Sean Hannity Show - NO CO-PAYS, NO DEDUCTIBLES...OH MY!
Aired: 2026-03-12
Duration: 31:30


=== Accessible Care for Families (15:04) ===

[00:00:00]  This is an iHeart podcast.
[00:00:02]  Guaranteed human.
[00:00:05]  Welcome to The Rogue Recap.
[00:00:07]  Hot takes, cold facts, and zero respect for the official narrative.
[00:00:12]  Sit back, roll your eyes, and let's recap.
[00:00:16]  Rogue style.
[00:00:19]  What's up, everybody?
[00:00:20]  And welcome to The Rogue Recap.
[00:00:22]  I am Linda McLaughlin, your host.
[00:00:23]  Please follow us at Rogue Recap at LindaMick, RogueRecap.com.
[00:00:27]  I have an awesome guest today.
[00:00:28]  This guy's a friend, but he's wicked smart, so we brought him on.
[00:00:32]  I know I say that about everybody, but this time it's true, I swear.
[00:00:34]  So Dr. Josh is with us.
[00:00:36]  He has a super weird name, so we don't say it.
[00:00:38]  But his company is the more important part.
[00:00:40]  It's called Atlas MD.
[00:00:43]  And he does concierge medicine and now has over a thousand practices across the United States, partnering with all these other physicians.
[00:00:51]  They're really helping people.
[00:00:54]  And for those of us that have families, have kids, you know, care about the cost of healthcare, care about affordability, accessibility, don't want to make an appointment to have an appointment to have a conversation about the appointment we couldn't get.
[00:01:06]  This is the solution to all those things.
[00:01:08]  So Dr. Josh, welcome to the show.
[00:01:10]  What's up, man?
[00:01:10]  It's great being here.
[00:01:12]  Thank you.
[00:01:12]  You're welcome.
[00:01:13]  So Dr. Josh has this amazing concept.
[00:01:18]  It's called actually practicing medicine.
[00:01:20]  It's a new thing.
[00:01:21]  I think it's really going to catch on.
[00:01:23]  And he sees his patients.
[00:01:26]  He talks to his patients.
[00:01:27]  He has 24-7 accessibility.
[00:01:30]  He does telemed.
[00:01:31]  He also has access to his own pharmaceuticals.
[00:01:35]  So he can give you the prescriptions for pennies on the dollar, as opposed to you getting some jacked up costs that you don't need.
[00:01:41]  He can mail them to your house.
[00:01:42]  All these interesting, unique narratives that are about patient care.
[00:01:47]  And for those of you who remember the book Patient Power by John Goodman, if you haven't read it, I suggest that you do.
[00:01:54]  It really is all about that.
[00:01:55]  It's putting control of your body, your health, what matters to you and your family back in your hands.
[00:02:00]  So Dr. Josh kind of personifies this.
[00:02:03]  And as we head into the midterms and people are talking about the issues that matter, I said to Josh, I'm like, you should come on and talk to the audience so that they can hear that there are people out there that have real answers.
[00:02:15]  And whether you're a Republican or a Democrat, you still need a doctor.
[00:02:19]  You are still a patient.
[00:02:20]  And Dr. Josh does not care about your politics, but he does care about his patients.
[00:02:25]  So I wanted him to talk a little bit about this and explain how he is able to do this.
[00:02:30]  He's going to tell you what he charges a month.
[00:02:32]  I'm going to let him give you that big bang moment because it's ridiculous.
[00:02:35]  How he does it for that cost, what the subscribership is about and what he offers and what he thinks about medicine today.
[00:02:42]  So go ahead, tell us about your practice.
[00:02:44]  Well, you know, this was a dream of ours.
[00:02:47]  You know, we saw going through training how kind of broken the system was.
[00:02:51]  And the story I like to tell is growing up, my dad was a trash man.
[00:02:55]  He's a lawyer now.
[00:02:56]  So we still tell people he's a trash man because it's less embarrassing.
[00:03:01]  You know, shout out to all the lawyers out there.
[00:03:03]  Now he's our lawyer.
[00:03:06]  But the funny thing is it was a great business model.
[00:03:08]  You paid once a month.
[00:03:09]  We picked up once a week.
[00:03:10]  It just made sense.
[00:03:12]  And then as I went through the med school and undergrad and residency training, you saw how the sausage got made and it made no sense.
[00:03:19]  Patients weren't happy with it.
[00:03:21]  Doctors weren't happy with it.
[00:03:22]  Employers weren't happy with it.
[00:03:23]  So it was funny that it wasn't working for anybody, but we kept doing it in a broken way.
[00:03:28]  So we were watching, you know, other practices that are doing interesting things, whether that was concierge on the very high end, no insurance, or fee for service on the very low end, no insurance.
[00:03:40]  And we wanted to kind of make the best of both worlds there.
[00:03:43]  We wanted to have our proverbial cake and eat it too.
[00:03:46]  So we created this in 2010.
[00:03:49]  We had no idea what we were doing, but that was nice because it was the emperor's new clothes.
[00:03:53]  We didn't know what we were supposed to do right.
[00:03:56]  And it gave us that flexibility to really design a new system.
[00:04:00]  But yeah, it's $50 a month for adults, $10 a month for kids for unlimited home visits, work visits, office visits.
[00:04:08]  All the telemedicine is free because that's just an extension of the office.
[00:04:12]  So calling, texting, emailing, video chat.
[00:04:15]  The goal really is to meet patients where they're at.
[00:04:18]  It was kind of this broken idea that you only got paid if you brought the patient through the door because then at least insurance had some sort of bottleneck on how much money could be spent.
[00:04:29]  But we appreciate that so much of the care happens outside of the exam room.
[00:04:34]  And we eliminated co-pays.
[00:04:36]  We don't need them.
[00:04:37]  They're not part of the financial business model.
[00:04:40]  They're more of a psychology business model.
[00:04:43]  It was the insurance giving you a speed bump before you spend their money.
[00:04:47]  And so we just kept innovating on ways to bring more value to the patient.
[00:04:51]  The doctors don't like billing insurance.
[00:04:53]  They don't like red tape.
[00:04:54]  It doesn't help the patient.
[00:04:55]  So yeah, we just, and, you know, 20 or 16 years later, it's still going strong.
[00:05:02]  It's interesting, you know, that you talk about the co-pays, right?
[00:05:06]  Because I feel one of the things that I hate the most as a mom and as a patient myself when I have to go in for myself is when they say, well, you're going to need a referral.
[00:05:16]  That drives me bananas.
[00:05:19]  So I feel like many of us, I'll speak to two examples.
[00:05:23]  One is the referral.
[00:05:24]  You need a referral to go see this doctor.
[00:05:27]  Yes, I know.
[00:05:27]  That's why I'm here seeing you because I don't know where to go.
[00:05:31]  I think we're doing that right now, right?
[00:05:33]  That to me is such talk about bullshit, right?
[00:05:36]  Talk about just billing to bill.
[00:05:38]  And then the other thing to your point is the accessibility.
[00:05:41]  Like you're like, you can text me, you can call me, you can email me.
[00:05:44]  That's why I'm your doctor.
[00:05:45]  That's why I'm here.
[00:05:46]  Being a doctor is not a nine to five job.
[00:05:48]  You know, people don't get sick within the, you know, normal business hours.
[00:05:52]  Exactly.
[00:05:53]  Yeah, they don't schedule it.
[00:05:54]  No.
[00:05:55]  Yeah.
[00:05:55]  No, it takes a lot of patience to be a patient.
[00:05:58]  Or aka it kind of sucks to be a patient, right?
[00:06:01]  Yeah.
[00:06:02]  It's not a virtue.
[00:06:03]  It's a bitch.
[00:06:05]  And so, yeah, and I think that you would never redesign this model if you put the patient first and like put all these roadblocks in.
[00:06:13]  And if I went to a hotel while traveling and said, oh, well, you need a pillow.
[00:06:17]  You know, you need to go to the pillow store.
[00:06:18]  Of course I need a pillow.
[00:06:19]  That's why I'm at a hotel.
[00:06:21]  I need all the hotel things.
[00:06:23]  And then somehow that's my responsibility or nobody knows, you know, how or what.
[00:06:28]  But it's broken for like, the system is working even though it's broken.
[00:06:34]  Right.
[00:06:35]  The Affordable Care Act and the way that it's set up is the systems get paid for volume.
[00:06:41]  And they, if they got paid one price for all your care, they would streamline that and not create as many visits.
[00:06:48]  But they're it's like a lawyer being paid by the word, right?
[00:06:52]  So, oh yeah, now we get another copay.
[00:06:55]  Yeah, the family doctor could take care of your psoriasis, but if we refer you on to dermatology, then we get another doctor visit and we get a bill dermatology price, not family doctor price.
[00:07:06]  And we squeeze money out of the system.
[00:07:10]  So you have this very competitive care system against the insurance system.
[00:07:16]  And they're trying to get as much money from each other as they can.
[00:07:19]  And the patient gets stuck in the middle.
[00:07:22]  So when you say, look, I'm paid one price for the month.
[00:07:26]  I might as well be as efficient as possible, make it as easy.
[00:07:29]  I don't need to schedule you unnecessarily.
[00:07:31]  If you can text me and that's faster and better for you, it's faster and better for us.
[00:07:36]  And I heard something recently, if you flip it on its head, you would never see a fee-for-service gym, right?
[00:07:43]  You would, where you have to pay every time you go in because that's not the psychology of people don't want to go to the gym, right?
[00:07:49]  Or at least most people don't.
[00:07:51]  And most people don't want to go to the doctor.
[00:07:53]  So you build a system with fewer barriers, not more.
[00:07:57]  And like, okay, I'm at work, the kid's sick, they just sent a picture of a rash.
[00:08:01]  I don't want to add all this to my day, but I can order anything I want from Amazon, but I still have to drive across town to see my doctorate.
[00:08:09]  It's, it doesn't make any sense.
[00:08:11]  It's outdated and there's better ways.
[00:08:13]  Yeah.
[00:08:13]  And I think to that point, right?
[00:08:14]  So you've been practicing medicine for two decades, if not more, right?
[00:08:18]  Because we're not including school and residency and all the things.
[00:08:21]  So you're talking.
[00:08:22]  upwards of two decades.
[00:08:24]  And you've probably seen a lot of the same things as I would hope you would as a professional in your business.
[00:08:31]  I think part of what we're trying to achieve here is I can do telemed for some of the basic things because of the fact that I have seen this on 13 or 15 other patients, maybe just in the last two days because there's something going around or whatever.
[00:08:45]  So I don't need that in-office visit.
[00:08:47]  Yeah.
[00:08:49]  The reason for the office visit was never for the quality of the care.
[00:08:52]  It was just for the building aspect.
[00:08:54]  And I think you take something like depression or anxiety.
[00:08:58]  I feel the care is better when they're not in the office.
[00:09:02]  And it's always nice to have a good cry session and see eye to eye and talk to people.
[00:09:08]  But if you're really anxious, you're anxious about coming to the doctor's office.
[00:09:12]  You're anxious about having that phone call and juggling work and everything else.
[00:09:16]  So if you just wake up at 2 a.m. and type out an hour-long email to your doctor and go to bed feeling better, that's care.
[00:09:23]  Right.
[00:09:23]  And I don't have to answer it at 2 a.m., but I can take that, you know, it read it through it later, build a response, you know, give you links.
[00:09:32]  Right.
[00:09:33]  I think it's, we've always felt the care was what was documented in bill to insurance.
[00:09:38]  But really, that's the least caring part of all of this.
[00:09:43]  So to be able to take my time and give you a great answer and not feel rushed, but also provide more resources that then you can remember, oh, yeah, find that email, save that link, go to that resource.
[00:09:54]  It's just a much richer experience and it's cheaper, right?
[00:09:58]  Like that's the, it should feel too good to be true aspect of it, but but also Costco is too good to be true.
[00:10:04]  And this is really just a Costco model.
[00:10:05]  That actually dovetails perfectly into my next question.
[00:10:08]  So you're doing something that everybody should be doing, right?
[00:10:12]  Because it makes sense.
[00:10:13]  It makes more time for the patient.
[00:10:15]  It makes more time for the doctor.
[00:10:17]  So you don't feel rushed because typically, whether you're billed $50 or $800, you're getting 10 minutes.
[00:10:23]  And so, which also really stinks because sometimes it does take more than 10 minutes.
[00:10:28]  I mean, you know, full disclosure, everybody, I am a patient of Dr. Josh's, as are my kids.
[00:10:33]  And there are times when I'm on the phone with him for an hour and he is on the phone where I'm like, well, wait, I don't understand this.
[00:10:38]  I don't understand that.
[00:10:39]  What should I take for this?
[00:10:40]  And he's like, you don't need an antibiotic.
[00:10:42]  You need a sinus thing.
[00:10:44]  You don't need this, you know, because I'm not a doctor.
[00:10:46]  But he takes the time to talk to me.
[00:10:48]  I think one of the things that is, I'm trying to understand is why everybody's not doing this.
[00:10:55]  It seems like a more efficient model, both economically and time-wise.
[00:11:00]  Yeah.
[00:11:01]  I mean, if I had an answer to that, then everybody would be doing it.
[00:11:05]  I'm glad they're not.
[00:11:06]  I'm glad that you're the one.
[00:11:07]  And trust me, I'm happy for you.
[00:11:09]  Well, but I think it's doctors are very risk adverse and the system is so big.
[00:11:14]  I mean, 20% of our GDP, it just moves really slow.
[00:11:18]  And there's a lot of people who are frustrated with the high insurance premiums, but don't need a lot of care.
[00:11:24]  And so it's one of those like doing your taxes, you hate it every time, but the frustration wasn't to the boiling point.
[00:11:31]  And when we started this in 2010, there were, you know, a handful of doctors doing this model.
[00:11:36]  And now there's almost 3,000 clinics doing this model.
[00:11:40]  So I think we are seeing a huge increase because in perspective, it took Starbucks 16 years to get their first 17 stores and they're selling coffee, right?
[00:11:51]  then as we compete against a system that gets worse every year and we always try to keep our prices low, I think it makes the change for the direction of change easier every year.
[00:12:03]  And so far in 2026, we're seeing that.
[00:12:05]  This is the most expensive year in the history of healthcare.
[00:12:08]  And people are saying that's, they're kind of just tapping out.
[00:12:11]  Yes, I understand I want insurance.
[00:12:13]  I need it.
[00:12:15]  I've moved heaven and earth to be able to afford it.
[00:12:17]  And now I just can't anymore.
[00:12:19]  We played all the games of deductibles and out of pockets and whatnot.
[00:12:22]  And so they're, but now when they drop an $800 per month insurance plan per person, they actually have more money.
[00:12:30]  Right now they can find an affordable insurance plan, pair it with direct care, and actually maybe save extra.
[00:12:37]  So I think we'll see this really start to take off in the coming months and years as it's just a better product.
[00:12:43]  And that's what patients want.
[00:12:44]  So to that point, I know that you do telemed, you do in office when necessary.
[00:12:50]  You'll go to somebody's house if necessary.
[00:12:52]  You're able to prescribe prescriptions.
[00:12:55]  You're able to send those prescriptions from your in-house pharmacy.
[00:12:59]  What about things like, you know, if somebody needs a lab or somebody needs an MRI or things like that?
[00:13:04]  How does that work?
[00:13:05]  It's pretty well, right?
[00:13:07]  The doctors doing this model have access to wholesale meds, but we have them basically behind that wall.
[00:13:12]  And when you cut out the middleman, now, you know, Walmart has a $4 a month prescription plan.
[00:13:18]  We have a $4 a year prescription plan.
[00:13:21]  So a lot of meds that are a penny a pill.
[00:13:23]  So you remove that hassle, that insurance bureaucracy, that wait at the pharmacy, but you kind of apply that same concept to other pieces.
[00:13:31]  Oh, we have client bill, which is basically just doctor pricing with national labs like Quest or LabCorp, which patients can get anywhere across the country through a direct care doc.
[00:13:42]  So a standard blood test to see if you have diabetes, A1Cs, it's going to be around 250, $2.50.
[00:13:50]  Check your thyroid for $2.75.
[00:13:53]  Check your cholesterol for $3.
[00:13:56]  Now, when you make the care so cheap, it's too cheap to insure.
[00:14:00]  You save 30 or 40% off your insurance premiums among other changes.
[00:14:05]  And a cash MRI in Kansas might be $350, but in Florida, it's $250.
[00:14:11]  Again, since most people aren't getting an MRI too often, just the savings for more affordable insurance helps to cover those things.
[00:14:19]  But when it's billed through insurance, it's $3,000.
[00:14:22]  Right.
[00:14:23]  So to that point as well, if I look at, for example, I have had to have, you know, all my kids are athletes.
[00:14:31]  Something is always broken, inevitably.
[00:14:35]  And even though you can have insurance and it's supposed to be a copay at the hospital, I can't get the appointment through the insurance.
[00:14:44]  So I can't get the appointment for the surgery.
[00:14:46]  I can't get the appointment for the MRI.
[00:14:48]  I can't get the, I mean, it is like, these are not things like if you're going in for a CAT scan, an MRI, an ultrasound, a Sonogrant, whatever these things are, it's because something is potentially more serious and requires a deeper look.

=== Fixing Hospital Trust Issues (09:37) ===

[00:15:04]  And yet we can't get you in for a month.
[00:15:07]  Right.
[00:15:08]  But if I turn around and say, I'll pay cash, you don't have to run it through my insurance.
[00:15:13]  I can get you in right now.
[00:15:14]  We have an appointment in an hour.
[00:15:15]  I'm like, oh my God.
[00:15:18]  You know, and I guess it's shocking, not shocking, right?
[00:15:21]  In the sense of if Amazon was waiting for my check, my pay per check to be mailed, then yeah, they're not shipping anything till they get the money.
[00:15:30]  And whoever pays the piper picks the tune.
[00:15:32]  I think that's how good it can be with consumer-driven healthcare.
[00:15:37]  The consumer has the money, then suddenly everybody finds a way to make this work, right?
[00:15:42]  I find this sort of infinitely hilarious that Walgreens can tell you exactly what everything in their store costs.
[00:15:48]  You can see the inventory, you see how many boxes of cereal are there and what the price is, and they'll run a coupon and they just make that as easy as possible because they have to to compete against other stores.
[00:15:58]  But then you get to the meds and oh, we have no idea what these things cost and we have to run your insurance and it's bloated.
[00:16:05]  It's just such a huge profit center for most places.
[00:16:08]  They don't want to compete.
[00:16:09]  They don't, you know, there's companies that sell pills online that we get for five cents that they sell for 10 cents.
[00:16:15]  Right.
[00:16:16]  Because they can't.
[00:16:18]  And that's the issue is my dad would joke, you know, rule number one of the rat race is everybody's got to keep being a rat.
[00:16:25]  And yeah, we're in some ways you could argue we're giving up a lot of profit by doing the meds basically at cost plus 10%.
[00:16:33]  But also then we don't need a marketing budget, right?
[00:16:36]  We don't have a problem recruiting and retaining patients.
[00:16:39]  But also we're, I think we're building trust with the patient because they can see how transparent that is.
[00:16:45]  There's a trust issue in medicine, like, ah, you, you're just treating my recommending high cholesterol medicine because you make money off that.
[00:16:53]  And then you get the bill and it's 34 cents a month for your cinemostatin.
[00:16:57]  And you're like, well, if he is making money on it, it's not enough.
[00:17:00]  Yeah, right.
[00:17:01]  I pay for his office.
[00:17:02]  Right, right.
[00:17:04]  Maybe it's because I think you need it.
[00:17:05]  And then like, okay, now I can trust you because you're transparent when others aren't, or there's no reason to lie for 34 cents.
[00:17:14]  Or now you kind of feel like the Mr. Rogers thing, right?
[00:17:17]  Look for the helpers.
[00:17:18]  Now the doctor will tell you what that is or go the extra mile or yesterday you had a 90 visit 90 minute visit with the whole family and some were joining by Zoom and speakerphone and because everybody needed to hear this and we wanted to just be very efficient and take the time it takes.
[00:17:38]  And no insurance should pay for that, right?
[00:17:41]  That's it's not what insurance is for.
[00:17:43]  It's for taking care of rare and expensive events, not for what the doctor is supposed to be doing, right?
[00:17:50]  High touch care.
[00:17:52]  And so I think that's it too, is separating insurance is a great tool for the right thing.
[00:17:58]  A wrench is a can make a decent hammer, but a hammer makes a horrible wrench.
[00:18:02]  We keep trying to force doctors into doing something through the lens of insurance when really you just, it's designed by subtraction, cut all that out and what's left ends up being very effective.
[00:18:15]  You know, I'm interested in how you work with hospitals.
[00:18:20]  And if they, so I'm assuming that you would tell your patients, you have us for $50 a month, 10 bucks for your kids, and that covers you, you know, for everything.
[00:18:30]  And then catastrophic insurance for things like outside of the boundaries.
[00:18:34]  Like, what do you recommend to people who have that question?
[00:18:38]  Yeah.
[00:18:38]  In the same way that you kind of have cash for gasoline, savings for tires, and insurance for car accidents.
[00:18:46]  We would make the similar analogy that you use, you know, general cash for the direct care, $50 a month membership, meds for two or three dollars a month, et cetera.
[00:18:56]  And then your savings for the bigger stuff, maybe that MRI for $350 or that CT for $250.
[00:19:02]  And then some form of health insurance.
[00:19:05]  It sounds a little vague, but it makes sense.
[00:19:08]  I say, we recommend the most affordable insurance you're comfortable with because insurance is really not health insurance, it's financial insurance.
[00:19:16]  And if you're young and healthy, it's easy to say, I'll roll the dice and hope for the best because statistically that's what happens.
[00:19:26]  But I've got car insurance.
[00:19:27]  I usually have home insurance or those kind of things.
[00:19:30]  Or if I fall in my parents' house, they have home insurance.
[00:19:33]  So you're never completely abandoned.
[00:19:35]  But then there's the cost sharing programs that were an interesting aspect out of the Affordable Care Act.
[00:19:43]  Then you have The ACA plans, if you can afford the deductible, or we work with employers to decrease their insurance premiums so that they can pay for the membership and the insurance.
[00:19:57]  But so there's a range of options.
[00:19:59]  And of course, we have one ourselves and we built an insurance program.
[00:20:04]  It's much harder than it sounds.
[00:20:06]  Now we know.
[00:20:06]  But to build an insurance plan that fits directly with direct care.
[00:20:10]  So that a family of four under 40 should be under $450 a month.
[00:20:16]  So say that again, because people need to hear that.
[00:20:18]  Yeah.
[00:20:19]  A family of four under 40, two adults, two kids would be under $450 a month.
[00:20:24]  And the national average is getting close to $2,500 a month.
[00:20:29]  Yes, it is.
[00:20:30]  And you can do a lot of good.
[00:20:32]  There's this perception that the best way to spend the money is on the health insurance premium.
[00:20:37]  And I think what families are realizing is that's no longer true.
[00:20:41]  And they'd rather just, yeah, have their own and say, well, you know, how much less anxiety would I have if I had a thousand extra bucks a month to either pay off my bills or buy a doctor or help my kids college fund.
[00:20:54]  And those are the things that I think really matter.
[00:20:56]  And I talk with my med students all the time.
[00:20:59]  If we take our seriously of do no harm, that should also include do no financial harm.
[00:21:04]  So doctors should be finding a way to help patients kind of throughout the whole system from family medicine to meds to labs to imaging to specialists to pathology to hospital bills and whatnot.
[00:21:16]  So I want you to speak to, and you did just a little bit there about your health insurance.
[00:21:21]  So atlas.md, for those of you listening, is where you can go to find out more about Josh and his partnering physicians in their clinics all across the country.
[00:21:31]  And then Atlas Insurance is brand new.
[00:21:34]  I will tell you as a friend of Josh, talking to him over the past four years, he has been through it trying to make this a reality.
[00:21:41]  So God bless you for sticking with it.
[00:21:44]  Tell us what it costs for that and how that works and how people can find out more and get involved and get that insurance.
[00:21:50]  Yeah, the insurance website is atlas.direct.
[00:21:53]  We're in 20 states.
[00:21:55]  The goal is that it's a plan that's closer to something like AFLAC, where we want the payments to go to the patient, not to this broken system.
[00:22:07]  So it's the prices are based on age, gender, and state only.
[00:22:13]  So we don't make this as a complicated sign-up process because other insurances might see you as a high risk if you have high blood pressure.
[00:22:22]  We don't because we know blood pressure meds are a penny a pill.
[00:22:26]  And that just kind of really changes the math on this.
[00:22:29]  And you have to be a member of a direct care practice.
[00:22:32]  That was part of our goal.
[00:22:34]  But that still fits with the car insurance analogy of if you try to insure family medicine, then that's when the price explodes.
[00:22:42]  Everyone thinks the expensive part is hospitals, cancer, surgeries.
[00:22:45]  That's actually not bad.
[00:22:49]  It's the daily stuff that nickels and dimes you to death.
[00:22:54]  But the insurance is no deductible, no copay, no network.
[00:22:59]  You're welcome to use it anywhere and then you can enroll all year long.
[00:23:03]  And that covers a hundred thousand dollars in care.
[00:23:06]  And, and there everyone, the most common question is, is that enough?
[00:23:09]  And by our math, it is most people.
[00:23:12]  They hear these giant inflated bills but no one pays that bill.
[00:23:16]  Um, to that point, we partner with the great company goodbill.com and they're a hospital negotiation service that we, we offer their services for free for our uh, both our clinic patients and our insured patients, so that we can try to help you on the front end and in the middle and on the back end.
[00:23:34]  Because um, hospitals don't give out all the required discounts that they need to to maintain their surprise right yeah um, they will if you ask.
[00:23:43]  Just most people don't know to ask.
[00:23:45]  Or most people try to pay through insurance.
[00:23:47]  And and the really frustrating thing is um, the hospitals incentivize to to inflate these prices because eventually they sell this debt on the debt auctions.
[00:23:58]  Um, so you can buy 100 to 200 of medical debt for a dollar.
[00:24:02]  What right, it's insane, it is absolutely insane.
[00:24:05]  So a lot of times the direct care community to you know um uh, do a good deed or help a charity or something, will get together ten thousand dollars to buy, you know um, you know a hundred plus thousand dollars of of uh medical debt and just give it away.
[00:24:19]  And there's great services that do that.
[00:24:21]  Um yeah uh, undo medical debt is one we've partnered with a lot and um, we did that.
[00:24:26]  Once we did a reverse copay where we paid patients.
[00:24:29]  Um uh, you know, we did a raffle.
[00:24:31]  I saw that a bar did that.
[00:24:33]  They gave everybody walked it through the door five dollars as a reverse cover charge.
[00:24:36]  I thought god, that's brilliant right um, and I saw Duncan this is in your neck dunk and Donuts.

=== Reversing Medical Debt Burdens (05:33) ===

[00:24:42]  Uh today uh somebody, uh had a medical problem or whatever.
[00:24:46]  They covered the bill.
[00:24:48]  Uh, gave them coffee for a year and then bought them uh, you know, tickets to the baseball season, like you're like that's like brilliant marketing right, because it costs nothing but it makes you feel good and uh, and so when health care is transparent, that's that's really easy to do and I feel like that's real caring, and and and companies want to feel, you know, cared for and cared about, and and that's where direct care comes in uh,
[00:25:13]  so there's just all these great ways to uh look at the system and find solutions wherever they're at, meds for 95 less, labs for 95 less, but hospital discounts and no co-pays.
[00:25:27]  So it's really easy to get down on the healthcare system right now.
[00:25:30]  No, it doesn't feel, if you're a patient, that someone's looking out for you, but I think it's it's brightest before the the dawn.
[00:25:37]  No, I think I hope that everybody, listening to this, I strongly advise you to check out, to check out dr Josh.
[00:25:45]  He's not just, as you can hear, the most normal, relatable person.
[00:25:49]  He's not trying to over talk you with fancy schmancy words and make you feel like you are a waste of his time.
[00:25:55]  I don't think there is anything more infuriating than trying to get to your doctor to ask a question.
[00:26:01]  If I didn't think it was important, I wouldn't bother you.
[00:26:03]  That doesn't mean there aren't people out there who are like out of their minds and just you know they're like hypochondriacs right, they're just constantly calling about things.
[00:26:10]  That's a real thing.
[00:26:11]  But your average joe is like I just what do you think?
[00:26:14]  Just like take some tylenol.
[00:26:16]  Like where am I?
[00:26:16]  You know, like they just have a simple question.
[00:26:18]  I am one of those people.
[00:26:19]  I am not doctor Google.
[00:26:21]  I'll look at Doctor Google and then send it to you and be like yo.
[00:26:24]  Is this for real?
[00:26:25]  Because I don't think that's not my thing.
[00:26:27]  Like people are experts in their field for a reason, and part of the problem with medicine right now is, while you may be an expert, I can't get to you.
[00:26:36]  I can't talk to you, And your nurse or your assistant or your secretary at the front desk is an asshole.
[00:26:43]  So when I call and she's mean to me, I don't want to come to your office anymore.
[00:26:48]  You know, I mean, so much of the patient care has been lost.
[00:26:53]  And I feel like you are like this shining light on the hill, right?
[00:26:57]  I'm like, oh my God, there's one guy doing it right.
[00:27:00]  Well, and thousands of doctors, you're working with us to do that too.
[00:27:04]  Yes.
[00:27:05]  And that's, but you're right.
[00:27:06]  We lost the hospitality side of things.
[00:27:08]  Disney does a better job of that.
[00:27:10]  And, you know, there is that aspect of, I left the office, but I still have a question.
[00:27:15]  And I guess that's so true.
[00:27:17]  Yes.
[00:27:18]  And I think half the time I'll tease patients that they're hypo contracts, but the system made them that way because they have all these questions and no answers.
[00:27:26]  And like, great, keep emailing.
[00:27:28]  Eventually, you kind of run out of questions, right?
[00:27:30]  Like, that's the any membership model.
[00:27:32]  Netflix knows you're going to watch a lot of videos at times, but then calm down at times.
[00:27:37]  And, you know, hey, that's our business problem to solve.
[00:27:40]  But the fact we've been doing it for 15 years across thousands of doctors says it works.
[00:27:45]  For sure.
[00:27:46]  And that gives those patients, you know, if you pay a lower price, now everybody gets, you know, access to everything in the gym rather than at a price that's ridiculous, essentially.
[00:27:57]  And this is that same way.
[00:27:59]  Now, if you need more, you don't have to worry about paying more.
[00:28:01]  You're good.
[00:28:03]  A gentleman had a weird skin infection.
[00:28:04]  I saw him every day for a month by either in the office or text or email picture or video call, just, and it took, you know, a couple of minutes each time.
[00:28:13]  So it probably wasn't an hour over the whole month, but we made sure we adjust the meds, you know, change dressings, do whatever, keep it good.
[00:28:21]  And to think that, you know, for $50, that could have been medical, you know, I don't want to say bankruptcy, but just stress and debt and hassle and no one's paying for that.
[00:28:32]  And not being able to get in and then worrying that you can't.
[00:28:35]  He was an early riser.
[00:28:36]  So usually my 530 text was him.
[00:28:39]  I slept through them, you know, but every morning, great.
[00:28:41]  Hey, wonderful.
[00:28:42]  I love it.
[00:28:43]  I'm a dad of guys.
[00:28:44]  Give me data.
[00:28:44]  Tell me how that fingers.
[00:28:45]  You know, most patients won't communicate enough.
[00:28:48]  You know, you get pink eye.
[00:28:49]  Text me a picture.
[00:28:50]  Text me a picture every hour.
[00:28:52]  You know, let's not worry about this because that continuity of care is great.
[00:28:56]  You're paying for that.
[00:28:57]  And so when I go to Costco, I have no need to go to other grocery stores, right?
[00:29:01]  Because I know my best value is there.
[00:29:03]  And I love the idea, you know, behind the Costco hot dog, right?
[00:29:07]  Like I F and murder you if you change the price of this hospital.
[00:29:11]  Right.
[00:29:11]  That CEO was committed to it.
[00:29:14]  And I feel like doctors should have some aspect of that of like, no, we are committed to no co-pays.
[00:29:19]  Yes, you know, there's inflation and other stuff, but some things we just, you know, patient comes first.
[00:29:25]  And, you know, if you need, you know, some dressing or, you know, some wrap or band-aids in the office, like, you know, the courtesy of those things, we've, we've lost that because we've squeezed the profitability of clinics to the breaking point.
[00:29:39]  Patients feel it, doctors feel it.
[00:29:41]  Yeah.
[00:29:41]  And the patient feels like a number and the doctor feels annoyed because we're all working under the same burden.
[00:29:47]  So you remove the burden and you return to what once was patient care.
[00:29:52]  What's so amazing is it's so bad for everybody, but then we're still hesitant to change, right?
[00:29:57]  Yeah, nobody's happy with it.
[00:29:59]  I have to say though, but there are, see, it's, it's to your point, right?
[00:30:03]  Like there are people who forge a path, i.e. you, right?
[00:30:06]  You forge a path, you try something new.
[00:30:08]  Your dad is a perfect example of that, right?
[00:30:10]  Working in sanitation, being a trash man his whole life, and then going back to school and becoming an attorney.

=== Forging a Better Path (01:14) ===

[00:30:16]  You know, there's something amazing to that.
[00:30:18]  It is.
[00:30:19]  And he had this great, he had a First Amendment case that actually went to the Supreme Court.
[00:30:23]  I remember critical of the local government and became a huge case.
[00:30:26]  And, and, you know, I think we learned that.
[00:30:28]  It's like, if there's something wrong, you just fix it, right?
[00:30:31]  Consequences be damned.
[00:30:33]  But at the same time, then you sort of realize that just because it is, doesn't mean it has to stay that way.
[00:30:38]  So if it's broke, go fix it.
[00:30:39]  It's a novel idea, Josh.
[00:30:41]  I'll tell you.
[00:30:41]  I hope it catches up.
[00:30:42]  I tell you.
[00:30:43]  Me too.
[00:30:44]  No.
[00:30:45]  Fixing broken things 2027.
[00:30:47]  Yeah, we're at it, man.
[00:30:48]  We're all done.
[00:30:49]  Guys, thank you for listening.
[00:30:51]  This is The Rogue Recap.
[00:30:52]  I've been here with Dr. Josh.
[00:30:54]  If you haven't heard the websites, atlas.md, atlas.direct, please go.
[00:30:59]  Please find out more.
[00:31:00]  He's wonderful.
[00:31:01]  It can only help you and your family.
[00:31:03]  I promise you.
[00:31:04]  I already do it.
[00:31:05]  Josh, thanks for being with us today.
[00:31:06]  You're the best.
[00:31:07]  Thank you.
[00:31:09]  I am Linda McLaughlin.
[00:31:10]  This is The Rogue Recap.
[00:31:11]  You know what to do.
[00:31:12]  RogueRecap.com at LindaMick at Rogue Recap.
[00:31:15]  Be careful out there.
[00:31:16]  Pray for our troops.
[00:31:17]  Have a good night, everybody.
[00:31:26]  This is an iHeart Podcast.
[00:31:28]  Guaranteed human.