Robbie Picard, Indigenous advocate and Oil Sandstrong founder, challenges media narratives after Chief Alan Adam’s RCMP altercation—11-minute dash cam footage shows repeated confrontations, contradicting initial claims of unprovoked brutality. Picard criticizes selective reporting, like Greta Thunberg’s premature tweet, and dismisses ties to historical Indigenous issues, arguing activists exploit minor incidents (e.g., Abbotsford’s 940-barrel oil leak) to halt projects like Trans Mountain Expansion despite their economic benefits. He warns Canada risks decline without oil/gas recovery, accuses anti-oil groups of promoting socialism, and compares the case to Covington Catholic media bias, urging full evidence before judgment. [Automatically generated summary]
Oh hi Rebels, you're listening to a free audio-only recording of my weekly Wednesday night show, The Gun Show.
However, as you are well aware, this is the internet, so you can probably just, you know, like listen to this whenever you feel like.
Tonight, my guest is Robbie Picard from Oil and Gas Strong.
We're talking about recent incidents in Fort McMurray and accusations of systemic racism by the RCMP there.
But we're also talking about one of my favorite topics, Greta Tunberg, and all things oil and gas.
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Is there systemic racism from the RCMP in Fort McMurray?
I'm Sheila Gunn-Reed and you're watching The Gunn Show.
One isolated incident in Fort McMurray that we still don't have the full context,
video evidence, and investigation of, somehow evidence of systemic racism against Indigenous people by the RCMP writ large.
Well, if you watch the news coverage about what happened to Chief Alan Adam a couple of months ago outside of a casino during a traffic stop, you would definitely think that way.
Alan Adam recently held a press conference just now, piggybacking on the BLM protest to show his black eye and busted up face after an altercation with Fort McMurray RCMP.
Adam also showed a cell phone video of the altercation at that press conference.
Now, the RCMP were universally condemned based on that information, but now more information is trickling out.
A full 11-minute dash cam video was released by the RCMP that gives far greater context to what actually happened.
Now, I've been doing my best to stay completely out of this until all the facts roll in before I weigh in.
And that's where I'm still at on this issue.
I know there can be bad cops, especially when I know one bent the arm of my friend Kian Bexty behind his back when Kian was just trying to do journalism.
But I also know that there are really great cops doing dangerous work to protect their communities from harm.
Now, since this happened in Fort McMurray, and I know an expert on all things Fort McMurray, and he's someone who's an absolute advocate for the Indigenous community, I thought I'd invite him on the show to discuss the effect of these horrible accusations on the people of Fort McMurray.
So joining me to discuss this and also some mouthing off by that little urchin, Greta Thunberg, and the Trans Mountain Pipeline is Robbie Picard from Oil Sandstrong in an interview we recorded yesterday afternoon.
Yeah.
OK.
So joining me now from his home in Fort McMurray is my friend Robbie Picard from Oil Sandstrong.
Robbie, thank you so much for coming on the show.
Thank you for having me.
I wanted to have you on the show because you sort of touch on all the issues that I wanted to talk about.
First of all, you are Indigenous, but you're also an advocate for Indigenous businesses and Indigenous prosperity.
You are pro-oil and gas.
But more than anything, you are the biggest booster of any community that I've ever seen.
You are so pro-Fort McMurray.
And you're sort of a refugee to Fort McMurray.
You didn't grow up there.
You just love it there.
And I wanted to have you on the show because Fort McMurray is in the spotlight right now with all the BLM protests and talks of systemic racism.
An Indigenous chief in your region, one that has taken money from tides, but he's also pro-oil and gas and he needs to be, Chief Alan Adam, has accusations against the police in Fort McMurray of police brutality.
And initially we saw the photographs of Chief Alan Adam and his face after the altercation with the RCMP.
And then subsequently we saw a bystanders video footage of that altercation.
And then we saw the police dash cam footage of the altercation.
And I know some media outlets are only showing the altercation and not the full context lead up.
And I think there's a reason for that.
But I wanted to have you on to talk to you about this because you're in Fort McMurray.
You care about Fort McMurray.
I wanted to ask you how the community is feeling about this.
And then I wanted to ask you sort of your take on everything to start.
I know that's big.
It's big, but you're a big guy.
You can do it.
Out of all the times that you've interviewed me, I'll have to say this is the one that I've definitely, I've been thinking about it.
And I knew that this would probably be the first question you were asking today.
So I typically never prepare.
And I have, actually, I never, I still have, don't prepare for.
I always just answer the questions.
So I will start from the start.
At the first, when the first bystander video came out, pretty much everyone was leaning towards Chief Adam and very, very concerned for what happened.
And then later on, when you saw the, you have to watch the full 11 minutes, the very first officer I thought, you know, should get, definitely get a medal for patience.
The followout, of course, you know, the takedown, and then there's debate whether it was justified, if it was too hard or not.
At the end of the day, though, it's a very, very, very disturbing video on multiple fronts.
But the one thing I'd like to point out, though, is that I do think that there's this new wave of not accepting responsibility for our own actions.
And yeah, it's concerning when you have a leader calling them on multiple times, getting out of the car multiple times.
At the same time, the one issue that I am shocked by, and I am struggling with myself right now, is the amount of people that are very upset with the RCMP in all walks of my life right now.
Whether it's reporters being taken away briskly from covering the prime minister to business leaders that I know that say, you know, in this particular situation, you know, that, you know, like, let's just be honest, Chief Adams is not totally clean in this.
I mean, if he didn't call the cop on, if it wasn't for the takedown, the first cop probably, you know, would have probably got an award for patience.
At the same time, I'm finding myself so conflicted right now because so many people I know are upset with the police.
And you have this movement of people talking about defunding, getting rid of the police.
And they're the same people that, you know, if someone was trying to break into their house or rob them, that they would be the first to call the police.
So if any good comes out of this, I hope that there's a serious discussion about why people are so upset in general in the world right now.
Overall, I mean, I still think Fort McMurray is pretty great.
You know, we had the massive Black Lives Matter protest, and other than a couple, you know, tense moments, it was very peaceful, and everybody, you know, everybody kind of got on with it.
So I'm very, very concerned right now.
Also, very cautious on how to approach every situation I'm in right now.
Yeah, I think that's important to say because I think especially when dealing with police and dealing with everybody, you sort of have to take these things on a case-by-case basis, as there are good people and there are bad people.
There are good cops and there are bad cops.
And those people are only responsible for their own actions, not this collective guilt and systemic problems like that.
And I noticed very wisely from the very beginning, you said, okay, I want to see a full and complete investigation into what happened to Chief Alan Adam without taking sides, without hearing one side of the story, without tarring everybody with the same brush.
You said, I want a complete investigation.
And I frankly don't think that we are done seeing the evidence yet.
We've seen one dash cam.
Are there more?
Is there casino footage?
Because this happened outside of a casino.
That's also why I haven't weighed in.
I think we sort of need to pump the brakes and get an entire picture of what happened as opposed to one photo, then a short cell phone video, selectively context removed in some instances, dash cam footage, if you get your news from the mainstream media.
There's so much more to this story.
However, it hasn't stopped people from weighing in, has it?
No, and one thing I think that is very important is clarity.
And you need to know what people's intentions are.
But the who, what, where, and why seems to be lacking in media now.
You know, the old W-5, because it's very unfortunate because it's just if something doesn't suit a narrative, it just doesn't go the distance.
You know, for instance, I was looking at, like, I'm a huge Howard Stern fan.
Blackface and Beyond00:07:05
I have been for years, but Howard Stern over the years has gone very to the left.
And there, I mean, he did Blackface multiple times.
And it's come out.
And but because Howard Stern is sort of on the left now, they, you know, he's not getting attacked for it.
But if someone on the right did Blackface, I mean, it would be council culture, shut them down.
End of story.
So it's very much, you know, like, for instance, like, you know, if Andrew Scheer did blackface, I mean, we'd still be hearing about it, but Justin Trudeau can do blackface, you know, 10, 12 times, and it's okay.
So I mean, there, I mean, there's something, there needs to be a correction in society if we're actually going to get along that gets us back to the middle.
You know, but I'm definitely, you know, I'm finding myself just very cautious, more cautious than normal right now.
But I am concerned because like if we don't get a reality check and find a way to move society forward, I think we're going to, you know, we're going to seriously, we're going to have some serious problems that I don't know if we're going to be able to recover when, when, you know, if, and we could very much be on the verge of collapse.
And it's sad because, you know, I just made a post today.
Like, honestly, there's never been a better time to live in Fort McMurray.
I mean, they just put the pride flag up a couple days ago.
You have a Black Lives Matters, you know, event in downtown Fort McMurray.
You have more multiculturalism than I've ever seen.
The one thing that, you know, I did take issue with Black Lives Matters is one of our city councilors, her name was Jane Stroud, got up and this at the Black Lives Matters thing, she was kind of, I guess, misstoked to what you're supposed to say at that event.
And she said, all lives matter.
And I mean, they attacked her viciously.
And the one lady from Black Lives Matters is a teacher at a school, you know, she started going on to her about the 60s scoop and all this stuff.
And the truth is that Jane Stroud, like actually, like, I haven't always agreed with some of her political decisions, but I respect how she's worked for the Indigenous communities in the rural areas and has her entire career.
I guarantee you, done more for Indigenous people than that teacher from the school.
And like, she wouldn't hear it.
I mean, Jane actually got driven off and wasn't allowed.
Like, they drove her off.
So, I mean, how can you have a dialogue if you're going to shut people down if they disagree with your narrative?
And two, you cannot judge anyone's life experience at all by how they look.
And I think that that's wrong to make on any front.
You cannot just look at someone and assume you understand their challenges or what they've been through.
And that's sort of my take on that.
Yeah, that's a really great point that, you know, this town councillor who has spent her life working to better Indigenous communities, she wasn't progressive enough because she didn't police her own language at a BLM protest.
And so she's run off by people who would never do the things that she's done and never work as hard as she has for the betterment of Indigenous communities.
But that's how it is.
That's what council culture is all about.
People, people who play the language games properly, but actually don't do anything else, they're the ones running the show now.
And it is crazy.
And you're right, it is very dangerous times.
Now, These, even though there's still a full investigation going on into the actions of these police officers with Chief Alan Adam, Greta Tunberg from her perch across the ocean, she's weighed in and convicted them.
She sent a tweet that said, I met with Chief Alan Adam in Fort McMurray last autumn.
I bet she did.
And I'm shocked by his shameful abuse by the RCMP, very disturbing to see.
So she's basically, before all the evidence is in, convicted our national police force of systemic racism against an Indigenous elder.
what do you think about that?
You know, I had a conversation about Greta Thunberg the other day.
One of my regrets is when she was here is I did not confront her.
Is that a regret?
I don't know.
I chose to stand down.
And here's my simple word.
We don't need the opinion of a 17-year-old girl across the ocean who has a larger carbon footprint than she possibly wants to admit on every Canadian issue.
I think it's a sad state of affairs that the world has been influenced by her.
I don't think she's overly intelligent.
I don't think she's that knowledgeable about any issues.
The issues here with Indigenous people are complex.
And after the second video came out, people are very divided again on this on multiple fronts.
There's also, I mean, there's another generation of people that look up to leadership.
My mentors in life have mostly been Indigenous people and women, to be honest with you.
And I have huge respect for a lot of, you know, the people in the Fort McMurray that are older and Indigenous.
You know, Chief Jim Boucher.
I was very, like, I, you know, Nicole, I mean, she's a friend of mine.
There's several others, the Glossy family, like these are hardworking Indigenous leaders that I've always respected and love the way they've conducted themselves.
And they've, you know, I've learned how to work harder on my own self-improvement.
So I say, you know, before we really comment, we need to wait for the full investigation to be over.
And then I think there's two fronts that need to be looked at.
You need to look at his behavior and how he responded and get to the root cause of why is there such hate towards the RCMP right now?
And I think you need to analyze both equally.
And everyone in all aspects of my life right now is, you know, they're having some issues.
But I will say, like for me personally, like I've had to dial 911 running nightclubs many times.
And, you know, when you're in a situation where you're under threat, when someone's physically going to harm you, or, you know, you call the cops, I don't believe that is going to change in society.
And in the places that the police are not responding right now, like I mean, some of the states are complete disaster.
You're going to, you know, your criminals will find a way to climb up to the top.
Small Leak, Big Impact00:03:29
So, I mean, we're definitely in a very delicate stage right now.
Yeah.
And I was just thinking as you were talking about Greta Tunberg using her private security force to get handsy with Kian Becksty in Sweden.
So she didn't care about overuse of force back then when it was protecting her from pesky questions from a pesky reporter.
I wanted to ask you about Trans Mountain because there was just a very small, actually when you don't measure it in teaspoons the way the media is doing, very small leak.
They caught it very early in Abbotsford at the Sumis pump station.
If you read the headlines, 150,000 liters of oil, the company says, well, that's about 940 barrels.
So that's actually really small.
They caught it really early.
It's quick cleanup.
Actually, I think it's already cleaned up.
It was just like two days worth of cleanup and it's ready to go.
But now the activists are using this as a reason to stop the twinning of that pipeline with a new state-of-the-art version of the same pipeline there.
They're mad because a 60-year-old pipeline leaked.
And so that is, for some reason, they think that's a reason to stop the upgrade of the pipeline into something far more state-of-the-art.
You know, honestly, that pipeline is an amazing accomplishment.
I mean, you're going to have the odds spill here and there.
The fact that they caught it and fixed it immediately and the lives keep going as normal.
And British Columbia, who benefited in the millions and millions of dollars that that pipeline has brought them in prosperity.
To me, it's such a non-issue.
Fix it, build a new pipeline, become better at it.
We are at a state where, you know, if we don't finish this pipeline and get our oil to markets, we will gradually, gradually, you know, slowly see ourselves fall apart as a country.
I'm concerned, you know, I mean, if we want an economic recovery from the coronavirus or COVID-19, we have to rebuild our economy and oil is the best way to do that.
So they're going to be crybabies over any little thing over and over again.
What I would say, though, is they should watch Michael Moore's documentary, Plan of the Humans.
And if they want to cry about something, they can cry about the mass devastation that so-called green energy causes, the amount of birds that die, bats that die, insects that die because of it.
If they actually cared about improving the world, they would not just focus on a pipeline who has ran almost perfectly for 60 years.
Now, I wanted to ask you, it's interesting that you brought up jobs because that was the next thing I wanted to talk to you about.
The jobs numbers are in for the Fort McMurray region, and they're not good because of the coronavirus shutdown, plus negative oil prices.
Fort McMurray, Wood Buffalo region lost 2,600 jobs in May.
It's the highest unemployment since April 2016.
Is the community feeling that?
Jobs Numbers Dwindle00:11:07
Do you think?
Yeah, we're in a weird space.
Like, you know, we have the flood, and then we've had the low oil prices, and then you had COVID-19 still recovering from the wildfire.
I don't even know how to gauge it or where to start.
I do know that some businesses are booming.
There's some people doing stuff, and slowly but surely we are getting, you know, getting a handle on things here.
I'm optimistic.
I do think that oil is going to go up fairly quickly.
And I think that, you know, once this COVID stuff is over, you'll see us come back.
And I also foresee a little bit of a tourism boom because there's going to be a lot of local tourism in Alberta now because people aren't going too far.
So I'm hoping we can benefit from that.
But yeah, like, I mean, we've been, it's hard, Sheila.
Like, it's hard to gauge because we've just been through so much all the time.
Like, you know, it's a little blurp here, a little blurp there.
But what I will say, though, is like, you know, if we, you know, I'm confident if they get that pipeline going, that you'll see some boom here.
You'll see some projects because your capacity will go up and you'll see more projects start.
A couple of final things.
How do you feel about Greta Tunberg getting a spider named after her?
She's been the time person of the year.
Now she's got a special spider named after her.
Oh my God.
Is it a black widow?
I don't know what kind of yarn it spins, but it's something to do with climate change.
They've named a spider in Indonesia after this kid.
She hasn't even graduated high school.
I don't get it.
I don't understand the fascination with her because she's, I mean, when you speak, there's not a lot of, I don't think she's brilliant.
I think I would mop the floor with her in a debate any day.
I think most people would.
I don't think she can handle, I think she's a spoilt little child who's slightly narcissistic, who has fits when she doesn't get her way.
And if you question her or throw her off, I think she'd like, I mean, even when I saw what Kian did, I mean, it's not like she'd like, I mean, at that age, I could have argued.
My little foster sisters, I mean, they could out-argue me at 16, no problem.
You know, they were spunky and you could argue with them and question them.
With her, she's protected with this glass bubble.
Like, you can't call her out.
You can't say anything negative about her.
But I do think people are catching on to her.
I think that the world is kind of tired of her.
But I mean, we have to be honest, she has a massive platform and the media picks up on what she says.
So, I mean, as much as we'd like her 15 minutes to be over, it's not.
And I think she's one of those people who will be around for quite a while tweeting and chiming in on things that are far beyond her comprehension.
One last thing.
Tides Canada, the anti-oil charity that doesn't actually do charity work, they've rebranded themselves to be called Make Way because they're tired of people defining who they are and what they do, I guess, through evidence and tax records and things like the tar sands campaign.
They've rebranded themselves.
Do you think that has to do with activism by people like you?
Because I firmly believe that they have been forced after 20 some odd years to change who they are and try to whitewash their history because of activism like people like you from people like you, which means that while you might not be moving the needle policy-wise, however, I think with Jason Kenney in charge, that's changing.
You are forcing the anti-oil movement to try to memory hole their own history.
You notice periodically, like they, I guess the other side, they try and they do do that often.
They change their name or they start a new group periodically.
I'm not surprised by it.
I think Tides has become quite a negative brand.
They come up all the time, tides, tides, tides.
The campaign against the tar sands, I think it's unfortunate that when it first came out, I guess when Ezra pointed it out a long time ago, that it didn't take the, we didn't all rally behind it to stop it or call it out then.
But yeah, I imagine, I mean, I believe our advocacy has had a massive effect.
On our side, it's unfortunate that you don't have more advocates in the actual seats that, you know, pay the bucks and that we need to, you know, people like me have to like, you know, subsidize our advocacy through, you know, doing videos or through our businesses.
But it is what it is.
But yes, we've made a major difference.
I mean, the rallies that we did across this country, build that pipe, build that pipe, calling people out, standing up to Jane Fonda, and even signing up to Sephora Berman, who, you know, I mean, she's been a lot quieter since that lovely press conference.
But at the same time, I mean, she still got $2 million to grant to study how to stop, you know, to cancel fossil fuels on a different front.
I do believe that we need to look closer at municipalities.
We've been focused provincially and federally, but locally, our mayors and our local offices, I do think that that, I mean, the other side, they're very intelligent.
What they do is they get into politics.
They become staffers.
They become.
They colonize everything.
Yep.
Yeah.
I mean, I know of an Indigenous group, and I didn't even realize it, but they, you know, they, the guy that came and then they hired all the staff.
Like, I mean, all of a sudden, like, there's all these people from, you know, they're not really part of this Indigenous group, but they, they were all hired as staff.
So, I mean, definitely, it's definitely, you know, worth looking at for sure.
But I also, for my organization, Oil and Gas Strong, I'm trying to go back to being a little bit more nonpartisan than I was.
I found myself leaning a little right.
And I want to try and just, you know, remind people that, you know, no matter who you vote for, the benefit of oil and gas for you personally and feeding your family and feeding your grandkids and stability as a country benefits us all.
And I mean, I don't believe that it's ever been about oil sands or climate change.
I think you're seeing it now.
There's a narrative to move us towards socialism or, you know, like communism.
And it's very unfortunate because we have it really good right now.
We do, even now.
I mean, COVID-19, I mean, look, look, people still got two grand a month.
I mean, businesses got money.
I mean, it could be way worse.
It could be way, way, way worse, you know?
And yet we are completely, you know, completely hell-bent on destroying what's working.
Capitalism works in this country.
We're very lucky to live here.
And I mean, it could be improved.
I'm terrified.
I'm just terrified of the lack of accountability for one's own actions and this notion that you're somehow responsible for everything that has gone wrong.
It's not your fault.
And so I do believe that you need to own your own actions.
And I think that that's what we need to focus on as a society.
And if we just got our oil to market, we'd have more jobs.
And if we took our, I mean, look at the wealth of Saudi Arabia.
Look at the wealth of Norway.
If we act, we have, we are far a superior country to them in so many ways.
If we just said, look, like we're no longer going to, you know, be treated like we're not valuable.
And like Stephen Harper said, like, you know, like we're a world energy superpower.
Imagine the country we could have.
But I mean, I don't know if we'll ever get to that point.
Robbie, thank you for being so generous with your time.
I want to give you a chance to let everybody know where they can get those amazing sweatshirts that sometimes people will see me wearing on air from Oil and Gas Strong and how they can support the work that you do.
Because I firmly believe you've scared Tides Canada so much they had to change their name.
And they get millions and millions and millions of dollars to do the work that they do when you do it on a shoestring budget and you brought those people to their knees.
So please tell people how they can support you.
So we just upgraded our website.
Go to oilandgasstrong.com or oilsandstrong.com.
Bear in mind, there's a few little tweaks to it, but it looks pretty good actually.
And yeah, and then just like us on our Facebook page, Oil and Gas Strong on Facebook.
That's great.
Robbie, is that everything?
Is that the only place to go?
Perfect.
Also, follow you on Twitter because you could use some Twitter.
Yeah, but Twitter's never been my strong state.
I have moments where I do well on Twitter.
So I'm on Twitter at Robbie Picard and then at Oil Sandstrong.
I think it's Picard Robbie, actually.
Maybe that's why you're not getting followers.
You're giving it the wrong Twitter account.
That's Picard Robbie.
Cool.
Thank you.
Yes.
Thanks, Robbie.
We'll have you on the show really, really soon.
Thanks.
Awesome.
If there's one thing I know about the mainstream media, it's that they don't like to learn.
They will rush to judge because that judgment lines up with their own political narrative.
Let's look back at the Covington Catholic School Boys.
Those boys were painted as white male privileged because of a short clip of them standing face to face with an Indigenous man protester at the March for Life last year.
But once the full context of the video came in, the boys were not the white privileged perpetrators, but rather the peaceful stoic victims of aggression.
And the media, well, they're paying the full price for that as the lawsuits from those boys roll in because the mainstream media rushed to ruin their reputations because what the media thought was happening completely lined up with their anti-male, anti-pro-life, anti-religious narrative.
They just wanted it to be true so much so that they just couldn't wait till all the facts were revealed.
Hope For Facts00:00:30
And that's what I'm trying to do right now.
I'm willing to be open-minded with what happened to Chief Alan Adam, but I want all the facts on the table before I make the decision about whether this was good cops or an aggressive chief.
And I hope, I hope my media colleagues do the same, but you know what?
They probably won't.
Well, everybody, that's the show for tonight.
Thank you so much for tuning in.
I'll see everybody back here in the same time, in the same place next week.