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Sept. 21, 2024 - The Michael Knowles Show
41:21
Religion FACE-OFF: Michael Knowles Vs Megan Basham
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Time Text
It's poor sportsmanship, Michael.
I'm just saying.
St.
Augustine Church First.
It has to be still a functioning church.
It's still a functioning church.
Listen to this guy.
Yeah, founded on September 8th, 1565.
How do you like that?
When shadowy figures like George Soros infiltrate and attack evangelical churches, the appropriate response is to bash them.
When Fed liberals spy on Latin mass Catholic churchgoers, we bash them.
And when French degenerates mock the Last Supper, we bash them.
And someone who knows all about this is Megan Basham, who's been bashing them for years.
Now, Michael Knowles and Megan both know all about Bashin' Liz, but who knows more about religion?
We'll find out.
This is Face Off.
Michael and Megan, the topic is religion.
What have you done to prepare for this?
That was the lamest pun you could have possibly opened with.
Are you kidding me?
When I find a pun, I beat it to death.
Truly, you took that pun and you wielded it as a club over that dead horse on the ground.
We have a wonderful guest.
Megan Basham, and you would blow it on that terrible punt.
We have this wonderful guest who has this great book out, Shepherds for Sale, New York Times bestseller, taking the country by storm.
I have done nothing to prepare, including reading the book, because I just received my copy, and I'm very excited to read this book.
Meg, thank you for being on my show, and Ben, thank you for inviting me onto my own show.
Thank you for having me.
I'm a little bit trepidatious here, but I do feel that my Arizona State pedigree might be a little intimidating to you, Michael.
I don't know if you know this, we are known as the Harvard of the Southwest.
So hopefully, you know, that Sterling education is what has prepared me to be here today.
Well, I believe it, thank you.
And actually, it occurs to me, thinking of the present state of Yale, that I think in order to be admitted to Yale Divinity School today, you have to be an atheist.
So, you know, the religious education, a little bit weak up in New Haven, We'll see how the game goes.
The winner will get a 30 second commercial for either why you should watch their show or why you should go read their book.
Number 1.
Behind Christianity and Islam, what is the third most common belief in the world?
A, Buddhism. B, Sikhism. C, Hinduism. D, secular atheist.
All right, here we go.
Mike, what do you have?
Since India overtook China, what, last year as the most populous country in the world, I'm going with C, Hinduism.
I also went with Hinduism.
This is very recent, by .2, now non-religious.
Atheist, secular, has now passed Hinduism worldwide.
Isn't that wild?
I almost said that.
Yeah, that's depressing.
That's depressing.
Pretty wild.
Number two.
How many books were included in the original Gutenberg Bible, the first major book printed using the movable type?
Is it A, 66?
B, 72?
A, 66. B, 72. C, 73. D, 80.
C, 73?
All right, Megan, what do you have?
I went with the standard, 66.
The standard?
Hold on here.
What do we mean by standard?
I was torn between 72 and 73, because it kind of hinges on how you score one of the books.
But I said 73.
The correct answer is C, 73.
Let's go!
Printed in 1450.
73 books.
This followed the Catholic canon at the time.
Yeah.
And at the present time, too, by the way.
It hasn't changed since...
Certain people took some books out, but you know, we stick by Gutenberg.
Is it not 72 right now?
73.
It kind of depends on how you score a book, but yeah, 73.
All right, good to know.
All right, number three.
The Kaaba, a shrine located near the center of the Great Mosque in Mecca, is unique in many ways.
One unique feature is a relic built into the wall in the eastern corner.
What is this relic?
Is it A, a footprint of Mohammed?
B, a section of Abraham's staff?
C, a rock carried out of the Garden of Eden by Adam?
D, a jewel given by the angel Gabriel to Mohammed?
When am I going to get my purpose-driven life Rick Warren evangelical question?
We'll get to the Protestant softball questions here later.
It's got to warm up Michael, you know?
There was one time I was traveling around the Middle East.
I was visiting a friend in Dubai and we kind of went all over to Oman and Beirut.
And I really wanted to get into Saudi Arabia, but it turns out it's difficult to get in.
So I didn't get to see the Kaaba, didn't go to Chop Chop Square.
I think I have an answer, I don't know.
The photos there are pretty impressive.
Yeah.
Of Chop Chop Square or The Comet?
Both.
How do you compare, you know?
Alright.
Megan, what do you have?
I went with a total stab in the dark of Abraham's staff.
I said the jewel from the angel Gabriel.
What's most impressive about this question is I made up all of them except for one, the correct one, which was a rock carried out by Adam in the Garden of Eden, which most people think is a meteorite.
So the answer... Oh, I've heard about that.
I have.
That'd be kind of cool to see.
Yeah.
Well, it's hard to see now because it's been rubbed on so many times you can't really see the area.
But you could Google it.
It's hard to see because there's like 10 zillion people there all kind of circling around.
So you got to like peek over their heads and stuff, you know?
You did good, because that one seemed like the least likely to me.
Hey, producing, you know?
Number four.
According to Pew Research Center and the Public Religion Research Institute, which is currently the fastest growing Christian denomination in America?
Is it A, Roman Catholicism, B, Evangelicalism or Protestantism, C, Pentecostalism, D, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, Mormon?
I'm checking my spelling.
This is a really tricky one, because it plays into other political questions, even beyond, like, religion and stuff.
Okay.
I said C, Pentecostalism, in part because of the immigrants, who you'd expect them to be Catholic, because they're Latin American, but many of them are Pentecostal, so I'm cautiously saying Pentecostalism.
All right, Megan, what do you have?
I said the same.
Y'all are both wrong.
Again, it is evangelical Protestantism.
Oh, really?
Yeah.
Really?
I thought evangelicalism was like waning right now.
Okay, so here's, it has been, and here's why I didn't go with that because, but here's what, I can see it because apparently since Trump, a lot of people have started identifying as evangelicals, though they don't go to church and they're not really involved in their faith.
So I don't know that they should count.
And they don't like believe in God or like pray or anything, but you know, that's the thing to be now.
Yeah.
Okay.
Interesting.
All right.
All right.
This next question is also very interesting.
Number five in Islam, how many wives can a man have?
This is closest without going over.
I just have to pick, like, any number?
Any number without going over.
Good trick.
Infinity?
I guess that would go over.
I was shocked to find there is actually a number you can draw.
Or maybe there's not, and I'm just tricking both of you guys again.
Like, because the Sultans had a lot of wives.
But maybe there is a number.
How many?
I actually did double check this, because our Orthodox Jewish associate producer gave me this question, and I was like, is that real?
And I did look it up, and there is a specific number.
I'm going to just take a random guess.
Michael, what do you have?
I said 211.
I have 72, because I figure if that's the number of virgins you're supposed to get, then it doesn't seem like, if that's heaven, that you should get more on earth.
So that's what I went with.
That is a great point, and it paid off.
The answer is up to four!
Four wives for the basic... Wait, so neither of us gets the point?
Oh, yeah, you're right.
It was going over.
Yeah, you're right.
Neither one of you guys got it.
Wow.
That was very technical and un-gentlemanly, Michael.
There was one time I was on that trip through the Middle East.
I was in, I think it was the Sharjah Airport in the UAE.
And I'm walking around with an Indian buddy of mine.
And we see there's a, you know, there's a guy like dressed up in traditional Arab garb.
And he's got these women with him.
And they're obviously not his mother.
It's not his daughters or anything.
They're all kind of the same age.
And I, in my naivete, I said, oh, that's nice.
The guy's going on like a big family trip with his wife and maybe his sisters.
And my Indian friend reminded me that it was more sister wives than wife and sisters.
You kind of bring, the whole family can just be, you know, the marriage.
Nice.
All right.
Number six.
What is the largest church congregation in America?
Is it A. Life Church, Pastor Craig Groeschel, Evangelical Covenant.
B. Lakewood Church, Joel Olsteen, non-denominational.
C. North Point Community Church, Andy Stanley, non-denominational.
D. Saddleback Church, Rick Warren, Southern Baptist.
Or E. The Potter's House, T.D.
Jakes, non-denominational.
Saddleback is tricky, though, because, you know, he claims Rick Warren to have trained, like, a million pastors, but if anybody has ever attended one of his seminars, he says he has trained them as a pastor, and they have these weird campuses all over the world that are not technically churches.
They're just people who get together and watch videos, but I think they count them as their international campuses, but it's in America.
I believe it's the congregation of the people that would tune in live or digitally now, so.
Okay, so not like satellite, you know, okay.
No, you know, it wouldn't be people just like reading the same Bible study somewhere.
It's like you have to actually be like in that denomination.
Okay, okay.
All right, what do you have?
I say it's Mr. Smiles, Joel Osteen.
I do too.
I quit.
No, he got passed.
What?
You can only fill up so many things in that giant, was it the Cowboy Stadium or whatever?
No, it's actually Life Church.
Who does that one?
Craig.
That's Greg Rochelle.
Yeah, Rochelle.
How am I not getting the even—because I'll tell you what, I don't follow prosperity gospel guys, so I don't care what they're doing.
The only one—I'd heard of Rick Warren, and then obviously I've heard of Joel Osteen, because he's on TV all the time and, you know, has that big—those big pearly whites.
But I— Wow.
I thought he was, I thought he had the biggest single, you know, church group in America.
He's still second, and it is large.
I have been to TD Jakes as well.
It is massive.
So there's a lot of pretty impressive churches.
I think that's, that's like a standalone church too.
It's not like in a stadium, like Joel, all the stand-up.
Okay.
Yeah.
Number seven, according to his CBS interview, what is George Soros' religious belief?
There are, like, a lot of punchlines here that I probably can't get away with.
We're gonna stay on YouTube for once, like, for one of these episodes.
Well, I wonder if that's a true question, because, I mean, I think it's pretty well known he's just an atheist, isn't he?
I'm gonna be more specific, even at the risk of getting cancelled.
He's a Jewish atheist!
I'm hedging my bets.
He's an atheist, correct.
I'll take both of those answers for it.
But does the Judaism not, like, it doesn't color any of his... Not in my research.
Interesting, okay.
You know, I was at his wedding.
I did not see Jewish atheists come up in my search.
I was at his most recent wedding back in 2013.
I was a fake sommelier there back when I was an actor.
Wow, I was gonna say, are you a plant?
I'm a plan, I'm a Soros op.
No, this is actually the first, I mean, there were a ton of prominent libs at this thing, and I had already worked in politics, but I was working, you know, as an actor, I got a casting call for what seemed like a theatrical event, and I only figured out it was for Soros, because they asked what languages I spoke, and I half-jokingly said Esperanto, and they said, oh, great, the client speaks that, and I said, oh, it's obviously George Soros, he's like one of five people who speak that language.
But it's one of the first things that made me think, Maybe George Soros doesn't control the world because the fact that they would hire me, I had already been pretty active in politics at that point.
Like, you could Google me, there was stuff to it.
I thought, oh, wow, okay, maybe he's just like a really rich guy who messes around, but he's not omnipotent or something.
That was a butterfly effect moment that you may have missed, Michael.
You might've saved the world if you had intervened in some way in George Soros' life.
I'm just saying.
What intervention?
You're saying I've got the sommelier corkscrew and a trip or something like that.
That would be very wrong.
I'm not...
I'm just saying, you know, there was a moment of destiny there that you may have just dodged.
That has to weigh on your conscience.
It did occur to me.
When I was thinking about the security of it, I said, no, no, that's, you know, we'll let things play out in the moral order.
Does that technically make you a diversity cast, too?
Are you a diversity cast in that?
Yeah, I must have been, for many reasons.
That happened actually once for me, because I was auditioning for an Olympic commercial, and it was all black guys and me, and they couldn't, in good conscience, cast only black guys to be fast.
And so I was the one white guy, and the only one you saw the whole time on the 4x1 team, which would never happen ever in the real world.
No.
All right, number eight.
In the Marvel Universe, which Avenger is Protestant?
I think it's gotta be Batman, right?
I think it's got to be.
Wait, which one is... Don't say it out loud.
OK, I know, I know.
I'm trying to think.
You've seen this movie.
It's been known in the canon for years.
However, this came back into the public fold in 2012 with the first Avengers movie.
I feel like I'm going to be really upset that I'm not thinking of it, but...
I've seen like half an Avengers movie, you know.
No, maybe I've seen, but I don't know.
Michael, can you name the Avengers for me real quick?
Yeah, you've got Donald, Pluto, Mickey, Popeye.
See, I'm on the other side.
I've seen all of them, and there's been too many, and it all just kind of starts to blur together in my mind now that I'm like, I remember no single detail.
I guess, I don't know.
Maybe I'm being too simplistic about it.
I would just assume Captain America is Protestant.
Megan Basham.
I also assumed that.
That is correct.
Captain America.
These guys come from legend.
They're basically gods.
There's only one god, ma'am.
And I'm pretty sure he doesn't dress like that.
I couldn't tell if I was like over... Was there like a deeper answer or two?
But no, it's like, I don't know.
There's a lot of, you know.
America's pretty Protestant.
If you actually look this up, there is like 300 different comic book characters from Marvel, and it lists specifically the different religions around the world, and they're all very diverse or non-religious.
It's very specific to all these characters.
Wow.
He's the only Protestant?
No, there's tons of other ones, but the Avengers themselves.
Yeah.
Oh.
What about the... Is the Hulk an Avenger?
Yes.
What's the Hulk?
He's gotta be... He's probably Protestant, right?
I didn't look it up.
No, he's a scientist.
He's probably like an atheist or something.
Yeah.
Yeah, that makes sense.
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Okay, Ben, back to you.
Number nine.
The Latter-day Saint canon consists of several books.
The Bible and how many other texts?
Close this without going over.
This is the canon?
I mean, there obviously is lots of different... These are the ones that are... Yeah, yeah, canon.
Are you counting the individual parts of the Book of Mormon?
No, no, no.
The actual books, yeah.
Yeah, okay.
Can I pause to call Mike Lee really quick?
Okay, I think I have an answer.
There's no way I'm going to try to, like, make you guys name these because... I'll name them.
It's a little wordy.
Oh, okay.
Hold on, hold on.
No, sorry.
Now I'm erasing.
How many total?
In addition to the Book of Mormon or including the Book of Mormon?
I said it's the Bible including these other texts.
So I gave you one, the Bible.
Okay.
And so how many other texts?
Okay, I think I have the answer.
I don't know.
What do you have, Michael?
I say it's three.
I think it's the Book of Mormon, Pearl of Great Price, and Doctrines and Covenants.
Oh wow, he actually knew the names.
I didn't, so I put two.
The correct answer is three, and somehow Michael Knowles is a closet Mormon and knows all of these.
I was going to say, Michael knew the names of the...
I actually, as you just alluded to, Megan, I do have to thank Mike Lee for some of my LDS education, but also I sort of cheated in that I went to Utah, what, like five months ago or something, and someone gave me, they call it a triple or something, and it's all three books in one collection with my name engraved on it.
It was very nice.
Oh, I totally forgot.
That was a layup that I completely forgot about.
It was a layup.
An accidental layup.
Yeah.
Alright, number 10.
According to the Catholic News Agency, which country has the least number of Catholics?
A. Afghanistan B. The Maldives C. Algeria D. Somalia Stuck between two.
Afghanistan?
Alright, Megan?
I went with Somalia.
It is a Afghanistan with zero, zero Catholics in Afghanistan.
Right.
Wow.
Ben, this is good.
If it makes you feel better, you know, look, a lot of this, it's all in, it's all in Providence, how these questions come out.
But I have been getting creamed, Megan, like for the, of the last five, I think like the first two, I got creamed and then I came back a little bit.
So this, it's just cycles.
It's just like Fortuna.
I'm glad I could be here today.
Restore your manly confidence, Michael.
Where are my John MacArthur questions?
R.C.
Sproul?
Spurgeon?
There might be some coming, all right?
I can't show bias here, all right?
Yeah, what is this?
You're getting all the Mormon question, the Muslims.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
The Jewish Atheist?
Jewish Atheist, yeah.
Yeah, okay.
All those softball questions.
Number 11.
Which of these countries has the same number of Protestants living there as Vatican City?
Is it A. Somalia, B. Turkmenistan, C. Bosnia, or D. Maldives?
What is the question again?
Which country has zero Protestants?
- Zero Protestants.
- Whoa, listen to this guy.
You hear that?
It's a Freudian slip he just did. - Which country has the same number of Protestants living there as Vatican City?
Is it Somalia, Turkmenistan, Bosnia, or the Maldives?
- The thing about Protestants is they'll go anywhere.
They will.
So I'm actually surprised that there is any country where one's not, like, sneaking around converting people.
Actually, you're right.
There's probably some people off the books doing their work, but, like, we've got to step it up.
There's zero in Afghanistan and zero here.
It's in the name.
I mean, you know, a lot of Protestants are evangelical and evangelicals evangelize.
We have to go and do that work.
Okay, I think I have an answer.
Even though I know a Protestant who has been sneaking in and out of Turkmenistan for some time now, I still think it's Turkmenistan.
Turkmenistan.
Alright, what do you have, Meg Basham?
That was my other choice again, but I went with the other one, Somalia.
It is Somalia!
We have zero Protestants.
Dude, she's on the board.
Don't call it a comeback, but it's happening.
I have some other right answers, just like a couple, but... All right, number 12.
This one's on Michael.
So, what is the largest Catholic church in America?
Is it A.
Oh man, it's gonna be hard to pronounce.
A. The Basilica of the National Shrine of the Immaculate Conception.
B. Cathedral of Our Lady of the Angels.
C. Cathedral Basilica of the Sacred Heart.
D. Cathedral Basilica of St.
Louis.
Wow, I would have said like St.
Pat's or something, so I actually don't... So you're talking about the building?
Yes, largest building.
Say it one more time.
Sure, Michael.
For you, I'll go through this again.
A. Basilica of the National Shrine of the Immaculate Conception.
B. Cathedral of Our Lady of the Angels.
C. Cathedral Basilica of the Sacred Heart.
D. Cathedral Basilica of St.
Louis.
Okay, I think it's got to be the Cathedral Of Our Lady of the Angels, unless it's, Cathedral Basilica is like a cathedral that also has a basilica, or that is a basilica.
You don't know the answer, why am I asking you that?
I don't know what those words are.
Cathedral of Our Lady of the Angels.
What is the Immaculate Conception, Michael?
I have no idea, I just read a 66 book.
Yeah, it's when Our Lady was preserved from the stain of original sin by a singular grace of her son.
And the cathedral that we're talking about is, I don't know, I guess I'd say of Our Lady of the Angels.
What do you have, Megan?
I literally threw like a dart See?
There you go.
The Dart Mist and Michael Mist.
It's the Basilica of the National Shrine of the Immaculate Conception in Washington, D.C., which covers an area of 77,000 square feet and has a capacity of 10,000 people.
Wait, the one I said didn't have immaculate... Which one did I say?
What was C?
There's a lot of buildings built to Mary.
There's like four... You guys see the Sacred Heart, the Basilica of the Sacred Heart one.
Which is the Sacred Heart of Jesus.
I thought my answer had Immaculate Conception in it, but...
You said C though, it was A. I can't give it to you.
You want to hear, talk about not fulfilling my duties as a Catholic.
I've been to Washington D.C.
a billion times in my life.
I've never been to the National Shrine.
I was near it one time and I've never been, I know.
Have you been in the second largest, which is the angels one you guessed?
Yeah, that's in LA?
Yeah.
Yeah, I've been to that one.
That is truly architecturally a monstrosity.
It is one of the ugliest buildings the church has ever made.
The bishop, it was Bishop Mahoney who built it, and they call it the Taj Mahoney.
There was so much horrific church architecture starting in the 70s, and this is like the crown jewel in bad architectural taste, and I can't wait for the church to build a new one.
I know it's hard for you to travel all over the world and see the beautiful office buildings erected in respect to the Protestant faith.
I know that's difficult for you Catholics, but... There's a nice sort of utilitarian chic to it, you know?
Just from the photos I've seen, when we get back to DC, Michael, we should check it out because the building looks spectacular.
Yeah, yeah.
Number 13.
Which X-Men character is Catholic, who was also one of the stars of X-Men 2 in 2003, grossing over $400 million?
You're saying the actor's Catholic or the character's Catholic?
The character's Catholic.
And he was pretty overtly Catholic throughout the entire movie.
What did I have to do?
I agreed to do a religion face-off, and you're giving me all these stupid comic book movies that I don't know anything about.
Millions of people saw this, Michael.
Like, it's pretty important to know which one of these figures is Catholic.
I'm hoping that I just said a name that is actually in this film.
X-Men 2 is, sneaky, the best one of the X-Men movies.
All right, Michael, what do you have?
I said the werewolf Hugh Jackman character.
Megan Basham.
I put Xavier.
Is he a character?
Professor X and Wolverine are not correct.
It was actually Nightcrawler.
He is the opening sequence of the movie where he attacks the President and he also tries to convert Storm, played by Halle Berry.
How could I forget the Nightcrawler?
How could I?
It was so obvious.
It was staring right in front of me.
But Dr. X does stand for Xavier?
Yes.
All right, nice.
Yeah, you got one of the characters correct, for sure.
And I couldn't remember the name of the werewolf Hugh Jackman character, but then I was reminded it's Wolverine.
Wolverine, yep.
There we are, okay.
All right, here we go.
Which major world religion currently has claim to the tallest religious statue in the world?
Definitely ain't the Buddhas that the Taliban took down.
- Leikun Sikya, Buddha in Myanmar. C, Spring Temple Buddha China. D, Statue of Belief, which is Hindu in India. - Definitely ain't the Buddhas that the Taliban took down. - I'm just gonna say I'm going for the home team with which is Hindu in India. - Definitely ain't the Buddhas that the Taliban took down. - I'm just gonna say I'm I'm going for the Burmese Buddha.
Not that I'm going, I'm not for him, but I'm like, I think that's, I'm gonna say that's the big one.
All right, Paul, can you scroll for a sec?
Because there's two different Buddha ones.
I'm gonna make sure you got it right.
The Myanmar Buddha.
The Myanmar one?
That is incorrect.
It is the China Buddha one.
Yeah, Spring Temple Buddha, China, which stands 420 feet high.
That's a big Buddha.
How wide is he?
Because they're kind of, the Buddhas are kind of plump, you know?
This one's kind of lean.
Okay.
He's that Siddhartha Gautama Buddha.
It's not even on the top five.
These other ones are much bigger.
The Hindu one's massive.
Literally, yesterday I saw a picture of a person next to Christ the Redeemer to show.
The perspective, and I don't know, it looked pretty big to me, so that stuck in my mind.
All right, what is the largest building constructed for worship of any religion in the world?
Is it A, St.
Peter's Basilica, Vatican City?
Is it B, Angkor Wat in Cambodia for Hinduism?
C, the Great Mosque of Mecca, Saudi Arabia, Islam?
The Java, holy smokes, the Jeta Venamaya Stupa in Sri Lanka for Buddhism?
And that's it.
Wow, I haven't thought about the Getty Ventilanca of Sri Lanka in a long time.
These are all very impressive, actually.
You want to say him again?
I mostly just want to make you say him again.
A, St.
Peter's Basilica, Vatican City, which is a Christian place.
Angkor Wat, in Cambodia, Hinduism.
The Great Mosque of Mecca, Masjid al-Haram, Saudi Arabia, Islam.
The Jetavanaramaya Stupa, Sri Lanka, Buddhism.
I say it is the Great Mosque.
I also said mosque.
It is by far the mosque.
You are correct.
350,000 square meters, not square feet, that's 88 acres.
How do you, yeah, how do you translate that into English?
It is absurd.
Wow.
I kind of remember the mosques I've seen are gigantic.
Just for reference, the second largest, the largest Christian one, Vatican City, is approximately 15,000 square meters.
Yeah.
So it's like 3.75 acres.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Wow.
All right.
What is the oldest standing church in America?
A. The Old North Church in Boston.
B. San Miguel Mission in New Mexico.
C. St.
Augustine Church, Florida.
D. Jamestown Church, Virginia.
Michael's off the races.
Well, listen, don't forget, I come from Pilgrim Stock.
We named my cigar company Mayflower Cigars.
American history is very important to me.
Religious history.
All right, you ready, Megan?
I went with Jamestown.
All right.
Well, even though I had that little Protestant fakeout about the Mayflower in New England, I know that it's actually in St.
Augustine, Florida.
Y'all are both wrong.
Y'all are both incorrect.
B, it's San Miguel Mission, New Mexico.
It's the oldest standing one.
The first church was originally built in Jamestown in 1607, but then it's no longer standing.
What about St.
Augustine?
The church one is 1610, Michael.
1610 in St.
Augustine?
No, no.
1610 was the St.
Miguel Church in New Mexico.
When was the St.
Augustine one built?
I don't know.
You don't know?
Well, let's Google it.
All right, let's Google it.
Is it still standing?
It's poor sportsmanship, Michael.
St.
Augustine Church.
It has to be still a functioning church.
It's still a functioning... Listen to this guy.
Yeah, founded on September 8th, 1565.
October 8th, 1565.
How do you like that? - I mean, I don't know why that didn't come up Yeah, I don't know, but I want my point.
So listen, you're gonna have to go fact check, you're gonna get judges involved and everything, I understand that, but I want this...
Yeah, this is... First of all, we need a reliable host of this show who is not going to try to jolt me out of my St.
Augustine points, but we're just going to put a pin in here.
Because, look, maybe you'll say, no, actually it was, you know, mystically transported somewhere else and it's this thing in Mexico or whatever, but I still think there's a good shot at St.
Augustine.
What's the score currently?
Is it going to affect these final standings?
It's tight, it's 6-4 right now, so see how it plays out.
That could matter.
It could matter.
Let's get the fact-checkers in the control room on it right now.
Yeah, it needs to be a standing, functioning church, ladies and gentlemen.
All right, here we go.
Now, next up, in the Jewish faith, the Talmud is studied at a rate of one page per day in a process called the daf-yami.
How long does it take to complete the entire Talmud?
Now, this is answer without going over.
In years.
Okay, wait, so one page per day.
In years.
It's studied, yep, one page per day.
So how long does it take to complete?
It only took Michael half this amount of time.
I don't know!
Okay.
You're saying it only took me half this amount of time to read the tomelet.
Yeah, yeah.
Yeah, yeah.
Michael already wrote something?
He's a scholar of the Talmud.
No, I just, I'm from New York and I know a lot of Jews.
It's basically my, the reason.
Even though what's funny, most of the, virtually all the Jews I knew growing up probably never read a single letter of the Talmud because it's all the Orthodox in Brooklyn that do it.
But I think, I think I'm right on this.
Is it seven years?
I wrote five.
It is.
Seven and a half years.
I thought it was seven and a half, but I didn't want to go over.
All right, I'll take it.
Wow, that's really impressive, Michael, even to keep yourself safe from going over.
I know a lot of Jews, my friend.
That's, you know, New York, L.A.
I mean, I don't know.
I'm trying to think the first time I met a non-Jew in my life.
All right, here we go.
Next one.
How old was Aisha, the wife of the Prophet Muhammad, when they were married?
This is the closest without going over.
You're trying to get us shot, Ben.
Is that weird?
I don't know if this is when they were married.
Not to be confused when their marriage was consummated.
I went with nine.
I too went with nine.
The answer is six years old.
Six.
I almost said six.
Yep.
And then the marriage was consummated at nine.
Yep.
All right.
On that happy note, next one.
When was the Bible with the 66 books proposed, which is recognized by most Protestant denominations today?
Is it A.
325 A.D.
at the Council of Nicaea, B.
367 A.D.
by Antithes of Alexandria, C.
1536 A.D.
during the Reformation, or D.
1647 A.D.
You're saying proposed...
Do you mean formally proposed?
Like, was, you know... It was proposed that these were, should be canonized.
But any, you know, even at the council, you know, the councils that actually canonized the Bible, they would have been, even with the 73 books, those 66 would have been proposed.
So, it would be inclusive of the 66.
So, you're saying, when was it... It was first brought up of these specific 66 books.
But they were brought up in the ancient councils as well as the modern.
It could be pretty ancient.
There's been a lot of different councils.
There's been years where there's more or less books also recognized in the Catholic Church.
When was the 66 books?
I don't know.
I feel like this is a trick question.
I just went with an idea.
Yeah, this is going to be a trick question because it's going to rely on, like, you know, Bishop, you know, Billy, like, suggested this as an idea.
And even if it was rejected by the council, you could still say, well, it was proposed at some ancient council.
But I'm going to go with a post-Reformation event.
I'm going to say 1536.
The answer is B, 367 A.D.
by Anathias of Alexandria.
In 367 A.D., he listed the 66 books in his festal letter, which corresponds to the canon recognized by the most Protestant denominations today.
This occurred 15 years before the Council of Rome in 382, where Pope Demasius I proposed the 72 books of the Catholic Bible.
This was later affirmed... This is Bishop Billy stuff, because you're literally saying, like, some guy wrote it in a letter, but... Okay, we're not talking about councils or synods, that's fine, some guy wrote it in a letter, okay, that's fine.
We may not be ready for that answer, but neither one of you got it.
So, currently, Michael Knowles is your champion.
Oh, it's over.
I won.
That is the last one.
However, there is always a chance on The Michael Knolls Show, which means there is a bonus question where you can go all in, double or nothing, on one more question that I hope is very neutral to both parties here of being a mackerel snapping papist and being a radical evangelical person like Megan Basham.
Okay, hold on.
So I have no incentive whatsoever to wager my winnings, because I've already won.
You have the incentive of a great time, Michael, and you'll get to hear this question, and the audience will get to guess along with you.
Can I hear the question even if I just keep my win?
No.
No, I can't.
Okay.
Because in the past, you've let me do that sometimes, but you're not letting me do that this time.
Not this time, Michael.
You've been freeloading for too long, all right?
We're going to keep it serious.
I want to hear the question.
I want to hear the question.
So maybe this didn't work out the last time I did one of these, but let's do it.
Oh, is everybody dialed in?
Are you ready, Megan?
I'm ready.
This is the final question, double or nothing.
Here it goes.
St.
Thomas traveled from Jerusalem to what is now Shania, formerly Madras, India, where he was martyred around 72 AD.
Now, how many miles did St. Thomas travel to accomplish this?
How many miles is that from Jerusalem to where he's martyred in India?
I was just right across the little tip of India from where St. Thomas, I think actually Thomas, I thought he was martyred in Kerala and then is buried in Chennai.
I do too!
Yeah, I think Mr. Davies is wrong here.
But nevertheless, I made this journey back in December for my buddy's wedding that was down in Kerala.
Now this will be miles without going over.
This is as the crow flies, or this is his actual journey?
Because there's a difference.
Right.
Is he shipwrecked in Socotra?
I just had to Google these two locations and like how many miles in between.
As the crow flies.
Yeah, because I don't know if he, as you do walk, do you go by ship?
Yeah, I don't think he walked.
He would have leg pains if he had walked it.
I did look up how long it would take to walk this, and it's not as long as you think, actually.
How many miles?
Okay.
I have zero idea.
I'm saying 10,000 miles because of that song, and that's really the only reason.
Because I feel that St.
Thomas would walk 10,000 miles and walk 10,000 more.
And he would walk 10,000 more.
I'm going to say, even though I think it's more than this, I'm saying 3,500 miles.
The answer is 5,500 miles.
Let's go!
Based on Google.
Michael Knowles is still your champion, ladies and gentlemen.
Thank you.
Thank you very much.
I...
I had a lot riding on this because St.
Thomas is my confirmation saint, and because I was a punk, like, atheist 13-year-old when I got confirmed, in retrospect, I don't even really know if I was thinking of Thomas the Apostle or St.
Thomas Aquinas.
But Thomas means twins, so there's something kind of fitting about that.
But had I blown it, having just been in this place, like, Eight months ago, I would feel like a big jerk.
So that's really great.
And Ben, I'm glad that your questions really excluded our friend Megan's expertise for her best-selling book and made it about a bunch of weird Muslim stuff.
That's great.
What I wrote about was in there, but I also feel that this was rather elitist, and I'm going to tell you why.
Because Michael is such a world traveler, and I did have to note that his world travels very much played into his expertise on some of these things.
So clearly, I need more time off and a larger salary.
So that I can do more traveling.
That's all I'm going to say.
The real trick I have found, a great way to accommodate world travel, is just convince Daily Wire you've got to, like, get important content or whatever, you know, in, like, Timbuktu.
And then you never have to release the stuff.
You just get a nice vacation from the company.
That's the key.
I need to work on my scamming skills, so that's what I learned here today.
Modern problems, modern solutions.
We can't help Michael's salary today, though, by giving him a 30-second commercial for why people should watch The Michael Knoll Show.
Megan, please take it away.
Well, you know, despite Michael's deficient religious education and not knowing that St.
Augustine was not the oldest church in America, I think we can say that he clearly needs that kind of audience.
To support him so that he's able to brush up and bone up on some of his religious bona fides.
But he is a gentleman and a scholar, and we want him to continue being a scholar.
So I encourage everyone to throw poor Michael Knowles a bone.
Watch his show every now and again.
That was beautiful.
That was great.
Thank you.
You know, I wouldn't want to violate having one by doing a plug for Meg's show and writing and all that stuff, but since it's not in the rules of it, I can plug the book.
Shepherds for Sale.
If you don't have this book yet, you're one of the few people in America that does not have this book yet.
A runaway bestseller.
Even the New York Times was forced to acknowledge it, which is quite a feat.
So go get it.
Go get Shepherds for Sale.
And as for Ben Davies, don't find him anywhere.
Don't look him up anywhere, ever.
Well, there you have it.
Thank you, Michael, so much for that outro.
And if you haven't already, like he said, get your copy of Shepherds for Sale, How the Evangelical Church Leaders Traded Truth for Leftist Agenda.
And you can get that wherever books are sold.
Now, please let us know in the comments section who you'd like to see and what topic to cover in the next episode of Face Off.
Folks, did you like that charming little game?
Well, if you want to get more charm, wit, wisdom, a beautiful jawline, sultry smooth dulcet tones, as well as insight into the news and politics and culture and everything, you've got to tune into The Michael Knowles Show.
That's my daily show every single day.
That's how daily shows work.
It's at The Daily Wire.
It's here on YouTube.
It's on the radio.
It's everywhere, man.
Make sure you listen to it.
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