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Dec. 10, 2011 - Freedomain Radio - Stefan Molyneux
01:13:54
2054 Banking, Despair, Tyranny and Gen X!

Stefan Molyneux, host of Freedomain Radio, interviewed on News Truth Radio - http://www.freedomainradio.com

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So, I just want to thank you very much for giving me your time.
I'll explain. My name is News Truth radio host, Wild Hunt Andy.
And I do believe you spoke with Simon about a year and a half ago for News Truth.
Northeast Truth, it's related.
Yes, I remember the accent well.
Ah, yeah, yeah, Deep Voice, he did, yeah.
I looked it up, there's a YouTube video and stuff out there, and it was actually very, very interesting.
I mean, you were fired up.
It was a very, very interesting conversation, you know.
Now, just to let you know, just because, well, I'm on air now, okay, I'll put the mic on, if you're okay with that.
Sure. I don't know. Okay, okay, good, just to let you know.
Thank you very much. And, yeah, I mean, Like I said, I know I'm a complete stranger to you, that's fair enough.
I saw your video of late on YouTube where I think you're almost crying really, very upset with obviously the awful state of the world that we're in at the moment, you know?
Sure, sure. No, I mean, I think passion and reason, there's sort of been a tradition in Western philosophy that if you're passionate, you can't be rational, and if you're rational, you have to sort of be pointy-eared, Spock-like, and with a bowl haircut, and that's the only way you can be rational, and I don't really subscribe to that view.
I think that emotions are not the enemy of reason.
In fact, I think that they They shore up and propel.
They're sort of like the jet fuel to an argument.
But a lot of people, of course, who prefer rational arguments can feel that emotions are distracting or manipulative or whatever.
But it's not my particular approach.
Is it? No, no, okay.
Hang on. Actually, damn it.
I had a… Sorry, Stefan.
I had… Oh, no problem. OK, thank you.
Excuse me for my unprofessional behaviour at the moment.
I'm just looking at the software that I have.
I've got a PC here, I've got all my bits and pieces and I've got Sam here.
Now normally, I've got all the buttons pressed OK and stuff.
Now normally there would be action on the VU. On the VU. There we are.
OK. Do you need me to do a testing?
No sir, it's okay.
Sorry, is my audio coming through okay?
It is now, thank you very much.
I just wanted to be absolutely sure because I don't actually want to miss a word you're saying.
I'm recording on this side too.
I can ship you my recording if I need.
Yeah, no, that's cool.
That's okay. Thank you very much.
So you were saying, I think that's good, rational.
God, man, I am a thinker.
I'm a deep thinker now myself and I'm just trying to make head or tail of this and get sort of straight into it.
It's like, you know, I've done a great deal of research now myself for the last five years, Stefan, with regard to, it started, if you like, the rabbit run.
With regard to the deceit on the name, law, legislation, what the court system is and how courts are operating and have been set up based on the deceit on the name, I call it really, you know, the sovereign bond.
And if you can sort of get your head around that and understand banking and what bankers have done for the last 700 years, the banking cabals, then that's shocking enough in itself and causing wars around the world.
But their end game I mean, none of this to me.
If you could explain what rational, you're right, logical rational within the sphere of me feeling like I'm a lovely, I've been raised with love and empathy, sympathy in my heart.
I try not to go around.
It's just absolutely normal that I wouldn't just go around any given day, anybody I bump into, injure them, whether emotionally or physically, because it's just not something I do.
But the outright psychosis, let's say, of the tyranny of the massive corporation business run just by money, And then those who are deemed to put value on it, own it, and organize everything has never actually been of benefit for mankind worldwide.
And clearly, you know, I'm frankly surprised the free and open internet hasn't actually been shut down yet, Stefan, because, you know, there's a lot of people getting some very good information from the internet, like myself, learning that you can't really be doing that necessarily down at your local library.
And it's an awful lot to be taking in.
Please step in any time, Stefan, we're good at this end.
Yeah, I agree with you about this.
This banking issues are absolutely wretched.
And one of the terrible things I think about the current system is that there is a tiny minority of human beings Who will actually take a knife and slide it through the ribs of another human being.
I mean, to do that takes such a degree of, you know, having had a terribly abusive history and developed so many terrible habits in your mind and your actions.
There's very, very few people who will do that.
And if that was required for theft, if that was required for rape and pillage and murder, if that was required for you to actually stand in front of someone and stick a knife in, Then we would be almost safe completely in the world.
The problem with the current system, as I'm sure you know, is it dissolves morality into these very abstract things.
So central banks can print money, which is exactly the same as sticking a knife into the ribs of the poor and taking Their gold teeth from their children's mouths.
As heinous a description of theft as you could imagine, that's exactly what counterfeiting is.
But it's so abstract that you never see the connection.
Or when people say, there ought to be a law against X, Y, and Z, and they don't understand that that means that guys in blue will kick in doors and drag screaming people off to imprisonment, they don't see it.
And so the violence gets shipped out and abstracted to the point where, you know, very few people will go and steal someone else's wallet, But if you find, you know, a 10-pound note on the street, you're just going to take it because you can't, you know, it's just, it's not the same.
And unfortunately and tragically, our system basically is scattering all of this money into the air and people are just grabbing it without really the understanding of where it's coming from, how it's harming people and what the end consequences of this predation is going to be.
Well, I'm a 46-year-old single male.
I'm not married, don't have any kids, but I didn't know any of this when I was say, you know, 14, 17 years old.
I always had inklings.
I felt pushed around like as a slave that I've got to earn money, you know, have a job, earn money, and that there's Only certain questions you can ask because I'm always asking questions with regard to why should I do this?
Why should I pay taxes? That's the paradigm that we have.
I get criticized a lot because people say I'm still into money and I don't understand the resource-based economy or the zeitgeist approach and so on.
I'm not into money. I don't frankly care how the economy gets organized in a free and peaceful society.
My only concern fundamentally is let's pull the guns out of each other's foreheads.
Let's stop sticking guns into each other's faces to get stuff done.
Whether what we want done is stopping gays from marrying or whether what we want to get done is helping the poor through the taxed and indebted and counterfeit violence of the welfare state.
Let's just put down the guns and reason with each other about how to solve social problems, but as long as we have central banking given its monopoly by the state in return for giving the state money to bribe citizens with, as long as we have this system that is founded on violence, and as long as we... Pretend that we're educating children on a system that is founded in violence, the property taxes extracted by force from parents to pay teachers who can't get fired.
I was just thinking the other day, we have the term learning disability, which usually means a kid who's going to get drugged to the effect of shrinking 10% of their brain mass.
We don't have a phrase called teaching disability where the teacher has to get drugged to improve his or her performance because that's just not how we think.
And so as long as we can make a commitment to stop using the violence of the state and of laws and the monopoly of fiat currency to try and achieve things in society, you know, we will live in a virtual paradise, but getting people to see this invisible gun in the room, this obvious gun to anyone with the eyes to see, but the invisible gun to those blindfolded by state propaganda in schools, As soon as people see the gun, they'll drop it like a hot potato, but getting them to see it is really hard.
Getting them to see it is...
This is the thing, you see.
There's just vast swathes of indifferent civil servants putting out these policies, you know, slapping the heads of those down at Occupy movements and not asking why.
I mean, there is a lot of good work going on, I think.
A lot of people talking down there.
But the hidden faces of the riot police down there.
I mean, how many people are watching these pictures on TV, say in America, and actually just thinking, oh, they're a bunch of rabble.
I have no idea why they're taking to the streets.
I mean, is that what's going through their head?
I mean, my goodness, you know.
Well, I think so, because of course, I mean, sorry, the perspective of the middle-aged and the old, I just released a video about baby boomers, and the perspective is, you know, people say, well, the young are just lazy.
But I don't really think that's the case at all.
I think that what's happened is the young realize that they've been royally screwed, that they have been really badly educated.
And the education that you and I received was pretty bad, but it's still a lot better than the, quote, education that the young are receiving now.
I mean, here in Canada, 50% of people don't even make it out of high school.
And almost everyone who goes to college has to have remedial writing and reading instruction just to bring them up to a vaguely comprehensible level.
And so they've been really badly educated.
They've gotten massive debts.
They're facing even, like just from the national debt, they're facing even more debts should they decide to go to college.
And if they come out of college, there is no single track that they can Even be remotely assured of getting any kind of reasonable middle-class lifestyle out of things because the economy has become like this twitching, rabid, epileptic, LSD-laced monkey rolling down a barrel on a rocky mountain.
I mean, it's completely insane.
People can't predict, they can't value, they can't figure things out, and everybody knows that there's this looming tsunami of debt requirements, of payoff requirements for the baby boomers' retirement and medical bills.
And so, why?
I mean, people lose their incentive when they can't see a way forward, when they know that everything that they make is going to be taken from them.
I mean, it's not laziness, it's a rational calculation based on uncertainty and dissolution.
Yes, yes, that's right.
Now, I do agree.
Now, and just to state for the record as well, it's Saturday the 10th of December 2011.
It's a quarter past eight in Dublin time, which is the location generally Stefan that I'm in.
I'm speaking with the good Stefan Molyneux.
Are you in Toronto actually?
Is that where you are in Canada?
Yeah, I'm near Toronto.
I was actually born in Ireland myself.
I was born in Athlone.
I used to go there every summer as I lived in London for most of my childhood, but I would go back every summer to Athlone where we had this sort of family estate.
I love the Emerald Isle, so I hope to visit at some point over the next little while and go back to the old sod, but that's my background.
Well, I'll tell you what, it'd be great for you to come here because you're really needed.
From what I can see, people here have either had the The fire in their heart kicked out of them or they're just absolutely dead.
The fluoride in the water is working because I would have hoped they'd be a bit more feisty and awake to the very serious problems.
I mean, yes, I mean, people are getting their homes kicked in, their doors, sorry, kicked in and their homes stolen from them from the state.
And there are movements, both in the UK and in Ireland, that there are groups of people who are fully awake, but by what I mean to that, Stefan, is the illusion of money.
I give debt and all these scripts unveiling in front of you in the House of Commons and Europe and stuff like that, these meetings and stuff, No credibility at all.
You could say one trillion dollars to me.
You could say 23 trillion euros to me.
They do.
They're using these words and it's pointless.
It's like as if they have actual receipts for that money.
It's all baseless rubbish of which in fact though sadly What they are looking to do is to make the entire planet, probably pretty well, overnight as well, a cashless society.
So it would take only about one or two weeks to just say, well, okay, these are our rules.
We'll withdraw everything, including the American dollar, the Canadian dollar there.
The Pound Sterling as well, no one's getting away from this.
And of course the Euro, they're making out that it's just going, the Euro was introduced to impale.
If you know, you know about the wider New World Order plan for one collective government.
One collective humor, no doubt, and you know, based probably in the United Nations, in the States, even though the States is fully and wholly collapsing.
These are the moves being made by them, and this isn't like 20 or 30 years away.
This is actually going to be happening pretty soon.
The mark of the beast, the RFID chip, but also hidden in that...
Well, sorry, but I mean, I think that, I mean, I think it's important to recognize that money I mean, it's an ancient human institution.
It's just a means of facilitating trade.
That's all it is. It's morally neutral.
You know, it's a goal.
So you don't have to find everyone who has a coincidence of needs.
You just can use the money.
There's no problem with that. Letting the government run your money, though, is completely insane.
Asking David Copperfield to build your house.
All he's got is illusions and tricks and distractions and fake mirrors and pretend sores.
I mean, it's all ridiculous.
All he can build to you is a deceptive illusion of a house and the moment you step in it, it comes down like a house of cards, which he then guesses which one you fell in your face.
So there's a huge difference between money as an organic, natural human institution, which I think is perfectly fine and people can choose to adopt it or not depending on their preferences, But it's nothing to do with the government's control of money, which is entirely different and is corrupting and is a mess.
Now, I think that the euro, of course, is a huge mess at the moment.
And what's funny to me, I mean, funny tragically, They keep talking about, you know, we're going to bail out the euro.
But there's this fundamental thing.
If every single country is in debt, which is the case in Europe, if every single country is in debt, where is the money coming from?
It's a basic question that any reasonably intelligent person should ask.
It doesn't take a PhD in economics to say, if everything is negative, where are we getting these positives?
Where are we getting this money?
And as soon as people start asking that question, they then tumble down the rabbit hole.
Sorry, go ahead. No, no, no.
Right on, Stefan. I mean, it always amazes me that even just of late, David Cameron can say things like, you know, he's made a certain amount of billions of pounds available to what is effectively forcing people to, you know, in inverted commas, volunteer for work.
He also made available just prior to Egyptians, the Egyptian government, to basically murder Libyans.
400 million just in arms sales alone was supposedly kept quiet but he was found out to have done that.
He's a known arms sales dealer and so is Tony Blair.
They create money electronically from nothing.
They always did. However, And sorry, I just wanted to point out that the arms sale thing is unbelievable.
I mean, it's something that's really not talked about.
I'm glad you brought it up. It's really not talked about a lot of the world stage.
The Western democracies, I guess, along with Russia, are the biggest arms dealers on the planet.
And I mean, if you think about that, I mean, I know you have, but I mean, if the audience thinks about that just for a moment, we say we need these governments to protect us from people who would do us harm.
It's like finding out that your local police are arming the mafia, which of course does happen as well.
They arm the mafia with money by making drugs and prostitution and gambling illegal, but they also directly arm them at times as well.
The very first thing that you would want from any protective agency is for them not to be selling arms to potential enemies.
It's just so mad that we all have to become mad to even remotely think of it as sane.
I agree with you.
I totally do.
I'm glad you know that because it's like, well, you know, for quite a long time now as well, actually, I'm glad that I've got the information that I've got now because I can see clearly.
Although, You know, it's very uncomfortable because, basically, even the word democracy is BS. It's, you know, Republican or sovereignty, basically, is what it's all about.
You being allowed, not asking permission to think for yourself, but just thinking for yourself kind of thing.
But democracy would be a very easy thing to achieve if we wanted it.
I mean, it would actually be a lot easier than the current system we have.
It's just that nobody in power would have any interest in that form.
Democracy would be very easy.
It would be to abolish the monopoly of the state and have the state be just another charitable agency.
And then people could say, okay, well, I want to help the poor, and so I have the Department of Health and Welfare, or wealth and hellfare, or whatever you want to call it.
You have some government agency.
It's just been privatized.
And say, okay, well, I can give my money to this local church.
I can give my money to some charity.
I can give my money to this ex-government agency, and that would be democracy.
I can give whatever sum I want.
Oh, so there's a Department of Defense that has one way of protecting me and maybe there's Bob's defense agency that has another way of protecting me so I get to pick and choose.
That would be democracy which would be to break up the monopoly of the state and have people give money in return for voluntary services either charitably or through exchange and that would be called democracy.
That would be a true direct dollar democracy but of course that would eliminate the monopoly of type whatever you want into your own bank account predation that so fuels the ruling classes.
But the point is Behind this, I think they're already doing that, Stefan, with regard to private companies.
Very definitely the hidden world of where the money goes within not just a US government You mean the mercenaries, right? Yes, yes.
They're not doing anything other than basically taking the money.
And that money will have strings attached.
It's created out of nothing electronically with interest attached.
It's all done on the quiet as well.
There's no transparency whatsoever.
And that's why most of the, say, Middle Eastern countries, African countries, Eastern European countries, all of them, end up suddenly, boom, boom, there you go.
They've got guns. They're not, like, not from America, but from China.
You know, they've got guns, bullets, bombs, airplanes, tanks, everything.
And it's not healthy, but it's a business.
It's business. And as it turns out, the players right at the very top, Stefan, as you probably well know, you know, they're playing both ends of the game.
It doesn't matter how many people die because they just say so to a number of...
Well, I mean, sorry, but the counter...
I mean, that may be the case, but the counter-argument to that would be that a farmer doesn't kill off his livestock.
I mean, the farmer wants to profit And so I think that they need, you know, the serfs out in the fields growing the corn for them to feast on.
But as regards to the mercenaries, I think, I mean, that's not exactly a consumer to business relationship because the war overseas is always made possible and requires the war at home first, which is To take guns against the citizens and take money from them in order to hand them over to the mercenaries.
But I think there are three major reasons why you see a drift towards mercenaries in modern warfare.
The first, of course, is it allows you to keep a lot of the expenses off book, right?
You don't have to take them directly out of the defense budget.
So that's one of the things that helps them hide the cost.
Sorry, go ahead. And straight up responsibility as well.
So that's the first.
The second is that, of course, politicians always love To give money to companies in return for donations, right?
And in return for campaign contributions and so on.
It's a basic kiss the ring thing, right?
So the more companies that they can enmesh in the defense budget, the more that they're going to ensure their own reelection through that kind of quid pro quo.
But the third, and I think even more sinister, is that...
I mean, I think it's fair to say that mercenaries are probably a little bit colder towards the domestic population than the military.
So one of the problems you have with using the military to quell the domestic population is they all tend to be from the same place, right?
So the British military comes from Britain.
And so if you then ask the British military to turn its guns on the British citizens, there's a problem of allegiance there.
Whereas if you have mercenaries from all over the world, you can import them and use them against domestic populations without any sense of fratricide or brother-on-brother violence.
Now that's very important, Stefan.
And you know that's exactly what they have done.
You know that's what they have done.
They certainly have done with regard to changing the names, the faces within even the high echelons of the police services or all the privatized corporations of the police service.
I mean, these are not white British men, let's say, or just British men, let's just say, with families.
But they're not people who come from the same sort of cultural loyalties and would have some hesitations about bringing guns to bear on the people or the culture that they grew up with, for sure.
I'm just typing in there.
No, they don't.
Now, I mean, that's plenty.
that's planning, the indifference is there, that's right and their faces are covered, they don't have badge numbers they are under EU legislation, not law, just legislation since it even started since 1974, no one was ever really asked for it and they are saying yes, maybe in some people's minds they might in the middle classes might actually think that was the case, but it's not the case it's been forced upon everybody in pretty well every European country
Italy right now has no politicians in charge.
It has just bankers in charge.
Not that the last 17 years of dictatorship from Bellasconi was any different anyway.
He's made his own personal fortune from the pain of the Italians.
Sorry, but also add that the traditional remedy for debt is devaluation of the currency.
That's the traditional remedy, which of course has been rendered impossible by the centralization of the EU. That's the first remedy.
Of course, the second remedy that nobody really wants to talk about is war.
The second remedy for inflation Or for a currency that is teetering on the edge of collapse is to go to war.
And that is to distract people from the fiscal malfeasance of the ruling classes.
And I think that that's not really possible in Europe anymore because of the advent of nuclear weapons.
War has become functionally impossible.
So Europe is facing a very interesting crisis at the moment in that they can't devalue their currency without leaving the euro zone.
Which I think is a pretty radical step.
And nobody really wants to do that because then they have to take their debt with them and they will almost immediately get probably a 20 to 40 percent lowering of the standard of living.
So politicians don't want to do that.
So they can't devalue and they can't go to war.
It's going to be really fascinating to see if there's a third way.
And I think you're right. They are going to attempt some sort of centralization.
But even that isn't going to solve the problem because, of course, labor and capital is already fairly centralized as is currency in the EU. So I think it's going to be very interesting.
I think there's a possibility for a sort of Death Star run.
You know, there's one tiny little tube that we could drop that photon torpedo in, you know, which is a rational philosophy around a relaxation of the reins of power.
Because all of the traditional remedies to the increasing fiscal collapse of late democracies, none of those traditional remedies are available at the moment.
That's interesting. Okay, but I mean...
Given what I've just told you, though, I'm sick to the back teeth of saying that there is an inevitability.
I know, because I've done my research, exactly how war, basically one-sided occupations for any given means, just open your mouth and say the words, it's not, you know, just make it up, it's not real, quite frankly.
But the war, unfortunately, say in Afghanistan, Iraq, twice, three, four times, I've got a list of all the wars here worldwide.
It's not brought mankind closer and the back end of that purely is one of commerce.
People dying, countries getting ruined, generations screwed including radiation for thousands of years based on the success of some kind of financial system.
Yes, I mean that has been the case.
I think that the Rockefellers and the Rothschilds armed wing is NATO. So they've tried, NATO is in bed with and given direction from the United Nations.
They're not the friend that people think they are.
They're working certainly towards all these people, working towards one central government.
But the problems that people are talking about, that people are seeing, including just dying, getting outright murdered right across the They're all caused by this end.
They haven't just suddenly decided at the beginning of this year to start talking about their freedom and sovereignty.
It's all been prodded and poked and, you know, financed even.
But a one-world government is not any kind of solution, as you and I know, right?
But, I mean, it's not even a solution for the ruling class.
So, I mean, if you look at the...
Eurozone as a step towards a European government, it's actually made things much worse.
And so if they were to go to one other level of abstraction and create some sort of separate government around the world, which, I mean, they'd have to exclude the US because the US citizens are just so well armed that they really wouldn't go for that.
But if they try to create some sort of one world government, it's a further level of abstraction and it's a further limitation on the wiggle room that each individual country has to escape the results of its bad fiscal policies and its bribing of the general population.
So I think that if they were to go to one world government, that would be the last domino to fall, I think, before a free society could emerge.
You know, we can try and get the arguments in beforehand, but it wouldn't be like there'd be one world government and that would be it for human freedom.
That would be the last straw of collectivism because it's not like, you know, when Russia took over Eastern Europe during and after the Second World War, That actually accelerated the demise of communism.
So the more you expand irrational systems, the shakier they become.
And a one-world government would be, I think, the fastest way to show how ridiculous and ineffective, evil and destructive this kind of collectivism is.
I could be just a mindless optimist, I don't know, but that's sort of the way that I think it is.
I was just going to say, I was listening very carefully to what you're saying, and that is actually very optimistic.
It's, well, it knows good, it's good.
Look, freedom is going to win.
Freedom is going to win.
Freedom is going to win. Reason is going to win.
Peace is going to win. It absolutely is.
I mean, we have the internet. You and I are able to have this amazing conversation, which would have been impossible even 20 years ago.
And the evidence is out there.
Nobody has any excuse to remain uninformed.
And I think that human beings don't want something Herman Goering said a long time ago, where he said, I mean, look, the average guy on the street, the average farmer in the field, he doesn't want any war.
I mean, what's going to happen? He's going to get dragged away from his family and from his business for years and the best that he can hope for is to return unshattered in body, though he will remain shattered in mind.
There's no benefit to the average person for war and there's no benefit to the average person for inflation and there's no benefit to the average person for fiat currency.
And once we can appeal to people's greed and their self-interest I think the lies that enslave people will fall away very quickly.
Well, I totally see where you're coming from, and I totally agree with what you're saying, absolutely.
But what I'm seeing here is, though, it was being a very slow burn, like the frog in a boiling pan of water, slow, slow, slow, and he might not realize he's cooking.
Well, but I think the heat's getting pretty quickly now, right?
I mean, if you look at the onrush of the Eurozone crisis, if you look at the escalation, of the deficits just over the past couple of years in America.
I mean, it's just astounding.
I mean, I think Obama has doubled the deficit in two years.
I mean, it's truly staggering how quickly all of this stuff is coming to a head.
And of course it's a worldwide problem, We should help people realize that it's not the policies of any particular country, but rather the Western system as a whole.
You know, this predatory bribocracy we call democracy is simply a system that doesn't work anywhere that it's tried.
And of course, it didn't work in ancient Athens, it didn't work in ancient Sparta, it didn't work in ancient Rome.
It hasn't worked anywhere it's been tried.
But unfortunately, the people who failed at making it work tend to be those who help write the history for the next generation to repeat their mistakes.
But the true history of the world, the true reality of the world, the true source of power, which is propaganda and currency in my opinion, the true source of power is becoming much more apparent to people.
And I think as the system begins to collapse, those of us who've said, it's gonna collapse, it's gonna collapse, it's gonna collapse, it's gonna collapse, who've been right all along, I think that there will be an increased avenue to get our message out.
And I think that people do want to live in peace.
I think people are getting pretty exhausted By this rollercoaster of a completely mad economy.
No, Stefan, I know that.
Again, I agree with you, but I know that.
But what I'm seeing here is that none of this is just bad management or just because of greed, right?
This is absolute planning to the nth degree, right?
And behind this is, when I say genocide, the lowering of mankind, When they're forcing, it's too late already, if you're not actually awake and then as a parent you allow a child to be forced to vaccine, say, with squalene into your arm, which maybe in the short term or long term will deliver cancer to your very body on purpose.
By the way, Stefan, those There are other aspects that bother me.
Which is the very existence of HAARP weapons, energy-directed weapons, not just in one spot in Alaska, but all over the world as it turns out, yes?
And those put an imbalance on the whole magnetic system of the Earth.
They're controlling the weather, they're controlling the magnetic systems and actually through those same weapons and even more advanced localized one with the army can control your way of thinking.
Well, okay, but this is what I would say about that.
I mean, to me, that stuff's kind of far out there.
And I say this as a guy who's an atheist and an anarchist and fairly far out there.
And I don't think that any of that is necessary to convince the general population.
And I think what's dangerous about that is it starts to sound a little bit tinfoil-hattie.
And I'm not putting you in that category.
I'm just trying to say that. All we need to talk about is the stuff that everyone acknowledges, right?
Or at least can easily acknowledge that the government has a monopoly on currency and can print whatever they want, that the national debts are, you know, largely fictitious, that money is a debt instrument, that the system can't possibly sustain itself mathematically.
All of that can be explained in sort of 10 or 15 minutes.
The other stuff is, I think, risky because it requires a large amount of research and it requires a large amount of fact-gathering Of which there is contradictory information, so I think it's probably better to stick to stuff that everyone agrees with and doesn't sound too unsubstantiated, if that makes any sense? Yeah, I'm with you.
I am digging on more research and looking to speak with...
I mean, there are experts out there quite happy to speak as well on the harp weaponry.
And I have been on other places as well, so I kind of know where you're coming from with regard to, which I hear quite a lot, you know, Stick with the stuff that you can deal with and find solutions to, ground-based, yes. And there's a lot of that going on with regard to efforts, peaceful efforts, of course, being made in courts all throughout the world, actually, as it turns out.
New Zealand, Australia, Canada, America, Ireland and the UK, anyway.
No, I mean, look, no conspiracies.
There are very few conspiracies that would surprise me.
You know, if they were proven to be true.
Honestly, there are very few conspiracies that would surprise me if they were proven to be true, where I'd say, whoa, okay, maybe if the moon landing was fake.
I don't know. But there are very few that I would find to be like, whoa.
But the thing is that I just, I think that to go further, and you know, when I hear things like, well, the government's controlling the weather and so on, it may be true.
I don't know. I mean, I haven't done the research, but I'm concerned that that sends too many scare signals into people's brains about the credibility.
Whereas if you simply talk about the stuff that everyone knows and can very reasonably, I mean, if you want to know how the Federal Reserve works, you simply go to the Federal Reserve website, you know, or read sort of mainstream economic textbooks and they'll tell you all about it.
Whereas if you go into the other stuff, whether it's true or not, I don't know, but I am a bit concerned that what it does is that it gives people an excuse to dismiss the credibility of the argument because it's not supported by the mainstream.
Whereas the other stuff we're talking about, it's all supported and very Openly accepted by the mainstream.
Right. Okay. Yeah.
Yeah. Fair enough. Well, it's not talked about that.
I mean, there's a great deal amiss.
Possible exceptions may be being RT on the Sky Network, you know, and Press TV out of Iran.
Well, no, but what I mean is in terms of saying that the Federal Reserve, you know, creates money out of nothing and, you know, that money is debt and so on.
I mean, that's all pretty well explained and understood even in mainstream economic textbooks.
So you don't have to go, you know, you can say, and the consequences of that, you know, morally and practically are X, Y, and Z, or if you want to understand why the economy is so bad.
But I'm always concerned about You know, if we go to stuff that is much more controversial, that is much harder to prove, we end up going back and forth with data rather than sticking to the fundamental moral argument that no human being has the moral might to accept the awesome power of making money up out of thin air without that corrupting their very soul and destroying the economy that they're supposed to be protecting.
I think that's, I mean, money, power corrupts and money is the greatest power in the world because it is The source of all other powers.
I mean, the source of the king's power was his ability to bestow gifts on others.
The source of the government's power is its ability to provide preferential legislation and free money to friends and to punish its enemies But it all depends upon money.
You know, whoever has the gold makes the rules.
And giving the government a monopoly on creating whatever money it wants, there's no human being.
I mean, you couldn't do it. I couldn't do it.
I mean, it is Soren's ring.
Nobody can wield that and remain uncorrupted.
And that's just a power where we almost have to gently take away from people.
If you've got, you know, a brother who's a heroin addict, you hopefully can gently take away his heroin from him and get him on some methadone, almost as an act of love, even if it might be driven from exasperation and frustration.
We have to take this power away from people because we need to stage an intervention on the corruption of this power.
We've got to take it away from them. It destroys them, it destroys us, and we need to outgrow it as a species.
Well, okay, okay, because I do see all this...
I see a planning here, I see where it's going, and I see it's happening very, very quickly.
However, I won't step into anything like that with you any further.
What I could ask you is, incredibly, I suppose, with all the pictures, even on the BBC, with regard to people clearly seeing, you know, what David Cameron is doing, and then maybe they flip off the headlines there and still go and watch TV, like in the UK, Stefan, The X Factor and EastEnders on a Saturday night and stuff like that.
I mean, it's shocking that people might feel that on the offset it will all work itself out and they're still living in a safe and secure environment.
But to the ones who are really awake to all this and know they want to change their way of life altogether, how would you suggest someone to basically stop bartering in their promissory notes?
And basically change, well, not comply, of course, to electronically, you know, these letters coming in, including mortgages, electric bills, gas, you know, just step out of altogether, which surely is your right to do without getting harmed from the state for any reason.
Right, so the question is, how can we affect change?
I think the one thing that we need to empirically recognize and understand is the magnitude of the task that we're facing.
When I was a young man, I guess I'm about your age, but when I was a young man, First getting into this stuff around the age of 16 or so.
I was very enthusiastic about the capacity of reason and evidence to change people's minds.
I was touchingly naive and optimistic about it.
And I remember it sort of reminded me of something that Leonard Picoff said.
He was sort of a friend of Ayn Rand's.
And he said, you know, within a year of the publication of Atlas Strike, all of these economic controls are going to be Removed because the arguments are so compelling that Ayn Rand is making and so on.
And I agree the arguments are compelling, but I was so touchingly optimistic about the degree to which when people are presented with the evidence that two and two make four, they'll say, ha, I guess you're right, two and two makes four.
But the reality is, after doing this stuff for 30 years or so, that the historical reality and the reality that I have experienced is that people prefer destruction to change.
And it's a chilling reality.
So, if you look at the lead-up to World War II, which was evident for, you could argue, sort of 12 to 14 years or more before it started, people did not take the steps necessary to avoid that kind of conflict.
I've spent 30 years talking to people about basic reason and evidence and philosophy, And the number of people who've actually changed their minds within my personal circle, I wouldn't even want to tell you the number, but it looks quite a bit like the inside of a bagel.
And so the reality is that you and I know that if people don't challenge the status quo, if they don't think for themselves, if they don't start standing up for what is right and what is peaceful and what is voluntary and what is moral, that we are going to go through an extreme excrement blender at very high speed and there are going to be disastrous social consequences for literally I don't know if people don't believe that's going to happen.
It's sort of like the denial of the drunk who's got a diseased liver.
I'm sure it's going to clear up.
It's going to be fine. It's just a cramp.
I don't know if people don't think it's going to happen, but the reality is that what we're facing is a society where people would rather They'd lose their life savings.
They would rather face incarceration through unjust laws.
They would rather look at the value of their homes get wiped out.
They would rather be threatened with interruptions in their food supply.
They would rather all of this rather than basically look at the facts and think for themselves.
So it's a huge, huge task.
I've got some other ideas, but I sort of wanted to give you a chance to let me know what you thought about that.
No, thank you, Stefan.
That's how I see it.
To me, from where I'm looking, It's stunning to me.
In fact, you worded it very well.
I mean, my goodness. Now, would you say that's a form of Stockholm Syndrome whereby you're actually kidnapped and over time you actually grow a liking to your kidnappers and grow used to the whole situation.
You're basically weaned like a cow away from your parents, away from your real life, stolen, and your mind somehow does forget that, you know, Do you see what I mean?
Very sick. Yeah, yeah.
No, I think there's an element of that to it.
I've done a series on YouTube called The Bomb and the Brain, which people can get to at fdrurl.com forward slash bib, which is a scientific analysis and an interview with a subject matter expert, Dr.
Vincent Felitti, which basically talks about, I mean, reason is our basic human birthright.
I am a stay-at-home dad to a delightful daughter who is now Almost three years old.
And she is a glowingly rational and delightful and conceptual and wonderful human being.
That is her birthright. And I'm never going to teach her my conclusions.
I'm going to teach her not what to think, but rather how to think, because to teach her my conclusions would be to say that I am incapable of error, which is completely not the case.
And so reason is our human birthright, but reason requires that we grow up in a situation of peace and of respect and consideration and that we are not indoctrinated, that we are not bullied, that we are not yelled at, that we are not spanked, that we are not hit at, that we are not dumped into these brain-mashing Shredders of human decency called public schools.
It requires that we live in a free and peaceful state, and that is the natural development of humanity.
You know, like there are these tribes in Africa where they put these hoops on women's necks to make them like giraffes.
They make them incredibly tall.
And what happens then is they no longer can even support their own necks without these hoops because they've become too long.
And the muscles have become too flaccid to allow for that.
And that's what happens to kids.
We prop them up with all of this ridiculous propaganda, whether it's about the state or nationalism or the bloody sports teams or religion or whatever it is, some superstition, the collective pride in the collective or the group.
And they end up not developing the natural muscles of rationality, their atrophy.
I mean, you can see this in the brain.
It physically changes the brain to receive this kind of indoctrination, and you end up with a heightened fight-or-flight mechanism.
You end up with a shrunken neofrontal cortex, which is a receipt of reasoning.
So people have become somewhat incapable of reasoning because of the results of traumas and deceptions from their childhood onwards.
So it's like asking those women in 19th century China who had that foot bound, you know, where their feet would get violently curled over months or years into their own heels.
It was sort of a process that went on.
It's like asking those women to run a marathon.
Well, their physiology has been too distorted to allow them to do that.
And for the most part, human beings lack that muscle of rationality and we simply need to find ways to bring it to them.
There's two ways to do that. I mean, there's the carrot and there's the stick.
You'll be happier if you're rational.
And the stick is, if you're not rational, if you continue to support a system that is marching us off a cliff to our own demise, then I can't associate with you as a human being.
If I'm against racism at some point, I have to stop hanging out with people who cheer every time the KKK come to town and send them money and think that they're the most wonderful thing in the world.
If I'm a Jew, at some point I got to cut the Nazis out of my life.
And so I think that there's a stick which is, you know, join me in the path, the reason, and be a happy human being.
Sorry, that's the carrot. But there's also a stick which is, you know, if you are cheering these evil people, I don't know how I can have a virtuous relationship with you.
That's sort of the approach that I take, and it's certainly been effective in my own life.
I think that's the best we can do.
Yes, it is. These are big problems, actually.
Just two more questions of what I was going to say.
Would you say that...
I mean, obviously, I think the logical, sensible way forward would be for people who are like-minded, who are wide-awake, who do hold the same values as in what you said, that they don't rah-rah-rah, the New World Order, or anything so even close to related to it,
or money, that they could get together in communities together, not just say individual, apart, spread, Yeah,
the Seasteaders have just, I think, started to sign some agreements with some countries in South America to end up with Yeah, there's some movements for that, for sure.
So Uruguay comes to mind, but I'm not positive of the city, of the countries where they have said, okay, we're going to give you some money, we're going to get this land, and you're going to exempt us from laws and regulations, and we're going to set up a voluntary community in these areas.
And it's Patrick Friedman that people can look up to find out more about this issue.
I think that stuff is so fascinating and I can't wait to go visit.
You're so quick.
You're speaking so quickly.
It's great. Did you say Patrick Friedman?
P-A-T-R-I Friedman.
F-R-I-E-D-M-A-N. He's the grandson of Milton Friedman, of course, the famous free market economist.
No, because that's news to me. That's interesting to me.
Seasteaders. In some South American countries, they already were arranging boats and ships of big, big ones.
No, they're actually getting land where they're going to get land where they're exempt from the local state, basically.
They're setting up sort of free zones and are going to try and entice people to come down.
And listen, can I ask you, you know what, let me just, I'm going to just check that out, because I just read this, so let me just...
That's interesting, that's okay, we've got guys here, not too many, mind you, hello, while you're doing that, I'll say you're listening to News Truth Radio out of the UK. It's Saturday, the 10th of December, 2011.
You're with radio host DeWald Van Dandie.
And on this early Saturday evening, just coming on to 5 to 9 now, I'm speaking live with Stefan Molyneux from Canada.
And I am the host of Freedomain Radio at freedomainradio.com.
Of course, freedomainradio.com, is it?
Yes. Freedomainradio.com, that's right.
We are the largest philosophy show in the world!
I guess a little over 30 million downloads now.
That's the deal.
That's fantastic. You're a heck of a talker.
It's fantastic. Occasionally I stop for breath, but not too often.
That's fantastic. Have you been doing this for like, well, yeah, it's a lifetime, isn't it, really, basically?
Well, yeah, I've sort of been full-time for a couple of years.
I did it part-time before.
I used to be a software guy.
I used to be a software executive and entrepreneur for about 15 years.
I studied at a bunch of different colleges, got my master's in history, and also wrote some novels and plays.
I went to the National Theatre School when I was younger, so a bit of an eclectic background, but it all seemed to have come together for this.
No, very good. Yes, it has, for this time, and me too.
And like I said, I'm actually very pleased to be here at News Truth Radio and to have the opportunity to find people like yourself, Stefan, and just go ahead and contact and talk about some very serious matters, you know.
What I wanted to ask you is, have you done presentations in schools and stuff like that ever?
I've done presentations to, I guess, a college class.
I've done presentations at the Students for Liberty Festival, sort of just speeches.
But no, I don't regularly go to schools.
I mean, I think that the introduction to...
I mean, what I'm really fundamentally most interested in is just philosophy and everything that radiates out from that sort of central light source.
And introducing people to philosophy is more than just a sort of dip-in kind of presentation.
So, like, I have a whole introduction to philosophy series, an 18-part series on YouTube and on my podcast feed.
But what I'd like to do, what I'd like to work on is a documentary that is going to be interesting and engaging and funny and stimulate people to think.
Because then, of course, you get 90 to 120 minutes to really make your case with lots of visuals and music and all that kind of funky stuff.
Yeah. I've done some of that.
Mostly what I do when I'm out and about, though, is I talk at libertarian conferences.
Of course, that's something that I have a lot of affinity for, so I've probably spoken at 10 or 20 of those over the past couple of years.
And I was just the master of ceremonies and the opening and closing speaker at the Libertopia Festival.
I try to make it out to the Porcupine Freedom Festival every summer in New Hampshire.
There's Porkfest. There's Liberty Festival in New Hampshire as well.
So yeah, I sort of try and make it.
I love doing speeches and talking to, especially getting Q&A from the audience, I find enormously enjoyable.
So that's sort of what I do when I'm not yelling at the internet at home.
The reason why I ask is that I've done a lot of teaching English as a foreign language in my younger year when I was more fitter and really up for it and it went over a long period of time and I really did enjoy that.
I was always in the subject matter trying to sort of in a subtle way.
I didn't know any of this fact at the time but actually I was talking about United Nations and the corporations and arms sales in certain ways just getting to Getting the children to know that these corporations exist, and at the time, in fact, I think I might have even tried to paste the United Nations as a collective good, which I have changed my mind on that now.
But do you know what I was getting at?
Well, okay, the other day there I was talking with a lovely girl of just 14 years of age live on this radio station, and she was actually very, very mature for her age.
Her mother had homeschooled her.
But with regard to the issues, we're actually talking about some very serious, heavy issues.
And I always distinctly remember, actually around about the age of 13 or 14 in my secondary school, when I was a lot younger there, some geography teacher also was telling us about the nuclear bomb.
And I do remember my...
I don't forget the feeling that came over me of disheartenment and great apathy at that age, thinking, my God, you know, I think what I'm trying to say is if you had a three-year-old it's not too difficult at the moment to slowly tell her who's a good man, who's a bad man or this kind of thing.
I think you've kind of answered my question already.
It depends. You're kind of subtle, more subtle with approaching the very serious nature of what a war is and who's actually doing it.
I'm not trying to obviously qualify the why because there's no absolute logic at all as to why other funny comments.
When I was a young man, I went out with a couple of women not For any intellectual attributes, but because I was shallow and only for their physical attributes, and I very quickly became embarrassed by them.
Oh, intimidated, maybe?
No, no, they would just say stuff that was dumb, because they were dumb but pretty, and I was only going out with them for their looks, because I was a young, shallow man, and it's forgivable than a young man, I'm sure, but I was sort of embarrassed by them, and I've sort of been reminded of that When I start to think about how am I going to introduce the world to my daughter, because frankly I'm kind of embarrassed by the world.
I mean, how am I going to explain to my daughter war?
How am I going to explain to my daughter how much debt she's in just by drawing breath and living in this geographical location?
How am I going to explain how the school system works?
And at the same time say don't use force to take another kid's lunch money.
I mean, how am I going to explain superstition?
How am I going to explain irrationality?
How am I going to explain child abuse?
How am I going to explain murder?
The world is an embarrassing thing to introduce To your daughter, and it doesn't even have the positive attribute of being very good looking.
So, yeah, I don't know.
I mean, I'm just embarrassed to introduce the rest of the human race for the most part to my daughter, and I'll just have to find some way to do that in as positive ways as I can.
Thank you, Stefan.
Actually, I've just got in, there's a listener on the chat box, okay, from Northeetruth.ning.com, and he's asked, do you have an opinion at all on the Libertarian Alliance attack on the Freeman movement, or if you know anything about that.
To be honest, I don't personally know anything about that.
It says the Libertarian Alliance is a blog that I can pop it through to you.
Yeah, I mean, you see these eruptions from time to time in the libertarian landscape.
Sigmund Freud called it the narcissism of small differences.
I have criticisms of political action.
People have criticisms of my approach about bringing freedom and peace to your personal relationships.
There's lots of people who have disagreements about how to achieve freedom.
How to achieve freedom. My particular approach is, and I've always said this, you know, I've made my arguments against the value of political action.
If people don't agree with me, of course, they could be wrong.
They're perfectly free to disagree with me.
I don't claim to have a monopoly on the only sure railroad track to a free and peaceful future.
But all I ask is that people throw themselves 150% into whatever it is that they're doing.
There's nothing that brings you closure to a failed endeavor than giving it your all.
That's the best way to get out of things that aren't going to work.
So, yeah, I think people should give it their all.
And I think that, you know, sort of sniping at each other about the ways to achieve it, you know, make rational arguments, make your best case, and then, you know, encourage people to give everything they've got to whatever course they're pursuing.
And, you know, all that I ask for people is that, you know, because, of course, the big Ron Paul thing is going on in the US at the moment, which is consuming the majority of libertarian efforts, I think.
Just follow the evidence.
Follow the empiricism. Does it work?
Does it achieve what you want it to achieve?
And if not, then start looking for alternatives.
That's my only suggestion. So no, I don't know much about that particular disagreement.
I'm not really up on the ins and outs of the politics of the libertarian communities, but I think that we should encourage each other to pursue our best case and best goals, but be strict with each other about the evidence of what works and what doesn't.
Okay, I just thought of some, because I don't know, because I just met you, Stefan, and I do appreciate you.
That's clear what you just said, that's good.
But, of course, there is, I'm aware of an organization, say in the UK, maybe you're not aware of it, called demos.co.uk, is their website, demos.co.uk.
Basically, it is the corporation of the United Kingdom government, outwith of the farce that continues on down in the parliament and the House of Lords on a daily basis.
They have a website that shows their white papers of which they force policy upon the schools.
Excuse me, I've just eaten a meal now this evening.
Burrito Freedom! Sorry, Colin.
One of the documents in there, I must pull it up, I don't have it in front of me, but it's a conspiracy theories paper, a white paper on the incredibleness of conspiracy theories or so.
And what I'm getting at is that this freeman of the land and freemen or sovereignty, as far as I can see, it's very, very important for people to know.
It's not an idealism and it's not a fantasy, it's not just an effort being made, plucked out of nowhere.
All of it The reality of jurisdiction, say, of the state over a living being, sentient being you should say, the trickery that's been forced all around us even with legalese, is very, very real. I don't really know much about libertarian now myself.
I just know that with regard to people who are making efforts to protect themselves against the state based on their turning Yeah, but you can't.
I mean, you can't. I mean, the practical realities you cannot protect yourself against.
They've got all the guns in the world.
They've got aircraft carriers, nuclear weapons, weapons of mass destruction.
They've got satellites, lasers.
I mean, you can't. They're such an overwhelming force.
You know, back in the day, right, I mean, you could have a peasant uprising and take on a couple of knights, but there's nothing.
I mean, you can't. And you can't win a battle against violence By using violence.
You can use violence in an extremity of self-defense.
I think that's morally defensible and perfectly right.
But it's simply suicide to go up against a state.
It's not going to solve anything.
What we need to do is recognize and trust in the basic virtue and the basic decency of our fellow men and our fellow women.
That everybody who is sane, and it is the vast majority of the population, Will reject violence once they see it.
Once they see the violence, they will reject the violence.
You know, the purpose of philosophy, the purpose of what we're doing, my friend, is to open the sandwich that everyone thinks is filled with delicious meat and veggies and Dijon mustard and mayonnaise, to open it up and say, hey, look, there's a worm in your sandwich.
And then as soon as you say, look, there's a worm in your sandwich, people are going to be like, man, I'm not going to eat that.
Ew, that's gross.
But of course, if it's mixed in with all the other tastes, people may never notice.
So all we're doing is open the sandwich and say, look, there's a worm in it, and there's some spit in it, and there's a little piece of fecal matter in it too, so don't eat that.
All we have to do is keep pointing out, as Monty Python says, the violence inherent in the system.
All we have to do is keep pointing out taxation is violence, fiat currency is violence, laws are violence, incarceration is violence, the war against drugs is a war against people, education, as we call it, is indoctrination, fueled by violence.
All we have to do is keep pointing out the worm and the sandwich and people will put it down of their own accord.
We don't need to go to war against the chef.
Oh dear, I took the metaphor one step too far, but I hope that makes sense.
No, no, that's good.
Thank you. And thank you, Peter, for dropping in these interesting angles and points in the chat box there at News Truth.
Stephan, what was I going to say?
Yes, because you named it, but the point is I've been aware of this for a long time.
I would like to think hundreds of thousands, actually, very good, peaceful, stand-up guys who full well know of their, they don't have to be told about their sovereign or common law, natural, inherent, God-given right to protect yourself.
If someone's going to come up and slap you in the face, you're going to protect yourself.
You don't actually turn the other cheek.
if you know that but still remain peaceful but then say go to a court or in fact you know you're taken in chains to a court and upon lies and deceit the judge therein is in fact just going to Completely ignore the fact that you're there under duress anyway,
and will keep you in fear of being incarcerated for even the slightest matter, including the fact that they've got FEMA camps, just as Alex Jones at least four years ago was saying, all set up and ready within the United States to have army soldiers, US army soldiers have gunpoint.
Right, but I think it's irresponsible to go and get yourself arrested.
At the moment. I mean, not you, but anyone.
Because that's not how the system is going to be...
Because if you get yourself arrested and the majority of people think that you're some disruptor and some antisocial element, then they'll be like, well, good, I'm glad that they got this crazy guy arrested.
It's not going to do anything to change the minds of the general population if they believe that your arrest is justified.
And to me, I look at it like if you are a doctor in a time of plague and you're one of the few people who can actually cure people, those who are willing to be cured of this plague, called irrationality, then it's not a reasonable thing for you.
It's not just and fair and good thing for you to do to get yourself arrested because that just means that you are not out there treating people.
So I think that it's important to stay free.
Give them their money. Who cares?
Who cares? Give them their money.
The important thing is we speak the truth and build a peaceful future.
Let them have the present. Let them have some money.
Obey. It doesn't matter because our focus is on the future.
It's on what we can lead human beings to.
Not, you know, the fact that we've got to throw a few dollars on our side to keep the jackals at bay.
Forget that. Let's just keep marching forward and let's not try and beat the state on its own terms, which is to say that we are going to start using violence because they're much better at it.
They've got much more experience with it.
They've got way more guns and the population will be programmed to cheer our arrest and incarceration.
So it will do nothing of any good and only take us out of a necessary avenue of healing where we need to be.
I do see that.
It makes a certain sense.
Stefan, you're suggesting that people might actually have a choice here against serious extremism and terrorism of the corporation of the United Kingdom and American governments.
But really, if you can keep the wolf at the door, that's right, and pay your bills, if you can, then maybe it's entirely your choice if you don't want to as well.
It's not immoral.
I think it's impractical and I think that it's more driven by, I would say, psychological factors around a hatred of authority rather than a rational plan for achieving freedom.
Oh, that's interesting.
Well, given what you just said, would you suggest that there should be some authority at all, in fact?
Well, I mean, anarchism, I don't like to call myself an anarchist because that's a conclusion.
Any more than a biologist likes to call himself an evolutionist.
I mean, it's just part of the discipline.
But we should not have a monopoly of force in society.
There should not be two moral categories of human beings.
The moral category called a citizen who is expressly forbidden from initiating the use of force to achieve his goals, And then those called the masters, who are not only is it allowed, it's encouraged and moral for them to initiate the use of force to achieve their goals.
These two categories of human beings, I mean, it's logically wrong, it's biologically wrong, it's philosophically wrong, it's morally wrong, and wrongness breeds disaster.
I mean, if you try and build a bridge using the wrong calculations, your bridge is going to fall down or it's going to be way over-engineered and wasteful.
Error breeds disaster and this is fundamentally two moral categories of people.
Those on the one side of the political firewall and those on the other side of the political firewall when there's no biological...
We're not two different species.
We don't... We can't have one rock that falls down and one rock that falls up, and we can't have one species of human beings who must subjugate themselves to force and never use it, and another group of human beings who must always use force and never subjugate themselves.
I mean, this is a category error as far as philosophy of biology and morality goes, and as long as we continue to believe that there are these two worlds of human beings not able to use force, must use force, we're going to forever have these disasters and corrupt people on both sides of the equation.
Yeah, but the constructs, the terminology you just used, Just let you know, in case you may not know, I'm sure you do know, but the word master and citizen are constructs of the whole commercial entity based on the alleged trust,
yeah, that exists on the bond on the name, and Admiralty, UCC. Now therein, in the equation, There was at one time habeas corpus, a piece of legislation stating that you shouldn't be imprisoned because that's the body.
There is a separation between the fictional name and the body within law and legislation.
Now it's not fantasy, it's all completely based on fact.
When freemen talk about being a free man, Sovereigns talk about being a sovereign, they're just clearly stating, and most of the people I know are very very articulate anyway, in stating I am not a civilian, I'm not Yeah, I'm not a tax cattle.
And you're not, absolutely.
Citizen is a fiction. It's a pair of imaginary manacles backed up by the threat of force.
So I agree with all of that.
I mean, to me, it's just around a strategy of change.
We have to change people's minds.
You know, standing up to guns when everyone's cheering those holding the guns doesn't achieve anything other than reinforce people's belief that we need people with guns.
Oh, look, there are all these antisocial elements being arrested.
My goodness, I'm so glad we have these police.
I mean, you're simply playing into the game.
I mean, don't do that. Strike to the root of evil, which is the philosophy which justifies it.
Yeah, that actually, I mean, I and many others in the UK had long, like two years prior, predicted those riots, which is, I think, given civil unrest, is nothing.
Oh, and there'll be many more to come.
Yes, I think so. But you can see that that was...
What's sad and disappointing for the folk there and even a stand back from the police, all technical manoeuvres to allow for actually sniper rifles to be pointed at the public now actually, Stefan in case you missed that.
What's her name? Theresa May and a Bilderberger, Kenneth Clark, Topic of Bilderberger just happens to be The Justice Secretary of the United Kingdom, a corporation of government,
a profit-making government, and so they've now stated that the next set of civil unrest in the UK, which they just can't wait for, they will be using, you know, like Israeli rubber bullets, they say, coming out of rifles and guns, as if that's going to be just a tad safer than your full-on, full-metal jacket bullet.
But, you know, it's ridiculous.
and because of the extremities of the poverty all based on this fictional monetary pinch that's going around because it's all fantasy but a great deal of people actually believe in all this We know when they say 23 trillion that somehow someone's got books and receipts of that.
It's just beyond absurd.
But they're unfolding these scripts in front of people's faces and they're trying to make out that they're trying desperately to do something good for the people of the world when really a full-on market crash and desperate people looking for food because they're a complete breakdown of society.
At the very top Stefan you know none of this is by accident it's shocking beyond belief but none of this actually as it turns out is by accident at all because the more well I don't know I'm more of a sort of negative I'm just looking I'm outraged by it I'm disgusted by it but you would say that what I like to think is that the persistence and the efforts of on every day of the people who I know in my groups and stuff and who are woken up and their persistence and even the higher action and stuff and you know there must be loads of other people stepping forward in higher places within I don't know governments and medical scenarios and stuff like that going oh no no no way and trying to sort of whistle blow you know tell the truth get the truth of what's really going on out there I know there are that's courageous That gives me heart,
doesn't it? Yeah, and look, there's no inevitabilities in history.
History comes down to the dedication, integrity, passion, and actions of discrete individuals.
When you have the majority of humanity's ethics on your side, when you have truth and reason and increasing evidence from the existing disasters on your side, that is about the best place from which to fight that you could ever hope for as an activist.
And, you know, if we can't win this fight, It'll be nobody's fault but our own because we have unprecedented communications tools like this conversation.
We have information available to everyone.
We have the majority of peaceful humanity on our side.
We have truth, reason, evidence, passion, clarity, conviction.
And so if we can't win, you know, we few, we sometimes happy, sometimes unhappy few upon whom this mantle has to some degree fallen.
If we can't win, then Humanity as a whole deserves to lose, because I think that we are the best hope for the future, and so I think that we cannot give in to despair, because that is going to create a self-fulfilling prophecy of the slide to totalitarianism.
That's very hopeful, Stefan.
What I'll try and do is, I'll try to, I'm kind of, there's early stages yet at this, well, no...
I'll try and upload this podcast.
Would you be kind enough on your website?
Do you think it's valuable to put this up as a podcast?
Oh, certainly. No question.
Thank you.
For my listeners too, can you just give your website again?
Yeah, Newstruthradio, there's two, thenewstruthradio.com, or there's actually a site with a nice chat box in it and a lot of information that you can learn from, and that's northetruth.ning.com, so that's N-O-R-T-H and then E, all one word, T-R-U-T-H.ning.com, northetruth.ning.com as well.
Thank you, Stefan. Thank you very much.
I really appreciate it. And people can check out my work at freedomainradio.com.
Freedomainradio.com. That's right.
And like I said, I really appreciate that.
You know, giving me your time to a complete stranger because it actually has lifted me up.
It's very positive and maybe we should do it again sometime.
Victory, brother!
Have yourself a great day. I'll talk to you soon.
God bless yourself. Thank you very much.
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