Drea Humphrey and Tamara Ugalini expose Vancouver’s park encampments violating trespass laws, with police failing to enforce bylaws despite unhygienic conditions and identity disputes. Ontario’s school mask mandates lack evidence, while 82% of COVID-19 deaths occurred in long-term care—yet officials prioritize children. Brampton Mayor Patrick Brown hypocritically fined residents $880 for violations while playing hockey, drawing parallels to Trudeau’s inconsistent policies. Public outrage highlights systemic failures where enforcement targets citizens over actual threats, undermining trust in authorities. [Automatically generated summary]
Hello Rebels, you're listening to a free audio only recording of my show Rebel Roundup.
Tonight my guests are Drea Humphrey and Tamara Ugalini.
Now if you like listening to this podcast then you would love watching it.
But in order to watch you need to be a subscriber to Rebel News Plus.
That's what we call our long format TV style shows here on The Rebel.
Subscribers get access to watching my weekly show as well as other great TV style shows too.
It's only $8 a month to subscribe or you can subscribe annually and get two months free.
And just for podcast listeners, you can also save an extra 10% on a new premium membership by using the coupon code PODCAST when you subscribe.
Just go to RebelNewsPlus.com to become a member.
And please leave a five-star review on this podcast and subscribe in iTunes or wherever you listen to podcasts.
Those reviews are a great way to support Rebel News without spending a dime.
And now, enjoy this free audio-only version of my show.
Welcome to Rebel Roundup, ladies and gentlemen, and the rest of you, in which we look back at some of the very best commentaries of the week by your favorite rebels.
I'm your host, David Menzies.
Indigenous Sacred Spaces00:11:46
Well, Drea Humphrey ventured into a Vancouver park that has devolved into a filthy tent city.
She met many wonderful, tolerant, and smart thinkers residing there.
No, actually, she did not.
Just will you see her report.
And Tamara Ugalini weighs in on the hysteria being generated regarding kids going back to school during the pandemic.
Hysteria that is simply not justified when you examine the stats and the science.
And finally, letters, we get your letters, we get your letters every minute of every day.
And I'll share some of your responses regarding our run-in at a hockey rink with the mayor of Brampton, Patrick Brown, the guy who has slapped hundreds of his own residents with those $880 Wuhan virus tickets.
But when it comes to Brown obeying the rules, well, it's one law for me and one law for thee.
Those are your rebels.
Now let's round them up.
I'm Dre Humphrey with Rebel News and we're just seeing what KT Camp wants the, not the world, but Canada to know.
And we're talking about the tax revolt.
Have you guys heard about that?
No, I can forget who's in charge of this camp.
Sure.
But it would be great if you could not film around because these are people's homes.
So just wait until we can speak with the leader of this camp because yeah, it's people living here.
Sure, it's a public park though, right?
It's homes.
It's homes.
Yeah, it's very respectful, but it is a park, right?
So it would be great if you could not film people personally.
Okay, well, the gentleman was actually, he invited me in here and I had his permission.
Very clever touch.
The black.
Black is a clever touch.
This is a public park designated, but it's native land.
Yeah, I'm actually Indigenous, too.
I'm black and Indigenous.
You're black.
You're not indigenous.
Excuse me.
Stop, stop.
Apparently, he knows who I am more than I do.
I know you're not native Indian.
Stop.
That's not true.
Stop.
Go away.
Okay.
I'll go speak with the leader of this camp until then it would be great if you could just refrain from filming people and filming.
Okay, well I'll keep filming.
This is journalism.
This is Canada.
I'm allowed to film, but I will be very respectful and I'd love to speak to whoever's running the camp.
Okay, thank you.
Yeah, so I spoke with the leader.
She's on her way.
But first, we need you to do protocol at our sacred fire.
Oh, okay.
Okay, so what is that?
That's putting tobacco in as an offering to the sacred fire that's over on this side.
An offering to the sacred fire.
That sounds like religious, right?
It's indigenous, yeah.
Okay, so I'm Indigenous, but I'm Christian.
Okay.
So do I have to, am I forced to practice a different religion to be here in this public park?
Or yeah, on Stolen Land, this is the protocol that we use.
Okay, everyone that comes by is asked to put tobacco in the fire, regardless of religion.
There's many people who are religious of different religions that come to do protocol.
It's being respectful to our elder who is here keeping the sacred fire.
So, okay.
So, so just to so I understand, is the fire representative of some sort of like spiritual god?
Am I doing some sort of offering to something?
Or it's a prayer fire, so that can be to whatever God that you are praying to.
It's a prayer fire, it's not definite on any kind of god or religion.
Okay, yeah, it's not specific to any god or religion.
It's kind of like going to the Mandarin buffet restaurant.
Let's see, I'll have a couple of Quranic verses, a chapter from the New Testament.
Oh, this line from the Torah, that looks pretty good.
I guess when you stand for everything, you really stand for nothing.
Strike that because, really, what do these squatters actually stand for, given that they seem wholly unable to articulate their positions?
And joining me now to discuss her descent into tent city madness is Drea Humphrey.
Welcome to Rebel Roundup, Drea.
Hey, good to see you.
Good to see you, my friend.
So, Drea, first of all, who are these people and what do they want?
Because they may talk all about a sacred fire or a sacred circle or a sacred whatever, but that looked like a tennis court to me.
Yeah, well, that is, it was a tennis court, and I guess that's where they have their kitchen and their setup and everything like that.
And I'm not sure who how they became the leaders of the camp or anything like that.
It's quite interesting.
I know while I was talking, someone just came and like handed a coffee over to one of them, like it's just like no big deal.
And it was kind of like they were the queens of the encampment.
You know, it is amazing to me that they are clearly disobeying the laws of the land.
They must be violating several sections of Vancouver's Trespass Act.
And so they're saying, well, we don't recognize the law.
I'm assuming this is unceded land, you know, the whole drill.
And then when someone like you comes over to practice journalism, they're like the heavy-handed colonialists coming down, enforcing their rules, rules that are actually entrenched, they don't follow.
I mean, what I'm getting at, Drea, is that the hypocrisy is stunning here.
It really is.
I mean, at what point as Indigenous people is it okay to do that?
That's the whole complaint is that some people under the name of Christianity, you know, were indoctrinating and colonizing and forcing things on people.
And then here I am, black and indigenous, and I'm being told that I can't go on a public park.
I can't do journalism unless I sort of bow down and do some sort of spiritual offering that I know nothing about.
I mean, it's totally hypocrisy.
Andrea, can we focus too on the law enforcement angle here?
It's clearly illegal what they're doing.
It looks like they've been there for a long time.
We've had in this city in Toronto run-ins with a group of squatters called Afro-Indigenous Rising.
They took over Nathan Phillips Square for three weeks.
They took over Dufferin Grove Park for two weeks.
They're belligerent.
They're violent.
The camps they set up were unhygienic.
They were violating 11 sections of the Trespass Act.
But it seems that the mayor is in the position here of taking the knee and saying, pretty please, won't you go?
Pretty pleased with sugar on top.
I guess what I'm saying is, what is the role of the mayor and law enforcement there in terms of getting these people to obey the law?
Well, I do know that this is pretty much the third encampment.
So it started, you know, at two other locations and then got taken down.
And now it's gone to Strathcona Park and it's kind of blown up.
So I do know that there has been steps before for this type of thing to be removed.
And I think my guess is that they're trying to approach it a little bit differently.
So it is like an ongoing problem.
But the bylaws of the tents having to be taken down every morning at 7 a.m. so that it can be a public park in the day for anybody to walk through.
That's just not being enforced at all.
You know, it's amazing because I think that might have been the same park.
It was definitely a Vancouver park.
Last September, I was in Vancouver.
It was for a different assignment, Drea.
And on local Vancouver radio, all the stations were leading with at 6 p.m., that's it.
The deadline's done.
The cops are coming in.
If the squatters aren't gone, it's going to be basically a forcible removal.
So I whipped over to the park an hour before teardown time, 6 p.m., came and went.
Nothing happened.
There were notices all over the park on the fences.
You have until 6 p.m. to vacate the premises.
Just when I was packing up after I made the video of this being a big nothing burger, I see all these police cruisers, these Vancouver police come.
I go, oh, okay, it's showtime.
Oh, no, Drea.
They were there to escort a protest of people in support of the squatters.
They weren't tearing it down.
They were adding another log onto the fire.
What is going on in this city?
You know, I think it's, as far as I can see, it's an ongoing problem in BC in general.
I know the same thing has happened in Maple Ridge.
I know it's happening right now in Victoria.
So it's really complicated, and I don't know what it is.
I think people are, I think the political correctness has jumped into it.
I think that's a lot of the reason why we don't see the bylaws being enforced or things getting removed when they're supposed to.
Yeah, well, I'm sorry, but you know, and I think you're right.
It is political correctness.
But Lady Justice, she has shown with a blindfold on.
All these kind of factors shouldn't have anything to do with the enforcement of the law.
And if you let this kind of stuff go, you end up with a Portland.
And I would bet you the majority of the citizens in Vancouver are sick and tired of this garbage and they want something to be done.
One last question, Drea.
I thought the most squirm-inducing moment in your video is when you had this white guy and this guy was whiter than Snow White and he's questioning your racial resume in terms of you being allowed to be in this occupied tennis court.
What did you make of that guy's chutzpah?
Oh, it's such a mess.
You know, I don't even think he was questioning.
He was like stating that I wasn't who I was.
I thought it was hilarious.
You know, we're seeing that so much nowadays.
You have these left extreme liberal white people who come after things like black conservatives or in this case, just a black indigenous journalist trying to bring freedom of the press.
And, you know, they're so strong because it's almost like a brainwashing thing.
It's like it's like does not compute.
There is a black indigenous who's not wanting to do exactly what we're doing.
It's like it doesn't compute.
So he was just speaking his mind and going off.
And I'm just like, oh, this is just so illogical, so ridiculous.
And, you know, it's funny, even that young girl, she's just like, no, go away, go away.
Because I don't know.
I don't know where he came from.
He was getting his coffee and felt he knew more about me than I knew about myself, really.
Well, I'll tell you, Drea, my jaw was on the linoleum watching that little interchange.
And I just long for the good old days when people would go to a park to, I don't know, have a picnic, play some baseball.
Now you go to the park and all you do really is play hop, skip, and a jump to avoid the excrement and the needles that are on the ground.
So let's hope somebody mans up in Vancouver and returns the parkland to the citizens who pay for it.
Children Reclaiming the Beach00:12:20
Thank you so much for an excellent report, Drea.
Thank you.
Bye, everyone.
You take care.
And that was Drea Humphrey in Vancouver.
Keep it here.
More of Rebel Roundup to come right after this.
The Ontario government has released its best guess plan for reopening schools in September.
Doug Ford notes that when it comes to keeping our kids safe, I won't take any unnecessary risks.
Well, it looks like the original recommendation by Toronto's leading experts at SickKids Hospital was thrown a political curveball when the updated guidance for school reopening doesn't appear to be based on any science or evidence-based decision-making.
The suggested implementations will have lasting psychological effects, especially to the youngest and most vulnerable pupils.
Not to mention, it looks like they're entirely unnecessary.
That is, if you look at the data.
The guideline published by SickKids is riddled with concerning verbiage such as evidence specific to children and youth on non-medical masks is lacking.
There is a lack of evidence that wearing a non-medical mask prevents SARS-CoV-2 transmission in children and in youth.
There are limited data on the effectiveness on non-medical masks used for source control, but there remains a theoretical benefit, especially for older children and youth.
Studies focusing on SARS-CoV-2 transmission in the school setting are limited.
There is limited evidence on which to base a pre-specified class size.
We can see the reoccurring theme here, limited, lacking, and theoretical.
It's almost as if they all went, well, there's limited data and evidence, but there's a theoretical probability.
So let's implement these psychologically damaging protocols and hope for the best because health and safety first.
So what does the data say?
Check out this screenshot from Ontario's Public Health Epidemiological Stats.
Children are at a 0% risk of death from the Wuhan flu.
There have been zero deaths reported in the province of Ontario in the age groups of 0 to 30.
So follow me here for a second.
If we contrast this with data from the Ministry of Transportation.
Wow.
Children are actually exponentially more likely to die being transported to and from school than they are from the virus.
Well, the solution is obvious, isn't it, folks?
Let's ban commuting, or better yet, let's just ban the automobile.
Yes, of course, I jest, but trust me, there are likely some Greta Tunberg acolytes out there nodding in agreement.
And joining me now to discuss this further is one of our newest Rebel reporters, Tamara Ugalini.
Welcome to Rebel Roundup, Tamara.
Thank you, David.
Pleasure to have you in here.
Tamara, you know, it's very interesting, the Wuhan virus.
When you look at the stats, healthy children, that is the least likely demographic to get the Wuhan virus.
And yet, look at what we're doing.
We have, in this province, we canceled sleepover summer camp for kids, which I think was an absolute atrocious shame.
And now there is this hysteria about going back to school when you showed in your superb report that if you looked at the statistics, when you looked at the science, that's not where the hysteria should be.
And in fact, if anything, we should be directing more resources to long-term care facilities where 82% of the deaths from this virus have occurred.
That's right.
Yeah.
I mean, I think the government, it's been highlighted several times to the Ford government that the people most at risk here are the elderly.
And of course, that military report highlighted the squalor that these poor people are living in.
I mean, that's a disease-breeding environment in and of itself.
So why the focus isn't there and on these poor, elderly, vulnerable populations instead of the children?
And as that graph from Ontario Public Health showed, 0 to 30, like next to zero risk there for that age group.
So, you know, hypocrisy seems to be more and more the new normal.
So what are they thinking?
What are they doing here?
Yeah, what are they doing?
It's funny you say that because yesterday in The Sun, there was a column by Smokey Thompson.
He, of course, is the president of the Ontario, what is it, the Ontario Public Service Employees Union.
And in his column, Tamara, basically what he was saying, it was about going back to school.
He said, it's going to take a lot of work in a short period of time to make it happen.
And then one of his concluding graphs is, we are calling for a brief timeout for all of the players to be part of a plan that puts health and safety first.
In other words, he wants two more weeks of summer vacation for the teachers.
Tamara, the schools have been locked down since mid-March.
They need more time.
I mean, what have they been doing all these months?
Yeah, what is it?
Six months now, two weeks flat in the curve.
And here we are still have best guess solutions for back to school.
I mean, riddled in that sick kids report, you saw it, was a lot of theoreticals and possibilities.
But let's look at the data, let's look at the science, let's get some experts who are, you know, able to do the same and decipher for themselves and provide actual recommendations that make sense.
And again, if we're talking about the health and safety of children, well, let's prioritize their psychological health and emotional, mental, and of course, their actual ability to be in a classroom and learn.
I mean, masking teachers for some of these poor students, they're not going to know what's going on.
They won't be able to understand and decipher what their teacher is even saying to them.
And Tamara, isn't this part of the problem?
You mentioned experts and what the experts are saying.
And yet, if we go back several months, Dr. Teresa Tam was saying, don't wear masks.
On March the 8th, you can look it up, folks.
Dr. Fauci in the U.S., Teresa Tam's equivalent in America, was speaking out against masks.
It was going to do more harm than good.
He said that.
And suddenly they do a 180.
So I don't know, as someone who is not a virologist, I'm getting really confused and concerned about what the real truth is.
That's right.
And I think a lot of people are starting to see that there doesn't seem to be a lot of cohesiveness in these recommendations.
I mean, the government's pretty much been the leading outputter of misinformation.
Throughout the whole COVID-19 pandemic, they told us masks don't work.
We won't need to close down the borders.
The Wuhan flu is going to sail right over Canada.
And I think Teresa Tam even said that closing borders is racist.
Oh, yeah.
Well, I remember Nancy Pelosi saying, go to Chinatown and celebrate Chinese New Year.
And if you don't, you're a racist.
So forget about social distancing back then.
And now, you know, you've got to keep two meters or six feet apart.
When they note even the one meter potentially provides protection.
So it's like, where are these recommendations coming from?
Are they evidence-based?
And why the two meters and not the one if we even, if a highlight like the Sick Kids Report even can highlight that one meter still offers protection.
Well, and to pursue this line of thinking even further, Tamara, we know from the death toll of the Wuhan virus, this is really just a very bad flu season kind of death toll when you look at the numbers.
Not the infections, but the people that actually died.
So if masks are effective and work, then why haven't health authorities for years during flu season being mandating masks?
We know the flu is highly infectious.
So why for those flus were masks not even thought of?
And suddenly for this particular type of flu, if you want to call it that, it's mandatory.
Right.
Yeah, that's a great question.
And I think that as you can research and find the data that shows that masking the general public who've never been educated in how to properly, they call it donning and docking, so the correct way to take on and put on a mask.
I mean, people, the general public have no idea how to do these sorts of protocols.
So what they're doing is actually just increasing their infection risk because they're touching inside of their mask, they're taking it on and off, they're holding it down on their chin.
I mean, they're putting it in their pockets.
That's exactly what Dr. Fauci was saying.
Yeah.
As to why this is worse than going maskless.
So it's crazy.
And yet, you know, Tamara, I just anecdotally, when I'm out and about, I just see so many people complying with this when they're walking alone outdoors, when somebody is driving in their own vehicle by themselves and they're masked up.
And, you know, it's staggering.
And we're going a bit off topic, but, you know, when I first met you, it was in Coburg.
It was for that caper about people reclaiming the beach.
And they found a way around the bylaw.
You could go up the pier and jump into the water and they couldn't do anything about that.
And yet that's public.
That information is out there.
But we spoke off camera.
I thought the people of Coburg and the tourists coming into Coburg would say, hey, here is a lawful way to enjoy that beautiful beach at Coburg.
But nobody, hardly anybody at least, is doing that.
Are they?
Yeah, so well, first of all, there is no bylaw in place in Colberg.
They've just arbitrarily closed off the beach with the fencing.
There's not an actual bylaw in place.
It's just, it's closed, end of story, you can't access the beach.
However, you've always been able to access the beach from the pier and go through into the shoreline.
I mean, there's a lot of gray area with who actually owns that space and what the rights are of the people to access the shoreline of Great Lake.
Now, in Coburg, I think it was 2007, the opposite side of the beach, it's called West Beach in Colberg, and not where we were filming that day, but just west of where we were, about three kilometers, I'd say.
There are homeowners along that shoreline who legitimately own their land.
Their lot line goes, in some instances, I think, up to 20 feet into the water.
And now they were having issues with pedestrians strolling their shorelines.
And so the town actually had a dispute with these homeowners.
And again, I think it was 2007, where the town won that these homeowners couldn't fence off their property lines that go out into the water and couldn't have signage that discriminates against the pedestrians trying to access the shoreline.
So the town knows, they must know that there is a precedence here that people have the legal right to access shorelines.
I mean, there's a lot of safety concerns if people, you know, something happens, you're on a sea dew out in the lake there, which you're allowed, as long as you own a sea dew or you have a boat or a kayak, absolutely that space is free reign.
And if there's ever an incident where you need to get to shore quickly, well, you need to be able to access that shoreline, which has now been completely fenced off.
So it's a bit of a safety concern as well.
And then as you saw when we were there, the seagulls have taken over.
So now it's also not clean.
There's the hygiene of that waterfront now.
I mean, how much is that going to cost to clean up?
Yeah, it's really something.
And, you know, before we wrap, Tamara, we should make mention.
I mean, the way we originally got in touch, it was a fight the fines case.
It was you and your friend strolling on the Coburg Beach.
You were arrested.
You were handcuffed.
You were put in a police cruiser.
I was held in a jail cell.
Taxpayer Dollars and Hockey Games00:07:24
Into a jail cell for almost two hours, I believe.
That's right.
And, you know, we are going to fight those fines for you.
You know, and I guess there's no update.
That hasn't been heard, of course.
But we've got our eye on that.
And isn't that something, folks?
I mean, you might recall last Sunday at Cherry Beach in Toronto, you had those two lunatics with chainsaws descending on the beach, lunging at pedestrians, going after cyclists, sawing apart $4,000 of DJ equipment.
And what was notable was that both individuals have a long criminal record, which begs the question, why aren't they in jail right now?
I wonder, is it because of the social distancing laws freeing violent offenders?
But Tamara Ugolini, holy mackerel, calling all cars, she's strolling on the beaches of Coburg.
What a world, what a world.
Tamara, thank you so much for joining me and keep it here, folks.
More of Rebel Roundup to come right after this.
Hi, sir.
Do you know where Patrick Brown might be?
Yeah, he hasn't showed up yet.
Oh, okay.
He does play here, though, right?
He does.
Oh, okay.
Then that confirms it.
Oh, yeah.
Yeah.
We can't have people just randomly coming in here.
Oh, why is that?
I see a whole bunch of hockey players playing a game, sir.
Well, folks, we're getting the bums rush, but.
Holy mackerel, I think I see Patrick Brown himself.
Hey, how you doing?
Mr. Brown, right?
David Manzi with Rebel News.
You're in a city facility?
What's that?
You're in a city facility?
Yeah, so are you.
So, are you playing hockey here?
No, I'm just coming to check in on our facility.
So I'm going to check you.
You're not supposed to be here, actually.
We were told that you play pickup here.
Mr. Brown, how come the kids in Brampton can only practice sports, but your buddies can play hockey?
So I don't know why you are harassing people in the city of Brampton, but you shouldn't be.
Oh, who's harassing who?
Your guys handed out 122 bylaw violations in one week.
Mr. Brown, why is there a hockey game going on in this arena?
I thought you're only allowed to practice sports, not play them.
And who is paying the $1,000 a day, Mr. Brown, for this rink?
Mr. Brown, are these taxpayer dollars being used for your buddies to play hockey on this rink?
Or are you paying it?
Or perhaps we'll lead Solomon.
So Mr. Brown, why is there one law for me and one law for thee in this city?
Mr. Brown.
And there he goes, like a scared little rat with a mouthful of cheese.
Patrick liar liar, hockey pence on fire, Brown.
And wow, to think this guy was a heartbeat away from becoming Premier of Ontario.
In any event, here's what you had to say about the mayor of Brampton who enforces the Wuhan virus social distancing fines with an iron fist, yet exempts himself from his own edicts.
Justin Blackface Trudeau writes, what is the difference between Brown and Trudeau?
Nothing.
Ouch!
Being compared to Justin, ooh, that's like a slapshot right to the family jewels.
RK writes, are you here to play hockey?
No, I'm just coming to check out our facility.
Cuts to his name on a hockey bag.
Yeah, I know, RK.
Smoking gun evidence, right?
But oh, not so fast.
He told the news website, The Pointer, that hockey bag was probably one of the bags he gave away to friends who forgot to simply remove the name tag.
Just one hitch.
Why was that particular bag full of equipment?
Shouldn't the friend have been on the ice by this point?
Can you even believe this guy on anything?
Valerie J. writes, this story is exactly the type of story the government bought and paid for media will not cover.
Thank you, Rebel and the Menzoid, for exposing their hypocrisy.
Ah, contraire, Valerie.
Media party members such as News Talk1010 and the Brampton Guardian are indeed covering this story, but they are doing so in a way that allows Patrick Brown to spew more lies about his conduct and to make defamatory remarks about Rebel News.
Way to go, you bought and paid for jerks.
Jerry Price writes, so police are called because the reporter has interfered in a game.
Yes, Jerry, the police were called, but I didn't interfere with any hockey game.
Alas, the practice of journalism in Canada is getting ever so closer to becoming a criminal offense in certain jurisdictions, it would seem.
Scow fan75 writes, that face when he got caught was priceless.
Oh yes, it was almost as good as the face he donned after getting booted from the PC Party of Ontario back in January 2018.
Oh, and that crybaby, did he ever run away from the media on that day too?
Ian R writes, that was fantastic.
The mayor looked like an eight-year-old kid caught with his hand in the biscuit tin, a mouthful of biscuits and covered in crumbs.
In fact, an eight-year-old is smart enough to know the game is up.
and to not bother trying to lie his way out of trouble.
This idiot doubles down and leaves his kit bag there with his name on it.
While watching this, my family came out to see what I was laughing at.
If you watch it frame by frame, you can see the moment he realizes he's gone.
Thank you, Rebel News.
You made my day.
Good day from Australia.
Well, thank you, Ian.
And say, how about we export Patrick to Down Under?
He could still play hockey there, field hockey, that is, on a girls' team.
And Arctic Mongoose writes, so Patrick puts out a tweet addressing this unarguable story with less than 50 words.
His tweet contains at least five blatant lies.
So what are you saying, Mayor Brown?
I guess you are saying that CTV would be your pick for a credible news source?
LOL.
Good one, Arctic Mongoose.
I wonder how his defamation suit against CTV is going regarding those allegations of sexual misconduct.
Oh, and Patrick, you might be headed back to court in the near future on a defamation matter.
Except this time, my friend, you are going to be the defendant, Capisch.
Well, that wraps up another edition of Rebel Roundup.
Thanks so much for joining us.
See you next week.
And hey, folks, never forget, without risk, there can be no glory.