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Sept. 9, 2025 - Stay Free - Russel Brand
01:00:14
Media Lies & Setups? Tommy Robinson’s Panodrama Watch Along - SF630
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Russell Grand Conspiracy Theorists trying to bring real journalism to the American people.
Hello there, you awakening wonders.
Thanks for joining me today for Stay Free with Russell Brand.
Because we did our interview with Tommy Robinson recently, and because on the 13th of September there is a protest march in the United Kingdom that Tommy Robinson is a participant in organising.
We are going to watch Panadrama.
And of course, because I've got a vested interest in looking at the behaviour of British media when it comes to well, what Tommy Robinson says is that British media organizations were going to set him up for a sting and falsely accuse him of sex crimes.
Now, this came up in the conversation with Tommy and I. He talked about his documentary Panadrama.
So for today's watch along, we're gonna have a look at it with my beloved friends, Dave Fields, our producer and my dear friend Jake Smith, and join us from the UK, our correspondent Joe McCann.
How are you doing, mate?
Alright.
Yeah, I'm not bad.
Do you think you'll go to that thing on September the 13th, uh Tommy Robinson thing?
I'm thinking about it.
Probably.
I think it's important, isn't it?
So I think I will go.
I'm sceptical, do you know what I mean?
I've got a lot of people that are considering it that are considering going, and like and I suppose people have them doubts about what it represents.
But you know what?
This bloke, Gavin DeBecker, uh who's a sort of a brilliant writer and who I met through Bobby Kennedy, has told me to read this book called The Brass Check.
And the brass check talks about how from the beginning media organisations have been owned by a small group of people that censorship is not a um a modern phenomena and propaganda and the control of information has always been more coordinated than we imagined.
And the brass check is sort of about how that takes place.
And when you sort of when you read that, and it's using examples where it's talking about American politics in the 1930s.
There's like a guy called Jack London, I think it's the writer Jack London, and I don't know, he spoke out in favour of I think certain socialist ideas.
And like American newspapers like the New York Times and other sort of, you know, it's more sort of state-organised American print media, and certainly it was then, all like ran space of negative articles on him, stuff that weren't true, and I thought like, well, this has always been the way that media has operated.
And when I just had an example like that that for me had no heat in it, I don't really know much about Jack London or who he is.
I don't have the same affiliation with America, don't know much about that period in American history.
But to sort of hear that media has always been like that, made me think about someone like Tommy Robinson, particularly because I've experienced it myself, and how much if someone is having an impact on the way that people are communicated with, how what kind of forces will go to work on ensuring that you hate that person.
They'll just say whatever they need to say.
So when I was talking to Tommy Robinson, I was thinking, how much of these feelings or thoughts that I have about him are things that I know, and how much of it's just stuff I've read, heard, had pushed down my throat.
Because when I talk to him, it's like talking to someone I went to school with.
That's what it feels like.
Just like, oh well, me and Dean was on the West Bank, like it just sort of made me kind of laugh.
Right.
So like the reason I mentioned all that about Tommy Robinson is course because the interview's out and we'd love you to watch it.
Of course, because we talk about September the first, even of course, at his recommendation.
We're watching Panorma, which is a documentary Tommy Robinson's made about how panorama, which is a bit like 60 minutes in your country, a show that it's like an in-depth look at the news, tried to set him up and frame him as a sex criminal,
and they had talked to like people that work with him, manipulated him, suggested stuff, and in some instances paid people, and in some cases, you know, I wonder if they'd have gone as far as to get actors to play people in a documentary, something that I've got personal experience of to frame him.
So we're gonna watch that panorama and uh it'll be interesting for you, Watch it Joe.
Have you seen it before?
Nah.
And it'll be interesting for you, Dave, because like I went Dave has been kind enough to travel to the UK with me for many of the preliminary hearings that I've had to attend as a part of the court process.
You know, as you know, I'm standing trial in the UK in June next year.
And uh like Dave Has come with me.
In fact, if you have a look at some of the footage and photographs, maybe Mass, you can find some of them.
Like it's Dave and Joe that are there.
And Dave and Joe.
And I'm hoping you, Jake, will be with me.
Isaac, I'd like you and your family there.
Because I'm going to be there for three weeks in June.
And we'll be still, we'll be streaming.
We'll be making content.
Like I'll be reporting every day after the court case.
Obviously, well, it won't be salved judiciary anymore, because it'll be public information.
There'll be press in the gallery reporting on their side of it.
I'll be reporting on my side of it.
Um Dave, so your all your experiences of the UK are like sort of these smash and grab hit and run visits.
Like, well, how long did you stay the second time?
Were you there a week the second time?
I think 10 days.
Yeah.
I think it was 10 days.
Yeah, and you stayed near my house.
You had your whole kids there and everything like that.
It was like I seem to remember it being a what's really weird is because it's obviously incredibly stressful to be accused of the things I've been accused of.
But like we've sort of had quite a nice time, won't we?
Like sometimes even in the old crown courts, it's been like alright.
It's been a guide deal.
It's been because you can feel the presence of God, isn't it?
That's what it is.
Like when you're walking through, like them, you might, if you're a regular viewer, you'll recognise Joe from the opening titles.
That's Joe walking ahead of me there.
Like, yeah, I've never felt the closeness of God, except for my God, birth of my children, and sometimes moments in solitary prayer.
But it's a very surprising way to feel the presence of God.
Of course, God is present all the time.
God is always present, not just when you're in some beautiful environment with a cascade in waterfall or some beauty, you know, when you're in like Walmart or Azta, you know, God is with you, God is in there.
And like I've got to get myself to that state.
I can't be conditional about when I'm connecting with God.
I've got to be in continual, constant contact with God.
Otherwise, the option is I get suicidal despair.
And I think that's probably what defines addicts as opposed to non-addicts.
Not that I'm saying there ain't a variety of addiction issues.
People might be addicted to screens, pornography, food.
But you know, people like me and uh Joe and Dave, where our experiences of addiction are chemical dependency first and foremost, and I and it's largely understood that that is a craving for God.
Now, like any sort of group or movement that we support, I reckon it should be contingent on the basis that we're doing the Lord's work, the Lord's work.
And like in the conversations I've had with Tommy around the interview, I've been just talking about Jesus because I don't know what's right for Britain, I don't know what's right for America, I don't even know what's right for me and my kids half the time.
But what I do know is that without surrendering to Jesus Christ and without his sacrifice, I'm in a lot of serious trouble.
I'm in trouble anyway, actually.
But I'm in a different type of trouble.
Alright, so um, with uh that preliminary chat dispatched.
Do you is you guys ready to start watching Panadrama?
Yeah, let's do it.
Yeah, let's get into it.
Or is it just on play, Isaac?
Yeah.
Alright, so at the uh behest of Tommy Robinson and potentially his Israeli overlords.
We discussed that in the interview, we discussed that.
Here is Panorama.
Now, obviously, I'm interested in this because this is Tommy Robinson discovered that that as he discussed in the interview with us.
In fact, let's have a look at that clip now.
Panadrama tried to set me up.
I get covert recordings of John Sweeney, the lead BBC investigative journalist for Panorama.
I get covert recordings of him making sexual allegations against me, lying, tell them people what to say.
I get all these things, yeah.
Go watch the documentary if anyone hasn't watched it, it's the best take down of the beast.
I get all this evidence.
Panorama then contact me to interview me.
They were doing a documentary on me, obviously.
When they're doing documentary on me, I sent a girl undercover into them, and I've got her to wear a wire, and I get I'll get them all talking, making things up, telling people what to say.
So they contact me for interview.
I say, Well, yeah, you have to do it tomorrow in my location.
I'll meet you at two o'clock at this venue.
And I set a fake, I set a screen up on the wall, and I sit down to be interviewed by Panorama.
And I've done you've done documentaries before, Russell, yeah.
The produ you have you have the cameraman and the editor, you don't have all the producers, but when they come for me, because this was a takedown, they were gonna end it.
When they come to sit there, there's about eight of them, and there was the producers sat there.
So when they ask me the first question, I said, Can I ask you a question, John?
Would you ever tell anyone what to say in an interview?
Is that Joan?
If you sat down and said, say this, say this, say this, would you do that, John?
And he said no.
And I said, play the film, and then behind me on the wall, and all I just stared at him.
Behind me on the wall was a covert record of him, him saying, say this about Tommy, say this about Tommy.
And his actual words were, do we have a deal?
Yeah.
So I've got this footage.
Now, oh, and I've got and at this time the producers are putting their hands in their heads, right?
Ended him, yeah.
But then I think Steven Bird.
And I'll say, right, mate, I need to see you.
I've got gold.
Yeah.
So I go and meet him, I sit down with him, he listens to all the recording, he's playing everything.
I've got him on button cam.
He's like, oh my god, this is fucking huge, Tommy.
I said, I know, mate.
This is massive, yeah.
He says, right, okay, it's meets me the next day, I'm not allowed to run it.
So here is the documentary that Tommy Robinson was discussing.
Let's have a look.
We chose the BBC with a thousand people.
also The British public do not trust you anymore.
What I will say, and this is the first thing I noticed about Tommy Robinson 15 years ago, is he's drummed up a crowd.
Do you know what I mean?
He's drummed up a crowd.
Like the left, like when I was sort of more part or more associated with the left.
My version of the left, by the way, was anti-establishment, pro-free speech, sort out the relationships between government and big business, we're being lied to, the media, but that it was the same.
None of my opinions have actually changed, other than I've surrendered to God and try and not be such a selfish idiot.
Anyway, I will feel the reason I wasn't focused on the reason Tommy Robinson, I was interested in him is he's a football fan, he's a normal working class man, and he's able to create this kind of interest.
So no, like whether even even if he was evil or the world's nicest person, I'll tell you now that the media in Britain would go, he's an he's a pedo, he's the worst person imaginable, because they can't have someone that can get drum up a crowd like that in Manchester, becoming more successful and prominent.
So in the interview, he said he hated you, right, before he wrote the new year and before all your change and all that.
And you said you actually still, even in y'all's disagreement, like watching him now, you could still respect him and you could see a strength even if you disagreed on policy, even back in the day, right?
So that means like, I mean, for me, I look at that, I was like, you've always kind of been a free thinker, no matter what they told you you're supposed to believe.
I was always against the government, I was always against the media, I was always against big business.
But what was weird is I was earning all of the money out of media, and I was like, sort of, and also I was ambitious, I wanted to be a star.
I wanted to be a movie star and a star comedian.
And then when those things happened, and it was like really all it was was access to sleeping with women and money.
That's all it really was.
Like, I can sleep around now.
It was like it weren't enjoyable for itself.
Comedy, you can perform in front of 20 people above a pub or 10,000 people at an arena.
If you're in the spirit, it'll be enjoyable.
Now, with Tommy Robinson, like what I thought was I like the way that he is accessed working class people and has a focal point of their passions, and he's right, they are being ripped off.
I've just always thought that the focus should not be migration, because my feeling has always been about power, that when you're if you want to change the power dynamics in a country or anywhere, actually, you're fundamentally going to be dealing with whoever currently has that power.
Migrants, whether you agree with migration or not, are not the source of the power.
You could argue they're the beneficiaries of power if there's an open border policy in the United States or the UK are around too many people over on boats or unregulated migration or whatever it is that people are concerned about, or primarily the concern appears to be the non um the inability for assimilation for people that hold the faith of Islam.
That seems to be, but that's not uniform and not universal, because there are Muslim communities where there is assimilation and happy cohabitation, right?
And I've always felt that when you make the absolute focus migrants and Muslims, that you create and generate a hostility that's actually largely beneficial.
And that's the a lot of the conversation I had with Tommy Robinson was about exactly that.
You know, some people will say, well, yeah, I don't think it's unreasonable to say if you want to come and live in a country, you should love that country and respect its rules.
I think that's kind of good, right?
But I don't love and respect the rules of the United Kingdom either.
I think the United Kingdom is an exploitative, corrupt place with corrupt media, corrupt government, corrupt institutions that's exploiting working people and has always done, and indeed there's always an exploitative relationship.
That's what working class, even as a category means, whether they were a pr peasant class working in fields, an industrial class working in docks and manufacturing industry, they're there to be exploited.
They'll allow 'em as much rights and privileges as they have to.
But even the end of slavery in your country, it's only like we'll give you a little bit of freedom, but we're gonna require disposable people.
We require disposable people.
And whether you and even if you just go to uh as I did the other day and it was absolutely delicious, a Chick-fil-A the other day, you know that the system has to accommodate a fast turnover of workers.
So those workers can't make demands to be paid more money, and as soon as they can automate Chick-fil-A, they'll bloody well automate Chick-fil-A and everyone will be out.
Um same at Walmart or any of them supermarkets, you know, in the UK or or the United States, they're moving towards increased automation with the ch checkouts or cashiers and the security.
And when you told me the other day, Joe, that you can't go out of a supermarket now, you have to show you have to scan your receipt to get out of there.
I'm like, no man, they can't have their cake and eat it.
If they want to not have people working in there, they've got to tolerate a little bit of shoplifting.
But like, you know, that's what it is, it's full aut automation.
They want it so that you like I and I think it shows you what they think of people.
You're just there to consume.
That's all you're there for.
And so I think the reason I like Tommy Robinson is because he g he's captured the spirit.
He is the spirit, he is the spirit of it.
In the same way you could say about Trump, that you know, you might not agree with everything Trump says, he's got the sort of spirit of something.
And people I think are too closed minded about how to deal with that, about how to deal with it, and too dismissive, derisery, derogatory, and when really what it is is this is an opportunity to create change because if someone can galvanise and leave people, they're in the conversation.
There's no point going, it shouldn't be you 'cause I think a lot of times when people on the left are criticizing Tommy Robinson, what they're saying is that should be me.
That should be me that's in charge of that, because I've been the person that they're attacking.
Why are people watching Russell Brown's podcast?
He's in I don't like him, and then in the end you become too successful.
Consequences.
Well, I think the left wants they think freedom means everybody should be able to do whatever they want to do.
Whenever they want to do it.
Even if it's harmful, even if you know it a woman can be a man or whatever it is, it's whatever you want to do whenever you want to do, and that's what they're fighting for.
I think his change is obviously he's gone against the uh the norms of society by saying we need to make change and we need to do something different.
So it's not he's against change.
I don't think he's against change.
No, nor do I. And that's the same thing you're saying.
I want to bring change, but you want the change to ultimately be beneficial for people.
So I think some of the extreme Muslim side of things, or what Tommy would say, the extreme Islamic part is saying, why would you want to come here and bring that because we don't know if there's a positive side to it.
I understand that.
I understand I I understand that aspect of it.
But because I've like spent a lot of my time living, say, in London, and like I interviewed like one time, I can remember interviewing this guy, I can't remember the dude's name.
It might have been called something like Mozambeg, I think, and he was banged up in Guantanamo Bay, and he was like, I think he was British and he was just on he was in doing business in Arabia and they nicked him and took him to Guantanamo Bay without trial and held him there, and like this guy was like, oh a minute, this is mad racism.
Like you're just like a and I had him on there.
Um he is a Muslim and he is like and and uh when I was talking to people like him and like other like um Muslims in the UK, I feel like the the vilification of Islam is just another tool in the toolbox of dividing people.
And I do I think we have to be able to have a conversation where it's like, look, if you're living in England, you can't be disrespecting, let alone sexually molesting and abusing people, but what is the British people's position on it?
And I like one of the things I was talking to Tommy about is what are you saying, the poor everyone, the poor all, like you know, and and I think a lot of the r the portrayal of Tommy Robinson is that is what he's saying.
Now, Joe, you're in the UK at the moment.
What do you feel like is happening when it comes to w uh the w working class sentimentality around migration and ha and what do you think about my points that it can be exploited like that?
Yeah, so what what I think is going on there, it seems to me like the mass migration is it is causing a problem.
We're a small island.
Do you know what I mean?
UK's a small island, and with that, like it's causing unrest.
Working class people don't feel like they're looked after it, they don't feel like they're valued here, especially under this government and the way things are going.
But it seems to me that this government wants to cause the problem, and then ultimately they're gonna try and provide some sort of solution, which, as we all know, comes as more control through fear, usually, isn't it?
Which is why I'm sceptical about going there on the 13th.
There's gonna be I don't know what's gonna happen, I don't know how it's gonna play out.
I think it's important to represent the working class people because I'm I am one, you know.
But is it playing into the agenda?
Polarising views, people trashing, and then ultimately more control, digital IDs.
I don't know what it is, I don't know what to provide, but they're gonna come with saying, couldn't they?
Yeah, they've got an adept at creating crisis situations and using them crisis situations to legitimise further authority, and I reckon that's yeah, that is the master plan and the master game.
Let's have a look at uh some of panadrama, uh Tommy Robinson's documentary as endorsed by the man himself in the interview that we had here uh last week.
You should check that out online on Rumble.
Do not trust you anymore!
*Cheering*
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Michael, he's going to explain what's going to happen next, right?
I've been arrested.
I am being arrested.
I'm I've caused a breach of peace.
I'm being arrested.
But the content of what you're uh we just say, the content of what I'm streaming, I'm being arrested for breach of the peace.
I'm being arrested for breach of the peace.
You've all watched this, you've all watched this.
You've all watched this, you've all watched this.
Can you give me a sliss up?
Can you just turn off your light beam?
Can you just turn off your light beam please?
Yeah?
What are the rest of your feet on top of it?
Breach of the peace.
Apparently I'm inciting on my video.
*Pewds*
Since my activism started over a decade ago, the establishment, the police, and the media have all been trying to take me down.
The whole world saw me wrongfully imprisoned last year.
Two and a half months on solitary confinement.
What was the response by the media to that unlawful detention?
They justified it.
They lied to you.
All of them reported that I pled guilty.
None of them got the transcripts From the court, none of them reported the truth.
We have a corrupt media.
When I went to prison and 600,000 people signed a petition for my release, 30,000 people marched here demanding my release.
When I come out of prison, I was completely unaware of the lengths that they were going to to take me down.
My PayPal was removed.
That removes my ability to hire a team and work and bring you the other side of the story.
My website was closed down, but I was completely unaware that Panorama, the world's leading investigative journalist documentary, were working on a programme about me with the working title, Tommy Takedown.
This was their final punch.
They were about to you have a reference for him, just like Guy Ritchie films or I don't know.
Like just UK boxer of some sort.
Yeah.
He just he gets the fact that he can draw a crowd makes him dangerous.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And like he's a nightmare because genuine working class, like, and just a kind of uh uh i indominable spirit, like he's like most people like I think it's actually about most people that I disagree with on something like say Trump or whatever, like that guy's not obviously he's motivated by money in terms of his corporate and commercial endeavours, but is someone's putting himself in a lot of aggravation or Bobby Kennedy, like he don't need this stuff.
He's putting himself in a position where like he's just going through nightmares, he's gonna get attacked, and he's clearly motivated by something.
So Tommy Robinson, what is motivating this guy?
Like it's not like he's got something in him that's very authentic.
Well, if you just tell story how all this money and everything just gets cut off, it wouldn't make me want to go, you know, more on the offensive, but he seems to be so courageous to keep putting yourself out there.
I mean, and you know that like the fact that they could just say we're cutting you off like a YouTube.
We're not gonna give you that money anymore.
I mean, that's a crazy thing.
But I think a guy like this is the reason why he's drawing a crowd is because you relate to that sort of courage that it takes to put yourself out there, no matter what the cost is to you.
Whenever someone's a threat, they have to legitimise taking them down.
They have to go, all right.
This is a problem.
What would make this problem go away?
And then you can I just imagine I'm sort of chewing pencils.
Oh, well, if he's a rapist, cool, yeah, that's it.
That's what we'll do then.
And ultimately, like they don't care about migrants or Muslims, the people that are like opposed to Tommy Robinson in media and in government institutions.
They're not sort of sat up at night sort of thinking, what can we do?
But in general, we've started to recognise that they're part of a kind of network, whether formal or informal, of interests that benefit from being able to exert control and direct profit and control information, whether that's like official media sites, New York Times, Guardian, CNN, BBC, all those kind of media networks that have lost their control with the advent of the internet.
Like, of course, online technology can be used for surveillance for further propaganda, but I feel like it evolved in unpredictable ways, and it generated a whole bunch of independent journalists and uh pundits and commentators, and we're living through the phase of where the old institutions of power work out how to shut that down.
Now, Tommy Robinson sort of spans and precedes that in so much as his activism was at first old school, like marches and flyers and leaflets and you know stuff that was affiliated with football.
And even if, as I've said at the beginning of this, I uh have queries and questions and concerns about the uh focus on Islam and Muslims and the potential that that has to create further division without solutions, and that it doesn't locate the problem primarily within the establishment and the institutions of power where the power is actually held.
Um what I do believe in is his authenticity and his personal integrity, and like my kind of he did say in the interview, are you like a utopian, but like the thing that I the thing that is um if maybe hopefully is a better word than utopian because it's A sort of a hideous word really, but my prayer is that that you could get to the point where members of the Muslim community in the UK and Tommy Robinson's constituency could go, right?
Well, what are we talking about here then?
What's the sort of solution?
What's surely there's no one saying rape gangs are a good thing.
Surely no one's saying having loads of male fighting age migrants come over here, where are the women and where are the children and the British taxpayer when Britain is unstable and in economic decline and ravaged by COVID, that resources, people are seeing resources going to migration and illegal migration.
Obviously, that's a problem.
And indeed, as I said again in that conversation, is if if you can't have it both ways.
If Britain's a democracy and people don't want migration, that's the end of it.
That's the end of it.
It's a democracy, they don't want it.
You can't continually say you should want it, it's beneficial for us, it don't bother us.
And as people like Paul Joseph Watson say, another sort of right-wing pundit would point out, the areas that are most impacted by migration are not where middle class professional people working in media live.
They like that place in Eppin is not where there are not many people that work at the Guardian or the BBC live in there or even from there.
They live in other areas, and like so there's a sort of a degree of hypocrisy there that's being exposed.
In fact, hypocrisy is in a sense, I suppose the hallmark of the left and where like the virtue signalling moniker has emerged from the belief that you're saying all this because you don't have to pay the price.
You don't have to pay the price for these opinions.
That they're not costing you anything.
It's not costing you anything to believe that.
They were about to discredit me to the nation, to you, the public.
And I will prove that that documentary is not impartial, that it's scripted, that they invent things, that they lie, that they clip, that they edit.
What you will witness in this documentary will prove to you this isn't about Tommy Robinson.
This is about all the people that have been lied to.
All the people who have been mislabelled.
Despite all their efforts to silence me, it became very apparent that something far more sinister was going on.
We're gonna have to take a short break before a message from our partners.
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With the collusion between the establishment, panorama, and a far-left extremist organisation called Hope Not Hate.
You're gonna hear about the tactics they use to get the narrative they want.
In this documentary, you're gonna hear a lot about hope not hate.
It's important you understand who they are.
Home Hate is a so-called anti-fascist organization who formed in 2004.
They formed from a group and a magazine called Searchlight.
Nick Lowells, who now leads Hope Not Hate, was a lead member of Searchlight.
In 1984, Searchlight worked alongside Panorama to fraudulently edit footage, which they were prosecuted or taken to court and sued for.
They paid a million pound damages to conservative MPs who they wrongfully edited footage to link them with far-right extremist groups.
Hope not hate brand themselves as an anti-fascist organisation.
They're there to tackle fascism.
In reality, they label slander and attack anyone who speaks out against open borders or against Islam.
The worrying thing is they have a lot of influence.
For example, all media outlets across the UK, across the world, take what they say is credible and they work Hand in hand with them.
From CNM, The Guardian, Hufferton Post, The Independent, Sky News, News Night, Panorama, The Metro, The Sunday Times, they even advise the UN.
If you're watching us on YouTube, we have to leave you there, possibly because you can't show Tommy Robinson on YouTube.
I can't remember.
And wherever you're watching this anyway, click the link in the description and join us over on Rumble Premium.
If you haven't got Rumble Premium yet, get Rumble Premium now.
They advise counter-terrorism in their advice to the UN.
They say that our Day for Freedom Demonstration that many of you would have watched was a far-right extremist rally.
That's fake news.
Being given as credible information and taken as expert info by the UN.
Our Day for Freedom Demonstration had homosexual speakers, drag artists, black speakers, A homosexuals, I think he was.
See?
What's that?
Yeah, so you know, come on.
That's I I like That's what I want to see.
This is Joe.
This is gonna be your reporting because we know you.
You're a normal person.
Go to this uh demonstration.
This one, September 13th.
Oh, watch everything.
Film a little bit with your phone.
Yeah, and come back and tell us what exactly it is.
And what we'll do, what about if we can get you introductions to Tommy Robinson?
So, like, and you've got to like say, right, what was it like?
And watch out for but we can't put get Joe in any trouble.
Stay very calm there, Joe.
Anybody do.
I'm calm, I'm calm.
You know me.
I do, actually.
But that's what we're gonna be able to see.
This is Joe.
This is Joe.
He's a normal guy.
He's a reliable correspondent.
You heard him talk on our show.
You can trust him.
And then he's gonna be like, hey, it was really peaceful, they were really nice.
Tommy said a lot of great things.
And then we'll see what the media says.
I like it.
Compare it.
I like it.
Do you I'm in except?
I accept, I'll be there.
I'd like you to keep a cigar lit throughout the your reporting.
Like I'd like to see at various throughout the day.
Unless that gets you arrested.
Little Sir, you're doing you aware, sir, the New York Kingdom, you cannot smoke a cigar within a hundred meters of a child.
How would a rape gang feel if they were trying to rape that child?
They get all smoking their eyes.
How's a rape gang supposed to get erection?
With you puffing on their cigar.
Right, that's good.
I like that, Joe.
It's gonna be good.
Jake, that's good producing.
That's on the spot producing.
That's on the spot producing from Jake, innit?
That's pretty produced in live.
It'd be great to compare it to the news stories that come out.
Yeah, we'll get do it.
We'll put them, we'll compare them.
We're comparing that we're like it's called Joe's Eye View, where we compare it to the BBC reporting to what Joe himself actually saw that we can rely on and trust to see if there is a future for various communities of working people across the UK to come together against the rise of tyrannical fascism in the form of bureaucracy.
Remember, as I've always said on here, it's more like Kafka, where like uh the invisible bureaucracies assert power.
It's a bit like Orwell, it's so terrifying, a boot stamping on the face of humanity.
What is the face of humanity?
That's God's signature.
We're made in his image.
He said a bit like Audus Huxley, where they get you all slobby and all slouchy and lacking sort of potency, the sort of what some would call the kind of feminization of the culture.
Not that women don't have an almighty power.
Right, we had women, right?
I see there's a black woman, uh March, here she is.
Asian speakers, there was nothing far right against it.
It was a liberal demonstration demanding free speech.
So what happens is when someone gets censored on on Twitter for some kind of uh for hate speech or for ex uh incitement to violence or engaging in some kind of terrorist communication, they get their account taken down, they tend to come back, and that actually leads to a sort of uh an increased level of uh of sense of participation and integration into these networks.
So I do a lot of work looking into right wing extremism in the United Kingdom and the United States.
And one of the things that we've seen there is actually an entire mobilization of right-wing extremist Activity around the concept of the freedom of speech being taken away from people.
So just a few weeks ago in London there was a march attended by a few thousand people that was called Day for Freedom, and that was entirely sort of centred around this issue of uh of free speech and the sense that the for in the kind of parlance of the extreme right, the liberal establishment was trying to silence uh uh extreme right or uh sorry, uh legitimate conservative voices.
Just last year, Hope Not Hate were identified in the Swedish military report on left-wing extremist violence.
It has been proven that hope not hate exaggerated hate crime figures by 3,000%.
Nothing they said after that point should ever have been taken as credible, let alone taken by journalists without checking anything and spread around the world to demonise and slander people and organizations.
They play a key role in pressurizing social media giants, whether it be with petitions or requests from MPs that they're working alongside with to say who's promoting hate.
Not who's promoting hate that would breach laws in this country, but who needs silencing with their opinion.
They're now teaching your children in schools about fascism.
If we take a quote from their original spin doctor, Dan Hodges.
From his quote, you'll understand the tactics they use in this documentary.
It was a no-holds barred bare-knuckle PR.
We used every dirty, underhand, low-down, unscrupulous trick in the book.
These are quotes from their spin doctor.
Joe Moorho, who is a lead researcher for Hope Not Hate.
He brags about days out with their BBC political reporters.
Their relationship works hand in hand with the corrupt mainstream media.
They do the reports, the media then use their ammunition and their labelling to attack people and organizations, to demonise them and slander them.
In 2015, Joe Milhau used the hashtag Antifa on several occasions.
The reason why this is so relevant is when you understand who Antifa are.
Antifa are an organization that leading members of the American government have called to be prescribed as a terrorist organization.
They bala clava up, they mask up and they violently attack people who they're told to attack, and organizations which are highlighted to them by groups and organizations like Hope Not Hate.
They find out who you are, they contact your work, anyone who steps above the parapet.
Hope not hate's goal is to silence them and stop them.
This is about stopping free speech.
This is about having people too scared to speak.
We'll speak with one gentleman now whose life has been completely changed due to him voicing his opinions.
He broke no law, committed no crime.
But wait till you hear what Hope Not Hate done to him.
This time last year, like I said, I was working full-time, happy, and because of some things I was doing outside of work, where I was sort of expressing my political opinions and so on, uh, I ended up drawing their fire.
Uh and they wrote uh a report and called it in to the employer, so it was a kind of deliberate attempt to.
It wasn't just to dox me, because I was I hadn't hidden my name, I didn't think I was doing anything wrong.
I was just expressing an opinion.
Uh, but it was an attempt to deliberately get me fired.
Where was you working?
I was working at Standard Chartered Bank in Moorgate.
Doomal.
Uh I was an associate, so I'd been there from a grad, I went to Bristol University and then went into the banks right afterwards.
So I've been there for about just around 18 months at this point.
So good career.
Yeah, it was going well.
Internally, there'd been no issues.
Didn't you say when you say you got involved, you was giving your political opinions with regards to uh obviously the controversial stuff, so immigration, uh Islam, these kind of issues, but not not in an extreme way, nothing you wouldn't happily say to anyone.
Just so we can get clear, we're not talking about committing a crime, we're just talking about speaking openly about immigration and Islam.
Yeah, and no one had a problem with it.
That's the whole point that kind of strikes me about.
So it's not like anyone made a complaint, no one you nothing's happened, so what did Hope Not Hate do?
So Hope Not Hate, one of the I can't remember which, but a team of their researchers wrote a small report.
They were calling up multiple officers uh at the bank, uh, and they're also focusing, because obviously we have a very big presence in the Middle East.
So they were focusing on officers there to call them and just basically say, you've got this guy working for you, he's an Islamophobia, he's a racist, blah blah blah.
All of which obviously isn't true.
I remember I was just sitting at my desk and I get called in by the MD and he sort of says, Are you, you know, have you been saying this?
And I say, Yeah, yeah, no, I have.
I didn't see it as a problem.
The same guys were going to a lot of journalists trying to flog this report as well to make a big story out of it.
Eventually, in around the summer of last year, you get this article, and it's very vicious news.
Obviously, largely lifted from the report that came out a few weeks earlier.
You know, using slurs, using kind of nonsense labels, calling us Nazis, all that kind of thing.
Calling you Nazis with any evidence, was there anything you said.
It was made up with a very clear intention of making me lose my job.
And it is a common tactic.
And you didn't lose your job.
Yeah, I was suspended, and then once the coverage happened, they obviously, whilst previously, like internally the bank, I think it kind of thought, well, maybe this is just an attack piece.
Once there was coverage, obviously, it's their reputation on the line.
So then pretty much immediately I was fired.
I have I have worse.
Just so that the public understand this.
You committed no crime.
You speak outside of work.
What do you think about the musical choices for this piano?
Maybe a little more violin.
Maybe some uh saxophone.
Better sax that make it a bit more not a little bit more sexy motel.
You lost your job, huh?
They contacted your high-profile clients in the Middle East.
Do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do Start too high.
Yeah, um.
Yeah.
It's it what like in a way, um is it you know I read a lot of still left-wing type stuff from intellectuals, people that are into psychedelics, like very virulently anti-Trump, uh like very sort of pro-Palestine.
I read a lot of that kind of stuff still because you know, mostly because it's not that long ago that that was generally the kind of cultural class that I belong to, and also because I like feel like there's interesting uh uh ideas still.
And uh I wonder what they would fit because the problem is is that most of the people that will watch this will be people that are in general sympathetic towards it, and I because I feel like uh how could you not with Tommy Robinson be kind of encouraged that someone that's so plainly and typically working class is like so hardworking and intrepid and like right so okay, she had a good joy like you know, it's just like doing his best and cracking on like why were you working?
No, okay, that's good, that's good.
Because I I actually think that's that's what it is.
You know, the f that moment, that pivotal moment, when Hillary Clinton said basket of deplorables, it revealed something.
And it w because English culture is so class-oriented anyway, we're much more inured to the idea that they're working class British people hate themselves anyway.
So when they're sort of spoken of hatefully, they kind of accept it.
The pride is a kind of rumbunctious pride.
But you know, like there isn't a sort of a sense of celebration around working class culture.
What I think has happened in the like last 10, 20 years is the bit like since probably Clinton and Blair, maybe, I don't know, I'm not expert in these things, is the sort of the normalization of the vilification of ordinary working people, so it becomes okay to not address the fact that the industries they used to work in are all either be outsourced or closed down,
the the concerns that come from families that like just a generation or so ago laid down their lives in wars for their countries and now being told your country is not a real thing anyway, more in the UK and the US, because America is uh gone in a different direction because of American populism and the rise of Trump.
And like there's no sort of sympathy or interest.
So I just wonder what the kind of the kind of the guardian writers and various media rule institutions and organizations that hate Tommy Robinson that also I know hate me and hate this community in general.
I just wonder how they can't be kind of open enough to see that this is fascinating, even if you don't like me, agree with him on everything.
Because I'd my point would be I'd want to be able to sit with a British Muslim or a Muslim from anywhere and then be and not feel embarrassed.
The same way as when we're talking about Israel, I don't want people that I know that are Jews to say, right, I didn't like the way you covered that or the way you spoke about that issue.
You know, like you've got uh it's integrity, isn't it?
Is it like sure?
Yeah, and I think from an American perspective, watching it from the outside, we like to see all of all of it, all of the classes in the UK, in the sense of we don't just go the royal family, that's gotta be that's what the UK looks like.
It's only the royal family.
So we also like the gangsters of the UK.
We also just like I like even what Dave was saying, listening to Tommy talk is fascinating.
Like just for us from an outside perspective.
So it's interesting that the powers or the you know, the writers or the the liberal left side would try to silence a whole segment of the country that's very intriguing to the rest of the world.
Yeah, and like you can only silence that portion of society if you vilify them in the same way as you would with an individual, like Elon Musk said, um, exciting that's one of Stalin's advisers, show me the man and I'll show you the crime.
Of course, if someone is a racist or a rapist or whatever accusation they're able to find, then you can legitimately shut them down.
But the problem is that this the centralised authority has now required that entire classes of people are shut down, not just individuals.
You can't listen to like and and they for a while they were not adept at playing the game and they would let it slip.
They'd say stuff like white van man, that's the equivalent of like a redneck trucker, or they'd say things about houses with flags outside, and like like you know, like they mean St. George's flags, and now what's happened is because of the ability to communicate, and because of leadership emerging from genuine working class activists like Tommy Robinson,
it's that that's being reclaimed, and like there's these protests, these flag protests across the UK, and because now there is no mandate, there is no like the Labour Party doesn't now represent a load of working class people through the trade union movement because they've abandoned them and all those jobs are gone and all those movements are gone.
So there's not like loads of working people going, Oh, yeah, hang about like you know, these were these Muslims and that they've then annihilated those constituencies through their own corruption.
What are you saying, Joe?
No, I think you're right, like it it's working class people being vilified, aren't they?
And like, as he's pointed out there through all these mainstream media outlets, they're labelling them as far right.
Do you know what I mean?
They're all far right extremists.
It's just working class people who've had enough.
They don't like they're not being looked after in their local areas, and by speaking out about it, they're they're using like these extreme left wings to attack them, saying you can't say that hate speech and all this lot, and it's like, well, I I agree with them.
Do what you want, act what you want if you're boy, girl or non-body, whatever they want to call themselves and all that stuff, right?
But you've got people open to criticize and say what they want, innit?
You can't have it both ways.
Do what you want, be what you want, but you can say anything then, otherwise, that's fascism coming in through the back door, isn't it?
That's the way I see it.
It's exactly right.
That's exactly right that they sort of have been kind of exposed as corrupt.
You know, like what I'm aware of is like m like the privilege that I've had is because I've lived in a variety of communities, like, for example, just where I grew up, normal Grey's Essex, and then because of the acting, going to stage schools and drama schools, and like and then because of some thank you, Lord, success in those areas, occupying different co and then because I'm a fanlandrian little womanizer, having girlfriends from all over the world and different places, living in different worlds.
I've got to see things like a tourist, like a tourist that's been in different worlds.
And one of the first moments is like, see, there where he was talking about Antifa and that.
When I, as I told him in the conversation, when I first went to protest, they that's the side I was on.
Like the Liverpool dockers, that's obviously the trade unions around like when Liverpool dockers, they all got sacked, all the people that worked in the docks because they didn't need dockers no more, and they'd have found some bloody reason to justify it or whatever.
And I remember being at those protests, and I was excited because of the chaos, like there's all police horses galloping around, people ripping up paving slabs, like parts of the cyborg.
I was like, fucking hell.
I just liked it because it was mad.
And then I started so I went to more of them and I started to learn about the ideas, and then I met more people that knew more, like my friend John Rogers, who taught me about sort of socialism and communism and the struggle of working people.
Then my mate Martino Sclavi, god rest his soul, who like Italian fella taught me all about sort of socialism out of that country.
So I started getting the education, but the thing that engaged me really is the feeling and the spirit, and by then I was already a drug addict and I took a bunch of acid and all that kind of stuff, and I was aware of like, yeah, we are being suppressed, you know, like and like so like but one thing I noticed, and like these things, you know how there's little things you log, they're almost like a penny you've picked up and sort of not known quite what it's gonna mean.
When I was first at those protests, protests, the police officers I noticed had accents more similar to mine than the other Protesters.
I just remember registering it.
I'm not saying those Liverpool dockers weren't legit, of course they were.
But there was the equivalent of Antifa.
They were groups like Reclaim the Streets.
Socialist movements that probably people have university.
No problem if you've been to university, that's good.
This ultimately has to be a movement that's transcendent of class.
But I remember just noticing them police officers are all from like Romford, Basilden, Maidstone, mate, like they're from places where I'm from, suburban London.
And they're like, right, back off place, would you stand back?
Like, no, they're the same class and group.
And then now you lot are all like in America, it's different, Joe.
They're their political and social and cultural dynamics are different.
But what happened is is that the vilification of ordinary Americans took place in the same sort of way as British people have known for a long time through the basket of deplorables things.
These lot they're all racist.
And then since I've got here, what I realise is the kind of people that they're targeting are capable people, men that are like able to hunt and fish and survive and fight, or like those kind of people, they're like they've made out that they're scum.
So it's like, yeah, that like so those people that you should be looking to for protection and to organise are looked at as hateful.
And it's interesting.
Then other little worlds I've lived in, you know, been around in Hollywood and around the British aristocracy and stuff like that.
And so I've like been like a little tourist or Zelig is the film reference, or maybe Forrest Gump, I suppose, where I've like lived in all these different worlds and gone, oh I see, and now I'm just like starting to put it all together, and now the culture's moving so quickly that I think that the requirement is for people to recognise that whether you're a person whose interests are ensuring, like you just talked about, Joe, people with different sexual orientation have their rights respected.
You know that if Jesus returned, he wouldn't be like, You fucking trans people, come fuck you know, it'd be like, hey, listen, you know, you'd be loving, he'd be loving to all, but the truth would be there, the truth would be there.
And what we're living in is this sort of state of bewilderment and denial of truth, and in the chaos of the denial of truth, crisis after successive crisis legitimizes the enhancement of authority and control, and it never goes back fully.
I think it was you that said that, Joe.
Like, you know, after 9-11, the Patriot Act, they rescind it a bit, but not entirely after COVID, all these measures.
They rescinded it a bit, but not entirely, and slowly they're legitimizing more authority.
And this is where it all starts to in my mind at least, tie together, like a politician, a politician like Secretary Kennedy, sta like very ultra focused on big pharma, big food, health, you know, like you know, someone like him, he's a more he's more of a threat than Trump, if you ask me,
because he's out of the aristocracy, the American aristocracy at least, of the Kennedy family, and he's sort of got a constituency that includes like hippies and yogis and lefties and like people, you know, and like he's willing to sort of confront authority.
So I'm the reason I mention it is these categories are no longer as relevant as they once were, and what we have to find is alliances between people that are like ardent fans of Tommy Robinson, and then people that are like, listen, this is the Muslim populations of Bradford and Birmingham and Luton and everywhere.
We're here now, so what are you saying?
We've got that, you know, what's what you're not kicking everyone out.
So, what's the Christian thing to do?
What's the righteous thing to do?
Yeah, I think we've all agreed and we we should get to a point where like credibility's gone for all these mainstream media, anybody that's saying I'm the expert on it and you can trust me, credibility's gone.
Yeah.
So now it's returning back to local, and we need a the the screens and the fact that everybody's connected to everywhere is a problem.
But if we go back to like the roots of it and we go, I know Joe, I know Joe.
I have a conversation with him.
Joe is at this rally that's supposed to be disruptive, and Joe is showing me it looks peaceful, or I know Russell, I know him.
So yeah, you're you got millions of people and you're talking to a bunch of people, but it's gotta get back to the connection of I know Dave.
Dave said this, I trust Dave.
I trust Russell, and I think that's what people need to go back to.
You had you sat down and had a conversation with Tommy.
Yeah, just a normal conversation.
I know, and when I saw his face, now like that was very funny because when um Larry uh David did that piece about Bill Maher meeting Trump and he did that very funny my dinner with Adolf Hitler.
I really really thought that's brilliant.
Slarry David's a comedy genius, so he was able to create it.
It was ingenious.
And what he was saying is that Bill Maher had humanised Trump by sort of commenting on Trump's conviviality and social ease and charm and the fact that he listened and enjoyed jokes, and that Bill Maher had been a bit bowled over by Trump, it seemed.
And Larry David, I suppose, was making the point that if you met it's very funny, it's worth it.
Like at the end of it, he's sort of going, Hitler was asking me about like my ex-girlfriend and saying, no, you can't don't ring her anymore because otherwise you're still in the relationship.
That's really so good.
Like Hitler would be sort of alright if you were chatting to him on a one-on-one thing.
But um, so it's uh like I mentioned that only to sort of offer some sort of counter to your point, because when I sort of saw Tommy Robinson, like, you know, all of us, like there's aspects of me.
When I'm shouting at my kids, I don't feel I would don't think you would like me very much.
My closest friends, I feel embarrassed about how I've like, you know, when Peggy drives me mad, and I'm like, Perry, shut up!
You know, like I don't want everyone in the world to but that's part of who I am.
I'm flawed, I get impatient, I make mistakes, and I'm sure that Tommy Robinson or anybody, they're the same.
But what I felt when we saw him is like, I know this bloke.
Yeah, he's alright.
He's alright.
I don't know.
I think it makes me trust those people more when I can see their other side.
I can see their anger, their rage, or you know, when I can see their dirt, I can trust them.
It's the politicians, big media.
Yeah, looks too clean, you don't trust it.
Yeah, everything's great.
I then I'm like I think there'd be a point though if all you did was scream at your kids.
Yeah, you know what I'm saying?
Like that guy, every time I see him, you know.
So I think there is like relation, it's like, okay, it's the good, it's it's all together and it's genuine.
Yeah, but I think you go like this guy steals from me every time I'm with him.
You know what I mean?
It's not like he took a dollar from me one time, it's like that's that's how you know.
Right, fallibility, yeah, right.
Stealing and shouting at kids, yeah.
Like, um, like yeah, fallibility, if if someone masks their fallibility, you know that what you're dealing with is a mask.
And isn't that the problem?
Because you know, with Keir Starmer, the Prime Minister of the United Kingdom, there's a lot of like you know, gossip really, which you know is in itself a sin, and rumours, but that appears to be a broader phenomenon.
I was initially thinking of when you were saying about like the fallibility, Jake is what allows you to trust someone, is like you're like, oh, I've seen this is a broken person who's not pretending to not be broken.
Think of like shows like Friends.
I remember uh like someone talked about it on that it was Tucker Carlson did an interview with Lee Strobel, is it is he saying Stro Bell, and on that they goes, um he goes, he said, like even a show like Friends, which is a sort of sanitary and innocuous show, actually was promoting a promiscuous lifestyle, actually, like you know, every week they're having it off with a different woman or a different bloke or whatever, and it's normalizing that.
And I like watch stuff with my girls all the time that's like you know, just good British and American, actually, usually entertainment like modern family or whatever, and I am sort of aware of like, oh, they're really normalizing a lot of stuff that I'm not sure I want culturally normalised.
But the thing is, I feel is that the culture operates on two levels, like those people that work on Friends, they're all sort of invested in a system that means they can't ever be themselves.
It was like some time ago, actually, at the beginning of me too and everything, one of my mates who's really famous in the UK said it's just accepted now that there's this uh there's this communicative level of who you actually are, and then the part that you present to the public, and all of us have a degree of you know, levels of authenticity, even Christ has the 12 and then the three, right?
And like, and but if you actually uh have had to submerge your true nature to the point where you don't even know it anymore, and that's what what I think our black male culture is built upon, like in the same way that there's the Diddy parties or the Epstein Island,
I think all of us are a bit ashamed if we've looked at porn or if we've had sex with a prostitute, or if we've looked acted in ways sexually that are outside of the covenant, which is that that sex is supposed to be an expression of love.
Sex is supposed to be an expression of love.
If you're trying to extract the Sex without the love, that's a sin, and you will feel ashamed.
Eventually, you'll pay a price for that.
You'll pay a price one way or another.
And this whole just populations of people that are living like that and a culture that's normalizing it.
What are you saying, Joe McCann?
No, no, I was just agreeing with you.
Like I don't know, I kinda lost your trailer thought there.
You better not, because I'm very you've got to stay very focused on me.
Swiss quick.
I do move fast.
I'm like lightning.
I'm all over the ring.
I'm on the front foot with a stiff jab.
I'm playing off the ropes.
I'm moving into the body.
I'm moving into the head.
I'm I'm laying on the floor.
I'm taking my shorts off.
I'm putting them on my head as a turban.
You don't know what I'll do next.
You don't know where I appear.
I'm a shapeshifter, I'm a Mercurial individual.
You know, like, yeah, I guess like we, you know, we went to a lot of places there, but what I suppose I was saying is is that the way that the culture messages us, it creates a kind of disorientation in the broadest possible way.
And what is this time of independent media defined by authenticity?
Anyone that you look at that's succeeding, like, you know, look at some of these people, Charlie Kirk.
Like that guy is so different from me in a million ways.
But I can tell that Charlie Kirk means what he's saying.
Yeah, that's him.
Yeah, we'll be with you for a bit longer on Rumble Premium.
But if you're watching us on Rumble, we're doing a raid now on the quartering.
Thanks, Crowder, and thanks, Paul, for the raid.
And please join the quarter in.
But if you've got Rumble Premium, stay with us for the rest of this conversation and watch along.
Stay free.
Yeah, I think there was a swing too.
I think about back in you know, home improvement.
Did you watch Tim Allen?
Yeah.
That's like a Michigan family.
That's what it represented.
And I think it was it was sort of like here's a sitcom.
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