In rank defiance of all the various conflicting things we've told you Episode 105 would be about, here is an episode about 2015's (and sadly also 2022's) Lauren Southern (lying, untruth-telling nazi liar-nazi) and the mainstreaming and normalising thereof. In this episode we consider Lauren's career (in brief, owing to the fact that chronicling her trail of lies and evil acts has become something of a cottage industry for the online left), her departure from politics and regrettable return, her ostensible changed nature (lol), her pub-excluding ideological lenses, and her sitcom life which comes complete with eccentric stereotype boyfriend, slapstick boat adventures and rollerblading accidents, and snarky one-liner strewn bickering with her mismatched (or is he really so mismatched?) buddy 'Destiny'. We take a stop-off with fan-favourites Posobiec, Elijah Shaffer, and (by mention) Rittenhouse, via Lauren's lie-filled 'documentary' Crossfire. We listen in on Lauren's conversation with Nicky-Boy Fuentes' old friend (turned undeadly enemy) James Allsup back at the time of Unite the Right. Then we also pop in on Lauren's friendly and boozy and giggly stint as a guest of our old 'person we talked about' Tim Pool. It is possible that unflattering nicknames were mentioned, and not just Tim's. We then round it off with some seriously nerdy shit. Elvish swords at the ready for the protection of pan-Western civilisation or some such stupid bollocks. Content Warnings, of course. Show Notes: Please consider donating to help us make the show and stay ad-free and independent. Patrons get exclusive access to at least one full extra episode a month plus all backer-only back-episodes. Daniel's Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/danielharper Jack's Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/user?u=4196618 IDSG Twitter: https://twitter.com/idsgpod Daniel's Twitter: @danieleharper Jack's Twitter: @_Jack_Graham_ IDSG on Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/i-dont-speak-german/id1449848509?ls=1 Episode Notes: Lauren Southern YouTube Lauren Southern Alt-Censored Lauren Southern in Lakemba, Australia, 2018 Why the Alt-Right’s Most Famous Woman Disappeared We were sitting together in her living room, while she scripted a video, when her new boyfriend emerged from the bedroom. George Hutcheson, who was 30 at the time, runs a Canadian group called Students for Western Civilization, which works to “advance the interests of European peoples.” Her most recent boyfriends had also been adherents of far-right ideologies. She had nearly gotten engaged to a prominent conspiracy theorist, and had had an on-again-off-again fling with a Croatian neo-Nazi. “Maybe I’m too picky,” she’d mused before Hutcheson joined us on her IKEA couch. In appearance, Hutcheson is the caricature of the Aryan ideal. His undercut haircut, known in the alt-right as the fashy(short for fascist), and his fit, thick, soldier-like frame give him a Teutonic air. He and Southern decided to go out to dinner, and to let me film them. Hutcheson refuses to eat food originally from nonwhite countries, such as ketchup, whose origins are in China, so the two, facing limited restaurant options, chose the British-style Oxley Public House in Toronto’s Yorkville neighborhood. Hey It's Vadim The Truth About Lauren Southern and Christchurch Lonerbox, Lauren Southern and the Boats Xanderhal talks to Lauren Southern Jose, The Many Lies of Crossfire Destiny Wanders Into Lefty Protest Wearing MAGA Hat ft. BLM Lauren Southern Lauren Southern Nearly Dies Trying to Rollerblade Lauren Southern Crossfire Documentary Shaun on Lauren Southern and the Great Replacement Shaun on Lauren Southern and 'What Every Girl Needs To Hear' Shaun on why Stefan Molyneux is wrong about Immigration and the Fall of Rome Shaun on why Immigration didn't case the fall of Rome Jose on Pseudo-Journalism and Lauren Southern Jose on The Many Lies of Borderless (Lauren's film)
And we're gonna go check out the city wearing some of our favorite outfits.
Got some good BLM gear here.
What are you wearing today?
My favorite hat.
For my favorite president.
Can you look this way and stop looking insane?
Hello.
Yeah.
There you go.
Are you happy?
What?
Okay.
How are you all today?
Destiny Super Elle.
Do I win this one?
Or is the BLM shirt not an L?
Hey Jack, how's it going?
Confused.
This is literally just a just chatting, just walking stream.
Well, this is odd.
This is... You've actually entered another universe.
Love you Lauren, but what the fuck are you doing with Destiny?
That's an excellent question, because it's the ultimate anime crossover.
I may just be on a show tonight.
Spoiler alert!
Spoiler alert, that you should probably watch live if you can guess what it is.
Wait, are you allowed to say?
Brittany Venti's here.
Do you want to say hi to Brittany?
She says, I don't know if I like this timeline.
Oh my god.
How many times has she called me a pedophile so far?
This is I Don't Speak German.
I'm Jack Graham, he/him, and in this podcast I talk to my friend Daniel Harper, also he/him, who spent years tracking the far right in their safe spaces.
In this show we talk about them, and about the wider reactionary forces feeding them and feeding off them.
Be warned, this is difficult subject matter.
Content warnings always apply.
Hello?
You caught me doing a podcast, and it's called I Don't Speak German, and it's an episode called 105 Lauren Southern, the mainstreaming of Lauren Southern, or something like that.
Whatever it is that we're doing for episode 105, it's definitely not any of the various things that we told you were going to be the subject of Of episode 105.
But you knew that already, didn't you?
People got really, really excited about the Patriot Front thing.
And it's like, yeah, that's just not happening anytime soon.
I'm sorry.
I had people like, yeah, I had some emails from people who were like, let me tell you about all the things I know.
And it was like, all right, I've got to go.
Like, clearly, I need to do more prep before I'm ready for this.
So, yeah, we just disappoint people on the regular with our episodes these days.
Yes, indeed.
Yeah.
Well, they shouldn't.
Yeah.
It's just, you know, it's just a given.
Now, whatever we tell you, the next one is going to be about.
It'll be about something else.
So we tell you about the next one.
It's going to be this.
And you get excited.
It's your own fault if you're disappointed.
I'm sorry.
At this point, you really should have learned.
Yeah.
So this is episode one hundred and five.
And it's about Lauren Southern, you know, and the mainstreaming thereof, which is up to these days.
And Daniel, we're actually recording this on Daniel's birthday.
And I checked with him that it was all right to mention that.
And for Daniel's birthday, he has been spending all day listening to Lauren fucking Southern.
Yes.
Digging deep into archives of Lauren Southern's incredibly racist material from 2015.
Very little of which we're going to actually discuss in detail, but you never know where you're going to find a gem.
Not in the works of Lauren Southern, that's where you're going to point a chair.
The thing that I was pointing, so the cold open today was Lauren Southern sitting and chatting with Destiny on a live stream, one of Destiny's live streams, where they were walking in downtown D.C.
on March 1st of this year, so just less than two weeks ago.
The original thing that I was going to use for The Cold Open was actually my favorite Lauren Southern moment of all time, which is the moment in which she is standing in Australia, in front of a, in Lakemba, Australia, and being interviewed.
And she's talking about all the, you know, ethnic restaurants around, and where is a traditional British pub?
And the questioner, the journalist says, there's one right there across the street.
She's like, I don't I don't see a British pub.
There is no British pub.
And then literally like the tweet, like the geolocates to where they are because they named the name of the pub.
It's like the La Kimba pub or whatever.
And it's literally it says La Kimba pub in like big letters on top.
It's very clearly a British pub, a British style pub.
It's that level of like whether she's just memeing or lying or just that myopic or you know there's always this like question with these people and I feel like Lauren Southern is just The deeper you look into her, the more you realize she knows exactly what she's doing.
But I think in that moment, she may just have been that dumb to not realize that the place called La Kimba Pub was a British pub, probably because, well, it wasn't like up on a hill with like a little thatched roof and, you know, like the stereotypical image she has in her head about what a British pub looks like.
Yeah.
Well, I mean, she was expecting like the prancing pony from Lord of the Rings, wasn't she?
Right.
Yeah.
No, I mean, we've seen this shit before with, um, uh, what's his name?
Andy Ngo in London, you know, uh, the, uh, the, uh, the, the no go Muslim zones, et cetera.
He just walked around London and he didn't see it.
He saw, you know, these people walk around with this, the sunglasses with the mirrors on and the mirrors are on the inside.
You know, they have the ideology so thick that they actually can't see things.
I do.
And they're right in front of them.
Ideology so heavy that it actually affects their, their understanding of object permanence, you know, And the question is always what's what's delusion and what cynicism and so on.
And you there is there is I think there is a sort of singularity where the two just collapse into each other and there stops being a distinction.
But also, you know, Lauren Southern is a fucking liar as well.
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
She's an obsessive.
I mean, I think it's pathological, actually.
Yeah, I hate to say that because it sounds like I'm excusing her, like it's not her fault, but she doesn't seem to be able to not lie.
Yeah, and she builds her whole brand on, like, this particular style of lying about things in which, you know, she highlights some factual inaccuracy.
Like being blonde and lying, you mean?
She highlights a factual inaccuracy in that there's this meme, and I may have expressed this previously, that in 2017 she fired a flare gun at migrants in the Mediterranean Sea.
She was on a boat that was trying to deter migrants.
She was holding a flare gun in the video.
She was calling for the people on the boat, the people, you know, to stop them, to stop the migrants.
But she did not technically fire a flare gun At migrants in the Mediterranean Sea, and therefore it's just the lying media, right?
It's just like, you know, and so she focuses on like these details and then like mocks everyone, you know, all the kind of random Twitter people who have ever like quoted that or have ever said that.
And she's like, they're just lying about me.
It's just lying.
And everything else about me is also lies.
It is the most it is.
It is finding the like the kind of most Silly kind of technical inaccuracy and then using that to justify a like a total, you know, not even a total skepticism, but a complete rejection of any other kind of things that you've heard about her.
And then the second anyone looks into this, these claims at all, they find massive, massive inaccuracies with like the picture that Lauren Southern is actually portraying.
And I'm just going to say this right now.
Go check out the loaner box video.
Lauren Southern and the boats because I'm a big fan of that channel.
I don't think I've ever had any interaction with him, but he has done some really great work kind of going through a lot of this work.
And in particular, that video is excellent because it just he's he does the thing that I'm not going to do here and like really kind of picking apart the like technical claims that Lauren Southern makes.
With these issues and using her words against her by showing, you know, the actual factual inaccuracies.
And there's sort of a cottage industry of this on YouTube, I find.
Go ahead.
It's almost an entire YouTube genre.
Yeah.
Fact checking Lauren Southern's bullshit.
We're either going to do this sort of as we go along, or I don't know, I'll put them in the notes at least, but there is a whole load of really great YouTube videos from a YouTuber called Jose, Sean's done several, and they're great videos, they're great fun, particularly Sean's, you know, because Sean is really dry and funny, and just the fact-checking is just fucking devastating.
So, yeah, I mean, Jose did a fact check video about her movie Borderless.
He did another one about another one of her videos.
I think he's done a couple more.
He's done.
He's done three.
He's done three.
And the most recent one is The Many Lives of Crossfire.
And don't worry, we're going to we're going to play some as we get to this.
Like, don't worry, don't worry.
Some familiar names are going to show up.
Let's just put it that way.
OK.
Yeah.
So I'm not sure I like this timeline.
No, I don't like this timeline at all.
I think, you know, Lauren Southern should not be taken seriously by anyone and probably should not be on YouTube.
Can I just say fuck Destiny as well?
I mean, you know, I'm not disappointed that he was hanging out with Lauren Southern because I had no expectations of fucking Stephen Bunnell.
Fucking useless.
I'm censoring myself now, which is, of course, the worst thing ever.
But yeah, fuck that guy.
Yeah, well, it's not the guy that said, I hope white militias mow down Black Lives Matter protesters because the riots have to stop.
So obviously I have no better expectations of him, but fuck him anyway.
Right.
And you I deliberately did not put in the bits just because it's it's dull.
But so that clip was from the YouTube clip version or one of the YouTube clip versions on that live stream that he posted.
The full version is on Twitch, and they literally bicker like an old married couple.
I might give Jack a little bit of this audio to splice in later.
I'll put the odd couple theme underneath it.
They're literally needling each other about Destiny's neoliberal ideas.
Everyone's still rich and pompous here.
Okay.
Is anyone in this chat from D.C.?
Does anyone know which direction you go?
I know where to go.
I have a map up.
Yeah.
Just go straight.
It's not that hard.
What is about to go down, Convoy?
Yeah, I was thinking that some were arriving today, but apparently they're not arriving until the 5th.
How do you feel about the U.S.
Freedom Convoy?
Um, you know, it's probably going to be cringe like the Canadian one.
Cringe?
Yeah.
I remember you were so excited, you were reading it on the phone, you were like, oh my god, they already have, and it was like 20 trucks.
It's 250!
Excuse me.
Half of them are probably, like, Ford F-150s, Chevy Silverados.
That's a lot of trucks!
And a lot more people join when they get closer.
Although, um, do you guys think it's gonna cause, like, some sort of riot or ruckus in D.C.
on the American end?
Because it was really peaceful on the Canadian one.
Wow, really?
Of course, Trudeau just lost his mind anyway, but... Damn.
That's so crazy that he would, like, get so upset about people causing hundreds of millions of dollars of economic damage instead of just showing up at the polls and voting in New Leaders, huh?
Like, what a cuck.
Who cares?
It's just like jobs and money and shit, right?
Oh yeah, because he cares so much about the economy that he just shut it down for two years.
Oh, yeah, because shutting the economy down because of a virus that's killing thousands of people a day is the same as honky boys getting ass-mad that their fucking mask mandates are too strict for them.
If you had to live in BC, or in a Canadian part of the country... I would kill myself.
Absolutely.
But only because I'd be surrounded by other Canadians.
We didn't even... Okay.
Obesity is one of the highest comorbidities with COVID, and we had gyms closed for like two years.
That's nuts.
Oh yeah, because gyms are combating obesity all over Canada so well.
Oh yeah, you're right.
Gyms are not combating obesity, correct.
They're having fun together.
Like they respect each other.
It's like, well, we can disagree about politics, but we agree on certain things, which is that like racial justice is bad.
If it comes with fire.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Not be criticized.
Yeah.
Sure.
No one told you life was gonna be this way.
Fuck you both!
Anyway, very much so, very much so.
I'm actually a little bit drunk, listeners.
You might be able to... It's a little bit of fun for you.
Change, change your pace.
You know, usually I'm the one going like, I had to listen to all this stuff.
I'm now going to get a little bit slushy and do this podcast.
But, you know, I've been listening to Jimmy Dore all day.
You know, I deserve this.
I mean, given the choice between Jimmy Dore or Lauren Southern, that's a that's a deep philosophical question.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Anyway, so the history of Lauren Southern, there is I think most people stop paying attention to her circa like 2018 or so, or at least kind of like after the Christchurch massacre in which, you know, she sort of like distance herself.
Yeah.
In which the guy's manifesto was basically the script of one of her fucking YouTube videos.
Yeah.
And she disputes this heavily on her YouTube channel, because of course she fucking does.
Of course she fucking does, because she's a fucking liar!
Friend of the podcast, Hey It's Vadim, did an amazing job documenting exactly her connections to Generation Identity and to Martin Seliger.
Like, she's literally doing propaganda for Generation Identity.
That stuff is still up in places, you know, like this is not hard to find.
And yeah, she's literally doing, you know, propaganda for Generation Identity.
And, you know, Martin Sellner was taking money from the Christchurch massacre.
Britton Tarrant, He was taking money from him, you know, as donations, and even offered to buy him a beer if he ever comes out, if he ever came out to Vienna.
So, like, the connections are very real.
And the fact that, like, the name Lauren Southern does not appear in the manifesto, you know, yeah, has no bearing on this.
And Hayes Vadim does a does a great job, you know, like highlighting that and going through all this evidence.
I highly recommend.
Again, there will be many, many notes to videos in the show notes, but that one in particular is very good.
I re-watched that this afternoon.
Well, he doesn't actually credit Lauren Southern in the manifesto.
Ergo, Patreon, you know, chucking her off their platform is pure censorship.
Right, exactly, exactly.
I think it was actually the immigrant boat thing that caused Patreon to chuck her off their platform on the very reasonable grounds, actually, that money given to Lauren Southern might, as you know, it was evident from that event, that money given to Lauren Southern might end up being used in criminal acts that could cause people harm.
But of course, that's not how she characterized it.
Of course not, of course not.
I think most people kind of lost track of her around that time, you know, because she actually took a little break.
There's very good evidence by meaning people have uncovered, you know, that she was attempting to move to Australia to be with... To emigrate, you mean?
To emigrate to Australia.
With her then romantic partner, or as far as I know, current romantic partner.
I believe they're married at this point.
But there was the goal of moving to Australia, and she sort of ended her political activism two days before the date of her visa application.
Meaning, I'm not currently involved in far-right white nationalist politics.
I quit that days ago.
And apparently it was good enough for the Australian government.
I mean, literally, I stopped doing that.
Like, I'm taking a long weekend.
It's going to be fine.
Also, she was pregnant with her.
I'm not actually doing it at this precise moment.
Exactly.
I'm not literally recording a video right now.
I have a photograph of myself not doing it in the last 24 hours.
No, absolutely.
So there is a very long, good piece in The Atlantic by a journalist who was one of the creative leads behind the documentary that The Atlantic produced called White Noise that followed Lauren Southern, Mike Stronovich, and Richard Spencer for like a couple of years.
And, um, uh, you know, the journalist, you know, got up close and personal with Lauren Southern and, uh, you know, kind of describes, you know, the history of her, you know, leaving and some of the complexities there.
Um, one of the things, and I'm, and I'm just gonna, just so you get a sense of like who Lauren Southern was hanging out with and like openly what's associating with and allowing the journalists to put on the record in this, in this like process.
Um, So, and this would have been like 2017 or so, 2017, 2018.
We were sitting together in her living room while she scripted a video when her new boyfriend emerged from the bedroom.
George Hutchison, who was 30 at the time, runs a Canadian group called the Students for Western Civilization, which works to advance the interests of European peoples.
Her most recent boyfriends had also been inherits of far-right ideologies.
She had nearly gotten engaged to a prominent conspiracy theorist and had an on-again, off-again fling with a Croatian neo-Nazi.
Maybe I'm too picky.
She'd mused before Hutchison joined us on the...
Maybe I'm too picky, she'd mused before Hutchison joined us on her IKEA couch.
In appearance, Hutchison is a caricature of the Aryan ideal, his undercut haircut known in the alt-right as fashy, and his fit, thick soldier-like frame giving him a Teutonic air.
He and Southern decided to go out for dinner, and to let me film them.
Hutchison, get this, Refuses to eat food originally from non-white countries, such as ketchup, whose origins are in China, so the two, facing limited restaurant options, chose the British-style Oxley Public House in Toronto's Yorkville neighborhood.
While recording this documentary and while giving open interviews to the press, she's literally dating prominent neo-Nazis.
And a guy so racist he won't eat ketchup because it's tainted by the Asian menace or whatever.
This person is very clearly not a white supremacist or white nationalist.
This person, not a racist bone in her body.
Yeah, no, no.
She's a pan-Western nationalist or something, which is definitely not the same thing as being a white nationalist or a white supremacist.
This really is, her life is a fucking sitcom.
It's not just like, you know, hanging out with a friend, you know, and they disagree about everything and bicker.
You know, she's got an eccentric boyfriend who's got eccentric food requirements.
She's taking part in like, you know, eccentric adventures on boats, which it's a fucking Fuck it's Nazi sitcom!
It's how I met your Fuhrer.
Ten rules for dating my Aryan Lebensborn daughter.
Absolutely, absolutely.
It's worth, again, like, look, there's documentation all over the place.
And I think that passage by itself is enough to demonstrate she has at least white supremacist tendencies, if not... She's a Nazi.
She's a lying Nazi.
Okay.
I'm just trying to demonstrate it to people who, like, I don't think anyone in this audience is really going to argue with me, but I found that passage incredibly hilarious.
And I find this current clip, not a current clip, This is no longer on her YouTube channel.
Imagine why.
But it is on her alt-censored channel, which stopped being updated in early 2018.
But it's still up.
It was apparently actually maintained by her.
I mean, it's under her name, and it has a lot of her old clips on there.
And don't worry, I downloaded them all before I started recording this episode.
So, you know.
You should have you should have deleted more shit, Warren.
That's that's kind of the truth here.
Although there are you know, she is very well documented by other people, clearly so.
But this is on the day of the Unite the Right rally, like hours after the violence on that day, on that day, she gives an interview to guess who?
James Alsup.
Hmm.
Who, to be clear, on that day was so excited to get to see Richard Spencer.
He, like, cried out in joy.
Oh, yeah.
Right.
Who would, weeks later, be doing a podcast with Nicky Boy Fuentes.
And then when that didn't work out anymore because they had petty fights between them about who's doing what kind of work for the podcast.
Biggest Nazi.
He continued his YouTube career making hugely downloaded videos about, you know, with coded white nationalism, in some cases not coded white nationalism, and who would later become a dedicated second chair on Facts of the Nation and a part of the Right Stuff podcasting network until he was just not interesting enough and he was replaced recently in what they claim was an amicable split.
But, you know, He apparently needed to make some more money.
He went on to, under an assumed name, under a false name, he was trying to become a real estate agent.
And when he was discovered, he was summarily fired.
So James Alsup is having the best career anyone could ever have.
Ultimately.
But James Alsup is a Nazi.
There's no question.
It's a bit irrelevant, but can you clarify that?
He was fired by the people that he was trying to work for as a real estate agent.
Right.
When they discovered who he was.
Is that right?
It turns out that some anti-fascists realized that the guy with his photo under it had James and some other name.
So it was James White or something.
They figured out that that person was actually James Alsup because, you know, He's James Alsup.
They informed his employer and he was summarily fired.
So yeah, no, it was it was it was kind of a blip and you miss it kind of story on the radar.
But yeah, it was it was it was not it was not a difficult call.
James Alsup has been very open about doing all this shit under his real name.
He is very, very, very visible and very distinctive.
So, yeah.
But anyway.
James Alsop, full-on Nazi.
Even though he is the most boring vanilla porridge individual that ever lived, yeah.
Exactly, exactly.
James Alsop, very much a Nazi, attended Unite the Right as a Nazi, hung out with Identity Europa for a while.
I mean, he's been all over the place, right?
You know, he is a Nazi, no question.
So, She invited James Alsop onto her show to talk about the events of Unite the Right in the way that the media might be spinning things the wrong way.
Yeah, the media might be spinning, you know, the car that plowed into the protesters the wrong way.
Well, and I this was pretty boilerplate at this point.
What I find interesting is that it was early enough that like the narrative around the events had not quite congealed yet, which is always a fascinating kind of few hours there.
But Lauren Southern definitely let's just say she has certain opinions about the about the car attack, about the terror, the car terror attack.
And we get to hear those now.
Oh, great.
car thing that happened as well.
Baked Alaska here was actually hit point blank with bear spray, which is.
And so James Alsop is emphasizing all of the violence that Antifa did against them, the peaceful protesters.
Of course.
You know, that's that's the lead into all this.
So, you know, again, boilerplate.
But that's what's going on.
As you know, I'm sure being Canadian, very potent.
Right.
Now, for those who don't know, there are two that are confirmed dead now, I believe.
One person from the car incident, which was a horrible incident.
A car plowed through what I believe were left-wing protesters there.
We still don't know who the individual was who did this.
There's been talk that it could have been an anti-Trump rider.
There's talk that it's a white supremacist.
We don't know.
Of course, the media is spinning things.
From your perspective as someone who was at the Unite the Right event, what is the feeling around this car situation where there were people that- it looked like a terrorist attack, a car that intentionally- it wasn't like how you see at the Black Lives Matter protests where they're holding hands and blocking cars on the highway intentionally and the car tries to get through, which I totally support.
If they're facing you and they're trying to block your car and you're just trying to get through to get to the hospital to get to your family, whatever, I've always supported that.
But this was from behind people while they weren't aware.
What is the feelings at the Unite the Right thing about this car attack?
So look, first of all, it's the car incident.
You know, she says it like four times, right?
The car incident, the incident with the car, just a little kerfuffle.
We don't know who was and there was a lot of like little Donnie Brooke with a car.
Yeah.
You know, little frackers.
That's all.
And this isn't this seems like an actual terrorist incident, as opposed to I mean, if the Black Lives Matter protesters were actually trying to prevent you from driving and you need to get to the hospital or see your family or something.
Oh, yeah.
Like right through.
Like, that's clearly, you know, constantly.
Yeah.
Black Lives Matter, you know, just constantly wantonly block people when they're trying to race to the hospital with their with their wife who's giving birth.
And, you know, it's just constant.
And when they do that, I mean, yeah, it's perfectly reasonable to just plow straight fucking through them.
I mean, of course.
Of course, of course.
And but that's the that's the like the moral justification there.
Right.
That's if it's a white baby, obviously.
Right.
Right.
Well, that's the language that she's using back in her.
Like if you want to say, OK, there's a break right between she takes some time off and she comes back and she's using different language.
Now she's doing different things.
She's not you know, she's changed destiny.
I was talking I was tweeting about Lauren Southern one day.
And Destiny came into my mentions.
I did not mention Destiny.
I'm assuming he's name-searching Lauren Southern because he also has no idea who the fuck I am.
You don't want to mention, you know, you might accidentally mention him three times near a mirror and he'll appear and start explaining to you why neoliberalism is actually good.
So, you know, be careful with that shit, man.
And then his whole thing is like Lauren Southern is not a white nationalist.
She's not a white supremacist.
She's not a Nazi.
She's changed from her old thing.
She's just a conservative.
She's just a conservative.
That's all she is.
She's just she's just got conservative beliefs.
And that has to be considered within the pale of discussion, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera.
Well, this man, I mean, I don't like to use this language, but he is so simping for this girl.
Oh yeah, yeah.
I legitimately hope they're fucking, because at least that would justify it, you know?
It would not at all, but like, you know.
Yeah, thanks for that mental image.
I am not going to go further, but I could, you know.
People like the impressions.
Would anyone like to hear the impression of Destiny trying to seduce Lauren Southern?
Dibs, I'm Lauren.
I'm Lauren.
I can't do it.
No, I agree.
If you're going to sell your soul, you should get something in return.
Maybe we'll do it as Patreon content.
I'm just trying to imagine, like, erotic short fiction with, like, Lauren Southern and Destiny, in which she's talking about, like, well, you know, there's a neoliberal trade imbalance in your pants, you know?
I think really you just need an injection of some capital.
There's, you know, that Canadian-U.S.
border thing, like, I don't know.
Oh my God, that's awful.
I apologize.
Jack should cut that.
So that's her in 2017, you know.
And again, she's still doing the shtick of like, I'm not a white nationalist.
I don't agree with the alt-right.
I mean, but she also does videos in which she's talking about, and these are still available on her YouTube channel, in which she's talking about The alt-right's problem with free speech, right?
The alt-right is rejecting these white nationalist characters who just want to come in and have their voices be heard.
And the alt-right, they just say they might as well be anti-fascist, they might as well be leftists, you know, because they're just not allowing the free exchange of these ideas.
And so she's like, I don't really feel aligned with either the alt-right or the alt-right, because I kind of disagree with both.
And, you know, I don't consider myself a white nationalist.
I mean, There are people who have been close to Warren Southern who have spoken privately and said, Oh yeah, no, she is complete Holocaust denier.
She, like all of these things, it's, you know, she is, she's 100% Nazi.
That to me is just clear, you know, aesthetically, you can, you can just, I mean, you can just fucking tell from the way she talks and the things she says that there's, you You know, privately.
Yeah, absolutely.
I mean, I would without these witnesses, I would I would say, yeah, I would bet vital internal organs.
Yeah, right.
And it's hard to it's hard to kind of say, because ultimately it's, you know, kind of unnamed people in private messages and, you know, sort of people infiltrate them.
And then, you know, it's kind of, you know, it's epistemically, you know, uncertain.
And so, you know, what does Lauren Southern really believe?
I don't fucking know.
All I know is what she says and all I know is what effect she's having in the world.
And she continued to make documentaries, you know, so she takes about a year off and kind of comes back and she's she starts her YouTube channel back up again.
She's hanging out and she produces in early 2021 or late 2020.
She produces this documentary, Crossfire.
She has moved away, you see, from the explicit racism of doing documentaries about how terrible NGOs are for bringing migrants into Western countries, bringing African and MENA migrants into Europe and America.
And, you know, how terrible it is that the white South African farmers are experiencing violence in isolated communities.
The South African farmers thing, I am not trying to belittle, there are like horrifying acts of violence.
There are horrifying acts of violence all over South Africa.
And focusing on the plight of the handful of very far right paramilitary Nazis who own literal like farms and factories and employ largely African, largely black and what they call colored labor at subsistence wages.
Maybe there's a bigger issue here than, you know, robberies against the against the isolated farms, you know.
I mean, I'm not going to get into this now, but there's quite a big news story going on at the moment in world events, and lots of people are commenting on it.
And yeah, if you didn't know this already, it should be very clear to you now that it is possible to talk about things that are absolutely true, even if sometimes you don't get the facts right or you lie about them.
Actually, but you can talk about real things that actually exist and real problems that actually are real and still be lying because the removal of context means that you completely distort the situation and you give a grotesquely inaccurate impression, you know.
So yeah, this is how Lawrence Southern operates certainly in that video about the South African Farm murders or whatever you call it.
Right.
Yeah, no.
And, you know, I always wanted to kind of do like a full episode about that and kind of dig into some of that.
But it's very difficult to get like reliable data out of that.
And there is there is kind of difficulty in kind of discussing it as an outsider, as well, but nothing that I've seen.
Not that Lauren Southern let that bother her.
Well, I don't want to, you know, stoop to that level.
Not that I physically could stoop to that level, you know, frankly.
It's funny that, like, one of the documentarians who was, like, helping her make those documentaries at that time has since, like, basically said, I mean, not even basically, he has said in so many words, his name is Cowlin Robertson, and I was going to include Some clips here, but I hate to be kind of included enough of it that I just point people to that video and go check that out.
But literally has said and podcasts and such that, oh, no, we knew we were manipulating that.
We knew we were lying.
Everybody knew we were lying.
Oh, yeah.
It was we were just lying.
It was.
Oh, yeah.
No, it's it's clear.
They you know, sometimes it's obvious from the way in which things are misleading.
People can't construct stuff without knowing what they're doing.
And I would say that's very true.
I think that some of that actually shows in the farmlands documentary because that's the one about the South African farm murders, because there's a clip that is that is pretty famous of Lauren Southern in the voiceover saying, These people have no weapons.
They are victims.
They are just trying to build a homestead to where they can be safe from the mongrel hordes or whatever.
And then this is laid over footage of like people like mounting crossbows on a wall, you know?
These people have no weapons except for all of the weapons they have.
Well, this is a theme, isn't it?
You know, the thing that I'm saying isn't there isn't there, because ideologically it can't be, even though I'm literally looking at it, you know?
Exactly, exactly.
So, so she produces this documentary, Crossfire, and this is a bit of an aside, but I think it's worth like kind of connecting this in because some of our favorite recent figures appeared in the Crossfire documentary.
You know, with the IDSG meaning of the term, yeah.
By which I mean, Jack Posobiec and Elijah Schaeffer, and Jack Murphy for that matter, although he doesn't appear in this clip, are like named people spreading lies in this documentary, because it is supposed to be this like nuanced look at policing and You know, the causes of racial violence and the, you know, kind of race riots and that sort of thing, you know, it's supposed to be, it at least bills itself as the answer to the, you know, the riots.
And why are the, why is the uprising happening?
What's the root cause of it?
And the answer is Antifa and BLM are allowed to run rampant.
And really what we need is a stronger police force that's going to come in and police these people at the, at the barrel of a gun.
And, you know, be them senseless because that's the only way that this effort is going to stop because these people are ultimately out to destroy our society.
It is the... It says the small government libertarian.
It is the wettest, sloppiest kiss to the police that I've seen in a long time.
And believe me, I've seen a lot of wet, sloppy kisses to the police.
There is absolutely no nuance here whatsoever.
It is just despicable.
This is viewable online.
I will include a link to it if you want to go watch the whole thing.
It is free to watch.
Not on YouTube because there is enough violence in the movie.
There's an I mean, it literally shows like people getting shot and beaten and all that sort of thing.
There's enough violence in it.
It probably would not actually be able to pass YouTube content standards like it is that violent.
So go check that out.
But I'm going to play you a clip.
Jack Posobiec and Elijah Schaffer in a video produced by Lauren Southern, in which she was intimately involved in the making of this.
There is no question who is making this video, right?
You know, in which these two people talk about Kyle Rittenhouse.
And I think what you're going to find, particularly when you talk about Elijah Schaffer, is he has a slightly different view in late 2020, and whenever this was recorded, than he did after the trial about Carl Rittenhouse.
And I don't know, I think that's a little interesting, don't you?
So this is a little bit long, we might dip into it a couple of times, but it's worth listening to this.
Kyle Rittenhouse was actually with a much larger group of people that were defending, I think it was a gas station, it's down the street, that these mob of sort of BLM and anarchists were attempting to burn down.
They wanted to blow up a gas station.
Holy shit.
That's Schaefer.
What are you doing?
This is now filled with footage if you're watching the video, which we're not.
But this is now filled with footage of from that night of violent protesters like rolling a flaming dumpster down the street.
Not really aimed at a gas station from what I see, but who am I?
I wasn't there on that night.
I was going to say, I mean, you say you say it's we're watching footage.
Presumably we're watching footage of Black Lives Matter protesters attempting to blow up a gas station, because that's what they said is happening.
So presumably, I mean, yes, that's that's what they say.
Yeah, no, right.
But that's not the that's not in the footage, really particular.
No, no, it's it's it's.
There's something there is a flaming dumpster and someone is rolling it and sort of like lets it go.
But it's again, maybe they were trying to aim it at the gas station, but it seems like they're moving more parallel to the gas station to me.
A lot of the details a gas station.
Yeah, a lot of the detail.
And look, I'm not trying again.
The epistemic nature of this is like It was chaotic.
Who knows what people were trying to do at any particular moment.
All the footage gets edited completely out of context with all of these things.
And it's impossible to judge anything based on, you know, a 15 second clip or whatever, but clear.
I'm not saying I know what happened or didn't happen.
I'm just saying that the claims here are being made by people who A known liars and B have no apparently have no evidence to back up their claims.
I'm just pointing that out.
Yeah, like there's to my knowledge, there's never anyone like prosecuted for trying to blow up a gas station that night.
You know, there was never any prosecution for that.
And well, that's clearly because the cops are on the side of the BLM protesters, you know.
Oh, yeah.
That's clearly, you know, they're not able to do their jobs because of the cucks in the Kenosha Wisconsin government or whatever.
Yeah.
So so just be aware that all of this is playing over, you know, very manipulated kind of awful footage of what that makes.
Completely out of context, it makes everything there seem as violent as possible.
It is cut together at a rapid pace, so you really can't tell anything that's going on.
But I recognize some of that footage specifically, and it's deliberately taken completely out of context.
There's no sense of an order of events happening here, right?
It's just these guys talking, it's cutting between.
There are two versions of this event and you're about to hear the two versions that show up because Posobiec has one perspective on this and Schaefer has another.
So, you know, interestingly.
But yeah, let's just let's just get back into it.
There, they prevented the attack from happening.
And this made people mad.
Specifically, Joseph Rosenbaum, the first victim of the Rittenhouse shooting.
So again, I said I wasn't going to like fact check this, but like every account on the ground says that Rosenbaum was kind of hostile towards the militia in general and the people carrying rifles in general.
And there's no indication that Rosenbaum got aggressive towards anyone as a result of this phantom, you know, gas station bombing.
Because Rosenbaum is standing at the gas station at that moment, by the way, which is also clear from the footage that is shown in the documentary in this moment.
Yeah, so this is this is all completely edited out of context footage.
It's it's it's building a narrative.
But I don't think I think it's like not even it's not even untruth.
It's just not truth probative at all.
Like there's just no truth value to be had from looking at.
No, because it's not like it's just not built in a way that is actually like telling that story like a documentary about people saying things, you know, that's it.
I mean, you can talk about, you know, sort of like the omissions of the mainstream media or that sort of thing, but within, like, a few days of the, you know, of the original incident with Kyle Rittenhouse, the Washington Post had put out, like, or no, the New York Times did a visual investigation going through and showing the footage of, like, how these shootings actually happened.
You know, like actually putting this footage together and actually trying to tell the actual story as it existed on the ground.
And presumably Lauren Southern.
I mean, these are talented editors.
These are people who had some time to do this.
They had access to all the footage imaginable.
They could have done that as well.
There was no reason they couldn't have done that had they chose to do so.
They chose not to.
And I wonder why that would be.
Yeah.
Interesting question.
Anyway, food for thought.
Yeah.
Why wouldn't they take their time and actually build a nuanced conversation about this?
Unless, oh, they're lying propagandists.
That's why they don't do that.
Anyway.
Holy shit.
I think you've got it.
He was angry.
He was upset.
But what the mob said was, don't worry about it.
Let's go target the other place down at the other end of the street.
I saw Antifa BLM rioters heading the group out towards the darkness because the streetlights had all been destroyed.
So Kyle Rittenhouse starts running down thinking that he's going to protect the burning from taking place at this place that ended up being called Car Source.
And they are...
And so this is also not what Rittenhouse ever really said.
Like, and I'd have to go back and look at the trial testimony, but Rittenhouse, like the car source thing, like it's really confusing in the kind of various stories about, because they're at one car source lot and then they're moving to another car source lot.
And then he's just kind of in his, in his trial testimony, my memory of it is that he says he's moving around and trying to offer aid to people and this sort of thing.
Whereas in this version of events, We're hearing, no, the mob having failed to blow up the gas station is now moving to the other car source lots to do their mischief over there, right?
Yeah.
Yeah.
It's like, you know, Rittenhouse's trial version is, you know, I was just sort of doing my Red Cross thing, whereas this is kind of, you know, Rittenhouse is there somewhere kind of trying to be John McClane while these protesters are rampaging in their attempt to just destroy everything.
Which apparently Schaefer can see very well, despite the fact that they've destroyed all the streetlights.
Right.
Exactly.
And and also in the video footage, the streetlights are not out, you know.
No.
But this idea that they're moving into darkness and, you know, this is, you know, they're they're the shadowy forces.
Believe me, I think.
But again, again, ideologically, the streetlights must be out.
Ergo, they are, even though you can see in the film that they're on, you know.
Believe me, I found a really batshit thing that Elijah Schaffer did and I almost want to just do a full episode about a particular interview he did with someone else because when he's not on his own show and like subject to Glenn Beck's like rules for how to engage He, yeah.
Glenn Beck is a restraining influence.
Well, you know, getting paid is kind of a restraining influence for, I think, a lot of these people.
But yeah, I hesitate to do too much Elijah Schafer content, but it's really good.
Anyway, we will talk off mic about this.
Let me know if you do or do not want to hear another full episode about Elijah Schafer, because I'm just fascinated with this guy.
He's so dumb.
He's so fucking dumb.
Anyway.
We don't want to build up this little pipsqueak, but my God, the material.
Getting to nip him in the bud now would be really satisfying, honestly, because he's been out there for a while and people are really not covering him.
But if I can get some of the bigger channels to start talking about this guy, that would be worth it, honestly.
Anyway, we should continue.
Again, I'm not trying to fact check this in real time, but it's worth noting, again, regardless of what the actual truth of the situation is, this is not the same story that we're hearing a year later.
You know, it's a different story.
And listen again to how Posobiec and Schaeffer are kind of telling two different stories, starting at about this point.
And it involves Kyle Rittenhouse's actions that night.
So this will be interesting.
Destroying what appeared to be a car shop, breaking every window, throwing rocks through the glass, using hammers.
I mean, these people were so aggressively ripping this place down.
And as I'm filming these individuals, somebody's running up on the other side of the car.
And I can't really see, all I see is a green shirt in my video footage.
It's like, running up, and it's just... Bang!
Bang!
And you can see this in Richard McGinnis' statement.
They go for his gun.
They start to pull it from him.
There's a scuffle in the ensuing altercation.
Gun goes off.
The first individual...
So just I think I think we all caught that.
But just to be clear, Schaefer is saying his eyewitness testimony, the thing that he witnessed there was Rittenhouse runs around.
He just sees a blur of that green shirt.
Right.
And then suddenly shots ring out.
Shots ring out.
I it's going to cost me so much self-control to not put the JFK music in the background, you know.
Back into the left.
Go ahead.
You should feel free with this.
I'm I'm not trying to sound like I'm just trying to elucidate the differences here.
Right.
Because I think this is very worthwhile in terms of, like, the narrative that has been spun around this and the narrative that Southern is doing.
But notice that Posobiec, who's like the more professional person on the set and who has more Sort of knowledge.
He's been paid by rich people for longer.
Let's just put it that way.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I gotcha.
Yeah.
You know, so Posobiec is saying, well, from the witness statements that we have, apparently there was a scuffle for the gun, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera, you know, and that's more like the narrative that everybody kind of landed on.
down the line, right?
And whichever one is true, these are two different stories being told here, right?
But the documentary is sort of building up a single narrative around Rittenhouse, a single narrative around these killings, right?
In fact, I don't remember if this is actually in the clip I clipped or not, but Schaefer actually refers to Rosenbaum as a victim at one point, which he would never do in the current situation.
There's no sense of using that language to describe Rosenbaum.
So, - He will die, he's this Rosenbaum.
- Get a light, get me a fucking light! - Put pressure on it, put fucking pressure on it! - Where, where? - And I'm still filming at this point and I'm going, oh my gosh, this guy's been shot! - Come on, put pressure, put pressure, put pressure! - Holy shit, come, come on!
I looked at this guy's face.
I saw like my mom or anybody that I've seen die.
And people are like, get a tourniquet, put pressure, you know, stop this man.
And I literally, I saw the eyes of death.
And it's haunted.
I'm still haunted by my mom's death.
But I watch this man and I go... I remember being one of the first people going, like, guys, this guy's gonna die.
Like, he's dead.
I kept saying, guys, guys, guys, he's dead.
This guy's dead.
Like, there's no point.
Like, he's dead.
And I watched that just... I watched him crack, the crackle, you know, just...
The death rattle and I just went... I don't, as a person, I don't want to see multiple people die.
I don't even, at that moment, I don't know if this guy's a child predator.
I don't know.
He's a human and I watch this and I go, this man...
is dead because we have not dealt with the problem of Black Lives Matter and Antifa, and we've let it fester.
And who cares if you want to say he deserved to die?
F you if you say anyone deserves to die.
In that moment, none of this had to happen.
And if Kyle goes to jail, if he goes to prison, it didn't have to happen either.
Wow.
That is just stunning when you when you've heard what we've heard in other episodes.
Exactly, exactly.
So go back.
I didn't put another Elijah Schafer clip in here and it would have been very easy to then go and like watch him like mock Rosenbaum and mock all the other, you know, victims and do the mean thing, you know, a year later.
But this is and so, you know, you can decide for yourself if these are crocodile tears or real tears or what.
That doesn't interest me at this point, right?
Yeah.
Is the differing narrative that Schaefer is giving to it in that moment, because the structure of the documentary is this is all the fault of Black Lives Matter and Antifa.
This is all the fault.
And those people are violent.
They're evil.
They are surrounded by darkness and they deserve what's coming to them.
Right.
And while that's not Lauren Southern speaking for herself, That matches what we heard from her in 2017, in terms of, you know, well, if the Black Lives Matter protesters are standing in front of the car and like linking arms to try to prevent you from getting to where you need to go, you can just run them over.
That's the moral stance.
It's the moral stance that these people are being coddled, that they're evil, that they are fighting She won't even say for a good cause.
I mean, sometimes, you know, you occasionally hear that from some of these people that like, well, I agree with like the kind of cause of racial justice, etc, etc.
But that's not what's being said here.
This is The police, the police state, you know, is actually under policing these people and they need to be put down for the safety of the rest of us.
And that's exactly what she's saying in 2017.
If anything, it's more overt in that documentary, right?
And again, you can say Lauren Southern is saying that, but this is her produced documentary.
This is the narrative that she is pushing.
And I promise you that is not out of context.
There is no point in what Lauren Southern then comes up and goes and wishy-washy on this.
There's no sense of that anywhere in this documentary.
This is what Lauren Southern believes, period.
And this is exactly what she believed in 2017.
If you think that this is, you know, not white nationalist rhetoric, then she was never a white nationalist, right?
She was never that because, like, ultimately there's no daylight between what she was saying then and what she's saying now.
Period.
Yeah.
I mean, that's her documentary.
And the message is clearly, you know, the problem is Black Lives Matter and we need to put them down.
We need to put down Black Lives Matter.
We need to put down Antifa, because if we don't, then we have this tragedy and this chaos.
And, you know, when people die, that is not the fault of the right wing.
A shitbag with a gun who inserted himself into the situation and decided to shoot them.
It's the fault of Black Lives Matter.
It's the fault of the people that I want to see repressed and oppressed.
That's very clearly the message that's being sent.
These protests because, you know, suppose they did.
I mean, look, there was property damage.
There was significant property damage that night, for sure.
One of those car dealerships, like a bunch of those cars did get torched.
And you can feel how you want to about that.
But to say that in order to prevent that, we need more murder.
We need to murder.
We need more policing.
We need more state violence.
We need more people in cages to prevent that because these people are like violent thugs out to destroy, destroy, destroy.
And there's no justification for that ever.
I, you know, our position, I would say, I mean, I presume to speak for you, I think we're pretty in sync on this, would be something like, okay, yeah, it's not, you know, nobody likes riots.
We don't like riots.
But riots happen because of festering unaddressed injustice and oppression.
The problem is the festering unaddressed injustice and oppression and inequality.
And the fact that it is not just permitted and allowed, but directly reinforced structurally and deliberately reinforced by society.
And without saying it's good when people's car dealerships get torched, we're not saying that, but we're saying this is going to happen.
And the approach to take there is not to blame the oppressed, And the victims of injustice and so on for reacting to the fact that they live in that condition.
The thing to do is to react to that bellow of injustice and outrage and to redress it as well.
That's something like the position I think both of us would take.
Well, that is actually You know, in terms of its formal structure, that is the same argument that they're making in that documentary.
Because they are saying, this guy died because of a problem which wasn't addressed.
They are excusing Rittenhouse, what he did, And I mean, they are not saying that specifically, at least not in that clip, but that is the whole import and meaning of what's happening there.
They are excusing Rittenhouse of his responsibility for what he chose to do.
And their argument for doing that is to say, well, he was reacting to this problem.
The problem of Antifa, the problem of Black Lives Matter that we haven't addressed.
So we don't have a social system that's addressing that.
So they agree with, and this is something that again, you know, Vadim covers to some degree in the video that he does, although in a different context.
So Warren Southern agrees with I don't like to do that.
and systemic problems allowing things to fester, affect people's ideas about things.
And in particular, Vadim points out misinformation and misinformation causing this.
And we can take the form, even without factual accuracy, which I don't like to do that.
But even if you accept both of these statements as valid, to accept one or not the other, Because ultimately the whole other thing that that documentary is trying to do is do all the like race science stuff about like, you know, black crime and, you know, and all that sort of thing.
And that's very, very explicit in the documentary is that there's a ton of, you know, black people have, you know, they don't really say black people, but it's like certain kinds of populations have homicides.
Higher levels of testosterone, and that creates a greater tendency towards violence.
And if what we see is these populations being policed more heavily, it's because they're doing more violence.
And this is, again, very standard right-wing rhetoric these days.
The only difference is that it is often softened to, oh, well, the problem is, you know, like, black culture right and supposed to it's biological it's you know fatherlessness or it's you know that sort of thing like that's the that's sort of the soft inversion that you get from the kind of more mainstream republican party kind of stuff whereas one southern again does not say in so many words but very much is like you know jared taylor color of crime level stuff on this yeah um
so in context the import of all that is we have these we have this population within the We have these, we have these animals, we have these animals that are out there and, you know, they are just dangerous and violent and destructive.
And they need to be policed and, you know, more and more repressively.
And the problem is not that they're is far from the, you know, them being over policed or over repressed.
The problem at the moment is that it's not it's not enough.
They need to be policed more.
They need to be treated like the animals they are.
And if we don't address this, this this problem that we have, this section of the population who are just inherently savage, In the only way that we can, with more repression, then we're going to end up with tragedies like this guy dying on the floor that Elijah Schafer's crying over.
In context, that's what's being said, I assume.
I haven't watched it.
Oh, absolutely.
Absolutely.
You're 100% correct.
That is the clear import of this documentary.
And the other thing is... And that's where we... Because cops do nothing wrong.
Yeah.
I said before, you know, their argument is formally the same as roughly the argument that you and I would want to make.
This is where we get into the real important thing, which is that, of course, political arguments can have similar formal structures, but as we know, politics has content as well as form.
And the content of our argument is about the fact that people who don't deserve in any way to be structurally oppressed are being, and that is a problem that we need to You know, we need to fundamentally change society to address, whereas the content of her argument is these people are fucking animals and they need to be kept in cages, which is completely different.
And just to be clear, if Lauren Southern were to find this episode and decide to do a video on it, she would cut all of that bit of you talking about the systemic problems and the parallelism there.
And she would say, well, the problem is, is the other way.
The problem is, you know, that we do have this like systemic issue and the systemic issue is the lack of policing.
And look at all these Black people, the business owners in these, they, you know, in the surveys show they want more police, not less.
And You know, etc, etc, etc.
And just get into like that kind of nonsense.
It's like, she knows the sort of counter argument, and she feels no need to address it in any significant way ever.
Right?
No, because it's, you're just clearly lefties who don't know anything.
So the ideological lenses, the pub isn't there.
You know, I'm looking at it, but it's not there.
So all this is kind of preamble, and I don't mean it that way because we don't have that much left.
But like this, this is all demonstrating who Lauren Southern was and is, you know, and a very streamlined, like we didn't even hit the top, you know, we didn't even hit the top ten things, you know, like there's just so much other.
I tried to pick stuff that hasn't been kind of explicitly picked apart, you know, by by other people, you know, so.
Yeah.
But, you know, there'll be plenty in the show notes.
Yes, but the thing that sort of made me want to do this episode was...
Lauren Southern not only showed up on Destiny, she's been debating Destiny, you know, A, like going back like five years, but, you know, particularly in the last like few months, she has made several like appearances in this, you know, online debate bro space.
Like she, she was, she had a conversation with this guy Xanderhal, who used to be called Pig Puncher.
Yeah, I've heard of him.
Yeah.
Yeah, she wrote a book that was, you know, like the ABCs of morality.
And he wanted to have a good faith liberal debate about like, well, you complain that leftists are doing, you know, political indoctrination of children, but isn't this political indoctrination of children?
And she being like, well, I'm just trying to do like traditional things.
And I'm just trying to have my own little ability to speak the truth to, you know, and it's just this very, Frustrating phenomenon of like a five hour live stream of which like, you know, like treating this person with seriousness treated this person as a serious person with interesting things to say, and not saying, Um, so how do you feel about all those propaganda videos you did for Generation Identity?
Like, how do you feel about Martin Selner?
Um, you know, oh, guilt by association.
This is guilt by association.
How do you feel about, like, interviewing James Alsup about, um, Unite the Right on the day of Unite the Right, given where he later ended up?
How do you feel about James Alsup's political trajectory?
How do you feel about laundering those talking points?
Also, let's talk about how you've changed.
How have you changed exactly?
What changes do you used to believe in that you don't believe in anymore?
Let's go through that, because ultimately, if you're saying, I used to be in this toxic space, and now I'm just a mainstream conservative, you have to demonstrate that.
If you've done harm to people, Would you go out on a boat and not shoot a flare at migrants today?
Is that something you're proud of?
Do you think that was a good thing for you to be involved in?
And if not, why not?
And don't you owe those people anything?
Don't you owe the people who you used for propaganda in those old videos?
Don't you?
Is it that?
These are the kinds of questions that any reasonable person would ask Lauren Southern, given the chance to speak to her, right?
You mean actually try to get at the content Rather than the form of her politics.
Right.
And before anybody gets at me on this, I know that Lance from the Serfs got into, like, did a kind of a two-on-two debate about the Indigenous graves in Canada, and he had his own reasons for doing that and recognizes that it was kind of a problematic thing to do.
I'm going to kind of give him a pass on that.
I sort of agree with his, like, he was trying to draw attention to the indigenous rights movement in Canada on a big platform at the time.
And you can agree or disagree with that.
I'm just kind of like, I wash my hands of it.
I don't feel the degree.
I don't feel the need to argue one way or the other on that.
Right.
You know, but.
Okay.
I don't know anything about this.
Yeah, so yeah, it was it was it was a bunch of bullshit because I don't think anybody should be treating Lauren Southern as any kind of respectful person.
And I think Lance actually has the skills to actually do the thing that I was doing before, you know, because he could obviously bring all this stuff up and he is charm and camera presence and all those sort of thing um he chose not to for his own reasons and that's you know look i hope he does not ever speak to her again um but i actually do kind of like the serfs and i think lance is probably a decent human being and i you know again just don't want to just don't want to bring up that kind of issue and not at least address that particular issue
i mean i will ding destiny forever because he is just a fucking dipshit on this stuff you know um anyway so the reason i started doing this episode was because i was originally prepping a like an episode about like uh ukraine um that's sort of like the right-wing propaganda around ukraine but What happened with that is what happened after the Trump election, after the 2020 election.
I thought there were going to be various types of narratives that you could pull apart and find interesting dimensions of, and then everything solidified in 24 hours.
And they're all telling like the same story now, which is, you know, NATO aggressor, et cetera, et cetera.
Anyway, we will probably get into this in kind of future episodes.
But in the process of kind of doing this, I noticed that Lauren Southern was hanging out with Tim Pool, which they used to do back in the day when they were both doing kind of covering the no go zones, et cetera, in Europe and in various places.
There are photos of them together being little Nazis to each other.
She has never been.
Which aren't real, by the way.
They're not a thing.
They're not a thing.
Yep.
No, no.
I believe there's a thought slime line, which is like an area with a little bit more crime is not actually an area that you can't go.
Yeah, very much so.
So anyway, Lauren Southern showed up on on Tim Pool's show and actually on subsequent days.
So that's a live stream from Destiny's live stream that I shared with you in the cold open was on March 1st.
So she had appeared on Tim Pool's show on the 28th.
So like the most recent episode at that time, and then would also appear on the night of March 1st.
So when she's recording with Destiny and doing their walk around DC and doing the bickering couple thing, she's also highlighting and hyping the fact that she's going to be back on Tim Pool's show that night.
So life is a vicious circle, right?
And not only does she show up on on those two episodes, but she shows up on the show called Cast Castle, which is this sort of like lifestyle channel where it's Tim Pool showing off all the cool stuff he has in his like multi-million dollar house.
It's also like the recording studio.
They've got like a skateboarding ramp.
They've got, you know, chickens and they're built.
They're just constantly building stuff on there.
And so there it's just like this, you know, almost like the real world Tim Pool sort of thing, you know?
And so it's all the characters are on all the various channels that he's in.
And you just get to see some behind the scenes stuff.
And it's very like Tim Pool trying to build his brand up.
Well, Lauren Southern shows up and I believe the thing is like the description of the video is Lauren Southern almost kills herself with rollerblading or worse than effect.
But um.
They decide on the night of the 1st that they're going to do a little drinking game with the State of the Union Address.
And I just think this encapsulates the nature of Tempool's material just so well.
I think it's worth, you know, just playing this little minute and a half or so of what this drinking game is going to be like live on Temcast IRL, by the way.
Tonight, we're doing a State of the Union bingo drinking game on IRL.
YouTube's cleared us to do it.
I'm saying it because I don't trust them.
But what about mentions any of the fake stories from Ukraine, like the ghost of Kiev or Snake Island?
Put that on there.
We're making it to the point where he's going to say these words.
What about if he mentions... You can't see yet.
It's going to be a surprise.
Why don't we do like a bet pool?
And then it's like, um, like, wagers, so like, if he ends up for some reason saying corn pop, it's like five shots at once.
Right.
That's the likelihood of him saying it's likely, it's really low.
That is not a bad idea.
What's the likelihood of him calling his child's school a racial jungle?
Why don't I just interrupt it?
Like, one of his staff comes up and is like, you know, we gotta stop.
We might end up streaming for, like, late.
So, it gets interrupted.
Starts early.
Ends early.
Sorry, starts late.
Starts late, ends early.
Those are all, like, good fun ones if it happens.
No questions.
No questions?
Is it?
I'll check.
No, there's not.
Yeah, I knew that.
That's why I said it was probably going to happen.
I can see him finishing and then walking in a completely wrong direction.
That's so true.
Walked the wrong way.
Very friendly relationship with these people.
Yeah, I was going to say, yeah.
Baldi McDickface is very friendly with Blondie McLieface.
Blondie McNutzieface.
Very friendly.
There's no content to any of this.
You know, there's no sense of, you know, like, even though, like, they're going to sell, they're going to tell, like, the Ukrainian propaganda is just like, it's like the mean stuff that was going on in that particular moment.
It was like what was on, you know, the front page of Breitbart or OAN or whatever.
It's like all the, you know, some of the original reporting out of Ukraine was, you know, turned out to not be accurate.
And therefore this is all just a NATO plot or whatever to draw the U S into a war because of, you know, yada, yada, great reset.
Nothing, nothing, nothing.
Anyway, very real criticisms of a lot of this stuff, et cetera, et cetera.
That's not what we're doing here, but there's no content to any of this.
There's no sense of, well, maybe he should talk about, you know, pandemic response, or maybe he should talk about, you know, maybe we should, you know, drink to that.
Or when he's not being fully truthful about, you know, the, the way his bills are not being passed through Congress and the failure.
Like, no, no, there's no, there's no content to any of this.
And I listened to a whole bunch of that drinking game, you know, night and there's nothing there.
It's just so devoid of any kind of actual political content or any actual discussion of anything.
It's completely aesthetic and it's completely aesthetic in the most juvenile way possible.
Like you can imagine like a, you know, you know, a Washington Post, like, you know, we're going to do like a drinking game at the State of the Union.
Right.
That's maybe not The Washington Post, but you can imagine some, you know, some kind of, you know, lefty blog, you know, gawker or something kind of doing this thing, but actually using it as a way of demonstrating very real problems with the Biden administration, you know, and very real things about our politics.
And so using it as a fun gateway into that.
There's none of this.
It's just the fucking meme culture.
That's all they do.
Yeah.
Well, that's it.
Yeah.
And they're inviting Lauren Southern, former, like, former, in heavy quotes, Nazi, is very welcome in this conversation.
Very, very welcome.
Yeah, that's exactly what struck me.
It normalizes.
It's an exercise in normalization.
Exactly.
Tim Poole claims to be, you know, a liberal or a centrist or neutral or whatever the fuck he's claiming to be these days.
Tim Pool, of course, is in practice, if you look at what he produces, a reactionary, a right winger.
But, you know, he claims to be this disinterested, neutral, centrist journalist who just sort of considers every question, you know, one by one.
And there's Lauren Southern, Nazi.
Claims not to be, of course, but still, obviously, nobody questions.
Demonstrably.
Yeah, demonstrably, and nobody questions it.
Nobody has done this.
When you say you're different, how?
Materially, how?
That's just not happened.
So there she is, and she's just, you know, mucking in with the gang.
Everybody's laughing, and they're laughing about Ukraine.
Like, it's this, oh, imagine taking that seriously.
Oh, imagine being the sort of person that cared about that, like Biden does.
That's, yeah, it's just normalization of what is essentially a fascist worldview.
And this is, you know, This is theorists have pointed this out.
Fascism is essentially the reduction, you know, in at least in this sphere, it's the reduction of politics to pure aesthetics.
You know, it's the taking of the content out and having just the form.
That's what they're doing there.
Exactly.
And it's worth actually playing a little bit of one of her appearances.
This is from the night before.
This is from the 28th of February episode.
But this is sort of how Tim Pool introduces Lauren Southern to his audience.
And, you know, again, kid gloves, very friendly.
So this one I did.
Documentary filmmaker, journalist, controversial, something like that.
I did.
I did cut into this slightly because they're kind of doing like a round robin of like introducing everybody at the beginning of the show.
And there is a like a moment of there's about a minute and a half that I clip here where another person is introduced.
They kind of go right back to Lauren.
So I didn't mark it, but I do want to just highlight that, you know, I did kind of clip into this slightly.
So, you know, just in case anybody wants to call me a liar for like Not actually playing that minute and a half of like boring because there's a guy named Seamus and a sign behind him says Shimcast and that's the real name of the show.
Yeah, nobody needs to care about that at all.
But here's the audio.
Pleasure to be here.
Thanks for having me.
Do you want to introduce yourself?
Yeah.
I'm Lauren Southern.
I am a documentary filmmaker, completely canceled all over the world.
Like a lot of people here, I'm sure.
Nah, we're good.
Just you.
No, just me.
All right, great.
Yeah.
Came here from Canada all the way.
How's that going?
Canada?
Oh, I'm glad to escape briefly from our dictatorship.
So that's been good.
They're not going to let you back in when they see this now.
Yeah, they're going to be like, hey, that's her.
She called it a dictatorship?
I was told to be on good behavior while I was here.
But you've done a lot of reporting before.
You did reporting at the Rebel, right?
Yeah, I was at Rebel Media, and then I did a bunch of independent, on-the-ground stuff.
We certainly crossed paths a few times at protests in Europe.
Viciously anti-Islam protested Europe, by the way.
I was going to say.
Yeah, that's how she got her start.
Ferociously Islamophobic, yeah.
That's actually like an undersold story about her, because when I was looking back at the very beginnings of her channel, it's all like, she started out as one of the FemRA types, the female MRA types.
Oh yeah, no, this is Karen Strahan, you know, like that was the beginning of her content.
And then also, like, you know, the real feminism is like attacking Islam because of female genital mutilation and that, like, that was her narrative back in 2015, you know.
Absolutely.
This has kind of been lost about Lauren Southern and all the noise, you know, because there's so much noise that she makes.
But really, you know, originally the animating forces of Lauren Southern, if you go back and look at her original material, it's very MRA-ish anti-feminism and absolutely ferocious, virulent anti-Semitism, not anti-Semitism, although I'm sure as well, Islamophobia.
Yeah, so absolutely.
I mean, George Soros gets a few like heavy mentions towards the end of that Crossfire documentary, but she actually maintains a certain degree of respectable deniability just by never really talking too much about.
That would be a question I'd ask her, you know.
How do you feel about the Holocaust?
How many people do you think died in the Holocaust?
It's funny how nobody ever seems to ask her that question.
It would be a fascinating thing to say, especially the degree to which her current, you know, rejection of the indigenous mass graves in Canada.
Her whole stick right now is, you know, they can't show a single body that's been unearthed from these so-called mass graves.
And it's like, yeah, that rhetoric sounds familiar there, Lauren.
That rhetoric sounds very, very familiar to me.
Yeah, the guy who produced that documentary, she did a short documentary on her YouTube channel about this issue.
That guy is sitting next to her in the chair at the TimCast IRL live show at this point, by the way.
So just in case you were curious about whether they're still working together or whether this is all kind of part of one big happy family, it very much is at this point.
So getting back into this.
I took a bit of a break from media and I'm back working on a few movies.
I had Borderless, Farmlands, Crossfire, and my new one is American Mirage.
Interesting.
What is that one about?
It's about the caravans and illegal migration into the U.S.
We definitely need to talk about that.
God, what a topic!
Jesus, Lauren, you're just doing the same topic over and over again.
On her YouTube channel, she actually has a trailer for a documentary she's making.
It's about modern problems with modern love and kind of disconnection between people.
Which I guarantee you is going to be used as a stick to beat on trans people.
Like, I can just tell you, it's going to be like gay people at pride and twerking and like, you know, shoving, you know, male butts into children's and, you know, like, oh, that's what that video, that's what that movie, that documentary is going to be.
At least that's not like, let's just do more stuff about migrants.
Like, it's literally the same shit over and over and over again.
Yeah, it's interesting how many of her projects track back in some form or another to, you know, in some sense, how awful people of color are, you know.
It's just a coincidence, I'm sure.
It's just straight great replacement.
It's just straight great replacement stuff.
Oh, yeah.
That's all it ever is, you know.
I don't know if you heard that the US government issued a memo requesting Customs and Border Protection leave the southern border to go to Poland to process refugees from Ukraine.
And it's like a job anyone can do and there's no reason to take our border guards off to do it.
Especially when there's not enough there.
They've given up on trying to protect the border because they've got so many people just working on processing people.
Or is that the policy of the Biden administration to have no border?
Yeah, it's half and half.
I mean, when you want to get into the documentary, you will.
All right.
Hey, I'm glad you're here, Lauren.
I'm happy to be here.
So that's the cut, right?
Okay.
Yeah.
Okay.
Is that the policy of the Biden administration to have no border?
Asks the serious journalist.
Exactly.
As if, you know, and even like left of center, you know, maybe not like the most blue wavy Democrat of the blue wavy Democrats, but like, Basically everyone left of center has had like the same fucking criticism of you didn't actually much change the Trump administration's kits and cages policy.
You put softer pillows in and you kind of said some nicer words.
You're not literally calling people rapists and murderers, but you haven't actually changed much.
Like it really just hasn't changed.
You know, that's that's been certainly, I think, a consistent criticism that I've been making.
Basically, everyone on the left who is not like, hey, you know, a lapdog licking the boot of the Democratic Party has been saying exactly that.
You know, yes, Trump was worse.
Biden, still terrible, still terrible.
We're allowed, you know, but no open borders because some right wing conspiracy bullshit, you know, like that's and that's the reality there.
Yeah.
Um, you're now listening to Ian Crosland.
So again, there's a little bit that I cut there and Ian Crosland is now going to talk about how, uh, how he originally found Lauren Southern's content and, uh, spoiler alert, it's through a Stefan Molyneux video.
You were like focusing on immigration way before I realized the danger and then I started studying like Roman history, the history of the fall of the Roman Empire and stuff and how basically unfettered immigration is the...
It's subtle there.
Stefan Molyneux made a video about how Rome fell because of migration.
Immigration toppled the Roman Empire.
And Sean did an amazing video debunking this back in the day.
But you can see Ian Crosland, because he doesn't actually, he's just too dumb to know, like, you know, not to say the quiet part loud.
He will just say stuff.
And if you are paying attention, you know, oh, so you failed Lauren Southern because you were watching Stefan Molyneux videos about and then got interested in reading about the Roman Empire and how that fell.
And that led you to Lauren Southern's content.
Oh, gee, I wonder if there might be like a web of connections here.
Also, shouldn't you maybe have, like, found out about Lauren Southern from your, like, boss and best friend, you know, who's sitting over there?
Like, Ian is on, like, every episode of this fucking podcast, practically.
Anyway, it's hilarious, right?
It's amazing.
Yeah.
Reason that that fell.
Any country that just lets other cultures come in and then set up shop and create the government is now that government.
Yeah, I've never understood the reaction to my conversations about immigration.
People always just lose their minds.
This is racism.
Immigrant is code word for like anyone that's not white to you, and that's why you don't want mass immigration.
And I'm like, anywhere except the West, I am a liberal.
I'm like far left.
If you go to Anywhere in Asia, anywhere in Africa, even if you go just down to Mexico, they're like, nope, no foreigners in.
Close these borders.
We want to protect our own first.
And I'm like, all right, we just need to, you know, slow it down a bit.
And that's racist here.
I'm a liberal by non-Western standards, but you're far right if you're living in America and say these things.
Yeah.
Okay.
A. My position is just we need to just slow it down and calm down a bit, says the woman who was literally trying to kill people who were trying to immigrate.
My position is just we should calm down, she says.
B. I'm not a racist.
I'm not a racist.
And my proof of that is everywhere in Asia and Mexico, everybody hates immigrants.
And even if you read that through, like, I have a slightly different lens.
I agree with you completely.
But, you know, it turns out everywhere I go around the world, everyone I talk to is harder on the immigration issue that I am.
Yeah.
That probably doesn't say much about the actual populations in these countries.
Like, yeah, I think there's a common factor here.
I think there might be some selection bias in your experience.
It's like these guys that say women don't enjoy sex, in my experience.
Well, yeah, maybe not generalized from the particular there, sir.
Absolutely, absolutely.
That's how Lauren, so again, it's the same language she's always used.
It's the same like two step of, you know, I just have legitimate concerns about these kind of immigration issues and the cultural factors and et cetera.
And I'm not a Nazi.
I'm not a white supremacist.
I just, I feel like these people have ideas that need to be explored and we should, you know, I just, I just want to have the conversation.
Like, let's have a real honest conversation about the, What these policies are doing to affect the people around the world, you know?
And she pretends to be this like completely reasonable actor, but then she's hanging out with like these far right dipshits all the time and, you know, actively advocating for the only people who are actually doing the work that is actually going to prevent these kinds of terrible policies from continuing.
Those people need to be mowed down with cars and beaten with truncheons by the police.
You know, that's the and that's the reality.
That's that's who she is.
Yes, indeed.
So we're almost wrapping up here, but I think I really, I feel bad because I feel like, again, there's just no way to kind of cover Lauren Southern fully in this format.
I just don't feel like the podcast format and our podcast format doesn't lend itself to doing her justice because she produces so much bullshit and she's so like wrong all the time that you really have to like go through with a fine tooth comb and you really do have to do like the more nuanced fact checking as opposed to kind of apply a more kind of generalized filter to her.
And I think I've tried to kind of like do both at the same time, but I think it's worth just looking at her most recent YouTube video and And ask yourself...
Has this woman changed?
This is a piece about how the woke have destroyed J.R.R.
Tolkien's Lord of the Rings with this new Amazon series, which has people of color in it, and maybe a little bit of gay representation and lesbian representation.
And it's not just a bunch of white people running around in a pastiche of medieval Europe anymore.
Am I am I wrong, or is this not actually even released yet?
I don't think it's been actually released.
I believe that there were some like EPK, you know, stuff that kind of came out on YouTube in which the cast is talking about how diverse and how, you know, and kind of the various experiences that they had kind of kind of trying to bring a more modern vision to this this this kind of old text.
And, you know, there's been a lot of kind of talk in You know, the JRR Tolkien Society and, you know, the people who are kind of the executors of his books and all that sort of thing, like really having, you know, very real conversations about, you know, the various ways that Tolkien can be read.
And he's not a simple figure, you know, he's not kind of straightforwardly one thing or the other.
And which, you know, you can read him and you can read him in a very sympathetic light and get some some really interesting things out of that.
And I think that that reflects I'm not a huge Tolkien guy or anything.
Um, but I feel like that does reflect kind of the quality of the original work and that he does have a sort of honesty about the way he views the world.
And you know, there again, there are complicated conversations about this, but the sheer fact that the new Lord of the Rings series is going to have Young millennial, you know, in Gen Z, people of color in it.
That's enough to make Lauren Southern go, I need to make a video about this, because apparently it's still 2015 and the SVG is just going to be 2015 forever.
This is just highlighting how Lauren Southern has not really moved past her, you know, her origins, right?
You know, So let's just, let's just play, let's just play this little clip.
And this is again from, you know, at the time of this recording, this is from her very most recent video.
This is what Lauren Southern is making right now.
This is after the appearances on the Temcast podcast, right?
You know, this is, this is after all that.
Not like good old John Ronald Rowell was tweeting out hot takes about World War II or the British government or whatever would have trended on Twitter if it existed when he was alive.
In fact, and I swear this was possible in an age before the internet, he doesn't seem to have publicly opined on politics at all, which has led a lot of people to think Tolkien didn't have opinions on it, an ambiguity that progressives have taken full advantage of.
At the end of the day, Tolkien died in the 70s.
So it's up to us, you know, to basically step our game up and see how his works can respond through the world that they created to the challenges of today.
But if they took two minutes to read his private letters, They would know Tolkien was far from a fence-sitter and has politics that would be very applicable to today, but which I would never expect to come from this man.
Let's put it this way.
If you think that J.K.
Rowling is leading in the cancelled fiction authors department, had Tolkien lived another 50 years, the reaction to his hot takes would have granted him that crown in mere minutes.
That is unless H.P.
Lovecraft joined the race.
Do not ask me his cat's name.
Jack, I'm sure you're aware of what H.P.
Lovecraft's cat's name was when he was a child.
Yes.
Yes, I know what H.P.
Lovecraft's cat's name was.
And there are, I think, at least two of his stories in which a black cat has the same name or a variation on the same name.
Yes.
It's Inward Man, although it doesn't say inward.
It's the word.
Yes.
Yeah.
Look at Lauren Southern there, just really wanting to.
This is not a defense of H.P.
Lovecraft, but that would have, I think that would have been a reasonably common name among white people for black cats at the time because of the racist culture that H.P.
Lovecraft lived in.
Right.
There are plenty of reasons to think that H.P.
Lovecraft was a racist.
Oh, he was.
He absolutely was a racist.
Absolutely was a disgusting racist.
Yeah, exactly.
And a very, very conscious one as well.
I mean, you know, this wasn't like it wasn't like, you know, I was just a man of his time.
He was considered unusually and distressingly racist by people at the time.
Yeah.
When people in like 1924 are going, dude, maybe tone it down a little bit, you know?
But of course, you know, Lauren Southern just really wants to stick that in there, you know, just that, hey, go Google the name of H.P.
Lovecraft's cat.
I mean, I don't really know what her point is.
I mean, it's it's it's just using the word.
She can't use the word, but she wants to she wants to use the word.
It's a meme.
It's a meme.
It's a rambling meme.
OK.
Yeah.
That's all it is.
Well, no, not OK.
You know what I mean?
I just love this whole idea.
So first of all, she's going to go through and look at a bunch of private letters written over the course of decades and draw out some of Tolkien's politics to prove how right-wing he is and how not progressive he was.
There are also plenty of- so A, you can't take his politics from that time and map it directly onto ours.
Also, the word anarchist doesn't mean what she thinks it means in that context.
We're not going to play any of this, but it's filled with very obvious- to me, who does not know much about J.R.R.
Tolkien's politics, It's clear that she's taking things completely out of context and reading them in this way to own the libs, to own the SJWs, because they dare to think that maybe there can be people of color and gay people and trans people in Tolkien's world, that maybe it doesn't have to be a right-wing fantasy, you know?
Yeah.
But that's the kind of content she's making now, you know?
Yeah.
Just to touch upon this, J.R.R.
Tolkien's politics, fascinating subject in terms of, you know, the political valences of his work.
That's fascinating to think about and to draw out.
Very, very complicated.
In terms of his actual personal political opinions and so on, which we do find expressed in his letters and so on and so forth, not only to his son, but to other people.
Again, very interesting to think about.
No bearing whatsoever on what we do today with the world that he created now that we're making original stories based upon it.
None, except as a question of discussion, you know, what he would have thought about there being black elves or whatever the fuck they're doing with this new TV series that I think it's coming from Amazon, isn't it?
Yeah, it's an Amazon series.
Yeah, that's being made by a fucking mega corporation.
Because, you know, Middle Earth and Lord of the Rings is now A massive IP, you know?
The entire fucking context, it's different.
It's no longer one guy, one Cambridge Don or Oxford Don or whatever he was, you know, working out his incredibly complicated and strange sort of personal legendarium in fiction.
It's now Amazon owning a multi-billion dollar IP and creating a fucking franchise out of it, you know?
It's just, it's no relevance at all!
It's no relevance at all!
Absolutely, absolutely.
How fucking stupid do you have to be to think?
I don't even, I mean, I think this is cynical.
I think this is, you know, get the clicks about the Amazon series while it's, you know, the pan is hot.
Get your clicks, get in and get out.
It's standard 2015, 2014 anti-SJW content.
Yeah.
It's just she's doing it in 2022.
She hasn't got tits anymore.
She's doing it in 2022.
She hasn't got tits anymore.
And doing this stuff, it allows her to distract from, you know, her more overtly racist past, right?
You know, she still gets to get into stuff, but she's not doing, like, open antisemitism.
She's not talking about Graper talking points.
She's doing anti-SJW bullshit.
And like, that's, that's kind of what we run into a lot of times with these people is that they just produce this sort of volume of stuff that's all aimed in a certain direction, but has no, like, kind of direct overt political valence towards this, you know, kind of, you know, actual, you know, kind of far right, you know, genocidal agenda, right?
You know, it's not about that.
She's just talking about, Hey, can't we just have the books and the stories the way we're used to?
Why can't it just be white people here?
Because, like, that's the history, right?
Middle Earth was never a place, you know, obviously.
But, you know, it is.
It is.
Like, that's that's that's what that's what this is meant to do.
And that's that's the content she's making now.
So that's who Lauren Southern is, you know.
And it's incredibly infuriating because, again, to get into this and to, like, pick out, so you'd have to look at the letters she's reading out of context, put them back into context, and then put them into political context in terms of, like, what Tolkien was actually writing about at the time and what his, you know, kind of other political beliefs are.
You know, it is a huge effort to unpack all of that just to debunk a 15-minute video from Nazi Barbie over there.
Yeah, yeah, and she's not, she's not going to be, I mean I haven't heard this, but she's not going to be making any serious effort to deal intelligently with Tolkien's politics, which is an interesting subject.
She's just, as you say, she's just creating classic Why do they have to ruin what was previously just a space that we thought was just for us by putting those people into it?
Wow.
I don't like it.
Wow.
Material, you know, for people that are presumably going to buy that.
That's all it is.
With no reckoning whatsoever with any of the political economy of how fiction is commodified in the modern age, in the age of Amazon, you know, Streaming television.
It's just, it's child, it's child stuff.
It's nonsense.
It's child politics.
Exactly.
Exactly.
And again, that's where she is.
So she gets to just be that.
She gets to just be that person now.
And she gets to be invited onto all these different shows.
She gets to make money.
She has sponsors.
She has ad revenue.
She still has a Twitter account.
You know, she got banned from Twitch last year.
I don't remember exactly why she got banned from Twitch.
She was, you know, doing something awful and got banned from Twitch.
And she's like the most banned person ever.
And this feeds right into that cancel culture meme.
That's like all over the place.
And, you know, on the right wing, even the moderate right wing, the whole thing is like, you're being canceled for your beliefs because you have normal, you know, Yeah, that's the first thing she said in that clip from the Tim Pool Show appearance, you know, oh, you know, cancelled.
And it's exactly what, you know, Marjorie Taylor Greene opened at FPAC in our last episode.
Hello, cancelled Americans.
Exactly.
It's just the standard rhetoric now.
And then, you know, then being cancelled is the same thing, whether you're, you know, Marjorie Taylor Greene or Nick Fuentes, you know, suddenly, suddenly all of those, all of the, the distinctions of the politics they get to be, well, we're the, we're the ones who are saying things that the liberals don't want you to say.
We're all just expressing our political beliefs and we're just trying to have honest conversations about these issues.
And the communist Democrats won't let you do it.
The communists at Google and Facebook, they just won't let you have this conversation.
Don't you know, there's a great reset happening?
Yeah, it's exactly that.
And again, what does it serve to do?
To unite the right.
That's what the whole political project is, is to unite these people around a single issue and to gain access for these extremely far-right ideas, like the Great Replacement and White Genocide, and putting them into mainstream Republican politics.
That's the goal.
That's what they're doing.
That's what all of this is meant for.
It's been a years-long project, and they are being very successful at it.
Yes, indeed.
Yeah.
So clearly, what we need to do is to get the ring to Mordor somehow so that we can get it to the crack of doom in the side of the mountain and and destroy it.
And thus, you know, Sauron will be defeated.
That's clearly what we need to do.
Yeah.
No, that's clearly.
Hey, look, at least at least it's not a Harry Potter metaphor.
You know, come on.
Give me some credit.
Indeed.
I have read another book.
Maybe even more than that.
So, you know, we're good.
We're good.
Okay. - Okay.
All right.
Well, that was, yeah, that was certainly an episode about Lauren Southern.
That's what that was.
It was.
I just feel so bad because I really wanted to like, there's so much that when you start prepping this sort of episode, it's just like, and then there's that weird moment in 2016 where she was doing this and it's like, no, stick to the plot, stick to, you know, don't go too far afield.
But yeah, no, it's exactly the same phenomenon.
And we can't, you know, look, Destiny is a dipshit.
Destiny is an asshole.
Destiny is practically a fascist at this point.
You know, like he's, you know.
He's at least reactionary in the way that fascists are, even though he expresses that through a neoliberal orthodoxy, right?
Well, he's hanging out with Lawrence Southern, who's a Nazi.
I mean, what more do you want?
Yeah, but they work you, Jack.
They bicker back and forth.
Look at them.
They're really just sharing audiences.
That's really what's going on there.
I think to a large degree is like, you know, they're both of their audiences get off on watching them bicker, watching them kind of fight with each other.
And they both derive benefit from that, like financial, direct financial benefit from that relationship.
I'm sure that's a large degree.
And that is, that is a key part of the political economy of how fascist movements work in the second decade of the 21st century.
Or are we in the third decade now?
I've lost count.
This isn't very hard, but yeah, no, it's very late where you are.
So wrapping up, check out.
Yeah, check out Patreon, et cetera.
Yeah, this is that was episode one hundred and five of I Don't Speak German.
The next one will be episode one hundred and six.
That's the most we can tell you with any degree.
Unless we just skip one of six and go right to one of seven.
Maybe this is it.
Now that I've said that, you know, the next episode will somehow not be the 106th episode.
I don't know how, but it won't, obviously.
So, yeah.
Happy birthday, Daniel.
Thanks for joining us on your birthday.
Thanks for spending your birthday listening to Lauren Southern.
It was a pleasure.
No, it wasn't.
But, you know, it's very worthwhile to get to do this work, and I appreciate everyone who helps make it happen.
Yes, indeed.
We do appreciate all the people who listen, who allow us to do this work and make this show.
And we appreciate, I won't say more, because listening and talking about us and so on, that's fantastic.
But if you can, why not toddle over to our Patreons to give us a dollar or whatever you like per month and get access to extras.
You can hear us talk bollocks even more often.
It's fun times all around.
And with that, goodbye.
Goodbye.
That was I Don't Speak German.
Thanks for listening.
If you enjoyed the show or found it useful, please spread the word.
If you want to contact me, I'm at underscore Jack underscore Graham underscore, Daniel is at Daniel E Harper, and the show's Twitter is at IDSGpod.
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I Don't Speak German is hosted at idonspeakgerman.libsyn.com, and we're also on Apple Podcasts, Soundcloud, Spotify, Stitcher, and we show up in all podcast apps.
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