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Dec. 22, 2022 - Health Ranger - Mike Adams
41:27
Dr. Robert Malone and Mike Adams discuss DECENTRALIZATION and the rise of sustainable civilization
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Welcome, everyone.
Mike Adams here, the founder of Brighteon.com, and today we're joined by Robert Malone.
He's, well, he hardly needs an introduction these days.
You've seen his work everywhere.
But he's also the author of a relatively new book, Lies My Government Told Me and The Better Future Coming.
And today we're going to talk about that part of the book and the title, The Better Future Coming.
Welcome, Dr.
Malone.
It's a pleasure to have you on.
Mike, thanks for having me on again.
I think the last time we spoke, I was sitting in a cabin in a boat on the Bosphorus.
That's right.
You are correct.
Hopefully not observed by your audience was that I was actually kneeling on a pillow in order to try to get the right height to the camera.
Yeah.
That must have been a little bit difficult, just physically, to hold that posture.
It was a little rough on the knees.
I was a carpenter, and I've been a farmhand, and we work our farm here, so I'm I'm used to doing things like laying floor, but as I get older, it gets harder over time.
Yes.
Well, I was thinking about you and your horse business and all the things that you do.
I gathered these large square bales of hay and I was distributing some of them today to my donkeys because this big freeze is coming.
As you know, I want to make sure they've got plenty of calories ahead of the big freeze.
So I was thinking about you today while I was doing that, even though I don't have horses.
But, you know, it's a similar kind of thing.
Yeah, we've got to get another few tons in the next couple of days before Christmas, because I don't want to be pestering my hay guy during the weekend.
You always got to be thinking about these things.
And we've got five pregnant mares, and one of them is just, she could drop any day.
I thought she was going to drop a week ago.
Wow.
She started waxing up and the udder got full and then it retracted.
She's a maiden mare, so maiden mares are always a little twitchy.
You never quite know what's going to happen and when it's going to happen.
That's just the nature of the thing.
You hope...
You hope that it doesn't happen right in the middle of the coldest part of all this that's coming.
I don't mind, and they don't mind, you know, I can move her into the barn.
We've got to keep our eyes on her.
And the foal comes out a little wet, of course.
What I don't like is wet, cold mud.
Yes.
That's not good.
Agreed.
Agreed.
Well, let's go from the mud to something a little more positive.
I mentioned your book, Lies My Government Told Me and The Better Future Coming.
And that's available everywhere, folks, Amazon and you name it.
And let me give you a shout out to your listeners, Mike.
Tony Lyons at Skyhorse, which is the publisher and the marketer.
Very generously offered and is activated that everybody, especially here in the US, but I understand Canada and the UK too, can get the e-book for free.
Starting last Monday through Christmas.
So you don't have to spend any money.
Our goal is to get the information out.
And so you can readily download it or download it and send it to your mother or your boss or whoever it is that you want a red pill and not have to pay 15 bucks to Amazon to do it.
Yeah, great point.
So is that a PDF? And where do they go to find that?
No, it's an e-book.
So you can download the Kindle app or whatever your favorite e-book reader is.
Oh, I see.
Yeah, Kindle is currently $0 on Amazon.
Okay, I see that.
Yeah, pretty cool.
Also, I almost forgot I'm obliged to plug We Carry Your Book on brighteonbooks.com, the physical version.
So if folks want to get them, to hand them out to people in the physical version.
You should definitely buy the hardcover from brighteon.com.
Absolutely.
Write down books.
Write down books.
Well, we're just happy to be able to carry it.
But folks, get it for free on Kindle.
Did you say through the end of the year?
Is that right?
No, Christmas.
Through Christmas.
Oh, okay.
So this is Merry Christmas from Skyhorse Publishing.
Awesome.
All right.
Tony Lyons is the best.
He's amazing.
Alright, so how do we get to a better future from here?
Is it about the lessons that we are learning the hard way?
Because it seems like, in my view right now, people like Fauci and others are doubling down on the insanity instead of learning from this.
Although we did see the Australian Medical Association director recently come out and talk about vaccine injuries, or the former director.
But what's your take on this?
And apparently there's also a data dump coming from Germany, consequent to FOIA, that may open some eyes.
Okay.
But I'm of the opinion, and I suspect you probably share that point of view, that this COVID crisis that we've experienced is more of a skirmish.
It's not the big battle.
Yeah.
We're clearly now in an environment where the plans that have been concocted since World War II by those who believe that the nation state is obsolete and the future of their world is a single world government, apparently run by corporations if the World Economic Forum has their way with us.
And steers us towards this transhumanism, humanism, fourth industrial revolution world that they're trying to shape for us, uh, in which, uh, you will own nothing and be happy and, and, uh, we'll live under a command economy based on utilitarian principles
and, um, uh, digital data on all of us and, and virtually a digital leash on all of us in the form of central bank, digital currency and other things.
So what is the alternative to that rather dark dystopian vision That we've all seen play out in so many different movies.
Of course, The Matrix is the profound metaphor that many of us move towards when we talk about red-pilling.
But we remember Terminator.
We remember the Borg.
We remember Mad Max.
So many examples of dystopian future visions that are very much of this world.
The centralized fourth industrial revolution fusion of man and machine world that is discussed in The Great Reset and Homo Deus by Yuval Harari and so many other books that these globalists have shared with us.
What's the alternative to that?
And many people...
Including many that I have learned from and had the pleasure of working with and interacting with over the last three years as I've traveled all over the world, have been speaking of a world that is much more decentralized as the opposite from this centralized command economy that's envisioned.
A world that is, there's a bunch of different words used But one of them is based on intentional communities, is one word.
Communities of people, they can be religious-based, they can be political ideology-based, they can be based in living practices, agrarian practices, but people coming together with a common philosophy and common purpose to form either physical or virtual communities where they can share information and Live freely in
the ways that they wish to.
And no stranger to you, Mike, and probably most of your audience, I don't know why people ridicule Ayn Rand, but Atlas Shrugged, I think, is an important work and really the basis for the name of my substack, who is Robert Malone.
I'm a little, I feel that it's almost arrogant to use that term because, of course, it refers to who is John Galt in Atlas Shrugged, which John Galt of Galt's Gulch has described is an intentional community.
So I've heard all over the world people talking about the idea of intentional communities and And their interest in forming them and forming a matrix of such communities in various ways In trying to solve the problems of how do we barter or exchange goods between such communities,
and people talk about, as opposed to centralized digital currency, the decentralized digital currency based on blockchain, as one token that can be used to exchange between such communities.
But what I found fascinating as time went by, Apparently in one of the early editions of 1984, George Orwell provided a prelude in which he envisioned, he discussed his belief that it was almost inevitable that eventually we would find ourselves in a world that would be basically a pharmaceutical industry dominated state in which all of humanity would
would be administered pharmaceuticals that would make them more docile and compliant.
And he, George Orwell, writing, you know, mid-century, mid-20th century, drew the conclusion that the only way that this would not occur, in his opinion, was if there drew the conclusion that the only way that this would not occur, in his opinion, was if there was a
So these ideas that many people, and I suspect even you and many of your listeners have discussed, of a more decentralized world, was envisioned as the logical alternative to the direction that was being was envisioned as the logical alternative to the direction that was being developed for the UN and many other Long ago, And yet here we are, still discussing it.
Well, this is a...
I think that this is the way forward, is we need to create a vision, a compelling vision of the future that the undecided, persuadable middle can look at and compare to this dark transformation You know,
dystopian vision that is being promoted by the World Economic Forum and their associates and say, hey, I would rather my children live in that world rather than the indentured servitude that this trade organization of the thousand largest companies would like to put us in.
And I think that is the way forward to that better future is rebuilding community, And actively seeking to advance humanity towards a world that is not dominated by imperialistic tendencies,
the need for one nation state to dominate, A world more like that which the founders of the United States envisioned.
one with a more limited federal government that basically functions almost as a treaty organization to maintain defense and regulate commerce between these semi-autonomous independent states.
Yes.
That was envisioned in the Declaration of Independence, the U.S. Constitution, and the Bill of Rights.
I think that despite all these efforts to ridicule and denigrate rich white landowners and this vision that they came up with, you know, 250 plus years ago, I think that that 250 plus years ago, I think that that remains like a lighthouse agreement.
a guiding light For all the world, in my experience, in my travels, and maybe it's biased because people know that they're talking to an American who's committed to the original intent, but I hear again and again, People continue to look to the United States as really the beacon of hope,
the last bastion of hope for the world in the face of this enormous economic power that's been coalescing the last bastion of hope for the world in the face of this enormous economic power that's been coalescing around this, you know, these thousand largest companies And I don't think our children have to live in that world.
I think they can live in a much better world in which they're connected to the earth, to nature and to each other through community.
Over.
You've hit on so many important themes here.
So let me bring a couple of topics to the surface that transition from what you said.
From the globalist point of view, one of the reasons they hate the United States, I believe, is because the United States of America under the model of federalism, which means states' rights, has that decentralization of states versus one overarching federal government, which is what most nations have.
Now, look at what's happening with these states and the AGs right now.
Engaged in lawsuits to reveal documents to challenge mandates and all that.
And of course, Ron DeSantis needs to get a shout out for having a pair as opposed to...
I'm sorry to say, even our governor here in Virginia seems to be scared of his own shadow in many ways.
Yeah, we've seen that.
But you mentioned, this is absolutely critical, the decentralization of, you know, I talk about decentralization of food, so local food production and decentralization of money, which is probably coming as the debt-based fiat currencies fail in their original intent.
Decentralization of science.
This is something you speak about, where we don't need one Fauci controlling the funding of who gets the grants, who can run the labs, and who cannot, because running a lab requires millions of dollars just to even start up something.
It is the structure of the funding of science that is developed largely during Tony Fauci's tenure is one in which older and older, smaller and smaller numbers of older and older established researchers who were invested in the dominant paradigm control more and more of the money.
money and the younger innovators that are coming up are again forced into positions of being indentured servants only we call them postdocs right well and i would add this overall layer to the decentralization argument that you're making which is that the topology of decentralization is naturally more resilient It's less vulnerable.
Absolutely.
And more likely to foster innovation, by the way.
I was going to say that next.
It is more competitive.
The better ideas rise to the surface instead of being quashed by the...
Those that are invested in the dominant paradigm.
Exactly.
So we need this structure.
And through concepts of federation, local communities can still make their own rules and laws, even about money, but then they can trade with each other through a common translation.
But we still have to solve those problems that the Founding Fathers addressed of needing common defense and security and some form of regulation of trade.
All of those things are fundamental human problems.
Yeah.
You know, they may have been rich landowners mostly, but they had the luxury of buying the best books and going to the best schools.
And at a time when there was just an enormous, incredible renaissance of thought, and they were at the forefront of that thinking, just because they were rich landowners doesn't mean they weren't Good thinkers.
And they didn't come up with good viable solutions that still serve, I think, as the model for the world.
The challenge, though, Mike, as you probably have thought through, is it's easy for us to become convinced of our version of utopia.
And not do the hard thinking about how to really enable that.
And the thing that worries me a little bit, or I'm focused on, is how do we avoid making the same mistakes of the past?
For instance, if we imagine this matrix of communities, well, they're going to have to have a communication scheme.
That's probably going to be something like the modern internet or some iteration of it, maybe with some VPN-like tunneling capabilities to avoid the overlords.
But we're going to find ourselves needing to have sensors.
I mean, we can all agree that we don't want snuff films, pediatric snuff films, right?
Right, right.
And so then somebody's got to say, nope, no snuff films.
And then whoever it is that gets put in the position of the power to say no snuff films, while they're sitting around, they're saying, what else should we not have?
Right?
And then pretty soon we're back at Twitter 1.0.
So, and I'm, my intuition is that we can't realize the potential of collective immunity.
Humanity.
And I don't mean collectivism in the socialist sense, but the potential of us as a species, if we were to be able to function in a matrixed world of semi-autonomous communities...
My fear is that we fall back into the same solutions and the same patterns of behavior because the very fact that we're familiar with the way things have already been done is going to bias the solutions that we come up with for the future.
And this is why I'm really wary of people that believe that they know I'm of the opinion that we can't know what that answer is, what that future is for our children.
And it's going to take, you know, it's taken them four generations to put us in this box.
And if you think you're going to, if we think we're going to get out of it in the next year and a half, I'm sorry, my friends, this is going to be a multi-generational problem.
You're going to have to teach your children and your children's children, and they're going to have to keep pushing this rock up the hill for quite a while.
I agree with that assessment, and I would add that I think the end results that we observe in most societies end up being projections of the internal morality and teachings.
Nicely put.
Yes.
Right?
So the fundamental education of moral, exactly.
This ends up then being expressed through what become the laws or the understandings or the integrity of the rule of contract, for example.
In a society that teaches no morals, you really can't have a basis.
Exactly.
If you have no integrity, you can have no commerce.
Exactly.
You cannot form community in an environment that lacks integrity.
And this is the basis of Ed Dowd's and other colleagues from Maui, their brilliant little essay, monograph that they put out that they named the Malone Doctrine.
Which is all about how to enable and validate integrity so that those that would endorse those principles could be relied upon in transactions between organizations, between individuals.
I think I so strongly concur with you That the foundation has to be an ethical one, a shared ethics, and I'm persuaded by the argument Whether you believe that the Bible as a document was produced through a direct intervention of a monotheistic
entity that we call God, or it represents some mix of divine inspiration and learned ethics over time through millennia of the human species,
Whatever your persuasion, those documents that we call Bible and the other central documents for many of the monotheistic world religions capture the learned wisdom of millennia and to discard them is pure hubris and believe that we could somehow
conceive of solutions to fundamental human problems In the span, you know, by, you know, Novel Harari writing a couple of books is just profoundly, profound hubris.
Yes.
And for no other reason, we should reject him for that.
There may or may not be insights in what Harari has to say.
Personally, I think he's naive and naive.
And it's just a fashionable trend among certain elites to follow him.
But to reject Judeo-Christian tradition, I think, is a fast road to hell.
Well said.
And I think what Harari is giving character to, at least this is my observation, among the younger generations right now, they grew up in an environment following the cycle of innovation leading to comfort, which leads to apathy, which leads to loss of morality and kind of an instant gratification mindset that we saw, I think, play out in the crypto space recently.
Now, Have you read Jared Diamond, Guns, Germs, and Steel?
No.
Okay.
It's very much in line with what we're talking about, where the sustainability of civilizations in the long run often comes out of the hardship and the...
The actual ecological hardship, you know, climate hardship, having to plan for seasons of food instead of starving because you don't have instant gratification of year-round, you know, papaya to eat at every moment.
You actually have to plan and...
Exactly.
I think that's what he's saying.
There's a deep truth in that.
God knows I've experienced it.
I'm not whining, but I think any of us that have lived enough years and lived close to the land have experienced our share of bumps and bruises and challenges, huh?
Indeed, and you mentioned something there, very critical, living closer to the land, because I think that a decentralization in terms of geography, also getting more people out of the cities and onto homesteads, or small plots, or larger plots, it changes your philosophy of life.
So this is why in the last section of the book we have a chapter dedicated basically to victory gardens.
I think that you and I share an ethic.
We have to be careful here.
It's just going to turn into a mutual love fest here.
But I'm with you.
I'm reminded of the key line in Candide, we must all go work in the garden.
One of the fun facts is that during World War II, with the rise of the Victory Gardens in North America and the United States in particular, we ended up having a greater output of food from these local community gardens than we had had produced from established agriculture.
They built Victory Gardens in Central Park in Manhattan.
I mean, imagine that.
Yeah.
It was a huge movement.
And then it got quenched.
Basically, it got killed by big ag.
And Earl Butz, during the Nixon administration, get big or get out, just destroyed this small farm.
To promote big ag, Monsanto, mechanization, exactly.
And when you destroyed the small farm, you destroyed the local communities.
And the other thing that I think people never talk...
I never hear people talk about, but you probably understand since you live closer to the land.
During the wintertime, Midwestern farmers and farmers in general hole up in their garages, maintain their equipment, and tinker.
And a whole bunch of innovation comes out of that.
You know, a case can be made that...
The automobile or even powered flight was in part the consequence of innovators tinkering in small garages.
So I think we've lost this, you know, I don't mean to overstate things, but we lost a key part of our national soul when we killed the small farm.
That's right.
That's exactly what has happened.
And look, I know we've just barely scratched the surface here, but in the interest of time, I'm going to wrap this up, but I just want to point out that in your book, you talk about this better future coming.
And may I ask you as the last question, you believe that humanity will overcome this current dark period and that we will go on and learn from this and do better?
Let's say I have a cautious, optimistic hope, and I'm doing my best to help communicate that we don't have to live in this dark, grim reality that they wish to shape for us.
We can choose otherwise.
And to that end, I've started discussions with Chris Langan, Are you familiar with Chris?
I'm not.
So you might want to look him up.
Really, I think he'd be a great guy for you to interview.
He has one of the highest IQs in the United States.
He's right up close to 200.
Wow.
But he was a bouncer in New York City for about 15 years.
Wow.
He lives on a farm in the Midwest.
They have horses, him and his wife.
It's an old 1800s farmhouse, just like the rest of us that have lived in old homes.
I just was with them on a Zoom call for a couple hours a couple days ago, and they were talking about Chris tore a major tendon in his leg because they were moving some heavy equipment and part of the floor fell in.
You know, he's a real guy living.
He used to be a bodybuilder.
He's now around 70, so a little longer in the tooth.
But another person that has lived a very rich intellectual life in parallel, no formal higher education, in parallel to living in the real world at the same time.
So fascinating guy.
And he has spent decades Really thinking hard about this same set of questions about religion, meta-religion.
What is the future?
How do we realize the full potential of humanity?
What is the nature of being?
What is the nature of reality?
He's asked these hard, hard questions and really built his own language around it.
But I encountered his work A couple of months ago and wrote an essay on the Substack.
And I was fascinated.
He'd written papers back in the 90s that spoke about a future of decentralized matrix-connected humanity and the potential that could be unleashed.
And it was far, far ahead of its time.
But in talking to him and reading about his work, which is not easy to follow.
It's deep in philosophy and fundamentals of thought.
But he has absolutely been making major advances in helping envision a better future for all of us.
And if you want to reach out afterwards, I'd love to connect you to him and see that you could get him on your podcast.
I can tell you one of my gifts is that I'm not that smart.
I'm smart enough that I can converse with folks that are at that level.
But in my experience, sometimes they live in their own worlds and it can be sometimes hard to communicate with them.
And Chris can go off.
He's so bright.
That sometimes it can be hard to follow him, but I think it's well worth the journey because he has thought deeply about God, religion.
He is absolutely a believer in humanity and unleashing the human potential.
And I think that's kind of where we have to go in addition to living in the real world as opposed to the virtual world.
Also, allowing ourselves to imagine what the full potential of humanity might be and how we might get there.
Mm-hmm.
Outstanding.
Yes, I would love that introduction and to explore those topics with him.
I'm right there with you, because as much as I talk about collapse and what people would say, doom, I'm only talking about the near-term doom.
The long-term is not doom, because we're either going to learn or die, and actually I think both will happen.
Some will die, others will learn.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And for the sake of our children, hopefully we make it so there's less tragedy and a little more comedy and joy.
Yes.
And I know we're trying to wrap it up.
If you'll allow me just a moment.
Please.
And I've just come back from Austria where we spoke to groups there about the importance of resiliency.
And about the season and what we've all experienced over the last three years and where we're going from here.
And in those discussions, I focused very much on this better future.
Right now, We're in this position, this point in time, as we head into Christmas in just a few days, where the ground is frozen, as you said.
It's asleep.
It's recovering.
The fruit trees are starting to build their bud.
The bulbs are asleep.
And then we're going to merge into spring.
And the daffodils will come out yet again.
The cherry trees will flower.
And I suggest that we use this period of time.
I think today may be the winter solstice, as I recall, today or yesterday.
So it's that transition, that ancient transition that we all experience in a deep way.
And is often historically a time for reflection, introspection, rebirth, and also forgiveness.
And I've been trying to emphasize in my discussions not that we should forgive those that have done this to us.
I think they need to be held accountable.
But in our daily lives, I believe we have to allow ourselves to forgive our neighbors, our brothers and sisters, the folks around us.
We've all been torn apart from each other in so many different ways.
And if we can find, during this season, the ability to extend a hand, give somebody a hug, Forgive a little bit, even if we don't forget.
Then we're more likely to be able to come back together.
In my opinion, we must oppose these forces that are trying to tear us apart as a community.
And find ways to find common ground and come back together.
That's how we get to resilience.
And I think that's an essential thing to fight and resist these individuals who seek to define our lives for us.
I think they've been working on this and they have so much economic power.
And political power that we're not going to be able to triumph if we allow ourselves to be fragmented.
Yes, well said.
So that's my closing on this is absolutely I'm not saying that we should forgive Tony Fauci or Klaus Schwab or Tedros or all these other nefarious actors that have We've breached their vows to defend the Constitution and maintain the laws of the United States, etc.
But that on kind of the local level, do our best to try to heal during this time so that we can be stronger as community.
Over.
Well said.
Yes, I think our audience would agree with that, and I would only add that we must remember that those who hold centralized power almost never historically give it up, and what usually happens is they become obsolete, or they create so much failure and inefficiency that their system implodes upon itself,
and then organically something else rises up I would rather boot them out than have to go through a major economic downturn, but I'm afraid we may be heading into that.
I think probably you and I both...
Share the belief that it is wise to hope for the best, but prepare for the worst.
Exactly.
Well, Robert Malone, this has been a real pleasure.
I think this has been the most meaningful, profound discussion that you and I have ever had, for sure.
I think our audience will love this.
Just want to remind them, your book is called Lies My Government Told Me and the Better Future Coming.
It's available for free through Christmas in the Kindle version on Amazon.com.
Or you can purchase it in hardcover, including on brighteonbooks.com, should you choose to do so, or Amazon, Barnes& Noble, wherever.
So thank you, Dr.
Malone.
Oh, and your Substack is rwmalonemd.substack.com.
Just so.
Perfect.
Thank you for joining us.
Thanks for having me on, and Merry Christmas, all.
Merry Christmas to you as well.
We'll talk again.
And please don't disconnect yet.
We have to finish the file sync on your side.
Understood.
Yes, Riverside.
Okay, yeah.
Thank you for joining me.
It's been a pleasure.
Take care.
Okay, bye-bye.
And to all of you listening, feel free to repost this interview on your own channels and platforms because we want to share this message with as many people as possible.
I'm Mike Adams, the founder of Brighteon.com, and this has been an interview with Robert W. Malone, MD. Thank you for listening.
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