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Aug. 24, 2006 - Rush Limbaugh Program
36:23
August 24, 2006, Thursday, Hour #2
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The Rush Limbaugh program on the Excellence in Broadcasting Network.
If you're wondering where Rush is, well, uh unfortunately he's been replaced by an undocumented worker.
Uh this is Mark Stein from today.
And Walter Williams, uh all American boy, will be back tomorrow.
But uh but for now it's uh it's great to be here.
Uh what a fantastic country.
I never thought, I never thought, as I uh scrambled through the darkness across the border, that in uh just just thirty-six hours late I'd be hosting the Rush Limbaugh Show.
What a fantastic country.
Uh we're talking uh talking about a lot of uh interesting topics today, but one thing I do want to get back to is something that Rush touched upon earlier in the week.
And this is the question of uh of patriotism.
You know, it there's something very psychologically weird, I think, about the uh Democrat line that whenever you criticize their criticisms, they say, are you questioning my patriotism?
And it shouldn't actually it shouldn't take a foreigner like me to point this out, but there's something very weird uh just psychologically in the idea that somehow criticizing John Kerry is what this is all about.
There's a great big huge global existential struggle going on.
Uh not just uh involving the United States, but in Bali, in Madrid, in London, in Chechnya, in the Balkans, uh in Sudan, in Nigeria, all over the world, and yet whenever uh whenever you uh criticize anything the Democratic Party says about it, they go, Oh, John Kerry goes, Oh, are you questioning my patriotism?
And this idea that uh that uh dissent is the highest form of patriotism, which uh Ted Kennedy attributes to Thomas Jefferson.
Thomas Jefferson never said that dissent is the highest form of patriotism, and it's highly unlikely he ever would have said it, because it's a really dumb thing.
And what I find so weird about that, this idea that dissent is the highest uh form of patriotism, is that's only true uh if you don't dissent from what John Kerry and Ted Kennedy are saying.
If you if you dissent from the John Ken uh John Kerry Ted Kennedy uh uh view on Iraq, then you're questioning their patriotism.
This is this is crazy stuff.
So we want to talk uh today about whether it is time to question the patriotism of uh of Democrats.
Uh Rush talked about this the other day, and uh in fact so did the president.
He was asked a question about it directly.
Let's hear that uh clip.
Leaving before the job would be done would send a message that America really is no longer engaged nor cares about the form of governments in the Middle East.
Leaving before the job would done would be send a signal to our troops that the sacrifices they made were not worth it.
Leaving before the job is done would be a disaster.
And that's what we're saying.
I will never question the patriotism of somebody who disagrees with me.
This has nothing to do with patriotism.
It has everything to do with understanding the world in which we live.
I want to respectfully disagree with the president on the last part of what he said.
I am going to challenge the patriotism of people who disagree with him because the people who disagree with him want to lose.
And I want to ask you people a question what it what what what is patriotic about losing?
How come we can't question the patriotism people who are actively engaged in sabotaging victory over this enemy?
Why can't we question their patriotism?
We most certainly can, and we most certainly should.
Damn straight we sh- I'm tired of pussyfooting around this so that we don't hurt anybody's feelings and challenge their patriotism.
We've said for all these years, I'm not challenging your patriotism, I'm just challenging your judgment.
Well, hell's bells.
It's about time we do challenge their patriotism.
The far left fringe in this country is actively seeking our defeat.
A wacko judge in Michigan actively seeking our defeat.
Jimmy Carter actively seeking our defeat.
Bill Clinton and John Kerry and Al Gore may as well be seeking our defeat.
So should Ned Lament.
Why can't we simply say what is patriotic about seeking our defeat?
Seems to me we should be saying that.
Their judgment is skewed.
Their judgment is crazy.
The president says, uh, understanding the world in which we live, who knows whether they understand the world in which we live.
We can't afford to take time to figure that out.
We don't have the time to worry about whether they understand the just like we don't have time to figure out why they hate us.
We don't have time to figure that out.
That's irrelevant to the to the mission, if you want to use that word or uh or to the cause.
So let it ring out from the mountaintops here at the EIB Limbaugh Institute.
We do question their patriotism.
If they want us to lose, what the hell is it about patriotism that makes us want to lose?
What is patriotic about wanting to lose against this enemy?
Amen, brother.
I agree with Rush.
Uh I I think we have a little pronunciation thing going here or pronunciation.
I uh I keep saying patriotism, he keeps saying patriotism.
But if it's uh uh if it's uh offensive, if it's offensive to question their patriotism, I'm gonna question their patriotism.
Uh you know, this is interesting.
I was in when I was down in Australia, the Australian government uh is doing incredibly well in the polls just from questioning the opposition's patriotism, because they understand that when you're in a war, the cho the choice is whether you want to win it or do you want to lose it.
Uh the the foreign minister, this one the reason why he's my favorite foreign minister, Alexander Downer, he was asked this question in Parliament uh about uh Iraq from the opposition, and uh and he thwacked it back across the aisle with this magnificently uh low line about how for the leader of the opposition, his constant companion is the white flag.
Amen.
The constant companion of Ted Kennedy and John Kerry and Nancy Pelosi and Howard Dean is the white flag.
It's all white flag talk.
All this talk, the minute you get it, what kind of serious country, the minute it gets into a war, uh starts talking about exit strategy, saying, oh, well, you know, it's uh we got into this war, now we have to think about how we get home.
The exit strategy is victory, and anything, any exit strategy short of victory profoundly damages the United States.
And the idea that you can somehow be this uh this great big a super comfortable isolationist hyperpower uh and uh and just uh l either lose wars or have wars that end inconclusively, like uh the uh the first Gulf War or this uh Cockamami thing in uh in Kosovo.
No one even remembers uh who the good guys or the bad guys were over there now or what it was we were there for.
The idea that you can be a superpower and not win wars against relatively uh uh uh uh uh against relatively small uh uh forces with significantly weaker military power, the idea that you can stay a superpower is is preposterous.
So yes, if the only contribution you have to make to the war is about how we need to get out, how it's a quagmire, uh how it's a disaster, then yes, uh it is time to question uh question your patriotism.
Uh so let's talk about the uh let's talk about the Democrats and the war and whether this uh this kind of um uh I guess this uh this kind of politeness about the whole thing, which certainly uh, as I said, the Australian government doesn't do with its enemies, whether this politeness is in fact a large part of the President's problems, that simply by declining to uh question uh their uh the these guys' patriotism, he hands them an or enormous rhetorical advantage.
That in fact we d we talk about the war now in democrat terms, in uh how we can get out of it.
What's the exit strategy?
Exit strategy is for losers.
Serious countries don't have exit strategies.
Uh and it's unbecoming to a great nation to talk about uh to talk about serious issues in in that way.
I would love to know.
I mentioned Joe Biden's uh uh rethink his five-point plan for Iraq.
The great thing about Joe Biden's five-point plan is that three of the points are already in the Iraqi Constitution.
His idea for running a decentralized federation.
Uh old Joe Lieberman, uh, when he was running for president, whatever it was 15, 16 years ago, plagiarized uh Neil Kiddock, the Labour leader.
That, by the way, shows you what a smart guy he was.
The British Labour leader, Neil Kindock, that uh that uh Joe Lieberman plagiarized was one of the most reliable losers in British politics.
So uh and and uh as it uh turned out, so approved for Joe Biden.
He's now plagiarizing the Iraqi constitution.
They they've already thought of these ideas.
They've got a great decentralized constitution.
What they need uh to know is that America is behind them.
And if you watch CNN International and CNN International makes CNN domestic look like the Rush Limbaugh show, it's uh it's an incredible thing.
But if you watch CNN International like all these uh insurgents are doing sitting in their uh s sitting in their hideouts, you'd think that America was just this big fleshy, effete uh wimpy guy in the lazy boy recliner, ready just to keel over and curl up into the fetal position and cry at the first opportunity.
And why do you think that?
Because every time you see a Democrat on TV, every time you see Nancy Pelosi or Howard Dean, that's what they sound like.
Uh so let's talk about whether it's time uh for the President and the administration to rethink this uh strategy uh in terms of fighting an opposition that it seems to have no interest in the war other than to lose it.
You saw what happened to a responsible Democrat uh Joe Lieberman uh in Connecticut.
Uh Uh clearly there's not a lot to be gained for the Democrats in uh in going down that route.
But it's at some point, if that party is the defeatist party, if it's the party of surrender, then they have to be called on that.
Because what is patriotic as Rush says, what is patriotic about wanting to lose a war?
Nobody in uh in many uh in many countries uh they they would have been uh it would have been called treasonous behavior to have no contribution other than to say everything's a disaster and to want to to uh to lose the war.
Uh let's go to uh Susan in uh in Santa Barbara uh who uh who uh who's uh who wants to talk about this issue.
Susan you're on the air on the Rush Limbaugh show thank you so much.
I just wanted to make a uh comment that the last time that I looked up patriotism in the dictionary it said to show love and pride in your country and that doesn't sound a bit like anything anyone in the Democratic Party is saying.
No, you're absolutely right there their idea is that we're the we're the country that needs to go to the United Nations and make amends and apologize to the global community and and in in effect allow other countries to have to have a veto over American foreign policy.
And you're right that whatever that means it isn't love of country.
Exactly I mean pride in your country and love of your country how much further does it go that I don't hate the president I mean you y you know that that that's you know if you don't if you don't agree with him that's one thing but to hate him and to disrespect him so is is unbelievable.
Absolutely right and the and the tragedy uh of the Democratic party is that for them the issue is is the President.
The I this absurd idea that somehow uh the war is just some cookie thing that he decided to uh to to basically cook up to improve his numbers.
It's not it's going on on every continent on this planet in Africa, in Asia, in the Pacific, uh in Russia uh there is a global jihad that these guys are waging against other nations on the boundary between the uh Muslim world and the rest of the world.
And uh if you're not serious about that and if you've got nothing to say about it except to say that everything the President is doing is wrong and we need to bring our troops down and uh hunker down in the fetal position, then sorry, it is time to question your patriotism.
You're not making any useful contribution.
And in a two party system it doesn't help when one of the parties is just nuts and has just flown the coupe on it.
This is Mark Stein on the uh Rush Limbaugh Show.
We will be back with more in just a moment.
Mark Stein for Rush on the EIB network 1 800 28282.
Walter Williams will be here with you tomorrow.
Let's uh let's go to Anthony in New Orleans.
Uh we're talking about uh whether it's time to question the patriotism or patriotism of the Democratic Party.
Anthony you're on the air uh yes uh I uh I'm a Marine Reserve uh and uh I fought in Fallujah in two thousand four and uh also in Ramadi right after that.
Right.
They're two tough towns.
Yes uh well what I would like to talk about is you know they took they say how we're losing the war.
Well look at Fallujah now as to what it was before.
It was a militant town we went in there we wiped them out and look at it now they say it's one of the safest cities in Iraq right now.
Yeah you're at you're absolutely right I was in I was in Fallujah about uh I think three or four weeks after the war I went uh d I was uh driving through there and I stopped and had lunch and about a year later when those fellows were killed in Fallujah uh you naturally think well my God that's uh that's terrible and and could it have happened to me and the reason it didn't happen to me I think three or four weeks I mean I've no doubt that that luncheon joint that uh cafe, that restaurant that was full of people who would have liked to kill me.
But the reason uh the reason they didn't was at that time America was seen as the strong horse as Osama bin Laden puts it and uh was uh tough and in control and what happened in the course of the next year is that with all this uh talking down the war from the Democratic Party and the media and the Europeans and all the rest of them is that a lot of people in uh in the SUNY triangle concluded that America was a wimp and you only had to demoralize the media and the Democrats on the home front and America would just take her ball and go home.
That's basically What uh what uh those uh guys in the SUNY triangle figured.
Yeah, I agree with you completely there.
And uh I actually ended up voting for Bush when I was over there at a Cinema absentee ballot.
But uh what I'd also like to talk about is how Kerry and all these other liberals are trying to cut the legs out of us right now, saying that that we should pull out.
But uh also Kerry was one of the people was one of the reasons that we're talking about this right now is what he did in Vietnam.
Yes.
And the way that he supported the communists.
Yeah.
He ba well he basically uh he basically contributed uh to a defeat in Vietnam.
And he thought, do you remember that famous uh declaration he made when he was appearing before Congress that in fact it would be incredibly easy to get out of Vietnam, it would just require evacuating a few of uh America's hardcore supporters and there would be no other price to pay.
Do you do you remember that thing, Anthony?
Uh I I've seen it, yeah.
Uh also, I mean, my father fought in Vietnam and the Marines, and he said if we'd have stayed in for two or three more years, we'd have we'd have ended up winning the war, but I mean, like we say, I mean, people like Kerry that cut the legs out from me in Vietnam and is now doing it in Iraq.
Yeah.
I mean, they kind of set a precedent there.
Yes, exact exactly.
And in fact, they didn't.
I mean, before we had never really lost a war.
No, and the demoralization, uh, Anthony, that uh that was caused uh in uh by by what happened in Vietnam is in large part responsible for some of our present day problems.
You know, the uh the Iranian revolution, the Islamic Republic of Iran, uh in part that was because those guys were emboldened by the fact that America was this paper tiger, this toothless, toothless old lion that wouldn't do anything, uh that in fact retreated in uh upon itself.
And then they took over Iran, uh the Mullers, and uh they confronted America and Jimmy Carter, the quintessential post-Vietnam president, Jimmy Carter, uh refused to do anything.
Uh and as a result now, thirty years down the line, we are faced with uh that crazy state, just as crazy as ever, only now it's a nuclear power.
And that's that's the reality that if you let things slide, if you say, Oh no, we don't have to confront this issue, chances are you'll only have to confront it ten, twenty, thirty years down the line when things will be an awful lot worse.
Uh let's go to Todd in Westerville, Ohio.
Todd, you're on the air on the Rush Limbaugh program.
Hi, Mark, doing a good job.
Thanks, Todd.
Um, I wanted to ask the Democrats when they talk about exit strategy, what they would say the exit strategy of the Islamo-fascists is.
That's a very good question.
The problem uh the problem, Todd, is that the jihadists they don't have an exit strategy, they have an entrance strategy.
They're coming here, they're coming to Spain, they're coming to France, they're coming to Britain, they're go they're they're they they've got an entrance strategy for the entire planet.
And uh and you're right.
Uh, you know, basically if you uh if you want to find an exit strategy for uh for for Iraq, then pretty soon you're gonna be have to be fighting an exit strategy for a lot of other places, because those jihad they're not like the uh the uh the gooks in Vietnam.
They're not just gonna be content to take over Vietnam.
Uh if America pulls out of Iraq, uh they're gonna follow us wherever we go.
Yeah, I think the exit strategy for the Islamo-fascists is Israel is no longer a nation and uh the great Satan is destroyed.
Absolutely.
You're right.
They're planning the big exit that uh that uh the uh the uh the infidels and the Zionists and all the other people should basically be uh be burning in uh burning in hell.
Uh thanks very much for your for your call, Todd.
We're talking about uh the patriotism of the Democratic Party.
You know, I find it interesting.
The drive-by media make a lot of fuss about differences on Iraq.
For example, my uh my boss at National Review, William F. Buckley, it's uh no great surprise that he has a dissenting opinion uh from a lot of the so-called neoconservatives on the Iraq issue and on the Iraq war.
And every time he says anything, people say, Oh, well, you know, the uh the the right is uh is uh divided on this issue.
They're hopelessly Well, that's because we're basically every side of this argument.
The arguments uh are on the right between the uh the liberty doctrine, the spreading doctrine of the Bush uh administration.
You've got the so-called realist uh right who are at odds with that.
Then you've got another faction on the right, a lot of Russia's uh listeners who want who want the president to hit these guys harder and faster.
All three sensible positions uh on the uh the global uh jihad are on the right.
The left is basically sat this one out.
It's basically uh this uh, you know, why liberals and only liberals can win the war on terror.
Well well, to to to win the war on terror, you guys have got to buy an admission ticket.
You can't keep saying it's all about Bush and Cheney and Halliburton and all the rest of it.
You've got absolutely nothing relevant to say about the war.
You've got to get in the game, and it's unbecoming and disgraceful for a so-called serious party for you to be not in the game.
We'll be back with more in just a moment.
This is uh Mark Stein sitting in on the Rush Limbaugh show.
Walter Williams here tomorrow.
The Rush Limbaugh Show on the Excellence in Broadcasting Network.
This is Mark Stein, your undocumented anchor man sitting in for Rush today.
Walter Williams will be uh with you tomorrow.
1-800-282-288-2.
We've been talking about whether it's time to question the Democrats' uh patriotism.
Uh there's a fantastic uh fig on C ed Ed last night.
Uh I love this.
In the footsteps of bin Laden, one of these uh great two-hour specials hosted by Christian Amon Poor.
I hadn't seen her on TV for a while.
I used to love it during the Afghan war, the way she would ostentatiously call them the Talibon.
And ever since the uh Taliban fell, I haven't heard uh Christian use that uh delightful uh pronunciation.
Uh but she was talking about it was wondering in the footsteps of Bin Laden how he hooked up with the Taliban and all the rest of it, and there was a interesting uh glimpse there that even at that point these uh the G Had had a media strategy.
Uh and Henry Schuster, who's a CNN producer, he's quoted uh uh telling uh The Guardian in London today, uh to give a quote, to give a notion of how important the Western media was.
Uh one of Osama bin Laden's earlier media advisors used the Nom de Gur Abu Reuters.
Well, it was one of their made subcommittees in the Al Qaeda structure.
The Jihad has a marketing department.
It's uh it's a we we think of them as just these like uh guys sitting around in caves.
No.
They knew even then how to play the Western media.
And when they offered uh exclusive interviews, they knew exactly who to offer them to.
Their three preferred candidates for exclusive interviews were CNN, the BBC, and CBS.
You notice they weren't lining up to get on the Rush Limbaugh show or to get on Fox.
Uh they had a media strategy and they marketed themselves very adroitly.
And uh just remember that every time you see one of these things uh on whether it's uh Hezbollah in Lebanon with these artfully posed photographs of the uh of the pristine uh perfectly clean child's toy, the little stuffy doll uh sitting perfectly on this heap of rubble.
Just remember that that the media guy inside Al Qaeda, he had uh his his nom de go was Abu Reuters.
Abu Reuters is driving a lot of this ridiculous uh approach to the war that we see in the Western media, and pitifully, uh the drive-by guys at the New York Times and their friends in the Democratic Party fall for it, and they're presenting this defeatist attitude, this defeatist attitude that would have cost this country every war if it had tried to fight uh in this way uh in previous years.
Uh let's go to uh let's go to Jim up in uh my part of the world.
Well, not really my part of the world, in Southern New England, Boston, Massachusetts.
Let's go to Jim.
Jim, you're on the air on the Rush Limbaugh show.
Uh thanks, Mark.
I'm in uh really uh enjoying your uh handling of the program today.
I have an important clarific well, an important to me clarification that I'd I'd ask you to make, which is when you say that the Democrats are not patriotic, are you also saying that they actively want us to lose the war in the Mid East or at least lose this front in the war?
And the reason I ask is I happen to believe that they're more than on patriotic to the extent they actually do want us to lose, because that would get Bush out of office.
Um but other uh talk show hosts, and I've heard you on the Hugh Hewitt show, for example, a number of times, and I've I've called into that show.
And Hugh Hewitt uh several times that says, Well, he won't question their patriotism, they're just misguided Democrats that don't understand.
And I've maintained that it's it's it's more than merely not understanding, they do actively want us to lose.
Yes, I I th I'd I'd put it this I'd split the difference in a sense.
I'd put it this way.
I think they think that if we lose Iraq, it's just a defeat for Bush and the Republicans and the Conservatives.
They think in other words, they see it in parochial terms, that they think if we can if we can get Bush to lose this thing, it'll just be a defeat for Bush.
No, it won't.
It will be a defeat for the United States.
And uh it's it's part of this tunnel vision and this self-absorption of these uh pathetic figures, uh Nancy Pelosi uh and Howard Dean and the rest of them, that they don't understand that the rest of the world doesn't distinguish.
They don't follow internal American politics.
They don't distinguish between this or that party, that if America runs with its tail out of Iraq, it will be a defeat for the United States of America.
And there's no reason in the world after that, there's no reason in the world why never mind Iran, why Russia uh and China, uh or even Belgium should t should take America seriously ever again.
The American moment would be over because it would be becoming a pattern.
Uh it's uh Lady uh Lady Bracknell in the importance of being earnest uh uh says uh to lose one parent uh is a well I can't even remember the quote now to lose one parent is a misfortune to lose two is something else.
Well to lose Vietnam is uh is uh is unfortunate.
To lose two is becoming a pattern of behavior.
And to it would it would indicate that this country simply is not willing to shoulder its uh its global responsibilities or even muster the necessary backbone uh to an to enforce its own interests around the world.
So in that sense I think uh it's beyond being just misguided uh that in fact uh they uh they are really uh gambling with uh with the future of America as uh as a superpower status.
Uh Rush Limbaugh Show 1 eight hundred two eight two two eight eight two Mark Stein with you today.
Let's go to uh Pat.
Pat's calling uh from Wisconsin.
Pat you're on the air Yeah greetings from New Gleris.
Aaron Ross Powell and where is New Glarus in Miss a great name uh I hope uh I i it's uh i w ha where does that come from is there an old Gleris?
Uh yeah in uh Switzerland yeah founded by Swiss settlers oh fantastic uh good uh good for you and uh are you like the Swiss there you're scrupulously neutral in world affairs?
Well I I don't know scrupulously neutral there.
Okay Pat what's uh what's uh what what do you want to say about the uh the current state of world affairs.
Uh well first of all I I like the Abu Rider's comment that was pretty funny.
Um but uh I what I want to say about the rest of the discussion is I think it's it's a waste of time to discuss people's patriotism right now and here's why because right now it's divisive.
We all have our own idea of what patriotism is, particularly in America, I assure you we all do.
And uh this is a time when we need to unite behind a successful and speedy plan for victory.
And I have my doubts like many Americans do.
But I think we'd all well, you know, the majority of us which is all you need.
Strong majority of us I think would fall behind any plan that addressed our concerns and there are many.
Soldiers are being re-upped.
The only people that can be drafted in America now are soldiers guys that have already served sometimes one or two years, dangerous deployments then being re-upped, ripped away from their families long after their commitments expired.
All this we need to have these concerns addressed and if they're not you're just going to see public support whittle and you can't fight a war without public support.
I uh I agree with you on on that Pat.
But uh let me let me say let me say what I uh I think that the um the the issue is here that essentially uh America uh I think should have fought this conflict uh in a united way because uh governments don't win wars and parties don't win wars, nations win wars.
Uh so you're absolutely right on that.
But the fact of the matter is that there has been, if you look at it in the days after September eleventh, I was told by uh respected uh mainstream moderate uh uh people on the left that Michael Moore spoke for nobody.
He was just some crazy flake way out on the fringe, just some wacko guy.
And what we've seen since then is in fact that wacko fringe as it's got louder and louder has effectively swallowed one party's to the part where uh as you see uh sitting senators are now defeated in their own primaries uh when when they try to articulate the kind of united strategy uh bipartisan strategy uh that that you're arguing in favor of.
Joe Lieberman uh Joe Lieberman has basically gotten turfed out by his own electorate in the Well the only thing that the Democrats all agree on is that the war uh is well the thing they all agree on is is that the war is being lost essentially that is what they agree on.
Now there's people that demand pull out and you can call that cut and run or whatever you want.
But again that's a divisive discussion.
There's an ample number of Democrats and Joe Lieberman I'm certain was one of them that were the first on board to help with the hand but that simply demanded more accountability from the President than his own party demands from as an example.
Well I think I think that's and the and the guys in the middle are just getting squeezed out now and that's what happened to Joe Lieberman.
There's plenty of Democrats who'd be right on board with a good plan.
But those Democrats I'm not a Democrat but I'm certain of this.
Thanks for your call Pat but those Democrats have got a choice whether they want to stick with a party unfortunately where where what you would call uh the guys in the middle sensible mainstream uh pro war let's try and devise a s uh successful strategy here.
Those guys are getting squeezed out because the pleasure of just turning this into an anti-Bush thing is too much.
The sort of kinky frisson that the nutty left get out of this is just too much for them, unfortunately.
Let's go to Tim in Lexington, Kentucky.
Tim, you're on the air on the Rush Limbaugh Show.
Substitute teacher dittos, Mark.
I'm calling to make two points.
First of all, as far as the Lieberman race goes, I don't think it's a surprise that his numbers have started to fall.
He ran and lost by, I think, four points.
because he was the pro war candidate he lost to an end war candidate amongst a bunch of extremists in the Democratic party up in Connecticut.
He got his bounce when he decided to run as an independent from people who were probably pro war most of them Republicans I'm guessing that based solely on the fact that the Republican uh challenger has I think like six percent of the vote.
Yeah I think it's down to three now.
Okay, down to three.
And recently Lieberman has come out and I think he's uh he's asked for Rumsfeld's head and he started kind of attacking Bush on it.
Uh this seems I mean it might have made sense for Lieberman to say these kind of things while he was running against Lamont as a Democrat in a Democratic primary with a bunch of Michael Moore Democrats voting it doesn't seem to me to make a whole lot of sense when he's a trying to appeal to the Republican Party and Moderate Democrats up in up in Connecticut and so I think that may be why you're seeing the drop in you know in his support up there over the last week.
That's uh that's a very interesting point Tim you know that the s he he's in a sense been trying to do what Hillary Clinton is doing find a kind of Clintonian way to triangulate this thing.
And the Iraq war is immune uh to Clintonian triangulation.
You've really got to decide whether uh what what you're for, what you stand for, uh whether you want victory or whether the uh the anti-Bush sniping is the the really important part of it for you.
And he's having difficulties with uh with that right now.
1-800-282-2882 this is uh Mark Stein sitting in for Rush on the Excellence in Broadcasting Network.
We'll be back with more in just a moment.
Mark Stein for Rush Limbaugh 1 800 28282.
Don't forget Rush Limbaugh.com.
You can join Rush 247 and hear everything Rush said over this past month.
Plus uh watch uh past shows uh on the uh on the Ditter camps if you're getting sick of switching on the rush show and finding wacky foreigners there you can go to rushlimbore.com and get the real deal uh from uh from the Rush uh archives uh that Lady Bracknell quote from the importance of being earnest that I bungled halfway through never start a quote you don't know how to finish to lose one parent may be a misfortune to lose two looks like carelessness.
Uh to uh to lose uh Vietnam may be a misfortune to lose Vietnam and Iraq looks like uh as I said a pattern of behavior and one that no serious country can afford.
Let's go to uh Jonathan in Houston, Texas.
Uh Jonathan you're on the air on the EIB network.
Hi Mark I just want to say you filling in great for Rush.
I like your uh your style a lot.
Thanks Jonathan but uh I guess uh you're coming in from uh patriotism and I just have to say like I I felt patriot patriotic back in two thousand three and I was you know I was more or less behind the warfare act going in.
You know nobody likes war but it going in it seemed like a smart thing to do.
And now two thousand six it doesn't feel so smart anymore.
So that patriotism has kind of waned.
Well, the the thing about patriotism, uh, Jonathan, is it's is it's uh it's visceral.
It's not it's not something like uh that's that's that should be affected by the uh the the the prevailing political winds.
But the but the thing about it is yes, Iraq is hard.
And why is it hard?
Uh because this is an existential struggle.
During the Cold War, I don't think uh we appreciated how easy an enemy we had.
Uh we were up against the Soviet Union, which yes, was sitting on a lot of nuclear weapons.
But it was perfectly obvious if you went to Czechoslovakia, Hungary, that their uh their peoples were even more innovative than we were, even less interested in having a great big existential struggle than we were.
It's different this time.
We're again up against people who don't want to negotiate anything.
They've got no conditions.
You can't sit around a table with these guys.
They basically want to kill us.
And that means that's a choice between Russian and Nixon and Carter and Reagan were up against the uh Soviet Union.
There was uh there was a give and take, but it always felt like we were uh we had smart people in charge, we had a competent leadership.
It always felt like we we could win if we just if we got out of lucky break, if we could break through.
And you know, sure enough, Berlin Wall Falls, you know, the path to victory is open.
In 2003, we saw a path to b victory, and I think Rumsfeld and Cheney and just the the guys in the administration just couldn't grab it.
And this far down the line, it's like a chess game that's gone on so long that you you see you can't win anymore.
Yeah, but as I said, it's a choice between bad or worse options.
And the worst option of all is to say, uh, sorry, we're we're taking our ball and going home.
We don't want to we we got on the wrong train, we're getting off at the next stop, and we don't want to be on it anymore.
Because that is that is never the option, not for any country that wants to retain its global reach.
And the danger in this world isn't that uh we look at these guys and we're we're like John Kerry after after that debate with George Bush.
Uh, you know, I can't believe I'm losing to this idiot.
We look at these this enemy and think, I can't believe we're losing to these idiots.
And that uh the the the thing is, uh generally speaking, wars are won by the people who want it most, by the people who mean it most.
It's what the uh the Germans used to call Wehrwilla, uh war war will.
And uh simply put, uh that means that uh if if the enemy suspect that you're weak, you're soft, you're getting a little uncomfortable, they know how to just prod you enough, just here there, just uh uh uh uh an unc uh a bomb here, a bomb there, and they know you'll weaken and you'll uh and you'll go home.
Thanks very much for your call, uh Jonathan.
It is a it is a tough thing, but the tough thing is often the right thing to do.
And you you mentioned those presidents during the Cold War.
They're very different guys.
You know, Jimmy Carter, that was the detante era.
Uh the uh an a second Jimmy Carter term, and uh the Soviets might well have won uh ended up winning the Cold War just by default.
They were g gobbling up real estate all over the world, including in America's backyard in Grenada.
And uh and the idea that uh that that somehow there's some continuum there, it wasn't.
It was that Ronald Reagan determined to win what uh Jimmy Carter in fact thought couldn't be won.
He thought basically that America was in for a period of decline and it couldn't be reverse.
Uh Ronald Reagan was an optimist and he didn't believe that, and he won the Cold War.
And that's the thing.
Defeatism defeatism becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy.
Uh this is Mark Stein on uh the Rush Limbaugh program.
We'll be back with more in just a moment.
Mark Stein on the EIB network sitting in for a rush.
Let's go to Bill in uh Gainesville, Florida.
Bill, you're on the air.
Oh, how are you doing there, Bob?
Good thanks.
I like the job that you're doing just like uh all the other callers seem to.
Great.
What's what's your view on Iraq?
Well, to me it's like a divorce.
A divorce where one party is a little smarter, a little stronger than the other party.
And therefore, they don't get along always.
The sm stronger party seems to win a lot of arguments, the other side gets mad and they start throwing, you know, things at you that don't make any sense.
So you decide to get a divorce, and then they kind of play dirty.
One side's trying to do everything right, one side's doing everything they can, the other side, no matter what you do, disagrees, and you're not PC enough, and so on and so forth.
You sound like you're s you sound like you're speaking for bitter experience, Bill.
Yeah, yeah.
I'll tell you what.
In the long run, I locked out.
I ended up with the kids.
Oh, oh okay.
I think uh you there's something in what you say.
I think the problem is that uh if Iraq is like a divorce, uh these jihadists are like some nightmare uh ex-wife that you could never you ne c you could never shake off.
Uh there are there were some ex-wives there were no exit strategy from.
That's the uh that's the problem.
Uh this is Mark Stein on the uh Rush Limbaugh Show, sitting in for rush.
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