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Dec. 19, 2016 - Praying Medic

02:11:40

067 Fringe Radio - Spiritual Warfare

My interview with Michael and Susan, the hosts of Fringe Radio, where we discuss topics like child trafficking, physical and emotional healing, signs & wonders, opening spiritual portals, the courts of heaven and the divine council. Resources The Shining Man With Hurt Hands Fringe Radio Network Engaging God (Online Class) - Mike Parsons Traveling in the Spirit Made Simple

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	- Hi, I'd like to welcome you to our show.
	I'm your host, Prang Medic.
	We're talking about life as a child of God and all things related to His Kingdom.
	Thanks for joining us.
	If you're a new listener to the show, you can find articles and books and other resources on my website www.prangmedic.com.
	Now let's jump into this week's show.
	We are live with Praying Medic, author of many, many books that are just super pertinent
	Traveling in the Spirit Made Simple and Seeing in the Spirit Made Simple and Divine Healing Made Simple and Defeating Your Adversary in the Court of Heaven.
	Thanks, Michael.
	Thanks for having me on the show.
	And thank you, Susan.
	I'm really excited to be here, to be able to talk to you guys and hang out and talk about what is on God's heart.
	Amen, we're happy to have you.
	Amen, and just to kind of sum up, like, we're probably going to get into a ton of stuff, but just to make a sketch of the plan here is to, recently, you've done some Facebook Live videos, and soon on your podcast as well, on the Praying Medic site, about the whole Pizzagate scandal, and you've been doing extensive research on that, and just, I guess, how to link that to the spiritual warfare
	Praying in the spirit going into the courts of heaven defeating our adversary in the courts of heaven how to link those together and Just where you see the Lord leading with that.
	I guess we're gonna touch on that and then get into your books and also, I have I have a ton of questions from people for you, but But just I mean, is there anything that's on your heart that that you want to share?
	Just to start out yeah, well, you know as long as you brought up the pizza gate thing and it is a
	Fresh subject the New York Times just posted a second article on Pizzagate this morning I don't know if you guys saw that but their first article didn't even really address any of the evidence and the things that investigators had looked into and It was widely criticized by a lot of people so the New York Times published a second article this morning
	Actually putting up some of the evidence that investigators have pointed to.
	And unfortunately for the New York Times, the way they wrote the article, I think they used the word fake news in their article six or seven times at least.
	Wanted to make sure everybody knows this is fake news.
	This is urban legend.
	It's alt-right conspiracies.
	There's nothing to it.
	And they actually put up some of the connections that people have made, but they didn't make a serious attempt to look into the connections between government employees and the pizza restaurant.
	And I guess I have been frustrated with this whole thing for a lot of reasons.
	The mainstream media has had no interest in pursuing this at all.
	From the get-go, they have decided that there's nothing to it.
	They basically attribute it as a conspiracy to discredit Hillary Clinton.
	Because it came out during the election cycle, it was viewed by the mainstream media as a way to try to not get Hillary elected.
	The interesting thing is, the mainstream media themselves have reported on this in the past.
	Back About five years ago, there was an investigation in the Defense Department into child pornography.
	And it was a big deal.
	They found somewhere on the order of like 5,000 people in the Defense Department who had been involved in downloading child porn on government computers.
	And this was called Operation Flicker, by the way, if you want to do some looking into it.
	CNN's John Anderson Cooper actually did an investigative piece on it, and he interviewed Senator Charles Grassley and asked him what the status was of the investigation, what happened.
	Essentially, the Defense Department refused to cooperate, didn't investigate a lot of people who were implicated, never followed through on most of the investigations.
	Of the 5,000 people suspected of being involved in child porn, only a few dozen of them were prosecuted.
	And this was a big deal on CNN and the mainstream media.
	years ago.
	This is exactly what Pizzagate is all about.
	Now, unfortunately, a lot of people think it's just about a couple of emails between John Podesta and some people at this pizza restaurant.
	It's not.
	That's the tip of the iceberg.
	This thing involves child porn and pedophilia in every branch of government.
	It involves human trafficking by the government with other governments around the world.
	It involves illegal arms sales.
	It involves bribery, extortion, and money laundering.
	It involves a lot of criminal activity.
	It's huge.
	And unless you start to go in to look into these emails and do some serious connecting the dots and looking through archived news articles, you're never going to understand what this is all about.
	It's much bigger than most people want to believe.
	It's easy for people to dismiss this as a conspiracy of some politically motivated people.
	But like I said, I am not a conspiracy person.
	I don't watch Alex Jones.
	I'm not into conspiracy theories and stuff just doesn't interest me at all.
	I have had a number of friends who have in the past told me about this stuff.
	For years they've been telling me about this stuff and I've always blown them off.
	I've always kind of attributed them to just being paranoid conspiracy theorists.
	But when the Lord put this on my radar right after the election, I didn't even know where to start.
	And so I began looking and doing some research and fortunately I ran into this conversation.
	Basically an anonymous FBI agent showed up on 4chan, which is an internet board.
	He gave the people who were investigating this a lot of good information.
	And I started following those leads and started connecting the dots, and the size and the scope of this whole thing blew me away.
	I couldn't believe how big it had gotten.
	And for those who don't know much about the internal workings of this, the mainstream media's narrative on this is that there is no merit to any of these allegations, that if there was, police would have investigated.
	And actually, the New York Times article this morning said that police have debunked this theory.
	That is not true.
	Actually, the opposite is true.
	You can go on the internet and look at Charisma Magazine, you can look at Breitbart, you can look at a number of other news outlets, and they all published a story, and if you just put it in search terms, New York Police Department, Anthony Weiner, arrest, and put in press conference.
	New York Police Department, after they arrested Anthony Weiner and seized his laptop, They looked at the hard drive, they looked at the files and found 650,000 messages that were transferred over onto his laptop from Huma Abedin.
	Huma Abedin is Hillary Clinton's personal assistant.
	The emails and many of the files are very incriminating for a lot of people in government.
	What happened after NYPD got the laptop, they made a copy of it and sent it on to the FBI.
	FBI looks at it James Comey, who's the head of the FBI, reopens the Hillary email investigation just before the election.
	The investigation is open for about eight or nine days, and then everyone's wondering if he's going to indict Hillary or not, recommend the Department of Justice indict her.
	He does not make the recommendation to indict.
	The case is closed again.
	Now, at this point, what happened was New York Police Department had already announced they were going to call a press conference and they were going to make arrests.
	They had all the evidence they needed to make arrests, and they were going to call a press conference and let everyone know the evidence that they had.
	Well, that never happened.
	And it didn't happen because the Department of Justice put pressure on New York Police Department not to prosecute, not to make arrests, and not to call the press conference.
	Because there is some very, very sensitive information That implicates a lot of people in the government.
	And under the current administration, nothing is going to be done.
	Nothing's going to be prosecuted.
	So when the mainstream media says there's nothing to this, they're completely forgetting the fact that New York Police Department has already said they're going to make arrests.
	That is on hold right now because the Department of Justice does not want this being prosecuted.
	Not right now.
	When Trump is inaugurated and if Jeff Sessions If his approval for Attorney General goes through Congress and he is appointed Attorney General, he can then go and decide if he wants to prosecute this and allow New York Police Department to prosecute the people they want to.
	For the mainstream media to tell people there's nothing to this, to me, is incredible.
	Because there is definitely a lot to this.
	I believe thousands of people are going to end up being prosecuted out of this whole thing.
	There's a lot of dirty people.
	in government.
	So that's kind of the background.
	It's extensive.
	It involves a lot of different governments.
	It involves a lot of different agencies.
	It involves nonprofit organizations.
	And there's a lot of different types of activity that are connected to these people.
	Like I said, it's much bigger than just a couple of restaurants in Washington, D.C.
	Absolutely.
	Yeah, and it's amazing because this dovetails perfectly with some of the other victims and people that are exposing this stuff that we've had a chance to talk to.
	Michelle Saldana, who I've had four interviews with recently, and Douglas Dietrich, who's a very controversial guy, but has been exposing the child pornography and abduction and rape and all the Satanism that exists in high levels of the government.
	And yeah, it's conspiratorial, yeah, but I really feel like God is, it's time.
	You know, it's time.
	God has had it with this corrupt system.
	And you know, you're not a conspiracy theorist, but here you are writing books about the court of heaven, the government of heaven, how to access the courts, how to get legislation done.
	You're very thorough about it.
	You're very meticulous.
	And now God has you looking at this stuff and Right.
	You know, I mean, it's just, I'm not saying I understand exactly what's happening, but I'm just also along, going down the rabbit hole here, and I'm wondering, like, what, what's going on, you know?
	And, you know, it's just amazing.
	What is your, what is your suspicion, knowing what you know so far, and knowing what you know about the courts, the councils of heaven, what do you think God is up to with all of this?
	Because I'll give you my, my theory in a minute, but I'm curious to know what your thoughts are.
	Okay.
	I feel like what's been happening with, for instance, how you put out the viral blog post, why are we all having dreams about Donald Trump?
	Now, when he got elected, that represented much more than a political move or even a populist uprising, which we're witnessing in many different countries worldwide.
	Right.
	Oh, if you want to talk about that, we can talk about that too.
	Absolutely.
	That is amazing.
	No, it just goes right into it because, yeah, I mean, I'm still like, I still can't believe that he won.
	I'm still just like, because I've known about the Clinton corruption for years.
	I do listen to Alex Jones probably a little bit too much between my more like supernatural stuff that I'm into.
	And people like you and I mean I'm just I see them as like two opposite sides of the same coin to realize okay there's this stuff going on we can't prove it all but a lot of it a lot of it we can prove like the Clintons and the way that you know there's been so much child abduction in Haiti for example after they went in there to supposedly clean up a mess and You know, it just never ends, and it's depressing, and I can understand Christians not wanting to look at this stuff, but the truth is God's Kingdom's invading the Earth.
	The Trump victory, it was like this light shining that was just showing, I'm not saying he's the Messiah hero or anything, but it's like the system, the Antichrist system, I mean we just have to be honest, these people are completely Antichrist.
	This system is putting itself into power and they never realized how unpopular it was going to be and how it was all going to be blasted out of the open.
	The whole world can see the sins of these people.
	I mean, if it was a video game, it would be like this big Dracula castle that, you know, it's like, here's Dracula.
	He's got lots of kids locked in his basement.
	Any spiritual warriors want to go on a little Dracula hunting quest?
	And, you know, And here we're all going in.
	I mean, we are attacking this thing.
	And I heard Susan there.
	I mean, she's, she's one of these people that she's just like raring to go.
	Susan, you want to say anything?
	No, I was just going to say, I think to answer your question, I'm just laughing because I love Michael's way of seeing what God's doing, but I, you know, the thing that God's been showing me is for those that are traveling in the Spirit that are seeing what God's doing is He's exposing things.
	That have been hidden and like Michael said the corruption that's been there for so long and I feel like you know it says like he eventually when we choose the wrong thing it's eventually going to be exposed and this is what's happening right now is these like and you know back in October I had that vision about the communication breakthrough and
	God showed me a picture of treasures, and these treasures all over the earth, they weren't just, like, good things.
	There were some things that were bad that were covered up.
	And, like, when I see things, I see things almost symbolically, but it was, like, covered up treasures.
	And God sent us out to uncover them, and I saw angels just, like, taking dirt off of stuff.
	And when it was exposed, Literally, it was like the next day we found out about the Amish voting.
	This was before the election.
	And then all the emails started to come out into more public view about there being a lot of emails about the government corruption through Hillary's emails, and I'm not good at all the names, but it's like, I believe God is exposing this for His church to rise up and to even begin praying more.
	But we have to have open ears.
	We have to be willing to ask God what we can do and step in and ask God how we can pray, how we can make a difference, you know, and to do our part.
	But at the same time, and this is my question for you, David, is when we begin to see things and we're doing things in the Spirit, Then how do we take that into the natural and begin to, and okay, maybe I'm answering my own question.
	Like, from the things I've, God's used me to do in the Spirit, I've seen things happen in the natural, but it seems like you're doing both, which I love.
	It's like you're exposing it in, you know, on the earth, but you're also Yeah, I'm doing a lot, both in the spirit and in the natural.
	I guess I can tell you a little bit about what that looks like.
	So, Michael, just to answer your question that you asked a few minutes ago about Donald Trump and what has been happening with this populist movement, it's no secret, if you're paying attention, that the globalism And if you want to call it the One World Government, that's fine.
	I don't like to refer to it as that.
	But the movement of globalism that's been supported by George Soros is in serious trouble.
	And the first evidence that there was a crack in the wall that Soros was building was the Brexit move.
	When Britain decided to get out of the EU, it surprised a lot of people.
	But it signaled to me that there's a significant group of people who have an understanding that This move towards globalism is a bad idea.
	And you can look at what's happening in Europe and look at all the rioting and the crime and how their economy is being destroyed.
	And you can look at it and go, this was a really bad idea.
	Enough people in Britain figured it out and voted to get out of the EU.
	The second thing that happened that is going to make the globalist agenda fail is Trump.
	Hillary was all in and, you know, open borders and one big happy global government.
	Trump is a strong nationalist and America first.
	You know, he wants to make America great.
	Trump's election is another thing that's going to stand in the way of that globalist agenda.
	The third thing is Italy's failure of the referendum last weekend.
	That referendum in Italy Was essentially a move to centralize the powers of government in Italy so it could be handed over to the EU.
	So that Italy would basically forfeit its national sovereignty.
	And when that referendum got defeated, that was another sign that people are sick of this globalist agenda.
	The fourth thing that's going to stop the globalist agenda is Vladimir Putin.
	Now this is just a crazy thing that I've noticed myself.
	I've been, like I said, I'm 55 years old, okay?
	I'm not a young person.
	And I've seen how conservatives in the past, especially in the 70s and 80s and the 90s, the Cold War against the Soviet Union was mostly waged by Republicans.
	It was always the conservatives who were against the Soviet Union, against communism.
	It was always the conservatives who wanted to spread democracy around the world, topple dictators, and set up, try to set up puppet You know, Democratic leaders.
	It's fascinating to me to look at the change of political ideology and how for years it was conservatives who hated the Russians.
	And now, in just the last few years, it is Hillary and Barack Obama and the Democratic Party that is actually now anti-Russia.
	And it's the conservatives and Trump Who are saying, we need to make peace with Russia.
	We have no reason to go to war against them.
	It is bizarre for me to look at that switch and go, what happened?
	Why did all of a sudden did the peace-loving Democrats become the warmongers?
	That's just one little piece of the thing.
	But Vladimir Putin is a strong nationalist.
	Putin is never going to allow this spread of globalism to go through Asia and through the former Soviet Union.
	It's not going to happen.
	I think That we're going to see Le Pen get elected in France next year.
	And I think you're going to see one country after another, after another, moving more towards this populist movement, more towards maintaining national sovereignty.
	I think the European Union is dead.
	I think it's not dead, dead, but it's got a short life.
	I think it's on its way out.
	And I think that's a good thing.
	I think the experiment in globalism is an interesting experiment, but I think it's Been weighed in the balance and found lacking.
	And so the rise of Trump is interesting because I think God is going to use Trump in some very interesting ways.
	Prior to the election, the Lord gave me a lot of dreams about Trump, just like he gave you dreams.
	And in one of the dreams, Trump had already been elected and he was uncovering dirty secrets and corruption In business and government, he was exposing it all, putting it all out there and bringing it all out into the light.
	Okay.
	We've never, we've never had a president who has been willing to look at the corruption in government and business and expose it and say, this needs to be dealt with.
	We cannot tolerate this anymore.
	Trump's big thing about drain the swamp.
	That's all about getting rid of corruption in government.
	And so I really do think that, that the, the major thing.
	The major reason why the Lord wanted Trump to be elected, and probably manipulated some situations here and there to make sure it happened, is because he wants to deal with corruption and crime in government and business in America, and have this stuff dealt with once and for all.
	It's just so huge what's happening and all of this is just overwhelming, even to the people who are quite familiar with international politics, which is something that in the old days people all used to be into.
	Nowadays everybody's obsessed with pop culture and American Idol and they're working two jobs, the economy's bad, they're just trying to survive.
	Well, how do you see like the, the, um, what's your, what's your view on, uh, the whole end time perspective of, you know, the rise of a, of an antichrist and the, you know, mark of the beast, all that stuff.
	Do you, do you get into any of that stuff at all?
	I don't.
	Okay.
	That's all right.
	I got saved reading the series left behind by Tim LaHaye, which is all about the tribulation and the rapture.
	Yes.
	I that's, I got saved reading left behind.
	I was an atheist and I read the first book and I got saved reading the first book.
	Does this mean I have to love him too?
	Oh Lord, Joel Osteen was too much already!
	During my first six or seven years that I was a believer, I went to a church that taught premillennial dispensationalism.
	I've taught the rapture and the rise of the Antichrist, and I was always looking for the Antichrist, looking for the false prophet.
	That was kind of what I was all wrapped up in, and that was my thing.
	And then, in 2008, I started having dreams.
	And the Lord has given me thousands of dreams since then, but hasn't given me any dreams, really, about the Antichrist and us living in the last days.
	and the Tribulation and the Rapture.
	I haven't really had any dreams about that stuff.
	I had a lot of dreams about healing and about other things.
	So, what happened to me was I started to focus on other things.
	I have studied eschatology.
	I've studied all the different views of eschatology.
	There are many of them.
	Preterism, partial preterism, dispensational premillennialism, amillennialism.
	There's a lot of different views.
	I've looked at them all.
	I don't like any of them.
	I don't like any of them because you can drive a truck through the holes in the theology of all of them.
	They all use certain scriptures to make their points and to establish their talking points, if you will, and to create their understanding.
	But if you look at their essential beliefs, You can find tons of scriptures that disprove or discredit a lot of what they believe.
	Every view of eschatology I've read can be supported by certain scriptures and destroyed by other scriptures.
	I've actually been developing my own view of eschatology that is not like anything that anyone else has come up with yet.
	It's completely different and it takes a little bit of the beliefs from a lot of different systems and comes up with something that's completely unique, like nothing I've ever heard anyone talk about.
	That's the long answer.
	The short answer is I think it's a waste of time to talk about the end times.
	I really do.
	I think it's an absolute waste of time.
	It's a waste of energy.
	It creates fear.
	It creates anxiety.
	It gives you no reason to even want to have children or to try to build anything that the next generation can can look forward to working with.
	My particular view is that we should not really talk about the End Times or eschatology much at all.
	I think it's an absolutely pointless and worthless discussion.
	All it does is detract from other things that are much more important.
	And so, I really don't get involved in discussions of eschatology at all.
	I just don't discuss them.
	The Lord doesn't talk to me about it, so I don't talk about it with other people.
	Sure.
	Well, that's fair enough.
	And that's, that's, that's kind of, that's kind of my view.
	Well, thank you for that.
	And I admire you for going through so many different worlds, like the healing world, this new mystical world, and you're touching on political things and just nailing it.
	I mean, it's all, it's like a resuscitated communism, this whole hate speech thing and fake news.
	And it's just all of it.
	It's just all.
	Oh, the bill that the house passed yesterday to crack down on fake news They're actually creating programs to educate people about officially approved government narratives.
	And they want to provide funding to people who want to educate journalists on how to create true news stories that support the American agenda and narrative.
	It's nothing but psyops.
	They just want to create the right narrative and get rid of narratives that compete with the state's official published views of things.
	It's very much like old-school communism and fascism.
	I was thinking that too.
	Communism!
	Oh yeah, absolutely.
	It's 1984.
	It's right out of Orwell's book.
	It's kind of scary.
	But hopefully, Trump is a smart guy.
	And Trump, obviously, does not have much love for the mainstream media.
	And I do not think Trump is going to allow this.
	If he can get it repealed, he'll get it repealed.
	If he can't, he'll have it defunded.
	It just won't be any money to, it won't be enforced.
	I'm not too worried about that, but I mean, I don't like the fact that Congress passed a stupid thing in the first place.
	It still has to go to the Senate, still has to be signed by the president, but I expect that thing will go away.
	But that, but it does, it gives us some idea of what is going on.
	I mean, the government really, the government that's in power now, They want to control the narrative.
	They do not like anything coming out that doesn't support their view of things.
	And that's concerning.
	Okay, thank you for that, and I just wanted to add in here too, as we're talking about politics, to remind people that you're very experienced in the realms of practically applying the supernatural.
	I mean, obviously you were a paramedic, and you performed healings on the job.
	And even in a very, let's say, very not typical way, do you want to talk about that?
	I'll just touch on that a little bit, just since my friends here in Taiwan are also just learning about healing, listening to people like Andrew Womack and such, and Stephen Lee Nepal, if you look at his YouTube channel, he's got like a million healings that he's got here.
	Taiwan and Nepal that I work with he was wanting to ask you about about some of that with regards to You know, why did you choose the name American sniper?
	for your spiritual warfare book and with regards to healing and And just I guess to create a bridge for him because he's just 100% healing, you know He doesn't want to talk about portals.
	He doesn't want to hear about any of that.
	He has your book in his house his wife Absolutely loves that stuff.
	Loves your interview with Dan Duvall.
	Just wants to get into all the supernatural stuff she possibly can.
	You know, he's all about healing.
	He's all about the healing, you know, and you're kind of the bridge for people like him and people like his wife.
	So if, if they ever have like another disagreement, they can just put your book in between, you know, and just be like, here it is.
	Well, the thing is, I mean, yeah.
	So I was all about healing too.
	When I, first started having dreams and the Lord and I got baptized with the Holy Spirit and I, you know, speaking in tongues and prophesying and all that.
	The very first thing that the Lord showed me was healing.
	I had started having dreams, lots of dreams about healing people in the ambulance.
	So I learned about healing, watched some videos, read some good books, went through a season where I had to learn about how to release the power of God.
	I had a season where my faith had to grow, because I came from complete skepticism toward healing.
	I didn't believe healing and miracles happened.
	I came from a background as an atheist, so it took a while.
	And once I got it, it was, it was amazing.
	I just loved seeing people healed.
	It was the greatest thing in the world.
	So cool.
	Wake up in the morning, go to work.
	Okay.
	Who's going to get healed today?
	This is going to be great.
	Get to praying for doctors and nurses and paramedics prayed for a lot of patients in the ambulance.
	So a lot of people healed well, probably thousands in the ambulance over the course of about, uh, from 2009 until I just retired from my job as a paramedic and I'm a full-time writer.
	You know, over the course of six, seven years, I saw thousands of people healed.
	My wife and I would go to grocery stores and restaurants and pray for people.
	I see people healed all the time.
	I love healing.
	It's great.
	I love teaching healing.
	I love doing healing workshops.
	But I would say this to people who are focused totally in on healing.
	The Kingdom of God is much bigger than healing.
	It's much bigger.
	Jesus did a lot of healing miracles, but he did a lot of other things, too.
	He operated in the gift of prophecy, word of knowledge.
	He gave people prophetic words.
	He did a lot of deliverance.
	If you do physical healing enough and you pray for people who need physical healing, you're going to reach a point where you're going to start seeing certain conditions that are not going to be healed consistently.
	You'll pray for Soft tissue injuries, fractures, sprains, joint injuries, neck pain, back pain, injured knees, easiest thing in the world to do.
	A three-year-old can heal that kind of stuff.
	But start going after autoimmune conditions, gluten intolerance, post-traumatic stress disorder, things of that nature, even things like Lou Gehrig's disease and multiple sclerosis.
	Good luck with that because you're not going to get those people healed.
	I've tried, and I have a lot of friends who have tried.
	And if you do not learn how to incorporate emotional healing and deliverance, you're going to have a very limited ability to get people healed.
	They all go together.
	You have to learn.
	This is what the Lord has been really speaking to me about the last two years, especially, is teaching me emotional healing.
	So, that goes into simple things like depression and post-traumatic stress disorder and bipolar.
	But it also, of course, involves satanic ritual abuse and multiple personality disorder.
	My frustration in the whole realm of healing was, okay, great, I'm transporting all these people who have back pain, neck pain, arthritis, get them healed, no problem.
	I transported a lot of psychiatric patients.
	And I was frustrated because I didn't know how to get those people healed.
	Depression and bipolar.
	And PTSD.
	And so I had to ask the Lord, how do we do this?
	And he gave me some ideas on how to get people emotionally healed.
	And much to my surprise, when I started praying for people to get their emotionally healed, the physical healing that they had been seeking came along with it.
	So one of my first experiences, yeah, one of my first experiences with emotional healing was a woman.
	It's just, I love telling this story.
	I went to speak at a conference with my buddy, Steve Harmon.
	And this was up in Tacoma, Washington, a couple of years ago.
	So we're at the hotel.
	We're hanging out for a conference.
	And the woman who checked us into the hotel was asking me, you know, what are you doing?
	Who are you?
	And I told her, I said, I'm speaking at the conference.
	And she said, Oh, you're praying medic.
	And I said, yeah.
	She goes, Oh, that's great.
	You know, this is going to be a great conference.
	And she was a believer.
	So we talked a little bit and I gave her a copy of my book, Divine Healing Made Simple.
	So she hung on to it and then she put it in the back room behind the registration desk.
	And the woman came on at night to, who relieved her and worked the night shift.
	She found the book and started reading it.
	Got halfway through the book and realized, Oh my gosh, maybe this guy can get me healed.
	So she sends me a private message on Facebook.
	Lo and behold, she's the daughter of a woman who's been a friend of mine on Facebook for years.
	I didn't, never made the connection, but so she says, Oh, my mom loves you.
	She's read all your books.
	She says, you're so good.
	Can you please, you know, can now that you're here, you're staying in the hotel, can we set up a time for healing?
	So I said, sure.
	So my wife, Denise, and I set up a time for her to go through some healing prayer.
	Well, her story was she had been in four car accidents over the course of about three or four years.
	and had really severe chronic neck and back pain.
	And she had received prayer from a lot of people and couldn't get healed.
	And this has become a standard thing for me now.
	When I run into people who have received a lot of prayer for physical pain and they have not been healed, I don't even pray for them for physical healing until we first do some emotional healing.
	She almost did not come to the appointment.
	As she was driving there, the pain got so bad She said, I literally felt like my back was on fire.
	The pain was so bad.
	And I thought, I probably need to just not do this because the pain's getting worse and I can't really take this anymore.
	She was starting to freak out.
	And she went through with it and she met with us and took her through the emotional healing process.
	And what happened was she had emotional trauma from relationships.
	She had been in two abusive relationships.
	A husband who would punch her and scream at her was very physically violent to her.
	Either another husband or boyfriend who was very violent would punch her and beat her up.
	And then she had some abuse from her father.
	So I took her through this process of emotional healing and she had suffered a lot of anger.
	She had a lot of frustration and grief.
	Just took her through the process of emotional healing.
	When we were done, I said, Hey, how does your back feel?
	And she stood up.
	She looked at me and said, wow, that's pretty crazy.
	She goes, I only have a little bit of pain in my lower back.
	So I did a quick prayer over her lower back and all the pain was gone.
	I kept in touch with her months later that the pain never returned.
	The thing was, She was under the assumption that the pain was being caused by misalignment of the bones from the car accidents.
	It actually wasn't.
	It was all emotional trauma.
	And all we had to do was get rid of the emotional trauma.
	And boom!
	The physical symptoms of pain completely gone.
	I've seen that happen a lot.
	So, for the people who are only interested in physical healing, all I can tell you is you're going to be disappointed and you're going to be frustrated if you do not learn how to do emotional healing and deliverance.
	You're missing out on the full package of healing that God has provided for us.
	There's just people that you're not going to get healed if you don't learn how to do that.
	Deliverance is the next part of it.
	So what I have found is if you do emotional healing, if you heal the emotional trauma, most of the time you don't need to do deliverance.
	I rarely do deliverance.
	It's rarely necessary because once you heal the emotional trauma and get the soul wounds healed, those are actually the things that demons attach to.
	And if you get the emotional wounds healed, the demons have no more point of attachment, and they just leave.
	I'll be praying for people who will do this emotional healing process, and they'll say, wow, I just felt something leave me, something lifted, something like a dark presence just went away.
	No commanding, no screaming at the demons, the demons just leave once the emotional trauma is healed.
	I mean, there are times when you still have to do some deliverance, but physical healing, emotional healing, and deliverance have to be done together.
	That's just how it needs to happen in my experience.
	Now, going one step further, okay, what I found is the Lord started teaching me about the courts of heaven.
	You know, I've run into people that I've done prayer sessions with and couldn't get physical healing stuff, commanding pain to leave, wasn't working.
	I tried emotional healing, wasn't working.
	They had demons that were manifesting, and finally I was like, okay, I'm going to go to the court of heaven to see if we can figure out what's going on.
	Well, the court of heaven, the court of accusation is a better term for it, has been a really effective tool for a lot of people.
	After I started doing it a couple of times and I was surprised at the results, things get fixed very quickly after going to the court of accusation.
	You find out what The enemy has against you, you get it dealt with, you get it removed, and pretty soon, you know, that situation is resolved.
	The demon's gone, your finances are straightened out.
	There's a lot of different ways that can be used.
	I have hundreds of testimonies now from people who have read the books and or read my blog posts and just read the articles, did the process, and boom, got stuff straightened out right away.
	To the people who are just, healing is your thing, okay, If healing is your thing, healing is your thing.
	I'm just telling you that there is so much more out there that you can consider.
	I consider them tools in the tool belt.
	Physical healing is a tool that God has given us.
	Deliverance is a tool that God has given us.
	Emotional healing is another tool.
	It works on a different problem.
	I have seen a lot of people who have been healed in God's presence.
	I simply ask the Lord to bring his presence into the room.
	And boom, His presence shows up and they get healed.
	It's another tool.
	God's presence is another tool.
	The court of accusation is another tool.
	And so if you get into the supernatural lifestyle and you're trying one thing and it's not working, try something else.
	If that doesn't work, try something else.
	If that doesn't work, try something else.
	There's a lot of different tools that we have available to us and we need to start using them.
	I found the power of forgiveness can really make a difference, too.
	A friend of mine, Abbey Ableness, who runs Healing Tree, she went into the Middle East and taught, like, diplomats there about healing through forgiveness.
	And it just blew their mind because it's just a concept that isn't used very often anymore in that culture.
	But that forgiveness is another aspect of healing as well.
	So there is so much deeper than just praying for someone.
	Yep.
	Yeah.
	Forgiveness is big.
	I learned that lesson about six years ago when I went to the Spiritual Hunger Conference, which was hosted by the International Association of Healing Rooms.
	I had gone there with neck pain.
	I'd actually had a bunch of different things that I needed prayer for.
	At the end of one of the sessions, I don't know if Bill Johnson or Randy Clark, one of those guys was speaking.
	At the end of the session, I went forward.
	They had prayer teams there and I had neck pain.
	Woman is praying for me.
	She closes her eyes and she says, are you harboring anger toward anyone?
	She got a word of knowledge, right?
	So I closed my eyes and in my mind, I saw a picture of my wife's boss who I was very angry at for the way he was treating her.
	So I said, Well, actually yes, I am angry at someone.
	And so this woman says, well, the Lord says you need to forgive that person and let go of the anger.
	So I did.
	And she prayed a quick prayer and boom, my neck pain was completely gone.
	So, um, yeah, anger and forgiveness is, is, is big.
	Um, some people, uh, dismiss that.
	Some people make it like the biggest thing in the world.
	I think forgiveness is important, but obviously it's not the only thing.
	But if you harbor unforgiveness toward people, it poisons you, it makes you an unhappy person, it's not a good thing.
	So yeah, forgiveness is big.
	Well, and something I'm learning is that it comes with, when God heals the emotional trauma behind what happened, the forgiveness comes with that.
	If you're just trying to forgive without allowing God to deal with the emotions behind it, it's almost impossible to really get through that, you know?
	So, yeah.
	That is true.
	I have, in working with the people that I've done emotional healing with, many of them come to the table and say, I've forgiven everybody.
	I've repented of everything.
	I've gone through Sozo.
	I've renounced agreements.
	I've gone ahead generational work done.
	I've done everything in the world.
	I get this story from many of the people that I work with.
	They've been through all the rigmarole and the enemy is still kicking their can around.
	So what I generally do is I go through the sealing process where I have them think of a painful event in their life.
	They identify what emotion they're feeling.
	We have Jesus heal the emotion.
	Take the emotion, heal the wound.
	And then I have them recall the event again.
	And about half of the time, all of the emotional pain is dealt with right there.
	About the other half of the time, there are more emotions involved.
	So we go through the process again.
	We identify one emotion after another, after another, get them all healed.
	And what happens to the person is, When we're done, I ask them, well, how do you feel about that event?
	For some women, literally, they were raped and traumatized as children by their relatives, or physically abused, or emotionally abused by mothers.
	And they look at the event and they acknowledge, you know what?
	I don't feel any anger anymore.
	I don't feel any resentment.
	I don't feel shame.
	I don't feel guilt.
	It's all gone.
	And then I ask him, can you forgive that person now?
	And I think, yes, absolutely.
	I can forgive them.
	And they'll say, I thought I had forgiven them, but I still felt this anger.
	I still felt rage.
	I still felt like I wanted this person to suffer.
	I still felt all these emotions toward them.
	And they would say, I forgave them, but I still had the emotions.
	When you get the emotions healed, those emotions never come back.
	And it's very easy to walk in forgiveness and love and understanding toward that person after you go through the emotional healing.
	It's much easier to forgive them from your heart once the emotional wounds have been healed.
	Yeah, yeah.
	So good.
	Amen.
	So I guess you probably just answered this question, but Reuben Neal joins us and he was just asking about what are the three questions that you ask people to facilitate emotional healing?
	And I guess you would maybe say forgiveness.
	And what are the other top things that you address?
	I don't actually address forgiveness all that much when I do emotional healing.
	Now I have to actually articulate why that is.
	But I think, I think it just came to me.
	Okay, so this is a little bit different perspective than what you're going to hear from most people, but it's just, it's my experience.
	So what I do with people when I go through emotional healing is, like I said, I have them come up with an emotionally traumatic event from some time in their past.
	It doesn't matter where they start.
	Some people, you know, they say, well, I have so many, I can't pick one.
	And I just say, pick one.
	It doesn't matter where you start.
	Pick the worst one.
	Pick the easiest one.
	Remember, it doesn't really matter.
	Because what I'm what I'm trying to do is I'm just trying to give them one example of how this process works.
	And once they get one example under their belt, I give them another one and another one.
	And then I say, OK, do you see how simple this process is?
	You can do this yourself without my help.
	And you probably should.
	So how the process works is I have them just recall one memory of one event in their life that's painful when they think about it.
	It causes shame, anger, guilt, whatever emotion comes up.
	I have them recall the event.
	I'll give you a little bit of extra information here.
	So what I'm actually trying to do is I'm trying to trigger the alters and fragments to come up.
	And the way I do that is I learned this from a guy who he developed his own process for emotional healing after studying many different models of emotional healing.
	And doing this, he does it professionally.
	He charges like $200 a session to do emotional healing.
	This is all he does.
	He came and worked with my wife, Denise, and he taught a class and we took the class.
	I liked his approach, but I altered it.
	I changed it for what I do.
	But what he does is he has the person remember the event in as much detail as possible.
	He has them describe the event to him and then he repeats it back to them with the smells, the sights, the sounds, as much detail as possible.
	What you're trying to do is you're trying to trigger an altar or a fragment to come up and you're going to have them meet with Jesus.
	Now, when I explain the process and people are going through it, they don't understand that that's actually what's happening, but that is what's happening.
	By recalling the event, You're triggering the alter or fragment.
	You're having them come up and then you say, okay, what emotion are you feeling?
	And they name the emotion.
	It's anger.
	It's rage.
	It might be guilt or shame.
	They might feel, sometimes they feel three or four different emotions.
	So this, once I get them to identify what the emotion is, the next process is give it to Jesus.
	So I just say, look, tell Jesus, I want you to take this guilt, take the shame, take the anger from me.
	And so he does that.
	He meets with the altar or the fragment, takes the emotion from them.
	That's the first step.
	The second step is healing the wound.
	So the second step is I tell them, OK, tell Jesus you want him to heal the wound in your soul.
	So they say that.
	And what Jesus does is he heals the wound.
	in their soul caused by the trauma.
	And the third step, which is probably optional, as I just tell them, look, tell Jesus you receive his healing.
	And they say that, and then we go back, I go back through the, have them recall the event again.
	And many times, just going through this process one time, they'll recall the event and go, I don't feel anything.
	I can look at the event, I can recall it, and I don't have any emotion about it at all.
	Or many times what they'll say is they have peace, That is probably the most common thing I hear people say is, I just have a sense of peace about it.
	Like, it's something that happened, it just happened, it was what it was, and I don't feel any anger or shame or guilt about it anymore.
	So, that's kind of my emotional healing process.
	Now, this works really well for non-complex emotional trauma.
	Obviously, for people that have been through satanic ritual abuse, It is not going to get them completely healed in one session, but the principle of having the altars and fragments meet with Jesus and for the healing, that does work with satanic ritual abuse and multiple personalities, but it's generally a longer process, obviously.
	Can I just ask you a quick question that just popped in my head as we're going into the altars?
	Yep.
	Daniel Duvall said some stuff while you were interviewing, while he was interviewing you, that I was like, oh my gosh, you know, man, praying medic is just going to hang up the phone after that or say something to retort.
	and you just said amen and then you went off onto this other thing about like portals and alters and i was like what you just let him get away with that now there's a lot of weird stuff out there and one of the things that um daniel gets into with some of the sra victims that he deals with and did victims dissociative identity disorder people is Once they get healed and they get to meet Jesus and everything, they don't go away.
	And that's one thing that I kind of got creeped out when he interviewed a few of these people.
	I don't know if you've heard these interviews, but he actually like has those altars come on the show live and Some of these people, like, apparently they've even transformed into their altars physically.
	I mean, I can't say I totally, you know, I'm like, yeah, this actually happened, but, but yes, these people just frankly come out and say that, yeah, they, they work with their altars still and that their altars have met the Lord and all this stuff.
	This made me wonder and question, is there a system inside of us that God has enabled us to be able to deal with this whole altar system thing?
	I mean, Oh, absolutely.
	Yeah.
	And why would he do that?
	Yeah.
	Well, first of all, let me, other than my interview with Daniel Duvall and Steve Harmon's interview with Dan Duvall, I don't think I've heard any other messages from him.
	Those are the only two that I've heard.
	I don't listen to his podcast.
	I have read his book, Parallel Universes, Alternate Dimensions, something like that.
	Dan is, he's an academic.
	He's a, he's a brilliant man, very much a thinker.
	He's a rational personality type.
	And I can only take so much discussion with rational personality types.
	It's just, it's just how I'm built.
	I'm wired.
	I'm not a rational person.
	I am what on the Myers Briggs, I am what they call a guardian personality type.
	I'm wired differently.
	And so.
	Rationals tend to love theoretical discussions and high-level intelligent discussions.
	I can hang with those people for a while, but after a period of time, they exhaust me.
	I just get mentally worn down.
	I think what Dan is doing is great.
	He's training and encouraging and equipping a lot of people, pushing the envelope, running down the rabbit trail as far as that freaking thing will go.
	So true!
	He does!
	It's so good!
	But I have some different things that the Lord has been asking me to be involved in.
	So, what I will say is this, it's my understanding, and I'll be honest, Daniel Duvall has ten times or a hundred times more experience with satanic ritual abuse and DID than I have.
	He's much more experienced than I have.
	I don't have that much experience with it.
	My experience is mostly with simple emotional trauma, not multiple personalities and a lot of alters.
	I'm learning, I'm growing, but I don't have as much experience as he has.
	So I'm just going to throw that out there as a disclaimer.
	But I will say this, what I do know is it's my belief right now that emotional trauma is a spectrum.
	And if you look at emotional trauma as a spectrum, it will help you understand the different degrees of emotional trauma people suffer.
	There is very minor emotional trauma, the kind that we suffer every day when, you know, somebody calls us a name or somebody embarrasses us publicly, you know, at a restaurant in front of our family and friends.
	That those little things cause emotional trauma, but it's usually minor, although it's individual.
	If you're a young person, if you're a child, events that seem innocuous to anyone else can be severely traumatic to young people because they don't have the ability to rationalize the way adults do.
	So most of us have, I think, a lot of fragments in our soul, at least one or two alters.
	But that doesn't mean you have dissociative identity disorder.
	Because if you don't dissociate, you don't have dissociative identity disorder.
	Because by definition, DID means there are times when you just check out, and another personality takes over, and your core personality is not aware of what's happening.
	And someone else is driving the car down the road, and when it gets to the destination, you switch drivers, you have no idea where you are.
	So that's dissociative identity disorder, is when you have alters that come up and take over, and you have these periods where you have no memory of what happened, you have blackouts.
	That is at the other end of the spectrum of trauma.
	I recently found out that I have alters, but I don't dissociate.
	I've really never dissociated, as far as I know.
	I don't have that pattern in my history, but I know I have alters.
	And two of them have been healed.
	And working with a friend of mine, we identified, found some alters.
	The Lord had revealed them to me in dreams and got them healed.
	And my personality and my life and my joy has completely just been, it's been amazing since I went through that healing process.
	It makes such a difference.
	It makes a huge difference.
	Yeah.
	You know, we're learning about the process of emotional healing and we're learning about the systems.
	When you talk to people who have true dissociative identity disorder, they are generally aware of an inner world.
	I would strongly recommend people consider picking up the book, The Shining Man with Hurt Hands.
	You can get it free if you just Google it.
	It's a book that was written by a guy who has worked with multiple personality disorder survivors for years, and he did most of his healing online through chat rooms.
	He has some really good insights into the inner world.
	But what you'll find out is, for people that have true multiple personality disorder, or DID, they're aware of an inner world.
	They have an inner world where the alters and fragments live, Many times they can see it or perceive it through a door or a window or some kind of portal or opening.
	The core of the main personality can look into the inner world, see what the sky looks like, see different meadows and cities and buildings and dungeons and prisons.
	They can see the altars and fragments and they can identify them and they know who they are, they know what's going on.
	It's a fascinating subject, but I think One of the processes for healing people is to, you have to learn how to engage the alters and fragments in the inner world where they are.
	And you have to help them understand that Jesus is there.
	There's a river of life there.
	Most people who are aware of the inner world know that there's a body of water that goes through the inner world.
	Typically there's a There's a fountain or a waterfall somewhere inside the inner world.
	And when Jesus makes his appearance to the altars and fragments that live in the inner world, it's usually by that body of water near the fountain or the waterfall.
	This is just stuff that I've learned.
	Wow.
	And a lot of the strategy for healing multiples is to find the multiples that already know Jesus and are willing to cooperate with him.
	Get those altars and fragments.
	Armored up, get them trained, and get them communicating with Jesus and having Jesus give them strategies and plans for how to bring the other altars to Jesus so that Jesus can heal them.
	That seems to be a strategy that anyone can do.
	It doesn't take a whole lot of learning and experience.
	And from reading this book, The Shining Man with Hurt Hands, the pieces of the puzzle have been coming together for me.
	Big time, reading this book.
	Because I do a lot of my emotional healing online, through chat.
	I'm on Facebook or whatever, and I'm chatting with people, and I'm asking them questions.
	And this guy who wrote this book, he worked with a lot of multiples and got a lot of people healed, and he did it all through chat.
	He would just ask them about the conditions of the inner world.
	He would ask them about the river.
	He would ask them about Jesus.
	You know, do you see a shining man?
	A lot of times angels are involved in demons.
	Angels and demons are very prevalent in the inner world and how the alters and fragments interact with the angels and the demons and Jesus is a key to getting them healed.
	Go ahead, Susan.
	No, I was going to say, I actually, you were saying about how the altars actually helped to bring healing to the other altars.
	I recently had an experience with Matt going through some emotional healing, and it was where there was this eight-year-old child in me that was really dealing with anger, and Jesus came to this eight-year-old child and it was like some major demonic stuff going on that the anger just, she didn't even want to look at Jesus.
	But eventually he did heal her and in the process of healing this eight-year-old part of me, the anger went away and it was like rivers of like, almost like lava was how the anger looked.
	And when we did, there was this infant underneath this and Like Jesus actually asked the the eight-year-old to try to wake her up and um it was like through that eight-year-old he was able to then bring healing to her.
	So it's interesting how you're saying about it going from one altar to the other.
	It's um and like we always kind of talk about like parts instead of altars or fragments because i'm not sure um in what facet they are but it's just um It's interesting you're saying that, so yeah.
	Yeah, well, and Matt does use the term parts, and I think parts is a good word because it can be difficult to try to make the distinction between what is an altar and what is a fragment.
	Yeah.
	Some people have really clearly, you know, outlined definitions, but I don't know that those are valid.
	I think, again, I think altars and fragments are a spectrum.
	There are some There are altars that are very, very well-developed altars.
	They have favorites of everything, favorite colors, favorite books.
	They have names.
	They have a very distinct, clear personality.
	And there are other altars that are not as clearly defined and well-formed.
	And then right next to those, there are fragments that really don't have a unique personality, don't have a name.
	They just have a lot of memories.
	And where you start to make that delineation between an altar and a fragment is hard to do.
	So I think, yeah, Matt's approach of referring to them as parts is fine.
	I don't think there's anything wrong with that.
	But Michael, back to your question.
	It is pretty striking when you talk to people who have multiples and an altar comes up and begins to discuss and talk about what they're seeing and what's going on.
	And they have a very, very different perspective on life from the core of that personality.
	If you're not used to that sort of thing, that can freak you out.
	It is scary.
	Yeah and um I'm just I'm just being blown away by this and thinking yeah this is why I don't play video games anymore because this stuff beats any Dungeons & Dragons game.
	It actually reminds me a lot of the Dungeons & Dragons game that people play where they sit in a circle and they kind of imagine this this whole world and they go and they take different forms and roles and I've never played that game but It just has a lot of these the same elements and I'm wondering like, is this a new thing?
	Have you noticed?
	Was there anybody a hundred years ago talking about altars or any of this kind of inner healing?
	The system?
	That is a good question.
	You know, I haven't done much research into the history of emotional trauma and techniques for healing.
	I really don't know.
	I suspect that there are people who have used these techniques in the past, probably didn't write about them much, probably wasn't well-known, wasn't disseminated.
	It is becoming, obviously, a much more common topic to be discussed in the Church, particularly since psychology has really failed to be able to do anything with multiple personalities.
	And now that people like Um, Steve Harmon and Daniel and Matt and some other people have had some success, had some breakthrough.
	Uh, I think, you know, coming full circle back around to the, the, um, human trafficking and the pedophile rings.
	One of the things we have to be aware of is when the international pedophile rings are broken and the people are prosecuted, we're going to have hundreds of thousands, potentially millions of victims.
	who are going to be needing ministry, needing healing prayer, needing integration and healing.
	And so we have to train up a lot of people who are believers who can effectively minister to people who have been through sexual abuse, satanic ritual abuse.
	And we do not have that many people right now who are up to speed on that.
	That's one of the big concerns I have is we are behind the curve.
	We got to get up the curve pretty quickly and figure out how to do this as a group in large numbers.
	Yeah.
	I think the key is, you know, in the past it was always like praying from earth, like just doing earthly prayers and routines.
	But God wants us to be able to step into His presence and from there minister healing.
	I think there's so much more power to bring deliverance, whether it be healing physically or whatever.
	If we're able to connect to the Lord directly, to connect to Jesus, rather than trying to do it out of our own power or just from what we're hearing, we need to see and, you know, there's more to it.
	Yes, exactly.
	And this is where, oh, by the way, the man who wrote the book, The Shining Man with Hurt Hands, his name is Ellis Schofield.
	Oh, cool.
	When I put my podcast up, I'll put a link to the book in there.
	I said it's a free PDF download.
	You can get it on Amazon, but I think it's also available free online.
	Yes, praying for healing from the natural is not going to make this work.
	One of the things that Scofield talks about in his book, The Shining Man with Hurt Hands, is, now I will tell you this, read every book, eat the meat, spit out the bones.
	There are some things in, in Schofield's book that I think he would probably say, yeah, ignore that.
	What, when I said that, because he records his evolution in learning how to deal with multiple personalities over the period of about 10 years.
	And some of the things he did and said in the beginning were really stupid.
	And he acknowledges that, that, that those were bad ideas and things he shouldn't have done.
	But one of the things that was helpful to me is.
	Schofield says that DID and multiple personalities is not a psychological condition.
	You're, you're working with an inter dimensional realm.
	Wow.
	Okay.
	This is the inner world.
	Okay.
	And, and this is, this is what people have to understand rather than seeing DID and multiple personalities as As a condition, a psychological, psychiatric, or even a physiological condition in the mind, what you're working with is you're working with a spiritual realm with real spiritual beings that exist in a dimension that we can access through the supernatural.
	Because in the inner world of the person who's got multiples, there are angels and there are demons.
	And angels and demons are spirits.
	They're not mental constructs of our mind.
	They are spiritual beings that exist in a spiritual dimension.
	And so are the altars and fragments.
	They are real spiritual entities that are interacting and engaging in this realm in the spiritual world.
	And that is what we're dealing with when we talk about multiple personalities.
	And I believe Schofield is absolutely correct.
	I don't think this is a psychological condition, and you can tell that because medications don't work.
	You can take all the psychotropic meds you want, and it does not cure multiple personality disorder.
	This is a caveat.
	I never advise people to stop taking their medication.
	If a doctor has prescribed you medication, take it.
	Until the doctor says stop taking it or until the Lord clearly tells you that you don't need to be on this medication anymore I am NOT one of these people who says oh, you don't need to take your medication I'm not going to go there, but I will say this if you talk to people who have who have DID The consensus is that meds don't help all that much They may help stabilize Some of the mood swings they may help
	mitigate some of the severity of the symptoms, but no one gets healed or cured through taking medications, because it's an interdimensional realm.
	And so when Steve is going through this process, he's not simply saying prayers from the natural realm.
	It's not about that.
	It's about engaging the demons, engaging the angels, engaging Jesus, getting Jesus is taken and sometimes he runs into Lucifer.
	He has run into Satan a number of times and has had to go to the court of heaven and face Satan because of things that happened.
	And Steve is a really good example of how in the supernatural realm, in the spiritual realm, we can work with the altars and the fragments, all the spiritual entities, which is, you know, like I said, Schofield, I think nailed it when he said that this is, this is a, uh, We have to do this in this spiritual world.
	Here's a good example.
	When Schofield was starting to work with altars and fragments, he found out, now he's doing this all through chat, internet chat, and he'd be talking to a multiple.
	And he would say, can you see the river?
	And they would say, yeah.
	And he would say, okay, go down by the river.
	And the altar or fragment would go down by the river.
	And he would say, here's what I want you to do.
	I want you to, Look around for the Shining Man.
	Now, with multiples, many times they describe the beings that they see as shining beings, dark ones, things of that nature.
	There are different types of angels that appear in the inner world.
	They have different numbers of wings.
	If I remember correctly, Schofield said angels that bring revelation have one pair of wings.
	Warrior angels are generally larger.
	They have two pairs of wings and healing angels have three pairs of wings.
	And he said, you can, you can tell the type of angel that is there by the number of wings that it has.
	Don't quote me on that, but there's, that's the relationship.
	There's angels that have one, two and three pairs of wings and they all have different abilities and empowerment.
	So when you're in the inner world, he's on internet chat with people, he says, Do you see the river?
	Yes.
	Do you see any shining beings there?
	Yes.
	Do they have wings?
	Yes.
	How many wings do they have?
	Well, the one that I'm looking at has two pairs of wings.
	So he's like, okay, great.
	That's a warrior angel.
	That type of angel is there to get rid of demons.
	So, you know, if you see any demons, tell the angel to go attack the demons.
	And so he's interacting with these.
	He would tell the altars to go into the water.
	And some of them were afraid of the water.
	And he would say, no, no, don't be afraid of the water.
	Water's okay.
	It's not going to hurt you.
	And here, I'm going to give you a towel.
	I want you to take this towel with you.
	He would, in his spirit, he would speak a towel into existence, throw it at, toward the multiple and the multiple, the altar would, would feel a real towel and go down to the river, wash and wash themselves off.
	And then Jesus would put them in a different garment.
	This is what Steve Harmon does.
	When Steve started telling me these stories, I was like, dude, that's crazy.
	Steve, when he was working with altars, he would speak into existence a book for the altar to read.
	And Jesus told him how to do this.
	He said, just speak it into existence.
	So Steve would say, okay, I speak into existence a book about Jesus, hand it to the altar.
	And then a week later, Steve would come back and he would minister to that altar, the same altar and say, So, how is the book?
	And the altar would say, it's a great book, I love it, I learned so much about Jesus reading this book.
	This is a book that Steve spoke into existence in the spiritual realm.
	So, Schofield is doing the same thing.
	You can speak into existence any tool, any device, anything that the altars need for defense, you can speak it into existence, it becomes a reality in the spiritual world.
	They can feel it, they can sense it, they can read it, they can use it.
	Okay?
	If you start to think about what that means, because our words have creative power in the spiritual world.
	That's the key!
	Yes, it is!
	Oh my goodness, yay!
	You can speak things into existence in the spiritual world.
	I know a number of people who have done this, and it may sound crazy, but it's real.
	It is!
	Well, there's people in the chat I know that do this and take it really far, and I'm one of them, but I'm not really ready to go out and just publicize everything, but it's almost like taking the concept of declaring stuff and just applying it directly and literally.
	It is.
	It's exactly what it is.
	It's exactly what it is.
	When you're praying for somebody to be healed, okay, and this is, you know, something that the Lord showed me.
	He said, when you're praying for someone who needs a new kidney, all right, What you need to do is, you need to speak it into existence.
	You need to speak into existence a creative miracle.
	Your words have the power to create in the spiritual world.
	So you create a kidney by speaking it into existence, or a new eardrum, or whatever the person needs.
	That is how creative miracles are done.
	They're done in the spiritual world, but we speak them into existence.
	The realm of the spirit has different rules than the realm of the natural.
	And the supernatural realm, the spiritual realm, is superior.
	It's a dimension of higher authority, higher reality.
	Everything that is created that exists in the natural world was first spoken into existence in the spiritual world by God.
	God, living in the spiritual world, spoke the natural into existence.
	Our spirit in the spiritual world can speak things into existence in the natural and in the spiritual realm.
	We're all being blown away here.
	The chat room is blown up, too.
	We are!
	It's like, we're believing it into existence.
	Michelle is also believing a lot.
	Evil ones use the same principle for evil.
	I'm all about, like, taking the stuff that people are exposing about the devil and, you know, the devil did this, the devil did that.
	You know, Aleister Crowley, he said this and Jack Parsons and they might have very well opened some demon portal in the last 80 years.
	That may be the reason that we're having to deal with this stuff with updated weaponry.
	That's very possible.
	But, um, but yeah, but I think that we shouldn't give the devil all the credit for everything.
	No, we shouldn't give the devil all the credit for everything.
	That's for sure.
	But you know, you can look at the enemy and look at what the enemy is doing and kind of figure out how things work.
	If nothing else, they're looking at what the enemy is doing.
	So if you just simply look at what high-level witches do when they cast spells.
	Okay, what are they doing?
	They're speaking into existence what they believe and what they want to happen.
	That's essentially what spells do.
	They're harnessing power.
	They're harnessing energy and they're focusing it on their opponents.
	And they can speak death and sickness to people.
	Yeah.
	through their words.
	Yeah.
	And I think words.
	Well, I got news for you.
	We can do the same thing and speak life to people.
	Yes.
	You know, I mean, that's just the reality.
	Yeah.
	And I know, like, our words, even in what we write, like, for the time I spend time in heaven, I will write as I'm journeying because it helps me to focus.
	But I also find those words can change things.
	And even Tony out here on the chat, he's sharing about how he writes and that it's true.
	It's like words and, you know, it's like the word became life.
	It's like Jesus.
	But, you know, it's like there's such power in it.
	Well, Jesus said a lot of things about that.
	He said, you know the words that I speak they are spirit and they are life Mm-hmm, and Jesus is our role model Yeah, the words that we speak our spirit the words that we speak are Uh, can create life and they can cause death.
	Uh, life and death are in the power of the tongue.
	Yes.
	So, you know, people don't, a lot of times don't get what that, what those verses actually say.
	They're saying the words that you speak, you know, Jesus said, you know, about your words, you be very careful of speaking idle words and, uh, speaking words carelessly because the words that you speak, They have the power to create realities in the spiritual world.
	Blessings and cursings.
	Now I'm just going to say, I believe one of the reasons that your books are really important for everyone to read right now and your messages is that you're able to cover so many of these different angles of this and you're not obsessed with one thing.
	Like some people get completely into one thing and it's very much like God is showing us how to be responsible How to have two feet on the ground and yet still go into the spirit world and do all kinds of stuff.
	Yep.
	Yep.
	I have another comment, but I'll let you finish first.
	Oh yeah.
	No, go ahead.
	If you have another comment, cause I'm going to go off on a tangent here to answer one of the questions that we had at the beginning of the show.
	Go ahead.
	Go ahead with your comment.
	Um, I was just going to go into some of the stuff in your book, uh, as far as portals and teleportation and time travel.
	The next thing, it sounds like something out of Doctor Who.
	Let me first answer the question about, Human trafficking and the child sex crimes and how I think God wants to address that and how he wants us to pray for that stuff to be relieved.
	So, Michael, did you get all the way through my book and did you read the part on the divine counsel, the chapter?
	I believe so.
	I'm pretty sure I did.
	So it's the last chapter.
	The very last chapter.
	That's okay.
	That's okay.
	I listened to it.
	If you're not familiar with it, I'll just give you a really brief overview.
	So I wasn't planning on writing on the Divine Council in my book on Traveling in the Spirit.
	I had some revelation about it.
	I knew that it was discussed in the scriptures.
	I didn't have a testimony to share.
	I know Mike Parsons has been to the Divine Council, what he calls the Galactic Council.
	I believe Ian Clayton has been there.
	And I have another friend who's been there two or three times.
	Well, I got this testimony from a guy down in New Zealand who just randomly one day sent me this really long email outlining in detail his two visits to the Divine Council.
	The first time he went there, He was basically, he met with his angel who said, you've been summoned to the Divine Council.
	So he goes to the Divine Council and it's literally this big room full of apostles and prophets and some fallen angels.
	Jesus is there.
	And they're discussing all these different issues that are being taken up concerning affairs on earth.
	And in general, The Divine Council deliberates things that affect the nations.
	Wow.
	Okay?
	Yeah.
	So, he was hanging out there with Jeremiah, Zechariah, and Isaiah.
	Those are the three prophets that had been mentoring him for a long time.
	He had been going into the heavens and meeting with them and they had been mentoring him.
	So, they're there in the Divine Council.
	And Isaiah is actually giving him instructions, and says, look, you need to pay attention.
	Watch how these people present submissions to the Divine Council, because you're going to be asked to submit a request to the Divine Council in three days.
	And he says, don't get freaked out.
	I'm going to help you write your submission.
	So he watched the Divine Council, and then the angel took him back to his Basically, his house, his prayer chair, he's hanging out there.
	And the angel said, I'll be back for you in three days.
	So, Isaiah had told him, you need to create a written submission that the Divine Council can discuss and put into action.
	And Isaiah told him, look at these chapters in my book, in the Bible, and it'll give you some idea about what you, how you may want to write out your submission.
	So Isaiah gave him some, some advice and he came up with a submission and at midnight, three days later, boom, the angel showed up.
	Isaiah and Jeremiah and Zechariah were all there.
	The three of them, an angel, they all went back to the divine council.
	He got to present his submission before the divine council.
	It was a submission that involved two nations on earth that had been having a lot of demonic attacks against them and he presented a submission for deliberation and discussion.
	A fallen angel accused him of having selfish motives and having no validity to, no reason to bring this submission and countered all of his points.
	And actually it was kind of cool because the Holy Spirit was sitting right beside this guy and the Holy Spirit answered for him, answered the accusations that this fallen angel had brought out.
	So, the deliberation went on, and the Lord decided that He was going to act on that submission, and He sent angels into the earth to make it so.
	Wow!
	Now, when people ask me about this, the human trafficking that's going on on a global scale, they say, should we go to the court of heaven to have this taken care of?
	My answer is, where most people go to the court of heaven, they go to the court of accusation.
	So the court of accusation is a place where you have personal one-on-one harassment from demons and you have it dealt with there.
	The court of accusation is the lowest of all the courts and councils in heaven.
	It's good for one-on-one personal things.
	It's not an appropriate place to take cases that involve nations.
	There are many other courts and councils in heaven.
	There's the court of angels.
	If you need assistance on an assignment, on a mandate that you have from the Lord, you go to the court of angels and you can get angels who will help you enforce that.
	There's a court of chancellors.
	There's a court of war.
	There's a court of kings.
	And then there's a divine council.
	There are many different courts and councils in the heavens.
	And we have the ability to go and find them.
	And the courts and councils of heaven are all about The saints, us, learning how to administrate God's kingdom and operate in judicial authority from heaven on earth.
	Boom.
	Amen.
	All right.
	So I suspect one of the reasons why the Lord has had people writing books on the courts of heaven and the councils of heaven.
	Is because he wants us to go there because in order to deal with the junk that has been going on here in governments for years, we're probably going to need to take this up in the courts and councils of heaven to have it dealt with.
	I think first we need to get judgments and mandates accomplished in heaven and then we can affect them and work them out on earth.
	So can I ask you, like when you're saying about the courts of angels and that, I know like when we're in the court of accusations that there's times that He has us go to the court of angels to bring like a mandate or a scroll.
	Is it that like when God gives us a mandate directly that we can take it then to take it and take it to those courts to be dealt with?
	Is that kind of how that would work?
	I've taken things from the court of accusation into the court where the angels are.
	Some people now are of the understanding that you have to have a ruling from the court of accusation before you can go to the court of angels.
	I don't think that's the case.
	I think the court of angels is a place you can go whenever you need angels who can work with you on an assignment or a mandate.
	that you have from God, regardless of where you got it.
	I think, if I'm not mistaken, Mike Parsons was talking about he was doing some work in the Court of Chancellors, and from there went to the Court of Angels to get angelic help to work out what he was doing there.
	Yeah, I think the Court of Angels is probably an open venue where you can go in and get assistance whenever you need it.
	It's good that we're getting organization for this because I think a lot of people come to this stuff and they just sort of sweep prayer.
	Like, I mean, and probably there's a lot of angels and beings in heaven that are on multiple courts.
	Like let's say you're Abraham or David, you're probably not just sitting on one court, you know?
	Right.
	I mean, that's it.
	Uh, the, the saints, And the angels are rather busy doing stuff in heaven.
	And I don't think they're just hanging out in one court.
	I think there's a lot of different things going on.
	They have their hands on a lot of different pies.
	It's like, you know, like me.
	I don't just hang out here at my house and write books.
	I go to the grocery store.
	I go and do speaking events here and there.
	I do podcasts and I'm involved in a lot of different things.
	And I think, That type of activity is also in Heaven.
	I think we do, the saints and angels are involved in a lot of different things in Heaven.
	Yeah, even the children.
	You know, I've noticed it with my daughter.
	She's had multiple encounters in her dreams lately and she's out with Jesus doing things and interactive with Him and seeing children and it's like confirmation of what God's been showing me.
	And it's so neat, because I'm like, He can use even the children to bring change.
	So, it's cool.
	Oh, absolutely.
	Absolutely.
	That is, yeah, He's not limited, for sure.
	He's always looking for people that want to help what He's doing.
	And I think it is the pleasure of His heart to do amazing things through anyone who's willing to work with Him.
	Is there anything else that you'd like to bring up from your books?
	I'm glad that you brought up that last chapter and I can understand why you might put it at the very end, because at that point people will be like, okay, I'm not reading this guy anymore.
	Like, what's he talking about?
	Because you very carefully laid out a lot of examples, a ton of testimonies.
	I mean, you get through just the first one fourth of that book.
	And you feel like you have enough, you have enough prayer power and love faith to just start time traveling, like walk through walls, spirit leaving the body.
	And you're very meticulous and careful about how you describe spirit travel versus astral travel.
	I don't know if you want to touch on any of those, but.
	All right.
	So you want to start talking about that.
	Now let's talk about time travel portals.
	Uh, out of body travel.
	Is that, is that something you'd like to get into?
	I'm just like chomping at the bit for that kind of stuff.
	I mean, I know that most people don't talk with you about that and you have some great advice on so many fronts, but like that stuff is so cool.
	Oh my gosh.
	All right.
	Well, let me start out with, with one of my, my favorite testimonies.
	So when I was up in Tacoma at that conference and I was, uh, speaking with Steve Harmon, um, We had been, we were up there in Washington for a week, and I had recently moved here to Arizona, but most of my friends are still up there in Washington, and I miss them.
	And so we're up there at the hotel, and it had been, I don't know, three or four days had gone by, and I hadn't had a dream.
	And that's a little unusual for me.
	I usually have a dream at least every other night, and it had been three or four nights I hadn't had a dream.
	And I was concerned.
	I thought, what the heck?
	What happened to my dreams?
	Did I just leave my dreams at home?
	I mean, are the angels that bring my dreams, did they get lost on the way here or what happened?
	I don't know.
	I wasn't getting dreams.
	So I'm laying there on the bed in the hotel room and I kind of, in my mind, just asked the Holy Spirit, why am I not having dreams?
	And he said, why don't you speak a portal into existence?
	And I said, can I do that?
	And I think he said something like, well, go ahead and try it.
	So I basically was laying on my bed in the hotel room and I just said, I speak a portal of revelation into existence between this hotel room and heaven.
	And this portal is going to bring revelation and is going to bring the presence of God.
	It's going to bring angels into this bedroom.
	So, That was it.
	I just spoke it into existence and I believed that it was going to happen.
	So that night I had dreams all night long.
	I felt the presence of God in the room.
	I had dreams all night long.
	And one of the dreams that I had, I could, I've never had a dream like this before.
	In this dream, the Lord showed me friends of mine and their prayers.
	He showed me their prayers.
	And then he showed me in time, down the road, 10, 15, and 20 years down the road, how their prayers were answered and how they turned out.
	I could see the effects of all their prayers in time.
	It was one of the most amazing dreams I've ever had.
	And I had a number of other dreams that night.
	So I, from that experience, that stretched me.
	I had never thought about portals in that sense that you could actually speak a portal into existence.
	But evidently, you can.
	And evidently, I did.
	And I hope that the people who are staying in that room of the hotel continue to have cool dreams and stuff.
	But that was that was kind of my introduction to the whole portal thing.
	When I lived in Washington, it was kind of became an ongoing Almost like an inside joke with some people about the portal that was in our house.
	I had never sensed the portal myself, but we had a lot of, a fair number of visits from angels.
	Jesus made a few visitations there.
	People would come to our house and we'd hang out, we'd have barbecue, you know, and stuff.
	And inevitably a person would walk over to me and go, so how long has that portal been there in the middle of your living room?
	I have no idea, but you're the third person that's told me about that in the last two years.
	People who didn't know anything about this would come to our house and say, so what's the deal with that portal?
	What do you guys use it for?
	Those types of things are what started to make me aware that portals are much more of a reality than we think and realize.
	We have the ability to open portals, I believe.
	I was having a discussion there in Tacoma at the conference.
	I was discussing with some students who were in a school.
	about what my wife does, because they all think, oh, you know, your husband writes books and he does the teaching and what do you do?
	And Denise is like, I don't even know what I do.
	I don't feel like I have a particular gift for healing.
	I don't really prophesy all that well.
	I'm not sure what I do.
	And the Lord told me, well, what she does is she prays in tongues like all the time.
	When I'm praying for someone to be healed, Denise is beside me praying in tongues.
	The Lord said, She opens portals.
	And I was like, what?
	And he goes, what do you think she's doing when she's praying in tongues?
	So I was like, you mean her praying in tongues opens portals?
	And he said, the revelation that you receive and the people receive in words of knowledge, the gold dust, the glory, the presence, the angels, the revelation all comes through portals.
	And it's your wife and people like her praying in tongues who are opening the portals.
	He's like, wow, that blows me away.
	So, you know, it's really funny because the people on the platform who get the words of knowledge and they manifest the gold dust and the glory and the gemstones, they kind of think like they have the anointing, but what many of them are not aware of is actually the people around them that are making all that possible.
	So, yeah.
	I think portals are a fascinating subject.
	In honesty, I don't know all that much about them, but the Lord has been teaching me about portals.
	And I think we have the ability to open them at will.
	I think we have the ability to speak them into existence.
	I think we have the ability to travel through them, to bring revelation.
	They bring glory.
	They bring manifestations of the kingdom.
	Gold dust, gemstones, all that stuff.
	I think those all come through portals.
	It's a very interesting subject to me.
	Do you have any specific questions about that?
	Basically, besides having fun at church and, you know, we see gemstones and I've heard both fake stories and legit stories about those, so I'm a believer.
	Right, right.
	I don't believe all the stories about that, but as far as like, okay, how do we practically use this stuff?
	Because let's say I want to talk to Ian Clayton, which when I first started listening to him, my sister gave me a like two gigabyte file of Ian Clayton stuff.
	I'm like, who's this?
	And he belted out stuff that confirmed all the weirdest supernatural things that I've been studying with my controversial mission group, the Children of God, Family International people, for years.
	And I thought, okay, either I'm crazy or maybe some of this stuff is real.
	But Ian Clayton was the first guy to Actually be doing it and preaching it in a church.
	And I was like, my gosh, these people are going to rip this guy in millions of pieces.
	And they weren't.
	They were just all laughing and giggling in the background.
	I was annoyed with those churches.
	I was like, Ian Clayton needs to get out of those churches and come to the internet and start talking on the fringe.
	And since then I've emailed him and he wants to do an interview.
	But I had a chance to talk to him in the spirit before I met him in the physical and I met him here in Taiwan basically on the street after listening to Mike Parsons all morning and all night the day before.
	I'm not kidding.
	This is not made up.
	You can ask him.
	And I didn't understand why.
	I didn't understand why, but he gave me the secret code to be able to email him.
	Which I did, and he didn't email me back.
	So I was like, what was that for?
	Well, a couple years later, we had this podcast, and it's gaining some momentum, and I was thinking, my gosh, we need to talk to Ian Clayton.
	But how am I going to get in touch with him?
	Hold on, I met him on the street, he gave me the code, I can message him!
	So I sent him a message with, you know, interview request, and he writes me back, he's like, we'll talk, you know, at the end of the month, let's do it.
	So, I was thinking about that, like, I first talked to him in the spirit, I have this stuff all on record, like, meeting him in some court of I don't know whatever I mean some of these things I don't even I have the time feel like I'm making it up when I do it I'm just going to be honest with you then I go back and I read my files and I realize this stuff is actually working it's actually doing stuff so I guess practically my question is And sorry to go on a ramble, but what is the practical way that we can apply this?
	And is it just a matter of doing it?
	Like my friend Tony Floyd, he'll just sit down and he'll write every vision that comes into his mind.
	And some of it gets confirmed across dreams other people get.
	I got a vision with him.
	Is it just a matter of doing that?
	You're very humble about saying you don't know much about this, but you are a teacher on this.
	You are one of the bridges for the mainstream church to start finding out about this stuff.
	So what do you suggest for somebody that's getting into this stuff as a newbie or a not-so-newbie?
	How to do it?
	And should we be praying, you know, for nations to be changed?
	Should we be praying just for individuals?
	Is it presumptuous to take these huge matters into our own hands in our prayers?
	You know, like, I guess, have you made any head or tails of how to practically go about this in our busy lives?
	And you can interject.
	Well, I would first recommend to people, if you want to Just be able to take the mystical realms of heaven and those really cool supernatural experiences and apply them in a practical way.
	Start listening to Mike Parsons.
	Michael, you're very wise to listen to Mike Parsons.
	I recently enrolled myself in his online Engaging God series, and I think it costs like $6 a month to be enrolled in that.
	And you get the MP3s and the videos and access to a lot of teachings.
	Mike, for my money, I like Ian Clayton.
	Ian is an amazing forerunner and he's taught me so much.
	He has had some amazing experiences, some great breakthrough.
	When it comes to the subject of translocation and traveling in the spirit, Ian is without equal.
	He's just a dynamic speaker.
	Some people have a hard time with him because he has a lot of... You have to get to understand Ian's lingo and all the terminology and stuff and get the CD.
	That's his keyword!
	Right.
	But the thing that I like about Mike Parsons is Ian is a great forerunner, has a lot of great experiences.
	But is a little bit difficult to follow because he's not necessarily very structured in his approach to teaching.
	Mike Parsons is very structured in his approach to teaching.
	So if you get into Mike's class, and for my podcast people, I'm going to leave a link.
	If you get into Mike's class, it's an online learning platform.
	There's videos, there's outlines, there's notes, there's PDF documents you can download, there's MP3s you can download.
	Mike has taken his Engaging God series, and I think it's six different modules with many different lessons in them, and it's all organized, you know, module one, module two, module three, module four, start out with some theoretical stuff, start out with Mike's experiences, and then he gets into, you know, where the rubber meets the road.
	When you engage God, when you go into the spiritual world, when you are meeting with The seven spirits of God, and when you're meeting with all these different beings, how do you take this stuff and apply it practically in your life?
	How do you use it to get other people healed?
	How do you use it to speak prophetically about someone else's destiny?
	How do you use it?
	Eventually, what it does is it builds into this understanding, which both Ian and Mike teach, which is Get a bench of three, and then a bench of seven, and you start doing judicial and legislative governmental work in the heavens.
	That's kind of the end goal.
	The end game is for us to be operating in the courts and councils of heaven doing legislative work, and all of that stuff changes things here, the situations here on Earth.
	But, of course, there still are some things we need to do here in the natural.
	Like you need to, you know, if you're interested in human trafficking and shutting that stuff down, you need to get involved in writing some articles, maybe doing some videos, teaching people about the realities of human trafficking and educating the church about what that stuff is all about so that they then start praying into it.
	So they start taking this seriously.
	So they are laboring with you in stopping the human trafficking.
	That's what I'm, that's what I'm trying to do right now is my, operation in the realm of the natural world is creating podcasts and articles that are educating people about the problem of human trafficking, the problem of government corruption, and to get what the Lord has clearly shown me is wake people up, make them aware of the problem, and get them praying that the darkness would be exposed.
	So those are kind of my three things right now is in the natural is Wake people up, make them aware, and get them praying for darkness to be exposed.
	I don't have much in the way of assignments past that right now, but each person will get assignments that are unique to them, that are tailored to their skill set and their gifting.
	Well, and I think you've done that, David, because, you know, when you started to share was when it was like, I didn't have a choice.
	God, in my time with Him, began to show me stuff.
	And I think what happens is it puts that compassion on people's hearts to see a change happen.
	And out of that, God uses that to bring more people in.
	So, you're doing it!
	Well, that's cool.
	So, Michael, does that kind of answer your question?
	It absolutely does.
	Yeah, it's very much like an all-hands-on-deck situation right now.
	We need Harvesters, and we need them yesterday.
	We need them months ago.
	Yeah, that's for sure.
	I hope that more people will stand up and get training.
	They can, like you said, they can go listen to Mike Parsons.
	They can get trained.
	It's very much like everybody has their own job.
	Ian Clayton yells his head off and brings attention to this stuff.
	And it's great, and my dream has been to get people like you, people like Ian, people like Mike, get that info into the new age spectrum too.
	And this show's going into new age dimensions now with people that have witches on their show.
	Not because I want to work with witches, but I want to get their audiences to know the name Ian Clayton, to know this guy was a former warlock.
	Now he's kind of leading the mystic troop in some ways to teachers like you and teachers like Mike, you know, and, um, we can be ready.
	We're, we're kind of like new bottles ready for the next revelation, you know, and with discernment to not just, you know, listen to any old thing that anybody says, but, uh, You know, we're very much on a journey here.
	It's very much like like some deep space operation.
	And it absolutely is.
	Yeah, it absolutely is.
	We're on an adventure.
	We're on a journey.
	There's a war and everybody is on is fighting on one side of the of the battle or the other, whether they know it or not.
	You're either you're either a warrior on one side of the battle or you're a prisoner.
	Once you get freed and you realize you're not a prisoner anymore, then you have to become a warrior.
	For one side or the other.
	My thing is I used to be an atheist.
	I didn't believe in any of this junk.
	And then I took the red pill.
	Yes!
	Once you take the red pill, there's no going back.
	I think a lot of people need to take the red pill.
	And they need to have their eyes opened and they need to start considering the realities of spiritual warfare, the realities of the kingdom of darkness and the kingdom of light.
	They need to consider the realities of what the enemy is doing.
	You don't have to go too far down the rabbit hole with the satanic cults in the governments in Europe, and the things that are going on there, and the things that are going on in our own government, to realize that the powers of darkness, the kingdom of darkness, has a very real power structure in government and business.
	And that has to be addressed.
	That has to be battled, and it has to be taken down.
	And we're the ones that are going to do it.
	If we don't do it, it's never going to happen.
	Amen.
	And it's fun to battle evil.
	I don't know why people are so afraid.
	They're like, no, don't talk about negative.
	I mean, it's fun to go and, and you know, you watch these movies with the heroes that go into the dungeons and save the children.
	I mean, that's what we're doing.
	I mean, isn't this like the things that people watch on TV all day and they just, you know, they're bored with life.
	Like guess what?
	You watch, you watch NCIS and you watch all these TV shows and go to watch these movies about all this crazy kingdom of darkness, kingdom of light things, even, you know, Tolkien and C.S.
	Lewis and the Narnia tales.
	It's all talking about it.
	It all illustrates realities of the kingdom of darkness and light.
	And how do you walk away from that stuff shaking your head going, no, this stuff isn't happening?
	Well, and I think that's the key, too, because, you know, I have people in my family that are very much into the New Age.
	And when they started to read my articles, they were like, We've never heard of someone that was so evangelical becoming a mystic Christian, or a mystic, and it was, like, baffling to them that I could still believe that Jesus, you know, is the one who saves us, but yet be, like, traveling in the Spirit.
	And, you know, I think that's the key, is who are you serving?
	Who are you serving, and where is your focus?
	And, you know, I've I've learned through the years, it's not as much about trying to correct their way of thinking as much as it is directing them to Jesus in my journey, just sharing what Jesus has taught me, what Jesus is doing when I'm in Heaven with Him, when I'm experiencing Him.
	And out of that, it draws – my prayer is that it draws them to Him, rather than saying, You know, I have someone in my family that does Reiki.
	Reiki?
	Energy healing?
	Yes!
	Yeah, and it's like, so much of the Church is very much against this and, you know, some of the things that they're doing, but I realize this stuff is very real.
	It's just, who's your attention on?
	Yeah.
	Well, and, you know, I wrote this article a long time ago, but I just I published it out again on my Facebook page.
	It's a story about how my EMT partner that I had worked with for two and a half or three years, how he came to know the power of God as a reality for him, a personal reality, without me ever evangelizing him or asking him to say the sinner's prayer.
	I never had to convict him.
	He was a sinner.
	All I did was I demonstrated the supernatural.
	He was a fairly accident-prone guy with big feet and he tripped a lot and he was always injuring his knees and ankles and back.
	He got healed probably a dozen times in the two and a half or three years that I worked with him.
	He would always come into work and he'd be, you know, I remember one time he asked me about our disability program.
	I said, why do you want to know about disability?
	He goes, because I think I blew out a disc in my back.
	Well, why don't we just get you healed?
	So I prayed over him and his back gets healed.
	He's up walking around.
	We transport a 300 pound patient later that day.
	He has no pain at all in his back whatsoever.
	The article that I wrote was about how I taught him personally by just by setting an example for him to follow about sticking coins to the wall.
	I got kind of turned on with some friends years ago who were big on sticking coins to the wall.
	You just ask the Lord to bring his presence and you ask him to hold on to the coin and you wait, you hold the coin against the wall until you feel a pull against the coin and then you let go and it stays there.
	While I had been doing this in the emergency department, in the break room between calls, I would take dimes and pennies and nickels and stick them to the wall And the Holy Spirit would just hold him on there, and guys would be looking at me like, what in the heck are you doing?
	So I was basically just doing little demonstrations of the miraculous for these guys.
	And one day, my EMT was there, and as I left the room, I pulled a dime out, I stuck it up on the wall, I think it was actually on the door jamb, and said, hey, I'll see you out in the ambulance, and left.
	He's looking at the dime sticking there on the door jamb, and he goes, Son of a... He goes, how do you do this stuff?
	I said, it's my work out, man.
	So, a couple of days later, I went, we were at the station, and I went outside to pull our ambulance into the parking spot.
	My partner was inside in the break room, and I was getting the ambulance put away and taking all the gear out, and I come inside to clock out at the end of my shift, and there's two pennies stuck to the wooden door of our break room.
	I looked at my partner and I said, uh, I'm guessing that was you.
	He goes, yup.
	He has this big smile on his face.
	I said, oh, so you want to tell me how that happened?
	He goes, well, he goes, I've been watching you.
	And he says, I tried like 10 or 11 times to get these coins to stick to the door, but I didn't ask God to do it.
	And I couldn't get the coins to stick to the, to the door.
	He goes, the first time, I put the coin up there and I said, okay God, I'm going to ask you to stick this to the door.
	He pulled his fingers away and both of the coins stuck to the door and they stayed there.
	So my EMT gets introduced to the power of God.
	Basically what I did was I provoked him to jealousy.
	I showed him the reality of God's power, that God's power could do stuff that nobody else could do.
	And he got jealous.
	He was like, man, he goes, if he can do this, I can do this.
	I'm going to try it.
	And he tried it, and it worked.
	So I've done it with my kids.
	When my children were young, the first time I showed my daughter the sticking the coin to the wall trick, I took my daughter to a friend's house.
	As we were leaving, I stuck the penny to the wall.
	She saw it.
	She's like, Dad, what are you doing?
	I said, it's power of God.
	Just ask God to hold the Coin on the wall.
	And we went home.
	So I hear, two days later, she taught her brother, her twin brother, how to do it.
	And my son spent the next day sticking quarters to the ceiling in his bedroom.
	I want to try that now.
	So what I've found is, as far as reaching people who are, you know, unbelievers, I love the supernatural.
	I love the manifestations of the Holy Spirit.
	I love the fact that you can just do those demonstrations.
	I have argued with my EMT partners for 8, 10, 12 hours, the whole shift, talking about evolution and creation and trying to take them down the Roman's road and trying to evangelize them and all this other stuff.
	I did that for years.
	Never got one person to be interested in Jesus.
	But I'll tell you, you demonstrate the power of God.
	You pretty much have the microphone.
	You do not have to do a whole lot of work.
	They will start asking you questions.
	That's kind of been my experience.
	Beautiful.
	So good.
	I know your time is very precious, and I know you probably have a lot of things on your schedule, but I just wanted to add to that, that it kind of takes off the responsibility from us to try to run around and fix everything, and kind of just enjoy and look forward to seeing what God's going to do next, because He can do anything, you know?
	And I still pass out tracts, you know?
	I live in Taiwan.
	We're working missionaries, and I respect people who Get souls in that old-fashioned way, but, you know, these Taiwanese, they're hard to reach, and I get blown away, like, time after time.
	You know, I feel like a lazy missionary.
	I'm, you know, not doing much, and then suddenly somebody comes up to me, they're like, I had a dream, and Jesus came into my dream, and I think he wants me to follow him.
	Could you tell me what to do?
	I'm like, alright!
	And that's how it's working out with this internet stuff, too.
	Like, you're a great example of that.
	You reach out to people all the time.
	You're so available.
	on Facebook it's it's insane how you do that and that's probably something that that you've actually convicted me on that because I always look down on on the social networking thing and it's actually huge it's huge and you know we could all hate Facebook and hate the you know the New World Order that runs it But just to love the people that are there and to try to reach out to people and be ready to minister to people.
	Well, you could argue that social media got Trump in the White House.
	Oh, yeah.
	You know, his live videos that he did, you know, he'd have 50, 60, 70, 80,000 people watching his videos live on Facebook.
	He leveraged, even though social media can be kind of, it's controlled and They control everything, they are creating data files on everybody and eavesdropping on you and doing all kinds of nefarious junk.
	That's all true.
	But I learned a long time ago, I don't put anything on Facebook that I don't want everyone in the world to know about.
	I just assumed that Facebook is gathering all my data and I don't put anything private that I don't want Zuckerberg and the NSA to know about.
	I had an anonymous profile, and I keep it pretty much focused on Kingdom stuff, prayer, teaching, the supernatural.
	You know, if the NSA wants to learn about how to heal people, and how to hear God's voice, hey, have at it!
	Maybe somebody in the CIA is going to get saved by monitoring my stuff on Facebook!
	I really do kind of enjoy being on Facebook.
	I've recently been more active on Twitter because that seems to be where the child trafficking stuff has been taken hold a lot more.
	And the Lord specifically gave me a lot of dreams about Twitter and reaching people.
	He gives me very specific strategies about social media.
	He gives me specific strategies about how to market my books when I put out a book.
	He'll tell me in dreams how to market, what promotions to run, How much money to spend on different ads and stuff.
	I mean, he gives me very detailed things about how to reach people on which social media platform.
	You know, focus on this one and not that one.
	So, I think if you're looking for ways to reach people, he'll use many different ways.
	I mean, I think what you're doing is great.
	Pass out tracks.
	There's nothing wrong with passing out tracks.
	Use that, but also be open to healing people.
	Be open to sticking coins to the wall be open to interpreting dreams be open to giving people words of knowledge and prophesying their destiny and Be open to whatever however God wants to reach people Amen good word brother.
	Amen We're just getting warmed up here too.
	There's gonna be new technology coming down the road.
	It's gonna change things again So we need to get on board.
	Yeah.
	Yeah, there's always always new stuff coming down the road and you know like Unfortunately for a lot of people who are believers, if you have a negative end times view, where you think everything is all about the Antichrist and everything is about, you know, we're going to go through the Tribulation and the world is coming to an end and the New World Order is going to take over.
	Well, I've got news for you.
	Everything that the enemy is developing or using or manipulating or whatever, God is also able to use that to his advantage.
	You know, even though a lot of people say, well, you know, social media is all controlled by, you know, the Antichrist spirit.
	Well, I got news for you.
	There's a lot of people getting saved and getting trained, educated, and equipped on social media.
	God can use anything that the enemy can use, God can use.
	Yes.
	So we don't need to be afraid of the new things that are coming out.
	We need to be wise, and we need to be shrewd, and we need to discern how is the enemy using this, and then discern how is God going to use it.
	Amen.
	I'm excited with what he's going to do with VR.
	Yeah, no joke, dude.
	That is going to be seriously interesting.
	As much as you know that the enemy is going to have some kind of his fingers on that, I know God's going to have his fingers in it too.
	I guess we just have to be not-so-easily-offendable, triggly puffs, social media justice warriors, and take this battle of spiritual warfare on the internet into the enemy's face.
	I think that if just a bunch of us do what you're doing, that we're going to take over the whole world right through people's phones, just like Trump did.
	And we're not in a contest with each other.
	I think one of the things that you've really shown is that a rising tide lifts all boats.
	And by encouraging and uplifting others, encouraging other people to become writers, podcasters, that you are essentially creating like millions more problems for the enemy than what the typical person does.
	They think shooting other people down is going to promote their own thing.
	Not true.
	Yeah.
	I absolutely believe that the best strategy is to get as many people out there creating YouTube videos as we can.
	Get as many people out there doing Skype healing, as many people out there as we can who are writing and blogging.
	Look, the reality is the mainstream media is dead.
	They brought about their own demise, they became corrupt, they allowed themselves to get in bed with politicians and take a lot of money, and they have lost their credibility with the public.
	What is going to replace the mainstream media is everyday average people like you and me, who are out there doing our podcasts, doing YouTube videos, writing blogs, writing books.
	The new media is us, and we are going to have a huge voice in the world, because people just don't really trust the mainstream media.
	A lot of the big mainstream media, they're going to go bankrupt.
	The New York Times will probably end up being sold again.
	I think a lot of mainstream media news is going to die financially.
	I think, if I'm not mistaken, the New York Times lost like 90% of their readership and financially they're not doing well.
	A lot of other news outlets are not doing well.
	ESPN has lost a lot of following because they have really not treated conservatives very well.
	A lot of the obvious liberal agenda and attacking people who are conservatives in the mainstream media has backfired.
	It's going to be very difficult for the mainstream media to recoup from that.
	It looks like they're doubling down on their policy and they're going to continue to go in the direction they've gone in that has already kind of ruined them.
	So it's time for people like us to rise up and We need to learn how to be good journalists.
	We need to do good investigative journalism.
	We need to learn how to write.
	Susan, I'm gonna give you some advice.
	Yeah.
	I recently installed on my Chrome browser an extension called Grammarly.
	Yes.
	And I'll tell you what, I have learned so much about punctuation, grammar, and spelling.
	When I'm writing my blog posts, I get all these little things saying, Missed a comma here.
	Need a comma there.
	You have two periods.
	Are you confusing this word for that word?
	One of the things that has kind of disappointed me with people in the new media, our friends and other believers, is we have a lot of passion to report on what's going on and what God is doing, but we have yet to develop the skill set to make it credible.
	The New York Times piece that came out on Pizzagate this morning What they were able to do was, they were able to take some of the errors that people had made who had been investigating Pizzagate, and they held these errors up and said, well, they said that President Obama was playing ping-pong in the basement of Comet Pizza.
	Well, this picture that they say was actually taken in the White House, not in the basement of ping-pong Comet Pizza.
	Some people had propagated this myth without actually checking into it.
	And they reported it as fact, and all the New York Times had to do was say, well, this is misinformation, this is fake news.
	So by not doing their homework and not doing the best job that they could, they discredited themselves.
	And one of the things that I do when I publish blog posts and podcasts is I do a ton of research.
	And I research and I research, and I double-check my facts, and I, before I hit the publish button, I go through and check the grammar and the spelling and check the punctuation and make sure that everything... Look, Susan, you're new.
	You're new.
	If you read the blog post that I wrote in 2009, you would laugh your butt off.
	It was so bad.
	But I've been writing now for, you know, six or seven years, and I have two editors, my wife and an actual editor that I pay when I write my books.
	And they clean up all my bad grammar.
	They clean up when I get on my high horse and I start preaching at people and I get an attitude.
	They're the first ones to say, OK, you need to soften your tone on this.
	You're coming across a little high and mighty on this.
	All of that is to say that we are going to be the new media, but we have got to bring our game up to the level of those at least be better than the ones we're replacing.
	Because one of the things that the establishment media is being criticized for is their bias, their lack of objectivity, and many times their erroneous conclusions that they come to.
	If you fact check a lot of their news articles you can find out that they reported things incorrectly.
	Well if they can point at us and say you guys are reporting things incorrectly making wrong associations or have errors in what we're saying we're no better than them and so I'm gonna probably get on Periscope this afternoon and do a little thing for the Pizzagate investigators and ask them to try to step up their game a little bit so that you don't give your your opponents such an easy opportunity
	yes to discredit all of you because yes if night Because if 95% of your work is good, 5% of it is absolute nonsense, your enemy is going to take the 5%, hold it up to the world and go, these people don't know what they're talking about.
	So anyway, I'll get off my platform, but that's a little rant that I wanted to get out.
	We need to hear it, though.
	We really do!
	And that's why I've appreciated you, because I think, you know, you've encouraged me, as a new writer, to step it up, but not to be discouraged, either, when things kind of go poorly.
	You're doing good, but I'll tell you this.
	I'm just going to say this.
	Before I published some of my blog posts on my website, I had one article that I published back in September, end of September, that I did over a hundred revisions on it before I published it.
	Yeah.
	I spent an entire weekend going through, rewriting, rephrasing, making sure the punctuation, spelling, and grammar was correct, because I had a feeling this post was going to go viral, and if it went viral, I didn't want it to be a piece of junk.
	Susan, you have some amazing revelation that people want to and need to hear.
	But, you know, you're like everybody.
	We're all learning.
	We're all getting better.
	Grammarly has helped me a lot, and I think it might help you if you install it.
	Although it does get annoying sometimes.
	I'll say that when I'm on Facebook and I'm trying to put in comments.
	And everything I write is underlined in red.
	You're killing me, Smalls!
	Yeah, I think I just, I need to slow down sometimes and, like you said, review it over and over again, not just one time.
	Because sometimes, you know, I've limited my time, but if it takes me two weeks to get it out, then so be it.
	You're a mom, right?
	And so you only have so much time.
	Yes, yes.
	My kids are grown, and my profession is writing, so I can spend two or three days writing a single blog post if I want to.
	I don't really have a whole lot of demands on my time.
	I think what you're doing is really inspiring, and I love looking forward to what you're writing.
	Thank you.
	I appreciate it.
	So, Michael?
	Yes, sir.
	Thank you very much.
	Thank you so much for your time.
	Say some declaration portal opening words of blessing over your periscope today.
	And I hope we didn't, like, take all of your thunder this morning.
	I mean, I know you could probably belt off for just... I've seen you teach.
	You have a five-hour, like, video of teaching that you've... Marathons.
	That's available.
	And just... I don't go on video teaching very often, but when I do, I figure I gotta make it worthwhile.
	It's been great talking to you guys.
	We'll have to do it again.
	Oh, thank you David.
	Bless you.
	Love you lots.
	Well, folks, that is our show for today.
	I hope you enjoyed it.
	Thanks for dropping by.
	If you're new to the podcast and you haven't been to my website, you might drop by and check out the articles I have there.
	If you have any questions or comments about the show, you can contact me at admin at prayingmedic.com.
	That's A-D-M-I-N at prayingmedic.com.
	You can also contact me on Facebook and Twitter.
	I'd like to thank you again for dropping by.

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