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April 20, 2012 - Project Camelot

01:38:07

04/20/2012 - Chuck Wade

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	Well, that's quite alright.
	That's the way it ought to be.
	webmaster was fooling around with my computer.
	I'm going to blame it on him.
	No, I just don't know.
	So anyway, I'm really sorry, Chuck.
	You know, it's not my usual to be so unorganized.
	It must be something in the weather.
	Well, that's quite all right.
	That's the way it ought to be.
	This is just two human beings talking together and telling what we need to know of what people need to know.
	Absolutely.
	Absolutely.
	So thank you very much for your patience.
	So this is Carrie Cassidy from Project Camelot.
	And I hope that I haven't just lost you.
	I don't know, somebody just hung up.
	So anyway, Chuck, are you there?
	I am.
	I can hear you fine.
	Excellent.
	Okay.
	So basically, we have done an interview with you.
	Lots of people have listened to it, and we had all kinds of trouble with the cameras.
	You and I have had some correspondence, but I don't know if you really know sort of the gist of what happened, but some tapes seemed to be erased.
	Some of the footage wasn't there.
	What we did get is you, and so they obviously erased the wrong camera, whatever the hell, because that was the one Bill and I were on.
	And so we did get the interview out there, although it wasn't in the greatest condition, unfortunately.
	But basically, you were there, and you were audible, and we didn't get to have the close-ups of the map and so on.
	So, I thought that we might have you on the show and just see if there were some things we didn't cover.
	You said there were some maybe more new developments.
	I talked to somebody who's in touch with you who thought there were some new developments at your end.
	And so why don't you give an introduction for those who haven't heard our interview with you and talk a little bit about the various crash retrievals that you are familiar with.
	That would be fine.
	My name is Chuck Wade, and I was born October the 23rd, 1939, in the little town of Corona, New Mexico.
	My parents owned the bar there in Corona for about 42 years.
	And back in 1947, Dad was tending bar there, and Mack Brazel drove up, and Mack Brazel had found a whole lot of debris out on the foster ranch where he worked.
	And he wanted my dad to go out to see what in the world happened out there, and also to try and move some of that debris, because there was sheep on the far side of the debris, and the sheep would not go across the debris to go to water.
	So it was imperative that that stuff be moved.
	And he really tried to get dad to go out there, but dad didn't go.
	But Mike did go to Roswell and report it to the sheriff there, and then the sheriff Reported what Mac had found and took to Roswell to the military.
	And the military came out there and cleaned up the debris and a whole lot of things.
	And then over time, they said it was a UFO.
	Then the next day they said it was a weather balloon.
	Folks, I'm here to tell you tonight that was a UFO.
	And that's where I got started.
	Okay, and so what happened there, as far as you know, did your, let's see, did anyone that you were in contact with actually see the bodies?
	Not of that crash.
	Gerald Anderson saw the two bodies and an injured alien and a live alien on the plains of St.
	Augustine, and I physically have parts of that craft, that crashed UFO.
	I have it here on my desk.
	And the plane to San Augustine happened before Roswell did, by a day or two or three, but it definitely did not happen the same day.
	Okay.
	And so, but your sort of position is that there were many crashes around the same time, isn't that right?
	There were seven of them that I am familiar with between 1945 and 1948.
	Yes, that is correct.
	Okay, and of those crashes, do you know what brought those craft down?
	Do you think you know?
	I couldn't understand your question.
	Of those crashes, do you think you know what brought the craft down?
	I definitely have a theory of what brought them down.
	The first crash that crashed in August of 1945, and that was down by San Antonio, New And San Antonio, just a few miles from Trinity Site, where the first atomic bomb was experimentally detonated on the 16th of July, 1945.
	One month later, there's a UFO that crashed there close to San Antonio, and there's two eyewitnesses.
	They was little boys then, and Paula Harris had just written a book about those two little boys, and now they're grown men.
	And what I think happened is, in August 1945, there was a UFO that was checking out that bomb site where they put off the atomic bomb, and they got hung up in radars there that was scanning, or had been built there on Oscuro Peak, close to the Trinity site.
	And I think that the first one Came down, the first UFO that crashed was by accident through that radar.
	But I think the rest of them were absolutely intentional.
	So basically radar.
	Yes, but high-powered radar, not just a little thing, not just a few watts.
	They made three, the military made three very high-powered radars in 1947 to guard the skies over Los Alamos.
	And one of them was mobile.
	And I think what happened is, I'm going to say that that mobile unit was made in White Sands, but it may not have been.
	But I think it was parked there in July of 1947.
	And as you all may remember, up in, I believe it was the state of Washington, where Kenneth Arnold saw those nine UFOs.
	That was in about the middle of June 1947.
	Well, somebody along the line, Found out about what Tim Sarno said, and then somebody, maybe the president or somebody like that, gave the order to bring down a UFO and see what it was.
	So the military took a mobile unit, high-powered radar from White Sands, up into the plain to St.
	Augustine, and shot that craft down.
	And we have parts of it.
	Okay.
	And I don't know if you have heard about this individual.
	Actually, he just wrote to me, and he has a theory, and I haven't gotten quite the theory straight.
	His name is Douglas Dietrich.
	Have you heard of him?
	Douglas?
	Dietrich.
	No, I've never heard of him.
	Okay.
	Well, he's somebody who worked at the Presidio.
	For the Department of Defense as a librarian, but it was a much more sophisticated job than what that implies, and apparently he's talking about the Japanese sending craft and also the Nazis.
	I mean, are you of the opinion that there were ETs in those craft?
	Without a doubt.
	Gerald Anderson, who is a friend of mine, physically touched one of the ETs.
	The dead.
	Okay.
	Absolutely.
	No doubt in my mind that they're extraterrestrial.
	All right.
	And when he, this person who was a friend of yours, who was who?
	Gerald Anderson.
	He was a five-year-old boy in 1947.
	He was a witness to this crashed craft on the plains of San Augustine.
	I see.
	And so he touched one of the bodies.
	Is that correct?
	That is correct.
	As a five-year-old, he thought it was a doll, but whenever he touched it, it became real to him.
	I see.
	And so his memory is that it was not like a Japanese, for example.
	It was not a small.
	Absolutely not.
	Okay.
	No, there's several theories.
	I don't know who this Douglas Beatrix is, but if he thinks these things are made by Japan, I'm here to dispute that.
	Yeah.
	Also, I have there's other people that said that, like I'm holding the book by Dr. Joseph Farrell, the Roswell and the Wright.
	Yes.
	He says 520 pages saying in German.
	I will absolutely dispute that and I challenge Mr. Farrell to have the metal that I have analyzed down to the isotopic ratios and I will prove to him that his book is wrong.
	Okay, and that is because what you think the medal is, is from an E.T.
	craft, is that correct?
	I have no doubt in my mind.
	Okay.
	It is fascinating that there's some, you know, people coming forward at this time to actually question the Roswell story in the area of whether or not those crafts came from the off-planetary races or not.
	And that doesn't necessarily mean that they don't believe there are off-planetary races visiting us.
	It simply means that those particular crashes, they question it.
	There seems to be all kinds of things going on in the background.
	And I haven't got the whole story with Douglas Dietrich.
	I will have him on my show at some point to ask him about that.
	But I just wanted to get your opinion, because I know that you've been researching this for a very long time.
	And I have to say for everyone listening, I did hold this material in my hand.
	It didn't seem to be of anything on this earth that I could relate to.
	And it had its own heat signature, if you will, so that it seemed to either radiate or pick up my own heat or something of that nature.
	Would you pass on a challenge to Mr. Douglas Beatrix?
	I challenge him.
	To have the metal that I will send him, and I will certify that it's, you know, signed on affidavit that it's where it came from, whenever he's dug up, and have him tested all the way to the isotopic ratio.
	Don't let him just stand in the damn lab and let them say that it's aluminum.
	Because it is mainly aluminum, but then it's got all these absolutely complexities to it.
	And the more we're getting into the complexities, The weirder it gets.
	Okay, and so you've had this analyzed.
	Do you want to say what the various elements are?
	Are you prepared to do that at this time?
	Oh, it would take too long on the phone, but they can go to my website, ChuckWadeUFO.com.
	There's a very, very comprehensive analysis, and it takes two pages to list all the different elements.
	The fellow that did the test, he had six different samples, Wade 1 through Wade 6, and he checked for 68 elements.
	He found 56 elements.
	There's 50 different types, 56 elements in those six pieces of foil.
	These things are complex, folks.
	Okay, I'm sorry.
	Is acting up in the background.
	I'm sorry for that.
	Anyway, I'm trying to put my earphones on so it won't be so loud, and I will quiet my dog down in a minute.
	Do you want to explain what the main crash is that you were talking about with Bill and I initially on the video?
	Was it the St.
	Augustine or was it a later one?
	No, it's the plane to St.
	Augustine.
	Okay, and can you describe exactly what happened?
	Okay, in the night of the first week of July, there's a dispute between Gerald Anderson and I of what night, so I'm going to say it's the first week of July, 1947.
	There were a group of archaeologists working in Bat Cave, which is on the plains of San Augustine, and we know exactly who these archaeologists are.
	Because there's all kinds of theories in the book, so I'm going to clear it up.
	It was a Dr. Herbert Dick, 1947.
	He was a graduate student from Harvard University, and he had some students there at Bat Cave, and approximately 11 o'clock at night, the first week of July, 1947, they thought what came down was a meteor, so they didn't think much of it.
	But the next morning, they looked out to the west, Therefore, the sun would be coming from the east, going out there, and there's just all kinds of shiny stuff over there.
	And so, Dr. Dick and his group, they thought it may be in a plane crash, the night before they thought it was a meteor, but now with all that gleaming over there, sparkling, they came across the planes, and sure enough, there was a UFO.
	But before that, before Dr. Dick got there, There was the Anderson family from Albuquerque that came down in the morning, and they were looking out there for moss agates, which there's quite a few of it out there on the plains, as I understand.
	But anyway, the Anderson family came out on the plains, and Gerald and the group looked over the edge of this little bitty hill, and there was a UFO down there.
	And they didn't know what it was to start with, but it certainly wasn't no airplane.
	And Gerald said it looked like an exploded aluminum factory.
	There's just aluminum pieces everywhere out there.
	And then, shortly thereafter, with the Anderson family there at that crash site, here came Dr. Dick, our Harvard graduate student, Mr. Dick, at those days.
	They came up, and shortly thereafter, Mr. Barney Barnett drove up.
	He was going from one ranch to another out on the plains, and he came up.
	And those group of civilians were just talking around and wondering what in the world it was and all that.
	And then here came the military.
	There's a staff car and then a truckload of MPs.
	As soon as the MPs got there to that crash site, and this is coming directly from Gerald Anderson, he said that the MPs did not even look at that UFO, which was really obviously right there.
	But the MPs surrounded the civilians They pointed guns at them and they yelled and screamed and hollered and told them you weren't supposed to be there.
	And over and over told them, if you ever tell anybody, you're going to die.
	And they were really belligerent, the military was.
	And then the military took these civilians and walked them up to the road, which is quite a ways, but they walked them up there.
	And there these civilians got up to the main road.
	In those days it was just basically a dirt trail.
	The military brought in a crane, and a bulldozer, and a tanker truck's load of fuels, and there's truckloads of army supplies.
	Folks, these people were prepared to pick up a UFO that they shot down the night before.
	I spent a long time in the military, folks.
	You don't get a crane, and a bulldozer, and people together overnight.
	Because this crash happened about 11 o'clock at night, These military people was on this crash site before noon the next day.
	That doesn't happen unless it's organized.
	They were organized.
	The military was organized to shoot this plane, this craft down.
	Okay, what's interesting is that they were organized, but at the same time there were what you might call pedestrians in the area, local people, and they didn't actually cordon off the area.
	So, in other words, they weren't You know, I don't know if it's their technology wasn't ahead of time or able to track the craft to where it was going to land and or crash.
	Do you know what I'm saying?
	In advance.
	I do, but what is my theory is that this high-powered radar was mobile.
	So it went into the planes and they would have these little small radars that would triangulate whatever they shot down, whether it's a plane Or whatever it was that shot down, they could triangulate it and bring it to ground.
	They knew where this thing hit.
	If they didn't know where they hit, and I have been there a few times, there's no way on this god's earth that they could have found it overnight.
	The plains of San Augustine is roughly a thousand square miles inside of a big, tall mountain.
	The plains are about 500 square miles of fairly flat, old lake beds.
	And another 500 square miles of sloping from the lake bed up to the big tall mountains.
	There's a thousand square miles out there and you can't see any road, building, nothing from this crash site.
	It's just out there in the middle of nowhere.
	So the military or anybody could not have called the military to come and get it.
	And if they did, let's say somebody did see a crash.
	Wouldn't it come with a stretcher and an ambulance?
	Why would they bring a truckload of MPs?
	Well, exactly.
	Well, that means that they possibly had some kind of signature, though, on their radar of the type of crap it might have been.
	Isn't that right?
	I would think that they knew about this for quite some time.
	Because inside of the plane, the San Augustines, which is just north of the White Sands Missile Range, It had another name in those days, what's called a white van's missile range.
	They had a radar in there inside of this in case that a missile, one of those U-2s or whatever they're shooting down a white van, may have gone into the planes.
	They had this radar in there where they could track it to ground.
	So it was intentionally put there to track the ground.
	Okay, so at this point what happened?
	Okay.
	The military took the folks over and towed the road there.
	The Andersons got in their car and left.
	And I'm not sure how Professor Dick or Dr. Dick got back over the Bat Cave because I have no way of knowing.
	And then also Marty Barnett, he was in his vehicle and he must have taken off.
	But Marty Barnett told his supervisor about it and the supervisor just poo-pooed it.
	Chuck, we're going to take a short break and we're going to be right back with you, okay?
	Thank you so much.
	Thank you.
	I'll be here.
	Okay.
	Well, I love the applause.
	No, just kidding.
	Okay.
	Are you there, Chuck?
	I am.
	All right.
	So we were right at the part where, I guess the party, you called them green.
	Is that last name?
	No, Gerald Anderson and Barney Barnett and Dr. Dent.
	Okay.
	So one of the groups, I guess the Anderson group, they had left, right?
	All three of them.
	All of them.
	They all went together.
	All of them left.
	They were herded up to the main highway or trail, the dirt road.
	And that's where they party company.
	Now, let me ask you, did they ever talk about like anything like, you know how Close Encounters of the Third Kind talks about how one side of the face gets sunburned, all that kind of stuff?
	Did they ever talk about that?
	No, not at all.
	I don't take any effect.
	I feel confident these things aren't radioactive.
	But Gerald did touch that craft.
	It was about 32 foot in diameter and kind of stuck in a very small hill.
	And he was under it and felt cold.
	He physically touched the craft, and he said it felt very cold.
	And that's very, very important, because that means that these crafts run on negative energy, not positive energy.
	Oh, okay.
	That's interesting.
	Because it was cold?
	Yes, it's cold.
	And it's out there in the July in the desert.
	It's going to get hot.
	Right.
	Very interesting.
	Okay, I don't recall you saying that piece of information before.
	I may not have.
	There's a lot I haven't said.
	Oh, really?
	Okay.
	Except for the fact that that's understandable.
	Because why?
	Because there's so many details?
	Well, there's so many details and so many crashes.
	Oh, I see.
	All right.
	So, at this point, what happened at that point after everyone left?
	Who was crushed?
	They went away.
	Everybody went away and the military took the craft someplace and I have no idea where.
	No idea.
	So if anybody knows where that craft was, let me know.
	Okay.
	And then the Andersons didn't reveal it to hardly anybody, just themselves up until 1989, whenever there was a TV program that said Unsolved Mysteries, I think it was.
	And Gerald Anderson came forward and saying that he knew something about it.
	And in 1992, they destroyed Gerald Anderson.
	And I am absolutely disgusted because they destroyed him intentionally.
	Because he knew what happened.
	Alright, can you elaborate?
	What do you mean by they destroyed him?
	Gerald Anderson was caught in a lie.
	But it was a polite lie, not a vicious lie.
	And they made that lie, which was the length of a phone call.
	It was that unimportant.
	A length of a phone call.
	And they said he's a liar and you couldn't believe a thing.
	From 1992 until Mr. Art Campbell got hold of Gerald Anderson just maybe 15 years ago, he hadn't mentioned it.
	And he still hasn't mentioned it up until about four or five years ago.
	And then he and I become friends.
	He's been at the site.
	He told us exactly where everything happened.
	And in June of last year, we were there at the site.
	Gerald Anderson was using a metal detector exactly where that craft hit Earth.
	We found pieces up to 16 inches in diameter.
	Well, long.
	It's not that long.
	16 long by 6 wide.
	We found quite a number of pieces.
	And Martin Campbell and I did not know where it hit.
	Alright, I'm sorry here, but I need to back you up a little bit, because you've said a couple things, and I really need to drill down with those couple things.
	First of all, I've got somebody who needs to know, are you saying they shot the craft down, and if they shot the craft down, did they use some kind of radar, or do you know?
	They definitely shot it down, and they used radar, without a doubt.
	We had no missiles, we had nothing back in 1947.
	But we have these high-powered radars that were intentionally built for the military to guard the skies over Los Alamos.
	That's a fact.
	Okay.
	And then the other thing is, you said this individual was caught, Anderson, Gerald Anderson, was caught in a lie.
	Can you elaborate?
	What was the lie?
	What was the nature of the lie?
	And then what did he mean when you call it a white lie?
	Why do you call it a white lie?
	It was the length of a phone call.
	Gerald said it was one, let's say it's 30 seconds, and they had it on tape that it was a minute.
	It's that small, it's absolutely insignificant, but it was a lie.
	I know, but can you tell me what was the nature of it?
	Under what circumstances?
	I have no idea, it was just the length of the phone calls, that's all I know.
	But it'll come out in the book one of these days.
	He lied to someone?
	What?
	He lied to someone?
	He said a phone call was a very few seconds, and they said it was a minute.
	I'm kidding.
	Therefore, if it was longer than it was, then he lied.
	That's not a lie.
	That's not a lie.
	It is.
	It's of him.
	It's insignificant.
	Well, okay.
	I mean, estimating time, you're telling me that he made wrong... But that's just it.
	It was absolutely insignificant.
	But yes, they could use that because it wasn't correct, and they destroyed Gerald Anderson in 1992.
	I have the proceedings of where they did this.
	And it was disgusting.
	Wow.
	Based on the fact that he said something was the wrong number of seconds long.
	Yeah.
	Incredible.
	It was the length of a phone call, right in the proceedings.
	Oh, so I see, I see.
	That's insignificant.
	And these key researchers, and from that, these key researchers, and you probably, and most of your audience has heard, These key researchers saying that the Plains of San Augustine crash did not happen.
	I have been in the audience three times since I heard that.
	Right.
	And it really ticks me off because I have parts of that stuff in my pocket.
	And twice after they said that and they said they're done, I raised up and told the audience that I have parts of that crash that did happen.
	Yeah.
	And I'll guarantee you these key researchers don't like me.
	Okay, well, yeah, and I have to say that, well, all people have to do is go look at our video and watch the way you handle yourself and they can tell that you're a very straightforward and honest man.
	Thank you, I appreciate that.
	And I want the people to know the truth.
	It's been, what, 65 years now?
	It's time the truth came out.
	I would say so.
	Okay, so at this moment, what happens was they carted that craft off.
	And then, what is it you did with your research from that point on?
	Did you follow those witnesses?
	Was there more to that story?
	Or do you have to go to the next crash retrieval?
	No, there was a Mr. Art Campbell from the state of Washington about 15 or so, 20 years ago.
	He and his wife were coming to New Mexico, reading the book, The Roswell Incident.
	And they were close to Sikoros and they said, let's just go out on the plains and see if we can find it.
	Well, it took him several years, but he found it.
	And then in 04, Mr. Anderson had, not Anderson, Mr. Campbell had parts and pieces of that craft on stage at the Aztec Symposium in 2004.
	And I was in the audience.
	And as soon as he stepped off stage, Art Campbell and I shook hands and we became friends, and he took me, myself and my wife, down on the plains, and others, and we have dug up parts of that craft.
	Okay.
	And that was the St.
	Augustine crash, is that correct?
	Yes, uh-huh.
	That is correct.
	Great.
	Yes.
	And I, you know, I have to tell people that I've been in touch with Art Campbell.
	In fact, I'm going to, it's very likely that I will get a chance to interview him, in fact, when I'm up in The Shasta Conference, which I will be speaking at the Shasta Conference, which is around the, I think it's the 19th of May, maybe that whole weekend, and so you're welcome to come down.
	Actually, West Happiness, I actually think they are full, although that's just the information I got today from Sean David Morton.
	It looks like maybe all the tickets have sold out, but you could check in.
	I personally couldn't make it, but maybe some people other could.
	That's right.
	But I have been in touch with him, and he has been talking to Camelot about various things going on, and we're going to try to cover some of those details.
	But yes, he was involved in this.
	So, at that point, what is it you did next?
	Where's your research gone from there?
	To another crash retrieval?
	I've been to other crash sites, but this is the one I know the most.
	But I'd like to clear up to your audience something that It's very, very confusing.
	And if they will take notes, I think that you'll find that these books that these key researchers have put out over the years, those were theories.
	And they don't add up.
	But what I'm fixin' to tell you is what happened in Roswell, 1947.
	1947 specifically about 11 o'clock the night of 4th of July 1947 and this you're from eyewitnesses and after Davidson other things and I think About 11 o'clock the night of the 4th of July, 1947, there was two children in the backseat of their mother's car going from Roswell to Prawn.
	And they saw three major flashes.
	I mean, really flashes.
	It lit up the desert and the mountains.
	Huge flashes.
	And what I think is, And this is a couple, three days after the one that crashed, the craft, the UFO crashed on the plane to San Agustin.
	The military took that high-powered radar over north of Roswell.
	And the night of the 4th of July, they reached up and shot a craft, a UFO.
	And that thing flashed, huge, and crashed.
	Let's say that's the Walter Haught Colonel Corso site, about 40 miles north of Roswell.
	Well, with those old radars, the tracking radars, they did not know, the military did not know they shot that down.
	Therefore, it was civilians that found that craft, the Hawthorne Coastal Site, and reported it to the military in Roswell.
	The military went out and retrieved that small craft north of Roswell.
	And that's in Walter Hawthorne's affidavit.
	Saying that it's like 14, 16 foot wide, not quite as high, or not quite as long, and 6 foot high.
	So it's small.
	14, 16 foot long, not quite as wide, and 6 foot high.
	That's a little dude.
	It is basically intact.
	There was a crack in it, but there were some dead aliens in it.
	Okay, that's the one north of Roswell.
	Then let's go over by Corona.
	About, oh, 40 miles south east of Corona.
	Same thing happened about eight seconds after, and in the interview I gave you in IUFOC, I said three seconds.
	I meant eight seconds.
	Okay, the first one crashed there by North Erazo, the Hot Corso.
	Then eight seconds later, there was another major, huge flash, and that crash, crash, flashed and crashed, and that Elastica crashed onto the Foster Ranch, southeast of Corona.
	But it flashed and crashed, and the military did not know they had shot it.
	Therefore, nobody found it, except Mike Brazel, and then he came to Corona to get my dad to go out.
	Then he went to the Sheriff Wilcox, and Wilcox got hold of the military, and the military went out to the Corona debris field.
	On that one, Last summer, July 2011, my wife and I went to Phoenix, Arizona to talk to an old retired military person.
	He wasn't retired from the military, but he was retired.
	He was 87 years old.
	But in 1947, he was in the military, and he was taken from the base in Texas, flew into Roswell, and from there he was put in the back end of a truck and went out to a UFO crash site somewhere outside of Roswell.
	And he said that craft was about 100 feet in diameter, and it wasn't tore up very much, and he told us a lot about how pretty it was and nice.
	They'd taken all the instruments and everything like that out, but the desk was still in through the walls and how nice the windows were.
	And then also about 30 feet back from the front of it, it's round, so about 30 foot back, there was a dividing partition.
	And this Army guy said that his job was to go up to a door and retrieve parts that they were taking that craft apart, like studs or boxes and stuff.
	And he went from that door out to the side of the craft, up a set of stairs that built an arroyo there, and dumped it down to a truck.
	Folks, that's the best I've ever heard about the only thing I know about the craft there in Corona.
	Because they're always talking about the debris field.
	But what really irritates me about these folks that got these mixed up, these drafts mixed up, is there at Corona, there was truckloads of debris.
	And then they tell the thing skipped over to the plains of San Augustine, after it hit Corona, went over to the plains of San Augustine, where I physically have parts of.
	The one there at Plains of San Augustine was basically intact.
	With a big crack in it.
	That's from an eyewitness.
	The one that's north of Roswell, that little bitty thing, by eyewitness and an affidavit, that craft was small.
	Okay, let's take another craft there, the UFO crash there by Roswell.
	And let's call it the Jim Ragsdale site.
	And that's 54 miles northwest of Roswell.
	In the talk I gave you there in At IUFOC, I called it the Jim Anderson.
	I regret that.
	It was a Jim Ragsdale site.
	I corrected myself the rest of the way through.
	But Jim Ragsdale and his girlfriend were having a good time on the side of the Capitan Mountains, which is not too far from a nightclub.
	There's lots of trees.
	And he and his girlfriend were having a good time up there.
	And they saw this major flash out to the north.
	And then that flash did not go out.
	It kept really, really bright.
	And per affidavit, Jim Ragsdale says it's as bright as a welder's torch.
	Well, whenever you take two wires, electrical wires, and put them together, there's sparks.
	Well, this thing just kept sparking.
	And it took about 10 minutes for it to come from up by Corona area to come over and go through the trees and then crash there on the side of the Capitan Mountain.
	And what I think happened is, being that this craft that Jim Ragsdale saw, flashed, but it did not crash.
	Immediately, it flashed and kept flashing for about 10 minutes.
	And those little radars were able to pick it up and bring that craft to ground over there on the side of the mountain.
	Because if Jim Ragsdale's after David, he says his girlfriend and he, after just a little while, They didn't know what happened.
	They thought it was maybe an airplane, of course.
	So they went over there, the thing was about a 20-foot in diameter round craft, and it was wedged between two big rocks.
	And folks, I'm holding a piece of that rock, one of those big rocks in my hand, right now.
	I've been there.
	You look out from that big rock to the north, you can see where the great big old tree's stumps are still there.
	But you can see out there.
	So whenever that craft came in, it knocked those trees and tops off.
	They died, but the stumps are still there.
	I've seen them.
	But being that that craft flashed, but did not go out, it kept sparking, that way the military was able to triangulate it to the side of the Capitan Mountains.
	Because when Jim Ragsdale asked for David, he and his girlfriend got up bright and early and was over picking up spoils.
	They had a couple gunny sacks full of spoils from that craft, and then here come a bunch of really big noises, and they got the heck out of there.
	Folks, I want to know, if they didn't, if the military did not shoot that thing down and triangulate it, why were the military showing up on the side of the Capitan Mountains early morning of the 5th of July, 1947?
	Okay, so you're saying that they took two, like a couple bags, you called them gunny sacks, of material away from that site.
	Is that right?
	That is correct.
	It's in his affidavit.
	Okay.
	And what happened to that material?
	One sack was in his girlfriend's vehicle, and she had a wreck, and it killed her, but the material was never found.
	The other material was in Jim Ragsdale's house, Someone broke into his house and took the material.
	Okay.
	And the girlfriend that died, how soon after this?
	Just a short while.
	I don't know exactly, but it wasn't long.
	I see.
	So that's very suspicious, right?
	Oh, definitely.
	Okay.
	The whole thing is suspicious.
	And has anyone ever followed those leads out?
	In other words, to find out, you know, how they died, whether it was natural causes, you know, any of that stuff?
	I have absolutely no idea.
	Okay.
	These other key researchers are doing over there by the Roswell thing, and I'm over here with Gerald Anderson and Art Campbell doing the Plains of San Augustine And really, I don't know too much about what those guys do over there, except what's in their books.
	And a lot of what's in their books was theory, which is wrong.
	Okay, interesting.
	So, but to get back to Roswell, because you basically said there was, were you saying there were three crafts that night?
	That is correct, within a minute.
	Okay.
	And you're saying one was very small, had bodies, right?
	Yeah.
	And was that the one, that was the one that Matt Brazell reported?
	No, not at all.
	No.
	The one that, there's just debris.
	I've read where there's bodies, but that's over the corona at the debris field.
	But they said there was bodies, but I don't know much about the bodies.
	It depends on what you read.
	I don't read all of it.
	But for sure, on the Jim Ragsdale side, Jim's affidavit, there were four dead aliens in there.
	And he tried to take the helmet off one of them, but it wouldn't come off.
	I see.
	And was that the one where they had six fingers?
	Had what?
	Six fingers.
	I can't tell you.
	I don't know that I know that.
	Oh, I see.
	But I've heard, depending on what crash it is and even what century it was, whether they had four, five or six fingers.
	So I don't know.
	Interesting.
	All right.
	So what do you think?
	I mean, do you want to sort of detail what you think were the wrong conclusions that we're coming to?
	For example, Colonel Corso, was his information correct?
	Yes, and I was a courier for Colonel Philip Corso.
	I had read the book in 1997, his book, The Roswell Incident, before I went to Roswell, and I thought, whenever I was reading the book, that the governor of the state of New Mexico needed that book.
	So my wife and I went to the UFO Museum in Roswell, purchased the book, Colonel Corso's book, and then we found Colonel Corso, and he signed the book for the governor, And then I got to talking with Colonel Corso, and I told him I was interested in alternative energy.
	He said, I've got something for the governor.
	So he sent me a packet of information that had some good stuff in it, and I took it to the governor of the state of New Mexico.
	The next year, which would be July 1998, I communicated with Colonel Corso several times during that period of time, but he and I were going to meet in Roswell, July 1998, he had another package for me to take to the governor.
	I got to Roswell, Colonel Corso wasn't there, and I found out he had had a massive heart attack, and he died on the 16th of July, 1948.
	July 1998.
	July the 16th, 1945 was the day they put the, detonated the first atomic bomb at White Salis Muscle Range.
	Okay, but Corso died when you were supposed to, he must have died right, or been taken ill then, right when you were supposed to go meet with him, is that right?
	That's right, and he was feeling fine whenever I talked to him, and in just a very few days.
	I wish I kept notes, but I don't, didn't.
	So he was very, very suspicious.
	Yeah, that's a really interesting piece of evidence.
	Now, were you written about in the Corso book that was written later?
	No, not at all.
	I'd never heard of Colonel Corso until I read his book.
	Oh, right.
	Okay.
	So, and has anyone else talked about the fact that you were meeting with him or anything like that in any other subsequent work?
	Do you know?
	Not that I know of.
	Okay.
	Well, because that's very interesting.
	So, so somehow the governor now, which governor?
	Do you know which governor?
	Governor Gary Johnson, that is running for president.
	Right now?
	Yes, right now under the, I'm not going to say what party, I don't really know.
	I see.
	And so this man is the governor that you were supposed to deliver this stuff for to from Corso was still alive then?
	Oh, definitely.
	Yeah, my son has been his speechwriter.
	The governor's speechwriter.
	Oh, really?
	Okay, so you're still in touch with this man?
	Oh, not very much.
	No, that was a long time ago.
	I see.
	But I did see the governor a couple years ago, and we shook hands.
	I see.
	Okay.
	But we're not friends by any stretch of the imagination, you know.
	He's a very good governor, but I'll say that.
	Okay, and this is the governor of Arizona or New Mexico?
	New Mexico.
	Okay, interesting.
	All right.
	We can also go to another crash there by Roswell in that same time period.
	Yeah.
	In 1947, over the 4th of July weekend, and this is about 45 miles southwest of Roswell, and Chuck Satowsky and his assistant Debbie Zickemeyer are researching this crash site.
	And they have got a lady saying in 1947 on the 4th of July.
	I'm going to have to ask you Chuck to just hold on.
	We're going to go to another break at the top of the hour here and we'll be right back.
	Thank you.
	Thank you, happy questions.
	About your relationship with this governor, and I'm very interested in that suddenly, because the link up with what you said might have because the link up with what you said might have been some, well, information about free energy as well, right?
	It was about a device that Los Alamos National Laboratory brought to a base near Carrizoza, New Mexico.
	I believe the Red Sands Missile Base or something like that.
	Colonel Corso, after he left the Pentagon and other places, he was the commanding officer of a military base just outside of Carrizoza, New Mexico.
	And Colonel Corso said that the Los Alamos National Laboratory brought a big device, he called it about six foot cubed and about six tons in weight.
	The military or civilians or whoever it was from Los Alamos, He dug a hole about 30 feet deep and put this device down in the hole and covered it up with the only thing coming out of that device was electrical cord that went up part of their base.
	There was no heat dissipation system or anything like that.
	Just one electrical cord coming out.
	And the Los Alamos left that device in the ground for several months And then they came and dug it up and took it back to Los Alamos.
	And what really ticked Colonel Corso off, they destroyed that device rather than putting it on the market.
	That was in the 1950s.
	Well, you know, just because on Camelot, are you sure they destroyed it?
	Are you sure that just wasn't a cover story to throw people off base?
	No, Colonel Corso was told that they destroyed it.
	No, I have no knowledge at all for sure.
	Okay, but he gave you a packet of information to give to the governor, right?
	That's true.
	And what I told you that was in there, that they dug this hole, put this device in it, and then came and got it and took it away.
	Okay.
	Well, it just means that that governor, and you say he's running for president.
	Sorry, but I didn't know that.
	Maybe he's actually somebody who actually knows something about what's really going on then.
	I predict not.
	No, Los Alamos is a world of its own.
	There's thousands of people up there and what they do, there's no telling.
	But I have been told, if we can think of it, they've already built it.
	Yeah.
	Well, what I'm saying, if that man was in communication with Corso, you know, back then, which is, I don't know if it's 40, 50 years ago, it's very logical to think that this man might be somewhere a lot longer, a lot farther along than most people in terms of his awareness of what's going on.
	The governor you mean?
	Yeah.
	Oh, I doubt it.
	No, I doubt it.
	He'd have no reason I don't think to do any of that.
	Okay.
	No, I really don't.
	No, I hear you.
	But, you know, well, okay, we'll just we'll just leave that alone.
	So at this point, you still have tried or have been in touch with the governor a bit because your son works for this man, is that correct?
	No, well, we worked for him two and a half years.
	But no, I personally only met him.
	Okay.
	Just met him.
	I don't know him, per se.
	Yeah, I understand.
	Okay, so at this point, when you're talking about the Roswell crash, is there anything else that you want to go over before I start with the questions that are coming from the audience?
	Yeah, let's go finish off that crash southwest of Roswell.
	This lady said that there was a lot of military out on their place over the 4th of July, 1947.
	And they didn't say why.
	But also there's a Frank Kauffman that just keeps batting around.
	He was intelligence in the military, and then he became the Chamber of Commerce president there in Roswell.
	And he was always said he was involved in the crash, and people always thought it was north of Roswell, until Walter Haught died.
	That was a very small craft.
	Frank Coughlin said his craft was about 25 foot, not diameter, but 25 foot long.
	Therefore, I'm going to predict the craft southwest of Roswell will be called the Frank Coughlin site, then the one north of Roswell, Corso site, the one over by Corona is the debris field, and then the Jim Ragsdale site on the side of the Capitan Mountains.
	That puts in six crafts that I've talked about.
	Let's talk just momentarily about a seventh crash that happened in March 1948 up on Aztec, New Mexico.
	The crash that crashed there in March 1948 by Aztec was 100 feet in diameter, absolutely totally intact.
	And there's a book that's just now coming out.
	I've ordered it, but it hasn't arrived, by Scott Ramsey, that's talking about the Aztec crash.
	And Scott has studied for years, researched for years.
	I can hardly wait for that book.
	So I give Scott Ramsey's book about the Aztec crash.
	I hope everybody will read it because I'm sure it's going to be good.
	Okay.
	That's the seven crashes that I'm familiar with.
	Okay.
	And that sounds fascinating.
	Now, are you saying you don't know much more about the Aztec crash at this point?
	Well, I've been up to it and Uh, they had trouble getting into it, but they finally figured out how to get into it.
	And I've been told that once they got into it, they figured out how to take it apart.
	And they took it apart and hauled it someplace, I have no idea where.
	But there were 16 dead aliens in that craft.
	Okay, well then, uh, do you happen to know what they look like?
	Uh, no, I was just told it burned to a crisp.
	Okay, do you know how tall?
	Do you happen to know?
	All right.
	Do you happen to know how, what do you mean he died?
	He died?
	When what?
	No, I'm sorry.
	You said that you found out there were 16 dead aliens and that was from an eyewitness who died.
	Yeah.
	A friend of mine's father was an eyewitness to the 16.
	My friend said that his dad told him there were 16 dead aliens in that craft and they were burned to a crisp.
	Okay.
	And that man has died as well, right?
	Well, he's dead now.
	I don't know when.
	I don't even know his name.
	I see.
	Did he happen to tell his son how tall the aliens were?
	No.
	That's all he said.
	They were burned to a crisp.
	No details at all.
	Okay.
	That's too bad.
	And the son didn't even ask him, huh?
	Well, I don't know.
	He was just a kid.
	Right.
	He probably was six years old.
	I see.
	Well, kids usually ask a lot of questions, but okay.
	That may happen.
	We forget also.
	I see.
	Okay.
	So, well, that's very interesting.
	So, it will be very interesting to see that, to hear about Scott Ramsey's book.
	Maybe I'll have to have him on my radio show here.
	Oh, please do.
	Okay.
	So, why don't you put him in touch with me if you happen to get in touch with him before I do.
	Okay.
	I'll be happy to.
	And so at this moment, in terms of all the crashes and all the information, because you've been doing this for many, many years, this is a lot of history, right?
	Well, I've known about the crash there at Cronus since I was 7 years old in 1947.
	But what really turned me on was the book, The Roswell Incident, 1980.
	I read that book in 1981, and in that book there's a picture of Bill Braswell.
	Who is Matt Brazell's son, and Matt was the person that found the debris on the Foster Ranch by Corona, that it came to Corona to get my dad to go out to the site.
	Well, Bill Brazell, I've known him basically all my life, and whenever I read that, in the caption of that picture, it said, Bill Brazell had parts and pieces of that UFO in a tavern in Corona.
	And then he showed it around, and then a couple days later, the military came and got it.
	Well, as soon as I read that, I called up Bill, because he lived in Capitan in New Mexico at that time, and we talked for quite a while.
	He wanted to know how my mother was doing, because my dad had passed away.
	My dad had passed away two years prior to this, and then I'd love for my dad to have read that book.
	I'm sure we would not be having this conversation.
	Because he was straightening some people out many years ago.
	But anyway, Dad, did not read the book, and I regret that.
	But anyway, whenever I read that caption that Bill had parts and pieces in my dad's bar, or tavern, I asked Bill, and I read him that statement, and then I asked Bill, point blank, is this true?
	And he said yes.
	That was 1981.
	What's that, 31 years ago?
	I decided at that moment I wanted to find out what happened in 1947.
	So I've been looking at this a lot for the last 31 years.
	Wow.
	Okay, that's very interesting.
	And so, as far as, I mean, you basically have sort of a vested interest in what goes on here in a certain way, right?
	Definitely.
	Okay, and what interest is that?
	Is that mainly just to get the truth out?
	The truth out, and then I also, this metal is extremely complex, and we don't know how those UFOs fly, but I will guarantee you, this metal has a lot to do with their flight, and also their lights, and their heat, and their cold, and everything else.
	This metal does stuff we, the people of the world, Needs to know why it was on that craft and what it did, how it's made, how it's used, etc.
	etc.
	Because every piece of metal we have is different.
	Okay, when you say it's different, what do you mean by that?
	Let's say a piece of paper is 20 microns thick, which is close.
	We've got pieces that's thinner than that piece of metal, piece of paper.
	We've got some that's 20 microns, 30, 40, 50.
	One of the biggest pieces, or thickest, is 65 microns.
	But that's about three pieces of paper.
	And then we've got pieces that is the outside of the ship, the inside of the ship.
	But we've also got one piece that we're calling a chunk.
	And also it's a honeycomb looking thing.
	And this honeycomb thing that's, let's say, about the size of the palm of your hand, it's an inch and a half thick.
	But the thickness is holes, just like you take a, you can have soda straws and put a whole bunch of them together about the size of the palm of your hand.
	And that's what this thing is.
	It's very, it's absolutely beautiful.
	And I was within a foot of whenever it came out of the ground, and it looked like it just came from a jewelry shop, not being buried for 65 years.
	And just yesterday, I received a laboratory report on that metal, and it'll be on my website here pretty quick.
	I don't want to discuss it.
	You don't, huh?
	Okay, well, all right.
	Well, that's very interesting.
	So, you've taken these pieces to a lab, and what about, have you ever had someone try to break in, take them away from you, anything like that?
	No, thank goodness they have them, but it would be awfully hard for them to find it, because I live in Galveston, Mexico, and I predict there's more space in this town than any town in the United States.
	So, they're going to have hell finding it.
	Oh, I see.
	Don't even try.
	Interesting.
	Okay, fine.
	So, we've got a lot of people here in the chat that want to ask you questions.
	Do you mind if I start asking you those questions?
	I'd love to, and if I can't answer them, folks, I'll tell you I can't.
	Okay.
	Thank you, I'd love to.
	Okay, fine.
	Let's see.
	Somebody's asking, do you know which ETs were aiding the Earth during the Roswell era, if any?
	Who is what?
	Aiding?
	No.
	Do you know which ETs were... The way they phrased it is, aiding the Earth.
	Helping the Earth, in other words.
	During those Roswell years.
	I have absolutely no idea, and I predict very few people would know the answer to that.
	There are so many different types of E.T.s here.
	There's just not one kind.
	There's lots of types.
	Okay, let me ask you this.
	Did you happen to hear if the E.T.s coming out of these crafts back in those days all looked similar, or whether they were all looking different?
	Because I heard they looked different.
	We don't have much to go on.
	I have a pretty good idea of what Gerald Anderson, he should have Gerald Anderson on some day if he had come on.
	And we could tell you, but these were small little greys.
	It sounds like whenever Walter Hoth saw one of these dead aliens there at Roswell in the hangar, I predict it was a grey.
	And then Gerald, Jim, Ragsdale said there's four little people in his, and I think you said called them people, and then we don't know much about the ETs off the CoronaCraft, and then the ones over there by Aztec is 16, but we don't know much about them.
	Right.
	So whether they're all the same or not, I have absolutely no way of knowing.
	All right, fine.
	What about Clifford Stone?
	Have you ever met and talked with him?
	I have.
	I've met him on several occasions.
	He's an excellent speaker and has I just, I'd really like to be with him.
	He probably don't know me, but I definitely know him.
	Yeah, he's a wonderful guy, for sure.
	Okay, and we did recently interview him again, the second time.
	He was there with Bob Dean at the UFO Congress just recently, where I... It's on the front page of Camelot.
	If you haven't seen it, then I encourage you to do so.
	Let's see, we've got a person asking if you've seen the series Dark Skies, and if you have, what you thought of it.
	Actually, I've not seen very many of the movies at all.
	I'm just not a movie goer, so I've never even heard of it, so no ma'am.
	Okay, well that's a TV series that was on TV many years ago.
	I've never even heard it.
	Yeah, okay.
	The one I do like though is Ancient Aliens.
	I like that a lot.
	Okay.
	Let's see.
	How many people were involved in the cover of what agencies?
	Now, that's a far-reaching question.
	I don't think... I have absolutely no idea.
	Yeah, I mean, how are you going to know that?
	Let's see.
	Someone wants to know, you know, you mentioned how the craft was cold on the outside, and I guess the person is thinking that, you know, it came from outside our atmosphere, that it might have been going through a cold I don't know, area of space, through space, which would have made it cold, but I think coming into the atmosphere and then landing on the ground, I don't know between the time when it landed and the time when he touched it, how long it was out there.
	Do you want to address that?
	Yeah, I'd be glad to address that.
	That makes no sense at all.
	These things were flying around, incited at the planes of San Augustine and over Roswell.
	There's eyewitnesses.
	Of UFOs being seen over the base there in Roswell before the Roswell incident happened.
	No, these things are flying around.
	They didn't come in from space.
	These things are... What I like to think of, the plane to St.
	Augustine, like I mentioned earlier, is about a thousand square miles, surrounded by very tall mountains.
	I think at least this one, maybe others, UFOs got in there and that was their Motel 6.
	Because they had radars and white fans and up in Albuquerque.
	But the radars would not go down inside of that big bowl.
	So I think they knew they were there, so they were there.
	But I think the cold is because of the way the electricity, of whatever kind of electricity, is using a negative current, not positive.
	And I've also read in other books where the craft feels cold.
	So it isn't just Gerald Anderson, it's other people.
	Okay, yeah, and that is an interesting dichotomy on a certain level.
	Well, you can appreciate though that if it is so-called ET, and it wasn't created here on Earth, that it had to come from another dimension and/or outer space at some point originally.
	You do accept that?
	That could have been a thousand years ago or a thousand days or minutes.
	We have no idea.
	Okay.
	But it did not get cold in the atmosphere.
	It got cold by the way the machinery, whatever it is on that craft, was operating.
	Gerald Anderson looked into that craft.
	It had a big crack in it and he got up and looked in it.
	And he said there was about a foot from the outside to the inner wall.
	And there's, you can see the back end of the equipment, there's lights going on and off.
	And also there was a, what he called at that time, he thought it was a horse's tail hanging out that craft.
	But it turns out, I feel that that was about a horse's tail size fiber optics.
	And why would they need a whole horse's tail of fiber optics?
	In a craft that most likely did not even have a telephone.
	Fiber optics went to all these different pieces of foil to make those pieces of foil do something.
	Whether it's propulsion, or turn right, or red, or orange, or whatever.
	That foil is a key to the propulsion system, the light system, everything on that UFO.
	Okay, well, let me ask you this.
	Did you ever give that material to any kind of a psychic or anyone else or even show it to Clifford Stone, for example, and get any kind of report from anyone like that?
	I've showed it to several.
	Some of them, whenever I handed a piece of metal, the whole arm will turn red.
	Right.
	Yeah, they have very, very, very strong reactions to it.
	And it's on YouTube.
	I was giving an interview with David Sirita, and his lady that was doing the camera work was a strikee with a pendulum.
	So after my talk, she took her pendulum, over six pieces this metal had there, and some of these pieces, the pendulum would go clockwise, some of them would go counterclockwise, and one of them went back and forth.
	And I've had other people do the same thing.
	Okay.
	Interesting, yes, and I will say again that it got warm in my hand.
	I was very aware of the heat being generated from it.
	Let's see, how many crashed UFOs?
	Well, I guess this is again sort of a general question, but over the years, do you have any idea about how many crashed UFOs have been shot down?
	Oh, I have zero idea of how many, but there's a lot of them.
	Yes.
	Lots of them.
	Clifford Stone went around the world cleaning them up.
	And no telling how many other casts and people over the years.
	No, there's been lots of them.
	Okay.
	Let's see.
	Do you know how thick the walls of the craft was in St.
	Augustine or the other craft?
	St.
	Augustine is the only one I'm really familiar with.
	And the outside of the craft is about a sixteenth of an inch.
	And then there's that chunk about an inch and a half.
	And then there's an inside wall that's about half the thickness of the outside wall.
	Okay.
	Let me ask you this.
	Were you ever told... Excuse me.
	While I'm thinking about it, I'm holding in my hand a piece that's about 16 inches long and 6 inches wide.
	I've taken a whole lot of pieces off to send to labs, but I have this piece in my hand as we speak.
	Okay.
	And you're saying it's 6 inches wide?
	Yes.
	Yes.
	6 inches wide.
	A sixteenth of an inch thick.
	Oh, I see.
	Okay.
	But it's long, about sixteen inches long and six inches wide and about a sixteenth of an inch thick.
	Okay.
	Let me ask you, somebody here is asking you whether or not there were symbols found on any of the craft.
	No symbols or anything like that.
	I have one piece of, it's a very, very thin piece of plastic.
	I've got two or three feet of it.
	And it's almost like a membrane.
	And there's one place on there that's an X, about maybe a half inch wide, an X, like a cross.
	But then there's also at the bottom, there's 45s coming out of the center.
	So it's an X with two extra 45s coming out of it.
	And that's the only kind of thing we've found any kind of symbols.
	Hmm.
	Okay.
	What do you mean by two 45s?
	45s?
	Well, 45 angles?
	And that would be on four 90-degree angles.
	And two of those 90-degree angles, they divided it into the half, which would be 45 degrees on both sides of it.
	So the top, there's a spike sticking up with angles of 90 degrees on both sides.
	And then the bottom, three sticks or whatever you want to call it, 45 degrees to clean all four.
	But these are not inscriptions, really, right?
	I don't think it's an inscription.
	It had something to do... What it looked like, something like whenever you're looking at a newspaper, they have little X's that helps the person in the press figure out what the newspaper is.
	Well, it's something like that, but it's about 3 quarters of an inch, or half 3 quarters of an inch, versus just tiny.
	But that's the only thing that we found that looks like any kind of a...
	Okay, one of the things that Bill and I came across several years ago was information in regard to that apparently James Jesus Angleton had in his files, it was said, which talked about I personally don't, but I would be a bit surprised.
	I know Dr. LaPause and others were involved, but no, I've not studied who was there at all.
	I've just read a little bit about it, but not studied it.
	that was called in to analyze or deal with any VESA?
	I personally don't, but I would be a bit surprised.
	I know Dr. LaPause and others were involved, but no, I've not studied who was there at all.
	I've just read a little bit about it, but not studied it.
	Okay.
	Have you ever had any experiences with men in black types or any None.
	No, absolutely nothing.
	And I'm really thankful.
	Nobody has whispered in my ear or put a .45 in my temple or nothing.
	And I'm really thankful.
	I hope that continues.
	Okay, we're going to go to break.
	We'll be right back.
	Thank you, Chuck.
	Thank you.
	Our questions here.
	We've got about a half hour to go, I believe.
	Yeah, until the end of the show.
	So, you know, I am curious, you know, a lot of years has passed.
	You've had various jobs.
	I think you are or you were in the military for quite a long time.
	Is that right?
	I'm still in.
	I've got 54 years now.
	In 2019, I'll have two 30-year careers back to back.
	One of them was for reals with the military, with the Navy.
	I got a nice retirement there.
	But I also am in the New Mexico State Defense Force, which is a militia.
	I hold the rank of Major.
	And I've got 24, in June it'll be 24 years in there, and 30 years with the Navy.
	I see.
	And do you ever feel that you are being messed with mentally at all?
	Zero.
	Okay.
	They wouldn't have much to work with either, by the way.
	That's very funny.
	No, that's not true.
	You're very astute and, you know, you're a great guy, too.
	So, I think maybe they don't want to mess with you for some reason, but it's quite interesting.
	I have no idea, but I am absolutely thankful they haven't.
	And I hope they don't.
	Because I think it's time the truth be known.
	And I have a lot of truth.
	That's right.
	Okay.
	So, at this point, we still have some more questions here in the chat, and if you want, I can continue to ask you those questions.
	Oh, please do, yeah.
	Alright, unless you have... Yeah, I'd like to know what people are thinking.
	Okay, fine.
	But do you have anything else that you want to say before I go there?
	Because, you know, we are getting to a, you know, we're almost through the show, and I want to make sure that you get to say everything you'd like to say about what's currently going on with your research.
	Okay, we started out talking about whether these crafts were Japanese, or German, or Russian, or what.
	I would like to make a challenge to three different individuals.
	One of them I'd never heard of until tonight was Douglas Beatrix, and also Dr. Joseph Farrell, and the lady that wrote that book, Area 51, Ann Jacobs.
	I'd like to make a challenge to all three of these authors to take the medal that I have And go to a certified lab, all the way to the isotopic ratios, and give an apology to the people that read their books, because the books are wrong.
	And I'm here to back up what I say.
	Okay.
	These things came from space.
	I hear you.
	Okay.
	Well, that's fine.
	And, you know, at some point, I may put you in touch with this Douglas Dietrich, too.
	Please do, because I can really inform him and get him off of his high horse.
	All in Japanese, because it's absolutely false.
	Okay.
	Now, let's see.
	We do have a few more questions, so I'm going to go to that.
	Did you know Jesse Marcel personally?
	Not as a dad.
	I've met and had lunch with Jesse Marcel Jr., a wonderful man.
	Okay.
	Full bird colonel.
	I see.
	Is he currently in the military?
	I can't tell you that.
	He may be out by now.
	He's getting kind of old.
	Uh-huh.
	Okay.
	I know him, you know, just through lunch.
	All right.
	And let's see, I'm trying to find if there's anything else.
	Do you know anything about orbs or what they're made of?
	No, I'm not too interested in orbs except I know a lot of people that are.
	So I'll let them do that, and I'll do mine.
	But yes, they're all over.
	Okay.
	In fact, I was on a conversation just the other day with a guy whose wife had passed away, and he said on the telephone conversation, there were several of us on it, that his wife had come on an orb to visit him.
	Oh, really?
	Except for what it's worth.
	Okay, very interesting.
	Yes.
	Let me ask you this.
	Have you, I don't know how much you've seen the Camelot interviews or anything like that, but do you happen to know about, have you ever been to Dulcey?
	Do you know about the Dulcey Base?
	Yes, I've been to Dulcey.
	I was up there about two years ago whenever Norio Hayakawa had a base seminar there, and there was more than a hundred people there, and they had people from the Dulcey tribe there, It was an absolutely wonderful experience.
	And then also there's a book called The UFO Highway by Mr. Sanchez.
	I've read it.
	I've talked to Mr. Sanchez.
	He wrote me an email one day that said my theories were correct.
	I encourage people to read the book The UFO Highway by Anthony Sanchez.
	That's great, and I'm a big fan of his.
	I've done several interviews with him as well, and so I appreciate that.
	So when you went out to Dulce though, but did you actually go out to the Dulce, the Archilega de Mesa, that area?
	Did you happen to walk out?
	No ma'am, we were right there in the main town.
	We started out in the hotel, but we more than filled up the hotel room.
	So we went to a meeting room that someone arranged for us very quickly.
	And it was a fascinating morning, or actually went into the afternoon, as I recall.
	As I recall.
	Yes.
	Now I've got a question here which I actually think I also wanted to respond to because I held some of this material in my hand and what I wanted to say was, and it's actually in our video, but what Bill and I Both our reaction was to holding this is that if you closed your eyes and you left the thing sitting on your hand, you couldn't feel it.
	It was that light.
	Now, the question the person's asking is how much does the piece of craft you have weigh?
	In other words, the one you're talking about that's six inches wide.
	I'm holding in my hand, and I'd say two ounces, maybe three.
	I can tell it's there, but I'm sure most things would be heavier than that.
	That's a good question.
	I've never weighed it, so I will.
	But it's red and white.
	I've asked a lab to do this, because I got a phone call from a fellow the other day, saying that for a neighbor, he tested this aluminum.
	It turned out to be 26 aluminum, and all Aluminum on this earth is 27 aluminum, the only stable isotope.
	So if this thing is 26, I've already put an email out request for a lab to test this and see if it is 26.
	Okay, well what will that mean if it's 26 as opposed to... It means that it's not made on this earth.
	Right, okay.
	I mean big time because this stuff is everywhere, the metals.
	I mean, there's a lot of people who got this metal.
	May I ask, say something on that?
	Sure.
	Folks, we the people have been absolutely taken to the ringer on analyzing this metal.
	Whenever you send this metal to a laboratory, it'll come back saying it's nothing more than aluminum.
	It's an aluminum matrix around some very, very complex formulas.
	Maybe send it off, tell these laboratories where it came from and do you want like a scanning electron microscope or these other EDXs or isotope ratios, tell them what you want.
	Because I gave a piece to a guy while I was there in IUFOC the other day and they took it to the lab and it came back, hell this is all it is, is aluminum.
	Well, it's an aluminum matrix, but all that little stuff in there doesn't come out unless you're qualified to get it out.
	This stuff is itty-bitty.
	This is in the nano stuff, and there's little of it.
	Okay.
	Well, one thing I have to say, if you send something off to a lab, there's no guarantee you're ever going to get it back.
	That also happens.
	Stuff gets, you know, supposedly lost.
	Yeah, I've heard that.
	Jim Mars had a very sad situation, and others.
	But so far, every one I've sent to, But I've not got very many stuff back, I'll say that, from the people that sent it to the labs.
	Right.
	I've given stuff to continents of people, and none of them will write me back.
	I don't know where this stuff is.
	And I think they're either ashamed to admit it or something, I don't know.
	But if any of you guys know a lab that's certified that wants to work on this, I'll be glad to furnish pieces.
	More than glad.
	You know, I was talking to Art Campbell, and he said that there was something, some new big announcement that he had coming up, something they were working on.
	Do you know what he's talking about, and are you prepared to say anything about that?
	This is the first time I've heard it, so whatever it is, he's not told me.
	Oh, all right.
	No, I have no idea, but now you've got my curiosity up big time.
	Okay, yeah, I mean, I don't know... Art Campbell, folks, is an excellent, excellent researcher.
	Yeah, I don't know what it has to do with.
	He does a lot of work in the area of the Eisenhower, the meeting with Eisenhower at the base and so on.
	And so that's some of his, he's been looking for witnesses in regard to that a lot.
	So I'm not sure what his information concerns.
	I will certainly be glad whenever it happens, because whatever it is, you can take it to the bank.
	Okay, fine.
	The people in the chat would like me to relay that everyone is just delighted with you.
	They would like to express their thanks from the chat group for your interview.
	Thank you.
	I really appreciate that.
	Keep track of my website.
	We don't update it very often because this is like making molasses or something.
	It takes a long time to get anything done, but I'll tell you what, I am absolutely determined to get it done.
	Okay.
	Yeah.
	And there's no doubt.
	I believe you.
	Absolutely.
	You're just like a dog with a bone.
	You will not let it go.
	And that's a good thing.
	Sure.
	I'm dedicated to finding out as much as I can and distributing the information correctly.
	Okay.
	I've heard some of these people that had a book in 1980 say, just two years ago, the two UFOs went together, crashed.
	I mean, When you say that it didn't happen, in what way are you saying it's a crash that you're familiar with and the way they described it?
	Yeah, the one that crashed over by the Plains of San Augustine crashed on the Plains of San Augustine.
	The one that crashed by Corona crashed at Corona.
	But they crashed on different days, so they couldn't possibly have ran together.
	Okay, so you're saying that... And also, if these things had ran together in the air and made any kind of a hole, they would be foil all the way to New York City.
	This stuff is really light, and like the one there at Corona, the debris field, it started out small and then it became a V-shape, and it wound up about a couple hundred yards wide and three-quarters of a mile long.
	But if that was in the air, it would never have got to ground, I'll guarantee you.
	Alright, but you're saying that this stuff basically fragments and spreads everywhere.
	Is that what you're saying?
	It did.
	It is.
	And every piece of, or let's say many of the pieces I have, went on that graph as a piece not pouring up in the crash.
	And I can explain that very thoroughly.
	Let's take a piece of foil and on the outside edge, turn over that edge and back on itself.
	And this dust is nowhere near like a rectangle or a triangle.
	This is weird-looking stuff.
	Every blasted edge on that thing was turned back on itself.
	And that's even the pieces the size of a nickel.
	The outside edge is turned back on itself.
	Okay, when you say turn, okay, what does that mean, turn back on itself?
	Just take a piece of paper and fold it over maybe a half inch or so.
	Yes.
	That edge is no longer an edge.
	It's folded over.
	Okay.
	And then you fold it over, whenever you fold a piece of paper over, you've got a bulb, a void there at the edge.
	You see what I'm talking about?
	Yeah, but what do you think causes it?
	Take a piece of paper and fold it back.
	Yes.
	Well, that bulb does not exist on these foils.
	They crimped that, the two pieces of foils, the flat one and then the piece that turned back, has been crimped where it's absolutely flat.
	In fact, we had this stuff two years before we even noticed that.
	But then we got to looking at every piece that's got the outside edge folded over.
	Okay, and what is the significance of that?
	Uh, I wish I knew.
	But I think it has something to do with the electricity in there.
	Rather than squirting it out the end, the electricity out the end of that piece, it's folded back on itself, where the electricity will go back into the foil.
	Rather than going out to other places.
	I don't know.
	That's a pure guess.
	But I'd like to know.
	If anybody would know why all these pieces of foil have turned back on itself and flattened, I'd like to know.
	I don't know now.
	Okay, and let me ask you this.
	Have you talked to Rich Dolan at all about your evidence?
	A little bit, but not much.
	He's always so busy with his wonderful books.
	I almost had no time to talk to him.
	I see.
	But he was selling his book one day in Roswell, and he also had a stack of the Fate magazine, and I bought one of them.
	It turned out my story is in that Fate magazine, and he didn't know it, and I didn't know it until I bought it.
	Okay.
	So that was a coincidence big time.
	Yeah, very interesting.
	I mean, it seems like he would be interested in your testimony, although perhaps because he's kind of moved on from that part of the book that he wrote.
	You know, I guess he has to, you know, whenever you get a new piece of information, you have to go back over the old information.
	And so he's kind of in a funny position where he's writing part, he's got like, you know, UFOs in the national security state for those listening.
	So he's got book one, he's got book two.
	And I guess the next idea would be he's working on book three, because he has still not made it up to the present day.
	And that was his objective.
	And so for him to go back to Roswell at this point, maybe that's why he just doesn't circle back just yet, because he's not prepared to do that.
	Yeah, I don't fault him at all, because he's doing wonderful works with his books.
	I get to admire him a lot.
	Absolutely.
	Well, I agree with you there.
	Okay, well, you know, it's been really great to talk to you again, Chuck.
	I'm trying to see if there's any last minute Information or questions coming through.
	One person does want to know if you have been to the DUM, what they call the underground bases in Kansas and Missouri.
	Have you ever been to an underground base?
	I've never been to any underground base anywhere, but I've known people that have been in them.
	And Mr. Balthasar in Roswell, he's an authority on those.
	Ask Dennis Balthasar in Roswell.
	Okay.
	Now somebody is asking me a question that's actually off topic, but I'm just going to answer it really quickly.
	They're asking me about someone named David Martinez.
	I think they got the name wrong.
	What they mean is James Martinez.
	I have tried to reach James Martinez a number of times.
	He's a person that had gotten in touch with Consciousness Media Network in regard to the financial changes, and I have not been able to get back in touch with him, unfortunately, but I would love to do so.
	So, we'll see what happens on that score.
	I don't think I do, but Martinez is such a common name, but I look through my files and see if I have a James Martinez I know I've got others, but I can't tell you right off hand.
	No, but that's okay.
	So as far as what you're planning to do next, do you have any ideas about where this might go for you?
	I think that I'm going to look for laboratories and scientists and try to figure out why this metal was on those crests.
	There has to be a reason or they would not have been on those crafts.
	So we got metal from the plains and then Jim Ragsdale found metal and metal is mentioned in the craft over there north of Roswell by Walter Hart.
	And then they found all that truckloads of metal there by Corona.
	Why was this metal on those crafts?
	Okay, but you're not talking about the stuff in your hand, right?
	You're not talking about that.
	Exactly, exactly what I'm talking about.
	Precisely.
	Okay, you're calling that metal.
	Yes, or foils.
	This big piece I think would be a metal, because it's got thickness.
	The others are foils.
	Okay, but you're saying why were they in the craft, but weren't the crafts made of them?
	Yeah, the whole realm of the metals on a craft I'm interested in it.
	I see.
	I want to know how this thing operates.
	I feel confident that our national laboratories have already figured this out many years ago.
	Sure, I would imagine.
	So we the people need to figure it out where we can have it in our realm, not just the military realm, our scientific realm.
	Okay, well let me ask you, have you ever tried to meet Robert Lazar?
	Bob Lazar, are you familiar with him?
	I am, but it doesn't... I mean, I can't... Please give me just a little hint.
	Yes, I'm... Okay.
	Well, I mean, he worked on Black Projects.
	He's quite famous.
	He was associated with John Deere.
	Oh, okay.
	Yes.
	Now I remember.
	Yes.
	Yeah.
	And they... Los Alamos, and they destroyed all of his records and all that?
	Yeah, probably.
	Bob Lazar is a real person.
	I have a friend.
	That was in the military with me.
	There was a security guard in Los Alamos that knew Bob Lazar.
	So yes, he's a real person.
	Okay, does that person want to talk to me?
	I doubt it.
	In fact, I know he doesn't.
	He doesn't.
	Okay.
	Okay.
	Are you real familiar with different levels of secrecy, you know, secret clearances and so on?
	Not really.
	In all my time in the military, I've never seen anything.
	No, I was with the Naval Seabees and all we did was use wood and, you know, construction stuff.
	No, I've not had any, absolutely no kind of clearances.
	Uh-huh.
	But have you met people with special clearances?
	Well, not really.
	No, there's no reason for me to have met anybody in the military with much of a clearance.
	Now, I wasn't around scientific people at all.
	We were construction people.
	I see.
	Okay.
	And now we're security type people.
	All right.
	Now, I've got somebody asking, have you ever come across any other material other than the kind of material you've been, you know, sort of talking about and getting analyzed?
	Yes, I have.
	I have a piece of a Well, actually, I have two pieces now of a craft that crashed down by Deming, New Mexico.
	A guy by the name of Shoemaker is familiar with that craft, and I bought a piece from Mr. Shoemaker, and then a friend of mine gave me a piece.
	And we've had that piece analyzed, the piece that I have, and it's very similar with lots of different kinds of elements in it as what I have.
	And last year I was involved in two guys back in the Midwest had globs.
	I don't know what a glob looks like, but two different globs.
	And this one fellow that got hold of me, he had walked out, and it was in the Midwest, and he'd walked out his back door and there was a UFO just feet above his head.
	And then when that thing took off, there was a glob fell off of that craft and almost hit him.
	He was still hot.
	So he's trying to find out what to do with it, and I put him in touch with a laboratory.
	And then he had a friend that had found a glob out on his farm.
	So I've been involved with two pieces.
	Well, I don't understand what you mean.
	Glob?
	You mean... Well, it wasn't a piece.
	It was just sort of like a cow patty, let's say.
	Of some kind of material?
	Just a piece of metal that got hot and fell to earth.
	That's interesting.
	I don't know too much about the science or anything.
	All I did was get him one-on-one with the scientists that did this stuff.
	Okay.
	Now, I've got another person asking, has a materials scientist examined the material?
	I'm not sure what that means by materials scientist.
	Well, I have a good idea, yes.
	And there's some top-notch people looking at it as we speak.
	I mean, absolute top-notch.
	Okay.
	And by this time next year, I'll be able to give you much more information on this foil than I can now.
	Why?
	Why this time next year?
	Why are you saying that?
	Because I finally found the type of people I need to analyze it properly.
	Okay, but it's going to take them a year?
	Really good.
	And it's going to take them a year to do it?
	I don't have any idea.
	So far, it's taken me since 2004.
	What's that, eight years?
	No, I think now we're in really good shape.
	We've got some really top-notch people looking at it.
	In fact, an aluminum expert looked at this stuff, a piece of this foil, I'm sorry, it wasn't the foil, it was a piece of the outside skin, within the last week.
	And he said he had never seen nothing like it before in his life, and he's an absolute expert on foil aluminum.
	So we'll see what happens.
	Well, yes.
	Well, please do keep us informed, Chuck, and keep Camelot informed so we can add links to your page and your interview and send people to your site to find out where things are at with your investigations, all right?
	I would really appreciate it.
	We'll keep it better updated now that we're getting more data.
	Absolutely.
	You can't update unless you have data, but we're fixing to get a lot of data, so we're going to update it.
	Okay, so what do you... But I really, really appreciate you, Carrie, for allowing me to come on and speak with the audience, and we can get this thing out in the open correctly, finally.
	Okay, absolutely.
	I guess I've got to say goodnight to you.
	I believe we're wrapping this show up, so I'm sorry I can't get to any last-minute questions here.
	Chuck, why don't you give your website and any particulars that you'd like to for people?
	My website is chuckwadeuso.com.
	And from there, you can go over to Ken Lima's website.
	It's still on my website.
	Who's Ken?
	And Ken is taking an interest in showing this medal off on his website, and he's got lots and lots of pictures of this medal on Ken's site.
	Excellent.
	Okay.
	Thank you so much, Chuck Wade, for your service to humanity and for hanging in there and being such a diligent researcher, and hopefully we'll hear more from you in the future, okay?
	I really appreciate that.
	Have a good night, everybody.
	Thank you.
	All right.
	And thank you, everyone.
	Please stay tuned to my radio show next Wednesday.
	Let me see.
	And I guess I'm going to be on this fundraiser tomorrow talking about my guest.
	I'm going to have Courtney Brown from Farsight Institute next Friday.
	John Kettler is my guest on Wednesday.
	Hoping that'll work out.
	And we're working on the rest of the guests for the future, but thank you very much for listening, and please stay tuned to Camelot.
	We are looking for donations.
	Our donations have been down recently.
	We do need donations to continue this work, so thank you very much.
	All right.
	Take care, everyone.
	Good night.
	Okay, folks.
	I hope you enjoyed the show tonight.
	I thought it was pretty excellent and very informative.

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