Dave Smith and Robbie the Fire Bernstein dissect Big Tech's censorship shift, noting how corporate media abandoned the COVID lab leak theory only after Dr. Robert Redfield endorsed it, while simultaneously deplatforming figures like Donald Trump and Alex Jones. They argue this narrative control stems from government interference rather than scientific consensus or organic market forces, contrasting CNN's decline with Fox's rise. The discussion extends to culture wars, where they claim conflicts arise from differing views on state power, and address online drama involving a controversial meme, refusing to prioritize condemning jokes over fighting COVID restrictions and over-regulation. Ultimately, the hosts urge libertarians to oppose the "cathedral" of aligned institutions that suppress free speech and market dynamics. [Automatically generated summary]
Transcriber: nvidia/parakeet-tdt-0.6b-v2, sat-12l-sm, and large-v3-turbo
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Lab Leak Conspiracy Theories00:15:28
Fill her up.
You're listening to the Gash Digital Network.
We need to roll back the state.
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You're listening to part of the problem on the Gas Digital Network.
Here's your host, Dave Smith.
What's up, everybody?
Welcome to a brand new episode of Part of the Problem.
I am Dave Smith.
He is the king of the caulks, Robbie the Fire Bernstein.
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Is it next Sunday, Bro?
Yes, sir.
So that's next Sunday, June 12th.
We will be back there.
Or I'm sorry, June 13th.
We will be back there at Old Man Hustle.
Me, Rob Bernstein, BK Chris.
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All right.
Let's get into today's show.
So are there any gigs you want to plug before we start?
RobbyTheFire.com for all your summer porch tour needs.
Oh, that's right.
The summer porch tour is coming up.
Exciting.
That thing just gets bigger and bigger every year, except last year when COVID hit.
No, we were still out, dude.
Oh, yeah, you still did porches.
Hell yeah.
COVID shot the summer porch tour down.
Some say you're what kept the virus going, the summer porch tours.
Porches were a hotbed for COVID.
Fauci needed my support.
It was starting a turn down and he needed to keep the narrative up.
So I did my part.
Hey, did you get a chance to look at that Vanity Fair article that I sent you?
I skimmed it.
I gave a pretty good read.
It was a long one to get, you know, just before.
I know.
I sent it to you.
It's my fault because I sent it to you way too late because I just found it early this morning.
But I wanted to talk a little bit about what was in this Vanity Fair piece.
And people, if you haven't seen it, here, let me give you the title so people can go look it up on their own.
But it was a piece that just came out in Vanity Fair called The Lab Leak Theory Inside the Fight to Uncover COVID-19's Origins.
And it was a really good piece.
And it was in Vanity Fair, which is, you know, strange.
Had autistic kids and everything.
Yeah.
Well, but Vanity Fair is just a trash publication in general.
There's like they used to have some talent there.
Christopher Hitchens used to work there for a little bit, but there's something interesting.
And I hate, I'm not, people who listen to this show for years, you know, I really don't like speculating.
I'm not big into conspiracy, like conspiracies.
I don't mean that in the like derogatory sense of the world word.
I mean like wild conspiracies.
I don't like to get into those things, even though I'm sure there are wild conspiracies that exist.
I just don't, I like to talk about things that we know and really be able to make an overwhelming case for it.
And the problem, that's why I like having Scott Horton on all the time because he will tell you exactly what happened here.
There's no, like, he has a, yeah, there you go, Libertarian Institute.
There's no kind of like, like he could convict every argument he's making in a court of law.
You know what I mean?
He can prove it beyond a reasonable doubt.
And that's what I like.
And even in the last show that we were doing, we were speculating more than usual.
Like when we're looking at these Fauci emails and you're like, well, what does this really mean?
What could be the answer for this?
There's almost like nothing else you can do in those situations.
So again, I'm just prefacing.
I'm disclaiming my speculation that's coming up with the fact that I don't like to do this, but sometimes you have no other option.
And I got to say, it's really bizarre how all of a sudden, over the last couple weeks, the entire tone in the corporate press has changed.
It's just very strange.
Like all of a sudden, it just went from like the idea that COVID came from the Wuhan lab, the Virology Institute, is it literally seems like one day it was, you're a crazy conspiracy theorist, and this is dangerous to say, and we will kick you off all social media if you say it.
And the next day, it was like, well, yeah, obviously it came from the lab.
I'm calling it the Cosby effect that there seems to be some weird thing that you can have something that everybody knows about.
And if for some reason someone publishes it, people are like, oh, we're allowed to start.
It's like the emperor wears no clothes.
Yeah.
It's one person publishes it and the wheel just turns where this is now acceptable.
And then everyone talks about it.
But it's so weird how everyone just falls in line.
You know, like everyone all of a sudden is just like, oh, yeah, no, what are you talking about?
Yeah, bats.
Come on, that's ridiculous.
It didn't come from bats.
It came from the lab.
And this is totally acceptable now.
I have no fear of this channel getting strikes or anything like that for saying this now.
There's like nothing.
There's no concern about it.
Every major mainstream media outlet is talking about this.
It's just completely acceptable.
Whereas just a month ago, it would have been like, oh, this, this might get you booted.
It's just, it's a very bizarre thing.
And all of a sudden, it seems like, but do I say this wrong?
Someone said this the other day.
Is it all of the sudden, whatever.
Anyway, and now throwing Fauci under the bus, talking about the dirty money, talking about the former CDC head who was saying early on that this was that the lab leak hypothesis was the most likely one.
All this stuff is just like, no, totally out there.
And it's really something when you think about, you know, like, what if, if you just play the counterfactual out in your head, right?
What if in March and April of 2020, the American people knew this?
Like, what if right away, you know, as this whole pandemic is beginning and really starting to hit America and change everything about our everyone's life that you know, you know, right as that's happening, if just the American people knew that this virus came from a lab in Wuhan that was doing gain of function research that Fauci's organizations were funding.
Like, what would the attitude have been about listening to Fauci then?
My guess is pretty different, right?
Like that would have made a pretty big difference.
I think a lot of people would have been like, I don't want to hear what this guy has to say.
Like he might be responsible for this whole thing.
Get him out of the way and let me listen to some like, you know, some expert who's not as conflicted on this topic.
And yet now, all of a sudden, now all of a sudden, the corporate press has decided it's okay that we can talk about this, but without any of that part that I just mentioned, like none of the like, oh, this kind of changes everything that we were telling you over the last year.
It's just really wild to see it happening.
And on top of that, there should be some sort of accountability or investigative study over what information do these news agencies have that they just weren't publishing?
Because man, were they able to put these stories together quickly?
New York Post had pictures of the scientists being bitten by the bats.
This Vanity Fair article is a pretty good deep dive.
Like, how many stories were these people just sitting on?
How many experts actually gave them, you know, the inside scoop and they just.
Well, that's why.
That's what I meant about saying like speculating and going into the conspiracy realm.
Cause it's like, I don't want to jump to conclusions that, you know, because the problem with speculating is that oftentimes you do jump to conclusions and you're missing a more likely or an easier path there.
So I don't want to do that.
But that's exactly right.
What you just said is exactly right.
It's like, wait a minute.
So you're just telling me all of a sudden we're ready to roll with all of these stories that all of the sudden it's kind of like, oh, there's, there were a few people.
I don't know if you remember like it was like three weeks ago on the show that I was talking about that Nicholas Wade piece where I was like, wow, this guy, Nicholas Wade, who's like a real deal science correspondent.
Like this was the guy.
He was the editor of the New York Times science section.
He was the editor of Nature and he was the editor of science.
These are like, you know, in the world of science journalism, these are like the biggest credentials you could have.
And he came out and wrote this whole piece note was on Medium.
They didn't publish it in the New York Times.
They didn't publish their own guy, you know, in the New York Times, but it was on Medium and he was like, look, the overwhelming scientific evidence is that the lab leak is the most plausible way that we got COVID.
And I was like, wow, that's pretty crazy.
Like this real deal guy is just coming out and saying it.
And then within like a couple weeks, it's just like, oh, yeah, now everyone's saying this.
Oh, and by the way, hey, here's this government document we have about all the sick people who worked at the Wuheim lab.
Yeah, it was right around November.
They all got sick and were hospitalized.
You know, that might be of interest if you're thinking that this is where the COVID came from.
And then it's like, oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
And by the way, the next week, here's all of Fauci's emails.
This just happens.
The timing just happens to like line up this way.
It just, it seems bizarre.
And now all of a sudden you can just go to Vanity Fair and get a really excellent piece, like really, really well done.
And one of the things that's really, that they really break down in the Vanity Fair piece that I got to say, it was, it was refreshing to see someone talking about this, although still with the feeling of like, where the hell have you guys been?
Because the idea of being a good journalist is not that once it's safe and after the fact, we will come out and do good reporting.
What you'd need in a good journalist would be willing to do the good reporting, like when it actually matters, when the crisis is happening.
But one of the things that they mentioned, and they had a line in there somewhere, I don't know if you caught this because I know I sent it to you pretty late.
But they had one line where they basically said that what the lab leak hypothesis threatened to do to the research community was what Chernobyl did to the nuclear energy community.
That like if it came out early, like they basically made the point that this whole industry is a honeypot and that all of them are getting all of these tax dollars to do all of these crazy different research projects.
And just like any other government, you know, complex, it's not really based off what research absolutely needs to be done.
It's more kind of like, well, there's this money allocated.
There's political favors being done.
There's who's connected and people are getting money left and right.
And some of the experiments are really, really dangerous.
And some of them are being done in these fucking, you know, crazy countries like China, where there's like no regulation or oversight or anything like this, you know?
And so if it came, if it came out that the virology industry is responsible for all of this, that was a real threat to their gravy train.
And so, of course, you saw all of these scientists who had a real incentive to make sure that their industry wasn't blamed for this.
And that now, as you see that, it makes so much sense looking back at it.
It's like, oh, yeah, that's why so many of these scientists were quick to rush to give, you know, the Facebook censors, the cover that they needed to say, yeah, no, this is a conspiracy theory.
And we've already, we've determined this is a conspiracy theory.
And therefore, anyone can be silenced who said this.
But then you look at like all the people who organized and they go through this in Vanity Fair.
You look at all the people who organized this group of scientists and it's like very closely related, if not the exact same people who were funding this gain of function research to begin with.
So of course, that's why they're saying it.
And now we know, like, this is a pretty slam dunk argument in hindsight that they didn't have strong scientific evidence that this didn't come from the lab.
They just were very heavily incentivized to make sure that they didn't lose their funding.
And this is, this is just like, you know, it's another great anarchist argument.
This is why government poisons everything.
You can't even have fucking science anymore when it really matters, the most important time when you'd need scientific experts, a global pandemic.
Look what they're doing.
They're protecting their own interests and not actually giving the people good information.
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All right, let's get back on the show.
One of the things that was really interesting about it is that they cover this guy, the former head of the CDC, who you've mentioned several times on the show, is that he says at one point that he was, he was not surprised when he received threats from politicians, but he was surprised when he received threats from other scientists.
And so this guy who came out and had the courage to say pretty early on that he thought this came from the lab.
That seemed like the most likely, you know, scenario is he's getting threats from other scientists.
Now, what's going on here?
I think it's pretty obvious.
This was obviously like, you know, very risky for their gravy train, for it to come out that they did this to the world.
Because what's the next logical thing for any normal person to think?
If you find out that these virologists are doing these crazy experiments and they gave us COVID, you'd go, well, why are we doing this?
Scientists Facing Threats00:13:49
What benefit is this gain of function, you know, producing?
I still have not seen one person, one article or piece, which I'm open to.
Like, I'm not saying I have a strong opinion on this.
I really don't know.
But they come out and say, no, no, no, you don't understand.
Gain of function research is dangerous, but here's how it saved so many lives.
Here's why we absolutely need to do this.
Still haven't heard anything.
Fauci's running away from gain of function.
He's like, oh, I don't know what you're talking about.
I mean, yeah, there was a little bit, but we didn't really fund it there.
And the ones we do, we only do in America and it's very, very safe, but no one's making like a strong defense of it.
This is why we need gain of function research.
We have to soup up these viruses because then this has allowed us to save so many lives.
And if COVID came from this stuff, which looks very plausible right now, then you would have had to save a whole lot of lives for it to be, you know what I mean, for the benefits to outweigh the costs.
Like if you're going to sit here and tell me that millions of people around the world have died from COVID, have you saved millions of lives with this research?
Because you would have had to for this to have been worth it.
I don't see anyone trying to make that argument.
And go do this in the middle of Alaska.
There's got to be, if gain of function is really that important, I'm sure there's a safe way to do it.
Well, if gain of function.
And it's not giving money to the Chinese.
Yes, even if it's really important, right?
If this, what we're living under, is a possible outcome of it, then it should be done under the strictest, most absolutely careful circumstances.
Yeah, maybe that's it, right?
Maybe Alaska or something.
I don't know, but it should be done in a way where we're really concerned about this.
And clearly, that was not the case.
There's really no debate about that.
So, I mean, nobody's saying, like, oh, the standards in the Wuhan Virology Lab were really up to par.
Nobody's making that claim.
So, anyway, I just think it's really interesting as this whole narrative is completely shifting.
And it does create this thing in you where you're like, it makes you want to question everything else.
I mean, once, you know, once you find out, like, you know, it's like if you have, if you were like dating someone and you find out that so much of what they've told you is a lie, you know, they don't actually have the job they told you.
You got to wonder, do they even have a vagina?
Right.
What was that thing?
No, but you know what I'm saying?
Like, if you turned out, oh, they don't actually work where they told you they work.
They don't actually live where they told you they live.
They didn't go to school where they told you that.
Wouldn't you start to go, hey, when you said you were at dinner last week, where the hell were you then?
You know, like, I can't trust anything you say now, right?
So it leaves you in this place.
And I got to say, I've mentioned this before, and I want to be careful because this is still the thing that will get you taken down.
So let me try to be as careful as I say this: that I see pretty compelling evidence that this came from the Wuhan lab, that that's where COVID came from.
Most scientists are agreeing with this now, that this is the most likely scenario.
I have not seen any evidence to suggest that this was a bioweapon.
However, once you've gotten to the point where you know that COVID was created in a lab in China, wouldn't it be insane to not ask that next question?
Why would it be that we find out this was created in a lab by the Chinese Communist Party and we're not allowed to go, we just have to take it as a given that it was accidental, that it couldn't have possibly been intentional.
Now, again, I don't think it was intentional.
That is not what I'm saying.
I'm just saying that once you get to this step, you would be derelict in your duty if you did not ask the next question.
And very few people seem to be doing that.
And that to me kind of raises a red flag.
Like, why are we not concerned about that?
I'm sorry.
If there's a group of Shiite militias in the side of Iraq with a few, you know, rifles, we have to take that as a very serious threat.
We have to really think about whether or not we need to bomb the crap out of Iran or Iraq again, right?
But this, we don't even have to think about.
We don't even have to like run the possibility of like what, what if it was intentional?
What could we do to stop it?
What's to stop the next one?
What if someone did want to use one of these intentionally?
We're just kind of pretending none of these questions exist.
And that seems awfully bizarre.
Well, I think it's that money is free now.
So if it comes to like the risk of a virus, we can afford to keep everyone at home versus people on the other side with guns, we can't control when they do or don't shoot them.
So it's significantly riskier.
That is true.
Money is free now.
That's the new Joe Biden 2024.
Money's free now.
What's the problem?
You want more money?
I'll give you more money.
That's Joe Biden's 2024 campaign.
It's just like, oh, $6 trillion not enough?
We could do $7 trillion.
I don't care.
Eight, nine.
Yeah.
Joe Biden's just going to slip you a piece of paper and be like, write a number down.
How much cash do you want?
I'm literally printing this stuff.
It doesn't matter to me.
Just take it.
What do you want?
You're like, I want $1,000 trillion dollars.
It's like, yeah, done.
I'll wire it to you.
No problem.
Joe Biden, 2024.
All right.
So one of the other things that's kind of ties into this, at least I see them as all being related.
And obviously, these are topics that we've talked about before, but this is what's going on in the news.
And it's, you know, fairly consequential.
But with the rise of COVID, really came an acceleration in the rise of tech censorship.
And as you were getting into on the last episode, the things are all related.
Like the people who are doing the tech censoring are like talking with Fauci and all of these other people and coming up with what are the standard lines that you're allowed to say and what are the scientific perspectives that you're not allowed to say.
And we found out already that a lot of them were bullshit.
But this was something that we noticed, you know, on social media that, you know, there had certainly been people being deplatformed and being banned, some people who I know well for years.
That was, you know, not a brand new thing in 2020, but it really got dramatically accelerated during the COVID pandemic.
Like it was all of a sudden in the private Facebook group that we used to have on Facebook, every day.
It was occasionally, like very occasionally, things would get flagged.
All now it was every day, every single day.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Well, it was, it was, but it was the COVID stuff was always what it was about, at least at first in March, April, May, June, July, like all from the spring through the summer.
It was any article that deviated from the official COVID talking points, something like, say, this might have come from a lab.
That would have been flagged, taken down.
It happened all the time.
It was always COVID-related stuff.
I remember pieces about, you know, early on, things like, you know, questioning whether ventilators were killing people or not.
That would get you flagged and taken down.
And it was over, it was very clear.
It was very clearly a concerted effort on their part to be like, we are controlling the narrative here.
Like this huge societal shift is happening and we're going to make sure that we get control of the narrative.
So, you know, people go along with it.
So that was a big part of all of this.
And then as you just mentioned, you know, it seems, again, maybe a little bit of speculation, but it did happen to be a presidential year.
And then, of course, as the fall came around and it was like primetime presidential season, it all became pretty obvious that that's really what this was about.
You know, stories like the Hunter Biden laptop being, you know, squashed.
Like that had nothing to do with the COVID stuff, but it was like, well, we've already really, you know, gotten used to using these tools and now we're going to use them to get Joe Biden elected.
So Hunter had to shut down that story because he was looking to profit off his crack usage.
He wanted to be, he wanted the first option.
They were getting to it first.
That wasn't fair.
That is true.
And he should, if anyone's going to, right?
Shouldn't he be the crackhead?
That's his story.
Yeah, he sure did.
That's right.
No one else could tell Hunter's story except Hunter.
And he did tell his story, right?
Didn't he?
All right.
So it was just announced yesterday that Donald Trump, who I believe the status was that he was suspended temporarily from Facebook.
And they like said in six months, we're going to make a determination about what, you know, I don't know.
Can you just imagine who has to look at all of Trump's tweets and make a determination whether this man should be allowed to speak?
And anyway, so they made a determination that another two years he is banned from Facebook.
Very, very, very, very coincidentally puts us right past the midterm elections.
I'm sure there was no, no one put that together.
I just happened to notice it.
But Donald Trump, another two-year ban from Facebook.
So they are really determined to not let this guy speak to his people.
And I, you know, this is quite an interesting story.
And there's really, I just don't see how anyone who's being honest here, even people who really don't like Trump, like myself, I don't see how you don't see this as pretty creepy.
Here's a guy who is number one, he's the most famous human being on the planet, I think, probably.
He was president of the United States of America, not to mention all his other credentials, like the number one show and number one book and all this stuff, but he was the president of the United States of America and just got in this last election, with the exception of Joe Biden, assuming everything about the election is legitimate, with the exception of Joe Biden, more votes than anyone's ever got for president.
Just a few months ago, he got more votes than Barack Obama got.
You know, that guy can't speak to his people.
You could have 74 million people vote for you as president.
And that's, you know, I mean, if someone would like got a million votes for them and they were silenced, you'd be like, wow, there's like a million people who wanted this guy to be president.
Probably more than that who want to hear from the guy.
It'd be crazy to silence someone who's that big.
This guy got 74 million people.
This is a huge chunk of the country who cast a ballot for him.
And yet he's still not allowed to speak to his people.
I just find that to be very creepy.
And it's so weird.
The people who go along with it and cheer it on.
Like, it really demonstrates like a real confidence that you're on the side of the establishment.
You know what I mean?
Because wouldn't anyone who was a little bit anti-establishment or even just worried about any aspect of it be like, I mean, if they could silence that guy, they could sure silence me.
They could sure silence someone I really don't want to be silenced.
How confident would you have to be that the powers that be are on your side to not be concerned about this?
Very strange.
Or how stupid that you don't think that they can retarget.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Perhaps that's it.
So they actually changed the entire, they love having their buy roles or whatever they call them.
Just they could go, well, that's the rule.
And so we apply the rule equally.
And so their new thing is that even any politician can be censored the same as anybody else if the statement that they're making Facebook deems to be inappropriate.
Now, firstly, when Facebook was dead wrong for an entire year on the, you know, the Wuhan lab leak story, how can they possibly claim that they are even good at censorship?
Like it would be one thing if they had a good track record of saying, look at all this disinformation that we managed to censor, but they don't have that track record.
It's pretty clear that they've become a good tool for controlling the narrative because Trump successfully used Facebook to get elected and they realized, oh shit, we got to get our grips on social media.
But now they said that essentially Ted Cruz could say something that Facebook doesn't agree with and they're going to censor Ted Cruz.
And same as what you were saying, if the most powerful people in the world, the senators or previous presidents aren't allowed to express their viewpoints that could very likely turn out to be 100% true a year later, Facebook gets to pull them down.
There's no free speech on these platforms.
There's no even reason to pretend.
Yeah.
And as we've been saying for years now, right?
Because this thing has been building up.
And I got to say, this was an issue that I was surprised that more libertarians didn't see the danger in right away.
Like for me, like even before Alex Jones got kicked off, I was like, oh, this is pretty creepy that they're just kicking people off.
Even when it's people I kind of in some way wanted to get kicked off, like you'd be like, oh, these guys are really awful, but they get kicked off.
You're like, yeah, this is creepy.
This is a creepy thing.
Free Speech on Platforms00:14:24
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In the same way that like when Barack Obama assassinated Anwar Alaki, who was an American citizen who had joined up with Al-Qaeda, I mean, no question about it.
He had.
He had pledged his allegiance to Al-Qaeda.
And Obama murdered him, killed him with the drone strike.
Now they came back and killed his kid, who is also an American citizen a few weeks later.
But they never.
Not very inclusive.
You would think a president who cares about diversity, an American that wants to go all the way to Afghanistan and live an alternative lifestyle.
Oh, he was in Yemen, but still, you would think you'd want in the spirit of diversity and inclusion, you'd want to hear from Al-Qaeda on your staff as well.
You'd want some of them.
They're very underrepresented in an American government.
But look, they never admitted that they, at least I believe, I don't think they ever admitted that they were targeting his son a couple of weeks later, but they were.
But they admitted they were targeting Anwar Alaki.
Like that was, that was from the official White House website.
He was the target.
And he had no question been radicalized after going through it quite a bit.
I think he was tortured by the dictator we were propping up over there for a while because he was actually like against Al-Qaeda for a while, got radicalized, joined them, swore allegiance to Al-Qaeda.
And at the time, I remember really passionately standing up against that.
And it's not like there's a, you're like, oh, so are you, are you sympathetic to al-Qaeda now or something like that?
And it's like, well, no, but you got to understand the precedent that was just set here that the president of the United States of America can kill an American citizen who he didn't charge with a crime.
Like, feel however you feel about this guy, whatever he did wrong.
He's an American citizen.
He needs to be charged with a crime.
He gets a trial.
He gets a lawyer.
He gets a jury of his peers.
And by the way, you can try people even when they're out of the country.
Like they can just, you know, they don't show up to their trial and you can present the evidence to a jury, to a judge.
They did none of that.
They just killed the guy.
And you're like, I'm sorry, that's really creepy.
The president should not have the authority to do that and doesn't under the Constitution or the law or anything.
So you can really not like somebody and still think it's wrong what's happening to them.
Right.
And once it got to Alex Jones, who I don't even like particularly, you know, dislike.
I mean, I think he's somewhat entertaining and he's kind of right about a lot of things and then really goofy about some other things, you know?
But when he got kicked off like all of the platforms at once, I was like, how does anyone not see this as creepy?
And, you know, that it was a thing.
And this is something that gets hung around libertarians' necks quite a bit and not completely unfairly that from the right-wingers where they're like, well, what would you do about this?
What's your guys' answer to this?
Oh, they're a private company, so they can do it, right?
So you're just going to allow these big companies who are in bed with the government to silence dissident voices that oppose the government.
How's that going to work out for libertarians?
You know, probably not that good.
And then the thought experiments, just like they, they just, they're right there.
You don't even need to think about them.
They, they're right there for you.
Like, okay, what if they decided they wanted to ban every single libertarian?
Do libertarians have to support that?
Are we obligated to cheer it on as we're completely removed from the public conversation?
I don't think so, you know?
And like the thing that I would just stress again, and this is why I do think that the whole like cathedral concept is so valuable to libertarians to understand that it's not just that we're against the government, is that we are against the government, the cronies who are in bed with the government, the entire corporate press apparatus and the academic apparatus that support the government.
Because it's all basically indistinguishable.
It's all this big cathedral.
And that's one of the things that you see in this vanity fair piece, right?
So those scientists, many of them who came out to discredit the Wuhan leak story to protect their own interests, many of them weren't government employees, okay?
But they were getting taxpayer dollars.
So what are they?
I mean, okay, you could say they're not technically part of the state, but they're relying on the state.
They're getting money from the state.
I mean, okay, it's not in the form of a salary.
It's in the form of a grant, but does that really make like to me or you?
Does that make some really fundamental difference in how we're supposed to view them?
Okay, so now just take it a few steps removed.
And you realize that this whole network, right, where Fauci's communicating with the Facebook censoring people, and then they're censoring for this reason, it's all in service of a political agenda.
So, what I have to cheer it on if it's just three levels removed from the state, I can't just oppose this whole thing.
I mean, to me, that's stupid.
Like, no, that's not what I want.
And clearly, right?
This is not like if the marketplace is what we're defending, and someone like Donald Trump has like 74 million people who will vote for him to be president, and yet he's not allowed to talk to all his people.
Like, there is this supply, which is Donald Trump, the hilarious tweet-making machine, and there's 74 million people.
These are the customers, but one is not allowed to go to the other.
I'm supposed to pretend that this is just the market at work.
Like, no, it's clearly not.
There's clearly something in here that's that's perverting the market.
Like, all of this shit is because of politics.
It's not like libertarians aren't right from the beginning.
None of these, look, here.
The truth is that none of these social media companies wanted to be in the business of banning everybody.
That kind of goes against their business model, too.
They initially, this is why the internet in 2015 really was the wild, wild west in a good way.
I mean, that is a pure compliment, or you could say anything.
There was never even a thought.
I mean, like, like, you know, Bobby's producing this show for us today.
Like, Bobby, I think it was around back in 2015.
We were doing Legion of Skanks.
There was never even a thought.
Oh, we're going to get kicked off the internet.
We'd say the most wild shit ever.
No one even thought this was a possibility.
It wasn't.
It just wasn't even like a thing.
No one got kicked off.
You could say whatever you wanted to.
And of course, these social media companies, they weren't looking to censor everybody and monitor what everyone said.
Their business model was, let's get more and more people in here.
It was all politics that corrupted this whole thing.
What happened was in 2016, Donald Trump won when he wasn't supposed to win.
And he won because Hillary Clinton is just a transparently horrible human being.
I mean, you know, a lot of other reasons too, but that was a big part of it.
All right.
And the powers that be were like, that's not a good enough reason.
We can't just say we lost because Hillary Clinton's like a miserable twat.
That can't be the reason.
So the reason is Russia and fake news and all of this shit.
And then they hauled these guys in front of Congress and put all of this pressure on them and basically said, we will ruin you if you don't do our bidding.
And so now they're on this campaign.
But so, okay, so it's not the government doing it.
It's the people who the government are making do it.
But I don't care.
Like at a certain point, libertarians got to grapple with real life and say, this is essentially all happening because of the government.
And so I'm opposed to it.
I'm treating all of you guys as the same.
I don't care if Brian Williams is not officially a government employee and he's just the guy who gets up on NBC News and talks about how beautiful the bombs are that the military is dropping.
I don't care.
I'm treating you the same way.
I have the same attitude toward you as I do toward the state.
And I think that's how we should look at the tech censorship stuff.
Just oppose it.
It's like advocating for better lines at the DMV.
And then other libertarians are quicker lines and other libertarians like, well, you're still telling the government certain.
It's like, no, I don't want to have to go to the DMV for a fucking license, but if I already got to show up there, just have less lines.
That's what I'm saying.
It's like these tech companies, they're government.
And so we're just saying if they are government, so then they're not just some company.
They're not.
They're being influenced by government.
So I guess maybe there needs to be some corrections in there.
Yeah.
Or they're government enforced.
Yeah.
Like, look, I have no idea, but I'm open to it in the same way that, like, if the government was like, hey, we're going to audit the Federal Reserve, I wouldn't say, well, I don't want government interference in the Federal Reserve.
I'd be like, yeah, no, that's fine.
Go audit the Federal Reserve.
Oh, we're going to have a criminal review of our police departments to see who's been murdering people.
Yeah.
I'm not like, well, I don't want more government intrusion into the police force.
Like, no, that's the state.
I don't care if they regulate themselves.
Like, go for it.
Now, some of these proposals might backfire.
That doesn't mean I'm supporting any government policy, but it's not as if you have to just be allergic to it.
Like, you don't.
You can think about these things.
And, you know, like, again, we could use a million other examples of the government, you know, oh, we're going to investigate the military to see who's guilty of war crimes.
Yep, go for it.
Go do that.
I fully support it.
So now, again, I also do think that libertarians should point out that politics is what corrupted this whole thing.
And that is the source of the problem.
That's what we want to eliminate.
And reducing the size and scope of the government is going to be the best way to get us there.
But, you know, I was talking about this with Michael Malice on his last show about like the idea that they were talking about banning critical race theory in schools.
And I'm like, yeah, I'm all for that.
All for that.
And then I got some libertarians, even good libertarians who I really like who are like, yeah, our position should just be to abolish public schools.
And you're like, yeah, okay.
Yes, that is our position.
But don't let the perfect be the enemy of the good.
Like, yeah, okay.
I want to abolish public schools.
But if we can't get that done in the meantime, would you rather them teach that free markets are great or that social essential planning is great?
Am I not allowed to have a preference in those two?
Because I don't think public schools should exist.
I can't say that one is better than the other.
Like, no, obviously, if they're taught that like freedom is really great, that's better than them being taught that freedom is really terrible.
But even better than that would be abolishing public schools.
So that's, and I don't think there's anything, not only is there not anything contradictory about that, it's so goddamn insane to even not be able to just see that blatantly as the correct position.
So I don't know.
It's, you know, like the thing of it is, is that Donald Trump now being silenced on this level.
Sorry, go ahead.
No, I just want to talk about how much of a loser Trump is.
The guy had to shut down his blog after a month.
He couldn't even keep his commitment to a blog.
The guy's like, I'm going to make the country great, but I can't do what grandmothers do.
I can't.
And I love it.
He just like totally oversells it from the beginning.
This blog is going to be the biggest thing that's ever happened.
It's going to change the world.
And then he was like on there and he's like, dear blog.
All right.
Shut the whole thing down.
We got nothing.
Blogs are stupid.
They're totally gay.
I don't know why I was thinking about what his plan was.
I mean, legit.
He could have built the guy's a billionaire who's the most famous person ever who just got deplatformed.
He could have built a new social media network and it could have been interesting.
He could have done that, but he's a fucking loser and he doesn't want to do any work and he doesn't want to actually get anything done.
It's Trump.
It's Trump from the whole time, right?
It's like there was never actually any plan there.
The only plan is like to make himself look as great as possible.
But it's like, oh, and how are you actually going to do that?
I mean, like, that's the thing too, is that like the Trump supporters do, and I have seen a lot of them doing this, but they do have to abandon Trump because the guy was just a failure by any stretch.
And everyone, you can make your excuse making, oh, it wasn't his fault.
It was everybody else's fault.
Whatever.
The guy sat there and bitched about how mail-in ballots were going to lead to fraud for six months before the election.
And then he lost the election.
And then he goes, that was fraud.
And they went, okay, so what's your plan?
He's like, well, I'm going to whine about it.
I'm going to try to wind my way into a second term.
And he's like, oh, these lawsuits and all this, everything fell flat.
Nothing.
He had no strategy, nothing, you know?
And the truth is that he screwed himself.
He sat there for fucking six months telling his supporters that voting by mail was fraudulent.
And so why do you think his supporters weren't voting by mail?
Whereas Biden and all of them were saying it's your patriotic duty to vote by mail.
Government Interference in Media00:04:12
And so even if there was some fraud there, I don't freaking know.
I have no idea.
I don't trust the government for shit.
But you go, he clearly, if you had no plan, then it was just sabotaging yourself to say this the whole time.
You would have been better off if he was like, we need to flood the voting by mail.
Because the older people skew Republican, you know, and the older people are also disproportionately afraid of COVID.
So fucking, you need them to vote by mail for you.
Like have a plan here.
I don't even care.
I wasn't even a Trump guy.
I'm just saying, like, this is your guy.
This is the guy who's going to drain the swamp.
He couldn't keep up a blog for a month.
I think that says it all.
Yeah, he's probably not going to drain the swamp of the biggest honeypot in the history of humanity if he can't keep the blog going.
But that being said, guy's got a lot of fans.
And the fact that he's not being allowed to speak to them really says something, you know?
And I just, you know, I do think that all of these things, like you, you look at, as we've talked about many times before on the show, but like Tucker Carlson having the number one show in cable news and having trouble finding sponsors is like, it tells you right there, like this is not an organic free market.
This is a market that's being perverted.
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Can I, I saw an article yesterday talking about how many viewers Fox News either has poached or just how they're crushing CNN in the ratings.
And then I looked at the numbers for the rating.
Firstly, they like to talk about how like the most lucrative demographic is 25, 25 to like 50 or 25 to 40, which is all the entire gas digital audience is 25 to 40.
And then I saw the numbers of daily watchers on CNN.
And as a network, we dwarf them.
And as a show, we're not even that far off.
And if you look at how much money CNN makes per hour off of the amount of ad reads that they're running versus us, and listen, we do, we do cool here.
It's not like, I'm not saying that, you know, I'm not crying poverty.
I'm just saying if you think for one second that it's not that there's a government propaganda machine and for some reason, money going over there that's not coming over here, right?
It has nothing to do with the marketing.
If they're looking to target 25 to 50 year olds in their demographic in the same numbers, they could do it for, I don't know, one 100th of what they're spending on CNN at gas.
I mean, not per rate.
I'm just saying the overall I understand what you're saying.
They are both CNN and particularly MSNBC have just plummeted.
They're getting in that 18 to 55 demo or whatever, they get like no one.
The numbers are unbelievably low, unbelievably low.
And yes, since losing Trump, they've lost their entire audience base because there's just nothing.
They have nothing to talk about.
But I'm saying, like, if you looked at who their advertisers are, I'll just pick a name out of half.
Let's say Procter and Gamble.
Procter and Gamble's million dollars spend on CNN to reach the demo that they're looking for.
If they were to spend that on digital advertising with less concern for making sure it's the political shows with the same agenda as them, they would move more products.
So it's not about advertising.
Culture War Backlash00:02:17
Yeah, no, that's absolutely right.
That's absolutely right.
And right.
It just shows you there's like some, there's, there's some perversion here in the market.
And essentially, right, libertarians, we've got a really good answer for what that is.
It's the government interference.
That's what it is.
So we want the marketplace absent that government interference.
But particularly when it comes to the tech censorship stuff, you're like, look, that's what we had before the government started interfering in this.
You had a situation where people could say whatever they wanted to online.
It was the great equalizer.
And just like everything else beautiful, the government came in and ruined it.
Like that's the story here.
So we've got a really compelling story.
It's the same thing with like the culture war stuff.
Libertarians really got to get our act together on this.
You don't, your story is not just that you blindly support one side or the other side of the culture war.
Our whole point to add to the culture war is that like, what is the war really over?
It's all over politics.
That's the obvious issue here.
That's what people are fighting over.
That's what families are being broken up over, right?
It's like, oh, your uncle was a Trump supporter and you're a Biden supporter and this and that.
That's what you're at each other's throats for.
Like when you just think about it, like it's all because of the state.
It's not just because you have different views.
It's because you have different views about government and how government should be running our lives.
And then you think about it like between we got Christians and Muslims and Jews in this country, right?
And other people too, but just to pick the big three, right?
They have fundamentally different views about the world to the point that some of them believe the other ones are going to be burning in a pit of fire for all of eternity.
A pretty fundamental difference in how you view the world.
Like some Christian looks at some non-Christian and they think the most important thing in the world is to accept Jesus into your heart and you don't do that.
That's how diametrically opposed they are to each other.
And yet they're not, they're not fighting a culture war against each other.
They're not constantly at each other's throats.
It's just like, hey, you go worship over here.
I go worship over here.
And then there's some atheist who doesn't believe any of this shit, who basically implicitly, if not explicitly, thinks you're all insane, thinks you're all just completely delusional.
Memes vs Real Violence00:10:48
And he goes, okay, I'm just going to go watch football.
No, why aren't we all at each other's throats all day?
Why aren't they all fighting?
Because they're not jockeying for power over who's going to rule over the other one.
Why does a Trump supporter and a Biden supporter have to be at each other's throats?
Because they are.
They are fighting for who's going to rule over the other one.
So like, we do have answers for all of this shit.
But if you're just going to say, like, you know, if you're just going to say, it's a private company, they can do whatever they want to.
Or like, I just want to celebrate Gay Pride Month or something like that.
You just come off like you have nothing.
And you're just repeating talking points that happen to be the exact ones that the establishment wants you to repeat, you know?
Anyway, that's a really, you should, you should craft a joke out of that.
That's a great point.
And there's a lot of wisdom in that.
So put that as a highlight.
Someone write that down.
Yeah, maybe I'll fuck around with that on stage.
I mean, I am running my hour tomorrow and then next week in Brooklyn.
And then I got to bring it up to Porkfest.
And I have not done an hour of stand-up comedy in quite some time.
So this will be interesting.
Maybe I'll fuck around with it a little bit.
You're going to be golden, dude.
And then you also got Norwalk before Porkfest, then Porkfest, a line of some more.
You're going to be golden.
Well, I'm glad that I'm glad that we got these gigs coming up because, yeah, I needed a few under my belt before Porkfest.
But yeah, man, I'm fucking looking forward to that.
I will say, dude, yesterday there was like all this fucking drama online in the libertarian world.
And, you know, I probably, I probably should just stay out of some of it.
But sometimes I just can't help myself.
You know, it's just like, but it is something that's funny.
It's like, whenever I go to, I was saying, I was, I was messaging with Reed Coverdale and Jeremy Todd, who I love those guys.
And I was messaging with them and I was saying, I was like, you know, I really need Porkfest because you go to these libertarian events.
And I know you just went to Childerberg and you have that.
And you just meet some of the coolest fucking people, like cool, funny, smart people.
It's like invigorating in a way.
It makes you feel sane.
Makes you feel like, oh, yeah, they're great people.
We're all kind of in this, you know, same fight.
We see the world in such similar ways and all this.
It's just great people.
Everyone loves each other.
Nothing but love.
And then you go online and you're like, I just like hate these people.
Who the hell is that?
You know, but it's like, you realize that's not real.
And it's so funny to see all the fucking drama.
And I'll tell you, I know this right away.
I go up to Porkfest and it's just going to be a love fest.
Everyone's going to just get along.
We're going to have just like it was last time we were up there.
Just like it was, you know what I mean?
It's like, it's, and it doesn't matter.
There's people there at Porkfest with like, you have like suit and tie conservatives next to some dude, you know, with like drunk with 12 guns.
Yeah, literally with guns and drunk and there's tattooed all over his body.
Then you have like some hippie, you know what I mean?
It's just, and everybody's just, we all love each other, you know?
It's like, that's the beautiful thing.
And I, you know, it'll be fun to go see that.
But I did see like this was someone, some guy fucking, I wouldn't even say his name.
Man, maybe fuck him.
I don't remember his name, but if I remembered it, I would say his name.
But he, he called me a Nazi for not condemning a meme on Twitter the other day, which is, you know, seems like a little bit of a- That's how people used to join the Nazi party.
Well, Hitler wanted to know, like, who's gonna turn on the ovens?
It's who will condemn a meme.
Yeah.
Yeah.
No, that's all.
That's what it's about.
No, who won't condemn a meme?
If you won't, I'm a Nazi.
I had it wrong.
Well, this is what happened, right?
So this is, this is the dumbass fight that I got myself into, odd lie, but you know, enough people are tagging me in it.
And I was just kind of like, I don't know, just joking around about it.
Or I'm not even joking around.
I was just like made a lighthearted, a comment that I didn't even think that much about.
But there was some meme and the meme was, I guess, a person like hanging on a noose and with like the Couchy fantasy?
No, that would be that.
It was almost that.
And I guess it was, it was, I don't know what they say.
It was like the gay pride flag or something was there.
And it said pronouns are we were.
So like a dead person, like the play is pronouns instead of they, them or whatever, we were.
Like that's the joke of it.
We're going to kill gay people.
I can get beyond that.
You know, anyway.
Finally saying it.
Yeah, right.
So it was, it's like one of those things that you look at and like immediately, you're like, holy shit.
You know, like it's, it's a, it's an over-the-top, dark, fucked up joke.
Now, of course, you have a whole bunch of people saying, it's not a joke.
It's not a joke at all.
It's like, no, no, no.
Listen, I'm sorry.
Defer to me here.
I'm the expert on this.
We were is a joke.
Structurally speaking, it's a play on they, them, meaning in the past tense, that's what you'd call someone after they died.
You don't have to like the joke or agree with it.
You can think it's totally fucked up and wrong, but that is what it's going for.
Once there's an attempt at being funny, that is by definition a joke.
You could say it's a bad joke.
Fine.
And someone advocates for killing a gay people even better.
Right.
Yeah.
Now you're really anti-humor.
But this is, but this is what people like pretend to be able to separate what you just did from an actual call to killing transgender people.
It's like, come on, man.
Like, this isn't a call to violence.
It's a joke you don't like.
But so anyway, but people are like flipping ad about this and people start tagging me in it.
And I said, what I said was, I go, look, dark, fucked up jokes aren't for everyone.
And some people don't like it.
You have every right to not like it.
But the people go like going nuts about this.
It's a little ridiculous.
That was more or less my comment.
And then as guys start getting flooded with the loser brigade types, like, Dave won't condemn this meme and blah, blah, blah.
And then one guy tweeted a thing at me and he said, and this is, I will say, this is not like a guy from some a non-account.
This is like a real guy who I might see at one of these events.
But he was like, you know, it's not a joke.
It's a, it's, you know, an incitement against trans people, you Nazi.
And I did say to him, I was like, look, man, if you want to tweet at me that I'm a Nazi all day, go ahead.
But just so you and everybody else in this community know, if you call me a Nazi to my face, I will probably slap the shit out of you.
So just wanted to put that out there.
Listen, as I later tweeted, you don't call.
I'll call slapping someone's very gay.
So what side are you?
I'm going to attack you in the gayest possible way if you call me a Nazi.
I'm on record.
I said, you don't call Jews Nazis and you don't call Nazis Jews.
Those are a rule of not getting slapped in the face.
Okay.
It's very offensive to Jews to be called a Nazi.
It's very offensive to Nazis to be called Jews.
Anyway, there's then I had sub people who were like, oh, so now you're offended by words.
It's like, yeah, listen, motherfucker, there is a difference between jokes and fucking insults.
And I'm saying, if you fucking joke, if someone came up and made a Nazi joke to me, I'd laugh if it was funny.
But if someone came up and called me a Nazi, I might slap the shit out of them.
There's a difference there.
If someone made a joke about trans people, I might laugh at it if it's funny, or maybe not.
Maybe I'd just be like, eh, I wasn't that good.
Okay.
But if you walked up to a trans person and said, like, you're an abomination of God, and the trans person slapped the shit out of you, I would laugh and probably cheer.
And not just because a trans person slapping the shit out of a man is funny.
Okay.
That's not the only reason why, but that's part of it.
But, you know, so I don't know.
Do I have to explain this?
I have to pretend people don't know exactly what the fuck I'm talking about.
Anyway, man, there's just got to be a thing.
Someone told me on Twitter the other day, they said, if you can't condemn this meme, then I can't consider you a serious candidate for president on the libertarian ticket.
And I just want to make your vote anyways, you idiot.
Yeah, obviously.
But I just want to make this clear that it's like, if you're looking to re-spark the Ron Paul revolution and try to create a real movement, bring the liberty movement into the libertarian party, try to create a real movement that's opposed to COVID restrictions, wars, militarized police, victimless nonviolent crimes, over-regulation, debt, monetary policy.
If you want to bring a big movement to those issues, then I'm your guy.
If you're looking for the guy who will condemn memes the quickest, I just may not be for you.
And I'm fine with that.
If that's the most important thing to you, like if making sure that any meme that goes against the allowable standards is condemned the quickest, and that's the most important issue to you, then I'm not your guy.
And that's fine.
Dave meme America.
I'm not in this.
I also, I just hate the idea of like condemning other people.
Like, first off, I didn't fucking post it, man.
Like, what do I'm in trouble?
Cause I didn't condemn enough.
And it's the same thing with other people who have like bad views, sometimes abhorrent views or whatever.
But like, you're like, well, I don't have those views, but the problem is that I just don't condemn the people who have them enough.
And then you run into that.
Then you run into the problem when you start condemning.
And then it's like, well, why aren't you equally condemning this like you are condemning that?
It's your whole life is condemnations.
What am I supposed to do?
Sort of priest or something?
Yeah.
Like, how about this?
How about you just ask me what I think and I'll tell you what I think?
That seems like a reasonable deal to me.
And I think that meme was funny.
Yeah, there you go.
As it wasn't even like a great funny Bibers.
It was fucked up.
It was like, you know, and there's like the we were thing was kind of like, all right, I don't know.
It was like a killer, but it was just like, whatever.
It's fine.
I'm also not going to pretend like it's not, there's a difference between that and like a real call to violence or really being shitty to some person.
Like it's just not the same thing.
It's different.
It's shit posting.
I don't care.
This has been my position forever.
I don't care.
I don't really like the shit posting, to be honest.
I asked the Mises Caucus to cut it out at my speech in Pittsburgh.
And I don't think that the official Twitter handles for like the states should be doing it.
I don't.
I think it's unprofessional.
But it's so low on my list of things I give a shit about.
Like so infinitely low.
There's just like so many more important things.
That's it.
You got to have some type of like hierarchy of values.
And when we're in the business of trying to like end genocides and save freedom, you know, where shitposting ranks on that is very, very far behind.
All right.
We're going to wrap up there.
Come see us in Brooklyn tomorrow night.
Me, Robbie the Fire, BK Chris.
I'm going to make some calls today.
Maybe I'll get another comic or someone on the show.
So we'll have a little bit of fun.
It'll be a good time.
I'll tweet about it and let all you guys know.
Come see us there.
Can't wait to see all you guys in Connecticut and Porkfest.