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Sept. 25, 2023 - Dr. Oz Podcast
42:45
Why Can't Anyone Stop an Explosion of Child Sexual Abuse? | Dr. Oz | S11 | Ep 40 | Full Episode
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Time Text
Millions of disturbing online images.
Are we talking about pornography?
Oh, yes.
For the first time, we joined an undercover sting operation and busted pedophiles hiding in plain sight.
Got any weapons on you?
Plus, the public outrage-facing rapper T.I. Stand on the controversial virginity test.
I think he did it out of protection.
It's up to you.
It's your choice, your body.
We're weighing in.
It's a wake-up call for the entire nation.
Coming up next.
Season 11 starts now. .
Children have the right to feel safe, but there's a disturbing epidemic endangering them that keeps growing and growing, and it's happening right in plain view.
What you see right here is a live map of children predators all around the world downloading explicit content of child abuse material.
By the end of today's show, there will be an estimated 63,000 additional images of sex abuse shared online.
There's been a staggering explosion of child abuse material.
That's more than we've ever seen in history, with officials everywhere saying we have reached a crisis point.
Today, we are declaring war on pedophiles.
And for the first time ever, my investigation squad joined up with a high-tech task force as they tracked and busted pedophiles in an undercover sting.
Reporter Mara Scavacompo from my investigation squad is here.
She's just back from the bust.
Let's walk through how this problem got so out of control.
In 1998, 20 years ago, there were over 4,000 reports of child sex abuse imagery.
4,000.
Mara, what happened a decade later?
Yeah, in 2008, that number had risen to more than 100,000.
In 2014, it skyrocketed to more than 1 million.
And shockingly, last year, there were 18.4 million.
That's almost a third of the total report of the date in one year.
That's 4,000 times more of an increase from 1998, just in the last year.
And what gives?
I'm seeing headlines around this in all the major papers.
What led to this explosion?
Yeah, this is a huge problem.
And quite simply, it's because of technology.
There are more ways to share photos and videos today than there have ever been before.
So Mark got an invitation from law enforcement in Houston, Texas, where their police have been on high alert.
Yeah, you know, we really wanted to get a sense of how law enforcement is tackling this problem.
So we spent 24 hours with officers in the biggest city in the country working to get pedophiles off the street.
And what I witnessed was even worse than I imagined.
I'm here in Houston, Texas getting ready to meet up with members of a high-tech crime unit dedicated to fighting internet crimes against kids.
They're going to give us exclusive behind-the-scenes access into their daily fight with sexual predators who lure, exploit, and abuse kids on the internet.
At the Harris County Sheriff's Office, I meet Gary Sperger, who manages the task force.
What does your unit do?
Our function is to hunt down those individuals who would hunt our children.
We're looking for individuals who are sharing child pornography on the internet.
We're looking for individuals who want to come meet a child.
Are we talking about pornography in the sense that we all think about pornography?
Oh, yes.
I mean, full-on sexual contact.
With children?
With children.
What kinds of people are sharing these images?
We've arrested priests.
We've arrested airline pilots.
We've arrested doctors.
We've arrested lawyers.
All walks of life.
All walks of life.
And how does the High Tech Crime Unit track down suspects?
Each one of these dots represents an individual who said they have an image of child porn and they're willing to engage in a file sharing transfer.
Every image, every file on the internet has a digital footprint that identifies that unique image.
We match the number to get the image, then we'll backtrack it through the IP address to find out where that originated from.
So now we obtain a search warrant through a judge to find out who is doing it.
When you track down the individual, do you find that they have a lot of material?
We arrested an individual who has over 29 million images.
Wow.
In a 650 square foot apartment.
Wow.
And what are we going to do today?
So today we're going to go after those individuals who are actively engaged and looking for live children for the purpose of engaging in sexual contact.
We head to the final logistical briefing for today's operation.
Describe what we're going to see.
So we have two locations.
We have operations that are going to be working.
One operation location is going to be where they're going to be talking from, chatting, acting like kids.
Another location will be an apprehension location where we will give out the location and our bad guys will show up with the intent of having a sexual encounter with a child.
And how many predators are you expecting to catch during this operation?
We've done operations where we've caught as little as 4 to 5 over a 3-day window, and then we've had operations where we've caught in excess of 25. It all kind of depends on which way the fish are running that day.
So let's get started with our briefing real fast.
You guys all know what we're after, right?
We're after individuals who have made the choice to actively go after a child.
These aren't guys that are possessing child porn.
These aren't guys that are distributing child porn.
These are guys who have made that next step.
Take photographs of that respective piece of evidence.
It might be a cell phone, if you see a micro SD card, because look, they're here to sexually assault the kid, right?
And so what we know about these types of investigations is it may have been a progressive type of deal where initially they were just looking at child pornography.
Now they're actually here to sexually assault.
We catch one guy tonight.
We keep one kid from getting injured.
What did we do?
We won.
Right?
Let's go catch bad guys.
So right now we're at the takedown location.
A child sex predator is on his way here now and you can see the apprehension team is behind me getting ready to grab him.
Public meltdowns.
Don't touch me!
Caught on tape.
That's okay!
Why'd you unleash?
I just snapped.
I had enough.
And Mel Robbins on overcoming your personal demons.
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Five, four, three, two, one, instead of yelling.
Plus, all my children's Cameron Matheson opens up about his cancer battle.
It's funny, you can talk about it so many times.
Still, you know.
That's coming up on Monday.
We catch one guy tonight.
We keep one kid from getting injured.
What did we do?
We won.
So where are we right now and what's happening?
So this is our apprehension location.
This is an area designed specifically for apprehending the bad guys when they show up.
We have another location that's specifically designed for our chat operator.
And what's happening with the chats?
What are they doing?
Those individuals are on different social media applications and they're acting as though they're children and they're having individuals approach them.
Is this the dark web or these apps that anybody can use?
No, these are apps that anybody can use.
That's who all the bad guys are.
Do you have an example of how the chats progress?
I'm gonna show you one that's actually a little tame for us, and it's what you got in mind.
Lots of physical affection.
I'm not too young for you, am I? Nope, no problem here, as long as you're cool with it.
Tell me about you.
You gotta pick.
Let me see more of you first, please.
And it will go south, usually within the first five minutes.
What you just showed me, it's clearly inappropriate, but it's pretty tame.
Pretty tame.
Does it get more explicit than that?
It gets extremely more explicit than that.
We see things that if I were to show you the screen, it would be nothing but all redacted, the whole thing.
And they believe they're saying this to a child?
To a child.
So what happens now?
If you'll take a look, these are the guys who they're going to be meeting.
There's a lot of activity happening right now.
What is happening?
Our unit that does the chats, they've identified an individual who's been talking to one of our undercovers.
That person wants to come meet them.
They believe that individual is a child that's home alone and that they're coming for the purpose of engaging in sexual activity.
What happens when he gets here?
Our undercovers are out in the parking lot.
They'll track them as he comes all the way up to the door.
When he comes to the door, he's going to meet them.
There's a dark colored vehicle that came in and was looking around over here on the first row.
It's going to be parking right now.
Roll over.
Get any weapons on you?
- No. - So what's gonna happen to this guy now?
So this evening this guy will become a resident of the Harris County Jail.
Charged with all my solicitation.
He's going to jail?
He's going to jail.
For us, that's a win.
That's one kid that's not being molested tonight by this guy.
That was our investigation squad on an undercover sting to catch pedophiles.
Morris Gavacompa was back along with Carly Yost from the Child Rescue Coalition.
As a parent, what was the scariest realization while you were right there taking part of the sting?
Yeah, when we were watching officers engage online, it was this stark realization that this is not some fictitious boogeyman.
This is very real and very prevalent.
And lots of predators all at once sending their stuff in.
All at the same time.
They just get swamped.
Hey, how are you?
Hey, beautiful.
Instantly.
So here's the moment, let me remind you all this, when the suspect came to the door, had no idea what was happening.
There he is.
What do you know about this individual that was caught and arrested in this undercover state?
Yeah, so he believed he was chatting with a 14-year-old girl, and he came over for the purposes of having sex with her.
He was dropped off by a friend.
And when he got there, and the moment he realized things weren't quite right, he bolted.
He ran immediately.
Officers had to chase him down.
They brought him back in.
When they emptied his pockets, as you saw, he did have condoms, which speaks to his intent for being there.
So, Houston police were able to take that one child predator off the streets, but right now, around the world, child predators are downloading and sharing explicit content online, as seen on this live map.
This is actually a map right now, right now, of what's going on in the world.
It changes continually.
You'll be able to see it.
According to Carly's estimate, every minute, more than 1,000 sex abuse files are being shared.
Carly's group developed software to detect this activity, which we're watching right now.
When you look at this map, I tell you, it is overwhelming.
Absolutely.
It can be very overwhelming to see all the dots on the map and how really this is occurring in all areas of the world.
We've seen over 54 million IP addresses, so individual computers in possession of child pornography.
54 million?
Yes, absolutely.
So, trading child exploitation material.
And Child Rescue Coalition has led to the arrest of over 12,000 child sexual offenders and the direct rescue of over 2,800 children.
And on average, one offender goes on to abuse 50 to 150 children in the course of their lifetime.
That's, let's just say, one offender per hundred children.
That's a lot of damage you can do.
So after years of monitoring, tech companies have started to step up to their task and started surveilling what's going on.
What steps have been taken so far?
You know, it's a mixed bag.
So the technology does exist to identify these images because they convert the image essentially into a fingerprint.
And then they can scan and compare it to existing images of known child pornography.
But one of the biggest problems right now and most disturbing is live streaming because it's extremely difficult to detect and it disappears without a trace.
So there have been cases where these abusers are abusing children in real time and live streaming it for that sick community to watch as it's happening.
We reached out to the Internet Association and they said in part, IAE member companies work with law enforcement and non-profit organizations every day to combat child exploitation and the distribution of child sexual abuse imagery online, including by specifically developing and donating technologies that are used to find and remove such images from the Internet.
And to help investigators identify victims and prosecute abusers.
They went on to say, IA member companies detect and take down tens of millions of images and videos every year and refer offenders to law enforcement to bring abusers to justice.
So, Carly, give me some practical advice.
These numbers are startling.
What can parents, grandparents do to prevent their children, their loved ones, from being victims of online abuse?
So, it's a great tip for people to...
Pause before they post when they're sharing information online.
So I don't know if you know, but by the age of five children, parents on average have shared over 1,500 images of that child through social media.
So one thing we realized was very dangerous was the use of hashtags.
So we actually compiled a list and we make it available on our website, the most dangerous hashtags that people use, such as hashtag naked kids, Or hashtag bath time fun.
So some other tips that we've included are always keep your settings set to private.
Make sure not to use these dangerous hashtags.
And also don't allow devices or computers in the bedroom.
Wonderful advice and Godspeed in all your work, Mara.
Unbelievably brave.
Wonderful work.
Thank you.
Thank you.
We're going to post an online safety guide from Child Rescue Coalition online.
Please share it with people that you care about.
Guys, we have to be vigilant about what we share because we don't know who has access to our information.
Even innocent posts are getting kids into trouble.
And it angers me that there's a digital hiding place for predators to abuse children.
We can't ignore the enormity or the danger of this problem.
Put it on your radar screen and keep tracking it.
We'll be right back.
We're exposing the truth about the latest hot topic, virginity testing.
We're separating medical fact from fiction.
Rapper T.I. created a firestorm when he actually admitted to accompanying his teenage daughter Deja to the gynecologist, requesting the doctor check whether she was still a virgin.
Yeah, you heard right.
Remember this story, right?
Yes.
All of a sudden just exploded over the last couple days.
Now today, we go behind the headlines of this controversial story.
Take a look.
G.I. is well known for his music and acting.
But now he's also known as the father who gets his 18-year-old daughter examined to make sure she's a virgin.
He admitted it on the podcast Ladies Like Us.
So have you had the sex talk with your daughter?
Yes.
Not only have we had the conversation, we have yearly trips to the gynecologist to check her hymen.
T.I. went on to say his daughter's gynecologist told him a hymen can also be broken by other activities, like horseback riding.
Here's how he responded.
I said, look, she don't ride no horses, she don't ride no bikes, she don't play no sports, man.
Just check the hymen, please.
And give me back my results.
The episode generated so much backlash from the public, even from celebrities, that it was deleted two days later.
The medical community also hit back.
Planned Parenthood tweeted, Virginity is a made-up social construct and has nothing to do with your hymen.
Unfortunately, virginity testing is widespread, a controversial centuries-old tradition practiced in at least 20 countries, mostly to determine a woman's eligibility for marriage.
And here in the U.S.? Well, the test is performed more often than you think.
TI's comments ultimately sparked an important conversation among fathers and daughters, in fact, the entire family.
So a few are here today from all over, even via Zoom, to weigh in.
But first, let's hear from our panel.
My good friend, board-certified OBGYN, and ABC News chief medical correspondent, Dr. Jen Ashton, is here to clear up some misconceptions related to a topic, and they're a bunch.
From grown-up hip-hop, Angela Simmons, who went through her own public controversy related to virginity.
Also from growing up hip-hop, her brother JoJo Simmons, who recently is married and has a father, right?
A new father to a beautiful little daughter, and what are his thoughts?
And we have iHeart's Carolina Bermudez, who like most people has been fired up about this topic since the story broke.
So what's getting you upset?
What do you have to say?
Well, I think the matter is that it was a public statement, and I think that his daughter, rather, T.I.'s daughter, Deja, didn't have the opportunity to decide whether or not she was going to let the public know about her virginity.
It's a very personal, private thing, and I think that's the reason why it was so shocking.
So you know this story well.
You've been following it.
What's Deja have to say about this whole conflict?
Well, as of now, she has been very quiet about it.
That's where we are at this point.
JoJo, as a father, you bring baggage to this conversation.
I certainly do.
So what are your thoughts?
Can you sympathize with T.I.? Um, I think the most important part here is the relationship that he has with his daughter, which some people, some fathers don't have relationships with their daughters.
So I think that even him doing that yearly with her, it shows that they have a great relationship that she trusts him to go with her to do that.
I don't think that he meant to just come out publicly and put her on the spot.
I think he did it out of protection.
You know, he tried to sound like a good father, which he is a good father, because clearly he's in her life and he's taking the steps to, you know, make sure she knows about Sex, obviously, you know what I'm saying?
So I think that them having a relationship about it is the good thing about this.
I was stunned when I looked into this whole issue of hymen testing, and we'll get to that in a second, how commonplace it is.
And just so we get past this, in a lot of countries, you know, the police officers do it.
It's a criminal activity if your hymen's not intact.
You know, in Afghanistan, you send you off to jail.
Wow.
So, I'm not trying to judge T.I. I'm just aware that in T.I.'s mind and a lot of other male minds, it's just something you do.
And there's a medical element to this because it can be really detrimental to young women.
So, Ezra, you were involved in a virginity controversy of your own.
Yeah.
Can you share a little insights on what that has taught you in life and how does that reflect on what's going on with T.I. and Deja?
Right, well, I publicly spoke about it, and a lot of people knew that I was a virgin, and I waited until I was, like, 28, and I went from virgin to pregnant.
So it was like, yeah, it was a lot, and it was in public.
So a lot of people were like, were you lying or, like, what happened?
But it just, like, it just happened really quick for me.
So, I mean, for me, I can understand she didn't speak about it publicly.
You know, it was a choice of mine to speak about it, to encourage whoever wanted to do it, to know that it's not not cool.
You know, like, you have all the time in the world to do that.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah, and Meme, I think we need to be careful before we presume that having sexual activity is not doing the right thing.
Why are we assuming that that's the wrong thing?
So you literally wrote the book, Jen, on adolescent gynecology.
This is the book, by the way.
Yeah, yeah.
So clarify for us, what is so-called virginity testing?
Well, first of all, there is no medical procedure called virginity testing.
We're not trained as gynecologists on a Hymenal exam.
And to be crystal clear, ACOG, which is our professional organization of OBGYNs, and the World Health Organization has made it very unambiguous.
They feel so-called virginity testing is medically, socially, morally, unethical, and an affront to human rights and to women's rights.
Come on over here.
Walk us through some of the biggest myths regarding virginity testing.
And it starts with anatomy, which we'll get to in a second, because you have to actually understand what the hymen is.
So the first truth about virginity testing is that the hymen is useless.
So this is a band of tissue, Mehmet, that sits at the opening to the vagina, and it has absolutely no physical function.
The other thing is that there is no normal hymenal anatomy.
It can disappear on its own.
It can disappear, yes, we've heard in sports.
And I describe it as, think of the hymen like a turtleneck.
There are tight turtlenecks.
There are loose turtlenecks.
None of those turtlenecks, just looking at them, can you tell, has that turtleneck been worn?
The hymen is exactly the same way.
All right, so come on over.
Has any parent ever asked the question that T.I. was asking?
Have they ever said, can you confirm that my daughter is a virgin?
Yeah, unfortunately, I've seen it.
I mean, I've been in practice 15 years, and I think that sets up a slippery slope of making something like sexual activity and behavior shameful, something that's oftentimes punishable with physical abuse to that girl or woman if she's found to be sexually active.
And I think it does the exact opposite of what we're trying to do in women's health, which is empower, educate, inform, And broaden access to make it more appealing for a woman to do something for her health.
And this does the opposite.
So JoJo, TI's got a 15-year-old son, who on their reality show has been quite clear that he's not a virgin, right?
So do you think there's a double standard going on?
Unfortunately, a lot of guys probably be mad, but it is definitely a double standard when it comes to guys with sex and it comes to women with sex.
And I think that it shouldn't be a double standard.
I think that, like she said, sex is a normal part of life, and it's your decision.
Carolina, what do you think?
Well, I think it just goes back to the toxic masculinity that is still in many cultures, you know, thinking that, oh, it's okay for a guy to go out there and to be able to have an active sex life, but then we're putting the value on a young lady.
If she's not a virgin, then she's not as valuable.
So shouldn't everybody hold themselves to the standards, male or female, that you shouldn't have sexual relations until you're in a trusting, comfortable relationship?
You know, so...
Absolutely.
That's the big takeaway, and I think a lot of folks are mixing the issue of when you should have sex with, is this the right way to figure out if you're having sex?
Because if all the major societies are saying it's not right to do, we're still thinking that there's something wrong.
All right, thanks everyone for being here.
You can catch all my friends, Carolina Bermudez, of course, is on Carolina and Greg T in the morning on KTU. Tune in to Angela and JoJo on their new season of Growing Up Hip Hop.
It's premiering Thursday, December 5th, at 9 p.m.
on WE tv.
When we come back, a woman who says virginity testing left her humiliated and violated.
Plus, young women and their dads are sounded off.
Stay with us.
Thank you.
I don't think it's invasive or anything of that nature, not at all.
That's like obsessive and inappropriate, especially father-daughter.
He really thinks of her as property.
Strong feelings.
I'm here with my good friend, Dr. Jen Ashton.
We're back taking on the controversial topic of virginity testing and landed the recent news that rapper T.I. takes his daughter to the gynecologist to check if she's still a virgin.
This is a town hall that you have asked for.
We've got daughters and we've got dads.
They hear from all over with different opinions to talk about the hot topic.
First, what did you guys first think when you heard what T.I. said?
Who wants to go first?
Christiana.
Hi.
Well, when I first thought of it, I just thought, well, having these tests done to her, it has definitely stranded the trust between her and her father.
Let me get to the father side.
George?
Absolutely.
This is almost a situation where you can agree to disagree.
I don't think that anyone can dictate how another man raises their child.
If this is TI's way of bonding with his daughter, slightly keeping her safe, I guess, then it's his way.
I still think maybe he shouldn't have gone public, but he did what he did, and this is where we're at now.
So let's address some issues because so many good points raised on both sides.
First of all, the law, okay?
There are different laws in different states, but over half the country has reproductive minor laws in place.
So a minor, and she was not a minor in this case, she was 18 years old, Uh, can get access to reproductive healthcare of any kind without parental consent.
Whether you agree with that as a parent or not, that is the law.
And that is a law that governs medical health.
I think the other thing that's really, really important here is we need to uncouple the fact that gynecologists are not just vagina doctors.
We're not just sex doctors.
That takes a woman's entire body and boils it down to one function.
And that's medically and socially inaccurate.
We treat the whole person, the whole woman, the whole girl, usually there's a body attached to that vagina.
And as an OB-GYN, that's who I'm concerned with, not just a body part.
So, let me get into that.
Let's get to the first issue, which is, is it appropriate for the father to be there at all?
I welcome it.
I think that more dads should come to the gynecologist with their daughter, but not to inspect or discipline or do detective work to show that, as a parent, they care about their daughter's reproductive health.
Unfortunately, most dads don't come enough.
I never had my father come with me, and my dad was a doctor.
I never went, period.
You never went, exactly.
I wasn't invited.
And so I think we...
There are probably a lot of reasons for that.
But I think if more dads did come, they could use that as an opportunity to get closer to their daughter.
What do you guys think?
Michael, would you go?
Yes, I have two daughters and I'll go.
I don't have a problem.
As long as they're educated and know what their body needs, I don't have a problem being there.
Can I ask?
Actually, you asked the awkward question about virginity testing.
Okay, the awkward question is, have any of you ever been subjected to that or do you know anyone who is subjected to that?
You do?
Yeah.
I had a virginity test done when I was 15 years old.
I asked my mom if I could go on birth control.
It was my, I was starting to have sex.
And I went to my family doctor, and as the exam was finishing, it was actually conducted by an intern, not my actual doctor.
My doctor leaned over her shoulder and said, is she still closed?
And the intern froze, said, yes.
Which, you know, I had already been having sex, because again, there's no way to medically tell.
And my doctor looked at me and said, Good girl.
And it has stuck with me to this day.
It still is so hard to go and trust a provider after trust has been broken in that way.
I'm sorry you went through that, but if I can ask a follow-up.
How did you deal with that in the days, weeks, months that follow?
You're only 15 years of age.
Yeah, I kind of blacked out after the good girl comment.
I don't remember leaving the doctor's office.
I don't remember driving home.
And now it's been well over 10 years.
And I still, when I go to the gynecologist, feel anxiety.
And the good girl comment really just made it feel like, okay, I'm saying good girl because you're supposedly not having sex, but you are.
What does that say about who I am?
So I worry about that judgment every time.
Again, I really appreciate your honesty.
I know how hard it is to talk about this.
It's evident from the way you're describing it.
Did it change your sexual behavior at all?
Absolutely not.
No.
For me, that's the big issue because we're burdening at least half the population with a lot of baggage.
It's not having the desired effect, even if you wanted that to be the effect.
We can disagree about that later on.
But if it's not gonna work and it's medically unsound, it's a wake-up call for the entire nation.
Comments from the women?
You get the last word, because it's your bodies.
Come on.
I just feel like everything has to be a conversation and you guys should be able to trust us and just support our decisions because it's not just about our bodies it's about us as a person like us having a conversation together about everything not just sex needs to be something that happens ongoing in our lives and if you're supporting us through everything it's easier for us to trust you and for you to trust us.
So here are my thoughts, guys.
We need to highlight that the battle over teenage sex with the risks of infection, pregnancy, and shame needs to be waged at home rather than at a doctor's office.
There are two doctors telling you that right now.
So I stand with the many women and doctors around the world that we need to end the practice of virginity testing for good.
It is inaccurate.
It intrudes on the precious covenants that we have with our doctors.
It's bad for everybody.
Thanks for being here.
I really appreciate all your honesty.
Honesty, we'll be right back.
Up next, breaking news about vaping.
Brand new lab testing reveals what could be the missing piece of the puzzle behind the vaping injuries and the deaths that we've been covering.
Could bootleg marijuana vapes be to blame?
Today, an alarming, breaking news report about vaping.
It's a new piece of the puzzle that may explain the mysterious vaping injuries we've been covering here on the show.
From double lung transplants to even death.
I mean big complications.
Is the culprit black market THC? The chemical in marijuana that gets you high.
Illicit products are being sold to unsuspecting customers that have no idea what they're buying may be lethal.
Senior legal and investigative correspondent Cynthia McFadden brings us this as an NBC News exclusive.
Our investigation took us to downtown Los Angeles, where in a 12-block radius we saw dozens and dozens of storefronts advertising vaping products.
We're in pursuit of what black market operators come here for, the empty packaging and cartridges that they fill with cheap and often tainted substances, sold as legitimate THC products.
Within minutes we score.
We were able to go in one shop, one stop shopping, buy these dank vape containers, the packaging, and a hundred of the cartridges into which you can put whatever you want.
There's no ID, no tax, no nothing.
And it's counterfeit marijuana vapes like these that may be making people sick.
I do believe that I was given black market stuff and I do believe that had an effect on me.
Fabian says his lungs were slowly beginning to shut down.
He ended up in the emergency room.
I couldn't breathe.
I couldn't talk.
I literally couldn't even move my hands.
So what is lurking in these black market vapes?
And are the legal ones even safe?
No one, not even the FDA or the CDC, had tested the actual vapor people are sucking into their lungs.
Until now.
And today, we reveal those results.
Cynthia joins us.
What exactly is marijuana vape, and how do you compare it to the typical e-cigarettes or tobacco vape products?
Okay, so a step backwards.
Vaping is just taking a liquid of the compound, heating it up, and then that vapor is what you suck into your lungs.
So if it's nicotine, like a Juul, which has 80% of the market, that's tobacco.
THC, the active ingredient in marijuana, it's made into a liquid form, and then it's heated up, and then you suck that into your lungs.
So again, the cartridge looks like this.
Yep.
That's what we were buying.
That's what we were buying.
And these are the ones we bought on the street.
So we bought, for a hundred bucks, we bought a hundred containers and a hundred of these.
So if I'm a black market manufacturer of THC oil, I'm in business.
When you walked into that store, what actually transpired?
What was the conversation like?
You said, I got a hundred bucks.
What do you got for me?
Did you have to sort of lead him along?
How'd you hook the fish?
Well, the first thing I would say is that we had our choice of dozens and dozens and dozens of stores in downtown Los Angeles, all of them selling these kinds of illicit products.
And so we said, hey, we want to buy some containers.
We rolled off a few of the illicit names that are popular.
Dank Vapes is one.
You've got it right here.
Dank Vapes is associated with many of the people who got sick.
It is not a legitimate brand.
There is no company called Dank Vapes.
So the black market on this, which is what's concerning to me, seems to be dominant.
There doesn't seem to be any way of taking them out.
Consumers are unsuspecting.
Well, even more insidious, there are legitimate brands that aren't contaminated of THC oil that you can buy in states where it's legal.
And these counterfeiters make boxes and carts that look exactly like those legitimate brands.
So the consumer has essentially no idea what he or she is going to consume.
So the black market operators fill empty cartridges with their own substances, and then they're selling them as legitimate tested products.
But what exactly are they putting in there, and is it dangerous?
Cynthia brought this stuff to a lab to find out.
The CannaSafe labs in Los Angeles, considered one of the top marijuana testing facilities in the world, Canasafe executives Aaron Reilly and Antonio Frazier explain they've come up with a brand new test.
We wanted to design a system that would be able to provide reproducible results.
To do something they wish the government would do, analyze the vapor produced by illicit THC oil.
Canasafe tested seven THC cartridges from licensed dispensaries and six from the black market.
When we come back, the shocking results from the lab.
I'm back with NBC News investigative correspondent Cynthia McFadden.
And for the very first time, a new lab test is able to tell us exactly what is in the vapor produced by THC oil when you vape.
What's actually going into your lungs?
Just remind everybody what you tested.
Okay, we tested seven legitimate products.
These are licensed brands from licensed dispensaries.
And then, on the black market, we tested six black market.
These are licent.
What did the CanadaSafe lab testing show was in the vapor coming out of these?
Okay, there were no contaminants in either the oil, we also tested the oil previously, either the oil or the vapor here, if it was used at the temperature that's recommended.
We can talk about that later.
What say now?
The lowest temperature or a lower temperature?
Yeah, a lower temperature because guess what?
When you crank the thing up, which is what kids do because it makes more vapor, carcinogens.
Yeah, so not safe anymore.
Not safe anymore.
Now, what happened with the black market cartridges even when it was turned at the right power setting on the low side?
Okay.
Under the best set of circumstances, this stuff is dangerous.
It's contaminated.
This is just you're asking for it.
You vape this stuff, you're asking for it.
Well, they're stealing your money.
It's not surprising they would steal your health.
But what percentage of America is given products that are counterfeit?
You're asking a question that's really hard to answer because this is the illicit market, the black market.
It's underground.
Law enforcement is having a really hard time Getting its hands around this.
Think about it.
I mean, the FDA isn't testing this stuff.
Why?
It's not legal across the country, so the FDA doesn't have the authority to test these brands.
But, you know, states are doing the best they can, but...
Well, the best they can is not good enough, in my opinion, because we've got a population that doesn't appreciate...
Just the things I've read, maybe it's a quarter, maybe it's half of all the stuff It's being brought, basically, from a drug dealer.
Alright, the THC oil.
Let's go through exactly what kinds of things were found in your testing.
By the way, it's state-of-the-art, and I would applaud you for doing this, because our own government isn't doing this.
We finally got the answers from you.
Well, some of the things, none of them good.
Carbon monoxide, formaldehyde, pesticides.
We're in the counterfeit stuff, the illicit stuff.
Correct.
And you found a couple of things that surprised you.
Yeah, it'll surprise you too.
Cyanide.
Yeah.
You don't want your kids breathing that stuff.
You just don't.
Or yourself.
And vitamin E oil, which is a little bit confusing, it really sounds healthy.
But what they want though is the consumer to think it's real THC oil.
So they mix it with vitamin E oil.
Why'd they pick that one?
Because the viscosity, the thickness, is the same as vitamin E oil.
So these are really crafty, dastardly criminals.
So, let's talk a little bit about vitamin E, because I think it's emblematic of the problem we have here.
We all know substances like pesticides and cyanide are dangerous.
That's why we talk about it.
But vitamin E sounds healthy, right?
But when you inhale the vapor with vitamin E in it, it goes into your lungs, right?
At the high temperature, it's converted into an oil, to a grease.
In your body.
Once in the lungs, some say that it coats the airwaves.
And when it does that, it coats the airwaves, it starts an inflammatory reaction, making it really hard to breathe.
The inflammation and the oil get into the tiny little sacs, these little sacs, right, of your lung that are hard to treat.
Now, the CDC thinks vitamin E is a big culprit behind these marijuana vaping deaths and injuries, but...
No one's sure.
And if these black market products are being sold like this, the question I'm having to everybody is, what can people do to make sure that they're getting something that's safe?
Well, don't buy illicit products.
Buy from a licensed dispensary is one thing.
I just want to add a little bit to your vitamin E oil here.
So the Mayo Clinic, as you know, did a round of testing on 17 patients who had that vaping illness, and they discovered that the lungs of those patients looked like someone who'd been exposed to mustard gas.
So, here's why it's important.
There are only state-regulated marijuana dispensaries in states where it's legal, right?
To your point, the government won't regulate it because it's only in these states.
So, when you look at the country, if you're in a red state, maybe you're buying marijuana from a legitimate place, right?
If you're in a gray state, guarantee you're not, then even in the red states, what Cynthia's telling me is there are more of the illegal places, illicit places, than illegal ones, which means you're buying the stuff from drug dealers.
They're not legitimate sellers.
I don't see a difference between the two groups.
So you've got another big warning, which I want you to point out, which is the temperature warning.
Just make that really clear to folks.
So when we tested the legal product that didn't have the contaminants that are horrifying, the cyanide and other things...
Cranked up higher, they produce what the lab told us were carcinogens.
But you know, if your kids are doing it, tell them making those big vapor puffs is just not worth it.
It could be killing them.
So, if you're not buying THC cartridges from a licensed dispensary in states where they're illegal, here's the picture again, right, you're buying them from the drug dealer, don't do it.
And if your vape pen is an adjustable temperature setting, don't crank it all the way up because it's dangerous.
Lots of data supporting this now.
Use the lower power setting.
Cynthia, wonderful reporting.
Thank you very much.
Thank you.
You can catch Cynthia's reporting today on NBC's Nightly News with Lester Holt.
And be sure to check out Cynthia's latest report, the results of a year-long NBC exclusive investigation where she uncovers an underground army of child laborers in Africa.
They're digging up a mineral being used in everyday cars, planes, and cell phones.
We're all using them.
We'll put a link to the special report on DrRoz.com.
I'll be right back.
All season long, we've been talking about the power of one.
How one person can reach out and help another in small but profound ways.
So today I ask the question, what's the best advice you've ever received?
And to share hers is my good friend and host of Inside Edition, Deborah Norval.
Who I adore.
Who I adore.
And you know, I look at you, and you just seem absolutely perfect.
Thank you.
But we've spent enough time together to have shared experiences, and we all have ups and downs.
I've lived my share.
What's the advice that's been most valuable to you when you've had one of those downswings?
Oh, my God.
Who hasn't had a downswing?
In fact, you know, statistically, they say at any given time, one in ten of us are depressed.
So somebody listening to this conversation right now needs to hear what we're going to say.
And that was me at one point.
My career blew up.
I used to be the anchor at the Today Show.
Then I wasn't the anchor of the Today Show, and that's like...
And what got me through it was figuring out who I am.
And we all get off-center, and who you are is the center of why God put you on this planet.
And when I get off-kilter, what I find is focusing on something that's positive gets me out of that funk.
Service helps.
Service helps a lot.
When you do for others, you don't think about yourself.
You know, if you're in a bad spot, there's a soup kitchen in your neighborhood.
Go to that soup kitchen and serve somebody who is so grateful for that meal.
It's gonna change your world.
Speaking of soup kitchens...
You can find more stories.
Oh, that was not meant to be a plug.
It's perfect, though.
It's a wonderful advice from Debra.
This book is called Chicken Soup for the Soul.
Think positive, live happy.
It's spectacular.
Everything else she does is on shelves right now.
And you know what?
The entire audience is going home with a coffee.
Remember, the power of change lies in the power of you.
One person, one voice, speaking the truth.
Goodbye.
Thank you.
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