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Feb. 11, 2025 - The StoneZONE - Roger Stone
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Why Obama and the Democrats Fear the Blagojevich Pardon | The StoneZONE w/ Roger Stone
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The Stone Zone, with legendary Republican strategist and political icon and pundit Roger Stone.
Stone has served as a senior campaign aide to three Republican presidents.
He is a New York Times bestselling author and a longtime friend and advisor of President Donald Trump.
As an outspoken libertarian, Stone has appeared on thousands of broadcasts, spoken at countless venues, and lectured before the prestigious Oxford Political Union and the Cambridge Union Society.
Due to his four-plus decades in the political and cultural arena, Stone has become a pop culture icon.
And now, here's your host, Roger Stone.
Hello and welcome to another episode of the Stone Zone with Roger Stone.
I am not Roger Stone.
I am Mark Vargas, editor and chief of Illinois Review, filling in for Roger, who will be back.
Tomorrow.
Before we get started, a big day yesterday, not just around the country, but in Illinois, as President Donald Trump gives Rod Blagojevich, the former Illinois governor, an unconditional and full pardon.
But joining me to discuss this is Chicago attorney John Donovan.
John.
Welcome to the Stone Zone.
This is your maiden voyage.
Appreciate you joining me.
Mark, it's good to see you.
Thanks for having me.
It's nice to see you this morning.
Congratulations to you, to the governor and his family.
You guys, a lot of work.
You did a great job.
Thank you.
We're going to play this clip of President Trump signing the presidential pardon live in the Oval Office just yesterday afternoon.
Next, we have a full and unconditional pardon for former Governor Rod Blagojevich of the state of Illinois.
Good.
It's my honor to do it.
I've watched him.
He was set up by a lot of bad people, some of the same people that I had to deal with.
He wasn't quite as successful, but he had somebody that saw what was going on.
I didn't know him, other than I believe he was on The Apprentice for a little while.
He was just a very nice person.
He had a fantastic wife.
She fought like hell to get him out.
He was given a sentence of, like, 18 years.
And it was sort of a terrible injustice.
They just were after him.
They go after a lot of people.
These are bad people, the other side.
So I think he's just a very fine person.
And this shouldn't have happened, and it shouldn't have happened to him.
Let him have a normal life and let him go out and do what he has to do.
So I'm signing this as a full pardon.
Rod Blagojevic.
Mr. President, are you considering him for Ambassador to Serbia?
No, but I would.
He's now cleaner than anybody in this room.
You got a pardon.
He's cleaner than anybody in the room.
He's cleaner than...
Anybody in this room, what an incredible moment there.
The president making a point, signing this pardon in the Oval Office in front of a bank of national television cameras in the White House Press Corps.
John, before I get to you, I want to play last night at 9 o'clock p.m.
Chicago time, Governor Blagojevich and his wife Patty held a press conference outside their home in Chicago where he Thanks, President Trump.
Let's watch that clip.
I want to express our deepest and most profound and everlasting gratitude to President Trump for what he's done today for the full presidential pardon.
I think about my relationship with President Trump and it's really, well, he's always doing things for me and he never asked me to do anything for him.
I had a chance to be on a television show and then he ended what was a long, long, hard nightmare.
After 2,896 days in prison, nearly eight years, President Trump pulled me out of there, and now he did this.
And all I can tell you is that President Trump is a man who, when he sees things that are wrong, he writes them.
He puts an end to them.
And Patty and I, Amy and Annie, will always be grateful to President Trump and never, ever forget his kindness to us.
Never forget his kindness to us.
And it's worth noting here on The Stone Zone that our very own Roger Stone has been incredibly supportive and helpful behind the scenes.
And so a big thank you to Roger Stone for his support.
But John, you're a respected attorney in Chicago.
The comments coming from some of the local Chicago media outlet is that the Illinois legislature passed a law when he was impeached.
Or convicted and impeached and removed from office as governor in 2009, banning him from running for office.
And the media still seems to think that despite this presidential pardon, Rod Blagojevich cannot run for office in Illinois.
Can you give the Stone Zone viewers just a little bit of background on this law and really kind of what it states and what it means?
So, you know, Mark, I... The law was passed in reaction to the governor being impeached.
And I actually questioned that.
I saw a bunch of the media reports this morning, too, saying the same thing.
And I question the legality of the law.
I don't know if the law is constitutional.
And especially in light of the pardon, the notion that a presidential pardon would not be applicable to this law, it's baffling to me.
Because, as you heard, the pardon is supposed to carry a full force.
That was by Jeremy Shepard.
Restored to full force.
And if you all of a sudden have it now where an individual gets a pardon and a law that was passed as a result of the alleged crime that they've now been pardoned for is still applicable, it makes the pardon moot.
And that's the complete opposite of what a presidential pardon is supposed to be.
So I think the governor has a pretty good case here.
I think he...
I don't think the law is constitutional on its face.
I don't think the law is constitutional or applicable in the wake of the pardon.
And I think the governor has a very good case.
He's a good leg to stand on with this.
And there's precedent, John.
John, I mean, there are officials in Illinois, current elected officials, whether it's local or in the Illinois legislature that are have felonies or a criminal record.
And that doesn't seem to be stopping them from being able to serve in public office.
But there just seems to be a unique exception carved out, especially for Rod Blagojevich.
But again, there are people serving in elected office in Illinois right now with a criminal record.
This just doesn't make sense. - Correct.
There are.
And we passed a law a few years ago in the legislature, you know, specifically dealing.
With a mayor who had a felony and whether or not they could serve, and we passed a law to make sure that they could serve.
Like I said, I think it's inconsistent.
I think Rod is a good case to stand on here.
And I think just as a matter of public policy, it's perplexing to me that we would pass those laws in Illinois, that we would want to open up the electoral process for all individuals to run, including those who have a criminal history, and then all of a sudden now...
Because we're faced with somebody who some folks may not like or disagree with their politics, that all of a sudden the pardon doesn't allow them to run, that they are singled out?
Just the entire notion is very wacky to me.
I don't think it sounds legally.
You know, we hear a lot about, because it's true, a weaponized justice system to go after political enemies.
We saw this in Rob Lagojevich's case.
We've seen this with I mean, they had armed men in the water, armed divers in the water.
I mean, it was...
Outrageous, but you can make that same argument that using a law that you just create out of thin air to target a specific elected official, I mean, isn't this another continuation of a weaponized system?
Yeah, I think nobody has to convince me that the Justice Department has been rotten to its core and it's engaging in lawfare.
I see it here in Chicago with cases that we have pending.
And I've seen it elsewhere.
You know, you've got cases in states everywhere that just are outrageous in the notion of what they're going after.
And I agree with you.
I think that when you use government and you use a law to target an individual or to single an individual out, there's a problem there.
And that's, in my opinion, and I hope there's a lot of law students who will hear this and feel the same way.
That's not what we learn when we're becoming lawyers.
It's quite the opposite.
And that is not a fair and impartial legal system, criminal justice system, or even legislative system.
Targeting an individual singing out, it's un-American.
And I think that's what you have here.
That's why I think the law is unconstitutional.
I think the governor has a good leg to stand on in challenging it.
And I think he should be restored fully, just as it was intended by the party.
John, both President Trump, who watches the Stone Zone, and Roger Stone would appreciate this little factoid.
But your family, the Donovan family, has a very unique story in Chicago politics.
Can you give us just a little bit of background by what I mean by that here for the Stone?
Yeah, absolutely.
So I'm a Democrat.
You know my background.
I've worked on Democratic staffs, and I consider myself a Democrat.
My father, my whole family are Democrats.
My father worked for two mayors, worked for Richard J. Daley and for Michael Blandick.
He was their chief of staff.
So we have deep Democratic roots.
Yeah, Mark, you'll actually be interested to know this.
I have a picture I'll find and send it to you one day where I have the governor's case on my floor when I was in law school on a post-it note next to two other cases similar to it.
And I was writing a paper at the time that I thought the sentencing was wrong.
And I thought the case was wrong.
I thought the court got it wrong.
And so it's full circle for me, too.
And that's how I look at it.
Again, I go back to, as a Democrat here, I've been in these circles.
I watch it.
I see a lot of good people who are facing cases right now from a Justice Department that is distorting the law.
And they've been doing it for years.
And we're finally seeing someone in Donald Trump who's standing up to it and speaking it because, Lord knows...
I couldn't, you couldn't.
We don't have the voice, the means to be able to do that.
And so thank God you got someone of courage who's saying it.
What's interesting, John, and what we saw in the Blagojevich case, what we witnessed in the Roger Stone's case in his subsequent trial, what we've been witnessing over the last eight plus years with President Donald Trump is that attorneys and Prosecutors and the DOJ,
they become more like Manhattan public relations firms than about the law and applying the law and the Constitution and equal justice under law.
And to come up with these sayings, the sale of the Senate seat or Russian collusion.
I mean, it really seems like these attorneys, these prosecutors, corrupt prosecutors have been spending so much time trying to find these narratives that can stick in the press rather than applying equal justice under law.
How do we end this very dangerous practice in our country?
Well, Mark, the first thing is it takes people of virtue of spying to stand up and speak up against it.
That's always the first thing.
And that's why I'm glad the conversation's out there now and that we're looking at these and taking a strong look at these cases.
I think that is always the first step.
You have to have people speaking up and willing to fight back.
For years, I think they've preyed on folks knowing that they're not going to have the money to withstand the case.
They're not going to have the means to get their message out.
And that's enough to pressure someone.
I think I saw a stat, you know, a 97.5% conviction rate or something percentage on RICO cases.
That's insane, all right?
Anything at that level, there's a problem there, all right?
That's not a fair fight for folks if that's the rate you're going at.
And I think, so the first thing is obviously the conversation.
And that's happening, and that's good.
And then I think you've got to get other folks, like those on my side, you know, the Democrats.
To start speaking up.
They know that this is a problem, too.
They see it.
They've been subjected to it themselves.
It's getting it to now acknowledge it when it's not you under the microscope.
And once that happens, then you start to see a groundswell and a change.
Because then you've got a coalition of people who are in agreement.
And I think it's there.
I really do.
I think the mechanisms of media don't allow folks to realize how close they actually are in their beliefs on these things.
I hope that that happens.
That's the first and foremost thing.
I hope someone like the governor keeps speaking up, President Trump, and I hope others do.
That's first and foremost.
And then, you know what, Mark, the other thing, too, is I just pulled out Profiles of Courage the other day.
I was reading the intro to the book.
We need folks in the legislature and Congress.
They've got to come together and they've got to change the laws.
There is a problem when when a Justice Department is misapplying black letter law so routinely and frequently.
And if it's if it isn't something that we can stop by pushing back and speaking up, then I think it's incumbent upon Congress to finally clarify those laws and change it.
John, my last couple of questions for you.
I want to zero in on Barack Obama because he's now coming.
Back to the surface in a discussion, because what some may not realize is Barack Obama's 302, which was his interview with the FBI after Blagojevich was arrested, has remained secret.
It's been hidden.
And as you know, that those are supposed to be made available to defendants in the case and made public, and Barack Obama's 302 is still being hidden.
What's on it, and why has...
The Justice, the FBI continued to keep that secret.
The other piece to this, John, is that 98% of Rob Begoevich's tapes are still under a lifetime seal.
Meaning what the governor argues, tapes that prove his innocence that have been spliced in certain sections of it to make it sound even worse than it really is.
They have been hidden.
Describe sort of what the legal ramification or impact that could be having a friendlier FBI director and attorney general who could release Obama's 302 and who could release the 98% of tapes that have been kept secret and hidden since his trials.
Well, I think...
Bart, it could be a short conversation because I think what we saw in the first couple weeks here with the president is if they want to release something, they can release it.
So those things can be released if they want to.
I think I don't want to speak to the legal ramifications without knowing the full background there and everything.
I'd have to refresh myself on it.
But what I will say is to the public opinion of the issue, it's important.
Having transparency and people being able to have all the facts at their hands to make an informed opinion is very important.
We've seen that in the last two election cycles.
I'm sure across your life, your viewers, everyone in their lives understands every day, just in ordinary decisions, the importance of being able to see everything, read it, digest it.
Why would it be any different in this matter?
And so I think there's probably a lot of value in a lot of...
A lot of light that would be shined if those things were released and people could look at them.
I don't know what the rationale is for not at this juncture, but as we know and we saw in the first weeks of this administration, they can release them if they want to, and I'm sure they're considering it and looking at it.
And it would certainly spell big trouble for Barack Obama and others when things are being hidden.
It doesn't make sense.
So we're certainly going to be seeing some transparency here in this second Trump administration.
My last question to you, John, and again, I'm so grateful that you joined us here last minute, is you're a Democrat.
Your family history is supportive of the Democratic Party.
You're now supporting President Trump.
Very briefly, just sort of what's been the transition from being a lifelong Democrat to now supporting the Trump agenda?
What happened?
You know, Buck, I consider myself, so I'm a Democrat in the party, and I consider myself a classical liberal.
I've always considered myself that.
And, you know, classical liberal is big on individualism, on independent thought, you know, and what I've seen for a long time here in government is a big shift away from those things as a Democrat.
You know, I grew up as a Daily Democrat, a Kennedy Democrat, and I believe that you've got to help the little guy.
You've got to provide economic opportunity.
There is a role for government.
It's not a large one.
That's always been my belief.
And I just feel that the party has gone so far from those things.
And that's why.
You know, I was not, at the start of 2016, a Trump supporter.
I was actually a Rand Paul supporter because I... I found myself even more libertarian on things then.
And I actually voted for Tulsi Gabbard in 2016 in my primary.
But I've just grown.
The second Trump won, I've always liked him.
And I believe Americans are inherently fair people.
I've always felt that way.
And to watch what he's gone through, fair and unfair, is just beyond me.
Sometimes I look and I just don't know what I'm seeing.
And I think that's it.
I respect the guy.
I really do.
He's tough as Dales.
And I think when somebody's tough and they go through stuff, I think they deserve your respect.
I really do.
So that's sort of it.
I'm a big fan.
I really am.
And I really don't hide it.
I like people that know it.
I think it's good for a conversation.
Again, I go back to what I said a little bit earlier.
If people can't admit that what's good on the other side, where do we go?
How do we have a conversation?
You know, you got to be able to talk with both sides and you have to be able to, you know, to work with folks.
And I just think he's doing his best and he's a tough man.
He really deserves a lot of credit for what he's enduring.
John Donovan, I want to thank you for joining us here on the Stone Zone.
I look forward to having you back again real soon.
Mark, it's always good seeing you.
Thanks.
And before we end this portion of the show, we're going to play a 35-minute interview of Roger Stone with Kimberly Goldfoyle, talking about the rapid pace of the first two weeks of the Trump administration and how President Trump is accomplishing more in his first two weeks in office than most presidents accomplish in four or eight years.
News, information, everything's happening so quickly that it's difficult for people to keep up.
But already in just a short period of time, we're already seeing a difference in our country, particularly when it comes to immigration and securing our borders and rooting out and deporting the most violent and dangerous criminals who have been welcomed into our cities by Democratic politicians like Illinois Governor J.B. Pritzker and Chicago Mayor Brandon Johnson and so many others.
But you're not going to want to miss...
This interview, it's about 35 minutes, and it'll take us to the end of the show.
But until next time, good night, God bless you, and enjoy this Roger Stone interview.
Right, and coming up right now, joining us, iconic political strategist, host for the Stone Zone, Roger Stone.
Roger, thank you for being on the program.
Kimberly, always great to be with you.
Fantastic.
So we're super excited to have you on today.
So much going on, so much winning.
Winning that you predicted, an election that you predicted, a robust and most auspicious presidency that you predicted.
So this is very exciting.
It's another week of big confirmation votes for the Senate.
All indications are that Tulsi and RFK have the votes.
I know you've been a big proponent of Tulsi Gabbard.
You know, from day one, you called it.
And then also, Kash Patel is slated to be confirmed next week.
But are there any surprises we should be on the lookout for?
And then just speak to everything, you know, that you know and what you think, your analysis, et cetera, about Tulsi Gabbard and her qualifications.
Well, first of all, Kimberly, thanks for having me.
Secondarily, I honestly believe that even though Donald Trump was a great president in his first term, And that was with half the people he appointed working secretly against him.
But he still achieved great things, the most robust economy in our history, the lowest levels of unemployment among all Americans, rebuilding our military strength and so on.
I actually think he's going to be a much greater president in this term than if he had been rightfully given the office in 2020, which I think he won.
The four years in the wilderness here, the four years.
Fighting the tsunami of lawfare against him.
He was able to see the deep state for what they are.
He was able to fully understand how Washington works and how the two parties work.
And you already see it.
He's hit the ground running in a way that is...
It's breathtaking.
This is going to be more dramatic than Franklin Roosevelt's first hundred days, more dramatic than John Kennedy's first hundred days.
Interesting.
I like that prediction as well.
I love to have interesting American political history and the juxtaposition between the past and the present, what President Trump's been able to do.
I mean, even though he went to the Super Bowl, he still used it as a working day.
Phenomenal what he did.
Very cool with the Gulf of America and making that, you know, Gulf of America Day in the United States.
And we see him there.
That's Theo.
That's Ivanka's youngest son.
Very cute.
Hey, they predicted the winner there.
He's got the green on for the Eagles.
But so you have been, I want to give proper credit where credit is due, Roger.
You have been vital, crucial, many say, in laying out why.
Tulsi deserved an important position in this administration.
What do you believe she can achieve in the office of the Director of National Intelligence?
Well, Kimberly, I've been in American politics for 45 years, a little longer now.
Tulsi Gabbard is one of the most impressive individuals I've ever seen.
Really is.
Both in terms of her communication skills, her knowledge, and her firm commitment to principle.
I honestly think she's going to be the first woman president.
I hope so.
She is, as you know, a combat veteran in Iraq and Kuwait.
She's a lieutenant colonel in the U.S. Army Reserve.
But she's extraordinarily smart.
And I thought it was very important that she helped bring, I think, a lot of independents, a lot of millennials, a lot of people who weren't in the Trump She also has a complete understanding of the deep state and how they operate.
This is why they're so apoplectic about her appointment.
I mean, they said, oh, she went and met with Assad.
So did Senator Robert Torricelli of New Jersey, a Democrat.
So did Nancy Pelosi.
Her concern was very clear.
The last time these radicals controlled Syria, 100,000 Christians were brutally slaughtered.
So, yeah, I think that's a legitimate reason to talk to the folks there.
Or this question that because she wants to curtail our support for the war in Ukraine, that that somehow means that she's pro-Russian.
How do you question the patriotism of someone who put their life on their line?
For their country in combat.
So I think she was adamant politically.
I think she helped bring a lot.
She campaigned very hard.
It's interesting, any day from the time she endorsed Donald Trump for president to election day, the only days that she was not campaigning, she was on military duty as a member of the US Army Reserve.
She worked very hard for this presidency, to win this presidency.
And I think the president's made an excellent choice here.
And sending her to be the director of national information.
I certainly think so.
And I got to tell you something.
I can't stop watching those videos.
It never gets old for me.
If I go shooting and I do all this stuff.
I mean, she is unbelievable.
And such a nice person.
You know, every time I see her, she's super warm and gracious and, like, amazing, supporting other women, being a role model to men and women, quite frankly.
You know, she's the best of the best.
That's what America First looks like.
Pretty excited about it.
Let's talk about this, too.
So, President Trump recently revoked security clearances for Biden, Blinken, Letitia James, Alvin Bragg, and others.
So, Letitia James, in particular, has some problems that you really have highlighted.
What do we need to know?
Well, she has a number of problems.
First and foremost, she has the problem that there is now solid proof That she overestimated the value of assets in order to secure mortgages to buy commercial properties.
Wait a minute.
Isn't that what she accused Donald Trump of doing?
Exactly.
Secondarily, if you examine her contributions to her campaign through Act Blue to become attorney general, you're going to find that a bunch of her donors, people who gave many, many, many times, either don't exist at all.
Or when you contact them, they say they didn't give those contributions.
So there's evidence of campaign finance fraud.
Right now, Kimberly, we are looking very closely at her campaign contributions when she served six terms in the New York City Council.
That's because, as you know, Eric Adams is charged with taking $100,000 of Turkish money, illegal offshore money.
Giving it to straw donors in the United States and then submitting it to New York City's 8 to 1 campaign finance matching program, turning $100,000 into about $800,000, only because not every penny was eligible.
I believe there's a solid pattern that Tish James did the exact same thing.
I have a team of researchers working on it right now.
She also covered up at least one case.
Of where her chief of staff was accused of sexual assault.
She fought it in court.
I believe it was privately settled.
There are two other examples of this that I know of that I'm researching.
There's also a woman who claims that she herself was assaulted by Tish James.
This is public information.
You can find it if you go looking for it.
So she's got some real problems, but I think...
The question of her personal wealth, because she went from being worth a couple hundred thousand dollars to being worth 15 million almost overnight.
It's insane.
And I think she's guilty of the very thing that she falsely accused Donald Trump of doing.
Haven't we seen that happen time and time again?
You know what they're accusing you of?
They actually have done themselves.
It's unbelievable.
These are morally and ethically corrupt individuals, and there needs to be accountability.
Facts.
It doesn't matter that President Trump won.
This needs to be addressed, regardless.
It's not like, forget about it, you know?
And I know you see that too, so keep digging.
Meanwhile, CBS News found that currently 53% of the public approves of the job President Donald Trump is doing, and 59% approve of his deportation of illegal aliens.
So it's going over very well.
How much should we read into approval numbers at this point, Roger, in a presidency?
It's very, very early.
However, let's be candid.
CBS, as a polling institution, has never rated the president very strongly.
I've always looked at their polls in the context of looking at several other polls in the same time frame and thought that there may have been Methodological problems there.
So this is the highest approval rating Donald Trump has ever gotten from the CBS poll ever since the beginning of his getting into politics.
And what's really interesting, Kimberly, is he is scoring best among younger voters.
That's the future.
A good demographic shift.
Yeah, very dynamic.
Very dynamic.
I love it.
I love it.
And let's talk about it because, you know, quite frankly, this administration is moving, as we highlighted in the beginning of our talk, at a rapid pace, right?
We've heard the term flooding the zone.
What's another little play on war?
Stone zone, flooding the zone.
What's the best strategy to keep this momentum going, in your opinion?
Look, I think the American people have already decided about this.
You point out this 59 percent number of people approving of his closing the border and expelling illegals.
Look, when you're in a bathtub and the faucet is still running.
And it's spilling over.
Taking pails of water and throwing them out is not going to solve the problem.
First, you have to close off the faucet.
So that's what Tom Homan has done.
Now, it's going to take some time, but they are systematically rooting out the most dangerous criminals, some of them terrorists, and removing them from the country.
I love it when these Democrat politicians like the mayor of Denver, others, J.B. Pritzker.
That guy's so fat he has his own zip code.
He's going to resist the federal law about deportation.
He better not mess around.
Tom Holman is a very tough customer.
Very serious guy.
If he has to.
No, you don't want to mess around with him.
He means business.
And I love that.
You know, as a former prosecutor, I can't stand this whole mess.
I cannot even believe it's...
So upsetting to me about the number of people that came in that we don't even know where they are, what's going on, you know, what crimes they've committed, what are their intentions just with this porous border that Biden and Harris created.
But what's your confidence right now?
Let's talk about a legislative branch.
You know, your confidence in Congress.
There is a majority, but it is not significant.
It's slim.
We also have an important special election in upstate New York.
That Democrats are trying to delay.
So, what are the key benchmarks for Congress right now?
Well, as you point out, we have very, very tight control.
We don't have much room for error here, although there are, I think it's 218 Republicans and 215 Democrats.
Two congressional seats are vacant because Matt Gaetz and Mike Walz, who became national security adviser, abandoned their seats, resigned their seats to those special elections, which will be won by Republicans, don't come up until April.
So, right now, Elise Stefanik, who has been appointed UN ambassador, while she's had her hearing, which went very well, she's not going for her confirmation vote, I think because they are concerned about how narrow our margin is to anything in the House.
Now, suddenly, last Friday, the Democrats come in New York on what's called a two-party bill from the- The Cousins and Heastie, the Senate leader and the Assembly majority leader, that completely changes how we do special elections in New York.
So that used to be that within 90 days of a member of Congress resigning, or when a member of Congress resigned, the governor would set a special election within 90 days.
That has always been the tradition in the law.
But now they're saying...
That if that resignation of Elise Stefanik happens before the qualifying period for this year's primary for local offices, well then the special election will be in June.
Or if she resigns after qualifying, the election will be this November.
That, of course, keep the seat vacant for, you know, could be the better part of a year.
I would also deny President Trump his UN ambassador if she has to stay in Congress to hold the seat to make sure we have a majority.
The other thing I must tell you I don't like is that under the existing law, Republican voters don't get to make this decision as to who should be the nominee to replace Elise Stefanik.
This decision is in the hands of 12 Republican county chairmen.
So it's going to be very interesting to make sure that we nominate the strongest candidate.
The Democrats have nominated a farmer who seems kind of like a moderate.
And this seat was held by a Democrat as recently as 2016. So it is a Republican-leaning district.
You know, special elections, particularly among New York Republicans.
Particularly one that I think potentially could be in the summer, June or July.
We're going to have to watch this very, very closely.
Well, you know, also it becomes tricky because you can't take anything for granted, like you said, probably leaning.
But, you know, special elections, a lot of times people don't show up.
And it can be low voter turnout.
And that to me is, you know, problematic potentially in and of itself, unless you're...
The superior candidate getting the vote out.
That is a great danger.
You're going to have very, very light turnout in a special election.
And traditionally, for whatever reasons, New York Democrats have done a better job of that than New York Republicans.
The other good news, however, is...
That you have this situation in Texas 28, Lyndon Johnson's old congressional district, where the congressman there, I always mispronounce his name, I guess it's Kulair.
He's Hispanic, Henry Kulair.
He and his wife have been indicted on 14 counts of bribery and embezzlement, I believe it is, and fraud.
He's going the way of Menendez.
I suspect that he will resign.
Now, we had an excellent candidate by the name of Jay Furman in that race, Commander Jay Furman, a veteran.
He got no help from the National Party.
No one thought he could win.
He only lost by four points.
President Trump carried the district.
So we could pick up a seat in Texas very early this year.
I think the congressman will resign as part of a plea deal opening that to a special election.
Well, and of course, some federal judges will do everything to stand in the way of Trump's agenda, right, which is what we're seeing.
Even if some of the rulings are arbitrary and capricious, we saw it in the first term.
We're seeing it now.
You know, what tools, Roger, does the executive branch have to kind of combat this form of lawfare?
Well, actually, I think it's the legislative branch that has the greater authority.
Nowhere does it say that the judicial branch is supremacy over the legislative branch.
Some of these judges, I think, need to be held accountable.
There is a process to question judges.
There's a process to remove judges.
Traditionally, judges are only removed for reasons of corruption.
But this ruling by a federal judge that the Treasury Secretary himself should not have access to the records of the Treasury Department, this is insanity.
That's an insane ruling.
It'll get overturned, but it just shows you how completely hysterical and apoplectic the left is because Donald Trump has the audacity to do exactly what he said he was going to do through the entire campaign.
Well, how should we also think about, you know, Doge?
A lot of talk about this and the access, obviously, that Elon Musk has to the different agencies to try to cut out the waste, the excessive spending, which is, we knew there was a lot, but my God, what do you think about all of this?
And Democrats in the media, you know, are more upset about the existence of Doge than the actual fraud and waste itself.
Yeah, people don't remember this, but we had something very similar under Reagan.
It was called the Grace Commission.
And they did a deep dive on American government.
They came back with a book this thick of all the waste and corruption that could be cut.
And then you know what happened, Kimberly?
Nothing at all.
That's what happened.
Because the Congress didn't have the courage to do anything.
I love what Elon Musk is doing.
And he's using his technical skills, the technical skills of his people.
To look at mass amounts of data, and he's undercovering amazing fraud.
USAID was signed into law by President John F. Kennedy to fund developing nations in the fight against communism.
That was the original purpose.
It has become a slush fund for the deep state.
They use it for anything they want, paying off journalists, toppling governments.
I think you're going to find their involvement.
In the Russian collusion hoax, you're going to find their involvement in the two Trump impeachments.
I think you're going to find their involvement in January 6th.
You see, the Central Intelligence Agency needs a presidential finding to take certain acts, but USAID... They don't need such a party.
They just do whatever they want.
And the spending is beyond belief.
Some movie star was paid $4 million, I believe it was, to go have his picture taken with Zelensky for publicity reasons.
This does not seem to me to be a good expenditure of the American people's tax money.
No, not at all.
It's outrageous.
I mean, the whole organization, it's terrible.
It's not even in any way, shape, or form being utilized for what its original intended purpose was.
And has just honestly, it's like you said, it's like a slush fund and they can circumvent any actual authority and approval to be able to do it and pay for whatever they need to get done.
Let's talk about Nixon.
It's another one of your guys that you know very well historically.
So he used to say that the worst thing a politician can be is dull, right?
And we know Donald Trump is anything but dull.
How does that affect his ability to deliver on his promises?
Well, it's kind of interesting.
President Nixon was probably the first one, even before me, who saw Donald Trump's potential to be president.
They met at Yankee Stadium at an opening game in the owner, George Steinbrenner's box.
President Nixon called me the next day.
He knew that I was doing some work for Donald Trump.
And he said, well, I've seen your man.
So what did you think?
He said, I'm just telling you this guy could go all the way.
Wow.
He wrote a letter, which has been published by the New York Times.
Yeah.
I saw it at the library.
Yeah.
Well, she says, Mrs. Nixon and I saw you on the Mike Douglas show.
And if you ever decide to get into politics.
There's no question you will go all the way.
So there's a great piece in the Free Beacon today about how similar in many ways Nixon and Trump were in terms of their willingness to challenge the power establishment in the early days of their presidency.
Nixon was brought down not because of Watergate.
Watergate, we now know, based on recently declassified documents, was a takedown of Richard Nixon by the deep state.
The Central Intelligence Agency knew about the plan to break into the Watergate, and they infiltrated the Watergate burglar team with four CIA agents.
So I think that they killed John Kennedy.
They took Nixon out in a silent coup.
They tried to kill our president twice.
Only through the grace of God did he survive.
And he knows it.
There's no question that he knows it.
You know, Kimberly, pastors always used to complain to me that Donald Trump didn't talk enough about his faith.
Well, he thought faith was a private matter.
He didn't like to talk about it, not politically.
But now you notice in his speech at the convention, at his inaugural address, he talked a lot about his faith in God and the fact that God has indeed spared him for this moment.
There's a certain...
There's a serenity about him now, a certain sureness.
Not that he wasn't always confident.
He was always super confident.
But there's something different about him now.
He's having the time of his life.
You can see that.
And he's extremely well prepared for this.
Unlike 2017, when he came from the world of business to politics, it was all new to him.
So he didn't know, for example, that the outgoing Republican national chairman He does not get to name their successor, that the president, the leader of the party, gets to do that.
He didn't know that because nobody told him that.
Perfect example.
He didn't know, for example, that the Congress had passed legislation in the late 90s that required all of the John F. Kennedy assassination documents to be released in 2017, unless the president made a decision to hold some of them or all of them back.
And he actually released about 80% of the archive in 2017. Then, as he's now said, Mike Pompeo, the CIA director, convinced him to hold back 20% of the documents.
Now, if Mike Pompeo, who is the director of Central Intelligence Agency at the time, doesn't want these documents released, what could possibly be in those documents?
What could it possibly be about?
Other than the role of the CIA in John Kennedy's murder.
Think about that for a moment, right?
Very interesting.
Let's talk about this, too, in terms of presidential leadership styles, of work ethic, whatnot.
Biden was nowhere.
In fact, he wasn't at the Super Bowl, but I did see Jill Biden.
And Trump is everywhere.
OK, he was golfing with Tiger Woods yesterday.
Then he's at the Super Bowl.
He's signing, you know, Gulf of America Day that he's nonstop.
You know how tireless the man is.
It's unbelievable.
But the media can't even keep up with their coverage.
Should the Trump administration double down, you know, kind of on that strategy as much as they can and just keep going?
Because the media is just like flailing.
I'm not even sure it's a strategy.
It's just him.
He's driving it.
He's driving it because he's peripatetic.
He's in constant motion.
He's a force of nature.
As you know, unlike any other political figure I've ever worked for, he's not handled, he's not managed, he's not scripted.
He's genuine.
He's authentic.
He's Donald Trump.
And he decides, yeah.
That doesn't mean he doesn't ask for advice from a lot of people.
He does.
He asks for a broad array of advice from people.
But at the end of the day, there's only one decision maker.
He's the one who decides where Donald Trump's going to go and what he's going to do and what he's going to say and who's going to appoint and so on.
Very much his own man.
It has not been that way.
With some of our recent presidents.
So it's not so much a strategy, it's just the reality.
He knows the Democrats will try to take back the House in two years.
And if that happens, we'll have the same baseless, phony investigations like the Russian collusion hoax, for example.
So he's in a race against time.
He's going to get as much done as he possibly can in the first two years.
And then if we have the boom economy that I believe we're going to have and we begin to solve the affordable housing problem in America, well, I think we may actually gain seats.
In the midterm elections, which, of course, you know, would be antithetical to all previous historical record.
Unbelievable.
So let's talk about sort of what you see going forward.
I mean, I know you're quite happy with so many of the things that have occurred.
Obviously, we want to see Tulsi and RFK, you know, confirm Kash Patel.
What else would you like to see President Trump do?
Because a lot has happened very quickly here.
Like, what's sort of on your, you know, highlight?
Two things I really, really like is he's thrown out the idea.
At this point, it's just an idea, but it's not an impossible idea.
I'd like to see him repeal the income tax.
I'd like to see us move to a flatter, fairer federal tax system.
And I think it could be done.
I agree.
Do you think that's on the horizon?
Because I find this to be very interesting.
I think we need major overhaul with the IRS. It's out of control.
And, you know, more money in the pockets of hardworking Americans.
You don't have to tell me I owe them $2 million, of which a million and a half is interest in penalties.
And this pertains to my 2006 taxes.
They put out a press release, the IRS, saying that I had failed to honestly declare my assets or my income when I did nothing of the kind.
It's so bad.
They learned that in an audit.
So, yeah, we do need reform at the IRS. I'll be paying them for the rest of my life if you want to know the truth.
But the other thing I really like is this announcement that they're going to audit the Federal Reserve.
Think about that.
I mean, Ron Paul must be so happy today.
It must be unbelievable.
He's actually going to go in and audit the Federal Reserve, something that Ron Paul's been calling for for decades.
So he's going after all of these.
of these untouchable entities in Washington who no one has ever questioned before, like USAID being a perfect example, and he's finding epic corruption and waste.
This is going to be the most transformative presidency in American history.
I'm super excited about it.
I want him to get right on that IRS ASAP. Let me tell you something.
Talk about approval rating.
Who goes to bed at night being like, oh, you complete me.
I love you, IRS. I don't think anybody.
We'll talk about this with the economy, and so far so good, but what does it look like for you specifically on housing?
And we have Bill Pulte tapped to lead the Federal Housing Agency.
What can be done?
What would you like to be seen accomplished there?
Well, I have to say, Bill Pulte is among the president's very best appointees.
He comes from a long-standing family of business that Bill...
Thousands and thousands of homes across America.
He's also a very early Trump supporter in 2016 and, of course, again in 2020 and again in 2024. He's a brilliant guy.
And I think that he, working with Scott Besson, are going to come up with some very innovative programs.
What we need are Trump homes.
Hundreds of thousands of affordable Trump homes, and we need a mortgage program that makes them affordable.
You know the problem today.
It's too expensive to build a home.
You can't get a mortgage for it anyway.
And if you try to rent someplace to live, the rents are stratospheric.
So we have a serious affordable housing problem in the country.
I give Robert Kennedy a lot of credit for being the first one to talk about this on a national scale.
But I think that is going to be one of the keys to winning the midterm elections.
First of all, we've got to get our oil and gas industry cooking at full capacity because that's the cornerstone of a boom economy.
To renew the Trump tax cuts, that's obvious, because a rising tide lifts all boats.
I hated during the campaign when they kept saying, and Trump wants to cut taxes on billionaires.
No, Trump wanted to cut taxes on everybody across the board.
Exactly.
In fact, the people in the middle brackets got a greater tax reduction than billionaires got.
But you know how it is.
They lie.
The first clip you showed here on the show was from CNN. I don't get my news from CNN for the same reason I don't eat out of the toilet.
Dear God.
Tough but fair.
So let's talk about winning your Rumble show, Fabulous, and on WABC. You've been doing a lot of big deep dives into all these top stories.
I know you recently interviewed James O'Keefe on his DOJ charges being dropped.
What did you learn?
This is an incredible case.
This is the first time in the history of the United States that the FBI raided the home of a journalist to try to find material, in this case, Ashley Biden's diary, that O'Keefe had gotten from a source.
Actually, I think it was somebody who worked for O'Keefe had gotten from a source.
Now, O'Keefe never published the diary.
He never did any video on the diary.
He wasn't even sure at that point that the diary was real.
He told me he figured out the diary was real when the FBI raided his home to recover the diary.
This is really outrageous.
And he was charged with transporting stolen material over a state line.
Really?
So what he's guilty of is engaging in the act of journalism.
What they do at the New York Times, the Washington Post, the Wall Street Journal.
The only difference is O'Keefe does it better.
And it's an outrageous case.
The best part of this, Kimberly, is when they released the probable cause affidavit as to why they had probable cause to raid O'Keefe's home in New York, every single word was redacted.
Every single word.
It's just black markings over the three-page document.
So there's a lot of real serious questions here.
Did the FBI infiltrate what was then Project Veritas?
Did they have something on the inside?
Or does the probable cause say that this was ordered by the White House?
I said to the New York Post at the time, I was so outraged by this raid.
I know a little bit about having your home raided.
Yes, you do.
The FBI is acting like Joe Biden's personal Gestapo in violation of the law.
It's unbelievable.
And I'll never forget that raid on, you know, your house and early morning and CNN being tipped off about it and your poor wife was sick.
It's just the whole thing is so reprehensible.
And that's why it's the dawning of a new day for justice in this country.
Thanks to President Trump.
Similarly, what happened to James O'Keefe is outrageous.
It's unbelievable the things that they try to get away with.
But now there's accountability.
Thanks be to God.
All right.
Give us all the promotion for everything you've got going on, because you really are breaking some big news.
You've got a fabulous show.
People want to check it out.
Go ahead.
Well, first of all, the Stone Zone is on Rumble.
I love Rumble.
Go to rumble.com slash Roger Stone.
Our show is every day at 8 o'clock Eastern.
But check it out on Rumble.
Rumble's a great platform.
It really is.
We've got a great leader in Chris.
Stone.com.
My website, where I publish things that I've written, as well as news stories that I see that aren't getting as much coverage as I think they should.
Also, you can go to the store there and get all of my books, The Man Who Killed Kennedy, The Case Against LBJ, The Real Story of the Kennedy Assassination, or The Clinton's War on Women, The Bush Crime Family.
The Making of the President in 2016, how Donald Trump started a revolution.
It's all there.
Plus, you can get your very own Roger Stone did nothing wrong t-shirt.
You get one of my signed Roger Stones, which is a paperweight.
It's all there.
And then on weekends, every Sunday from 3 to 6 Eastern, you can go to WABCradio.com.
WABCradio is the most powerful.
It's the most influential and most entertaining radio station in the country.
It's the most powerful signal.
And we're doing really well Sunday afternoon traditionally.
Not the highest traffic area for radio listeners, but we're doing very, very well there.
We've kind of beat that.
I'm just glad I wasn't on at the same time as the Super Bowl.
Exactly.
There you go.
There you go.
Roger, what a pleasure, my friend, to be with you.
Everyone check out his fabulous show, 8 p.m.
Eastern, right here on Rumble.
And the White House now has their official Rumble channel as well, so that's pretty exciting.
All good things.
Thank you so much for being with me.
Kimberly, I want to congratulate you again for being appointed ambassador to Greece.
I can't think of anyone more qualified to go to that.
Which, because of the relationship between Greece and Turkey, both American allies, it's a hot spot.
It's a very delicate job.
Nobody will do a better job than you.
And yes, I'm going to come visit you.
Good.
I cannot wait.
OK, we'll do the stone zone from there.
Be a lot of fun.
Thank you, my friend.
I really appreciate it.
God bless you.
A man who's gone through hell, but he's kept going and he's smart and he's strong and people.
Love him.
Not everybody, but people love him and respect him.
Roger Stone.
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