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March 19, 2016 - Freedomain Radio - Stefan Molyneux

02:58:54

3233 P3NIS W3AR AND T3AR - Call In Show - March 18th, 2016

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	Hey everybody, it's DeFan Molyne from Freedom Aid Radio.
	Hey, you ever want to do deep cuts on sting songs and figure out what the heck is that Brit squealing about?
	Well, I had a caller who said, oh, that's the question.
	Do you think economic freedom is a precursor to political and social liberty?
	And we talked a lot about an example that he brought up, which was the Chicago gang of free market economists who worked under the military dictator...
	Pinochet in Chile to try and uncommunistify the 1,000% inflation disaster bequeathed to them by the previous economic dictator named Allende.
	And a lot of this gets laid at the feet of Milton Friedman, a bad guy, apparently a big fan of military dictatorships and so on.
	So we unpack all of that and look at some pretty solid leftist tactics for slandering the free market and why you've heard so much about Chile and so little about, I don't know, all of the horrors of communism as a whole.
	Second caller, is it naive for me, he says, to think that I could have a strong, healthy, lasting relationship with a Christian woman?
	Well, in my continuing evolution of, I don't know, seeing some of the finer and better aspects of Christianity, we had a good chat about that.
	Number three question from a caller, how?
	Can I determine my sexual market value?
	Question.
	Are you sitting down?
	Look down.
	Did you poke yourself in the eye with your penis?
	That might be a hint, but we actually go slightly deeper than that.
	How can you figure out what is your sexual market value so you don't aim too low or aim too high?
	Good questions to have, and we also had a fairly robust discussion of the origins of yellow fever.
	Trust me.
	You'll find it interesting.
	So please remember freedomainradio.com slash donate to help out the show.
	Please sign up for a subscription.
	Don't let other people pay for what you find valuable.
	Do the right thing.
	You know what it is.
	FDRURL.com slash Amazon to use our affiliate link.
	And with that having been said, let's go south.
	All right.
	Well, up for us today, we have Michael who wants to know, do you think economic freedom is a precursor to political and social liberty?
	That's from Michael.
	Hey Michael, how you doing?
	Oh, I'm doing good.
	Thanks a lot, Steph.
	Your question was longer if I remember it originally.
	Well, yeah, I was referring to Milton Friedman's work that he had done in Chile during the 1970s where he went down and did a series of lectures and then Pinochet, of course, and the government at that time He began to implement his ideas of economic freedom,
	which some people would say that the Chilean miracle was or was not attributed to Friedman or not.
	Some people say yes.
	Some people say no.
	But he said it was.
	Friedman said it was.
	But the idea was that it eventually led to The democratic government in the 1990s in Chile and raising Chile economic standards and freedom to where it is now where it's bubbly bubbly.
	I think it's almost above the economic freedom index above America.
	I'm not sure.
	So I got to thinking about that.
	I thought, is that kind of one of the things that holds people back from You know, having less government in their lives, you know, being more independent, more, you know, in control of their own lives.
	So that's kind of the question I've got, you know, using Chile as an example of that, I guess.
	Okay, so let's just give people a quick run through the Chilean situation for those who aren't particularly aware of it.
	So, long-term history, we'll just blow it away and pretend it doesn't exist, just because we want to talk about 70s and onwards.
	So, in 1970, a full-on communist, pretty much, got into power in Chile.
	In Chile.
	This was Salvador Allende.
	Allende.
	And, like, he was supported by Castro, full-on communist.
	So naturally, of course, all of the leftists who control the media and who control academics and who control, I believe, my grocery cart when the legs wobble, like, they all immediately rushed in and said, this is Freedom!
	Or freedom for my people!
	The best thing that could ever happen!
	You know, this is a miracle!
	This is wonderful!
	And so on.
	And the communist, they call him a socialist, basically a communist, he put in massive protectionist barriers, he nationalized huge numbers, huge amounts of the Chilean economy, the usual nightmare of wage and price controls and everything that went on.
	And...
	How did it go, my friend?
	Well, basically their economic hit bottom.
	I mean, things like milk and bread were considered luxuries.
	They had an inflation rate I don't know.
	I think it's like 105%, something to that.
	No, no.
	It was 1,000% per year.
	You're thinking per month.
	It's 1,000% inflation.
	Of course, a big export, because Ayn Rand does her research, a big export from Chile is copper, and the copper miners, as they did under the socialists in England, the coal miners, They were on strike like half the time.
	The economy was literally falling apart.
	The country was breaking up.
	And people were literally desperate and hungry.
	And it was the usual communist centrally controlled nightmare.
	And so this did not go very well for the propaganda merchants on the left, right?
	No, right.
	And then that's when the Nixon CIA became involved.
	You know, and then we have Pinochet and that whole military coup that comes in.
	Yeah, so Augustus Pinochet, who was a military leader, and he imposed a, basically, I think it's not unfair to call it a military dictatorship.
	His human rights atrocities were enormous.
	Well, okay, listen.
	I mean, I don't want to sound indifferent to this, but all you ever see on the left in Sigourney Weaver movies is just how horrendous Pinochet was.
	And there's Sting squealing in his countertenor about all the missing people and so on.
	When you actually look at the death count compared to, say, Soviet Russia, which the leftists had no problem with whatsoever, compared to Soviet Russia, it was relatively benign.
	Compared to China and Mao, it was relatively benign.
	So without a doubt, it was a military dictatorship.
	Where does it rank on the scale of military dictatorships or communist or democide, like the murder of citizens by their own government?
	Throughout human history, it doesn't even show up in the top 50, I would say.
	So again, not to diminish the pain and suffering of the Chilean people under this dictatorship, but the left had a huge incentive to massively inflate how bad Augustus Pinochet was, not because he replaced a communist who during the coup either was murdered or killed himself. not because he replaced a communist who during the coup This was Allende.
	But they had a huge problem.
	Not so much because Augustus Pinochet took over.
	Like, they don't seem to have any...
	They don't seem to have any problem with military dictatorships coming in, as long as those military dictatorships are socialist or leftist or communist, right?
	They only have a problem.
	Like, you know how everyone compares Trump to Hitler?
	Well, no.
	See, if you really want to insult Trump, you've got to compare him to Mao or to Stalin.
	Have you ever heard anyone on the left who doesn't like Donald Trump comparing him to Chairman Mao or Stalin?
	No, no, no.
	That's really kind of funny.
	I mean...
	I forget what the quote is.
	It says, Hitler killed his thousands, but Stalin killed his tens of thousands to that effect.
	Oh yeah, no, you never ever want to compare, because that would remind people about how evil communism is.
	So you always have to compare bad people to Hitler, who even though he was in charge of the German National Socialist Workers' Party is somehow considered on the right.
	What a great and helpful scale that is.
	Hey, you know what's really on the left?
	Communist dictatorships.
	Hey, you know what's really on the right?
	Socialistic dictatorships.
	Excellent!
	I think this is going to be helpful.
	So the left had a huge PR problem in that they were really hoping that things were going to go well.
	Maybe they were, but they liked the fact that a true communist was in power in Chile.
	And then the Americans did help overthrow, they did help fund Pinochet, probably would have done it anyway, but they helped to fund Pinochet to overthrow Allende.
	And Pinochet, Then, like, the Chilean miracle is not what the free market did.
	It's the fact that a guy who's a military warlord was even remotely interested in free market principles.
	Right, right.
	Friedman said that.
	He says the real miracle was the fact that he was listening to Friedman at all.
	Yeah, Friedman points out the military is top-down and the free market is bottom-up, right?
	So I don't know the story of how this all came about, but I do know that Friedman, of course, taught At the University of Chicago.
	And there were a lot of hardcore free market adherents at the University of Chicago.
	They were called the Chicago Boys.
	And one of the guys whose PhD was directly supervised by Milton Friedman.
	Sorry, just a little shiver of multi-orgasmic free marketness.
	But he was very instrumental and they really worked hard to convince Pinochet to abandon the central planning of Allende, the communist, and to let the free market do that funky groove thing that it does so well.
	And he did.
	Miracle of miracles, there was a significant move towards the free market under Pinochet.
	Now, again, Pinochet had his human rights abuses and he was a military dictator and so on.
	Again, I think those have been vastly exaggerated by the left because they have ideological reasons for opposing what happened in Chile, right?
	Under the communists, Everything was supposed to be milk and roses and honey, right?
	And yet, things went to shit.
	Things went to the literal out-wood house, stuff the economy like some hapless extra in Fargo into the wood chipper, stuff the economy in, destroy it completely, and the workers were doing terribly, and the poor were doing terribly, and as you say, milk and bread were luxuries, you had to line up the usual central planning nightmare.
	And so if...
	The free market guys came in and Chile did well, then the left loses.
	Their propaganda war, and so the left had to cover up how bad things were under the communist, and then they had to say, oh my god, look how bad it was when the free market guys came in and took over.
	Yeah.
	So eventually they had this vote in Pinochet where he was eventually a yes-no vote where he was taken out in the 1990s.
	And what replaced him?
	Well, we came in and I'm a little fuzzy on what replaced him.
	But what came in is the fact that the economy started growing eventually.
	It had...
	There were downturns and whatnot, but eventually it came in where the economy started going again.
	We had more of a democratic society that came in.
	The argument was that if you let free market reforms occur within the country, you create a middle class who wants law and order, you create an intellectual class, you create people who profit, entrepreneurial class, who profit and are invested in the continuing freedoms.
	And once they have their economic freedoms, then they get restless and they want their civil liberties, they want freedom of speech, they want freedom of assembly, they want to overthrow the political dictatorship and so on.
	And the other thing too, you know, let's not forget that the communists did not take very kindly to the displacement of Allende by Pinochet.
	And so the communists, as they do in their weaselly, horrifying way, were insurgents who were fighting against the relatively more free, and certainly with the free market principles implemented by the Chicago boys, more economically free Pinochet.
	So it wasn't like, it was more of a war of insurgents than it was that Pinochet would just go around shooting people randomly.
	So again, this is not to justify it all, but just to place it in perspective.
	So once people had their economic freedom, then Pinochet gave way to a more liberal kind of democracy.
	And Chile is one of the most successful turnaround stories from communism to the free market that has ever occurred anywhere, anytime, anywhere in history.
	They have the world's second biggest exporter of salmon.
	They are, of course, massive exporters of fruit.
	Love Chile!
	Chile is why I don't have scurvy in February.
	I love that place.
	So the question comes, is that Milton Friedman, when he was ostracized, of course, you know, unrightly so, by many people saying, you went into this terrible place, you just...
	Did your economic freedom – how could – he basically came across the idea.
	He says, look, they're sick and I'm a doctor and I'm giving them the cure for their disease.
	So anything I can do to that – and he also said he believed that economic freedom was a precursor almost to social and political freedom.
	And that kind of got me thinking about a little bit about our own country.
	You know, I kind of left that out in my second question.
	Our own country where we have...
	Which is your own country.
	Yeah, our own.
	United States here, our own country.
	You know, where...
	Because I'm in Canada, but nonetheless, I'm happy to talk about America.
	I can read my demographics on YouTube.
	I'm happy to talk about America.
	Where we have an incredibly dependent class on social welfare that's very, I might want to say...
	Almost impotent is a good word.
	To the fact they're almost diseased.
	It's like they haven't got an understanding.
	Like a sick guy on a bed.
	Wait, wait, wait.
	Hang on, hang on, hang on.
	Sorry, I hate to interrupt you, but I just wanted to back up for a second.
	Because the left was in trouble in the 70s because, of course, Khrushchev had already talked about what a cult and evil personality was going on under Stalin in Russia, the horrifying famines and so on that Chairman Mao had executed.
	In China, people were aware of just how bad things were over there.
	And people like Milton Friedman were winning Nobel Prizes.
	So they were freaking out.
	Things were not looking good for the left in the 70s.
	Plus, of course, the Labour Party and the centrists had been in power for a long time in...
	In England, and England was an economic basket case, you know, half my childhood, there was no meat, there was no heat, because everybody was on strike, which of course drove the Thatcher phenomenon and the Reagan phenomenon after the stagflation that was the failure of Keynesian policies in the 70s under Carter.
	And so the left was kind of freaking out.
	So they had to find, as the left do, they had to find a scapegoat, and that scapegoat was Milton Friedman, and their example was Chile.
	However, the fact of the matter is that Milton Friedman was offered two honorary degrees by universities in Chile.
	He rejected them because he did not want people to feel that he was somehow beholden to Chile.
	The sum total of his interaction with Augustus Pinochet was one meeting that is variously reported as lasting between 30 and 45 minutes.
	Now, he's good.
	I don't know that he's 30 to 45 minutes completely convinced a military guy of the perfect values of the free market and have them.
	He's not that good.
	I mean, nobody's that good.
	I'm working on it, but not yet.
	And so he never took a penny.
	From the Chilean government.
	He was never an advisor to the Chilean government.
	He had one very short meeting with Pinochet, which would have, you know, I mean, if you can convince someone who's a military dictator all the way over to the free market in 30 minutes, you should be running this show and I will donate to you because that's just a remarkable feat.
	So they had to pin it on Milton Friedman because...
	Also, he's Jewish.
	He's white, right?
	So they couldn't pin it on the Chilean people because then they could be called racist.
	So they had to pin it on someone.
	And they pinned it.
	And Naomi Klein's got a whole book called The Shock Doctrine, which is all about this, which I've read.
	But they had to pin it on someone.
	And so they pinned it on Milton Friedman, who had almost nothing to do.
	With what happened in Chile.
	And the fact that Chile is called the Chilean miracle, that it did turn around in a way that Brazil, which is currently going through an unbelievable million-person march semi-revolution, if you look at Argentina, Argentina up until the 1920s, Had the same per capita income as America and then went on pretty much close to a century now of disastrous socialist experiments.
	The evidence keeps crashing into the sandcastles of the leftist delusions and they keep having to wish it away.
	And so they had to create the disastrous story of what happened in Chile.
	And the way that they did it was they focused on two things.
	The first thing they focused on is the pain of the transition.
	Because it was considered, look, we've just got to rip that band-aid off quickly.
	We have to...
	Everything has to change.
	Because what happens, as you know, is that when central planning gets in, what it does is it puts everything in the wrong place.
	All the capital, all the resources, all the labor, all of the intellectual capital, the fixed capital, you name it, human capital, it all gets misallocated because central planning is ridiculously inefficient.
	Now, the transition to the free market is painful.
	People lose a lot of money.
	Poor people do badly.
	There are interruptions in services because it's sort of like if you're addicted to cocaine for 10 years and then you go into rehab, you have a terrible time.
	And so all the cocaine dealers will show you sweating on the floor and throwing up and all kinds of Gary Oldman and the actor who played...
	Sid Vicious, not Gary Oldman as the...
	I don't think he's a drug addict.
	Anyway, he's a good actor, though.
	But they have to show the painful transition In the same way that people who want to sell you donuts are going to show you pictures of fat people having a bad time dieting.
	Oh, look how terrible that dieting just makes you sick and it makes you weak and it makes you throw up.
	And look at this clip from The Biggest Loser.
	Here, have a donut, right?
	And same way, like the drug dealers, they don't want to say, well, the problem you see was being addicted to this drug for 10 years.
	They want to say, well, look what happens.
	These people who claim to really care about you, these people in rehab, you know, they take you off this drug and it's really difficult and it's really unpleasant and it's really horrible.
	Even some people die.
	It's like they want to kill you.
	It's terrible, right?
	And so they focus on the transition pain.
	That happens when you are peeling off all of the misallocation of capital and resources from central planning.
	That's a painful transition.
	Of course it is.
	It's really hard to get off cocaine.
	That's why you don't take it because I assume it's a huge amount of fun, but you don't take cocaine because it's highly addictive and getting off it is really, really – and it's expensive and it's really unpleasant to get off it.
	So, of course, getting out of central planning and going to a free market is really brutal and people have a horrible time.
	That's why you should not have central planning because quitting it is really, really, really tough.
	But that's not what the leftists say.
	The leftists say, and you see this with Donald Trump too, like Donald Trump is divisive.
	He's like, nope, those divisions are already there.
	He's just naming them.
	Naming them is not magic.
	He's got his fingers on the band-aid.
	Yeah, I mean, it's, you know, when there's huge conflicts in society, but they're all buried and covered up, you know, like, I don't know, a bunch of Pakistani men raping thousands of British women in Rathashem, and the police cover it up, and then someone comes along and blows the lid wide, They say they did not create the rapes.
	In fact, the rapes were created and continued by the police covering it up.
	So it's all the people covering it up who are actually really extending and inflaming the conflict, not the people who point out that there is in fact a conflict.
	So when the free market people come in, there's a lot of changes and some people suffer a lot.
	Fortunes are made.
	Fortunes are lost.
	And people lose their houses and people lose their maids.
	And it's brutal.
	And that's why you shouldn't have central planning because the transition to the free market is painful.
	And the longer it goes on, and to the credit of Chile, even though it was not exactly a free market before, at least Allende was only in for a few years taking his wrecking ball to the foundations of the Chilean economy.
	So they will constantly talk about this.
	They'll focus on how difficult it is for some people when the free market comes along.
	Which is truly, it's like saying nobody should quit any addictive substance because quitting is tough.
	And, you know, boy, if that rapist doesn't get to go out and rape someone, he's really unhappy.
	Like, good!
	You know, it's better than him raping.
	So, that's the first thing they do, is simply focus on the negative aspects.
	The negative short-term aspects, they focus on everyone who's suffering from the transition.
	Oh, there was this...
	Look at this, because they cut a lot of regulations, right, in Chile.
	And...
	They go, oh, this guy used to have this wonderful position in Screw the Taxpayer Regulatory Agency 101, and now he's walking the streets.
	He's looking for—you know how, like, when the Nazis lost, everybody was like, this Nazi used to have a wonderful job at a concentration camp.
	He had benefits.
	He had—his children were happy.
	He could bring home toys— And now he's wandering the streets and he...
	Like, of course, never, right?
	Because they don't...
	It's all manipulation.
	So they focus on the short-term negatives of the transition to a free market economy.
	It's number one.
	Number two, which I can say a lot easier and quicker, is they focus on the brutal tactics of Augustus Pinochet, the military dictator, and they ascribe the tactics of the military dictator...
	Somehow, to Milton Friedman, or to the free market, or to capitalism.
	Like, as if that has anything to do with the other.
	So, yeah, focus on the short-term pain while you transition to a free market, and focus on the brutal military dictator Who is fighting against the counterinsurgency run by evil communists.
	And you say, well, somehow the free market is responsible for the human rights violations of the military dictator who is allowing some aspects of the free market to flourish in his society.
	And it's so illogical and so irrational, but, you know, you repeat a lie often enough and people find it credible.
	Yeah.
	So my question is, you know, I understand your opinion.
	Before people can...
	Begin to even experience any sort of liberty in their life, political freedom, political liberty.
	Do you think economic freedom has to come first?
	I mean that's my big question.
	I know we have to go through this detox as it were, as you explained, the band-aid ripping off, before the rest of it comes.
	Are we kind of setting ourselves up for the big detox?
	You know what I'm saying?
	Hang on, hang on.
	Sorry, go ahead.
	I had a long speech, so please go ahead.
	I look at the United States, look at the culture.
	I mean, I feel like I look at people and I'm kind of like, oh my god, it's like a bunch of dopeheads walking around saying, please feed me.
	Where's the next nipple?
	You know?
	And, you know, meanwhile, you got somebody like Trump and other people going, hey, look, you know, we're in a bubble.
	We got to cut this out.
	We can't just continue this onslaught of, you know, borrow more money, you know, print more money, make more money, raising, you know, all this economic bubble thing.
	And Friedman saying, look, hey, you know, before we got to have economic freedom, before we go to To actual having a more freer government, a more freer society.
	I understand.
	I get what you're saying.
	Where we're saying, okay, look, we're going to come off this drug addiction.
	I'm looking at this.
	I'm like, okay, this stuff's coming along.
	And there's this, in the back of my mind, going, okay, are we getting ready for the great big detox?
	Because you've got a lot of people screaming, no, not my job, not my job.
	Contested convention, not my job.
	Okay.
	So...
	I'm like, I'm thinking, okay, if Friedman got it right here, you know, where, gee golly, you know, we're going to have to go through this process, come what may, in order to get from point A to point B. Okay, what process are you talking about?
	You mean the Chilean-style process?
	Basically, we're going to have to basically get people used to the idea of being less dependent upon government subsidies.
	We're going to get less of a status idea, status-controlled economics.
	We have it now where, you know, in the United States, I mean, we're so dependent on government control.
	I mean, people aren't even aware of it.
	I mean, your government-controlled education, you know, the welfare system, it just goes on and on and on and on.
	People almost consider it, you know, Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid.
	I think it's like, what, 40, I think 41, 42 percent of The United States economy goes to either Social Security or Medicare, you know.
	Well, and seventy percent of the American population gets significantly more out of the government that they pay in taxes.
	So I'm thinking, you know, hey, this looks to me, you know, I look at this and I go, gosh, we've got an incredibly dependent enslaved society that is willing to elect into positions of power Those kinds of people that are wanting to keep the gravy train going.
	They're not wanting to stop it.
	And I'm like, is there something going to have to come along?
	We're saying, hey, we're breaking this off.
	We're going to have you guys making your own money, having a job creation.
	We're going to have a place where you are free from the government so that you will stop wanting to vote people in And who are wanting to control your lives.
	Because if you're dependent on your subsistence to a government, you're not going to want to vote it out.
	You're going to say, I need to have you still in positions of power.
	And that's kind of the question.
	I got to say, okay, so do we have to have a world, in my country, especially in the United States, we have to have a situation where economic freedom is I'm going to have to come first before people say, okay, I've had enough of these people, the government intruding in my life and every other asset and aspect of my life.
	So that's the kind of question I'm thinking about.
	Okay, okay.
	So let me see if I can respond because you keep piling up particular things that I want to respond to.
	So...
	First of all, for the left, let's say that some free market reforms required the strong hand of a military dictator to implement.
	Let's just say.
	But for the left to say they have a problem with the implementation of an economic system requiring violence is so laughable that it would be funny if the left wasn't literally drowning in human blood from the implementation of leftist schemes throughout history.
	I mean, if the left says, oh, you know, Pinochet was heavy-handed implementation of market reforms, it's like, yeah, you know what else might be considered that?
	Fucking communism.
	You know, how many times did communism come in nice and peaceful?
	How many times did it slaughter the Romanov family and kill 10 million kulaks and kill, you know, what is it, 90 million people or 70 million people got murdered in Russia alone?
	I mean, the idea that with the left getting all kinds of blush, dubois, hysterical, pearl-clutching fall on the couch, oh my, I need my smelling salts, I can't believe it, there's actually some aggression and violence in the implementation of political reform.
	Communism was like a brutal combine harvester that cut down human lives like wheat to get to its goals.
	And so the idea that there was a strong-armed man or dictator in Chile who may have shepherded along some free market reforms The fact that the left would complain about that without pointing to the millions of times more people who were killed than the leftist regimes just shows you how goddamn partisan false lying and manipulative the left is in general.
	So I just wanted to mention that.
	Secondly, in general, I think that it's very hard to implement free market reforms without aggression.
	And, you know, I don't say that lightly.
	I'm just, I'm telling you what I think.
	And this is outside the sort of ideal non-aggression principle situation, kind of in a state of nature with this stuff.
	But, you know, Donald Trump gets in, and I said this all about Ron Paul as well, but Donald Trump gets in.
	Let's say that he wants to close government departments.
	Let's say he wants to simplify the tax code.
	Let's say that he wants to cut regulations.
	Like, he wants, like, all the things that he says that he wants to do.
	Well, how do you think?
	The government workers are going, and the people dependent on government largesse, how are they going to respond?
	They're going to freak out.
	They're going to block traffic, right?
	I mean, you try cutting farmer subsidies in Canada, and they'll take all their trailers, and they'll drive at three miles an hour down the highway, destroying the economic movement of the nation.
	And what do you do?
	I think that's one of the, probably the, you know, on the sites, that's one of the things that I'm probably watching and getting the biggest kick out of.
	Is watching Donald Trump really upset the right and the left and the media all at the same time.
	I mean, I'll be honest with you, I haven't voted for the Republican Party since Reagan.
	Okay, that's how long it's been.
	And when Donald Trump showed up, I go like, okay, I'm watching this guy because he's very interesting, you know, watching what's going on.
	Not so much him as much as the reaction from the far left, from the far right.
	From the media, you're all screaming.
	Sorry, I've got to interrupt you because we're going off on some other tangent.
	Do you think that Donald Trump is going to, or any, if Ron Paul had got into power, do you think that they would be able to implement their free market reforms without ever having to call out the National Guard?
	I don't know.
	In my hope of hopes, I hope they wouldn't.
	But...
	In reality, I think you're probably true in the National Guard because people are totally wigging out.
	Because they're knee-deep within the blood, and I doubt very much they want to get out.
	And the people who are dependent on welfare, and I'm thinking specifically about the inner cities, some of the black populations, although it may happen among the white population as well, the Hispanic population, what is the black population in America going to do if there are reforms in these areas?
	Riot.
	If welfare is cut significantly.
	Riot, scream, yell, riot, throw a fit, burn cars, things like that.
	And what do you do if you are responsible for law and order?
	And you're responsible for keeping the peace.
	What do you do with rioters?
	You constrain them.
	You call the National Guard.
	You try to keep a hold on it.
	Or you be like Obama and identify with it.
	But, you know, I mean, yeah, you try to keep a hold of it.
	Right.
	You have to stop the riot.
	Right.
	Because as I argued recently, if you look at the city of Detroit, once the richest per capita income city in America, now one of the poorest and completely in the hole, in debt, the whole city has been destroyed!
	Because of the black riots in the 1960s.
	Now, how good has that been for the white, the black, the Asian, the Hispanic, any population, any goddamn bipeds?
	How are they doing in Detroit because nobody put down the riots?
	Oh, well, we don't want to fight.
	No, this is the result.
	You have destroyed an entire city and you have a massively dependent population who now have to go out with baseball bats to beat back the wild feral dogs currently roaming Detroit like it's some John Carter on Mars scenario.
	I mean, it's like Hyperborea out there.
	It's like Iranistan and the Cimmerians.
	It's like something out of Robert E. Howard before he killed himself because his mom died, the tough guy.
	But this is monstrous.
	So how are you going to deal with it?
	Well, the one thing that's true is that if you let people riot, it will escalate until you end up with a full-on post-Rodney King Thousands of injuries, tens of billions of dollars of damage destroy the economics of the city like what happened after the Rodney King acquittals in Los Angeles.
	Or you end up with Ferguson or you end up, you know, these places where this stuff happens and the taxpayers leave and the economy dies and it just goes from worse to worse.
	Or you put down the riot.
	That's sort of the argument that...
	Rudy Giuliani, the mayor said, it's like, no, you have to put down the riot because if you let it spread, it's like gangrene.
	It spreads until you die.
	You have to put down the riot.
	Now, Ronald Reagan was willing to do that.
	Rudy Giuliani was willing to do that with his tough-on-crime measures and so on.
	And so I am not, you know, I'm not a big fan of politics or political action as a whole, but I can, you know, you don't need to be a weatherman to know that it's raining outside, as the saying goes, right?
	Right, right.
	And so it's very, very clear that if you are going to cut government spending, if you're going to cut government benefits, if you're going to cut regulations, if you're going to cut what you're going to be paying in public sector pensions, what is going to happen is people are going to get really angry, really upset, and particularly the lower IQ population are going to riot.
	And you're either going to let the riot destroy entire cities, literally forever, It's not like you burn it and then, oh, it just goes back to normal.
	Did Detroit ever go back to normal?
	It never, ever, ever did.
	And so you either let the rot of rioting destroy the entire city forever, or With a firm hand, right?
	You do whatever is necessary to put down the riots.
	And the one thing that's true is that if you let rioters riot, then the criminal element will take over in the city and destroy it forever.
	But if you don't let rioters riot, they go home.
	That has been shown all the way back to Napoleon's whiff of grapeshot.
	That if you use decisive force to end a riot, everyone goes home.
	And the city survives and may in fact flourish.
	But if you let the rioters riot, it's fall of Rome time.
	So, you know, the degree to which you could have implemented these free market reforms in the absence of a strong man at the top, I don't know.
	I don't know.
	I mean, if you look at the founding of America, well, there was more than a whiff of grapeshot.
	There was an entire war, a revolutionary war that was fought against the British in order to allow Washington to impose a whiskey tax on Pennsylvania.
	But it's a topic for another time.
	Yeah, yeah.
	So, I don't know.
	Because, you know, I've spent 30 years or more talking to people and trying to reason them into living better lives and doing better things.
	And I've spent 10 years on the internet doing it.
	I've got accumulated a huge amount of experience in this.
	And because of feedback and emails and comments, I have more information than just about any philosopher in history as to the effect of throwing...
	The rock into the pond.
	What are the ripples?
	What's the blowback?
	What's the feedback?
	I'm in a unique position in the history of philosophy to know the effects of what it is that I'm doing.
	And I would say that it is not looking good for rational change.
	It is not looking good for rational change.
	I understand a human being that I tend to agree with you.
	I'm perhaps...
	I'm trying not to be as pessimistic, maybe more hopeful, maybe being older, on the older side of that thing.
	Those are meaningless terms.
	Listen, those are girly, meaningless terms.
	Pessimistic.
	Well, pessimistic, in other words.
	You must be empiricist.
	You must be realistic.
	I'm older, you know, so it's like, okay, out now economic collapse and writing in the streets doesn't bode well with me.
	I mean, you know.
	Oh, no, no, no.
	Listen, hang on, hang on.
	I didn't say anything about economic collapse.
	Okay.
	I didn't say anything about economic collapse.
	You know, the economic collapse happens if the rioters win.
	If you want to turn America into Detroit, let the rioters do their thing and drive out the taxpayers.
	And even if people can't leave the country, they'll just go galt.
	They'll just work a bare minimum.
	And, you know, like I was talking to a friend of mine today, got a windfall.
	The government took 60% of it.
	60% of it!
	He's like, oh yeah, really, really worth working hard for that now, wasn't it?
	And that doesn't even count, the 13 or 14% tax on everything you buy, the property tax, the taxes embedded into everything.
	It's insane!
	So what you're really saying, I'm sorry, I don't mean to interrupt, but what you're really saying basically is you're going to need a strong hand within the government to control the rioting or the rebellion, as it were, against the economic reform because people are being cut off.
	Well, people are going to, like, they've been trained since the 1960s that rioting works.
	Right.
	Because people don't want to see the strong hand that may be necessary to contain or push back rioting.
	Because, I don't know, is it women?
	Is it people just, ah, you know?
	Well, I mean, in my country, you can scream racist.
	And the political class, you know, cowers in the corner, you know, nursing, sucking their thumb.
	Right.
	So I don't know if we have a government system that can actually stand up to something like this.
	I mean, in my lifetime I've never really seen much of it.
	You know what I'm saying?
	The media screams, you're bad!
	And they run over there and, hi, yes, I am.
	I'm sorry.
	Let me genuflect right before you.
	You know.
	I don't know.
	You know, maybe not.
	You know, maybe the writers will win.
	I don't.
	I'm, you know, desperately not optimistic, but I'm desperately committed to reason and evidence winning the day.
	And that's, of course, what I do the show for, why I have these conversations.
	So I am very much for if we can have a rational conversation based on reason and evidence, then we don't need Then violence doesn't become inevitable, right?
	Violence is what happens when people have abandoned reason as the arbiter of their disputes.
	then it becomes win-lose.
	It becomes, you know, two carpets running into each other.
	One has to buckle under, and it's usually violent in its methodology or its implementation.
	And so, you know, like we did a whole presentation called The Death of Reason, where you can see all of the evidence as to why people don't listen to reason.
	But I will still, to my dying breath, I will continue to yawp the virtues of reason and evidence and facts to a world, whether it wants to listen or not.
	Because I know, I know, I know what the alternative is.
	And the alternative to reason and evidence is violence, because people have got to get shit done in the world.
	They They've got to make decisions in society and either people are going to listen to reason and evidence as the foundation and basis for making those decisions or they're going to reach for their gun.
	There's no other choice.
	There's no third way.
	It is violence or reason.
	That's it.
	So yes, I am committed to spreading reason as best as I can, but I am not, you know, now I know all of the IQ stuff, now I know all the cultural stuff, now I know all of the degree to which people mask Naked, greedy, exploitive economic self-interest in the guise of helping the poor or charity or whatever, right?
	People are committed and they want something for nothing, which is the foundational motivation of all evil is the desire for the unearned.
	And a free market will benefit a lot of people.
	It will even benefit the people currently sucking off the government teat in the long run.
	But it's going to be a very difficult transition because now, unlike Chile, which only had a couple of years of heavily socialist central planning, the U.S. has had 100 years of central banking, central planning, and an ever-escalating government control over the economy.
	So, yeah, taking that Band-Aid is going to take half your arm off with it.
	And it sucks, but that's why we should never have goddamn well done it in the first place.
	Yeah, I can see that.
	I can see that point.
	I mean...
	You know, I'm like you.
	I use logic and reason all the time.
	You know, I've got three kids.
	I sit there and have debates with them all the time about logic and reason.
	You know, they're adults now.
	But, I don't know, Stefan.
	To be honest with you, I look at it and I kind of like, I shake my head.
	And I'm going, oh my god.
	You know, because, you know, I watch these people out here and they just kind of, I don't know, just, I guess, just sit down and just hold on to it, I guess.
	And do the best you can in your own little world, you know?
	Well, I think, though, that we need to prepare people for the fact that the addiction to the unearned has gone on for so long that the withdrawal is going to be very painful.
	Because, you know, idiots are going to say, oh, look, some libertarian-ish or conservative guy, look, some conservative guy has gotten into power, and now, look, there's all this violence!
	And idiots are going to say, well, if we had never tried to change the system, if we'd never tried to give some money back to the makers and maybe lower some of the predation of the takers, well, everything would have been great.
	Everything was relatively good until this guy came along, and now, look, there's all this conflict.
	And just idiots are going to say that, which is why I think we need to be blunt and say, look, people have, for two generations or more, have been trained into...
	Rioting works, and it's going to take a certain amount of firmness to convince people that rioting isn't going to work.
	I can see that.
	I'm hopeful, maybe.
	I don't know.
	I'm trying the best I can.
	I'm going to move on to the next caller.
	I really appreciate your call.
	It was really enjoyable, and thanks for calling in.
	You bet.
	Alright.
	Well, up next we have Andrew.
	Andrew wrote in and said, As a 19-year-old heterosexual male who loves kids and eventually wants to get married and raise some of my own,
	I started thinking about what type of woman I want to pursue a relationship with, and I've met several girls here who I consider extremely virtuous, caring, intelligent, and overall delightful people.
	However, almost all of them are Christians.
	Is it naive of me to think that I could have strong, healthy, lasting relationship with a Christian woman?
	Am I in the completely wrong place to find a good future spouse?
	Normally, this is something I would ask many of the adult friends I have, but once again, most of them are Christians.
	I feel as if I'm at a difficult crossroads.
	That's from Andrew, who I'm assuming is an atheist.
	Yes, that's correct.
	Right.
	Right.
	Well, hey, Andrew, how are you doing?
	I'm doing great.
	How are you?
	I'm doing very well, thank you.
	So, Christian girls.
	That's right.
	Is there anything you wanted to add to this equation?
	The only thing I think I would add is that since I typed that question, I did meet for lunch with my uncle, who's about 40, and our mutual friend Lee, who is, I guess, same age, and they're both married to Christian women, and they're both atheists.
	And I guess they're pretty much the only atheist adult friends I have.
	I guess I know some atheists, but they're mostly closer to my age.
	And they both kind of said, you know, there are obviously obstacles, but we make it work.
	And they basically said that if I have a good relationship with someone, I shouldn't let that one factor happen.
	dissuade me from pursuing a relationship with someone, potentially.
	So, that's the only thing I would add.
	Well, I thought about marrying a Christian woman.
	I actually remember that was a...
	You talked about that in one of your videos.
	Yeah.
	And the thing that stopped you was the discussion about kids.
	Yeah.
	I mean, very briefly, this is a woman...
	We never actually really dated, but I liked her a lot.
	Very smart...
	Woman and an excellent writer.
	But anyway, and a good friend.
	And it's interesting because in her family, it was the same kind of setup, that her mother was religious and her father was an atheist.
	And, you know, when we talked about sort of our future together, she basically made the same offer, you know, which is, you know, my dad sleeps in.
	when we go to church, right?
	And so I, you know, I was certainly willing to consider it because she had a lot of wonderful qualities.
	And my, you know, my perspective, as you've heard, was I don't mind if you're religious because you have a lot of wonderful qualities.
	And I'm certainly not perfect.
	So that's fine.
	But when it comes to kids, the kids have to be able to choose when they become adults, whether they follow religion or non-religion.
	Yeah.
	And she was no.
	That was a deal-breaker for her, and therefore it was a deal-breaker for me.
	Because children...
	I didn't see how it could work with children being told things were true that I didn't live by.
	And they were true and virtuous that I didn't live by, such as worship of or praying or adherence to...
	God's dictates and so on.
	I just, I couldn't see, I couldn't see how that was going to work out.
	And like, oh, I don't want that happening.
	Yeah, you know, and it was, it was a shame, you know, and in a way, he respected her more for that.
	Mm-hmm.
	You know, in that she was willing to be the replicator for religious ideals.
	She didn't need me to be anything other than a provider and a good father, if that makes sense.
	Right, right.
	So, there was strength and weakness in her position.
	Sorry, go ahead.
	I was just going to say, there's something else that I've noticed about Christian women, for the most, at least Christian women that I'm around, is that if you marry a Christian woman, you're not just marrying...
	You've got a community that's going to help with a lot of things that are, you know, I consider really, really valuable, and they were valuable for me growing up, such as, you know, friends of you and your spouse who have kids about the same age,
	and they're going to provide support, and, you know, you have, especially with your church life, there's There's regular social interaction, you learn loyalty, and there's a lot of great things that come along with at least most of the Christian women that I'm around here at school.
	Oh yeah, like a friend of mine whose father got really ill.
	I mean, this is going to sound a bit harsh, but it's from the movie, I think it's called As Good As It Gets with Jack.
	Nickleson, where, spoiler, it's an old movie, but a gay guy played by Greg Kinnear, a gay guy gets beaten up and Jack Nickleson comes basically over and the guy's all alone and he's really beaten up badly and he's like, where are all your faggot friends now?
	In that, oh, this guy needs help now, and if you ever want to know whether you have real friends, all you have to do is be of negative utility to them for a while.
	Oh yeah, and I don't know any group of people who is more willing to help out in times of crisis than Christians.
	Oh yeah, my friend's father got ill, and the Christians were the ones who stepped up to help the family.
	He was an atheist for most of his life.
	But the Christians came by with food, they came by to help, they shuffled the driveway, they did all of the...
	sounds little, but they're huge when you're not well.
	Yeah, absolutely.
	And it's not like the opposite of Christianity is rationality.
	I mean, we've all seen the leftist, lunatic, social justice warriors, patriarchy-hating, cisgender scum-hunting lefties who are atheists and insane.
	So it's not like the opposite of Christianity is philosophy.
	The opposite of Christianity is, like, unhinged hatred for the narcissism of minor differences.
	Right, and a lot of people replace...
	No, no, no.
	People replace God with cowardice and conformity in general.
	Right?
	Because with God, you have a personal relationship.
	You speak.
	I mean, as you know, my argument is, which I talk about in Against the Gods, that God is actually the unconscious.
	And when you are asking questions of God, you are dropping...
	Bottles into your unconscious, which gets scribbled in and thrown back up.
	So I think that there is great value in prayer, insofar as prayer is a methodology of acquiring self-knowledge.
	It's not God who's answering.
	So your unconscious is answering and so on.
	So there's a lot of value in that.
	But the reality is that you are responsible for following God's plan and God's commandments and so on.
	And that can sometimes put you very much at odds with regards to conformity.
	Now, I know that there's a lot of conformity in religion and so on, but nonetheless, what I find with the people who have left religion behind is that they no longer have a belief system that requires any courage or sacrifice. what I find with the people who have left religion Exactly.
	That gives them any energy to push back.
	Like, you know, it's like somebody who says, I'm against racism.
	It's like, oh, my God.
	Like, talk about shutting the barn door after the horse has left.
	You know, after the civil rights movement, there are no racist laws left in America, at least not any that are pro-white.
	There are a lot of pro-minority racist law, affirmative action and so on.
	But being an anti-racist, like, I am against slavery.
	You are not a moral hero.
	That fight is...
	So I don't know the degree to which people on the left push back against their own particular rolling prejudices.
	A few do.
	Bill Maher talks about the dangerous and the intolerance of Islam and will take on those on the left about that.
	But that's kind of like an exception.
	Like people on the left should have been all over the Bernie Sanders supporters who shut down the Trump rally because that's a clear violation of the First Amendment.
	That's a clear violation of the private property that has rented out these halls.
	You know, you are not allowed.
	I mean, your phone goes off in a movie theater.
	You can get kicked out.
	And people don't say, the movie theaters are prejudicial scum who hate people who have cell phones who forget to turn them off.
	You get thrown out of a movie theater for a cell phone going off.
	You get thrown out of a lecture in a university for a cell phone going off.
	But you apparently, if you stand and screech like a diseased, wounded harpy at a Donald Trump rally, which people have driven hundreds of miles or thousands of miles to get to, who've been looking forward to it, who have maybe paid a lot of money to come there, you can stand and screech for 10 minutes at a Donald Trump rally and anyone who removes you is somehow violent and aggressive.
	Yeah.
	Try that.
	Try that.
	Try going to the Met, to the opera, and singing along at the top of your lungs and see how well that goes.
	Or try just setting off an air horn at Cats.
	Well, first of all, you generally can't tell the air horn if it's high-pitched from the song Memories, but try doing this anywhere.
	Try going to somebody's house and urinating floridly into their pool.
	Oh no, they threw me out.
	They must hate people who have bladders.
	It's like, no, you're just being an offensive dick and you have to leave.
	Try that anywhere on private property, really interrupting people's enjoyment.
	You know, try going to a disco and setting up your own music and cranking it really, really loud.
	They'll say, sorry, you're really interfering with things.
	You have to leave.
	And if you don't, they'll call their security guard and the guy with no neck will put you out on your head.
	Thank you.
	This conformity that happens, people on the left should have said, look, that's not fair.
	You know, these people are having, they don't come disrupt our debates, and you simply can't go and disrupt their debates, right?
	This needs to be a conversation, right?
	And the fact that all these lunatics, I guess, leftover, burned out, Bernie Sanders rejects from the Occupy Wall Street movement and now are going to plan to spend a spring, I guess, decidedly not working, but instead going around disrupting Donald Trump rallies, the left should be all over that, but they don't.
	They don't do that because they are—well, the left has no values, no honor, no ethics, no virtue.
	They simply rely on other people having those things so they can torture them until they get conformity.
	And so this—the opposite of Christianity is not rational, independent thought.
	I mean, didn't the social justice warriors— Drive, pretty much drive Richard Dawkins into having a stroke recently, like he was uninvited from some atheist conference because of some, I don't know, he made some criticisms about feminism or something and, you know, a guy had a stroke.
	Well, that's not exactly rational debate.
	You know, try being Warren Farrell or Ann Coulter talking in Toronto and you'll have a pretty short speech if the social justice warriors have their day.
	Try being Ben Shapiro speaking somewhere.
	Try being Milo Yiannopoulos speaking somewhere.
	They're not interested in any kind of rational debate.
	They just want to come out there and scream at you until you reasonably have to act against them, at which point they can cry victimhood and persecution and all the usual leftist bullshit.
	And so, I don't know, like if I look at the opposite of Christianity, I find it far worse, to be honest with you.
	Yeah, yeah.
	Or at least what, in our culture, the opposite of Christianity has become.
	You know, people are really good at realizing that the Westboro Baptist Church are really, you know, untasteful for picketing a rally.
	And then, you know, that kind of seems to be like the exact same thing that's happening across the country, you know?
	Right.
	So, if I had a choice between a leftist and a Christian woman, I'm going to tell you that I think there's quite a bit less penis wear and tear on the Christian ladies, which statistically gives you a far better chance of a successful marriage.
	Just because that phrase in my head, it's just going to come up every time I get any kind of red flag.
	That phrase, penis wear and tear, is just going to...
	It's just going to go off in my head, so...
	Oh, yeah.
	No, listen.
	If you want to understand how penises, particularly, you know, multiple cock carousel penises affect women, think of a lovely picture and the penis as an eraser being dragged back and forth on it.
	Excessive penis exposure is toxic for women.
	It is a kind of drug that is really bad for them.
	And so, you know, one of the things that you're much more likely to get with a Christian woman is...
	Is considerably less Johnson mileage.
	And as far as that goes, it's a dose-dependent thing in terms of You know, the old thing that you can't tour, you simply cannot turn a whore into a housewife.
	It's a fantasy that lots of men have because they imagine that they can get a nice meal and all the, you know, crazy staircase sex that they can imagine, but you simply can't do it.
	And statistically, you know, the more partners a woman has, the more likely you are to get divorced.
	Now divorce for men, you know, as the old thing is like having your wallet pulled out through your penis.
	I think as Robin Williams said, and he had some good reason To say it.
	And so, Anything that you can do to avoid getting divorced, which is like inviting the state in, you know, to give you a black inductor-style proctological exam that never ends.
	Anything you can do to avoid getting divorced is great.
	And certainly some social justice warrior feminist is very likely, I would argue, to use the state to bludgeon your balls into submission and to turn you into your average, I don't know, Cock-enabled, spineless, broken man, which you really, really want to avoid.
	And so...
	I guess if you look at women as an airstrip, and you've got to land your plane of marriage, you don't want a whole other bunch of Cessnas and helicopters already on the runway.
	And so even if the woman has not contracted the kind of STDs that turn your nose into a tentacle, then she's...
	She's sold herself cheaply on the sexual marketplace, value marketplace, and it doesn't look good for long-term stability and basic self-respect.
	And also I would say in general that the women who've had a lot of sex when they're young...
	Don't have good relationships with their fathers!
	You know, there's this old...
	You know, there was this meme that flew around years ago.
	I guess it got made into a sitcom with the late John Ritter.
	You know, eight rules for dating my teenage daughter or something like that.
	You know, there's that old thing where you go up to pick up the girl and the man is sitting there.
	I'm just cleaning my gun.
	No particular reason, but I'd also appreciate it if you took real nice care of my little girl and get her home by, say, 9.30pm.
	And if she's walking like John Wayne just having been thrown off a heifer, well, I've been cleaning my gun for a pretty good reason, son.
	Like, everyone's got to run the gauntlet of the dad...
	And the dad keeps the hairy-legged trash men away from the eggs of his daughter.
	And so a woman who's like running around, you know, basically grabbing cock like a woman training for a javelin contest, she is no good relationship with her dad, which means that she's raised by a single mom, which means that her mom hates men, which means that's going to infect her.
	And you really are, you know, sticking your dick into a pencil sharpener and, you know, having O.J. Simpson crank the handle.
	Man, these images are just coming right after the other and they're really inspiring me.
	So thank you for that.
	It's funny— They're actually just meant to frighten you.
	You know, I'm like the preacher talking about hell in Portrait of the Artist as a young man, except I'm talking about vaginas with teeth.
	Vagina dentata, I dare say.
	You definitely do want to stay away from—you know what they say when I was a kid, they were honest, and they said, used goods.
	Used goods, right?
	And then they said, previously owned, like that somehow.
	And now it's like, previously enjoyed.
	It's like, I don't want previously enjoyed vagina.
	I just don't.
	I don't want it.
	I want something that's freshly wrapped.
	I want something that's not basically like, hey, here's some food I found on the sidewalk.
	I wonder, it's been previously enjoyed.
	Actually, it just means it's been swallowed and thrown up again.
	I don't want to eat it.
	Sorry.
	And so if you're around the Christian women, right, and again, I know there's some uncertain stats about all of this, but among high IQ, high intelligent, high quality Christian women, I think you're more likely to Yeah, that's usually not the case.
	That's so funny that you bring that up, because my friend and I here at school, he's a Christian, he and I were talking about this, and he said, you know, girls here, I've noticed, they actually want to have sex with you more when you say, I don't want to have sex until marriage.
	That just turns them on, you know, because that is the most zeitgeist of Christian communities.
	And so when you say, you know, I'd rather wait, then they're just like, oh, that just makes me want that much more.
	Well, because you're displaying case-selected behavior, right?
	Right, of course, yeah.
	I was just going to say, I watched that video that you did, The Truth About Sex.
	And I started watching it and I was like, this is, I guess, not where I expected it to go.
	Not that I had anything in mind.
	But the more you got into it, I was like, oh wow, this all kind of rings true to how I was raised.
	Then I was even more fascinated with the people who called in, I guess the couple who called in and had criticisms of that video.
	And they had kind of a...
	I was kind of at that point once in my life.
	Because I kind of...
	When I realized...
	I admitted to myself, you know what?
	I was raised in this Christian environment, but I no longer...
	I just can't do this.
	I can't play this game anymore.
	I can't say that I believe in these things anymore.
	Which...
	Part of why I was so happy I found your show was that you kind of said, well, you don't have to abandon any kind of solid foundation for principles.
	And so at one point I was kind of saying to myself, oh, I guess I'm an atheist now.
	I guess this means I can go smoke weed while having sex with some random person that I just met in a bar.
	But then I was like, wait a second, I have no desire to do that.
	I have absolutely no desire to do that because, you know, like you say on your peaceful parenting stuff, what you model is what your kids wind up, you know, looking like.
	And so my parents were always kind of like, you know, there's nothing good comes of that, of kind of sleeping around in a promiscuous lifestyle.
	So I had no desire for it.
	And I was in a community where There weren't a ton of people who did that, and people who did usually saw negative consequences for it.
	And it wasn't like they were kicked out.
	It wasn't like they were ostracized.
	It was kind of like, oh, well, we don't really do that.
	Does that make sense?
	And so my initial reaction was, I guess this means if I don't believe in Christianity, I can go wild and do all this stuff.
	But eventually I came back and said, okay, I liked Christianity.
	The values that I had, for the most part, of course.
	But the foundation just wasn't super strong.
	You know, faith is not super reliable.
	But I liked where I was.
	So I had to...
	It's this funny kind of pendulum that I've been on.
	And I'm kind of heading back to where I was before because I'm realizing that the alternative, like you said, isn't really what it promises.
	And a lot of Christians would say, that's exactly why you should be a Christian is because the alternative is...
	This kind of wayward kind of lifestyle, prodigal son lifestyle.
	But I would say there aren't a lot of people who come back to those virtues and values and put a rational foundation underneath it, which is what I'm really thankful to your show for doing.
	But it's just interesting because the kids thing is what really gets me.
	Obviously, I'm not quite to that age of looking to settle down yet, obviously, but when I think about marrying a Christian, I think it seems like I just kind of grit my teeth and kind of tense up when I think of that.
	Think of what?
	Oh, the prospect of having to raise kids with someone who Is wanting to teach them religion and wanting to teach them that religious doctrines are true.
	Right.
	And it comes...
	Yeah, I mean, so that's...
	Is the more you wanted to add?
	Because I don't want to jump in.
	No, no, no, that's it.
	No, that's what I was saying.
	Right.
	Okay, so there's a graphic.
	And this is from 2007.
	Okay.
	And there are three norms...
	That you need to follow if you want to get to the middle class.
	This is not like a trick.
	I'm just curious if you know what they are.
	Three norms that you have to follow to get to the middle class.
	No, I've never heard of them.
	Three things that you have to do if you want to not be poor.
	I don't know.
	What are they?
	Okay.
	The first one is...
	Complete high school.
	I mean, we're not talking rocket science here, right?
	Number one, complete high school.
	The second one is...
	I hate to say it, it's so ridiculous.
	First one is complete high school.
	Second one is...
	Have a job.
	I mean, it's so ridiculous to say, right?
	Complete high school, work full-time, at least for a year.
	And the third one is wait until you're 21 and marry before you have children.
	Right.
	Complete high school, get a job, wait until 21 and marry before having children.
	And a lot of people that I know would say, that's judgmental.
	No, it's not judgmental.
	It's statistical.
	Exactly, and that's what I would try to say.
	You know, it's not judgmental for me to say, if you only eat chocolate cake, your health will not be optimum.
	Oh, you're against chocolate cake.
	It's like, no, I'm simply stating a fact.
	So, if you...
	Do not conform to either completing high school, working full-time, or waiting until 21 and marrying before having children.
	If you do none of that, don't finish high school, don't get a full-time job, and you have kids, so out of wedlock or before the age of 21, then 76% of people who conform to zero of those norms, 76% of them are poor.
	Like, Less than 100% of the poverty level, right?
	Right.
	And 7% of them are in the middle class, which is the middle class is like more than 300, more than three times the poverty level, middle class and above.
	Yeah.
	So if, now, if you only conform to one or two of those norms, then 27% of those people are poor, but 25% of them are middle class and above.
	Yeah.
	Now, if you conform to all three of these norms, what percentage of people do you think who conform to these three norms end up poor?
	I'm going to say 10%.
	How low can you go?
	How low can you go?
	5%.
	It's lower.
	I feel like Abraham testing God with Sodom and Gomorrah.
	4%.
	It's lower.
	3%.
	It's lower, baby!
	Two!
	That's correct.
	If you complete high school, work full-time, wait until the age of 21 and marry before you have children, you only have a 2% likelihood of being poor.
	You have, on the other hand, a 74% likelihood of being in the middle class and above.
	So zero norms, 76% of people are poor.
	These three norms, 74% are in the middle class or above.
	Yeah.
	So, Christianity is going to encourage you to finish high school.
	Christianity is going to encourage you to get a job!
	Idle hands of the devil's work!
	Of course, I'm speaking mostly of Protestantism.
	And, yeah, they're going to say, don't have a child out of wedlock.
	Well, coincidentally, these three things are necessary to not be poor.
	And so the idea that the poor are just victims and, oh, the capitalists are exploiting them.
	Nonsense.
	Just do some not stupid things and you're most likely going to make it to the middle class.
	This is not an IQ test of, wow, okay, I need you to understand quantum physics and have a job.
	It's only one of those.
	And it's not a high IQ test, although...
	Apparently it is for a lot of people.
	But so this, well, I've left religion, so all is permitted, right?
	I mean, that's nonsense.
	Yeah.
	Yeah, but that's kind of what I thought as soon as I got out.
	And not because anybody, any one individual told me that.
	Just because that's kind of what the general message coming from the media and coming from the world seems to be.
	It seems to be, you know, you're either a conservative Christian, Or then you become an atheist, then you become a liberal.
	And yeah, that's kind of the message that I seem to have received.
	But then I realized, you know, okay, maybe that's not quite true.
	And I say I've left religion.
	I still do go to church.
	And I still, you know, I'm very close with my religious friends and everything like that.
	It's just, I'm kind of the black sheep of the congregation.
	That makes sense.
	So, I'll tell you something else, too.
	Do you mind if we just wander off the path of philosophy and just go to sheer bullshit speculation land?
	I love bullshit speculation land.
	Okay, good.
	It is my nemesis, but I find it irresistible.
	I can resist everything except temptation, as the Oscar Wilde quote goes.
	Okay.
	So, Chicks and God.
	Chicks and God.
	Would you say that, in your experience, more men are into God, or more women are into God?
	I was just talking about this the other day.
	Women, I feel like, have a much harder time leaving the faith.
	Women are typically more religious.
	Yeah, women get boners for Jesus.
	Yeah, because they say, you know, Jesus is my boyfriend, and, you know, Jesus is the romance that I have, you know, I'm in love with Jesus.
	Don't see too many men saying that.
	No.
	What is it they say?
	Steph, I love you.
	No homo.
	It's like, Jesus, I love you.
	No homo.
	Even though Jesus seems to spend a lot of time posing in a loincloth.
	I'm just saying, it's kind of Chippendales.
	That's all I'm saying.
	It's a lot of not covered up.
	It's like those Hindu goddesses with the nine tits.
	You know, it's like, okay, tits are nice.
	I guess I can go, like, will I take blue if there are nine?
	Okay.
	You know, I can, you know, I can get into that.
	I'll even, you know, if there are nine tits, I'll take them blue.
	I don't even mind if there are some swords whirring around from some of the other arms, and maybe there's an elephant head.
	I still do get the nine tits, though.
	So it's a tough call.
	Yeah, it's like, I'm imagining like a calendar of like Jesus in these seductive poses and his robe is exposing his flexed pecs, and there's like a Bible verse underneath it.
	Right.
	I mean, because he's a young guy, there can be a second coming.
	Ba-dum-boom!
	Oh.
	Oh.
	I can't believe I said that, but I can't.
	So why do you think that women are more into God than men?
	Wow, that's a great question.
	I have a couple theories.
	I guess one would be that women around the globe, not necessarily by principle, but just the way things are, are typically more dependent.
	Like most women throughout the course of history stayed home and raised kids.
	In a recent survey, 84% of American women said they wanted to be housewives.
	Is that true?
	Yeah.
	Oh, wow.
	Well, that was higher than I would ever expect, but yeah, so that would kind of seem to confirm that, like, you know, the idea that women are more dependent, and so the idea of depending on God is more in line with your mindset.
	And men typically like to be more, I'm going to go out into the wilderness alone and create an empire kind of thing.
	And so then, you know, it can be almost kind of cool to say, I don't need God, or easier, easier, cooler.
	Maybe.
	For men to kind of say, I don't need religion necessarily because men as a whole are more individualistic.
	Just a thought.
	Right.
	I mean, I think there's some truth in that, and of course we're not in the realm of any kind of objectively provable truth.
	Now, you said you're not a dad as yet, right?
	No, no.
	Okay.
	I think that women are to some degree more into God because they are God's.
	I mean, women make people.
	Yeah, yeah.
	No, seriously, as a father, it's completely insane.
	Yeah.
	It's completely insane.
	Like, what was my contribution to this whole thing?
	Yeah.
	Bad foreplay, 90 seconds, and falling asleep where she has to wriggle out for a moment.
	Like, my contribution was, you know, like, I don't know, the kind of stuff that I was just trying to hide throughout my teenage years so that people could actually bend my sheets, right?
	It's like...
	Women, they make life.
	They make people.
	What goes in is, I don't know, a bit of odd-smelling yogurt stuff, right?
	But women...
	Make life!
	It's like throwing some flour into an oven and out comes a baker.
	It's like completely...
	It's not even a cake, it's a human being!
	And I think the only thing that can contain that incredible, unbelievable, astonishing power is an affinity for a God who also creates life.
	Wow.
	That's a great observation.
	I did nothing!
	Yeah.
	And she made a human being!
	Yeah.
	Oh, I made a podcast this weekend.
	What did you do?
	Oh, I made a human being!
	Are you kidding me?
	Compared to...
	What will I ever do in my life compared to making a human being?
	It's incredible.
	Yeah, it's like, I got this frozen pie and I heated it up.
	Right.
	Right.
	And out came a dance troupe.
	It's like, what is that?
	Yeah, yeah, yeah.
	It's like when the kid builds the huge Lego model following the instructions.
	Like, I made this!
	Yeah, yeah.
	Did you?
	Did you?
	Mommy, mommy, look what I made!
	Hi, honey, look what I made, which is you!
	I mean, your drawing is nice and all that, but can it make another drawing?
	No, it can't.
	So I'm not fundamentally that impressed.
	Yeah, exactly.
	Exactly.
	So I think, like, this fundamental division between men and women, which is...
	We throw resources and sperm at women and they make human beings.
	That's, I mean, that's so bizarre.
	You know, like, there's this old thing about, like, this old cliche about the artist who draws a person so lifelike that they step off the canvas, you know?
	That's like, whoa, what a trippy idea!
	It's like, that happens every single minute of the day with human beings falling out of women.
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	Excuse me while I go produce life.
	Yeah.
	You know, I'm really glad you're good at darts.
	I'm going to create an entire human brain out of coffee.
	I mean, that's incredible.
	Yeah, yeah.
	Women are fantastic ways of turning tequila into the next generation.
	It really is transubstantiation that puts anything in the Catholic Church office entirely to shame.
	What Victor Frankenstein was trying to do Yeah, that's right.
	So Dr.
	Frankenstein, you have to have a PhD, you have to have wild hair, buggy eyes, and be completely insane to do what women can achieve in two and a half minutes.
	I mean, it's madness.
	Like, you know, it's funny because, you know, when I wrote novels and plays, people, oh, you know, your dialogue is really realistic.
	They're like real people, the people.
	Okay, but they're not real people like a woman can produce.
	I mean, I just, it's mind-blowing.
	And, you know, I look at, it's a cliche, but it's true.
	Just look at your kids' eyeballs.
	Yeah.
	I have no idea how these crazy light-sensing marbles can do anything sensible but the jumble of outside information that comes spraying their way.
	No idea.
	No clue.
	Oh, I think I'm going to just invert everything because faraway stuff is too big and we really want to focus on the tiger that's closest to us or the thing we're hunting.
	How do these orbs of jelly, how do they...
	Do anything useful.
	I have no idea.
	And neither do women.
	But they can make them.
	You know, in a way, women have kind of, like, done better than God.
	Because for God to make a woman, he needed a rib.
	Women need way less than a rib.
	Right.
	Right.
	Yeah, so, I mean, I think that this...
	power to create life.
	Now, I get all of this, and I know what people are going to say, because I have a relationship with the planet.
	And people are going to say, "Yes, but a man who makes a sculpture has to study for years, and women get this power automatically." I get that.
	Which is why their god doesn't have to study anything and just creates life.
	God doesn't have to, well, you know, like that old Gary Larson cartoon where he's making stuff out of clay, and it's like, "Wow, these snakes are totally easy." It's like, God doesn't have to become good at anything, he just has the power to create life.
	And this is why there's an argument that all gods are in fact goddesses, that there's capacity to create life.
	I mean, think about, for Christians in particular, for Christians in particular, God...
	Still needed an egg.
	Yeah.
	He still had to have the very God of Christians still had to be born of woman.
	Yeah.
	And, you know, there's this thing in fiction, which I've talked about, where women are just amazing at everything without actually having to study it.
	The Mary Sues that they're called out of some old – I think it's an old Star Trek meme about this woman who's great.
	Women are fantastic at things without having to study.
	And it's like, well, yeah.
	First of all, they pull the best out of men because we're all chasing the golden eggs.
	And secondly, they can make life by – Assuming a position.
	You know, like, I mean, that's just amazing.
	It's truly astounding, staggering, and it's one of the beautiful and glorious, magnificent things about women, and I think it leaves them to have a little bit of more affinity with a God who can make life without effort.
	A little bit more affinity for divinity.
	Right, right, right.
	Absolutely.
	I'm totally gonna...
	Yeah, that's definitely...
	That's definitely...
	And what do women say when they're in the very moment of conception?
	Oh, God!
	That's right.
	That's right.
	And you're like, well, you don't have to call me that.
	I don't know if I'm that good.
	Right.
	But that's because in the moment of conception, they are becoming gods.
	Yeah.
	Now, and this is why women have trouble.
	Like, when you go to men and you say the state is forced, a lot of men will kind of get it.
	They certainly did before the draft ended.
	Yeah, they can force me to go shoot people.
	Oh yeah, they're pretty much forced.
	I kind of get that, right?
	And of course men were paying the taxes and women were receiving the protection.
	Yeah.
	You know, the roads and the police and the sewage system.
	I mean, the men paid the taxes and the women received all the benefits.
	Right.
	And so, for women, the government was like, wow, you know, it's great.
	I can drink water without having to boil it.
	I flush and crap magically goes away.
	And there's roads and I can pick up the phone and, like, it works and kids have a place to go to school.
	Like, it was all magic benefits, right?
	Uh-huh.
	Whereas the men are out there like, Holding the, like, shredded remnants of their paycheck after the government dogs have been at it and is, like, happy to still have four fingers, right?
	And so when you say taxation is force to men, and again, this is a little bit more true in the past, but they're like, yeah.
	But if you say to women taxation is force...
	It doesn't register nearly as much, nearly as deeply, which is why women tend to vote left, because there is wonderful benefits that they get that they don't have to pay for.
	Yeah, WIC and stuff like that.
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	Oh, and this is why, you know, I mentioned this a while back ago, but I was with my daughter at a playground, and I was listening to these women.
	And they were single moms and they were like, well, you know, but if you have another kid, you know, that's not hard to find a guy who'll give you that favor, har, har, har, right?
	And so if you give all these other, you give all of these, you know, get another kid and the government's going to give you another $800 and then you get this benefit and they were just going through all the calculus, right?
	So they were conscious of it.
	Oh, it doesn't happen by accident that when the government increases benefits, women have more kids.
	They can count, right?
	Yeah, totally.
	And women are not in the business of producing vital civilization-enhancing services, right?
	So this is the 20 leading occupations of employed women.
	This is from 2010.
	This is from the US Department of Labor.
	What do you think is number one?
	Why don't you just tell me and then I can just agree.
	I was surprised at this because I thought that this had kind of gone the way of the dodo.
	But the number one is secretaries and administrative assistants.
	Now, God knows, where would civilization be without someone to answer the phone?
	They're not inventing phones, right?
	They're not making the next iPhone.
	They're secretaries and administrative assistants.
	Yeah, which is not to say that they couldn't.
	It's just to say that that's just the way it is.
	They just don't.
	Well, there's two reasons.
	One is that women will go into STEM fields if they don't have much choice.
	But as income tends to go up and economic opportunity tends to go up, they tend to gravitate towards more people-interactive occupations.
	But anything where you do a lot of interaction with people is almost by definition not what builds civilization.
	Mm-hmm.
	So, Number one, secretaries and administrative assistants.
	Number two, registered nurses.
	Now, again, it's nice to have nurses around.
	Are they responsible for building and furthering civilization in the same way that guys who build sewage systems are?
	Or electrical grids?
	No.
	Number three, elementary and middle school teachers.
	Number four, cashiers.
	Number five, retail salespersons.
	And then number six, nursing, psychiatric, and home health aides.
	Number seven, waiters and waitresses.
	Right?
	Customer services representatives, maids, receptionists, childcare workers, you know, teachers' assistants, home care aides, office clerks, cooks.
	These are all fine, you know, but they're not...
	This is not what builds and maintains civilization.
	This is all stuff which is because there already is a civilization that's built and maintained, you can have these jobs.
	So...
	Men invent and build the civilization stuff.
	We repair stuff.
	Women benefit and contribute, but very much as a dependency on all of the stuff that men have built, right?
	Right.
	2% of CEOs are women.
	Only 6% of CFOs are women.
	5% of COOs.
	White men still own 95% of all of the mainline businesses.
	Right.
	Women at the moment are leaving the workforce in record numbers completely.
	And yeah, a lot of women are going to college.
	What kind of degrees are they getting?
	Right.
	Only 5% of women go into any work that is really serious.
	Law, medicine, STEM. And even those few women typically only work for a couple of years or work less than men, right?
	Female doctors work like 500 hours a year less than men.
	And so women, glorious, wonderful creatures, but they are not foundational in the making of civilization.
	They are foundational in making the men who make civilization, but they themselves are not foundational to making civilization.
	Yeah, that makes sense.
	And also women, of course, cluster more around the middle of the IQ scale, and the higher you go up on the IQ scale, the more likely you are to be an atheist.
	It's generally IQ and atheism are dose-dependent.
	They correlate with each other.
	Yeah.
	And so the fact that women cluster around the media means that they're more likely to be religious.
	And the other thing too is that, and this goes back to your first point, I think, that women...
	Are dependent on other people to provide, like for men, historically, evolutionarily, women had to rely on men to provide the resources because the women would spend like 20 years disabled with childbirth and breastfeeding and childbirth and breastfeeding and rinse and repeat and rinse and repeat.
	So they're kind of dependent on men.
	And so the idea that there's a God that creates everything and provides things for them It's not, again, way outside.
	Also, women get their resources more through their behavior with regards to other people as compared to their behavior with regards to reality.
	That's a bad way of putting it.
	Let me circle back over that roadkill and see if I can bring it back to life.
	Men gain resources by interacting with reality.
	They gotta go hunting, they gotta plant crops and all that.
	Women gain resources by interacting with other people.
	And that's, you know, maybe that's manipulative, maybe it's not, but basically women gain resources by men being attracted to them, which is manipulating people and getting stuff from people, not from reality.
	And women also gain resources by giving and taking within a community, usually around the raising of children.
	Which again is interacting with people rather than interacting with reality.
	Women have evolved to deal with and get resources and manipulate and get things from people rather than interacting directly with reality.
	Men can't manipulate their way into increasing their sexual market value.
	Women can.
	Men have to go out and actually produce resources rather than put on makeup, push up bras and go to the gym or whatever, right?
	And so men have a necessary foundational pragmatism with regards to reality in that there's no intermediary that they can pray to to get the rabbit to jump magically into the trap.
	They actually have to go out and hunt the thing, they have to go down We're good to go.
	And they couldn't go out and hunt for three days when they have a newborn at home because he'd be dead by the time they got back.
	So the fact that women like to think of a universe that is populated by consciousness rather than bare empirical reality...
	It's perfectly valid to me because women's fundamental interaction is with other people and their consciousness rather than bare material reality.
	That's the job of men who have to go out and actually get resources in the world.
	And so the fact that men are more scientific, the fact that men are happier working a lot of times without people but with stuff, with material, like this whole thing, right?
	That the girls sit around and braid each other's hair and want to talk about people.
	Perfectly fine.
	And the guys are going out there building forts and learning how to hunt and playing war, and they're happy...
	You know, when I was a kid, I was happy working with computers.
	And the computer lab that I went to on Saturdays in my school, there were no girls.
	Not one in the years that I went.
	Not one girl there.
	And that's because men are happy to work with stuff...
	And not that drawn towards working with consciousness, but women have evolved to work with other people's consciousness and to gain resources through interactions rather than going out and getting pulling resources from a harsh, cold, bitter reality that is not open to manipulation.
	You cannot manipulate the sheep into coming back.
	You actually have to go and catch them or train a dog to do it or something like that.
	But you can manipulate a man into...
	Giving you resources.
	Like Mindy Lahiri.
	The Mindy Project.
	There's a sitcom.
	I watched a few minutes of it the other day.
	And she was down on her knees cleaning the floor.
	floor, there was this episode where she was trying to figure out whether she should stay at home or go back to work.
	And naturally, of course, because it is the kind of show that it is in the world that we are, she ended up, of course, it's better to go back to work, right?
	Of course, right?
	that the government wants.
	But she was down on her knees.
	She was cleaning, and she was just saying to herself, wow, this is the first time I've been down on my knees where I didn't get jewelry.
	Yeah.
	Now, a man has to go down a 6,000-foot-in-the-ground mine to dig up a diamond, and then he's got to carry it to the surface, and he's got to learn how to shave it down with machines made of other diamonds and polish it and all this kind of crap.
	right?
	To actually get a diamond, a man has to risk his life, his limbs, his air, his getting buried alive and running out of methane suddenly pumping out of the ground.
	That's what a man has to do to get a diamond.
	But in this joke, the woman has to give a blowjob.
	See, he has to interact with reality.
	She has to interact with a person to get the resources.
	So the fact that women are more drawn towards a consciousness-populated, consciousness-enveloping, consciousness-providing resources, universe, and men are like, okay, it's nice, but I gotta go and get some shit done, and God isn't gonna provide it.
	You know, you can have your God thing, I actually have to go out and plant some crops.
	Right.
	Yeah, that makes sense in kind of a general sense.
	I mean, the man that you were talking about wouldn't obviously go down to the mind himself.
	You know, he would...
	Other men would do that.
	But...
	But that's not my point.
	The point is that it's not women doing it.
	Yeah, I get it.
	It's funny.
	The women in my family, my mom and my younger sister, are very kind of go-getter kind of people.
	And they are very...
	They don't want to be defined by the kind of stereotypes that you're kind of talking about.
	Not that those aren't completely legitimate.
	But my mom, for example, is getting her...
	Oh, dude.
	Oh, dude.
	You didn't just contradict yourself that unconsciously, did you?
	How do I contradict myself?
	Is education facing reality or people?
	No, no, no.
	I was trying to agree with your point that...
	Yeah, it's facing people.
	So that's right within the cliche that I was talking about.
	But you're saying, well, my parents, my mom is very much different.
	But this is exactly, what was the third biggest profession was teacher.
	Yeah, yeah, yeah.
	I'm sorry if that sounded, I was trying to disagree with your point.
	I was trying to say that she likes to say, oh, I'm not like that.
	I'm not, you know, I don't want to be bounded by those stereotypes.
	But She's getting her degree in higher education.
	Do you see what I'm saying?
	I was trying to, like, agree with your point there.
	Oh, I'm sorry.
	I thought you were saying that you...
	So, okay, so she's a person-facing person, which is entirely in the realm of...
	Of femininity, right?
	And now, of course, it's generally more profitable but more risky to go and try and get things from reality rather than try and get things from people, right?
	And so what happens, of course, is that the men go out and fail significantly or succeed significantly, right?
	Uh-huh.
	And what happens is when men succeed significantly, women can either go out and try and compete with them directly in the marketplace, or what they can do is complain that men are sexist and then get stuff for free.
	And every time a woman complains about sexism and says, well, only 2% of women are CEOs, right?
	Or only 2% of women get Nobel Prize, whatever it is, right?
	Whatever the numbers are.
	Every time a woman complains about That it's sexist and it's bad and the government should give her stuff for free.
	She is merely confessing that women can't compete.
	If women are upset that only 2% of CEOs are women, then go out and work to become a CEO. Right.
	But what they want is equal pay for work of equal value.
	They want the government to come in and force employers to pay women who often will go off and have kids and may not come back and, you know, who have less, who work fewer hours than men and so on.
	If you want to get paid as much as a man, then work as hard as a man does, and you will be paid as much as a man.
	Because the market doesn't discriminate between penises and vaginas.
	The market doesn't say, outies get paid more than innies.
	The market says, if you provide value, you will make more money.
	The more value you provide, the more money you will make.
	But when women come and say...
	I don't want to work as hard as a man, but I sure would love to get some of that money that the men who work hard have.
	Okay.
	Then all they're saying is women can't compete, so they have to run to men in the government to get resources for them, which is the most ridiculous—feminism is the most retrograde situation or mindset— That is conceivable.
	Which is, a woman wants more stuff.
	Okay.
	You want to go out and compete with men?
	Go out and compete with men.
	A woman wants more stuff.
	Great.
	And what does feminism tell women to do?
	Whine, complain, nag, so that men will go and get you more stuff.
	Oh, come on!
	What a ridiculous retrograde notion.
	How cliched and Victorian hysterical could you possibly be in that, well, I think that men should go and get me stuff because I'm complaining.
	It's like, oh, are you kidding me?
	I don't decide.
	This is why I think only 18% of women...
	Identify as feminists anymore.
	It's because they've got some pride and they don't want to pull this manipulative, whiny, nagging, complaining, shrill bullshit where they just wear men down with nagging until the man's like, okay, here's some stuff.
	Will you shut up now?
	Because most women have much more pride than that.
	Yeah.
	Yeah, absolutely.
	So back to the point about marriage, if we could maybe bring it back Never!
	No, okay, go ahead.
	Not that I have the, what do you call it, bullshit wonderland or whatever.
	I do love that.
	I enjoy it very much.
	Is there anything that you would suggest?
	If I'm, you know, obviously I'm not quite to that, like I said, I'm not quite to the age of wanting to settle down yet.
	But if I did kind of say, okay, wow, I really like this person.
	She's everything that I would look for in a And a merit to want from a wife.
	But she's a Christian.
	Is there...
	Should that...
	Should I really consider putting...
	You know, halting it because of that?
	Or...
	No.
	You don't think so?
	No, no, no.
	Not on that standard alone, I would believe.
	Now, look.
	If you can find a rational woman who will listen to...
	You don't have to be an atheist when you meet her, right?
	Because you're not perfect.
	I'm not perfect.
	We can all learn from each other.
	But if you can find a woman who's willing to listen to reason and so on, then okay, great, fantastic, right?
	But the trick to a happy marriage, happy marriage 101, from a guy, you know, very happily married, 13, 14 years going on or whatever, right?
	This is the trick.
	When you're young, your penis chooses the vagina.
	And your penis...
	We'll generally choose wrong.
	Right.
	Now, when you become a little older and a little wiser, your future children choose the vagina.
	In other words, not, is she hot?
	Great if she is.
	Not a huge problem, although power tends to corrupt people, so be careful.
	But Your baby, your toddler, is not going to care whether the mom is hot, right?
	What is your baby and toddler going to care about?
	Whether she's a good provider.
	Whether she's a good nurse.
	Whether she's a good mom.
	Yeah, exactly.
	Yeah.
	Right.
	Now, I would argue that the qualities that go into making a good mother are virtually identical with the qualities that go into making a good person.
	Right.
	A good wife, a good friend, a good companion.
	And you don't have to have kids to manifest these values, but it helps.
	So if you think about your future kids choosing the vagina, which seems only fair, they are going to live there for a short amount of time and they're going to come out of it.
	So, you know, they don't care how attractive the tits are.
	You know, if they're like young Uma Thurman swinging pendulums of happiness...
	They care if they've got good, healthy milk in them, so to speak.
	And so, you know, at 3 o'clock in the morning when your kid has a nightmare for the third day in a row...
	It doesn't matter how nice the lady's calves look in high heels.
	It matters whether she or you are going to get up and comfort and be patient and soothing and helpful.
	It matters whether she's going to reason with the children rather than bully the children.
	It matters whether she's aggressive.
	It matters whether she's patient.
	It matters whether she's got courage.
	It matters whether she's going to model the kind of virtues that you want your children to inhabit or to inhabit your children.
	These things are what matter now.
	A woman, I think more so than a man, can be religious and not be crazy.
	For the reasons, and other reasons too, but the reasons that we were sort of talking about in the call.
	Right.
	So if...
	It's the old argument I made before.
	Would you rather...
	A doctor use the wrong methodology to give you the right prescription, or would you rather him use the right methodology and give you the wrong prescription?
	Absolutely.
	You want the right medicine.
	Now, if the doctor prays and gives you the right medicine, this is all nonsense, but, you know, just go with me with it, right?
	Sure.
	As opposed to he looks it up and does all the right methodology but ends up with the wrong medicine.
	And that's actually not so insane because I'm pretty sure that prayer...
	Assiduously and conscientiously applied is much better for certain forms of mental ailments than these God-forsaken SSRIs that tend to shred the brain like cheese making a pizza.
	So, if she has genuine, loving, compassionate virtues that come from a religious belief, you will be far better off, in my humble opinion, than someone who's a man-hating social justice warrior atheist, right?
	Yeah.
	Yeah, it's good to hear you say that, because that's kind of what I was leaning towards.
	But I know that my own bias is so strong.
	Like I said, there aren't a ton of people in my life I could talk to about this.
	So I'm glad that you get that perspective, because that's really kind of—you're putting my kind of suspicions into really well-worded arguments.
	Well, then you need to be careful because you're going to fall into confirmation bias.
	So listen back to this and make sure that I make sense.
	I just want to point that out.
	And a lot of people, and I speak more for women than men in this regard, my friend, but they're not religious because they really accept religion.
	St.
	Augustine's arguments about the ontological proof of God.
	Yeah.
	That's not where they're coming from.
	Why are most people or women religious?
	Social benefits.
	Yeah, social benefits and conformity.
	And, you know, this is what my parents, I don't want to upset them.
	And, like, it's not...
	It's not...
	It's fundamentally because they have a philosophical, metaphysical argument about it.
	And this is why they're like, eh, you know, and I've heard this from people I know who are religious.
	It's like, you know, it's a social club and this is just where we happen to meet.
	Yeah.
	Now, guys, because we've got this, it's gotta make sense.
	It's gotta, like, all hang together, right?
	Like, I don't know if you heard the call with the guy...
	who a lot of people think I was mean to with regards to evolution.
	But when a guy goes full religious, it's like it bores down into and dismantles his sanity.
	Yeah.
	But women, it's not the same thing with women.
	And I know I'm generalizing, but nonetheless – For women, it's like, this is how we share values.
	This is how we become good people when we're not very good at philosophy.
	And there is no...
	I would put Ayn Rand in there, but nonetheless, there is no...
	World-class, history-straddling female philosopher, or mostly, for the most part, physicist, couple of chemists, there's no mathematicians.
	There's just no world—like, women, they cluster around the middle, and they don't go to the extremes of smartness and dumbness.
	And so for a lot of women, it's like— It's the easiest way to be a good person is to conform to these values and women don't have the same general compulsion for rational consistency that men do.
	Because for a man, not having rational consistency meant being a really bad hunter and therefore being a really bad provider and therefore not being chosen by women and therefore genes dying out.
	But for a woman, it is easier in many ways because they don't, you know, you know the proportion of men to women in this show.
	It's 90% men who listen to this show, give or take.
	And it depends on the region and so on.
	And that falls into, given that there's very high IQ people who listen to this show, pander, pander, but that falls into the IQ, right?
	It's perfectly rational and perfectly logical based upon the IQ spread of the genders as to why there are many more men who listen to this very high IQ show relative to women.
	So it is different for a smart man to be religious because he's got to go all the way.
	Whereas women just have to go to social conformity and mutual benefit and decent values.
	They don't have that same drive for it's all got to fit together and I've got to go right down to the metaphysics and the epistemology.
	This is why theologians tend to be men because they're tortured by certain irrationalities and they've got to find some way to Neoplatonism plus Christianity.
	It's got to fit together, and it's got to, you know, like the bridge halves have to meet if you start from either end, and if they don't, the whole thing's damn well been wasted.
	Inconsistency tortures men, and for women, it's like, eh.
	You know, men don't care what kind of shoes they wear, and women don't care that much about intellectual consistency.
	These are very ridiculous generalizations, but in my experience, there's some significant truth, and there's very strong evolutionary arguments as to why that might be the case.
	Quick story along those lines.
	I was dating a girl, a Christian girl, in high school, and this is when I began, I kind of stumbled upon your show and a couple others, you know, found Dawkins and those kind of people.
	And I was like, oh my goodness, I was talking to her on the phone, and I was like, there are all these problems with these doctrines that I had never thought of before.
	She was like, like what?
	I was like, well, like there's this and there's that, and there's, you know, there's the problem of faith, there's the problem of evil, and there's, you know, irrationality, whatnot.
	And she said, Andrew, God doesn't want your brain.
	He wants your heart.
	Right.
	And that, I think, encapsulates what you're saying.
	There's a phrase which is not an argument where people say, you're overthinking this.
	Yeah, yeah.
	And it's like, for men, it's like, That doesn't make no sense.
	No, that's what we do.
	Sorry.
	It's like, your penis is just too big.
	It's just like, no, that's what we do.
	Right?
	There's no such thing as overthinking.
	But for women, there is such a thing as overthinking things.
	In other words, if you're just kind of getting along with social conformity, you're sharing resources back and forth, you've got enough values to be a really great mom and a really great provider, a really great wife, or a really great CEO, if that's what you want to be.
	I got enough of these values.
	If I go further and I start really thinking about why God allows evil in the world and can you be all-powerful and all-knowing, the stuff that drives men crazy, well, they end up splintering their social support network and creating a lot of enemies, which significantly harms the survivability of their offspring.
	So yes, there is overthinking in the female universe, just not so much in the male universe.
	And I would say that, I mean, the conformity problem applies to men too, but in a slightly different way.
	Because I have definitely...
	I mentioned this, I think, in my initial writing of the question, but I have experienced, for the most part, people kind of accept me, but there is definitely, especially in high school, that I experience this kind of like, if you go against the Bible Belt kind of way of thinking, then you run a risk of some serious social ostracism, no matter what gender you are.
	But I definitely agree that genders understand this and experience it in a different way.
	Right.
	And the leftist fantasy, and it is to some degree on the right as well, but the leftist fantasy that we're all the same, and therefore all inequality must result from exploitation, it's completely false, obviously, but this fantasy that we all have, that men and women should be the same, and therefore all differences must be the result of sexism.
	Mm-hmm.
	That is extremely pernicious.
	And the funny thing about it coming from the left, it's saying, just as they say about race, it's saying that although men and women have fundamentally different evolutionary pressures, that men and women have ended up exactly the same.
	In other words, this bear lives in the snow.
	This bear lives in the woods.
	Therefore, we would expect the fur of the bear to be identical.
	And it's like, that's not how evolution works.
	It's not.
	It's not.
	And of course, if there wasn't this leftist hysteria that all gender differences exist, That are identified must be the result of sexism, in the same way that all racial differences that are identified must be the result of racism.
	If there wasn't this terror that experts have in talking about this, like me fools rush in where angels fear to tread, but if we could actually study this stuff, what a wonderful step forward in human understanding, in sympathy, it would be.
	And the last thing I'll say is that a lot of intellectuals, and I think this is true across the political spectrum, intellectuals fundamentally lack empathy and imagination for less intelligent people.
	Like, when I was younger, I worked at a seafood restaurant.
	It's a pretty classy place.
	And I, of course, was just doing it to make some money while I was in college and all that.
	But There was this guy who worked there, and he'd been a waiter for 25 years.
	And I found myself, in my mind, being a total dick to this guy.
	Like, ugh, how terrible to be a waiter for 25 years.
	Like, why wouldn't you try and become a manager?
	If it was something, just open your own resume.
	But he was a nice guy.
	He was a friendly guy.
	He made his little jokes.
	He helped me.
	And here I was in my little ivory tower of intellectualism looking down on this guy who was helping me be a better waiter.
	You know, he was happy to serve my tables when he wasn't.
	He was a great team player.
	You know, when I had a breakup at that time and he was very nice, you know, listen.
	A really nice guy.
	And I, in my ivory tower of vanity, was looking, oh my god, I can't believe I've been waiting for 25.
	How plebeian.
	Like, just what a terrible human being I was in that moment with regards to that.
	And I caught myself.
	And I was like, well, he's not bothered.
	But he enjoys what he does.
	You know, he was the kind of guy, like a lot of people do, like he had a job so he could do the stuff that he wanted.
	He liked motorcycles.
	He had a job.
	He went and did his job.
	And there's been times where I've been doing my high-flying intellectual act where I'm like, yeah, being a waiter would be pretty good right now.
	And this guy was just a less intelligent guy.
	And what kind of What kind of a douchebag was I? That I looked down on this guy, who's a nice guy, who's a helpful guy, who's doing something that people want.
	He's able to sell his services as a waiter.
	What was wrong with him being a waiter?
	Well, I was projecting myself into his life, and I was saying, how would I feel If I was a waiter for 25 years, well, I'd feel like a failure because I'm capable and my life has demonstrated that I'm capable of a lot more than being a waiter.
	Yeah.
	But it's like the guy with the giant dick looking at the guy with the tiny dick saying, why aren't you in porn?
	You know, just it makes...
	He didn't have the equipment mentally to do what I do.
	Now, if I say, okay, well, his life must be terrible because if I was him, my life would be terrible.
	Right.
	That's fundamentally not understanding that we're different.
	Yeah.
	And having respect for that difference.
	And it's fundamentally cruel because it's making him...
	I never said anything to him, and I caught myself, and I was a much nicer person and a better person to him.
	And, you know, again, so I never said anything to the guy.
	This was just like a couple of days, and I was like, I heard this chatter in my head.
	Oh, my God.
	What a ridiculous underutilization.
	Stop being a dick.
	Stop being a dick.
	Undick yourself, Steph.
	Because if I'd said anything, it was like, maybe he would have felt bad.
	And for what?
	Short guy's not on the basketball team.
	So you're a tall guy, you're on the basketball team, and you're, you know, short guy with one leg's not on the basketball team.
	Do you make him feel bad about that?
	Only if you're a serious dick.
	And I was, in those few days, being a serious dick about that.
	And so this idea that this is what happens all the time.
	All the time.
	The feminists, to give them, like the early feminists, the second wave, let's say, to give them as, you know, let's just say they weren't CIA-paid Marxist agents of social destruction or whatever.
	So they were very smart women.
	Very smart women.
	And they said, the life of a housewife would be unbearable to me.
	Therefore, the life of a housewife must be unbearable to everyone.
	Do you see what I mean?
	They did the same thing to all women that I did with this nice waiter, except they didn't catch themselves after three days and saying, I'm really being a vagina to this person.
	Because you say I was being a dick, so I'm just transcribing.
	Right?
	So, okay, I get it.
	If you've got an IQ of 140 plus...
	Then I get that being a housewife might not be the very best thing for you to do.
	It might be a little frustrating.
	Although there are some very, very smart women.
	Phyllis Schlafly, who had six kids and was Illinois Mother of the Year and became a lawyer in her 50s and is like smart as a whip and best-selling author and was a very successful mom.
	And she was writing once where she said, oh yeah, so at my house the other day, Bunch of men around, bunch of women around, and a mouse runs across the linoleum.
	And what happens?
	All the women scream and jump up on a chair, and all the men go and get a dustpan and a broom.
	Because, you know, nothing changes.
	So there are women who can, you know, and I'm a very smart guy, and I've been a stay-at-home dad since my daughter was born, and I think it's great.
	Wow, I do have this...
	I want to say outlet because I'm going to get backed up like a 17-year-old.
	But it is so women who were like, this is the Hillary Clinton thing, right?
	You know, what was I supposed to do?
	Stay home and bake cookies?
	Yeah, like that's all that women who raise children do is bake cookies.
	Well, I mean, that's a kind of...
	So she looks at that life and she says, because I would hate that life, that life must be hateful.
	Exactly.
	You know, implicit in that argument is that A lawyer is superior to a waiter, which is really...
	Right!
	It's not!
	It's not!
	Yeah.
	The market sorts it out.
	Sorry, you were going to say?
	No, I was just going to say, you know, with that rationale that you had in your head, and I've definitely caught myself doing that too, like, you know, there's always a really, really nice janitor at my high school who everyone loved.
	And I was like, oh man, I really like that guy, but like, why is he being a janitor, you know?
	Like, But then I was like, wait a second, how hateful or discriminatory of me to say that a janitor is inferior to a lawyer or a doctor or a businessman.
	You know?
	Right.
	It's like that old quote from Wall Street where the father says to the son, I never raised you to judge a man by the size of his wallet!
	Right.
	Just because you're paid more doesn't mean you're worth more as a human being.
	Absolutely.
	And lots of people who aim high do the Icarus thing, right?
	They crash and burn.
	They flame out.
	They would have been better off to not.
	And so this sowing of discontent.
	And Marxists are the same way too.
	Marxists who are smart, they look at workers and they say, those workers have a terrible life.
	Because if I were doing that job, Marx, a very smart guy, whatever his other godforsaken faults are, we've got a presentation called The Truth About Marx, people can check that out.
	But Marx was a super smart guy, and so if Marx had been operating a lathe for 40 years, he would have, after six minutes, used the lathe on his own head.
	That life is unbearable to me, or would be unbearable to me, therefore that life must be unbearable And because I would hate that job, the whole system must be fixed so that that job is not what it currently is.
	A lot of people who work as an employee don't want to be the boss.
	I also saw this.
	Like when I worked at a...
	At a restaurant, there was a cliched Italian manager.
	Really stressful, lunchtime in particular, crazy stressful.
	And like he'd sometimes throw up after lunches because he would just be so stressed about it.
	And I remember the waiters thinking like, man, you couldn't...
	I remember them saying to me, there were these old pizza fossils who like had been working at the restaurant for, I don't know, since the Paleozoic era.
	And they were like, you could not pay me enough to do that job.
	Yeah.
	They did not want the job.
	Now, a smart guy, like, maybe he started as a waiter and wanted to do more.
	Maybe he regretted it.
	I don't know.
	But the idea that all of the workers want to be managers, like, why can't we have a society where all the workers are managers?
	It's like, because they don't want that job.
	Yeah.
	And if you're a manager, there are some times where that seems like a really, really good idea.
	Yeah.
	And so I think the feminists are like, well, I'd hate being a housewife.
	So being a housewife must be terrible, so I'm going to go and sow all this discontent among housewives.
	And say that they're dumb breeding cattle who just bake cookies and gossip and have weak tea and do nothing with their lives.
	And they're total dicks.
	To women who are very happy being housewives because they're sowing all this discontent.
	When some really smart, vocal, verbally intelligent, brilliant, genius-style person comes along and tells you that your life sucks and you should do so much better, it's really tough if you're not as smart and you're kind of intimidated by that, and as people are intimidating, it's kind of tough to say...
	No, you're wrong.
	You know, maybe you are thinking of yourself in my life and you wouldn't like it, but I look at your life, I don't want that.
	Does that mean I should...
	Like, I would hate to be an academic and I'd hate to be a writer and I'd hate to go out there giving speeches.
	I like my time with my family and my kids.
	I'd hate to be doing all this traveling.
	And so...
	Should you not do your job because I wouldn't like your job?
	Then shut the hell up about me being a housewife just because you don't want to do my job.
	Shut up.
	Go away.
	You don't want to have kids.
	You're too good for it.
	You don't like the smell of fresh cookies and fresh nappies and the sound of children's laughter.
	Fuck you.
	Go away.
	Do your thing.
	Leave me alone, you crazy, cantankerous, bigoted bitch.
	It's not a lot of housewives going to have that speech in them, right?
	And now, after two generations of being exposed to the wonderful joys of customer service, women are leaving the house, leaving the workforce in droves.
	Thanks.
	And now it's like, you know what?
	That housewife thing, that raising kids thing, that was a pretty sweet gig.
	Yeah.
	What was I thinking?
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	And now all of these women, okay.
	Like, people say to me, oh, Steph, you're really funny.
	You should be a comedian.
	And I'm like, God, no.
	No.
	I like my family.
	I don't want to go on the road for 300 days a year.
	I'm bad at roofing people.
	Like, I don't, like, that to me would be a horrible life.
	A horrible life.
	Does that mean...
	That comedians are bad or stupid?
	No.
	I even caught it myself there where I said, I like my family, thus implying that comedians don't.
	And comedians do.
	They just love comedy more, right?
	Because they're off doing that.
	I don't know.
	Maybe they don't have families.
	Maybe the kids are grown or whatever, right?
	But I would not want the job of going to comedy club after comedy club, traveling all the time.
	I'm glad there are comedians because I like laughing at people.
	But I would not want that life at all.
	That doesn't mean it's a bad life.
	That's why you pay him to do it.
	Yeah, yeah.
	Like, I would hate being a dentist.
	I'm really glad there are dentists.
	Yeah, exactly.
	Yeah.
	And now, of course, well, women in Europe who've said, oh, can you believe?
	Cheryl became a housewife.
	How terrible.
	I can't believe.
	So much potential.
	Squandered and wasted to be this empty, oven-filling breeder of cookie bake.
	I can't believe what a loss to humanity that she's just producing.
	So, okay, women are like, okay, well, I guess I won't have kids anymore.
	Hey, what are all these North Africans doing in the country raping people?
	Oh, that's right.
	Being a mother is really bad, and it's a huge waste of your wonderful potential, you people clustering around 105 IQ. So nobody had any kids, so there's no one to pay for anyone's retirement.
	So now we've got to import all of the incompatible, women-hating, Western-hating cultures that the world has vomited forth from the dark recesses of theological hell.
	How's that going to work out for you?
	And I had a long chat with my daughter today about the second half of life, so I won't get into the whole speech.
	But it's a long time.
	It's a long time to go from 45 to 85 without a family.
	It's a long time to go.
	I mean, just look at Madonna.
	Yeah.
	Ah, that vile Satan spawn of loose female morality is finally getting her karmic blowback.
	It's beautiful.
	You know, maybe this means that I'm a more feminine guy, but I sometimes hear you talking about getting to do what you love and be a stay-at-home dad, and I'm like, wow, that sounds like the ideal situation.
	And I hear so many people talking bad about being a stay-at-home parent, and I'm just like, really?
	That sounds bad to you?
	If you can, like, you know, have a living and raise kids, I'm like, wow, I definitely don't see eye-to-eye with the people who say that, you know?
	Yeah, no, and I get these comments like, oh, Steph, you're a really good public speaker.
	You should go out and give more speeches.
	It's like, yeah, but travel sucks.
	It does.
	Like, it sucks.
	And, you know, it's at least a couple of days out of my week.
	And my wife has a career.
	And I could spend a couple of days...
	For a 40-minute speech and be tired.
	I've never given a speech not tired just because, you know, there's usually time change or I've got to get up early and screwed up my sleep for some damn flight somewhere.
	And I was tired and I still think you have good speeches.
	I like public speaking, but oh man, it's just too much.
	It's too much travel.
	And, you know, I can't go with my daughter because, well, at least I couldn't before and all that.
	And plus she'd be like, Dad, I'm bored.
	You know, like make a...
	Make some funny voices or something.
	Although I probably would.
	But I just...
	You know, I mean, it's opportunity cost.
	Like, I could go and spend, you know, four days preparing, traveling, giving the speech, coming back, and then I've got to get my sleep schedule back adjusted and all that.
	Like, it's basically, it's a week of, like, weird disruptions for, like, one 40-minute speech.
	Or I could do five shows that do a quarter million.
	Anyway, it doesn't really matter.
	But, I mean, it's just different choices.
	It's not...
	The cost-benefit doesn't work for me, because it's not like getting paid huge amounts of money, if any, to go give a speech.
	And it's also not like...
	If you look at my top videos, You have to go quite a ways down before you come to a live speaking gig.
	So anyway, it's not really here.
	This is the same thing with going on other people's shows.
	It doesn't pay off that much relative to working on stuff solo.
	But yeah, if you can, you know, occasionally, like everything, nothing comes for free.
	There is the occasional pound of flesh that you have to give up for confronting the prejudices of the world.
	But that's, you know, that's in the job description.
	I mean, complaining about that is like being a surgeon and saying, ew, that's blood!
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	That's the gig, man.
	I really had that value of having a family structure.
	You've talked a lot about the importance of having two parents.
	I've always had that really drilled into me, not by words, but by my parents' actions.
	My dad traveled all the time.
	When he was a broadcaster, and he would have to go to all these sports events and broadcast these things, and they offered him a ton of money to do twice as many things.
	And he sat us down.
	I was probably eight or nine at the time.
	He sat me and my siblings down, and he said, there's a reason why I'm not going to take this job that's going to offer me a ton of money.
	And it's because I don't think it's valuable for me to be bringing in X amount of money, which is way...
	Which is considerably more than we make now, but to not have me at home ever, except for 10 weeks out of the year.
	And so that immediately told me, wow, you know, there are some things that are, you know, cost benefit analysis is more than just money.
	And your career choices are, you know, go so far beyond, you know, what's going to make you more money.
	And so Yeah, I've definitely come back more to the camp of kind of what you're talking about.
	Yeah, no, I mean, I could have a bigger show, more exposure, TV. I mean, but why?
	Exactly.
	Why?
	I mean, I'm in Canada, so let's say I want to pay 60% taxes on everything.
	No, thanks.
	Not really.
	And...
	For your father, too, I mean, it's very admirable, and I, you know, I respect and appreciate what he did, because, you know, at the end of your life, you don't look back and say, boy, it'd been great if I'd talked about one more baseball game 25 years ago, or 10, or 100, because that's all gone and forgotten, and nobody ever listens to that.
	At least this stuff people will be listening to in the future, but people don't listen to recordings of old baseball games or whatever he did this broadcasting.
	But your relationship with your kids, that...
	That matters.
	It matters enormously.
	It matters really more than anything else because at least your spouse is there by choice and your kids aren't.
	You know, my daughter is still a biological prisoner of accidental birthing.
	And so, yeah, the prison's got to put on a good show in order for her to think it's a hotel.
	Yeah.
	I tell you what, it paid off too because now I'm in college and I call him all the time, call my mom all the time, and I I want to know what he's up to.
	And I think that's probably because he showed me as a kid, I care about you enough to give up this job that would offer me $80,000, $90,000 a year.
	And now it's great.
	I mentioned this maybe in the question.
	I talked to him about, hey, look, I'm not a Christian anymore.
	And he's like, all right.
	I accept that.
	And he wants to have conversations about it, and we have a great relationship still.
	And so, I mean, I definitely now know that.
	That being, you know, like, if you model your life in accordance with your values, people will notice, especially if you have kids.
	And I think that definitely proves the benefit of that.
	Right.
	And is your mother religious?
	Yeah.
	Both of my parents are.
	Right.
	Right.
	Is there one more than the other?
	It's so funny.
	My dad was raised in a super-duper conservative religious household.
	And he has strayed.
	He's gone a lot more moderate religiously.
	And my mom was raised in a super-duper liberal household and has come a little bit more to the center.
	So...
	I would say they're about equal religiously.
	Yeah, the money thing...
	I remember when I lived...
	It doesn't really matter the details.
	So I lived in a condo with an ice pool.
	Yeah.
	I didn't have a condo.
	I was just renting a room.
	But anyway, I lived in a condo with a nice pool.
	I'd go down and I'd work out.
	And one night I was in the pool.
	It was empty.
	I was swimming.
	Yeah.
	Sorry, that's redundant.
	I was skiing in the pool.
	And I remember thinking, okay, let's say I do make a lot of money in my life.
	I was just starting out an IT career.
	And I said, okay, I've got a business I'm starting up.
	What if I do make a lot of money in my life?
	I could end up with a house with a pool inside it, like this condo.
	I could end up with a house that big that I have an indoor pool.
	I knew some people had an indoor pool.
	A friend of my mom's when I was growing up had an indoor pool.
	This is back when her husband, the pilot, you could actually make money as a pilot.
	And I remember thinking, okay, so let's say I have this house with an indoor pool and it's as empty as this one.
	Yeah.
	How much could I possibly enjoy it?
	Wow.
	Wouldn't that actually be almost worse?
	Oh, totally.
	Having this big, beautiful pool.
	And also, how bad would it be if the only people who came over were the people who wanted to use my pool?
	Oh, how sad, right?
	Oh, terrible.
	Scrooge McDuck swimming in money, you know?
	Yeah.
	Richie Rich, right?
	At least you're the best friends of Butler.
	That's a chilling story.
	Yeah, exactly.
	All right, listen, I've got to move on to the last caller, but...
	Oh, next caller, but I really appreciate the chat.
	I hope it's helpful.
	Aim for virtue and...
	To a large degree, you know, my sort of thinking evolves with additional information, and I'm much more sympathetic now to the manifestation of virtue, and I'm less fastidious about its cause, if that makes sense.
	It does.
	It does.
	So that's sort of where I'm at, and, you know, people can make it what they will, but I just wanted to sort of mention where I'm at.
	But yeah, let us know how it goes if you get a...
	A hot Christian chiclet to let us know.
	I'll invite you to the wedding.
	Yeah, thanks for this conversation.
	Thanks, man.
	Thanks.
	Bye.
	All right.
	Well, up next is Michael.
	He wrote in and said, how can I determine my sexual market value?
	I've heard you mention it in some of the shows that I've listened to and think it might be something of value for me to at least look into.
	Any pointers or anything?
	I happen to have a case of yellow fever, and I've actually embraced that even more after being informed of the IQ levels members of that community have, but I'm finding it difficult to find someone who matches the balance I'm truly looking for.
	Where would you, with your life experience and intellect, suggest holding out and lowering my standards as age increases with potential matches?
	That's from Michael.
	Well, hi, Michael.
	How you doing?
	I'm living the dream, man.
	How about you?
	I'm living the reality.
	So, the yellow fever.
	So, you are into East Asian ladies, is that right?
	Yep, you hit the nail on the head there.
	Northeastern, specifically, but Japanese.
	Like what?
	Like one village, or how specific are we getting here?
	Japan, Korea, Northeastern China.
	And have you dated women from that?
	I have.
	My last girlfriend was Japanese.
	I met her here Is she not Japanese enough?
	Is that why she's no longer your girlfriend?
	No, she's no longer in the West.
	She went back to Japan.
	She was here, unfortunately, temporarily doing a study abroad type thing.
	So I kind of knew that going into the thing, but I thought, hey.
	But why not follow her back and marry her?
	I mean, maybe I'm missing something.
	That's something I definitely entertained.
	I had actually considered trying to move there prior to meeting her anyway.
	I've been there twice.
	It's a very remarkable place.
	I don't know if you've been, but just the whole...
	China, yes.
	I've not been to Japan.
	So you didn't follow the girl back.
	But to me, it's like, if she's the one, then pay any price, bear any burden, right?
	I totally had the mentality, but I don't think she was necessarily on the same page.
	I'd only known her for three or four months, and then she went back.
	I guess it just wasn't long enough for her to, you know, oh yeah, come here with me eventually and...
	Yeah, I dated a Chinese woman for a while.
	A very nice young lady.
	She actually bought a plant to our first date, which I found very, very charming.
	Very charming.
	I kept that plant for quite a while.
	And I thought, that's pretty cool.
	And she was remarkably tall.
	I mean, I'm about six foot, and she was like a little taller than me.
	A very, very nice young lady.
	But anyway, so...
	When did this first come about for you?
	Did you have an initial imprinting?
	Did you type yellow fever into Google at some point as a teenager?
	No, I mean, to be totally honest, I was raised Catholic.
	I'm no longer Catholic.
	I still am a Christian, Protestant.
	But I remember even at like eight, nine, maybe ten years old, sitting in mass.
	I lived in Virginia Beach for most of my life, which has like the third highest Filipino concentration in America.
	So I just remember even at that young age, just being fascinated with all the young Filipino girls as they would go up to receive the body and blood of Christ.
	So yeah, it's kind of like it's been a thing as far as I can remember.
	I tried to kind of bury it, I want to say five to six years ago for a year or so, but then Just mostly due to kind of social pressures, if you will, at the time.
	But since then, just a couple years ago or so, I just came back out of the closet unashamedly, so to speak.
	Now, hang on, hang on.
	Is there a particular physical characteristic of Asian girls or Asian women that you find particularly appealing?
	Or is it a value thing?
	I would say it's probably both.
	Physically, yeah, just the dark, rich, typically thick black hair.
	Not all of them have thick hair.
	The skin color, texture, and eyes.
	Usually they're a little smaller and such.
	I'm not terribly huge.
	I'm not small.
	I'm about 5'10", but they are on average shorter and such.
	That's always nice.
	At least the way they present themselves to be At least in the areas I'm interested, a little more conservative.
	I guess Korea might kind of be tossing that by the wayside more recently.
	Sorry, tell me what you mean by more conservative?
	Just the way they dress and such and how they present themselves.
	Like, what girl in America is going to bring a plant on their first date?
	You know, just kind of like a little more...
	Yeah, it was lovely!
	Yeah, no, absolutely.
	I mean, my last girlfriend was extremely lovely.
	No games, no nonsense in terms of pursuing her and such.
	The values are still a little more conservative, I would say, in general, to my experience, at least to my knowledge.
	So, yeah, definitely a combination of the two categories you gave.
	And have you dated...
	You're Caucasian, is that right?
	Yes.
	And have you dated many Caucasian women?
	Love, so to speak, was Caucasian.
	I mean, I had like a few minor girlfriends.
	This person I never actually dated.
	I got friend-zoned.
	I was in high school at the time, still like learning the art of pursuing a girl and sealing the deal, so to speak.
	Wait, two Asian girls I've dated.
	Doesn't matter.
	Okay, go ahead.
	I was not parallel thinking.
	It just popped up.
	Sorry, go ahead.
	Oh, good.
	Yeah, so I had like a couple of official girlfriends after that person in high school, but they were not white.
	But the second person I really was in deep with emotionally and mentally and all that stuff was half Korean, half Greek.
	But we never dated.
	I was friends with them for about a year and then kind of had the aha, wow, I want to be more than friends with this person.
	But since her, it's been...
	Mostly, yeah, it's been exclusively Asian.
	So that's been the last five years or so.
	And just two or three people since then, I think I'd have to sit down and consciously remember all those relationships.
	But yeah, two or three in the last five, six years or so since that second really involved relationship that was never officially a dating relationship.
	Now, as far as ethnicity goes, or race goes, do you think of yourself as white at all?
	It's not any kind of trick question.
	I ask myself this sometimes, too.
	I'm just kind of curious what your thoughts are on that.
	Stefan, I think of myself as a rainbow.
	No, I'm totally kidding.
	I would say I'm pretty white.
	Maybe not...
	I don't know, not like yuppie or anything or hipster, if you're familiar with those kind of subcultures.
	No, no, no.
	I'm just talking ethnicity, not a particular cultural subgroup.
	Oh, yes, definitely.
	Yeah.
	And the Asian girls, women, do they think of themselves as Asian?
	And look, the reason that I was...
	Someone to Beauvoir wrote in The Second Sex, she said that the first thing that I think about when I think about myself is I'm a woman.
	Now, I don't...
	What was that old Stephen Colbert joke?
	I don't see color.
	People tell me I'm white and I believe them.
	But I don't really think of myself as white or anything like that.
	But I also have done the thought experiment, the sort of black-like-me thought experiment.
	Okay, what if I was a different race or a different gender or whatever?
	Would I think or feel differently?
	I think that for myself I wouldn't, but I think there'd be a lot of horizontal cultural cues that would be very different.
	And I wonder the degree...
	To which, and I've read some studies on this, which we did this for Elliot Rodger, who's, you know, is I think half Caucasian and half Asian, that kids who are mixed race have some challenges.
	Not just that they may end up president, but they have challenges in that, in a sense, neither fish nor fowl, it's tough for them to find the tribe, so to speak.
	Right.
	And so, as far as, and this is neither here nor there, and certainly it's no, it's something to mull over, right?
	That if you have, let's say you move to Japan, you marry a Japanese woman, and you have kids.
	Will Japan, a Japanese society, accept those kids as thoroughly as they would a full Japanese kid?
	To my knowledge, they absolutely would not.
	Although I'm I'm aware of movements to change that.
	I've watched some videos on YouTube of the Hafu community, people that are half biracial, either white, black, and Japanese.
	More often than not, not quite accepted.
	But, yeah, no, that would...
	I mean, we're tribal species, you know?
	I mean, and my tribe is the people of the mind.
	I don't care about the ethnicity.
	But we are, you know, not everyone is super smart, and, oh, Japan is pretty high.
	But we are a tribal species, and if you're going to make decisions to marry outside your ethnicity...
	It is less of a challenge for you, but if you're very smart, you have to look at the numbers, and the numbers with regression to the mean is that if you're super smart, your kids are not likely to be as smart as you.
	And if they're biracial, then they're not likely to be as smart as you, and they may have trouble finding a place where they feel That they fit, if that makes sense.
	And it may not feel like you may move to Japan and feel perfectly comfortable, but that may be a function of intelligence, which your kids may not have.
	Again, regression to the mean.
	If you're 6'7", your kids are not likely to be as tall as you are.
	They're not going to be 4 feet, but they're not going to be 6'7".
	And so that's a consideration that...
	Needs to be, I would say, needs to be in your mind when it comes to, you know, whatever decisions you make for yourself.
	I, you know, I'm interested, but I don't, I'm not invested in.
	What I'm concerned about is generally the decisions that people make for other people.
	And in general...
	My kids would fall under that category.
	So you need to do some research.
	I'm no expert on this, right?
	I've read an afternoon of this stuff.
	But do some research about some of the challenges that are pretty significant that mixed-race kids have.
	And read their experiences, look at the studies, and so on.
	It's not any kind of absolute, you understand, right?
	It's something that your kids...
	If you go to Japan and marry a Japanese woman, have kids there, that's fine, obviously.
	It's not the initiation of force, but I think it's gonna be important for your kids to know that you knew about some of the challenges so that you could work to alleviate or prevent some of the challenges from manifesting to the degree that that's possible.
	Does that make any sense?
	It does, yeah.
	All right.
	What about language?
	Would you obviously be willing to, like, what if her parents don't speak English?
	Oh, no.
	I mean, I would be more than willing to learn.
	That would obviously take time and work, but something else.
	Well, you really have the fever if you're willing to learn kanji and whatever.
	I said kanji and the Japanese, right?
	I mean, that's like 10 years of significant study, right?
	Yeah, I'm sure.
	I mean, I would just...
	Are English speakers really that repulsive to use?
	Okay, I could speak the language of you and your relatives, but this lady has a bit of an ochre hue, so I'm going to put 10 years of study into learning Japanese.
	Like, wow, that's...
	You don't ever go colorblind or whatever.
	But again, you could meet an Oriental woman where you are, family speaks English and perfectly naturalized and all that.
	Would that be – because that's going to be less cultural, right?
	And some, but that's going to be more physical and less cultural.
	Which I'm totally fine with that.
	It'd be obviously simpler in many ways.
	But, yeah.
	Okay, so as far as your sexual market value goes, how old are you?
	I'll be 27 in about two months.
	And how much money do you have?
	I have savings.
	How exactly do you mean that?
	Well, you're...
	Okay, just to give me a dollar, but what's your rough salary?
	Mid-40s.
	Okay, that's not particularly high.
	What about your assets?
	I have a car to my name.
	Is it paid?
	It will be in a couple of years.
	I have about 20 grand saved, some tied up in mutual funds.
	I don't know if that's the right phrase for mutual funds.
	If you're a lawyer who's articling, you're not going to make much money, but your future earning potential is fairly high.
	What is your trajectory of income potential?
	I'm not quite sure.
	I haven't figured that out.
	No, I mean, I'm just kind of, I have cash, six months worth of savings, and then I'm kind of- No, no, no.
	Sorry.
	Could you, like, could you be making 80 in five years from 40 now, or is it going to somewhat stay around the same neighborhood?
	I just started with a new company the last month and a half.
	I don't know quite their raise schedule.
	I know they give healthy bonuses each year.
	I'm actually strongly considering Largely in part due to a few episodes of yours that I've listened to, going back to graduate school and trying to change industries outright.
	Hopefully not at the same time as you're also learning Japanese.
	Hopefully that's not going to collide.
	If I was to make that change, I do think there would be a significant jump in pay considering what I would like to study and hopefully get into doing.
	Right.
	Okay.
	And when I'm talking about your sexual market value here, I'm not talking about your tequila-laced bangability.
	I assume you're not, like, how do I go and have a one-night stand with a jacket?
	Like, I don't care about that.
	I'm pursuing a marriage, yeah.
	Yeah, yeah, yeah.
	Okay.
	Now, how much fun is your family to marry into?
	I would say they'd be a blast.
	Pretty typical family, you know, somewhat morally upright and And all that by a number of my friends' standards, probably slightly opinionated just based off of how people say I am.
	But no, I mean, very caring and nurturing towards, you know, me and my siblings.
	And I would assume the same for welcoming towards any person that I would kind of try to bring into the family and, you know, any career in kids I would have.
	So I would think it'd be a very...
	Good family to try to or potentially come into as a daughter-in-law.
	Okay, and how would they be in terms of accepting a Japanese woman into the family?
	Please understand, I'm not asking, are they racist?
	I mean, anything like that.
	I totally understand.
	My parents are well aware of my preferences.
	I mean, they met my last girlfriend.
	They met the girlfriend I had prior to that.
	I would say they're pretty involved in my life.
	I try to keep them as such.
	They're very welcoming of the thought.
	The grandkids with blue eyes, they already have from my older sister.
	My mom had mentioned, the only thing with you going for an Asian girl is I wouldn't have grandkids with blue eyes because I have blue eyes.
	But she already has those with my older sister, so I'm not super worried.
	I think ultimately they would I just want my happiness to be the thing that was most important, and they've communicated that, so I don't think it'd be an issue whatsoever.
	And with regards to if you have a wife who stays home with the kids, would your family be available to help?
	Theoretically, I would say yes, although I just about a year ago moved From where my parents are.
	So logistically, that'd be an issue.
	But yeah, in terms of advice...
	Would they or you move?
	Because, I mean, it's hard raising a kid without family support.
	Yeah.
	Because if you want sexual market value, this is reproductive market value if you're looking for a wife and kids.
	So I'm going to look at the cold-eyed look at, okay, if I marry this guy...
	How many resources do I have available to me?
	Now, maybe her family would be around and that would help, but if they're not, then if your family's not around and you're working a lot, which you will tend to do when you become a father, because it's sort of an instinctual thing, then she's gonna have some solitude, right?
	Right, sure.
	Yeah, I've considered moving back, but that was more heavily considered prior to considering graduate school.
	Yeah, I mean, Ideally, I think it'd be wise and something I'd like to do in terms of trying to locate or relocate to either the area my parents happen to be in or hers, if not around my parents.
	So, yeah, that's to be determined, I guess.
	Okay.
	And...
	So you don't make a lot of money.
	And again, you're 27, right?
	So this is not, listen, it's not a big problem.
	But you don't make a lot of money.
	I mean, your take-home is not enough to support a family, I would assume, right?
	Yeah.
	So if you want a stay-at-home wife, you're going to need more money.
	Yep.
	Right?
	Because she's going to look and say, okay, well, if I marry this guy, his family's not around, he doesn't make much money, he's thinking of going back to school, that's a challenge, right, for sexual market value for reproduction, because if you want to go back to school, what, are you going to spend two years in grad school?
	Yeah.
	Okay, so you've got money going out in another two years.
	Now, if the woman is your age, she's going to say, okay, I'm not going to be able to figure out this guy's earning potential until he's in his early 30s, which means I've got to invest four years into the guy before I figure out how much money he's going to make and whether that's going to be enough money for me to stay home and raise our kids.
	Right.
	And if you have, like if you want a wife who is going to really want to go out and work and so on, then you have more challenging logistics, you know, daycare and all that kind of stuff.
	And not having a primary caregiver for your kid, and I'm, you know, as I know, very much opposed for very rigorous moral and scientific and statistical reasons.
	You know, dumping kids in daycare is like marrying a woman and immediately having an affair with a stewardess on the way home from your honeymoon.
	It just seems like, okay, what's the point?
	So, yeah, if you want to offer a woman the stay-at-home thing, then having more resources is important.
	Now, the ideal for a woman is for you to have a lot of resources already and not have to work as hard, right?
	Because otherwise, she's like, well, it's great that you have a lot of resources, but you're not really that involved in co-parenting because you're working 60 hours a week, right?
	Right.
	So, if your career is starting out, if you go to grad school and you graduate, you go next year, you graduate when you're 30 or whatever, then there's not like magic money that opens up the avenue for you, but then you're still, in a sense, starting out in your career, and when you're starting out in your career, that's when you have to really...
	Work a lot.
	Like I used to, if we bothered when I was starting out of my career, look at these older guys.
	It's like they'd leave at five o'clock and I'd be there till midnight.
	And it's like, that's because they're more efficient because they've got more experience and they know what they're doing.
	They have to look everything up.
	Right.
	And so you will be, you know, starting out.
	at 30 basically in your career and that's a challenge because you either won't be that successful in which case not going to be enough money for her to stay in any kind of comfort or you will be successful which means you're going to be gone a lot while she's raising the kids without a family members around does that make sense Yeah.
	Yeah, it does.
	Your physical appearance, what are we talking here?
	This is more in terms of initial attraction, but one to ten, where do you put yourself?
	I have no idea.
	I would say seven and a half to eight.
	I could be totally deceived.
	All right.
	So you said you were, how tall again?
	About 5'10".
	5'10, okay.
	So, you know, for Asians, you're like the jolly white giant.
	So you're tall and head of hair?
	Yeah.
	It's all hanging in there?
	Yep, still.
	All right, body mass index?
	Wait, hang on, what?
	You're starting to lose it?
	I mean, I don't know how seriously.
	I just noticed, you know, when I brush my hair, more comes out than it did a year ago, but I don't know how normal or accelerated that might be.
	But, yeah, I'm just, you know, probably typical...
	Signs of aging are starting to appear, but I don't think it's anything abnormal.
	Body mass index?
	I don't know.
	I don't mean down to the...
	I mean, are you a lean guy?
	Are you a fat guy?
	I'm lean.
	Okay.
	Overall health and athleticism and so on?
	Yeah.
	Slightly above average.
	Okay, good.
	And history of genetic ailments, family, mental health issues, cancer, whatever it is that may have some genetic component?
	None that I know of.
	Oh, that's good.
	That's good as a whole.
	And, yeah, a little different from me.
	Hey, we're all nuts wanting to get on board.
	I mean, we are in the sense that I'm half Irish, so there's something a little off, but nothing.
	Hey, what's wrong with being half Irish?
	Nothing, it's great.
	I'm half Irish too, so anyway.
	And so, okay, reasonably full head of hair, good body mass index, I guess, blue-eyed, you said blue eyes?
	Yes.
	Okay, that's a plus for some, for sure.
	Irish, subtract 85%, okay.
	Hey, what's wrong with being Irish?
	You're a good conversationalist, good sense of humor, I assume.
	Do you have the ability to give women the socially acceptable orgasm of making her laugh in public?
	Some of them, yeah.
	Okay, that's good.
	If you can make a woman laugh, that is, I think, a very, this is why men have a sense of humor, because it raises your sexual market value significantly if you can make a woman laugh, because then you can apply the remote control endorphins without actually undressing her.
	That's good, right?
	Oh, sorry, Mike has just mentioned that your photo is in your avatar.
	Let's see here what we've got.
	What do you think?
	Six?
	I don't see the photo.
	Okay.
	Mike, you're going to have to give it to me in some other way.
	All I've got is that blue weird Skype headless guy, the guy with no neck.
	Anyway, Mike's offering up an eight in the sexual market value, and he is a fairly experienced judge of man flesh.
	Okay, cool.
	If Mike's giving you a solid eight, I'll back that up, sight unseen.
	Okay.
	Okay.
	So you have good sexual market value, I would say, except that the earning potential remains somewhat theoretical at the moment.
	But you have some savings and assets and so on, which is good, and that indicates case-elected capacity to defer gratification and so on.
	Social poise, social confidence, that kind of stuff?
	Yeah, I would say pretty...
	Slightly above average or so, yeah.
	All right.
	And she's going to meet your friends.
	And how's that going to go for her?
	Assuming you have friends.
	You listen to this show, so.
	Six of one and zero of the other.
	Right.
	Yeah, that would go pretty well.
	Most of my close friends are obviously still back and forth.
	But, you know, that would probably be a trip we would eventually go on and they'd be introduced and find that they're pretty similar to me, more or less.
	The ones here still kind of, you know, getting to know, but more or less, yeah, I would say would go fine.
	Sexual competence?
	I'm a virgin.
	Do you find clitoris without a spelunking kit?
	I'm blind as a bat.
	I'm a virgin, so...
	You're a virgin?
	Yes.
	Okay.
	And can you step me through that?
	I've never had sex.
	I mean, it's unusual for 27.
	It's not necessarily a bad thing, obviously, but it's unusual for 27 if you can step me through that.
	I mean, I've had sexual experiences, if you will, but I've never...
	I have no idea what that means.
	I mean, I've kissed girls.
	I don't mean to be prying or anything, but if you could break that down a smidge, I think it would benefit both me and the listeners to know what that means.
	Totally fine.
	I mean, I've kissed girls.
	I've made out with a few girls, but I've never had oral sex.
	I mean, I've had some experience with foreplay.
	I guess you could say dry hoping, but that's really the extent of...
	And bra expertise?
	I mean, is it literally a booby trap for you?
	Like, I mean, because that's always a sort of make or break thing in certain situations is, you know, can you do the bra without chewing through Wolverine style?
	No, never attempted that one.
	I just could never bring myself to do that, even before I more seriously I considered my faith when I was about 17, but before that, I just had no—to me, it required so much trust to kind of do that with someone.
	I just never brought myself to that position, and since becoming more seriously a Christian, I have extreme reservations with that type of activity prior to marriage.
	And you would want a girl who would also be a virgin?
	I assume.
	Yes, that would be strongly preferred, but it wouldn't necessarily be a deal-breaker.
	More so, their behavior Yeah.
	I mean, if they were at one time not necessarily trying to live morally or as a Christian, but thereafter ceased that behavior, that would be kind of redeemable in my eyes.
	But if there was, you know, no outright change in motivation or behavior after a point like that in their lives, then that would kind of be a deal breaker.
	Yeah.
	If that makes sense.
	Okay.
	Okay.
	And now, you mentioned the Filipinos.
	I assume that's within the scope of your yellow fever.
	What is the population of, I guess, East Asian Christians that you have access to?
	Right now, not much in my immediate vicinity that I know of.
	I'm still kind of getting used to the big city here.
	Coming to a point now where I'm more comfortable and wanted to try to branch out and explore what venues I do have.
	I've tried a few of the online type things, not necessarily Tinder so much, but I think there's another one that kind of has a little bit of a different reputation, although I guess Tinder's kind of changed.
	Coffee Meets Bagel.
	Yeah, I think there is a Tinder for virgins, and it's called Get Away from Tinder, as far as I understand it.
	It's like, have nothing to do with Tinder.
	Tinder is actually one of the very few apps that can actually give your finger an STD just by touching it.
	So I just wanted to mention that challenge.
	Yeah.
	Coffee Meets Bagel, I've tried eHarmony as well.
	I mean, there's a pool, but typically, you know, I would say that most of them are older and just kind of a little more desperate seeming than I quite want at this point.
	And I would say kind of below my...
	What's older for you?
	Case by case, but I would say in general, 32.
	Right.
	Well, I mean, if you're still trying to figure out your career to some degree, 32 is probably not a very productive age to start dating a woman.
	Because she's going to be, you know, her fertility is already declining and she needs to sort that stuff out probably a little bit faster than would be comfortable for you.
	There would be a pressure, right?
	I mean, you can't date a woman in her 30s who wants kids, unless you can figure it out really quickly, you know, you can't string them along.
	It's not, you know, not fair.
	Right.
	Right.
	Touché.
	I saw a picture the other day about how Asian women age.
	I think it was done by...
	Have you ever seen that?
	Yeah, like with the six little segments to it or whatever.
	And they look fantastic until they just drop down into these little black holes down at the bottom of the pit.
	It's pretty funny.
	Yeah, yeah, yeah.
	It's like, hottie, hottie, hottie, shrunken prune.
	Menopause.
	Yeah.
	It's so true, though, and that's part of the draw, but in general.
	So you're also going to need to find an East Asian woman, Japanese woman, or whatever, whose family is obviously not going to be young.
	She's going to maybe have some mileage, and her family is going to have to be comfortable with her marrying outside the ethnicity, hopefully not necessarily outside the religious context, right?
	You know, finding...
	This is the problem with...
	You know, this is what a lot of people say about women.
	You know, you've heard this, not all women are like that.
	It's called the Nawals, right?
	The woman who is...
	Like the caller we had recently when we talked about why feminists hate men.
	And a great woman to have a chat with.
	But a lot of times the high-quality women are...
	Kept.
	The men don't let them go, right?
	Because if they have any experience, they know what's out there, and it's like you've got a high-quality woman.
	The analogy, which is not necessarily the nicest in some ways, but it's instructive, is used cars on the market are generally lemons, because if you have a used car that's not a lemon, you don't put it on the market.
	Right.
	So you are going to narrow down quite considerably your standards, and you're going to have to have cross-cultural, cross-ethnic compatibilities.
	So my concern is that if you were 20, but by 27, a lot of the high-quality women have been snapped up, right?
	Right.
	I mean, if there's this great, attractive, virginal Japanese woman who's, you know, smart, sensible, kind to men, and uninfected by feminists, odds are, right, that she's been beamed up to some patriarchal harem and not, you know, released.
	Anyway, so I, you know, I would definitely look, I wouldn't necessarily look only within the East Asian community.
	I mean, you don't You want to look for values, not skin tone, right?
	And so I would say that it would be in the nice to have.
	Like everyone's got a physical thing that they want in a partner, right?
	But obviously I think the wise approach is to say that's in the nice to have, not the have to have, because it isn't a have to have, right?
	You want a good woman, you don't want a Japanese woman.
	In other words, how much...
	How many points in virtue are you willing to sacrifice to have a Japanese woman?
	And the answer philosophically and sensibly would be zero, right?
	Like if there's a woman who's, you know, a nine on a virtue scale, but she's eight and she's Japanese, then you'd go for the nine.
	At least that would be my advice.
	And so if you're looking for a woman of rare quality, limiting yourself to a particular ethnic subset is going to make it harder, right?
	for you to achieve that.
	Now your sexual market value as you age, assuming that your career goes well, is going to go up.
	Women's sexual market value, again, generally peaks early 20s and then can decline.
	Again, we're talking about just basic reproductive stuff as they age and so on.
	Particularly if they've had lots of boyfriends or slept around a lot, then the sexual market value to anybody who's got the data, and we've got this in presentations, I think it's in "The Truth About Sex" We've got this data that, you know, as we talked about with an earlier caller, a woman who has more partners is much more dangerous, in fact, downright suicidal, seppuku style to drop in a cultural reference, and much more dangerous to date,
	to the point where it's just like, I mean, you might as well just Have lawyers machine gun you at the wedding.
	It's just going to be easier, quicker and less painful.
	So yeah, it's in the presentation, The Truth About Sex.
	People need to check it out.
	It's the most searched for term with regards to sex on the entire internet is our presentation.
	I have convinced myself that's true because I need to get out of bed in the morning.
	So...
	I wouldn't, you know, focus on the virtue.
	Now, if you find that or there are, you know, and I've certainly heard people say that a lot of the East Asian women, you know, being uninfected, relatively uninfected by feminism is, you know, there are specific benefits.
	So if the virtue is going to be more concentrated in that ethnicity or in that culture, then I can certainly see looking in there first.
	Right.
	As your sexual market value goes up, you know, this is a challenge for men, is that if you want a younger woman, then that's obviously fine, but there's going to be some age incompatibilities there, and the wider the age gap, to some degree, also the less stable the marriage is.
	So I would definitely start casting my net wide, looking for the virtuous...
	make a list of the virtuous characteristics that you want.
	And as I mentioned earlier, the fundamental choice of your wife should be decided by what your future children will best benefit from because that's a great way of getting out of your penises way or getting in your penises way so you don't get dicknapped by somebody who hits your particular biological buttons.
	And the problem with having a particular kink or fetish or preference or whatever it is is that that's where your penis will poke out your eyes.
	Like, this is where your neofrontal cortex will get beaten into a stupid pulp by your dumbstick.
	So you have to be, like, the more attractive the woman is in terms of fitting a particular profile for you, the more you have to be careful.
	It's like it's a confirmation bias that you really have to, because, you know, she immediately would have a huge amount of power.
	Over you and men are basically trained to to be done when in the proximity of a particular kind of egg configuration that they really like and so Your sexual market value, I think, is decent to high and, you know, you listen to the show, you're a smart guy, you're pursuing virtue and so on.
	And the fact that you're a virgin is very positive in many ways as well because, you know, the particular bond you'll have with a woman as your first sexual partner being your wife will be very strong and virgins are very stable.
	This is the female version.
	I don't know how it is with men.
	Apparently Donald Trump was quite the man whore when he was younger, but again, he's, I think, been a better father than husband, as I think he himself would admit.
	But your sexual market value, I think, is good.
	And if you really focus on trying to find the virtues that are going to be the most productive for your future kids, that's going to spill over into having a great wife.
	And I think that would be my particular approach.
	And, you know, be careful what you wish for, you just might get it.
	If you do find a woman who pushes every conceivable biological button of hot lust in your spine, that's like, yay, and that's also like, ah!
	At the same time, too, because that's not where you may be making your very best decisions.
	Oh, I think we just lost him.
	But that was pretty much the end of my speech anyway, so I just wanted to say, of course, thank you everyone so, so, so, so much for inviting me into your brains, into your hearts.
	Oh, I'm just finishing up, Mike.
	That was the end of my speech anyway, so...
	Oh, lost him again.
	So, yeah, thanks everyone so much for...
	Allowing us to have and share, not just have, but to share these conversations.
	It's very meaningful for the world.
	You are laying down your fossils of experience for future archaeologists to pour over forever, and I really appreciate having that opportunity to discuss these issues with you.
	So have yourselves a wonderful week.
	Please, please, please remember, remember, remember, not only the 5th of November and the Ides of March, but...
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	Thank you, everyone, so, so much for a wonderfully exciting conversation, a wonderfully exciting life in these conversations.
	Have yourselves a great, great read.

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