Erin O’Toole’s abrupt firing of Conservative MP Derek Sloan—over a $131 donation from racist Paul Fromm—ignites backlash amid his nine-day pivot to anti-cancel culture rhetoric, despite past defenses of Sloan. Critics argue this move weakens the party’s focus on vaccine mandates and lockdown censorship while Trudeau outmaneuvers him on progressiveness and media charm, risking voter apathy or defections to the PPC. Meanwhile, protests face heavy-handed police tactics, sparking comparisons to authoritarian regimes like the Stasi, as civil liberties battles escalate. [Automatically generated summary]
Today I'll tell you the sorry tale of Aaron O'Toole acting like a good liberal.
How do I know he's acting like a good liberal?
Because Justin Trudeau has praised him.
That's always a bad sign.
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All right, here's today's podcast.
Tonight, Aaron O'Toole goes full cancel culture and fires an MP without even talking to him because leftists on Twitter told him to.
It's January 19th and this is the Ezra Levant show.
Why should others go to jail when you're the biggest carbon consumer I know?
There's 8,500 customers here and you won't give them an answer.
The only thing I have to say is government will walk just because it's my bloody right to do so.
Nine Days of Apology00:05:22
Today is the ninth day in a row that Aaron O'Toole, the leader of the Conservative Party, has read word for word from the Liberal Party script for him.
He has said nine days running now that he doesn't tolerate the far right or things that are Trump-like.
He has no room for racist or sexist or anti-gay people.
He's done emotional Facebook posts about this.
His communications staff have been busy giving off-the-record interviews to liberal media across the country about him.
Nine days of talking about racism in the Conservative Party.
The Liberal Party can't believe their luck.
They're the ones with the leader who has done blackface more times than he can remember.
They're the ones who sacked the first Indigenous justice minister in history for the sin of being too ethical because Jody Wilson Raybold didn't want to go along with Trudeau's corrupt scheme for SNC Laval and let them off the hook for a criminal prosecution for corruption.
Seriously, they fired her for being too honest.
I don't think it was because she was Indigenous.
Trudeau probably would have fired anyone who got in his way.
But it's just another proof point that all this talk about Trudeau being a feminist, being pro-Indigenous, whatever, is just spin.
I mean, that feminist stuff.
This is the guy who sexually assaulted a female reporter in Creston, B.C. named Rose Knight.
And he just said, well, you know, she experienced it differently.
That's exactly what Harvey Weinstein's defense was.
Take a listen.
Like I said, I've been working very hard to try and piece it together.
And even when the original editorial came out at the time, I was fairly confident.
I was very confident that I hadn't acted in a way that I felt was in any way inappropriate.
But like I said, part of the lesson that we all have to learn through this is respecting that the same interactions can be felt very differently from by different people going through them.
I don't think anyone believes Trudeau on race anymore either.
I mean, when he's off script, he shows his contempt for actual Indigenous people.
Here's some people from an Indian band up north with poisoned water trying to ask a question at a fancy donor's reception.
Trudeau laughed in their faces as they were ushered out.
Remember this?
That we invest in the middle class and in people working hard to join it.
Thank you very much.
Thank you for being here tonight.
Thank you.
People in Rosie Nero are suffering from Mercury poisoning.
Thank you.
Thank you for being here.
Thank you very much for your donation tonight.
I really appreciate the donation to the Liberal Party of Canada.
And as we know, the Liberal Party is filled with different perspectives and different opinions, and we respect them all.
And our commitment to reconciliation continues to be strong and committed.
And we will continue to engage.
Thank you, sir, for your donation to the Liberal Party of Canada.
I really appreciate you being here tonight.
Thank you for being here.
That is why we are moving forward on reconciliation in a real and tangible way.
Thank you, sir.
Thank you for being here tonight.
Thank you for highlighting how important reconciliation is.
Thank you for being here tonight, sir.
Thank you very much for your donation to the Liberal Party.
And don't forget this shocking confession before he was even Prime Minister, that he deliberately set out to humiliate Senator Patrick Brazeau by using his Indigenous heritage against him.
You know, the side bet sort of happened almost organically.
Pat sent me an email.
He said, let's make it, send me a tweet.
Let's make it interesting.
Let's put some, you know, some pride on the line.
The loser will wear the opposing party's jersey for a day or for a week.
I said, okay, you know, that's something we can do, but it doesn't quite seem to the level of the event we're doing.
I mean, after any playoff game, you have an opposing mayor wearing a jersey.
So I said, you know, we're both known for our long hair on the hill.
Let's say the loser gets a haircut.
He resisted back a little bit, pointing out that hair has a cultural significance for First Nations peoples.
And I said, I know, that's why I proposed it.
When a warrior cuts his hair, it's a sign of shame.
So it's very apropos.
So yeah, Trudeau is a racist.
I've just given you the proof.
Aaron O'Toole is not racist, and neither is the Conservative Party.
But for some reason, it was O'Toole who spent the last nine days talking about racism.
And instead of a dozen pressing issues, he should be talking about relating to the overlapping crises we're in.
Imagine that lack of discipline to talk for nine days about racism in your own party rather than, you know, oppose Justin Trudeau's Liberal government.
That's O'Toole's official job description.
It's his job title, leader of the official opposition.
Has he done that?
Well, nine days just promised to be a month because bizarrely, last night O'Toole announced that he was firing Derek Sloan, a popular Conservative MP and a former rival to O'Toole in last year's leadership race.
Nine Days of Racism Talk00:14:42
I say Sloan is popular because he was well received in the Conservative Party leadership race.
He obviously didn't win, but he raised a lot of money.
That's one measure of popularity.
I think he won every policy debate.
And he ended respectably in terms of vote count.
The Liberals in the media hated him, but like I say, that's their job.
It's a good sign.
Sloan criticized Trudeau on the issues of the day, including the hapless leadership of Teresa Tam, the public health officer who once daydreamed about locking up Canadians in internment camps if they defied public health commands.
I think the public has to know this is one of the worst case scenarios in terms of an infectious disease outbreak in that their cooperation is sought.
If there are people who are non-compliant, there are definitely laws and public health powers that can quarantine people in mandatory settings.
It's potential you could track people, put bracelets on their arms, have police and other setups to ensure quarantine is undertaken.
Sloan's criticism of Tam was very specific.
One of his criticisms was that Tam worked for the United Nations World Health Organization, which as you may know is controlled by China.
At the same time, she was purporting to work as Canada's public health officer, but those two things are in conflict.
China's view and the UN's view is not Canada's view, at least not all the time.
Here's the World Health Organization tweet from almost exactly a year ago.
Look at this.
Preliminary investigations conducted by the Chinese authorities have found no clear evidence of human-to-human transmission of the novel coronavirus 2019 identified in Wuhan, China.
Well, now, that's not just false.
It was a lie from China propagated by the World Health Organization.
But Teresa Tam worked for them while working for Canada.
So obviously, she couldn't criticize her boss of the World Health Organization, who signs her paycheck there.
Seriously, was there any other country in the world, besides China, I guess, that allowed their country's own public health officer to work for the China-controlled World Health Organization while purporting to represent our own national interest too?
That's nuts.
And no, don't tell me that's racist.
It's not.
China is a country.
You can criticize it without being racist.
And by the way, Derek Sloan's own family, they're visible minorities.
That man is not a racist.
So here's what happened.
When Sloan ran for party leader, he raised money online, like all the candidates do.
And the party takes a cut of all the sales, like the Conservative Party of Canada, from all the leadership candidates, I should tell you.
And they process the names the party did, because remember, these candidates weren't just raising money for themselves.
They were selling party memberships.
And Sloan raised $1.3 million in donations and memberships.
That's pretty huge.
But amongst that pile of donations, $1.3 million, was a $131 donation from a guy named Frederick P. Fromm.
Have you heard of Frederick P. Fromm?
Of course you haven't.
No one has.
He's just a guy.
One of, what, I don't know, 10,000 donors to Sloan.
And like I say, he signed up through Sloan's website.
But it was a membership of the Conservative Party itself that was in question.
That's why you're supporting Sloan to be the leader of the party.
All the leadership candidates were selling the same thing, Conservative Party memberships, Conservative Party donations.
All of them were offering the tax credit of the Conservative Party, if I understand the rules right.
I think I do.
So no one knew who Frederick P. Fromm was.
And who cares?
No party, no candidate vets the identity of the hundreds of thousands of donors who contribute online to Canadian parties.
It's just not done.
How could it be?
And by the way, for years now, there's been a limit around $1,200.
It's not like there's $100,000 donors that you woo.
I mean, everyone's a small fish these days.
Well, the Left Wing Broadband Institute, which publishes a propaganda website called Press Progress, they found that tidbit about Frederick P. Fromm, presumably from Elections Canada's disclosure of political donations, and they made a big fuss about it.
But like I say, how big a fuss is it anyways?
Sloan doesn't endorse the 10,000 people who donated to him.
He didn't know them all.
I doubt he knows more than 1,000 of them.
When Sloan was asked about it and told who Frederick P. Fromm really is, that he's actually better known as Paul Fromm, a well-known racist.
Well, Sloan immediately asked the party to refund the money to Fromm.
Okay.
But look at Aaron O'Toole's reaction.
He took a non-story from a bad faith left-wing political attack site and he approved of the story.
He normalized it.
He accepted its premise and granted it legitimacy as a real news story.
It wasn't.
But when the person who should be the goalie pushing back, or really, just ignore it, I mean, let some cranks on Twitter have it, when the leader of the party accepts it as a problem, how can the media, including left-wing attack sites, not proceed with enthusiasm?
O'Toole should have ignored the non-story.
That's what liberals would have done.
I posted the other day this tweet from Liberal MP in Toronto named Adam Vaughan.
I saved it because he deleted it.
It was a really weird tweet, really creepy, about Catholics being pedophiles or something, just bigotry, apropos of nothing.
Vaughn hates Catholics and he doesn't feel shy about publicizing his feelings.
You know, if your party leader puts on blackface and gropes women and gets away with it, it sort of sends a message to the rest of the team of what's acceptable.
So after loving and promoting that tweet against Catholics for a few days, he just deleted it.
No apology, no retraction, no humiliation, no Trudeau groveling or saying, I swear I'm not a bigot.
In fact, when Vaughn finally deleted the tweet, he implied it was unfair that he had to because people were reacting wrong to it.
Not a drop of penance because they're liberals.
But more importantly, because they didn't make a fuss about it.
O'Toole, on the other hand, took the ball from press progress and then ran so hard towards their own net score.
O'Toole took the issue and made it his issue.
He kicked it up.
He escalated it.
Trudeau is much smarter than that.
O'Toole went online, which he thinks is real life, and he denounced Sloan.
This is what he said.
Derek Sloan's acceptance of a donation from a well-known white supremacist is far worse than a gross error of judgment or failure of due diligence.
Really?
Is F.P. Fromm well known?
If so, why didn't the Conservative Party of Canada itself catch it?
They sold him their membership.
They processed all this.
They took a cut of his donation, apparently.
Worse than the gross error of judgment?
What's worse than that?
What's Aaron O'Toole saying?
Well, he's saying that he was going to fire Sloan.
He was going to kick him out of the caucus.
He wouldn't let him run again.
And then he ended with a slur implying that Sloane himself was racist and had no place in the party.
But according to Sloan, not only did he and his volunteers have no clue about who this Frederick P. Fromm was, but when things hit the fan, O'Toole did not even have the courtesy to pick up the phone to call him before firing him.
Earlier today, Aaron O'Toole made a statement to Press Progress that he would conduct a public undertaking to find out what happened.
Yet neither Aaron O'Toole nor anyone on the team made any effort to contact me.
Wow.
Derek Sloan is going to fight this, he says.
So this story will continue to explode for days, if not weeks.
I'd be mad if I were Derek Sloan too.
O'Toole essentially called Sloan a sneaky racist when Sloan's explanation is much more plausible.
It's a small donation, one of thousands.
No one knew the name.
He refunded immediately once he knew.
And O'Toole has plenty of time to talk to left-wing hate sites, but he never even had the courtesy to call Sloan.
And in fact, he called Sloan a racist.
I think that's the meaning of the last sentence in his statement.
Yeah.
I don't think that's a winning argument against Derek Sloan.
All of this is self-inflicted over nothing.
And it sets a new precedent.
If some left-wing troll finds something that the hypersensitive Twitter crowd is mad about for 90 seconds, apparently Aaron O'Toole will drop everything he's doing and denounce his own team, set up a circular firing squad.
He's so easy to manipulate.
I didn't see that coming.
If O'Toole doesn't like Derek Sloan, all right, that's fine.
But when you're the leader of a party of 121 MPs and 20 senators, this big team, you're going to have a lot of people you don't like very much.
And part of your job is to forge them together as a team.
But it's weird because O'Toole posted social media comments during the campaign implying that he wasn't in support of canceling Sloan in particular.
He mentions Sloan by name.
And of course, he specifically campaigned against cancel culture itself.
So even if you don't like Sloan, you've got to be appalled by the way in which he was treated, not even the courtesy of a phone call by the leader.
Why is O'Toole and his staff so attuned to pleasing their enemies?
I don't get it.
It will not win a single vote over from the left.
But boy, will it demoralize the party?
And even if Sloan has his share of enemies in the party, he surely has enough friends or people who respect him, who will chafe at the unfairness with which he's being dispatched.
A good test to always ask yourself is this.
What does the Liberal Party think?
What does the media party say about you?
If they're pleased with you, maybe it's a sign you're not doing it right.
You want the Liberals to be unhappy with you.
That's a sign you're winning.
Here's Trudeau today, though.
Trudeau pleased to see O'Toole attempt to oust Sloan from caucus over donation.
It's true.
The left is loving it.
Take a listen.
In the wake of what we've seen in the United States from the infiltration or the active presence of fringe or extremist or violent or unacceptable or intolerant elements.
And that's something that we constantly need to work towards as all politicians in Canada, which is incidentally why the Liberal Party has been calling for Aaron O'Toole to remove Derek Sloan from caucus for many, many months now, following a number of unacceptable comments that he has made.
We are pleased that Aaron O'Toole has finally decided to take leadership.
We will see how that unfolds.
In our staff meeting here at Rebel News this morning, we talked a bit about this.
And frankly, I said to our team, I don't even like calling them the Conservative Party of Canada because it feels like false advertising, just like saying the Canadian Civil Liberties Association is false advertising when they don't lift a finger during the lockdown.
I mean, if they are the Conservative Party of Canada, where's the Conservative part?
I call them the party that stands for nothing.
And if you stand for nothing, you'll fall for anything.
Stay with us for more on this with Spencer Fernando.
Well, I should tell you, without disclosing any confidence, that today I spoke very briefly on the phone with Derek Sloan himself.
I invited him to come on the show to make his case.
He gave me a very thoughtful answer.
He said he wants to make the case in the proper processes and that he will decline to talk to us for now out of respect for the processes.
He didn't use those exact words, but that was his meaning.
And I took two things from that.
First of all, I always enjoy my conversations with him.
We interviewed him several times during the leadership race.
And the second thing I took from that, perhaps most obviously, is that he doesn't want to burn down the joint.
He didn't pick this fight with the Conservative Party.
And it sounds like he wants to try and stay in the fold.
He's not torching the place on his way out.
He's not fighting back wildly.
I mean, it is true he put out a statement with his position yesterday, which I think was incredibly important to rebut the slanders against him.
But he right now wants to work within the party system.
The question is, how can Aaron O'Toole back down without losing faith joining us now via Skype from Winnipeg is our favorite Winnipegger, Spencer Fernando, the boss of spencerfernando.com, not only one of the most thoughtful pundits out there, but frankly, in terms of quick news, breaking news, you know, you can go to spencerfernando.com and he's going to have the news faster than just about anyone else.
I really find that valuable.
Spencer, great to see you again.
Good talking to you.
Well, thanks for being here.
You were all over this story.
What do you make of the fact that, I mean, it's a tiny little tidbit, but it sounds to me like Derek Sloan isn't looking to blow the place up.
He's not leaving in a pout.
He wants to stay.
I find that interesting.
Yeah, well, I think he's looking what happens to most other people when they get pushed out of a party.
And then if they try to run as an independent, they generally lose.
I mean, Jodi Wilson-Rambold was an exception to that, but she had such a high national profile.
And she's a very good politician, right?
So she was able to survive that.
But I mean, Jane Philpott didn't.
We saw what happened even with Maxine Bernier started his own party, but couldn't win his own seat.
So I think he's probably looking at that and saying, well, if he wants to stay in politics, his best chance is to try to stay in the party.
I think you're right, just from a pragmatic point of view.
And of course, every politician wants to win.
They want to be reelected, not just because it's a pretty good job, you know, financially, the perks, the status.
But I think he actually wants, he has a message.
I mean, I thought he was by far the most detailed in terms of policy of the leadership candidates.
And by the way, I think it's absolutely fine to disagree with him or even to dislike him.
But I think my main beef with how Aaron O'Toole has handled this is that it's so obviously what some of my British friends would call a stitch-up.
Like it was not, he didn't actually willfully engage with a white supremacist.
There's no way he knew the identity of Frederick P. Fromm, that that was actually Paul Fromm.
Conservatives Look Skeptical00:11:52
It was a small donation made to the party.
The party accepted its cut, gave the guy a membership.
No one knew who Frederick P. Fromm was.
And to throw him out without even talking to him and to denounce him publicly, I think that even people who don't like Derek Sloan have got to be thinking, whoa, that is bad practice.
That's unfair.
And if that's your new standard, get ready to lose a dozen MPs when something bad is found on one of their minor donors, too.
Yeah, I mean, I'm seeing a lot of people say that.
And in many ways, it's kind of my thoughts.
I'm not a huge fan of Sloan's views on the LGBT community, for example.
But this is obviously, I mean, they're obviously trying to screw him over, right?
Because if you look at what the party's doing to him, I mean, let's look at when he was in trouble before, right?
With what he said about Teresa Tam and then when he was criticized for his social conservative views.
Well, what was Aaron O'Toole doing when that happened?
Aaron O'Toole was putting out a ad saying, I'm the only person who's defending Derek Sloan.
I'm standing with him.
You know, he was trying to win the leadership, right?
So, you know, when Sloan was in trouble for other things, O'Toole was very glad to be seen as, you know, Derek Sloan's best friend.
Oh, yeah, I'm standing with him.
I'm keeping him in the party.
I'm not going to let him get pushed out.
And then all of a sudden, this thing, I mean, it's like, come on, like he got, what, like 13,000 donations or a whole bunch of donations.
There's no way they're looking at every one of them.
The Conservative Party accepted it.
And now we're seeing people, it looks like on Twitter talking about how it looks like Fromm might actually be a current member of the party.
You know, he might be registered to go to their convention.
So nobody in the party saw a problem with any of this.
Nobody recognized the name.
But oh, all of a sudden now Derek Sloan's got to go because look what we found out.
And it's, I think what bothers people is, you know, Aaron O'Toole, if he really wanted to be credible, there's things he could have, he could say, I don't like Derek Sloan's views on certain issues.
I don't think he fits in the party.
But at least have the guts to just be honest and say that.
But to try to screw somebody over in this way, I think it just looks gross to people.
Well, yeah, and because there's a, you know, the whole idea of law, one of the first things they taught us in law school was this Latin phrase, stare decisis, which means stand by the precedent.
Another way of saying that is everybody should know the law so they have some safety, security.
What are the rules?
You got to know the rules if you want to play a game.
And to bring in a new crazy rule that if some anonymous guy donates, like Paul Frum didn't walk up to Derek Sloan and say, here's $131.
He went on the website, typed in the credit card number, and it was processed immediately, I'm sure.
So it's like someone on Twitter.
If you retweet someone on Twitter, I mean, maybe you should be careful, I don't know.
But if five years ago, that guy said something kooky to hang that around your neck, like it's so remote from Derek Sloan willfully doing something white supremacist.
And by the way, I should point out that Sloan's wife and kids are visible minorities.
The guy clearly is not a racist.
I mean, his own family is of minority background.
I guess my point about star decisis and knowing the rules is this feels like a whimsical rule.
And now everyone in the caucus is probably saying, well, am I going to be thrown under the bus next by some troll digging up someone who donated me five years ago?
I mean, it just feels capricious.
And it's like an invitation to press progress and the NDP and the liberals to dig up fake scandals because now that's how low Aaron O'Toole's standards are for sacking someone.
Yeah, and to go after someone in this way, too.
I mean, it's one thing to say, oh, I think he's too socially conservative or he's not a team player.
And then you, I mean, you shouldn't push someone out for that, but you could make the argument, right?
So he pushes them out for that, okay, Derek Sloan's political career and the conservatives ends because he's too socially conservative or whatever.
That's not going to destroy Derek Sloan forever, right?
But to push someone out on an issue where you're saying, oh, look, they accepted a neo-Nazi donation, right?
That's, you know, the kind of thing that that follows someone around for the rest of their life.
People look that up on the internet.
Oh, Derek Sloan, what's he about?
Oh, he got kicked out of the Conservative Party for accepting neo-Nazi support.
So when you're willing to destroy somebody in that way, and when it's so obviously dishonest, I think that's pretty disgusting.
And I think your point about other conservative MPs, I'm sure last night, a whole bunch of conservative MPs were calling up their EDAs saying, hey, guys, you want to send me a list of everybody who's donated in the past few years?
I just want to take a look and see what names are on there.
And a lot of them must be saying, you know, if I get in trouble, what?
Is there going to be a bad press progress article about other MPs?
And then Aaron O'Toole's going to say, well, see you later.
Your career's over.
I think a lot of them might be having some second thoughts about this.
Yeah, you know, I got a question for you.
I mean, you mentioned, and I've just been thinking about this since you mentioned a minute ago.
During the leadership campaign, Aaron O'Toole made some good noises about fighting against cancel culture.
I remember when he stood up for Derek Sloan, I was a little bit impressed, I admit.
He had a whole bunch of social media posts during the campaign about, he specifically used that phrase, cancel culture, which is something that conservatives, it's like he was really signaling, hey guys, I'm for free speech.
I'm for fighting back against wokeness.
He did an interview during the campaign with Andrew Lawton where he discussed this issue.
He even talked to our rebel reporter Kian Beckstey, sort of ending the boycott.
So I had some good vibes there.
And I mean, forget about us.
Rebel News out of the picture for a minute.
Just on his own terms, Aaron O'Toole really laid down a good track record of or a paper record of supporting free speech and not bowing in the cancel culture.
And wham, in the last nine days, that has gone out the door so hard.
And I'm wondering, is this the same guy?
Did he mean it?
Did he even write those things?
Was that just a way to get the leadership and now he's pivoting to the center?
Like, I'm trying, I have whiplash reconciling his repeated calls to fight against cancel culture with what I think can only be called cancel culture.
Help me unscramble that omelet, Spencer.
Yeah, well, generally, the most simple explanation I think is the right one.
Not in every case, of course, but often.
And the most simple explanation here is that he's doing whatever serves his immediate political interest, right?
So he ran for the leadership previously and lost, came in third.
He ran as a moderate conservative then, didn't win.
He ran the second time, and it really looks like basically what he did is it's as if he just researched all the keywords that he felt would trigger conservatives into supporting him and then said that over and over again.
And it worked.
I mean, he did win, right?
I mean, even people like me were saying, oh, this looks pretty good for Motoo.
And then, so that served his interest then, as did helping Derek Sloan.
But now his interest he feels is served in not doing that stuff and being against Derek Sloan.
So that's what he's doing.
So that seems kind of like the explanation to me.
The problem is, you know, he may feel he's going to gain some votes for that, but I think conservatives are looking at this and saying, were we supposed to believe you the first time you ran or the second time you ran or now when you're presenting a different face?
You know, what is real?
And if you won't stand up for, you know, your own people when they get in trouble, are you going to stand up for conservatives?
Are you going to stand up for what conservatives believe?
I mean, we see all this stuff with lockdowns, with the expansion of government power and authority, far beyond what people really expected would be happening with social media censorship, free speech.
And the Conservative Party doesn't seem to have much to say about that all of a sudden.
So I think a lot of people are wondering, you know, what's really going on here?
Well, yeah, I mean, it's been nine days in a row that the party's been talking about its own navel, you know, navel gazing very destructively.
Nine days that we could have been talking about the lockdown, if you believe in vaccines, how poorly Trudeau is distributing them, big tech censorship, Keystone Excel the last few.
There's a lot of things to talk about, but instead the party's having this bonfire.
I have a prediction, and I'd like your thoughts on this, if you agree or disagree.
I think that this is demoralizing to the party base.
Even those who didn't like Derek Sloan, because it feels canceled culture, it feels giving into the media.
The last time I checked the opinion poll aggregator that I go to, the conservatives are around 30, 31%.
So enough for a respectable showing, but certainly not going to win.
I fear that this nine-day bonfire that's going to continue, because Sloan's fighting this, I think it's going to take 5% off the Tory vote.
And it's not necessarily going to go to the Liberals.
It's just Tories who are saying, yeah, I don't care anymore.
I'm not motivated anymore.
And by the way, if the Conservatives can't get their own house together, how could they get our country together?
I think that far from being a vote winner that O'Toole thinks maybe some liberals are going to come running to support him.
I think this is going to be his own version of the People's Party shaving off some votes to his right.
And I don't think the People's Party is a force right now, but this has the same demoralizing splittest feeling.
That's my hypothesis.
That's my prediction.
A loss of several points in the next opinion poll.
What do you think of that prediction?
Yeah, I think there's a lot of truth to that.
I think the issue that O'Toole faces is, you know, one that Trudeau will always be able to be more progressive than him, right?
So if O'Toole keeps moving towards the center, well, Trudeau will move more to the left and the center will thus change, right?
So O'Toole will keep chasing Trudeau to the center and the center will keep moving to the left.
And Trudeau will always be able to do that more.
And, you know, I know people don't like hearing this.
It sounds superficial, but Trudeau is also always going to be more photogenic than Aaron O'Toole, right?
So if you have two people competing to be the most progressive, well, the guy who looks better on TV is probably going to have a better chance.
And then again, conservatives, they may not have really another party to go to.
Yes, they can go to the PPC.
They're not going to probably win too many seats.
We'll see what happens.
Things could change.
But it's the issue of staying home.
And we saw this with the liberals back when Stephen Harper was winning.
You know, the conservative vote from the first, I guess, the first minority they won to their majority didn't really change all that much.
But the liberal vote collapsed, especially under the fan Diana and Mike Oldnadieff.
So it's not just about, you know, are you adding votes or losing votes to another party?
A lot of conservatives will just say, you know what?
All these parties seem like they're the same.
Maybe I'll stay home and see if it changes next time.
So I think that's a big threat for the conservatives.
Well, more and more, I think keeping the flame of these ideas alive falls to independent voices outside the party structure, including yours, Spencer.
It's always great to catch up with you via Skype.
I highly recommend to all my friends, spencerfernando.com, based in Winnipeg, a Western view, a conservative view, thoughtful, very thoughtful view.
And like I said earlier, one of the fastest to catch the news headlines and give a thoughtful analysis.
Great to see you.
Thanks for being here.
I already appreciate it.
All right, there you have it, Spencer Fernando.
Stay with us.
Hey, welcome back to my show last night.
George writes: Alberta should become an American state.
Then there would be no border issue.
Hey, they could also stop financing Trudeau and Quebec's socialist programs and keep more of the profits.
A win-win-win.
Yeah, imagine what Biden would do, a state of Alberta, but it would have more rights than it has as a province in Canada.
Protests and Quarrels00:01:02
Cedar rights, it's horrible that no one can protest peacefully.
Taking that right away, it's not a protest if you follow all the rules you don't agree with.
I was very angry at Tori's friend's comment when I saw it a couple of weeks ago.
You know what?
I think that protests should be peaceful.
Those protests over the weekend were peaceful.
The fact that police said, okay, time's up, move on.
Sorry, that's not how we roll in Canada.
Police don't make that decision.
Gilly writes, the images seem like scenes from a movie.
How can this be real?
How can this happen in Canada?
How could we all turn on each other so quickly and easily?
That's the part I hate the most about the lockdown: it pits shopkeepers against customers, pits people against each other on the street.
Masks are now a source of quarrels.
Police are being turned into versions of the Stasi secret police.
Police actually busting into private homes.
That's the worst thing that's being done to us.
Well, we'll fight back with civil liberties lawyers.
You know we will.
Until tomorrow, on behalf of all of us here at Rumble Wolf Headquarters to you and Alvin, good night.