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Feb. 24, 2024 - The StoneZONE - Roger Stone
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JD Shuttlesworth and Roger Stone In The StoneZONE!
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The Stone Zone with legendary Republican strategist and political icon and pundit Roger Stone.
Stone has served as a senior campaign aide to three Republican presidents.
He is a New York Times best-selling author and a longtime friend and advisor of President Donald Trump.
As an outspoken libertarian, Stone has appeared on thousands of broadcasts, spoken at countless venues and lectured before the prestigious Oxford Political Union and the Cambridge Union Society.
Due to his four-plus decades in the political and cultural arena, Stone has become a pop culture icon.
And now, here's your host, Roger Stone!
Roger Stone is with us today as we now become the Stone Zone.
Wow.
Great to have you.
Great to be here.
First question, very important.
Yes.
Who is the best dressed man in American politics, and why is it you?
You know, unfortunately, in America today, most men don't care how they look.
It's really degenerated.
So, there was a very famous columnist, syndicated columnist designer named Mr. Blackwell.
And for 48 years, he did a column, once a year, of the very best-dressed people in the world.
Celebrities, athletes, business titans, starlets, actors, and so on.
And then I read 15 years ago that he passed away.
So I decided to pick up this tradition and start producing my own list on New Year's Day every year.
I didn't know that.
And it has gotten harder and harder and harder to do.
Sure, because people, I mean, people dress like they're going to the gym, but they go to a restaurant.
In other words, don't wear athletic outfit if you're going to a fine restaurant or if you're going to the opera, okay?
But also, by the same token, you don't wear blue jeans to a wedding.
- Right. - So most people don't care.
The key thing is always be dressed appropriately for the activity in which you're going to engage.
And if you just stick to that, you'll always be well-dressed.
Now, you look pretty good tonight, I must say. - I tried to do better since you were coming.
- You did good. - All right, I'm gonna have them throw something up It's Trump's path to win the election to 270 electoral votes.
Basically, and you can correct me on anything I'm wrong on, I'm just repeating what the analysts I like have to say.
Trump is probably not going to lose any states that he carried in 2020.
2020, correct?
I agree with that, yes.
Okay, and then so then that gives him a very high floor, about 251 electoral votes.
So he doesn't need to pick up much.
Can you guys put the graphic up?
From what I saw, it's going to be, so there it is.
So you've got Pennsylvania, Michigan, Wisconsin, Nevada, and Arizona.
So I know Pennsylvania is about dead even.
Michigan, he's doing great and better.
Wisconsin, he's starting to pull ahead.
Nevada's plus seven or so, Trump, plus five at the worst.
Arizona is tight.
So with his path, if he picks up Pennsylvania, then he's got it.
The other ones, he basically has to take two of those four states.
I think he's up in all five, maybe except Pennsylvania, if we're running a fair and square election.
But since it factors in election integrity heavily, which of those states do you feel is his best path to 270?
First of all, I must tell you that I'm not as optimistic about Pennsylvania as you are.
No, I'm not optimistic about Pennsylvania.
And the reason for that is, I mean, if we had a free, fair, honest, transparent election, we would most definitely carry Pennsylvania.
Mail-in ballots are unconstitutional in Pennsylvania.
There is no question about that.
The lower courts held that.
The middle courts held that.
But the left-wing Democrat state Supreme Court overturned that.
And as long as you have mail-in ballots, the Philadelphia machine, where vote stealing is an art form and has been for decades, is of great danger.
I think if you had an honest counselor in Pennsylvania today, I think he would win.
I also think his margins are going to increase.
In other words, he's not He's going to go even higher.
He is going to go higher.
And Biden, I'm not saying this as someone who detests Joe Biden.
I'm saying this as a realist.
He really can't turn the ship around.
Unless he's just going to embrace all of Trump's policies, which he can't do.
Can he?
Well, no, but it's interesting that for the first time now, we're suddenly giving out oil and gas drilling permits.
So they basically have figured out their whole green energy BS is not going to work.
It's destroying the economy.
So they'll never admit it.
But it's like Joe Biden saying, we've got to seal the border.
Wait a minute.
They've told us for months, Mayorkas, that crazy Jean Pierre woman, they keep telling us the border's secure.
They've been insisting.
Seems like a happy lady.
Yeah, right.
Nice hair.
I've never seen her smile, ever.
ever.
She's better than the other one, though, that Saki woman.
She had the ability to lie with a straight face like very few people I've ever seen.
That's true.
So I do think that if that if you saw Biden's very angry press conference the other night, he told you a lot where he said, first of all, I'm the most qualified person in the country to be president.
He actually believes that.
Yes.
He really believes that.
Who could do what I've done?
Indeed.
Who could do what I've done?
I mean, an open border, a fentanyl crisis, a crime crisis, a financial crisis in the states and counties and cities struggling to pay for the social services for illegal migrants while we're cutting services for average Americans. a financial crisis in the states and counties and cities We have $370,000 homes.
Homeless veterans in this country.
But we're giving $53 million worth of prepaid credit cards in New York City to illegals.
It really does boggle the mind.
He actually thinks, one, that he's popular.
He believes that.
He believes his policies are successful.
I guess that's because they tell him that.
But I really don't think he's, he's not living in reality.
And he's clearly manipulated by the real President of the United States.
Which is whom?
Barack Obama.
Not Susan Rice?
No, well, she's, but she's an agent of Barack.
She's a creation of Barack Obama.
She's Barack Obama's henchwoman.
So you've seen the video of Barack Obama talking to Stephen Colbert.
Remember him?
He used to be funny.
When they go liberal, they really objectively aren't funny anymore.
That guy's not funny at all.
But you see Obama say, I've often thought how great it would be To sit in my basement in my sweats and I'd have a microphone there'd be like earphones in the front man uses those words the front man and I have my third term that's exactly what's happening today it's precisely what's happening today except I'm convinced and I've said this now for a while Even Obama has figured out that Joe can't make it.
The guy can barely stand up.
He can't finish a sentence.
The way he loses his train of thought in the middle of a sentence and trails off, that's a sure sign, neurologists tell me, of the onset of senile dementia.
The general lack of memory.
I loved this the other day when he said how outrageous it was That the special counsel asked me about the death of my son.
Well, first of all, we now know he brought it up.
They didn't bring it up.
Secondly, he uses it as a political trope all the time.
He always uses it.
He misremembers, keeps insisting his son died in military service.
That's not true.
But then the best part, he said, I have this rosary.
There's nothing wrong with my memory.
There's nothing wrong with my memory.
I've had this rosary and I have worn it every day since my son died.
And it was given to us by our lady of, uh, of, uh, And he just trails off, because he doesn't remember.
Right.
It is really quite extraordinary.
So, I'm convinced that he shows... First of all, that volcanic anger is the other clear indicator that he's not all there.
That he's mentally slipping.
That's right.
My own mother, my own grandmother, had dementia.
And I remember that very specifically.
They flare up.
When you challenge them, they flare up.
It's very sad.
Okay, so pop that map back up, but keep us on the sides.
So with Pennsylvania, I agree.
I would not want my hopes resting in Pennsylvania.
Which states have shored their elections up where if you look at those remaining four gray states, you would pick two of them and say, I think you got a shot with those two?
It's a very difficult question.
I actually think Wisconsin's your best chance.
You've got an active Republican majority there in the legislature that is about to throw off the yoke of the leadership because they're fire breathers.
And Republicans, the state has been trending our way.
Georgia should be winnable.
I think we won it last time, in all honesty.
Yeah, I'm doing this with the assumption that we take Georgia, because it looks good, huh?
Good-ish.
Good.
However, you've got, first of all, people lose sight of the fact that there are two active litigations, one federal, one state, challenging the underlying premise of these criminal indictments.
In other words, let's recognize what Fannie Wills is saying.
She's saying that Trump lost.
He knew he lost.
He told the Secretary of State to go out and find 11,860 votes.
Now listen carefully, because I've listened to it and I've read the transcript.
It's not what he said.
What he said is, essentially, you have already inadvertently counted 11,860 illegal votes, and he breaks them down.
People who have moved, people who are dead, people who are no longer eligible.
And once you remove those, once you find those and remove those, I win.
That's not the same as saying go out and manufacture 11,000 votes.
So I think we won last time.
I think that this indictment, this tsunami of lawfare, is based on a false premise, both the January 6th indictments and the Georgia indictments.
So I think politically, Of the states you mentioned, Georgia, with an honest count, is the state that would probably, I put in our column first.
Pop it back up and then he would still need No, Nevada is problematic because I think it probably is the dirtiest state in the country.
I don't trust with Philadelphia, and that's basically the whole population center of the state.
Wisconsin, there's 10.
And then between Michigan, Nevada, and Arizona, which have any of those states shored up their elections enough where you would have a semblance of confidence?
No, Nevada is problematic because I think it probably is the dirtiest state in the country.
I mean, I think their election system is without any question the single most corrupt.
Wow, that's quite a statement.
You've already seen it the last couple of days.
I mean, there are people who didn't vote in the local primaries are going in to vote.
Oh, no, I'm sorry, sir.
You voted.
Pardon me?
You voted.
No, no, you voted two days ago.
You voted by mail.
People who haven't voted.
When I was there before the last election, speaking at a rally for the president, Man comes up and he has five ballots in his hands, and they're all addressed to different people, but all at his address.
And I said, what is this?
He said, well, I didn't know at first.
One of them is addressed to me, but the other four are people who rented my apartment before I did.
And they're still on the voter registration rolls.
He says one of these people rented the apartment 15 years ago, and they're still getting a mail-in ballot.
So in Nevada, every voter is mailed a ballot whether you ask for one or not.
This is Harry Reid's Nevada.
This is the Clark County machine.
So Trump essentially carried every county outside of Clark County, but they pile up a margin.
Now, is it coincidental That Adam Laxalt loses the Senate race by the exact same number of votes that Joe Lombardo wins the governorship because he's the Clark County Sheriff and he's the choice of the casino industry.
That's just an amazing coincidence.
It's the most corrupt state in the nation.
Wow.
And that's saying a lot.
Yeah, it is saying a lot.
But you made a good point.
Makes New Jersey look like Rebecca of Sunnybrook Farm.
Uh, I wish I knew enough literature to know what you're talking about.
Let me see those other states.
I'm not a heavy reader.
You know, New Jersey, you know, where Chris Christie's from.
Oh, no, that's bad.
My mom's from Tom's River.
It's corrupt.
That guy needs to run, not for president.
He just needs to run.
Coming out swinging.
All right, so that leaves us with Arizona and Michigan.
If Trump has to take one of those two, Because he does, right?
This is pretty accurate?
Yes.
It's going to come down to these five.
Have any made progress that you're happy with?
No, and that's the largest single problem.
So we've had three plus years.
The Republican National Committee raised $200 million for this exact purpose.
Why have we not changed the election laws in a single one of these states?
Well, you know the answer to that.
So why is that?
Because I think we, well, let's say this.
Ronna Romney McDaniel, as I always call her, she's a very historic figure.
She's the first person to chair the Republican National Committee, preside over a presidential loss, and keep the job.
Every other Republican national chairperson who lost a presidential election has been cashiered since 1861.
So in a way, she did her job, which is why she got to keep her job.
In a way.
So they spent no money going into these states, running a lobby operation in the states with Republican legislatures, pushing to switch the laws back to the way they were pre-COVID.
So, at this point, unfortunately, I think we are locked to these rules.
Now, at least here in Pennsylvania, there was a serious effort to outlaw the mail-in ballots.
It was very well thought through.
It was very well funded.
It was very well put together.
None of the money came from the Republican National Committee.
It was all raised privately.
But we were thwarted in a political decision in the courts.
But at least we tried.
They've tried in Wisconsin.
They've got rid of drop boxes.
They've had some minor reforms there that I think are going to be meaningful.
Arizona is just a mess.
It's not like the evidence of the theft of the last gubernatorial is questionable.
It's overwhelming.
It is rock solid.
There is no question because the tabulator takes a paper ballot that is 19 inches long and it was tested in Maricopa County the night before the election with 19 inch long paper ballots and then on the day of the election 20 inch paper ballots were sent to the more Republican precincts and the machine is always going to reject them.
Multiple times.
And then it's, oh, well, just throw your ballot over there in that bushel basket, and we'll count it later.
So the evidence of theft is overwhelming.
It's indisputable.
I thought Carrie Lake's lawyers did an excellent job considering the judge tried to say, OK, you have 15 minutes.
Go.
Right.
They did as good a job as you could possibly do.
There is no judge in the state with the courage To do what happened in the 20s where they hadn't this exact thing happened and they overturned a gubernatorial election because of fraud.
There's no judge in the state who's willing to do that.
It's really extraordinary, but it's why she's running for the Senate and I do think That the state is trending our way.
It's also trending our way because of the policies of both the governor and Joe Biden.
That's their biggest single problem is it's much tougher to pull off a fraud in the face of the failure of all their policies.
We're making truly historic gains among Hispanics, among African-Americans, among younger voters, among Asian voters.
Numbers that, as a Republican, I've never seen before.
There's a poll today in New York State, New York State of all places, that shows Donald Trump with 25% of the African-American vote.
Which is enormous.
That'd be up, in New York, that'd be up from what, 6% last time?
Eight?
Eight, maybe.
Yeah, that's amazing.
Gains are what bring us victory.
If you go back and look at it another way, the reason Trump won in 2016 is because in Philadelphia and Detroit and Milwaukee and Phoenix, He gets about 2% more of the black vote than Mitt Romney, but that's enough.
When you only carry Michigan by 26,000 votes, then that incremental gain in the cities is what puts him over.
And I think one of the great failures of his reelection campaign was spending no money on urban radio, not talking about the First Step Act, the Second Chance Act, the criminal justice reform.
I mean, I'm sorry.
When the law written by Joe Biden, signed by Bill Clinton, says that the mandatory penalties for possession of rock cocaine is more stringent than for powdered cocaine, that is racist.
Yeah, that's going after the brain.
That's racist.
And I think people with no previous criminal record who were prosecuted for...
for possession of small amounts of drugs for personal use.
They belong in drug treatment programs, not incarcerated.
Not the first time.
Now, if it's a recidivist, if it's twice, that's a different story.
But these racist policies were given to us by Biden and Clinton.
Donald Trump is the first president to do something about it, to reform them.
Yet you have all these members of the House Black Caucus who've been championing these things.
They vote against it only because it was proposed by Donald Trump.
If you had to put a percentage chance, if you were a bookmaker, that Trump takes the election at this point, obviously a lot's going to change between now and November with the rigging and everything.
Let me throw this in.
I have, I don't know if you share my sentiment, a little hope.
Number one, you have X that's free now, Twitter, where they can't suppress everything like they did last time.
Then second, people were very stupid in 2020.
They said there's a water pipe that broke, everybody clears out.
I don't know that they're going to do that this time.
I think that's a very good observation.
Look, the Trump people, the Republicans, have to be much, much better prepared.
There was no preparation, in all honesty.
I mean, I was awaiting trial, so I wasn't involved in any of this.
I think that was a big part of why I was charged.
To get you out of the picture?
Absolutely.
Because you have good advice.
Well, I've known Donald Trump for 45 years.
I saw that.
It wasn't even well before he was in politics.
You were helping with his first casino in Atlantic City?
Correct.
I met him in 1979.
Which was a beautiful building.
I met him in 1979.
I was sent to New York to work for Governor Ronald Reagan's campaign.
I was in charge of New York, New Jersey, and Connecticut, which the Bushes thought they owned.
We skunked them We took every delegate in New York, every delegate in New Jersey, and we split their home state of Connecticut.
They got 16 delegates, we got 15.
This is why Barbara Bush hated my guts.
But she was bombed by 10 a.m.
every morning on screwdrivers anyway, so... She did a great job doing cover model work for the Quaker Oats Gang.
Very good.
I like that.
In any event, I went to... I was given this card box, like a recipe box, index cards, by Mike Deaver, who worked for the Reagans.
And he said, these are the Reagans' friends in New York.
Surely you can find somebody here who can help us.
So I went through the box and they were all theatrical in nature.
They were all entertainment oriented from his movie star days.
And there was a card there for Roy M. Cohn Esquire, the famous lawyer, fixer lawyer.
And I of course knew who he was.
He'd been counsel to the McCarthy Committee.
He was quite a character.
Yeah.
And he was a great anti-communist.
So I wangled an appointment with him.
And he said, oh, I love Ronnie and Nancy.
How can I help you?
What do you need?
I said, well, I need office space.
I need telephones.
I need some union contacts.
I need some people from my finance committee.
I need a lot.
You know, the establishment here is they're either all for George Bush or John Connolly.
And he said, you know Donald Trump?
I said, well, I know who he is.
You need Donald Trump.
He's perfect for this.
He doesn't like Jimmy Carter.
You know what?
You should go see his father, Fred, first.
Fred's a great conservative.
You'll love Fred.
And if Fred buys in, you'll get Donald.
I said, well, I don't know either one of them.
He says, I'll set you up.
So I went out to Queens the next day.
I saw Fred Trump, who's a very unassuming, very nice guy, kind of low-key, not flamboyant at all.
And I'm looking at the wall, and there's, like, pictures of Adlai Stevenson and all these Democrats.
I'm like, am I in the wrong place?
Maybe I'm in the wrong place.
He says, uh, so how can I help you?
So I'm working for Governor Ronald Reagan.
Oh, I love him.
Pulls out from his drawer, he's got a letter from Billy Graham.
He's got a letter from Robert Welch of the John Birch Society.
He's got a letter from Barry Goldwater.
He'd given each one of them $100,000, which in the 60s is a lot of money.
That's a lot of money.
And he said, look, locally, my politics is Democratic because I need zoning permits and building permits and so on.
But nationally, I'm a Republican and I'm a conservative Republican.
So what do you need?
I said, I need $100,000.
I need $100,000.
I need you to raise $100,000.
And I need your son to raise $100,000.
He said, "Have you seen my son yet?" I said, "No, Roy said I should see you first." He said, "Okay, make an appointment to see my son tomorrow, by the time you see him, I will talk to him.
I'm in, I think he'll be in." So the next day I went to see Donald Trump.
And his assistant, Norma Federer, who's passed, great woman, later became a great friend of mine, said, "You're only gonna have 15 minutes.
So if that.
He's very, very busy today.
So Mr. Stone, I advise you to state your business, get in and get out.
I said, OK.
So I went in and I said, Mr. Trump, it's a great honor to meet you.
He said, please call me Donald.
Very nice.
And I pitched him.
And he said, well, I kind of wondered when you were going to show up.
I said, pardon me?
Well, they've all been to see me.
George Bush, Howard Baker, John Connolly, Phil Crane, John Anderson, they've all been here.
Jimmy Carter's been here.
I wondered when you were going to show up.
I said, well, what did you think of him?
Howard Baker, boy, that guy really is short.
Is he, huh?
George Bush, he said, the guy has a handshake like a fish.
Speaking of handshakes, after I shook John Connolly's hand, I had to count my fingers.
He says, I wasn't impressed with any of them.
So he asked me a lot of, and we were together for about two hours, and he asked me tough questions.
What about California?
What about the Iowa caucuses?
What about New Hampshire?
Can you win Texas?
Can you win Florida?
And he knew the electoral map.
He knew the numbers without my prompting him.
So he knew a lot more about this than anyone ever thought.
He was a great sports enthusiast.
He still is.
But he also, he had thought this through.
He finally said, your man's going to win.
I said, you really think so?
He said, yes.
You know why?
I said, why?
He said, because he has the look.
We live in the television age.
He has a look.
And then he said, I have the look, but I'm not interested in being president.
Interesting.
So he and his father both joined our committee.
They both raised their $100,000, which in those days you had to do in $1,000 checks.
It was a lot of work.
Yeah.
A lot of work.
But then he was like a man who had made an investment.
And we didn't have cell phones in those days, so I would come into the office in the morning, our headquarters on 52nd Street, they'd say, Donald Trump called this morning, I want you to call him back.
And he was like, how we doing?
How's New Hampshire looking?
How's Iowa looking?
What about this?
What about that?
I read that Carter screwed this up today.
He was very, very involved.
He was very aware.
He loved politics, like he loved sports.
And when Reagan announced his candidacy at the Waldorf Astoria, Trump was at his table.
So the people in 2016 say he's not a conservative.
They don't know him.
They don't know him like I do.
Right.
That's great.
I want to ask you a couple things that were brought up while we were talking.
Number one is the border, which is on everybody's mind, I'm sure.
Am I overstating it?
I did some thinking on it today.
You know, you catch terrorists from Yemen or Somalia coming through the border.
You can't get to America from Somalia.
You can't get to Mexico from Somalia.
So you have to go on a tanker ship.
And have the cartels reached the point that they're basically pipelining our jihadist enemies into the country?
And second, You can't tell me our government that has all of our phone calls and text messages recorded has no clue where these people from these terrorist cells are coming from.
Do you have high-level people in the U.S.
government that so want to see the Judeo-Christian America as we know it wiped out that they're facilitating terrorism or is that overstating it?
No, I think you're right on the money.
So this isn't an accident or a mistake.
These people are not naive or just, you know, well-meaning, but misguided.
They know exactly what they're doing here.
I've had several people on my own show.
I had Christy Hutcherson from Women Fighting for America, who spent a lot of time on the border, also a lot of time in South and Central America.
We are bringing in weapons.
We're bringing in military age, Middle Eastern and Chinese single men in record numbers.
They're coming in through Panama, and then they move them into the country from there.
They move them to the border from there.
Laura Loomer has done some amazing reporting just in the last couple days.
Talked her on the way here.
When she jumped on that bus and got thrown off.
Just amazing reporting.
So it's an invasion.
It's willful.
There's no mistake here.
Carrie Lake told me there's 419 gates on the border between Arizona and Mexico that are welded open.
And they say, well, because we have a very rare species of antelope that needs to go back and forth.
This is not a mistake.
This is the plan.
It is to flood the country with illegals for multiple purposes.
I think ultimately to make them all citizens so they can vote.
But in the short term, I think we're looking at some kind of I don't think that's a question of if.
American soil because, you know, everybody rallies to the president at the time that the country is under attack.
So I don't think that's a question of if.
Sadly, I think it's a question of when.
The President: That's -- you know, I like being sarcastic because I know you do just gloss -- That's pretty chilling.
And like that call that Kerry Lake got from the former head of the Republican Party in Arizona, now where he said, as you know, the cartel's in all 50 states and I got a call from the guys back east to please pause your campaign.
You know, that's chilling.
That if the cartels are that embedded in the U.S.
politics, Where people, even if it's not to bring the country down, if they just want a piece of the human trafficking money that's billions of dollars.
You know, it may be at the point where our government isn't controlling the border anymore, even if they wanted to, correct?
They clearly aren't, although this idea that you need new laws or even new funding is absolutely false.
All you have to do is enforce the laws that are already on the books.
Absolutely.
It's a question of giving the order.
And bring back the stay in Mexico policy.
of Trump that was canceled by Biden as soon as he became president.
This is a it's a controllable problem for two for two reasons.
One, you can definitively seal the border.
You have to have the will to do it.
And if Dwight Eisenhower could deport 1.3 million people, then you could deport these people.
It can be done.
It's a matter of will.
We have the we have the means.
We need to have the will.
If you had your pick top three, Vice President Joe Canis, you'd be happy to see Trump name.
Ooh, that's very tough.
If you can't come up with three twos, fine.
Well, let me let me set the table first.
So, by the way, interesting tweet about Ron DeSantis yesterday.
I think you were the first one.
I don't think anybody knew that till you put it on Twitter.
Yes.
So the 12th Amendment of the Constitution and the rules of the Electoral College say that you cannot have a candidate for president and vice president from the same state.
Actually, you can.
But you forfeit the electoral votes.
Of Florida, which you can't do.
Which we cannot do.
So that leaves out Byron Donalds, who's a very good man.
You couldn't have General Michael Flynn, for example, because he's also a Floridian.
And you certainly couldn't have, nor would you want, Ron DeSantis.
Because if you had Ron DeSantis, well then Trump would need a food taster.
Yeah, that's right.
Little traitors.
So then who's three you'd like?
So let's go to your criteria.
So first of all, you need a person who has the qualifications, the experience, the judgment and the temperament to actually be president.
That's the first criteria.
Secondarily, the days of balancing the ticket, those days are over.
You need someone who is fully committed to the America First agenda, so in the event that, God forbid, Trump for whatever reason cannot fulfill the term, is going to stick to the plan, the basic plan of putting America First.
Obviously, that eliminates Nikki Haley.
Yes.
Eliminates her.
Not that she's under consideration, because I don't think she is, but this idea that you need to bind up the party, if that's what she's hanging around for, she's wasting her time, in my opinion.
So, then secondarily, only after reaching those qualifications do you start to look at the political considerations.
You need someone Who doesn't disturb the people in your base but allows you to get some new votes you're not already getting.
That's very tough.
Nixon once said to me, when you choose a candidate for Vice President, don't look for someone who can help you.
There is no one who can help you.
Look for someone who doesn't hurt you.
That may be a little cynical.
But you do want somebody, ideally, who could help you among those voter groups where you know you can make ground.
Hispanics, blacks, younger voters, and so on.
So the question you have to ask yourself is, who here, of the names that we've had mentioned, is that person?
And then I added another criteria, which is you need someone who is sure-footed.
Someone who's not going to make rookie mistakes their first two weeks out on the road.
Like who?
Like who made rookie mistakes in the past?
Spiro Tiagno, for example.
Made multiple errors the first week out.
And got roasted for it.
Perfect example.
Henry Cabot Lodge.
Henry Cabot Lodge was a senator from Massachusetts, was the UN ambassador under Eisenhower, was the scion of a great political dynasty in Massachusetts.
Nixon was running for president in 1960.
On the advice of Dwight Eisenhower, he picked Lodge.
Nixon was in California.
Lodge had a press conference and he said, in a Nixon-Lodge administration, we're going to have a Negro, which is what African-Americans were called then in the cabinet.
Well, this was news to Nixon.
It was on the West Coast.
Nixon put out an immediate statement saying, no, nobody will be hired on the basis of the color of their skin.
People will be hired from my administration on the basis of their qualifications and no other criteria.
Perfect example.
It became a huge two-day media conflagration.
So by that criteria, Ben Carson has run for president before.
Tulsi Gabbard has run for president before.
Neither one of them would make a rookie mistake.
They know the fake news media jackals are out there trying to find some way to trick you or to goad you into a mistake.
So I think sure-footedness is also a key.
On the other hand, I love Ben Carson.
He's a great man.
But I don't know what vote you get that you don't already have with Jim Carson.
I think the answer is... I can't identify one.
So, look, I'm a wildcatter and I will take a beating for this, but I kind of like the idea of Tulsi Gabbard and I'll tell you why.
First of all, she's a lieutenant colonel in the U.S.
Army Reserve.
She's an Iraq War veteran.
She was a Democrat.
She's now an independent.
She's clearly against the war machine, right?
She has become pro-life, but four or five years ago, so it's not a new position.
She's moved our way on every important issue.
She was a Democrat.
I think she appeals to millennials.
She's a championship surfer.
She's very attractive, but she's not so attractive that women voters hate her.
Yeah, which is a thing.
It's a thing.
It's just sadly a thing.
I mean, she's very attractive, but when you're drop-dead gorgeous, women immediately despise you.
Right.
So, I like the idea.
Now, people say, well, she was a Democrat.
You know what?
Ronald Reagan was a Democrat.
He was a very liberal Democrat.
People change over time.
If you get new information and you don't change, then there's something wrong with you.
Right.
I'm very impressed with her.
I think that that would allow you to reach out to some new voters without really upsetting the base.
But I don't know anybody who bolts on that basis.
Yeah, and what does the base know anyway?
If you let the base pick, that's how we got Mitt Romney and one loser after another.
Trump wasn't the pick of the base.
He was who the base, as far as the political base, despised.
And that's how we got a win.
The base, the Republican, I'm talking the like, operatives, pick losers, huh?
Well, except for, I guess, this is, here's where I make the distinction, which is, it's a mistake To view things through the prism of Republicans versus Democrats.
Now, look, I have a long sentimental attachment to the Republican Party of Lincoln and Eisenhower.
Obviously, Reagan, Nixon and Trump.
But I also figured out that this is really an act.
I mean, there's really only one party.
It's a uniparty.
It's the permanent party.
That's true, huh, when people say that?
It's completely true at the leadership level.
Donald Trump has changed that at the grassroots.
So this is now, it's a new Republican Party.
It's the party of the middle class.
It's the party of working people.
It is the party of America First.
If you don't believe me, let's have a primary.
That's why he's wiping up in the primaries.
And it's also why America First candidates are winning primaries at all levels.
So the party at the grassroots level has changed.
The leadership of the party, most of whom actually live in Washington, because once they go there, they really never come back.
They really never do.
The leadership of the party is locked into the status quo.
They're worried about fundraising, they're worried about keeping the defense contractors happy and so on.
But the party, you shouldn't view things in view of parties.
This is really a contest between outsiders and insiders.
It's bigger than that because it's also, in truth, And this is the most important thing.
It's also between dark and light.
It's between good and evil.
It's between the godly and the godless.
It's that stark a difference.
There was a day that the Democratic Party believed in capitalism.
The Democratic Party believed in strong national defense.
The Democratic Party was anti-communist.
Both our parties We're basically patriotic.
Democrats thought we should spend a little more and we should tax a little more.
Republicans, at least theoretically, thought we should spend less and tax less.
But the party of John Kennedy, the party of Harry Truman, that Democratic Party no longer exists.
It's gone.
It's been taken over by radical Marxists.
And if you recognize that, then you realize that when I speak of the base, I'm talking about Those conservative Republicans joined by blue-collar Democrats and independents, all of whom see things through the prism of, does it benefit America?
Does it put America first?
So when I speak to the base, I'm not speaking of the Republican base so much as I'm speaking of the Trump base, which is much larger and broader than the Republican Party.
And you have to pick a running mate that holds everybody in place there, but also allows you to reach out and get somebody else.
Well said.
You mentioned good versus evil and darkness versus light.
You, I believe, were the first guest I ever had on when I did this program before the lockdowns.
And we were talking about other things.
And all of a sudden, you went into how you had an encounter with Jesus Christ.
And it wasn't some celebrity testimony.
You talked about repenting and how Jesus changed your life.
So since then, I think the last time I spoke with you in person was five years ago.
What have...
Tell me something out of the Bible that strengthened you during all that you went through the last three years.
I'm glad you brought that up. - So this Bible belonged to Kim Clement.
This was his Bible.
You can see his, those are his, those are his highlights.
Yes.
Those are his notations.
And I use this every day now, which I, if you told me 15 years ago I was going to do that, I would tell you you're out of your mind.
Deuteronomy 31.6.
Be strong and of good courage.
Do not fear nor be afraid of them.
For the Lord your God, he is the one who goes with you, and he will not leave you nor forsake you.
I read that every morning and I read that every night.
I mean, I have been the target, as you know, not because I did anything wrong, but because I'm a 45-year friend of Donald Trump.
So essentially, when Robert Mueller and his thugs, who had unlimited legal power and unlimited budget, unlimited manpower, couldn't find any evidence of Russian collusion, they decided to manufacture it.
Which is why on January 25th, 2019, at 6 o'clock in the morning, 29 fully SWAT-clad FBI agents wearing the full SWAT gear and brandishing fully automatic M4 assault weapons stormed my home to arrest 29 fully SWAT-clad FBI agents wearing the full SWAT gear and brandishing fully automatic M4 assault weapons stormed my home to arrest me for the completely fabricated crime of lying under oath in my voluntary testimony before the House Intelligence
It wasn't that I made misstatements, because I did make some minor misstatements, but none of them...
We're material, meaning none of them hid any underlying crime.
There was no Russian collusion to lie about.
There was no WikiLeaks collaboration to lie about.
So they manufactured these crimes for the purpose of then coming back in July and pressuring me to testify falsely against Donald Trump.
They wanted me to bear false witness against him.
That's what this was all about.
And they basically said, you know, they said to my lawyers, your client's going to die in jail unless he cooperates and says what we want him to say.
We have this list of 26 cell phone calls between him and Donald Trump in 2016.
All he's got to do is say these pertain to Russia, WikiLeaks, and so on.
I refuse to do that.
And I was so naive.
Pastor, I thought I was going to get a fair trial.
See, I thought this was America and I'd have a chance to defend myself.
I had no idea that I was going to be led to a Soviet-style show trial in which the judge not only would gag me so I couldn't defend myself publicly, but that she would disallow every possible legal defense.
So my prosecution is based on the premise that the Russians hacked the DNC And an online hack stole these emails that somehow made their way to me, and I gave them to Donald Trump, which is entirely false.
There's no evidence.
The government produced no evidence to that effect, but I could have proved with forensic evidence and expert testimony that there was no online hack.
The judge would not allow that.
The FBI admitted that they never examined the computer servers at the DNC.
So the time came when I realized that I was about to be lynched.
Gagged first, and then lynched.
And I got to be very depressed, and very angry, and very frustrated.
I can't imagine.
Very despondent.
Very concerned about my wife, who's hard of hearing, and I had no idea how she would be, how she would support herself, where she would live, how she would eat.
I mean, I have grandchildren, but, you know, they're struggling financially.
So, I was drinking too much.
I was very angry.
Because I'm pretty articulate.
If I was allowed to defend myself, I think I could have done so.
And I did pretty well until I was gagged.
Gagged the way Donald Trump is gagged right now in D.C.
And then a young pastor named Randy Coggins.
Yes.
Who I had met in North Florida at a book signing several years previously.
He kept in touch with me.
And he just, he stayed on me.
He said, you know, you, I know what you're going through.
But you need to turn your burden over to Jesus Christ.
You need to confess your sins and get right with God.
And he sent me a Bible, and I was reading the Proverbs and the Psalms, but I'm going to tell you the truth, I wasn't feeling it.
I couldn't sit through a movie.
It was eating me inside.
And then he called and said, Franklin Graham's going to be in Boca Raton.
Randy's dad was a pastor and his grandfather was a pastor and they had a very close association with the Grahams.
And I had met Billy Graham when I worked for Richard Nixon.
I still have a signed Bible that he signed for me.
I once picked him up at the Key Biscayne Hilton Hotel in a golf cart and brought him over to Nixon's home in Key Biscayne.
He was one of the greatest men of the 20th century.
First time I saw him, I was 12 years old.
My grandmother worked as a domestic in the home of these very wealthy people in Darien, Connecticut, and the woman who was a cook in this household was an avid follower of Billy Graham's crusade.
So she asked my parents if I could go to the crusade with her.
I remember it like it was yesterday.
August in Connecticut in a tent, it was so hot, and Billy Graham came out and every hair was in place, he was bronzed, he was like a god, and by the end of his speech he was completely soaked through his shirt, the hair was hanging in his face, and he had the crowd In the palm of his hand.
It was one of my earliest memories as a kid.
So I, of course, said, I'd love to meet Franklin Graham.
He was very gracious.
I went to Boca Raton.
He gave me 20 minutes in his tour bus.
And he says, so what's on your mind?
I said, well, you know, I think I'm about to be lynched and sent to prison to die there.
I'm 68 years old at that time.
I have a lifetime history of asthma.
I don't think I can survive this.
But I'm not going to get a fair trial.
I'm not even going to be allowed to defend myself.
So I thought, you know, Reverend Graham, you know the president, who I'm no longer allowed to talk to.
His lawyers won't let me talk to him.
My lawyers won't let me talk to him.
His lawyers won't let him talk to me.
Maybe you could put in a good word for me.
He said, well, I'll see what I can do.
But let me give you a better piece of advice.
You need to turn this burden over to Jesus Christ.
You need to confess your sins.
You need to get right with the Lord.
I've known other men in your position, and I'm telling you, if you will do that, and if you'll do it in all sincerity, if you'll change your life, and dedicate your life to Christ, and ask Christ to come into your life, He will not only lift you up, but He will save you from those who are persecuting you.
Wow.
And, you know, I'm a pretty hard-boiled guy, so I said, well, I'll think about that.
So then we went immediately to this big open field where he had his revival.
It was amazing.
There were six, seven hundred people there.
Could have been a Trump rally.
A lot of Make America Great hats.
Oh yeah, of course.
A lot of people recognized me.
He had some folding chairs for us in the front.
And you know, he has his own style.
He's not his father, but he's a very effective orator in his own right.
Absolutely.
Very effective.
I don't care if your problem is alcohol addiction, or gambling addiction, or drug addictions, or health problems, or financial problems, or relationship problems, no matter what your problem is, The answer is Jesus Christ.
The answer is to confess your sins.
The answer is to walk with the Lord.
And those who want to live forever with our Heavenly Father, stand up with me now and confess your sins.
And in that moment, Pastor, It was the most natural thing in the world.
I stood up in this field with 200 other Christians, and I changed my life.
I turned my life over to Christ.
And the following Monday, we learned that the forewoman in my jury, who claimed during jury selection and the trial that she had no idea who I was, she never heard of me, had been attacking me on Twitter and Facebook and had it on a private setting the entire time.
So, I've experienced miracles in my own life.
I've seen miracles in my own life.
And it was as if, in that moment, like cement blocks are being removed from your shoulders.
I left there, I went there epically depressed.
Almost suicidal, my wife would tell you.
And I left there knowing that it would all work out.
That is awesome.
What a great testimony.
And when I got home, my wife noticed this change.
She said, what happened to you?
And I explained everything.
And I said, you know, this is actually all going to work out.
And it worked exactly that way.
So I began praying.
I became more serious about the Bible.
And I tried to learn more about it.
I mean, I know a lot about politics, but I had never really seriously taken my faith As seriously as I should.
I was baptized as a Catholic.
I went to Sunday school and all that, but when I lived in Washington, I was a very successful lobbyist for a period of time.
Everything they've told you about Washington is true.
Everything.
The sex, the drugs, the booze, the whole thing.
I left all that behind.
I changed my life dramatically.
What still aggravates me to this day Are these liberal elitists who mock you for it?
Who think it's some kind of joke or it's a pose or a head fake.
That's Roger Stone.
Another dirty trick.
He's just trying to get sympathy.
You know, I've thought about it.
The hardest thing being half Sicilian is forgiving those who trespassed against you, actually praying for those who tried to destroy you.
That's really hard.
That's difficult.
But I work at it every day.
But at the end of the day, I really don't care what they think.
I only care what he thinks.
What a great testimony.
Well, I'm going to, not to put you to work, but for the people that are watching, like you did the first time I had you on, that are in your boat.
They've done well in life, but I remember what you said the first time I interviewed you.
I said, what would you say to somebody that's successful in life and doesn't feel like they need God?
You said, well eventually, you will.
And so, somebody that's watching that's in that case right now, where their business is going south, or just carrying the weight of running a business or a family, they feel like you felt.
Would you mind saying a word to them and then praying for them?
Sure.
Let me make one other point, because I think it leads to this.
It's not that I've had one miracle in my life.
I've had miracle after miracle after miracle.
So, miracle one, after I was unjustly convicted, I prayed fervently that Donald Trump would see that I was being politically targeted and I hadn't done anything wrong.
As you know, he commuted my sentence 48 hours before I was to be remanded to a dank Georgia prison.
The Bureau of Prisons was insisting there were no COVID cases at this prison, but the African-American woman who was the head of the prison guards union read that in the newspaper, contacted one of my lawyers and said, that's a lie.
There are 200 cases here that are being suppressed.
Which if you have asthma is one of the worst.
That would have been it for me.
Yeah.
So, so, and then the following Christmas, I got a full and unconditional pardon.
There's miracle number one.
Shortly after I was pardoned, my wife was diagnosed with very aggressive stage 4 cancer.
The doctors said, look, this doesn't look good.
There's really not much that can be done.
And together, we started to really study everything we could learn about cancer.
She chose her own course of treatment, which was a mix of traditional medicine, Western medicine, but also a lot of alternative therapies.
And I can tell you, As of today, because her checkup was this morning, she's now two and a half years cancer-free.
And that's a miracle.
That's a miracle.
Now, you won't read this in the Washington Post, but the morning of January 6th, I was in the shower getting dressed in the hotel.
And the Lord came to me and said, don't leave the hotel today.
And I didn't.
You were in DC?
In DC.
I spoke at a legally permitted rally the night before.
It's very interesting because I used the same words.
I said, what we have here is not a struggle between Republicans and Democrats or liberals and conservatives, but an epic struggle between dark and light, good and evil.
The Godly and the Godless.
CNN said they're stoned advocating violence.
There's nothing violent about that.
I have an apocalyptic view of the situation we're in.
It's actually anti-Christian to say that that was an advocacy of violence.
So I believe that never leaving the hotel wasn't involved in the efforts to delay the Electoral College.
If there was a war room in the Willard Hotel, I was never in it, and I don't know about it, even though I keep seeing in CNN the contrary.
So I consider that a miracle as well.
I was kept out of harm's way yet another time.
Then I was in Memphis the day after the election, on my way to Mike Lindell's TV studio, And a driver hits our car broadside at 55 miles per hour.
The car is entirely totaled.
The two security guys with me have minor injuries.
I walk away without a scratch.
That is awesome.
That's a miracle.
That's a miracle.
So the bottom line of this is Jesus Christ can do anything.
It doesn't matter how hopeless you think your situation is.
It doesn't matter how dark things look at this moment.
You asked me about the election.
Here's something you don't usually hear from political strategists.
What's the most effective strategy?
I'll tell you what it is.
Divine intervention.
How are we going to carry these states?
We're going to pray for victory.
We're going to pray for victory.
Kim Clements said in his famous prophecy that We were elected president who was not a religious man, but a man who prays.
That's the perfect definition of Donald Trump.
It's the perfect definition.
About two months ago, I was mocked for this too, I'm gonna say it again, I don't really care.
It was a Sunday morning.
Now, I go to Coral Ridge Presbyterian Church.
Oh, yeah.
Which is a great church.
The James Kennedy's old place.
It's a great church.
We have a very dynamic young pastor, Rob Pacinzia, who, like me, was baptized as a Catholic.
He's very dynamic.
He's very young.
He gets the big picture of globalism and the evil that we're fighting.
Right.
He totally gets it.
And Billy Graham dedicated the church.
It's a great church.
I was going to the Catholic Church, but you know, I didn't feel very welcome.
I actually had a woman come up to me and say, what are you doing here?
Really?
Yeah.
I said, lady, it's a church.
I mean, yeah, it's a, it was, it's just, it's too woke.
So I got tired of hearing sermons about why I should be vaccinated, but never hearing any sermons about the right to life.
Now, I think in all honesty, if you're baptized as a Catholic, you're probably a Catholic.
I don't think it really matters.
Here's what matters.
Do you believe in the birth, death, and resurrection of Jesus Christ?
If you do, then you are my brother or my sister.
Absolutely.
I don't care if you're a Lutheran or a Methodist or a Presbyterian or a Catholic.
That's what matters.
That's what holds us together.
So I really think That when Trump called me on a Sunday morning, I was on my way to church.
I was walking out the door and I've got a time, you know, so I know what time I have to get there to get a parking place and get to the pew just before the service.
And he called and I, he said, uh, can you talk for a minute?
And I said, I'm on my way to church.
He said, you're going to church right now?
He said, yeah.
He said, uh, uh, right this second.
And I said, yeah.
He said, do you want to pray together for a minute?
Now that's the Donald Trump I've never.
I remember I had a spiritual conversation with him.
He used to go to Norman Vincent Peale's church.
Yep, our positive thinking.
And he said, you go ahead, you lead.
And I did.
And then he said, call me later.
And I did.
Now, people say that never happened.
That happened.
That very definitely happened.
I think that his faith has been deepened by this entire experience.
Being targeted in this tsunami of lawfare.
I think has also hardened him, battle hardened him.
You would think that facing 600 years in jail, facing financial ruin, that he would be depressed or hysterical or, No.
No.
He's resolute.
His mood is great.
He's optimistic.
He's confident.
The stamina the guy has.
I was with him the day that he got indicted in Georgia.
You know, he played golf.
Then he said, I gotta fly down and get indicted.
I'll be back for dinner and came back.
You know, If I had to go through that at 43, I'd need to lay down.
And he was like life of the party coming back.
In his late 70s.
His energy level is really extraordinary.
But it's more than that.
It's his attitude.
Because he's a winner.
He's a winner.
And he knows that he wins this fight in the end.
He's extraordinarily confident.
So, to that person who's out there struggling right now, whatever your problem is, look what happened to me.
They were going to throw me in jail.
I was supposed to die there.
I'm here today through the grace of Jesus Christ.
I'm here because I was redeemed in the blood of the cross.
It's absolute proof that Jesus Christ can do anything.
So I urge that person to pray.
I will pray for you.
And it's really simple.
All I say every night is, Dear Lord, please come in my life.
Guide me.
Strengthen me.
Give me wisdom.
Give me patience.
Temper my temper.
Because I'm Italian.
And it has had this calming effect where I'm confident now that no matter what the problem is, it will work out.
They continue to attack me over ridiculous things.
An alleged four-year-old audio in which it is said that Stone threatened the lives of two Democratic congressmen.
I immediately take the audio.
I go out and I find the very best AI detection software programs in the country.
It's a fraud!
Yes.
MSNBC reports this without ever examining it.
CNN reports it without ever examining it.
So, look, there are a bunch of people who say if it's raining out, well, that must be Roger Stone.
It's his fault.
Jesus Christ can do anything, so that person needs to have absolute faith.
Here's the thing.
Fear can consume you.
Fear can only be replaced with one thing.
Faith.
If you have faith, then you have nothing to fear.
Excellent.
Well, if you're watching and you would like to receive Jesus Christ into your heart, I want to pray with you right now that whatever burdens you're carrying, just like God did with my new friend, Roger Stone, He's going to do for you because God's no respecter of persons.
What He does for one, He'll do for anybody.
And like Brother Roger said, if you have faith, God speaks that language.
If you believe in Him, that settles it for God.
Say this prayer with me out loud.
Heavenly Father, I admit that I've sinned.
I repent.
I believe in my heart.
You raised Jesus from the dead.
I confess with my mouth, Jesus is Lord and my Savior.
Right now, I receive forgiveness.
By the blood of Jesus, I am saved.
In Jesus' name, Amen.
Let me pray a second prayer for you.
Wherever you're watching, just lift your hands.
Father, the same way in that great exhortation, That Roger Stone told how there's nothing that's going wrong.
That you don't have the power to change in 24 hours.
I pray for people going through major trouble right now.
Maybe trouble others don't even know about.
I pray that right now in their home, in their car, that your power would come and destroy the thing that was sent to destroy them.
In Jesus' name.
Let people see that you're not an idea, that you're a living God who delivers those that call on your name.
And we thank you for it in advance by faith and give you the praise in Jesus' name.
Amen.
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