Nat and Kat critique Generation Drag, a Discovery+ show featuring teen drag performers, calling it exploitative and arguing drag is an adult art form tied to sexual expression. They highlight Desmond Naples’ early drag performances in adult venues and Walt Heyer’s detransition case, questioning irreversible medical interventions for minors while citing 80–95% acceptance rates with therapy. The episode ties rising LGBT youth trends to CRT and queer theory, urging conservative groups to prioritize child mental health over political labels, and warns of Hollywood’s normalization of trauma-inducing roles for kids. [Automatically generated summary]
Misunderstood, the show for the misunderstood lady or gent.
We are your hosts.
I'm Nat and I'm Kat.
Today we're going to talk about the new trend that is drag kids, y'all, eating disorders and body image.
But first, it's time for our patented culture shock moment of the week.
Let's take it away, Nat.
Yeah, so Discovery Plus, they just announced a new show called Generation Drag, which follows five teen queens, sorry, five teen drag queens to document their drag journey as they, quote, find their identities.
So we're just going to play you a little clip from that to start things off and just get things real nice and disturbing.
Welcome to the Pink Palace, my lovely friends.
I first discovered drag at 13.
I didn't know what it was, but I knew I wanted it.
Put on the wig and the makeup, and I'm someone completely different.
I'm so fat!
My drag name is Vanessa Shimmer, and she is just a force you cannot reckon with.
How do I parent a child that wants to do drag?
I never expected drag to be a part of our lives.
Oh my god, these are so cute.
These are problems I never thought I had to prepare for.
What I love about drag is the glit and the glam.
My name is Noah, and I'm transgender.
Have you talked to mom and dad about pictures?
What do you think of taking this photos down?
Did Constant remind her that we had to pretend I was a boy?
Do you think a mom would ever want to watch me do drag?
How do I explain this to my child that she doesn't fully accept novella?
Making friends has been a hard thing for me to do.
When I'm becoming Nemo, become more confident.
Let me make sure you are appropriately fluffed.
This transition has been difficult for them, but they try and that's all you can ask for.
It's important for kids to understand that they're not alone.
So my mom started Draguton.
Kids and their families are coming from all over the country where we get to be our true selves.
Oh God, this is happening.
It's Vanessa Shimmer.
This is a place of love and support because we need that in this world.
This is me, and you better like it.
Bye.
So critics feel the show is grooming kids.
Can see it.
Yeah, and Howard Lee, the president of TLC Streaming and Network Originals, touted the teenage drag stars' commitments to being true to themselves and recognizing the importance of living authentically.
Yeah, because kids, kids can authentically be themselves pre-puberty, right?
Yeah, I mean, well, kids are like being a child and authentic is almost synonymous unless you have something like, like you don't know who you are going to be when you grow up, like you said, like before puberty, but you're at least like being a child should be about being authentic all the time and just like living.
And like when I was a kid, I would just like jump in the lake with my shoes on.
Like you don't think about your free spirited.
Exactly.
So while I like, and I'm going to say the same thing throughout this entire episode, I think kids should be allowed to dress up and play.
Me too.
Exploration, of course.
Yeah.
but adults using that to profit and posting it on the internet and posting it on television is disgusting, I think.
Yeah, like these parents are literally exploiting their kids.
And it's like, okay, if your child wants to express themselves in a certain way, I mean, I'm all for it, but like let your kid audition for theater, musical theater, I don't know.
You know, join the arts, do dance or something.
You don't need to dress up with a lot of makeup in dresses to make yourself, I don't know.
I just, it doesn't really, it doesn't make sense for me.
Like, I think that there are so many other options for you as a child, as a parent.
Yeah, especially because drag, again, like, I'm going to say this probably a couple times, but drag is for adults.
And it's mostly adults who do it.
It's mostly adult gay men who do it.
So like, why would you put your child in a situation where there's like basically no other children and they have to grow up so much faster and they're not going to have any peers.
They're just going to be hanging out with a bunch of adults who are not their parents.
Right.
And I mean, as you said, it's all right if you're a consenting adult and you want to do, if you want to dress up like a woman, whatever, man, like live your life.
But this show is kind of normalizing gender bending to me.
Like it's not healthy for a child who doesn't fully understand their own, you know, gender yet or sex or other people's sex and gender yet to be exploring these things.
Because when you're a kid, like you're supposed to just be exploring yourself, you know, and discovering the world.
Oh, that's a boy.
That's a girl.
Like throwing this confusion into the mix is pure evil, I think.
Like I really think it's evil.
Yeah, and profiting off of it.
Yeah.
Like why does Tyra Banks need to make more money from television?
Doesn't she have enough going on?
Yeah.
And why, like, just go back to America's Next Hob model or something, you know?
But she'll probably be like, okay, and I'll do it with children.
It's like, just leave kids out of the world.
Exactly.
Exactly.
Like, we know what being in the limelight does to children.
We know from...
And we'll talk about that more.
Yeah.
Like child actors and child stars.
It's a problem.
It creates mental health issues.
Except for that one that we talked about who was in Disney, who's like grew up to be pretty normal.
But he was like the guy who was on Disney and he was like, oh, all the my female co-stars were.
Oh, yeah, Cole Sprouse.
Yeah.
So like he was probably the exception where he's like, he seems okay, maybe.
Yeah.
All the other ones are messed up.
So great.
Throw your kid into that dragon's den or whatever lion's den.
Yeah, no, absolutely.
So there's been obviously some backlash.
And I think it's warranted, frankly.
And there's another article that I think we should pull up that's called Letting an Eight-Year-old Be a Drag Queen Isn't Progressive.
It's Child Abuse.
So this, I think a lot of you probably are aware of Desmond is Amazing or Desi.
I hadn't heard of this person.
Okay, yeah.
So they went viral a few years ago and we'll kind of get more into who this child is.
But this article was written a few years ago about this person and one other drag kid.
So this is just a quote from it that I'd like to read if that's okay.
So what concerned onlookers likely mean is that children who are encouraged to embrace their opposite gender or who are encouraged to dress in drag when they are not sexually developed or even coherent about sexuality may grow up to be profoundly confused about their sexuality and gender.
Yeah, so I think that's, I really think that basically sums up my thoughts on this entire segment, frankly.
Like I just think it's you're it's wrong to confuse kids before they have any understanding of the world.
Yeah, and I also think, and we've touched on like pageant moms before, but like gay or straight, trans or not, putting a kid in a bunch of makeup and propping them up and taking sultry photos of them.
Yeah, making them look more mature.
Yeah, so people could be like, oh, well, why don't you criticize pageant moms?
We do.
Yeah.
We literally do.
It's like it's weird adults who want to live vicariously through their children because they weren't successful or beautiful or whatever.
And you see it even without pageant.
You see it with dance moms.
You see it with hockey dads.
And using your child to live vicariously to have success that you didn't have in your own life is messed up on its own.
But this is like so sexual.
Drag is a sexual art form in and of itself.
So putting a child in that is just super messed up.
And like the drag queen who was like, yes, queen, it's like, why don't you just find another person to prop up instead of a child?
Like pick any of, there's 18 year olds and up who want to be drag queens, who want to be the face of your new line or whatever.
Like, go for it.
Use them.
Why do you have to use the kid?
Because you know it's controversial.
Well, especially because like kids can't consent to this stuff.
They really can't because if a child is too young to have sex, they're too young to partake in things that are sexual or exploitative in any way.
And I think another thing that's really important to note here is that when a kid does something, let's say little Desmond, who is, so Desmond Naples, known as Desmond is amazing, is one of the kids listed in this article.
And they began dressing in women's clothes at two, according to Metro.
And one of the things Desmond says is I always get a positive reaction.
People will clap and will be smiling when I'm done.
I also do public speaking to give speeches, and I always get a good reaction to that too.
So the point I'm trying to make is when little Desi dresses up in girls' clothes and mommy goes, you look so pretty, Desi, that's affirming him.
And that's what kids, they aim to please.
They aim to please the superiors in their life.
So you are planting a seed that, oh, I get praise when I do this.
So I'm going to continue to do it.
And it's grooming.
It's wrong.
Yeah.
And the fact that they're like, oh, adults love it.
Yeah.
Creepy adults.
Yeah.
Like creepy adults also have child pornography on their computers.
Yeah.
That doesn't mean it's a good thing to do.
And it makes me think, like, just what about a kid who has an affinity for playing with toy guns?
Like, well, that's who they authentically are.
Let's send them to war.
Yeah, exactly.
Let's give them a real one.
Yeah, like, because that's what they're into as a five, six-year-old.
Like, that's who they are.
No, that's crazy.
You wouldn't do that.
And this is, this could be just as life-damaging.
Yeah, I agree.
And this Desmond is amazing, has also received a lot of, the parents have received a lot of backlash because this child has been seen dancing at literal gay nightclubs.
Like, who's watching this child?
It's adult gay men.
And this is nothing against the gay community, but it's creepy for a child to be in that situation or setting full stop.
It would be creepy for a little girl to be dancing in an adult nightclub with heterosexual people.
Exactly.
It would be extremely inappropriate and extremely creepy.
And we would never do that.
We would never do that because some adults like children.
Like, we have to protect children.
Even if, let's assume there's no pedos in the audience, which you can't assume.
You can't assume.
It's still not good for the kid to be indoctrinated into that like limelight, Hollywood-esque world where, you know, to talk to the next article that we're going to talk about, maybe it's not the next one, but one of these is about eating disorders, anorexia and bulimia, which affects gay men and women more than the average population.
So it's like, so you're just going to put your kid in that world and give them body dysmorphia, if not full-blown gender dysmorph or gender dysphoria?
Yeah, absolutely.
No, that's a great point.
And also, like, how many drag kids are there in this world, in the world?
This seems like a very isolating thing for a child to be subjected to.
Like, so now your kid's going to grow up being this weirdo who does drag surrounded by a bunch of gay men their whole life without any real friends.
Like, that's not, that's not productive for them.
They need to be around kids their own age being weirdos.
Like, I don't, I just don't get why in 2022, like, this is where it is for children.
Like, this is what's considered allegedly normal by our society.
Like, kids should just be getting dirty and like playing in the whatever.
Yeah.
Muddy, dirty.
Yeah.
Like, yeah.
But you know what I mean?
Like, they should just be kids.
Like, and we need to preserve their innocence.
And I just think parents have just really screwed up.
Yeah.
Well, remember a couple weeks ago, we were talking about how when you erase the definition of a woman, it hurts women.
And then you mentioned like what happens if you erase the definition of a child.
And it's like, this is sort of that slippery slope.
Thank goodness they're still throwing drag kid on it.
Sure.
Like, when is that line going to be blurred?
Yeah.
They're already dancing in nightclubs.
It's like, it's not good.
It ain't good.
Yeah.
And I think, too, like, it's one thing to let your kid play, dress up, and put on nail polish, but it's a whole new thing to affirm a biological male child that, like, that they look pretty.
Like, it's just, it's not right when they are in women's clothes or girls' clothes.
Or post it online because these kids are so young.
Yeah, and they can't even have social media accounts of their own.
It's obviously adults who are posting for them.
Right.
Like, maybe it's parents.
Maybe it's not.
Maybe it's older friends.
But like a child can't consent to their photo being shared like that.
Exactly.
You know, and it's I just think it's really sick.
And I mean, Walt Heyer is someone who is, who was a trans woman who detransitioned.
And this is what happened to him as a kid.
His grandma would dress him up in girls' dresses, affirm him, and then he grew up with all this confusion and gender dysphoria.
And then he transitioned and detransitioned.
And you can learn more about him at sexchangeregret.com.
But like, this is what happens.
This is how you groom kids.
And it's, I don't know how many times I can say this, but it's so evil.
It's just so belligerent and disgusting and like demonic even.
Like, let's just preserve their innocence.
Let's just preserve their innocence.
Yeah.
Well, like you just said, a kid can't consent to sex.
And like the example I used about war, a kid can't consent to going to war.
They're not allowed to vote.
They're not allowed to get piercings.
Like, but this is okay.
Yeah.
This is fine.
When their soft little sponge brains are still developing, you're going to affirm them and say, oh, you're so pretty.
Well, what about how they look without the makeup on?
Do you ever say to boy Desmond, Desmond, you look very good today.
You look handsome.
You look like a smart, young, strong boy.
Like maybe they are, but like if you are giving them way more affirmation when they're in drag than they are regularly, maybe that's why they want to get in drag in the first place because a lot of drag queens come, like I love watching RuPaul's drag race.
Like I'm probably, well, I don't think I'm the only one at Rebel, but I might be one of two.
So, you know, for someone on the conservative side, it's like not the most common interest.
I've been to drag shows.
Really?
Surprisingly.
So I love drag.
It, for me, brought me out of a time where I was very depressed and I didn't feel beautiful.
And I was like, if these men can cinch their waists and put on all this makeup and feel confident and beautiful, why can't I?
Yeah.
On a daily basis.
So for me, it was extremely uplifting.
And I really, it makes me laugh, but it's dirty.
It's super dirty.
It's raunchy.
It's raunchy.
Sometimes I'm like, oh, man.
Yeah.
Because it's adult content.
Yeah.
Pushing Identity Boundaries00:06:56
And that's what it needs to remain.
Okay.
Yeah.
I forget what my point was, but it's raunchy.
It's for adults and having children watching this.
Like, you know, the article about Desmond, he mentions that what got him into it was that his mom was watching RuPaul's drag race and he was playing and he dropped what he was doing to go watch it.
Well, what, like, his mom shouldn't have been watching RuPaul's drag race with the kid there.
I agree.
Watch it when he's in bed.
Yeah.
Like, it's not a normal thing to expose your child to.
It's, it's messed up.
It is messed up.
Yeah.
And I just wonder if like exploiting your child like this and pushing them into this sort of, I guess, identity class or group of people, is it going to confuse their gender identity when they're that young and they're exposed to this?
And maybe this is part of the big agenda to just confuse the hell out of kids.
But like, I don't know, like we've seen the stats.
Like most kids who identify as trans when they're younger detransition or change their mind or grow out of their gender dysphoria.
So I don't know.
Maybe we should talk about this next.
Yeah.
Well, I remember my point really quickly.
It's that a lot of the contestants on RuPaul's drag race, like majority of them had terrible childhoods.
Not all of them.
And as the seasons progress, you see more and more people with supportive families.
A lot of them have emotional issues stemmed from terrible parents who didn't love them for who they were.
So having a kid who's that young, who's already feeling like they need to put on all this makeup and this glossy exterior, it's like, so what?
How are you treating your kid?
They should feel loved and beautiful and smart.
And like my parents, when I was a kid, they were like, you can do anything you want, maybe too much.
But like, she turned out great.
Yeah.
Too great.
No.
But it's just like your kid shouldn't need that facade at that young age.
Maybe if they have a terribly troubled childhood, and maybe that's just going to be who they are, anyways, even if they have a super happy family.
But it's, it's usually people who don't have that.
And so they find their family within the drag community.
So like, what's going on in Desmond's house that he needs this so young?
It's sad.
Yeah.
And I think like the mother seems to be very defensive when anyone calls her out on this maybe being a little inappropriate.
And it's like, well, if you're that defensive, there's something sus going on, mom.
Okay.
And we've seen this before too, where kids feel, you know, unsafe in a household or they don't feel like they can connect with people.
So they find these, you know, forums online.
We've talked about Tumblr a lot being very dangerous for young girls.
And as we've seen, these girls and young kids are exploited to these ideologies.
They, you know, mutilate their body.
They take hormones and then they grow out of it or change their mind or regret it.
And I just don't think it's worth the risk.
It's not worth the risk.
Not at that age.
No.
Your breasts are like as a woman, like your breasts are developing and you're putting them in binders, which I was, as I was doing the research for this episode, I didn't know, but it kind of makes sense that like just putting your boobs in a binder unhealthy.
It's really unhealthy for you.
It can constrict your breathing.
It can physically damage your skin.
You can do all sorts of stuff.
And it can make your, if you want to have a double mastectomy in the future, if that's what you choose, it can make that procedure not available to you as an option for whatever reason.
I don't know.
So it's weird.
It's weird to put a kid in drag and to bind them up and to put fake penises in their little underwear.
Like it's just, it's all so weird and it's becoming so normal and I don't like it.
No.
And I think that it's become this way because people, conservatives and Christians, have just been too silent about it.
We were too silent when things started, the slippery slope.
We just started going down and we were like, oh, it's going to be okay.
I need to be loving and accepting.
And it's like, no, we should have stopped it from the start.
And now it might almost be too late.
So it's really time for us to pick up this fight because.
I think the ones that weren't accepting of it were labeled as bigots.
Yeah, exactly.
And like, you don't want to be a bigot.
I don't want to be a bigot.
I certainly don't, but it's like, okay, well, maybe bigotry is not what it should be called.
Maybe it should be called protecting kids.
I just don't think that word means anything anymore, frankly.
Yeah, let's just maybe quickly touch on this EV article.
So up to 95% of trans kids outgrow gender dysphoria with no medical intervention.
Ooh, surprise, surprise.
So according to Gallup, 16% of Gen Z now identify as LGBT, while 9.1% of millennials do.
1.8% of Gen Z identify as trans, which is more than double the combined percentage of Gen X boomers and traditionalists that identify as trans.
So there's clearly something in the water, folks.
It's called public school.
It's called chloride or whatever it's in the water.
Or that.
Yeah.
I just think it's interesting that like the crazy increase in people who identify as gay or lesbian or transgender has increased so much.
It's like, so either they're actually increasing at way more than natural evolution.
Like humans evolve over millions of years, right?
Or thousands.
Like it's not, it's not two.
Yeah.
It's like a long time.
So for the generational gap between these numbers to go up that significantly, something's either something's wrong, like the water, like maybe Alex Jones was right about the frogs, or I meant that more figuratively, but maybe it is literally the water.
Or they're not.
We're just pushing this agenda on young children.
And they're like, oh, that sounds fun.
Like we've talked about this before with the thing that's called the thing.
Yeah.
Cognitive something.
Cognitive development?
The thing that we, like, young girls are, they're part of groups and they have.
Cognitive dissonance.
No.
We'll figure it out.
I'll post an article and cut all this out.
Oh, like social contagion.
Yeah, social contagion.
That's the one.
We nailed it.
So good.
Yeah.
I definitely think it's a, it's, it's definitely a political agenda, cultural agenda to do this to our children.
As we've talked about with CRT being in partnership with queer theory, like there's, there's definitely a clear-cut agenda.
I just can't see it any other way.
It's not the way God made us.
God did not make us to be gender confused.
Like, you know, he calls men, like he created men and women, called it good.
Like that is how it's written.
There's really no arg, you can't argue that.
Like, you know, unless you're not a Christian, I guess.
But like, I'd say you're wrong.
So I also thought that in this article, they pointed out something very interesting, which is like a lot of kids might be expressing feelings of body dysmorphia and then being misdiagnosed as gender dysphoric.
Projecting Insecurities Onto Kids00:02:13
So the difference is gender dysphoria refers to an internal conflict with an individual between the gender they identify as and the one that they were given at birth, their sex at birth.
But body dysmorphia defines a sense of anxiety around your body or a particular body part wherein the person with the condition may believe that some part or all of their body is defective or wrong.
So I think maybe you agree.
I have definitely experienced body dysmorphia.
Oh yeah.
I'm like, I think most women, they're so big.
And then my friend's like, what?
Yeah.
No one sees that but you.
Like when I look at you, I see a beautiful girl.
But like sometimes, like, you know, I don't know what you see when you look in the mirror.
Maybe an ogre.
So clearly there's something going on in your brain, right?
So think about how probably I would guess, and I'm just going to make this number up, like 90% of women have body dysmorphism.
Oh, for sure.
So it's like, oh, my God, like this, my eyebrows, or whatever it is.
And you're like, all I see is someone very beautiful in front of me.
So it's like, so maybe people are getting misdiagnosed and they're like, oh, hey, mom, I feel wrong inside my body.
Like I didn't, I don't have big boobies, but when I was a kid, like, I loved playing sports and jumping on a trampoline.
So I can imagine had I developed earlier.
Yeah.
I would have been like, I hate this.
Yeah.
It stops me from playing hockey.
I can't wear the chest guard.
Especially when other classmates are not developing at the same pace as you, right?
There's always that one kid that just has that growth spurt and you're like, so I can imagine hating my body if that was the case for me and sports and whatever.
And maybe someone would have been like, oh, you hate your boobies because you're really a boy.
It's like, no, because I want to play sports and they're annoying.
But like you grow into it.
You grow out of that.
Like you figure out a right bra for you and you can still like get some support and make it work.
No, for sure.
And okay, you kind of touched on this earlier, but do you think that all the people who are like encouraging these kids to do drag, to mutilate their bodies and encourage them to transition before they are, you know, fully developed?
Do you think it's just that they are projecting their own insecurities on these kids?
Like they just want them to be actually miserable and confused because it's just such an extremely abusive and manipulative thing for these people to do.
And they don't, like, they don't, like the teacher that's telling a student to transition does not love that student more than their parents.
Awkward Projections in Youth Media00:12:12
No, yeah.
Like it's they're just also it's parents who do it too.
Yeah.
Which I think is a projection thing.
Like, I think, as you kind of called out earlier, there must be just this weird thing where kids are just like their parents, sorry, are projecting their insecurities on them.
Absolutely.
You know, I see it all the time, all the time.
When your parent gets too angry that you didn't win that soccer game, or your mom is like, you didn't do the right dance or something.
You're not pretty enough for whatever.
Yeah.
Well, we know moms can be critical.
So it's not that they're, I don't think that most of these people are necessarily evil or trying to hurt their kids.
I think that they think that they're trying to make them better and trying to vicariously live through them.
And that can be just as dangerous.
It's like, maybe I don't want to be who you want me to be, mom, but it's like, like you said, kids love acceptance and they will move in the direction of whatever the adults are clapping for.
Yeah.
Not just kids do that.
Adults do it too, but it's way more dangerous when it's a kid.
Yeah.
No, a thousand percent.
So I guess this article is based off of a study by the American College of Pediatricians.
And as the headline reads, 80 to 95% of gender dysphoric children accepted their biological sex by working with a therapist.
And I just read the conclusion of this study, which I think is important if you don't mind me reading.
So the treatment of gender dysphoria in childhood with hormones effectively amounts to mass experimentation on and sterilization of youth who are cognitively incapable of providing informed consent.
There is a serious ethical problem with allowing irreversible, life-changing procedures to be performed on minors who are too young to give valid consent themselves.
Adolescents cannot understand the magnitude of such decisions.
So it's funny how like a culture that's so keen on consent and like, you know, all this doesn't matter if it's a kid.
Let's just experiment on them.
Like it's just, it's funny.
And we talked about this last week, even how kids are just unconsenting subjects to this crap and it's not fair.
It ain't fair.
It's not fair.
And I'm mad about it.
I'm mad too.
Yeah.
Gosh.
How, I don't know.
I don't know how we're supposed to fix it.
I think the best way to fix it is to not worry about being labeled a bigot and a turf and keep talking about it.
You can go to church.
Bring your kids to church.
A thousand percent.
Because like the Bible says, if God is for us, who can be against us?
So even if like you're getting like beaten up on social media, you know, or whatever, people start to abandon you in your life because you're standing up for the truth.
You can rest assured knowing that you're standing up for the truth and you're right.
You know?
Yeah.
I like that.
That's the only advice I got.
That's good advice.
Anyway, should we talk about that?
Should we talk about health?
Yeah.
I mean, it ties into this conversation nicely because a lot of these kids are going to have severe health problems physically, if not mentally, mentally, if not physically.
So that's mixed up.
So, all right.
Nope.
Okay.
There we go.
All right.
Well, this article is about Sophie Turner from Game of Thrones who played Lady Sansa.
She reveals the best advice she received from her companion while in the throes of an eating disorder.
So she describes her companion as a live-in therapist, which she must be nice.
Yeah.
To afford that.
Right.
Which she needed for several reasons.
Mostly her eating disorder when she was working on Game of Thrones because she was 15 when she started that.
Yeah.
So young.
But also, I think you might have sent me the article.
She also had issues from all the adult content and subject matter that they were filming on Game of Thrones because her character was particularly abused.
So she was like, she had to disassociate from the content.
And as soon as the camera stopped rolling, she had to like sing and dance and like play.
And then she said she's definitely going to have trauma long term from what she went through filming that as a young child.
So anyways, that's a side note.
But this is specifically about her eating disorder.
I'm glad she had helped she was there.
Yeah, she's lucky that she could have that level of help.
You know, that is a great privilege.
I mean, yeah, so she, I think one of the things that really kind of sprung this on was the fact that she started to get weird comments and criticisms on social media about her appearance.
And we talk about social media a lot on the show.
But it's like, it's fair because like grown adults can't even handle those criticisms.
So how can we expect a teenager in the public eye to cope with that?
Like it's difficult.
I mean, I have a hard time reading some of your mean comments sometimes.
No one says anything mean about you, Winter.
But I mean, I don't take it personally because I don't really care.
Like, if you had a profile picture in your YouTube or whatever.
Chances are you're not more gorgeous than Neb.
But one of the things that her companion told her that Sophie says was very helpful for her was that this is a quote from her companion: you know, no one actually cares.
I know you think this, but nobody else is thinking it.
You're not that important, which is kind of mean.
It's like, you're not that important, but it's true.
It's like, that's so true.
That's what we were saying about body disorders.
Dysmorphia.
When I look in the mirror and I'm like, oh my God, like this nostril's bigger than this one.
Or like my ears, for instance, that I freaking hate.
They're like, they're fine.
Yeah.
Well, I don't see it that way, but you're like, no one cares about you that much that they're like, ew, her ears are too weird or whatever.
But it kind of just stems from our culture, which is like this self-love thing.
It's like, it just keeps you solely fixated on yourself.
And it's like, it's so self-centered.
And, you know, like people are too busy worrying about their own lives to give a crap about your ears or my double chin or whatever, you know?
And I think one of the things that I just thought of about this article is that, like, in general, we just need to normalize like weight fluctuations in teens too.
Because like I've had weight fluctuations, like young girls, like she was 16 when she started the show.
Of course, her body's going to change.
Like, that's normal.
Like, it's just normal.
We need to not like criticize young girls for gaining or losing weight unless it's extreme and they're in danger.
Yeah.
And then you take them to the hospital.
Like, I was straight up ugly in high school.
Me too.
Thank God.
Honestly, thank God.
That plastic surge.
No, just kidding.
Thank God social media wasn't.
Oh, I know.
It wasn't as prevalent when we were growing up.
I got Facebook for the first time when I was in grade 12.
Right.
And by then, I had already kind of become hot.
So, yeah.
So I was fine.
But these kids are growing up now and they're like going through their awkward teen chubby phase where they get their, like, I got my eyebrows waxed once and they were like way too thin and it was like pimples.
Oh my God.
Or like awkward bras, awkward outfits that you're like, oh, like I'm dressing like a kid, but like I'm a teenager and it's like awkward and your parents are still buying you kids' stuff and you feel just so awkward.
It's the worst time.
It's literally the worst.
Yeah.
And so to have be in the eye of the public like Sophie was and to have literally like people, if people are trolling us, like we're literally nobody.
She was on Game of Thrones, which is one of the most popular shows of all time.
Yeah, ever.
And she was a beautiful, like, that's gorgeous.
She's so beautiful.
So for people to be like criticizing her, and then how is she supposed to deal with that?
It's awful.
But it's just jealous trolls.
Yes.
That's the thing.
It's the same thing with like these weirdos projecting their crap on kids.
That's what, that's what's going on here in the world.
If you're insecure, just shut your mouth.
Like go work on yourself.
Honestly, like go find Jesus because you're not doing anything fruitful for the world by criticizing someone, especially taking the actual time to comment.
Yeah, especially a teenager, you creep.
Yeah, like it's just so ridiculous.
Those people are not watching our show.
You are watching our show.
No, you creep.
You know.
Our viewers are nice people.
Yeah, they're lovely.
We love you guys.
Thank you for your support.
But yeah, I don't know.
I just think like when people are in the spotlight at that young age, it just puts so much pressure on them to be thin.
And I think there needs to be more of a normalization of just like your body is your body too, you know?
And not like, obviously, there's a line where it's like, you're too skinny.
You're too and you're like, you need intervention because you have a problem.
But it's like, those are extremes.
Most people aren't falling in that category.
And let's just normalize the rest of us.
You know?
Yeah, we look great.
We look fine.
I also think it's weird that, like, Sophie Turner was 15 when she started on Game of Thrones, which is like, you know, not so young.
You're three years away from 18.
It's not like an Olson.
No, so I think it's so weird.
Like, I was watching some show the other day and there was like a newborn in it.
And I was like, whose baby is that?
Like, I hope it's someone on set who's like.
I just gave birth to this.
I work on the show.
I know everybody here.
I trust everybody here.
But is it like, are people giving their kids up to Hollywood for the chance that their kid can make money?
Like, it's super creepy.
And like, it's cool.
We need them for the plot, but it's like, we're sacrificing these children for our entertainment and not caring if they grow up messed up.
And letting a creepy, dirty actor hold them.
Those people are filthy.
Like, who knows where they've been?
Yeah.
It's super weird.
Like, I think, didn't Will Smith use his own kid in one of his movies?
Yeah, The Pursuit of Happiness.
Yeah, so it's like, okay, at least he's like, when his, like, at least Will could hold his kid and be like, okay, we're going to do it.
And kiss his kid.
Yeah.
And kiss your head.
Like, that's normal for him.
But it's like most of the time, it's not the actual dad in the scene with you.
It's like, and where are the parents?
They're just like, oh, I'm so proud of like my two-year-old boy.
And they're doing like emotionally intense scenes, like adult subject matter.
It's weird.
It is weird.
Why do we, can we not just like not?
We should just, I just think no kid should be in entertainment.
And I, that's actually funny because Sophie actually touched on that in her interview.
She said she doesn't want her child to professionally do anything until she's 18 and she doesn't believe in becoming a nepotism child, which I really appreciate.
That's such a good take.
Yeah, I was like, such a good take because like, you know, you need to take, kids need that pressure alleviated.
You know, you don't need to become an actor because mommy and daddy are.
just in general kids should just not be in entertainment I really just think that we could do without them yeah Yeah.
We don't need them.
You could say like, oh, I have children, but you don't need to show them.
Or if you do, maybe they're people's kids that work on the production and they're around all the time and they know everybody.
But I still even, it's weird to have, like, kids, like you said, can't consent to most things, but they can consent to being in these weird scenes on TV just for like the season because it's so important for the plot.
Well, what about even like kids in horror films?
Like, they don't know what they're doing.
And now they have to, now in retrospect, they're like, dang it, I played that creepy demon child and that's on my resume forever.
And Sophie Turner here is saying like, yes, I'm going to be traumatized from the things that I, like, some of the scenes that she was in were like really traumatizing.
Yeah, it's a gruesome show for sure.
Why did she need to be so young?
And that's why, you know, when my sister and I used to used to be an actor too, like, we know that they often use like 20-year-olds to play high school kids.
And at the time, I was like, why is that?
Well, it's because you don't want actual 16-year-olds doing sex scenes and having like conversations about abortion and death and suicide.
It's gross and weird, and they should be protected from that.
It is gross, but do you also think it's kind of creepy that consenting adult, like adults are doing things, then they're dressed up as teens?
And it's like, so it kind of makes it seem like, oh, I'm young and I can do this, but it's, or this is normal, but it's like, no, these are actually adults doing this.
Like, so there is like a, I agree with you, but there's also like, I think Hollywood's just really freaking creepy.
Just really creepy.
I should watch nature documentary.
We should just watch nature or the Bible series that you're watching on YouTube, you know?
They're so good.
There's a Bible collection on YouTube.
You can watch all the movies for free.
That's great.
But no, like, and I mean, just a personal anecdote.
I once auditioned for a movie and I had to give birth and I was like 15 years old.
And they were like, all right, let's do it.
And I did it.
And then they're like, can you relax a little more?
I was like, I'm giving birth to strangers.
I'm six.
Like, I'm 15 years old.
Like, didn't get the part.
Yeah.
But it's for the best.
I once quit a show because, well, it was a movie.
It was a short film.
And I was like 20 something, but I had to make out with someone.
And I was like, I thought that it was fake kissing because I had never done it before.
And they're like, no, it's not fake.
I have a boyfriend.
Like, I was like, oh, I have to make out with this dude.
And there's a camera in my face.
Kim Kardashian's Complex00:09:24
And I did it for the rehearsal.
And then the next day I was like, oh, I have mono.
I can't be in the show.
And they probably all have to say it too.
I thought they were fake kissing.
I thought it was like.
And they're like, no, no, no, you need to tongue each other.
And I was like, ew?
Yeah, you don't know where their mouths are.
That's why I said actors are filthy.
Kissing is very intimate.
I don't think it's a good idea.
It is random.
It's gross.
Like, maybe I'm a fan.
For like creepy pervy directors, by the way, there are all these male, creepy executive producers.
And they're like, oh, can you do this nude scene for free?
And you're like, no, I can't.
Literally, they're like partial nudity.
Yeah.
And it's cool.
And I was like, there's going to be a hundred other girls who will do it.
And if I don't say yes, I'm out.
So I was like, I'm out.
I just quit.
I quit acting.
I was like, I was like, I'm done.
Yeah.
So here I am.
Here we are.
And that was our personal anecdote for the day.
I have more.
Pause for an ad break.
No, I'm just kidding.
Okay, so let's move on to maybe our next one about Victoria Beckham.
This is a really good, this is another based take.
I liked it.
I appreciated it.
She is a very elegant lady.
She's gorgeous.
So she says the goal to be really skinny is an old-fashioned attitude that shouldn't be an aspiration for young women.
So I guess she has a fashion line and it's very expensive.
I cannot afford it.
I literally want the dress that she's describing.
Like that tight-knit dress.
Oh my gosh.
I know.
750 pounds.
That's it.
If someone could send it.
If you want to buy us some stuff, we will take it.
E-transfers to misunderstood at relevant.
So I guess she launched a new jersey dresses and stuff.
And she got a lot of inspiration from time spent in Miami.
Is she hinting, she's a conservative, with her family where she noticed a lot of really curvy women really own it there.
And she just appreciated their beauty and like how they show off their bodies with confidence, which I really appreciate.
Because, you know, she's, she's from like the 90s where everyone was like super skinny.
Yeah.
So it's nice to see her have this more healthy approach and to not, you know, put the same pressure that was on her on young women.
That's what I really appreciate about it.
I do think it's like the wording that she used was like, it was, I mean, she said something about like, it's not all about being super skinny.
She's like, you want to have boobs and a butt.
And it's like, okay, well, that's also putting people in a box.
Because not everyone has, like, when you say like, accept all body types, like, some women are, they don't have like curvy hips and giant boobs and giant butts.
We're not Kim Kardashian.
Exactly.
Well, she's not even Kim Kardashian.
Like, like, so it's while it's helpful to expand the definition of what's beautiful and sexy and in vogue, it's still super limited to having a perfect proportion.
Yeah.
I wonder if she just misspoke because she also did say that she's happy that her daughter can witness women who are comfortable with their natural figure.
So, but I do agree.
Like, we just, the thing is, like, just, we just need to abolish extremes when it comes to voyeurism as it pertains to the female body, you know?
Like, just no extremes.
No, don't put women in a box.
And she is so influential that it's really refreshing to hear someone like her who has a fashion brand talk about this because maybe she's going to, and I think she has already with these new jersey dresses.
It sounds like New Jersey.
Yeah.
They're new jersey dresses.
And they're jersey dresses.
That's cute.
You know, they're hot.
Yeah.
Yeah.
But I think it's interesting because she might actually make clothes that fit different shapes instead of like, cause you know, like Club Monaco, like I love Club Monaco clothing, but they are made for like tall, super skinny women.
Yeah, giraffe ladies.
And I'm like, I can't, it's not, it doesn't fit.
I'm like a stump.
You know, it's not gonna work.
Literally, like an elephant in those clothes.
Like, I'm like, so you'll see.
Um, so it's nice that she's gonna maybe take into consideration different body shapes and types when designing clothes.
Yeah, like, you know, because, like, as we said, like, you don't have to be a size zero to be beautiful.
Women's bodies vary.
Um, but you know, yeah, I just think balance, just a balanced approach.
We need to see that more from people who have influence, I think.
Yes, you know, we're talking to you, Kim.
We're talking to you, Kim, and maybe we're talking to you a little bit too, Jordan.
Yeah, Jordan Peterson.
Jordan Peterson.
Yeah.
This was, I think, last week or this week.
This is this week, early last week.
It's been a long week.
It's been a week, you guys.
Oh, it will be last week when the show comes out.
Yeah, we're doing this early.
This is last week.
Right.
Jordan Peterson widely mocked after calling sexy swimsuit cover authoritarian.
It's a big word.
Yeah.
So this is, I love Jordan Peterson, but just because he's great.
Yeah, just because you love someone doesn't mean that you have to agree with them or defend them all the time.
Yeah.
You shouldn't agree with anyone 100% ever.
Definitely.
If you are, you're not doing your research.
Exactly.
Just like the same thing when people say like Trump people, it's like you're just going to defend everything he does or Biden.
You're just going to defend it.
It's not.
It's wrong.
You have to be able to see things more nuanced.
Exactly.
Yeah.
He's speaking like he's speaking for everyone.
And that's what's wrong with it.
It's like beauty is subjective.
It is.
And like, for me, I was like, men are not the arbiter of what is and isn't beautiful.
And like, who the hell are you, Jordan Peterson, to tell me what's beautiful?
Like, you're not like George Clooney.
Like, I'm sorry.
Like, stop.
Like, I hate, I'm sick of these ugly men pointing fingers at what's who it is and isn't beautiful.
Like, you have no right to tell me like it.
Yeah.
It doesn't mean that others won't and that other women won't look at her and say, wow, she's beautiful because the model is beautiful.
Like, she's plus sized.
Like, her face is great.
She's beautiful.
She's still, like, so beautiful.
Like, so beauty is subjective, but Peterson would argue, and I would agree, there are still objective standards of beauty that people look to, like facial symmetry and, like, curvature of your silhouette.
Absolutely.
But this girl still falls into that category of beautiful according to her.
She's not a blob.
No, she's beautiful.
I guess maybe I understand some backlash because it is like a sports magazine.
So, but, but, but even so, like, women of all sizes are athletic.
Yeah, like, usually, girls who play sports aren't the ones who are on Sports Illustrator.
Absolutely.
Yeah.
I mean, Kim Kardashian recently.
I bet she can't even throw a rubber ball.
No.
Probably not.
So, so maybe this girl, like, yeah, so I was thinking the same thing, but it's like this, the magazine is not called like fitness pro or like abs galore.
Exactly.
Like, she shouldn't be on abs galore because she's not, she's not super ripped, but like, sports illustrator.
We need to start that magazine and we will not be on it.
Um, sports illustrated sports.
Like, she could be any sort of athlete.
Like, it's true.
She could be shot put for all you all know.
Okay.
Like, those girls aren't, like, stick-thin with giant boobs wearing a thong on the beach.
Like, weird.
And, okay, what about the fact, though, that men who are ugly get to still remain on the news, in film, and all this stuff, and no one cares.
But women are the only ones who have to be slender and beautiful and, you know, just objectively conventionally gorgeous.
Like, I don't like this standard.
And it may seem a little like feminist of us, but like, it just really irks me that men get to do this.
But, like, if we do it, it's like, oh, it doesn't matter because he's a man.
Who cares?
Yeah.
You know?
Yeah.
I don't know.
No, I totally agree with you.
It irks me.
It irks.
It's irking.
And I really, I mean, is it authoritarian?
Maybe it could be if, you know, it was someone who was like very, very obese, like 700 pounds.
She feels like Tess Holiday.
You know, and they're like, this is authoritarian.
It's like a crazy leftist.
Like, we're trying to, it's normalized.
Modern, where it's like, like you're trying to completely abolish the definition of what beauty is.
Yeah, I'm sorry, Tess.
She's super fat.
She's so fat.
And no, she is, though.
She's like unhealthy.
Like, there's no way her organs are not changing.
But she's anorexic, so we gotta be sensitive.
Sorry, Tess.
But like, this woman is not even close.
Yeah, not even in the same hemisphere.
Yeah.
And I mean, as we were talking about like anorexia, do you think that like when we talk about women's bodies like this, like this kind of negativity towards this model?
What's her name?
Numi something?
Yumi Newmie.
Anyway, it doesn't matter.
But talking about a beautiful woman like that, don't you think that makes other women compare themselves to this person?
They're like, well, I don't.
Sorry.
Thank you.
Well, I don't look like this.
So maybe I'm ugly.
So I need to change myself.
Maybe, oh, I'm that weight, but everyone thinks this is ugly.
Maybe I need to be anorexic.
It's not helpful, Jordan.
It's not helpful.
Obviously, we are pro-health.
Take feeding your body well, exercising, you know, whatever.
She doesn't look unhealthy.
She doesn't look unhealthy, though.
That's the thing.
Like, sorry that she hasn't, she has some body fat on her.
Like, that doesn't necessarily make her unhealthy.
Like, she's not obese.
She's not anorexic.
Like, she, a lot of women fall into that category.
Like, true.
I think if, like, have you ever seen those photos, though, of like the 1970s, like what the average person looked like?
Everyone's super shredded.
It's like, I do think that people, like, I know for a fact that the average BMI has gone up significantly, which is a problem.
It is a problem.
So I see the point in, like, let's not normalize obesity, but this person's not obese.
Like, it's, she's just not.
No.
So, sorry.
She's not.
Sorry, Jordan.
So, uh, you know, just think before you tweet.
Well, he's not going to be tweeting anymore because he's a soy boy who left.
Sorry.
I do really like you, Jordan, but like, bad take.
Subscribe to Rebel News Plus00:01:37
Okay.
Well, he's been super spicy on Twitter lately, which I think has been great.
But when you're that spicy and off the cuff on Twitter, you're bound to F up.
Yeah.
And he did.
So that's the price you pay.
Like when you don't think before you tweet.
Yeah.
It's a great people gonna get made up.
People gonna get mad.
People won't get me.
And you know what?
Just take it with a great assault.
Jordan.
It's not the big deal.
It's not that big of a deal.
Okay.
It's really not.
Like, you're a married man.
You don't need to be attracted to her, anyways.
Yeah, it's true.
Good point.
Anyway.
Anyways, I think that's the show.
Is that the show?
We did her.
We did her.
So this was Misunderstood, which airs every Tuesday at 7 p.m. Eastern Time at misunderstoodshow.ca, i.e., Rebel News Plus.
So definitely watch it.
If you haven't subscribed, subscribe.
Subscribe.
Please.
And if you haven't subscribed yet, that's okay because you can still listen to the show on Tuesdays when it comes out on all your favorite streaming platforms for free.
You just can't see our beauty and all like the article and the phlegm that flies.
You can't see the phlegm.
And you can't see me going, yeah.
So, you know, you get what you pay for.
You get what you pay for.
And then on Saturdays at 2 p.m., if you go to watchmisunderstoodshow.ca or subscribe to our YouTube channel, Watch Misunderstood Show, you can watch the show for free.
But the content might be old, Ben.
So I really think you should subscribe to Rebel News Plus.
Yes, you should.
And then you can get access to all the other shows on Rebel News Plus 2, which is Ezra Levent, The Ezra Levent Show, The Gun Show with Sheila Gunread, Andrew Says with Andrew Chapados, and of course, Rebel Roundup with David Lansley.