The Megyn Kelly Show - The Truth About Tucker and Charlie Kirk, Egregious BBC Lie, and Violent Antifa vs. Turning Point, with Stu Burguiere  |  Ep. 1191
Aired: 2025-11-11
Duration: 01:41:01


=== Violent Protests and Angry Chants (06:11) ===

[00:00:00]  Welcome to The Megyn Kelly Show, live on Sirius XM channel 111 every weekday at New East.
[00:00:12]  Hey everyone, I'm Megyn Kelly.
[00:00:13]  Welcome to the Megan Kelly Show.
[00:00:15]  We are back live in the Red Studio today, taking a little break in between tour stops.
[00:00:19]  Our last and final tour stop starts next week, Thursday, Friday, Saturday, and then we're done with the tour.
[00:00:26]  And I just want to say again, thanks to all of you so much who are showing up and making it incredibly special.
[00:00:33]  Yesterday was two months to the day since Charlie Kirk was murdered in a public execution and leftist protesters chose to mark the day by showing up at a turning point event to taunt conservatives with pure hatred.
[00:00:48]  Last night marked the end of what was supposed to be Charlie's tour across college campuses, an event he absolutely loved and for which he prepared hours and hours and hours on end prior to their beginning.
[00:01:01]  As you know, after he was murdered, conservatives like Michael Knowles, Tucker Carlson, yours truly, and many others stepped in to host those events in his honor.
[00:01:11]  I think most of us who went out there had been previously booked to do them with Charlie and others, perhaps not, but I don't know.
[00:01:19]  It's just one of the things that made it so profound, I guess, to be out there on the stage because it was supposed to be a joint event.
[00:01:28]  It was supposed to be something that we did together.
[00:01:30]  And he's only been gone two months.
[00:01:32]  It's hard to believe how much has changed in those two months.
[00:01:36]  It's hard to believe just how disgustingly vile the left has gotten.
[00:01:40]  Honestly, like I, I don't know, I knew they were like not great.
[00:01:45]  I'm not sure I would have anticipated such large swaths of the left celebrating and even reveling in his assassination.
[00:01:56]  There's something deeply wrong with these people.
[00:01:59]  Charlie chose the University of California, Berkeley, birthplace of the campus free speech movement, though it hasn't been living up to that for quite some time, to be his last stop.
[00:02:10]  Independent journalist Andy No, reporting the protests were organized by the violent Antifa group, quote, by any means necessary.
[00:02:19]  That's what they call themselves, but it's Antifa.
[00:02:21]  They showed up with signs like this one.
[00:02:23]  For the listening audience, it reads, Kirk said, hold on, drown fascism in a sea of resistance revolutionary student organization.
[00:02:35]  Then there's another one that reads, Kirk said death penalties should be public, quick, and televised.
[00:02:42]  Congrats, bro.
[00:02:44]  Fucking douchebags.
[00:02:46]  Another sign held by two protesters with their faces covered and one wearing a cafe scarf reads, drown fascism in the sea of resistance.
[00:02:54]  We just showed that one.
[00:02:55]  And in front of them on the sidewalk, a pile of soiled freedom shirts, like the one Charlie was wearing when he was killed.
[00:03:03]  Another protester, again, with her face covered in a cafe, holding a sign that reads, Charlie Kirk berated black people, rest in piss.
[00:03:13]  What kind of an idiot is that?
[00:03:16]  What the fuck is that?
[00:03:17]  He berated black people.
[00:03:18]  He berated no one.
[00:03:20]  He had spirited on-campus debates with blacks, whites, Latinos, Asians, you name it, you absolute nimrod.
[00:03:28]  She clearly knows nothing about Charlie, his beliefs, or his practices, just another ignorant, stupid Ivy League college student.
[00:03:37]  Protesters also chanting, fuck your dead homie, over and over.
[00:04:00]  And there's a person pointing to his neck or hers, ambiguous, over and over on the left side, understanding that he's caught on camera.
[00:04:09]  It's unbelievable.
[00:04:11]  I mean, how many Vs do we have to see to understand that they're reveling in Charlie's death?
[00:04:15]  They want more people killed on the right.
[00:04:20]  It's, of course, the same gesture that Chicago elementary school teacher Lucy Martinez made at a recent No Kings protest.
[00:04:26]  And just a reminder, she's apparently still employed by the school and they're perfectly fine by that.
[00:04:30]  They're fine with that.
[00:04:31]  They love Lucy Martinez.
[00:04:33]  Great.
[00:04:33]  Great.
[00:04:34]  Per the news outlet, the Berkeley Scanner, several protesters passing by police officers telling the officers to kill themselves or others saying, you have a gun, use it wisely.
[00:04:45]  Five individuals were arrested in relation to various altercations with police and protesters.
[00:04:49]  One fight broke out after a Kirk supporter selling freedom t-shirts was attacked and wound up bleeding heavily from his face.
[00:04:58]  Watch this.
[00:05:24]  This poor guy was getting the living shit kicked out of him by these lunatics.
[00:05:28]  Police were not sure what started it.
[00:05:30]  Some said the Kirk supporter shouted a racial slur, but later footage was released that showed a violent protester yanked his cross necklace off from around his neck.
[00:05:40]  And can I tell you something?
[00:05:41]  I watched the whole lead up to that, at least what was posted online.
[00:05:44]  It was like eight minutes.
[00:05:45]  And the guy had been standing there just holding up the freedom shirts and other shirts, Charlie Kirk type branded merch.
[00:05:53]  And everyone around him was aggressive.
[00:05:57]  My first thought in watching it was, they sound like they're about to get violent.
[00:06:01]  Like it did not sound like your average college campus douche.
[00:06:06]  They sounded angry and they sounded like they were getting ready to hurt him.

=== The Danger of Reactive Anger (02:02) ===

[00:06:11]  And sure enough, they did.
[00:06:14]  It's amazing.
[00:06:16]  However, there was a silver lining, the most amazing part of all, which was that every single person who stood in that line to support Charlie Kirk never left.
[00:06:25]  The taunting, the cursing, the screaming, the death threats, they were undeterred.
[00:06:31]  We saw explosions.
[00:06:32]  They were lighting off some sort of pipe bombs or flares.
[00:06:37]  No one left.
[00:06:38]  The event was sold out and this was the crowd inside.
[00:07:01]  Joining me now, Stu Bergier.
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=== Dehumanizing the Opposing Side (03:57) ===

[00:08:14]  I mean, any, like any human would, would look at this and say, why don't we just let them do their thing?
[00:08:22]  You know, like the right is very much still in mourning over Charlie.
[00:08:28]  I don't know what these people are.
[00:08:30]  What is that?
[00:08:30]  Is that a human being?
[00:08:32]  Like the one who taunts the freedom shirt holder, beating the shit out of people, the ones lighting off flares or Molotov cocktails.
[00:08:38]  I don't know what it was, but there was a clear like explosion that we saw on camera.
[00:08:43]  What is that?
[00:08:44]  I don't understand that species.
[00:08:48]  It's a great question.
[00:08:49]  I don't think I understand it either.
[00:08:50]  I don't know that I have met people like that.
[00:08:54]  They seem to exist.
[00:08:55]  You know, when I talk to people who are more left than I am, which is the vast majority of the American populace, most of them seem pretty rational and normal and maybe have some bad ideas.
[00:09:08]  But I can talk to them.
[00:09:09]  I can have a drink with them.
[00:09:11]  I can eat dinner with them and deal with them.
[00:09:14]  There is a massive change that is happening with at least a, I want to say a large chunk because that's what it feels like, but at least it's a decent-sized chunk of the left that has almost militarized.
[00:09:29]  You know, it feels like you see that around the pro-Palestinian protests.
[00:09:34]  You see it around the aftermath of the Charlie Kirk situation.
[00:09:38]  You saw it after George Floyd.
[00:09:40]  It's become much, much worse over time.
[00:09:44]  And I think it's been accelerated by the way that we deal with each other.
[00:09:50]  Young people in the last 20 years are their time socializing with other human beings is down between 50 and 70 percent.
[00:09:58]  And apparently when they are socializing, things get worse and people start bleeding all over the place.
[00:10:05]  You know, there's a stat that I'm always amazed by is that young women today that are pet owners spend more time actively engaged with their cats than they do other human beings.
[00:10:19]  And I don't know if that's just an awful part of this.
[00:10:25]  Like it's a symptom that maybe accelerates it.
[00:10:27]  It certainly doesn't cause you.
[00:10:28]  I mean, hanging out with your cat doesn't make you attack other people, but I do think there's a disconnect that's brewing between younger people and just the people around them.
[00:10:38]  They don't see them as humans.
[00:10:40]  They don't have any respect for them at all.
[00:10:42]  I think it was really, really easy, a super low bar to clear to feel sadness for the family of Charlie Kirk, for the people that supported him, even if you hate their ideas.
[00:10:54]  I mean, I don't find that to be a challenging thing.
[00:10:57]  If someone on the left is murdered, there's no moment where I'm like, gosh, I don't know, is this a good thing?
[00:11:03]  There's never a consideration for a human being that can operate within a civilization.
[00:11:10]  And that aspect of whatever bonds kept us together, that we used to call a civilization, has deteriorated to a massive extent and it seems to be getting worse.
[00:11:21]  I mean, I think you show those pictures of inside of the arena.
[00:11:25]  You show the pictures of people staying in line through all of this.
[00:11:29]  should not ignore all the positives that have happened after Charlie's passing.
[00:11:35]  You know, people going back to church and doing incredible things.
[00:11:38]  I think people investigating faith again.
[00:11:40]  And that stuff has all happened, but it really is, it feels like these ends, the fringes are coming apart at a pace that is unsustainable.
[00:11:54]  All I can think when I see these people doing the fake shot in the neck and rest in piss and all that, like all I can think is that there's a family in Phoenix, Arizona right now greatly suffering.
[00:12:09]  There's a baby boy who's still sleeping in a crib.

=== Grieving Families and Lost Fathers (02:30) ===

[00:12:12]  There's a toddler girl who have no understanding that they will never know their father.
[00:12:17]  And there's a mother who's trying to raise them.
[00:12:19]  Any mother who goes from having a two-parent intact family to losing the father will be overwhelmed with grief suddenly, losing him suddenly in particular, overwhelmed with grief and with the newfound responsibilities, which are no longer shared at all.
[00:12:36]  So not only do you have to still raise these children and be ever present for them, but you have to do it while you're massively grieving.
[00:12:44]  And all the responsibilities just got divided, you know, that in large part were divided, are now all yours at your most vulnerable and weakest.
[00:12:53]  Erica Kirk, I assume it was Erica, I saw it like a third party, but posted this video of their baby boy in his crib and their toddler girl going over to him and singing Jesus Loves Me just a couple of days ago.
[00:13:07]  Look at this still.
[00:13:33]  Yes, he helps me.
[00:13:39]  Yeah.
[00:13:57]  She puts her arms out to hug him.
[00:13:59]  He goes over and he backs up and he goes back to hold his sister's hands.
[00:14:04]  That's a lot to take in.
[00:14:07]  They are never going to know their dad.
[00:14:10]  They're never going to have Charlie Kircher walk them down the aisle or give him the talk before they take a gal down the aisle or see their children through their grandparents' or their father's eyes.
[00:14:22]  Like none of it.
[00:14:23]  None of it.
[00:14:24]  That little boy bouncing up and down in that crib, just like we've all seen our babes bounce up and down in their cribs.
[00:14:29]  So she's singing.
[00:14:31]  You know, it's like Charlie's never going to get any of those moments.
[00:14:33]  I just don't, I don't get it.
[00:14:34]  I'm thinking of like, who can I not stand the most on the left?
[00:14:38]  You know, like, who can I really, who do I really loathe?

=== Rich Parents Creating Future Losers (11:24) ===

[00:14:42]  There's a few media personalities in particular, okay?
[00:14:45]  I'm not going to name them.
[00:14:46]  But I would never wish anything like anything, anything bad to happen to them.
[00:14:52]  You know, I would never wish for them to get hurt, never mind, die.
[00:14:56]  And God forbid they ever got attacked.
[00:14:59]  I would never celebrate it.
[00:15:01]  I would shed tears for them.
[00:15:03]  I would.
[00:15:04]  Like Pete, especially people in our business who you spar with, it's like, you know, it can get ugly at times, but like to have that level of hatred and inhumanity in you, what you said sticks out to me.
[00:15:14]  50 to 70.
[00:15:17]  Wait, can you say this, Dad, again?
[00:15:19]  That communication between people, like person to person, young people has gone down 50 to 70 percent.
[00:15:25]  Yeah, people hosting events and hanging out with each other and just face-to-face time with other human beings has dropped among young people 50 to 70 percent.
[00:15:35]  And I believe it's over the entire American population.
[00:15:38]  It's over 20 percent.
[00:15:39]  Because it's this thing.
[00:15:41]  This thing did it.
[00:15:42]  The iPhone.
[00:15:43]  I'm sorry, but that is that was caused by Steve Jobs.
[00:15:49]  You know, it's back to this debate we've all been having ever since 2007 when it hit.
[00:15:52]  Has this thing done more harm than good or the opposite?
[00:15:55]  You know, gee, I have my map on my phone.
[00:15:57]  It makes driving so much easier for people who don't have directions like me in there.
[00:16:00]  It can't follow directions.
[00:16:02]  Like you can get a photograph of your children in the bed, you know, in the crib very easily.
[00:16:06]  Like all those things.
[00:16:07]  Email, text, work from home.
[00:16:10]  We no longer see people.
[00:16:12]  We no longer talk to each other.
[00:16:14]  We're shooting each other up.
[00:16:15]  We're celebrating each other's murders.
[00:16:17]  I'm sorry, but I think it's directly related to that rectangle we all walk around with in our pocket.
[00:16:23]  I completely agree that this is a massive component of it.
[00:16:27]  I mean, you know, read the Jonathan Haidt book that came out recently, The Anxious Mind, I believe it's called.
[00:16:33]  I mean, the stats in there are just shocking.
[00:16:35]  You know, as a parent who has, you know, kids in this age, which they are constantly begging for phones and want them all the time and want their own phone.
[00:16:43]  And, you know, I'm out of, I mean, I look around even my school, which is a conservative leading school.
[00:16:50]  Most kids, my kids are 14 and 12.
[00:16:53]  Most of them have phones.
[00:16:55]  And, you know, our kids don't at this point, but it's a hard thing to hold out for parents.
[00:17:00]  And if you think about how badly adults are handling this, how much society has changed and how human interaction has changed among adults, you think about what this must be doing to our kids.
[00:17:12]  I mean, you know, you look at the suicide rates and all and all of these other things, not to mention just brain rot that is happening.
[00:17:20]  That's a massive component.
[00:17:21]  And I think, because I think we could look at this and say both conservatives and liberals are both pretty guilty of just giving our lives over to these devices without really any thought, you know, hours and hours and hours a day.
[00:17:36]  And I think there is effect on both sides.
[00:17:39]  But I do think that the effect is really exaggerated on the left.
[00:17:43]  And partially I think it's because the lack of personal connection, the not seeing each other as human works together with the idea of collectivism, unfortunately, into a really bad recipe.
[00:17:58]  And with one other thing, the loss of faith.
[00:18:01]  And the loss of faith is massive among that.
[00:18:03]  When you lose that personal connection, the personal foundation to a higher power, and then you combine that with collectivism, which is basically largely an idea of seeing people as members of groups rather than individuals, right?
[00:18:16]  That concept, which I also believe leads to racism and anti-Semitism and so many other terrible things, because even when you see that stuff on the right, it's always in a collectivist mindset.
[00:18:27]  You're seeing these people as just this, hey, there's this giant glob of people and they're responsible for it rather than seeing them as individuals who you would be sad for when their children lose their father.
[00:18:41]  Like when you just see him as this, and you see Charlie as this guy who was leading this movement toward things that I don't like in politics, it's a lot easier to go out and do these terrible things and mock his death and all of this when you're not seeing him as an individual.
[00:18:58]  This is a person who, yeah, you know, maybe he did like lower taxes than you.
[00:19:02]  You know, maybe he did like lower regulation levels than you won.
[00:19:05]  And maybe his healthcare subsidy level was different than yours.
[00:19:09]  These aren't things that should make you cheer his death.
[00:19:13]  That is a low hurdle to clear.
[00:19:15]  And one I believe for a really long time we were able to clear, at least as long as I've been alive.
[00:19:21]  And over the past few years, maybe accelerated by COVID, certainly accelerated by technology and just wild left-wing ideologies, we crossed a line that it doesn't seem like we're able to make those distinctions anymore.
[00:19:37]  We're not able to just say, hey, like I don't like that.
[00:19:40]  I don't like any of your ideas, but gosh, that's terrible.
[00:19:42]  What happened to you?
[00:19:44]  There were some on the left that were able to hit that hurdle, but far too few.
[00:19:48]  Well, I do think.
[00:19:50]  Your points about collectivism and then the point about faith.
[00:19:55]  Explain what's happening.
[00:19:57]  Explain why this is happening on the left, but not the right.
[00:20:00]  You know, because the right wing has young kids.
[00:20:04]  The right wing has college-aged kids.
[00:20:06]  The right wing has 18 to 24-year-olds right now who are not doing this.
[00:20:11]  So why?
[00:20:12]  Like, why not?
[00:20:14]  And I do think it's not to say they've never had a shooter that age and so on come from the right wing, but I'm just saying in general, in general, right-wing families are connected with faith.
[00:20:23]  I mean, honestly, it's one of the reasons why the whole Tyler Robinson mystery is so bizarre, because while he was a leftist, he came from a right-wing family.
[00:20:32]  And I don't know what role faith played in their life.
[00:20:34]  You know, just because you're right-wing doesn't necessarily mean you're a family of faith.
[00:20:37]  But I do think that the more you remove faith from your life, the more you replace it with false gods like wokeism, which is extremely damaging.
[00:20:47]  It's basically the same thing as catching, not that it's contagious, but I mean, like, as like getting anorexia, like a disease that will eat you away from the inside.
[00:20:58]  You do it to yourself.
[00:20:59]  You kill yourself day by day by day by choice, by believing in things that aren't true.
[00:21:06]  That's what these kids suffer from.
[00:21:08]  That's the collectivism.
[00:21:09]  And then, you know, if you fill up that space with a belief in God, in Jesus, in being redeemed from sin, and also just belonging to a community, then you don't have the need to turn to Antifa to work out your need to feel like you belong.
[00:21:30]  Every time I see one of these kids out there, and we always get inevitably the follow-up piece on how they're all rich, how they all have like, you know, endless supply cards at Starbucks and they have expensive laptops.
[00:21:44]  Yeah, here's some of the fire that we saw last night at the event.
[00:21:48]  Don't know exactly what that is, but not exactly a peaceful protest.
[00:21:52]  They're all rich.
[00:21:53]  They're all privileged.
[00:21:54]  Nine times out of 10, I guarantee you the parents are paying no attention to them.
[00:21:58]  They're really just ornaments, you know, like you'd see on a fancy car hood.
[00:22:03]  And so they need this.
[00:22:04]  They need to go out there and do something crazy to make themselves feel like they matter.
[00:22:09]  I mean, if we're really talking this through, it comes down to a basic parenting fucking fail, right?
[00:22:14]  Like stay in touch with your kid, have family dinners, go to church, stay on top of his well-being, including and arguably especially when he goes away to college.
[00:22:26]  And by the way, the Tyler Robinson situation, if he goes away to college and winds up living with a trans furry who's allegedly famous for growing mold in plastic Tupperware containers throughout the apartment and hoarding to the place where he looks like he's living in a dumpster or an actual landfill, maybe get more involved in checking on his wellness.
[00:22:51]  I mean, truly, the well-being of society depends on it.
[00:22:56]  Yeah, it really does.
[00:22:58]  You need those foundations.
[00:22:59]  We all need them.
[00:23:00]  This is not, you know, not some nuclear, you know, chemistry level sort of discovery.
[00:23:05]  This is basic, you know, human nature.
[00:23:08]  You do need those authority figures.
[00:23:09]  And like as a parent, like I have, maybe this is just completely selfish.
[00:23:14]  I don't want to jinx myself, but like, you know, I think there are times a lot of parents do these things and the world takes their kids and does God knows what with them.
[00:23:23]  You know, it's not always, even if you're trying your best, sometimes you lose your kids.
[00:23:27]  And the fact that so often we're turning them over to, you know, in some cases, literally the Chinese Communist Party with TikTok and these things, you should assume this is going to happen a lot more often.
[00:23:40]  You have to be more and more diligent about this.
[00:23:43]  And so often, like, you know, you do see it's like from these like nicer backgrounds and kids that are spoiled and have, you know, done have these amazing lives by any historical representation.
[00:23:56]  And I think too, part of this is like human beings kind of need struggle.
[00:24:00]  You know, we will often search it out, even when it's kind of silly to do so.
[00:24:05]  And I think you see a lot of these kids at these colleges that have, you know, have what all, you know, impressions are great lives, right?
[00:24:14]  Like everything they've ever needed, never struggled for food, never struggled for the wants and needs, live in nice houses and nice communities, not threatened by the horrible inner cities that left-wing mayors have created over the years.
[00:24:28]  They're not dealing with that.
[00:24:29]  That's not who they are.
[00:24:30]  Those aren't the people that are voting for this nonsense most of the time.
[00:24:34]  It's people who are outside of that world.
[00:24:36]  And I think in some ways we've smartly gone after and tried to solve a lot of the basic concerns of our lives.
[00:24:44]  You know, if you think about the George Floyd era for a second, when the left is going into these town squares and they're tearing down these statues of Confederates and all of these things, and they're acting so oppressed by them.
[00:24:58]  And now they're in a situation where what they believe they're oppressed by are statues.
[00:25:03]  But at one point in our history, those statues were real people and some of them were terrible people and some of them did terrible things.
[00:25:09]  And we used to have to deal with the actual dictators, not the statues of the dictators.
[00:25:15]  And the fact that we see that as our main struggle today in some ways speaks well of our society that we've been able to take away a lot of those threats, right?
[00:25:23]  But I do think that like, especially people without, as you pointed out, Megan, you know, that connection to faith, the connection to real, something real and foundational, they search and they search blindly in this awful wilderness we've created for them.
[00:25:40]  And that is not a formula that leads to good things.
[00:25:43]  No, no, it's not.
[00:25:45]  And these, these, you know, rich families that think parenting is accomplished by lavishing their children with expensive gifts or trips or cars, whatever, are creating the next gen of losers, absolute losers.

=== Selling Laboo Boos for Sadness (06:15) ===

[00:26:07]  I mean, and we're all going to have to deal with it.
[00:26:08]  I mean, it really does concern me.
[00:26:11]  And that brings me, of course, to Jimmy Kimmel and the absurd, absurd clip that's circulating now.
[00:26:20]  The other night we played and aired on this program, the soundbite of his wife, who apparently is just as crazy as he is, lamenting that she still has Trump supporting relatives.
[00:26:35]  And notwithstanding the fact that she begged them, begged them and gave them 10 reasons not to vote for Trump, they still voted for Trump.
[00:26:41]  And she feels like they voted against Jimmy.
[00:26:45]  Okay.
[00:26:45]  Something's wrong when your so-called comedian husband is in your mind on the ballot, but all right.
[00:26:53]  There was more to that interview.
[00:26:54]  I don't even know why they're doing this, like, but there are other, both of them are on like what appears to be like a Zoom call with a bunch of people in the frame.
[00:27:01]  And listen to this.
[00:27:02]  Now, the subject of poor Jimmy's cancel it.
[00:27:06]  Oh, wait, I mean, five nights off.
[00:27:10]  Five nights paid off where he got multi multi-millions just pursuant to his contract.
[00:27:17]  But yeah, he's a free speech warrior.
[00:27:20]  How that went over the trauma in their family when speaking with their daughter who is 11.
[00:27:26]  They also have a son who's eight.
[00:27:27]  Listen here.
[00:27:29]  And Jimmy let them know.
[00:27:31]  He said, our show is, my show has been suspended.
[00:27:35]  And our daughter immediately burst into tears.
[00:27:38]  And she said, I'll sell my laboo boos.
[00:27:43]  And we told her, yeah, you should.
[00:27:45]  No, we did not.
[00:27:46]  We told her, no, you don't need to do that.
[00:27:48]  You don't need to sell labo boos.
[00:27:49]  And our son asked if the president had done this.
[00:27:53]  And we looked at each other and we didn't quite know how to answer that question.
[00:27:57]  I think I said yes.
[00:27:58]  We did.
[00:27:59]  We actually both said yes at the exact same time.
[00:28:02]  We said yes.
[00:28:03]  He did.
[00:28:04]  Okay.
[00:28:06]  So you chose not to tell your children that the reason he got suspended is because he mocked and wrongfully blamed a beloved conservative's death on conservatives.
[00:28:20]  I can see why you didn't think that was appropriate to share with your 11-year-old, I guess.
[00:28:24]  Much easier to just blame Donald Trump.
[00:28:29]  Zero personal responsibility there, Stu.
[00:28:32]  It's all about Trump, not what Jimmy said.
[00:28:35]  And then the cherry on top of the Sunday, the referencing of the laboo-boos, these little dolls that can be as cheap as $25 or can be $850 a pop.
[00:28:48]  And the little girl thinks they're so poor, she's going to have to sell hers off.
[00:28:53]  Sure.
[00:28:54]  Sure, Jan.
[00:28:56]  Yeah, living in this incredible mansion somewhere in Hollywood and living the life that everyone would aspire to financially.
[00:29:05]  And let me tell you something.
[00:29:06]  I'm sorry to interrupt you, but let me just say one thing quickly.
[00:29:08]  By 11, your kids know exactly where you are on the earnings scale.
[00:29:12]  They may not know your salary, but they know if you have money or if you're struggling for money.
[00:29:17]  That whole thing sounds like a fucking made-up lie to me.
[00:29:19]  Sorry, keep going.
[00:29:20]  It does seem like one of those stories that actually didn't happen.
[00:29:23]  And also, like, how would it happen?
[00:29:26]  How, why on earth would your children assume the president of the United States was getting you suspended?
[00:29:32]  How would they come up with that idea?
[00:29:34]  They come up with that idea because you're telling them how evil he is all the time, right?
[00:29:38]  Like probably every conversation around your house is focused around this one guy and the things you claim he's doing to you, which of course, you know, largely are nonsense anyway.
[00:29:48]  I mean, you know, Trump does occasionally dive into some Hollywood issues.
[00:29:53]  He does enjoy to do that every once in a while.
[00:29:56]  But I mean, it's insane, right?
[00:29:59]  Like these things don't just happen.
[00:30:01]  It's like when you see these parents who are like, gosh, my daughter goes to bed every night and she's so concerned about global warming and how is she going to live?
[00:30:09]  Like that doesn't come from the kid.
[00:30:11]  The kid doesn't come up with that on their own.
[00:30:14]  And no child actually goes to bed thinking about a 0.9 degrees Celsius temperature rise over a globe in a century.
[00:30:21]  And there's no child who actually fears that.
[00:30:23]  That is given to the kid by the parent.
[00:30:27]  And, you know, like, as well as all those labo-boos, this is something that the parents are handing down and giving to these kids and giving them a perception of how the world works, which is they are somehow this in the mansion with the laboo boos, somehow the victim of this society.
[00:30:44]  It's insane when you really think about it.
[00:30:46]  Because we all have an $850 doll for our child.
[00:30:51]  There's zero chance that they went for the $25 laboo.
[00:30:54]  And by the way, yet another tell that she's lying is the part where she says, I don't even remember what we said in response.
[00:31:03]  And Jimmy's like, we said yes.
[00:31:04]  And she's like, we said yes.
[00:31:06]  But not a hesitation.
[00:31:08]  She knew.
[00:31:08]  she tried to like she wasn't gonna say that they didn't take personal responsibility because like at the last second she had the the the light bulb go off that this would not make them look good jimmy was too dumb to realize this was not gonna make them look good let's watch it again now with our analysis baked in let's watch it one more time stop 14.
[00:31:30]  And Jimmy let them know.
[00:31:32]  He said our show is, my show has been suspended.
[00:31:35]  And um, our daughter immediately burst into tears and she said um, i'll sell my laboo boos.
[00:31:44]  And we told her, yeah, you should.
[00:31:45]  No we, we did not.
[00:31:46]  We told her, no, you don't need to do that, you don't need to sell labooboos.
[00:31:50]  And our son asked um, if the president had done this?
[00:31:54]  And uh, we looked at each other and we didn't quite know how to answer that question.
[00:31:58]  I think I said yes, we did.
[00:31:59]  We actually both said yes at the exact same time.
[00:32:02]  Oh, you remember now you did.
[00:32:04]  And now, oh right, I think it was that I said yes yes, you did we both.
[00:32:08]  We both said yes, we both did.
[00:32:09]  Like she's a liar, that's my opinion.
[00:32:12]  And, by the way, we didn't even talk about the hosts.
[00:32:14]  The other host on this podcast, which I guess is called We Can do hard Things their horror that she might have to sell her labooboos.

=== Conservative Movement Losing Its Glue (16:04) ===

[00:32:22]  They're all like literally everyone.
[00:32:25]  One girl touches her head with both hands like oh, not the laboobus no, the horror the poor Kimmels have had to go through.
[00:32:34]  Stu oh, I think you found the my favorite part of the clip, which is the host their, their hands, gestures throughout it, like I, the entire time you're telling the story, one has her hand over her heart like oh my gosh.
[00:32:47]  And then it's the hand to the face and they're like I can't believe.
[00:32:50]  What a, what an adorable moment, but what a sad moment.
[00:32:54]  Now none of these people seem to be they.
[00:32:57]  They wouldn't have the same sadness from the Jimmy Kimmel laboo boo uh, child possibly losing their laboo boos, as they would to that first clip you showed from the crib like that's the, that's the clip that should make you feel that way.
[00:33:11]  Not a millionaire losing their $850 dollar.
[00:33:15]  That shouldn't make you feel that way.
[00:33:17]  The pastor, that's what Jimmy was joking about.
[00:33:20]  That's really what he was joking about.
[00:33:22]  He was making light of what happened to Charlie by being like, haha MAGA, you know, scrambling to make it seem like it wasn't their their own.
[00:33:30]  That includes the whole thing.
[00:33:32]  And he diminished the whole tragedy with that flippant, erroneous death, defamatory comment.
[00:33:40]  We all know the guy confessed to his family that it was Tyler Robinson.
[00:33:47]  Okay, that's who killed Charlie Kirk.
[00:33:50]  It wasn't one of MAGA's own.
[00:33:52]  The guy was a leftist, according to his own parents, not withstand and not, and not to mention what he wrote on the bullets and the way he'd been living his life and all that stuff.
[00:34:01]  He won't take personal responsibility for misstating the facts, which was obviously intentional, and now wants us to feel sorry for him that there's no other reason for her to tell that story, Stu.
[00:34:15]  No, of course they're trying to get sympathy for themselves, even though again, like what he Was, obviously untrue and something that is believed widely by the left to this day.
[00:34:26]  They still believe that this was a MA person.
[00:34:30]  We have, you know, it's not just Jimmy Kimmel who said it.
[00:34:32]  It was widely spread around left-wing media.
[00:34:35]  We have America's dumbest congressman, Eric Swalwell, said something like that.
[00:34:39]  We have tons of tight race, but I agree.
[00:34:43]  Yeah, I think, I think he, look, there's definitely a tight race.
[00:34:47]  There's a bunch, but I would say I think he's America's dumbest congressman.
[00:34:52]  But, you know, this was a widespread thing.
[00:34:54]  This is something that is still believed when you look at polls.
[00:34:57]  They don't, I mean, who would want to blame your own side for something so terrible?
[00:35:01]  But internalize that.
[00:35:03]  It is your own side.
[00:35:05]  It was your own side that did this.
[00:35:07]  And they did it because of the same reasons you're standing out there beating the crap out of a guy trying to sell t-shirts.
[00:35:12]  It's the same, it's the same instinct.
[00:35:15]  And that anger and just brutality toward your fellow human being is disgusting.
[00:35:21]  And especially when it's placed in this bizarre context where they're the good guys.
[00:35:26]  Like, oh, gosh, they're so upset at Chuck Schumer today because he didn't have healthcare subsidies because they're so concerned about people's health.
[00:35:34]  Are you?
[00:35:35]  It certainly doesn't feel that way when I watch you mocking someone's death.
[00:35:40]  It's really horrific.
[00:35:42]  I don't really know how to reach out to these people at all.
[00:35:46]  You know, I do want to ask you something.
[00:35:48]  It's kind of interesting that I saw online.
[00:35:50]  I think it might have been Chris Ruffo.
[00:35:52]  I can't remember, but it was a conservative saying, just given everything that's happened since Charlie died, it's more evident to him than ever that Charlie was the glue holding the conservative movement together and that it's become so, you know, I don't know, fractious and acrimonious in the last two months because of Charlie not being there to hold it together.
[00:36:15]  I don't agree with that, actually.
[00:36:17]  I don't think Charlie was the glue that held the movement together.
[00:36:20]  I think he was great at forming alliances.
[00:36:25]  And, you know, of course, the turning point events were events that we all, most of us, got invited to and went to, no matter where we stood on various issues, including Israel.
[00:36:35]  But I don't think what's come out, you know, since he died and the, you know, the fighting, infighting, especially around the issue of Israel, was something Charlie could have prevented.
[00:36:46]  You know, the thing with Israel has been coming to a boil for a while now because of the war.
[00:36:51]  And I just think like it's actually kind of, I don't know, something about the comment bothered me because it's putting too much on Charlie, first of all.
[00:36:59]  He was amazing and he was extremely talented, but he was not some sort of weird godfather, Christ-like man who was able to achieve the impossible, which is keep people fighting from fighting about Israel and like a very controversial war.
[00:37:16]  How do you see it?
[00:37:20]  It's a great question.
[00:37:21]  I mean, you know, when you're talking about Israel, I mean, yes, the war is certainly part of that, but these are ancient hatreds, right?
[00:37:28]  These things go back.
[00:37:29]  Many of the theories being tossed around these days have been around for a very long time, long before the Gaza war.
[00:37:36]  These are things that have been bubbling around the country and the world, unfortunately, for a very long time.
[00:37:44]  I think that I agree with you.
[00:37:46]  Charlie was an incredible guy.
[00:37:50]  And I think he would even be a bit uncomfortable with getting that much credit.
[00:37:56]  I mean, I think he was a guy who really tried hard to maintain alliances and be the type of person who was connecting, was connecting people rather than breaking others apart.
[00:38:09]  We have this battle, I think, going on on the right right now between coalition builders and lineholders.
[00:38:18]  And, you know, which one should you be?
[00:38:20]  Which one should you be?
[00:38:22]  And I think it's interesting to think about that conceptually for all of us, because I have thought of that.
[00:38:27]  I've watched a lot of this go along on the right.
[00:38:29]  And as I've thought about it a lot, I think the answer to a healthy movement is you need both.
[00:38:36]  You need people like, I mean, Charlie was really, really good at reaching across to people who are even on the fringes of conservatism and trying to bring them in all the time, trying to hug them, trying to say, hey, here's where we agree.
[00:38:47]  Come talk to us about these parts that you don't agree on, but here's where we agree.
[00:38:51]  And he was a great coalition builder, but even inside of himself was also a lineholder on certain things.
[00:38:58]  You look at what he, you know, how he dealt with, you know, the Nick Fuentes of the world.
[00:39:03]  He was not, he was angry at some of them when they would come and ask questions.
[00:39:07]  He would be loud and forceful against them.
[00:39:11]  And so I think we all have to kind of find where we are on that spectrum.
[00:39:15]  We do need, we can't just say every time somebody disagrees with us, we toss them from the movement.
[00:39:19]  I mean, I support Israel and I support what they did largely in the war there, especially after October 7th.
[00:39:27]  But like, I know a lot of people who are much more skeptical and concerned about what they did there.
[00:39:31]  They're not terrible people.
[00:39:33]  They're good people.
[00:39:33]  And they're really trying to find what the right answer is for something like that.
[00:39:39]  There are people who aren't trying to find the right answer.
[00:39:41]  There are people who just disagree with everything that a Jew does.
[00:39:45]  That is a real thing in our world.
[00:39:47]  We've all documented it throughout history and it still exists today.
[00:39:50]  It exists across the spectrum and I don't want any part of it.
[00:39:53]  But like criticism of Israel's government is of course on the table and totally okay.
[00:39:59]  We don't, you shouldn't hold a line to keep those people out of your movement.
[00:40:04]  You have to be able to have those conversations and have deep conversations about that because these are complicated issues.
[00:40:10]  When you move on to just trying to toss everybody that disagrees, that's bad.
[00:40:14]  It's also, though, I think important to look at what your movement is.
[00:40:20]  Is it something that is accepting people for their beliefs and their faith and all of that?
[00:40:26]  Or is it something that's just going to just take out groups and blame, like the left does, come up with a group that's responsible for everything and just point fingers and say that that group is evil?
[00:40:36]  Usually it's us and their particular arrangement.
[00:40:39]  I don't want to do that either.
[00:40:40]  I mean, again, I bring it back to the point I made before, which is collectivism.
[00:40:43]  You know, racism is collectivism.
[00:40:45]  Anti-Semitism is collectivism.
[00:40:47]  You're putting these people into groups and thinking of them as groups.
[00:40:49]  And sometimes I think, you know, conservative and liberal, that stuff gets kind of messy.
[00:40:53]  Sometimes I think about it as just collectivist and individualist.
[00:40:58]  And if you think of people as individuals, you're much more likely to come to normal human interactions with them.
[00:41:03]  And the left has completely lost that.
[00:41:07]  Yeah.
[00:41:07]  No, that was, that was, ironically, the point that Tucker was trying to make to Nick Fuentes in their, you know, much reviewed interview about how wrong collectivism is.
[00:41:18]  And why would you be saying that to a guy known first and foremost as an anti-Semite unless you were against what he was doing?
[00:41:25]  I mean, that's what he was trying to say to him.
[00:41:28]  And I know people think, oh, Tucker doesn't like Jews or Tucker, he's an anti-Semite.
[00:41:33]  I mean, I've listened to his show.
[00:41:34]  I do listen to Tucker's show.
[00:41:36]  I just don't hear that.
[00:41:37]  I hear somebody who's not a fan of Israel or Netanyahu at all and believes some of the things that, you know, the Palestinian protesters believe about Israel, which is fine.
[00:41:47]  I mean, who would argue that Israel has conducted a perfect war and hasn't been guilty of a disturbing number of civilian deaths, even though they take extraordinary measures versus most other world fighters to prevent them?
[00:42:00]  That doesn't, they're not perfect.
[00:42:02]  And there have been.
[00:42:02]  And there's, of course, plenty of room to criticize them.
[00:42:05]  They just seem to have an incredibly thin skin.
[00:42:08]  They're most ardent supporters who told us for two years we could criticize them if we wanted to.
[00:42:13]  Then when some of us started to, the rules changed.
[00:42:17]  But that's what he was trying to say to Nick Fuentes, that collectivism is bad and it's anti-Christian and it's evil.
[00:42:25]  And that's, I think, an incredibly important point.
[00:42:28]  You know, I think like there's this all of this is happening and there is a value to talking this stuff out and finding where your lines are and what you're going to accept and what you're not.
[00:42:41]  And that's something that human beings need to do and the conservative movement needs to do generally.
[00:42:45]  You see the motivation though for I think a lot of the talking, a lot of the conversation around this is not necessarily coming from people I think that have the best interest of the conservative movement at heart.
[00:42:59]  And, you know, sometimes I think about it in the way of, I think about it as the, I get asked about these questions sometimes and I think about it as the same face that Sidney Sweeney made when she's being asked about how she wants to comment on her gene commercial.
[00:43:16]  And it's just like this, so many of the people are coming at this with no interest in making the conservative movement better or having it thrive or having people have more individual rights.
[00:43:28]  It's coming from this idea of how do we destroy that movement?
[00:43:33]  How do we take the fractures that of course exist in every movement and separate them and make everything worse?
[00:43:39]  And that does, I don't want to make that sound like I want to accept every lunatic that comes on and says they're to the right.
[00:43:45]  I keep hearing this argument of like, oh gosh, no enemies to the right.
[00:43:48]  Well, the people that were in that conversation aren't to my right.
[00:43:51]  I don't know whose right they're to.
[00:43:53]  I don't know what national socialist is to my right.
[00:43:56]  None of them.
[00:43:56]  It's got nothing.
[00:43:57]  Those ideas have literally nothing to do with what I believe.
[00:44:02]  Those are the Nazi Party wanted to control every single aspect of the German citizen's life.
[00:44:09]  That is nothing to do with my vision of what I want out of government.
[00:44:13]  But you have to understand the motivation of what the left wants out of this.
[00:44:17]  And what they want out of this is to destroy everything that Charlie was trying to do.
[00:44:22]  They want to destroy everything that the president and other conservatives are trying to do.
[00:44:29]  They want the worst for us.
[00:44:31]  And so giving into this idea that we have to embrace their vision of whatever intramural disputes we wind up having on the right, I think isn't healthy for the future of the movement.
[00:44:45]  I talk to people all the time I disagree with.
[00:44:47]  There's a lot of them.
[00:44:47]  I work here at the Blaze.
[00:44:48]  There's a lot of all sorts of views at the Blaze that I don't agree with.
[00:44:51]  I've been able to have conversations with everybody here.
[00:44:53]  I disagree with them on a lot of things sometimes.
[00:44:56]  They disagree with me on a lot of things.
[00:44:58]  I think that's healthy.
[00:44:59]  I think that's a thing that we should want on the right.
[00:45:04]  I just feel like when you look at the motivations of the outsiders trying to exploit that, we should be really sensitive to watch out for what their motivations are.
[00:45:14]  I have more to say on this, Charlie Front, but I'll pick it up on the back side of the break because I want to show you something that I've never shown anybody before, a piece of tape that I have.
[00:45:24]  And the Chris Ruffo comment got me thinking about it, but stand by.
[00:45:28]  You mentioned Sidney Sweeney, so I do want to mention this in the couple minutes we have here.
[00:45:32]  She is under attack right now, a new attack, because she's starring in a new movie.
[00:45:40]  It's about a boxer.
[00:45:43]  And it's about this boxer named Christy Martin, who was extremely successful and I guess gay, or at least turned gay or was lesbian at some point.
[00:45:56]  I don't know the story.
[00:45:57]  But Sidney Sweeney is playing her in a movie.
[00:46:00]  And it opened this past weekend.
[00:46:02]  And apparently it did not do well at all.
[00:46:04]  And now she's getting attacked by this actress named Ruby Rose, who stars in Orange is the New Black, who took to threads.
[00:46:11]  That's of course the left-wing ex, kind of like Blue Sky, on Monday evening to attack Sidney Sweeney for playing esteemed boxer and domestic abuse survivor Christy Martin.
[00:46:25]  Again, they point out in this article that this is on the Daily Rail, Daily Mail, that there was a lackluster reception, including one of the lowest ever domestic openings for a wide release.
[00:46:35]  It has set tongues wagging, leading to Ruby Rose's explosive rant toward Republican Sidney.
[00:46:42]  And we do believe she's a Republican.
[00:46:45]  Here's what she says.
[00:46:46]  She says, the original Christy Martin script was incredible, life-changing.
[00:46:51]  I was attached to play Cherry, who I think, I think that's another name for Christy Martin, but in any event, everyone had experience with the core material.
[00:47:01]  Most of us were actually gay.
[00:47:03]  It's part of why I stayed in acting.
[00:47:06]  Losing roles happens all the time.
[00:47:08]  She's trying to act like she's above, she's not bitter against Sidney for taking the role, but here it comes.
[00:47:13]  For her PR to talk about it flopping and saying Sidney Sweeney did it for the people, none of the people want to see someone who hates them, meaning gays, parading around pretending to be us.
[00:47:26]  You're a Cretan and you ruined the film.
[00:47:29]  Period.
[00:47:29]  Christy deserved better.
[00:47:32]  So this, I believe, is the obvious clear price that Sidney Sweeney has had to pay for, and they said it, being a registered Republican.
[00:47:44]  That's it.
[00:47:45]  That's her sin.
[00:47:46]  It's not the ad, the jeans ad.
[00:47:48]  It's not the answer to that reporter last week.
[00:47:50]  It is the fact that they now know she's a Republican, that she has to be smeared as a failure and totally behind the disappointing open of this film.
[00:47:59]  And also, by the way, for Kicks, quote, hates gays, for which there is zero evidence.
[00:48:05]  I'm sure that's based in this woman's demented head on the fact that she's a registered Republican.
[00:48:12]  Again, like, this is such a low below the belt hit, Stu.
[00:48:16]  Yeah, it's also incredibly unlikely that she, why would she take the movie of Christy Martin if she hated gays?
[00:48:26]  It makes no sense.

=== Tucker Carlson's Shifting Views (17:22) ===

[00:48:27]  I mean, when you look at the plot of the movie, here's a woman who was able to go from nothing to a very successful career throughout while dealing with all sorts of terrible abuse.
[00:48:38]  Like this is a left-wing type of plotline you'd think normally they would want to talk about and promote, right?
[00:48:45]  Like this is a Hollywood story.
[00:48:47]  It's very typical.
[00:48:49]  She's been promoting the film alongside Christy Martin.
[00:48:52]  Like they've been making all these appearances together.
[00:48:54]  So clearly Christy does not think Sidney Sweeney hates gays.
[00:48:58]  Yeah.
[00:49:00]  It's so ridiculous.
[00:49:01]  Like we know nothing about, we know literally nothing about Sidney Sweeney's views.
[00:49:05]  The fact that she's Republican, I mean, a Hollywood Republican oftentimes is nothing that I would consider a conservative.
[00:49:11]  I mean, it's true.
[00:49:12]  You know, she might be a conservative.
[00:49:14]  I have no idea.
[00:49:15]  She really hasn't said anything about it, which is what I loved about her interview, right?
[00:49:19]  Like it wasn't a, look, I love when people agree with me, but, you know, that's not what she was doing.
[00:49:24]  She's just saying, like, look, I'll talk about this on my own timeline.
[00:49:27]  Like, you're not going to goad me into this.
[00:49:29]  That's not what's going to happen.
[00:49:30]  And you look at her career.
[00:49:31]  First of all, she's actually really good.
[00:49:33]  She's a good actor, actress.
[00:49:35]  But you think about euphoria.
[00:49:37]  She was in the freaking handmaid's tale.
[00:49:39]  Like the only literary reference left-wing people know.
[00:49:42]  She was in that show as well.
[00:49:44]  She's not made some right-wing career.
[00:49:47]  She's tried to do all these things and I think she's been good in them.
[00:49:49]  And they're just beating her up because she has an R near her name.
[00:49:53]  It's complete insanity.
[00:49:54]  Yeah, there were reports that she is a registered Republican, but she hasn't done anything to show that other than she was, she did not back down after she did the jeans ad to the left-wing shaming, which everyone should take a lesson.
[00:50:09]  So shame on this actor for hurling the bigot charge at her.
[00:50:14]  Totally baseless.
[00:50:15]  More with Stu right after this.
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[00:51:18]  Megan Kelly Live on tour across America.
[00:51:21]  I was like, we have to go.
[00:51:22]  And then after what happened to Charlie, I'm like, we definitely have to go.
[00:51:26]  The best way to honor Charlie's legacy is to be out here, to be unafraid, to not back down.
[00:51:32]  Stand firmly.
[00:51:33]  Do not waver on the truth.
[00:51:36]  Next stop, White Plains, Jacksonville, Miami, and Atlanta.
[00:51:39]  So go get your tickets right now before they sell out.
[00:51:41]  MeganKelly.com.
[00:51:42]  Presented by YReFi and SiriusXM.
[00:51:49]  Back with me now, Stu Bergeer, host of Stu Does America.
[00:51:53]  Okay, so on the subject of Charlie, I think people who didn't know him may be misunderstanding Charlie.
[00:52:02]  Like Charlie, he was important.
[00:52:06]  He was hugely important to the conservative movement, but he didn't do it by discouraging debate or trying to tell one faction they couldn't or shouldn't say something or not saber rattling on something that was like a sacred cow of the administrations.
[00:52:22]  He didn't always do it, but he wanted those discussions to happen.
[00:52:27]  I don't think Charlie would be upset about the debate that's generally happening between, say, Tucker and Ben Shapiro right now in Israel.
[00:52:35]  He would not like how nasty it's getting.
[00:52:38]  You know, he definitely would not support calls to have Tucker, you know, people to stop watching Tucker.
[00:52:43]  Ben's not asking for him to be deplatformed, but clearly he wants him cut out of polite conservative movement circles.
[00:52:51]  He would not be in favor of that.
[00:52:53]  He knew what Tucker was saying, including about Israel, and continued to invite him to turning point events.
[00:52:59]  And so I just wanted to tell this story because I think people are misunderstanding.
[00:53:04]  Like Charlie was all for really robust discussions of very tough issues, including Israel and beyond.
[00:53:12]  It's just he wouldn't necessarily lead them because he did have donors and he also was very close with the administration.
[00:53:18]  And so I just wanted to say two things.
[00:53:20]  Number one, there was a turning point event last July and many of us were there and we all saw Charlie.
[00:53:28]  And that was an appearance at which I spent all my time talking about Epstein.
[00:53:33]  It was right after the whole debacle with Pam Bondi promising she's got the file on her desk and she's going to reveal it and then releasing that two-page memo saying, oh, there's nothing.
[00:53:42]  There's absolutely nothing to talk about.
[00:53:43]  I don't know what you're referring to with those Fox News hits.
[00:53:46]  You know, they memory hold them.
[00:53:48]  And the FBI got swooped up into it and it was very controversial.
[00:53:53]  And that is what my appearance was not a speech.
[00:53:55]  It was a Q ⁇ A.
[00:53:57]  And that is what Charlie wanted to talk about.
[00:54:00]  And backstage, he made very clear to me that he wanted to focus in on Pam Bondi and encouraged me to really go for her.
[00:54:09]  Now, I didn't need Charlie's direction because I had been going for her on my show.
[00:54:13]  So it's not like this is orchestrated.
[00:54:15]  He had been listening to my show and he was basically like, please say all of that right here.
[00:54:20]  And that's fine.
[00:54:20]  I'm like, you're leading the Q ⁇ A. Let's do this, which is what happened.
[00:54:24]  So Charlie was not at all averse to seeing Pam Bondi take a hit.
[00:54:30]  He was just too polite to be the one personally to do it himself.
[00:54:35]  But he knew that the administration wasn't going to like that and he was not shy about that.
[00:54:39]  He thought that was an important issue.
[00:54:41]  And who was really hot on that issue in particular?
[00:54:44]  Well, Republicans, yes, and young Republicans too, who smelled a rat and just felt like, do we have the same thing with this administration as we've had with other administrations, red or blue, where important people get protected and only people with no connections are left to fry.
[00:55:00]  So anyway, that was one example.
[00:55:02]  And the second example also relates partially to Epstein and partially to Israel and involves Tucker.
[00:55:10]  So two weeks after Charlie died, Tucker had me on a live broadcast he did of his own show.
[00:55:17]  It was on a Wednesday night and it was, it was about free speech.
[00:55:22]  It was about a lot of things and definitely touched on Charlie too.
[00:55:25]  And he and I had a long talk that night.
[00:55:27]  It was actually a great show.
[00:55:30]  Here is Tucker describing his discussion behind the scenes with Charlie.
[00:55:37]  Now, before I play this, Tucker would come under withering criticism for what he said at the turning point event.
[00:55:43]  He did criticize Israel.
[00:55:46]  He also suggested he thought that Epstein was a Mossad spy, something I speculated could be true in my own remarks too.
[00:55:53]  I mean, I had no idea and I made that clear, but to me at the time, it made sense.
[00:55:57]  We've since had many discussions about whether it does make sense.
[00:56:00]  Alan Dershowitz, who represented Epstein, has said Epstein denied that to him directly and Alan would have used that if he could have to get him off.
[00:56:08]  Ehud Barak has said it wasn't true and he used to run the IDF in addition to Israel, but he was also extremely close with Epstein.
[00:56:14]  So take it for what it's worth.
[00:56:16]  Okay.
[00:56:18]  Tucker got criticized by the pro-Israel crowd for his remarks at the turning point event.
[00:56:24]  Charlie also had threats from donors thereafter saying, if you don't get rid of Tucker Carlson, like we're done.
[00:56:32]  And he had received some threats about that even before Tucker's appearance.
[00:56:35]  And he said, well, I'm bringing him anyway.
[00:56:37]  And that's all been documented.
[00:56:39]  This is kind of water under the bridge, but I'm showing it to you for a different purpose.
[00:56:43]  Tucker on that broadcast said the following about his backstage conversations with Charlie before he went out there.
[00:56:53]  Before that speech that I gave in July, we had a conversation about this backstage, right before I went on.
[00:57:01]  And I was fulminating and getting all red in the face like I often do to my shame.
[00:57:06]  And I was mad thinking about this and thinking about the effort by the neocons in the United States to draw us in to another forever war with Iran.
[00:57:16]  Not a defense of Iran, of course.
[00:57:18]  It's merely an acknowledgement that we've done this before.
[00:57:21]  This happened in Iraq, which we entered into at the behest of those same foreign policy strategists and it didn't work.
[00:57:31]  And so I was going on at some length backstage with Charlie and I said, you know, probably not going to talk about that.
[00:57:39]  I'm not going to torture you.
[00:57:40]  I know your donors hate this when I say that.
[00:57:43]  And also Epstein was in the news and it was clear to me that Epstein's probably not like a Mossad agent or something, but Epstein clearly had contact with Israeli intelligence and American intelligence and French intelligence, but the only one you're not allowed to talk about is Israeli intelligence.
[00:57:59]  But it seemed true to me, and I had done some work on that.
[00:58:02]  I knew a bunch of people pretty close to that story.
[00:58:04]  So I thought that.
[00:58:06]  And I said that to Charlie.
[00:58:07]  And I said, but I'm not going to say that because I don't want to make your donors mad.
[00:58:10]  I know.
[00:58:10]  It's just going to be like an endless flurry of text telling you to stop or you're going to lose a bunch of funding.
[00:58:17]  And he looked at me, I'll never forget it, and said, go all the way.
[00:58:22]  Do it.
[00:58:23]  Go all the way.
[00:58:23]  I said, man, a lot of things I can talk about.
[00:58:26]  I don't need to talk about that.
[00:58:27]  And he said, do it.
[00:58:29]  So I did it.
[00:58:32]  And here's the thing, Stu.
[00:58:34]  I was recently going through some old pictures to find one of me and Charlie that I knew we took at that event.
[00:58:42]  And not only did I find pictures of me and Charlie, but I found a video of me, Tucker, and Charlie speaking backstage right before Tucker went out.
[00:58:57]  Tucker and I were talking.
[00:58:59]  Charlie came over and interrupted for just a second.
[00:59:03]  And you can hear him on this tape, which I've listened to many times.
[00:59:06]  It's very clear on my phone, less clear here, probably as we play it.
[00:59:09]  But he says to Tucker, go Max.
[00:59:13]  He interrupts the conversation because he has to say to Tucker something.
[00:59:16]  And what was so important to him to tell Tucker was, go, go Max.
[00:59:21]  Here it is.
[00:59:30]  It's quick.
[00:59:31]  It just happens to be on tape.
[00:59:33]  And it backs up what Tucker said.
[00:59:36]  And so I just think we need to be realistic.
[00:59:40]  Charlie understood what was happening to the conservative movement over Israel.
[00:59:46]  He probably understood it better than any of us because he absolutely loved Israel.
[00:59:49]  And yet he represented and was of young people.
[00:59:54]  He was young.
[00:59:56]  That was his constituency.
[00:59:57]  That's where he spent all of his time.
[00:59:59]  And he knew that even on the right side of the aisle, they had turned and were turning on Israel.
[01:00:05]  And knowing all of that, he told Tucker to go out there and do all the things Tucker did.
[01:00:11]  Go Max.
[01:00:12]  He said, now, why did he do that?
[01:00:14]  Because he knew there was a faction within their conservative movement that needed a voice.
[01:00:20]  They needed somebody to put their thoughts and their complaints and their objections into words in a public setting and not just cede the whole argument to the other side, which has been dominating conservative thought and media forever, you know, the Mark Levins of the world.
[01:00:38]  And so it's one of the many reasons why I really object to this attempt to otherwise snuff out the voice of Tucker Carlson.
[01:00:48]  Charlie knew exactly where Tucker stood on these issues and wanted him, and I quote, to go Max.
[01:00:56]  The answer to what is happening right now in at, you know, on the conservative half of the aisle is not to silence Tucker, to diminish him to the point where he doesn't have followers.
[01:01:07]  Not that that's possible, you lunatics, or to try to delegitimize Tucker.
[01:01:14]  If anything, Tucker is a remaining voice for Charlie, whose views were changing himself.
[01:01:23]  So I have nothing against Ben saying all the things he feels or more neo-Connie people feeling that or pro-Israel people saying all I think they should say that.
[01:01:32]  And I understand perfectly where they're coming from.
[01:01:35]  But there is another reasoned, passionate point of view.
[01:01:39]  And Tucker represents that.
[01:01:41]  And that's what he's been doing on his show.
[01:01:43]  It rubbed some people the wrong way, but it didn't rub Charlie the wrong way.
[01:01:47]  In fact, he wanted more of it.
[01:01:50]  Your thoughts on it.
[01:01:52]  Yeah, I mean, there's a lot there.
[01:01:54]  I think, you know, We don't have to speculate as to what Charlie believed about having Tucker's voice in the conversation, right?
[01:02:03]  He was very clear about that in text messages late in his life that have come to light.
[01:02:08]  I mean, he was upset that people didn't want him to have Tucker at turning point events.
[01:02:16]  And knowing that he would really go for it, that it wasn't going to be milquetoast Tucker.
[01:02:22]  Yeah.
[01:02:23]  Yeah.
[01:02:24]  Yes.
[01:02:25]  And, but, and also, like, we know even videos of Charlie late in life talking very positively about Israel as well, being very offended by those who were infected by sort of an anti-Semitism woke virus that we know he separated from what Tucker believed because he wouldn't have wanted Tucker at those events if he thought he was that person.
[01:02:48]  I think like, you know, there's a lot, we've thrown around a lot of names here and, you know, a lot of them I really like, you know, frankly, you know, certainly probably agree with most of them on most of these things that they talk about with some exceptions.
[01:03:00]  But like, I think maybe the biggest issue here is tonally and how we talk about this, because I see this stuff on my feet all the time.
[01:03:10]  I follow most of the people we talked about and a lot more that are involved in this conversation.
[01:03:14]  And I wonder about the effectiveness of everybody just killing each other.
[01:03:19]  Like, you know, everybody hammering each other conversations.
[01:03:22]  Rhetorically.
[01:03:23]  Yes.
[01:03:24]  I know, I apparently in the world of Democratic donors, I have to make that very clear.
[01:03:28]  I'm talking rhetorically here.
[01:03:33]  Everybody hammering each other all the time with their views.
[01:03:35]  And like, I understand these are important and they're passionate topics.
[01:03:38]  But one of the things I thought Charlie really brought to the table in this world was the ability to have these conversations respectfully, even when that bridge, he had to bridge large gaps.
[01:03:50]  I mean, he really was very good at that specific thing, among other things.
[01:03:55]  But that conversation that he was able to bring a lot of different people who thought of themselves as conservatives into a very large tent, if you will, to have those conversations respectfully but passionately.
[01:04:09]  And I know Tucker recently kind of apologized for the way he framed his comments on Christian Zionists.
[01:04:17]  He said he didn't mean it, which by the way, I said that.
[01:04:21]  I mean, like, I was interviewed by the Daily Mail right after.
[01:04:23]  I said, I guarantee you he did not mean that he hates Christian Zionists because I'm one and I know he adores me.
[01:04:28]  Like we're very good friends.
[01:04:29]  And he said to Dave Smith, I didn't mean that.
[01:04:32]  That was bullshit.
[01:04:33]  I just had like these neocons in my head, like whatever.
[01:04:35]  I can't remember who he named it.
[01:04:36]  And he's like, that's what I was thinking about.
[01:04:37]  Maybe Ted Cruz, he might have mentioned.
[01:04:40]  Yeah.
[01:04:40]  And I think, you know, and you could tell like there's a tonal difference of the way he talked to Ted Cruz and the way he talked to some, you know, some of the other people that.
[01:04:47]  Ted Cruz inferred he was an anti-Semite within the first four minutes of the interview.
[01:04:51]  So if you watch that interview, you can see Tucker kind of turned out that they were like, yeah, they don't like each other.
[01:04:57]  And like, it's okay to have those conversations too.
[01:05:00]  It's not like he can never be mean or never be sarcastic or never be a wise ass.
[01:05:03]  I do it all the time.
[01:05:05]  I'm totally guilty of breaking my own rules on this at times.
[01:05:08]  But I do think that like I know people on both sides of like Israel, for example, I talk to them all the time.
[01:05:17]  And, you know, I don't agree with some of them.
[01:05:19]  I agree with some of them.
[01:05:20]  But you're able to have normal human conversations.
[01:05:23]  This goes back to what we saw you highlighted earlier with Jimmy Kimmel and his wife.
[01:05:27]  Like if you have a view that everybody who disagrees with you on a topic is just basically subhuman, this is how you, how these problems grow, not contract.
[01:05:39]  And I, you know, a lot of people I love who are super passionate on both of these sides go at each other in my feet.
[01:05:45]  I'm following both of them.
[01:05:46]  I like both of them and they're just hammering each other constantly.

=== Leftist Tactics vs America First (14:56) ===

[01:05:49]  You get nothing out of that.
[01:05:50]  And I think like if you look at Tucker, for example, I mean, Tucker's had, he would describe he's had different views over time.
[01:05:57]  You know, you go back, people keep pulling up these clips of him in 2002.
[01:06:00]  He'd be the first to tell you that.
[01:06:02]  Exactly.
[01:06:02]  He has much different views.
[01:06:03]  You know, like he was at the Cato Institute for a while.
[01:06:06]  You know, like he was, he was at different stages of his life.
[01:06:10]  He's believed different things.
[01:06:11]  It's hard for me to believe a guy like Tucker, who has really strong views, is going to be won over by people yelling at him on the internet.
[01:06:19]  Oh, to the contrary.
[01:06:21]  Right.
[01:06:21]  It's going to be the exact opposite.
[01:06:23]  He may be won over to some of these views, some of your views.
[01:06:27]  If you talk to him respectfully, maybe behind the scenes, maybe treat, you know, you've talked to him.
[01:06:32]  I don't, I doubt you agree with him on everything, Megan, but you've had respectful conversations.
[01:06:36]  He's come on our show.
[01:06:37]  We've talked to him.
[01:06:38]  You know, I remember he came back after Russia and we were like, I don't know, that whole Russia thing, like the grocery stores, do you really believe that?
[01:06:44]  And he explained it in a different way than he had initially phrased it.
[01:06:47]  And it was, you know, I think we had more in common, though I still would disagree with him on that topic.
[01:06:54]  Like you can have conversations with that and people can be moved.
[01:06:57]  That's how you actually can win people over.
[01:07:00]  If you scream at them, if you just call them names, you get nowhere with them, especially with a person like Tucker who's been doing this his entire life.
[01:07:08]  Like he, you know, it just seems to me a leftist tactic.
[01:07:11]  It's a leftist tactic to try to say like, you're out.
[01:07:15]  I don't like your opinion on X, so you're out.
[01:07:17]  And I'm going to push you out by labeling you this terrible thing because that's what the left does.
[01:07:23]  They label you the terrible thing and then you're out of polite society.
[01:07:27]  It's a leftist tactic.
[01:07:28]  I really object to it.
[01:07:30]  It's also a leftist tactic to try to make somebody say something, which is also being done to me.
[01:07:36]  And all the more reason why I just won't.
[01:07:38]  You know, I've said before, like I'm not going to go after Tucker.
[01:07:41]  I'm not going to go after Ben either.
[01:07:42]  I'm good friends with them.
[01:07:44]  I'm just not doing that.
[01:07:44]  So I don't care if you don't like it.
[01:07:46]  Candace is not a good friend of mine.
[01:07:48]  I know her a little, but we're not friends, but I'm not going to go after her for a variety of reasons.
[01:07:52]  Number one, we, before this whole thing started, had a very nice like connection over something.
[01:07:58]  It's personal.
[01:07:59]  And I have no desire to stick a knife in her.
[01:08:01]  And number two, the more you insist I must, the more I want to tell you to go pound sand.
[01:08:07]  And now that it's like the stakes, you must, you have to.
[01:08:11]  No, it's a no.
[01:08:12]  Okay, BLMers.
[01:08:14]  I didn't raise the fist and I won't be saying whatever you want me to say.
[01:08:18]  To your, you know, chagrin, I might have said something.
[01:08:21]  I don't know.
[01:08:21]  I don't keep a daily monitor on other podcast hosts, but if they cross on my newsfeed and I find it interesting, I might comment on it.
[01:08:27]  But now, now that you've made it, the stakes of our relationship that I must, now I really won't.
[01:08:33]  And you know what?
[01:08:34]  I'll be fine.
[01:08:35]  No, wait, but I want to get back to the Tucker thing because it's also true that Charlie hated Nick Fuentes and Nick Fuentes hated Charlie.
[01:08:45]  And Charlie definitely did not want to see Nick Fuentes platformed or in any way emerging as like a reasonable figure in polite society.
[01:08:55]  And I'm sure he would not have liked the fact that Tucker interviewed him at first.
[01:09:00]  And he probably would have sent Tucker a text saying like, why?
[01:09:03]  But I do believe once explained to Charlie why, he might have softened on it.
[01:09:10]  And even if he didn't, he had nothing but respect for Tucker.
[01:09:13]  He looked up to Tucker.
[01:09:14]  He looked up to him.
[01:09:15]  He was a lot older than Charlie.
[01:09:17]  He was like a mentor.
[01:09:18]  Charlie was.
[01:09:19]  Sorry, Tucker was to Charlie.
[01:09:21]  And it would have been, I think, something that Charlie would have come to understand and listen to that Tucker, I think, was trying to reach this young man as maybe only Tucker can.
[01:09:34]  He's got a very similar audience of young men to say, we don't do collectivism on the right.
[01:09:42]  It's evil.
[01:09:43]  We don't put whole groups of people into categories and then demonize them because we have a problem with one or two.
[01:09:52]  It's unholy.
[01:09:54]  And if you watch that interview that he did with him, I personally am convinced it was about Tucker trying to reach Fuentes, not Tucker trying to launch Fuentes in a bigger and more profound way onto the national scale.
[01:10:08]  And by the way, if that's your goal, it's not helpful to say, you're an anti-Semite, you're a bigot.
[01:10:13]  Here are the 25 most incendiary things you've done.
[01:10:16]  And that's not really something Tucker ever does.
[01:10:18]  He didn't do that with Andrew Tate when he had him on.
[01:10:21]  He didn't do that with the president of Iran.
[01:10:23]  It's just not him.
[01:10:25]  I am that way.
[01:10:26]  I am prosecutorial for sure, which is generally why these people won't sit with me.
[01:10:30]  But he has a different style.
[01:10:31]  So I just think people are totally understanding what the whole thing was about.
[01:10:34]  And I think in some ways understand misunderstanding, they're misunderstanding what this whole thing is about.
[01:10:38]  They're misunderstanding Charlie to a bit too.
[01:10:41]  Anyway, spent more time on it than I expected to, but I'll give you the last word.
[01:10:45]  Yeah, it's really interesting.
[01:10:47]  You know, I've seen Tucker go.
[01:10:49]  I mean, Tucker does go after people sometimes.
[01:10:51]  I think he was like that with Ted at some level.
[01:10:54]  He went after him.
[01:10:54]  He was trying to corner him into certain positions.
[01:10:56]  And I like that Tucker approach at times, particularly when he does it certainly with people on the left.
[01:11:01]  There's a good part of me that would have loved to have seen that approach with him going after Nick Fuentes in that way for some of those considerations.
[01:11:07]  But if the goal were, as I said, would that have been well?
[01:11:11]  Yeah, that's exactly what I wanted to say.
[01:11:12]  Cause I, you know, as someone who's been in this conservative media space for a while, I know a lot of conservative media executives who have at there is a you among the younger conservative set, there is a group of people that I, and I've heard some of these executives describe it this way, of people who are, they were worried about they might get lost.
[01:11:36]  They might go down the road of real anti-Semitism.
[01:11:41]  And they are being sucked in by some of these online forces we discussed earlier.
[01:11:45]  And there is an opportunity with a person like that, especially as they're developing and they're trying to find their way.
[01:11:51]  We all have views that are way different than we did at 20 and 22 and 23.
[01:11:55]  And the way the media has worked is it's launched a lot of these people through social media into people that have audiences of millions and millions of people who get rewarded with the stronger and more outlandish and more controversial takes that they have.
[01:12:13]  I was all about antagonizing everybody when I was 20 years old.
[01:12:17]  Like I thought the funniest thing in the world, whatever I say something that would piss somebody off.
[01:12:21]  Yes, I know.
[01:12:22]  It's hard to believe.
[01:12:22]  It's hard to believe.
[01:12:24]  But when I was in that growing up, like, you know, and coming of age politically and as an adult, like you struggle with that stuff.
[01:12:33]  And I've known people who are in the conservative media who've looked and targeted people and said, this person's really talented and they have great views, but I'm worried about where they will go.
[01:12:42]  I will try to bring them in.
[01:12:43]  Now, I don't know that Fuentes is one of those guys.
[01:12:46]  I think, in my view, probably not one of those things that I think that one sailed, but that may very well have been what he was trying to do.
[01:12:54]  And, you know, look, I've had Tucker, Glenn and I have had him on the show many times.
[01:12:59]  We've done events with Tucker.
[01:13:01]  I've never sensed from him this, you know, this terrible human being that I see described.
[01:13:07]  He seems to be thoughtful, but he is in an interesting place.
[01:13:11]  Like some of the stuff, you know, some of the content that he does is not, it's not, I like the Cato era Tucker, maybe a little bit more.
[01:13:18]  But that doesn't mean that everyone gets angry and throws everybody out of the movement.
[01:13:22]  It's much more effective to talk to people.
[01:13:24]  As you mentioned, probably what Charlie would have done is send a text and say, hey, I don't know.
[01:13:28]  Are you sure about this part?
[01:13:30]  He didn't do it when Charlie was around, so we don't know.
[01:13:34]  But I think that there is a line that we can kind of, we can all see, and at the very least, shouldn't unite us to resist what the left is trying to do to us with all of this.
[01:13:44]  These conversations are not.
[01:13:45]  We can't become them.
[01:13:46]  We can become them.
[01:13:48]  And we don't want to give them what they want either.
[01:13:51]  What they want is all of us torn apart.
[01:13:53]  And so the coalition that Charlie was trying to legitimately build with a lot of these exact names disintegrates.
[01:14:00]  That does not help us.
[01:14:01]  It does not help the movement.
[01:14:02]  And it doesn't help the country.
[01:14:04]  It doesn't help our children.
[01:14:06]  So we have to figure out a way to get through this.
[01:14:08]  But having these conversations, I think, in a respectful way, like I know you've tried to do, is, I think, the best path forward.
[01:14:16]  Yes.
[01:14:16]  I mean, that's really what I want.
[01:14:18]  I have so many wonderful, like suffering Jewish friends who really are desperate themselves to see Israel out of the news.
[01:14:28]  They don't want Israel or their religion being bandied about and discussed and debated.
[01:14:34]  It's like, they just want to go back to being like normal, private people whose connection to Israel, if they have one, or whose religion isn't constantly being debated, and who aren't seeing their fellow Jewish people get murdered on American streets, like we saw in Washington, D.C. Not to mention the pain that the whole thing with 10.7 and the two years that followed has caused them.
[01:14:56]  And then people on the other side who have just, you know, they've had it.
[01:14:59]  They don't want to see any more risk come by America getting sucked into foreign conflicts like we saw with Iran and so on.
[01:15:05]  It's like this thing just needs to end.
[01:15:06]  It needs to end.
[01:15:07]  Now, I will say one other point since we kept going.
[01:15:13]  Turning point is having an event in December.
[01:15:15]  I'll be there.
[01:15:16]  Lots of us are going.
[01:15:18]  And Tucker apparently asked Mark Levin to debate him at the turning point event, or so says Mark Levin.
[01:15:30]  Mark Levin went public with, by reading Tucker's texts saying, you know, he asked me to do this thing with him, and then just went off about how over his dead body would he ever share the stage with this disgusting anti-Semite and like just a vile attack on Tucker, whom he's literally been comparing to a Nazi.
[01:15:56]  And I just think this is like, this is so far beyond.
[01:16:00]  We just finished like a several year period where we tried to make clear to the left that those terms are not acceptable in the public dialogue.
[01:16:11]  They are too incendiary.
[01:16:13]  They're going to get somebody killed like President Trump or Charlie Kirk.
[01:16:19]  With him, it was fascist.
[01:16:21]  With Trump, it was both.
[01:16:23]  And we should not be resurrecting terms like that to attack or undermine fellow conservatives with whom we have a disagreement on Israel.
[01:16:34]  Here's just a little of that.
[01:16:39]  Then we have on the fascistic, neo-Nazi, radical right.
[01:16:44]  And by the way, I'm not talking about constitutional conservatives.
[01:16:49]  Not in the least.
[01:16:50]  We're not on the radical right.
[01:16:52]  We're right in the center.
[01:16:54]  And I don't mean ideologically.
[01:16:56]  I mean we're right in the center.
[01:16:58]  We support the Constitution, the Declaration, the founding, and everything that was done to create this nation.
[01:17:04]  How can we be right wing?
[01:17:06]  Right wing of what?
[01:17:09]  These people are not America first.
[01:17:13]  America first isn't evil over good.
[01:17:16]  America first isn't tyranny over liberty.
[01:17:20]  America first isn't sounding like the Marxist, Islamist, anti-American Jew haters.
[01:17:27]  That's not American at all.
[01:17:29]  That's not America first, second, or third.
[01:17:32]  No, they're aiding and abetting people who want to destroy the country.
[01:17:37]  They want to destroy the country.
[01:17:42]  Yeah, fascistic neo-Nazi radical right.
[01:17:47]  And that is no way to be talking about Tucker.
[01:17:53]  It's too much.
[01:17:54]  It's too far.
[01:17:56]  It's dangerous.
[01:17:57]  And honestly, like I know Tucker and Ben both, they are both under serious threats.
[01:18:02]  Like to be honest, I am too.
[01:18:05]  Like it's, it's, this is a very volatile time.
[01:18:09]  I don't like to talk about it.
[01:18:10]  I'm not going to talk about it, but I'm just saying I know both of them are under serious threat.
[01:18:13]  So just fucking put a lid on it, fucking Mark Levin, because I guarantee you the wrong people listen to that and we could have another powder keg on our hands and you don't want that.
[01:18:24]  You don't want that on your conscience.
[01:18:26]  Just have a debate like a man on principle.
[01:18:29]  And why don't you show up at the turning point event and debate him?
[01:18:33]  Just debate him.
[01:18:33]  That would be so good for this conservative movement you claim to love so much.
[01:18:37]  You know who's at the turning point events?
[01:18:38]  Future conservatives and current conservatives, young people, young people.
[01:18:45]  This would be a chance for you to influence somebody under the age of 70.
[01:18:48]  You should show up there and debate.
[01:18:51]  Why wouldn't you debate?
[01:18:52]  He's so disgusting.
[01:18:53]  You can't debate him.
[01:18:54]  I can see not debating Nick Fuentes, to be honest.
[01:18:56]  I can.
[01:18:57]  But Tucker, he's so far outside the mainstream.
[01:19:02]  All the Jewish friends I have in my head who text me all the time, like, this is their, this is my father.
[01:19:06]  They would all debate Tucker.
[01:19:07]  They would love to debate Tucker.
[01:19:09]  They've got their facts ready to go all day.
[01:19:12]  Why won't he do it?
[01:19:13]  And why is he sounding like a leftist shill with his rhetoric, just trying to dismiss people as like these horrible bigoted people who I need to be?
[01:19:20]  You can't even stand next to them on a stage.
[01:19:22]  Stu, this is not good for America First or the conservative movement.
[01:19:27]  And it's mana from heaven for progressives.
[01:19:33]  Yeah, it's, it's, you know, look, you know, Mark is, is on Blaze TV.
[01:19:37]  That's where I work.
[01:19:38]  We have people who are very much opposed to Mark also at Blaze TV.
[01:19:43]  You know, we, it's a, it is, it is a, you know, conservative movement has a wide mind on this.
[01:19:48]  And I agree with you.
[01:19:50]  Like, I don't, you know, I, I think the debate would be great.
[01:19:53]  I'd actually really like to see a debate between Mark and Tucker.
[01:19:56]  I think that would be actually really interesting.
[01:19:58]  And I, you know, I agree, as I stated, I think tonally that it's not a helpful approach.
[01:20:04]  I understand, you know, there is a real concern, especially by people who have, you know, put a lot of thought into what has happened over history when it comes to this particular issue.
[01:20:14]  You really want to make sure you don't go down these roads.
[01:20:17]  And I, you know, as you pointed out, like, I don't think there's any, I don't think there's any value in hearing Nick Fuentes' thoughts on these things personally.
[01:20:24]  That's just, you know, my thought.
[01:20:25]  I know, you know, Ben Shapiro, for, I remember what year it was, he was the victim of the most attacks on his, on racial or anti-Semitic or religious-based attacks on the internet.
[01:20:39]  He was the biggest victim of that from the alt-right.
[01:20:43]  From the alt-right.

=== Stop Government Takeover of Cards (03:27) ===

[01:20:46]  Exactly.
[01:20:46]  And so, like, I can see he's probably legitimately spent millions of dollars on security to protect his life and his family's life because of these threats.
[01:20:57]  So I get why the passions can be really high on this.
[01:21:02]  I don't know that any of that, you know, I think a reasoned debate between people who are in the movement can be really helpful and doesn't escalate this stuff.
[01:21:13]  That's the stuff that I think Charlie was trying to put together.
[01:21:16]  I think Charlie would have loved an event where those two guys argued those things.
[01:21:20]  So I think that would be a great event.
[01:21:22]  Maybe, you know, maybe Mark will change his mind.
[01:21:24]  I think the problem, though.
[01:21:25]  Maybe Ben will do it.
[01:21:26]  Maybe Ben.
[01:21:27]  Yeah, maybe Ben will do it.
[01:21:28]  I think that everyone's been, and I've watched, I think, in the past, you know, debate type conversations between Ben and Tucker, where they've had, you know, conversations about capitalism and really.
[01:21:40]  Having just come off a week of talking to them both for hours, I don't feel so great about it.
[01:21:45]  I'm going to be honest.
[01:21:46]  I did my best on camera and behind the camera to try to broker something.
[01:21:51]  I don't feel hopeful, but you know what?
[01:21:54]  It's December.
[01:21:55]  I think it's December 19th.
[01:21:57]  We're getting close to Christmas in Hanukkah.
[01:22:00]  A different spirit infuses the air.
[01:22:02]  And maybe, maybe they'll, you know, Tucker's, I think, willing to do it.
[01:22:06]  I mean, obviously, if he'd be across from Mark Levin, I think he'd be across from Ben.
[01:22:10]  I hope they do it.
[01:22:12]  I hope we can just try to find a way back to each other on the right half of the aisle.
[01:22:17]  The real political enemy is over there on the left.
[01:22:22]  And they are the ones we need to fight.
[01:22:24]  Okay, that's enough about that.
[01:22:26]  An hour and a half in.
[01:22:27]  That's it.
[01:22:28]  But we've got to get to the BBC.
[01:22:30]  It's my favorite story of the day.
[01:22:32]  We'll pick it up right after this quick break with Stu Bergeer.
[01:22:35]  Don't go away.
[01:22:36]  As President Trump is settling into his new administration, one of the top Democrats in Congress aiming to undermine the Trump agenda is Senator Dick Durbin.
[01:22:45]  And according to our sponsor, the Electronic Payments Coalition, Senator Durbin has a new scheme, a government takeover of your credit card.
[01:22:53]  Today, Americans have thousands of choices in credit cards, but they say Senator Durbin's plan will result in less competition and less security.
[01:23:01]  And that means more risk for your credit and identity.
[01:23:04]  Learn more at guardyourcar.com and consider telling your senators to stop Dick Durbin's government takeover of your credit card before it's too late.
[01:23:15]  Streaming November 16th on Paramount Plus, it is the return of Landman, TV's biggest phenomenon from Taylor Sheridan, co-creator of Yellowstone.
[01:23:26]  Academy Award winner Billy Bob Thornton is back as Tommy Norris and managing higher stakes than ever before.
[01:23:32]  It features an all-star cast, including Academy Award nominees Demi Moore, Andy Garcia, and Sam Elliott.
[01:23:39]  In the wake of his former boss's passing, tensions come to a head as Tommy and Demi Moore's character Cami Miller struggle to maintain control of M.Tech's oil.
[01:23:48]  And with his father, played by Sam Elliott coming back into his life, Tommy must juggle both his roles as an oil man and a family man as pressure builds and his worlds collide.
[01:23:58]  Don't miss the hit series everyone's talking about.
[01:24:01]  Landman's new season starts streaming November 16th only on Paramount Plus.
[01:24:11]  We are going on the road.

=== Editing Speeches to Mislead Listeners (15:36) ===

[01:24:13]  Join me live.
[01:24:14]  Megan Kelly Live, 10 stops across the country.
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[01:24:34]  It's Megan Kelly Live, presented by YReFi and SiriusXM.
[01:24:38]  Go to MeganKelly.com to get your tickets now.
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[01:24:56]  Subscribe now and get your first three months for free.
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[01:25:09]  Offer details apply.
[01:25:15]  Back with me now, Stu Bergier, host of Stu Does America.
[01:25:19]  Stew, just when you thought we had the most biased, disgusting, hard left media in the world, enter the BBC with a hold my beer moment.
[01:25:31]  It has come out only now, even though this sin happened a week before the presidential election here in America back in November of 2024, because a whistleblower internal to the BBC has come forward with public accusation, private accusations that are now public.
[01:25:49]  that he made against the BBC.
[01:25:51]  It sounds like he was a member of their standard and practices board, like the group that oversees basically trying to stop the BBC from getting sued and tries to make them stay neutral on their reporting.
[01:26:03]  And he noticed several problems and wrote, sounds like a barn burner of a letter to them saying, you guys are a hot mess.
[01:26:09]  There are a lot of things you're doing wrong.
[01:26:11]  And now it's gone public and he's whistleblowing.
[01:26:14]  The most severe of which was an edit they made in a quote documentary they were doing about the American election in which they played this soundbite.
[01:26:25]  We ran this on an AM update of President Trump allegedly, okay, three years earlier in January 2021, allegedly calling for violence at the U.S. Capitol.
[01:26:37]  Watch.
[01:26:39]  We're going to walk down to the Capitol and I'll be there with you.
[01:26:44]  And we fight.
[01:26:46]  We fight like hell.
[01:26:47]  And if you don't fight like hell, you're not going to have a country anymore.
[01:26:52]  Except that's not what he said at all.
[01:26:55]  He did say the very first part that you hear in there where he says, we're going to walk down to the Capitol.
[01:27:03]  And then 54 minutes later, he said the part about, I'll be there with you and we fight.
[01:27:11]  We fight like hell.
[01:27:12]  Look at this.
[01:27:12]  This is laid out in pages of the transcript.
[01:27:16]  One, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight.
[01:27:20]  So that's 8, 16.
[01:27:22]  24 pages later is where he said the thing about we fight like hell.
[01:27:27]  They took those two bits of tape, butted them together as though it was a stream of consciousness by Donald Trump in an effort to make it look like he was calling for violence.
[01:27:39]  It is by any measure grossly unethical, a cardinal sin of journalism.
[01:27:45]  Even a first-year reporter knows you don't do that.
[01:27:50]  It's dicey, even if in the same answer, let's say the answer is a paragraph long and it has five sentences.
[01:27:57]  It's dicey even to take sentence one and butt it with sentence five.
[01:28:01]  But you can do it if two, three, and four kind of suck and they were stumbling and it's the same point.
[01:28:06]  You're not misrepresenting.
[01:28:07]  But you go 24 pages later to pull the most incendiary thing he said and plop it up against the beginning to make it look like he called for violence and you are 100% going to get sued for defamation because you have violated somebody's rights.
[01:28:26]  And that's what's about to happen to the BBC.
[01:28:29]  Trump said, I want an apology, I want a retraction, and I want a big fat check, or I'm going to sue you for a billion dollars later this week.
[01:28:41]  The BBC, understanding he's got them by the balls, gave one of those things, an apology, not a retraction, not a check, but the two top officials of the BBC have voluntarily stepped down.
[01:28:58]  They're both gone, which is extraordinary, by the way.
[01:29:01]  They've been through some other scandals lately too.
[01:29:03]  But they're both gone now in response to all of this.
[01:29:07]  So even they recognize this is a big effing deal, to quote Joe Biden.
[01:29:13]  Your thoughts on the egregiousness of this, I don't even want to say mistake, behavior.
[01:29:19]  Yeah, I mean, far more egregious than anything that he's, I think, even sued these American companies over.
[01:29:27]  I mean, that is blatantly trying to mislead your audience into thinking he said something that he didn't say.
[01:29:33]  You know, we've seen some of that here.
[01:29:35]  You know, the thing that the Find People on Both Sides debate was an interesting version of this where you saw a lot of editing out of not the Nazis, not those people, but just taking these clips immediately out of the speech and claiming he said something else.
[01:29:52]  You know, it's he's won these things.
[01:29:55]  He keeps winning these things.
[01:29:56]  He keeps winning over and over again because I think there was a little bit of a change in the media from at least when I started in it, where it was always left-wing, right?
[01:30:07]  Like it was always left-wing.
[01:30:08]  There was always people out there who were left-wing and they were left-leaning people that made left-leaning decisions and promoted claims that phrased them and framed them in ways that I didn't like.
[01:30:17]  I think with Donald Trump, you can call it TDS if you want, Trump derangement syndrome.
[01:30:23]  But I think more central to that, there's this idea on the left that these times are too serious.
[01:30:28]  We can't, those old rules of journalism cannot be respected anymore because this is too much.
[01:30:36]  It's too serious.
[01:30:37]  We have to break all those rules.
[01:30:40]  I think you saw that with the Hunter Biden laptop story, frankly, when they, you know, I think normally in the past, it would be, they bring up Hunter Biden.
[01:30:46]  They would say that, you know, it was misleading or maybe fake and that was it.
[01:30:50]  They just didn't tell anybody about it at all.
[01:30:52]  They acted as if it didn't even exist.
[01:30:55]  They were so focused and became the activists inside of them instead of left-wing people doing journalism with some sort of loose respect for those rules.
[01:31:06]  That's gone out the window.
[01:31:07]  And what makes it incredibly dangerous if you happen to be the BBC is they don't have the First Amendment protections that most of our media do.
[01:31:17]  I mean, I think you can argue even with the cases where these companies in the U.S. have stepped up and said, okay, like we're going to donate to your presidential museum or whatever it is because we don't want to go down this road, admitting that they made mistakes and did things that were wrong.
[01:31:34]  They still had First Amendment protections.
[01:31:36]  And I think some of them may have actually still won in court if it had gone all the way down the road, just because we really do prioritize free speech here.
[01:31:44]  That's not the way it is in the UK.
[01:31:47]  It's not the way it is in Europe.
[01:31:49]  It's not the way it is in a lot of other places.
[01:31:50]  They don't have those First Amendment protections with their media.
[01:31:53]  So when they do things like that, they are incredibly vulnerable to very big checks.
[01:31:58]  And the BBC, I think, might be writing one soon.
[01:32:01]  Yeah, they're 100% going to be writing a big check.
[01:32:03]  The only question is what the number is going to be.
[01:32:05]  Zero doubt in my mind about it.
[01:32:07]  Here is, you know, the Telegraph broke this story of the whistleblower.
[01:32:12]  This is their associate editor at the Telegraph, Gordon Rayner, explaining the edit and their reporting.
[01:32:20]  Watch.
[01:32:21]  They played the following clip.
[01:32:24]  We're going to walk down to the Capitol and I'll be there with you.
[01:32:30]  And we fight.
[01:32:31]  We fight like hell.
[01:32:33]  But Trump didn't, in fact, say this at all.
[01:32:36]  The BBC spliced together two clips that took place 54 minutes apart.
[01:32:43]  So let's go through it again.
[01:32:47]  We're going to walk down to the Capitol and I'll be there with you.
[01:32:52]  Now, see there, between Capitol and that's a cut.
[01:32:58]  Here's what Trump actually said.
[01:32:59]  We're going to walk down to the Capitol and we're going to cheer on our brave senators and congressmen and women.
[01:33:11]  It's different.
[01:33:13]  It wasn't until nearly an hour later that he then said the second part of the BBC's version.
[01:33:19]  We're going to walk down to the Capitol.
[01:33:26]  And we fight.
[01:33:27]  We fight like hell.
[01:33:29]  Oh, so dishonest.
[01:33:31]  And they cut out the party said up front in that part like that they chopped to butt it towards the end, where he said, and I want it to be peaceful and patriotic.
[01:33:41]  We're going to go peacefully and patriotically.
[01:33:43]  That didn't make the cut at all.
[01:33:44]  That was removed to try to make him sound like he was trying to incite INCITE violence.
[01:33:52]  This is the same dishonest news organization that about a year ago, Stu, ran this clip, which is making another resurgence right now on X for obvious reasons.
[01:34:09]  Now, transgender woman's milk is just as good for babies as breast milk.
[01:34:14]  That's according to a letter from the medical director at University Hospital South Foundation Trust.
[01:34:21]  The claim was made as part of a response against campaign groups.
[01:34:24]  The trust referred to studies and the World Health Organization guidance, including one case which found what it called no observable effects in babies fed by induced lactation.
[01:34:36]  You're a disgusting fool who doesn't know what the fuck she's saying.
[01:34:39]  No skepticism whatsoever.
[01:34:42]  That trans milk, meaning a man who jacks himself up on hormones such that his chest can produce something that resembles some sort of fluid, that's just as good for a baby as breast milk.
[01:34:55]  So I want them to pay.
[01:34:57]  I want them to pay so much it hurts.
[01:35:00]  And they actually bring somebody in there who understands facts and how they matter.
[01:35:05]  And that doesn't appear to include anybody who's at the top of that organization currently.
[01:35:12]  No.
[01:35:14]  I had missed the trans milk debate.
[01:35:18]  I will say, Megan, and you've illuminated me to that was the fact that that was even a thing.
[01:35:22]  I have to say I didn't even know.
[01:35:24]  So disgusting.
[01:35:24]  That was a thing.
[01:35:25]  That's it.
[01:35:25]  And the fact that that's what chest feeding is by a trans person.
[01:35:28]  Child abuse, infant abuse.
[01:35:31]  That's psychotic.
[01:35:33]  And quite clearly not.
[01:35:37]  There's no medical basis behind any of that.
[01:35:39]  That's just crazy nonsense.
[01:35:41]  They do deserve it.
[01:35:42]  I mean, the BBC's been bad on a lot of things for a long period of time.
[01:35:46]  And, you know, this is why I would argue I don't want any state-run media.
[01:35:49]  I don't think there's anything positive about that.
[01:35:52]  I have friends who are like, oh, gosh, no, the BBC is good.
[01:35:54]  No, they're not.
[01:35:56]  They do this type of stuff all the time.
[01:35:59]  And the Trump edit is really egregious because we all were there.
[01:36:03]  We all remember it.
[01:36:04]  We all watched the speech.
[01:36:05]  We all are very familiar with the things that he says and the arguments around it.
[01:36:09]  And the fact that they thought that they could get away with it.
[01:36:10]  I mean, maybe it's because they thought their audience wasn't as engaged in American politics.
[01:36:14]  And this is an easy way to paint the president because it probably agrees with a lot of the people watching over there.
[01:36:21]  But, you know, over here, you can't get away with that stuff, I don't think.
[01:36:25]  And the media has tried forever.
[01:36:27]  I think, you know, it's one of the things that, because I have some sensitivity.
[01:36:31]  This, I think you probably do as well, Megan, when it comes to a president of the United States going after media corporations and saying, hey, you know, you lied about me.
[01:36:40]  Because, you know, Obama would say that about us and Biden, I'm sure, probably did say that about us.
[01:36:46]  And that does concern me.
[01:36:49]  But the fact that he's been able to highlight these examples that are really egregious and hold these places accountable, I think might at least give them hesitation.
[01:36:58]  I don't need them to have the exact analysis I have or that you have about every issue.
[01:37:02]  I kind of expect them to be off the rails and to the left.
[01:37:05]  I can deal with that.
[01:37:06]  I'm an adult and I can deal with that.
[01:37:08]  But you can't lie to the American people constantly and be protected by these by these licenses and the way that they are.
[01:37:17]  They have to be held responsible at some level.
[01:37:20]  And at the very least, this is Trump's.
[01:37:22]  The taxpayers are funding these lies.
[01:37:24]  Yeah.
[01:37:25]  Trump is at least putting the fear into them on this stuff.
[01:37:27]  Hey, let's, you know, if you were a left-wing media executive and one of these reports was about to air, you'd say, wait a minute.
[01:37:33]  I don't want to get in the middle of this.
[01:37:35]  Let's make sure this is buttoned up.
[01:37:37]  Why are we editing two clips that are 54 minutes apart?
[01:37:39]  Just tell the truth.
[01:37:41]  If you think Donald Trump did a lot of things around January 6th that were bad, just make that case with the facts.
[01:37:47]  That's one of the things that I'm saying.
[01:37:48]  Why do we have to lie?
[01:37:49]  Yeah, totally agree.
[01:37:50]  And here's something I didn't know.
[01:37:52]  This is in National Review today entitled Troubles Mount for the British Biased Corporation.
[01:37:59]  It's 103 years old, the BBC.
[01:38:01]  It's the oldest global broadcaster.
[01:38:03]  It employs 21,000 people.
[01:38:05]  It recently drastically expanded its footprint into the United States through a partnership with PBS.
[01:38:11]  Its website attracts more than 60 million monthly visitors from America.
[01:38:15]  It is widely viewed by American viewers as impartial and authoritative.
[01:38:21]  They go on to write the British know better.
[01:38:24]  And they write about, you know, the number of examples of people who have, you know, complained about the BBC, have objected, have stopped paying that licensure fee as part of their taxes because they just will not support it.
[01:38:37]  And they go on to reference this case that we talked about a couple of days ago of Martine Croxall, who corrected her BBC script, which read something about pregnant people and changed it to, they mean women, who just got in trouble with the BBC.
[01:38:54]  Their executive complaints unit found that she had broken the BBC's impartiality rules by explaining that pregnant people means women.
[01:39:04]  You can't do that on the BBC, but you can say that chest feeding out of a man's chest is just as healthy as women's breastfeeding.
[01:39:14]  And you can say that Trump called for violence and take sound bites an hour apart and butt them together.
[01:39:21]  Like that sat there for a year and they would have gotten away with it had this whistleblower not come forward.
[01:39:26]  This is a disgusting, disgraceful, dishonest organization, Stu.
[01:39:30]  Like this is just as bad as anything we've seen here domestically.
[01:39:34]  Yeah, I mean, I think that example is as bad or worse than anything we've seen.
[01:39:38]  I think it also highlights a very interesting thing.
[01:39:41]  If they're coming here into the United States, which is, I think, a real problem with American culture in that we are very susceptible to British accents.

=== The Credibility of British Accents (01:12) ===

[01:39:49]  When we hear a British accent, we automatically find it credible.
[01:39:55]  We don't have anything said.
[01:39:57]  It's true.
[01:39:57]  It just feels that way.
[01:39:58]  I don't know what it is.
[01:39:59]  So I'm not sure.
[01:40:00]  They just sound smarter.
[01:40:02]  It's true.
[01:40:03]  I don't know what it is.
[01:40:03]  I do think that that is the perception.
[01:40:05]  When you come to perception, I mean, the American people know very little about what the coverage of the BBC is.
[01:40:10]  I mean, I've watched their climate coverage for years.
[01:40:13]  It makes my head explode.
[01:40:15]  Horrible.
[01:40:17]  But they just feel, that's the reason why polling shows that they're credible.
[01:40:21]  They sound British.
[01:40:23]  And to us, it doesn't matter who say it, Tony Blair, Dua Lipa, whoever has an English accent, we will basically believe.
[01:40:31]  Definitely Charles C.W. Cook, but that one is well-founded.
[01:40:33]  Yes, you will not go wrong.
[01:40:34]  Yeah, he sounds smart because he is.
[01:40:37]  Stuberger, you as well, my friend.
[01:40:39]  It was great to see you in Texas a week ago.
[01:40:42]  Loved meeting your wife.
[01:40:43]  Love having you on the show.
[01:40:46]  It was a lot of fun and great to see you.
[01:40:47]  And thanks so much for having me out.
[01:40:50]  All right, to be continued, and we will be back tomorrow with Batya Ungar Sargon and more.
[01:40:57]  Thanks for listening to The Megan Kelly Show.
[01:40:59]  No BS, no agenda, and no