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Nov. 12, 2021 - Rubin Report - Dave Rubin
41:38
Can Courts Stop Biden? Lauren Chen, Allison Williams, Stu Burguiere | ROUNDTABLE | Rubin Report
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Main voices
a
allison williams
08:28
d
dave rubin
12:59
l
lauren chen
08:26
s
stu burguiere
09:53
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unidentified
[Outro]
dave rubin
Hello, Internet people!
I'm Dave Rubin, and it's time for another Friday Roundtable extravaganza.
Today, I'm joined by former ESPN reporter, now lady doing some stuff over at The Daily Wire, Alison Williams, the host of Stu Does America on Blaze TV, Stu Berger, and politics and culture commentator, Lauren Chen.
Welcome to the show, guys.
Thanks for having us.
Alison, I wanna start with you first, because I think it'll set up a bunch of the stuff we're gonna do related to COVID.
And I said on the show, I believe on Wednesday, that I don't wanna just do COVID stories anymore.
Like another crazy thing happened, another expert got something wrong, another mandate happened.
I wanna do stories of people that are fighting back, which is why I'm so glad that you're joining us today.
Can you tell people a little bit about why you are formerly an ESPN employee and now doing some stuff With the Daily Wire.
allison williams
Yeah, in a nutshell, I spent 10 years with ESPN and their parent company, Disney, came out with a vaccine mandate this summer and I did not comply.
So I refused to get the injection.
I don't feel I need it.
Had COVID.
I have natural immunity.
There's a plethora of reasons why I don't want to receive this injection.
So I did not.
And my request for an accommodation was denied.
So I was forced to separate, as they call it, from the company.
I was fortunate enough to be contacted shortly thereafter by Ben Shapiro and The Daily Wire, and they brought me on to do some special sports projects with them, which I'm super excited about.
So it's been a whirlwind of a few months, but I've definitely seen the direct impact of these mandates and how they can completely uproot your life and really force people into some difficult decisions, essentially between their livelihood and their freedoms.
That's no place any American should be.
dave rubin
Yeah, and I just love that you're standing up and fighting for what you believe in.
It's just, that's what it's all about.
Stu, you work over at The Blaze.
That's kind of like the scary Daily Wire.
Is Glenn not injecting you people with things every morning?
stu burguiere
He does inject us every day when we walk in.
With various substances he's found around his garage, which is a little disturbing.
Yeah, no, I'm so glad people are out there actually stepping up and taking much more risk than many people in the media are taking.
When you believe something, it's your choice.
We're talking about a situation that is serious and it's been a really crappy last couple of years, but that does not mean that the government gets to take over your life and make all of your decisions for you.
And we've forgotten that.
And if anyone in the world is going to defend a principle like that, it needs to be the United States.
Everybody else seems to fall down for anything their government says.
If it's not for people here stepping up, no one's going to.
dave rubin
Oh, you gave me a great segue there because Lauren is in crazy Canada.
And I say that with all due irony because I'm in crazy California.
But Lauren, you're basically independent.
You have people that work for you, I'm sure.
Do you not believe that you have the right to just force them to inject whatever you want in their bodies?
lauren chen
You know, what's funny is that it would never even cross my mind for me to assume that I have any type of authority, not just to mandate that they take a vaccine, but even to ask.
And that's something that You know, I do, I guess, contribute to different networks here and there.
I have had people ask me, oh, by the way, are you vaccinated?
Because, you know, such and such studio needs to know.
And it will never stop feeling like such an intrusive personal question.
You know, I have had to turn down opportunities because as an unclean second class citizen, I am simply not allowed.
into some of these venues and I cannot imagine being on the end that's actually doing that
to another person.
And I think conservatives, right wingers, we tend to be kind of like keep our head down,
go with the flow.
We don't want to be rule breakers by nature, I think, but things are coming to a point
where it's like if we don't, I guess, resist now, then we've pretty much just lost all
of our freedoms.
dave rubin
Yeah, well said.
So everybody knows, and the main story of the week is that Biden is basically trying to force companies with over a hundred people, over a hundred employees, to make sure that everyone is vaccinated.
The Daily Wire, Alison's new home, is one of the first companies suing against it.
The Biden administration says they're gonna ignore the courts.
I mean, it's pretty extraordinary.
I'm pretty sure if the orange man said that, we'd be in impeachment number seven right now, but we got some more info from the Hill here.
Under an order by the Occupational Safety and Health Administration, OSHA, private businesses and non-profits with more than 100 or more employees must coerce their unvaccinated employees to get vaccinated, undergo weekly testing, or lose their jobs.
Penalties can be $14,000 per violation, and they go up from there.
We've got a little more from The Daily Wire.
A U.S.
federal appeals court issued a stay on Saturday temporarily halting Democrat President Joe Biden's vaccine mandate that would have required companies with at least 100 employees to get vaccinated for the coronavirus or be tested weekly.
Lauren, as somebody that you care about sports, like that's obviously your first love.
Now you're in a political fight that's become a very personal fight.
Does this all just feel completely insane?
And what are some of your colleagues or ex-colleagues saying?
Because I'm guessing that there's a lot of others, like this isn't just you.
allison williams
I'm guessing you mean me, right?
You said Lauren, but... Oh, I'm sorry.
lauren chen
Yeah, well, he said he loves sports.
unidentified
I knew he wasn't talking to me.
allison williams
No, this is just complete insanity.
And the fact that we're even having this conversation in the United States of America blows my mind.
Imagine if I would have said two years ago, there's going to come a point where the federal government is going to require you to receive an injection that you don't want and probably don't need in order to maintain your employment.
You would have said no way.
We have a constitution.
We are a free people.
That would never happen in this country.
And yet, here we are.
I mean, it's really mind-blowing when you stop and step back and think about it.
Now, I am optimistic right now.
I think it was huge that the court issued that stay so quickly.
I think it says a lot that Daily Wire is one of several countries across the country that are fighting This mandate, states have joined in as well.
But it's just ludicrous.
And for OSHA to say that they have to do this to prevent, quote, grave danger.
Can we define grave danger?
I mean, you have a 1.6% chance of dying from this virus.
And I'm not trying to downplay the lives that have been lost by it.
But those are very, very slim numbers, and I would imagine even lower for people who are of working age.
So this is just completely unjustified.
It's a constitutional violation in every way, shape, and form.
It's such a blatant overreach I mean, I think even this administration knows that they don't have the legal authority to do what they're doing.
And I just caution the American people who think the vaccination is the way out of this and the mandates are the way to get there.
What are you willing to risk to achieve this?
Because as I said before, power given is seldom returned.
And you go down this road, where do you draw the line?
Where do you draw the line?
When the government can have the authority to tell you that you don't have bodily autonomy and what you have to do with your body, that's freaking scary to me.
I don't know about you guys.
And I honestly think when I talk to people as individuals, when I connect with them on an individual level, they understand this is wrong.
But it's when they get in this like groupthink or this corporate culture, they say, no, no, no, we have to do it.
But individually, they see that this is such a violation.
dave rubin
All right, now to the other Lauren.
I thought it was my body, my choice.
Wasn't that the feminist thing?
lauren chen
Yeah, well, it's funny.
It's my body, my choice, except when it comes to this vaccine, apparently.
And the reasoning I've heard for the difference is that, well, you know, your vaccination status actually affects someone else.
So it's like, I don't think you want to start bringing who else abortion affects into the argument.
You may not like where that is going.
But in any case, there's been like this almost huge 180 when it comes to people who traditionally say they are for workers' rights and things like that.
And now we see people who traditionally are pro-labor.
They are condemning workers who go on strike against these vaccine mandates.
They are supporting the idea that if you lose your job because you're not vaccinated,
you should not be able to claim unemployment benefits.
They are siding with big government.
They are siding with big pharma.
It's just very strange how there's almost this double speak.
They still believe that they are on the side of the little guy.
Meanwhile, they, they have the, their boots on the necks of so many different companies and states.
And it's great to see actually some pushback in the United States, because like in Canada, in Australia, aside from, I'm not saying every Canadian and every Australian has taken this rolling over, but by and large, uh, yeah, the populations do support this, but the populations are going along with this.
And it's been honestly a blow to my morale as a Canadian and as someone who has visited Australia
and wanted to go back at some point to see how these people by and large,
again, generalizing, are so quick to throw away for their freedom.
dave rubin
Right, so clearly, I mean, a whole bunch of people are just staying silent and staying scared,
but there are tons of videos also of people pushing back and there are rallies in Paris and even in Australia
some in Canada and elsewhere.
Stu, we never see any of that on the media, which maybe is even more specifically to Lauren's point.
It's like we all kind of feel like we're losing because the media doesn't even show us what's actually happening.
And there is some pushback.
stu burguiere
There is some pushback and I think people do recognize that this just feels wrong.
It feels off.
It doesn't feel very American and it's because we've come a long way.
I think conservatives have spent a lot of time talking about whether they might think the vaccines aren't as effective as have been reported or Talking about maybe COVID isn't as bad as others have said, and all that's really important stuff to cover.
But it boils down to this.
If the vaccine was 100% effective and COVID killed every single person who got it, you still shouldn't be able to do this.
You still shouldn't be able to mandate that people take it.
This is an individualist base of a society.
We are not a collectivist society.
And this is I think this will eventually be overturned in the courts. I
am hopeful on that front.
But first of all, you're going to have a bunch of businesses doing it anyway in preparation as
this goes forward. And there's a fundamental seed in our country that allows this sort of
nonsense to go on. You know, you look at OSHA and the standard that is set by OSHA.
I wrote this down so I'd remember it, but the quote that creates the idea that OSHA
can do this is, "If it is reasonably necessary or appropriate to provide safe or healthful
employment or places of employment." That could be anything.
It could be anything.
And the only thing that matters with that standard is who's in power.
If someone who likes the vaccine's in power one day, who knows?
We could have tomorrow, if someone becomes president and they think the cure to this is mask mandates or vitamin D or hydroxychloroquine or whatever else, they can have that same exact standard.
And there's so much of this in our administrative state that allows people to think they can get away with this crap, and it should be a focus on any party that actually cares about personal liberty, which the Republicans continually say they do, to do something about this.
dave rubin
Yeah, and to your point, the way they use language is so Orwellian, because the implication is that if you don't go along with them, that you're the unreasonable one.
And it's like, you're not gonna believe this, but a couple of weeks ago, my producer sitting right here, Michael, had the sniffles.
He had the sniffles.
And he said, Dave, should I come into work today?
I said, maybe don't come in today.
If you feel better, you can come in tomorrow.
And we all survived.
Everyone in this room is alive and healthy.
It's really crazy.
I didn't force them to get- Well, it could end at any time for you, Dave.
stu burguiere
It could end at any time.
You could fall over in the middle of the show.
dave rubin
Anything can happen.
I want to pull up a tweet because I triggered a lot of weirdos this morning, a lot of blue check people.
Can you pull this up?
This is what I said on Twitter this morning.
I didn't mean to, you know, get into a fight with people.
I said, I know a lot of people who regret getting the vaccine, don't know anyone who regrets not getting it.
That was just my personal feelings on this, that I personally know several people who have had adverse reactions.
I know two women that are having balance issues.
I have a good friend who's about my age who's really like had no energy for about three months.
I know a couple women because we're in the middle of surrogacy that their cycles are off like a bunch of stuff.
And I have a bunch of friends that are unvaxxed and nobody regrets it because they see that it's clearly not working.
Well, anyway, I got a million people saying that I want people to die and all the rest of it.
Is it possible that some people might be regretting some of the decisions and the way they were forced into this stuff?
Allison?
allison williams
The ones that are still thinking clearly, yes, it's entirely possible, but the ones that have been brainwashed to the point of being incapable of critically thinking and connecting the dots in their own life, no.
I mean, they have doubled, tripled down on this vaccine and the notion that it could cause any sort of harm to anyone is blasphemy at this point.
I mean, it's so, It's so mind-boggling, because I've been on that side with you, Dave.
Like, I got all the tweets when I had to go public with my decision.
And people blast me.
I mean, they wish death upon me and my child.
I mean, they're sick, and they're demented.
And I don't see anybody who's unvaccinated wishing death upon the vaccinated.
Like, no, we want this to work.
We hope it's the golden ticket you've been sold.
It just doesn't look like it is right now.
And the data's not lining up with these beliefs that this is, like, the cure-all and the only way forward.
If you want to use it as a tool in the fight, Great, but this is apparently a war we're in and there's multiple weapons at your disposal.
If I don't choose to use the vaccine, why is that a problem?
And if I acknowledge that for some people, there have been adverse reactions, which are well documented in the vaccine adverse reaction system.
I mean, there's over 17,000 deaths.
There's only over 2,500 miscarriages.
This is real.
We have to stop gaslighting these people.
And just because You're so far down in this rabbit hole and so convinced in this echo chamber you're living in that there's nothing wrong with this vaccine, doesn't mean you should be gaslighting people who are having problems with it.
dave rubin
Yeah, so Lauren, to that point, what do we do about the people?
Because I think there's a whole bunch of people that either regret their decision, As I was saying in the tweet, but they've gone in so deep at this point.
They've basically been like, oh no, vax, vax, vax.
And when they find out the efficacy isn't as good as it was supposed to be, they still say more vax, more boosters.
How do we help un-brainwash some of these people?
Is there a way or do we just have to kind of bid them adieu?
lauren chen
Well, I think in a perfect world, the way forward would be to highlight the cases where people do have adverse reactions.
And we've seen countries in Europe specifically highlight Adverse reactions specifically with people under 30 when it comes to the Moderna vaccine.
You know, there's a lot of speculation going on whether it makes sense to vaccinate especially young children who might be at greater risk of vaccine side effects than they would be of COVID.
We've had some researchers suggest that no, actually we should stop giving the vaccine to pregnant women until we can conduct more studies.
And the thing is, there is really no medical treatment that is 100% free of side effects or that is completely safe for everybody, not even peanuts are safe for everybody.
So for the especially mainstream media to be acting like this vaccine is this magic cure-all,
it just doesn't make sense. And I think it's honestly coercive and I would say just plain
immoral to try to shove this down people's throats without letting them know that, yeah,
you know, you might be fine.
Hopefully you are.
I don't wish bad side effects on anybody.
But there are some things you might want to consider.
You may want to weigh things and determine whether the risk is right for you.
But for saying things simply like that, people have been censored off social media.
Doctors are getting kicked out of their practices for having hesitancy.
So what we see is that this is not about science.
This is about ideology.
And, you know, we all accept that, you know, corporations can be corrupt, that the government can be corrupt, but for some reason now there's like this cult forming around doctors and the established approved medical narrative, and we should be concerned about that.
It's very concerning to not be able to question what people are forcing into your body.
dave rubin
Right, it's sort of hilarious.
It's like the most dystopian movie ever where the pharmaceutical companies are the ones who can't be questioned.
It's very weird.
The other piece of this is that the new thing is that, oh, none of us will be safe till everyone is safe.
So I want to throw to this video.
This is a Chicago public health commissioner basically saying that until everybody is vaccinated in schools, we probably won't open or you'll have to mask up or we'll wrap you in plastic.
Let's see.
unidentified
You know, do offer particular vulnerabilities.
If there are younger children still who have not had the opportunity to be vaccinated, that'll be something we'll be looking at.
My expectation is schools would probably be one of the last places, honestly, that we would not have masks in place.
But if we can get to a point where schools are 100% vaccinated, that would be the setting I would be particularly interested in.
dave rubin
All right, so to be clear, first off, it's 100% impossible that 100% will be vaccinated.
It's just not going to work.
lauren chen
Schools don't even have 100% literacy rates nowadays.
dave rubin
Right, their vaccine rates should be congruent with their literacy rate.
That would be pretty hilarious.
But not only that, but also I've read this stat 400,000 times.
The morbidity rate for children 5 to 11 is 0.002.
It's under 500 children and in many cases they had all sorts of other problems and everything else.
Stu, what do we do about this idea, though, that, you know, until everybody is vaccinated, now we're still gonna keep kids in masks?
I mean, I've seen my nieces and nephews in masks, you know, five-, six-year-olds.
This is not how children are supposed to grow up.
stu burguiere
Compliance is really the thing we should be chasing here.
You don't get that anywhere on anything, including all the childhood vaccines that are already in place with mandates in schools.
You don't have 100% compliance on those things.
You never will.
Every once in a while, I try to put myself in the mindset of the other side, right?
For me, I take care of my own health.
That's how I see the world, right?
It's my responsibility.
It's interesting that the other side of this sees themselves as unsafe unless everyone protects them.
And that's it.
Look, if you look at it that way, it's a scary world to be in, right?
But we have a situation where they want everyone else to be vaccinated.
They want everyone else to wear cloth masks that do basically nothing.
There is a solution here that's pretty clear to me, which is... Yeah, I got it.
No, I mean, this is serious.
dave rubin
Yeah.
stu burguiere
There is a solution where we have N95 masks.
Which do actually do something and have showed some actual difference when you test them, not only in labs, but in real world situations for various viruses around the world.
And the best part about that is you are protecting yourself.
You don't need everyone around you to wear an N95 mask.
You just need to wear one yourself.
And you notice the government never comes out and recommends people wear effective masks.
They just want everyone to wear masks that don't work, which doesn't make any sense.
You know, this is the United States of America.
We have to be able to sit here and say, we are responsible for our own health and understand that people are going to have different views.
If you look at, go down the cold aisle of your CVS, you're going to find all sorts of medications.
You're also going to find all sorts of herbal cures.
You're going to find all sorts of stuff.
Some of it you might think doesn't work.
Some of it, the person next to you will think that is going to work.
We are at a situation right now, right now, that 80% of all adults have already taken the vaccine.
None are considering it, have already taken it.
80%.
What on earth did they think was going to happen here?
You know, there has to be some level of understanding of who the American people are.
They're not people that are just going to bend over for every one of your mandates.
They are going to make their own decisions.
And if your product is as good as you say it is, let it speak for itself and people will choose it.
dave rubin
So last thought on this for everybody.
To me it seems at this point this has nothing to do with COVID the virus and hasn't probably for over a year that it has something to do with a much worse mind virus about humans desire to control other people and how quickly we all fold.
We all have ideas that will stand up to the machine and fight for what's right and say what we think but we see how quickly people Don't do that.
Alison, do you think that's like a fair assessment at this point that there's another problem that's not really COVID?
Like, cause we're not really talking about COVID this whole 20 minutes so far.
We're really talking about the other problem that COVID has unearthed.
allison williams
It's the psychological warfare that's going on right now.
I mean, to Stu's point, this is the conditioning that's been taking place for the last year and a half plus.
This notion that not only do not have to take responsibility for yourself and for your own health, But that you get to blame others if you get sick, that is insanity to me.
And this notion that children should be wearing masks to protect others, at what cost, right?
Because at some point you have to step back and say, what are the ramifications of this?
I mean, the American Academy of Pediatrics declared a mental health emergency for children in this country.
We are seriously harming our children with these protocols that we've put in place because of COVID-19.
So there's clearly some sort of compliance and control issue that's taking place, a conditioning that's taking place, especially towards our children.
I mean, we've talked about it time and time again.
The data doesn't back any of it up.
So what is this really about?
It's about compliance.
It's about control.
And I think the more we get into this pandemic, the more that becomes very apparent.
And how about the irony, guys, that this is this is somebody in Chicago, where more children
have died of gun violence this year than of COVID-19.
You have a threat to your children there.
And it's not the virus.
It's the violence.
dave rubin
Let's get the Chicago gun death numbers.
I do this almost as a joke at this point every week because it's so ridiculous that obviously the deaths are tragic, but you're completely right.
Nobody cares about that because unfortunately they don't like the racial makeup of who's shooting who in this case.
So we'll get the numbers on that in a sec.
Lauren, in the meantime, take it away.
lauren chen
Well, I think Alison is completely right.
This is not about COVID.
This is about control.
I mean, just look at so many different restrictions and mandates we've seen that made absolutely no sense if we actually care About the virus, the fact that you can take off your mask when you eat in a restaurant, but kids who are stuck in school at their own desk, they need to keep their masks on the entire day.
If we actually cared about transmission, we wouldn't be using vaccine passports because you can still transmit the virus when you have the vaccine.
We would probably be doing what a lot of places started doing early on in the pandemic, where you just take someone's temperature, because we know that the transmission rates, if you're asymptomatic, are so, so low, and obviously you can't spread COVID If you don't have it, this is all about control.
I mean, that's why you, you even see that online students who have no in-person classes are still being, I guess, kicked out of their universities for not being vaccinated, which makes absolutely no sense.
And, um, I think what this has revealed is that there is a shockingly large percent of the population who is happy to go along with whatever the government says.
They want to play hall monitor, a tattletale call the police on their neighbors for having gatherings when they're not supposed to.
And that is kind of like the main problem that I see right now.
Like, all right, what do we do when we live in a society where, you know, around half of the people don't want you to be able to make your own choices?
They want to make those choices for you.
What is the best way forward?
How can you like live peaceably together when the other side simply does not want to let you be?
allison williams
And Dave, can we call out the hypocrisy that's going on in this country real quick as someone that lives in the sports world?
Every weekend I watch 100,000 football fans pack into Michigan Stadium or into Tennessee.
And on Sunday, there's 60,000 shoulder to shoulder in football stadiums across the country.
And then these same people wake up on Monday and they send their kids to school in masks
and with plexiglass between.
I mean, the hypocrisy right now is just through the roof, and people can't even see it.
dave rubin
Yeah, all right, I wanna give you some numbers.
Let me give you some numbers on the Chicago situation real quick, and then, Stu, you'll bring us home on COVID, and then I wanna move on.
10 people were shot dead in Chicago last week, 42 wounded by gunfire.
Don't talk about that on CNN, very curious.
All right, Stu, give us a nice closing statement on COVID.
stu burguiere
Chicago, I was there for a baseball weekend.
I want to go to Wrigley.
I've never been before.
I did a baseball weekend this summer in Chicago.
Cubs were very bad.
But other than that, you have, as Allison pointed out, a stadium filled with people completely sold out.
In Lori Lightfoot's Chicago, you know, shoulder to shoulder.
But I think even worse than that, there's an outdoor venue.
We have no instances, right, of a super spreader event at an outdoor venue since the beginning of COVID.
But however, if you've ever been to Wrigley, the area Wrigleyville around there is basically nonstop bars that were built 75 years ago with no ventilation.
They're all indoors.
It's musty.
You know, everyone is packed in there.
I went upstairs to one of them and they had inaction, a dueling piano bar where everyone's doing singalongs indoors and like.
This goes back to what we talked about at the very beginning of this.
Even in a place like Chicago, an incredibly liberal city, people are just done with this.
We spent a ton of time talking about these restrictions and we have to fight hard against them to make them go away.
But really what makes them stop is when people just stop paying attention to them and go about their business.
And that is happening all over the country.
dave rubin
Yeah, well, you did bring us home in the right way, because that's what my message is at this point.
I'm gonna really try not to focus on just, okay, the stupid COVID information of the day.
It's like, go live your life.
All right, but let's switch for the remaining few minutes.
Obviously, the Kyle Rittenhouse trial has been this week, and it's been just a perfect example of the split in this country, that people watch the exact same thing and just see it in completely, completely different ways.
So there are two videos I wanna throw to here.
First off, half of the internet, half of Twitter, which maybe I should be spending less time on, have, no doubt about that.
Yes, half of Twitter was going crazy because the judge, his phone rang during the trial, and you're not gonna believe what his ringtone was.
Take a listen.
unidentified
I don't think that's necessarily what I'm supposed to do.
But I think the court has to make some findings as it relates to the bad faith on the part of the prosecution.
dave rubin
And if the court makes a finding that the actions that I had talked about were done in bad faith, then I think both elements If you didn't quite catch that, the judge's ringtone was God bless the USA, which I'm not even going to bother showing you the amount of blue check Twitter people who are saying that he's now a white supremacist.
This is the call of MAGA and Trump.
I mean, just absolute insanity.
Lauren, I know you've been paying a lot of attention to the trial.
So any direction you want to go here?
lauren chen
Well, so first off, this is not the only time that the judge has had his phone ring with that ringtone.
It happened several times today.
Just the jury has been dismissed for the weekend, but there's still a meeting between the defense
prosecutor and the judge.
This has happened several times just today.
This judge is more popular than me, I tell you, because his phone is just ringing off
the hook nonstop.
But it's very strange for the left.
Oftentimes, it's the right that is alleging that the left is not patriotic.
You don't actually love your country.
And we hear the left go like, no, no, no, that's not true.
Just patriotism is not just for the right.
And I agree that it should not be.
But then here, we see very clearly that when confronted with a song that is obviously patriotic,
God bless the USA, they are so quick to connect that to white supremacy, Donald Trump, MAGA,
political bias.
It's like, wait a second, I thought you guys were arguing that this type of thing was for
everybody.
Now, all of a sudden, because it suits you and you're trying to paint the judges biased,
you're saying it's this, I guess, dog whistle toward the far right, which is ridiculous.
He's also been called a racist because he referred to Asian delivery that the jury had
ordered as an Asian person. I don't understand how that is racist in any way, shape or form.
But I think they know the trial is not going the way that they want. So they are just looking at
anything they can pick apart to say this was biased, retrial, etc., etc.
dave rubin
Lauren, you're obviously a self-hating Asian because you're not offended enough, right?
Stu, what do you make of the trial, just generally speaking?
What do you think is happening here at this point?
stu burguiere
Well, first of all, I do want judges in our justice system that know how to put their phone on silent.
And that is a real problem.
We do need to solve that one.
It seems like the left, though, just wants him to have the Soviet national anthem instead.
And then they would be fine with it.
You know, I don't mind my judges liking America.
I think it's actually kind of a good thing.
And we have a justice system that is supposed to push back against Twitter.
And you're seeing in the Rittenhouse saga that this is what happens when you turn that justice system
over to people who are on social networks. This is a social network-fueled trial. It should
not even be a trial at all. We have video of every moment of this, and anyone who watches it
can clearly see he's in a position of self-defense. A couple of really important parts of it.
parts of what you see on video where someone comes up to attack Kyle Rittenhouse, he brings
his gun up and points it at them, they back off, and he does not fire.
That is crucial to what is in his mind at this time.
And we're all going to, I think, agree that he should not be convicted of these really
harsh charges.
However, that's not really enough.
It's not enough for him to just get an acquittal.
They've ruined his life for a year, and while I think you can sincerely look, because I have a ten-year-old son, and in seven years, I am not going to advise him to take guns to riot scenes and try to patrol them.
I don't think it was a good decision, and you can criticize that decision, but this is a court of law.
We can all talk on Twitter.
We can talk on the internet about what we think the right choice was, Uh, as far as his travel plans for that particular evening.
Um, but when it comes down to the law, this is supposed to be open and shut.
And in this case, it shouldn't have even been an open.
There is no, there's no reason with the amount of video that we have of this case that it should have ever been able to get to this point.
And it's, it's scary because we're now fueling our legal system with what gets the most retweets.
And that's not a way for a civilization to operate.
dave rubin
Yeah, Alison, is that the key point?
Because, you know, even Joe Biden called Kyle Rittenhouse a white supremacist.
I mean, there's no evidence that he's a white supremacist.
And as Stu points out, like, maybe he made a mistake by going or shouldn't have been there or whatever.
But that we're just doing this all on social media.
And no matter what happens, MSNBC is going to report it one way.
The Internet's going to report another way.
Like, we're just caught in that.
allison williams
Yeah, and I think what's happening here is what we've seen so often lately, and it's the two courts in which we're prosecuted.
One is the court of law, and the other one is the court of public opinion.
And the court of public opinion is very quick to rush to judgment, and that's what we're seeing in Kyle Rittenhouse's case.
Honestly, you guys, I think if you were to poll the majority of Americans who are kind of on the surface following this case, I don't think they realize that the victims, I will call them victims, the two men that were shot by Rittenhouse, three if you include the survivor, were all white.
I really don't think people realize that, honestly.
If I'm being completely honest, it wasn't until recently that I did.
I just assumed, I mean, he was at a Black Lives Matter protest, and the way the left has reacted to this.
and the divide that we've seen in regards to him and calling him a white supremacist,
I just have figured the people that were killed and the one that was shot were black.
And I still think there's a lot of people that believe that to this day.
So the fact that the victims were all white is kind of being glossed over by the left.
I think that's really telling as far as how they want to paint the picture of this trial
and what's going on in the court.
dave rubin
No, it's a great point.
I mean, the guy shot three white people without getting into the specifics.
So it's like, he's not doing white supremacy that great.
All right, we got one more video for you.
Which this one, I mean, to me, when he gets acquitted, and of course I think he should and I hope that he does, this might be the moment of the entire trial because basically the prosecutor was trying to take away Kyle's right to not discriminate, you know, not to incriminate against himself, his right to remain silent.
Take a look.
unidentified
You need to account for this.
Your Honor, I don't want a jury here.
He's commenting on my client's right to remain silent.
No, Your Honor.
I am making the point that after hearing everything in the case, now he's tailoring his story to what has already been introduced.
The problem is, this is a grave constitutional violation for you to talk about the defendant's silence That is, and you're right on the borderline, and you may be over, but it better stop.
Understood.
This is, I can't think of the case, the initial case on it, but this is not permitted.
dave rubin
You know, I sort of wish the judge had been a little more forceful there.
He was a little muddled in the way he said it, but I mean, a grave constitutional violation.
You may be over the line.
I mean, it seems like he was completely over the line.
Lauren, you said you've been hearing some legal people talk about a mistrial even related to this.
lauren chen
So this is not the first time that I think the prosecution and I mean, obviously not just me, but more importantly, the judge in this case thinks the prosecution has stepped out of line.
So he was the prosecution kind of insinuating that the fact that Kyle had yet to comment on the case until his testimony almost
indicated that he was trying to like craft his narrative until everyone else had already said
something which like the judge was saying is not allowed by the Constitution.
You have a right to remain silent later on in the case.
The prosecutor also implied that a witness who was I mean, kind of on Kyle's side, the
fact that he had retained a lawyer to deal with the legal system indicated he was biased
or maybe untrustworthy, which is also, of course, ridiculous.
You have a right to an attorney.
And, you know, second, the prosecutor, third, sorry, the prosecution also ended up trying to introduce some evidence into the case that the judge had not permitted him to do.
And there was another little separate blowout for that.
A lot of people are thinking that the reason why the prosecution is being so brazen and ignoring all of these established legal rules is because they want a mistrial because they know the case isn't going their way.
They would like to have a do-over, but that may not go their way, especially if Kyle's defense files for a mistrial with prejudice, which they have mentioned they may do, in which case if that does go through, it's granted, then the state will not be able to file charges again against Kyle.
And if, unless there's federal charges brought, he will be walking clear of this.
So that's something that a lot of people are waiting to see, like, I guess, what develops over the weekend
and what Monday brings.
dave rubin
Yeah, we shall see.
I believe Stu froze up.
He froze?
We've lost Stu.
stu burguiere
Am I frozen?
unidentified
Can you hear me?
dave rubin
Oh, wait, you're back!
Wait, is he back?
stu burguiere
I'm back!
dave rubin
He's back.
I was just patiently waiting.
You know what, I'm going to give Allison the final word either way because it's her first time on the show.
So, Stu, you want to make any predictions here?
Are you in the prediction game?
That's what political people like to do, right?
stu burguiere
Kind of, yeah.
I do think he will be acquitted on this.
Like I said, I don't think it will be enough.
The legal system seems to be one of the last places we even have a chance to keep our actual foundational principles intact.
You know, a lot of people are talking about the Constitution.
You mentioned the Constitution, and obviously a really vital part of all of this.
But your right to defend yourself does not come from Kenosha.
It does not come from Wisconsin.
It does not come from the federal government.
It does not come from the Constitution.
Your right to defend yourself is a right that is inherent for You as a human from God, if you don't believe in God, either way, it's still yours.
No government can take it away.
And I hope, I hope that we are still at a point where at least the legal system can look at these things and understand that even if it's not popular, even if you're worried that some activist is going to burn your city down the next day, you still make the choice that focuses on the individual case on its merits.
It doesn't feel like that happens in the media anymore.
That's gone.
This court of public opinion seems to be already lost.
But at least the legal system can stand up and give this kid his rightful freedom after this, even after we have this long debate.
And he pays a serious price just to get to this point.
dave rubin
Stu, that was a fine closing argument.
Alison, I'm gonna give you the last word.
You know, every day on the show, I try to end it with something a little bit uplifting, especially on Fridays, to show people that there are more of us and that we have a chance and that better days are ahead and all of that stuff.
So can you just bring us home on, now that you've been through the machine and they called you all sorts of mean things and you still got a new job and you're obviously flourishing and doing great, can you just give people a little bit of that message to take away for the weekend?
allison williams
Yes, and thank you for that opportunity because I think that's really important in these times.
We've been told a lot of lies throughout this pandemic, and I think a lot of us are in our own time and at our own pace waking up to them.
But let me tell you right now, the biggest lie you're being told is that if you have questions about this vaccine or if you have questions about the motives of the government and the overreach and the How do I even say this?
The way they're trying to destroy the freedoms that you hold dear.
If you think you are alone in that, you are not.
That is the biggest lie, is that we are the minority.
That this group that is so loud And so antagonistic and so hateful that they are the majority.
They are not.
They are the loudest, but they are not the greatest.
And I have been overwhelmed with messages of support, of gratitude from people who think like us and feel like us.
And look, when I was in it, it was a really, really lonely and scary place.
But I'm telling you, once you speak out, you will realize you are one of millions.
dave rubin
And you know what?
Every single person without exception that I know that has been through the machine, either at a micro level, just doing what they thought was right at their job or at a public level, everyone comes out better on the other side.
Every single person.
All right.
I want to thank Allison and Lauren and Stu.
I'm going to finish up without you guys for about a minute, but have a good weekend and we'll do it again for sure.
And for you guys watching, I think Allison's message was right, guys.
Not only are there more of us, but we are starting to get louder.
We are starting to get braver.
But what they are using is our fear, and that's what we got to take away from them.
If we just take that away from them and you just start telling your neighbors and your family and your friends and everybody else just what you think, Not because you're a crazy right-wing racist maniac, just because you kind of think that you can manage your health and you know how you want to live your life and what you want to do with your family and the type of people you want to work with and everything else.
I think that's a better message.
I actually think that decency and logic and reason and And love and belief.
I think all of these things are a lot better than what they're selling.
And if we can incorporate that into our own lives, I think that's the best thing that we can possibly, possibly do.
Guys, I am heading off to Nashville for a couple days.
I'll be on Candace Owen's show on The Daily Wire on, we're taping it on Monday.
Does it air on Monday as well?
I think so, yeah.
So that should be on Monday, and then I'm gonna interview Candace on her set for our show.
So we won't have shows in studio on Monday and Tuesday, but I'm back on Wednesday, and there's a bunch of other good things happening.
You know, I have a way of teasing things to you guys, and then some of you kind of figure it out, usually in the Rubin Report community, you figure it out a little bit first, but good things are happening, trust me.
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