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This came out in 92, late 92.
And I would have seen it on like, I actually saw it on pay-per-view in early 93 or like mid 93, whenever it was released.
So I would have been like 13 or so when I saw this movie.
Um, and I feel like it's, uh, you know, it made a big impression on me because of the time in which I saw it.
Cause it was kind of the first, like, Oscar baby movie that, like, I kind of saw and understood on, you know, a first viewing, you know, like, it just hits you at that, like, moment in life, I think.
And so I have a fondness for this that the film really does not deserve for the slightest, you know?
So, you know, but I've rewatched it many times over the years and, you know, sat down to rewatch it recently and went like, wow, there's There's a lot here.
There's a lot here.
So yeah.
Yeah.
No, I saw it back in the day.
I suppose it would have been like 1993, probably a video rental.
I don't really remember.
But yeah, I remember it.
I remember seeing it several times for some reason.
I can't think why.
Maybe it was a big movie.
This was a big movie at the time.
Yeah, it was a big deal.
Yeah, it was.
It was a huge hit.
It made $240 million on like a $40 million budget, which Doesn't sound like a lot in 2021.
Well, maybe in 20 in 2020.
Those are big numbers, right?
In the middle of the pandemic.
But, you know, that doesn't sound like a ton, but like that was a huge movie at the time.
You know, it's probably thinking about it.
For me, it was probably Jack Nicholson.
I was probably watching it on the strength of him, you know, nominated for Best Picture.
I mean, it got it.
It was it was kind of one of the big like awards big pictures at that time.
So.
Yes, yes.
Because it's very, well, it's a movie about ideas and ethics.
Big, big ideas.
Very thoughtful, yeah.
Like the Nuremberg defense.
Well, I mean, that is it, isn't it?
Really?
I watched it several times back in the day and watched it again for the first time in years, decades, probably just just in the last couple of hours in preparation for this.
And yeah, it's shit and it's deeply, deeply stupid and deeply, deeply offensive.
And yeah, basically it is championing the Nuremberg defense and lampshading it, but nevertheless, that's what it's saying.
Right.
But only with respect to Americans.
I think that's the all important wrinkle, isn't it?
Right.
It's the Nuremberg defense, American exceptionalism edition.
Let's put it that way.
But Jack, he's mirror engaged, sir.
Don't you understand?
Yeah.
You're engaged.
This is not something we need to interrogate any further.
He's mirror engaged.
Therefore, the shooting was justified.
Therefore, Santiago... Yeah.
Yeah.
Well, I hate to do this because it feels like cheating, but I'll read for the audience a message that I sent to Daniel.
On our private WhatsApp group, while I was in the middle of watching this movie, suddenly, out of nowhere, Paul Daniel gets a message from me that says, Oh my dear, sweet, merciful, weeping Christ, this fucking movie.
And that was in direct response to the bit where, what's his name, Kevin Pollock says, why do you like them so much?
And Demi Moore swings around and she gives him this piercing stare and she says to him, it's because they stand the post and they say, nobody's going to hurt you tonight, not on my watch.
And I just thought, yeah, because Americans are in dire, desperate danger of being invaded and killed by Cuba.
Right, exactly.
And like the best that like Kevin Pollak has in response, you know, like his answer is, you know, because they beat up on a little kid because he couldn't run very fast.
You know, there's certainly no moral heft given to one side over the other in this.
Yeah.
Yeah.
The correct answer to her, because that's that's that's his response to her rhetorical question just earlier in that scene.
Why do you hate them so much?
The correct answer to that is because they're fucking murderers.
Indeed.
Indeed.
Although I think the film argues that they had no, they didn't have any reason to believe that Santiago was going to die, given that.
But like, you know, they are, they are a part of this like system.
I don't know.
It gets complicated because ultimately we are kind of given, what we are given by the film is what we're given by the film, ultimately.
And we're, you know, we're sort of treated to, you know, that as a, as a justification.
But they willingly engage with this system that does these things, you know.
Well, this is why I did think that old Rittenhouse might pop up.
Because one of the things about the Rittenhouse verdict is that I'm no expert on American law, so I don't know.
But people have been saying about the Rittenhouse verdict, you know, stuff like, well, like it or not, agree with his politics, agree with what he did or not.
You know, ethically, putting all that to one side, just legally, it was the right verdict, right?
Because he didn't go there with intent.
People have been saying things like that.
And that is kind of what this film says, isn't it?
It kind of says, well, they're not murderers because they didn't intend.
