Part Of The Problem - Dave Smith - They Don't Care About You w/ Michael Malice
Aired: 2021-02-20
Duration: 01:06:02


=== Boomer Hypocrisy Exposed (12:07) ===

[00:00:00]  Fill her up.
[00:00:02]  You are listening to the Gash Digital Network.
[00:00:08]  We need to roll back the state.
[00:00:10]  We spy on all of our own citizens.
[00:00:12]  Our prisons are flooded with nonviolent drug offenders.
[00:00:16]  If you want to know who America's next enemy is, look at who we're funding right now.
[00:00:21]  Every single one of these problems are a result of government being way too big.
[00:00:26]  You're listening to part of the problem on the Gash Digital Network.
[00:00:30]  Here's your host, James Smith.
[00:00:33]  Hey, what's up, everybody?
[00:00:34]  Welcome to a brand new episode of Part of the Problem.
[00:00:38]  As always, I'm excited to have my homie back on the show, the one and only, fresh off another great Joe Rogan experience appearance, Mr. Michael Malice.
[00:00:50]  How are you, my brother?
[00:00:52]  I am great, especially because everyone in Austin right now is cold and homeless.
[00:00:57]  There you go.
[00:00:58]  That's what.
[00:00:58]  Sorry, guys.
[00:00:59]  Had fun.
[00:01:00]  Now I'm back here.
[00:01:02]  Oh, you're lucky you got out.
[00:01:04]  Yeah, exactly.
[00:01:06]  There were only flights to New York and Cancun available, but there was nowhere else.
[00:01:11]  Nowhere else could you go, which, by the way, is the, that is the first thing I wanted to talk to you about today.
[00:01:18]  I, I have just loved this Ted Cruz story that's blowing up.
[00:01:23]  I just think it's wonderful.
[00:01:25]  And there's a, you know, like everybody has their own take on it.
[00:01:29]  I love the things where it's like everyone switches roles, you know, like obviously the every, there's nothing better that exposes like every boomer con you know who would be criticizing this if it was a Democrat, but they're criticizing it for a Republican.
[00:01:45]  Every corporate press show would be criticizing this if it was a Republican or are criticizing it because it's a Republican, but wouldn't say anything if it were Nancy Pelosi.
[00:01:53]  But really the best part of it is it's just a great, it's like that George Carlin line that I think I've said before when we've been on together that it's a big club and you ain't in it.
[00:02:04]  What's even funnier is you know as a comedian, like Cancun is like the hack punchline of what he got out of town and went to Cancun.
[00:02:12]  It's like, like that's the one place go to anywhere else in Mexico, but that is the punchline place where like where you go.
[00:02:22]  The hack spring break 20 year old vacations.
[00:02:26]  It's the one place where I've never been to Mexico where you know like it's not like he's meeting with someone.
[00:02:32]  It's not like he can play it off like I'm seeing the refugees.
[00:02:35]  You're only going to Cancun to get drunk and hopefully get your dick wet.
[00:02:40]  That's the list.
[00:02:41]  The funniest part of it was the way he tried to play it off.
[00:02:44]  I was just dying laughing yesterday when I saw the statement he put out.
[00:02:49]  And he basically said, he goes, he's like, yes, I went to Cancun for, I dropped off my daughter and came right back.
[00:02:58]  It's like, my daughter wanted to go to her friend's house.
[00:03:00]  We had nothing going on.
[00:03:02]  I just mean a dad, you know, just like all you dads out there.
[00:03:05]  But it was the thing where he goes, yes, I went to Cancun and then I came back the next morning.
[00:03:10]  Like it's just, which obviously wasn't the plan.
[00:03:13]  It was just that the whole thing blew up on him.
[00:03:15]  So, but it's just so funny to get caught and go, yes, I went to Cancun for lunch and then I was home by the end of the day.
[00:03:24]  Did I snorkel?
[00:03:25]  Yes.
[00:03:26]  Okay.
[00:03:26]  I snorkeled.
[00:03:27]  I was in Cancun and I got a couple's massage, but that came, that was part of the deal.
[00:03:31]  It was in the price.
[00:03:32]  So I had to get that.
[00:03:33]  Do you know how hard it is to get Mexican food in Texas?
[00:03:36]  It's Tex-Mex.
[00:03:37]  He wanted Mex-Mex.
[00:03:40]  I had to Google because I was going to tweet out that maybe he took Trump's advice and he went back where he came from to come back here and teach us how it's done.
[00:03:48]  But he's actually Cuban.
[00:03:49]  So I can't even use that stupid line about him being Mexican.
[00:03:52]  That'd be really funny if he just put on a sombrero and a big mustache and he goes, I was going to the motherland to like visit my grandma.
[00:04:00]  And he can't even say that.
[00:04:02]  Oh, man.
[00:04:02]  It's just, it's, it's what's wonderful too about the day and age we live in.
[00:04:07]  And I think this is in part the biggest white pill.
[00:04:11]  Like this might be the best thing about what we have now is that a politician will do something like this, get caught because everyone has cameras on their phones and then hand this picture over to the internet where they will make the funniest memes.
[00:04:25]  Like it's just, I mean, dude, I saw ones where of uh Chris Christie on the I was just saying that one.
[00:04:31]  That was the one.
[00:04:31]  Oh my God.
[00:04:32]  So funny.
[00:04:33]  Just fat Chris Christie on the beach and him on the sand with his carry-on rolling bag.
[00:04:40]  And the fact that like people in powerful positions can not only be mocked, but mocked on such a huge scale where it almost feels like the entire country is laughing at them.
[00:04:55]  I think that is so powerful and such a beautiful thing that we have going for us.
[00:05:01]  And it's also hilarious because Ted Cruz is no stranger to like loving the camera and putting himself front and center and being an attention whore, which all politicians are to some extent.
[00:05:10]  So you would have thought this would be a great opportunity for him to show leadership and be like, look, Texas having an emergency.
[00:05:18]  This is how Republicans will handle this.
[00:05:20]  None of this global warming stuff, blah, blah.
[00:05:22]  Have him work those cameras and take, you know, lead.
[00:05:25]  It's not like Governor Abbott's going to stand up and do anything.
[00:05:28]  So this, and his instincts are usually not that bad.
[00:05:32]  He's pretty good with the debates.
[00:05:34]  And like, even though he's lying through his teeth, I saw him on, I think it was CNN when they're asking like, how are you letting Amy Comey Barrett through?
[00:05:41]  And you're letting Merrick Garland.
[00:05:42]  And he's like, well, 17 times in history, they were the same party.
[00:05:45]  And it was this whole like bull crap, which just got such.
[00:05:49]  But he said it in such a way, it sounded like he actually believes it as opposed to, look, we're just being partisan.
[00:05:54]  So I'm surprised that he was this kind of sloppy about it.
[00:05:58]  I'm not going to lie.
[00:05:59]  Yeah.
[00:05:59]  Well, I think it was just as simple as he just didn't want to be in Texas through this.
[00:06:04]  It's like, it's free now and there's power out and I want to go.
[00:06:07]  So I do, aside from what's hilarious and beautiful about it, I got to say, I disagree.
[00:06:13]  Like I, even when you said, I don't blame him and this stuff, I understand.
[00:06:17]  I saw Tom had a tweet where he was basically like, look, this guy has nothing to do with the power being out and he can't do anything about it.
[00:06:24]  So why wouldn't he take his kids to, you know, like Cancun?
[00:06:28]  And okay, I get where he's coming from.
[00:06:31]  And I, I, I get it as a father being like, well, I'd take my kids in the best situation.
[00:06:36]  But I kind of do feel this like, yeah, you know what?
[00:06:40]  You're, if you're going to be the senator and you're going to claim all the bullshit that they claim, I'm a public servant and I'm the representative of the people, all this stuff, then you know what?
[00:06:51]  If your people are going through it, you don't bail and go to the beach, even if it's just the optics of it or the principle of it.
[00:06:58]  It's like a general bailing when a war comes or something like that.
[00:07:01]  It's like, no, that's not your role.
[00:07:03]  We saw this with Trump when he went to visit Lewis's family.
[00:07:06]  He was throwing out towels like in that bunker in Puerto Rico, just like it was literally tossing them.
[00:07:11]  But the photo was more wealth than Lewis's family had ever seen.
[00:07:16]  Too fly.
[00:07:17]  Too fly.
[00:07:17]  We're millionaires.
[00:07:19]  But in Texas, there's a lot of things he could be doing to help people.
[00:07:23]  Even if he just had some like handing out food or driving, there's a million things he could have been doing and taking the photo op or you could have a photo of him in his Texas office working the phones.
[00:07:34]  Just something.
[00:07:34]  Anything.
[00:07:35]  Something.
[00:07:36]  It looks real.
[00:07:37]  Can you imagine?
[00:07:37]  Here's the other thing.
[00:07:38]  Like, here's just a parallel.
[00:07:40]  During COVID, COVID, if Cuomo was like, all right, I'm going to go get out of town for vacation.
[00:07:46]  People are like, we don't have that possibility.
[00:07:49]  So you need to be doing, or maybe we got Chuck Schumer, whatever.
[00:07:52]  But I think it's very bad optics.
[00:07:54]  I think he's, I would have expected him to be smarter than this.
[00:07:58]  It's not like he's on a private jet where he's not going to get spotted.
[00:08:02]  Yeah, no, I agree with you on that.
[00:08:04]  I'm surprised he was so stupid because say whatever you will about Ted Cruz, he ain't stupid.
[00:08:09]  Like he's a very bright guy.
[00:08:11]  So that was kind of like how he didn't see this going like so bad for him.
[00:08:15]  That I'm surprised about.
[00:08:18]  But I do stand by, like I was literally just talking about this on my last episode where I was saying, like, I, and I guess this is kind of informed by Lysander Spooner, great guy.
[00:08:29]  I don't know if you've met him.
[00:08:30]  Wonderful guy.
[00:08:32]  Hangs out at the studio a lot.
[00:08:34]  But when he said that, that it is completely, he's, of course, one of the early brilliant anarchist thinkers.
[00:08:41]  Did I tell you about my anarchists?
[00:08:43]  Do you know about this?
[00:08:44]  No, I don't.
[00:08:44]  Oh, well, finish your thought because I'll tell you, you're about to get really, really excited, like really excited.
[00:08:49]  Like when you met Tom Woods for the first time.
[00:08:51]  Well, there we go.
[00:08:52]  All right.
[00:08:52]  That's that's pretty big.
[00:08:54]  So Lysander Spooner, for people who don't know, you got to read him.
[00:08:56]  He was like the best of the early anarchists.
[00:08:59]  And what he said, which I completely agree with, is that he said, you can absolutely morally hold politicians to the Constitution.
[00:09:08]  He's like, they're actually the only ones who the Constitution are actually bound by it because they took an oath to it.
[00:09:13]  So that is like a legit contract.
[00:09:16]  Like you stood up and swore.
[00:09:17]  So in the same sense, I said on my on my last show that like, I don't think anyone should go to jail for pot for pot.
[00:09:25]  But if a cop gets caught with pot, I have no problem with them going to jail for it.
[00:09:30]  If you, if you would throw someone else in jail for that crime, then yeah, but you go to jail too, you know, right, and have.
[00:09:37]  And so I feel like, well, look, even though I can sit here and say it's absolute bullshit that you're a civil servant or it's bullshit that you're the representative of the people, I think it's fair to still hold you accountable to that because that's what you're claiming.
[00:09:52]  That's your own claim about who you are.
[00:09:55]  So if you're a servant of the people, when the shit hits the fan, you should act like a servant.
[00:09:59]  A servant would be cleaning things up.
[00:10:01]  A servant would be bringing things to people, not jetting off to Cancun.
[00:10:06]  This is one that I was just, I was telling you before we started recording, I just did Michaela Peterson's podcast, Jordan Peterson's daughter.
[00:10:11]  And, you know, she's thinking of getting out of Canada.
[00:10:13]  And I've also been thinking about getting to New York.
[00:10:15]  I was just in Austin for a week.
[00:10:16]  Check that out.
[00:10:17]  Thinking Miami, those seem to be the two places everyone is going.
[00:10:20]  Don't worry, I won't be voting the way you want me to vote.
[00:10:22]  Relax.
[00:10:22]  I don't vote.
[00:10:23]  And one things that happened after we resolved this conversation, I'm like, we also need to take a second and really acknowledge the people who don't have that luxury.
[00:10:33]  The people who are trapped in Canada or trapped in New York.
[00:10:36]  Maybe they're stuck in an apartment with a roommate who they hate and they can't leave.
[00:10:40]  And as bad as we might have it, we have it way better than them that we can pack our crap and be like, screw this, I'm out of here.
[00:10:48]  And there's a lot of people who don't have that luxury.
[00:10:50]  So, you know, I thought that was important to acknowledge, not that their life matters, not that what I do really affects them.
[00:10:56]  But yeah, if you're going to be asking people to vote for you and their support, it's just kind of like pretend you care what they're going through, especially when it's so temporary.
[00:11:04]  It's like, this is going to be a week.
[00:11:06]  Like, just wait a week.
[00:11:08]  You're like, we're all in this together.
[00:11:09]  Like, I'm, because that Tom Dashell, who was the, I think either South Dakota or North Dakota, he was Senate majority leader, he got defeated because they were like, he doesn't live here anymore.
[00:11:18]  He, there was a clip of an interview he did.
[00:11:19]  We saw him with Washington residents.
[00:11:21]  It's like, are you a man of whatever the state is or are you going to be a man of Washington?
[00:11:25]  And it's like, if you're a Texan, you know, Texans are tough.
[00:11:29]  They're very proud of being Texans.
[00:11:30]  Show it.
[00:11:31]  Don't be like the first sign of trouble.
[00:11:33]  I'm going to Oklahoma or haha, going to Cancun.
[00:11:37]  Yeah, right.
[00:11:38]  And of all the places to go, you know, again, not just the hack element, but the idea of going to like the beach vacation spot where it's warm and all this.
[00:11:46]  It's just if it was LA, if it was DC, if it was New York, like there's so many.
[00:11:50]  DC would be the move.
[00:11:51]  DC would be the move.
[00:11:52]  He could probably find an excuse for why I have to go to DC.
[00:11:57]  Yeah.
[00:11:58]  But it's just like, I mean, I love these examples, whether it's, you know, Nancy Pelosi at the beauty salon or what, whatever.
[00:12:05]  I just love these examples.
[00:12:06]  They owe me an apology.

=== The Fume Essential Apology (03:33) ===

[00:12:08]  Remember?
[00:12:09]  What did you say?
[00:12:10]  She said they owe her an apology.
[00:12:11]  Oh, yes, That the beauty salon owes her.
[00:12:13]  That's right.
[00:12:14]  That was her defense.
[00:12:15]  Well, in her defense, he didn't leave very beautiful.
[00:12:17]  So they do her an apology.
[00:12:19]  Oh, no.
[00:12:19]  Listen, she may have a false advertising lawsuit on her hands.
[00:12:23]  Nobody ever argued with that.
[00:12:25]  She could probably sue that place out of existence, but she still should have worn the mask.
[00:12:29]  She's going to ask others to.
[00:12:31]  But I love this stuff.
[00:12:32]  And it's just one more.
[00:12:33]  It's just great to bring up the conversations that, I mean, think about the fact that the, what is a senator's salary?
[00:12:41]  I think it's like $180K a year or something like that.
[00:12:44]  The average salary in America is like $35,000.
[00:12:48]  It's like the average.
[00:12:50]  So, you know, how are you?
[00:12:52]  Let's also not have the pretense that that's all the money they make.
[00:12:54]  I mean, everyone, all these senators should go off in multi-office, multi-multi-millionaires.
[00:12:58]  Sure.
[00:12:58]  But my point is almost.
[00:13:01]  And they all have, you know, like stock and weapons companies and stuff that they're driving up.
[00:13:05]  And then they have the revolving door and all that shit.
[00:13:08]  But even despite getting all of that, the fact that we allow them or that, you know, like that they can just say, yeah, I mean, I'm the servant, but what's the average salary?
[00:13:19]  35,000?
[00:13:21]  No, I'm going to need 180,000.
[00:13:24]  Those may not be exact numbers, but I'm right in the ballpark.
[00:13:27]  They're like right around there.
[00:13:29]  And you're like, wow, you're not even pretending.
[00:13:31]  You're not even saying the average salary is 35, but I need 80K.
[00:13:36]  You're like, no, no, no, I need 180K.
[00:13:38]  I got to be real comfortable while you guys struggle.
[00:13:41]  All right, guys, let's take a quick second and thank our sponsor for today's show, which is Fume.
[00:13:47]  Fume is a great natural and non-addictive replacement for smoking, vaping, and nicotine addictions.
[00:13:54]  It's not a vape.
[00:13:55]  It's not a cigarette.
[00:13:56]  Fume is a hollow piece of Canadian maple with cores infused with the benefits of the world's super plants.
[00:14:04]  Using fume is a great replacement therapy.
[00:14:07]  It replaces the hand-to-mouth action of smoking or vaping.
[00:14:11]  A number of their different flavors are great natural nicotine craving reducers too.
[00:14:16]  There's a wide selection of cores with focus on flavor, aroma, and the specific effect you're looking for.
[00:14:22]  The newest Conquer Cores are a deep cooling mix of earthy sweetness, a combination of black pepper for cravings, peppermint to help with breathing, and cinnamon and lavender to ease the pain of quitting.
[00:14:34]  The Conquer are the number one cores for quitting smoking start to finish.
[00:14:39]  All fume items are manufactured and sustainably produced in Calgary, Alberta, Canada with Canadian maple.
[00:14:45]  Part of the problem is about a lot of things, but new knowledge and the betterment of ourselves is at the top of the list.
[00:14:51]  Smoking SIGs and vapes is disgusting.
[00:14:54]  We all want to quit.
[00:14:55]  So this is going to help you.
[00:14:56]  It's still resolution time, I guess, technically.
[00:14:59]  Quitting smoking or vaping is always at the top of the list.
[00:15:02]  And fume is a great help when it comes to changing your habits.
[00:15:06]  Check out their website, fumeessential.com.
[00:15:08]  That's F-U-M-E-S-S-E-N-T-I-A-L dot com and take a look at their entire selection.
[00:15:17]  There's more than half a dozen flavors and they explain the entire fume program.
[00:15:21]  You can subscribe for monthly deliveries and never have to worry about your fume supply or check out the new products a la carte and find your favorite that way.
[00:15:29]  But make sure you use our promo code problem10.
[00:15:32]  That'll get you 10% off your entire order at fumeessential.com.
[00:15:37]  Be sure to upgrade yourself in 2021.
[00:15:39]  Go to fumeessential.com.

=== Libertarian School Arguments (12:18) ===

[00:15:41]  All right.
[00:15:42]  Let's get back into it.
[00:15:43]  Do you know what else is fun?
[00:15:44]  There's some comedian.
[00:15:45]  I hate it when I quote people, I don't remember who it is that I can't give them credit, who made the joke of like, these people spend $20 million to get a job that earns them 180 grand a year.
[00:15:54]  Isn't that a little stupid?
[00:15:56]  Like, let's sit down and think about this for a second.
[00:15:59]  And it's like, yeah, you got a big point there.
[00:16:01]  Well, yeah, but the, and, and the answer to that question is that it's not about their salary.
[00:16:07]  It's about the money they're moving.
[00:16:09]  So if you realize that the federal government is moving $5 trillion a year, it makes a lot more sense to spend 20 million on a campaign.
[00:16:17]  All of a sudden, that's peanuts, you know?
[00:16:19]  Do you want to hear my exciting news?
[00:16:21]  Oh, yes, yes, yes.
[00:16:22]  What are you doing?
[00:16:22]  Okay.
[00:16:23]  So this is thanks to Marla.
[00:16:24]  This time I do remember the name.
[00:16:26]  So you get this, but I get this a lot more because I think I'm swimming in more kind of normy circles than you in some contexts.
[00:16:34]  People always ask me if I want to learn more about anarchism.
[00:16:37]  Because what I'm trying to do is destigmatize the concept of anarchism.
[00:16:40]  As you know perfectly well, whenever you have any radical ideology, you just sound like a moron or a lunatic if you just talk about it for two minutes.
[00:16:47]  If something is so far removed from people's concepts of what's possible and what's on the table, like it's going to be very hard to even get a hearing because it's like, okay, sure.
[00:16:54]  We all should be living on the moon.
[00:16:56]  Okay, Greg, great, great.
[00:16:57]  You know, it's like, it's not even, I'm not even having this conversation.
[00:16:59]  So I've been doing a lot of work to try to get people to be like, this is a legitimate thing that should be considered, even if you don't personally end up thinking it's correct, but to dismiss it out of hand, you're, it's wrong.
[00:17:10]  And I've been making a lot of headway with that.
[00:17:12]  I don't know if Kirk Schlichter was advocating for anarchism to some extent.
[00:17:15]  I'm not sure to what extent he means it, but to have that term not have the stigma it did before it was very important.
[00:17:21]  And they always asked me, where can I learn more about anarchism?
[00:17:25]  And my answer always is like, I don't know, don't bother me.
[00:17:27]  I figured it out.
[00:17:28]  And then, and there was a book written in 1966 called Patterns of Anarchy.
[00:17:33]  And it was a collection of essays from the old, like Bakunin, Proudhon, all those people back at Emma Goldman back in the day.
[00:17:39]  And Marla says, why don't you do the audio book of this?
[00:17:43]  And I'm like, wait a minute, all of these old essays are public domain.
[00:17:48]  So I'm going to put together the anarchist handbook, which is all the all the my quote is the black flag comes in many colors.
[00:17:56]  So it's going to have all the commies, Emma Goldman, Bakunin.
[00:17:59]  We're going to have Lysander Spooner.
[00:18:01]  I got permission to include Anatomy of the State or whatever else I want from Rothbard.
[00:18:07]  And this is going to be the book you need to read to just understand all the different types of anarchism in one handbook.
[00:18:13]  That's incredible.
[00:18:14]  And I talked about this.
[00:18:15]  That's a good idea.
[00:18:16]  I talked about this with Tom.
[00:18:17]  He's like, this is such a good idea.
[00:18:19]  So thank you, Marla.
[00:18:21]  That's incredible.
[00:18:22]  Yeah.
[00:18:22]  I can't believe nobody like today has done that.
[00:18:25]  And what's funny is it's going to drive the ANCOMS crazy that it has like Spooner and Dan Friedman and Rothbard.
[00:18:32]  But at the same time, they're very well represented here.
[00:18:35]  I'm not pretending they don't count.
[00:18:37]  They don't exist.
[00:18:38]  I have all the essay calling for the use of dynamite against the cops from like 1907, wherever it was.
[00:18:44]  So it's all in there.
[00:18:46]  And a lot of it contradicts the rest.
[00:18:48]  But yeah, like that's just, you know, once you eliminate the state, what's going to happen?
[00:18:52]  That's a very, very open question.
[00:18:53]  And you and I might think it's one thing.
[00:18:55]  Emma Goldman or Bakunin might think it's another, but let's hear and read it all out.
[00:19:00]  And whatever calls to you, you know, you can do further investigation.
[00:19:03]  Yeah, 100%.
[00:19:04]  Absolutely.
[00:19:05]  That's that's such a great idea.
[00:19:06]  That's excellent, man.
[00:19:07]  That is really, really good.
[00:19:09]  Yeah.
[00:19:09]  Okay.
[00:19:10]  So speaking of- And the white pill is still coming out, but this is something that I'm doing simultaneously.
[00:19:14]  It's very quick.
[00:19:15]  I just have to go.
[00:19:15]  Well, right.
[00:19:16]  This isn't the type of project like writing, you know, the white pill.
[00:19:19]  Like that's a whole, that's a much more involved thing.
[00:19:22]  By the way, do you have like a date that you're shooting for with the book?
[00:19:26]  No, but I mean I want it out by the end of the year.
[00:19:29]  I'm over half done.
[00:19:30]  Yeah.
[00:19:30]  Okay.
[00:19:31]  All right.
[00:19:31]  That's fantastic.
[00:19:32]  I'm very excited for that one.
[00:19:33]  So I wanted to ask you also, and this will just lead to some kind of, you know, anarchist philosophy, but applying it to today's world.
[00:19:42]  Did you get flooded with tweets over Will Chamberlain's appearance on Tim Poole?
[00:19:50]  Because I did.
[00:19:51]  And he didn't mention me, mentioned you.
[00:19:54]  I did not get flooded.
[00:19:55]  So I know he used one of my quotes.
[00:19:58]  He brought you up, not like a lot.
[00:20:01]  And he was not being like, you know, we're powerful kind or anything.
[00:20:04]  Yeah.
[00:20:05]  Now, I don't know Will.
[00:20:07]  I mean, we follow each other on Twitter, but like I've never had a conversation with him before.
[00:20:11]  But so people, I just started getting like flooded on Twitter because I guess he was taking some shots at libertarians and kind of, you know, talking about what he, why he's not a libertarian anymore and all this other stuff.
[00:20:21]  And but a lot of people were tweeting at me.
[00:20:22]  So I ended up going and watching it and I actually thought it was, it was really interesting.
[00:20:27]  And he, so he kind of went basically the conversation was going in a very libertarian direction because that's just the nature of Tim Poole's show is he just keeps bringing up articles about what the government's doing.
[00:20:39]  And at every turn, it's the most corrupt, awful, you know, counterpart thing.
[00:20:44]  And so you just, you sit there and you sound like a libertarian, even when you're not one, you know, like you're just kind of unknowingly almost like making this case.
[00:20:52]  And then at a certain point, I think Will almost felt like the need to be like, hey, look, this is why I'm not a libertarian and what I don't like about them.
[00:21:01]  And he brought up several issues.
[00:21:02]  He did bring up you specifically about the, he said, he kind of presented it like that you were calling him like, you know, like you were saying he's thinking like a leftist and he was saying the government needs to regulate social media.
[00:21:18]  And that then a year later or two years later, when he was on your show, you had basically conceded that he had a good point or something like that.
[00:21:26]  And I was like, I don't think that second part happened.
[00:21:28]  That's going to be right.
[00:21:29]  I can see that.
[00:21:29]  He's just remembering that.
[00:21:30]  No, I conceded that he's making an interesting argument.
[00:21:33]  Yeah.
[00:21:33]  Yeah.
[00:21:33]  Well, he is making an interesting argument, which a lot of conservatives are.
[00:21:37]  And I got to say, I mean, I know we've discussed this briefly before, but it's worth talking about that there from my perspective, I think that the way a lot of libertarians talk about the tech censorship stuff is really stupid and dismissive and just makes you sound like,
[00:21:58]  you know, it hands the conservatives a big win on this on this argument when you don't need to, because there really isn't a very strong argument for the government to regulate big tech.
[00:22:10]  But if you just look there and pretend there's no problem going on or pretend this is a private company, they're going on.
[00:22:16]  Yeah, it's just so stupid.
[00:22:17]  And it sounds like, you know what?
[00:22:19]  Can I just say one more thing?
[00:22:20]  I got to interrupt you.
[00:22:21]  Sure, sure.
[00:22:21]  If anyone here says it's a private company, they could do what they want.
[00:22:25]  Don't ever use Yelp.
[00:22:27]  Don't ever use a read a book review.
[00:22:30]  This is such an ASPI, like really like, I can't have time for this argument.
[00:22:36]  No one is, first of all, it's not true.
[00:22:38]  They can't, I always, when I, sometimes when I'm in a mood and they say that, I go, do you agree we should repeal all anti-discrimination laws immediately?
[00:22:45]  Because they're not, they can't do that if they don't want to.
[00:22:47]  That's just a very obvious one top of your head, off the top of their head.
[00:22:50]  But the idea that you can't criticize, this is the argument of how the free market regulates things.
[00:22:56]  It regulates things through reputation.
[00:22:59]  It regulates things through word of mouth.
[00:23:01]  It's not like everyone does whatever they want all the time and has no pushback ever.
[00:23:06]  If you're in my house and you, I think Rothroth talked about, what do you call them?
[00:23:09]  Modal libertarians.
[00:23:10]  It's the kind of people that come to your house and take a dump on the floor and say, well, it's a free country.
[00:23:14]  It's just like, what are you doing?
[00:23:16]  This has nothing to do with Alice Shrunk speech.
[00:23:18]  Well, and it also, it feels almost like, you know, I don't even know what the hypothetical to come up with, but like if we lived in a free market society completely, you know, a complete anarchist society and pretty much, you know, like three companies had bought up like all of some precious resource and were keeping it away from some people to just sit there and be like, well, my philosophy tells me that this is okay.
[00:23:42]  It's it's.
[00:23:42]  It feeds into the worst impression of libertarians which some libertarians really live up to, which is that I have this great philosophy in my mind.
[00:23:52]  I feel really great about myself because i'm pure and logically consistent and I don't care.
[00:23:57]  I can't get slowed down by petty little forces like the real worlds that you live in.
[00:24:03]  That's not my problem, man.
[00:24:04]  I'm here in my perfect libertarian world and what I always try to stress to people is that the reason why our philosophy is awesome is because it actually works in real life and solves real problems that people have.
[00:24:18]  And if they, if it didn't do that, then it would be stupid and we'd be wasting our time on this like that's I. I've had a I don't know if I ever told you this.
[00:24:29]  I think i've mentioned it on the show before but i've.
[00:24:31]  I've had, like I had three, I think, profoundly libertarian, anarchist experiences before I ever found politics in my as a kid.
[00:24:42]  That I that I think about uh, that that really affected me profoundly.
[00:24:46]  Okay, so Murray Rothbard bought me and raped me yes, that was a lot and and I realized that it should be legal I was like this is a good time and we should be allowed to do this whatever we want to.
[00:24:58]  So the first one which, by the way, is also an experience Murray Rothbart had that I heard him uh, talk about once in a speech but I went to both public and private school.
[00:25:07]  Yeah, that was the first one, which was a really eye experience to go like wow public bad, private better, the vibrate better.
[00:25:19]  I talked about this in Ego And Hubris.
[00:25:21]  The very first day, fourth grade, I stepped into public school for the first time there was a mobile that one of the kids had made that was hanging in the classroom.
[00:25:29]  So they cut out pictures from a magazine, glued them on, then labeled them and it said chicken c-h-i-k-e-n.
[00:25:37]  And seeing that on display in your classroom, I could not wrap my head around it.
[00:25:43]  It was unconscionable to me from what i've been streaming for i'm talking about I had.
[00:25:47]  I mean, I saw abusive teachers, not just like uh, physical abuse, which I did see a few times, but threats of physical abuse all the time, all over the place.
[00:25:57]  Kids, threats from kids to other kids and outrageously unethical behavior like giving kids the answers to standardized tests in front of everybody.
[00:26:07]  Just like i'm gonna read the question, i'm gonna give you the answers to all of these questions to try to get the scores up, like really up.
[00:26:14]  My first day in public school it was um first grade, second grade, second grade and a kid came up to me and uh said I forget what happened, but he said he was gonna beat the out of me in the bathroom, which already beat the out of you was like a it was like a real harsh way to talk.
[00:26:32]  Like I was like well, it's also, you're in the bathroom, there's not gonna be left.
[00:26:35]  Yeah well, that's a good point.
[00:26:37]  Which way are you getting me?
[00:26:38]  Are you getting me when I first come in or when i'm leaving, because you better get to me quick.
[00:26:43]  Is this the story of how Legionist Ganks got started?
[00:26:45]  This is.
[00:26:46]  It was Lewis, that was who I met.
[00:26:47]  I met Lewis in second grade.
[00:26:49]  Uh no, but so, and I I mean I was so soft at the time like I I you know know like he was like i'm gonna beat the out of you and I was like well, the joke's on you, because I am going to tell a teacher and we will see how far this goes.
[00:27:01]  And I went and told the teacher and she goes figure it out and like kicked me out and I was like woof.
[00:27:06]  I was like all right, so i'm on my own.
[00:27:09]  Yeah, like something like that six or seven, whatever the age in second grade is uh, and then it just didn't happen.
[00:27:15]  He just didn't, I think he forgot, like he just literally was just talking and then like never beat me out, but it was a real eye-opening experience anyway.
[00:27:22]  So public private school, that's one, uh.
[00:27:24]  Number two is I. Uh, I went to Amsterdam when I was 17 and uh, I was a huge pothead in uh, high school, not the best thing.
[00:27:31]  I smoked a whole lot of pot.
[00:27:33]  Uh, you know, I had issues with my father and my family and stuff don't recommend it, especially for teenagers, uh.
[00:27:38]  But I was and going to Amsterdam and just being like oh, I can do this here, like this isn't?
[00:27:46]  I'm not scared of cops, no one's threatening me no, it was a weird thing when you grew up with this mindset like I live in a free country, and then I realized like oh, there's this really profound freedom that I do not have, that I all of the sudden have and that's cool and that, yeah.
[00:27:59]  But here's the other one.

=== Flawed Marketplace Ideas (14:31) ===

[00:28:00]  Right, and this is getting back to this is a long tangent for me to get back to this, but I remember this, when I was in seventh grade I think, I had this lefty history teacher who told me once and I knew nothing about politics, but she was telling us what communism was and I didn't object at all to the theory of communism.
[00:28:17]  I didn't like know enough to object to the theory um, but she said at one point this was her lefty take on it.
[00:28:24]  She goes, communism was a philosophy that worked really well on paper but never worked out well in practice.
[00:28:32]  And I just my own.
[00:28:33]  The way my seventh grade brain worked.
[00:28:35]  I was like that's bullshit, that doesn't make any sense.
[00:28:39]  And I argued back and forth with her for a while and then she just kind of shut me down and wouldn't like talk anymore.
[00:28:44]  But I was like, but that you know.
[00:28:46]  Like I didn't say it as well as this.
[00:28:47]  But I was like, but that's like if you have a blueprint for how to build a building but it doesn't build a building, then you can't say your blueprint was perfect, but the building just stuck.
[00:28:57]  What doesn't work in practice right, because the whole point of a philosophy is that it's supposed to be applied.
[00:29:03]  And like, if it?
[00:29:03]  If it can't be applied, then it did.
[00:29:05]  It wasn't right, like it can't be right on paper and wrong in practice, and you made a mistake on the paper.
[00:29:10]  That just drove me nuts, that and so that always, like that's in the back of my mind sometimes where I go.
[00:29:16]  You have to realize that the what we have to demonstrate is that we actually can solve these problems and they are bringing up a major problem.
[00:29:24]  You can't deny that.
[00:29:24]  This is not a problem that people can be, you know, unpersoned.
[00:29:29]  Yeah oh, I mean Carol Markowitz, who's a columnist for NEW YORK POST.
[00:29:32]  She's a strong conservative and she's been kind of dipping her toe into these waters.
[00:29:36]  I'm not hopeful i'm going to convince her of anarchism, but you know she's from the Soviet Union, just like me, so she sees through.
[00:29:42]  A lot of this propaganda was very obvious to her and she had asked me early on.
[00:29:47]  You know, what would the anarchist response to covet be?
[00:29:50]  And i'm like I don't know that'd be particularly different, because a lot of it is like, let's look at the numbers, let's see what's working and what isn't.
[00:29:56]  So it's not like we would say, no one has any lockdowns and it's guaranteed that that's going to make sure uh um, infection rate.
[00:30:03]  We would, we would be the ones actually following the science.
[00:30:06]  It would be getting as much data, looking around as much as possible and making some of these hard choices.
[00:30:12]  I don't think there would be any, I mean, there's a lot that we would end up being differently in terms of having these prolonged lockdowns, but in terms of it being some unambiguous, we would have all the answers immediately when you're dealing with a dynamic emergency situation that's worldwide.
[00:30:26]  I can't say that.
[00:30:28]  Yeah.
[00:30:28]  Yeah.
[00:30:28]  No, it's what you, what you can say with some degree of certainty is that you wouldn't have the interference in what a lot of people are trying to do to help the situation, you know?
[00:30:40]  But so I, you know, I, I, where I do think you, in the example of the, the tech censorship thing, where I do think you are essentially right in your initial criticism, that I couldn't help but just think it's like, no, a lot of these conservatives are acting like leftists.
[00:30:58]  That is, they're having that type of response.
[00:31:00]  That doesn't mean that they're not addressing a very important problem.
[00:31:04]  And I actually think that, as I've said before, that this case, the case of tech censorship is, from my perspective, the strongest argument compared to all like the other antitrust arguments, compared to all the other examples.
[00:31:20]  This is actually the strongest example that they've got, but they're still wrong.
[00:31:25]  It's the strongest example, I would say, since segregation, where you would actually have like a very strong argument to say, no, look, the government should not let you do this.
[00:31:38]  You aren't allowed.
[00:31:39]  Now, I don't agree with that, but it is since then, and that was worse, but it's the closest example I could think of to that, where there is blatant discrimination going on that's not being solved in the marketplace.
[00:31:52]  And you could argue that that's because the market isn't free enough or whatever, but that is true.
[00:31:58]  The issue is that what Will was doing from my perspective is exactly what a lot of leftists do.
[00:32:04]  They go, okay, so here's the problem.
[00:32:07]  Libertarianism doesn't have an answer for this problem.
[00:32:10]  Therefore, government come in and solve the problem.
[00:32:13]  But the issue there is what you're ignoring is, well, number one, what caused the problem?
[00:32:18]  How did this develop?
[00:32:19]  And number two, what is the government going to do for the solution?
[00:32:23]  And how could that go wrong?
[00:32:24]  And those are important areas as well.
[00:32:27]  Yeah.
[00:32:27]  I mean, how he's specifically thinking like a leftist is for over 100 years, progressivism was regarded as scientific as opposed to the chaos of the market.
[00:32:37]  And how it works is you envision what you want the marketplace to look like and you keep passing laws or engineering the inputs to force the outcome that you like.
[00:32:48]  And what ends up happening time and again, and like I think literally every case, I would probably say, is that the people who are writing the rules, it doesn't end up forcing an equitable, equal, whatever word you want to use, marketplace of ideas.
[00:33:00]  It ends up creating barriers of entry to new ideas and marginal ideas and creating a cartel for the players who are there who will then further manipulate the rules in order to make sure that they're the ones who have the power.
[00:33:13]  And you could very easily see why Google, Facebook, and maybe one or two others would want to be like, yes, let's have these rules.
[00:33:20]  No miss it parlor, no companies that spread misinformation.
[00:33:24]  You're going to have to sit at one of our tables.
[00:33:26]  And it's going to be very hard if they're willing to silence a sitting president, if they're willing to kick off a country, which happened with Australia on Facebook, to be like, well, you also got to let Milo on here.
[00:33:40]  It's not going to happen.
[00:33:42]  They would have an excuse, whatever the, because Will's like, if you word it a certain way, they're going to be able to force the outcome you want.
[00:33:49]  I go, the Second Amendment, the First Amendment, they say shall not be a fringe, shall make no law.
[00:33:56]  Well, they mean except for hate speech or they mean especially political speech.
[00:34:01]  Where are you getting this?
[00:34:02]  You're just making things out of nowhere.
[00:34:04]  There's, and there's a one-two punch there, right?
[00:34:07]  So the one punch that you just said is kind of the you know, whatever living document type, like that every law can be interpreted in a million different ways, right?
[00:34:14]  Um, and then number two is that they also can just ignore laws when convenient, like the example I brought up on Kennedy the other night.
[00:34:22]  Where they go?
[00:34:22]  You know that she was asking me like, do you think Cuomo will face criminal charges for the cover-up and which is a very clearly obstruction of justice?
[00:34:29]  I mean his, his aides said they covered up the numbers because they were worried that Trump's UH, Justice Department could investigate them.
[00:34:36]  Very clear uh, obstruction of justice.
[00:34:38]  But they go.
[00:34:39]  Will he be prosecuted?
[00:34:40]  And then I go.
[00:34:40]  Well, I don't know, but that all probably not.
[00:34:43]  But that all just depends if there's political will or not.
[00:34:45]  Too right, i'm telling you, he broke the law, like I don't care what.
[00:34:48]  You know it's like, look, Clapper broke the law.
[00:34:51]  He lied to Congress.
[00:34:53]  If Clapper was a member of the Trump transition team, Clapper would be sitting in jail right now because there would have been political will to prosecute him, but there wasn't.
[00:35:01]  So there is, so he's not.
[00:35:03]  You know, it's that.
[00:35:04]  So just because there's a law written down in no way means that your enemy class is going to enforce it when you want them to enforce it.
[00:35:12]  Yeah, this is one of the reasons why we are so skeptical of minarchists is this idea of equality before the law is an absurdity, as any powerful, rich people are always going to have more access to quality and quantity of objects.
[00:35:28]  That means cars, that means medical care, that means food and that also means access to justice.
[00:35:35]  You can't have everyone have equal lawyers.
[00:35:38]  Someone is going to have better lawyers and those lawyers are going to have connections or they're going to be intimidating, or whatever the situation is.
[00:35:45]  It is certainly going to be a competitive advantage in a court.
[00:35:48]  At the very least, even if it's not a nefarious way, you're paying for some guy who knows how to brainwash that jury.
[00:35:55]  That is an enormously important skill.
[00:35:58]  That's going to have enormous consequences in the outcome of any trial.
[00:36:01]  And even if you had some type of anarchist system without lawyers uh, then smarter people will have a big advantage in defending themselves.
[00:36:09]  I mean there's, there's no way.
[00:36:10]  It's, it's a ghost that you're chasing the equality in any sense.
[00:36:14]  Back starter said, yes yes, all right guys, let's take a quick second and thank our sponsor for today's show, which is Pauls to the Wall.
[00:36:21]  Pauls to the wall is a great libertarian podcast hosted by two libertarian brothers that are longtime supporting listeners of this show, Mike and Nick Paul.
[00:36:32]  Each episode they interview experts on many different topics.
[00:36:35]  Their past guests include greats like Scott Horton, Gene Epstein, Pete Prinones, Jason Stapleton, Matt Erickson and the entire Lions OF Liberty cast, just to name a few.
[00:36:45]  Outside of political discussion, they also interview experts on other interesting topics like history and jujitsu cars music, barbecue and lots more.
[00:36:54]  Pauls to the wall can be found on all major podcast platforms.
[00:36:58]  Check it out today.
[00:37:00]  Again, that's Pauls To The Wall.
[00:37:02]  P-a-u-l-s To The wall great show.
[00:37:05]  Check it out, you're gonna love it.
[00:37:06]  All right, let's get back into the show.
[00:37:08]  Um so, so the other thing that uh, that will brought up a bit was the um, the Civil Rights Act, and how libertarians oppose owes, that and that.
[00:37:17]  He's, and and he made an argument which uh, you know it's not original to him but is is a strong argument and a fair argument.
[00:37:24]  That he goes, look, say whatever you want to about the marketplace.
[00:37:28]  It was not going to desegregate the Jim Crow South, that that had to be done by the force of the federal government and that you actually had to have rules that say no, you cannot hang a whites, only sign out front of your business.
[00:37:44]  And i'll tell you For a long time, a lot of libertarians make this argument.
[00:37:50]  And I was one who used to make it as well.
[00:37:53]  And I've kind of look, you know, just looking at more data that I've taken in, I'm not sure it's as strong as I once thought it was, which was basically that the market would solve all of these problems and that the market would, it's like, look, you're going to turn down black people who want this, who want to come, you know, eat at your restaurant.
[00:38:15]  That's bad business.
[00:38:16]  Someone else will be willing to take that business and this will drive you out.
[00:38:20]  And eventually the market pressures will make you integrate.
[00:38:24]  You know, it's easy to say that in the abstract.
[00:38:27]  It's easy to say, I've thought about this logically, but real life is very complicated.
[00:38:32]  And there's many different factors and many different forces at work.
[00:38:37]  And you could, if I was just, and this is kind of what made me think about that, was just looking at things like Tucker Carlson struggling to find sponsors.
[00:38:45]  Now, you can say, if we were just thinking about this on paper, you'd go, no, He's got the biggest show in cable news.
[00:38:52]  People will want that sponsorship.
[00:38:54]  There's no way the market will solve this.
[00:38:56]  And there'll be lots of companies who are willing to sponsor Tucker Carlson.
[00:39:00]  But there's not really.
[00:39:01]  There's like my pillow and like one other guy.
[00:39:03]  And they actually really struggle to find sponsors.
[00:39:06]  And that's because the thing that's easy to overlook is culture and hatred.
[00:39:12]  And hatred is a powerful force.
[00:39:14]  And the people who really, really hate Tucker Carlson have been empowered by this culture to feel like they can give a world of shit to any sponsor that would sponsor him.
[00:39:23]  And so they just won't do it.
[00:39:25]  And to say if that, if our culture is capable of that, the idea that the racism in the Jim Crow South could not have kept some establishments being like, we don't want black people in here, that's, it's not as strong an argument as I once thought it was.
[00:39:41]  Well, I think that there's several points, which is you're not going to have those votes politically unless there's enough of an anti-racist culture to begin with.
[00:39:49]  It was, if you looked at the period before that in the 1920s, for example, Langston Hughes, who's the great African-American poet, whose autobiography, the first one, is called The Big C.
[00:39:59]  I highly recommend everyone read it because he talks about being a student at Columbia, Columbia, and he couldn't get a job.
[00:40:05]  Or he'd show up at a place and they'd say, oh, I didn't ask for a color boy and just to his face and turn around.
[00:40:11]  So you were going from a period where nationally blatant discriminatory, and this is Langston Hughes.
[00:40:18]  He's walking in a suit.
[00:40:19]  And one of the greats, you know, if you have national racism, you're not going, you're going to have a problem, period.
[00:40:26]  The only thing you could do at that point is education because any politician who tried to stick his neck out of that case would put himself and his family in physical harm.
[00:40:35]  So there's no space there.
[00:40:37]  And as you mentioned, education, it's also, you know, worth asking yourself, like, well, who was in charge of the education that led to this country being so horribly racist or shitty to people for no reason?
[00:40:50]  Well, oh, yeah, the government had them for their entire educational experience.
[00:40:54]  But what you saw preceding the Civil Rights Act was the Great Migration, where people had to walk with their feet when the North became significantly less discriminatory and certainly less violent towards blacks than the South.
[00:41:06]  And they're like, screw this.
[00:41:07]  We've lived here for 150 years, not of our own free will the entire time.
[00:41:11]  We're going to have a better time of it in the North.
[00:41:13]  And they certainly did.
[00:41:14]  But yeah, this is also the problem when you have a country that's made up of separate cultures.
[00:41:19]  There's no easy answer.
[00:41:20]  The South had their racist, and a part of this was also the problem of how the Civil War and Reconstruction was happening.
[00:41:27]  It wasn't an attempt to have this kind of reconciliation.
[00:41:30]  It was very much an era of vindictiveness, perhaps warranted toward the South.
[00:41:34]  But when you have this kind of built-in legal animosity between the two races, I don't see any way where that is going to be resolved amicably other than kind of education and slow cultural ebbing, just like the gay rights movement.
[00:41:49]  It doesn't matter what the laws are.
[00:41:50]  At the end of the day, it's a function of people coming out and people knowing gay people and lesbians and trans people and being like, okay, I don't think like this guy.
[00:41:59]  I don't like this girl.
[00:42:00]  I think it's gross.
[00:42:01]  If they want to get married, I don't care.
[00:42:03]  Like, I just, I don't need to talk about it.
[00:42:05]  So that's political, you know, I just think politics is always going to follow the culture.
[00:42:09]  Yeah, I, so I, I agree with that.
[00:42:11]  And I think that what one of the things that I thought Will was stopping short on in his thought process on this episode was it's kind of like, okay, so look, I'm not saying that like there people who say, well, the free market will be the silver bullet and solve all of these problems.
[00:42:29]  That might be an oversimplistic, flawed argument.

=== History and Political Culture (09:18) ===

[00:42:32]  And like, yeah, it's, it's, but that doesn't grant you government.
[00:42:38]  Like that, that, that hasn't solved your argument yet because you actually have to compare the two things and what is going to be the result.
[00:42:46]  And, you know, like this problem also isn't going to be perfectly solved by the government.
[00:42:49]  It's not like just because a law was passed, there were no businesses that weren't still a hostile environment for black people to come into post 1964.
[00:42:57]  And then, you know, he kind of looked at it and he goes, well, look, we had this problem and the problem was cleaned up.
[00:43:02]  There's no one else who has, you know, white only signs outside their businesses.
[00:43:07]  And you're like, okay, true enough, but you can't just look at it that way.
[00:43:11]  You'd also have to take into account what, you know, what came as a result of the federal government deciding that private businesses were places of public accommodation.
[00:43:22]  And what's come from that is the biggest regulatory state in the history of the world and the largest expansion of government in the history of the world.
[00:43:30]  And so many incredibly draconian expansions of government have been justified by the legal precedent set by the civil rights.
[00:43:38]  So you have to own all of that.
[00:43:40]  Like you can't just own the good part of it.
[00:43:43]  You also have to own all of this other negativity and the fact that we still, like every college in America is still obsessed with racism, you know, 80 years later.
[00:43:54]  So that's got to be taken into account too, that this doesn't, this forceful suppression of an idea that you might think is a bad idea, doesn't that that doesn't eliminate it?
[00:44:04]  And to make the comparison toward the, the online censorship today, you're like yeah, what pandora's box are we opening up by allowing the government to really regulate the internet?
[00:44:14]  That might be a much more dangerous force than than Trump and right-wingers getting kicked off Twitter just saying you have to consider that possibility too.
[00:44:23]  And it's.
[00:44:23]  He's also, I think he's insisting that this, that there's There's enough law in favor of the First Amendment.
[00:44:30]  He's using the argument of college campuses and forcing with Nazis to speak that, you know, he's sure that the judges are going to rule in favor of free speech.
[00:44:38]  And I mean, I don't see how there wouldn't just be all it would take was one judge, which would not be hard to find.
[00:44:45]  And then they could be like, look, it's not, we're not doing it.
[00:44:47]  It's out of our hands.
[00:44:49]  This is, we're just following the rules, you know, and now we're going to have to purge even more people to keep ourselves safe from litigation.
[00:44:55]  So I, I mean, I'm, I don't see, I, he's a lawyer.
[00:44:59]  It's the kind of thing where like, if you're a doctor, you think an operation is the answer.
[00:45:02]  If you're a chiropractor, you think.
[00:45:03]  So I can see why as a lawyer, he would think that would be the result.
[00:45:07]  But again, as you said, they can interpret that law because if they're going to say his argument is you have to say political speech is a civil right.
[00:45:15]  Well, then I can easily say, well, you attacking me is assault and battery.
[00:45:20]  So you have to be banned because you're violating my free speech.
[00:45:23]  You can see them making that argument very easily.
[00:45:24]  Right, right.
[00:45:25]  It's just, it's going to be a very, it's going to be very, very tough, no matter what you think the silver bullet solution is to all of this stuff.
[00:45:34]  And then the other aspect that we didn't even really get into is that what I feel like, you know, leftists do all the time is that, and even the well-intentioned ones, is that they just don't think through what caused a problem to begin with.
[00:45:50]  And, you know, like, so if they're complaining about healthcare costs or something, it's very easy to say like, oh, well, this is why the government should provide free health care to everybody.
[00:45:59]  But you have to at least go like, and with college and all this stuff, you have to at least go like, okay, but what led to the costs getting so out of control?
[00:46:05]  I mean, why are they so inflated?
[00:46:07]  And then you start to realize that you're like, oh, that's actually how we got here.
[00:46:11]  And let's not pretend that before this cancel culture on big tech really took off, before this, this deplatforming really took off, they were all hauled in front of Congress and basically threatened to death by all of the congressmen and women that it's like, oh, you have fake news and we're going to regulate your companies and we should do X, Y, and Z to you.
[00:46:32]  And to a large degree, this is all of this is it's a result of them being threatened by Congress.
[00:46:39]  It's a result of the politicis, the politicization of everything because the government's gotten so goddamn big that it's such a battle over who's going to control it.
[00:46:47]  And so it's not as to me, it's like the overwhelming growth of the state is a big force in what's caused this problem to begin with.
[00:46:56]  It reminds me a lot.
[00:46:57]  You know, I know you've made the point in the past that there's nothing new to cancel culture.
[00:47:02]  And I think it was, it was you and I think you and Curtis Yarvin on one of your streams were talking about this.
[00:47:07]  Like, I was like, oh, you want to talk about cancel culture?
[00:47:09]  Try being like an anti-war advocate during World War I. Believe me, it was a lot worse than getting silenced online and stuff like that.
[00:47:16]  And I think part of it is that it's like that Louis C.K. bit where he was, it's an old Louis bit.
[00:47:23]  I forget exactly how he does it, but he was talking about being on a plane the first time there was Wi-Fi on a plane and then the Wi-Fi went out and he was furious.
[00:47:32]  You know, and it's like, it's like this new thing that you didn't even know you had that was just given to you and then it's gone and you're like, fuck, I'm so pissed off this was taken from me, you know?
[00:47:40]  And I think that we had a few years there where the internet was this new thing and you really could say whatever you wanted on it.
[00:47:46]  And now it's like a little bit of that's taken back and people are furious, but it's easy to lose perspective that we still have way more ability to dissent than we ever had before.
[00:47:56]  And I think it's also important to point out that Parler was represented as an existential threat to America, that this is basically where America's al-Qaeda goes to discuss their plans to murder the president as opposed to boomer cons posting their cringe-worthy memes.
[00:48:12]  And, you know, the way there was a literary agent who I actually know, and she said she fired someone from her agency because she had a parlor account.
[00:48:23]  Like it was going that direction.
[00:48:25]  And Parler's back.
[00:48:26]  Now, I'm not saying, oh, there's no problem here.
[00:48:28]  This is great.
[00:48:29]  I told you so.
[00:48:30]  I'm just saying you would think that given everything they threw at it, that they would be able to like nip this thing in the bud.
[00:48:37]  Because a couple of years ago when Cody Wilson was launching Hatreon, which was a Patreon alternative involving people who'd been banned from Patreon, he couldn't get off the ground because Visa and MasterCard refused to be payment processors.
[00:48:50]  So the fact that Parlor could be back up within a month, I think is very interesting to see, especially because it shows a lot of people wherever you stand politically, this is something that Google Store and Apple will attempt to do in coordination with each other.
[00:49:07]  And you need to find workarounds to get around it so this kind of stuff can't happen again.
[00:49:11]  It's kind of like, you know, we take off our shoes at the airport because the shoe bomber, I think his name is Richard Reed, he had like that bomb in his shoe and they wrestled him down.
[00:49:19]  It's like they're not going to try shoes again.
[00:49:22]  So it's the same kind of thing.
[00:49:23]  Like once you know what they're going to do, the market or in this case, the terrorists are going to adjust around.
[00:49:29]  But it's same thing here.
[00:49:29]  It's like, okay, you know what they're going to try to do to the next parlor or to Polarid Parlor again.
[00:49:35]  And all these different groups are like, okay, we need to create workarounds now.
[00:49:38]  So they lose that capacity.
[00:49:40]  And I think that's happening at an accelerating rate because they only have a very limited number of tools.
[00:49:45]  They're not sophisticated actors for the most part.
[00:49:48]  I think that right wingers, and not just right, anyone who's not a left winger, basically, because according to them, that makes you a right-winger, you know, if you're not a lefty.
[00:49:57]  By definitely not a lefty.
[00:49:58]  Right.
[00:49:59]  So anyone who's not a lefty basically needs to stop bitching about the double standard and start taking it as a given.
[00:50:08]  Like stop, stop, you know, because it's, you're, you're right.
[00:50:11]  Like you are right, by the way, you know, like the, yes, the Ted Cruz story is blowing up more than it would have if it was a Democrat.
[00:50:18]  And the corporate press is harsher on him than they would be on a Democrat.
[00:50:21]  No question.
[00:50:21]  But you know what, Ted Cruz?
[00:50:23]  You knew that when you signed up for the job.
[00:50:26]  All people knew that.
[00:50:27]  Yes.
[00:50:27]  So that's a given.
[00:50:28]  That's like already there.
[00:50:30]  And then you have to assume, you know, control for that and then plot your moves accordingly, you know?
[00:50:36]  So that's just whether you want it to be the situation or not, that is the situation that we're in.
[00:50:42]  But I do, you know, it's like, I do want to.
[00:50:46]  Have you seen that meme?
[00:50:46]  There's a meme of a tombstone and it says conservatism on it.
[00:50:50]  And the quote says, imagine the situation were reversed.
[00:50:53]  And it's like, yeah, keep saying that.
[00:50:54]  They don't care.
[00:50:55]  Yeah.
[00:50:55]  Yeah.
[00:50:56]  All right, guys, let's take a quick second.
[00:50:57]  I want to thank our sponsor for today's show, which is Yo Kratom.
[00:51:01]  Go celebrate your freedom at yokratom.com.
[00:51:05]  Get yourself a $60 kilo.
[00:51:07]  It's the world's best value in Kratom shipped right to your door.
[00:51:10]  No questions asked.
[00:51:12]  If you've never heard of Kratom before, just ignore this ad.
[00:51:15]  We're not talking to you.
[00:51:16]  No need to hear about this and go try Kratom.
[00:51:18]  But if you're currently a fan of Kratom, then celebrate your freedom at yokratom.com, home of the $60 kilo, which is unheard of.
[00:51:26]  Yocratum.com is one of the biggest sellers of Kratom nationwide, and they made yokratom.com so you can buy directly at wholesale prices.
[00:51:33]  This is quality Kratom.
[00:51:35]  We've heard great feedback from the fans.
[00:51:36]  They confirm this is solid stuff.
[00:51:39]  And like I said, it's the only place where you can get a kilo for $60.
[00:51:42]  So last time, if you're currently a fan of Kratom, go to yokratom.com and get yourself a $60 kilo.
[00:51:48]  All right, let's get back into the show.

=== Chandler's Transgender Jokes (02:30) ===

[00:51:50]  You know, when you watch, and this is what it's been like on the internet in a way, but like, you know, when you watch, and it used to be more of the reverse, where when we were kids, if you watch something old on TV, it would be kind of cheesy and family friendly and clean.
[00:52:04]  And then you could do a lot edgier shit, like when we were kids on TV.
[00:52:07]  Like, you know, South Park would do things where you were like, dude, if the Simpsons even ever thought of doing that, they'd be like, someone in the writing room would be like, we can't possibly say that.
[00:52:17]  But now it's kind of gone in an opposite direction where you'll see a lot of things.
[00:52:20]  I mean, I see jokes just on the office and you'll be like, oh, they could not.
[00:52:24]  They would not do this.
[00:52:25]  What about the fact that the cast of Friends and the cast of Seinfeld were all white?
[00:52:29]  That would never happen.
[00:52:30]  And some of the jokes just would never happen.
[00:52:33]  You know, like just even when they weren't like mean-spirited jokes, but it would be like a joke about like on Friends, I think Chandler's dad was like a drag queen or a transgender or something like that.
[00:52:45]  And they would just make jokes about it the whole time.
[00:52:47]  That wasn't mean-spirited, like fuck that.
[00:52:50]  And also the fact that it was an actress playing him.
[00:52:53]  Yes, yes.
[00:52:54]  That would have been a complicated.
[00:52:55]  Why do you have a woman playing a transition?
[00:52:58]  Every inch of it, you wouldn't have been allowed to do.
[00:53:00]  Even though the moral of the story was like, Chandler, get over it.
[00:53:03]  You know, it's your dad.
[00:53:04]  You love him.
[00:53:04]  You know, it wasn't like the moral was like, yeah, I know Lewis is watching Seinfeld now.
[00:53:10]  They had one of the best jokes on Friends involved that dad.
[00:53:14]  So it's the act, I forget the actress name, Catherine something.
[00:53:17]  She was the star of Cyril mom.
[00:53:19]  I got to tell this because it's just, what was her name?
[00:53:23]  Kathleen Turner.
[00:53:24]  So she's sitting there as Chandler's dad, you know, as a as a transgender woman.
[00:53:30]  And Morgan Fairchild is transgender is the mom, whatever, Chandler's mom.
[00:53:34]  And they look at each other and the mom says, you know, I knew we were in trouble when I saw you wearing my wedding dress before the wedding.
[00:53:44]  And she goes, no, no, no.
[00:53:46]  It's only bad luck if you see the bride in the dress.
[00:53:49]  And Morgan Fairchild goes, it ain't good luck.
[00:53:54]  And she would just deliver that line perfectly.
[00:53:57]  But there was, you know, I'll tell you, there was something nice about it where it was kind of like the spirit of that time, which I actually think we've really regressed since then.
[00:54:08]  But the spirit there was kind of like, look, you can say, you can be uncomfortable with this.
[00:54:14]  And that doesn't make you the bad guy at the end of the episode.
[00:54:17]  You can be this very non-traditional person.

=== Strategic Sacrifices in Politics (11:41) ===

[00:54:20]  And that doesn't make you the bad guy.
[00:54:22]  It's funny.
[00:54:23]  We all agree the situation is kind of funny and uncomfortable and we can all enjoy it.
[00:54:27]  And then the moral at the end is like, whatever, everyone kind of get past it and you love each other, your family, you know, like that.
[00:54:32]  It was everything about the tone to me was kind of right.
[00:54:35]  And nowadays, the tone would be, if there is anything here that we can pick apart, you are all going to be ruined.
[00:54:43]  So you better just avoid the topic.
[00:54:45]  Or if you approach the topic, approach it from this dogmatic position where everything you're saying is woke compliant and try.
[00:54:52]  And anyway, it's a, but to me, the parallel on the internet is like, I do think about the thing like, dude, like in 2015, 2016, the internet was like, if you were looking at it now from today's eyes, you'd be like, I can't believe people are getting away with saying this shit and not getting kicked off.
[00:55:14]  Like, holy shit.
[00:55:15]  If you had a Twitter account, you could post whatever you wanted to on Twitter.
[00:55:19]  Like it was not, I literally, I, the first interaction I ever had with Christopher Cantwell was him calling me a faggot on Twitter.
[00:55:27]  Like that was, you know, for some argument that we got in.
[00:55:29]  And he was like, you know, he was just like spewing his shit on Twitter.
[00:55:34]  And no, there was no like, oh, you know, dude, he's obviously, you can't say that on here.
[00:55:39]  It was just like, okay, he's just advocating white nationalism on Twitter.
[00:55:42]  Like that was, and it's just that changed really drastically in the last few years, where now you're just kind of like, I mean, if you even see a tweet like that, it's going to be from some sock account with 200 followers and you'll be like, they'll be gone.
[00:55:54]  They'll be gone in a week.
[00:55:55]  You can't last on here like, you know, with that shit.
[00:55:58]  Yeah, which is interesting.
[00:55:59]  It's an interesting change.
[00:56:00]  But I also think it's, it's, it's, um, like with Facebook.
[00:56:04]  You know, I'm not on Facebook anymore.
[00:56:05]  I'm on locals.
[00:56:07]  I think the fact that people are aware of how much of this is curated to some extent is creating a market opportunity.
[00:56:16]  And I think this is, you know, in our lifetimes, the things that were going to destroy America were ICT.
[00:56:23]  And then the gap was a big concern.
[00:56:25]  There's a gap on every store, clothing store, Starbucks, Internet Explorer.
[00:56:29]  They were looking at antitrust from Microsoft because every computer came with a free Internet Explorer.
[00:56:34]  And if you have the gateway, the Internet, you have control of the Internet.
[00:56:37]  I don't think my doorman controls my house, but what do I know?
[00:56:40]  I don't have a doorman.
[00:56:41]  So, you know, I agree with Will that this is a concern, especially if you have your finger on the scale in dealing with a democracy that's going to have some kind of asymmetries.
[00:56:53]  And it's not something you could just hand wave away.
[00:56:55]  But I do think that his approach would make things worse.
[00:57:01]  I don't see how it's always going to be a lot easier for Mark Zuckerberg to get a center on the phone than Laura Loomer.
[00:57:10]  And I think once you have that, I don't see how you think that I just think is not at all what a lot of conservatives who push it is.
[00:57:21]  It's like repealing 230.
[00:57:22]  It's like, okay, so even if you were to say that your average person can now sue Twitter, I mean, it's like you're going to go up against Twitter's army of lawyers from some regular person.
[00:57:33]  Then it's going to be a whole, it's going to be all debatable about whether, what it was exactly that you did.
[00:57:38]  You also have to realize that like, it's like, like, as you were getting at before, this whole thing where it's like incitement to violence, all it takes, the problem is that our country has been overtaken by this progressive statist religion.
[00:57:54]  And if you don't deal with that, then what, okay, so misgendering someone or dead naming someone, that is incitement to violence in their mind.
[00:58:03]  Right.
[00:58:03]  Right.
[00:58:04]  So that's okay.
[00:58:05]  So you're booted for that.
[00:58:06]  So it like they're still going to be able to find some way to say, well, that's not political speech.
[00:58:11]  That's outside of political speech.
[00:58:13]  As you said, all it takes is one activist judge who's going to set a precedent for this whole thing.
[00:58:18]  So I just don't, I'm very, very skeptical of their solutions.
[00:58:22]  But it is, there's no question that they have, look, there is a real concern when the, you know, the public square has been taken to the internet.
[00:58:38]  You have this company in Twitter where all the biggest journalists and biggest politicians and all of these big players are in this space.
[00:58:46]  And now they can just take other people's voices away from them in this space.
[00:58:50]  There's no question that that is concerning.
[00:58:52]  And to pretend it's not, then I think we just, we come off as the libertarian who's concerned with what's on paper rather than what works in practice.
[00:59:01]  And you're going to say, sorry, I can't deal with this real life problem right in front of me because I've got this philosophy on paper and it doesn't jive with that.
[00:59:10]  And I think that we have to deal with reality.
[00:59:13]  And it's also kind of funny when you have a situation where 49 of the 50 attorneys general are suing, they were suing Facebook, I believe.
[00:59:21]  When you have that kind of agreement across party lines, when the guy from, you know, I'm assuming it's Hawaii.
[00:59:27]  I don't know which is the state that's holding out is teaming up with the guy from Alabama.
[00:59:32]  I mean, is this a really, really good thing?
[00:59:34]  But my gut tells me it's a really, really bad thing.
[00:59:36]  When things get that bipartisan, it usually ends up screwing over the average person.
[00:59:42]  Yeah.
[00:59:42]  No, the worst disasters, all of the worst disasters of our of our lives have been bipartisan and the ones before that as well.
[00:59:50]  You know, that's like where the worst of the worst shit happens.
[00:59:54]  Okay.
[00:59:55]  So we're, we're getting close to the end of time here, but I wanted to ask you completely aside, different topics.
[00:59:59]  My favorite part of the episode, I would say, is what I got to tell you about the anarchist handbook.
[01:00:04]  That was a good part.
[01:00:05]  That was a good idea.
[01:00:06]  That was a good part.
[01:00:07]  But I wanted to ask you about Cuomo.
[01:00:10]  I was hoping you were going to say that.
[01:00:12]  Because you had talked about this kind of throughout the last year in different in different situations, but about the Democrats turning on Cuomo and the corporate press turning on Cuomo.
[01:00:24]  And it really seems like it's just happened where it's not just, so you have the Republicans who are calling for investigations.
[01:00:31]  That's a given.
[01:00:32]  But the fact that the media class who lionized this guy for a year actually seem to be turning on him and Democrats, this guy, Lou.
[01:00:41]  Kim, I think.
[01:00:41]  Kim, Kim, I'm sorry.
[01:00:44]  And I'm a racist.
[01:00:45]  Okay.
[01:00:46]  That guy.
[01:00:47]  Well, you might be right about it.
[01:00:48]  One of us is right and one of us is racist.
[01:00:51]  I think I'm the racist.
[01:00:52]  I think it was Kim.
[01:00:53]  But so he, it was Kim.
[01:00:54]  You're right.
[01:00:55]  I just remember.
[01:00:56]  So he basically said that Cuomo threatened him that to I will destroy you.
[01:01:03]  You better shut up about this.
[01:01:04]  De Blasio.
[01:01:05]  Ron Kim is his name.
[01:01:06]  Ron Kim.
[01:01:06]  Yeah.
[01:01:06]  Ron Kim.
[01:01:07]  So de Blasio has come out and said, I bet that's true because we've all gotten those phone calls from Cuomo.
[01:01:13]  So now you have Democrats really turning on this guy.
[01:01:16]  I'm just curious, like, what are your thoughts about the whole thing?
[01:01:20]  So there's a few theories.
[01:01:22]  I was really hoping you were going to bring this up.
[01:01:24]  First of all, the one which I think is the least likely, I'm not going to dismiss entirely, but I really, really think it's unlikely.
[01:01:30]  People are like, well, you know, now that Trump's gone, they need to start holding their own accountable.
[01:01:35]  And I'm like, what?
[01:01:36]  That's not a thing.
[01:01:37]  Like, why would they ever hold it?
[01:01:39]  Who have they held accountable for the Iraq war?
[01:01:41]  No, really.
[01:01:42]  That's not a thing.
[01:01:43]  The only time someone was held accountable was when he did things that compared to all this are relatively minor, Al Franken.
[01:01:49]  And if you ask me, like, which is worse, grabbing a girl's boobs jokingly while she's asleep or killing grandma or going to war, I think even that girl would be like, yeah, grab my boobs again.
[01:01:59]  Just don't kill people.
[01:02:01]  And he didn't even grab her boobs.
[01:02:02]  You know, he just kind of put his hands in front of her boobs or whatever.
[01:02:05]  But either way, there's really no comparison.
[01:02:08]  Right.
[01:02:08]  Right.
[01:02:09]  So that was one theory that they need.
[01:02:12]  I don't ever, it's like, who's forced him to do this?
[01:02:14]  That was number one.
[01:02:15]  The other one is that he really is just a POS.
[01:02:20]  And now that they don't have to kind of be aligned against Trump, let's throw this guy in the trash where he belongs, which is not implausible.
[01:02:28]  The third one, there's two more.
[01:02:30]  When Biden was talking about his VP nomination, there are a few names floating around that were under consideration.
[01:02:37]  One of them was Karen Bass, who I believe is the head of the Congressional Black Caucus.
[01:02:41]  She's a congresswoman no one heard about, or she did not have a high national profile.
[01:02:45]  And all of a sudden, there were all these articles, which were clearly planted by Officer Harris, about how she had a speech and she was praising Scientology.
[01:02:53]  And they were clearly hit pieces designed to undermine her standing and they worked.
[01:02:57]  So possibly it is the vice president trying to make sure her path is clear for 2024 by taking out any potential rivals because Cuomo, as you said, was lionized.
[01:03:07]  You and I, I think, have discussed if Biden had to step down as a nominee at that time, he would have been the obvious choice because he was being praised as the New York is the best state, this test standard, the standard for the whole country, even though per capita had the worst murder death rates on earth.
[01:03:22]  But okay, somehow it's number one.
[01:03:23]  The other one, which I've came up with, which I think is very interesting, Letitia James is the Attorney General of New York.
[01:03:30]  She's been making a lot of headlines.
[01:03:32]  She's the one who sued the NRA.
[01:03:35]  She also came out against, I forgot what it was, something that was pretty like something that we would like.
[01:03:40]  I forget what it was, maybe it was taking on Facebook or something like that, doing investigations.
[01:03:44]  And this could be clearing the way for her to become governor next year because she's very been very ambitious.
[01:03:50]  She's been making a lot of waves in a hard left kind of way.
[01:03:55]  And they would, look, if it's going to be a safe Democratic seat, wouldn't they rather have a progressive black woman and kind of make a New York state the example for how other states should follow?
[01:04:06]  So any of those are the hypotheses on the table right now.
[01:04:10]  And it could be a mix.
[01:04:11]  It doesn't have to be one or the other, right?
[01:04:13]  So it could be a mix of some of those.
[01:04:15]  I also think that as with the Al Franken situation, I think that sometimes they make strategic decisions that it's better to throw one person under the bus for the sake of the group.
[01:04:30]  And I think that it might be possible that they just thought some of this stuff with the nursing homes was going to come out one way or the other, and that it's better to get ahead of it.
[01:04:39]  And the media better start treating him like he's not their golden boy because if it gets really, really ugly, they don't want to be implicated in it as well.
[01:04:48]  Oh, look, we were harsh on him.
[01:04:49]  But this is why I disagree.
[01:04:50]  I can get how they would stop making him the golden boy, but the New York Times was clearly giving marching orders that this guy.
[01:04:57]  It's the difference between we're going to ignore it, pretend it's not happening, like with the Hunter stuff, and like, we're out for this guy.
[01:05:03]  We are making a concerned effort.
[01:05:06]  Because when they talk about Letitia James opening investigations or whoever the FBI, excuse me, opening investigations, they're not saying, yeah, they're opening investigations and then running interference for him, you know, which they would always do.
[01:05:16]  This is based on nothing because blah, blah, blah.
[01:05:18]  Other states, Ron DeSantis and Christina, blah, blah, blah.
[01:05:21]  They're not present, framing it that way at all.
[01:05:23]  No, you're right.
[01:05:24]  So I am, I'm very curious what's going on.
[01:05:27]  Yeah, it's interesting.
[01:05:28]  It'll be interesting to see more.
[01:05:29]  Or maybe it's just Hillary because she's a vindictive bitch.
[01:05:33]  That's always a possibility.
[01:05:34]  Maybe she's angry if there's a Democrat who killed more people than she has.
[01:05:38]  I'm number one.
[01:05:40]  That's not true.
[01:05:41]  If you add up all the wars, she's killed a lot more people.
[01:05:44]  Well, at the rate he's going, you know.
[01:05:45]  Hillary, Hillary, keep your head up.
[01:05:47]  You've still killed a lot more people than Cuomo has.
[01:05:50]  All right.
[01:05:50]  Come on.
[01:05:51]  Hey, hang in there, Hilldog.
[01:05:53]  You got this thing.
[01:05:54]  Don't worry about it.
[01:05:55]  All right.
[01:05:56]  I love you, brother.
[01:05:57]  Always a pleasure talking to you.
[01:05:59]  All right.
[01:05:59]  See you soon.
[01:06:00]  Thanks for listening.
[01:06:01]  Peace.