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Aug. 3, 2023 - On Brand

02:45:56

OB #12 - UFO Grifters

We dissect the UFO claims of David Grusch, Bob Lazar, and David Fravor, and the grifters who glom onto them for profit on Russell's show. Support us on Patreon! - patreon.com/onbrand

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	This is On Brand, a podcast where we discuss the ideas and antics of one Russell Brand.
	I'm Al Werth, and each week I go through an episode of Brand's Show with my co-host Lauren B. Hi, I'm Lauren B., and I haven't got a clue what I'm about to be assailed with.
	Yeah, we got a fun one this week.
	But first, Lauren, what is your bright spot?
	Okay, so I need... hear me out.
	Okay.
	I like how this is starting.
	Hear me out.
	Paul Reubens, aka Pee Wee Herman, has passed.
	Yeah, yeah, yeah.
	Saw that.
	R.I.P.
	Yep.
	Right?
	So, not a bright spot.
	Everybody, go with me.
	My feed on my Instagram has been inundated with everyone, Patton Oswalt, Pamela Adlon, Norman Reedus.
	They're all talking about how lovely and wonderful this person was, and they have receipts.
	I have not seen this to this volume and degree when a celebrity has passed away.
	Paul Robbins would like send like so that Patton Oswalt and I'm you know maybe this stuff some people want it to be private that's absolutely fine but the fact that they post it publicly is incredible and and and I'm so glad to see it because Patton Oswalt apparently on his birthday Fucking Pee Wee, the one, the only, Pee Wee Herman, was texting him GIFs all day of like, of the three stooges hitting each other with pies in the face.
	All day.
	I mean, that's just delightful.
	That's great.
	Yeah, like, there's all these stories that, like, people are sharing and he's just- oh, he was super fucking wonderful?
	Like, I wish- my fondest hope would be that, like, People would have a tenth of the nice things to say when I, you know, when I've passed on.
	And I'm also, you know, if he was dealing with health issues and suffering, I think that there's a bit of, like, relief that comes with knowing someone doesn't have to deal with that anymore.
	So, like, that's, you know, it's bittersweet.
	And also, I mean, I didn't mention, I guess, and it's worth mentioning that, like, Pee Wee's Playhouse was a rev of Revelatory for me.
	That was such a huge, huge part of my childhood, and I'm so grateful.
	Yeah, I glue shit to shit, and of course!
	That's what I do now, myself!
	It's Peewee.
	Get fancy!
	It was Peewee.
	Right!
	I've made puppets.
	I've been making puppets for people randomly for like years.
	I know that's crazy.
	You know, building weird sets.
	All that stuff, all that creativity is monumental for me and for a lot of people.
	I don't think that we're losing anything.
	I think it's so cool.
	I see that not only was this person so influential in our lives and kind of taught a lot of really good lessons and all that, and were really useful and a place for weirdos to gather and see each other, but if you have not, listener, just look through, I mean, I don't know if there's a hashtag that would Bring all this together, but yeah, man, everybody is sharing like these amazing stories that are so kind and it's like simple shit and and even like the idea of sending a theme of comedy gifts on a birthday is like so simple and really beautiful and like, oh, we could just do that.
	Like, it doesn't have to be... Yeah, I mean, especially to a comedian as well, you know, there's a certain, you know, there's, yeah, that's very cute.
	Cats falling off bookshelves is another idea, or... Great one.
	Great one, yeah.
	Right?
	Kids getting hurt... Cats knocking shit on the floor, always funny.
	Always funny.
	Yes.
	Yeah, right.
	So what's your bright spot?
	Mine is a little bit more mundane, but I've got to say, my washing machine.
	I'm already jealous.
	I can feel it.
	I guess that's the first thing.
	Do you have a washing machine in your home?
	Well, we have access to our landlords in the house.
	Right, okay.
	Over here it's very normal to just have your own in the house, that is the standard.
	Which you find out as an American travelling overseas, when you have to use a laundromat.
	And then you read an article and you're like, oh.
	These don't exist here.
	Or it's just more difficult here in America.
	The flip side of that is that laundromats are inherently more expensive over here.
	But in any case, mine broke several months ago.
	And I remember it pretty vividly.
	I was watching the live-action Aladdin with my daughter.
	Surprisingly decent, actually.
	And there was this grinding sound.
	I was like, oh, that's not good.
	And then a loud bang!
	And then I was like, oh, that's definitely very not good.
	And this was thankfully on the spin cycle, so it was at the end.
	Yeah!
	But then I looked up the error message that was showing, and it said that there was a fault with the motor, basically.
	I was like, ah, fuck, that's not something I can deal with.
	So I just kind of left it, and then spent several months just hand-washing clothes, which sucks ass.
	Yes, it really does.
	And then the other day, opened up the back of it, and saw that what had actually happened was the belt that makes the thing spin had snapped.
	And I was like, "Huh, maybe that's just the only problem."
	So put a new one on and did one and a half washes and it broke again.
	But then what happened was it heated up and then snapped.
	So there wasn't enough friction happening.
	So the bit that spins on the motor, there just wasn't enough friction there because
	because there was like oil or grease or whatever on it.
	I don't know what the fuck from.
	So anyway, cleaned that off, put a new one on, so you know, 20 quid spent at this point, whatever, and fixed!
	Working!
	Magic!
	I can now wash things again without any... Oh, honestly.
	That's awesome!
	I have never been so excited to see clothes spin in a washing machine as I have this last week.
	I can't tell you, I understand.
	I've been washing everything in the house.
	I've just been like, oh, next load, let's go.
	Well, especially like with a kid, like I know that the difference in laundry loads for just adults versus like you got throw a kid in the mix.
	I feel like hand washing April's stuff is a lot easier because it's smaller.
	So, you know, I can just, I can do a lot of it at a time, whereas dealing with my shit, it is inherently large.
	I'm like, oh God, this is going to take forever and take up so much space, and there's the hand wringing it out and everything else, and yeah, it's exhausting.
	But yeah, no more of that, so woo!
	That's awesome!
	Yeah, ours doesn't work great.
	I'm thrilled.
	And our dryer cooks everything.
	Awesome!
	Our dryer is like... That's what you want.
	Um, and also, like, you know, uh, we're getting older.
	We've been living here for a little while now, and your metabolism changes.
	We're dealing.
	We're handling it.
	And getting paunchy, which is fine.
	Paunch is fine.
	I'm almost fucking 40.
	So I'm trying to be kind to myself, but my dryer is not.
	And so it's always a crapshoot, is like, am I getting fat?
	Or is my dryer just like, cooking my clothes?
	Or have I shrunk everything again?
	Because like, it's impossible to, it's unknowable to some degree.
	It's because it's like, it's really, yeah, on the lowest setting it's still But you can also have a setting that's too low, and then the clothes are still wet, or cooking.
	And there's not really a balance.
	Yeah, I guess I would err on that side, because at least then you can hang them some way.
	They'll be halfway done, and not completely fucked.
	Also Mike does, yeah.
	He just hangs, because it's not worth it.
	It's just easier.
	Laundry sucks!
	It sucks so bad, but I'm so glad yours sucks less!
	And yet, I'm so thrilled, I'm so excited.
	That's amazing!
	That's awesome!
	It's been great.
	Good for you, that's killer.
	Hell yeah.
	Adulthood is a fucking joke.
	We're so excited, oh my god.
	This harks back to a time when I was working in a university and I had to remove a lot of staples, and one of the executives came round and lent me his staple remover.
	And I remember vividly this moment of using it and going, the action on this thing is amazing!
	And then just stopping and being like, What is my life?
	What have I done?
	Yeah, but when you go from a thumbnail and it's awful and it hurts and you're desperately trying to like get an edge and pull with your hands and then you have that little... Oh no, I had my own staple remover, but it was nowhere near as good as this guy's, honestly.
	Yeah, his was great.
	It had like a marble effect in the plastic and everything.
	It was fancy.
	Anyway, enough of me being sad.
	Enough of me being very, very sad.
	And old!
	Don't forget old!
	This was like 10 years ago, so I was young at that point.
	Just still demonstrably sad.
	We have a show to deal with, but first up we should thank some of our new patrons.
	So first up, Wes, you are now an awakening wonder.
	You are indeed an awakening wonder.
	Thank you very much, Wes.
	Thank you, Wes!
	Ryan Zimmerman, you are now an Awakening wonder!
	You are indeed an Awakening wonder.
	Ryan Zimmerman!
	Are you mine?
	Are you one of mine?
	You might be.
	If you're not, you're also great.
	But, if that's ZimDog, oh, I'm excited.
	If you're not, you might be now, so congrats!
	Honorary ZimDog!
	Either way!
	Yeah, booyah T.J.
	Oshii, that fuckin' rules.
	Nice.
	Awesome.
	Yeah, let us know on Patreon, anyway.
	Oh yeah, thank you!
	Quentin Accord, you are now an Awakening wonder.
	You are indeed an Awakening wonder.
	Thank you, Quentin.
	Thank you, Quentin.
	What a reliable vehicle your last name is.
	I think that's entirely... you should be proud.
	I think a reliable first name as well.
	I like Quentin as a name.
	I think that's a solid name.
	I like that.
	Winter is coming and I should know.
	I'm the queen of fucking Narnia.
	You are now an awakening wonder.
	You are indeed an awakening wonder.
	Thank you very much.
	Cute.
	Nostalgic.
	I'm here for it.
	David M, you are now an Awakening wonder.
	You are indeed an Awakening wonder.
	Thank you.
	Thank you, David.
	And I'm a dragon, boy.
	You are now an Awakening wonder.
	You are indeed an Awakening wonder.
	Thank you very much.
	Thank you and congratulations on being a dragon.
	It sounds like fun.
	Yes, yes.
	I'm certain that is a reference to something that I do not know.
	So let us know what it is because, oh, maybe I do know and it's just gone over my head.
	That is also very possible.
	I have a memory like a sieve.
	And we are also going through our members of the Invisible Hand.
	So next up, Juan Jalapeno, you are now the Invisible Hand.
	Yay!
	Let me tell you that we love you.
	There is a sort of an invisible hand guiding these events.
	You are fundamentally beautiful.
	Not others, you.
	I believe you are fundamentally beautiful.
	I'm right wing.
	Now get me some shit fuck ice cream, you pig dick!
	How do you feel about past you at this point?
	I only suggest how to think and how to vote.
	Another big subject over here with us right-wing fascists.
	How do you feel about past you at this point?
	I don't even recognise that idiot anymore.
	I'm right-wing.
	Oh God, I just had a poo and a bit of my bum fell out.
	God, it's propaganda, did you guess it?
	Did you guess it?
	I'm right-wing!
	Hey, thank you, Juan Jalapeño!
	Thank you so much!
	You're the best!
	Oh, tremendous.
	And if anyone wants to support us in what we do, become an Awakening Wanderer, join the Invisible Hand, or donate on an elevated tier, head to patreon.com slash onbrand, and you will have our eternal Gratitude.
	As a patron, you will also get a shout-out on the show and access to our patron-only show, Offbrand, where we talk about pretty much anything but Russell Brand.
	And please note that while you can easily listen to our audio version anywhere you can find podcasts, you can also watch us on YouTube, or if you listen in the Spotify app, the video should come up there too.
	Right.
	I said last week that we would cover something a little bit lighter this week, as the last couple of shows have been a lot, dealing with DeSantis and RFK back-to-back in quick succession!
	So I'm going to let Russell- Yeah, I almost cried once!
	That Rubicon has been passed!
	It's been fun!
	So I'm gonna let Russell introduce the topic of the day.
	Oh boy.
	Hello there you Awakening Wonders.
	Thanks for joining me for Stay Free with Russell Brand.
	Do you think we're blind?
	Do you think we're mad?
	Do you think we don't read the comments and the chat?
	Do you think you get yourself an awakened wonder then don't listen to their innermost thoughts?
	We do.
	That's how we know that you are fascinated by the phenomena of UFO sightings.
	Whistleblowers coming forward.
	Pentagon denials.
	What is the truth behind UFOs, aliens and the paranormal?
	That is why we've constructed A very special episode indeed, with some fantastic experts commenting on just that.
	That's right, we're getting into some UFO shit, baby!
	Yahtzee!
	Okay, here we go!
	Now Russell says he's got a special show with three supposed experts on to talk about UFOs, but virtually none of that is true.
	The most I'm willing to concede is that there are in fact three of them.
	Oh, good for her.
	This is actually a clip show that his staff have put together.
	Russell clearly fancied a few days off, so he's consolidated the highlights and best
	parts from a few interviews discussing aliens.
	He's had a few more of these clip shows over this last week, so I think he is off on holiday
	doing something.
	Fine, whatever.
	Oh, go for her.
	Go for her.
	Yeah.
	Go for it.
	Our first guest to deal with is a guy called Sagar Njeti.
	Have you ever heard of breaking points?
	There's going to be a lot of stuff in this episode that I have tangentially heard of and I will be reminded.
	Don't worry about it.
	I need to not go into that hole and just say no.
	This is hopefully not one of them.
	It's a media channel supposedly set up with the premise of having one host on the political left and one host on the political right and then they talk about the news.
	Yeah, guess which of those two hosts Mr. Njeti is?
	Right wing or left wing?
	What do you think?
	Right.
	Correct, 100%.
	The left-wing host of Breaking Points has also been on Russell's show, to be fair, but there are a few issues.
	Her name is Crystal Ball.
	Oh, I know who that is.
	You do?
	Okay.
	Well, I don't know exactly who that is.
	I know enough to know that it's not just a wacky name.
	Okay, yeah, it is a worky name though.
	We don't get to pick our name!
	No, no, I don't think it was chosen.
	I don't think it was chosen.
	You know, fair enough.
	But she's a former 2010 Democratic nominee for the House in the state of Virginia.
	Obviously, she lost.
	She has since then seemed to skew quite a bit to the right, actually, being aggressively anti-Biden, anti-MSM, and anti-intervention in the Ukraine.
	Though she still presents as being left, you know, because we don't get enough of that.
	Her last video that I saw was a takedown of the recent Barbie movie, which tells you exactly who her audience is.
	Yeah, yeah.
	She's very much one of these people, much like Russell, who says they're left-wing and then says a bunch of right-wing shit.
	She says some left-wing shit as well, fair is fair, but yeah.
	Russell happens to also.
	It's just...
	Aesthetics.
	She says a bit more, I guess.
	But yeah, there are issues, and so I reject the premise of breaking points entirely, until proven otherwise.
	She's the combs.
	Yeah, that kind of deal.
	A little bit less useless, but nonetheless.
	In our first clip here, we learn something about Russell.
	Saga, before you go, if you would humor us further, we know that you are interested in the subject of unidentified flying objects, or whatever the hell they're called now.
	Why do you think it is that they're suddenly being openly discussed?
	You know, I'm, like, you know people who like a band before they become popular, right?
	I'm like, I used to like UFOs when I was like 16 years old, and everyone was like, oh, well, why is there no good footage of UFOs then?
	Why don't they land on the White House lawn?
	And now it's like the CIA are releasing footage of them in war zones and stuff.
	What the hell's going on?
	Yeah, real quick, the CIA aren't releasing footage of UFOs in war zones.
	But also, yeah, we learn that Russell was into UFOs as an adolescent, which is both interesting and not terribly surprising, given his propensity to believe pretty much anything anyone says to him.
	So, I'm like, yeah, okay.
	Fair enough.
	Yeah, you're a teenager!
	It's fine!
	It's fine!
	Everyone I know was.
	Yeah, you're a teenager!
	Yeah, yeah.
	For, like, it's fine.
	It's fine.
	The X-Files was on.
	Come on.
	Yeah.
	The X-Files is a fucking great show.
	Yeah.
	Yeah, just believing that aliens exist, perfectly fine.
	I am sure they exist somewhere.
	Sure, agreed.
	The things we are getting into in this episode are a little bit different.
	Oh boy, okay.
	Let's get into it, because next we get into the UFO lore proper.
	Well, I understand why people are skeptical.
	I think you should be skeptical of anything the government is releasing or saying.
	Here's what I would say.
	I was with Jeremy Corbell, who I know that you know as well.
	I've spoken to him about this.
	They don't want to be doing this.
	They got dragged here kicking and screaming because people like Commander David Fravor,
	who was the pilot during the Tic Tac object video, people like Ryan Graves, well, highly decorated,
	like completely with it pilots are trying to speak out and have been recording this video.
	They've been trying to flag this.
	They're trying to get to the bottom of it.
	So this here is the stuff that took the time for this week's episode.
	It's lighter in tone but because there's less at stake but absolutely not in terms of workload because these UFO people have a tendency to just throw something out there that just the mention of it is supposed to confirm this stuff as being true and then they tell the audience to go and look into it and look it up.
	Which I've then had to do, which is fucking great, okay.
	So, it's been a week.
	It was in our Congress.
	I'm allowed to be embarrassed.
	Like, it was weird.
	We're gonna get into that in a minute, don't you worry.
	Yeah, so first, let's address former Navy Commander David Fravor, who is actually one of the people who was in that hearing, and the so-called tic-tac video.
	This was back in 2004, and Mr. Fravor describes a tic-tac-shaped object of some kind flying through the air, hovering, and then it allegedly disappeared and travelled 60 miles away in less than a minute.
	Two pilots and two co-pilots were apparently witness to this experience.
	Another plane came out with an infrared camera, which is what captured the footage of the thing.
	Said footage is grainy and shows no physics-defying acts, but it does look a little weird.
	What I find particularly important to note is that the closest Fravor got was approximately half a mile from the thing.
	Now, don't get me wrong, it was apparently a clear day, and over the ocean, so there's not much else to have a look at, but all the same he was literally flying a fighter jet, travelling at speed, and relying purely on his eyesight to see a thing that's apparently only 40 feet long from half a mile away.
	It also apparently could block his radar, so there's no radar footage available.
	Supposedly, yeah.
	The video and the testimony is all we have to go on here, and none of the wildest things that Fravor claims were captured on the video.
	I do think it's important to note that other pilots and co-pilots present that day back Fravor up, at least as far as that they saw something weird.
	The reality of the situation is no one has a clue what that thing was, but there is little evidence of it and literally no evidence that this thing ever defied the laws of physics as we understand them, which would lead to it being aliens, of course.
	There are any number of mundane, man-made explanations for this thing, but David Fravor himself is an ardent believer and so that's the way the narrative goes.
	What you're going to hear from me a lot today is summations of stories that ultimately come down to witness testimony with no other evidence to back them up.
	I want to make it very clear that sure, these things could be aliens.
	It's just that there is no evidence to support that and I do not consider the eyewitness testimony of a person to sufficiently meet the burden of proof required.
	Now, I'm not saying...
	We'll get into eyewitness testimony a bit later.
	I'm not saying that the witnesses themselves are lying or are malicious in any way or that they're stupid.
	I am saying that the three shitheads we're about to deal with today are exactly all three of those things.
	But I do want to point out that malicious or not, Presenting this as an alien object has considerably raised David Fravor's status within this specific community, and his IMDB page reflects that, with the man having appeared in TV miniseries, Docutainment for the History Channel, he's been on 60 Minutes and Tucker Carlson Tonight, and of course he was on the Joe Rogan Experience.
	And I'm quite sure he also has a lucrative speaking career at UFO events as well.
	Does he have books?
	I bet he has books.
	Or he will.
	I didn't see any books.
	He might do.
	Yeah, he might do.
	I didn't see any when I was looking him up.
	Okay.
	Yeah, but yet.
	It's coming, I'm sure.
	Yeah, I'm glad that we mentioned that because like, yeah, of course.
	And there's, I mean, there is eyewitness testimony that is kind of historically very... I don't know if we're going to get into historical kind of experiences.
	No, not too much.
	It's not terribly relevant, but... Right, right, right.
	Well, I do want to say, like, there are certainly confusing elements, like the Travis Walton story, like the story that Fire in the Sky was based on, which scared the ever-loving shit out of me as a kid.
	Aliens are one of the things I was most terrified of as a child.
	Really?
	Oh yeah, I can't explain it.
	It just was nothing.
	I lived out in the country also, but what I do know is if you spend time like in the country or like alone a lot without a lot of light that you expect, you know, like a lot of street lights, there are crazy Optical illusions, I've experienced quite a bit.
	If you're like, if there's like a reflective surface, like water or in like the desert, like your eyes can play tricks on you.
	You see weird shit because the human brain is designed to find patterns.
	It's designed to see patterns in things.
	Absolutely.
	Because the fucking caveman side of our brain is still like, something's gonna eat me.
	Yeah, well, and there's people that have had, like, have had experiences that are not straightforward, Travis Wall being one of them, and, like, Petty and Bernie Hill, like, they went through something, something very traumatic.
	There are people out there that have had, you know, like, real experiences that are, like, the experience is real, the explanation is fuzzy, and I wish that they would have been treated better At the time and offered more understanding at the time.
	So I think that would have been something that could have honestly done us all a lot of good.
	So I think there are certainly like there are things that are not easily explained that happen.
	Yeah, no, I think, from my perspective, saying that something is weird and this strange fucking thing happened and I can't explain it, fine, completely fine.
	Saying it's definitely this thing, when you cannot know that, you literally cannot know that, that's a problem.
	That needs addressing.
	Yeah, and I think that it would be a lot more, like, kind.
	to offer people that are having experiences that are that are having these having these experiences that are not necessarily like there's like creative writing exercise experiences that are shared that I've seen and then there's like people that have been traumatized by something and I wish that they would have more I wish there was a more care and like kindness to like take care of people that are maybe going through something Um, that's kind of how I feel about it.
	I still think that, you know, again, like the folklore and I think it's really fascinating.
	And I think the history is fascinating.
	I think it's fascinating to see when a new movie came out in the 50s.
	And then all the UFO sightings that year describe those things directly.
	Like there is a, um, yeah, there is a car.
	Yeah.
	Yeah, in my house we celebrate the wackiness of the UFO lore in its entirety and like Billy Meyer and his pie plates and all that like we we celebrate that pretty readily but Yeah, and you know, my issue with any of this is almost never directed towards the witnesses themselves.
	Very rarely, because a lot of the time those people believe the things that they're saying.
	And they're exploited!
	All the time.
	Yeah, are exploited.
	And my issue is with the people then doing the exploiting.
	Not just of them, but the whole thing in general in order to make money, which is exactly what we've got here.
	Cigar and Jetty is a more tangential sort of example, but UFO stuff is massive in the right wing.
	That's so weird.
	It is really.
	Well, you know, it's weird until you think that how prone to conspiracies that they are, you know, how prone to conspiracy theories.
	And this is all of what's wrapped up in that, basically.
	Yeah.
	And there's like a weird Mormon connection that they mentioned briefly, like they touch on it in the book, The Colony, which I highly recommend.
	It's like it's that's a whole other tangent.
	I'll say, you know what?
	Off-brand.
	We'll talk about off-brand.
	We'll talk about it off-brand.
	Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
	It's interesting, but it's worth mentioning because, especially if we're talking about right-wing and we're talking about conservative politics in America, You can't, you have to look, often you will follow a thread to a very surprising and upsetting place and I think this is one of those things that like, it was mentioned in this book and I looked into it and I was like, oh god, it's like, it's whatever like dark stuff that we know some sects of Mormonism or
	Capable of her practice.
	Like, oh, that's connected to UFOs?
	Oh, great.
	Oh, cool.
	Well, that's a huge bummer.
	Like, so, there's a lot in there that, as you mentioned, conservative.
	I think there's a lot of, it's hard to put, there's so many little weird artifacts and pieces.
	It's, like, almost impossible to put it all together.
	Yeah, yeah.
	There's a lot of kind of fragmented kind of things around this issue in general.
	Yeah, yeah, yeah.
	So it's nice to actually like cover it.
	I think it's a good thing to cover because there's a lot of like very real politicking and power grabby struggle type stuff that's like real and we should be way more concerned about.
	And you know what?
	Russell is dealing with this shit like once a week.
	He has UFOs as a regular feature of his show.
	So yeah, as I've said before, I think it would be dishonest not to cover at least some of it.
	Oh, totally.
	So next we get to see a video of a different UFO before Brand asks a barrage of questions.
	Let's have a look at their recently released UFO footage saga, and after that I want to ask you about what you imagine they've got on their files, or at least your speculation, while acknowledging that it is speculation.
	Let's have a look at that footage.
	An American military drone conducting surveillance in the Middle East.
	Suddenly an unidentified object zips in and out of frame.
	Slow it down and it appears to be a metallic sphere.
	But where it came from and what it was doing remain a mystery to the Pentagon.
	Have you ever seen a UFO?
	Why are you interested in the subject?
	What do you think of the philosophical and ontological connotations of life elsewhere?
	Do you think it's advanced technology that is human or do you think it's evidence of life elsewhere?
	Do you think it might be finally the clarion call for us to unite as one human tribe while decentralizing power wherever possible?
	I can only hope so, Russell.
	I mean, fair play to him for hanging onto a thread there, at least.
	That was a lot.
	One human tribe?
	Fuck off, Russell.
	You spent an hour shitting on Rainn Wilson for being too globalist for your liking.
	One human tribe.
	One human tribe, but not global.
	Yeah, right.
	So anyway, this metallic orb video is a little bit different.
	So physicist Dr. Sean Kirkpatrick, director of the Pentagon's All Domain Anomaly Resolution Office, ARO, said, quote, we see these all over the world and we see these making very interesting apparent maneuvers.
	This one in particular, however, I would point out demonstrated no enigmatic technical capabilities and was no threat to airborne safety.
	While we are still looking at it, I don't have any more data than that."
	So, ARO and NASA aren't quite sure what these things are, and 47% of the UFO sightings reported to ARO are apparently spherical objects.
	Very interesting, definitely a bit weird, but not outside the realm of human capabilities.
	So, yeah.
	Sure is still out on these things.
	Well, for listeners, it looks like a ball bearing.
	It looks like a ball bearing dropped, is what it looks like.
	Going through the sky.
	Yeah.
	In a very uniform kind of way, it's very consistent movement.
	And hey, I look forward to an explanation of this, I imagine it will be incredibly boring when it finally does happen.
	But hey, you know what?
	It could be aliens, who the fuck knows, but there's no reason to think that as of yet.
	This is definitely within the realm of human capability, as I said.
	So we're going to skip Russell and Sagar's speculation on this stuff, because that's all it is, and go to the next searchable thing that Sagar brings up.
	Christopher Mellon, former Assistant Secretary of Defense, he was a State Senate-appointed official inside the Pentagon, is on the record saying that there is a video of two craftsmen flying together, two pilots, and a UFO that zooms in between people inside the cockpit video, absolutely freaking out about seeing that.
	They said it's one of the most high-impact videos that exists around this.
	So this video hasn't been seen by anyone and we only have Christopher Mellon's word for it that it exists.
	All of Mellon's statements on UFOs are second-hand information and he says things like, quote, I've been told that we have recovered technology that did not originate on this earth by officials in the Department of Defense and by former intelligence officials, unquote.
	To which I say, whoopty shit, I've been told by seemingly credible people that if women try to lift more than their body weight, their ovaries collapse, and just because they've said it does not make it true.
	Yeah, and I would love to just ignore this stuff, these claims of a video that no one has seen, or people can say they've seen it, Also, like, I think that I could find many reasons to be upset if I'm piloting a fighter jet.
	I could think of a lot of upsetting things.
	A goose in the wrong place could be particularly upsetting if that were the case.
	You know, like there's a lot of things.
	So just video of someone being really upset.
	Um still even like we can't see that like that's that we we don't even have that option.
	Yeah right that's that's that's somehow too classified like come on it's yeah like where's the video yeah and I um I I have a hard, like, as far as them being compelling, like, one of the few things that, like, I can't handle in true crime, um, content is, like, 911 calls.
	I can't really, I can't deal with it.
	Like, I, it just upsets me, and unless it's, like, pretty mundane, or, like, I feel like if the husband is lying about murder, um, that's usually okay to deal with because, you know, he's lying about murder.
	So, you know, he's acting but, like, other than that, I can't really deal with it.
	So even describing that, like, I can... But a lot of people do.
	A lot of people insist on that being part of the narrative that they hear.
	And so the sensationalism of, like, a first-hand account, I think we can acknowledge that it's extremely compelling.
	And I would love to ignore these claims but the QAnon video that is obviously never happened, the Frazzledrip claim of a video that was upsetting and bad that never
	happened.
	That is still flying around in some fashion years later because someone made a claim on a
	message board once so unfortunately we can't just disregard these things out of hand. People believe that it's
	true despite never having seen the video or having never surfaced it.
	Absolutely.
	Yeah.
	It's incredibly frustrating and more than a little bit absurd.
	Because it seems like there is a bit of a double standard when it comes to verifying evidence for these people.
	You think?
	You think?
	I feel like we have a theme!
	Okay, alright!
	So, next, Saga accidentally makes a hole in his own argument.
	And I also do think all of the discussion around, oh, we don't have any video of it.
	These, first of all, you know, the presumption is that this is a highly advanced civilization, or advanced technology, but second, like, all of these are happening either several hundred thousand feet, or thousands of feet up in the air, or miles off the sea.
	Cameras don't exist there.
	You know, it's not a place that a lot of people are, you know, necessarily with their cell phone.
	How convenient!
	This is it.
	I mean, he's right.
	These things are only being claimed in areas where there aren't any people who could get decent footage of it.
	Where there's no one who could even remotely push back.
	How strange!
	Who did that get?
	Might want to examine that thought a little further, Sagar.
	Just take it to the next point.
	You're so close!
	You're so close!
	Next, he admits he doesn't know what the spherical object is.
	I have no idea what it is.
	Again, this is just my theory.
	I could be completely wrong.
	It could be a Chinese drone going Mach 7.
	But I don't think so.
	You don't think it's that?
	With what reasoning?
	You have literally nothing to back you up other than just a feeling of, oh, this is weird.
	Like, provide evidence and cite sources or get the fuck out.
	Yeah.
	I would also like to point out that earlier in this interview, in one of the sections I cut out, Njeti confidently states, this is all just a very straightforward story of being lied to and not getting the truth.
	Well, which is it?
	But also, where's your proof for that also?
	Exactly.
	Like, do you have no idea what these things are, or do you know what they are and can therefore assert that we're all being lied to?
	Right.
	Pick a fucking line.
	And if that is the case, give me evidence.
	No shit.
	Which is it gonna be?
	I'd like to finish his thought that he said, um, I don't believe that that's true because I don't want to.
	Yeah, that's what I hear.
	You don't know how right you are, honestly.
	I kind of die of an inkling!
	Well, we're gonna get into something in a minute, but yeah, it takes a little bit of a turn.
	So yeah, I tell this guy to pick a lane, but in the next clip he definitely still does.
	I feel like I heard Early tapes of Bob Lazar, because remember I'm a long-time aficionado, sort of saying that, like Timothy Goode and stuff, talking about how like there's a sort of a concomitant feeling of love somehow, that it sort of induces a feeling of sort of spiritual ease, and perhaps that's because it induces in you somewhat like, you know, you see like a Rorschach test, what you want to see in there, and I want to see the possibility for meaningful change.
	Yeah, that's incredibly well said.
	I take great humility in the fact that we have no idea.
	Again, which is it?
	You have no idea or we're all being lied to.
	It can't be both.
	We're going to get into Bob Lazar in a little bit.
	Yay!
	I mostly just cut this clip to highlight Bran's hilarious pronunciation of Rorschach test.
	He makes it sound like a sneeze.
	Words get away from you sometimes.
	I think that's the way he thinks that that is pronounced.
	ALICE Yeah.
	Next, we get a bit of a callback to our first episode.
	And I find that to be very inspiring.
	I find, you know, I believe you're a fan of Graham Hancock and a lot of his work as well.
	Do you know why that's so important?
	To say, who are you?
	You think you're the most advanced human to ever live?
	You have no idea.
	People should go visit the pyramids.
	Go touch it with your hands.
	Go and look at it.
	Go to Malta.
	Go and look at some of those temples.
	I've been to some of these places.
	Ancient Hindu temples in India or in South America.
	Yeah, I'd love to go to Malta, buddy.
	How about you give me some of that sweet, sweet right-wing blowhard money and I'll see if I can swing it?
	I somehow doubt that most of Bran's audience are particularly wealthy, so, like, way to illustrate how out of touch you are.
	Classism aside, what Sagar is about to get into is some classic narratives that ancient civilizations weren't capable of building any of these great architectural wonders, and so it must have been some lost civilization that did it.
	Notice that all the places he named are traditionally made up of brown people.
	Graham Hancock has reared his head again with his casually racist pseudoscientific narratives.
	Cool, I didn't think I was going to be upset by this one.
	Hey!
	Yeah, this took me out of left field as well.
	So yeah, Hancock's lost intelligent race is heavily coded as Caucasian for anyone who didn't know.
	God, I hate it.
	Incredibly.
	Yeah, for those of you listening and not necessarily aware, the background that I am coming from is both like history and art history was kind of my gateway drug.
	And so I I spent my young life watching the History Channel tell me about cool places, and then the History Channel, the Learning Channel, ironically named, and all these channels decided to take the history they were showing me that I was excited by as a kid, and then claiming it was made by aliens.
	It was the same content, just like, oops, we're going to lie about it in a terrible way.
	Yeah, they took a turn.
	And it was never particularly on the, it was real Ripley's Believe It or Not in the first place.
	Like, there's a lot of like, there's kind of a lot of harm and there's sort of, Getting some blowback and starting to see some consequences now that like the um that shiny happy people documentary came out on the duggers and like there is some discussion of responsibility that these tv networks have for generating this kind of like really problematic content um but not not soon enough and not enough accountability yet.
	I'd like to see that.
	No, no.
	I think it might happen.
	It might happen.
	I don't know.
	So next, Sagar shows himself as a bit misinformed, and who'd have guessed it?
	I very recently was looking at some Mayan ruins.
	One of them was in Mexico.
	It was on a cliff.
	Nobody knew why a hole was in the center of it.
	It turns out that it's a sophisticated hurricane warning system.
	That only when the wind goes over 60 miles per hour makes a sound that can warn everybody around you.
	If you really believe that that was, you know, just happenstance and that didn't require, you know, the knowledge of a very advanced civilization.
	Okay, so the ruins he's talking about are the Mayan ruins in Tulum, Mexico.
	It wasn't a hole in the middle of the building, so much as conch shells embedded in the structure, which whistle more loudly as the wind speed increases.
	Pretty sure an ancient civilization could work that one out, particularly the fucking Mayans.
	The Mayans invented a complex and accurate calendar system, more accurate than the one we currently use.
	They invented hydraulic buildings, filtration systems, jewelry, rubber and chocolate.
	They were also great at medicine and dentistry.
	I think they could manage some noisy shells, Sagar, you patronizing fuck.
	They also had really effective social safety nets.
	That's another thing that we don't talk about, that ancient cultures, almost all of them, had really sophisticated and caring systems in their society.
	That's my conspiracy theory.
	We don't talk about that.
	I can't really call it that.
	It's just something that doesn't get any attention, which like, if it's oops, all aliens, then yeah, you don't have to talk about any of that stuff.
	Because it was just good on the planet.
	Yeah, no, it's true.
	It's funny how kind of systems that aren't based on a Horrific version of capitalism have have different values for an invasion and colonization.
	Yeah, because that's the narrative with aliens that we and like it's imperialism.
	And if you romanticize that it's a problem.
	I mean like I have a I'm like, I could... It's out of reach, but like, I have a book on Tulum right there!
	Right there!
	Off-brand, off-brand, off-brand.
	Well, not even... I just... That book knows.
	Mm-hmm.
	Oh, why doesn't this boy who's talking on TV know?
	Yeah, yeah.
	Well, yeah.
	I'm using TV as YouTube, but like, yeah, come on.
	It's not hard to find out.
	No, no, no.
	A cursory Google search was all it took for me.
	And by the sound of it, like he, he said he was looking at it.
	I don't know if he's been there or what, but yeah, it's not, it's not hard to find.
	I don't know.
	I'll be curious to see what his source was for this information.
	I'm willing to bet it's not good.
	Anyway, in the next clip, Sagar explains why he believes in ancient civilizations.
	Sagar explains why he believes in ancient civilizations.
	Oh, well, hunter-gatherer, and then we went to civilize, and we started having wheat, and then this happened, and then war happened, and now we're here, and technology is the height of humankind.
	What if it's a prison of humankind?
	What if it's actually not, you know, not even close to where we were before?
	I find that to be a very inspiring story.
	Yes.
	Yes.
	Asshole!
	Are you joking?
	Okay.
	So the cookie cutter narrative of human evolution and development is a bit too boring for him.
	I mean, I get it, reality is boring, but unfortunately we don't live in a fucking comic book like he seems to believe.
	I like the- I like our story!
	I'm super fascinated by, like, crop rotation.
	And I know that's a me problem, but it's fascinating!
	Us figuring all of this shit out is pretty amazing in its own kind of way, and yeah, he just has no appreciation of any of that.
	Even, like, learning cursory knowledge about, like, ceramics is like, how the fuck did we figure this out?
	It's incredible!
	Neither does Russell, you know, and we got into this in the Dawkins episode, really.
	They don't have that same kind of sense of awe and wonder at this shit, you know.
	It has to be taken to this fantastical, spiritual, or in this case fucking extraterrestrial level, otherwise it's not interesting.
	Well, one can even assume that maybe it's a more comfortable substitution for God for I don't know.
	Maybe? Maybe. I don't know. I don't care to go down that road. I'm not playing his game, see? He got me.
	Yeah, so I do want to touch briefly on the Piri Reis map that he mentioned, which was a world
	map compiled by the Ottoman admiral and cartographer Piri Reis, not Piri Reis. Piri Reis in 1530.
	The surviving fragment of the map is about a third of the total thing.
	Parts of the map are astonishingly accurate, and others decidedly less so, including mythical creatures, for instance.
	What Sagar mentions there is the claim that the southern portion of the map displays an ice-free Antarctic just over 500 years ago.
	This claim was initially made by a guy called Charles Hapgood who proposed a theory of global exploration by a pre-classical undiscovered civilization along with it.
	Graham Hancock has touted Hapgood's claims as proofs of a lost civilization comparable to Atlantis, so it's pretty easy to see where Sagar got this claim from.
	For reference, recent IceCore data shows that Antarctica was last free of ice over 10 million years ago, though we are well on our way to seeing that day return.
	Hmm, cool.
	Yeah, that's great!
	So, yeah, complete horseshit there.
	So, the map was made by someone- A cartographer in 1513, yeah.
	1513 is the map that we're discussing right now.
	Yeah, the Piri Reis map.
	Right, right, right, right.
	Yeah.
	Cartographer and admiral, went around the world a bit, and made a map, and used a couple of other people's maps as well.
	I think that we figured that out!
	Oh you'd love this map!
	You would love this map!
	I might find it for off-brand actually because it's quite a unique thing like a lot of kind of maps of this style didn't have like traditional like Muslim iconography and stuff and so there's like some really beautiful artwork around it and so you yeah you definitely appreciate it.
	Like it's it's an interesting map, but yeah where where where this guy's taking it is completely full of shit Because his source is full of shit because it's Graham Hancock Yeah, so next Sagar thinks he's Morpheus Best with the stories of exploration of civilizational first contact and so much more because in that I see the birth of something new didn't always go well for a lot of people but it was exciting and it was riveting and I think that so much of the cookie cutter ways that we look at our current story in our current society that are almost designed as you've often talked about to keep us complacent and locked into systems of power where all the only thing that's keeping you in a prison is your mind.
	Free your mind, Neo.
	whenever you think differently, almost anything is possible.
	And a lot of this can sound hokey, but, you know, take it from a guy like me,
	even in a suit, like you can manifest quite a few things whenever you just want to think differently.
	Free your mind, Neo. Free your mind.
	Yeah. Take it. Take it from a guy like him in a suit.
	Sure. I, but I.
	I don't generally like to comment on people's appearance, but I have to say someone who can afford to travel the world should probably be able to afford a suit that fits.
	It looks like something his mum bought him at the insistence he'd grow into it.
	Yeah, in any case, yeah, this guy doesn't believe in reality, and him and Crystal Ball have a million subscribers checking into their weekly bullshit, so that's great.
	Well, what's he saying?
	Like, do we gloss over the... I'll come back to it in a second.
	Okay, okay, okay, okay, okay, okay.
	They've also been on Rogan, by the way.
	Breaking Points have.
	They've had their time on Rogan as well.
	Seems like all these fucking people just get in there.
	But yes, as to I think what you picked up there was him saying, oh it didn't go well for some people.
	He was talking about imperialism.
	The notion of colonization didn't go well for some people.
	Is that what he was getting at?
	I think the generous view is that he was talking about ancient civilizations that obviously did not exist.
	But I think he's talking about those and how those didn't go well for some people, I think.
	We can play that part of the clip, Black.
	With the stories of exploration of civilizational first contact and so much more because in that I see the birth of something new.
	Didn't always go well for a lot of people but it was exciting and it was riveting and I think that so much of the cookie cutter ways that we look at our current story and our current society.
	Whatever you just want to think differently.
	Just want to think differently.
	Just want to think differently.
	That was absurd.
	You're right.
	First contact didn't always go well for some people.
	Yeah, that's the slaughter of the Native Americans.
	So that's the slaughter of a lot of people.
	Yeah, no, you're right.
	Yeah, yeah, yeah.
	I like this guy to learn about a certain Leopold that was a bit of a problem and it didn't quote-unquote go well for folks getting their hands cut.
	Okay, all right.
	Also, I'm pretty sure this guy is of Indian heritage somewhere in his line.
	Should probably have a bit more of a fucking awareness of what colonization does and is.
	is. Okay, yeah, sorry about that. I thought he was still going on about the ancient alien ship,
	but no, you're... Yeah.
	I mean, I know where my moral core lies, so I'm a little sensitive to hearing about that stuff
	because it's really upsetting and fucked up.
	That's a fucked up thing to say.
	Exciting and interesting?
	I guess public execution was too, dude.
	Yeah, I guess you could use those words.
	He probably would say that, though.
	He probably would.
	Oh yeah, that is interesting.
	And because he's in the, you know, he comes from the right-wing wealthy fucking sphere of it, he's like, oh yeah, that's fine.
	Entertaining.
	So, yeah, that's thankfully that is us done with Sagar and Jetty for now.
	Yeah, there is more of this interview that didn't touch on aliens, because obviously this is just the edited portion from that.
	But I don't think I really want to get into this guy any further unless we have to.
	Right.
	Well, so we're dealing with the clip show also today, right?
	Exactly.
	Exactly.
	Yeah, yeah, yeah.
	So we've got a couple more people to deal with.
	But yeah, it's not great that this guy and Crystal Ball have a million subscribers, you know, and that well-platformed, but... Okay, we'll see what happens with him.
	Yuck.
	So yeah, hopefully next time we deal with him he'll have grown a bit, either physically or mentally.
	And our next clip... I'm not gonna hold my breath!
	No, right?
	Our next clip is just a little throwaway comment from Russell.
	Mmm.
	I've got some, I mean, I've said I've had some interesting information about UFOs now and extra dimensional beings and, and like diplomatic relationships between extraterrestrial nations and the United States and the Chinese government and the Russians.
	I mean, it's really blowing up this stuff.
	I'm so deeply upset that he doesn't elaborate on this stuff.
	I would love to know the inner workings of the diplomatic relations between the aliens and the US, Chinese, and Russian governments.
	Like, I want to see the West Wing, but with extraterrestrials, right?
	I would watch that show.
	I would watch the fuck out of that show.
	The Terrest Wing, uh-huh.
	The extraterrestrials.
	The Terrest Wing, yes!
	Uh, yeah.
	Okay.
	What was that?
	And that's just, that's just thrown away.
	That's just, that's just there in the middle of this thing.
	Just boop.
	All right.
	What?
	What did you just say?
	We can also kind of tell, like there are moments where he kind of tells it himself or like digresses and is joking.
	And I can tell the difference for the most part, even if we're like, oh, well he said something upsetting, but he couched it as a joke or not serious.
	That was not One of those instances that I'm referencing that was like he said that because he thinks it that's Looney Tunes.
	Yeah.
	All right.
	Yep.
	Yep.
	Yeah, I hope we get to explore that more at some point because I'd be fascinated.
	See, this is where they get us because it's also fascinating.
	Like, what do you think you mean?
	I don't give a shit about fucking, you know, cover-ups or whatever else.
	I don't care about any of that, but give me, like, diplomatic relations, give me treaties and stuff, give me the boring admin shit, and I'm like, wow, this is interesting.
	This is great.
	All of it's completely made up, but I am- Who works for the Raptor Princess?
	Yeah, I am drawn in.
	Yes, yes.
	I am 100% in.
	Honestly, the politics of alien shit is, and this is an unpopular take, but it's one of my favorite things in Star Wars.
	It's one of my favorite things in Mass Effect.
	I'm just like, yeah, let's just focus on the Senate more.
	Let's do it.
	Oh, I love it.
	I love it.
	Everyone else is like, nah, fuck that.
	Yeah, well, that's also something that, like, podcasts has awakened in me.
	I did not know that, like, things like forensic accounting.
	Oh, I think that's just a part of me.
	Hugely interesting.
	Yeah, it's wildly interesting.
	And also, when you let people explain these ideas, It's, um, the creativity is always, uh, what is it?
	Exciting and intriguing.
	You know, exciting.
	I don't remember which words I just used to describe colonial occupation.
	Um, yeah, that's, it is very interesting.
	I try to forget.
	Where do you think this is going?
	Tell me how you think MedBeds work.
	And let's go from there.
	Because there's a movie.
	There's a movie, or a comic book, or a TV show, or a book, that is in there somewhere.
	And I want to know.
	Yeah.
	Bring it all out.
	Bring it all out.
	I want to see it all.
	So in this next clip, Russell introduces the next guest, opening with some big claims from someone that they interviewed.
	So you have a strong suspicion that people have been murdered to protect the secret.
	Over the years, yeah.
	Ross.
	Ross, are you, through your rhetorical style, through your cadence, through your leaning in, dramatising this subject?
	Please welcome Ross Coulthard to the show.
	Hello Ross.
	G'day Russell, how are you mate?
	I don't think it needs any dramatisation.
	It's real.
	The phenomenon is real.
	What Dave Grush is saying is real.
	And the mainstream media, you are a rare exception.
	Thank God somebody like you is doing a show because we are being ignored.
	There is an attempt to cover this up.
	Bury it back in a box for another 80 years, and the simple fact is David Grush is telling the truth, backed by other whistleblowers who are ready to come forward.
	This is going to come out.
	Even the astonishing and captivating revelations contained within your interview are just the tip, and I mean just the tip, Ross, of the iceberg, and by God, it's a hell of an iceberg, because I know, because I can tell, Ross, I can see the way that you're conducting that interview, you know a great deal more than you're able to publicly say.
	Now, I've heard off the record, and I won't name my sources because I'm a professional journalist, I'm the best, some say, Russell considers himself a journalist?
	He just said that on his show.
	He just said the words, I'm a professional journalist.
	I would accept commentator, or entertainer, or pundit, or transparent propagandist, but journalist?
	Russell, you lack the training, credentials, skill, wit, and degree of critical analysis required to be able to hold that title.
	Oh, but he can excuse that as just joking.
	That's the thing.
	He can play that off, which is infuriating.
	Maybe.
	If it comes up again, I'm gonna fucking jump on him for it.
	This pisses me off.
	Which is entirely valid!
	That's the thing, is like, we have to point it out because we need to stop accepting That, like, I was just kidding.
	It's not serious.
	I'm an entertainer.
	I just say I'm a journalist.
	No, he 100% means that to the people who believe him.
	Like, he 100% means that to them.
	So the first guy we saw in that little clip there making the big swing was David Grush, who we are going to get into in just a second.
	But I'd like to introduce shithead number two, Ross Coulthard.
	Ross Azave is formerly an award-winning journalist and historical author who previously in his career has rendered some searing exposés of the Australian government.
	In 2021, he starred in The UFO Phenomenon, a TV series that claimed to, quote, unearth startling new evidence of UFOs from government officials and eyewitnesses, unquote.
	And in that same year, he authored a UFO-themed book called In Plain Sight, An Investigation Into UFOs and Impossible Science.
	In doing so, he landed in the sights of Jason Colovito, who debunks a lot of this stuff and the ancient civilization stuff, actually.
	And he said the book was, quote, less a serious analysis and more of a book report on the last works of the leaders of the faith.
	It also serves as an application for Coulthard to join Leslie Kean and George Knapp on the lucrative UFO speakers circuit as a serious journalist with paranormal conclusions, unquote.
	In Plain Sight has been reprinted this year following Grush's claims, so it's safe to say Coulthardt stands to benefit in a very obvious kind of way from all of this.
	I will keep wondering if those books are in my house.
	They might be!
	They might be!
	Because also like, from like a cultural anthropology, you know like, to be curious about the folklore and the tradition that we have created in this country.
	Completely fine.
	Right!
	A fascination with the shit that people are saying?
	Completely fine.
	Nothing inherently wrong with that at all.
	Totally!
	And that's unfortunate because you've got two sets of audience And success does not differentiate, and popularity does not differentiate between either kind of, like, from the outside looking in, or, oh, I believe this is real and true.
	Yeah, right.
	Michael, tell me!
	Yeah, no, I'm looking forward to the various book reports from Mike.
	We might have to include that as a patron-only segment, you know.
	Mike's book reports.
	I'm into it.
	So yeah, now before we get into David Grush and the things that he's claiming, I'd like to play this next clip as something to bear in mind when considering anything that Ross Coulthard has said and anything he will say.
	To preface this, he's discussing an extraterrestrial crash retrieval program that Grush alleges is a thing.
	I can't say definitively I know it's true, because I haven't yet seen these craft.
	I haven't seen the secret documents that David Grush has seen.
	So the entirety of what Coulthard is saying hinges on the testimony of David Grush and believing that what he's saying is true.
	Coulthard doesn't know a fucking thing!
	And yet, in that opening clip, he said, It's real what David Grush is saying.
	It's real.
	And David Grush is telling the truth when it's literally impossible for him to know.
	So let's get into David Grush, right?
	Who is David Grush?
	You may have seen him plastered across the news in the last week as he testified before the U.S.
	House Subcommittee on National Security in the hearing titled Unidentified anomalous phenomena, which is another acronym for UFOs.
	The US government in the 80s wanted a phrasing that was less synonymous with crack pottery, and that's what they landed on.
	Fair enough.
	David Grush is a former officer in the US Air Force and veteran of the National Geospatial Intelligence Agency and the National Reconnaissance Office.
	Anyway, he's...
	He's gone before the House to make these claims, alongside David Fravor, the tic-tac guy who we mentioned before, and a fighter pilot, Ryan Graves.
	This hearing was actually sent to me by a patron before I was even aware I'd need to deal with it properly for Coulthardt's appearance, and I watched the whole thing, which comes in at nearly three hours, including the various Congress people's statements.
	So in the in the hearing Grush claims that he was quote informed in the course of my official duties of a multi-decade UAP crash retrieval and reverse engineering program to which I was denied access unquote and in response to someone asking about the U.S.
	allegedly retrieving non-human biological matter from The pilots of the crashed UFOs.
	Grush said that this was, quote, that this, quote, was the assessment of people with direct knowledge on the UAP program that I talked to that are currently still on the program, unquote.
	He claims that there is substantive evidence that white collar crime took place to conceal UFO programs and that he had interviewed officials who said that people had been killed to conceal said programs.
	He also insinuates there is a form of shadow government who are the ones committing these acts of espionage to keep the UFO program under wraps.
	That's a big swing.
	His proof better be very airtight if he's going to make those claims.
	Many big swings, and I have my own take on this, but let's see what the experts think.
	So Joshua Semita of NASA's UAP Independent Study Team said, quote, without data or material evidence, we are at an impasse on evaluating these claims and that in the long history of claims of extraterrestrial visitors, it is this level of specificity that always seems to be missing, unquote.
	Adam Frank, a professor of astrophysics at the University of Rochester, said, quote, it's an extraordinary claim and it requires extraordinary evidence, none of which we're getting, unquote, which pretty much sums up my position on the matter.
	Grush's claims are backed up at this stage by nothing but hot air.
	His wildest claims seem to come from people he's interviewed who knew a guy, and any time the House hearing wanted to delve into specifics of any of what he was saying, he said he would only willingly do so in a skiff, which is a closed session to discuss classified information.
	Accordingly, he can make claims of pretty much anything he wants, say he'll provide details in a skiff, and whether he does so or not will never be known to anyone who wasn't in that room.
	This leads me to the biggest problem with UFO claims of this nature specifically, which is that I can't outright call this guy a fucking liar.
	He might be.
	He might be.
	Or he might be telling the absolute truth.
	He does seem to earnestly believe the things that he's saying.
	What I do know is that as yet he hasn't provided a single scrap or iota of evidence to support the things he says, and he is now a world-famous UFO whistleblower, which is a lucrative career that will support him for the rest of his life.
	I'd like to be clear that I am in fact open-minded to literally all the things he said as being true.
	Aliens interacting with humanity, UFO crashes and all this stuff would be cool as fuck, but there is exactly zero evidence of any of it having ever happened.
	My investment comes from terror.
	Absolute horror, which makes me concerned and vigilant in my own way.
	But oh, I'd like to know.
	I would like to be informed.
	Exactly.
	I would love that.
	I am 100% on board with any of this stuff.
	If there is ever any evidence, I'll be the first in fucking line.
	I come more from the Mars attack school.
	I'm expecting the absolute worst.
	Stunningly beautiful, and the worst.
	I'm less concerned about Independence Day, but yeah, you never know.
	Some folks might be persuaded by the fact that these claims are apparently backed up by several people, all believing them to be true, but To that I say, when people believe something, they will go to extraordinary lengths to protect and confirm that belief.
	Especially in groups, you need look no further than churches, where several seemingly normal people end up speaking in tongues by the end of the thing.
	Like, it's the same, just that example is more ridiculous, but it's the same principle.
	And this is without us even getting into... Ridiculous, but very common.
	It's a great example.
	Incredibly common.
	And this is without us even getting into the inherent fallibility of things like eyewitness testimony, upon which most of this stuff is reliant.
	Or the fact that conspiracies are incredibly difficult to keep under wraps, particularly among hundreds of people over several decades.
	In short, I'm open to being told extraterrestrials have visited and interacted with humanity, but you'd better come correct and with evidence more substantive than, it's true because I said it is.
	Unfortunately, that's the best that we can get out of David Grush at this time.
	Well, and and I just I think that it is a good idea to apply your your the intellectual rigor If you're like subjects that you think are neat and subjects that you that you think are a problem you can't apply to standards and I don't I have not seen evidence that I find compelling and like enough no and I can't really listen to like I mean yeah it's it's it's a sticky wicket and
	The thing that drove me nuts, because I couldn't get away from these clips, from this dude.
	Right, yeah, me either.
	Me either, he was fucking everywhere.
	And like, did they define what they meant by non-human biologics, or did they just say it in that hearing?
	I don't recall, to be honest, but I don't remember a definition being specified.
	Yeah, that drives me nuts, because guess who's a non-human biologic?
	Your dog!
	Yeah, my cat.
	Algae.
	That's most stuff on the planet.
	That's not specific.
	It sounds fancy and is stupid and is not specific enough for me.
	Those words came out and I was like, that's it, I'm done, I'm out, no ma'am.
	It's like UAP, right?
	Unidentified Anomalous Phenomena does not mean extraterrestrial.
	That is not the same thing.
	It's just something where it's flying and we don't know what it is.
	Which we should be concerned with.
	Yeah, that is something to worry about.
	Right!
	But there's nothing indicating that it's not from Earth.
	Yeah, that's pure speculation.
	Yeah.
	Anyway, let's get back into some clips.
	So next up, considering we know that David Coulthard doesn't verifiably know a fucking thing, he just throws his journalistic credibility out the window.
	But what he's done, what this incredibly brave man has done, is he's come forward, not only to the Inspector General of the Defence Department and the Inspector General of the Intelligence Community, he's also testified under oath to the Congress, to the two oversight committees, the House Intelligence Committee and the Senate Intelligence Committee.
	If he's lying, send him to jail.
	Prove it and send him to jail.
	If he's not lying, Then that's the test.
	I know he's not lying.
	I know he's telling the truth.
	You don't know shit!
	You said you haven't seen the documents or any of the evidence yourself!
	And here's the thing, they might be able to prove that Grush was lying under oath, that might be possible if he ever did make claims specific enough to be investigated, but the reality is if they did prosecute this guy for lying to Congress, he'd just become a martyr to the cause and it would be used to say, oh look, they're trying to silence him by sending him to prison.
	So what would be the fucking point?
	Right.
	Yeah, it's very unlikely.
	I mean, lie detector tests, quote-unquote lie detector machines, yeah right, but like they don't detect if you're lying, if the thing that you're saying is a lie or not, they're measuring your physiological response because you think you're telling the truth or you think you're telling a lie.
	That's all that's actually being measured.
	And so people can believe things with their heart of hearts and be very convincing.
	And that doesn't mean that's what happened.
	Yeah, exactly.
	And prosecuting someone for being wrong in that instance, even though they believed everything, that's an entirely different situation.
	If someone lies to Congress unintentionally, that's a different situation to lying to Congress.
	It's a different legal category.
	Because it removes the with malice part.
	It takes that out.
	That's a pretty essential portion.
	Anyway, next Coltart blames the mainstream media for doing their job.
	And what really gives me the It pisses me off, Russell, because I'm a journo who has spent much of my life in mainstream media, and I'm seeing newspapers like the New York Times, the Washington Post, the London Times, all of these papers are suppressing this story.
	Not because they're being told to by the intelligence community, because they don't have the capacity anymore for critical thinking like you do, and like so many other shows that are starting to develop online do.
	The simple fact is mainstream media is failing to cover this issue and I've never in my long
	career as a journalist been so shocked and confronted by the fact that what we're looking
	at here is we're seeing unfold at the moment the biggest story in human history.
	Yeah, the mainstream media hasn't suppressed a damn thing.
	Even without having to look all this stuff up, I was getting force-fed stories about Grush's testimony from literally every news source on the planet.
	What he's actually taking issue with is people who still have some journalistic credibility pointing out that there's no evidence to back up any of what's being said.
	That is his problem here.
	Which is coverage.
	Just because it doesn't agree with his particular ilk does not mean it's not being covered.
	I am sick to death, to death, of that particular claim and like that.
	Yeah, fuck off.
	I'm fucking over that shit.
	There is coverage, you just don't like the way the coverage is.
	And there was coverage when he did this interview as well when he, because he originally interviewed David Grush before all this and that's kind of when it all came out and blah blah blah blah blah.
	There was coverage then from the mainstream media, so yeah, fuck off.
	So the next clip is a little bit long, but there are a few interesting points that I want to deal with.
	Ross, that's so fantastic.
	You've really raised the temperature.
	You're obviously a credible journalist yourself, not prone to hysteria, even if you do sometimes lean in dramatically to your subjects.
	You've raised the temperature so much, I've undone another button on my shirt to celebrate.
	Now, one of the revelations I'd like us to discuss, and this is an opportunity for us to use our unique platform here on Rumble, particularly on Locals, and if you're watching us on Rumble, join us on Locals now.
	Press that red button on your screen.
	Why don't you collectively use Google Earth?
	Why don't we use Alphabet's utilities for good?
	If you have a look at Area 51 now in Nevada, you'll see a mountain in that region which many claim has visible entrances and exits that are currently being used by these UFOs, by these NIHs.
	I'm not sure what acronym to use anymore, but we can do this research right now ourselves.
	You lot in the chat have a look at our production company.
	Bad Graphics Jack could have a little poke around.
	I mean it seems to me that in some cases it's almost ludicrously ordinary that these interactions have been going on for a long time, there are sort of bureaucratic diplomatic agreements, there have been conversations, there have been trade agreements almost, there are the rights to access certain territories, legitimized exchanges of human life, stuff that the mainstream media will Understandably to a degree Ross, treat as ludicrous because given the conditioning we've received up to now it seems implausible to discuss it until you increase the size of your frame to include the evident reality that the cosmos is without limitation both temporally and spatially and within that framing
	A more advanced species, whether that's extraterrestrial or interdimensional, is a literal inevitability.
	And the likelihood of exchanges increases exponentially on that basis.
	And then the idea that, oh, why haven't they landed on the White House lawn?
	Well, it seems like every time that there is credible evidence, it's suppressed, it's undermined, it's reframed, it's rephrased, whether it's footage.
	Oh, look, we're looking for that mountainscape now.
	There's really good footage of that.
	We had a mercantile dog!
	Okay.
	Okay.
	Yeah.
	Trade agreements, whatever else is going on.
	And apparently, it's absurd to consider all of this alien stuff until you expand your mind enough to consider the possibility that it's definitely true.
	He knows that he puts the goofiest shit in the middle.
	He knows!
	Because that's his... I usually have to, like, wait for him to finish when I have a bone to pick with, like, whatever is in the middle or in the first third.
	Yeah, whatever he said at the start, and then you're like, fucking...
	Like, oh, right, right, right!
	Yeah, you said the one thing, but now I do have to accept the concept of the known and unknown universes?
	How am I going to address the trade agreement that you claim we have with extraterrestrials in China?
	Sir!
	Right, so first up, we have Russell's idea of research here, telling his audience to go on Google Maps and look at Area 51 to find the holes in the landscape where the aliens get in and out.
	That's research.
	And apparently, yeah, we have diplomatic agreements, territory agreements, and near-trade agreements with extraterrestrials, all without anyone below what presumably must be the highest level of the executive branch knowing.
	Like, do you think for a fucking second that Donald Trump would have learned about alien life and kept his mouth shut?
	As we were all saying!
	The whole time!
	He would have tweeted about it before they had time to confiscate his fucking phone.
	Or, maybe that's what the whole Covfefe thing was about.
	Like, they took his phone off him mid-tweet while he was trying to alert the world.
	It was actually, Covfefucking aliens exist!
	That's what he was trying to get to.
	How fucking absurd.
	Oh, it's so stupid!
	Oh man, oh man, oh man.
	Well, that's the thing that was with the Google Maps shit.
	Like, that's, it's really hard because there are, like, there is one specific Um, tool for research with Google Maps is if you can, and, um, this might be contentious by all means.
	Tell me if it's, you know, listener, anybody out there tells me if it's, this is, I have, I'm quoting from PBS right now.
	Um, but there are instances in, um, specifically in China and I'm not being anti-China here for arbitrarily, um, There are certain government actions that I think are bad that China does.
	That doesn't mean it's all bad.
	Oh yeah, China has some fucking problems, yeah.
	Right.
	So there are, like, if a researcher who's trying to figure out where There might be kind of, you know, re-education camps or some kind of base, right?
	And you can find that, like, if the person, if the entities that want to keep that secret don't know you're looking for it, and you find it on Google Maps, and then you report on it, and then you look at Google Maps again, and that facility has been dismantled or moved, that is evidence that they're doing something shady.
	When in a broader context of reporting where there's corroborating evidence and witness testimony that can be corroborated, that it's tough because there's like a kernel of truth.
	In a tiny little degree, that is crucial, potentially, to who maps.
	But that's not what Russell is talking about.
	Yeah, that's not what they're doing.
	That's not what they're doing.
	They're looking at a desert landscape and they're looking for holes that aliens get in and out of.
	That's it.
	They're zooming in on a shadow and they're confused.
	Well, we actually get to see a little bit of that in the next clip, because while Ross Coulthard is talking, one of the people, I'm assuming Bad Graphics Jack, who we mentioned, is roaming around the place over Area 51, and it shows up on the big screen.
	So that's great fun.
	So yeah, next up, Ross Coulthard, he takes a swing of his own.
	Do you think that, in a sense, Ross, that what this challenges us to do, as both recipients and creators of media, is to responsibly broaden out our framing?
	Absolutely.
	I mean, just to give you an example of just how absurd this is, that this story is being overlooked, Russell, your and my mate Jeremy Cordell, with his colleague George Knapp, broke a story in the last 12 hours about a document that I've known about for some months.
	And in that document, a Canadian MP, a Member of Parliament in Canada called Larry Maguire, writes to the Canadian Defence Minister and reveals that he has investigated and discovered a secret Canadian collaboration with the US on UAP crash retrievals.
	The Canadians have been allegedly working on non-human technology in collaboration with the US government.
	Big swing!
	Big swing!
	So we'll get to who Jeremy Corbell and George Knapp are in a bit, but the thing they've supposedly released is actually just a typed up letter that was doing the rounds on Twitter back in May.
	The original account who shared it was a seemingly random account with one and a half thousand followers, and their bio reads, quote, lover of life, truth, family, dot dot dot, Christ Consciousness, really bad spelling, Shut up.
	"Always learning, centrist, UAP/phenomenon, m.ed."
	No.
	When another Twitter user asked them for the source, they said a military friend of theirs
	sent it to them in a DM.
	Shut up.
	No.
	Bye.
	Yeah, the letter itself is supposedly from a Canadian MP, Larry Maguire, and he's asking
	the Minister of National Defence about the "recovery and exploitation of physical material
	from UAPs."
	We have no idea if this document is real.
	Larry Maguire has not confirmed it as real so far as I can find.
	But even if it is real, it still doesn't say the things that Coulthardt, Corbell and Knapp are saying that it says.
	Like, nothing about extraterrestrial anything.
	It's just UAPs, which are a thing.
	That's a thing.
	That's a thing that happens.
	And they do get shot down.
	Right.
	That's what I was like.
	Yeah, I'm on board with that part.
	Let's agree to talk about it together instead of having separate silos.
	Not too crazy so far.
	And then, oh, it's extraterrestrial and reverse engineering now.
	Take a turn.
	Oh, man.
	All right, okay.
	Yeah, intellectual rigor.
	Cool, cool, cool.
	Oh yeah, this guy's fucking full of it.
	Next, Ross Coulter and I arrive at the same point, but from completely different directions.
	It's like, you know, it's funny actually, listening to your show, I hear so often things that make me wonder as a journalist, has society lost its capacity for critical thinking?
	Me too.
	I too watch Russell's show and wonder if society at large has lost the capacity for critical thinking.
	I think that all the time when I am watching this man's shows.
	It keeps me up at night!
	Yeah!
	That's a big concern!
	I was shook by this.
	The moment he said it I was like, Me too!
	But yeah, he means it in the other way.
	Yeah, I'm not crazy.
	Society's crazy.
	Okay, buddy.
	Except also, I feel like better about mine because like, oh, we are in society.
	Are we going crazy collectively?
	Not like, I'm right!
	It's y'all that are wrong!
	That's a very different approach.
	Oh God, yes.
	Yeah, it's a lot.
	So, in the next clip, he actually says another thing I agree with.
	Just because a bunch of experts or pompous twats in Washington say something, why should we necessarily believe it?
	We should test it.
	We should always challenge claims.
	And the thing that really shocks me at the moment is we are lurching towards a new kind of authoritarianism in media, where this kind of group of lumpenproletariat journalists basically make the decisions about what we're all meant to think.
	And there's an absence now, there's a disconnect between critical thinking and what's put into our papers and to our media.
	We should always challenge claims.
	He's right about that, and I'm challenging your claims, Coltart, and I find them wanting.
	And by all means, challenge experts, but I warn you, buddy, they know more than you about this stuff.
	It's why they're called experts, and that's why experts are valuable to society.
	For a group of people that insist on finding the best person for the job, which is usually just coded racism or anti-LGBTQ sentiments, This lot sure do fucking hate experts.
	I do find his insistence on a lumpenproletariat group of journalists deciding what the world should believe a little bit odd.
	Lumpenproletariat basically means working class or the bottom rung of people, but those who aren't striving towards the revolution, unlike the proletariat who are.
	So, again, he's saying, ah, all these journalists are just ignoring the truth in front of them.
	Whereas, actually, the issue he's running up against is most journalists doing their due diligence and waiting for actual evidence.
	That's the problem.
	Yeah, well what I have a serious issue with, and it sucks that they can pick at this bone so effectively, is your issue, I don't think, is with, yeah, the average person journalist is a dying breed because of corporate consolidation of media.
	So yeah, fewer voices than ever And I think that maybe a news presenter is not to be confused with a journalist.
	No, no.
	And they do that interchangeably all the fucking time.
	And it makes me mad because people, you know, the Rachel Maddows of the world, and I'm not, this is not a judgment call in any way, but like the public face, I'm saying is like, I've listened to some of her podcasts, some of her research is really, really interesting.
	But I also don't like what the TV show says a lot.
	So I have a very mixed set of feelings about that particular person.
	I feel safe using her as an example of someone that makes me feel conflicted.
	Yeah, no, for sure.
	The person doing the talking is, in many cases, not the person doing the research.
	Those are two kind of different things.
	But yeah, journalism in general, over the last couple of decades especially, is in a fucking crisis.
	There is a massive problem.
	That they are not talking about, but they could if they wanted to, but they don't.
	Yeah.
	Like if you siphon all this wealth into the very top and yeah, I don't want to listen to like rich, famous people tell me about how to live my life either.
	Yeah, but they're not gonna get into that, though, because they have a vested interest in the, quote, independent journalists on Substack who just fucking make shit up that aligns with these people's views, you know, and then they can say, oh yeah, this person said it, so it must be true, and it's like, well... That even has another layer!
	Pisses me off in another special way that somebody making ludicrous claims on Substack that just appeals to someone's emotional feelings.
	Because this is one thing that Mike tells me all the time.
	Mike, my UFO boy, right?
	Like, is you can't, you don't get to choose what you believe.
	Like, you can work on it, you can develop skills to, you know, you can develop a rubric, but, like, something that resonates with you and that you believe and in your feelings.
	You don't get to choose, so we shouldn't be so judgmental when people cling to a belief.
	If they have no tools to replace that feeling, Who could blame them for continuing to cling to that belief?
	So, I think that coming from a compassionate state, a point of view, is way more useful and like, and... Yeah, for sure.
	I feel like we're already there, but like... Yeah, no, I agree with that completely.
	And also, I think a lot of beliefs kind of stay with people because they spend a lot of time unchecked.
	Like, I've certainly had things that I've believed, had things that I've believed that have only been checked when someone's actually, like, conflicted with them and gone, hey, that's bullshit.
	And then I kind of, I have to wrestle with that and then be like, wait, is that bullshit?
	And then a few days later, fuck, that's bullshit.
	And that sucks, but you know, it, yeah.
	Yeah, but not being wrong is a gift.
	Yeah, exactly.
	Learning the correct information is a gift.
	And it's awesome.
	It feels really good.
	Like if you get through the yucky part of being like, oh, I was wrong.
	My feelings are hurt.
	My ego is blues.
	But then if you get through that and then you get to learn, that's actually way more exciting.
	And I feel way more enthusiasm for like, oh, I was wrong.
	I want to learn the right thing.
	Um, which then does take me down rabbit holes of despair constantly, but hey, you know what?
	They're all interesting.
	Whatever.
	But that's the thing is like, I think that what's really tough is that we know that they are exchanging MS, you know, mainstream media, um, legacy, legacy media, I think is a more appropriate term, but like, yeah, I don't want to fucking hear news from someone that is rich and famous and getting paid by a Corporate oligarch.
	No, I don't like that either.
	But what drives me crazy is like, yeah, these subs, these, like, fucking substack idiots, like, that just don't have to prove anything.
	That's money that could be going to real journalism that helps people because, like, corruption, like, local corruption can thrive And just run rampant because we've lost all these local news outlets and the fact that, like, it did not even occur to me until right now that, like,
	These yokels that are just making claims to appeal to someone's fear or whatever, they're appealing emotionally and they're dressing it up like facts with no corroborating evidence and no journalistic rigor or integrity.
	And folks are paying for it to show up in their inbox when they could be paying for their local journalism to actually do work and get potholes fixed and make sure that kids have lunch at school.
	That makes me upset.
	Yeah, they could be paying for actual serious journalists.
	That makes me upset.
	I'm upset.
	Yeah.
	Yeah, that's incredibly depressing to think about.
	So we have one more clip.
	You're welcome!
	We have one more clip from Colt Art here now.
	We really do need to test this UAP subject.
	And what David Grush has done, and what Larry Maguire in Canada has done with the letter that he's written to his defense minister, is open the argument.
	Let's call David Grush's bluff.
	Let's go to the Pentagon.
	Let's go to the Defense Department.
	Let's ask Joe Biden.
	What's the truth of this?
	If it's a lie, they're all going to jail because they've lied under oath.
	If it's not a lie, it means this is the biggest story in human history.
	So I don't think anyone's going to prison for this, least of all because Grush barely made any claims that are verifiable or direct.
	All of what he said is too vague to be even considered as lying, and it's predominantly based on hearsay, which means he can say, oh, I was told this, but the person who told me was clearly wrong and slip out of it.
	But hey, I agree with calling his bluff and getting to the bottom of it.
	I just don't think that exercise is going to take particularly long if he ever comes out with specifics.
	Yup.
	That's silly.
	What a silly man.
	Yeah, just a little bit.
	I'm not a great fan of Ross Coulthard.
	That's where I've landed on him.
	I like Australians in general.
	Me too!
	Not that one.
	Though, do you know what?
	Actually, he was born in the UK, raised in New Zealand, and then he later moved to Australia.
	So, you know, he's a... I don't know.
	Maybe I'm allowed to consider him British.
	Spread the fault around, yeah.
	Spread the blame.
	Yeah, English maybe.
	I do like blaming the English for things, so there we go.
	Well, if we're looking for evidence... I think you can find evidence!
	Yes, right.
	Either way, I'm happy to consider him a knob, at the very least.
	So that was the last that we'll hear from Ross Coulthard.
	And now we get to Russell's biggest hitter on Alien stuff, the fairly infamous Jeremy Corbell.
	Jeremy, what is the Mosul Orb?
	And tell us, is this a particularly significant sighting?
	Yeah, it's really significant that it was able to be seen by the public, so let me be very abundantly clear.
	There are these orbs, these spheres.
	You said foo fighters, which all the way back to World War II, you have these metallic spheres that are traversing our restricted or war zone or combat areas.
	It's taken everything that I could muster not to make a joke about the band.
	Right, so yeah.
	So we're not gonna?
	We're not doing it?
	No, no, I'm gonna go past it.
	I'm gonna go past it.
	I could do a growl joke.
	I don't know.
	There's something.
	There's something in there.
	Throwing a real monkey wrench in the works with that choice.
	That's it, I'm done.
	That was my one.
	I want to, I'm not gonna.
	I got it, I released the beast, I'm done.
	There's something, I don't know, learn to fly, that could be seeing UFOs, there's something there.
	Anyway, so we've got a bit more Orb stuff.
	The difference being this one is apparently released exclusively by Jeremy Corbell.
	The government have not verified its authenticity, as they have in other cases, and for some reason we only have a still image that was released by Corbell.
	There is also supposedly a video, but he's not released it for whatever reason.
	I wonder why.
	Whatever reason, sure.
	So, who is Jeremy Corbell?
	Well, he's a former martial artist who, after contracting a near-fatal illness, turned to fine art.
	In 2015, he launched an investigative film series titled Extraordinary Beliefs, presented by Jeremy Kenyon Lockyer Corbell.
	Surely just the two names would have been fine, mate.
	Note, it's not called Extraordinary Facts or Extraordinary Evidence, it's Extraordinary Beliefs.
	Since then, he's worked with former journalist George Knapp in investigating all this UFO stuff.
	I say former journalist because he was once a decent, credible journalist, but all that went out the window after interviewing Bob Lazar, who we will get to very shortly.
	At present, Corbell and Knapp have a podcast together called Weaponized, where they just talk shit about aliens.
	Corbell's films have been picked up by Netflix and Hulu, and cover subjects like advanced nanotechnology, space travel, and extraterrestrial contact.
	All of them are well shot, but poorly assembled in terms of continuity and narrative, and contain interviews with spurious sources to which there is little, if any, pushback.
	What Corbell stands to gain here is, again, quite obvious.
	It's just all in his financial interest to keep going down this road.
	Right, yeah.
	We got a grifty boy.
	There's so much entertainment.
	That's the thing, too.
	There was more entertainment.
	It's slicker to me, and therefore more boring.
	I prefer a pie plate on a fishing line.
	Infinitely more to this weird, real, murky bullshit that is also fluff.
	None of it's even compelling.
	No, not really.
	Not really.
	Can we also, real quick, just address his backdrop here?
	It's weird.
	Yeah, it's weird.
	For listeners, behind him there's this kind of general pink hue going on behind him, and then there's a countertop with a typewriter on it.
	And above that is a kind of, I don't know, it's a clock with like a sun motif.
	Yeah, it's a vintage Starburst clock.
	It's like a mid-century modern Starburst clock.
	Right.
	Okay.
	And then also behind him is an enormous safe!
	An enormous safe!
	It's huge!
	An American security, human-sized safe.
	It's exactly what I was thinking!
	The first thing I thought of, I'm like, oh, a person.
	Could fit in there.
	Person-sized!
	This is the segment where Jeremy Korbel keeps his humans.
	That's the thing, it's like, well, I can't say that because it's such a loaded accusation to have a human-sized safe right behind you on video, but you came to the same conclusion!
	It's a bizarre thing.
	I don't understand why you would need a safe that big.
	Maybe it's a gun safe?
	Is it like a specific gun safe for big guns or something?
	I don't know.
	The thing is, I was like safes, like I'm used to, so my, you know, my mom's jeweler, like
	I'm used to big safes.
	Yeah, yeah.
	There's a reason.
	People have reasons, but it's a weird... Out of business?
	Fair enough!
	If you've got... At a jeweler, there's a very good reason for that.
	At a bank, very good reason for a big safe.
	This guy's house... Prolific drug dealing, excellent reason to have a safe in your house.
	100%.
	It's a lot to have in the background.
	Of a shot.
	Like, yeah.
	That's a why.
	It sets a weird tone.
	It does!
	I will say that.
	It really does.
	So, he develops his orb theory a little bit further in this next clip.
	And what happens is, through all of these decades, none of them ever have come out from military film until now.
	I was able to obtain this image, which by the way, Was from a classified briefing about UFOs, or what they call UAP, Unidentified Anomalous Phenomena.
	That's the true definition now.
	And I was able to obtain it and release it.
	And this image is the first time the world is ever seeing one of these UAP from a conflict zone.
	Yeah, so Korbel provides no evidence to substantiate what he's saying, and were he releasing classified information, I am quite sure the DoD would have something to say about it.
	So he's just talking himself up here.
	Supposedly he got this from a guy called Jay Stratton, who appeared on Korbel's podcast.
	Yeah.
	All of these, like, we're getting into familiar name territory.
	Yeah, I've only just really noticed this, but they flipped the layout around, and for listeners, Brand and Korbel are on the wrong side when they're showing an image.
	They're normally on the left, and now they're on the right, and it's really fucking with me.
	I don't know.
	I just, I don't like it.
	Don't like it.
	Well, but also, like, to say that's the first image ever, no.
	That's a claim that's just, nah.
	And like, why even make that the lie?
	Like, why is that part of your lie?
	I don't know.
	That's weird.
	That's another weird choice.
	This still image here is all that we have.
	It's all that he's talking about.
	That is it.
	What we're looking at right now in front of us, which is, you know, could be a fucking reflection in a puddle of water.
	Who knows?
	It looks like someone's dropping a ball bearing in front of a camera to me.
	It does, doesn't it?
	I would be intrigued to see this video that he's on about, but we never do.
	But we can't!
	Okay, so... Yeah, we can't.
	We're not allowed.
	So where he's going with this narrative is actually pretty amusing to me.
	Now why is this important?
	People were laughing when I said it about a year ago until they start understanding that it's true, which is that we sometimes shoot at these unknowns.
	We shoot at them, but not just us.
	We also know that Russia and Syria fire upon the same units, the same objects, which means it's not theirs.
	So whose is it?
	Now this image, the Mosul Orb, is from Northern Iraq.
	Luckily, I was able to obtain it and release it.
	But here's the deal.
	It is from within a classified briefing.
	What was that classified briefing?
	That classified briefing, which was authored by a man named Jay Stratton, who ran the UFO programs for the United States for a while.
	He put it in there to educate pilots and aviators and our warfighters.
	Hey, this is what we're seeing.
	This is one of those UFOs.
	You should and can report it.
	We're not going to call you cuckoo.
	We get it.
	We see it on radar.
	We want to know more about it because if we shoot at these, if we shoot at these in conflict zones and we don't know whose they are, we could misidentify and have a fight between two countries because we're shooting at UFOs.
	Okay, yeah, there's nothing to back up what he was saying at the end there.
	So it's true that the US military will shoot down UFOs, not just in conflict zones, but in the US as well.
	There are pretty much dozens of cases of this every year.
	Um, in looking into a report from ABC7 Chicago about this, uh, one of the comments on it was, uh, quote, as a former UFO balloon maker, I want to congratulate these guys on not only receiving international press coverage, but actually being shot down.
	I'm envious, unquote.
	Chicago!
	Chicago.
	In case it hadn't occurred to anyone yet, any random fucker can make a balloon, drone, or remote control flying machine and send it up into the skies.
	All it takes is quite basic equipment and honestly a fairly limited knowledge of aviation engineering.
	And probably just a fucking YouTube video these days.
	So who are these various UAPs, Jeremy?
	Probably some random dude dicking about in his garage.
	That's who it probably belongs to.
	And no doubt, they paint them with metallic paint to make them look fucking weird.
	Yeah, no shit.
	Because that's what I would do.
	If you wanted to fuck with as many people as possible and make it seem believable, that's what you'd do.
	And that's what these people do.
	Fucking rules!
	That's awesome!
	Yeah, I take way less issue with the people just dicking about and flying things up there than I do people like this.
	Well, but that's like, there is something to, like, there's a whole other element that's, like, really fun and interesting to, like, the crop circles, guys.
	Yeah, it's hilarious!
	The thing is, it's like, crop circles?
	I don't need UFOs to make them for them to be incredible!
	Like it is a feat of human engineering it's so cool to see it's like maybe gonna make a farmer mad compensate them in some way if you're gonna do it I don't know have an agreement you know have some permission but like they're so cool on their own let's let's focus on how creative and neat and rad the humans made of a thing like that's that's what I'm saying is like there's so much entertainment about like there's it's so compelling Do you know what I want to see?
	I want to see, like, an aerial version of Robot Wars.
	Just UFO wars.
	Like, fucking, you know... People and their kids have to... Drone wars!
	It'd be drones, right?
	People and their kids have to make, like, the, you know, the... but actually make them themselves and then get them to fly up there and, you know... Oh my god, that'd be amazing.
	But there's a million reasons why we don't do that, because it would go horribly wrong!
	It would go horribly wrong.
	Robot Wars went horribly wrong plenty of times.
	Absolutely true.
	Well, but I mean, that's the thing is like what I'm seeing is, you know, we we go when we see, you know, we try to bop around the area and vacation when we can and take weekends here and there.
	And so, you know, you see silly tourist trap events, which I love.
	And there are, like, I started seeing, like, robotics clubs.
	That's when Robot Wars got big.
	Right.
	It's like, there's these kids that are making, you know, these are like 12, 13, 14 year olds, and they have these robotics clubs, and they're making, and like, the stuff that I saw on a float, you know, like, 10 years ago, like, going a little, you know, homecoming parade in a small town, versus like, 10 years ago versus now, those kids are building awesome shit.
	That, like, is crazy!
	It's so cool!
	And, like, that's also, if we think about, you know, there's the Flat Earther guy that, like...
	You know, blew himself up in a rocket, and that's sad, and it's a bummer that that person did that with their, like, workshop.
	You know, like, they made something at home that was dangerous.
	There might be people that are building much more sophisticated stuff in their garage that the government might want to keep an eye on.
	That, to me, is where all this like, oh, well, they've agreed to look at this and they have agreements that we're going to talk to Canada about it.
	Like, there are so many totally valid terrestrial reasons to keep an eye on crazy shit that people are sending into the sky.
	Yeah, if they shoot something down and then go and look at it, you know, they're not looking into like, is this from aliens?
	They're looking, okay, who the fuck made this thing?
	Why?
	What?
	Is this a problem?
	Does it have fucking explosives in it or whatever, you know?
	Exactly!
	What's the deal?
	Is it a toy or is it dangerous?
	We need to know that!
	Is it someone dicking around?
	Can we figure out where it came from so we can tell them to stop that?
	Because it's a problem!
	Yeah, you know, it's, yeah.
	There's so many real things that they're ignoring!
	So many real things, as always, that they could be discussing, but no, let's stick in the realm of fantasy.
	So, out of interest, how often do you think that this happens, right, the pilots seeing orbs all around the place, how often do you suppose that that occurs?
	Oh, fairly frequently.
	Well, let's get into Jeremy's answer.
	This happens on a daily basis.
	Our pilots are seeing these orbs.
	Now they're also pyramid in shape.
	They're also cubes with spherical auras, which is reported by pilots.
	So what you're seeing is an image they don't want you to see.
	It's from a video.
	They don't want you to see it.
	So the Pentagon is sitting there right now like, hmm, what do I do?
	Jeremy just released an image.
	We know it is from a classified briefing.
	It is of a UFO and we've designated UFO and it's in a classified briefing.
	What do we do?
	Do we, are we honest to the public?
	That's what they're thinking.
	I just love his narrative that, ah, he stumped the Pentagon because he's that fucking dangerous to them.
	Yeah, the whole Pentagon's worried about me.
	Exactly.
	That's a lot.
	All these fucking morons, they just love to inflate their own status.
	Oh shit.
	Anyway, daily orbs.
	Over yourself, dude.
	Daily orbs.
	I was thinking fairly frequent, twice a year.
	That's where I was coming from.
	Every day.
	Every day.
	There's an Orba day, Lauren.
	Orba day, at least.
	Orba day.
	And yet we only have evidence of like three.
	You know, it's ridiculous.
	Well, but quotes are on that evidence, dude.
	Yeah, right.
	Footage.
	Footage of- It's 2023.
	If there was an orb zipping around, there would be like multiple camera angles, fucking, you know, 500 people would have been like, what the shit is that?
	Kids aren't doing anything else but putting shit on TikTok.
	Do you really?
	And like, there's always a kid dicking around when something happens to catch on.
	video. Like it comes in. It takes a couple of days. Yeah.
	It's like the news goes viral.
	It takes a couple of days and there's like 15 different angles of anything that happened,
	like major event in a city. Like it's, I cannot buy this because like, it's not there.
	That's the thing.
	I think that, um, you know, when back before technology became so sophisticated and ubiquitous, there was a whole lot of wiggle room to get creative.
	Billy Meyer being an example.
	Like, so when, And that's like where that's to me is like the more compelling time period because there's more you can inject more creativity into your little story and then and and there's more word of mouth less like and and if you can't you know like basically you know the internet is forever so we can look stuff up and and fact check much more easily than just like folks
	Discussing a weird thing in a town and kind of potentially working this up into a froth which like um that it just that is kind of was we just uh watched Close Encounters of the Third Kind like all right yeah it just seemed more fun yes I mean, it was like a bunch of Space Hot Rods, obviously way more fun, but like it impressed upon me the difference versus today.
	This just is like way less, like this whole disclosure nonsense, it's irritating and it's just so much less fun.
	And this dude claiming that the whole ass Pentagon Oh no!
	He's just released an image!
	Oh no, he's just released an image!
	What do we do?
	An image.
	Oh, he just tweeted, "We have to do something."
	Oh please, I'd be more than happy to have a safe behind you.
	Yeah, that would be more my concern.
	Oh, God.
	So next is another prime example of why all this UFO stuff is a problem.
	So right now, Susan Goh, who's a woman who's the spokesperson at the Pentagon, is trying to figure out what to say.
	And right now she says, I have nothing for you.
	I mean, she says that to mainstream media.
	She says that to independent journalists.
	Well, they do got something for you.
	They got a four second video that they can release to the American global public.
	So I'm pushing, I'm pushing, trying to put gasoline back onto this fire and make sure that they try to put out in the right way to the American and global public what this is.
	This is a UFO, man, straight up.
	They've made sure it's not a balloon.
	They made sure it's not a satellite.
	If you ever see the video, which I hope you do, it moves from the right side of your screen to the left.
	It is under intelligent control and it is not ours, it is not China's, it is not Russia's.
	This is not a balloon.
	This is an intelligent controlled machine that is advanced and we don't know who it's from.
	So we just have to take his word for literally all of what he just said.
	I'm getting tired of saying it but there is no evidence I would also love for this video to come forward so he can supposedly back up these claims, but I know that even if there is a video and it looks similar to all the other old videos out there, he's still not going to be able to back up what he said about them.
	Even if it does look the way they did.
	The fucking wall is like, there's all this like, we don't know what this technology is, it defies physics, this thing, we have no idea how it can go 300 miles and blah blah blah.
	But no one is saying, and I mean this like as in I'm not hearing it, people could be saying it, but in the reporting that I am inundated with, not intentionally, against my will, Mm-hmm.
	This shit looks like a laser pointer that you play with with your cat.
	Don't tell me.
	Truly.
	I've traveled a lot.
	I've been out in the boonies in a number of scenarios where your brain and your eyeballs get tricky.
	And so I've seen reflection.
	And this is just how my personal experience informs what I'm bringing to the table.
	Even for the sake of being, you know, transparent, it's like, I have seen stuff that is weird, and I was also, like, not just a peewee kid, I was a Mr. Wizard kid, obviously, nerd alert, and, like, I get curious about how surfaces reflect, and, like, the mirage effect, and, like, I've learned a lot about what your eyeballs can do, and, like, yeah, physics doesn't explain Most of these phenomena, but a laser pointer does.
	It looks like a light!
	It looks like light!
	It doesn't look like anything else!
	It could be so many things.
	And like, I do find it interesting that all of the footage of these orbs is always from the same kind of camera.
	It's always from the same kind of, you know, military thing.
	And so you wonder whether there's a particular quirk of that type of camera that makes it do a certain thing under certain conditions or whatever.
	I'm a hundred percent sure there is a very rational explanation for this thing.
	Most things.
	Most of this stuff.
	There's an artist that like is really... Mike turned me on to it and actually I'll ask him.
	It's this gal who did like a cross-country road trip like photography series and she would stick stuff to her windshield.
	It's not Laura Dodsworth is it?
	No.
	Even though this dude, this Jeremy dude, is the second idiot from my team that has already shown up.
	That doesn't make me feel good, you know, the art nerd world.
	I don't like that.
	I don't like that representing me.
	I have an issue with that.
	But so there's this gal that did the photography series and it was like kind of a, you know, cheap shitty camera or whatever.
	But like the style was really cool and it was really creative and a fun series where she would stick Stuff like gummy bears to her, the inside of her windshield when she, and driving.
	And she would compose these images that looked really surreal and crazy.
	It looked like they were floating in, you know, in, in the sky.
	And it's a, it's an eye, it's a trick of the eye that made for really, really cool images.
	And the equipment was profoundly basic.
	Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
	It's remarkable what you can achieve, you know.
	This is it.
	And the thing is, as much as I'd love to believe that all these orbs are aliens or whatever else, the reality is that life is incredibly mundane.
	Life is not that interesting.
	I hate to say it, but I have never been presented with anything more than life being dull.
	And I think that's what this is gonna be here.
	That feeds directly into my argument that art makes life fun.
	Yeah, oh no, it's down to us.
	It's down to us to find the beauty in all of this.
	Not just make shit up.
	And it doesn't have to be something that is real that is proven by the government.
	Why is this even part of it?
	Because, again, you're taking resources away from earnest, important reporting.
	I can't help but think about these people, you know, disinformation agents will Insist on the validity of only certain whistleblowers when, like, if we as a culture were more informed and more aware of what actually happens to reporters that try to, you know, like there's, I mean,
	Again, my PBS, like, YouTube history is full of, like, actual journalists, like, in the Philippines, you know, like, or even here, whatever.
	Like, we're trying to report on money laundering.
	You look at some of the totalitarian countries.
	Fucking hell.
	Or you look at, again, it's forensic accounting, which I am shocked that I'm, I love it.
	I'm so fascinated by it.
	But, like, Proving that international banks like HSBC and Wells Fargo are laundering money for drug cartels and they're in cahoots with governments.
	You can learn about that stuff.
	Maybe it's not as sexy and maybe there's no aliens or Fox Mulder or whatever, but I promise if you just look into it a little bit, it's actually really interesting.
	And exciting to learn about!
	And it's actually real.
	It's actually real.
	It's actually happening.
	We can actually deal with it.
	We can actually deal with it.
	Like these people can exploit the rest of us so effectively because we are Because it takes a lot more work to learn about and find out what happens with actual reporting and with whistleblowers that are like actual whistleblowers, not just like telling us a dream they had.
	And this is very much, very much kind of playing into that sort of fantasy.
	And it's very much who Jeremy Corbell wants to be.
	He wants to present himself as someone who is like a whistleblower and all this stuff.
	You know, and and a credible journalist on all this stuff, you know, he he regularly kind of you've seen it with with this image.
	He's like, oh, thankfully, I I found this image and I I released it.
	I was able to do this.
	Oh, shut up, man.
	White man.
	Shut up.
	Confident.
	Why is just incredible to me.
	It's it's if only if I if I had that kind of confidence.
	Boy, howdy.
	In the next clip, Russell points out that this is all speculative, but then falls flat on his face.
	If we've been in regular, continual contact with UFOs, all of this is of course speculative.
	How could it be otherwise?
	But the possibility that...
	Human evolution has been impacted, influenced, even directed.
	Some of those theories that we're living in a simulation start to have a different kind of grounding.
	For fuck's sake.
	So we're all living in a simulation now, Russell?
	I find this endless acceptance of literally any conspiracy theory incredibly exhausting, and this one does take the cake.
	Also, human evolution being directed?
	I'm sorry?
	What?
	Engineers!
	It's the engineers theory.
	Haven't you seen Prometheus?
	That was a documentary about real life.
	Yes, yes.
	Oh my god.
	So anyway, note that when Russell said this was all speculation, Jeremy was nodding along.
	When I first saw that, I thought, ah, at least he knows he's full of shit.
	And then I saw what came next.
	Right, so I don't need to believe, I don't have the luxury of disbelief about this.
	You know, it is my job to speak with people in different levels of government and the military and pilots and, you know, look man, I don't have the luxury of disbelief.
	I know for certain, and it has been proved to me beyond a shadow of a doubt, that we have full intact craft and machines that we have been trying to reverse engineer.
	And I'll just say it, ma'am.
	These machines, they're not from here.
	Whoever built these appear to be a non-human intelligence.
	You don't have the luxury of disbelief about full, intact, extraterrestrial crafts, and this has been proven to you without a shadow of a doubt?
	When, as with all of these claims, you're simply taking the word of some guy who says it so?
	Like, Korbel never has and never will claim that he's seen these things himself, or seen the documents that would prove any of it, and so again, apparently just taking someone's word is sufficient to accept something as truth!
	Like that's all he's got.
	He's got nothing.
	He's got nothing.
	Show me.
	Show me.
	And he's standing there.
	I don't have the luxury of disbelief.
	Fuck off.
	This isn't luxury.
	What I'm doing right now is not luxury.
	It's me having to fucking debunk your bullshit.
	This is not a luxurious feeling.
	The luxury is believing.
	That's the luxury.
	The luxury is not having to examine any of this critically.
	That is luxurious.
	Absolutely.
	What's crazy, what's crazy to me is, last podcast on the left, which is a true crime comedy podcast.
	It's huge.
	They're great at it, and I love it.
	They're awesome.
	But they never claim to be journalists.
	They never claim to be researchers.
	They have learned skills over time that has developed their ability to do that, but they're not making claims.
	It's journalistic, but they're not- Right.
	It's a book report.
	It's a real nice, fancy, fun book report to listen to, and they're a live show.
	Whenever they came to Chicago, they wrapped up, because, like, Henry's the, you know, the Mufon, like, big into the, like, he wants, it's adorable, he, and my part, want to see a UFO, and then don't.
	And it's almost like they want it so bad it will never happen, which, like, implies some kind of, yeah, anyway.
	And so they, Used a portion of their live show to examine the most compelling actual evidence, way more than any of these people are even attempting to show to Russell or anyone.
	They show actual, like, there's like, this is the actual footage.
	That we can disprove the least.
	There was like some kind of like there was a video that was like it it looked like and it wasn't one of those like oh my god what is this object and I think it's a laser pointer.
	I watched and I was like that it was something I think it was over Mexico City I believe and it was like I don't think that's that's weird.
	It looked weird.
	Yeah.
	And that's the that's the largest claim they will make Because Marcus is the skeptic.
	We can't actively disprove.
	That's as far as you can go.
	And as a willing skeptic, took part of their live show to entertain the best footage that we have, that people are making claims based on, and still it was like, I don't know what this is, but it is weird.
	And that's like the thing that's like, well, it's weird.
	This is not immediately debunkable.
	That's as far as you can go.
	And, you know, I'm open to any of that shit by all means.
	Bring it on.
	I will keep an open mind to any of this as long as I'm presented with some kind of evidence that isn't just, oh, this guy said that this thing happened.
	Come on.
	Next, in fact, Jeremy brings up his credible witnesses.
	So I know for certain that there have been limited comms or communications with whoever these builders, we'll just call them occupants, or builders of these craft are.
	Now are we being told the truth when we've had these comms with these builders or occupants, right?
	And that I have no idea how could I possibly know, but I do know that we have reverse engineering exploitation programs for non terrestrial technology and I have brought forward witnesses.
	I brought forward witnesses publicly as well as privately.
	I brought witnesses forward, so within government people know who they are, and I'll be bringing a lot more people forward that have actually worked on these technologies.
	Verified, bonafide, no mystery, they've been part of these reverse engineering SAP's special access programs.
	I look forward to seeing more of your witnesses, Korbel, but I hope they bring at least, I don't know, a selfie of them with the craft with them, you know, a fragment of alien material, something, anything.
	I'd even accept whatever the alien version of furry dice hanging off the rearview mirror is.
	Just give me a scrap of evidence that isn't just some guy saying, Oh yeah, I saw all this stuff and worked on all this stuff, honest.
	I did, I did, really.
	Because that's all you've brought to the table so far, and as always, it is not fucking sufficient!
	No!
	It's also boring!
	It's a fucking slog to get through.
	Which didn't used to be like that!
	Straight up!
	No!
	At least back in the day UFO conspiracy theorists would have something interesting to say, whereas this is just the most interesting thing is that the government supposedly want to cover it up and even then that's complete bollocks.
	Right.
	Like, show me the woman who's at the UFO convention.
	This is on an episode of Penn & Teller Bullshit and it has burned in my brain.
	It's one of my favorite things I've ever seen.
	It was a woman who had drawn an image of her alien husband and held it up to the camera in all earnestness and said, this is my alien husband.
	His name is Tlap.
	Oh, I just...
	She's an angel that lives in my heart forever.
	Oh my god.
	And it's like, you know, like a pencil, like a high school kid pencil drawing.
	And not a bad one!
	I admire that lady for going on that show.
	That's, you know what, I respect the amount of ridicule you're willing to go through.
	Well, it was the first episode, so, like, stakes were low.
	It's so funny and fun.
	It's still Penn and Teller, though, you know, it's gonna be watched.
	But even, like, that show, which honestly kind of taught me a lot about skepticism and, you know, listen, we had two resources back then and I found it, it was cool, like, I'm sure I'll mention it again.
	Penn and Teller are great, yeah, yeah.
	Well, I mean, like, there's plenty of questionable shit, but, like, what they told me at the end of every single episode was, this is just our opinion, We are showing different aspects of our subject.
	You, and obviously this has been subverted, you know, in a do your own research, but like, they're not saying anything definitive.
	We all have a stake and we all have a say.
	And they weren't making fun, I mean like there were some ridiculous people at that UFO convention.
	And that we're, you know, making a little bit of fun and it's silly, but, like, it wasn't being spirited and, like, you know what I mean?
	And that's something that's very different than we have in our current social climate.
	Like, it was, it's just a different attitude and it taught me enjoyment in that way and, like, you're not laughing at, you're laughing with, and if you catch yourself laughing at, take a fucking step back and chill out.
	Like, none of us are perfect and we're all nerdy and weird in our own ways, so, like, The gal that- oh my god, the gal that won the UFO crash plate was so good.
	It was- anyway, it's wonderful.
	I highly- I mean, like, we're gonna go- we're planning a trip to go to Roswell.
	Like, we're gonna get to do it.
	We've been talking about it for years.
	And, you know, we're gonna go from Lubbock, I think, in- oh my god, October?
	um from Lubbock to Roswell and like I'm so excited I can barely contain myself like I'm so thrilled that you know am I gonna go get to see this thing and and like we get to be excited yeah without any of this weird boring bullshit and like yep This is such a snooze!
	Like, I found a hotel that had, like, a little, you know, put a put an alien, like, statue in the front of your, like, Holiday Inn, and I am on board so much more than this joker.
	I'm 100% staying in that one.
	Right?
	Yeah, yeah, yeah.
	Also, any tips?
	Anybody that knows that have been to Roswell, Tips?
	I'll do a little update at the end.
	Let us know.
	You give me the forewarned one.
	I am into it.
	Right.
	In this next clip, Corbell follows the same line as Russell did earlier and pisses me off yet again.
	You know, we're living in a data-rich environment, but we're, like, data-poor in the way that we see it, we look at it.
	The scientific community, even our friend Neil deGrasse Tyson, has made statements where we realize, oh man, they really gotta catch up.
	They're not exposed to the data.
	I see Congress and Senate not having as good briefings as George Knapp and I do as journalists, and that's concerning.
	You're a fucking journalist, are you Corbell?
	Are you?
	Like, not only do you lack the credentials or capacity to critically analyse the information being said to you, but your journalism mentor is George Knapp, who has been saying crazy shit for decades at this point.
	Journalist in fucking deed.
	And then you say that you and George have better, more accurate briefings than Neil deGrasse Tyson, Congress and the Senate.
	Like maybe by not as good, he means not as entertaining, which I'll agree with.
	But again, it's because the ones deGrasse Tyson, Congress and the Senate are dealing with are largely based on provable reality, not unprovable bullshit.
	Yeah.
	Yep, yep, yep.
	Journalist.
	Fucking hell.
	Anyone can call themselves that now.
	Anyone can call themselves that.
	The thing is, there's a legal implication.
	There is.
	I don't know if he knows that.
	I don't know if he knows that.
	Well, they'd start to find out if he started suffering legal consequences in the same way that actual journalists do.
	I'd love the holy shit out of that.
	If he fucks around enough, he's going to find out, right?
	And same with Russell.
	If Russell keeps calling himself a journalist, at some point he's going to say something that's going to do the wrong fucking thing.
	And that, in a court of law, is going to work very much against them.
	You know what?
	We're never going to call ourselves... I mean, listen, if we go back to school and get a degree, that's one thing.
	Yeah, if I go and study journalism...
	No.
	Not without a fucking... No!
	No!
	Not without sufficient background and training and education.
	No!
	I'm not a journalist.
	What we do is journalistic in its nature, but that doesn't make me a fucking journalist, right?
	No!
	It's reporting!
	It is researching!
	But, like, we're not gonna call ourselves that, like, because that's not true!
	And the thing is, it's like, what I think is really cool about podcasts and the way that things have shaped up, you know, as far as, like, access to information, it is super cool.
	I mean, obviously, I didn't think that we'd have to be part of the quote-unquote news.
	I'm a little resentful.
	Yeah, I didn't think we'd have to do this.
	This was not my first choice.
	This is not what I saw, right, for my life, right?
	The fact that, like, it's easy to disprove and to debunk a lot of this stuff because we do have so much access to information, and we're making it accessible, but I'm not gonna get big for my britches!
	Still not a journalist.
	Like, no fucking credible newspaper or whatever would hire me, and certainly would not hire Jeremy Corbell.
	Jesus.
	Right, so... Words mean things to people who use them for a living.
	Unlike Tucker Carlson.
	Anyway, in this next clip, we finally address Bob Lazar.
	Bob Lazar is probably the most central significant person when it comes to the public knowing about our government, our military, reverse engineering, alien spaceship from other worlds.
	That's Bob Lazar.
	That's what he did.
	And George Knapp brought him forward.
	Bob Lazar was a pimp.
	I will say, he wasn't a pimp at the time of making his UFO claims, only after, and we as a podcast do not stand for throwing shade at sex workers, but I've gotta say, I've never heard of a physicist who's qualified enough to work on extraterrestrial crafts who later on becomes a pimp.
	Yeah, moving to pimp!
	Quite a move indeed.
	I would say that's not a lateral move, that's pretty much a downward spiral.
	I mean, it's a choice!
	One would think if he were that good at his work to be able to work on extraterrestrial crafts, some lab somewhere would take him, right?
	Surely!
	His claims specifically relate to his work at the Los Alamos Mason Physics Facility, In an interview with George Knapp in May 1989, with face blacked out and under the pseudonym Dennis, he claimed the physics facility site consisted of concealed aircraft hangars built into a mountainside.
	Lazar said that his job was to help with the reverse engineering of one of nine flying saucers which he alleged were extraterrestrial in origin.
	He claims one of the flying saucers, the one he coined the Sport Model, was manufactured out of a metallic substance similar in appearance and touch to liquid titanium.
	Lazar has claimed that during his joining the program, he read briefing documents describing the historical involvement of Earth for the past 10,000 years with extraterrestrial beings described as grey aliens from a planet orbiting the twin binary star system Zeta Reticuli.
	Here's the problem.
	Lazar claims to have obtained master's degrees in physics from MIT and in electronics from Caltech.
	However, both universities show no record of him.
	Lazar is unable to supply the names of any lecturers or fellow students from his alleged 10 years at MIT and Caltech.
	One supposed Caltech professor named by Lazar, William Duxler, ...was in fact located at Pierce Junior College and had never taught at Caltech.
	Scientist Stanton T. Friedman asserted, quote, quite obviously, if one can go to MIT, one doesn't go to Pierce.
	Lazar was at Pierce at the very same time he was supposedly at MIT, more than two and a half thousand miles away.
	Yeah.
	Unquote.
	Man, that used to be easier to claim before the internet.
	You could just say some shit.
	This was debunked like around, this was debunked in the 90s.
	So as for his work at Los Alamos Mason physics facility, inquiry into Lazar's position at the facility revealed his role to have been as a technician for a contracting firm and that he worked neither as a physicist or for Los Alamos.
	As such, the laboratory has no records on Lazar, and all claims of him being a physicist are self-ascribed.
	There's plenty more information to discredit the guy, but I think that'll do for now.
	Jeremy Corbell and George Knapp have since made a documentary on this guy, which I have watched, and good lord, it is just the worst exercise in providing cover for this moron you could imagine.
	It opens.
	Have you seen it?
	I can't sit through something that insults my intelligence to a degree that I'm like, if this movie keeps telling me to go fuck myself, I'm out.
	I don't have that much patience for it.
	Mike does, I don't.
	Pretty much, because that's what it does in the opening, because it opens with Jeremy's phone blowing up with texts from Lazar saying about how he's being raided by the FBI, which did happen.
	But Lazar claims they raided him to take back some materials he stole from the lab all those years ago.
	In reality, this happened due to a murder investigation involving the chemical thallium, and his company, United Nuclear, was raided due to having previously sold illegal chemicals, which is something he pled guilty to at the time.
	That's why he was raided!
	Oh, they've raided me to take back this thing I stole from the lab 30 years ago.
	Shut up.
	That's also Judy Miscovitz shit.
	One of the Plandemic, like, quote-unquote whistleblowers.
	That's the thing!
	There are trends that we can identify.
	Yeah, we can plot this.
	So in the documentary, instead of it being, you know, oh, he did this thing he shouldn't have done, it's presented as, oh, look how dangerous Bob Lazar is.
	The feds are after him.
	Corbell believes everything Lazar has said, even though Bob Lazar is completely and utterly, demonstrably full of shit.
	What is impressive is his, like, is his Skill at being like an old timey snake oil salesman.
	I just gotta give it up.
	You know what I mean?
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	No, he's he's charismatic, right?
	Like there is something kind of fun.
	Again, if there's like not the results, like the resulting problems.
	And the wrenches being thrown in the works make it less fun.
	Be charismatic about something based in reality, Jeremy.
	Come on, pick something.
	Don't then devalue actual military.
	There's so much stuff that we would not know about that happened in the Iraq War if there were not actual missile blowers.
	There's actual fucked up shit happening.
	There's actual fucked up shit.
	Yeah, yeah.
	Don't just then be like, oh, Bob Lazar, the whistleblower.
	Fuck off!
	Next we have a familiar narrative being spun.
	Everything you're seeing from the mass media is absolute theatre, other than when I do an interview with knowledge on like CNN or something, because I fight for that.
	I make sure the truth is being brought out.
	Ah, so the media is all bad, unless of course I'm on there, or it's my show.
	That's different because it's me.
	Give me money.
	And of course, yeah, the alien lot are in on this grift, because of course they are.
	Of course they are.
	But yeah, that was the thing that Russell Brand says all the fucking time, you know?
	Don't trust the mainstream media.
	Trust me.
	Trust my show.
	Subscribe to my locals channel.
	Don't sue me.
	I'm not actually a journalist, even though I say so.
	I'm an entertainer.
	I was joking.
	Honest, honest.
	I was joking, Gavna.
	I was joking, Gavna.
	So we have one final clip from Jeremy Corbell here.
	So, Bob Lazar gave us the basics, and then from there now, you're seeing this kind of sleight of hand thing going on the surface level.
	Are we now?
	But underneath the surface, there are people very interested to hear from people like Bob Lazar, who know the names of the programs, who have hands-on experience, and who actually worked on these things unsuccessfully, because we don't have the material science, but that is also happening in tandem right now, is good people, Patriotic people are trying to find out what's up with UFOs.
	They want to hear from pimps everywhere.
	But based on everything we know about Bob Lazar, information that is easily Google-able, including him, you know, being a pimp, why in the fuck should we believe a single word that Jeremy Corbell says?
	Bob Lazar is a lying moron who made a bunch of shit up, and Korbel presents him as the second coming, the whistleblower of all whistleblowers who worked on Alien Craft, despite having literally no evidence whatsoever.
	Jeremy Korbel has all the integrity of a marzipan dildo, and he is about as useful.
	Kind of looks like one too.
	I just.
	Used.
	I don't know.
	Yep.
	I don't have, like, yeah, yeah.
	It's hard, you know, like, you get to, we get to a point where they are, like, the ridiculousness levels, like, what do I even say?
	Yeah, well, what can I say to that?
	What can I say to that?
	Um, I'm gonna go with a blanket no.
	Like, it just... You're... Come on, man!
	Come on, man!
	Don't piss on my leg and fucking tell me it's raining!
	Like, if you're gonna tell me a story, entertain me with a story.
	Yeah, that's fine.
	I love stories.
	Right?
	Don't just... I don't know.
	Now I'm back to mad.
	Okay.
	Yeah.
	Well, fortunately, I've rescued some of our...
	I wish I wasn't saying that.
	I have our fox molder.
	I have some of our fun, like, our toys.
	Lauren is holding up figurines, yeah, for anyone listening.
	Our house is full of little sci-fi toys.
	And also, Mike is either going to be happy or sad, and I don't really care which one it is.
	We don't have just one.
	Video can see audio to VHS copies of the alien autopsy that they put on fucking Fox or something.
	Incredible.
	Well, you need a backup, you know, you need a backup.
	Of course, because the government will come for it, because it's an alien autopsy.
	The government will come for it, and you can wear VHS tapes out, so there we go, you need the backup.
	Exactly, exactly.
	I have no doubt this is on a constant loop somewhere in your house.
	You know what's magical?
	It's not, because our TV-VCR combo broke.
	Ah, that sucks.
	That's what's really upsetting.
	That's the real tragedy here.
	Yeah, they're putting these kernels of truth, and that's the power of a conspiracy theorist, is nailing a kernel of truth, but then spinning the yarn around it for their own benefit, which, boo, sucks.
	Yeah, and in this case, in most of these instances, there isn't even a kernel of truth.
	They're just saying stuff.
	There isn't a true thing for them to fall back on.
	It's just, this person told me this thing.
	Very vague.
	Okay, we know the government lies.
	The government can be dishonest and can have ulterior motives.
	Government is made up of people.
	People lie.
	Exactly.
	House was correct.
	People lie.
	That is a universal truth.
	Right.
	That's all they need to build a whole other story.
	Or like, oh, you saw something weird in this guy once.
	Are you a liar?
	You know, like, that's kind of like... It's just too easy to exploit.
	It's a fucking bummer, man.
	It's a fucking bummer.
	Yeah, these people are... Again, it's lighter because there's less at stake.
	Oh yeah, totally.
	But it's still definitely not fun.
	Having to look at all these people grifting and making money and saying, these things are definitely true when they don't have a fucking clue.
	Yeah.
	And they have real harm.
	And they can do real harm.
	They cause real harm.
	They can send people down rabbit holes of tinfoil hats and God knows what else, and a lot of people never come back from that.
	Right.
	Yeah.
	It's dangerous bullshit.
	Yet again.
	Less dangerous, and somewhat fun.
	Some of the ideas are fun.
	None of the ideas we've dealt with today are fun, but some of the classic 50s, 60s ideas, those can be fun!
	But yeah, I'm just, I'm just, I'm incredibly underwhelmed by all of this.
	You know, I was very disappointed with David Grush, especially.
	I thought, you know, fairly serious seeming individual, you know, I watched the whole fucking thing, you know, you're there testifying in front of a house, etc.
	I thought, come on, you've got to say, Something verifiable.
	You've got to come out with something new.
	Something.
	Anything.
	No.
	Just, I've heard this.
	I've heard this.
	Oh, I'll say this in a skiff.
	I'll elaborate this where no one can hear me.
	Why?
	If you want to blow the whistle, do it publicly.
	That's kind of the point, right?
	That is kind of the deal.
	This is the time.
	When you're sitting in front of this microphone is the time to say all the shit.
	Or, you don't actually have shit to say.
	This isn't whistleblowing, it's just talking shit.
	There's no stakes for you, buddy.
	There's no stakes.
	If there were stakes for you, if you were actually saying something verifiable and true, then that would be a different story.
	Something that could actually land you in prison or whatever.
	I don't know, I don't know, I'm just- Lying to Congress, landing you in prison.
	There's no fucking way.
	It's too fucking vague.
	Too vague.
	It's just, I'm upset.
	I'm upset.
	Yeah, well, but even like the, you know, there's an argument.
	I mean, because here's the thing.
	I'm usually the one that like brings up like, "Um, excuse me, this sounds weird."
	And then I get like shot down.
	But, like, there are some quote-unquote, like, sightings reports, and those are visual, and then I see the video, and I'm like, nah, I don't fucking think that's real.
	Like, that does not convince me, versus, like, there's radar anomalies, and those are a lot easier to convince me of, because I don't know a lot about radar.
	And maybe if you did, it would be harder to convince you, because... And even then I'm like, because I don't know a lot about radar, I don't know that this is gonna... Like, that's the thing, is it works both ways.
	I'm like, I don't know enough either way!
	Right, like, this isn't gonna convince me... That's the appropriate amount of skepticism, but that's not how a lot of people deal with that information.
	They say, well, I don't know anything about radar, but that must be true.
	That's...
	Which is exactly why I just said that into this microphone.
	And also, like, it's fine.
	Guys, everybody, within the sound of my voice, being wrong is okay.
	Yep.
	It's normal.
	It's fine.
	Sometimes it happens.
	It's an important part of human existence.
	It doesn't invalidate your feelings or your experience.
	I mean, you know what you saw, like, whatever, but like, it's also fine.
	If you want to believe David Grush, if you want to believe that these people are telling the truth, other than fucking Bob Lazar, don't believe him.
	But if you want to believe that these people are telling the truth, fine!
	Like, that is absolutely fine.
	Just also do so with the knowledge that thus far there is no evidence.
	Like, you can believe it, and you can believe that they are telling the truth, or at the very least telling their truth, And also hold in your mind that there is no evidence yet.
	You can believe that it is still true, and that is fine, and I'm not going to take issue with that.
	Yeah, exactly.
	And like, if you're going to concern yourself, And get wrapped up in military disclosure and the inner workings of the military.
	Please, you don't even have to switch your focus.
	Give as much energy and effort and focus to actual concerns of like, Adequate health care, mental and physical, for the military so that our bases are safe, so that we have a better reporting system whenever assaults and sexual assaults happen for citizens that are serving in the military.
	Like, there are real people with real problems that actually need your attention and support.
	This is it, like the conspiracy stuff, the military stuff, the shadow government stuff.
	There are verifiable and provable issues within all of this, like structures of power, you know, that kind of thing.
	There are problems there, actual verifiable problems that need addressing.
	Deal with those.
	Don't tell me about fucking UFOs.
	Deal with the things that we can see.
	That's what real reporters, like that's the thing, is like two fucking doofuses talking into a microphone is because Because there's other doofuses talking into a microphone that don't know shit about shit.
	So we're all on the same playing field to a degree of like, well, y'all are making claims that are fucking bullshit, and yes, your studio looks nicer, and man, it all sounds really good and whatever, but we can at least try to play that game because we're all just doofuses in a fucking, you know, in a pile.
	But real reporting Requires access that the regular person doesn't have and requires, like, resources and a legal team, like, things that we don't have access to.
	I am not confident in commenting on those issues that matter.
	That's why I want to learn about them, but that still doesn't make me an expert.
	It makes me informed.
	No, and while, you know, I was about to say I'd love to have that studio or a studio, but I honestly don't know how comfortable I would be.
	I don't know how comfortable we would feel sat in a studio doing this show.
	I feel like it would be very, very different.
	If we could be in the same room to record?
	Same room, great.
	But a studio like Russell's?
	I don't know.
	I don't know.
	I'd feel weird, yeah, with like a crew around you and everything.
	I don't know.
	I could hang out with your dogs!
	So, another point, I know, right?
	We see the dog running around, I'd be into that.
	I love how you say I could hang out with the dogs before you say I could hang out with you.
	I already made that!
	Suck it!
	I already said I want to be in the same room!
	Because of my dogs.
	No!
	That was tertiary, and you know it.
	Y'all heard that.
	You heard it come out of my mouth.
	Okay, I'll take your word for it.
	If anyone wants to support us and what we do, please find us on patreon.com slash onbrand.
	Oh, you have plugs.
	Far, far away, far away.
	So I did want to mention, like, also just as an example, I would like to set a good example.
	And I think what Mike makes is really and also like it all kind of just happens in this room is like these ideas pop up and they're weird.
	And like, I cannot stress enough how fun and cool it is to celebrate and enjoy the folklore and the, like, kind of profoundly American fabric of the UFO story.
	Yeah, very American-centric.
	Well, right, but even, you know, like, obviously, Billy Meyer is European, you know, like, there's, not everybody is, but, like, this is funny and, where is it?
	Here we go.
	These bumper stickers are not so cool.
	He's reading another book and I just got a picture sent to me yesterday while I was at work like, George Adamski's mentioned in this book!
	Holy shit!
	Well, cool!
	This is my favorite.
	So for those listening, if you've ever seen the Start Seeing Motorcycles bumper stickers, Mike made a Start Seeing UFOs version.
	I think this is hilarious.
	Objectively funny.
	It's so funny.
	It's great.
	This is what you can do.
	He made an enamel pin of the face on Mars.
	Which is really fun.
	It's really fun to watch people not know what it is at all when we go bend at events.
	It's amazing.
	People are like, um, and then Mike explains it and they're like, um, it's great.
	But there's also a couple of like real characters that will talk to him forever.
	And it's so fun.
	And let's see.
	So this is a thing that we made to I made out of his stuff.
	So some of his yes, you've shown that one.
	I've shown this one.
	Okay, cool.
	Yeah.
	Yeah.
	Like, but that's okay.
	So that image, this is like biker alien, right?
	It's very, um, basically from the Greaser.
	Grisa right here.
	Yeah, but that's from an account that's from the Betty and Barney Hill story.
	They basically described a gray that's dressed up like James Dean.
	I'm in.
	Okay.
	I'm in.
	But when we think about the real world and the real life, maybe let's be a little critical and look at how pop culture affects the way we see things.
	Yes, yes!
	Because also, like, those people, those people went through, like, it ruined, like, whatever happened to those two people, and there are plenty of, like, of, you know, family and friends that talk about how they were affected, whatever they went through, Ruined their lives and that's that's heartbreaking to me and so I think There's also a degree of like you're fucking with people's real like regular ass people they get caught in the middle Those are the people that also suffer real consequences Because maybe they could have dealt with what actually happened and there could have been legal recourse in some way or whatever like
	It's tough.
	It's really tough.
	It's tough because like there is a like it's a it's a ridiculous picture.
	Like it's a ridiculous picture of a thing that like that people took seriously at the time and like It sucks to hear the real human cost because what and also you were you were mentioning and I think rightfully so the you know speaker fees or whatever that these guys are getting and there's a lot of misunderstanding as to like where these revenue streams are coming from.
	Anyway, oh my god, I have an actual announcement, holy shit.
	Yeah, I'm gonna, and here I have this new shrine that just I got finished.
	Oh my god, it's so bright.
	Dolly.
	Oh, this is doing her dirty.
	Yeah, it's a new Dolly shrine, and I'm going to give myself a goal of August 26th.
	I will have shop up, hopefully, fingers crossed, maybe some merch stuff and an actual website area for the for the podcast too.
	So cool.
	I'm giving myself that goal.
	And at least for sure, there's going to be art around that's available.
	And then you know, maybe some Speaking of goals, I forgot to mention, we are one dollar away, I think, from hitting our first stretch goal of doing the Russell Brand Primer.
	Why didn't you mention that?!
	Probably should have done!
	Yeah, I think so!
	Completely slipped my mind.
	Well, well.
	It's a dollar.
	Let's hope for the drastically fewer percentage of people who listen right to the end that one of those will now become a patron.
	But yeah, we're a buck away from having to engage with a Russell Brand primer.
	Yeah.
	Right, so if you want to send us an email, it's theonbrandpod at gmail.com.
	We'd love to hear from you.
	On socials, we are theonbrandpod.
	I think that on most things.
	And you can find our personal socials.
	I'm at alworthofficial and Lauren is at made.buy.lauren.b.
	Oh, and find our subreddit as well, if you're a Redditor kind of person.
	It's onbrand underscore pod.
	And there's some really cool discussions and things going on there.
	Dawkins new podcast has come up.
	I don't know if you saw that.
	No.
	So immediately out the gate, a couple of trans episodes.
	One with Ricky Gervais.
	Fucking brilliant.
	We actually might have to deal with it at some point.
	I don't know.
	I'm going to look into it.
	But yeah, it's horrible.
	Well, I am putting more stuff up on all of our socials, too.
	I'm getting on.
	I'm a little more on top of it.
	And so if you want to share stuff and if you want to, there's a place for you to comment and engage.
	And YouTube, of course.
	I see you YouTubers.
	I don't acknowledge you enough, but hi, YouTube people.
	It is always a pleasure.
	I'm profoundly grateful for every human being that's listening to this or seeing this right now.
	Pretty fucking rad.
	I really appreciate it.
	It's wonderful.
	Oh, and there's a cat.
	That's our cue!
	My cat is blocking the camera.
	Right.
	And that's just the way I'm going to be for the rest of the day.
	Cheers, Kat.
	And that's our show!
	Well, thank you, everyone.
	We're going to go off-brand now.
	And yeah, we'll see you next week.
	Thanks so much!
	Probably something much worse than this.
	Thank you for listening, everybody.
	Hooray!
	Bye!
	Bye-bye!
	Bye-bye-bye-bye!

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