Dr. Oz Podcast - Lamar Odom on His Sex and Drug Addiction
Aired: 2019-06-04
Duration: 29:21


=== Hardest Part Exposed (14:54) ===

[00:00:01]  I mean, there was days where, you know, your heart beating too fast, and you can't sleep.
[00:00:09]  But I mean, rock bottom was that whatever I was hiding, now I was exposed.
[00:00:16]  Or people were gonna, whatever I was trying to hide is exposed because people thought I was, you know, doing drugs at this damn brothel.
[00:00:24]  But it was a bad situation, man.
[00:00:26]  Hi, I'm Dr. Oz, I'm Dr. Oz, and this is the Dr. Oz Podcast. podcast. and this is the Dr. Oz Podcast.
[00:00:51]  He's been called a walking miracle.
[00:00:53]  Two-time NBA world champion Lamar Odom was found unconscious in a Nevada brothel nearly four years ago and was in critical condition, fighting for his life.
[00:01:02]  Today, Lamar is here with his harrowing story of survival and the truth about his road to recovery that keeps him from falling back into the dark throes of addiction.
[00:01:10]  His new book, fittingly called...
[00:01:13]  Darkness to light.
[00:01:14]  What did it take for you to come here, Lamar, and talk openly about what you went through?
[00:01:19]  It takes a brave man to do that, but you've taken a life that we were all watching from afar and brought it into the light for us.
[00:01:28]  Yeah, well, therapy.
[00:01:32]  It was extremely therapeutic for me to vent in this form.
[00:01:40]  And then I wanted to let my family know exactly what I was going through.
[00:01:44]  Like, why'd he miss so many days?
[00:01:47]  You know, where was he?
[00:01:49]  I wanted to let everyone know where I was going through, where I was at mentally.
[00:01:53]  And hopefully it'll help...
[00:01:57]  Men.
[00:01:57]  All relationships that were hurt due to my addiction.
[00:02:04]  Let's start with men.
[00:02:05]  You talk in the book about your relationship with your father.
[00:02:09]  And a lot of folks listening right now have had issues with their dads.
[00:02:14]  If you don't mind, share yours with everybody.
[00:02:16]  I want people to take lessons away from yours.
[00:02:18]  Well, you know, at an early age, you know, the trauma that we go through at an early age, I think it helps shape us into the people that we become.
[00:02:32]  And on top of seeing my father and my mother go through some physical altercations, my father was a heroin addict.
[00:02:39]  So I think maybe he might have passed the gene towards me, and that was the most beneficial thing.
[00:02:52]  Lesson that my kids and I learned when my stint in rehab was that these are not choices that we make consciously.
[00:03:02]  An addict is someone who can't even make rational decisions.
[00:03:08]  That was some of the most important lessons that my family was able to learn.
[00:03:12]  The things you disliked about your father Is what in many ways you became.
[00:03:17]  Yeah, I started to become...
[00:03:18]  Yeah, and it's too bad that my family had to...
[00:03:21]  My kids really were hurt the most in my years of addiction, I would say.
[00:03:31]  Help me understand how it all came down.
[00:03:34]  So, you're an NBA superstar.
[00:03:38]  Top of your game.
[00:03:39]  Actually, let's go before that.
[00:03:40]  You played in high school.
[00:03:41]  Yeah.
[00:03:41]  Having a good time.
[00:03:43]  Anything going on in your life at that point that was a harbinger, a warning of things that were to come?
[00:03:50]  Um...
[00:03:52]  Well, I didn't really understand that I might have been past that gene.
[00:03:59]  And I'm an avid pot smoker now.
[00:04:03]  But I would hate to think that...
[00:04:07]  I don't know if it was subconscious, maybe like the pot.
[00:04:10]  I just wanted to try and make another high.
[00:04:11]  I don't know what the hell made me wanting to try cocaine because the stories that my father used to always tell me about, Len Bias, who was a famous basketball player who, when he was drafted, on the day he was drafted, he tried cocaine and OD'd.
[00:04:31]  And so it was something I never thought I would try.
[00:04:33]  I don't know if subconsciously if I wanted to get higher.
[00:04:38]  When did you first try cocaine?
[00:04:40]  I was 24, 25. So in high school, nothing much?
[00:04:47]  No, no.
[00:04:48]  College pros?
[00:04:49]  No, nothing.
[00:04:50]  Maybe like 24, 25. So what was the first time, the very first time that you started to stray?
[00:04:56]  Because at this point, you're already a superstar.
[00:04:58]  Yeah.
[00:04:59]  So why would you want to do drugs when you're already on top of your game?
[00:05:02]  game?
[00:05:02]  What wasn't filled?
[00:05:03]  I don't know if I was trying to like subconsciously feeling the loss of my mother or maybe the loss of my son.
[00:05:10]  There were a lot of losses and I don't know what I was trying to feel.
[00:05:14]  When you do cocaine, you think you're getting high, but you're getting low.
[00:05:18]  How so?
[00:05:22]  Knowing things in your nose that can cost you your life, if it hits you the wrong way, it doesn't make sense.
[00:05:29]  Why even take that risk?
[00:05:32]  So you were about 12 years old when you lost your mom.
[00:05:35]  Yeah, yeah.
[00:05:36]  What was going on in your life when that happened?
[00:05:38]  How did you deal with it?
[00:05:39]  Well, how I dealt with it was that day in basketball.
[00:05:45]  It was like my way to escape from everything at that time.
[00:05:48]  You know, when you're 12, you're confused, hurt.
[00:05:51]  You're not going to see your mother anymore.
[00:05:52]  You don't even know how to digest that and how to make sense of it.
[00:05:59]  But luckily for me, I had my grandmother and God was on my side, I guess.
[00:06:03]  Was your dad around?
[00:06:05]  Yeah, yeah.
[00:06:05]  No, not really.
[00:06:07]  Not really.
[00:06:08]  So, let's fast forward.
[00:06:10]  I'm not sure how well you could cope with your mom's loss.
[00:06:12]  Yes, you have support.
[00:06:13]  You've got God.
[00:06:14]  You've got the love of your grandmom.
[00:06:16]  Life's not full.
[00:06:18]  Then you lose your child.
[00:06:20]  Yeah.
[00:06:21]  I think that's the one that I'm probably still hurt from the most.
[00:06:24]  I don't think I've...
[00:06:25]  I even had the opportunity as the rock in my family, even to grieve, if that makes sense.
[00:06:33]  I always felt like I had to put on, you know, be strong for everyone else.
[00:06:36]  I don't know if I even took the time to deal with that.
[00:06:40]  Even if you were the rock on the outside, what were you feeling on the inside?
[00:06:44]  Could you imagine losing a six-month-year-old?
[00:06:47]  No.
[00:06:48]  That's why I'm asking.
[00:06:49]  I used to look at you.
[00:06:50]  I used to walk into the room and this little dude used to stare at me without me even saying anything.
[00:06:56]  I knew he knew who his father was in his place.
[00:07:01]  His face is tattooed on my chest and he'll always be with me.
[00:07:07]  But I mean, you know, it hurts like hell.
[00:07:09]  It hurts like hell.
[00:07:10]  You don't even know how to digest it.
[00:07:12]  You don't even know to make sense of it.
[00:07:13]  But I think one of the only ways I was able to get over it, I didn't ask why.
[00:07:20]  I didn't ask why.
[00:07:21]  And if I'm not mistaken, he passed away the same day as my grandmother.
[00:07:27]  So to me, that was like, you know, like spiritually, I felt connected.
[00:07:31]  Maybe that she was telling me that she got him.
[00:07:34]  Yeah, she got him.
[00:07:35]  Yeah.
[00:07:38]  So, through the emotional strife, and some of it may have given you the drive to become the athlete.
[00:07:44]  Oh, it definitely did.
[00:07:45]  It definitely did.
[00:07:46]  Even though playing in the NBA, it felt like it was my destiny.
[00:07:50]  Like, I knew at eight or nine years old what I was going to be doing, which is also a blessing.
[00:07:57]  So you're playing the game, but now you're starting to do drugs and cocaine, which you very wisely, sagely are saying it wasn't a high, it was a low.
[00:08:04]  Yeah.
[00:08:05]  Because it admits to you that you couldn't cope.
[00:08:07]  Yeah.
[00:08:08]  Were you thinking about how that would affect your game, how it would affect your career?
[00:08:11]  Yeah.
[00:08:14]  At the time, I would say no.
[00:08:16]  I was being selfish.
[00:08:19]  But I think about all those summers that was kind of wasted where I could have been perfecting my craft and becoming the best player that I possibly could.
[00:08:34]  And, you know, that's probably the one thing that I regret about, you know, doing drugs or having this weakness that I couldn't control.
[00:08:42]  Just the time missed from everything, from my family the most.
[00:08:47]  My children.
[00:08:48]  Yeah.
[00:08:49]  How's your relationship with your family now?
[00:08:51]  It's great.
[00:08:52]  It's great.
[00:08:53]  I think it's been healed.
[00:08:56]  But, you know, when you go through things and you get beat down, sometimes the only thing you have to lean on is your family and yourself.
[00:09:03]  The forgiveness process is hard.
[00:09:05]  It's hard for you to forgive yourself, I guess.
[00:09:08]  That's why I'm so impressed you're so honest about what you went through.
[00:09:11]  Hard for people who loved you, trusted you, to forgive you for having wronged them.
[00:09:16]  Yeah.
[00:09:17]  And that's what this, like, this book, it's like, it's just like letting them know where I was at mentally and, you know, why I was going down such a dark road.
[00:09:31]  You know, but I'm here now and I'm a fighter and I didn't give up.
[00:09:35]  What did they say to you when you realized that you need to talk to them and be honest with what was going down?
[00:09:43]  Well, my daughter is really proud of me.
[00:09:50]  And that's really all I live for.
[00:09:53]  It's for the love of my kids.
[00:09:56]  That really keeps me going.
[00:09:59]  Really keeps my motor running.
[00:10:01]  I lived selfishly for so long.
[00:10:03]  It hurts me even to say that, but you know what I mean?
[00:10:07]  I lived selfishly for so long.
[00:10:09]  So it was just time to give back.
[00:10:11]  A lot of people listening right now are living selfishly.
[00:10:13]  They just don't know it yet.
[00:10:14]  Yeah.
[00:10:15]  I mean, it's a time to give back.
[00:10:17]  My time is now for everything.
[00:10:20]  Alright, we're just scratching the surface here.
[00:10:21]  here.
[00:10:22]  We've got a lot more to discuss, so stay with us after the break.
[00:10:24]  So let's go through some of the things you did.
[00:10:33]  I I'm curious about them only because I'm wondering how your mind was working as you got through these things.
[00:10:40]  Because you're so brutally honest, which I respect.
[00:10:43]  Maybe we can shed some light for all the rest of us on how this even happens.
[00:10:45]  Because we look around at people that we admire, superstars, and we wonder how...
[00:10:49]  What went down?
[00:10:50]  Let me go back 15 years.
[00:10:53]  One of the dreams that every basketball player has is representing their country in the Olympics.
[00:10:58]  So you're picked for the team, not surprisingly, because it was an incredible mix of talent.
[00:11:05]  And you realize you might have an issue because you got a drug test.
[00:11:08]  And everyone's been reading the tabloids about what went down.
[00:11:11]  But I'm just curious what was going through your mind when you realized, I could be thrown away the dream of my life because of these drug issues.
[00:11:20]  You know, and I brought this story up.
[00:11:22]  Like, the one thing, I didn't want to cause any controversy with USA Basketball.
[00:11:27]  The hardest part about reading this book was me being, like, too honest.
[00:11:31]  Like, I didn't want to offend the...
[00:11:36]  The Kobe Bryant's or the Pat Riley's or the Phil Jackson's.
[00:11:40]  People that took a common interest in me and that were really genuine with me, I didn't really want to offend them.
[00:11:49]  So I guess that was the hardest part about being completely honest in this book, but...
[00:11:55]  You know, my honesty set me free.
[00:11:57]  And hopefully it can, you know, people that are going through it that can't get over a death or can't get through their addiction, hopefully it can help them.
[00:12:07]  Hopefully it can give them a push in the right direction.
[00:12:09]  So you're sitting there, you're about to go through the drug test.
[00:12:12]  Just to recount, you have a...
[00:12:14]  I don't know.
[00:12:14]  Whose idea was it to get a prostitute?
[00:12:16]  There was a friend of mine's who is a good friend.
[00:12:20]  I just wish that he could have been a better friend and kept me away from the drugs.
[00:12:25]  But I've been smoking marijuana that whole summer and doing God knows what.
[00:12:32]  It was marijuana.
[00:12:34]  Smoking marijuana that whole summer.
[00:12:36]  I knew that I couldn't embarrass myself or USA basketball.
[00:12:40]  Decided to use a fake penis.
[00:12:44]  We had to clean urine.
[00:12:47]  But that thinking, that was just by any means necessary.
[00:12:50]  You know, always was a dream of mine to play USA basketball.
[00:12:55]  You know, had to make it happen.
[00:12:57]  It has to be fresh urine, right?
[00:12:59]  It has to be warm urine.
[00:12:59]  Yeah, it was scary, though.
[00:13:01]  The whole process was scary.
[00:13:02]  I'm thinking, like, damn, if I get caught, you know, everything will be over.
[00:13:08]  Since I'm a doctor, I'm trying to envision how this happens.
[00:13:11]  Because if I was watching someone pee, I'd probably be able to tell that it was legit or not.
[00:13:15]  Yeah, but I forgot the fake thing.
[00:13:17]  You're not really just on it.
[00:13:19]  You can't really tell.
[00:13:20]  Yeah, you're not going to stare.
[00:13:21]  So where's the actual urine held?
[00:13:23]  Is there a bladder behind the fake penis?
[00:13:25]  Yeah, it has like a little ball sack in it.
[00:13:27]  You just...
[00:13:29]  They actually make a fake penis with a ball sack?
[00:13:31]  Yeah, because it has to keep it warm.
[00:13:33]  Oh my goodness.
[00:13:36]  So you're peeing to the cop, the drug tester comes over, sees that it's warm, dips it, tests it.
[00:13:42]  Well, you don't get the test right away, but obviously you know that you pass when they don't come knock on your door.
[00:13:48]  And so when he said, welcome to USA Basketball, or whatever he said, how did that affect you?
[00:13:53]  I made it.
[00:13:54]  It worked.
[00:13:55]  But I'll bring this to light.
[00:13:58]  I'm laughing about it now, but it's something that I'm not proud of.
[00:14:02]  Obviously, I really think...
[00:14:08]  I'm almost ashamed.
[00:14:10]  To be honest, I could have let my country down, you know.
[00:14:14]  It's a bad situation.
[00:14:15]  Were you worried by telling the story now that they could take your medal back from you?
[00:14:18]  A little bit.
[00:14:20]  A little bit.
[00:14:21]  We won the bronze.
[00:14:23]  Yeah.
[00:14:24]  Yeah.
[00:14:25]  I mean, those are the consequences and repercussions I gotta live with, I guess.
[00:14:32]  In the middle of all this, the pressure on you is mounting.
[00:14:36]  You're keeping up with the Kardashians.
[00:14:38]  Then you had your own show, Chloe Lamar.

=== Life's Worth Living (02:24) ===

[00:14:42]  Folks are all over you.
[00:14:43]  They're watching you.
[00:14:43]  They're staring at you.
[00:14:44]  They're gawking at you, actually.
[00:14:46]  Half of them are watching because they want to be like you.
[00:14:48]  The other half are watching a train wreck and not sure what's going down.
[00:14:52]  All this while you're camouflaging the weaknesses.
[00:14:55]  The problem.
[00:14:56]  Through that process, Were you having imposter syndrome, thinking, I'm not worthy of this, or are you thinking, heck with it all, life's not worth living, I lost my son?
[00:15:04]  No.
[00:15:06]  Life's always been worth living.
[00:15:11]  And it's funny that you say that, because that's the slogan for my CBD line, is worth living.
[00:15:17]  But life's always been worth living to me.
[00:15:19]  I never wanted to take my own life or anything like that.
[00:15:23]  It's always been worth living.
[00:15:24]  Yeah.
[00:15:25]  But as those shows are airing, you're more and more in the public eye.
[00:15:29]  People are getting to know you intimately.
[00:15:31]  Yeah.
[00:15:32]  And that was a different part of reality TV than just being a sportsman.
[00:15:38]  Being a sportsman, people would think they know you.
[00:15:40]  But being a reality TV star, they really, really feel like they know you.
[00:15:45]  And so adding the two...
[00:15:48]  It was a tough combination to deal with, but I've played the best basketball in my career when I was married to Chloe.
[00:15:56]  I won the Sixth Man of the Year award.
[00:15:58]  It took a great deal of concentration and commitment to do that.
[00:16:04]  I think that was my proudest sports moment.
[00:16:07]  I always admired the Sixth Man because it meant that you could be selfless.
[00:16:11]  You could come off the bench and be better than the people who started the game.
[00:16:15]  That's right.
[00:16:16]  I didn't start every game that year, but I finished them.
[00:16:19]  Yeah, you finished them.
[00:16:20]  That's good.
[00:16:21]  So when you're gone, and again, in the honesty in the book, you've talked about the fact that you've had sexual intercourse with 2,000 women.
[00:16:29]  That was me being narcissistic, but it was 1,999.
[00:16:36]  No, I don't know.
[00:16:38]  You know, I have a daughter.
[00:16:42]  That I respect.
[00:16:44]  And women in my life that I respect.
[00:16:47]  I wouldn't want to disrespect them, but I was just trying to bring the life to the book or letting people know.

=== Ketamine And The Third Eye (11:30) ===

[00:16:55]  Let them see life through my eyes.
[00:16:58]  Well, you were honest with the fact that you were addicted to sex.
[00:17:01]  I think when someone says they've had intimacy that many times, it's not about being in love with that many women.
[00:17:05]  It's about something that some unfulfilled need you have, just like with drugs.
[00:17:09]  So I'm just curious how that gets translated.
[00:17:14]  In recovery, which is where you are now.
[00:17:16]  When you...
[00:17:17]  If you're talking to Chloe or other folks that you've...
[00:17:20]  In this case, very specifically, being unfaithful to her, how do you cross that barrier until it becomes a healing experience as opposed to the darkness that you were in before?
[00:17:30]  How do you bring light to it?
[00:17:31]  Well, I think what really made me go hard with my sexual addiction was because when I... When I thought of cocaine, I thought of having sex.
[00:17:47]  So they came hand to hand.
[00:17:51]  And I'm not doing cocaine anymore.
[00:17:54]  So a lot of the addictions, though, are just starting to slip away.
[00:17:59]  Yeah, the triggers go.
[00:18:01]  They were triggers for each other.
[00:18:05]  So take me back, if you can, to that fateful day where you nearly died.
[00:18:08]  I remember I was on the set and I heard the story of what happened.
[00:18:11]  And like many, I'd heard rumors here and there, but it just didn't seem believable.
[00:18:18]  So you're in this brothel, you're in Vegas, and you're doing cocaine.
[00:18:27]  I didn't do cocaine at night though, and a lot of people, they don't know that, but when you have a history, and I tell people that, they're like, okay, whatever.
[00:18:37]  But I don't know what they were able to do to me or anything, but it almost worked.
[00:18:43]  But I'm just living testimony at the ears of God.
[00:18:47]  What happened that night?
[00:18:49]  How did you end up?
[00:18:49]  I don't know.
[00:18:49]  I was asleep.
[00:18:50]  Next thing I know, I woke up.
[00:18:52]  Honest with you.
[00:18:54]  You just passed out?
[00:18:56]  Yeah, I couldn't.
[00:18:57]  When I woke up, I couldn't walk.
[00:18:59]  I couldn't talk.
[00:19:01]  Scary.
[00:19:03]  So, again, as a doctor, from what I can tell, it looked like, first of all, you shouldn't be here, right?
[00:19:10]  I mean, there's no way you should be sitting across from me, lucidly describing your recovery.
[00:19:15]  You had a bunch of strokes, small ones.
[00:19:18]  So how do you put all the pieces together in your own mind?
[00:19:22]  Do you have no recall of any of this?
[00:19:24]  No, no, I was sleep, man.
[00:19:27]  You know, you're a doctor, you know being a coma is, no.
[00:19:30]  You miss the fun.
[00:19:30]  Yeah, I miss that.
[00:19:32]  I miss that.
[00:19:32]  But maybe, well, the reason why I'm here is to let people know.
[00:19:37]  Why do you call that day rock bottom?
[00:19:40]  I mean, obviously, you almost died, I get that.
[00:19:42]  But why that day in particular?
[00:19:44]  Were there other warning days before that where you thought, I can't keep doing this?
[00:19:48]  I mean, well, there was days where, you know, your heart beating too fast.
[00:19:52]  Man, you can't sleep.
[00:19:57]  And, you know what I'm saying?
[00:19:59]  You realize, like, damn, why'd I do that?
[00:20:01]  And, of course, the effects of cocaine the next day is harsh.
[00:20:08]  Um...
[00:20:09]  But, I mean, rock bottom was that whatever I was hiding now is exposed.
[00:20:16]  Or people gonna...
[00:20:17]  Whatever I was trying to hide is exposed because people thought I was, you know, doing drugs at this damn brothel.
[00:20:23]  Um...
[00:20:26]  But it was a bad situation, man.
[00:20:27]  Why did you go to the Bunny Ranch that day?
[00:20:30]  You know what's funny?
[00:20:31]  Because I remember actually watching the Bunny Ranch on HBO. Right.
[00:20:38]  Yeah.
[00:20:39]  And it's funny that you even bring that up.
[00:20:42]  I remember watching it with my ex-wife.
[00:20:45]  Then I wound up going there.
[00:20:47]  It's crazy.
[00:20:48]  Is that why you went there?
[00:20:49]  Because you'd seen it?
[00:20:50]  Yeah, I seen it on TV. Seen it on HBO. It's nuts.
[00:20:54]  Were you curious?
[00:20:56]  What made you want to see the inside of a spot you've already seen on television?
[00:21:01]  Just being a freak.
[00:21:04]  In every which way of the word.
[00:21:06]  Looking for it.
[00:21:08]  And me and Chloe were going through it at that time.
[00:21:10]  She was trying to make the divorce final and everything.
[00:21:15]  So I wasn't in a good place, good headspace mentally.
[00:21:19]  It was a great time for someone to take advantage of me.
[00:21:24]  So what do you think happened?
[00:21:25]  I have no idea.
[00:21:28]  I have no idea.
[00:21:30]  I don't know how they got it into my system or what.
[00:21:36]  But whatever it was, you know, I think about it all the time.
[00:21:44]  It's like sometimes I think like, Why did he pick me to do it to?
[00:21:50]  You know, like, what would he get out of harming me?
[00:21:52]  Who's he?
[00:21:54]  The guy that worked Bunny Ranch, Dennis Hoff?
[00:21:57]  Dennis, yeah.
[00:21:59]  And it's hard for me to even understand that.
[00:22:02]  But if I'm not mistaken, I think he passed away in the same room I overdosed in.
[00:22:06]  I know he passed away.
[00:22:07]  I didn't know it was the same room.
[00:22:08]  I heard it was the same room.
[00:22:10]  Did you ever ask him?
[00:22:11]  No, I didn't get to ask him.
[00:22:12]  I didn't get to see him.
[00:22:14]  But, you know, he has a family.
[00:22:15]  I wouldn't want to disrespect his legacy or his memory.
[00:22:19]  There's lots more when we come back.
[00:22:21]  So you don't remember passing out.
[00:22:34]  You end up at the hospital, your whole family is running over to try to manage you.
[00:22:38]  Yeah.
[00:22:39]  Were you, when you awakened and you realized that Chloe's around you and your kids are, you know, how did that affect you?
[00:22:44]  Well, I think the part that Chloe was there, because at that point in time of our relationship, you know, me getting, me being found in a brothel, I would think that would give her all the energy to, like, keep him away from me, just stay away from me.
[00:23:04]  But not just because of that, but because she was there and bringing me pictures of my mother to help get my memory back, making sure I had the best in physical therapy, making sure I had the best doctors to get my speech back and talk.
[00:23:25]  I mean, that was amazing.
[00:23:27]  She's like she's an angel.
[00:23:29]  Let's me know that God is real.
[00:23:31]  You still love her?
[00:23:33]  Mm-hmm.
[00:23:35]  You're never going to lose love for someone that you marry after 30 days.
[00:23:40]  You know what I mean?
[00:23:41]  That'll never go anywhere.
[00:23:45]  So, the injuries that you sustained that Chloe and others helped you get past seem to have recovered quite a bit.
[00:23:52]  Yeah, I mean, that's why I'm doing all these things for mental health.
[00:23:59]  Ketamine.
[00:24:00]  Did it work?
[00:24:01]  I think so.
[00:24:04]  Just help me open up.
[00:24:07]  Did they give you ketamine for depression or post-traumatic stress disorder?
[00:24:10]  I do it for everything.
[00:24:12]  Yeah, it takes more than...
[00:24:14]  What's that experience like when they give you ketamine?
[00:24:19]  Because it just got FDA approved for...
[00:24:21]  Yeah, well, for the first time I did ketamine, I... It's crazy because I've filmed a documentary on Academy.
[00:24:32]  The first time I did it, it was like I went to heaven.
[00:24:38]  Just felt all this overwhelm of love and emotion.
[00:24:46]  And then, you know, you hallucinate.
[00:24:48]  I've always been against doing drugs intravenously, you know, because of my father's history.
[00:24:56]  But, you know, if I could take this intravenous medicine and it can help clear my depression or anxiety...
[00:25:07]  And just make me better, hope I open my third eye, then I'll do it every day.
[00:25:14]  You have two things that are really cool.
[00:25:15]  The first is the third eye.
[00:25:17]  What do you know about the third eye?
[00:25:19]  I just know it makes you better.
[00:25:21]  Explain it to everybody at home.
[00:25:22]  Well, I mean, if you can see things for what they truly are, and the good, the bad, and the ugly...
[00:25:30]  And learn from them?
[00:25:31]  Then why not use it?
[00:25:33]  And I think a lot of people are scared to tap into it because a lot of us are scared of greatness or scared to understand how great we can be.
[00:25:48]  How much potential that we each have.
[00:25:51]  That we all have.
[00:25:53]  I think that's important.
[00:25:54]  Were you scared of greatness?
[00:25:56]  For a long time.
[00:25:59]  A long time.
[00:25:59]  Yeah.
[00:26:01]  Yeah, hopefully this book is not the first step, but not the first and the last step to greatness.
[00:26:09]  So let me go back to the first time they offered ketamine to you.
[00:26:12]  What was the situation?
[00:26:13]  What was going on that they said, hey, listen.
[00:26:15]  No, I have this friend who I started the CBD company with.
[00:26:21]  He's from Utah.
[00:26:24]  He was a special person to me.
[00:26:26]  He came into my life and he just knew what I was going through.
[00:26:28]  And he said, Lamar, I got this plant medicine.
[00:26:32]  I can't quit ketamine.
[00:26:35]  I was like, what?
[00:26:36]  I'm not really into sticking needles in my arm.
[00:26:41]  And I tried it, and it started to work immediately.
[00:26:44]  Oh, he gave you the ketamine?
[00:26:45]  Yeah.
[00:26:45]  No, he didn't personally give it to me, ketamine, but of course we got it with doctors and did the ketamine in Utah.
[00:26:52]  And how often are you taking ketamine now?
[00:26:54]  The last four or five months, I probably took it like four or five times.
[00:27:01]  It's cool.
[00:27:02]  And what do you think about folks listening right now who might be actually depressed or in recovery or having issues with post-traumatic stress disorder, vets returning back, trying ketamine?
[00:27:13]  Well, be open up.
[00:27:14]  Open up your heart and your mind to getting better.
[00:27:18]  It's not easy.
[00:27:19]  And it ain't gonna just come to you.
[00:27:21]  It ain't gonna just fall in your lap.
[00:27:23]  You gotta go out and search for it.
[00:27:26]  When you walked out of that hospital alive, Were you already in recovery, or was that just the very beginning, the wake-up call, and you couldn't even process it?
[00:27:39]  I couldn't process it.
[00:27:41]  I didn't know where I was at.
[00:27:46]  There's some things that I'm still trying to process, and I think the ketamine, when I can say it can open you up, I had a problem with being empathetic.
[00:28:00]  You did?
[00:28:01]  Yeah.
[00:28:02]  I don't know where that came from.

=== Forever Learning (01:16) ===

[00:28:06]  I've always been a people person, but I just always had a problem of showing empathy.
[00:28:10]  Because you seem pretty empathetic to me.
[00:28:12]  Yeah.
[00:28:13]  We're talking about the book.
[00:28:15]  Do you feel like you're fully recovered from the injuries you sustained at the Bunny Ranch?
[00:28:22]  Yeah.
[00:28:24]  Yeah.
[00:28:26]  Yeah, they should have tried.
[00:28:28]  I'll leave it alone.
[00:28:30]  Did you what?
[00:28:31]  No, I feel like I fully recovered.
[00:28:34]  Alright.
[00:28:35]  You're still working on the big question we all face in our lives.
[00:28:39]  Who are we really?
[00:28:40]  Who is Lamar Odom?
[00:28:41]  Well, you know what?
[00:28:42]  I'll be 40 November 6th.
[00:28:49]  And I can honestly say I'm still learning a little bit about myself every day.
[00:28:56]  But my grandmother told me, when you stop learning is when you stop living.
[00:29:02]  So I'm living, so I'm forever learning about myself, about everything around me every day.
[00:29:06]  You've got a wise grandmother.
[00:29:08]  Listen, I really, really enjoyed meeting with you.
[00:29:10]  I treasure your honesty.
[00:29:11]  I think you're going to change a lot of lives.
[00:29:13]  You can hear lots more about Lamar and his fantastic memoir, Darkness to Light.
[00:29:18]  It's got a handsome picture on it.
[00:29:20]  Thanks.
[00:29:21]  Bless you.