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Oct. 10, 2016 - Praying Medic

01:28:24

062 Have Spirit Will Travel - Lisa Perna

In this episode, I'm interviewed by my friend Lisa Perna from Touched by Prayer. Our focus is on traveling in the spirit and in particular, on how to operate in the Courts of Heaven. Resources Lisa Perna's show Touched by Prayer Defeating Your Adversary in the Court of Heaven

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	Hi, I'd like to welcome you to our show.
	I'm your host, Prang Medic.
	We're talking about life as a child of God and all things related to His Kingdom.
	Thanks for joining us.
	If you're a new listener to the show, you can find articles and books and other resources on my website www.prangmedic.com.
	Now let's jump into this week's show.
	In today's show, I'm going to be interviewed by my friend Lisa Perna from the show Touched by Prayer.
	Thank you.
	Hey, welcome to Touched by Prayer.
	Is it possible for your spirit to travel?
	In the Bible, it talks about people traveling.
	It talks about people having these encounters where they weren't sure if it was in the dream or if it was in real time.
	Is it still possible?
	I mean, that was in the Bible, but is it still possible now?
	I mean, is it possible that when you sleep that you can actually go to distant places?
	That is the question that we are going to answer tonight.
	And I am ridiculously excited to introduce my guest.
	You guys know him?
	Let's see.
	He's an author.
	He's a teacher.
	He's a prank medic.
	So welcome to Touched by Prayer.
	Thanks so much for coming on.
	Thank you, Lisa, for having me on the show.
	And I want to answer your question.
	If it's not possible for us to travel in the spirit, this is going to be the most boring interview you've ever done.
	I know.
	We'll be like, well, it's not possible.
	Thank you and good night.
	So you wrote a new book called Traveling in the Spirit Made Simple because you have the Made Simple.
	Yeah, it's a series of books.
	Yeah.
	And this series is called The Kingdom of God Made Simple.
	Yeah.
	You know, I heard a pastor years ago say that the kingdom of God is the most difficult concept in the Bible to understand.
	Because it's this very mysterious kind of symbolic kingdom that Jesus spoke about in parables.
	And so a lot of people believe the kingdom of God is this great mystery that you just can't understand.
	And there is some truth to that.
	But I think if you draw close to the Lord, he will explain and reveal his kingdom to you.
	So that's what I do.
	My books in the series Kingdom of God Made Simple.
	There's Divine Healing Made Simple, Hearing God's Voice Made Simple, Seeing in the Spirit Made Simple.
	Now there's Traveling in the Spirit Made Simple.
	And probably the next book to come out in the series will be Power and Authority Made Simple.
	I've got a few more books planned after that.
	I think probably going to be seven or eight, maybe nine books in the series altogether.
	So yeah, Traveling in the Spirit.
	Just an insanely cool book.
	The most difficult book I've written so far.
	It was like pushing a meal up a ladder, getting that book written.
	That's just because there's really no reference.
	I mean, if you think about it.
	Not much.
	Some of the other books, you know, Healing Made Simple, Seeing in the Spirit, you know, there have been other people who have wrote books about seeing.
	So you can kind of draw bits and pieces and then simplify it.
	And, you know, even with things like Healing and Seeing in the Spirit and Hearing God's There's tons of people teaching on it, even if they haven't written books.
	You know, Sean Boltz and Chris Vallotton and all these guys are really great teachers, and so I learned a lot from other people on healing and seeing in the Spirit.
	But there aren't a lot of people teaching or writing on traveling in the Spirit, so it really came down a lot to studying the Scriptures.
	And once I got this kind of the biblical foundation down, I was like, okay, I got that part done.
	I did a lot of crowdsourcing and asking for testimonies, which you provided one of the coolest testimonies in the book.
	Well, thank you so much.
	And it was so funny because I completely forgot that I shared an experience, which we're going to talk about.
	I know, which we're going to talk about.
	Did you not know that your testimony was going to show up in the book?
	No, I had no idea.
	I had absolutely no idea.
	I was excited about the book being released because I wanted to read about it because I wanted to see what the heck was going on.
	But there's stuff that I didn't share with you that I'm going to share and I've saved for tonight.
	I've been asking these discussion questions on Facebook for years now.
	Just collecting testimonies, answering questions, and kind of group discussion type things.
	And I've learned a lot from it.
	But your testimony was very interesting to me because it was It was the odd duck.
	Yeah, that's me.
	It was.
	It stood out from all the rest of the testimonies, because you experience some things that are similar to things people experience when they astral project.
	Yes.
	Not the same, but similar.
	And so, you know, that was one of the big questions I had to answer in the book was, because I get this from so many people.
	I'll tell you, when I write articles on traveling in the spirit, the trolls come out of the woodwork to bash me and say, This is just astral projection.
	It's just new age.
	It's all witchcraft.
	I came to this point where I had to ask myself, honestly, is this astral projection or not?
	You know, I didn't know.
	I mean, I didn't think it was, but the problem is I don't know a lot of people that astral project.
	I've never read any books on it.
	And if you don't know much about that subject, it's easy for you to come to the assumption that maybe it is astral projection.
	I mean, how do you really know?
	So, I knew that was one of the questions I had to answer.
	Interestingly enough, your testimony gave me a really good story that I could use to compare the things that people experience when they astral project.
	And I just went side by side, and you know, you can see there's some similarities, but you can also see the differences.
	It's very interesting because I just went to a women's conference and at this women's conference I ran into this pastor friend of mine.
	And I was so excited to tell her about your book.
	And I couldn't, I was like wondering, Lord, why am I telling her about this book?
	And I said, and it was so funny, I said, because I'm in this book too.
	And I said, and he really does a comparison about astral projection and like what I experienced.
	And she goes, oh, I used to astral project.
	And it just completely, all of a sudden it was like the brakes went.
	Wait a second here.
	So she shared that with me.
	She said that she only did it once and in the time that she did it, it was so scary.
	It was ridiculously scary.
	She never did it again.
	But that was when she was tapping into some New Age stuff.
	This is before she became a Christian.
	Now she's a pastor, and she's a seer, and she's a prophet, and so she's doing all this really cool stuff, but she's doing it with God.
	But I think it's very interesting that people have been fascinated.
	See, I've never been fascinated with it.
	Okay, so this is the first thing that I did not share with you.
	One of the first times that I can remember where my spirit left my body was when I was at this church.
	I was at this church in Florida that I was attending, and it was a Southern Baptist Church.
	Like, it's not the worship that you see nowadays, okay?
	This is like old-time hymns, but the thing about worship is worship is an act, and I didn't understand it then.
	But I do kind of understand it now.
	So your whole body can participate in worship.
	And there were times that when I would be worshiping and singing that I actually would feel my spirit floating above the entire congregation.
	And I was so afraid.
	I'm like, I'm not going to open my eyes because if I look down and I see people sitting in the chairs, I'm going to really freak out.
	So, but I would be hovering up in the ceiling and I felt myself up there.
	And it happened not every single time, but it happened on more than one occasion, but I never ever understood it.
	So apparently my spirit always was very free to, I guess, leave the vessel.
	I guess.
	Yeah.
	I've heard some of your stories and you said that you've That happens to you a lot at night.
	Yes.
	Not a lot, but fairly often when you get sucked, hoovered up out of your body.
	Well, that was a very unique experience because usually, let me just give you guys a backstory just so you understand what we're talking about.
	There was a day I wasn't feeling good.
	My husband said to me three times, why don't you go take a nap?
	So I did.
	And I'm like half a week, half asleep, when all of a sudden I feel this hum.
	And it's like a vibration.
	Now, this has happened to me before while I've been sleeping.
	I feel this hum.
	And at first I was thinking, and this is after I got filled with the Holy Spirit.
	So at first I thought, oh my gosh, I'm being abducted by aliens because this was the only thing.
	This was the only thing I could equate.
	I'm like, oh my gosh, there must be aliens here because I feel this hum.
	And all of a sudden I would feel my spirit leave my body.
	And it would kind of hover.
	And then all of a sudden sucked.
	And there was one time that I actually could feel myself.
	I would come in, come out, come in, come out.
	And it was almost like my spirit went on top of my body.
	And it happened like many, many times.
	And I still am like – I wasn't afraid, but I really couldn't move.
	So I was like, well, if it's an alien thing, I can't really do anything anyway because I can't move.
	But I wasn't afraid.
	So I think that's really important.
	But this one particular time that I was taking this nap, again, I heard this humming.
	I felt my body.
	I felt my spirit come out of my body.
	And then all of a sudden, I was gone.
	But this is the key thing.
	I actually went someplace and I saw it.
	And what I saw, I was in, it looked like I was in some sort of a bathhouse.
	So I could see the wall and I could see these five spigots that were coming out of the wall where you would put the water.
	And I saw this big like silver basin.
	And in this silver basin, it almost looked like a food trough for animals.
	That's what it looked like.
	And there was this very, very thin piece of metal.
	And I knew that's where you put your soap.
	And there was a person, there was a woman on my left and there was a woman on my right.
	And I could see that they actually had these like things covering their face, almost like veils.
	So I surmised that I was in India.
	That's what I thought.
	So all of a sudden I heard the Lord say, put your finger in the water.
	So I did.
	I put my finger into the water and I saw all the white push, because the water was like this milky, milky white.
	It looked like milk.
	So as soon as I put my finger into the water I could actually see the milk separate and I could see clear water.
	Then I heard the Lord say, now drink it.
	I didn't like scoop down like gently and my whole head went into the water.
	I just remember my whole head.
	So I don't know if somebody pushed me into the water or but I went into the water and so but when I came up I could feel the water like dripping off of my face.
	I could feel my hair like sticking to my head.
	I could feel like the wetness of it and I could hear the women squealing in not fear but in excitement and whoosh!
	I was back in my bedroom.
	I was like, what was that?
	I'm like, that was kind of crazy.
	So at first I thought it was a dream.
	But the interesting thing about this, about a dream is I don't think that you can dream something that's not real.
	So I investigated the sink and I actually found it.
	So they do make us think like that, which to me was like super shocking.
	But I shared that dream with you and you went, oh, you just traveled out of your body.
	You were doing some spiritual traveling.
	I'm like, wait, what?
	And I think that I shared that story with you when we first started to get to know each other, right before you did my first show, correct?
	Yep, you sure did.
	Yeah.
	And that's when you started to talk about traveling in spirit.
	I'm like, wait, what is that?
	That's how it happens with most people.
	People have these dreams and they have these experiences and they go places and they feel their spirit getting sucked out of their body or they have a dream where they are in a foreign country and there's people talking some language you don't understand.
	Kind of write it off as just a weird dream.
	So what's the difference though?
	How do you know?
	Ah, see?
	Now we're going to go into the book.
	How do you know?
	Part of it is perspective.
	I have these conversations with people all the time who just don't understand what dreams are.
	They refuse to believe what dreams are, according to the Bible.
	What they say is, well, you know, a lot of people just dream things that their conscious mind is thinking of, that come from their soul, things like that.
	Well, that's not what the Bible says dreams are.
	You know, when you look in the Bible, you see that in dreams, angels are always appearing to people in dreams, and they're receiving heavenly revelation.
	And a lot of times in dreams and in visions and trances, people are being taken places.
	They're going to heaven.
	They're getting a revelation.
	They're traveling around different parts of the world.
	I take my understanding of dreams from the Bible, and from my own experiences.
	What I found out in the last year is I'm traveling in my dreams a lot, and I'm praying for people to be healed, and I'm not aware of it.
	Until I go on Facebook in the morning, and one of my friends says, hey, you showed up in a dream last night, and you were praying for my shoulder.
	And when I woke up this morning, my shoulder was healed.
	That's awesome!
	Cool, I'm out doing healing ministry while I'm sleeping, you know?
	And I've got a lot of testimonies like that.
	I have been fortunate in that I'm in touch with all these people and they have these interesting stories to tell.
	Like, hey, you came and visited me in a dream and you said this and you said that.
	And I'm like, wow, that's crazy.
	Have you read my latest blog post?
	Because that's exactly what I'm teaching on.
	And they're like, no, I haven't read anything on your website in like months.
	And then they'll go and like, yeah, that's what you were talking about in the dream.
	So, I have all these experiences where I have some kind of experience, or some interesting thing, and then somebody else says, you know, yeah, yeah, I had something that happened that kind of confirmed that.
	There are other things, too.
	Like, in the book, there's a testimony of this man.
	He sent me a private message on Facebook.
	It was a prayer request.
	He had a dislocated thumb, and he wanted healing.
	So, I start, I'm asking him, dislocated thumb, you know, how did it happen?
	Well, I had this dream, and in the dream, I went to some country in Southeast Asia, I think it might have been China, and there were these people, and they're wearing these hats, and they were talking in this language, and we're working on this heavy equipment, and we're putting metal in this machinery, and kick back, the door opened up suddenly and smashed his hand, and that's when we got a dislocated thumb.
	In a dream.
	So, I said, wait a minute, you're telling me that in a dream, You went to some foreign country, you're working with people you didn't know, on heavy equipment, and a door flies open and hits you in the thumb, and you wake up with a dislocated thumb, and he said, yeah, that's what happened.
	Can you pray for me to be healed?
	And I was like, yes, I will pray for you to be healed, but I want to know more about the story.
	So it turns out, yeah, he got a dislocated thumb while he was traveling in the spirit while he was asleep, and I prayed, and the next morning he was expecting that his thumb would be healed, but it wasn't.
	The healing of his thumb actually manifested later on that same day.
	But to me, it was interesting because this guy gets a physical injury while he's traveling in a dream.
	Now, how do you get a physical injury in a dream unless you are actually at the place that you were dreaming about?
	These kind of experiences, I keep getting these messages from people asking, what is going on?
	You know, I had this experience.
	I thought it was a dream.
	I traveled someplace.
	And I'm like, well, you probably actually traveled there in your spirit, and you actually probably met those people, and you probably did pray for them, and you probably did give them the Bibles, and those are the kind of things that people have these experiences in.
	So, the more of them that I hear, the more of these testimonies I hear, the more I'm coming to the understanding that these are not just dreams.
	Our spirit is traveling a lot more than we realize, and God is just teaching us what it's all about and what He wants to use it for.
	I actually read this book.
	It was by a nun.
	And somebody gave it to me.
	They said, oh, you need to read this book.
	It's about this nun.
	She gets the gift of healing, which she doesn't want to use, but God really kind of makes her use.
	And there's this part where she talks about that she goes to this conference.
	And she's at this conference and this woman comes over to her and she goes, Oh my gosh, Sister Bridget, Sister Bridget.
	She said, Thank you.
	Thank you so much for last night.
	And she's like, I'm sorry, do I know you?
	And she says, Sister, you came to my room last night.
	Don't you remember I was going to kill myself?
	And she says, um, she says, You know what?
	I'm just a little lightheaded.
	Let me just go get something to drink and I'll be right back.
	She actually leaves and she goes finds a corner and she starts talking to God.
	And she's like, what is this?
	You're, you're using me while I sleep?
	He says, it's my gift.
	I'll use it when I want.
	And she says, how dare you?
	He said, are you tired?
	He goes, your spirit doesn't sleep, just your body.
	He said, so I can still use my gift while you sleep.
	Now, Billy Brim has talked about it.
	Also, Gloria Copeland has talked about it on their show when she's had Billy Brim on.
	They have said that they travel out of their spirit and they pray for people and heal people while they sleep.
	Now, these are people who are very well known.
	Yeah, it's a lot more common than people realize.
	I got a testimony the other day from a woman who said, Yeah, so check this out, my brother gets sick, he goes in the hospital, I'm working, I can't go see him, and she says I'm praying for him to be healed, and I see him in a vision, I can see him, like he's in this hospital bed, and she said in her mind, in a vision, she could see him, right?
	So, the next day, she's off work, she goes to visit her brother, and she shows up there, and the nurse goes, oh, you're back!
	Oh, that was so nice of you to stop by yesterday, you're such a sweet person.
	This lady's like, what are you talking about?
	I wasn't here.
	And the nurse is like, no, no, you were here.
	You came in, you were visiting your brother and we talked and you were praying for him.
	And she's like, I was working yesterday.
	I was not here in the hospital.
	But the nurse swears she saw her and talked to her in the hospital.
	I receive testimonies like that all the time from people.
	Well, I mean, even in the Bible, because I think that's one of the things that you wrote in your book, you know, Traveling in the Spirit Made Simple, is you kind of go into some of the biblical references you've discovered.
	So can you share some of those things?
	The two cats you really want to check out if you're interested in learning about traveling in the spirit.
	I love that cat!
	Is Elisha and Elijah.
	These guys are ninjas.
	I'm not even kidding.
	I love it.
	So if you start looking at the life of Elisha and Elijah, you realize that God was supernaturally moving these guys around all over the place.
	When Elisha meets Obadiah on the road, he tells Obadiah, hey, go tell Ahab this is where I am.
	If he's looking for me, he can find me here.
	And Obadiah says, I'm not going to go tell Ahab anything because as soon as I do, the Spirit of the Lord is going to pick you up and take you someplace else.
	And when Ahab comes to find you and doesn't find you there, he's going to kill me.
	See, Obadiah knew that Elijah was being moved all over the place, traveling in the Spirit, physically and in the Spirit.
	Elisha was doing a lot of the same stuff.
	It's the healing of Naaman, Syrian general.
	So Naaman gets healed, and the general wants Elisha to come out so he can talk to him.
	Elisha won't come out.
	He sends a servant.
	Servant goes, talks to the general, Naaman.
	He offers the prophet silver and gold.
	Prophet says, no, I'm good.
	I don't need any.
	But the servant decides he wants them, so he goes and he catches up to Naaman, gets a bunch of silver and clothing, stashes it, and then goes back to the house of Elisha.
	Elisha says, where were you?
	And the servant says, I wasn't anywhere.
	And then Elisha says, no, no, you were.
	Don't you know that my spirit followed you when you went back to meet the general?
	Elisha was traveling around, he was eavesdropping, following his servants around.
	When Israel was at war with Syria, the Syrian king was getting irritated because Israel always seemed to know their battle plans, always knew their troop placements.
	So the king said, who's the traitor?
	There's got to be a traitor in the camp.
	Someone is giving Israel information.
	And his servants said, there is no traitor.
	The prophet of the Lord knows the things that you speak in your bedchamber.
	And he tells the king of Israel.
	Right.
	Prophets are going into The Syrian king's quarters, eavesdropping, listening in on the Spirit, and then going back and telling the king what's going on.
	And this is all throughout the Old Testament.
	So, you know, when people ask me, where is that in the Bible?
	Well, it's there.
	Just go look for it.
	In the New Testament, it happens to... You know, I had this guy on a Facebook thread that was talking about traveling in the Spirit.
	And this guy knew better than to say, traveling in the Spirit isn't in the Bible.
	He knew it was.
	So what he said was, None of the disciples of Jesus had a regular practice of traveling in the Spirit.
	You know, it would be okay if you could demonstrate that any of the disciples of Jesus were doing this on a regular basis.
	Not that it was just happening once or twice, because he knew that Paul got taken up into the heavens.
	So I said, have you read the book of Revelation?
	And no answer.
	Yeah.
	I was like, right.
	So the entire book of Revelation is essentially the revelation given to John while he was traveling in the Spirit.
	The whole book.
	And it's likely, I think, that John was one of those mystic people who had learned to travel in the Spirit and learned to engage God and engage the realms of Heaven.
	And the book of Revelation is just one of those experiences that he had.
	I think that John probably did have a lot of mystical traveling in the Spirit experiences.
	I can't say it for a fact, but I suspect he probably did.
	Well, I think a lot of them did.
	I mean, they definitely, they saw things in the spirit.
	And I think that's another thing, too.
	If you haven't gotten your spiritual eyes open, because that's one of the first things that you mention in your book, is that you really need to see things in a spiritual level to make that experience much more memorable.
	Right.
	It is helpful if you have an ability to see in the spirit, to see angels and demons and to see the realms of glory.
	It's not necessary.
	I've been taking people to the courts of heaven a little bit more.
	So glad you brought this up.
	I know.
	How can you talk about traveling the spirit and really not talk about the courts of heaven, right?
	Well, that and also being in the throne room of heaven.
	And I think that's the biggest thing is that, okay guys, I'm just going to say this.
	If you are a son or daughter of God, guess what?
	You actually have a birthright to go.
	So if you ever question, can I go to heaven before I die?
	Heck yeah!
	You have a birthright.
	It's part of your inheritance.
	You can go where your daddy is.
	Okay, continue.
	Yeah.
	One of the really significant passages that opened the door for me was the passage where Jesus is talking about being the door, the door to the Father.
	He's having a discussion with Thomas.
	He says, I'm going to leave, and where I go, you know, and the way you know.
	And Thomas says, Lord, we do not know the way.
	We do not know where you're going.
	How can we know?
	And Jesus, he explains to him that I am the door.
	I am the way.
	I am the truth and the life.
	I am your access to the Father.
	I'm your access to heaven.
	And he said, I'm going to prepare a place for you that where I am, you may be also.
	So where was he going?
	He was going to heaven.
	What was he going to do?
	Prepare a place for them.
	When did he want them to go?
	Pretty darn quick.
	I mean, if you look at the way that that whole conversation is constructed in the Greek, this wasn't something that Jesus was saying, when you die and your body goes back into the ground, you can then go into heaven.
	No, no.
	What he was telling Thomas and the disciples is, here's the plan.
	Heaven has had restricted access up until now, but when I go to the cross, when I die and I'm resurrected, I'm going to open heaven so you guys can come here and hang out and learn about my kingdom, learn about the government, learn about your destiny, learn to administrate my government.
	So that's what it's about.
	That's what he was trying to teach them.
	We've kind of lost that over the years.
	When we understand what the importance of being able to access heaven, I think that people will say, wait a second, there's something that I can get when I go there?
	Like for the courtroom of heaven, I mean, you can get stuff removed.
	Hot diggity, dog diggity.
	So why don't you talk about like some of that.
	I was doing this emotional healing and deliverance session with a friend a couple days ago.
	She's got a demon and none of my emotional healing stuff was working.
	And this is really driving me crazy because my emotional healing protocol that I use normally works really well, but this woman didn't have any of the trauma that most people have.
	She didn't have a lot of abuse.
	She didn't have, you know, sexual abuse or physical abuse or verbal abuse.
	I'm trying, I'm digging through her past and I'm trying to come up with something that would be a doorway for the enemy to come in.
	I can't find anything.
	So I finally thought, okay, let's go to the court of heaven and find out what's going on.
	So I asked her, have you ever been to the court of heaven?
	She goes, Well, no.
	She said, I've thought about it, but I don't think I'd be able to see anything.
	See, she is a person who sees a lot in the spirit, but for the last 10 years, everything she sees is darkness.
	She sees evil spirits.
	She sees perverted sexual images.
	She sees all kinds of dark things that she doesn't want to see.
	That's a big tip off for people who have a calling and a gifting to operate in those realms through what they see.
	A lot of times the enemy will see and understand what their destiny is and what their calling is, and he will pervert it to get them to shut it down.
	Interesting.
	It's really common.
	It's like what Blake Healy happened to him.
	He wrote about that in The Veil.
	Blake was able to see demons and angels from the time he was, you know, one or two years old, and he had always been able to see everything.
	And for the first, I don't know, six or seven years of his life, all he ever saw was demons.
	Demons are coming into his bed at night.
	In his bedroom, tormenting him and all this horrible stuff.
	Satan was trying to get him to shut it down, but he came under the teaching of some people from Bethel, and they showed him how to use it.
	So it was pretty cool.
	So I'm talking to this gal about emotional healing, and I said, well, let's just go to the Court of Heaven.
	And she said, well, I don't know how to do that.
	And I said, okay, well, it's really simple.
	Here's what I'm going to have you do.
	I'll walk you through the process, and you just tell me what you see, what you hear, what you feel, what you sense.
	So what is going on in the court of heaven?
	You can sense in many different ways.
	You can feel an accusation.
	You can see things that are written in books.
	You can see demons appear.
	You can hear things that demons or the judge are saying.
	It's a simple process of, and this is what I told her, I said, just a half a dozen steps.
	So just, I'm going to walk you through it.
	I said, here's what I want you to say.
	Just repeat after me.
	I say, Judge, I ask the court of accusation to be convened.
	So she said that, and I said, what do you see?
	And she said, well, I see a big room.
	And there's like a bench and a table and some judge sitting at the bench.
	And I said, right, so you're, that's the court.
	And I said, now ask the judge to have your accuser appear.
	So she said that, and I said, what do you see?
	She goes, oh, well, there's, there's a demon over here to the side of me.
	And it's yelling and screaming and ranting, and I said, right, what is it saying?
	She told me some of the things it was saying.
	I said, well, those are the accusations that it's bringing against you.
	This woman had schizophrenia, by the way.
	It was her diagnosis.
	The doctor said she had a foreign psychosis because she heard voices a lot, she heard demons, and she would see what most medical people would say, hallucinating.
	So she's seeing demons, she's seeing angels, she's seeing all kinds of things in the spiritual world.
	Tell a doctor you're seeing that.
	They're going to say you're hallucinating.
	They're not trained to deal with people who are actually seeing in the spirit.
	So she heard the accusation of schizophrenia.
	And I said, okay, so you have, you're in court.
	You have called your adversary.
	You have heard the accusation.
	The next step is agree with the accusation.
	You never dispute the accusation.
	So I just said, just say, I agree with the accusation.
	Matthew six, Jesus said, agree with your accuser quickly while you're on the way.
	Right.
	So she did that.
	And then I said, OK, ask for the judge to render a verdict against the spirit, commanding it to leave.
	And I said, oh, ask for a decree of divorce from the spirit.
	So she did that.
	And then she said, I'm seeing something like a rolled up piece of paper being held in front of me.
	I'm like, that's a scroll.
	Grab it and just make a prophetic act and put it inside your spirit.
	So she got a verdict and she got a scroll and didn't even ask for it.
	The judge just gave it to her.
	And then I said, OK, now you have to enforce the verdict, which means you have a decree of divorce.
	The spirit has no right to harass and torment you.
	The judge has said it needs to leave you alone.
	And if the spirit continues to harass you, you can now take the spirit back to court and make the spirit face contempt of court charges and ask the judge to render judgment against the spirit.
	Very quick, but I'll tell you a couple of things that happened with her that were interesting.
	One is, The demon was manifesting in her like crazy while we were doing this.
	Now the demon did not manifest much at all.
	And I was on Skype with her for about an hour and until we went to court and then it started manifesting like crazy.
	That thing did not want to go to court.
	The entire time that she's trying to see and hear what's going on in the court, the demon is manifesting and the demon is yelling and screaming things and trying to block her vision so she can't see what's going on.
	Because the demon knew if I go to court, it's not good.
	So I'm going to try to throw all the things I can to distract her from getting in front of the court.
	Didn't work.
	Although she was having difficulty, some difficulty hearing me because the demon was screaming and yelling to her all the time.
	And her face was contorting and twitching and her arm was making involuntary movements.
	And the demon was hissing and screaming and like meowing like a cat while we were doing this.
	It was just, it was, A bit distracting, but the cool thing was she was able to, for the first time, go into the court, understand what it's about and get a verdict.
	And I've been doing this more with people who need, you know, deliverance or emotional healing or when they've, when they've received prayer and they don't seem to be making any progress.
	Now, one of my strategies is I just tell them, look, you probably need to go to the court of heaven and find out if there's an accusation against you.
	And there usually is.
	And if you get it dealt with.
	You can usually get the problem resolved.
	Yes.
	And, you know, it's interesting because when Dave and I first, when we actually met in person when he was on Sid Roth, it was so crazy because I asked you about the courts of heaven.
	I don't know why I asked about the courts of heaven, but you gave me a very quick little, like, little, okay, this is what's going to happen.
	This is what you do.
	And that was it.
	And I was like, okay, I'm... It's not complicated.
	It's not complicated.
	And you've been there.
	You've been there.
	I just recently.
	Yes.
	Well, because my my front passenger.
	No, sorry.
	My front driver's side tire flew off of my car, leaving me just on my axle.
	Like seriously?
	During rush hour traffic at like 540.
	That night, you know, on a major highway.
	Like, that should go to the courts.
	Seriously, like, you can't be doing that kind of stuff to me.
	I mean, I was completely safe.
	I really wouldn't take that to the court.
	You did.
	So what happened?
	Okay.
	Well, this is what happened.
	I said, okay, Lord, I got to go to the courts.
	I got to go to the courts.
	I got to go to the courts.
	And I was like, okay.
	So I was actually driving to work.
	Now, that incident happened on Tuesday.
	From Tuesday to Saturday, I kept asking the Lord to take me to the courts.
	Take me to the courts.
	I'm ready.
	I'm ready to go.
	Let's go.
	So I was driving to work.
	So I'm driving in my car, different car though.
	So I'm driving in my car and I'm just praying in the spirit.
	Next thing you know, I'm in a courtroom because the accusers are already there.
	And it's not just one.
	There's like a bushel of them.
	Yeah, most people report seeing one, but you're the second or third person now that I've talked to who has reported on there was a bunch of them there, which is fine.
	Well, I couldn't, I think, because this needed to be dealt with once and for all.
	So I go to the courtroom, and I'm still driving, so I could still see the road in front of me, okay?
	But in my imagination, because that's where seeing the spirit starts with folks, it's part of your imagination.
	That's why God gave it to us.
	I'm seeing this, and next thing you know, I'm hearing, and I heard the Lord say, how do you plead?
	And I was like, okay, I plead guilty on any and all charges.
	That's what I said, because that's what you told me to say.
	So I'm like, Dave said, agree.
	So I did.
	And I said, however, I said, I asked for mercy and I asked for grace and I asked for forgiveness and I repent for anything that I've done or for anything that I have said and I asked for the blood of Christ to wash my sins clean and I and I throw myself on the mercy of the court.
	That's all I said.
	Okay.
	I'll bet the demons didn't like that.
	I didn't hear them.
	I couldn't hear them.
	Oh, there was a big angel guarding them.
	Yes, there was.
	There was a huge, this angel was huge.
	So all of a sudden I heard.
	If you have never Listeners, if you've never seen Angels, go to the Court of Heaven.
	I almost guarantee you, eventually, you're going to start seeing Angels.
	I rarely do I see Angels, but when I go to the Court, if I ask for this, you know, I want the books to be open, an angel will go and get my book and bring it out and put it on the table.
	Oh, hey, there's an angel!
	Look at that!
	Well, the angel was standing right next to the accusers, and it was big.
	So I heard the Lord say, just like a couple seconds later, I heard, knock guilty.
	But this is what happened next.
	So this is where your imagination versus truth comes forth.
	Because there are certain things that we believe, but there are certain things that we would never believe that God would say.
	But this is what I heard the Lord say.
	He says any and all attacks cease and desist now against Lisa, her ministry, her children, her family, her relationships, her finances, and her destiny.
	Wow, so you got a summary judgment against a lot of accusers.
	Yes.
	Accusing spirits.
	That's cool because a lot of people have to go back over and over and over And deal with one spirit at a time, but you got a lot of them taken care of at once.
	Yes.
	And then he also said, he said, no longer will you block the things that I have prepared.
	And he says, no longer will you put stumbling blocks over the things that I have, the doors I have opened or something like that.
	But it was basically about my destiny.
	That's what I heard.
	Wow.
	Hey, you want to hear something crazy?
	Go ahead.
	Did you know that there are angels that remove stumbling blocks?
	No, I did not know that.
	That's their assignment.
	See?
	They literally go in the spirit and they remove stumbling blocks from your pathway.
	Oh my gosh, I did not know that!
	Okay, so cool!
	Okay, so I'm getting more confirmation.
	The only reason I know that is I listened to this guy who was speaking one time and he had an encounter with these angels and he asked them what kind of angels they were and they said, we're angels that remove stumbling blocks.
	And the guy busted up laughing.
	He's like, Are you serious?
	Oh, that's so funny.
	We're very serious.
	That is our assignment.
	We remove stumbling blocks that the enemy has placed in front of people's divine destiny.
	Wow, that's awesome.
	And that's what the Lord said.
	And then after he said that, he said to the angel, now take them away.
	But after that, then I saw Jesus.
	And so I ran over to Jesus and he hugged me and he said, I did real well.
	And he kissed me on top of my head and we were laughing.
	And then I heard the Lord say, Lisa, approach the bench.
	Okay.
	So now you're in trouble.
	You know, the funny thing is, no, I know because I was like, Oh, so there's something that needs to be said.
	But I wasn't afraid because it says that you go boldly before the Lord.
	I wasn't afraid.
	A lot of people are afraid when they go to court because they don't know what to expect.
	You know, I've been into human courts a lot and I never liked going to court.
	It's always a colossal pain.
	And so it's natural for some people to have some fear and anxiety when they go to court of heaven.
	But just telling you, if you've never done it, you do not need to be afraid if you go to court of heaven.
	Because Jesus is there.
	He's your attorney.
	The father, the judge is there.
	He's on your side.
	He wants to acquit you.
	You know, and the adversary is there and he's under the control of the court.
	So he's not going to do anything to you.
	Right.
	And that's why there was a big angel.
	And they couldn't talk to me either.
	They weren't allowed to talk to me.
	I just knew that.
	I was like, I don't want to see them.
	I'm like, I don't want to see them.
	But when the Lord said to me, Lisa, approach the bench, and I approached the bench, this is what he said to me.
	He said, Lisa, these things were not to punish you, which I was like, huh?
	Okay, that's something else.
	Now, let's take our theology.
	Let's take the religiousness of what we've been told.
	You know, you're being punished because you're out of alignment, or you're being punished for this, or God is giving this.
	No, he said very specifically, he says, you're not being punished.
	I think that was so important for me to hear.
	But he also said, but you need to keep yourself clean.
	You need to forgive quickly.
	You need to not hold things against people.
	You need to, you know, walk in righteousness, walk in love, you know.
	That's basically what we're supposed to do.
	But I think it was, I think that in that moment the Lord wanted to show me that I wasn't being punished by Him.
	But that this is something, see, the devil, it says that the devil roams like a roaring lion, seeking whom he can devour.
	Absolutely.
	And so that's the difference in traveling.
	See, we're able to go and to see what the lion is trying to devour.
	Exactly.
	That's the whole point of going to the court.
	Okay, so here's the thing.
	I've been getting a lot of private messages and questions from people about the courts of heaven.
	Well, that's going to be one of your books.
	Uh, Lydia is editing the book right now.
	Okay.
	In fact, she sent me her first round of edits on the manuscript today.
	Okay.
	I made some corrections and sent it back to her.
	I'm hoping that by Saturday or Sunday we'll have the book available.
	Cool.
	It's a short book.
	That's cool.
	You can read it in about 20-25 minutes.
	It's very simple.
	It just explains the courts.
	It explains why you go there, when you go there, how you go there, what you might see, what you might hear.
	There's a simple protocol that you can follow.
	It tells you exactly what to say and what not to say.
	The cool thing is, and this is what the Lord has shown me, there are two passages in the Bible that you can look at to see what happens to people who do not go to the court of heaven to answer an accusation, and what happens to people who do go to the court of heaven to answer an accusation.
	The two passages are Job chapter 1 and Zechariah 3.
	Okay, people don't think about this, but What happened in Job chapter 1?
	Satan shows up and he's accusing Job.
	He accuses Job of serving God for selfish reasons, right?
	He said, does not Job serve you because you put a hedger on him?
	Basically saying Job's a mercenary.
	He's only serving you because you take care of him.
	If you didn't take care of him, he wouldn't serve you.
	That was his accusation, right?
	This is in heaven where this is happening.
	Probably in either divine counsel or The Court of Accusation.
	I'm guessing maybe the Court of Accusation because he's bringing an accusation against him.
	Yeah.
	What happens?
	Job does not appear to address the accusation.
	Now, God defends Job's honor and says, well, Satan, you know Job is a righteous man.
	There's no one like him on all the earth.
	The problem is Job isn't there.
	He's not there to answer the accusation and he's not there to be acquitted.
	Because here's the deal.
	If you are in an earthly human court situation, your neighbor has an accusation against you.
	Your neighbor says, you broke into my house, you stole my stereo.
	I'm going to have you arrested.
	So they go, they file a police report and the police put out a warrant for your arrest.
	And it goes to court.
	If you appear in court, you have the opportunity to defend yourself and to be acquitted of charges or found guilty.
	Right?
	What happens if you don't appear?
	You go to jail!
	You are found guilty, and there's a bench warrant that is put out for your arrest.
	And they will either force you to appear, or you'll just be arrested and taken to jail.
	In either case, if you appear in court, and you refuse to defend yourself, you're going to be found guilty.
	If you don't appear, you're going to be found guilty.
	Even if you didn't do it, okay?
	Why?
	Because there's an accusation against you that goes unanswered.
	The accusation has to be addressed, right?
	So what's happening with Job is he's being accused.
	Chapter 2, Book of Job, Satan appears back in court.
	He's accusing Job.
	God is like, okay, Satan, you know he's a righteous man.
	Satan's like, got some more accusations against him.
	Job doesn't show up to defend himself.
	He doesn't show up to answer the accusation.
	He doesn't need to defend himself.
	What he needs to do is show up there so that God can exonerate him.
	Because if you don't show up, you can't be exonerated.
	You can't be cleared of the accusations.
	Job gets hammered by Satan.
	Why?
	Because he didn't show up so he could be exonerated of the accusations.
	We never know if the accusations are true because Job never shows up.
	Now, if you go to Zechariah chapter 3, same thing happens, but this time it's to Joshua the high priest.
	And Satan is there and he's accusing Joshua, but this time Joshua is there and Zechariah goes with him as a witness.
	So Zechariah is writing this all down.
	He's watching what happens.
	He's watching Satan accuse Joshua.
	Joshua is dressed in dirty clothing.
	All right?
	So the Lord says to Satan, I rebuke you.
	I refuse to hear your accusations.
	And he has Joshua, the high priest, dressed in new clothing, takes away his unrighteousness and says, see, I'm taking away your sin.
	I'm taking away your unrighteousness, putting in new clothes on you.
	Because Joshua showed up, he could be exonerated of the charges, even though he was guilty.
	So they put a clean turban on his head.
	They put clean clothes on him.
	And then the Lord says to Joshua, if you walk in my ways, if you keep my statutes, I'll give you places to walk here in the heavens.
	And he goes on to tell him what's going to happen if he follows and obeys the command of the Lord.
	Walking in my ways, being righteous.
	Right?
	That's what we were talking about.
	Right.
	What did the judge tell you?
	Same thing.
	You need to walk in my ways.
	Right.
	You need to act in such a way that you don't give the enemy a reason to accuse you.
	Yes.
	Because if you do, you're going to end up back in court.
	Well, that's the whole thing.
	And so I asked the Lord because, you know, we're human.
	Right.
	We are human.
	And so I try, I try, but you know what?
	We are human.
	And so I was like, Lord.
	We're human.
	I'm like, Lord, do I have to come back to court yet?
	Here's the thing.
	Here's what Mike Parsons, and this is the thing, I love Mike Parsons' teaching on the court.
	But he has said, he has said, look, here's the deal.
	If you don't want to spend your life in the court of vacuums, defending yourself, and appearing with these stupid spirits that are going to accuse you of everything that you do, Well, he flipped somebody off and he was cursing this person and he is not being faithful to his wife or whatever.
	Right.
	If you do not want to be in court facing all these accusations, you need to live in the spirit, walk in the spirit, walk in love, and allow your heart to be transformed by the power of the spirit so that you're walking in love and you're not offending and you're giving the enemy no reason to accuse you.
	That's what it's all about.
	Oh, I agree with that.
	The Lord said to me, there's two things we have to do.
	Number one, when we're accused, we need to show up so he can exonerate us.
	Number two, we need to live in such a way that the enemy has nothing to accuse us of.
	Right, but there is nothing in common with us.
	That's the whole thing, you know?
	But, again, we are human, and it's like, seriously?
	Sometimes?
	And this is what the Bible says.
	If we sin, we have an advocate with the Father.
	Correct.
	What is an advocate?
	It's an attorney!
	That's right.
	It's in 1 John 3.
	It says, when we sin, we have an attorney with the Father, Jesus the righteous.
	What does that mean?
	It means when you sin, Go to the court of accusation, let Jesus be your attorney, let his blood be your defense, and get rid of that thing, and keep on going.
	You know what?
	This is the thing that gets me.
	Okay, so what you said... Contempt of court.
	Thank you!
	I'm going back for contempt of court.
	Because, see, that's the thing.
	If the Lord said, no longer will you Attack.
	Relationships.
	Okay?
	Key word.
	That means people.
	Because, see, that's what the accuser will do.
	So the accuser will go after the people who will want to get you angry so that you become bitter, so that you have all this stuff so that he can go back.
	Right.
	Well, that's exactly what happens.
	I mean, it's a vicious cycle.
	What the enemy does is, yeah, the enemy finds people He finds ways to provoke you to committing sin.
	And then when you do, he takes you to court.
	He goes to the court of accusation and goes, well, guess what happened today?
	And you told them not to do that.
	Dave went and did so-and-so.
	I have an accusation against you.
	You have to just live in such a way that you're not being offended, that you're not lashing out, not reacting to people.
	Don't give the enemy a whole bunch of ammunition they can use against you in court.
	But you're right about the contempt of court thing is big, because if you get a decree of divorce against an evil spirit, that doesn't necessarily mean that spirit is never going to come around and harass you again.
	Right.
	The wager that the spirit is going to make is that he can come back and continue to harass you, and you're not going to do anything about it.
	You're going to fall right back into the behavior And the enemy's going to have to get to play you again like he did before.
	The way to end that cycle is... Get a restraining order?
	No, you already have one.
	Okay.
	You have a decree of divorce, restraining order, no contact order, same thing.
	Okay.
	What you do is, when that spirit comes back, you ask the judge to convene the court and you say, I want the spirit to face contempt charges.
	And your honor, I would like you to render judgment on the spirit and see that the judge can can punish the spirit and order torment.
	He can also send the spirit to the abyss.
	And if it goes to the abyss, it cannot come around and harass and torment little people like us anymore.
	Then it is out of the game.
	Okay.
	So demons take a risk when they come back and mess with us after they've been told not to, because we can take them back to court and they make them face contempt charges.
	Remember when Jesus was dealing with the demoniac?
	Yes.
	And he had the legion of demons.
	Yes.
	Right?
	And what did the demons say?
	Don't send us to the abyss.
	That's right.
	Have you come to judge us before our time?
	Let us go into the pigs.
	We don't want to go to the abyss.
	No, that's a bad place.
	That is a bad place.
	We can't mess with people if you send us there.
	Right.
	So Jesus said, fine, go into the pigs.
	That allowed the demons to continue roaming the earth and stay in play.
	But Jesus could have sent them to the abyss and they would have been done for.
	Yeah.
	They would not have been able to go back on the earth and harass people.
	But the judge can order that.
	So demons, we have a little bit of leverage against them.
	I mean, you could ask the judge, say, I want this thing sent to you this.
	Yeah.
	I'm sick and tired of this thing harassing me.
	And the judge can do it every once.
	Okay.
	I'm just letting you know.
	I'm definitely putting that in my memory bank, trust me.
	But there are other places besides the courtrooms that we can travel in the spirit to in the heavenlies.
	One of them is a different court, which is a court of records, right?
	Or the court of books, is that what it's called?
	Court of scribes.
	Okay, so what is that?
	Well, the court of scribes is where everything's recorded.
	All the books that are written in heaven, the scrolls of destiny, all the Recordings of your entire life and everybody's life, all of those things are all being recorded in the Court of Scribes.
	There's scribes there.
	They're just writing and writing and writing and writing, and I haven't been there, I don't think.
	Okay.
	But Mike Parsons has been there.
	Yes.
	I remember him saying, you can go there to this Court of Scribes.
	Don't go there if you're just curious.
	If you're going to go there, go there on an assignment and know why you're going there.
	I mean, it's not like it's a super dangerous place, but In the different courts in heaven, you want to know what your purpose is for going.
	You don't just go barge into a courtroom on earth because you're curious and you want to look around.
	Right, because then you could be held in contempt of court, right?
	Well, you know, there may be something going on there that you're not actually supposed to be privy to.
	Okay.
	However, you can ask for assignments, and you can ask the Lord if you're supposed to go someplace.
	Like, another court is the Court of Chancellors.
	You don't want to go to the Court of Chancellors unless you've been invited there and given chancellorship.
	That is something that we can walk in as we mature as believers, as we become mature sons of God.
	As the Lord told me in a dream one night, as we mature, our sphere of authority increases.
	Interesting concept.
	A lot of people don't know this, but your authority can increase or decrease.
	And power does not increase or decrease, really.
	We all have access to power.
	Even people who work in, you know, Satanism and New Age, they can use power.
	Power is not relational.
	Power is energy.
	It's out there in the universe and anyone has access to it.
	But authority?
	Authority is relational.
	You can only receive authority if it's given to you by someone you have a relationship with.
	And just like in the military, you can get promoted, right?
	In the military, you can go from being A captain, to a major, to a general.
	Higher authority, right?
	Same thing in the Kingdom of God.
	God can give us higher and higher levels of authority.
	As we are faithful, and as we mature, as we understand and we're doing right with the authority we have, He can promote us and raise us in higher levels of authority.
	It's all an issue of walking in relationship with God.
	Authority is relational.
	The closer you walk with the Lord, the higher your authority becomes.
	Like, the Court of Chancellors is a place where you're now going to be doing judicial and legislative work for the Kingdom of Heaven.
	And that's something most people are not prepared to do.
	You have to understand a little bit about the Court, a little bit about the realms of Heaven, and a little bit about what your divine destiny and your mandates are.
	And so that's something we can look forward to.
	But, you know, eventually we'll be going there, hopefully.
	Well, and I think that that's the whole point is that, you know, traveling with our spirit because, look, Jesus was able to go to different places.
	He was able to travel.
	He was able, he walked on water.
	I mean, come on, guys.
	Like, seriously, you know, Jesus walked on water, but so did Peter.
	I don't care if it was one step.
	He still walked.
	Well, if you look even back at Enoch.
	Oh, yeah.
	What did it say about Enoch?
	Enoch walked with God.
	What does that mean?
	I think that means that Enoch lived in the realm of the Spirit fairly regularly, as well as walking in the earth.
	So his physical body was here on the earth.
	His spirit was often walking in heaven with the Lord, in different courts, in the different places in heaven.
	Wisdom Heights, all these other places.
	Well, same with Elijah.
	I mean, not Elijah, Isaiah.
	Isaiah went to, he went to the Throne Room.
	Because when he got there, he was like, wait a second.
	You know, and he said, I don't want to say anything because my mouth is unclean.
	And that's when he saw the cherub come over and drop a hot coal into his mouth.
	I mean, so these are biblical truths that have been written.
	These are not just, you know, fantasies that people had.
	Look, either you believe the Bible is real or you don't.
	That's really what it comes down to.
	So if biblical travel, if spiritual travel is in the Bible, then God hasn't changed his mind.
	He still does it.
	And we live in a better covenant.
	We should be able to do more.
	Than they did, probably.
	Well, and the other thing, too, is that we can go and worship in the throne room.
	I mean, I have been to the throne room.
	I have, and I have, I have, I have seen heaven.
	I've been to heaven, which is like a, you know, what's so crazy, Dave, is that God is so good.
	Like, just like you gave me that confirmation about removing the stumbling blocks.
	See, God will always confirm.
	He will show you that what you saw, what you heard was truth.
	Because the fact that you said that about the stumbling blocks, okay, that is proof that what I heard is a reality.
	That is true.
	That somebody else has said that this has happened.
	The fact that when I went to heaven and I saw that the sky was pink, it kind of was like, why is the sky pink?
	And then somebody said, hey, did you ever see Cat Kerr?
	Do you know who she is?
	I'm like, um, I think so.
	And they're like, yeah, you know, her hair is pink.
	Do you know why her hair is pink?
	I'm like, no.
	She says because the sky in heaven is pink.
	And so she dyed her hair pink.
	I'm like, are you kidding me?
	And they said, oh, you didn't know that?
	No, I did not know that.
	Well, one of the cool places that people will want to visit eventually, speaking of angels that remove stumbling blocks and all those other things, there is a court of angels.
	Ooh.
	That you can go to.
	Okay.
	Okay.
	The Court of Angels is where you go to get angels to work with you and partner with you on fulfilling your divine destiny.
	Huh.
	So do you need like a hall pass to get in there?
	Yes, you do.
	What you need is, you need to understand what your divine destiny is.
	Because if you go to the Court of Angels, you're going to ask for specific angels to partner with you Who wanted to help you work out your destiny.
	So then you should go to the Book of Scribes.
	You should go to the Court of Scribes first.
	And that's what happens is you go to one court and you get a verdict.
	You get some documents.
	You get some scrolls from the court that tell you what you should be doing.
	You can go to this Court of Scribes and have it all transcribed and written down in the record.
	This is what Mike Parsons explained one time.
	He said, then you go to the Court of Chancellors.
	And you have it sealed.
	Okay.
	And you go to the court of angels and you get angels assigned to help you walk out that mandate.
	Huh!
	All these different courts and different realms of heaven exist for different purposes.
	Like I said, as you mature and as you start to walk in higher levels of authority, you're going to start doing all these things, but it's a process.
	And for most people who are not familiar yet, go to the court of accusation, face your accusers and get some verdicts and get some freedom from the obstacles that the enemy's been placing in your way.
	As you get more familiar with the judge and the courts and interacting with Jesus, I mean, really funny thing is a lot of people have never seen Jesus until they go to the court of accusation.
	And they're like, wow, there's Jesus standing there.
	Like I've never seen him before.
	the first time they saw him.
	And that, I think, is the other thing, too.
	Like, we can see Jesus.
	And it's funny, the first person, I'll never forget this, a good friend of ours, Jeremy Mangersheen, was talking about how he went to India and how he prayed for this woman and this woman saw Jesus.
	And I thought, Lord, that is so, so cool.
	Well, not too long after that, I actually prayed over this woman who was suffering with anorexia.
	And so the Lord said, bring her to the mirror so that she could see herself.
	And I was thinking, because one of the things about anorexia is they don't like to look at themselves.
	It's like a big thing.
	You see yourself as fat.
	Exactly.
	Right.
	So I bring her over to the mirror thinking, okay, God's going to do something really cool and let her see herself in a different light.
	So I said, what do you see?
	And she's telling me how she sees a sad person and how ugly and this and that.
	So I put my hand on her and I pray.
	And I said, okay, now what do you see?
	And then all of a sudden she goes, I see him.
	I'm like, who?
	And I'm like, wait, who do you see?
	She says, I see him.
	And then all of a sudden I hear in my head, I hear the Lord go, she sees me.
	And so I'm trying to wrap my head around this and I'm thinking to myself, and the Lord said, now I'm smiling at her.
	And I said, what is he doing?
	She goes, he's smiling at me.
	Dave, I was completely blown away by this.
	Cause I was like, she is seeing, I have not seen Jesus and you're seeing Jesus.
	And the funny thing is, cause I saw her like a couple of weeks later and I asked her how she was doing.
	She said that one of the things that I, she says, you know, you did something to me and I, and she was really mad at me.
	And I said, I did.
	And she says, yes.
	She says, after you prayed, you kept talking to me about eating these, these, these brownies.
	And she says, and I, I don't like brownies.
	She says, except for these one particular brownies that I could get from, from this one particular store.
	And do you know that my mother went out and bought these one particular And she says, and I can't stop eating them.
	And I, and I said, and the Lord showed me mirrors.
	And I said, I said, do you have mirrors in your house?
	She says, no, I only have this one mirror that I look just for when I put on my makeup.
	And I said, oh, okay.
	And I said, and are you looking in it?
	And she says, she goes, yes.
	She goes, And then sometimes he just comes.
	And I said, excuse me?
	And she says, you know, if I look in the mirror long, she says, he shows up.
	It's quite annoying.
	And so the Lord said to me, He goes, I'm giving her a longer and longer gap.
	So she has to look in the mirror longer before I appear.
	So it's making her stare into the mirror.
	Isn't he Jehovah's Sneaky?
	But see, that's the thing.
	Now she is, she was a new believer.
	And so I prayed over her and she, you know, she, she said this in her prayer and the whole bit, but it's like, so she was able to see like right from the get go.
	Like it wasn't this, you know, she didn't have to go through classes and she didn't have to go to this.
	Like God had something to do right then and there.
	And that's, I think, the cool part about our Father, is that if you need to go to the courtrooms of Heaven, you just start asking Him, take me to the courtrooms.
	He will take you.
	Yeah, it's crazy.
	Like, I get so many testimonies.
	Almost every day I get a testimony from someone who said, okay, so I read your article on your website, and I read your testimony, how you did it, and I said, okay, God, I'm ready.
	And boom!
	They're like, as soon as they said they're ready, boom!
	They're like, I saw this vision.
	I saw the court.
	I saw my accuser.
	There was the judge.
	I saw Jesus.
	And I'm terrified.
	Or, you know, they're like, this one guy said, uh, he appeared in front of this room and this building and there was this door.
	And he said, I knew it was the court.
	And there was a man sitting outside.
	He was a tall man with white hair, skinny man.
	And I said, I can't go in.
	I'm unworthy.
	And he pointed at me and he motioned and said, come inside.
	So the guy goes inside and the judge says, how do you plea?
	And he said, guilty.
	I'm guilty of everything.
	And the judge slammed his gavel and said, I declare you not guilty.
	And he saw his accuser and his accuser was taken away.
	And then the judge came over and had a word with him.
	And he said, the judge cut off of this stuff off of him.
	He said, it was like thick strands of spaghetti.
	He cut it off of him and he picked up and threw it at the accuser's feet.
	He said, don't give the accuser any reason to bring you back here.
	Okay.
	And he said, that was it.
	And he said, I was outside the court and I saw this large angel standing next to me.
	So this guy had never been to court before.
	And I have all these people sharing these testimonies with me.
	They're like, never been there.
	Don't know anything about it.
	And next thing, boom, they see a vision or they have a dream where their eyes are closed and they appear in court and they didn't expect it.
	It just happened.
	So, I think if your spirit is willing, and you give your spirit permission to go there, and you tell the Lord, I'm willing to go there, I want this stuff dealt with, you will start having these experiences.
	Absolutely, and same with even traveling in the spirit.
	Like, not just going to the courtrooms, but if you... Oh yeah, you can go anywhere.
	Absolutely, and you can actually, it's just like Isaiah, here I am Lord, send me.
	Well, there are a lot of places you can go in heaven.
	One of the places I would highly recommend checking out If you have the time, is The Heights of Wisdom.
	There's a lot of cool stuff.
	And if you go to the book of Proverbs, and start reading Proverbs, and you go through, and you start seeing this woman named Wisdom, and she's going through the streets, and she's crying out to people, getting wisdom, I want to give you wisdom, I want to give you understanding, right?
	Well, this is an actual spirit that lives in heaven, and she lives in a place that's called Wisdom's Heights.
	Wait, have you seen her?
	Okay, can you please tell me what she looks like?
	Because I have had, no, no, seriously, I have had many, many dreams about Wisdom.
	All right.
	Is she petite and does she have black hair?
	Oh, no way!
	No!
	Seriously?
	Okay.
	Spirit beings can appear slightly different to different people.
	Okay.
	Everyone's not going to see her the same.
	Okay.
	But if you have read my blog post on my website, it's part of the Bogren novel.
	Okay.
	Called The Seat of Authority.
	No, I have not.
	You have to send that to me.
	Oh my gosh.
	Okay.
	Well, that is an encounter where one of the main characters is having an encounter with wisdom and wisdom is teaching her.
	Okay.
	So my encounters with wisdom, this is going to sound strange, are mostly when I'm writing my books.
	Um, and just give you the backstory.
	So, you know, I'm writing this novel.
	Yes.
	Which is going to be a movie.
	A lot of the scenes, a lot of the scenes in this novel take place in heaven.
	So different realms, different places, throne room, and, uh, The Garden of God and some other places.
	Well, I'm writing this book from visual experiences that I'm having while I sit down at my computer and I ask the Lord, show me what wisdom looks like.
	Show me what her place looks like, where she lives.
	Show me what the paths of wisdom are.
	Because if you read in the book, in the Bible, paths of wisdom, those are the paths around wisdom heights where you walk around and you can talk with her and hang out and learn from her.
	There is actually something like a university at Wisdom's Heights where classes are being taught.
	Right now, you can go there and you can sign up for the classes.
	If you listen to my podcast, I interviewed Kelly.
	I interviewed Kelly Gourley.
	Yes, who's going to be coming on my show.
	I had this experience.
	She goes to Wisdom's Heights.
	She meets Wisdom.
	They start walking around.
	She ends up going up to this overlook, looks over the ocean.
	And there's a big rock wall, and in the rock wall is an amphitheater.
	And the amphitheater is a place where people sit and take classes.
	So she goes over there to the amphitheater, and she and Wisdom are talking, and she goes and sits down on one of the benches, and Jesus comes over and sits down next to her, and they start talking.
	So it turns out John, the Revelator, is teaching a class.
	And Kelly looks over and sees me in the class.
	Oh, that's so funny.
	Along with a couple of her other friends.
	She's like, oh my gosh, Pragmatic's here.
	Oh, Del Hungerford's here, too.
	Oh, that's so funny.
	And she sees Ian Clayton.
	Ian Clayton is there.
	He's teaching classes there.
	Okay.
	He wasn't teaching that class, but she met him and stuff.
	So there's this place in Wisdom's Heights where you can go and take classes in the spirit.
	Ha!
	You can learn from the apostles, from the prophets, from wisdom herself.
	They teach you.
	They give you instruction.
	The stuff that you can do in the heavens is amazing.
	That is so cool.
	I think we have to do another show just on going to heaven.
	No, seriously, because this could be a four-hour show, and I don't even think you could even touch all the cool stuff that happens.
	I mean, even the River of Life that runs from the throne room.
	And I actually saw this light.
	It was light.
	I was like, this is supposed to be like water, but it was light.
	And it looked like it was in a box.
	I was like, huh, okay.
	But it was so interesting, the different things that I saw.
	And I walked into the courtyard, like the door opened and I walked into the courtyard and I saw Abraham.
	I'm like, oh, that's Abraham.
	And then right behind him, I go, oh, that's Joseph.
	And it's like, okay, all right.
	But all this stuff, it's not foreign to us.
	It's like, oh, yeah, that's who it is.
	Because that's where we were before we came here.
	That's where we were.
	Right, exactly.
	Because our spirit has always been, right?
	Well, I don't think our spirit has always been.
	Not in the sense that God has always been.
	God has always been.
	He's the eternal God.
	He was not created.
	He was not born.
	So when he created us.
	We were created, right?
	We were created in the heart of God, as Cat Kerr says.
	And we come out of the Father, the heart of the Father, and the Spirit, and then boom, we go down to the earth.
	Hang out in our little earth suits for a while, then go back up into heaven.
	And then hang out back.
	Yeah, exactly.
	Pretty much.
	But I mean, these are like some of the things, and I just, I just feel like this, this whole thing about traveling in spirit, I think especially... It's a big deal.
	It is.
	It is a huge deal.
	Ever since I published the book, the Lord has been giving me dreams about what he is going to do with us and through us and in us when we get this.
	It's huge.
	It is going to be such a transformational shift.
	You know, there's all these prophetic words out there about shift and acceleration, and the Lord is shifting, and the Lord is accelerating, and the Lord is giving breakthrough.
	Yes.
	All these prophetic words.
	But people don't understand what God is trying to use to do that, okay?
	How is He going to accomplish it?
	He is accomplishing it through people who are learning to travel in the Spirit,
	Learn your identity, to go into the court, deal with the court of accusation, learn who they are, grow into a little more maturity, go into the other courts, into the divine council, into the court of chancellors, into all these other places, get your mandates, find your mountains, start ruling from your mountains, get rid of the giants that are opposing you, deal with the principalities over your territory, get rid of them and displace them.
	See, people don't understand this, the reason why there's all these There's areas like Chicago that's just being shot up with gangs and drugs and violence and killing.
	There's principalities in the heavens over those places that have not yet been dealt with.
	And for the last, I don't know, 30, 40 years, charismatic Pentecostal people have been trying to wage warfare against principalities, but they've been waging warfare from Earth.
	That's right.
	Or they go into the heavens at the realm of the principalities and try to take them on face-to-face.
	That's why we have been so ineffective.
	What God wants to do is to have us operating in the heavens, in the courts, doing warfare from our thrones and our places of authority in the heavens, where we can then effectively war against the principalities that are in a lower realm.
	When we operate from above them, there's no way they're going to hurt us.
	Well, God is sovereign.
	That's the biggest thing.
	I think people always think of, well, God is sovereign, so therefore He allows it.
	No.
	God is sovereign.
	That means that He rules over all things.
	That doesn't mean that we can't go to... No.
	God is sovereign in the sense, in my understanding, that He is the ultimate authority.
	Yes.
	But He has delegated much of that authority to us.
	All the stuff that Jesus did, we're supposed to be doing.
	Right, but that's on an earthly level, right?
	Who did he hand over the keys of the kingdom to?
	Us!
	Yeah!
	We are supposed to be ruling and reigning with him in the heavens, affecting changes in our spheres of influence in the earth by doing it first in the heavens.
	That's when all this stuff about shifting and breakthrough and all this change and transformation that God wants to bring, nearly all of it is going to come when we learn to go into the heavens and do the stuff we're supposed to be doing and we haven't done yet.
	And that's traveling.
	That's traveling with our spirit because our spirit never sleeps.
	Pretty much.
	Yeah.
	And I think that's the other thing, too.
	You know, people are like, well, how do I know?
	Well, your spirit doesn't sleep.
	And so what you said earlier, you just have to give your spirit permission to go do what it has to do.
	First time I did that, Boom!
	My spirit took off.
	I was listening to a Mike Parsons video and he was talking about going into the heavens and getting scrolls and ruling from your mountains and all that stuff.
	Before I even went to sleep, my spirit took off.
	I was aware, vaguely aware, that my spirit just left and went to the heavens to get some scrolls and I was like, okay, awesome.
	And then I went to sleep, same thing, all night long.
	My spirit was in the heavens doing stuff.
	What I did was I gave my spirit permission.
	I said, I give my spirit permission to go into heavens and travel and get stuff done.
	And as soon as I did, bam!
	My spirit took off.
	Yes.
	See, a lot of people have not really submitted themselves to God in that sense.
	You need to submit your spirit to the Spirit of God, to the Holy Spirit.
	You need to let your spirit have permission and reign to go into the heavens and do the stuff that the Holy Spirit wants us to do.
	I have a couple of friends.
	Funny stories where they started to travel, they started to lift off, they could feel their spirit leaving their body, and they chickened out and they were like, no, no, no, I don't want this to happen.
	No, get back here.
	No, I don't want my spirit to leave.
	And boom, they were done.
	It never happened.
	Right.
	Because there's this anxiety and this fear we have, like, oh, I don't want my spirit to go.
	I don't know where it's going to go.
	Well, guess what?
	Your spirit knows where to go.
	Right.
	If you are born again, born of the spirit, Your spirit is going to go to heaven.
	It's not going to be going into the depths of darkness.
	Right.
	It's not going to be astral projecting.
	More than likely, you know, and you can just say to your spirit, hey, you know what?
	You have a very short leash.
	I want you to go to the throne room and nowhere else.
	Right.
	Right now.
	Maybe we'll talk about the courts later, but right now, tonight, you're going to the courtroom, or you're going to the throne room.
	And just give your spirit direction.
	Where it should go, what it should do.
	That's what I did.
	And it's really cool.
	Wait, is that, does that kind of go with that scripture?
	The spirit of the prophet is subject to the prophet.
	Do you know that people have misused that quote?
	Because, because all of a sudden it pops into my head.
	Cause that, that has been used against me.
	That, that exact verse has been used against me.
	It's easy to take that and twist it to serve your own agenda.
	But what it really means, simply means is that your soul Yes.
	It is ultimately in control of what your spirit does and where it goes.
	Right.
	The spirit of the prophet or the apostle.
	Right.
	Or the pastor.
	The spirit.
	Or the teacher.
	Subject to the individual.
	Right.
	So we have a degree of sovereignty and authority over our spirit and we can tell our spirit what to do and where to go.
	My spirit, my spirit had never gone up looking for scrolls and All this other stuff, until I gave it permission to do it.
	Once I did, man, I have been... I take naps and boom, my spirit's gone.
	It's in the heavens doing stuff.
	Always traveling around, but what I had to do at first was give my spirit permission to do it.
	Okay, so what I would love for you to do, Dave, we're not going to do a prayer.
	We're just going to... I'm going to bless the popcorn!
	I'm going to bless that butter!
	I'm going to pray the anointing of God on your coffee.
	No, we're not going to pray, but what I would like you to do is I would like you just to tell people, just to repeat after you, that you're going to give them just how they would say to themselves, what they would say to their spirit.
	It's really simple.
	You can't mess this up.
	This is just all you need to do is say, I give my spirit permission to go to the heavens, and then whatever else you wanted to do, whether you want your spirit to go to the courts of heaven, the court of accusation, to the throne room, to wisdom's heights, wherever you want your spirit to go, give your spirit permission to go there.
	And then watch what happens.
	Well, I hope you know I'm going to Wisdom Heights, because seriously... I want to hear what you find out when you get there.
	Yeah, seriously, because that is so crazy, because I've had so many dreams about wisdom.
	If you're interested in doing this, seriously, go to the book of Proverbs.
	Start reading, and then when you get to like Proverbs chapter 7 and 8 and 9, here's what you do.
	When you get to that section of the scriptures, ask the Lord to take you to show you what wisdom is talking about.
	Okay.
	So you engage the scriptures.
	It's a doorway.
	Okay.
	You say, Okay, Holy Spirit, I want to go and I want to see this.
	I want to go to wisdom.
	So I want to see what wisdom is talking to have her teach me personally what she's talking about here.
	Interesting.
	And that's a really good way to do it.
	Interesting.
	Because she's been in my dreams.
	She's been in my dreams on like several occasions.
	Really?
	Yes.
	Yes.
	Interesting.
	She's the woman of your dreams?
	Yeah.
	She is.
	And what's interesting, one of the things that she said to me is she looked at me because I was apologizing and she says, you need to stop saying you're sorry.
	That was the first thing she said to me.
	And then the second thing, she's with this other man and she's just looking at me because I think I was in her house and she just looks at me.
	She goes, you know what she needs?
	She needs a ring.
	That's what she needs.
	She needs a ring.
	Do you want to hear something?
	Do you want to hear something really funny?
	Okay, go ahead.
	I'm going to send you the link to the article.
	Oh, please don't tell me that she gives a ring.
	Are you kidding me?
	No.
	Oh, okay.
	No, no.
	Okay.
	She does tell Shiloh No need to apologize.
	Okay.
	You need to stop apologizing.
	Okay.
	And what you said about you don't apologize, when I was writing this scene, I saw her telling Shiloh, look, stop apologizing.
	Yeah.
	That's not necessary.
	You're not, you are a very sweet person, you're very intelligent, and it's a pleasure being around you.
	Wow.
	So what you said about wisdom, telling you not to apologize, that's exactly how she is.
	Yeah, and she did.
	She told me to stop apologizing, and then she looked at me, she was smiling, and she said, because I was crying.
	In the dream because I felt so bad because I felt like I did so many things wrong and she says, stop apologizing.
	But she looked at me and she looked at the person next to her and she says, she needs a ring.
	I didn't know who Joseph was.
	I just started reading the Bible.
	So I didn't even know what that ring.
	I said, what does a ring mean?
	Like, what is that?
	Does she want to get married?
	I don't know.
	I don't understand what that means.
	But now I do.
	That was my authority.
	When you take the Word of God and you put it against your dreams, when you take the Word of God, you take it and put it against your visions, you put it against your experiences, you're going to see that it's not so far off.
	There is such a truth that God is trying to reveal, especially in this new season of acceleration.
	And I almost want to say teleportation, because that's what I feel.
	Like, it's going to be, look, let's get together.
	Okay, great.
	Let's go meet in the heavenlies.
	And everybody goes, and we meet, we powwow, do what we have to do, come up with strategies, and then we go back to our places.
	Because, look, we have to be smarter than what the enemy is doing.
	And like you were saying earlier, That there are people, Satanists, and they do this all the time.
	Like seriously, they do it all the time.
	They would go to hell.
	This one Satanist, John Ramirez, he would go and he would talk to Satan and he would get strategies.
	Oh yeah, absolutely.
	So if he can do that, I mean, and that's true.
	You guys can look it up.
	You guys can go to Google and Google John Ramirez and he talks about it.
	And he said that he was like his father.
	Satan was like his father.
	You know?
	But our Father, our Father in Heaven, who is so good, that we can go and we can sit with Him.
	We can ask Him things.
	We can come and get strategies from Him.
	And then He says, listen, you can also go get strategies from wisdom.
	And you can go to the courtroom and get these accusations taken off.
	And you can go to the court of scribes and you can find out what your destiny is.
	Right.
	You have to know that.
	You have to know, like, what are your mountains?
	You have to know what is your destiny.
	What do you call it to do?
	Are you called to be a writer?
	A painter?
	Are you called to be a radio announcer?
	What is your divine destiny?
	Which mountain are you supposed to influence?
	Or mountains, plural.
	Education?
	Government?
	Media?
	What mountains has God given you to have influence in?
	You have to understand that.
	And the way you do that is you go to heaven and you find out.
	That's right.
	I don't know if it's a court, per se, but Del Hungerford went there.
	Heaven Strategy Room, where she showed up there.
	And she was looking for strategies on how to promote her music.
	There was all kinds of angels, and God was there, and she was given all kinds of strategies and different tools to use.
	There are so many places in the heavens you can go to.
	Right.
	I have a friend who went to, I don't know if he went to the Court of Scribes.
	He described it as a place, it was like, he said it was like the court of business.
	He said, I saw all these angels.
	And they were writing, and they were signing contracts.
	One contract after another after another.
	They were all just scribbling and writing, and they had these huge piles of paperwork and the contracts.
	They were validating and signing and sealing all these contracts.
	It was like this big business.
	And this guy, he's worked as a real estate banker, and so he's very much aware of what the world of signing contracts is all about.
	He's done it for a living.
	And I went to this, this is after he started reading it.
	your book went there and he was like man he goes it was crazy and he said I talked to one of the angels and I said this place is so business like and so efficient and the angel looked at him and said did you expect heaven to be less efficient than earth that's That's a word.
	That's definitely a word.
	There's all kinds of places people can go.
	And I would, you know, recommend do it.
	Absolutely.
	Go explore.
	And so by just giving your spirit permission, also you can get a copy of Dave's book, Traveling in the Spirit Made Simple.
	And all of the books have been great.
	I mean, the books are fabulous and they're so simple.
	If you're looking for a down-and-dirty book on how to go to the Courts of Heaven, now, Robert Henderson has written two books on the Courts of Heaven.
	I got his first book.
	I think it's called Operating in the Courts of Heaven.
	It's 200 pages, and there's a lot of good information in it, but it's a long book.
	The book that I'm publishing on the Courts of Heaven is short.
	You can read it in 20 minutes.
	It'll be available next weekend.
	I'm probably going to put it out on Kindle for 99 cents, at least initially, to be able to pick it up.
	And it's real simple, down and dirty.
	The Court of Heaven's for dummies.
	You know, like I said, what to do, what not to do.
	Yeah, so if you need help going to the Court of Heaven, you can look for that book, too.
	Well, I also see you doing some videos about going to the Courts of Heaven.
	Oh, gosh.
	Yes.
	Yeah.
	I have videos.
	I have videos I need to get done.
	Yes, you do.
	Just doing that first video on the difference between astral projection and traveling in space, it took me three days to write the script.
	It took me Friday, Saturday, and Sunday to do that because I'm learning video editing software.
	The learning curve, I'm getting the hang of this stuff, but I'm trying to get more videos out.
	It's going to be a while, though.
	It's a work in progress.
	Well, I do know someone who is very good at videos.
	Oh, gosh.
	I know.
	I do know somebody.
	I know.
	But the thing is, I'm a do-it-yourselfer.
	I want to do everything myself.
	No, I understand that.
	But if you need some advice as to what tools to use to expedite things.
	Yeah, well I think I have the process down a whole lot better now.
	I was just having problems understanding what export format to use and some of that, and some of the special effects things with the program I'm using, but it's getting better now.
	I'm getting quicker with it.
	Well, I think that's awesome and I'm excited for this new book.
	So if you guys want to check it out, you know, definitely, if you're not friends with David Joseph on Facebook, you know, definitely friend him.
	And also you can go to prayingmedic.com.
	If you're going to friend me, send me a private message so I know what's up because I get a lot of friend requests and I can't accept them all.
	Okay.
	And also, when are you going back to Sid Roth?
	That's going to be my last question for the evening.
	Well, that is going to be up to Sid.
	I sent them copies of the Traveling in the Spirit book.
	Uh-huh.
	And they'll have to read the book and decide if it's something that they want to have on the show.
	Oh, heck yeah.
	And if they decide they want me back on the show, I'll let everybody know.
	But I haven't heard back from them yet.
	Both Jenny Wilcox and I are praying for like February.
	You guys want the big Pamela reunion back in Charlotte again.
	Heck yeah!
	Heck yeah!
	We had so much fun, but this time we're all staying at the same hotel.
	We already decided.
	We're not going to go to different places.
	That would be really cool.
	Yes.
	No, that would be cool.
	That hotel is really nice actually.
	I like staying there.
	Yeah, and then we said that we would just have to make you stay one extra day.
	Oh no, if we go back there, we're staying for a few extra days.
	Yes!
	Just fly in, fly out, and have no time to socialize.
	Yeah.
	That's not happening.
	I'm sticking there for a few days.
	I definitely agree.
	Well, this has been so much—this is so much longer than I normally go, but this was so good, especially about—and it was so funny, because the Lord said, you're going to talk about the courts.
	And I was saying, well, we'll just kind of dabble.
	No, we're going to talk about the courts, because I think that God really is—He's looking for His kids to come and visit.
	But more importantly, to get strategies so that they can become much more effective and efficient here on earth.
	So that's really what I feel this is all about.
	I mean, it's all fun and games because let's be honest, when we hang out with our father, he is fun and it is like a game because he's so awesome.
	But there is something that is so much more strategic in what he's doing and I think that because we are the generation that understands that that understands about we've seen these movies about teleportation we've seen these different like ideas about time travel so it's not foreign to us we're maybe back in the 1800s they would have thought no way but see we're we're ready for this
	I think that we've been customized because of the Matrix and some of these other movies that we've been programmed that this is going to be okay.
	But more importantly, this is coming from our father.
	Yep, exactly.
	So I am super excited about your new book.
	Like I said, if you guys want to check out Praying Medic, go to prayingmedic.com.
	Thank you so much, Dave, for spending this time with us.
	This has just been so fun.
	I've been getting texts where people don't want to ask questions because they're having so much fun listening to the stories.
	Cool.
	So we'll definitely have to have you come back on and talk about some more stuff in the courtroom.
	Okay.
	Thanks, Lisa.
	All right.
	Thanks a lot.
	Well, folks, that is our show for today.
	I hope you enjoyed it.
	Thanks for dropping by.
	If you're new to the podcast and you haven't been to my website, you might drop by and check out the articles I have there.
	If you have any questions or comments about the show, you can contact me at admin at prayingmedic.com.
	That's A-D-M-I-N at prayingmedic.com.
	You can also contact me on Facebook and Twitter.
	I'd like to thank you again for dropping by.

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