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June 27, 2014 - Project Camelot
01:38:09
PROJECT CAMELOT: JOHN MACK MOVIE ROUNDTABLE DISCUSSION
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I'm Carrie Cassidy from Project Camelot, and I am here to do sort of a roundtable discussion with three lovely ladies all about John Mack and the John and I am here to do sort of a roundtable discussion with And each person has had their own interaction with the John Mack material.
and I'm assuming John Mack himself, although I haven't had a chance to ask everyone, so we'll find out where that's at.
And I myself never got a chance to meet him or to interview him, unfortunately.
That would have been a really amazing thing to do.
Okay, so at this moment, we've got Denise David Williams, and she's the brunette over here, and she is the producer of the John Mack movie, To Come, and she's going to explain what's going on with that.
We are trying to raise money to make that movie a reality.
And then next to her, we've got Rebecca Hardcastle-Wright, And she's very well known, I believe, out on the circuit, as we call it.
But I can say that I believe she's maybe most well known for being associated with the Phoenix Lights, although maybe she might have a different point of view on that one.
And then we've got Sandy Cochran, who's new to me, and we're going to find out more about her as we go.
So we do have bios on the page on Project Camelot where you found out about this event.
And you can sort of skim those bios if you'd like.
But meanwhile, we're actually going to go one by one and get these women to talk about their backgrounds in their own words.
So let's start out with Denise.
And, Denise, what I'd like you to do is, first of all, talk about the sort of the venture, the fundraising, What you have in mind and sort of the parameters of what's going on here so that people kind of can focus on where things are at.
Sure.
So we decided about, we meaning the John Mack movie team, to launch an Indiegogo campaign.
We decided this It's about six weeks ago.
Why?
Because although there is a lot of interest in mainstream Hollywood, a lot of interest in the story of John Match in Picture, what I discovered was that they just wanted me to hand over the project, and I was not willing to do that.
So what I did with my team was launch an Indiegogo campaign asking The public, meaning people who admire John Mack, who think his story has value and importance and is a powerful tool for shifting the consciousness of the planet, which I believe that it is, to help us with the very first step of the project, and that is hiring a writer and developing the script.
So that is where the initial money is going to go.
And it's going to be money well spent because what it will do is give us a screenplay and enable us to take the next important steps, which are to attach talent and get the production financing.
But that first step is the most vital and it doesn't require that much money.
Three I mean, the number is kind of fluid, but let's just say I know that we can get a million dollar writer for one-fourth of that amount of money.
So that's why we've launched the Indiegogo campaign, so that we can hire the right writer we want and develop the script that best, most authentically, and most sincerely is in keeping with really the real work that John Mack did, not sensationalizing it, Not making him out to be crazy or saying that it's a phenomenon that happened in the brain.
Because I had several people come forward and wanted to give me money for the script, but those were all things that were prerequisites to the deal.
And so in order to avoid that, we've launched this Indiegogo campaign and we're asking for support to develop the script.
Okay, great.
So at this moment, we're going to move along because we want to get each woman to talk about who they are and their contribution to this project, either in future or in the past, however you want to frame it.
So let's go to Rebecca Hardcastle-Wright.
Hi, Carrie.
Denise called me.
Actually, we emailed and then we spoke about the John Mack film project.
I was so excited because for many years when I lived in Phoenix, I worked with a mentor named Ruth Hover.
People called her Dr.
Ruth.
She actually ran the longest-running experiencer group in the nation that I was a part of as an extraterrestrial experiencer.
Ruth had worked with John in his peer group, so I was sort of factored in and learned John's techniques, read all of his books, learned about John from Ruth, and then I began to have a professional career in ufology and In an area that I call exoconsciousness and I was even deeper into the John Mack material because I
had always felt as though while ufology was really tied to craft And sort of the nuts and bolts of what you see in the sky.
I can use the Phoenix Lights.
I was always drawn to the consciousness aspect and I became a hypnotherapist.
I became a coach.
I have a religious background, so I moved very, very deeply into spirituality.
Then I began to investigate trauma and worked with a lot of trauma clients and just the whole John Mack information just...
It was like a book, a pathway book for me, a guide as to how to do this work.
And I'm so grateful that Denise is putting together the John Mack movie.
I just know that it's going to open people's hearts and it's going to reflect a real shift in how we see experiencers, not just how we see John Mack, But how we see experiencers and he was so dedicated to taking away that kind of You're crazy,
you're insane, and talking about the sanity of the non-local, that we have this psychic ability inborn in us, which I call exoconsciousness.
So I so am looking forward to what Denise is doing, and I think it's going to be just a gift for all the people of the Earth, and for the ETs also.
Okay.
All right, thank you for that.
All right, and we've got Sandy Cochran, and I hope I'm saying your name right.
Is that correct?
It is correct, yes.
Okay, go right ahead.
I did know John, and I worked with John and his assistant, Roberta Palasante, who was the clinical director of the program.
I came to it Kind of through the back door.
I have worked with Native American indigenous wisdom keepers in North, South and Central America for the last 30 years, born out of the death of my first daughter.
They sought me out and they started teaching me their ways.
All of them discussed that in their lineage in their history they all know that the star people brought them unique gifts depending on what the tribe was.
Around 1998 I went to John's Star Wisdom conference that was being held in Boston with a number of different presenters from all aspects of the community and at that particular meeting I had A change of life experience and Bobby and John started working with me because I remembered and recognized one of the men on the speaker's
stage who was talking that day and he and I were both sharing the same story with John and Rebecca.
We remembered each other We remembered the ships, what they were trying to show us on the ships, how they were trying to help humanity come to grips with what we were doing to the Earth.
And in some ways, John saved my life because I was a psychotherapist at the time, and I didn't want to be seen as public, so I strictly worked with Roberta and John.
My co-partner, who was experiencing the same things, he and I had never met, and I don't want to reveal his name right now because that would be more up to him to divulge what his name is.
I believe that the project Denise is working on with John not only will honor a man who saved many people's lives from not thinking they were crazy, from helping us understand our ontological experiences, to allowing us the paradigm shift that these inter- and extradimensional beings have brought to us.
And I do believe that whether it was at birth or pre-birth or At a different age, I signed up for that.
And it has totally changed my consciousness of what this reality is really about.
And thanks to John, not dismissing it and not making fun of it and allowing it to unfold.
I think he's often a want to humanity, and I think this paradigm shift and this, as Rebecca calls it, echo consciousness, it's time has come.
It really needs to be out there in a bigger way, and I think that's what Denise has been shepherding with her work.
Okay, thank you so much.
And I hope at the moment we're not having an echo.
Okay, well that's great.
So we have sort of set the scene here, and let me say for my own self, because I am part of this group as a host, hostess, whatever, but at the same time I've also had my own experiences, and I actually stumbled on his book very early on,
way before Camelot, the book Abduction, and that was sort of like finding an old friend in John Mack, There was something about his face that very much had a lovely sort of openness and warmth and the stories in the book were things that I could relate to and I was definitely having my own contact experiences in those years and had had for many years since I was a kid
as a matter of fact and at this point it looks like I have some MyLab background as well.
But I can say that that definitely made me feel like that there was a community out there that not being in Camelot and not even...
We're not even talking.
I mean, talking very early on, during the 1990s, I guess, you know, that I wasn't so unusual.
And so it was very nice to have that...
Sort of have come upon that book and it did affect me and it did open my eyes in terms of what other people were experiencing.
And so here I am doing Camelot all these years and I'm sure that it was instrumental in certain ways.
So in kind of putting the pieces together and bringing the contactees Really front and center.
So I've never lost that sense of how important contactees are and who's actually driving those craps, so to speak.
Because I was always, in a certain way, it was always like a man's world with machinery in the skies, but they never talked about who was inside in the early days of ufology.
And I always thought that was amusing and very strange.
Because I was much less interested in the craft than I was in the occupants, shall we say.
Alright, so now at this moment, what I'd like to do is, I know that you're doing this campaign, and I don't know if I have the actual page here, but can you give the URL of the page where people can make a contribution, Denise?
And would you also talk about why it is that you have had to go this route in more detail?
As a producer, and a lot of people will think, well, you're Hollywood, you should be able to raise the money.
Hollywood has tons of money.
You know, talk about yourself in relation to that game, and one that you've been involved in, but at the same time, on a certain level, even getting involved in the John Mack story puts you on the fringe, I would say, of Hollywood.
In a strange way, you know, even though they're known for blockbuster, you know, sci-fi movies.
And so can you talk about that?
Sure.
To your first question, the URL is johnmackmovie.com.
And...
I'm going to be really candid here because, you know, I'm just with the three of you who are just so lovely and beautiful and your spirits are so big and I just, you know, it's like this is just not time for bullshit.
This is just too real.
You know, in this forum, and especially Carrie, you inspire me to do that.
So, yes, I have been in the business since, you know, for many years, but I am really not part of Hollywood.
I'm really not.
I started out, I had some jobs, I had a couple other jobs, and then I didn't have any jobs for various reasons.
Carrie, I know you can relate.
And I wanted to have jobs, but I didn't have them for many years.
And so I formed my company, Make Magic.
And I worked out of a little office on my own and developed projects that were meaningful to me.
On my own.
I mean, really not part of Hollywood.
And one of them that...
Well, let me just say this.
At the same time, I've had a lifelong...
Passion for all things metaphysical and that doesn't even describe it that well because it's just really from the minute I was born I had a highly developed intuition I I knew that there was a veil and that the veil had dropped and I was here now and That my parents were like these wounded children doing their best.
I mean this is from the minute I was conscious so that's been something whether it's part of my karmic Blueprint or whatever that that has been a driving force for me you know metaphysics and spirituality and and Trying to you know understand something grander what is consciousness and so when my ear started ringing and I was literally led to the woman who told me about the story of John Mack I just
I just knew that whatever experience I had in Hollywood Was intersecting with John Mack's story.
And that it was really an answer to something that had lived inside of me my entire life.
It's like there's something I'm supposed to do.
Something.
And as soon as I heard John Mack's story, I knew that that was it.
So I shopped it around, which is not that comfortable for me because, again, I'm not somebody who can honestly pick up the phone and just call every studio and every agent.
I'm just not.
But I did my best.
I was able to connect with a lot of several big companies.
And should I be specific, Carrie?
I don't think there's a problem with being specific.
I think it's kind of in the public domain at this point, but you be as specific as you're comfortable being.
It's your stage.
Okay, so just the facts.
The facts are, I pitched it to several companies.
Many of them liked it very much, but there were a couple who really wanted to actually get into business, and one of them was Robert Redford's company.
I had a preconceived Notion about that company.
Anyway, so we partnered and we spent 14 months looking for a writer.
There was never any deal signed, although they wanted to sign a deal for some reason.
And now I know why it just got away from us.
And finally, after 14 months, we zeroed in on a writer who I thought had potential, but I did have concerns after the first meeting.
This writer said that the phenomenon, believed that the phenomenon occurred only in the brain.
And I had a...
Big problem with that.
But that's not what John Mack said.
So when I expressed my concerns to the Redford people, what I got back from them was, we want to move ahead.
We need 100% control of this project.
And I was like, okay.
Actually, the truth is, I was like, no.
I mean, I didn't even have to think twice about it.
But, you know, I could have hung in there.
I could have had the bragging rights that, oh, I'm producing a film with Robert Redford, and it is about John Mack.
I mean, yeah, it'll turn out how it's going to turn out.
But I could not do that.
This is not about bragging rights.
This is about what we're here talking about, shifting the consciousness of the planet.
Having telling John Mack story in a meaning and authentic way and so I walked away from the situation and I I also had a kind of similar situation with William Shatner And that was not going to be workable either so So now I'm kind of you know on my own and And to carry this out in a
way that I believe it needs to be carried out.
And I've befriended beautiful people like you guys and so many of John Mack's friends and his experiencers and colleagues and people who are so supportive of the project.
I know we're going to get there.
I don't know how.
But if I can impress anything upon your listeners is that I am not Hollywood.
I'm someone who is passionate about doing this kind of work and converging it as a motion picture because it's a powerful medium.
And it literally is a tool that can shift people around the entire planet.
So it feels huge, but I know it's not insurmountable.
I know it's not.
Okay, very, very good.
Let me say that, thank you for that, because that's great.
I think it is useful for people to hear the sort of Hollywood side of the story.
I've shot projects around Hollywood.
I don't know if the other women have, but I know the experience of that.
Just because you shot projects, even when you have worked in Hollywood, doesn't make you sort of Going Hollywood, so to speak, because there are a lot of independent people in Hollywood that are working in independent production companies that are just trying to make their way along their careers, etc.
So, you know, there's a top echelon, sort of a power triangle in Hollywood, and basically you're kind of like, just like anybody else, you're sort of scrambling and trying to find money and trying to find You know, stars that might be interested that could have helped to sell tickets for, you know, to get the movie seen in theaters.
I mean, in some ways it's a very pragmatic situation, but it gets kind of glossed over into a glamorous type of image.
And money is very hard to come by.
And it's a whole game.
Right?
Carrie, your listeners may, I'm sorry to interrupt, but your listeners may appreciate this, and it's to the point that you're making.
When I said, no, I'm not handing over 100% control of the project, and no, this writer is not right, I got a call from a very high-up agent at one major agency screaming a blue streak at me.
I could not imagine.
How dare you and who do you think you are?
So that's what we're up against, you know, and I hung up on him, by the way, because...
Great.
So for anybody who thinks I'm Hollywood, you know, I don't know what to say to that, but...
Well, I have my own Hollywood horror story, so to speak.
You know, we could probably have a lunch and talk about all of that, which would be a lot of fun.
But I, you know, so I can definitely relate.
I, you know, this is the kind of thing that does go on.
There is, and it's important for people to understand, because we're really talking about, we're taking something that's a project that is part of you know the ufology this world and has been part of it for a very long time and we're trying to push it into the mainstream consciousness and the vehicle is a movie okay so that's really what's happening here but along the way you've got all these politics and I'm gonna be coming back around to you
in a little while to ask you to talk about and describe some of those backroom politics that are making this Even getting this movie off the ground and I have to say getting other movies off the ground I can tell you the Camelot television show hit the stops as well along this road and so we do not have a television show for a variety of reasons not because the pilot wasn't a very excellent pilot and so this is the kind of thing that goes on that keeps you
know the top power echelon decides what goes into people's consciousness in the mainstream world and what doesn't and they have a way of keeping things out and steering their consciousness and so we're really trying to break that paradigm you're going against the grain and it takes a lot of courage to do that so kudos for that and just persistence alone it can be draining psychologically emotionally and certainly
monetarily on an individual To try to push a project along.
Some producers spend, you know, it's even a legend in Hollywood, 10 years trying to get a project off the ground.
So these are labors of love, with all due respect to even the good artists that are in Hollywood that are trying to get other projects made.
So there is a misunderstanding about what's Hollywood, what is it really comprised of, and so on.
So I'm glad we have this opportunity to talk To use this sort of unique situation and very important situation to To bring that to the fore as well.
Rebecca, I'd like you to talk about a little more because you've kind of been in the mainstream eye in your own right and on and off.
And you know what that means.
You know what kind of being semi-well-known, famous, whatever you want to call it, in this sector versus maybe trying to get something done With using that sort of leverage that you may have, but at the same time reaching stone walls.
So maybe you could talk a little bit about that and, you know, maybe even reply to some of the things Denise has said.
Yeah, I very much would like to reply to some of the things Denise said and kind of weave in a little bit of my own experience because I think all of us here today have had our share of patience.
And kindness and to ourselves as we try to live the life that we came in to live with an extraterrestrial awareness.
I find it very fascinating because for several years, about the past five years, I've been working with Dr.
Edgar Mitchell and that pathway kind of pulled me out of the mainstream and led me into working with a group of scientists, primarily consciousness scientists.
I find it very interesting that Denise's movement to fund the John Mack film is coming at this time for a couple reasons.
Number one, As you know, in the disclosure movement, consciousness, it does not rank high.
Disclosure via exo-politics, I've been in exo-politics for years since, you know, around the founding of Michael Salva's Exo-Politics, and consciousness was never talked about.
It was disregarded, it was kind of pushed to the side, and God forbid an experiencer would get up and talk about consciousness.
I mean, it was just, you were automatically labeled as the person to get out of the room as quick as possible, because they were going to ruin any chances that we might have to talk to anyone in government or academia or whatever.
Any of those levels of finance, whatever.
And it's quite interesting that now, after myself going down this path and working with Dr.
Mitchell, working with these scientists, and then in the past year or so, I've been tracking back into the mainstream.
And I find it so interesting because there are quite a few scientists, Deepak Chopra being one of the primary ones that really want to talk about, you know, this isn't a brain phenomenon.
This is a consciousness phenomenon.
This is a quantum hologram phenomenon, however you want to describe it scientifically.
And certainly, you know, Edgar Mitchell, Rudy Shield have done a lot of work in this also.
So it's almost like there's this merging of, I call it the perfect storm.
Consciousness science, ufology, opening to consciousness, to a discussion of it, and for the first time, experiencers being pulled into this discussion.
I mean, you look at somebody like Sandy, or yourself, or Denise.
I mean, we all enter this Earth life as Aware of who we are as an extraterrestrial being.
That carries us a mission, a calling, a willingness to say, I'm going to see this through during my Earth life.
And there's a reason that I'm linked in through the Earth.
With the wisdom that I have.
But I would claim in exoconsciousness, one of my philosophies is, it's not about Carrie, Denise, Sandy, or Rebecca.
This is about everybody.
Everybody on Earth has this.
And, you know, whether you track that back to, you know, religious history and the Gnostics, or you look at Biblical quotes as to, oh my goodness, don't be psychic, you know, don't go to the Oracle, when If you read the Old Testament, everybody went to the Oracles.
It's just really quite an amazing phenomenon that's happening today.
You look at Gary Schwartz, and he's putting the peer-reviewed studies on mediums who talk to people who've passed over.
He's working with people that communicate with ETs, as I'm sure we all do.
And the timing is right.
I'm not saying it's going to happen tomorrow, but I'm saying that Denise's initiative came in during this perfect storm of science experiencers and the study of consciousness.
Okay.
Well, thank you.
Yeah, absolutely.
Very wise words.
Okay, Sandy, it would be great to have you respond to everything you've heard already, to bring your piece of the puzzle in.
You come from sort of a different angle, and I'm certainly very curious because, actually, I don't quite understand how, with all, you know, sort of...
Just to be delicate about the matter, but how your daughter's death led you to the indigenous peoples, and then how that kind of circled back around to the contact experiences.
So those things do end up in the same world, but just hearing briefly about it, so briefly, The through line is just missing, and I know this isn't your interview,
so I don't want to kind of go off in that direction too far, but I still would like, I'm sure people listening are kind of like, there are questions, you've got a lot of questions as to how did you go down that road, so maybe if you can connect a few of those dots, and then also respond to what you've heard.
Okay.
First let me respond to what I heard, because I think That's important.
I think Denise running into issues with Hollywood is very much like Dr.
Mack running into issues with Harvard.
And I think there's a lot of people out there that don't want this information out because, like Rebecca said, of the amazing turn of consciousness and the paradigm shift this will give to so many people who, ironically, I think, already believe in the subject to some degree, but don't have a place to feel comfortable in that braille of information.
The second thing I would compare it to is our reality is only what we put our attention to.
So, in many ways, if you're only looking through these eyes, unlike somebody who can see infrared, say, like many of those in the animal kingdom, That's only going to be your reality and I think what all four of us have talked about is from a very young age something shifted in us where whatever that gene is that's attached to our DNA turned on and said I'm more than just this physical body and
that consciousness is able to go into inter and multi-dimensional spaces and when you do that you encounter other beings who are likewise trying to evolve That are working out of those inter-multidimensional spaces.
You can call them ETs, you can call them by their planetary names, their cosmic names.
I think that can go in a lot of directions.
Coming back to me, when my first daughter passed, like any parent that outlives their child, I was sought out by Native American women, initially.
Not all at the same time, they passed me one to the other, who began to teach me their ways of working with energy, their ways of healing, their ways of expanding the light body that is around all of us.
In their culture, in their history, they had stories of the star beings.
My second and probably longest and strongest mentor was grandmother Twyla Nietzsche of the Seneca Nation.
And I had an experience one night where I woke up.
I knew I wasn't dreaming.
I wish I could tell you a dream.
It wasn't a hypnagogic experience.
I wish I could tell you that.
I wasn't high.
I wish I could tell you that.
Because at the bottom of my bed were three tall Nordic beings with a gray next to me.
And I was immobile, I couldn't speak, I couldn't run, I couldn't scream, even though it was like white noise in my head, screaming.
And they imparted to me, all at the same time, in one voice, without bells moving, that they came of a legion of light, and that we all had that in our DNA. And we were evolving on a spiritual level to move back to that conscious awareness that we are all connected at that place.
And that I would start to remember my episodes because I needed to start to use them with other people.
Well, I didn't want to hear that and I didn't want to tell out of me.
I knew they could find me wherever I was.
I moved all over the place.
But they always still found me.
When I attended the Star Wisdom Conference to learn more information about the phenomenon, I had a memory in the middle of the experiences room where I was on a craft, I was on a gurney, I could see the beings working on me and the person that all of a sudden all these memories started to tumble back that I had been with with a group of other children for a very long time.
And they were experimenting on him, and in the past, I would always reach my arm out to him to quiet him down, because he was always trying to get off the table.
And when he went to turn to me, he had no arm.
And I remember screaming, thinking they were going to do more types of experiences or experiments on me where they would take my arm.
And I snapped two.
I was back at the Star Wisdom Conference, and I completely fled the room and bumped into...
As I ran out on the porch, Edgar Mitchell.
And Edgar didn't say anything to me other than hand me a cigarette and say, it gets complex sometimes, but I think you should stay.
At that point, I couldn't close the box.
The memories were tumbling out of me, and I didn't know what to do with them.
And so I called Roberta, and she agreed to see me the next...
And I told her my story and it turned out that it was the exact story that one of the people John and she were working with was telling her.
And he was on the stage as an experiencer at the Wisdom Conference and what triggered me is when he turned to the side I saw that he had no arm.
And that's what triggered my memory.
And then we started working together because everything we were saying was so similar.
And it was Without Roberta and John, I could have made sense of a lot of things that were being remembered in myself at that point.
But now it just seems like what an opportunity.
What is humanity missing by denying this, by rejecting this, by continuing to hide it?
Because every single government has come forward pretty much except our own with disclosure.
And I just think this movie can trigger something that so many people have been waiting for.
Absolutely.
Okay.
Thank you very much for that.
Okay.
Excuse me.
Alright, so at this moment, in terms of this discussion, what I'd like to talk about next is really the sort of theme of the movie and where you want to go with it, your understanding of the John Mack story,
Denise, and perhaps maybe anecdotally some of the things that you've encountered along the way of getting this off the ground and Aside from pitching it to Hollywood, you know, in other words, what you've been encountering maybe in the UFO sort of circles or the reaction to you and to the story.
And even if you're coming up against what one might say are obstacles in the community, what those obstacles might be.
Sure.
First of all, Sandy.
Amazing.
Thank you for sharing that.
First of all, the story as I see it begins...
John Mack lived a big life.
He did a lot of things.
He wrote a Pulitzer Prize winning book, as you know.
But the story is really, it starts about 1990 when he met I spent several months with Will Boucher, who is this incredible person who worked with John Mack at Pier and now is in Boulder, Colorado.
He oversees all of John Mack's archives, personal and professional.
Will and I constructed a storyline.
And we have not shown that to too many people, so there hasn't been that much, and purposefully, because you can have, you know, so many people knew John, they had their idea of the story, you know, his death was a conspiracy, his death was an accident, you know, he, as you could imagine.
Everybody has their own sort of take on it.
So to some degree, we're keeping the story as we see it close to the best.
Having said that, once we launched the campaign, we had to be more transparent.
And I think so far people have been very supportive.
The UFO community, however, for some reason, I think it's what Rebecca said, it doesn't seem to be resonating with them, and I think it's because they think in a very literal manner.
And John Mack, that's what I mean by more sophisticated, John Mack began thinking of the phenomenon in a literal manner, but then he, over a couple of years, He changed his point of view and said, no, this is interdimensional.
This is more nuanced.
This is more complex.
And that's what I'm very protective of.
Because, again, going back to talking to people in Hollywood, you know, It's not that it's not something that people readily grasp and our job as my job as a producer and with my writer and Director of the team all the way down the line is to make sure that It is about consciousness without a with but still being accessible to the mainstream and I
think maybe that's one reason why the campaign didn't hit with the UFO community the way I thought it would.
Because I always maintain it's about consciousness.
I remember sitting in meetings at Redford's company and going, this is about consciousness.
You understand that, right?
This is a story about consciousness.
And they would kind of look at me like...
No, not, but I'm not quite sure if it was getting through.
So you're basically coming up sort of against a few roadblocks just in terms of the overall story because it's multifaceted.
It's not, you know, sort of a quick draw type of thing.
It's not, you know, a shoot-em-out type of thing.
And it also has to do with This sort of almost verboten subject of abduction, okay, or contact.
And so there's also a controversy there right from the get-go, because some contactees see themselves as abductees.
Other contactees see themselves as contactees, and then there are all shades sort of of gray in there, And I also wonder if you're going to be focusing on any particular...
In other words, I guess he had some very...
His relationship was with the people that were giving their stories to him.
So on a certain level, I don't know how you're going to handle it, but are you even having to deal with getting the rights from those people to disclose their stories even though they're already in the book?
Or do you have the rights from the book from the...
I don't know if it's his parents or how that happened.
So that would also be something...
I know at least the more sophisticated people, even people in Hollywood, who...
Let me say, I'm starting to get contacted by.
Not specifically about John Mack or any of that, but just in general, there is now...
We're reaching a time when there is more openness to this...
Subject matter, there have been so many E.T. movies out there, and I guess Hollywood is starting to realize that, oh my God, this stuff could be real, and maybe Camelot has had an effect, and Black Projects, and the Secret Space Program, and the whole Nine Yards.
But so really what's happening is there is starting to be this openness, but there are these areas that have been forbidden.
And so what are you seeing in terms of, you know, yes, maybe the UFO community hasn't quite got it, but are you going to go at this vis-a-vis the contactees that were on John's couch, so to speak, you know?
Yes, so the rights were granted to me by his sons.
He has three sons and they granted me the rights.
I think why we haven't yet really encountered the kind of controversy that you're talking about is because, believe me, once the film is done, I expect an onslaught because all the contactees and just all the different factions see it from their own point of view.
And obviously it's not going to resonate with everyone's particular point of view.
So I do expect it that.
When it becomes an actual motion picture.
About John Mack's experiences, we have several of them as consultants on the film.
They've given us permission to access their clinical records, their actual audio tapes with John Mack.
And they are friends of the production.
And these people are incredible.
I mean, they are...
Truly incredible.
There's about a dozen of them who we've linked arms with, not to mention people like Rebecca and Sandy, who are with us.
And we're going to do our best.
I mean, that's where we're having a very skilled writer and, you know, we put our heads together and we use, you know, everything we have to come up with a screenplay that is as inspired and authentic as we can possibly make it.
You know, Carrie, you're a creative, you know, a creator.
And everyone else knows that you have to work from the inside out.
You can't work as a creator to try to please...
You know, you can't work from the outside in.
You have to do what you're inspired to do using everything you have.
Your brains, your intuition, your experience, and your collaborators.
I can tell you that people watching this, there may be some screenwriters out there who stumble on this, if we're lucky.
And there could even be some inexperienced...
In other words, they don't have a track record.
Are you entertaining the idea of even spec scripts or people that are not so well known that might be willing or very interested in submitting a screenplay or a potential screenplay or a synopsis or whatever they could come up with?
Are you at all interested in entertaining those possibilities and Or are you really going, because I'm, you know, and this is the dilemma always in Hollywood.
You know, how do you get something made if you don't have major names behind it?
And so we, you know, you are going to have that dilemma inevitably, I would say.
And so you are talking, you need major stars to be in it.
But do you also need known writers to actually write this project?
Absolutely not.
And I am 100% open.
100% open.
I've already been, I mean, after being on several shows, I get emails from writers where you read my spec script, and obviously I can tell if someone is a complete novice, but I am open.
Creativity and talent, I know this is one thing having experience in the business has really served me in this situation.
It's, you know, you don't know.
You don't know.
There's nothing more gratifying than discovering a gem, you know, a diamond in the rough.
I'm good at it.
I love doing it.
I've done it many times before.
And so, yes, I'm open.
And I have a pile of spec scripts that I'm reading right now that have come from all over the country.
You know, what about me?
I want to throw my hat in the ring.
So, absolutely.
Okay, do you want to give that information out then for, and you know, we can also publish it later, but can you give, just for people listening who want to submit a script to you, what do they do?
Go to makemagicproductions.com, which is my company, and my email address is there.
And send me an email, tell me something about you before you send your script, and we'll communicate.
Okay, and do, obviously, they probably have to sign a release at some point before you read the script?
Do you have legal protections in place, that sort of thing?
Maybe.
I mean, you know, John Mack's story is not, nobody's going to steal his story, you know, and I'm not going to, well, yeah.
Yes, we'll have them sign a release.
That's the short answer to that.
Okay.
All right.
So, in terms of...
I guess that some people are going to also ask, and, you know, I'm going to move down the line here as well, but are you yourself a contactee?
And if so, kind of, do you want to talk about that at all in more specifics?
It's to...
I think Sandy was saying, you know, whatever it's called, I... I have a multi-dimensional awareness, and I have.
As I said before, since the minute I reached the planet, I had the conscious thought, oh no, here we go.
I actually think it was, oh shit, here we go.
And that I was here for the experience.
And what do you call it?
Psychic?
Or just a very highly developed intuition?
Dead people have talked to me my entire life.
Dead people.
I've had, I spent three years in communication with beings who call themselves beings of the Christ light, who transmitted to me the most profound, incredible wisdom that is the foundation for my life today.
And when I first met them, and I mean literally through the instruments who I was meeting them through, I burst into tears because I felt, I just kept saying, I know you.
I know you.
I know you.
And because my heart was filled with this love that I had never experienced here on this planet.
I knew them.
And they said to me, they call us beloved.
Yes, beloved.
It's like running into an old friend in a foreign country.
That's what they said to me.
It gives me chills.
And so all of these things are very natural to me.
Did they make me a freak in my family?
Yes.
But, you know, it's why I believe I'm here talking with you guys, connecting about this truth.
I've had so many experiences, you know, in that realm.
Sorry, I lost my train of thought.
No, that's okay.
Actually, that's perfect, and that's great.
Because, you know, we want to keep the...
Talk going around the circle and we'll come back to you so you'll have a moment to collect your thoughts in this area.
Because, you know, obviously you're not necessarily coming online to reveal your personal story and I understand that here.
But at the same time, I do know that people that are listening, especially the people in the audience that are contactees or abductees, however you want to classify that, They want to know that a person who's shepherding this project through really knows on an intimate level what they're dealing with.
In other words, you're kind of one of us, so to speak.
And that's sort of a loose way of putting it, but nonetheless, that may be the way they look at you.
And I think in the UFO community, if you haven't gotten...
A lot of response.
It may be because they don't know who you are.
They don't know how to classify you.
And this world works on, you know, faces and personalities and understanding, you know, you're associated with a project.
Who are you?
You know, we know John Mack.
You know, he has his own calling card and he basically has his, you know, his His resume out in front of everyone.
But you are sort of the unknown entity.
And I think that once people realize that you've got sort of this unique, not only a unique tie, which you've been demonstrating here on this live stream, but that you have intimate experiences that, just as you've just said, that mean that you, in a certain sense, really get it.
And so it's kind of like that.
What I'd like to go to now is Rebecca and just ask you, in terms of your own, again, personal experiences, as you said you've had contact and so on, I think people would like to hear.
I'm going to get to Sandy on this level a little deeper.
In other words, what can you tell us about your own experiences How they parallel what went on with some of the experiencers in the John Mack book, perhaps, or how they were completely different, if that is appropriate.
I feel anyone that reads the John Mack book is going to be touched at a deep level, and there's going to be a resonance there that something in the stories that are told The relating that was done to John, it's going to touch your heart.
It's going to touch your being even more than your heart.
And on a personal level, my experience started at a very young age.
I have recall as young as three years old, which in the contact community is not that unusual to have contact at three.
It's kind of a time when it seems to happen.
And I have I have a memory of going to what I call Star School with a group like Sandy talked about.
She went with a group.
I also was with a group and I was mentored and taught and taken in and out of my home as a child and introduced to Different races.
I've never been a person that, for example, is just connected to one ET race.
I always have been a person who's worked with a lot of different races.
I don't know why that is, but that's just been sort of my baseline as an experiencer.
I mean, I've had experiences with reptilians, praying mantis, greys, Pleiadians.
You know, Christ consciousness beings, angels, people, you know, beings from different planets.
And I remember as a child, I did okay with the experience until I was about 12.
And then I just, something flipped in me.
I don't know, probably 12 years.
Maybe I was a little late, but kind of the peer group kicks in and I just thought, this isn't working anymore.
I don't really have anybody to talk to about this.
My parents were, you know, in this.
So I just, I remember having an encounter and just saying, you have to leave me alone for a while.
And they did.
They left me alone.
And, of course, they probably didn't leave me alone, but they weren't taking me out anymore.
So, then that went on until, and I would kind of move in and out of awareness of their presence.
And then, around my 40s, it really, it was in my mid-30s to my early 40s, was the time when, I don't know, Saturn returned.
I don't know where it was, but...
I really began to reconnect, as Sandy said, with not only ETs, but I began to connect with Native Americans.
I was living in Phoenix.
I did a lot of shamanic Native American teaching of their star information, you know, being taken at night and being taught.
And then One night, actually one morning, I was lying in bed and this word, just exoconsciousness, it just came in my mind and that sort of became my marching orders.
That was what I was supposed to do.
I was supposed to sort of seed and nurture and love that concept into the Humanity and the human heart.
So, now today, I have constant ET contact all the time.
It's just part of my life.
I'm communicated with.
It's just how I live my life.
I wanted to cycle back a little bit, Carrie, because you commented on the Phoenix Lights, which is really interesting because I never saw the Phoenix Lights.
Oh, really?
No.
And I think one of the reasons I never saw the Phoenix Lights was because I was supposed to see the Phoenix Lights.
Probably if I had seen the Phoenix Lights, and I did live in Phoenix at the time, I could have well of seen them.
I think I would have gone a very different path.
I think I would have become a ufologist.
I would probably become a craft researcher.
At the time, around 2005, I was teaching extraterrestrial presence at Scottsdale Community College and talking all about the history, but I always knew it was about consciousness.
I haven't really shared this with Denise, but I would like to just share for a minute just the impact of working with Len Kitai's Phoenix Lights film for so many years.
I'm in the film, as are many others, but Lynn has just loved and shepherded that message of the Phoenix Lights.
I was just back in Phoenix this past spring, and I just gave a brief talk at the end of the film and got to meet people.
You could just feel in the room people.
There's almost...
A mass consciousness that was alive in that room.
Watching those images, listening to those voices, feeling those energies.
And, you know, Lynn has done such a beautiful job of making every time that Phoenix Lights movie is shown, giving people a chance to talk.
And the people love it!
You know, even if they're not an experiencer, they just love to share about it because there's nowhere else to do it except there.
And I think that's exactly, I don't know how we as a community are going to capture that because I think, you know, John Mack's movie is going to be a big movie, but how are we going to capture That opportunity to further awaken people, to further say, you know, you can be healthy and gentle with yourself around the fact that you've had contact.
Even if you have a MeLab contact, you can be healthy.
I mean, part of my contact was MeLab.
And you can still be healthy with that, and you can relate to other experiencers, and you can feel a oneness, and you can feel a belonging that maybe you've never felt in your life with yourself and with the Earth.
And I think that what our charge is, in a sense, because maybe the UFO community is not responding, is that we need to broaden.
We need to go out to the healers.
We need to go out to the people that are working in consciousness.
We need to go out to the people who are working in spirituality and bring them into the John Mack story.
For goodness sakes, John Mack was on Oprah!
He was so mainstream, he was on Oprah!
I mean, I don't know, have you seen An ET experience on Oprah?
Oprah went with John.
He's almost like a mythical figure in that.
And that's a historical reality.
Oprah talked to John Mack.
And I think that may open doors for us, as may relationships with people in spirituality and consciousness and healing.
This is where we're supposed to be going right now.
And Denise is making it possible.
And I wanted to add, Carrie, you had said it before, that It's time to come out of the closet.
That's why this is new to me, revealing my experiences.
It's like, wait a minute, I'm just a producer just doing my thing.
But what I'm seeing is, no, I'm being required to share this.
And you know what?
It's exactly what all of us are supposed to be doing.
And that's what we are doing.
That's the whole point.
Bring it out of the closet.
There are so many of us in the closet, you know, and we're all going, you know, we're over here, we're in the fringes, we're in the margin.
If we all came out and linked arms, we'd be in the center.
We would be exactly where we want to go.
I'm getting used to it, but when I started, and this is only a couple months out of the closet, it's okay.
That's part of the courage that John Mack had.
And that's part of the courage.
I know that that's what's being asked of me to, you know, get out of your comfort zone and start just saying this is the way that it is, you know?
And this is the way that it is for a lot of us.
Right.
Yeah, I mean, we are disclosure.
I know it sounds a little corny, but that's a fact.
And so, you know, there's no reason to look outside ourselves.
For an authority figure to say, yes, this is happening.
We don't need the Catholic Church to come and tell you, you know, that there are, you know, that ETs are real and that they are, you know, port of God's creatures or whatever they're going to go on about.
You know, the fact of the matter is, is that, you know, we are disclosure and this is really what's required is this kind of a forum as well where people do reveal what they're about.
I think this movie in itself We'll open those doors so that more mainstream people who haven't had that opportunity or the same opportunities we've had that we've provided ourselves with that they will suddenly be able to maybe form consciousness groups and discuss their experiences and discuss their hidden memories because I can say that and you know I think Rebecca even said this it's happening to everyone and this
kind of thing in other words Everyone has psychic abilities and everyone has, you know, precog memories.
Some of them access them, some don't.
Some put them in a box and file them away and never reveal them.
You know, miraculous things that happen to human beings.
We are multidimensional.
This is the fact.
And this is part of revealing all of that.
So this is down that road.
You know, and I think, you know, we could say fairly that all of us are on the avant-garde of that.
But this movie will really kind of push that, push the wave further.
And so this is, I'm just sort of saying this for the purpose of also the audience to understand that you're part of a wave and you're part of something that is a consciousness movement.
And this movement involves, you know, getting movies out there that now tell the truth.
Not just, you know, shoot them up, bang, bang, you know, ETs that always look like machines that drive me crazy.
You know, there are whole other sides to these stories, and they are fascinating stories, and they are movies in and of themselves, and there are multiple movies that can be made in this way, revealing all the dimensions of our lives and our experiences as, in essence, kind of star beings, whatever you want to call it.
And so that, yeah, we need to pave the way for that.
And so this is, thank you, Rebecca, also for the lovely statements that you made.
Excellent, excellent information.
Sandy, you know, it's an open-ended discussion at this point, but, you know, if you can bring to the fore your own personal experiences, how they dovetail with perhaps the experiencers that John was working with, and also reply to some of the things you've heard here.
Sure.
I knew some of the experiences that were in the peer enclave.
I, like I said at that time, was distant from it because I was a fairly well-known psychotherapist and didn't want that label to be put on me.
But like Rebecca was saying, I have memories back to three years old and around my teen years I too said knock it off and around my Late 30s, early 40s, it was back on target again.
Like Rebecca, I've had experiences with many different inter and extra dimensionals.
It hasn't just been one race.
But one of the things that started to change, I think, For me a while back was I realized some of those ships are actually conscious entities.
It's not who's on the ship, because there are those two, but it's the conscious entity of the ship itself.
And I don't quite know what I mean by that other than it was alive.
That was my feeling.
I think I want to counter one of the thoughts here and I don't think it is a small community of people that believe in inter and extra dimensional beings.
I think there's tons of people out there.
I've traveled all over the world teaching my workshops and I don't care race, creed, color, ethnic background, culture.
I always bump into people Who have had these experiences or have this belief.
I think more what it is, is gathering the consciousness of everybody saying there is a safe place to experience and talk about this stuff, not just in small forums.
On campus, on YouTube, in your dining room.
And I'm still waiting for them to come down and have dinner with me some night in my own dining room so I can have a bigger conversation with them.
But I do think there's a lot of people.
I wouldn't want to just see this be the UFO community.
I agree with Rebecca.
I think this needs to be much broader because Experiences run the gamut, and some of them might not have their memories, some of them might not have talked about it yet openly, but I believe it's in our genetics.
I really believe that it's in our genetics, and that's what we're becoming conscious of.
That's the paradigm shift, is that we all are all of this at the same time experiencing this individual life in this tiny little body with this personality and name called Sandy, but beyond that, I'm connected to all of you in something far greater, whether you want to call it the One or the Absolute or the Godhead, I don't know.
There's still a lot of questions, but for me there's not as many questions as there used to be.
And I think Dr.
Mack helped me get to that, and I think Denise's movie will help bring that to all those people out there trying to find a unity consciousness.
Absolutely.
Well, I mean, I think nobody would deny the sort of multidimensional quality of each of the women here as they've listened to you all.
We've been going for a while, so I'm going to more or less kind of try to wrap this up.
There's the opportunity to answer questions if we have audience members that want to ask them.
So I want to throw that out for you.
But in the meanwhile, let's see, before we kind of close this down, I do want to say that if there are any other sort of subjects in terms of the nuts and bolts of getting the movie made, any obstacles that you want to talk about, outing Hollywood, outing the situation, the, you know...
The community, whatever community you brought it to, if there are issues that you could bring to the fore here that people can kind of get on board with you on that, Denise.
Because it's kind of like you're shepherding through a project and you need the support, but in order to get the support you need to sort of appeal to the hearts and minds out there.
And this vehicle will go out there To my very large audience that will have the opportunity to view this, it may go mainstream.
A lot of things I do go viral at this point.
And so this is an opportunity to just say, you know, look, there's sort of a roadblock in this area.
I'd love some help in getting through it.
You know, what do you need to do in that way?
Do you kind of understand the nature of my question?
I think so.
Right now, the roadblock is, you know, to be honest, what is the dollar amount that we're asking people to help us with?
Because, as you know, films are done in stages.
And right now, in order to really kick-start this, we need money to hire a writer.
Now, how much that is, to be honest, I really honestly do not know.
It all depends.
You know, it really all depends.
But to say, look, can we all just get together and get us to $300,000 or get us to $350,000, it would really get us down the road.
That's where we need to get.
That is not a lot of money.
It's not a lot of money.
So if X amount of people give $10, $20, I already see this as a reality.
But that really, really would get us moving.
And a year from now, we could be having this conversation on the set of the movie.
I'm not kidding.
That's how close it is.
If this conversation hasn't in some way facilitated some kind of spark, I'd be surprised.
I'm not sure what else to say.
Well, at the moment, we do have a couple of questions in the chat.
We have a chat room that goes alongside a live stream, and there have been a few people chatting as the show is going on.
I'm able to grab a couple, and I always ask that the people who want to ask a question put their questions in all caps.
So that helps me distinguish that from the sort of random chat that's going on when I'm looking really quickly to grab a question.
Now I can say that there are a couple questions here, so I'm going to ask them on behalf of the audience.
One person is asking, has either Rebecca or Sandy ever met Dr.
Carla Turner?
I have not, Okay.
I have not, but I've read her information.
Okay.
Denise, this isn't sort of an interesting question coming from Hollywood, but I'll ask it.
Denise, why are writers wanting to take the script in a different direction when you're the one who hired them?
Shouldn't they listen to the person who's going to pay them?
Okay.
Yes.
Yes.
I wouldn't say all writers.
Just this one particular writer who we were considering hiring wanted to take it in a different direction.
And I, you know, put the kai, I said no, and that's why we veered off in a new direction.
But yes, ideally, you find a writer who you are of like mind, you're on the same page.
And ultimately, yes, they are a work for hire.
So But also, it's a creative endeavor, so they need to bring their own take to the process.
When it's the right writer, I'll know it's the right writer, and they'll know they're the right writer.
Again, that's an intuitive process.
Yes, there's a short answer to that.
Well, let me say also that, you know, we're talking about, there is a big issue.
It's sort of a schism, if you will, between the people who believe that this is all in people's heads.
This is sort of a psychobabble point of view that has been pushed out there for a very long time with regard to the sort of abduction slash contactee experiences.
And so that mindset is going to be in the minds of lots of writers, especially writers who don't necessarily come to the project as a labor of love and maybe have been more thrown into the project by virtue of other successes.
And also, you know, the monetary angle.
So you're really talking about being able to take on board both the consciousness, the aspect of a wider consciousness way of looking at this, but also the so-called reality, what, you know, as we know it in the matrix, that Very real experience that people are having when they have contact, which gets left completely out of the box when somebody is talking about, oh, it's all in your head.
So I think that, yes, writers should listen to producers.
Yes, one second.
Writers should listen to producers, but at the same time, we can't help what's been put out into the minds of writers and the general public, in fact.
When it comes to these kinds of experiences, so you're really talking about a whole paradigm that this is going to be in some ways going in the face of.
Sandy, go right ahead.
That is what I think is so insidious about this entire topic, is that it It has been played to be in people's heads, to be crazy, to be out there.
And there are so many people who have come forward from the military, from religious groups, from heads of state, who have said, yes, we know people were having these experiences, and we purposely tried to paint them in a whole different direction.
My belief is that Denise came to this because she's just enough Hollywood that she will find the writer who's just enough contactee that will be able to put the whole thing together.
Because so many people have tried to derail this subject for so many years when they know it exists.
And that's the insidious part of it.
And that's the part that I didn't want to come forward about.
That's the part that made me really frustrated and really sad and really scared.
And that's the part John said to me, there will be people who will never believe you.
But if you believe yourself, and I believe you, and Roberta believes you, and all these hundreds of thousands of other people have had similar experiences, you just need to know you're not alone.
And coming on the show today was very frightening for me, because now you have a face.
But the irony is, in talking to the Beans over the last couple of years, I had a book that I did that I put out, and I'm not promoting that, but the only part I said to the Beans is, I'll promote any part of that but the John Mack part.
I don't want a public face around the John Mack part.
A couple of days, Rebecca, Joan Bird, Denise, they all got in touch with me, and it's that cosmic laughter I hear of, wait a minute, you signed up for this.
How can you now tell us what part you don't want to play?
So again, just my two points are, it has been insidious, but we're not nuts.
None of us.
And I think a lot of people are ready to talk about it, and that's where Denise and John Mack...
Reaching across the grave and coming through on this one.
By the way, I wanted to add because creatively I will be coming back to certainly this circle and maybe even a broader circle because one of the challenges we have creatively is do we show aliens or do we not show aliens?
I've been asked that question a million times.
Many, many, many times.
And the answer today is I don't know.
I don't know.
But I think it's huge, and we will know.
We're going to have to rely on, again, inspiration and guidance and whatever.
But we know how Hollywood has portrayed aliens.
That's just a big question mark at this point.
In telling John Mack's story, do you show or do you not?
So I'll be talking to you guys about that.
And your listeners, it's something...
But if we don't show them, aren't we, in a sense, feeding into the fact that they don't exist?
Well, there are two films, and I don't know, Carrie, if you want the conversation to go in this direction, but 2001 and Contact, the two films that kind of handled the phenomenon with some sense of Dignity.
Neither one of them showed aliens.
And then we know the whole genre of evil aliens and machines.
I am open.
I don't know.
It's a conversation to have with informed people.
Well, I mean, I think that's a valid question, and I'm glad you brought it up.
I think people will be very interested, and perhaps, I don't know, do you have an email address you're giving out in connection with this project, or how do people write to you?
They can go to either johnmackmovie.com, which is the short one to remember, or makemagicproductions.com.
Either way, they can get my email and contact me.
Okay, very good.
There are some more questions cropping up over here, so let me say that it may not be so easy a question to answer, but there are many different kinds of beings out there, and which ones you decide to portray and which ones you don't.
Is obviously a good question.
It certainly seems like a great opportunity to portray beings.
Now, Avatar didn't hesitate.
And I can say that Star Trek never hesitates.
And, you know, so there are...
The humanoid ones are certainly being depicted in various genres.
And, you know, so it can be done.
And it is an interesting...
You've got some challenges on your hands, no doubt about it.
Now, someone wants to know how much money will the whole project take?
That is probably really hard to judge at this moment when you don't have a screenplay, but is there any thought in your mind along those lines?
You know, my vision for this film It has always been, and even before I knew that it was a John Mack film, I'm talking years ago when I lived with that feeling like there's something, there's something, there's something big, and then it was revealed to me that it was John Mack, I always envisioned it as a big film.
I don't mean $100 million, but I'm talking about an end-of-the-year, prestigious, award-worthy kind of film.
Now, having said that, those films can cost $5 million or those films can cost $30 million or $40 million.
So, you know, as my film school professor said about all things Hollywood, it all depends.
We really don't know.
I mean, we could pay a writer.
You know, I know...
We could pay a writer 200 grand, who's a million, like I said in the beginning, who's used to getting a million dollars, and that would be a bargain.
Or we could hire a writer for a guild minimum, which is whatever, you know, 30 million, 30 thousand dollars, and then still make a 30 million dollar film.
We just, it's impossible to answer.
But the feeling of the film, this is not an independent film.
This is not a Sundance film.
This is a movie movie.
That's what I envision.
You go to the movies, you buy your popcorn, and you come out and you go, wow!
That's how I envision it.
And that gives me goosebumps.
So, you know, intention is everything.
That's always been my intention for this film.
Okay, someone is asking, Sandy, will your story be included in the movie in some capacity as other John Mack experiencers?
I don't know.
That's going to be totally up to Denise.
Okay.
There will be, it probably will be a...
Composite of experience or stories.
I mean, as I said, I have several of them signed as consultants.
This goes back seven years.
When I started on this journey, it's already been seven years.
But definitely, Sandy is part of the circle.
Now, Rebecca is part of the circle.
I consider them now, and you too, Carrie, valued members of the team.
So, you know, you'll all have a voice.
Okay, there's another question here.
Mac believed the alien abduction phenomena is connected with the planetary ecology crisis.
Do you think this could help bring a lot of more people on board?
Yes.
Absolutely.
The two are intimately woven together.
Sandy talked about the Native American approach.
To the sacredness of the earth and I've been doing a lot of research in the goddess recently and depth ecology and that has to do with extraterrestrials.
All of that is linked in together and I totally agree.
I think that once we begin to...
We really haven't moved that message very much, I don't think, in terms of, you know, People think about...
I met a woman the other day at a workshop and I told her I was an experiencer and we were talking about it and she goes, oh!
She goes, well, you're really grounded.
And I went, yeah?
And she goes, well, most aren't, you know.
And I said, no, I didn't know that.
But there's this image that's been portrayed that if you're an experiencer, then you're spaced out all the time and you're out of your body all the time and You don't want to be on Earth.
And some experiencers don't want to be on Earth.
I'm not going to say that that's not true.
But I think as you move through your experience, one of the things that you realize is that your exoconsciousness belongs on Earth, and you have to live your life in and through Earth.
You're sitting in the middle of this lotus that's unfolding, And you're participating in it, and if you don't choose to, then that's your choice.
And I think another thing that pulls into that is apocalyptic thinking.
And I think a lot of us were shown pictures of, quote, what the future may be.
May be.
And I think that there's an apocalyptic bent to sort of an end-of-times narrative sometimes that comes out with experiencers.
And I think that we need to talk about that, talk about the feelings, talk about where that comes from, and then allow that to not move us away from Earth, but to move us into the Earth and on the Earth in a new way.
So I totally agree with that.
Okay.
I do as well, Carrie.
Going back to what Rebecca was saying, they would often show the planet as an entire ecosystem that was alive.
And many of the experiencers in John's groups talked about that as well, that they were warning us, not in an apocalyptic way, but that we're destroying another planet.
living being and that living being gives us everything to support us while we're in these earthbound bodies and many to my my experience has been that many of the different extraterrestrial groups that I have had contact with all delighted in the fact that this was earth that because there was so much diversity and that was part of the beauty of Being allowed to take a physical body and
be here.
Is that we got to experience this beauty in a very raw and real and embodied way.
But I still think we all come from that celestial energy that just shows in whatever card we drew to have a terrestrial experience.
And it's amazing if you don't destroy everything around you.
And John was a proponent of not letting you destroy yourself with the experiences you've had, but to be able to live them.
And most of the people, going back to Denise's comment with the experiences she has signed on, these were all educated, grounded, articulate people.
Yeah, there are crazies and zealots everywhere, but my experience was always they were very grounded.
And very well spoken on the topic.
Okay, someone else is asking, is this movie based only on John Mack's book?
Denise, do you want to address that?
It's not actually based on John Mack's book because Abduction is a series of, and Sandy please and Rebecca correct me if I'm wrong, but it's a series of his patients that he worked with, their stories.
And Passport to the Cosmos, the second book, is a more nuanced, sort of deeper look at the subject matter.
So it's the years that John Mack did the work, from about 1990 until he was killed.
It's that arc when he started as this kind of left-brain, materialist, worldview kind of man and did a complete change.
That's the story.
That's the protagonist.
Very important that the audience believes that John Mack believed.
We will take the journey through his eyes.
We will take the journey through John Mack's eyes.
Thank you.
It looks like that's the end of the questions that are here so far in the chat.
As I say, we've been going for quite a while, so we should probably close this down.
What I want to say is that This role, we haven't really addressed the role from the point of view of a major Hollywood star sort of person, but although it certainly could be played by an unknown, it is a very,
what you would call, an actor would call, sort of a very meaty role, and it's in some ways maybe the role of the lifetime, and I wouldn't be surprised at all to learn that Robert Redford was interested in Possibly too old for the part at this point because I imagine you're going to start out when John Mack is a bit younger and then have to age him.
But the bottom line is that this is an amazing role for a male actor and it would be, you know, it is useful if anyone, even actors, watch this and if any mainstream actors watch this.
To start to understand that type and what we've got going here is just a really amazing vehicle.
So I'm actually kind of surprised that this whole thing hasn't come together and been wrapped up in a bow, so to speak, already with what you'd call major talent attached and the funds coming through.
And it is maybe by virtue of the fact that there is pushback to the change that could occur as a result of such a film.
That it hasn't actually all come together.
But I'm going to hope that this vehicle and other contacts you make do get out there to more mainstream actors, actors that do have a conscience and a consciousness that would be open to playing such an amazing man.
And just, Denise, do you want to address any of that?
Sure.
I recently went to...
Pretty well-known actors, manager.
And the first thing I said to her was, this has got to resonate for you.
If it's not going to resonate for you, then we could end the conversation right here.
And I pitched her the story.
Seemed like it resonated with her.
And she said, I'll talk to my client.
And having heard back from her, them, I did leave a message, but I just feel like I don't want to chase them because it's the kind of story that you either pounce, you go, I have to be part of this, which is what I felt.
And even to Redford's credit, that's how they responded to it.
And other people in Hollywood responded to it like that.
So I just, I don't want to chase them down, you know.
You would agree with me that this is one of those key, you know, Academy Award actor key, you know, roles that you would expect mainstream actors to just be jumping at the possibility.
Without a doubt.
And it's Lincoln.
It's playing Lincoln.
You know, you just don't, an actor, especially an actor in his 50s pushing 60 or younger, it could be younger, you know.
There just aren't roles like this for them.
Now, I will say this.
The hesitation is most definitely because there's not a script yet.
Although the actor that I just went to, I offered for them to come on board for the development process and be a producer.
So, the fact that I haven't heard back, you know, speaks volumes.
Sure.
Well, it is an exciting project.
I can say that I think that everyone who's watching this certainly is going to be sort of wanting to join the sort of force, you know, have the force be with you, want this thing to take off, want to follow its progress.
Maybe we can even reconvene and give a progress report at some point in the future.
This has been a great conversation.
I think people would agree with me.
And...
And I want to thank all of you for contributing your very unique perspectives and also very valuable perspectives.
I think it's great, and we have a wonderful team here even just assembled for this brief time.
So thank you so much for coming on the show, and let's see where this goes from here.
Denise, you're also going to be starting up even after you raise, regardless of what happens here.
I understand Indiegogo lasts how long?
And then just tell people the logistics of the next sort of effort to raise the money.
Sure.
So we've had 60 days on this current campaign.
It runs out July 5th.
We're going to have like a two-day campaign.
Breathing period, and then we're going to relaunch, and we're going to be asking, we're going to explain what the relaunch is about.
We're going to go for a smaller dollar amount, and it's going to be specifically to raise money to hire a writer and develop a script.
We're going to be very specific about that, and it will be relaunching, you know, like July 8th or something like that.
Okay, and so via India, go, go again?
Same URL, John Mack movie.
We'll get...
We'll get everyone there.
Okay.
All right.
So, again, thank you, everyone.
Any last comments?
Certainly, there's room for any last comments from anyone.
I just think this is going to happen because it's meant to happen, and all the pieces will fall into place.
And now that Mercury is going direct, it needs to be left.
Yeah.
Okay.
Thank you, Karen.
All right.
And Denise and Rebecca, thank you for the opportunity.
Thank you.
Denise is doing a beautiful job of just allowing the spirit of John to sort of move through this project.
Congratulations, Denise.
You're doing a beautiful job.
You really are.
Thank you so much for giving this platform.
Absolutely.
All right.
Thank you.
Thank you so much, Carrie.
All right.
Thank you, everyone, for listening, and let's see where all of this goes.
Okay.
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