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Nov. 21, 2016 - Praying Medic

01:32:31

065 Shae Bynes - Child Trafficking and Entrepreneurism

Shae Bynes and I have developed a free style of conversation over the years and we talk about whatever is on our minds. In the first half of the message we discuss child trafficking and then my most recent books. In the second half, we discuss the books she'll release next year, how to find your unique business model, and the different tax-exempt options for ministries and non-profits. Resources Helping Hand Outreach - 508(c)(1)(a) The Kingdom Driven Entrepreneur Podcast Defeating Your Adversary in the Court of Heaven Traveling in the Spirit Made Simple

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	Hi, I'd like to welcome you to our show.
	I'm your host, Prang Medic.
	We're talking about life as a child of God and all things related to His Kingdom.
	Thanks for joining us.
	If you're a new listener to the show, you can find articles and books and other resources on my website www.prangmedic.com.
	Now let's jump into this week's show.
	Sleep when I'm done.
	My brain is just screaming.
	I process a lot.
	I try to get myself to go back to sleep but it doesn't always happen.
	So do you keep a notebook by your bed?
	Not a notebook.
	3x5 cards.
	Index cards.
	I just have a pile of them.
	When I have dreams I just write them down.
	I'm supposed to, about every three months, transcribe them into a Word document, so I have a file.
	I'm way behind.
	I haven't done that in a long time.
	So you have a pile of index cards about this big?
	Yeah, it's a big pile.
	I don't think I've transcribed anything into my journal in probably a year.
	Oh wow, so yeah, you've got quite a bit going on.
	Yeah, for sure.
	Very good.
	So yeah, I had a dream.
	I've been having all these dreams.
	About child sex trafficking.
	I just noticed a thread or two on this topic over the past week with you, and I was like, uh-oh, he must be having dreams on another topic now.
	Yeah, after the election stuff.
	I was like, wait a second, this is a switch?
	We switched gears!
	I was having nothing but, you know, a lot of Trump dreams before the election.
	And since the election, it's switched gears to all the stuff about pedophile rings and sex trafficking kids and Which goes cross-party, cross-justice.
	Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely.
	It's non-partisan stuff.
	Yeah.
	This is, and I didn't have a grid for this.
	Unfortunately, it's getting into some areas that I have been reluctant to think about and to look at, like, you know, things like the Illuminati.
	Yeah, it's, it's, it's, it's deep, ugly stuff.
	It's deep, ugly stuff.
	It's deep, ugly stuff that a guy like me doesn't really have time for.
	Uh-huh.
	I have a lot of friends who are pretty fringy as far as conspiracy theory stuff goes.
	Yes.
	And they've been warning me about this stuff for years.
	Yep.
	And I've always been like, you know, whatever.
	Like, I'm not going to touch that.
	I don't have enough headspace to go down that rabbit hole.
	Right.
	But the dreams came.
	Now the Lord has been giving me dreams about this stuff.
	Right.
	Not specifically about Illuminati and satanic cults and stuff.
	But as I have been doing some investigating online on Reddit and some other places for Chan, oh gosh, I've run into some stuff that I'm just thinking, wow, I cannot believe this stuff is happening.
	Wow.
	It seems to be happening.
	In many sectors of society.
	Wow.
	So this is a little different than, well, I mean, I guess it's similar, but, you know, I've been learning a lot about sex trafficking in general, you know, you know, people, you know, kids being kidnapped and then all of that, but it seems like the dreams you're having are very specific to like rings and hype, like high profile people as it relates to this, not so much, you know, the dude trying to make a buck or the like, but this is like high, Yeah, high profile stuff.
	High profile stuff.
	Yeah, mostly involving the powerful and the wealthy.
	Wow.
	It looks as if it is very pervasive in government and probably pretty pervasive in the corporate America among the upper echelon.
	Yes.
	It's been alleged for years that it's really pervasive in Hollywood.
	Yep.
	That's the only one out of the three that I had heard about.
	Yeah, I mean everybody hears about that.
	Teenage TV movie stars.
	That's right, they're the ones who start telling stories about that.
	They don't tell full stories, but they allude to.
	And nobody really tells the full story.
	Because what I'm finding is the pressure to get people to shut up about it.
	is enormous.
	Uh, death threats.
	Does that make you a little concerned about diving deep into this for your own safety?
	No, it doesn't.
	Okay.
	You're like, God didn't give me these dreams for no reason.
	Well, you know, when you look at what's going on, if you go far enough down the rabbit hole, you ultimately, you come into pages and places where human sacrifice is going on.
	For satanic cults.
	Wow.
	And it doesn't take long to figure out if they would sacrifice children to get their power from Satan, they would think nothing about killing somebody who is going to rat them out.
	No, that's not a stretch of the imagination at all.
	Right.
	So, because you have that dynamic where there's so much power, Uh, to suppress and to keep it silent and to keep it all under wraps.
	What I've found is that these societies, they use code languages, code terminology.
	I had a dream about that where actually had two dreams where the Lord was illustrating to me how they speak in these coded languages.
	Yes.
	So that people around them don't have any idea what they're talking about.
	Wow.
	They can talk about, if you're in the know, if you're in the group, you'll know by the secret words, the colors, the references to things, you'll know that that's a person who's signaling to you that they're on board with what you're doing.
	But if you are not hip to what they're, you have no clue.
	It would just sound like a regular conversation.
	And when you find their stuff on social media, it doesn't throw red flags.
	Right, right.
	And you find talk on websites and you find signs out in the public, you're oblivious to it.
	But if you're in the group and you'll see those signs and you see the code words and the colors and stuff, you know exactly what's going on.
	You know who to call, you know when, you know where the doors are, where the places are, what's... Sick!
	It's really, really crazy.
	Wow!
	But that is what the Lord He has me on right now.
	I can tell you what he's been speaking to me about.
	Oh gosh, it's so deep.
	It's so vast.
	But here's my selling point, I think, to the Charismatic Church on this issue, which when people hear about it, they're like, oh, that's terrible.
	Oh, that's horrible.
	Oh, someone should do something about that.
	Yes.
	How much?
	I mean, other than some people who go to places like Thailand and go to places where there's obvious human trafficking going on, there are a few people who will go to truck stops and try to bust trafficking rings at truck stops, but it's a massive problem.
	The FBI was reading an article where they interviewed some FBI agents, and the FBI has basically said, Pedophile rings in the United States are at a near epidemic proportions.
	It's just unbelievable how bad it is.
	Wow.
	It's in the church.
	It's in entertainment.
	It's in government.
	It's in business.
	It's everywhere.
	And what the Lord said to me the other night is He said, you know how all of your friends are praying for revival?
	Yes.
	He said, what do you think is actually stopping revival from coming?
	And I said, well, there's a lot of theories on that, but I don't really have any good ones.
	And you know the answer.
	So why don't you tell me?
	He said, okay, so go back to the Old Testament, days of Israel, when Israel was worshiping idols in the high places.
	And where they were sacrificing their children to Molech and to Baal.
	What happens to a nation that sacrifices its children?
	And we're not talking abortion.
	No, we're not.
	Yeah.
	We're talking human sacrifice for satanic rituals.
	And if this is happening in the highest places of your nation, and you are doing nothing to stop it, Why would you expect revival to come to your nation?
	Wow.
	The highest people in the land are sacrificing children to Satan.
	Wow.
	And what the Lord told me is, if we will deal with this thing, expose it, prosecute the people involved, free the children, it is only then that we're going to see revival come.
	Wow.
	Because The people who are in charge, the leaders, government, business, entertainment, even in the church, in every sector, this is going on.
	And it's being winked at, and it's being nodded at, and it is not being confronted.
	And we really need people like Jehu, who will come and have kind of a ruthless spirit and say, you know, this stuff has to end.
	Yeah.
	And heads are going to roll.
	So what I've been doing with my friends on Facebook is I've been digging into 4chan and Reddit and the places where this stuff can be found and I've been Sharing it with my friends and asking them to pray that it would be exposed.
	Yes, right now.
	That's the only Assignment I have from the Lord.
	Okay is Let people know what's going on.
	Let people know it's real and have a few hundred people praying That stuff would be exposed and it is being exposed.
	Yes, it's being exposed The FBI is making arrests They haven't made arrests in the higher levels yet.
	It's all low-level stuff right now.
	Yes.
	But I think... But they have awareness?
	Oh yeah.
	That it's happening at the highest levels, but they haven't been able to... One of the problems, I think, of what's going on between the FBI and the Department of Justice is that there are people in those agencies that are involved.
	Right.
	And they don't want it coming out.
	Wow.
	So I think with a turnover, Of personnel in government.
	Maybe we can get some of this stuff prosecuted.
	I see.
	Maybe.
	Wow.
	But, you know, it's going to take cooperation on the part of a lot of people who have been unwilling to cooperate for a long time.
	Yeah.
	Wow.
	That's some serious stuff.
	That is some serious stuff.
	It has been just wearing on my mind.
	It's pretty much all Denise and I have been doing for the last two weeks.
	We get up in the morning and when we go to bed at night, we are researching and reading and listening to videos and documenting things.
	I'm cataloging and indexing the information that we find.
	Because, unfortunately, as soon as this stuff gets uncovered, it's erased.
	It gets deleted.
	Websites are changed.
	Storefronts are changed.
	As soon as somebody finds out that they've been exposed, they start hiding all the evidence.
	It's really difficult to get a good string of evidence, a chain of evidence on this.
	WikiLeaks has helped a lot.
	We've been going over the WikiLeaks emails, and there's a lot of stuff in there that is very... Does this stuff go way back?
	Like, when you look at the WikiLeaks stuff, this is like years of stuff?
	Yeah.
	On this topic?
	Yeah, it goes back to before the Obama presidency, actually.
	Oh, wow.
	Wow.
	So we've been looking into that.
	We've been looking at the documents and archiving stuff.
	Um, I think, I suspect that this problem in government has probably, it's been there for decades.
	Right.
	It's actually been well documented in government, local governments and state governments, some degree in, in federal governments, but mostly in like UK, Australia, places like that, it's been exposed.
	In the federal government, United States, it hasn't been exposed yet.
	It's going on.
	It's been going on for a long time.
	It just hasn't been exposed.
	From time to time, state and local government employees will be exposed and prosecuted.
	But the really tragic thing is they typically get very light sentences.
	They're typically pardoned early or released early.
	The children and the people involved, the victims, seldom get healing and integration and get the kind of ministry that they need.
	That's one of the biggest problems that I think we've got right now.
	And this is what I'm concerned about.
	I had a dream, I think it was two nights ago, and Denise and I were talking on Facebook.
	We have a group conversation going on right now with some friends where we're trying to strategize what kind of resources and what kind of issues we're going to have with this.
	And one of the things that I'm very concerned about is, is the enormity of the task.
	You know, let's say 10, 15, 20,000 people are eventually prosecuted from this activity.
	What happens if you have two or 300,000 or 500,000 Or maybe a million victims of sexual abuse, satanic ritual abuse, mind control.
	How do you get those people help?
	How do you get them to a safe place?
	How do you get them healed?
	The church doesn't have the resources right now to minister to that many people and to get that many people healed.
	And I'm afraid that a lot of those people are going to fall into the hands of more predators.
	Any insight into, okay, so the children who are involved in these rings, it's like, so, I mean, where are the kids, like, I don't understand, are these kidnapped children?
	It's crazy.
	Is it like?
	So there are places, one of the places it has traditionally been rampant is on military bases.
	The children of soldiers?
	Yeah.
	So here's the deal.
	If you look back now, you saw one of the links that I posted.
	It's a link to an article that looks at six different case studies of pedophilia, pedophile rings around the world.
	that were investigated, documented, and the people involved.
	Either the cases were dropped, the evidence was lost, the evidence was covered up.
	Grand juries decided not to prosecute.
	Psychologists got involved who brought testimony that disallowed any of the testimony of the children.
	I mean, everything in the world was done to make sure these cases were not prosecuted.
	Very few of them ever went before a grand jury, but when they did, when they went to trial, all these people came out of the woodwork to make sure that nothing happened.
	Judges were pressured to find the people not guilty.
	It's crazy.
	The Presidio in San Francisco is one well-documented case where they had a daycare center there, and the kids were being Raped and and tortured and they were taken to different buildings and a lot of evidence of satanic ritual abuse People involved were not prosecuted and it happened at West Point It happened at a bunch of different military bases around the country.
	This is in the 80s and 90s.
	That kind of stuff is going on.
	And then they go back to their parents and the parents are wondering why their child is acting like a nut?
	And the parents can see that their children have been sexually abused.
	They report them and nothing is done about it.
	Wow.
	It's just, it's crazy.
	When you start looking into this, there's been a really well-documented history of it, but I'm telling you, the press doesn't want to report it.
	The people involved are being protected.
	It's just, it's insane.
	Wow.
	So one of the things that I think we're going to see, I'm praying we're going to see in this next year or two, is a government that is willing to do the right thing.
	And make sure these people are prosecuted and that the victims get help.
	Right.
	It's very pervasive.
	And this is an absolutely new thing to me.
	This was not on my radar three weeks ago.
	I've just been studying and researching like crazy for the last couple weeks.
	It is wild.
	It's wild how God works with you.
	It's like, you'll be on the economy, you know, deep dive.
	It's like, okay, we're not talking about that anymore.
	We're deep diving in, traveling on a spirit.
	It's like that!
	It switches like that.
	I've told the Lord, I want to be on assignment for whatever you want me to be doing.
	Just give me the heads up, give me the information, and I'll do my best to Research it and learn about it and then share the information with people who want to be involved.
	And yeah, for a while, you know, I'm still interested in traveling in the spirit.
	I'm still getting testimonies.
	I'm still teaching on that at the School of Supernatural Ministry.
	How did everything go?
	It was awesome!
	Well, it was awesome, mostly because I went through some emotional healing before I went and taught.
	Nice.
	Because I had an altar I've had a few dreams and some inklings that I have suffered some emotional trauma that caused some alters and a lot of fragments.
	And I went through this emotional healing process a couple of years ago and found some of it and got some of it healed and integrated, but I knew there was more.
	And so I went back through another two-hour session with my friend Matt and found another major alter.
	I don't dissociate.
	I don't have blackouts and periods where I don't know what's going on.
	I just have this alternate personality inside of me that is very different from The outgoing, gregarious, social me.
	I have this me that wants to crawl in a cave.
	I don't want to talk to anyone.
	I don't want to be on social media.
	I just want to be in my cave for two or three weeks and not talk and not be around anyone.
	Yes.
	I have that kind of Jekyll and Hyde thing going on.
	So we did a little healing session.
	We found that altar.
	He was literally in a cave inside me somewhere.
	I didn't even know I had this inner world.
	Yeah.
	I know that people who have multiple personality disorder are aware of an inner world where the multiples live.
	Yes.
	I was never aware of that, but I saw it in the healing session.
	I saw the inner world.
	Wow.
	And so Jesus came and he healed, integrated this altar.
	And it was an amazing experience for me because like when I spoke at the Arizona Healing Rooms, Two or three months ago, and I did that teaching on altars and fragments and emotional healing.
	Yes.
	After I did that message, I was exhausted, emotionally drained.
	I didn't want to talk to anyone for three days.
	I literally just wanted to spend the entire time in my bedroom.
	I laid in bed a lot.
	I was wiped out.
	I did not want to talk to anyone or be anyone for three days.
	After that experience, because I don't even know why.
	I just know that that me, that version of me, came up and didn't want to talk to anyone and be around anyone.
	Wow.
	I just became a recluse after that.
	And that's how it's been.
	I like teaching and I like public speaking, but there has always been this low-level anxiety and fear and apprehension about Being in social environments like that.
	It's like part of me loves it and part of me hates it.
	So after I went through this emotional healing, I thought, okay, this'll be good because now I have to go out and speak at churches and schools six nights in a row.
	It was pretty intense.
	I gave seven messages at six different locations.
	Wow.
	At seven different locations over six days.
	It was intense, yeah.
	We were driving around the state.
	This was organized by like one thing?
	Yep.
	It's a very loose organization.
	It's just a couple of guys, my friends Tom Schirmitzler and Jim Weiss and Lila Shaw, the three of them.
	Yep, I see her name a lot.
	Yeah, Laila's not a guy.
	Jim and Tom are the teachers.
	They'll do teaching.
	Laila is kind of a coordinator, facilitator.
	She's with people and she's helping out.
	So they took over this School of Supernatural Ministry for the state of Arizona that had been going for about five years until the founder and the coordinator died.
	Last year.
	Oh, okay.
	She died suddenly.
	Okay.
	So the school kind of fell apart.
	And then these folks picked it up this year and decided that they're going to run with it and make it happen again.
	So they're doing supernatural ministry at six locations in Arizona.
	They're actually going to add a seventh location in Tucson next semester.
	And they just have people come in from different parts of the country and they They drive them from one location to another location during the week.
	Yes.
	Speak at a different place each night of the week.
	So it was kind of cool for me because I was able to drive there myself, me and Denise.
	Yes.
	In the Jeep.
	Nice.
	And come home and sleep at home.
	Yes, exactly.
	No airplanes, no hotels.
	That's right.
	Can't beat it.
	None of that nonsense.
	That's right.
	We're not really big on that.
	In fact, If it had not been the fact that we would be able to drive home every night and sleep in a bed, we probably wouldn't have done it.
	You probably wouldn't have done it, right?
	But it was great.
	I put together a talk on two different subjects, really.
	One is traveling in the Spirit in general, and then specifically the Courts of Heaven, because people are so interested in the Courts of Heaven.
	And we've been getting a lot of really cool testimonies from people who have been trying it.
	The rookies who go there for the first time, they have the best testimonies.
	Well, I'm looking to be added to that list.
	My first was a flop.
	Was it really?
	It was a flop.
	I'm like, I don't even know what I'm doing.
	Well, that's the thing, you don't know what you're doing.
	You can't get there, but if you can connect with Jesus and if you can connect and see the judge and all that stuff, once you're able to do that, most of the testimonies that I've heard from people said, oh yeah, it was short, it was pretty easy, you know, I saw Jesus, I saw the judge, I heard the not guilty, I saw some demon over there, he was running his mouth.
	Do you have a group going on talking about just that topic too?
	Oh, I don't.
	Should I get one?
	I don't know.
	We've got a lot of stuff going on, but if there is something you're looking to go towards and want a community around that, then it would make sense.
	Yeah.
	I just created a group to discuss the Pedophile ring which makes sense because there's an outcome that you're looking for in terms of getting people together for prayer and Right, this is what we're learning This is what we've found and it's a secret group So yeah, whatever gets posted nobody gets to see it and if you're not a member and yeah
	That was I had a couple of friends contact me and said hey I'd like to talk about this but I can't do it on a public timeline because my friends and family are gonna see what I'm posting and I don't want them to see it right So that's why I just, you know.
	That was wisdom.
	Yeah.
	But no, traveling in the spirit and the courts of heaven don't, there are a lot of groups on Facebook where they're already talking about this stuff.
	Actually quite a few.
	If you go on Facebook.
	I think I'm in, I recently joined one.
	Yeah.
	I think it was called Courtrooms of Heaven.
	Courtrooms of Heaven.
	Yeah.
	Okay.
	The admin of that, I'm trying to think of his name, can't think of it, but that group has been active for several years.
	Oh wow.
	There's a lot of people in it and there's a lot of people posting, asking questions, sharing testimonies.
	I'm in that group and I post in there once in a while.
	Okay.
	If people are interested, and that's why I didn't create my own group.
	Right, because there was already a resource to send people to.
	Actually, I have a group.
	On Facebook, it's called Traveling in the Spirit.
	You do?
	Oh yeah!
	I created that group, gosh, probably four years ago.
	Uh-huh.
	When we first started speaking, talking publicly on Facebook about Traveling in the Spirit, it was taboo.
	Yes.
	Nobody wanted to talk about it.
	Right, right.
	So we decided to create a group, and I did, and we had some conversations initially.
	Yes.
	Yes.
	And then it became a subject I was talking about more openly.
	Yes.
	And I was having the discussions on my timeline and people are jumping in and I'm inviting people to come into the conversations openly.
	Right.
	So now I don't, the group is still there.
	Yeah.
	But we're having a lot more discussion.
	We don't feel the need to have.
	I've pretty much put all my friends on warning this year, and I said, look... We're going to be talking about some deep stuff around here!
	I'm going to be talking about traveling the spirit, according to what's happening.
	If you are on board with stuff, you are welcome to the conversation.
	If you do not have a grade, and if you think this is heresy, well, you might want to just either ignore me, or There's the unfriend or unfollow or whatever you want to do.
	Right.
	Yeah.
	And that's how it rolls.
	Yeah.
	But that's good.
	But it's been good.
	It's been good.
	You know, it's kind of funny because I published a book on traveling in the spirit.
	Yes.
	Traveling in the Spirit Made Simple.
	And that came out, I think, in September.
	That was September, I believe.
	Yeah.
	Yeah, early in September.
	And darned if all of a sudden I don't start getting all these questions from people about the Courts of Heaven, which is one of the chapters in the book.
	Yes, all the questions were directed on that specifically.
	It's like 18th chapter is Courts of Heaven and chapter 19 is the Divine Council.
	Yes.
	I have been getting some questions about the Divine Council too.
	I am actually in the process of re-reading it, because you know, you made a lot of changes since the one that I read, so now I'm re-reading it now.
	But, the Court of Heaven is a thing that a lot of people are interested in.
	You know, Robert Henderson put out his book, Operating the Courts of Heaven, and so it's been a subject, there's a lot of interest, a lot of people are going there, a lot of people are having experiences, and there's a lot of people who are new to it, who are trying it now.
	And so I'm getting all these questions and I thought, you know, this is how all my books start out.
	Yep.
	Frequently asked questions.
	I write out these answers and then I think, you know, if I put this in a book, it would actually help a lot more people.
	Yes.
	So I wrote this short ebook.
	Yep.
	I've got that one.
	Defeating your adversary in the court of heaven.
	Yes.
	Holy moly.
	Shay, I've been selling a hundred copies a day.
	Are you serious?
	I'm not joking!
	When it first came out, it was selling three or four hundred copies a day.
	Oh my gosh!
	That's how much interest there is in the subject.
	That's amazing!
	I'm like, wow, people really want to know about this.
	Wow.
	It's been, it's been selling.
	It was, it was for the first month it was selling ballpark, about 150 copies a day, pretty regularly.
	Now it's done about a hundred copies a day, a day.
	Yeah.
	And we're trying to get the print book available.
	Um, Denise has been very, very distracted.
	I haven't written anything in any of my books.
	She hasn't done any graphic design.
	We want to get all of our e-books available in print now, because we're getting so many people asking us, hey, do you have paperback for this?
	Well, we only have it as an e-book.
	That's because Denise doesn't like to deal with the shorter ones.
	She doesn't.
	She has agreed to do the paperback copies for all of the books that have only been available in e-book.
	We're working on The Traveling in the Spirit, or the Court of Heaven one right now, because that's the one that everyone's interested in.
	Yes.
	Yeah, that thing has been selling like crazy.
	That's amazing.
	How's the Traveling in the Spirit one doing?
	Well, hang on.
	I'm going to tell you about the first one, the Courts of Heaven one.
	Yes.
	So, it is the highest rated book I've ever written on Amazon.
	The one on the Courts of Heaven?
	Yeah.
	Nothing but five-star reviews.
	Wow.
	People are just raving.
	They love it.
	They say it's simple.
	It is simple.
	It takes all the mystery out of, you know, the thing.
	And that was my whole goal.
	Really, what I did was I found seven questions that people kept asking me.
	Yeah.
	These seven questions, like, I know that I'm actually in the court of heaven.
	How can I hear the accusation?
	What do I do when I first get there?
	Okay, I got my verdict and I got my scroll.
	What do I do then?
	So I kept getting these same questions.
	So those are the chapters.
	The chapters are, here's question number one, number two, number three, number four, number five.
	Just, you know, this is what you should say.
	This is what you should not say.
	This is what you should do next.
	This is what you should do.
	Look for Jesus, find the judge, get your verdict and then enforce the verdict and all that.
	So people just have loved that book.
	Now, The book on Traveling in the Spirit was selling really well until the one on the Courts of Heaven came out.
	They're like, what I really want to know!
	People are like, well, I don't need that.
	I want this book first, because I want to go right to the Courts of Heaven.
	Right.
	That's funny.
	But the one on Traveling in the Spirit is still selling well.
	Yeah.
	The thing is, it's like, how would I describe it?
	It's like, The book on Traveling in the Spirit is like a hotel.
	Yes.
	And the book on the Courts of Heaven is like the lobby.
	Uh-huh, uh-huh, uh-huh, uh-huh.
	People are getting their feet wet in the lobby.
	You know, oh, check out, they got a TV, flat screen, watch some TV there.
	Yes.
	You know, and then, but, you know, eventually, hopefully, they'll start realizing this is a huge hotel, there's a lot.
	Yes, there's lots more to explore here.
	Yeah, but it's good because The Traveling in the Spirit book has been really well received.
	I have had some one-star reviews on it, and I don't stress about one-star reviews.
	Both of the people who left one-star reviews, there's only two of them, said, I didn't read this book, but this looks really scary.
	And it could be deceptive.
	You should, you know, don't read this book.
	Like, okay.
	Yeah.
	Well, at least if you're going to give the book a one-star review and you haven't read it, at least admit that you haven't read it.
	And they did, which is good, because people will read that and say, okay, well you didn't read the book.
	I did have an interesting three-star review, Traveling in the Spirit book.
	Actually, the woman who left the three-star review is a friend of mine.
	And she said, you know, Pragmatic's a friend of mine.
	I've read most of his books.
	This one stretches me beyond my comfort zone and I'm not too sure about some of the stuff that's in here.
	And I was like, okay.
	Well, I asked the Lord, what should I do with that?
	And he said, well, he goes, did you know that this book was going to stretch people?
	And I said, yes.
	And he said, Mission accomplished.
	Yep, exactly, exactly.
	So I don't worry too much about, you know, reviews and stuff, but most, you know, 85, 90% of the reviews are four and five star.
	People really like it.
	They say that it's helped them.
	It's straightforward.
	It demystifies things.
	You know, you know me, I got the biblical basis in the first chapter and all that stuff.
	It's been really well received.
	It seems to be helping move the conversation.
	That's good.
	That direction.
	And I've gotten a lot of testimonies from people who read the book and then they're like, Oh my gosh, wait a minute.
	I had this like dream thing the other night where I went somewhere and I was praying over this person to be healed.
	And I thought it was just a dream, but it was so real.
	Yes.
	And like, I read your book and I realized I was probably actually there.
	Yes.
	And the penny has dropped for a lot of people.
	It's funny because I had a dream a couple nights ago, maybe about three or four nights ago, and I actually woke up out of my sleep cracking up laughing.
	I was with the friend who I always tell you these stories about, the one whose bedroom I showed up in.
	Right.
	Yeah, same friend.
	I was with her and we were having this, it wasn't, we didn't go anywhere.
	We, you know, we didn't go anywhere, but we were having a conversation and I remembered aspects of the conversation, but I just remember we were having the best time and we were cracking up laughing.
	And when I woke up, I woke up laughing.
	I actually thought that this had... I was confused a little bit.
	You were disoriented because it was so real.
	Right, because it was so real.
	And my husband's like, what's so funny?
	And I'm, because I'm cracking up.
	And I was like, I was like confused for a moment because I was like, no, I was with Shay.
	Wait.
	I was like confused!
	I sent a text to her.
	I was like, hey, you and I had a great time last night cracking up, you know?
	Did she have any awareness?
	She did not.
	She did not.
	Nope.
	Most of the time that's the case.
	Most of the time when you go and visit somebody, they have no recollection of it.
	Yes.
	I have had one experience.
	I actually had several experiences where both parties were aware something was going on.
	Yes.
	Like Mike van Vlemmen?
	Yep.
	Okay.
	It's kind of crazy.
	When Mike published his book, Supernatural Transportation, he sent me the manuscript, a Word document, so that I could read it.
	Because we agreed that we would, like, share, compare notes before we published our books.
	Yes.
	So he sends me the document.
	It's literally like two days before he published it.
	I didn't have a whole lot of time to read it, or give him feedback, but it was cool because it's a good book anyway.
	So the night that he sends me the manuscript, I'm reading it, I get four chapters into it, and he has this amazing revelation that answers a major question that I had to answer in my book, but I didn't have an answer for.
	So he just, boom, gives me the answer to the question.
	I'm like, this is so awesome.
	That night, I had a dream.
	Where Mike Van Vlijmen and Bruce Allen came to visit me in the dream.
	And Bruce was teaching me about traveling in the spirit.
	Wow.
	Now, when I sent Mike a message the next day, I said, so I had this dream-like thing happen last night.
	You and Bruce Allen came and visited me.
	And he goes, yeah.
	He goes, I was wondering who I was visiting.
	He goes, I know I was visiting someone last night.
	I felt and I knew that I went somewhere to be with somebody else.
	But he wasn't sure.
	He didn't know the details.
	He could not remember who it was.
	Interesting.
	It was me.
	So every once in a while... That's interesting.
	I had this friend, Josh.
	I had a dream one night where I was going around visiting different people.
	Yeah.
	He had a dream the same night I came to the dream in this dream and I prayed over him for shoulder to be healed and he was actually healed.
	He woke up in the morning and his shoulder pain was gone.
	Wow.
	So every once in a while, like I get a testimony from someone who I visit in their dream.
	Yes.
	And they're like, wow, this is what happened.
	And you were, you were unaware.
	Most of the time I'm unaware, although many times, I'll have a dream that kind of illustrates that something is going on, but I'm not real super aware of what it is.
	Yeah, yeah.
	So yeah.
	Wow.
	It's interesting stuff.
	So how do you deal with this like, you know, transition from one topic to the other?
	Like, you know, I'm on this and now I'm having dreams about this.
	And so now you are on Trump for a while.
	And then it was like, okay, oh wait, no, we've shifted.
	Do you do these shifts with ease?
	Yes.
	The thing is, the Lord usually has me multitasking.
	Continuously.
	Okay.
	So, when I'm writing books, I always have four or five books in the works at any given time.
	On various topics?
	On various topics.
	So, I've been working on this book on Power and Authority, Power and Authority Made Simple.
	Yeah, I remember you mentioning that.
	Okay.
	I've been working on that.
	That'll probably be the next book in the Made Simple series.
	Okay.
	I've been working on that for probably a year.
	Okay.
	I'm also working on a book I'm working on the novel and that is actually turning into a trilogy.
	I have concepts and characters and some of the content for three books.
	Are you writing all of them before you release one or are you going to finish one?
	I'm working on Bogren, the novel, and a lot of people are giving me a bad time because they really want that book out.
	I have been, I've been, so I'll get to talk about the books.
	I've been working on a book called Emotional Healing and Deliverance Made Simple.
	Okay.
	Working on that for about two years.
	Yeah.
	It's going to be mostly testimony based.
	And then I'm working on the novel and I'm working on concepts for some shorter ebooks.
	So I'm always working on those things as I'll get some revelation, as the Lord gives me a dream, as I work with somebody on emotional healing or something of that nature.
	I'll take that revelation and write it down and throw it in the document and put it in a folder on my computer in that book folder.
	So I'm building the content for each book as I go.
	So I'm used to multitasking.
	And you know the Lord has me working on healing, physical healing sometimes, although most of that is... I mean I've written probably 40 or 50 articles on physical healing alone.
	And I've almost Drained the well dry on that subject.
	But, you know, emotional healing is something, deliverance is something else, traveling the Spirit is something else, hearing God's voice, seeing the Spirit, all these different subjects.
	So I'm used to the Lord speaking to me on a variety of topics.
	I've never been a one topic person.
	There's been a lot of different things.
	Then, you know, Trump came along.
	And then I started having all these Trump dreams.
	In the middle of Having the dreams of Trump and what God's doing there, I'm still getting revelation about emotional healing.
	Yes.
	Well, I have some bad news for people who, if you're not a fan of Donald Trump and you follow my website, you're going to continue to get more revelation about Trump.
	So you're still having dreams?
	Oh yeah.
	And the Lord has told me he's going to continue to give me dreams.
	Yes.
	All the time while Trump is in the White House, I believe, the Lord is going to continue to show me revelation about what he plans to do through the Trump administration all through his presidency.
	Oh, that's exciting.
	That's what I signed on for.
	Yeah.
	You know, here's the thing.
	Like, a lot of prophets will get a word from the Lord About who is going to be the next president.
	And that's the end.
	And that's it.
	And then they go on to their other ministry.
	This is what, you know, church things and other things.
	And they never hear anything more until the next four years later when there's another election.
	That's right.
	So the Lord didn't actually tell me who the president was going to be.
	Yes.
	He said, if the people choose to elect Trump, These are some of the things that may happen.
	Yes.
	So, he has been continually giving me revelation about things that are going to happen months and years down the road.
	Yes.
	And, you know, like, I was not a Trump supporter.
	I know, I remember.
	I just, I wasn't.
	I was on board with a lot of, you know, evangelical, conservative, hey, you know, other candidate, another candidate.
	And Denise and I were very, very supportive of this candidate.
	Yes.
	But then we started having these dreams and I was like, really?
	Are you kidding me?
	You want to use that guy?
	But, but, but, but yeah, right.
	You know?
	Yes.
	But the thing was, I said, okay, I want to be open.
	To whatever you want to show me about this character.
	Yes.
	Whatever you plan to do, I'll try to be as faithful as I can to share what I'm hearing, what I'm seeing.
	Just give me the revelation and I'll share it to the best of my ability.
	Yeah.
	So, I didn't know what I had actually bitten off when I read that.
	I kept having more and more and more and more dreams about Trump.
	Wow.
	And so I expect that I will continue to get more revelation about what the Lord plans to do through the Trump administration.
	Yes.
	But then there's this thing with, uh, there's this thing with, um, the, the pedophile rings that, that will be an ongoing thing I would imagine for, Sometime I've already had three or four dreams about that.
	Yeah.
	There are going to be other things.
	Yeah.
	There are other things that he are on his heart.
	That's right.
	And so I'm used to multitasking.
	Yes.
	I try to be as quick and obedient as I can.
	Like this is how I teach people about supernatural ministry.
	I will have an experience where I'll learn something new about like traveling in the spirit or hearing God's voice or healing.
	And I will start sharing it a day or two later with people.
	Oh, wow.
	You know, it kind of makes Denise a little bit worried sometimes.
	Yeah.
	She's like, look, this is new.
	We haven't talked about this.
	Yeah.
	I've never heard of this before.
	Right.
	We need to, you know, pray about this and get some.
	Process this some more.
	And I'm like, no, people need to know.
	I don't ever tell anyone, look, take my word for it.
	I'm like, no, no, no.
	Here is something that happened to me.
	Here's something that I stumbled upon or that the Holy Spirit showed me.
	Take it and use it and ask the Holy Spirit how to use it in your life or whatever.
	I mean, that's fair because it's not like you're saying this.
	I mean, we can't refute, or people can if they want to, but someone's experience, it's their experience.
	You can either Exactly.
	"Okay, I believe that that was their experience and that it means something," or that person's a bunch of, let's talk a bunch of BS, right?
	But it's still your experience.
	You're not saying, "I'm teaching this XYZ "as some gospel truth or some," no, you're like, "This is the experience that I had." - Exactly.
	For me, it's a little bit like cooking.
	I had this recipe for roast beef, and the other day I tried putting in a new spice, and oh my gosh, it's amazing.
	You should try it.
	You might like it.
	You might hate it, but you might like it.
	You know, that's me.
	My thing is, I tried this because I didn't know what else to do, and it worked.
	Yeah.
	And most of the time, when people try the crazy stuff that I tell them to do, they have good results.
	Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
	So I have, over the years, I've become less fearful about sharing my crazy experiences.
	Yes.
	Because it usually works out okay.
	Yeah, that's good.
	That's good.
	So, Shay, I just read that you have plans to release three books next year.
	I do.
	It could be more, but three for sure.
	Since we're both podcasters and interviewers, now I get to ask you a question.
	What is up with the three books that you're going to release next year?
	OK, so the one that I'm writing is called Grace Over Grind, how grace will take your business places grinding can't.
	So that's going to be a book that I'm working on.
	So that's all about because, you know, with entrepreneurs, it's almost like a badge of honor to say, I hustle hard or, you know, I'll sleep when I'm dead or, you know, all of those things.
	Oh, my gosh.
	That used to be one of my mantras.
	Well, you know, years ago when Denise and I met, I would always say, because I'm a paramedic, and sometimes I would go two or three days without sleep.
	Yeah.
	And I'd always tell her, I can sleep when I'm dead.
	She's like, mister, you are going to stop saying that because you're going to get on a regular shift and you're going to start sleeping at night.
	That's right.
	I don't want to hear that word out of your mouth anymore.
	That's good.
	That was that was smart.
	Why?
	So I've got that book which is going to be talking a lot about that process of trust and rest and working diligently and what that looks like and partnering with God versus feeling like everything depends on you so therefore you have to grind it out 24-7 often to the detriment of other things that are important in your life as well.
	There's two ditches, aren't there?
	There's the one ditch where you work yourself to death like a slave because it's all about you.
	Yes.
	And then there's the opposite ditch, which is, well, if it's God's will, he'll just make it happen.
	Like it's going to fall out of the sky.
	Sit back and wait for it to happen and not do anything.
	Yes, exactly.
	Two ditches that aren't going to work.
	Right.
	You have to be kind of in the middle.
	Yep.
	And know that you need to do the work, but you do it for a place of rest and not striving.
	That's right.
	And that's the whole premise of that particular book.
	That's cool.
	So that one's one.
	Also, with Kingdom Driven Entrepreneur, we also do partner books where I didn't author the book, but we partnered with someone who wrote the book.
	Usually I write the foreword for that book.
	Kind of help in that process, usually write the full word, but I don't actually write the full content of the book.
	And so we have one that's coming up.
	We have all these books that are called like the Kingdom Driven Entrepreneur's Guide to a Particular Topic.
	And this one's going to be the Kingdom Driven Entrepreneur's Guide to Debt-Free Business.
	Okay, so there's a woman in our community who has grown a bakery, a storefront bakery, completely debt-free.
	The Lord's given her a lot of revelation as it relates to those who are willing to say, yes, I want to grow a business.
	I don't want to be a slave to anybody, financially.
	And I know that I can build a thriving business.
	Even a large and a thriving business completely debt-free, and you can do that with God, right?
	So he's been giving her revelation on this for probably like two or maybe three years now, and she's been walking it out in her own business.
	So she's writing that book.
	She's been sending me pieces of the book here and there for the past several months, and it's really good stuff.
	So she'll be finishing that one up.
	Hang on, hang on, hang on.
	I want to talk about that.
	Okay, okay.
	Because I have some friends who are trying to start up businesses.
	Yes.
	And one of the big things that they're wrestling with is the small business loan.
	Yes.
	Because you got to have capital.
	Well, people think you have to have capital to start up a business.
	And that means going into debt and taking out the loan.
	And, you know, a lot of Sometimes you go to a bank and they say, okay, you're going to take on a $150,000 loan.
	Well, you have to have $30,000 cash collateral to get the loan.
	And a lot of people don't have the collateral to put down for the loan.
	So they kind of think, well, I'm out of luck.
	It's just not going to work.
	Right.
	And a lot of people won't ask God for wisdom on how to do that.
	If their heart is, I want to do this and do this debt free, but yet a lot of people won't even ask God for the wisdom on how to get it done another way.
	And they settle for second best, which isn't a sin or anything.
	It's not like it's a sin to get a loan, but it's just not as best.
	Right, right, exactly.
	And Denise and I, you know, we built our little business and we didn't take out any loans, no debt.
	That's right.
	We asked the Lord for wisdom.
	Yes.
	And he gave us dreams.
	Yes, he did.
	And he showed us strategies for marketing and strategies for getting the word out and for sales.
	And I was, I tell people, listen, I think they probably think I'm crazy, but After I published my first book, Divine Healing Made Simple, for the next four months after I published the book, every dream I had from the Lord was about marketing and promoting the book and nothing else.
	And I was shocked because I did not know the Lord actually cared about money and entrepreneurism and being successful and getting the word out.
	And it wasn't like he wanted to make me some filthy rich person driving a gold Mercedes.
	Right.
	It was a thing where he wanted this book to get out into the hands of people who could use it, and in the process, he was going to help me start up the business.
	That's right, that's right.
	And so, as we used the strategies that he gave us in the dreams to get the word out about the book, and the book, the popularity grew and sales grew, we just took the money.
	We got from Amazon from selling a book, put it into the business, bought some stuff, bought some more advertising, more money came in, we reinvested it, back in the business, got some more things, kept reinvesting it, and now we're doing pretty darn well, actually.
	Which is why I quit my job as a paramedic, because... That's right.
	I guess you don't miss it so much?
	Oh my gosh!
	You miss it a little bit, or what?
	I get to wake up in the morning, and have coffee and breakfast with Denise every day, She does her thing, she's got her easels over there, so she does her painting, and I'm at my computer, you know, writing and editing and stuff.
	I love it, but the thing is, we did it debt-free, and unfortunately, we just got bumped up into a higher tax bracket.
	I mean, it's a good problem to have.
	It's a good thing, right?
	We're taking a huge hit on taxes for the rest of the year.
	Yeah.
	So we have to come up with a strategy.
	Well, the Lord has to give us a strategy about how we're going to deal with that.
	But you know, one of the things that I'm kind of excited about the new administration is I was going to bring that up.
	If he can push through Congress the business tax cuts, it's going to help a lot of people in business and who want to be entrepreneurs.
	Because, man, taxes.
	We are an S Corp.
	So we are paying out payroll.
	So as employers, we're paying payroll taxes and we're paying out Social Security, Medicare and all that stuff.
	We're also having it come out as employees.
	So we're getting double dipped on taxes and expenses.
	We pay an enormous amount of money in taxes.
	And we're going to ask the Lord for specific strategies for this coming year about how to streamline our business and minimize our tax burden and bring in more revenue so that we can put out Like, I would love to be able to do video teaching, but that is going to probably maybe require hiring somebody to do all the things.
	As far as editing and things of that nature?
	To do video editing and help with the technology end of that.
	Right now it's just me and Denise, and I can only do so much.
	If we could hire somebody, that would be really awesome.
	But, you know, you're looking at paying insurance and all the expenses that go with that.
	Or you hire a contractor.
	That's what I do with our podcast.
	We have a podcast editor.
	Or you contract somebody.
	That's probably the best way to do it.
	It would be nice to have somebody join us as a team member.
	But I have heard so many bad stories about people in ministry.
	You're partnered with someone, and then after a few years, it went south.
	And then you're stuck with this.
	You're stuck with a situation where it's uncomfortable, the vision isn't working, you're not on the same page.
	And I don't want to get into one of those situations where... So yeah.
	But, you know, the thing is, I think in the next two or three years, the environment for entrepreneurism It's gonna be so much better.
	I really do.
	Yeah.
	I'm hoping so.
	I mean, based off of what seems to be on his agenda related to that, especially if he's successful with that tax cut, then that does open up a lot of opportunities for business.
	A ton.
	A ton.
	I have friends who work in investments and banking.
	Outside the US.
	And they said, look, there's a reason why all these large corporations have their headquarters in Dublin, Ireland.
	It's because Ireland has a 10% corporate tax rate.
	And why would you want to headquarter your company in the United States and pay 35, 38, 39% corporate tax when you can go to Ireland and pay 10% tax?
	Why would you?
	Who would want to do that?
	So they have these huge buildings in Dublin, where all these corporations have their corporate offices.
	And it's really, and there are very few people in there, but that's their official headquarters, and that's where it's at.
	Well, you know, Trump, his thing now is, look, we are We could bring all these companies and all this revenue and business back to the States if we get hip to, you know, reasonable tax rates on businesses.
	So I'm glad to see that's happening because, man, our economy has been so devastated.
	You know, something has to change or it's not going to get better.
	Yeah, it's been... So what about your third book?
	So the third one is called The Wild Ones.
	I don't know what the subtitle is going to be yet.
	There will be a subtitle.
	I'm not sure what the subtitle is yet.
	But the basis for that one is around the story of David.
	So here's David.
	out you know he's he's doing all these amazing things and getting all his training with the bears and he was he's doing all this stuff out where nobody can see right it's just like but he's you know sharpening sharpening his skills out there right and then someone's thinking about who's going to be king and they're they're lining up the lining up the suns and it's like no not that one that one or that one not the ones that seem to look the part not the ones that you know seem to be the right
	You know, if you were kind of making your little checklist of who would be king, who would be good for king, you know, maybe we'd check off all the marks.
	It's like, no, anyone else?
	Anyone else?
	And then you've got like scraggly David out there, you know, wild hair, you know, whatever.
	And so the whole premise around the wild ones is that there's a lot of times where as entrepreneurs that You know, God's given you something, given you a pretty major assignment, and you might even be feeling like, you might even be seeing a lot of people doing something similar, maybe similar in the vein of what you're doing, and you're seeing, you know, you're seeing them get exposure in certain things, and you're kind of watching that, and you're like, Lord, You know, what about me?
	But in the meantime, you know, you're off in the field like getting, you know, getting sharpened, you know, getting all of these things together in the back that nobody sees, right?
	In fact, you're able to do even a lot more with a lot, you might even be doing a lot more with a lot less resources, right?
	And so The Wild Ones is really almost like a, this one's actually written by a gentleman named David Burris.
	And it's it's I love it.
	He just kind of shared with me just kind of the premise and he gave me the outline for the book, but it's gonna help a lot of people who are In like a weird phase where they're wondering like, I just feel like I'm being, like I'm, I'm hidden.
	Like I'm in this bubble and I, and I, you know, you know, I'm feeling that, but yet I know what God's placed on the inside of me.
	So this is a book for the people who feel like they're in the bubble, the ones who are out in the field, but yet there's something in their heart for way more than that.
	Right.
	And so it's going, so it's a kind of a combination of inspirational and instructional, uh, with all the scriptural basis.
	I like that concept.
	So that one's going to be awesome too.
	That's one of the things that, I run into a lot with aspiring authors.
	Yes.
	Because, you know, as a, you know, I'm sure you run into them too, people who feel like they have, you know, a book or a series of books in them and they're really struggling to get going on writing.
	How do I get the word out?
	You know, I don't know anything about social media.
	I don't know about this.
	I don't know about that.
	I'm like, well, you know, it's a process.
	And if you've been in that wilderness period where you're getting the revelation and you're getting the experiences, that's the first part of the process.
	It's having something to write about.
	Yes.
	That's right.
	And then you come to the point where you have to start developing the ideas in a cohesive statement and writing some drafts.
	And you know what I tell people is, The best time to start promoting your book is three years before you write it.
	Because it's going to take that long to build your website and get an audience so that when you launch your book you can actually... People will actually know that you just wrote it.
	There's people who are waiting for it.
	But it's a process.
	It is a process, and there's authors who go through that.
	There's people who are speakers and teachers who go through that.
	I mean, there's people who have a business idea on their heart.
	I mean, they could be a barber, but they've got this particular vision for something else, and they feel like, ah!
	And they're seeing the best of the best in their industries, and they're seeing these things, and they're like, wow!
	That's the best of the best, but the Lord is giving me something that I think is really awesome and it's different from that, you know, but I feel like I'm over here and I'm hidden.
	And then people who are really not even, they're not even overly impressed by what they see, by the big names or the whatever, where a lot of people are kind of like, Big fans.
	They're like, I respect what they're doing, but they're not, you know, cause they're like, man, I've had, I've had to fight some battles over here, you know, with so much less resources with, you know, with not a bunch of eyes on me or whatever.
	So there's, I think there's so many different types of business people that go through that phase, but especially people who are like the, you know, writers, you know, those authors, speakers, teachers, like particularly those types.
	You know, Yeah, that can happen quite a bit.
	Because it's easy for a writer or a business person, a budding entrepreneur, to say, well, somebody else is already doing that.
	You know, somebody else is already successful at that.
	Somebody else already wrote a book on healing.
	Somebody else already has a business where You know, they do, you know, lawn maintenance or whatever it is that you want to do.
	But the thing is, nobody is going to do it the way you do it.
	You have to do it uniquely your way with your identity and your stamp of individuality and uniqueness.
	And what people don't understand, a lot of them is, they don't realize, look, there may be 30 different companies in your town that do landscaping but no one's going to do it the way you know you just need to find an angle you need to find something unique that's a way of doing customer service a way of presenting yourself to your customers as different and better and unique and people will want what you're doing same thing with writing a book
	That's exactly right.
	One of the reasons why people like my books, there's tons of books on healing, but people like my book because they're like, oh, you take it and you break it down.
	So somebody who doesn't have a seminary degree can understand it.
	A theology degree.
	That's my unique selling point.
	You have to have something that is unique that makes you stand out from everybody else.
	And a lot of people don't really believe in themselves.
	I think that they have something unique, but everybody does.
	That's right.
	And that's a discovery process, right?
	It totally is.
	And it's like, so in the meantime, you're trying to take someone else's template and like try to model after their template, but that doesn't work because that's not you, right?
	So you have to go through that process of discovery.
	You can use social media templates and you can use, you know, like email marketing.
	Strategies and things of that nature.
	But the message, the business itself, the logos, the identity, the way you're going to approach your customers, all of that has to be individual and unique for you.
	It can't be a carbon copy of somebody else.
	That's exactly it.
	That's exactly it.
	And then a part of the other angle with the Wild Ones is about the fact that a lot of times people feel like they, you know, they don't look, because they don't look like, or there's something then that's kind of different from what they're used to, what people are used to seeing, kind of on the stage or whatever, a certain kind of polish or a certain type of look or a certain type of style or whatever, but yet you're not any of those things at all, you know?
	And that can be, especially, You know, we're talking about, you know, folks in the kingdom, you know, you think about speakers on the big stage on certain topics in the kingdom and you're looking and like, wow, they're all decked out or they're all this or they're all that or whatever.
	And like, man, I've got purple hair and I, you know what I'm saying?
	You know, those kinds of things that you can make you feel uncomfortable, but the Wild Ones is about embracing all of that, you know, embracing all of that uniqueness, right?
	Well, and the thing is for me, that's kind of, Why I resonate with a certain group of people, because unlike most of my contemporaries, who are speakers and leaders within the church, went to seminary, went to Bible college, and have pastored churches and stuff like that, I'm a paramedic.
	You don't even want people to call you man of God.
	Don't call me man of God.
	Oh my gosh.
	That just makes me cringe when I hear that.
	That's so funny.
	You know, what I found is my unique selling point, my unique individual way of presenting the kingdom is I don't speak in Christianese.
	I'm used to speaking to nurses and doctors and patients and paramedics and firefighters and cops, so I don't use the language of You know, the people who have been, you know, churchy-anity.
	I don't use that language.
	Churchy-anity?
	I'm not comfortable with that kind of... I only use those concepts, admittably, as little as I need to, to get the message through.
	You're a wild one, Dave.
	I am kind of a wild one.
	But see, the thing is, I can't and don't want to be coming out of the mold that somebody else has already cut for me.
	That's right.
	I have a unique message, I have a unique style, a different way of presenting information, and it resonates with certain people.
	The other thing is, you know, Lauren, a lot of my audience are church dropouts.
	They are people who have been kicked out of churches, abused by... For being a little too weird.
	Or they've been abused by church leadership, or they have had really horrible experiences being backstabbed in the church, They've had uncomfortable, a lot of people have actually suffered emotional trauma in church settings, so they don't connect with the church in a normal way.
	And probably 60 or 70% of my following on Facebook, people are church dropouts, ex-leaders, former leaders who have been kicked out of positions, people who just have had really bad experiences.
	When the Lord showed me seven, eight years ago that He wanted me outside of the regular Sunday church meetings, some of my friends who are still going to regular church meetings every Sunday, whatever, they're always trying to get me to go back into the church.
	Oh, you need to be with the brothers, you need to be in the congregation, you have to have fellowship.
	You're like, I have fellowship!
	If you sat next to me and saw how much time I spend on Facebook praying for people, teaching, hanging out with my friends, and conversing, and teaching, and learning, and all this stuff, my church life never stops.
	It's just not inside of a building once a week on Sunday.
	That's right.
	It's an ongoing thing.
	But the thing is, What I found was when the Lord, when I got kicked out of a church after I got divorced.
	That is your story, right?
	The Lord said, look, it's okay.
	I have a plan.
	Just follow me.
	Watch what I do.
	So when I talk to my friends and followers, it's from a perspective that's very unique for most church leaders.
	Most church leaders, are in the church building on a regular basis.
	I'm not.
	I'm on social media.
	And I don't have their background.
	I don't have their history and experience.
	I don't talk to my friends the way they talk to their friends.
	I try to treat people as, you know, I'm just another average Joe who has an axe to grind against religious institutions.
	Although I'm getting some emotional healing on that.
	That's a process, too.
	The thing is, that kind of makes me one of those wild ones.
	It really does.
	And there's a lot of people out there that are like that.
	There's a lot of, there's a lot of people like that.
	If it's not because of that particular reason, it's for some other reason.
	You know, it's just, there's so many people who just don't fit into what seems to be the typical mold, right?
	Of, of who gets a large, a significant, influential platform, let's say, right?
	Yeah.
	And so, so when people look at that, when they're like, wow, what the Lord's showing me was this significant platform, but I, I'm seeing that.
	That's what he's shown me.
	But everything that I'm seeing around me...
	Looks nothing like that, you know?
	Right, so it's that process of what you're doing during that time that you're hidden, and the time that you're protected, and the time that you're developing, and getting okay with all of that uniqueness, and adding your personal stamp, and all of those things, and how God will open doors at the right time, right?
	As you're being diligent in that area.
	And that's the key.
	The key is, if you try to If you are a round peg and you try to fit yourself in that square hole, the door is not going to open.
	Because there is a door over there for round pegs.
	And until you go through that door, you're just going to be a frustrated round peg trying to fit the square hole.
	That's exactly right.
	We're kind of trained that way.
	We're told to fit in and to, you know, be like everybody else and don't do anything that's a little weird.
	You know, kind of be predictable and And cookie-cutter Christianity.
	And cookie-cutter entrepreneurism.
	All these people who have strategy models for creating businesses and being successful.
	Well, you can use some of their strategies, but ultimately, you don't want to be a cookie-cutter business person.
	You have to do... The Lord, this is the thing, the Lord will give you specific, unique strategies that will work for you and nobody else.
	That's right.
	Holy Spirit COO.
	Chief Marketing Officer, Chief Operating Officer, Chief Development Officer, Chief Financial Officer.
	No, he actually cares about all that stuff and I love your story about how When you wrote Divine Healing Made Simple, he would speak to you very specifically.
	With you, he speaks in dreams a lot, but he was very specifically giving you strategy for how to deal with this book that you wrote.
	Exactly, because I didn't know anything.
	Marketing strategy.
	I don't know anything.
	I'm a paramedic.
	What do I know about marketing and promotion?
	But, you know, the Holy Spirit, He just said, look, do this, do that.
	And, you know, obey.
	So I obey.
	And then He's like, OK, good.
	Now try this.
	I'm like, OK, try that.
	All right.
	Now that you got that down, try this.
	And as you obey and as you follow that unique strategic plan that He gives you, He gives you more and more steps, opens more doors, connects you to more people.
	So you can build a network.
	And that's how He does it.
	That's how he does it.
	I gotta tell you one other thing, so this is outside of books, but Big Big On My Heart next year, it's all media, it's really all, a lot of it's media related, so that's on the book side, but the thing that's also been on my heart, and this is brand new for me,
	So, the idea is, the goal is that I actually want to create, produce, create these like mini-films, like you know, 10 minute, you know, no more than 10 minute or so, these mini-films that are testimonies of God at work in the marketplace, okay?
	So, for example, the very first one that I want to share is called The Bakery That Jesus Built, and it's actually the story It's just a crazy, awesome, crazy, faith, miraculous, provision type of story of how Alicia, who's writing the Guide to Debt-Free, the Kingdom Driven Entrepreneur's Guide to Debt-Free Business, went from home bakery to storefront bakery, completely debt-free, very little money out of her pocket even, just the way God orchestrated that whole thing, right?
	And it's an amazing story, but I have other ones too, some that are related to healing that happened, you know, within the marketplace, you know, all these various things.
	But I want to capture another way of telling stories.
	So we've been doing a lot of print.
	But I also want to be able to do this from video, because I think being able to share a story in video has a whole other dimension to it.
	You know, it's a whole other dimension to share your story that way.
	And so that is, I've got like four that I want to do, you know, that are all marketplace testimonies, really powerful ones.
	In film.
	Short film.
	But this is so brand new.
	I've never done anything like it.
	I don't know anything really about film industry.
	I just know how to tell a good story.
	So, I've been going through this process of learning.
	I actually spent a handful of months just sewing, because whenever I've got a dream into something, I always want to sew into helping it happen for someone else, you know?
	So, I found a ministry that does, that that's what they do.
	They're actually, they're a 501c3, but all they do is create testimonies.
	They're not marketplace testimonies necessarily, but all they do is create these awesome films that just share Jesus, you know?
	Great stories.
	And so, So I've just been sewing into their ministry and also in the process been chatting with their operational...
	Manager and she's been really helpful for helping me think about some of the technical details or or helping me connect some of the dots and you know, even from a resource perspective for funding these things and I'm just believing God I was like God You know, I'm a passionate storyteller, you know what I say God give me awesome stories to tell I'll tell them from the rooftop You know, I just but I just and I believe in this provision to make every single one of them happen But it's different because for a business it's not like these are
	It's unlike a book where it's like you create the book and you sell the book.
	These are videos.
	These are videos that, sure, they're going to say KingdomDrivenEntrepreneur.com and invite them to be part of a community and accept this invitation that we have with God to do business in partnership with Him.
	But it's really, I mean...
	That's a substantial investment to make in something that's not like a direct sales vehicle, right?
	And so it's not something that we would traditionally do at this level of revenue in our business to do something like that.
	Right, because that's got to be a fairly substantial investment in doing film.
	Yeah, yeah, yep.
	Nevertheless, watch and see.
	It's going to be awesome.
	I believe it will be awesome.
	You know, you're not going to be reinventing the wheel, obviously.
	You're already connecting with people who are doing this and getting some good counseling and advice as to what are, you know, learn from somebody else's mistakes and let them kind of coach you and show you how to best do it.
	That sounds like a great idea.
	I really want to start doing video classes.
	It's just an issue of time, you know.
	I'm struggling to set time aside just to write my books, much less record and edit videos.
	I have all these millions of things I want to do, but not enough time to do them all.
	You know, I wanted to tell you one thing.
	You said 501c3.
	What's that?
	Yeah.
	Some people have asked why we're not a 501c3.
	Oh, I know why you're not a 501c3!
	Why did we go with the S-Corp?
	Yeah.
	Well, it's not about politics.
	What is it about?
	Because here's what a lot of people don't understand.
	They know about the 501c3, and they know about the Johnson Amendment, which basically says, if you are a 501c3, you're not supposed to talk about elections and back politicians, or you can lose your 501c3 status.
	Well, that's what the Johnson Amendment says, but actually, I don't think, I've looked at case law, I don't think any 501c3 has actually lost Their tax-exempt status due to violating that law.
	It's on the books, but I don't think it's ever been enforced.
	Okay, okay, okay.
	But, you know, Trump has said he wants to get rid of that, which is a good thing.
	But I don't know that it's necessarily a good thing for most preachers to be supporting political candidates.
	I agree.
	I don't think that's necessarily a good thing.
	The actual reason why we're not a 501c3 is there is an enormous amount of paperwork you have to fill out to do the 501c3.
	You have to answer all these questions.
	It's a process where they evaluate you.
	You have to have a board.
	You have to have board meetings.
	It's just a lot of jumping through loops that we didn't want to do.
	And not just at its initial onset, but on an ongoing basis.
	Yes.
	But there's another tax status that most people do not know about, have never heard of.
	Even a lot of tax experts have never heard of it.
	Don't know what it's about.
	It's called 508C1A.
	508C1A?
	Yes.
	508C1A.
	508 C1A?
	Yes.
	508 C1A is a tax exempt status.
	Non-profit Okay.
	Does not require a board.
	The paperwork you fill out for it is like two pages.
	You can get approved in 48 hours.
	What?
	The Johnson Amendment does not apply to 508 C1A.
	Who is creating these?
	What kind of organizations?
	It has been on the books forever.
	It's just nobody knows about it because the government wants people to become 501c3s.
	So is it only governmental related nonprofits that are actually using this right now?
	No, it's designed for churches and religious organizations.
	It's designed for churches?
	No, the IRS wants churches to be under the 501c3 so they can control them.
	They don't want people to know that there's another tax designation they could file, which is 508 C1A.
	There is an organization called Helping Hands Outreach.
	Okay.
	Write it down.
	You can contact them, and they help mostly churches and faith-based organizations go through, understand how that structure works, fill out the paperwork, submit it, and And become a 508C1A.
	We have not... So what's the bad?
	Where's the... There's pros and cons to most decisions.
	What would be the cons for this one?
	I don't know of any cons, actually.
	You haven't discovered any?
	I haven't found any.
	Interesting.
	I don't know that there's any downside to it.
	Like I said, I'm going to put in the podcast notes on my end, linked to Helping Hands Outreach.
	These folks, they're an organization, and I'm trying to remember if they themselves are a non-profit or not.
	I don't remember.
	They charge a fee to assist people in going through the paperwork and getting their 508C1A set up.
	Right.
	But it looks to me like there is very little or no downside to doing this.
	It's just that people don't know about it.
	We are looking at the possibility of doing the 508 C1A next year.
	The only problem is most of my income for our business is book royalties.
	And I don't know if royalties can be considered A tax-exempt form of income or not.
	Oh, I see.
	I've heard that these guys with Helping Hands Outreach have assisted one guy who is an author.
	He's a pastor, but he also writes a lot of books.
	And I've heard that they have actually set him up with a 508C1A where his book royalties are tax exempt.
	If that's true and they can do that for us, we're considering the possibility of doing that next year.
	Then we would be a non-profit.
	Wow!
	Which also means that people can make tax-deductible contributions?
	People can make tax-deductible contributions right now.
	Here's the tax laws.
	People do not understand how the tax laws work.
	Here's how they work.
	By default, Anybody who is involved in any kind of Christian ministry, whether it's a prayer ministry or a healing ministry or preaching the gospel or, you know, evangelism or whatever it is you're doing, if it's a faith-based endeavor that you are doing, You are, by default, a tax-exempt organization.
	You do not have to apply to the government to get a 501c3 or any other tax-exempt status to be tax-exempt.
	This is what people don't understand.
	You do not have... We... Do you see my face?
	Yes, I know.
	We take donations.
	We take donations from people all the time.
	And they can legitimately write it off on their taxes.
	The position has always been with the IRS, and it's always been this way historically.
	If you are involved in anything that is considered to be furthering humanities, faith-based organizations, anything like that, there's a list of them where you are endeavoring to help mankind.
	You are considered by the IRS code to be tax exempt.
	By default.
	Without applying for tax-exempt status, you are automatically tax-exempt.
	It's always been that way.
	So then why apply for tax exempt status of any sort?
	Of any kind?
	A 501c3 or a 508?
	Because people think that they have to do that, but they don't actually have to do it.
	So it's more like a marketing thing so that people believe that it's actually tax deductible?
	I hate to say this, but in fact the whole 501c3, all those tax categories, It's kind of a little... Say it's a racket?
	It's a Jedi mind trick that the government has kind of put over on us.
	I've got some research to do, buddy!
	Here's the thing.
	When Denise and I formed our business, we decided, and we researched the tax laws, and we have a CPA, and we're doing everything by the book.
	But here's the thing, because I'm a guy who writes and teaches on the Christian faith, I am, by default, involved in a tax-exempt endeavor.
	It's tax-exempt.
	So, anyone who donates through my website, to my PayPal, to my ministry, they can take A tax deduction for that donation, even though I'm not a 501c3.
	You don't have to be a 501c3 in order for people to donate to what you're doing and write it off their taxes.
	If that endeavor is considered tax-exempt by the virtue of what they're doing, then your donation can be deducted.
	Whether they have a 501c3 doesn't matter.
	It's irrelevant.
	So, people who donate to me, they can write it off their taxes.
	And you tell them such?
	Right.
	Well, no, I don't.
	You don't.
	This is what I'm trying to get underneath!
	If people want to donate to my ministry and they want to deduct it from their taxes, it's legal.
	Yeah, that's on them and they can do that legally.
	If they don't want to deduct it from their taxes, they don't have to.
	Right, right.
	You should pay taxes on their donations.
	Yes.
	Because all of the money that we bring in comes into our S-Corporation.
	Yes.
	We're paying corporate taxes.
	We pay tax on everything we bring in.
	That's our choice.
	We could be a 501c3 if we wanted to.
	We've chosen not to.
	Because we hit this bigger tax bracket this year.
	Now it's actually looking like... Maybe we want to consider... It's a little more painful.
	Denise and I have been talking about it for a while.
	Do we want to become an actual tax-exempt government thing?
	Or do we want to remain an S-Corp?
	We're not sure where we're going to go with that yet.
	But you're like a tax-exempt S-Corp?
	Just not because you're doing faith-based stuff, but you can't say that.
	Yeah, the ministry that we're doing is tax-exempt, but we have chosen for the purposes of our tax filing to organize as an S-corporation.
	Right.
	It's weird.
	It is weird!
	I've got a few conversations to have as a result of this conversation.
	For all of you entrepreneurs out there, faith-based people, you know, I've been trying to tell Lance Wallnau this forever because Lance is afraid of the 501c3, the Johnson Amendment, where he's been, because he's been a huge, huge Trump supporter.
	And he's a little bit nervous about having his 501c3 yanked because he's one of the only leaders that's out there talking about Trump.
	Well, I've been trying to tell Lance, and I don't know him, and he doesn't know me.
	I'll send him messages on Twitter, check into 508C1A, and he never responds, and he is now looking at creating a separate entity that he can talk about politics from that's domestic from his ministry, because he's afraid of the 501C3 thing.
	Right, right.
	Most people don't know that, as far as I know, no one's ever actually been prosecuted and lost their tax-exempt status for doing that.
	Right.
	Hopefully.
	Doesn't mean you can't, but the precedent has been set that it has not taken place as far as you know.
	I just wanted to let people know that there is another option out there.
	Yeah.
	If they're looking at going tax-exempt, you don't have to do 501c3.
	Right.
	It's a huge headache and it's not necessary.
	Good stuff, man.
	Yeah.
	Yeah, I've got like three phone calls.
	I have like three phone calls.
	Yeah, seriously.
	No, it's seriously worth researching and looking into.
	If we're going to do tax exempt, it's definitely going to be 508C1A.
	We're not even going to look at 501C3 because it's just too much paperwork, too much hassle, too much nonsense, and we're not down for that.
	Yeah, it's good stuff, man.
	Wow!
	I love it!
	I love it, too.
	We always learn stuff, don't we, when we talk?
	Well, folks, that is our show for today.
	I hope you enjoyed it.
	Thanks for dropping by.
	If you're new to the podcast and you haven't been to my website, you might drop by and check out the articles I have there.
	If you have any questions or comments about the show, you can contact me at admin at prayingmedic.com.
	That's A-D-M-I-N at prayingmedic.com.
	You can also contact me on Facebook and Twitter.
	I'd like to thank you again for dropping by.

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