Dennis Prager Show - A Compelling Case for Hell
Aired: 2026-04-30
Duration: 38:50


=== Can Rational Minds Believe in Hell (02:03) ===

[00:00:00]  On today's episode of Timeless Wisdom, can a sophisticated, modern, contemporary, intellectual, rational, moral person believe in hell?
[00:00:13]  That's coming up on Timeless Wisdom with Dennis Prager.
[00:00:17]  Is losing weight getting harder as you get older?
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[00:00:47]  Welcome to Timeless Wisdom with Dennis Prager.
[00:00:50]  Hear thousands of hours of Dennis's lectures, courses, and classic radio programs.
[00:00:55]  And to purchase Dennis Prager's Rational Bibles, go to DennisPrager.com.
[00:01:13]  Or not to be?
[00:01:15]  That is the question.
[00:01:17]  Where was God?
[00:01:19]  Isn't God supposed to be good?
[00:01:20]  Isn't he supposed to love us?
[00:01:22]  And does God want us to suffer?
[00:01:24]  Ten years, you're not finished yet?
[00:01:27]  Morning!
[00:01:28]  Why did you do this to me?
[00:01:31]  Who are you?
[00:01:34]  Bruce?
[00:01:36]  I'm God.
[00:01:37]  Bingo!
[00:01:38]  Yahtzee!
[00:01:39]  Is that your final answer?
[00:01:40]  Our service has God!
[00:01:43]  Bing, ding, Well, it was nice to meet you, Scott.
[00:01:47]  Thank you for the Grand Canyon, and good luck with the apocalypse.
[00:01:52]  Hi, everybody.
[00:01:55]  This is the Ultimate Issues Hour on The Dennis Prager Show.
[00:01:58]  Every week, this hour is devoted to some great issue of life.

=== Redefining Eternal Punishment as Karma (15:44) ===

[00:02:04]  And the issue today is.
[00:02:08]  I wish I had a drum roll here.
[00:02:10]  Do you guys have a drum roll?
[00:02:11]  Give me a drum roll.
[00:02:12]  The issue today is.
[00:02:22]  Very good.
[00:02:23]  Very, very good.
[00:02:25]  The issue today is hell.
[00:02:28]  H E L L.
[00:02:32]  And can a sophisticated, modern, contemporary, intellectual, rational, moral person believe in hell?
[00:02:44]  Well, I will give you my response, and I will be happy to take your calls in response to my response.
[00:02:52]  Hold on a moment.
[00:02:54]  Not only do I believe that there is a hell, which I will explain in a moment, I pray there is one.
[00:03:05]  And that I know will offend some people.
[00:03:09]  And if you're offended by that, you let me know.
[00:03:13]  See, folks, this notion that a lot of people have well, I believe in a sort of heaven, but there is no hell, cracks me up.
[00:03:23]  So, what exactly is there?
[00:03:24]  If good people go to heaven, Where do bad people go?
[00:03:28]  Now, I'm not going to get into the issue of the criteria that your religion or you personally have for who gets to heaven and who gets to hell.
[00:03:38]  That's a separate issue.
[00:03:39]  It's a theological difference.
[00:03:40]  I never debate theological differences.
[00:03:44]  They're statements of faith, and it is pointless, truly pointless, to debate faith, in my opinion.
[00:03:49]  I never do.
[00:03:49]  I debate everything else in life.
[00:03:51]  But I certainly debate reason.
[00:03:54]  Remember this, folks.
[00:03:56]  Let me get to the bottom line and then work backwards.
[00:03:59]  Those of you who say that you hope there is no hell or there is no hell are saying that you hope that the most vile human beings, the cruelest, most sadistic human beings, do not in any way get punished after they die.
[00:04:18]  That's what you're saying.
[00:04:19]  I don't know why you would root for that.
[00:04:22]  Those of you who hope there is no such thing as a hell, please call me and tell me why, and now you can start, 1 8 Prager 776.
[00:04:34]  But I'd like you to react to what I'm saying and not offer a monologue of your own.
[00:04:39]  Forgive me.
[00:04:41]  But I really want to narrow this to the arguments that I am making.
[00:04:46]  There is something amoral, isn't there, about a universe wherein there is no punishment for bad deeds?
[00:04:55]  Do you really want the universe to be like that, those of you who hope there is no hell or who believe that belief in hell is primitive?
[00:05:04]  Now, folks, let me make something clear.
[00:05:05]  I have no definition for hell.
[00:05:08]  I don't picture people burning.
[00:05:10]  I don't even picture it for eternity.
[00:05:13]  I don't know how much time people spend there.
[00:05:16]  The word time makes no sense after death anyway, so I have no desire to use it.
[00:05:21]  So I'm not talking about eternal punishment.
[00:05:24]  I am not talking about burning.
[00:05:26]  I am talking about reward and punishment.
[00:05:30]  We have names for them, they are symbolic names.
[00:05:34]  Reward is called heaven.
[00:05:36]  Punishment is called hell.
[00:05:38]  Those of you who hope that there is no hell or can't believe that a good loving God would have one are saying that a good loving God doesn't punish those who torture children.
[00:05:51]  Do you really believe that that's a loving God?
[00:05:54]  I don't.
[00:05:55]  If God is loving, there is punishment after death.
[00:06:00]  I don't even understand the concept of God loves humanity but doesn't punish those who rape children.
[00:06:07]  I don't get it.
[00:06:10]  I don't.
[00:06:11]  That's why you'll have to explain that to me why it is that you would even think that way.
[00:06:18]  Likewise, heaven.
[00:06:20]  Of course, there is reward.
[00:06:21]  And by the way, these are certainly basic to all faiths.
[00:06:30]  Every faith I know, East or West, believes that we earn some type of hereafter consequence.
[00:06:42]  I know that there are Christians who say, well, we don't earn it.
[00:06:45]  It's gone through God's grace and it's done through faith.
[00:06:48]  It's still earned.
[00:06:49]  It's earned by your faith, okay?
[00:06:51]  There's something that you've done.
[00:06:53]  To go to a certain place afterwards.
[00:06:55]  So everybody has it in some way.
[00:06:58]  Some through acts, some through faith, some through acts and faith.
[00:07:03]  Eastern religion believes that you'll come back here and karma.
[00:07:08]  You will suffer for what you did in the past life in this life, but there's still the afterlife to this life that you'll suffer.
[00:07:15]  Because the reason it's universal, and Judaism, there are 13 principles of the Jewish faith according to the greatest Jewish philosopher who ever lived, Maimonides.
[00:07:24]  One of them is that there is reward and punishment.
[00:07:27]  God rewards the good and punishes the bad of all faiths, uh, after this life.
[00:07:32]  Every religion that has ever existed believes that, that the good, that, that however they define the good are rewarded and however they define the bad are, are punished after this life.
[00:07:46]  Why modern sophisticates think that that is primitive or bad is my question.
[00:07:51]  That's my challenge to you.
[00:07:54]  Why would you hope there isn't anything like a hell?
[00:07:58]  Do you really want people who, the people who slipped that, you know, the innocent's throats and were burned alive Americans on 9 11 or ran the Nazi death camps or the Japanese death marches, you want them to have the same exact fate as Mother Teresa?
[00:08:23]  Is that what you consider sophisticated?
[00:08:27]  Wow.
[00:08:28]  Then count me as a non sophisticate.
[00:08:31]  1 8 Prager 776.
[00:08:34]  1 8 P R A G E R 776.
[00:08:42]  That's the phone number here.
[00:08:45]  13 minutes past the hour on the Dennis Prager show.
[00:08:50]  And I would be very curious to hear from anybody who has difficulty with the notion of a hell.
[00:08:58]  In other words, the notion that a good, kind, just God. Punishes people after this life.
[00:09:05]  If I didn't believe that God did that, I would not believe in Him.
[00:09:09]  I would not consider Him kind or just.
[00:09:14]  I am as dependent upon the belief in a hell as I am on a heaven for my sanity, for my love and regard for God.
[00:09:27]  If all He does is give the same faith to everybody, no matter how we acted on this planet, Wow.
[00:09:38]  Let me take your calls, folks.
[00:09:40]  Let's begin with Jeff in Canoga Park, California.
[00:09:42]  Thanks for calling, Jeff.
[00:09:43]  This is Dennis Prager, the Ultimate Issues Hour.
[00:09:46]  Yes.
[00:09:46]  I want to bring up this idea.
[00:09:48]  There's been people that I've hated or people that I've disliked or wanted to hurt because they get revenge or whatever, but I've never come across anybody that I'd want to see suffer somewhere forever.
[00:10:00]  Now, how can I be more compassionate than God?
[00:10:04]  In other words, I wouldn't want to see someone tortured.
[00:10:07]  Forever.
[00:10:07]  I understand, maybe forever.
[00:10:08]  All right.
[00:10:09]  Well, I deliberately dropped the forever from consideration.
[00:10:14]  I dropped it.
[00:10:15]  I said, I have no time frame here.
[00:10:17]  I just want to know, do you believe that a Nazi torturer should be punished after death?
[00:10:26]  Sure, that would be fine.
[00:10:28]  I understand that.
[00:10:30]  So the only objection you have is to how long?
[00:10:32]  Yeah, because most people.
[00:10:33]  All right, all right, all right, all right.
[00:10:35]  So then we have no argument.
[00:10:36]  I'm with you.
[00:10:37]  I'm with you, Jeff.
[00:10:38]  I have no position on the eternity question.
[00:10:41]  I have no idea why one would affirm that necessarily.
[00:10:46]  I don't.
[00:10:47]  I have no idea.
[00:10:48]  God is just.
[00:10:49]  He'll figure out how long a person's punished.
[00:10:52]  But most people today, Jeff, or at least most secular people today, find the idea of hell, even for 20 minutes, repulsive.
[00:11:03]  Okay.
[00:11:04]  All right.
[00:11:05]  Okay, good.
[00:11:05]  All right.
[00:11:05]  Thank you.
[00:11:06]  That's what I'm arguing.
[00:11:08]  I'm arguing that it is not only not sophisticated, it is unjust and it is moral chaos to wish that there is no such thing as heaven and hell.
[00:11:22]  And I include hell just as much as heaven.
[00:11:26]  I have no position on the eternity issue because it's not what I'm talking about.
[00:11:32]  The people who object to there being heaven and hell do so on the grounds of sophistication, reason, and morality.
[00:11:38]  How could a good God send anybody to hell?
[00:11:41]  I have the opposite.
[00:11:42]  How could a good God not?
[00:11:44]  Back in a moment, I'm Dennis Prager.
[00:11:46]  This episode of Timeless Wisdom will continue right after this.
[00:11:52]  Is losing weight getting harder as you get older?
[00:11:54]  It's not your fault.
[00:11:55]  You're eating better, you're moving more.
[00:11:57]  But your body isn't responding anymore.
[00:11:59]  At PhD Weight Loss, they help people identify what's actually blocking fat loss and help increase your lifespan.
[00:12:04]  If you want to understand why your body isn't cooperating, call PhD Weight Loss now and book your consultation at 864 644 1900.
[00:12:12]  Mention Dennis Prager and you get two weeks free in the program, and they'll pay for your food.
[00:12:16]  That's a $1,500 value absolutely free.
[00:12:19]  Call 864 644 1900.
[00:12:24]  Now, back to more of Dennis Prager's Timeless Wisdom.
[00:12:30]  Okay, my friends, it's the Ultimate Issues Hour, 21 minutes past the hour on the Ultimate Issues Hour, so it means it's 21 minutes after the Ultimate Hour.
[00:12:41]  Okay, it's pure silliness, pure, undiluted, pristine silliness.
[00:12:48]  On this Ultimate Issues Hour, I have raised the presumably somewhat provocative issue, and it's provocative only in the sense that I want to provoke you to think if you have dismissed the notion of heaven and hell as I don't know why you would do that.
[00:13:09]  The notion that no matter how you act in this world, there is no reward or punishment for you is hardly a desirable notion.
[00:13:20]  Why would anybody want to believe that?
[00:13:22]  I mean, maybe you have to believe that because you just don't believe there's any God and therefore there can't be any reward and punishment after life.
[00:13:28]  So I, I, I look, and you're unhappy about it.
[00:13:32]  I respect that tremendously.
[00:13:35]  Look, your intellect tells you you just can't believe in a God, and therefore Hitler and Mother Teresa have the same fates.
[00:13:43]  But it's unfair, it's tragic, and there's nothing you can do about it.
[00:13:46]  Okay, fine.
[00:13:48]  But for those of you who believe that there is a God and believe that somehow it's unworthy of God to have a heaven and a hell, I don't get that.
[00:13:58]  It's unworthy of a God not to have one.
[00:14:03]  I mean, I want there to be.
[00:14:06]  I want the good to reward it.
[00:14:07]  I want the bad punished.
[00:14:10]  I do.
[00:14:14]  It keeps me sane.
[00:14:16]  When I see the cruelty of this world, it bothers me tremendously.
[00:14:19]  Doesn't bother you?
[00:14:22]  All righty, let's go to Long Beach, California.
[00:14:25]  Bill.
[00:14:26]  Hi, Bill.
[00:14:26]  Thanks for calling.
[00:14:27]  Dennis Prager here.
[00:14:28]  Hey, Dennis.
[00:14:29]  Thanks for taking my call.
[00:14:30]  I love your show.
[00:14:31]  Great.
[00:14:31]  Thank you.
[00:14:32]  Me too.
[00:14:34]  I had issues with the term you brought up as being a primitive notion because I don't believe there would be a heaven or hell.
[00:14:41]  And I think the God that's portrayed has kind of a shady character.
[00:14:46]  Like when you look at the first book of Samuel, God commands the Israelites to kill women and babies for the sake of holy war.
[00:14:53]  And so I think this is based in Christianity and Judaism and Islam as far as a God that can justify killing innocent people and commanding his followers to do so.
[00:15:04]  And so I think it's based on how morality changes and fluxes.
[00:15:09]  Well, even putting that aside, let's say God and Samuel said, Please take all the enemy's babies and raise them as wonderful people.
[00:15:18]  I don't think it would affect any of your beliefs whatsoever.
[00:15:20]  So let's leave Samuel out.
[00:15:22]  Do you believe that Hitler and Mother Teresa have the same fates?
[00:15:28]  You know what?
[00:15:28]  I'm with you.
[00:15:29]  I believe that they shouldn't have the same fate.
[00:15:31]  If I had my druthers, I don't think they shouldn't have.
[00:15:34]  Okay, so you hope for.
[00:15:35]  Wait, wait, wait.
[00:15:36]  All right, so one minute.
[00:15:37]  So you also hope that there is a heaven and a hell, like I do.
[00:15:41]  That's the thing.
[00:15:42]  I'd hope to, but I guess I'm kind of alone in it because I know a lot of.
[00:15:45]  The hardline fundamentalist Christians believe that Hitler was a Christian, so he's saved regardless of acts.
[00:15:51]  I have never met a Christian who thought that Hitler was saved.
[00:15:55]  I mean, I'm sure there are, but I have never met one.
[00:15:57]  But even putting.
[00:15:58]  I don't want to get it all sidetracked here.
[00:16:01]  You and I both believe it would be an infinitely better universe if there were some form of heaven and some form of hell, correct?
[00:16:09]  Yes, but like the previous caller, I believe hell should be more like karmic, like the Hindus and the Buddhists, where it's a learning process and you go through your punishment and then.
[00:16:17]  Like you said, time is a non issue in the afterlife, so you go through and you.
[00:16:22]  All right, fine.
[00:16:23]  But you want the bad to have consequences for their actions.
[00:16:27]  Right.
[00:16:28]  All right, so where do we differ if we differ at all?
[00:16:32]  Well, I listened to your program, and I know you have a lot of respect for your Jewish heritage.
[00:16:36]  I'm just wondering how much of that is when you actually read the Old Testament and you see God justifying the killing of innocents.
[00:16:42]  Okay, that's all right.
[00:16:43]  Yes, I do deal with that, and I admit that it is problematic, but I do deal with it.
[00:16:48]  And in the final analysis, I would have to drop my faith if God made a commandment, you will always kill babies and children of enemies.
[00:16:59]  But no, there was a one-time order in a one-time situation and only God knows why.
[00:17:05]  And I have to say in the final analysis that if God said it for whatever reason, God said it and I am not God.
[00:17:12]  But since there is, it has no ramification whatsoever in my life or the life of any Jew proposed Samuel, it's an academic question more than any other.
[00:17:24]  So, so that's how I deal with it.
[00:17:25]  But in any event, we agree on heaven and hell.
[00:17:28]  We both, uh, hope that there is one.
[00:17:30]  And that is my argument here, because if you go to, uh, to modern sophisticated language today, uh, at the university, uh, for example, and among the intellectual elite, uh, to say that you hope that there is a heaven and a hell, uh, is, is, is really almost like flatulating at a cocktail party.

=== Free Will and Moral Imperfection (07:47) ===

[00:17:48]  You just can't do that.
[00:17:49]  It, it, it's just too disruptive of, of everybody's sensibilities.
[00:17:54]  And I don't even, I don't know exactly why.
[00:17:57]  But that's why I'm making this case to disrupt those sensibilities.
[00:18:02]  1 8 Prager 776.
[00:18:04]  1 8 P R A G E R 776.
[00:18:09]  And let's go to Corona, California.
[00:18:13]  And Ken.
[00:18:14]  Hello, Ken.
[00:18:14]  Dennis Prager.
[00:18:16]  Hi, Dennis.
[00:18:16]  How are you doing today?
[00:18:18]  Good.
[00:18:18]  I'm wealth today.
[00:18:19]  Thank you.
[00:18:19]  Yeah.
[00:18:20]  I do believe that there's punishment for evil.
[00:18:23]  If you look at Adam and Eve's time for sinning against God and mankind, they were given the death penalty.
[00:18:29]  And Adam was told, from the dust you will return, from the dust you were taken.
[00:18:33]  Well, they.
[00:18:35]  They were not given the death penalty, except that, well, they were, I guess, yes, because they were immortal, presumably, and now they would eventually die, but they didn't die at the moment.
[00:18:46]  Yes, go on.
[00:18:47]  So what's the point?
[00:18:49]  No, but if they didn't sin, they would have been with us today, and all of us would have been living in perfect.
[00:18:55]  Yeah, I have never found that to be compelling, because inevitably, if they didn't sin, then their children would have sinned.
[00:19:06]  They weren't made not to sin.
[00:19:08]  They were made, God made, no, they weren't.
[00:19:10]  They were God, how could they, wait a minute, how could you be made not to, they weren't perfect.
[00:19:17]  If they were perfect, they would, wait, wait, wait, wait, if they were perfect, they wouldn't have sinned.
[00:19:21]  Well, that's where we have free will.
[00:19:23]  God didn't want robots to walk.
[00:19:24]  You're right, you're right, then they weren't perfect because free will means that you will make an imperfect choice.
[00:19:31]  It's inevitable.
[00:19:32]  Well, I don't believe exactly that.
[00:19:35]  But it also, if you think about what Adam did to mankind, nobody was more reprehensible than him because it's, If he caused the death of all humans today, because all are dying in the world.
[00:19:48]  Right, all right, well, he brought death into the world as the story would go, yes, that's right, okay, so.
[00:19:55]  But his sin.
[00:19:57]  Yes.
[00:19:58]  His punishment was to never be able to live again.
[00:20:02]  And just to burn down a house and destruct it again.
[00:20:06]  What does that have to do with heaven and hell?
[00:20:08]  Well, you think about that's the only punishment he deserved for what he had done.
[00:20:13]  He would never have a chance to have his life back again.
[00:20:16]  Yeah, all right, but I don't know what that has to do with heaven and hell.
[00:20:18]  Anyway, I don't think he went to hell.
[00:20:23]  In my book, and everybody has a different book on this, you have to do something rather evil.
[00:20:29]  Eating from the prohibited tree of knowledge was not evil, it was a sin.
[00:20:33]  We'll be back in a moment.
[00:20:35]  You're listening to The Dennis Prager Show.
[00:20:41]  34 minutes past the hour on The Ultimate Issues Hour on The Dennis Prager Show.
[00:20:46]  Every week at this time, I devote an hour to some great issue of life.
[00:20:50]  There are two and only two issues on this one.
[00:20:53]  It's easy.
[00:20:54]  People get sidetracked.
[00:20:55]  I totally understand it, but I won't, I won't allow that to happen because then we will lose the point of the hour.
[00:21:02]  I'm talking about heaven and hell.
[00:21:06]  And I have two and only two items for your consideration.
[00:21:12]  One, is it okay to hope that there is a heaven and a hell or is it only okay to hope that there is a heaven?
[00:21:20]  Two, are there a heaven and hell?
[00:21:24]  That's it.
[00:21:25]  I'm not talking about how long.
[00:21:27]  I know for some, hell by definition is eternal.
[00:21:30]  That is not my agenda here.
[00:21:31]  My agenda is not theology.
[00:21:33]  My agenda is morality and indeed justice.
[00:21:37]  What is it that one hopes for?
[00:21:41]  Why am I raising this?
[00:21:42]  Because it is in many circles, as they say today, in intellectual circles, it is unshaky at the very least to hope that there is a hell, let alone to believe in it.
[00:21:53]  What's wrong with you?
[00:21:55]  Oh, oh.
[00:21:56]  What's wrong with you?
[00:21:57]  Well, I want to know.
[00:21:59]  I have the opposite.
[00:21:59]  What's wrong with a person who doesn't want the truly vicious and sadistic and cruel to be punished and the truly good to be rewarded?
[00:22:11]  What's wrong with them?
[00:22:12]  To me, that's the question.
[00:22:14]  All right, let's go to some more of your calls.
[00:22:16]  And in Champlin, Minnesota, it's Steve.
[00:22:19]  Steve, thank you for calling.
[00:22:20]  This is Dennis Prager.
[00:22:21]  Hi.
[00:22:22]  Hi, Dennis.
[00:22:22]  Thanks for taking my call.
[00:22:24]  Thank you.
[00:22:25]  I am just wondering about your rationale so far, as I've heard it in the show, revolving a lot around.
[00:22:33]  What you want.
[00:22:35]  Your hope that hell exists, that heaven exists.
[00:22:38]  And I'm wondering how you would respond to, you know, sometime in the future finding out that, yes, there is a hell, yes, there is a heaven, but they don't function quite like you want them to.
[00:22:52]  As for example, do you have an example in mind or is it just a generic question?
[00:22:56]  Well, perhaps.
[00:22:58]  You mean they function, let's say the opposite?
[00:23:00]  You mean bad people go to heaven and good people go to hell?
[00:23:04]  No, certainly not.
[00:23:05]  I'm talking about the people in hell.
[00:23:08]  We seem to have a spectrum of how bad the thing is that they've done.
[00:23:13]  Maybe somebody just missed the line and they're in hell, but the thing they did isn't that bad versus some of the.
[00:23:19]  Well, I believe that God.
[00:23:21]  Well, all right.
[00:23:21]  I believe that God is perfectly just and that our fate is determined by God's perfect justice.
[00:23:29]  That's all.
[00:23:30]  So that I don't believe that the man who.
[00:23:34]  Tortures children and the man who takes a stapler from his office have the same punishment.
[00:23:41]  So you are trusting, in a sense, then, God's justice to resolve any potential issues that you would have with how things function.
[00:23:48]  You could drop the words in a sense.
[00:23:51]  Okay, great.
[00:23:52]  All right.
[00:23:53]  Okay, good.
[00:23:54]  I love that.
[00:23:55]  I love clearing things up.
[00:23:56]  Let me try to do that for Ben in Philadelphia.
[00:23:59]  Hi, Ben.
[00:23:59]  Dennis Prager.
[00:24:01]  Hi, Dennis.
[00:24:03]  Yes.
[00:24:04]  I think that if God is good, then there would be no hell.
[00:24:08]  Because God would want everyone to just be happy.
[00:24:12]  Well, I'll tell you this.
[00:24:13]  Well, Ben, Ben, I'll tell you.
[00:24:15]  If I were not happy, then that would just be, that would everyone be good.
[00:24:19]  I mean, everyone would be happy.
[00:24:20]  Okay, well, first of all, if there is no hell, I won't be happy.
[00:24:27]  But I mean, I'm saying in heaven, like, what if God could just make you happy?
[00:24:34]  Why would you think that a good God would make a mass torturer happy?
[00:24:41]  Why does that mean God is good?
[00:24:44]  God isn't good if he doesn't treat the good and bad differently.
[00:24:48]  No, because God would just want everybody to be happy.
[00:24:51]  That's what makes God so good.
[00:24:53]  No, that doesn't make him good.
[00:24:54]  It makes him stupid.
[00:24:56]  It makes him vicious.
[00:25:00]  Let me ask you something.
[00:25:01]  Wait, Ben, Ben, Ben, Ben, hold on.
[00:25:05]  Ben, you're 18.
[00:25:07]  Are you at school?
[00:25:10]  Yes.
[00:25:11]  Okay, if there was a kid in your class who went over and, whenever he could, beat up really severely any kid he could find, and the school finally caught him, would you want them to want to make him happy, or would you want them to have him punished in some way?
[00:25:33]  I'll wait to give you time to give me that answer.

=== Balancing Feelings with Morality (12:18) ===

[00:25:36]  1 8 Prager 776 is the number on this Ultimate Issues on The Dennis Prager Show.
[00:25:43]  This episode of Timeless Wisdom will continue right after this.
[00:25:50]  Is losing weight getting harder as you get older?
[00:25:52]  It's not your fault.
[00:25:53]  You're eating better, you're moving more, but your body isn't responding anymore.
[00:25:56]  At PhD Weight Loss, they help people identify what's actually blocking fat loss and help increase your lifespan.
[00:26:02]  If you want to understand why your body isn't cooperating, call PhD Weight Loss now and book your consultation at 864 644 1900.
[00:26:10]  Mention Dennis Prager and you get two weeks free in the program, and they'll pay for your food.
[00:26:14]  That's a $1,500 value absolutely free.
[00:26:17]  Call 864 644 1900.
[00:26:22]  Now, back to more of Dennis Prager's Timeless Wisdom.
[00:26:31]  All righty, everybody.
[00:26:32]  You're listening to the Dennis Prager Show.
[00:26:38]  And if you have been shaking, just think of the topic here.
[00:26:45]  1 8 Prager 776.
[00:26:47]  This is the Ultimate Issues Hour.
[00:26:53]  And the subject is appropriately in some parts of this country right now.
[00:27:00]  Heaven and hell.
[00:27:04]  And I'm making the argument that a good person can certainly hope that there is such a thing.
[00:27:13]  A good person can hope that there is such a thing as heaven and hell.
[00:27:19]  And we welcome back the folks in the LA area where we just had earthquake news.
[00:27:28]  And we hope everybody is well.
[00:27:31]  I am in New York presently, so no shaking here, but apparently there was one felt.
[00:27:38]  Sean was rocking and sucking back at the home studio.
[00:27:40]  Sean, are you steady right now?
[00:27:48]  Okay, fine.
[00:27:50]  I have to say, there is no connection.
[00:27:54]  For those of you in the Los Angeles area, there is no connection between my topic and.
[00:28:01]  And the fact that you just got shaken up quite a bit, apparently.
[00:28:07]  Here we're getting 5.8.
[00:28:13]  I can't believe it.
[00:28:14]  That's exactly what I predicted for 3,000 miles away.
[00:28:18]  Somehow listening to it like that.
[00:28:20]  Yeah.
[00:28:21]  So I hope everybody is well.
[00:28:23]  And there is no relationship between the topic I chose for this Ultimate Issues Hour and this 5.8.
[00:28:32]  In Chino Hills.
[00:28:35]  Uh, which was felt obviously at the headquarters of this show in Glendale, California.
[00:28:41]  I'll tell you, every section of the country has its own perils.
[00:28:44]  That's the way it works.
[00:28:45]  The tornadoes in the Midwest, the hurricanes in the East, the earthquakes in the West.
[00:28:53]  What do they get in, uh, what do they get in Montana?
[00:28:58]  Hmph.
[00:28:59]  You don't ever hear about any natural calamity in Montana.
[00:29:03]  Although it's so big and so few people it might happen and nobody would know.
[00:29:07]  So, who knows?
[00:29:08]  Anyway, I truly do, though, hope everybody is well, and we'll keep you abreast here locally in any event for those of you in the LA area.
[00:29:20]  And I'm getting feedback here as well when there's any new report.
[00:29:27]  But again, I plead innocent, excuse me, not guilty to any correlation between my topic and this event.
[00:29:37]  So, the topic here on the Ultimate Issues Hour has been.
[00:29:41]  My belief is that it's quite alright to hope there's a heaven and a hell, and you can't only hope there's a heaven.
[00:29:46]  It makes no sense.
[00:29:48]  So, what does it mean?
[00:29:49]  Does everybody go to heaven?
[00:29:50]  Well, if not everybody goes to heaven, so then whatever it is that they don't go to, that would be a hell.
[00:29:55]  I'm not defining hell.
[00:29:56]  I'm not telling you how long it is.
[00:29:57]  I don't care.
[00:29:59]  I'm happy to use the words reward and punishment.
[00:30:02]  But I don't out sophisticate myself and drop the traditional term.
[00:30:07]  It's fine with me, heaven and hell.
[00:30:10]  All righty.
[00:30:10]  Let's go to Will in Frisco, Texas.
[00:30:14]  Will Dennis Prager.
[00:30:16]  Hi.
[00:30:17]  Hi.
[00:30:17]  You know what?
[00:30:18]  You're a smart man.
[00:30:19]  I'm sitting here listening to you talk.
[00:30:21]  And instead of saying heaven and hell or trying to figure out the correct term for it, you're fine with saying punishment.
[00:30:29]  And first, can I just say I appreciate that?
[00:30:32]  Yes.
[00:30:33]  Okay.
[00:30:33]  You may say, yeah.
[00:30:34]  Thank you, sir.
[00:30:36]  Now, I don't believe that this should be the type of hell that most people try to force down your throat.
[00:30:43]  Because from my research, and I've looked at manuscripts and other things, to come to find out that the hell that most people try to shove down your throat don't even exist, it's actually a common grave.
[00:30:59]  And I can't figure out.
[00:31:01]  Well, what do you refer?
[00:31:02]  I'm sorry, you're referring to.
[00:31:03]  What do you mean by the hell people are shoving down your throat?
[00:31:06]  Like most people, like the way I think of it.
[00:31:08]  You mean the one where people burn?
[00:31:10]  You mean that one?
[00:31:10]  The one where you burn.
[00:31:12]  Right.
[00:31:12]  All right, let us say that some terribly bad people do suffer burning.
[00:31:18]  So do you find that morally objectionable?
[00:31:22]  I'm trying to figure out.
[00:31:25]  Are you at peace with punishment?
[00:31:27]  Well, I think one should be punished, including as the guy mentioned earlier.
[00:31:34]  Noel, you're right.
[00:31:37]  We're getting into theology, and I'm not getting into theology.
[00:31:40]  I just want to speak morality and justice.
[00:31:43]  A lot of people today, especially secularly educated people, find the notion of heaven and hell morally objectionable and intellectually stupid.
[00:31:52]  I don't think it's intellectually stupid, and I don't think it's morally problematic.
[00:31:56]  I think it's morally problematic if there's a God who doesn't punish bad people.
[00:32:01]  I agree with you.
[00:32:02]  Okay, that's it, and I thank you for your call.
[00:32:05]  I really do, Will.
[00:32:06]  You see, here's the irony.
[00:32:08]  I think that most people actually, when put this way in non-theological terms, will agree that the moral equilibrium of the world and indeed our own psychological equilibrium are dependent in large measure on the belief that there is reward and punishment after this life.
[00:32:29]  Folks, it doesn't happen in this life.
[00:32:31]  I mean, let's be honest.
[00:32:34]  There are people who do awful, awful things who are not punished in this life and there are people who are utterly innocent Who suffer hell in this life.
[00:32:44]  So there has to be some way of, if there is a good God, then He makes up for this somehow.
[00:32:49]  He compensates for that imbalance.
[00:32:51]  To me, this is just, it's so basic and so elementary, I don't know why it's contentious.
[00:32:58]  That's the reason I'm raising it, though, because if you said this, you know, oh, you hope your moral and emotional equilibrium depend upon there being some form of heaven and hell.
[00:33:10]  If you said this in some graduate, Seminar in psychology, sociology, political science, and God knows what, you would be looked at as if you, I don't know, advocated smoking cigarettes.
[00:33:22]  Well, I don't know if that, I don't know about that bad.
[00:33:25]  We'll be back in a moment.
[00:33:27]  Final segment of this Ultimate Issues Hour coming up on The Dennis Prager Show.
[00:33:31]  This episode of Timeless Wisdom will continue right after this.
[00:33:38]  Is losing weight getting harder as you get older?
[00:33:40]  It's not your fault.
[00:33:41]  You're eating better, you're moving more, but your body isn't responding anymore.
[00:33:44]  At PhD Weight Loss, they help people identify what's actually blocking fat loss and help increase your lifespan.
[00:33:50]  If you want to understand why your body isn't cooperating, call BHD Weight Loss Now and book your consultation at 864 644 1900.
[00:33:58]  Mention Dennis Prager and you get two weeks free in the program and they'll pay for your food.
[00:34:02]  That's a $1,500 value absolutely free.
[00:34:05]  Call 864 644 1900.
[00:34:10]  Now, back to more of Dennis Prager's Timeless Wisdom.
[00:34:16]  Yeah, apparently it was a pretty tough one out there in Southern California.
[00:34:21]  I'm in New York.
[00:34:25]  Apparently, the LA Time server is down and either being flooded or damaged, or who knows.
[00:34:32]  There's the Ultimate Issues Hour.
[00:34:33]  Dennis Prager interrupted by an earthquake.
[00:34:36]  But, you know, we go on, we troop on no matter where it is.
[00:34:41]  Thunderstorms, tornadoes.
[00:34:42]  That's what I say in the Happiness Hour, right?
[00:34:44]  No matter what.
[00:34:46]  Talking about hell and heaven here.
[00:34:51]  And let me summarize some of your calls.
[00:34:53]  I've been making the case here for a moral person to hope that there is some form of heaven and hell.
[00:35:01]  Because there's hell for good people here and heaven for bad people too often.
[00:35:06]  And doesn't that bother you?
[00:35:09]  Don't you want there to be some recompense somewhere, if not this world, then something after this world?
[00:35:16]  So why would people be offended at the notion?
[00:35:19]  Now, you may not like any given religion's take on hell.
[00:35:22]  That's a separate issue.
[00:35:24]  That's why I said I'm not talking theology.
[00:35:26]  I'm talking morality, justice, and reason.
[00:35:31]  All right, let's see.
[00:35:32]  So Ron says he doesn't believe in hell and Fort Worth because a good God wouldn't torture people forever.
[00:35:38]  I'm not here to deal with the forever issue.
[00:35:40]  I announced that at the very beginning.
[00:35:43]  So that means I assume from that that Ron believes that there would be a time limited hell.
[00:35:48]  That's fine.
[00:35:49]  My argument was again, please, please just react to what I'm saying.
[00:35:55]  That the idea of a divine reward and punishment, heaven, hell, call it what you want, is axiomatic to belief in a good God.
[00:36:05]  I'll tell you, that was a fascinating call with the 18 year old young man who said that God wants us all happy so he wouldn't send anybody to hell.
[00:36:15]  Now, God is more interested in justice than he is in that bad people are happy.
[00:36:21]  Anyway, we wouldn't all be happy.
[00:36:23]  As I said, I wouldn't be happy if I knew that.
[00:36:28]  That terrorists went to heaven?
[00:36:33]  Isn't that obvious?
[00:36:35]  So they might be happy.
[00:36:36]  I wouldn't.
[00:36:38]  How about the victims?
[00:36:41]  Boy, that's a real source of happiness.
[00:36:44]  Yes, your kid has nails in his head.
[00:36:47]  Indeed, I met such a child in Israel with a nail that went to his head.
[00:36:53]  You know, these latest killings by these women.
[00:36:58]  In Iraq, they put nails in the bombs so that those who are not murdered are brain damaged, eyes blown out by a nail.
[00:37:08]  Palestinians developed that one for export.
[00:37:12]  Yeah, that's why I want a heaven and a hell.
[00:37:15]  That was this Ultimate Issues Hour.
[00:37:16]  You're listening to The Dennis Prager Show.
[00:37:26]  Untimeless Wisdom with Dennis Prager.
[00:37:28]  If you allow yourself, and this is super duper serious, if you allow yourself to be better, to the extent that you allow your feelings to do two things one, control your behavior, two, be the measure of your happiness, you can never ever be happy, and you will inflict misery on others.

=== Guiding Happiness Through Your Feelings (00:55) ===

[00:37:54]  Other than that, it is a good idea to be guided by your feelings.
[00:37:58]  Join us tomorrow to hear more on Timeless Wisdom with Dennis Prager.
[00:38:03]  This has been Timeless Wisdom with Dennis Prager.
[00:38:07]  Visit DennisPrager.com for thousands of hours of Dennis' lectures, courses, and classic radio programs, and to purchase Dennis Prager's Rational Bibles.
[00:38:20]  Is losing weight getting harder as you get older?
[00:38:22]  It's not your fault.
[00:38:23]  You're eating better, you're moving more, but your body isn't responding anymore.
[00:38:27]  At PhD Weight Loss, they help people identify what's actually blocking fat loss and help increase your lifespan.
[00:38:32]  If you want to understand why your body isn't cooperating, call PhD Weight Loss Now and book your consultation at 864 644 1900.
[00:38:40]  Mention Dennis Prager and you get two weeks free in the program, and they'll pay for your food.
[00:38:44]  That's a $1,500 value absolutely free.
[00:38:47]  Call 864 644 1900.