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Nov. 17, 2005 - Rush Limbaugh Program
36:20
November 17, 2005, Thursday, Hour #1
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Welcome to today's edition of the Rush 24-7 podcast.
And welcome to the Rush Limbaugh program here at the EIB network at the Limbaugh Institute for Advanced Conservative Studies, we will advance those studies today, you and I together, in a dramatic uh fashion, we have news breaking on WMD.
I'm going to get to that uh later in uh Iraq.
We're gonna pick up the case of Tukey Williams, the next uh Mumia.
Will you hear this story?
Death row co-founder of the Crips gang, lionized now by the uh lunatic left, and actually nominated for a Nobel Prize for his work with youth.
Not not the youth he killed, mind you, but other youth.
So we'll talk about that uh today.
The uh moderates have got my attention.
What they're moderate about will take more money out of your paycheck, and we'll talk about that today.
And amazingly, as the world turns, this is like a soap opera in Washington, Woodward of all people.
Bob Woodward may actually now save Libby.
Scooter Libby might be saved by Bob Woodward, and there's a lot of talk today in Washington, we'll get to that today.
Law and order last night, if you saw it, we'll get into that as well.
But first an update on Fields versus Palmdale School District.
We talked about this yesterday, a sex survey given to students at the Palmdale School District as young as six years old.
Parents suing the school district after finding out that their kids had been asked a series of sexual questions in class.
The survey, by the way, included questions on lots of other topics, uh health and nutrition and habits and that sort of thing, uh, that had actually been sent home for the parents to see before it was distributed to the students, what had been left out in the copy that was sent to parents was the sex survey section, incredibly.
Uh then the uh parents found out about it, found out that the uh children were asked about the frequency of, quote, touching my private parts too much, quote, thinking about sex, quote, thinking about touching other people's private parts.
This is this is six-year-olds now, being asked this question.
Um not trusting people because they might want sex.
I I won't there's a dozen of these.
I'm not gonna get into them.
So what happened yesterday after we talked about this is that the House of Representatives voted to ask the Ninth U.S. Circus Court of Appeals to rehear the entire issue.
A three-judge panel, which uh had been chaired uh by uh Judge Justice Reinhart, Judge Reinhard, uh the the panel, the the Ninth Circus has uh forty-seven judges, twenty-six of whom were appointed by Clinton and uh Carter between them.
But uh the three that uh that made this another wacko decision.
I mean, this is the I know, this is the uh the Ninth Circuit is the court that uh gave us uh uh the that under God in the Pledge of Allegiance was was was unconstitutional, the phrase was unconstitutional, that there was in the Constitution a quote, right to die, unquote.
Now I don't know where in Life Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness in the Declaration and where in the Constitution they would have found a right to die, but apparently this is the school of thought, the judge's school of thought, that uh we just make it up as we go along because we know so much better than you do.
As a combination of ignorance and arrogance, which could only have been produced by our current public school system.
Ignorance and arrogance, high self-esteem, and absolutely no clue what they're doing.
So this is uh in terms of destroying our Constitution.
So this is the the uh backdrop of this, and the House of Representatives yesterday voted 320 to 91 for uh a resolution that uh said that this this decision in the Fields versus Palmdale School District case, quote,
deplorably infringed on parental rights, unquote, no kidding, and that they should rehear the entire Ninth Circuit should re-hear it to uh to think again before they are overruled again by the United States Supreme Court.
This is the most overruled circuit court in the country by a large margin, and it is overruled because it sits in San Francisco and thinks that's America.
Sorry.
Uh That's part of America, apparently an undefended part of America, but it isn't all of America.
By the way, if you're in San Francisco, and you decide you're not turning in your gun after the election, uh recent election in which uh San Francisco majority voters adopted a uh a local ordinance uh banning all guns from all private uh ownership.
If you are since since you sit on the San Andreas fault and you're aware of what happened in 1906, and you're aware of if it happened today, millions and millions of people without food, water, shelter uh would would make New Orleans look like a picnic in terms of the looting that would go on.
If you're aware of all that, and I think you are, turning in your gun is either a masochism, B uh blind stupidity, or C a faith in liberalism that goes beyond all facts.
So I'm confident 95% of you will be D, I'm keeping my gun for the earthquake.
Okay, so I I think that's where most San Franciscans are, regardless of how they vote.
They vote because that's the way you have to vote.
I remember being in San Francisco as a law student and uh voting for Richard Nixon, and it was like uh uh four hundred and sixty-five thousand for um whoever was running against him, Humphrey, and one, and that was my vote for Nixon.
I mean, it had the actual total.
Um I'm Roger Hedgecock filling in for Russia, one-eight hundred-282-2882.
And of course at Rush Limbaugh.com, uh our adopt a soldier program is up and running.
We want to match generous donors from this listening audience to a uh combo subscription gift to soldiers stationed worldwide, uh anyone in the armed services station uh worldwide for a Rush 247 and Limbaugh letter combo subscription.
So if you're active duty anywhere in the world, you can come to Rush Limbaugh.com, sign up for a subscription donated by our listeners, and of course, if you're a listener, you go there the same way and sign up uh your soldier, and uh there you go.
We're going to ask people to give the gift of rush in a variety of ways there in two ways, uh Rush 24-7 and the Limbaugh letter to our armed forces.
A part of the campaign to get the truth out.
I'm afraid if I was serving in Afghanistan, if I were serving in Afghanistan, and all I got was CNN, I'd be discouraged.
Sorry, I would be.
I would certainly not be watching.
I would just be doing my duty and keeping my head down and thinking, okay, uh hope things are going well back on the home front.
Because if I watch CNN, I would think I'm pretty much out here by myself.
Or any of the other elite media for that matter.
Now, um speaking of the elite media, the uh so that's the update on uh fields.
We're going to continue to pursue that.
The uh last night on NBC, a pretty good show, Law and Order.
I've watched it one or two times and uh thought it was uh, you know, re meets the minimum standard of entertainment, which of course a bar that has been lowered many times over the last number of decades, but but still uh pretty interesting show.
But I'll tell you last night they went so completely over the edge, it was hard to um hard to stomach.
They they were calling them countrymen, but they were talking about the minutemen at the border.
And the issue was the death of a coyote, uh a smuggler of uh a slave trader, if you will, uh smuggling people across the border for economic gain, uh this uh uh and a death and the uh immigrants, the illegals uh roasting in the truck and all of that.
And uh the issue was did the minute man uh kill this smuggler and that was kind of the thrust of the of the thing.
Do we have a little bit of that from law and order?
Let's here's a little bit of that.
Are you one of those guys who sits on the border looking through binoculars, pointing out illegal crossers?
I am personally responsible for sixty-eight detainees.
Well, there you go.
So they kind of made fun of that whole um that whole thing, and um the Minutemen have now, uh Jim Gilchrist or one of the co-founders have now asked for an apology because in the um hundreds and hundreds of people and hundreds of days that have been spent by volunteers in what amounts to a national neighborhood watch uh on the border with binoculars,
sitting in their lawn chairs, Mostly uh grandparents, uh observing, not killing anyone, not detaining anyone, not whipping anyone, not uh roasting anyone at all.
Simply reporting what they see, which is the invasion of the United States of America.
And as they report it to the authorities, asking the border patrol to do their job.
Border Patrol agents, of course, on the field desperately want to do that job.
They're higher ups politically suspect, because the border patrol has never been allowed to do its job, either at the border or against employers who are knowingly hiring, and you know who they are, knowingly hiring uh illegals.
So NBC, you owe um America an apology.
Uh these good Americans who are on the border, who are I know Bush called them vigilantes, I don't think he knew what he was talking about.
Uh he's wrong.
The uh the Minutemen on the border are uh and I've met a lot of them because they sit right here at the San Diego Tijuana border.
I mean, to keep in mind I'm sitting in a studio, it's what, sixteen miles from the border.
Um they are uh good people, they're good Americans, and they're trying to point out that you can't have homeland security, you can't uh bar your windows and doors and put up guards of your home and put up cameras and lights and uh and and and get uh uh heavy into homeland security and then leave the back door open and leave the porch light on and leave a little sign next to it, y'all come, or the equivalent in Spanish.
You know what I'm saying?
This is just doesn't make any sense.
It isn't homeland security.
So we can talk about uh that the minute man like murderer who's convicted on law and order uh was a bit of propaganda put up uh well with uh I guess I put in the same category as commander in chief, getting us all ready for uh for Hillary's presidency and so forth.
By the way, in the real world, and I'll get back to this in just a second, momentum is building for solutions on the border that make sense and that will protect America.
They need your support, and we'll talk about it.
I'm Roger Hedgecock, Infor Rush, right after this.
You're listening to Rush Limbaugh on the excellence in podcasting network.
California Congressman Duncan Hunter, the chairman of the House Armed Services Committee proposing that the fence, which has been so successful here in Operation Gatekeeper between San Diego and Tijuana, reduced uh by eighty some percent the apprehensions across this border.
And as it's completed, not even completed yet, it's taken us fifteen years to get to this point.
Uh as it's completed, it will reduce it to zero.
It works, and Duncan Hunter is saying, why don't you build it from here to the Gulf of Mexico and solve the problem?
Momentum for that idea, billions of dollars, admittedly, is building.
And uh Duncan Hunter says that uh there are now dozens of co-sponsors with him on this bill.
In the meantime, Congress doing some well, terrible work.
Um Tancredo from con uh Congressman from Colorado talks about a new law authored by uh uh Senator Bennett, a Republican from Utah, that shields religious groups from a federal law which prohibits transporting, concealing, and harboring illegal aliens.
In other words, for most people, doing those things to help illegal immigration is a federal law violation.
A new, a new exception has been added to the law at the request of attorneys for the Mormon Church to make uh religious groups exempt.
In other words, religious groups can now aid and abet the violation of federal law by illegal aliens coming into the country.
What the uh Mormons and Mr. Bennett are not remembering is that the left is adept at co-opting, quote, religious groups, unquote.
There is a friends group, which started as a Quaker group in San Diego and is now just nothing but a naked uh lobbyist group for illegal immigration and open borders in the San Diego area, and I think it's duplicated uh down along the border, uh aiding and assisting and constantly harassing the border patrol and filing civil rights suits and doing everything they can to hinder the enforcement of federal law and increase the number of illegals coming into this country.
Where they get their financing from has never been asked or answered in this area, but it should be.
So Tom Tancredo's blowing the whistle on that one.
And here, one more point from the border, then We'll get to calls.
From Columbus, New Mexico.
The Border Patrol there has been on a month long, this is Associated Press now out of the Seattle newspaper, and as I say, this illegal thing, which used to be our little problem here in the Southwest, is now apparently got the attention of everybody in this country, as it should.
But it it seems that at Columbus, New Mexico, the Border Patrol has been working with a squadron of uh troops from Fort Lewis.
Fort Lewis, Washington, which is how the Seattle Paper, I guess, got into this.
And the uh the mission began in mid-October and is ending this week.
Hundreds of soldiers from the um 14th Cavalry Regiment, Fort Lewis, helped catch 1922 people crossing the border illegally during that time and seized more than a thousand pounds of marijuana.
The uh soldiers were not involved in pursuits or apprehensions.
They did what the Minutemen do, uh, according to the uh lieutenant colonel in charge, he said, quote, our sole purpose is to observe and report.
Wonder if NBC will be doing a show about them.
Here's uh Dennis in Bullhead City, Arizona.
Hi, Dennis, welcome to the Russian Limbaugh program.
Good morning.
Hi.
I just had a quick comment about the Law and Order episode you were talking about.
Now I I enjoy that show.
I watch it on a regular basis.
But it seems like whenever there's any kind of a political issue, they do tend to spin it toward the liberal side in the extreme.
Surprise.
One thing I noticed was the one illegal alien that they dealt with personally in the show.
Uh they painted her rather sympathetically.
They were careful to refer to her as an undocumented worker, and the poor thing had been living in this country illegally for ten years and now she was going to be taken away from her family, etc.
etc.
Yeah, and then at the end, I'm told I didn't see it, but at the end of the uh program after the DA, who's kind of the Republican figure, was uh talking about having to to return this woman and then not allowing her to stay, even though she was married and had a kid and all that heart-wrenching stuff.
Yeah, and he's talking about the necessity of them the going back, and then he's served coffee by an obvious uh stereotypically uh Mexican-looking guy.
So uh, you know, this is part of the propaganda mill.
Exactly.
And I applaud the Minutemen for what they attempted to do, and I believe their main purpose was to shame the government into doing something about securing the border.
And that's working.
Now, if they're if their excuse is they don't have enough money, if you look at the statistics on how much money it costs this country for illegal aliens for medical care and and whatnot, use that money to secure the border, and they'll probably have plenty left over.
Amen, Dennis, I appreciate the call.
Thanks uh for doing that.
And I'll tell you, this leads me to right to my next point, which is uh people are saying, well, as Chertoff did the other day, the Homeland Security Secretary, Michael Chertoff, he said, Oh, it's not practical to deport illegal aliens.
How would we ever find them?
How do we know where they are?
It's impossible.
There's eleven to twenty million people, we have no idea where they are.
I mean, notwithstanding the fact that they can that they can trace a cow from its origin in Canada to the meat shop where it was sold, uh, but they can't keep track of illegal aliens, you know, because of the mad cow thing.
Uh they can't keep track of illegal aliens.
It makes no sense to me whatsoever.
Uh President Bush says, signing the Homeland Security Spending Bill, quote, if somebody here's illegally, we've got to do everything we can to find them, unquote.
As if this was a needle in a haystack.
Hello, try the social security records.
That's right.
Try the W twos.
Last year in this country, the form W2 filed by employers, nine point two million of them had no, as the as the IRS put it, quote, no known taxpayer, unquote.
In other words, they were filed by people with phony names that they couldn't match to the Social Security number.
They know exactly where these people are hired.
They know exactly the the uh the fact that they're using uh false names and false numbers, and they have a computer.
In fact, they know it so much well that they have sequestered that money that comes in from the W2, the withholding money in case there's some later legal problem with these people who have been using fake numbers and fake names.
They know exactly where they're employed and what they're doing.
Now, how do you match the rhetoric of we got to catch him?
We got to do everything we can, with the idea that they know exactly where they are and they're making money out of it.
They're the interest off that account that they're setting aside is put back in the general fund.
It helps the deficit.
It funds the programs.
It's a wink and a nod.
It's a uh corruption in Washington that they don't want people to know about.
Now you do.
Now you do.
Now, Chertoff, not practical to deport illegal aliens, unbelievable.
Uh and this was unbelievable too.
After the fence got sixty-nine percent approval rating in a poll.
This business of a fence between here and Brownsville got sixty-nine percent yes.
Bush sent U.S. ambassador to Mexico Tony Garza to Mexico City to the Mexican government to say the Bush administration opposes, opposes a fence, which could solve the problem.
So there's a big gap in the rhetoric uh between George Bush trying to control the border, as he often says, and the reality the Bush administration leaving our back door open, the lights on, and you all come.
Roger Hedgecock in for Rush.
Wow, high taxes, corruption, they can't get a state motto.
What's next for New Jersey?
I read today Reuters reporting out of Philadelphia, of course, all the bad news comes out of Philadelphia for poor Jersey, uh, that rising sea levels threaten New Jersey.
New Jersey could lose three percent.
Of course it's in the next hundred years.
In fact, they're not sure about the hundred years.
The authors of this study call for a reduction in greenhouse gas emissions, which many scientists believe lead to global warming as the most effective way of reducing the rate of sea level rise.
Then the next paragraph is cutting emissions would have a limited effect on sea levels over the next fifty years, but it could slow the rate by twenty-one hundred and beyond.
I think I'll be prepared by then.
Good grief.
Anyway, let me talk about George Bush because uh while critical of him on the border, and I am, and because I think it makes no sense to leave the back door open, which is what he's doing.
The uh uh the stance he's taken in Korea and the stance he's taken on this Asian tour is to be applauded and congratulated.
He told the Chinese, listen, don't try to conquer Taiwan.
Look to Taiwan as a model.
Here's a free market doing even better than you're doing because they've extended freedom beyond the the narrow economic issues and into the broad political and personal issues, and they've resulted in one of the most prosperous societies in the world, even though you, China, the Beijing regime have strong armed the whole world to try to shun uh Taiwan.
The fact is that Taiwan has prospered far beyond I mean the the uh the gross national product divided by the number of people there, give them a standard of living on the order of ten times mainland China.
Uh so there is there isn't any question that Bush is just calling it right.
He gets to to Korea and he says that uh hello, you guys want a uh light water reactor.
You want some kind of uh electricity reactor, that's fine.
But unlike Clinton, I'm not just gonna give it to you and hope that you dismantle your uh nuclear weapons.
You have to dismantle the nuclear weapons first, then we have to verify you've done it, then you can get the nuclear reactor.
See, this is called negotiation for our side.
Clinton and Albright were in negotiations for the other side in the Carter model.
Uh by the way, I think it's working.
Ladies and gentlemen, at long last, and I don't know, how many months did Rush carry the burden of pointing out the deceit of the Democrats in voting for the war, in voting for the resolution in ninety-eight in the Clinton administration that called for regime change,
in making statement after statement about weapons of mass destruction being in uh Iraq, and then turning around this year, and uh you know, hoping we don't have a memory, and saying, Oh, Bush lied, millions died, Bush lied about WMD, never found any, we uh manipulated the intelligence, didn't know what he was talking about, and hoping that we don't remember that they all believed it too.
And so did all the intelligence networks around the uh world, and so did people who believe it to this day, one of whom will have on the program coming up in the next hour, so stand by for that.
But I think it's working that Bush and Cheney and others have been successful in pointing out this at the least hypocrisy, at the least political opportunism.
At the worst, a a playing with America's armed forces, putting our armed forces in danger over in Iraq because they the the people, the insurgents, of course, have CNN too.
They continue to hear the voices of dissent and criticism.
And dissent is okay, but the idea that the president lied, that there's no support for the war, uh feeds the idea that if the insurgents can just hang on, they'll outlast America and defeat America, the Vietnam model.
So Cheney strikes back, and uh I thought some of this stuff was absolutely uh brilliant.
Uh in fact, uh Cheney, echoing Rush, had this to say.
The President and I cannot prevent certain politicians from losing their memory or their backbone.
Right.
But we're not going to sit by and let them rewrite history.
Trevor Burrus, Jr.
Nope.
And that's it.
That's the that's the essence of it.
And the fact that the papers are now screaming about the um uh about the on the attack, Bush on the attack, and Cheney on the attack, and and what was this last one I just saw here.
This is this is uh well, that Washington's oh, yeah, the backlash for the Republicans.
Uh listen, this thing is working.
This idea that we're going to s to call this what it is.
A campaign by people who said exactly the same thing Bush did at exactly the same time in 2002 that he was saying it, and Colin Powell was saying it, and the French intelligence agency was saying it.
And the British intelligence agency was saying it.
And all the Middle East intelligence agencies were saying the same thing.
Saddam was a threat.
He had used and would use, if given a chance, weapons of mass destruction, chemical, nuclear, biological, whatever.
So Cheney uh, again, in this speech today had this to say.
These are elected officials who had access to the intelligence and were free to draw their own conclusions.
They arrived at the same judgment about Iraq's capabilities and intentions that were made by this administration and by the previous administration.
There you go.
By the previous administration.
By the way, the previous administration, this has never happened before.
I was angry about it when Gore did it in uh in Scandinavia.
I'm even more angry about it, uh, that Bill Clinton is in front of an Arab student, in front of an Arab student population at the American University of Dubai in the United Arab Emirates, and makes a speech in front of these Arab students with Al Jazeera and all of the opponents uh media there, and he says that the United States made a quote big mistake, unquote, when it invaded Iraq.
Uh he received a standing ovation at the end of an hour-long session.
He said, among other things that were just egregiously historically wrong, politically indefensible, in terms of an America at war, and what a former president going to the most uh volatile area of this war and making these comments, what that means for our armed forces.
What that means if you're a grunt uh in the sweep by the Syrian border today, when your former president, your former commander-in-chief says, quote, it, the liberation of Iraq, it was a big mistake.
The American government made several errors, one of which is how easy it would be to get rid of Saddam and how hard it would be to unite the country, unquote.
Well, wait a minute.
How hard it would be to unite the country.
Uh he goes on to talk about uh Clinton just doesn't get it.
Quote, the mistake they made, meaning Bush, is that they, when they kicked out Saddam, they decided to dismantle the whole authority structure of Iraq.
Now let's just take that statement.
The officer corps of Saddam's army was 80,000 people, just in the officer corps.
They were 99% Sunni.
Had we adopted the 99% Sunni army of Saddam Hussein, the Kurds would have immediately seceded from Iraq.
The Shias wouldn't have been far behind.
Civil war would have erupted.
The dismantling of the Sunni-dominated Bathist dictatorship was an essential first step to uniting a truly united Iraq.
Everyone there knows that.
Apparently Bill Clinton does not.
Bill Clinton goes on to say, we never sent enough troops.
And didn't have enough troops to control or seal the borders.
Well, wait a minute.
At the time we sent the troops, We were sending troops and shouldn't have invaded.
Now it's we didn't send enough troops.
And of course, back home, the Democrats are saying, bring the troops home.
So Bush is wrong when he invades with the troops, then he doesn't have enough troops, and then he should bring all those troops home anyway.
I mean, what what position are they actually trying to take here?
Because it's not constructive.
It's worse than not constructive.
It's destructive.
And Cheney nailed it on this subject.
The saddest part is that our people in uniform have been subjected to these cynical and pernicious falsehoods day in and day out.
Amen.
And then he goes on to name the names.
And these names need to be named.
You need to know who in the United States Senate is essentially working for the defeat of the United States, is working to support the insurgency holding out against the United States, is working in short to destroy the infant democracy of Iraq and produce a chaos they can blame on Bush and win the 2008 election.
I'm sorry.
That's exactly as I see it.
I know many of you don't, and I'm going to take your calls in a minute, but here's Dick Cheney, and I think he's nailed it.
I'm sorry we couldn't be joined by Senators Harry Reed, John Kerry, and Jay Rockefeller.
They were unable to attend due to a prior lack of commitment.
A prior lack of commitment.
Now, ladies and gentlemen, because you have a memory, I know you already know this, but uh as the lawyers say, and I am a recovering attorney in the 12 step program, so I do have every once in a while to do this.
For the record, as attorneys say, let me take you back to December 16, 1998.
CNN reporting, a grim looking President Clinton addressing the nation from the Oval Office.
From the Oval Office, says CNN.
President Clinton told the nation Wednesday evening why he ordered new military strikes against Iraq.
The President said Iraq's refusal to cooperate with UN weapons inspectors presented a threat to the entire world.
Clinton said then, quote, Saddam Hussein must not be allowed to threaten his neighbors or the world with nuclear arms, poison gas, or biological weapons.
Unquote.
End of story.
I'm Roger Hitchcock, in for rush, back after this.
Roger Hedgecock in for Rush Limbaugh on the uh rush program and having some fun here.
Let's get to the calls.
Jay in Atlantic City, New Jersey.
Jay, hi, welcome to the program.
Hey, Roger.
Um big thing.
Um my issue is the conservative radio is still pushing this Iraq war and the support of the Bush administration.
And what is it, 60, 70% of the American public is against the Iraq war?
Uh I supported conservative radio all through the Clinton administration, exposing all the liberals.
I supported, you know, I I consider myself a little bit right of a fill of the hug.
And I was one of those few against the Iraq war, and I'm a Republican.
Now I'm being made out to be a liberal or an anti-American because I still think that way.
When are you going to come around to the American public?
Well, let me ask you, Jay, uh, let's uh let's put all those uh numbers aside for a moment and just talk personally.
If you were the president of the United States, given the facts as they are today, what would you do?
I'm sorry.
What do you what are you offering me as far as that's concerned?
Was it was that too complicated?
Let me go slower.
If you were the president of the United States today, you given the facts in Iraq today, what would you do?
I would bring okay, here's a good one.
I would bring back all those dissenting generals that said that we had either had to go in with more troops or that we were going in the wrong way, or saying that we shouldn't have even gone into Iraq, but they were good generals like General Anthony Vinney, who was a Republican.
I would bring them back and say, okay, I made a mistake, I didn't listen to you guys the first time, now I'm going to listen to you.
That's what I would say.
And what if Zinny said, which is what he did say, what if the general said, for example, we need to put in not a hundred and sixty thousand troops, but three hundred and sixty thousand and complete.
That was my thought.
I had a uh let me tell you, Roger, I had a son.
I have a son who's airborne, who was over there.
I have more friends that are still over there than I just said presidents over to him for veteran study.
I support the guys in Iraq war.
But that doesn't mean that I think the Iraq war was right.
I think the Afghanistan war was right.
I think we should have stayed away from Iraq.
But I tell you what I want to do, Jay.
Since we've we're already in there, I understand for history purposes we could have this debate about whether we should have had uh the war in Iraq.
It's the same debate about whether we should have intervened in World War I, as far as I'm concerned, it's water under the bridge.
Today we have a situation in Iraq, and you're saying that if you were president and you consulted generals who told you to send in another couple of hundred thousand troops and finish the job and do it right, that you'd do it.
Uh that's my feeling.
We can't go out of there.
Now that we've created a Hornet's nest, we can't leave there without finishing the job.
And right now we're treading water.
We're not finishing that job.
They keep saying things are getting better.
Over the past three years, either either Dick Cheney or Condoleezer Rice has said things are getting better, but they aren't getting better.
They are getting worse.
The insurgents keep getting worse.
Well, Jay, and I appreciate that you're saying that, and I appreciate that most people actually believe it.
You only believe it because you are understandably reading the uh the New York Times, the Washington Post, you're watching the network news, you're watching the cable news, and you're seeing the violence.
Let me just if if you know this, there in the eighteen provinces of Iraq, the violence that you've seen recorded is located in three of those.
In fifteen of those provinces, schools are being built, oil pipelines are working, roads are open, uh, people are going to work, sch uh hospitals are better than ever.
Uh in the Kurdish area, they have such a secure uh capitalist economy in the north of Iraq that they've got Wendy's and and other franchise uh operations up and running in their cities without a problem.
Now that's not on TV because it doesn't make the liberal point that Bush shouldn't have gone into Iraq.
What if it turns out that in this next election, when a parliament is actually elected under their new constitution, and the new government gets a handle on these insurgents with the help of the U.S., and those three provinces are calmed down because they do participate in the vote and they do have members in parliament.
What happens in short if Bush's strategy works?
I think we'll never see a democracy in the in the Iraqi area.
I think the Ambor province was the key to the whole place, and they didn't seem to worry about that, and that's still the major problem.
Um if you're familiar with Iraq, that is the center of the Sunni area and the center of the country.
So you're not sure.
And they just had an election there, Jay.
They just had an election there, and they just had some pretty good turnout.
Are you are you telling me then that it doesn't matter that the Shias in in the Shia area jokes?
Do why is the vote a joke?
Because it doesn't matter if these people vote or not, it's the feeling that they have for the U.S. soldiers and the U.S. public.
And right now they basically think because we're treading water over there, we haven't either gone in there and won the war, which we haven't, or we haven't gone in there and walked away from it, which we haven't.
They think that we're basically crusaders in another one of our third or fourth crusades.
This is the Iraqi mindset.
And you are not going to convince those people any different.
They are taught that by the Wahhabi religion from the Sunni from the uh friends, the Saudis from a very early age.
All right, Jay, I appreciate your call.
So your choice would be to win the war by sending a couple hundred thousand more troops.
So if you you're not willing to win the war, then you're willing to put us in another Vietnam.
Jay, thanks for the call.
I I I feel precisely the same way, but I don't feel it's going to take another couple hundred thousand troops.
I'm for victory in Iraq, and ignoring the critics because victory will bring the public opinion around.
Public opinion now in the United States and in Iraq is divided by the fact that we don't know, given that the constant harping on the dissenters, we don't know whether the will, the American will to win, is present.
That's the big issue.
And I think Jay, you've nailed that.
I'm Roger Hitchcock, back on the Rush Show after this.
So weapons of mass destruction, which Bill Clinton in 1998 said was there.
In fact, he ordered an attack.
He said the mission of the attack is to attack Iraq's nuclear, chemical and biological weapons programs.
And uh, did they exist or didn't they?
Well, new information coming up, and I want you to stand by.
Uh Steve Hayes will join us from the uh weekly standard, because well, people are still wondering not whether there was weapons of mass destruction, but what happened to them.
Is there new information?
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