Okay, got it.
And, you know, I noticed that a lot of atheists try to downplay Christians' arguments simply because they believe in a god.
And I experienced this, like, a little bit...
You know, like, I say something and, you know, they just sort of try to downplay my arguments, I guess.
I don't know.
Right?
Sorry, are you still on?
Yeah, I'm still on.
Yeah, I'm still waiting for you to finish.
If you finish your thought, I mean, you can end with a question or let me know you're done.
Yeah, well, basically...
Whether or not you believe in God should not really be an important topic of discussion, considering the crazy times we live in and all that.
Also, I wanted to ask, why are there religion-bashing atheists, but not atheism-bashing theists?
Oh, no, come on.
There are some atheists and bashing theists.
I think that's fair to say.
But I would agree that in my experience, and having been on the atheist side of things and launching some salvos as well, it seems to go a little bit more from the atheist to the—well, not to the theist, but to the Christian side.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
For the most part.
Yeah, definitely.
Right, which has got to be kind of annoying.
You know, Christianity is— Not, these days, one of the more aggressive religions and the fact that Christians get a lot of attacks from atheists whereas other religions don't can be frustrating.
It's like, oh, so we're nice, so we get picked on.
Okay, that doesn't seem to have a lot of intellectual integrity behind it, but I can't, obviously I can't speak to most atheists.
But, you know, as you know, I've significantly shifted my views with regards to Christianity in particular.
I was willing to duke it out harsh with Christians when it was me and Christians.
Now there are other factors in the midst that I think take a bit of precedence with regards to that.
You know, like, if space aliens come, I think humanity will pull together for a while and deal with that.
Oh, yeah, definitely.
The atheists have a hostile attitude towards Christianity.
Well, it's partly because Christianity is nice and atheists don't fear repercussions.
There is, I mean, atheism, and this is not, I don't mean this to be particularly directed at you, but to a lot of studies that I've seen, the higher the IQ, the more likely, although there's lots of brilliant theists, but the higher the IQ, the more likely someone is to be an atheist and the more scientific training and so on.
So there is some of that, you know, smart kid phenomenon that goes on.
And of course, a lot of people who are atheists were raised in a religious context and weren't given scope for criticizing the environment that they were in.
Like a lot of the atheists may have been skeptical of the Sunday schools that they were in, may have been socially ostracized or punished or rejected or scorned or Whatever.
Maybe it was more mild than that, but they would have experienced social disapproval for thinking thoughts that they didn't feel probably they could express in the way that they wanted to or in a way that would be acceptable.
You know, I remember in Sunday school, you know, raising questions and all of that.
And there was no room for that kind of curiosity, whereas, of course, among certain...
In certain theological environments, that is not the case.
I mean, I'm sure you've, I don't know if you've seen, there's a movie called Jesus Camp, which is pretty rough on kids' intellectual curiosity, and there's the examples of chanting the responses to arguments from An evolutionary perspective, a Darwinian perspective, and so on.
And that's, you know, that's not good.
That's not the way that anybody should be taught anything.
Like, you don't want people to chant responses to, well, except not an argument.
That's a great chant.
You should use it more often, because it's so often appropriate.
But, so, you know, maybe the Christians in particular, because Christian countries tend to, like Western countries with Christian elements tend to be the countries where criticism of Christianity is the safest.
I mean, and so most likely the atheists in the West grew up in a Christian environment and were frustrated by a lack of scope for their intellectual curiosity.
And, you know, if you're a curious and intellectual Christian, then that's different from some of the other people, which is also fair to say that there are significant portions of not intellectually curious and not rigorous people.
Atheists, right?
Because, you know, I mean, I've talked to atheists quite a bit, and trying to get them to understand that the state doesn't exist any more than God does, well, you're then criticizing their religion, which is statheism, right?
The combination of atheism and being a statist.
And so atheists, again, this is a generalization, and I've got Podcasts I did recently on this, but atheists are critical towards religion.
And then when you take the exact same methodology and criticize the atheist view of the state, then they tend to get more heated.
And this is true, like I've said this before with my sort of domino.
I mean, everybody loves it.
When I push one domino at the beginning, it goes out into this big spread, like this octopus being dragged along the ground.
Think of the octopus legs as like dominoes.
And I push one domino at the beginning, and everyone's like, oh man, I really, that domino number one, that leg number one domino, I love it when those go down.
Domino number two is fantastic.
Wait, domino number three?
Wait, that's something I really care about.
That's part of my identity.
I hate this now.
This is horrible.
Let's stop doing this.
And I've seen this before with atheists with regards to the state.
And I've seen this also with people who are very much into the non-aggression principle, and then I start talking about spanking.
And so when I was pushing non-aggression principle down and the state was, you know, in its, oh, great, you know, I'm with you, man.
But then it's like, boom.
Okay.
Or, you know, they like the fact that I'm very much into reason and clarity and evidence, but then when I criticize excessive drug use as disorienting and bewildering and bad for the brain, they're like, oh no, I like the reason and evidence thing when you were talking about God and the state, but now they're talking about...
Right?
It is a problem.
And people say, well, I want to get...
I've got destructive or abusive governments out of my life and bureaucrats and so on.
I say, well, you can't really control that.
But if you have destructive or abusive people in your life, well, you have a little bit more of a choice about that.
Oh, no, that's, you know, that's too actionable.
That's too personally costly or whatever, right?
And so it's not just atheists.
I mean, there are most people have this...
You know, this is the stuff that I'm happy to criticize, and this is the stuff that is sacred to me.
And sacred, you know, sounds like an elevating term.
Sacred to me is just something that is in a cowardly way excluded from reason and evidence, and you just call it sacred because calling it cowardice is not as elevated.
Libertarians, libertarians, government programs are terrible.
Government programs are terrible.
You know immigration is a big giant government program.
No, immigration is great.
It's like, okay, so the welfare state is bad.
Which is a big, giant government program, which is no relationship to charity, but it's the exact opposite of charity.
That's really, really bad because it's coercive.
Okay, well, the immigration policies are a big, giant government program that have as much to do with the free movement of people as the welfare state does with charity.
Oh, no!
And that's just because they're afraid of being called racist or whatever it is.
Who knows, right?
But...
So, I mean, I obviously aim towards that kind of consistency and just bend myself to reason and evidence.
That's the gig.
That's the job.
You know, singers got to sing on note and I got to follow reason and evidence.
That's the gig.
And I have a lot of people who are, you know, watching and listening to what I do who let me know if I drift to science.
So, I've got a lot of course correction stuff going on and that's...
I don't have to change.
Like, if I change...
Given that I've always said reason and evidence rather than conclusions, it's the methodology that matters, not the conclusions.
If I change direction...
Based on reason and evidence, I mean, people can say, oh, he's a flip-flopper, and it's like, well, that's nonsense, because I've always said reason and evidence is what it is, so if I get new information, right, if someone does a study which brings some really important new information, To light, well, then I have to absorb that because that's evidence.
And if someone comes up with a really good argument, then I have to follow that because that's a really, right?
So because the gig has always been for me, you know, I'm going to follow reason and evidence, then changing my perspectives on things based upon new information or new circumstances, it's perfectly fine.
You know, the box's goal is to win the match, not to punch this way.
And then it's like you just adapt to what's going on and win the match.
That's my guess, is that if you want to see atheists, a lot of atheists, having a stronger reaction towards an idea even than theism, just talk to them about anarchy and you'll see an even stronger reaction because that's, in many cases, their religion.
Right, right.
And obviously I know you're an atheist, Stefan, but you're a very knowledgeable guy.
Why don't you attack religion in the way that most renowned atheists do?
Oh, I have in the past.
I have been quite critical of religion.
And, you know, you mean sort of why am I... I've generally had pretty positive conversations with people about religion, but I have been very critical of it.
Well, that's a big, big question, and I should probably do a proper essay on it.
But now that I've had this sort of bell curve stuff, and again, I'm not talking ethnicity just as a whole, the bell curve stuff has sort of been netted into my basic cortex.
It's been netted into my spine.
And I wonder the degree to which religion is not a very effective way of transmitting values to people who have neither time nor inclination nor perhaps capacity for philosophy.
And I think that I see a very strong common cause with Christians in particular.
And I have seen so many wonderful things come out of Christianity, and particularly recently, a lot of courage, a lot of strength.
And a lot of support.
So, you know, I have a hard time slapping an olive branch out of people's hands.
That's a pretty churlish thing to do.
So, there is a lot of difference.
And, you know, when I was younger, in Green and My Salad days, when I was younger in this show, and even younger than before the show, about, I don't know, 10 years ago.
So, I started, give or take, and...
When I was younger, I had much more faith.
It turned out to be faith.
I had much more belief in reason and evidence changing people's minds.
You know, a big pivotal presentation that we did was called The Death of Reason, which you can find, of course, at youtube.com slash freedomainradio, which just points out all the ways in which when you give people counter evidence, very often their initial prejudice tends to become stronger.
And...
Recognizing the limits of reason and evidence means that I simply cannot rely on other people being like me and responding to reason and evidence with integrity.
I may regret it, I may be frustrated by it, but you know, if the sun is hot, you put on sunscreen.
There's no point getting angry at radiation, right?
You have to just recognize what the situation and adapt to it.
And I have A greater common cause, in many ways, with Christians than I do with atheists, because atheists tend towards the left, as I've pointed out repeatedly in my criticisms of atheism, and the left is willing to initiate force against me, whereas the Christians will let me follow my own conscience.
They will attempt to convert me with the word rather than the sword.
And the atheists, I mean, there was an atheist conference that went on, a big atheist conference that went on recently, and It was all leftist topics.
It was like atheism and politics, and it was all just really, really lefty stuff that went on.
I don't know the degree to which, because, you know, there is a strong tradition in leftists and particularly communists thought that religion stands between the communists and his ideal society, which is why it must be attacked and undermined and destroyed.
Not because there's a giant commitment to rationality, Any more than if one mafia family attempts to wipe out another mafia family, it's because they want to bring peace and harmony to the city.
I mean, it's just a competition of gangs.
And to some degree, the atheist attack on Christianity is because Christianity stands between the atheist and the state.
Because when Christianity works, In some ways, there's less need for a state because there's the internalization of ethics rather than the fear of punishment from a secular standpoint.
So I have a lot more.
And I share, you know, I mean, some of the frustrations that philosophers have with atheists is that it's kind of a one-note band.
It's like, do you guys jam at all?
Do you just play your three greatest hits?
Is there a lot of moving forward?
Atheism is...
What did Milo Yiannopoli say?
Atheism is so boring.
I mean, it's...
That's true.
I mean, okay, so there's no God.
Okay, let's say there's no God.
Okay, then what?
And that, I think, is interesting.
And the fact that, you know, I mean...
People who were atheists have made some pretty spectacularly bad moral decisions.
Communism is a pretty obvious one, but Fabian socialism would be another one, and a lot of socialism would be.
And much so I like certain things that Christopher Hitchens did, the fact that he was obviously in his youth and not even so much of a youth a Marxist, and then was very keen on the war against Saddam Hussein in Iraq and so on, and I guess died Before he saw the genuine and terrifying fallout of that, which may in fact eventually be fallout from that.
And that there does not appear to be an ongoing process of intellectual curiosity and self-examination in the Socratic sense.
Like when are atheists saying, okay, what is the stuff that we believe that might be subject to the same rigor we apply to Christians or other belief systems?
I mean, when I heard arguments against God, I was very excited.
When I heard arguments against the state, I was very excited.
When I, you know, talk to or read people like Gabor Maté, Dr.
Gabor Maté, who's been on the show a couple of times, talk about addiction and how it works.
When I hear The Origins of War in Child Abuse from Lloyd DeMoss, I was fascinated by it.
When I Find out about race and IQ. I'm curious.
I'm fascinated by it when I start thinking more about feminism and the role of women in the cycle of violence and spanking and childhood development.
Like, I mean, my curiosity just goes six different ways from Sunday.
And that is why I like to do what I do.
And that's why it will never be done because there's more things to think about.
And every day there's new reason and evidence, new evidence for sure.
And from that you can construct better arguments.
And I don't know that that same ongoing treadmill of intellectual progress is going on in some of the major atheist communities.
I think they think they've got it all sorted out, which is basically less God, more state, equals paradise.
And I don't know...
Well, actually, I do know that that is not the answer.
And they seem to have stopped some of the forward progress because they think, well, we've got these leftist views and more state and less God and boom, you know, paradise.
And that gets kind of boring.
And when people can continue to have the same perspectives and not get bored, I have a lot of trouble respecting that intellectual approach.
It's not an intellectual approach.
It's a dogmatic approach.
A dogmatist will get the idea set and then defend it, no matter what.
And to relinquish it is to relinquish identity, right?
You never want to fuse your identity in with conclusions because that is a terrible, terrible way to insult reason and evidence, which is a process, it's a methodology, not an end point, a journey, right?
Not a destination.
And so when people aren't bored of atheism after a while and say, okay, well, it's only so many times I can say there's no God, now what?
How can I take these same processes and apply it to new areas?
You know, can we apply it to gender questions?
Can we apply it to parenting?
Can we apply it to the state?
Can we apply it to whatever, right?
But when there's just like, yep, still no God, and socialism, or whatever, leftism.
Not a lot of moving forward.
Yeah, it's a fixed and eventually, to me, arid belief system.
And it's dogmatic, and it is...
Well, again, you know, Milo's got it right.
It's boring.
You know, it's boring.
It's boring.
And now what, right?
And, you know, whatever you think about Milo, the word that comes to mind is never boring.
So does that help?
Oh, yeah.
It's two rival gangs in a lot of ways, and I like the Christians a lot more these days.
Yeah, yeah, no, that definitely helps.
And wouldn't you agree that, you know, the topic of, like, you know, God really, like, isn't that important?
Because we're living in, like, such a crazy time right now.
Oh, yeah.
Yeah.
Oh, yeah.
Oh, yeah.
No, I mean, you don't, you know, if you're a painter, to hell with delicately mixing paints when your house is on fire.
You know, you should have some higher priorities than that.
Yeah, definitely.
You know, if you're fighting with your wife and then there's a bear in the room, I don't think the bear's going to wait.
I think you might want to put down your disagreements and deal with the bear.
And that is, you know, that used to be called, well, it still is called scholasticism, which was these arguments, you know, how many angels can dance on the head of the pin?
Or the big one in the Middle Ages was, did Adam have a belly button?
Because Adam's made in the image of God.
God doesn't have a belly button because he's not born of woman.
But if Adam's made in the image of God, then Adam can't have a belly button, but we have belly buttons, so then we're not in the image of Adam, and therefore we can't be in the image of God.
I mean, people would really, really think about that stuff.
And then the Black Death came along and people stopped thinking about that stuff and started trying to figure out how to not be dead.
And again, I love that stuff.
I mean, abstract intellectual questions are great deals of fun.
And so is learning how to break down.
It's just not when the tsunami is gathering on the horizon.
That's all.
Right.
Do you feel that maybe a lot of atheists try to downplay people's arguments because they believe in God?
If they speak out against, I don't know, the legalization of homosexual marriage in all 50 states, And the people on the left say, you know, you're against that just because you're a Christian.
Would you say that happens a lot?
I think it does.
And of course, if the people on the left are concerned with proper treatments of homosexuality, there are other religions they could be looking at other than Christianity.
But they don't tend to because maybe they're nervous about it.
But no, I mean...
What Christians need to do, in my humble opinion, and the great good that they could do for the world, is to start questioning atheists about the existence of the state.
You know, to hell with playing defense.
It's so boring, right?
I mean, to hell with playing defense.
Just say, yeah, you know, this atheist Christian thing has been going on for thousands of years.
Tell me, atheist, does the state exist?
Yeah, so what do you mean by that?
You know, the existence of the state.
Do you mean government?
Yeah, does the government exist?
I've done this a bunch of times before, so people can just do a search for it, but just ask, you know, You believe in a...
Oh, it's terrible for me to believe in a central authority that only exists within my own mind and doesn't exist within reality in any empirical, tangible way.
How about the state?
Isn't that your God?
Isn't that what you believe in?
That is an authority that you think exists in the real world but is only a set of beliefs?
That has no tangible material existence in the world?
Say, oh, here's a picture of the Capitol.
That's not a picture of government.
That's a building.
You can convert it to a flea market and, well...
I guess the price of the congressman would just go down a little bit.
But yeah, this is my, you know, what I say.
Oh, look, there's a cop.
No, that's a guy in a blue costume.
You don't need a cop because you call him that, right?
How is that?
Nothing exists.
It's just, right?
Atoms and space and energy.
It's all subjective.
Well, and if you're going to say to me that the government exists because government buildings exist, then you have to tell me that God exists because churches exist.
If you're going to say, well, people believe in the government, that's why it exists, and you say, well, then faith in God creates God.
God exists because people believe in Him.
Right.
And so, with Christians, they do a hell of a lot of good, and by God, you know, punch these arrogant socialist atheists in the nets.
They sure could use it.
You know, it gives them something to work for.
You know, nothing breeds arrogance like laziness.
Right.
Because, you know, when you're lazy, you have to justify, and you say, well, I'm just so superior.
And if you're well-practiced in taking down theistic arguments, and the theist turns around and says, okay, is the existence of God more important right now, or is the existence of the state more important right now?
Because I think, pretty safe to say, the state has a little bit more dominion over us than God, right?
Because, you know, the state's taking half your money and selling your kids off into generational debt slavery to foreign banks.
So let's talk a little bit about the state.
And you know what?
That's great for atheists because it gets them to start thinking again and stop repeating all the stuff they read in atheism, the case against God many years ago.
And so, yeah, just turn it around and say, yeah, God is boring.
Let's talk about government.
And let's see what's going on with that.
Because, you know, if atheists are really fantastic at figuring out what exists and what doesn't exist, what is real and what is not real, what exists only in the mind and what exists in reality, they should have no trouble with the state and its existence.
And they certainly can't say it's less important than God because the state has far more dominion over people than God does, certainly in the modern world.
I mean, it's not like churches can force you to pay for 12 years of Sunday school, but the state will force you to pay for 12 years of government schools.
It's not like churches can declare war, but states can declare war.
It's not like churches can increase your taxes, but the governments can increase your taxes.
It's not like the church can engender national debts that go intergenerationally, but the state can.
It's not like the church can throw you in jail, but the state can.
So let's talk about the existence of the omnipotent deity that actually rules our lives these days called the state, and let's get away from this other stuff which is frankly boring and inconsequential in how we live our lives these days and what has effect and power over us.
Right.
Right.
You know in Saudi Arabia they have those religious police authorities that'll throw you in jail for being homosexual.
Right.
Absolutely, but that's the power of the state backs them up.
And, you know, we're not there, so, you know, there's more to talk about here.
Right, definitely.
And so, yeah, that would be my suggestion is, you know, stop pushing back.
And, you know, the concept of the state is far more dangerous than the concept of religion these days.
And let's make the atheists start working for their claims and start to understand that statheism is the most dangerous religion these days.
Right.
Right.
I also want to ask you, so what do you think the Catholic Church could do better in particular?
I'll have to defer on that one because that's a big, big topic right now and I've been running the show for years.
Three and a half, three hours and 40 minutes, so I don't know if I've got enough juice in the gas tank.
Do you think you could give me a little synopsis?
Just a tiny one, nothing to tire you off.
Yeah, I would say, you know, maybe they could start caring about Christians a little bit more than migrants.
Right.
You know, they could care about some of the Coptic Christians and some of the Catholics and some of the other Christians that are currently being ground under.
In the Middle East and other countries.
And they could offer them some sanctuary and help.
And that would be something that would be, I think, of significant value.
But I think that the social justice warriors have finally taken down the Vatican.
And until that gets sorted out, that's going to be a big problem.
That is going to be a big, big problem.
And that would be the major thing.
That I would talk about.
I mean, you know, having a socialist, what strikes me as a socialist-y pope, is pretty bad.
And that is pretty bad for a lot of people in Latin America, a lot of people in Venezuela, a lot of people in Brazil, and other places where these socialist principles are being put into place, and people are now dragging chickens from trucks that they push over on the side of the road because they're so hungry.
You know, maybe that would be a little bit more helpful.
And You know, his relationship with the migrants is challenging for me, to put it mildly.
But this doctrine of infallibility is a big problem, because if the Pope does it, it's more likely that people are going to think it's just right.
But of course, you know, the Catholic Church has put a lot of focus on third world outreach and third world developments.
So the fact that they're going lefty, going socialist, and so on is not shockingly surprising to me.
And the fact that the Catholics have basically been replaced by our selected cucks in big hats seems to me is why they don't have any particular in-group preference anymore and are courting significant conflict by embracing those who...
Very much doubt we'll embrace them back.
So those are just some of my thoughts, but it's not like I'm going to have much effect on people doctrine.
Do you think the Catholic Church is going down under?
You don't mean to Australia, right?
Yeah, yeah.
Sort of just being decimated, I guess, by this world that we're living in.
I know that that kind of future prediction I try not to make because you never know who's listening to me or who's listening to other people and might change their minds based upon better evidence.
I've done a lot of shows On Brexit.
And now Brexit appears to be 55% leave and 45% stay.
And, you know, I've had a little bit to do with that.
And Paul Joseph Watson and, of course, Nigel Farage and a bunch of other people have had something to do with that.
And so, you know, it's like saying, well, is England going to stay or is England going to leave?
It's like, well, I'm not going to say either way because that would be To have less of a say on how it goes.
So I'm not, you know, I don't like to make predictions because rather than making predictions, I like to have influence.
And so, you know, no, you don't know what is, who's going to listen to what and who's going to be enlightened by what and who's going to be awakened by what and who's going to be inspired by what to change.
And so I'm just going to continue to put out influence because I don't know what the future holds, but as sure as hell no, I want to shape it as much as possible according to philosophy.
All right, I got to close up shop.
Thank you so much to all the callers, Joe.
You were a great person to chat with.
I'm sorry for the long, long parts.
Can I just say a couple things?
Yeah, so Michael does a great job with organizing the show and all the emails he has to sift through and all that.
I really just want to congratulate him for all the work he does for the show.
I agree.
Thank you, Joe.
Also, I mentioned I was vocal about my opinions.
I run a YouTube channel where I commentate on a lot of the issues you discuss, and I think your FDR listeners would really like my content.
The link to my YouTube channel is youtube.com slash joe.x.
Again, that's youtube.com slash joe.x.
Thank you so much, Stefan, Michael, for having me on.
It's awesome.
All I thought of was Joe Dos Equis and now I'm thirsty.
But anyway, alright.
Thanks everyone so much.
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