Ezra Levant examines Treaty 6 (1876), where Indigenous groups ceded 121,000 sq. miles to Canada in exchange for $5/year per person, farming reserves, and supplies like tools and ammunition—yet land disputes persist due to BC’s lack of similar treaties. Meanwhile, Rebel News’ undercover team in Cuba reveals Havana as an open-air garbage dump amid fuel shortages, with families rationed 1.5–6.5 lbs of bread monthly and children surviving on sugar water. Cubans outside tourist zones share desperate conditions, fearing surveillance but exposing regime failures, like Díaz-Canel’s figurehead role post-Fidel Castro and state propaganda clashing with social media truths—such as 32 Cuban deaths in Venezuela. Exiles confirm worse realities beyond Havana, underscoring how treaties and authoritarianism alike can mask systemic betrayals of their people. [Automatically generated summary]
Tonight, have you ever read a Canadian treaty with Indian bands?
It might surprise you.
Let's do it together.
It's February 6th, and this is the Ezra Levant show.
Shame on you, you censorious thug.
Well, everyone talks about Indian treaties.
Maybe not everybody, but it's certainly in the news a lot.
Recently, it's been in the news in British Columbia because treaties, or sometimes the lack of treaties, has given way to an idea that there is indigenous title.
That is, that the land under our feet, the land perhaps under your house or your business, belongs to Aboriginal people, however that is determined.
And this is terrifying.
Hundreds of people in British Columbia whose land under their houses is now in question.
And of course, that's a precedent that could spread throughout British Columbia and elsewhere too.
The idea of indigenous title is something that radical lawyers and judges have been working on for a generation, and now it's coming to fruit.
I've also heard Indian treaties talked about for other things like in Alberta.
Do those Indian treaties make it impossible for Alberta to separate from Canada?
You have other Indian treaty claims, for example, that treaties allow Indigenous people to get lower sentences for crimes.
Those are actually framed as, you know, respecting the cultural hardship of Indigenous people.
But these treaties are certainly thrown around a lot, and I don't think most people have read them.
I mean, it's an obscure document.
It would sort of be like reading your own mortgage, because in a way, it's a kind of mortgage.
At least it touches on the land.
It's a binding contract.
What I want to do for the next 20 minutes or so is read a treaty.
I'm not going to read every word because some of it's repetitive and some of it's way too detailed and you sort of get the point.
But I want to read to you a treaty from my home province originally, Alberta, called Treaty 6.
You can see a map of different treaties and you can see that British Columbia was not covered by treaties, which is a source of some of the problem.
But Alberta is completely covered by various treaties.
And I just chose Treaty 6 at random.
And I want to take you through it.
It's a fascinating document.
It's a kind of contract.
And why don't I just jump into it?
Remember, this is in the late 19th century.
The queen at the time is Queen Victoria.
Canada is being populated very quickly.
The CP Rail is being built.
The settlers are coming in.
The government wants to settle the West before America gobbles up more land.
You know, they would love to have British Columbia join.
So there's a real need to firm things up on the ground.
Who owns the land?
Well, the Queen needs to because she's going to bring in a deliberate policy of immigration, particularly of farmers, for example, to make something out of the land.
So let me just jump in without further ado to tweet treaty number six between Her Majesty the Queen and the Plain and Wood Cree nations and other tribes of Indians at Fort Carlton, Fort Pitt, and Battle River with adhesions.
Adhesions is an interesting word.
These are people who, after the treaty was signed, said, hey, can we sign that too?
So they adhesed, they adhered their name to it.
It's difficult, I would imagine, to sign a treaty with the Indian tribes, as they were called then, because there wasn't a central Indian government.
And I'm using the word Indian because that's the word in the treaty and that's the word in the law, the Indian Act.
And frankly, most Indians I know call themselves Indians.
They were not organized.
They did not have newspapers.
They, in fact, didn't have written language at all.
So to do a contract, to do a treaty with an entire nation of Indians was very difficult.
But they just basically went around talking to elders and talking to chiefs and bosses and trying to cobble together enough signatures that they could say, yeah, we have extinguished any interest that everyone else had because they all signed this.
Without further ado, let me read.
Articles of a treaty made and concluded near Carleton on the 23rd day of August and on the 28th day of said month, respectively, and near Fort Pitt on the 9th day of September in the year of our Lord 1876 between Her Most Gracious Majesty the Queen of Great Britain and Ireland.
Remember, this was before Ireland broke away, so even the name of the empire is different, by her commissioners, the Honorable Alexander Morris, Lieutenant Governor of the Province of Manitoba and the Northwest Territories.
Remember, this is before Alberta and Saskatchewan with provinces.
And the Honorable James McKay and the Honorable William Joseph Christie of the one part, and the Plain and Wood Cree and other tribes of Indians, inhabitants of the country within the limits hereinafter defined and described, by their chiefs, chosen and named as hereinafter mentioned of the other part.
Whereas the Indians inhabiting the said country have, pursuant to an appointment made by said commissioners, been convened at meetings at Fort Carlton, Fort Pitt, and Battle River to deliberate upon certain matters of interest to her most gracious majesty of the one part and the said Indians on the other.
So basically they're saying, all right, we got these Indian chiefs and other leaders together in these different towns and forts on different days, and it was for the purpose of doing a deal.
And whereas the said Indians have been notified and informed by Her Majesty's said commissioners that it is the desire of Her Majesty to open up for settlement, immigration, and such other purposes as to her majesty may seem meet,
a tract of country bounded and described as hereinafter mentioned, and to obtain the consent thereto of her Indian subjects inhabiting the said tract, and to make a treaty and arrange with them so that there may be peace and goodwill between them and her majesty, and that they may know and be assured of what allowance they are to court upon account upon and receive from her majesty's bounty and benevolence.
So this is the Queen's agents, the commissioners, the governors.
This is their job, is to do a deal with the Indians, that the Indians understand it, that there's peace and goodwill, but they express some of the goals, immigration, settlement, and whatever other purposes are necessary.
And whereas the Indians of the said tract, duly convened in council, as aforesaid, and being requested by Her Majesty's said commissioners to name certain chiefs and headmen who should be authorized on their behalf to conduct such negotiations and sign any treaty to be founded thereon, and to become responsible to Her Majesty for their faithful performance by their respective bands of such obligations as shall be assumed by them, the said Indians have thereupon named for that purpose, that is to say, representing the Indians who make the treaty at Carleton,
the several chiefs and counselors who have subscribed hereto, and representing the Indians who make the treaty at Fort Pitt, the several chiefs and counselors who have subscribed hereto.
So they're saying, look, they don't really have a political system that we know of, so we are deputizing these guys as chiefs and these guys as headmen, and it's their job to negotiate and sign a deal and then to make sure their followers follow it.
And thereupon an open council, the different bands having presented their chiefs to the said commissioners as the chiefs and headmen, for the purpose aforesaid of the respective bands of Indians inhabiting the said district hereinafter described.
And whereas the said commissioners then and there received and acknowledged the persons so presented as chiefs and headmen for the purposes aforesaid.
I know this is a lot of detail.
Want to show you the thinking because it's sort of the tells a story, doesn't it?
This treaty tells a story of, well, why are we doing this?
Well, the queen wants to settle the land and get immigrants and farmers in there.
Okay, what about the other side?
Well, they were assembled and they chose their chiefs and headmen, and their job was to make sure their followers followed.
And the respective bands of Indians inhabiting the said hereinafter described.
And whereas said commissioners have proceeded to negotiate a treaty with the said Indians, and the same has been finally agreed upon and concluded as follows.
That is to say, okay, so that's a very long preamble.
And here is the treaty as concluded.
I hope you're still with me.
The plain and wood creek tribes of Indians and all other Indians habiting the district hereinafter described and defined do hereby, and here's the key word: this is the most important sentence.
This is actually why I'm doing this monologue.
I want you to read this sentence and think about it.
These Indians do hereby cede, release, surrender, and yield up to the government of the Dominion of Canada for Her Majesty and the Queen and her successors forever all their rights, titles, and privileges whatsoever to the lands included within the following limits.
That is to say, and I'll describe the land in a second, but I just read to you really the most important sentence in this whole treaty: that these Indians, on their own part and on behalf of all their fellow Indians, cede surrender.
This is a treaty of surrender.
I know that's hard to take if you are an activist who believes in progressive liberal views.
No, it was a treaty of surrender, and the Indian chiefs and headmen gave up all privileges whatsoever to the lands.
And then they describe the lands.
And I'm not going to read the whole thing because it's quite an intricate description.
Commencing at the mouth of the river emptying into the northwest angle of Cumberland Lake, thence westerly up the said river to its source, then on a straight line in a westerly direction to the head of Green Lake, thence northerly to the elbow in Beaver River, thence down the said river northerly to a point, like you see what I mean.
It just goes through the details.
The tract comprised within the lines above described, embracing an area of 121,000 square miles, be the same more or less.
To have and to hold the same to Her Majesty the Queen and her successors forever.
That includes now.
And Her Majesty the Queen hereby agrees and undertakes to lay aside reserves for farming lands, due respect being had to lands at present cultivated by the said Indians, and other reserves for the benefit of said Indians to be administered and dealt with by them for her by Her Majesty's government of the Dominion of Canada,
provided all such reserves shall not exceed in all one square mile for each family of five, or in that proportion for larger or smaller families in manner following.
That is to say, that the Chief Superintendent of Indian Affairs shall depute and send a suitable person to determine and set apart the reserves for each band after consulting with the Indians thereof as to the locality which may be found to be the most suitable for them.
So they give up all the land, all the rights they cede and surrender it to the Queen.
But the Queen says, okay, for each family of five, you get a square mile.
We're reserving that out.
Now it's called an Indian reserve.
And it's going to be measured and handled and dealt with by the commissioners.
But you've surrendered everything, but the Queen is going to give you some land to farm.
I'll keep reading.
Provided, however, that Her Majesty reserves the right to deal with any settlers within the bounds of any lands reserved for any band as she shall deem fit.
And also that the aforesaid reserves of land or any interest therein may be sold or otherwise disposed of by Her Majesty's government for the use and benefit of the said Indians entitled thereto with their consent first had and obtained.
So there is some ability to sell it, but you've got to give some consent first to the Indians.
And with a view to show the satisfaction of Her Majesty with the behavior and good conduct of her Indians, she hereby, through her commissioners, makes them a present of $12 for each man, woman, and child belonging to the bands here represented in extinguishment of all claims heretofore preferred.
So the Queen is saying, look, I appreciate you doing this.
I'm going to give you some money as a kind of gratuitous gift because all your claims are extinguished.
And further, Her Majesty agrees to maintain schools for instruction in such reserves hereby made as to her government of the Dominion of Canada may deem advisable whenever the Indians of the reserve shall desire it.
So the Queen is promising, look, I'm going to educate your kids.
That's where these residential schools came in.
And they have been besmirched because, of course, there were some bad behavior in residential schools, as frankly, there are in residential schools in cities or for rich kids or poor kids, too.
There is some bad behavior, but many of the Indian families wanted their kids to get a modern education, and that's what these schools did.
Her Majesty further agrees with her said Indians that within the boundary of Indian reserves, until otherwise determined by her government of the Dominion of Canada, no intoxicating liquor shall be allowed to be introduced or sold, and all laws now in force are hereinafter to be enacted to preserve her Indian subjects inhabiting the reserves or living elsewhere within her northwest territories from the evil influence of the use of intoxicating liquors shall be strictly enforced.
That's sort of incredible that the Queen is saying I'm banning alcohol from the whole place, but it was the case.
Look, you know, the Europeans brought alcohol to the Americas.
The Americas brought tobacco to the Europeans.
I like to joke that must have been a hell of a party.
Neither side was really quite used to the other, but it is a fact that alcohol has been a great detriment to First Nations people.
By the way, when I grew up, I don't know if it's still the same.
I know the blood reserve southwest of Calgary was a dry reserve.
So I don't know if that's the case all across Treaty 6, but I know when I was growing up, and I actually went on the blood reserve, it was an alcohol-free zone.
Treaty Rights Ceded00:07:26
Her Majesty further agrees with her said Indians that they, the said Indians, shall have a right to pursue their abocations of hunting and fishing throughout the tract surrendered, as herein before described, subject to such regulations as may from time to time be made by her government of her Dominion of Canada, and saving and accepting such tracts as may from time to time be required or taken up for settlement, mining, lumbering,
or other purposes by her said government of the Dominion of Canada or by any of the subjects thereof duly authorized, therefore for the said government.
So Indians were allowed to keep their traditional hunting and fishing, although white folks and the government had the right to use those lands for other purposes too.
There have been some problems because, of course, the abocation of hunting and fishing was a subsistence economy.
Does that apply to industrial scale fishing, let's say, on rivers?
Which is something that was clearly not contemplated back then.
I'll keep reading.
Did you find this interesting?
Find this fascinating.
And there's even language there, her Indians.
I mean, the Queen obviously loved her people, but was doing a deal with them.
Them having surrendered, she's saying, Okay, you're going to get some land, you're going to get schooling, you're going to have fishing and hunting, and you're going to have the right to do your farming.
This is a deal.
And I suppose the alternative to this deal is how it would be in another jurisdiction where the domestic population was just killed.
That's how the world's empires were.
The British Empire was the gentlest and most progressive empire in the world.
You know how I know that?
They banned slavery.
The Spanish Empire didn't.
The Portuguese Empire didn't.
French Empire didn't.
Dutch Empire didn't.
There were a lot of empires around the world.
Even Italy had empire in northern Africa.
It was only the English that banned slavery.
This was the gentlest empire in the world, by the way.
It is further agreed between Her Majesty and her said Indians that such sections of the reserves above indicated as may at any time be required for public works or buildings of what naturesoever may be appropriated for the purpose by Her Majesty's government in the Dominion of Canada, due compensation being made for the value of any improvements thereon.
And further, that Her Majesty's commissioners shall, as soon as possible after the execution of this treaty, cause to be taken an accurate census of all the Indians inhabiting the tract above described, distributing them in families and shall, in every year ensuing the date hereof, at some period in each year, to be duly notified to the Indians, and at a place or places to be appointed for that purpose within the territory ceded,
pay to each Indian person the sum of $5 per head yearly.
Now, $5 back then, it's not a ton of money now, a couple hundred bucks per Indian.
Of course, in reality, Indian affairs pays tens of thousands of dollars per Indian.
It is further agreed between Her Majesty and the said Indians that the sum of $1,500 per annum shall be yearly and every year expended by Her Majesty in the purchase of ammunition and twine for nets for the use of the said Indians in matter following, that is to say, in the reasonable discretion, as regards the distribution thereof among the Indians inhabiting the several reserves or otherwise, including herein.
So the government's going to buy them tools like ammo for hunting.
It's further agreed between Her Majesty and the said Indians that the following articles shall be supplied to any band of the said Indians who are now cultivating the soil or who shall hereafter commence to cultivate the land.
That is to say, four hoes for every family actually cultivating, also two spades per family, as aforesaid, one plow for every three families, as aforesaid, one harrow for every three families, as aforesaid, two sides, and one whetstone,
and two hay forks, and two reaping hooks for every family, as aforesaid, and also two axes, and also one cross-cut saw, one hand saw, one pit saw, the necessary files, one grindstone, and one auger for each band, and also for each chief for the use of his band, one chest of ordinary carpenter's tools.
Also, for each band, enough wheat, barley, potatoes, and oats to plant the land actually broken up for such cultivation by such band.
Isn't that interesting?
The detail.
I mean, so the queen was taken over.
The Indians surrendered everything, all their land and all their rights.
But the queen said, listen, don't worry, here's what I'm going to give you.
Now, was it too much?
Is it too little?
I don't know.
It's more than any other country gave the indigenous folks when they conquered.
And the undersigned chiefs on their own behalf and on behalf of other Indians inhabiting the tract within ceded do hereby solemnly promise and engage to strictly observe this treaty and also to conduct and behave themselves as good and loyal subjects of Her Majesty the Queen.
They promise and engage that they will in all respects obey and abide by the law.
They will maintain peace and good order between each other, and also between themselves and other tribes of Indians, and between themselves and others of Her Majesty's subjects, whether Indians or whites, now inhabiting or hereafter to inhabit, any part of the said ceded tracts, and that they will not molest the person or property of any inhabitant of such ceded tracts or the property of Her Majesty the Queen, or interfere with or trouble any person passing or traveling through the said tracts or any part thereof,
and that they will aid and assist the officers of Her Majesty in bringing to justice and punishment any Indian offending against the stipulations of this treaty or infringing the laws in force in the country so ceded.
That's a hell of a contract, that's a treaty, and now you know, and then they sign it.
In witness hereof, her majesty said commissioners and the said Indian chiefs have hereunto subscribed and set their hands at or near Fort Carleton on the days and year aforesaid, and near Fort Pitt, Fort Pitt on the days above foresaid, recorded 24th February 1877, and you can see the different names.
And then here's what I mean by an adhesion.
So they had this big signing, but later other Indians that they came upon said, hey, we want to sign that too.
So they call that an adhesion by Cree Indians.
We, the undersigned, chiefs and headmen of the Cree and other bands of Indians, having had communication of the treaty, a copy of which is printed in the report of the minister on the interior for the year ending 30th of June 1876, concluded etc.
Etc etc, so they want to join in.
So they say yep, we heard about the treaty, we know who signed it, but not having been present when the negotiations were being conducted at the above-mentioned places, do hereby, for ourselves and the bands which we represent, agree to all the terms conditions, covenants and engagements, of whatever kind, enumerated in the said treaty and accept the same as if we had been present and had consented and agreed to.
The same treaty was first signed and executed.
So there's several adhesions on and on.
Moment at Customs00:07:42
That is treaty six.
Very interesting historical document, very interesting cultural document, very interesting analysis of how the different parties viewed each other.
Some people would say that there was a great disimbalance of power.
Some people might even question if that legalese was well understood to the Indians.
I would imagine that the negotiations was more in plain language and that the legalese was just like when you have an agreement with a friend or any other agreement lawyers gussy it up because they need a certain precision that the legal language affords them.
But that's treaty six, and so I ask you what I started off this monologue by saying.
When you have a surrender document the word is in there where you give up all claims to the land whatsoever, how can you possibly make some of the claims that indigenous politicians and, more usually, their white activist friends do, based on the treaties?
That's a treaty of surrender, my friend.
Stay with us.
Next up, my friend Alexa Lavoie, back from Cuba, to talk to us about it.
Welcome back.
You know Rebel NEWS has been around for about 10 and a half years now, Actually, almost 11 years.
I want to tell you the most scary moment of those 10 and a half years.
It was not when I was arrested briefly in Toronto and was taken to jail.
I actually wasn't scared at all.
I knew it was a false arrest.
I knew I would be released quickly and I knew I would sue the Toronto police, which I have done.
It's not when I bumped into Larry Fink, the CEO of BlackRock, and he tried to intimidate me by taking my picture.
I knew that was just his attempt to do something, anything to scare me off.
No, I'll tell you the scariest moment in the nearly 11 years of running this place was when Alexa Lavoie and Efron Monsanto flew to Cuba to do their undercover reporting because, of course, they were using their real passports and we weren't going to try and give them forged documents with not that cloak and dagger.
And we had sort of talked about how they would answer the question: What are you doing down here?
Well, we're here on a vacation.
And they were posing as a couple going to Havana.
They were, we booked them into a Havana hotel.
And I watched as their flight, it was a snowstorm in Toronto.
So I watched, I tracked their flight.
There's all sorts of different websites where you can see the plane's progress as it goes.
And the flight was a little bit late, so it landed in Havana.
I saw it online landing in Havana just after 7 p.m.
I thought, okay, I know that when you land in Calgary or Vancouver or Toronto on a foreign flight, you have to line up at customs.
And I thought, okay, it's probably going to take a couple hours, I thought, so I'm not going to worry.
Okay, so seven o'clock turned into eight o'clock, turned into nine o'clock.
I thought, okay, I should be hearing from them fairly soon.
Like just a message that they're okay.
Then 10 o'clock, then 11 o'clock.
Now it's four hours, then midnight.
So they have been on the ground for five hours and I haven't heard a word.
And I thought to myself, even in the most red tape, Kafka-esque bureaucracy, it wouldn't take five hours to get through customs.
And then I got terrified.
I thought, how would I know if they were arrested?
What if they were arrested and taken to jail?
I just simply don't know.
And I don't know how to contact them because they took what we call burner phones down there.
They didn't take their phones.
You know, modern smartphones have all your email and all your contacts.
And, you know, you don't go to certain places with your real phone.
You don't go to China with your real phone.
You don't go to Russia with your real phone because they'll scan it and snoop on it.
So we sent Alexa and Efron down there with burner phones.
And five hours in, I started to, well, I don't know about, I don't think panic is the word, but I got truly scared.
I thought, what if they've been arrested?
And so I broke protocol and I phoned the hotel where they were staying.
And I just said, have they arrived?
And she said in her broken English, oh, yeah, they've arrived.
And I thought, oh my goodness.
And then it wasn't too much longer when Efron sent me just a friendly email saying, yeah, they landed.
And I was relieved because it was that first moment at customs that I thought would be the stickiest moment.
Anyways, I have to tell you, I was genuinely scared.
And I thought to myself, what have I done?
Because the bravery required to go into an authoritarian regime where merely criticizing the regime gets you, if you're a citizen, five or ten years in prison.
Now, I knew that if Alexa and Efron were arrested, they would not be sentenced to five or ten years in prison.
They would probably be held in prison a few days and then deported.
But even that might be very unpleasant in a place like Cuba.
Their jails are not like our jails.
Luckily, it was just a combination of moving through customs very slowly and the fact that they have very poor internet and phone service there and that our team had dumbed down burner phones.
Anyways, I just wanted to tell you in the 10 and a half years here, that was the scariest moment I had.
And joining me now is one of our two intrepid reporters who went undercover at risk of jail.
Alexa Lavoisier.
Alexa, great to see you.
And I just wanted to tell that story.
You really had me worried when you landed and I didn't hear from you for five hours.
I really thought that there was a chance you were arrested.
Thank God that didn't happen.
Actually, I didn't have any access to my email.
I didn't have access to anything.
So all my faith was on Efron to actually send an email to say that we are alive.
Well, I'm so glad.
Tell me what it was like.
So you went down there, you used your real name, and it would be foolish to try and hide who you were.
If someone were to type in your name in Google, it would pop up that you were with Rebel News.
So we didn't try and hide that or lie.
Lying could probably get you into bigger trouble.
So what was it like?
You landed at the airport in Havana.
I've never been to Cuba.
I take it it's a smallish airport.
It's not going to be a busy hub like Toronto.
What was it like?
You went on, I think, WestJet, if I recall.
Was the plane full?
Who met you at the airport?
Were there police or was it just aboard someone who just rubber stamped your passport?
What was it like?
And did they ask you questions about who you were or did they just assume you were tourists and wave you in?
It was really a small airport.
And when we arrived, it was only one plane who actually landed.
And the first room that you enter, you need to go and scan your visa and then you return to the line for going to the custom.
But the thing is, it took so much time.
I don't know what was happening and what was the whole process, but for every single person, it was taking so much time to verify probably the passport or anything.
But they didn't actually ask us any questions.
So we gave the passport, they took our picture, then they gave back our passport and then go.
Cubans Begging for Help00:15:23
Well, thank God.
I mean, I have to tell you, I was on the edge of my seat.
So I take it then you went in a bus with the rest of the people into the city.
And obviously we chose to send you to Havana, the big city, the capital city, as opposed to a beach resort.
A beach resort, you would be hidden from the local population.
The staff at the hotel would be very careful.
They wouldn't say anything.
In fact, they probably would be friendlier to the regime because they have a job that gets them better food, tips in U.S. money.
Like working at a resort in Cuba is considered a great job, isn't it?
Because you have access to Westerners, some of whom bring gifts, like whether it's toiletries or clothing.
A lot of people, when they go to Cuba, actually bring things to leave because they know the people there are so poor, right?
Yes.
So the best job that you can have is either working for the regime or working in a hotel.
First of all, because you sleep there, you eat there, and you have a salary.
As an example, someone says that doctors and teachers have a lower salary than the people who work in the hotel.
they have to beg in the streets as a second job because they can't afford to feed their family.
It's nothing.
It's nothing.
I live with my family.
I have two girls, one of five and one of three.
My girl has two years of drinking water with sugar.
I've been able to teach your family how to live in the country.
What's going on?
We have a new carton that costs 3,000 pesos a month.
It's so heartbreaking.
That was the number one thing.
I watched your video.
Obviously, I watched the video being edited, so I've seen it several times.
And the number one thing that hits me, besides the fact that Havana is turning into an open-air garbage dump because they've stopped running the garbage trucks because they're running out of fuel, like that's it's just so shocking.
But that's the first thing, these mountainous piles of garbage everywhere, which has got to be unhygienic.
I'm sure it doesn't smell good.
There's got to be rats in there, like it's a terrible thing.
But the second thing is the abject poverty.
I have traveled in various places in the world, and it reminded me of the poverty I saw in Port-au-Prince, Haiti.
People living in what looked like bombed-out buildings.
The apartments these people were living in, it looked like it had been attacked in a war.
But it's just 70 years of neglect under the communists.
Like the excruciating poverty.
I didn't know Cubans were so poor.
Maybe, you know, and it reminds me of what happened in Venezuela, which used to be one of the richest countries in the world, until communism and socialism undermined it too.
Were you shocked by how poor and how hungry everyone was?
Yeah, I've been to Cuba many years ago.
I think it was 10 or 12 years ago.
And at that time, I knew Cuba was a poor country.
But now what I saw was something else.
I've been traveling in many, many countries in my life.
And I think Cuba, it's one of them where I can say that I think it's one of the poorest places that I did visit in my life.
I've been to India, I've been to Africa, but I can tell you that over there is just despair.
It's just there is nothing left.
Like buildings are collapsing, garbages are just pinning up, there is no food.
You go to the drugstore, there is literally no medicine, it's empty shelves.
There is a lineup for going to buy bread, and there is only a certain amount of bread available per day because they run out of flour or other ingredients.
This is the box that we use.
We have a book of reasoning, which goes monthly and what comes out.
Now only this month is 3.5 libras.
5.2 libras, and 6.5 libras.
For the whole month, for a whole family.
Or only 1.5 libras.
Now look, now look, and nothing.
This is the box.
What is this?
The box of the people.
So it's really sad to see.
It's...
It's sad also to hear like some parents saying that they give sugar water to their kids because they cannot afford to give them anything else.
It's so heartbreaking.
Now, you two stood out just by how you look, how you dress.
I mean, you clearly were tourists.
What was the reaction when people saw you?
You were in Havana, so you weren't at a resort.
You were right in the heart of the city.
You were staying in a hotel that online looked nice enough.
It was surely nicer than the accommodations of 99% of Cubans.
You went out into the street.
Did people come up to you?
Did they want to tell you things?
Did they want to sell you things?
What was it like interacting with Cuban people before you got into your conversations with them?
Well, first of all, the main street, the street of the capital, it's really touristy.
A lot of people are like harassing you to sell you all kinds of like stuff or a trip with those vintage cars.
But when you go a little bit outside and when you just, you know, you look at the garbage or you look at some graffiti, people are just coming up to you and say, you see how life is?
And then you start talking, like, just like casually talking about all kinds of stuff about life, about how it is now in Cuba.
And people want to speak.
They are just afraid that they are being caught by some secret police.
But they open up like pretty fast to tell like their story.
And the thing that they were asking is like, please tell the world what we are living under because we can't continue like that.
People say, no, COVID, COVID, no, COVID was for everyone.
But normally, after the commandment of Fidel died, things are in Cuba.
Wow, it's heartbreaking.
Some of the poverty was just in the video that we published that you filmed was just incredible.
Did you encounter any supporters for the regime who didn't also work for the regime?
So, for example, if someone was in a hotel, they would probably say something nice about the regime because they have the best job they could.
A policeman would probably say something nice about the regime.
But once you spoke to an ordinary person living in poverty, did any of them still say, you know, socialismo o muerte or something like were they still mouthing the slogans of the socialist regime?
Or was everyone just burnt out by it, long ago stopped supporting it?
Like I were there any people who still thought communism worked?
I don't think people think that communism works, but the thing is they have been indoctrinated since young age to believe that communism, revolution, and Fidel Castro was actually the best thing for Cubans.
So there is still some people believing that Fidel was a great man.
But with the social media, this opened a new door of information for them.
And it's how they started questioning everything, questioning the life they are living under.
And you can see now that people are not dumb.
They see what is happening, and especially when Fidel Castro passed and Raul, his brother, took the place.
And now everybody says that, okay, the president is Diaz Canel, but no, it's actually Raul that is behind and is ruling the country still.
But people are saying now that the country is falling apart faster than ever.
But they still believe, some of them, that Fidel was a great man.
Some of them say that they never actually asked for the revolution.
But one thing, they all liked Chequevara.
Really?
Wow.
Isn't that interesting?
I suppose it's like in China, Mao has become, has turned into a bit of a legend more than a reality.
Isn't that interesting?
Now, you mentioned social media.
I imagine the internet is highly censored there.
What kind of information did people know?
Did they know about the arrests of Nicolas Maduro, the dictator of Venezuelan?
Did they know about Trump sort of operating in Venezuela?
What did they know about?
And did it come from independent sources or did it come from communist sources?
There is both.
So you can see in the TV, because we, me and Efron, we were watching the TV and there is actually ads of ads for bringing back Maduro and that the US operation was actually anti-democratic and that all the fault is on Donald Trump.
This is a piqui...
oh!
What?
That's right.
How do you say it?
That's to make the soup worse too.
Yeah, you have to make the soup worse too.
Yes, because you can't do it.
Yes, because you can't do it.
Look at that.
Look at that.
No, no, no, no.
Oh, okay.
Water on the sofa.
Look here, in the kitchen.
You are in Cuba.
You are in Cuba.
But on the other hand, they heard that there were no Cubans in Venezuela when this happened.
And...
And then they heard that 32 Cubans died.
And so they started questioning, but you just say that there were no Cubans in Venezuela.
But now you are saying that there is 32 Cubans who died.
So they were able then to start questioning.
So you're lying to us.
So what else should I know?
And then they started looking at social media and looking at certain probably news that they have access.
But again, it's really, really dangerous for them to go and check on social media or on the internet because everything is controlled, everything is monitored.
And if they find out that they have social media on their phone or they have been watching other news on their phone, they can be jailed.
Now, what reaction have you had?
The video has not yet been out for a full 24 hours.
Have you had a reaction from Cuban exiles in Miami?
I know you went down to Miami a few weeks ago when Maduro was toppled.
Have you made any connections with other Cuban freedom fighters?
What's happened in the last day?
Yeah, we have a former candidate for the Conservative Party of Quebec that is Cuban himself.
He actually moved in Quebec 25 years ago, and he was actually so happy to see that report.
He was actually glad, and he said that he's going to share it with all the expat.
As well, on X, there is a lot of Cubans who actually share my reports.
I have some of them who actually wrote to me privately.
And I have also some people who reached out to me by email saying that they actually live in Cuba part-time and they want to share some other part of Cuba and how it's even worse when you go out of Havana.
Wow.
Well, listen, I'm so proud of you and Afron.
And I recognize that we put you and you chose to go into harm's way, which is a very courageous thing to do.
You knew that you were at risk.
And that's why I was so nervous when I didn't hear from you for five hours.
I thought, oh my God, that risk has come true.
But I'm glad you went.
And you didn't go.
It was not a vacation at all.
You just walked the streets all day talking to real people.
And the results show it.
For folks who haven't seen the video, I played some of it yesterday, but you can see the whole thing at thetruthaboutcuba.com.
Well, congratulations, Alexa, to you and Efron, and thanks very much for doing this.
Thank you.
And thank you for giving Cuban a voice because I received the assignment, but the first person who decided it was you.
Well, I knew you would do a great job there in Afron too.
Thank you, my friend, for that.
Thank you so much.
There she is, Alexa Lavoie, one of the two-person duo who went to Havana.