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Dec. 13, 2022 - Health Ranger - Mike Adams
46:16
Interview with Jeremy Cordon, founder of Goldbacks - currency with atomic GOLD infused within
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All right, welcome to today's interview.
Mike Adams here, the founder of Brighteon.com, the free speech platform.
And as all of you know, I am a huge fan of atomic elements, certain ones in particular, such as gold and silver and platinum and so on.
And today I have a really special guest for you.
He's the founder of a company called Goldback, and the website is goldback.com.
His name is Jeremy Corden.
And he has a unique solution for a fungible gold-infused currency that looks revolutionary because it's real money, not just fiat currency backed by nothing.
The gold is in the bills.
So anyway, he joins us now to answer all my questions and tell us about this.
Mr.
Corden, it's an honor to have you on, sir.
Thank you for joining me.
Thanks for having me, Mike.
Absolutely.
This is really exciting.
As I mentioned to you earlier, a friend of mine, Robert Scott Bell, he gave me one of your Goldback bills, which is very, it's a work of art all by itself.
And he said the gold is infused in the bill that represents the value of the bill.
And so I'm holding one in my hands as I speak to you.
Can you give us the quick summary version for those who are totally new to what is a Goldback?
Can you tell us what that is?
Sure.
You know, if you're looking at a gold back, and I'd recommend you look it up if you can, but it kind of looks like a Willy Wonka ticket, right?
So the idea is that currency, at least in bill form, has either been backed by, you know, faith and trust, or it's backed by metal in a vault somewhere else.
Right.
The gold back allows you to actually have the gold on you in the bill itself, which hasn't been done.
So a single gold back is one one-thousandth of an ounce of gold.
It's the smallest mass-produced bullion product in the entire world, as far as we can tell.
And, you know, they're designed to fit into your wallet.
There's other denominations of goldbacks that carry more gold.
So, for example, the five goldback has five one-thousandths of an ounce of gold or one-two-hundredth of an ounce of gold if you're mathematically inclined.
And it has five times the value, you know?
We've got denominations going up to 50.
Oh, up to 50.
That was my next question.
Up to 50.
The highest denomination.
Okay.
Okay.
Yeah, after that, you're doing more with a bar, right?
That's a 20th of an ounce of gold, so that's kind of a lot to have in something that's bendable, I guess.
Yeah, exactly.
So the physical bill is a polymer or kind of a plastic substance.
What would you say it is other than the gold?
You know, I think of it as like a gold sandwich, right?
So you have these really tough kind of circulation-grade polymers on either side, and then the gold is sandwiched in the middle, so you don't lose any of it.
It doesn't rub off in your wallet or, you know, whatever.
So the gold, as I was looking at your website, the gold is applied at the, I guess, it's nebulized atoms of gold that are applied and then sealed into the bill, sandwiched in, or how would you describe that process?
So the process is called vacuum deposition.
Have you ever seen a pair of Oakley sunglasses?
Yeah.
So there's a layer of gold in Oakley sunglasses.
So it's the same people that originally developed that technology, you know, and it was used for, you know, putting a layer of gold in, say, windows, right?
Or a layer of silver in mirrors.
The vacuum deposition is also used for putting tiny, tiny amounts of gold in microchips.
So, you know, you're talking about, you know, this is very advanced kind of stuff here.
But it's never been used for a bullion product before.
So, you know, that's what we're looking at for goldbacks.
Okay, so right now I'm holding, and we'll put this on screen to show people what these look like, I'm holding a one goldback bill.
And as you said, it contains one one-thousandth of an ounce of gold, correct?
Correct.
Okay, so right now, let's just say a gold ounce coin is roughly $2,000.
I know it's not exactly that, but we'll call it $2,000.
So then the current U.S. dollar value of this would be somewhere around $2.
Is that correct?
That would be the melt value if you melted it down and turned it into a pellet.
What kind of car do you drive, Mike?
Well, I drive a truck, actually.
I drive a Ford truck.
Okay.
So it's made out of steel and rubber, and it's probably got a catalytic converter with some rhodium in it, right?
Correct, yeah.
What's the melt value of your truck?
Yeah, only a fraction of its utility value.
Okay.
But you paid more than melt for it?
Exactly.
Why?
Yeah, because of its utility, exactly.
Right.
So a goldback, I mean, you imagine, we take an ounce of gold, we split it into a thousand different pieces, and then every single unit, every single goldback has a serial number, and it's in a unit that has never, ever, ever been counterfeited before.
Right.
And probably couldn't be.
I mean, we're talking millions of dollars worth of equipment and decades of expertise to make one.
So when we take the material and we work it, it does add value to it.
If you have a one-ounce coin, just going through the U.S. Mint and then stamping it, it'll add about $50 to $100 of value per unit for a stamp.
And that technology has been around for eons, right?
Right, right.
A goldback, we're able to get them down to under $2 a unit in terms of unit price.
So we're really proud of, you know, it used to be like a 6-800% premium to do something like a goldback.
Right now, it's closer to like 100%.
And I think it's going to stay there.
Wow, okay.
So someone can buy this from you or your dealers for roughly how much right now?
Like four bucks.
Four bucks?
Oh, wow.
Okay.
Yeah, that's pretty incredible.
Yeah, so it's not too bad.
I mean, we're actually really proud of it.
If you had tried to buy a bar...
That was as small as a goldback, like a quarter grain bar, you know, something just itty bitty.
And they look like they're, you know, like the fingernail off of like a fingernail clipping off your pinky.
I mean, these things are tiny, tiny, tiny.
You know, you're looking at like six bucks.
Right.
You know, and you basically just roll those things out of a...
So what's amazing to me, and again, one of the reasons why I wanted to have you on, our audience, they're very sophisticated, very high IQ. They know that inflation is destroying the value of the fiat currency dollar at an incredible pace.
We've calculated it at about 2% per month, by the way, loss of valuation in terms of purchasing power of things that people really buy, like food and fuel and so on.
2% a month.
Now, what I like about your goldback is there's no dollar sign on it.
It's not a dollar, and it's not pretending to be a dollar.
It's not tied to a dollar.
Am I correct in all of that?
Yeah, in terms of, like, Federal Reserve Note dollars, they're not posing as Federal Reserve Note dollars.
That's not what a goldback is.
And their value is independent.
I would think of Federal Reserve Note value.
So goldbacks came out in 2019, and when they were first sold for the very first time, they were like $2.
So you can get a 50 goldback for $100.
You can get a 1 goldback for $2.
All the pricing is interchangeable across the goldbacks, generally speaking, if you're dealing with a reputable dealer.
And now, I mean, the average price is a lot closer to $4.
So, you know, the dollar value, the US dollar value of the goldback has gone up a lot over the last three years in a way that would be consistent with the inflation that you're saying that we're having.
The people that have owned goldbacks haven't been hit with that.
Right.
Okay.
Yeah, that answers my question.
So in terms of then using the gold bags, let's talk about that.
Now, obviously these have to be physically handed to someone to use them or mailed, I suppose, or sent, you know, FedEx or what have you.
There's no electronic, you know, back end to this, right?
It's the physical bill because the gold is in the bill.
There is one company that will vault goldbacks.
They actually vault them for free.
And you could transfer balances within a membership to each other for goldbacks.
So that does exist.
I don't think that's super common.
For the most part, goldbacks are a lot more like cash, just like you said.
It's going to look and feel like a cash transaction for 99% of people.
So then you have merchants all over the place that accept goldbacks, because I saw they can put stickers in their windows like, we accept goldbacks here.
Does that network exist?
Is it starting to grow?
Yeah, it exists and it's starting to grow.
When goldbacks first came out, one of the early criticisms that we got was, well, no one's going to take your stupid gold back.
No one wants to get paid with gold and silver.
You know, those aren't really money.
We just say that, right?
That's crazy.
This is the only real money.
Gold and silver are real money.
How come people don't get that?
Well, okay, so my partner is Larry Hilton.
He drafted the Legal Tender Act that got passed in Utah in 2011.
And what he expected to have happen after Utah recognized gold and silver as money is he expected people to come out with their coin purses full of gold and silver coins and to engage in all sorts of commerce with them.
And there wasn't a whole lot of evidence that that happened.
I think the reason why is, and I hate to say this as a precious metals person, If you want to spend a $2,000 gold coin, you've got a few problems immediately.
The first is that our market has been flooded with fake gold coins.
So even if you have a purchase that you want to do and the other person is inclined to accept gold, they might not trust your gold coin, especially if they don't know you.
And that's a big problem.
So that's the first problem.
The second problem is you're dealing with a $2,000 gold coin.
I mean, what does this transaction even look like?
You know, a lot of people buy gold coins just in case.
And if you ask them, well, just in case of what?
You know, there's a dirty bomb.
It's an EMP. It's a communist revolution.
You know, I mean, whatever just in case looks like.
Just in case the US dollar doesn't buy things anymore, right?
Just in case the $100 bills I have stashed away aren't that valuable.
That's why I own gold coins.
The next step of that is, okay, well, now you have a bag of $2,000 one ounce gold coins.
Were you actually intending to spend those as gold coins, or was your plan to cash them in for whatever the currency was doing at the moment?
And for most people, the answer is the latter one.
It's like, oh, well, you know, I mean, gold will be a million dollars an ounce, so I'll just, you know, get a million dollars an ounce at the time.
Or cash it into the next new currency that replaces the failing currency.
We've had those discussions before.
But it's not to use the gold coin directly.
It's rare for me to encounter someone that seriously thinks that.
Or if they do, they're buying the Volcambi bars that break off and the chips or whatever.
Goldbacks are so different.
Because it is convenient for small transactions.
I mean, a single gold bag is...
That's your case of bottled water.
I mean, that's your loaf of bread.
That's your dozen eggs.
It's your small transaction.
Correct.
Right.
And it scales up to big transactions as well.
So then it would seem then...
As the dollar gets weaker, well, and I know people are going to say, well, it's strong compared to the British pound.
Yeah.
Yeah, the dollar is just not failing as quickly as the British pound is failing.
Okay, so we'll have that discussion later.
They're all failing.
Just go buy food and you'll find out they're all failing.
But I would think that there'd be more and more demand for something like your goldbacks I know there's a lot more demand in physical gold and silver as well, especially junk silver, which has that small denomination that people like.
Are you seeing more interest now because of the inflation scenarios?
You know, when COVID hit a couple years ago, all the goldbacks sold out.
And not only did they sell out, not only did every retailer sell out of every goldback, the only place that you could get them on was eBay.
Really?
And they were $50 a piece.
For the one unit?
For the one denomination that was worth like two and a half bucks or whatever at the time.
Oh, that's crazy.
Because people wanted a spendable form of gold.
And frankly, there's just not enough goldbacks and the market dictates the value of a currency.
And the same is true for goldback.
Now, I'll say right now, up until today, we have been able to sell every single gold back that we can possibly physically produce.
Really?
Our biggest problem is production.
That's it.
Wow.
And that's not a gold shortage.
No.
It's the vacuum deposit.
It's the vacuum deposition bottleneck.
So we're like literally buying vacuum deposition machines, multimillion-dollar machines, and having them installed and training crews.
And, you know, there's millions of dollars being poured into it right now.
Wow.
And we have orders right now.
I have contracts where we could sell between $25 and $30 million worth of gold backs every month.
And we're producing maybe $3 to $4 million a month.
Wow.
Well, that's a nice problem to have in your space.
But also, I'm sure you understand that this needs to reach a critical mass in the consciousness of familiarity with people to really continue to take off.
It's kind of like a parabolic response, I would think.
Yeah.
Here's the thing with cryptocurrency, and I'll give cryptocurrency people this.
It's...
If you have a new cryptocurrency and it gets popular, you can have a million users tomorrow.
Right?
I mean, like, it's code.
You can just keep dividing it.
I actually have to make all these callbacks, right?
Well, that's why we like your solution.
Because we've all watched crypto just collapse, you know?
And actually, I was one of the guys talking about why crypto shouldn't be trusted as an asset long ago.
And people gave me all kinds of crap for that, by the way.
But here we are.
I don't doubt it.
Yeah, here we are.
So the nice thing about Goldback is if you have these in your possession, let's say that your company, Jeremy, if your company collapses and your servers collapse and your website collapses, it doesn't matter.
People still have these in their possession.
Let's say that I get arrested and thrown in the deepest, darkest dungeon.
They'll probably just make your value of goldbacks go up because we're not making them anymore, right?
Oh my gosh, you're right.
I hadn't thought about that.
You're probably right.
Okay, a practical question.
I notice if I rub my fingers on the back, I can feel the pattern a little bit of some of the words as they go through, like the word goldback.
You can feel it with your finger like braille.
What am I feeling there?
Because the gold's not going to rub off, right?
No.
So the back of a goldback is literally a negative image of the front.
And that's part of what makes them so dang difficult to counterfeit.
You can read the serial number of the goldback through the goldback that's actually imprinted in the gold itself.
So it's really high-end.
I mean, this is like future Twilight Zone space money, you know, if you look at it closely.
Okay, well I am looking at it right now.
So one of my questions then, if I'm a merchant, if I have a little shop somewhere and I'm selling sandwiches and I want to accept goldbacks, how do I know that the goldbacks that people are handing me are legit?
What can I check as a merchant?
So you could read the serial number.
If you read the serial number on there, you can read the same serial number through it.
Me, personally, I wouldn't.
And the reason why is because there's never been a fake goldback.
To fake a goldback, and I think I mentioned this a few minutes ago, you'd need about $3 to $5 million worth of vacuum deposition equipment.
And you'd have to have at least a decade's worth of experience to be able to make anything that looked even kind of close to a goldback.
I mean, not to mention, you know, the government level, any counterfeiting features, and all the other things that are actually printed on there that all the other currencies have.
I mean, that's just to make something that could resemble...
You know, a golden ticket at that price.
Well, but specifically as a merchant, okay?
Let's say I'm a merchant.
I don't know anything about vacuum deposition.
I just want to know, is this thing real?
What can I look at?
You know, because if I take a $100 bill, I can use the yellow marker, right?
Or I can hold it up to the light, look for the holograms or whatever the people do.
You know, the embedded little magnetic read code, whatever that thing is.
What can merchants do with your gold back?
So there's six anti-counterfeiting features.
If you look at the front, there are security strips that wouldn't really be easy to duplicate.
The best anti-counterfeiting feature is the back, where you're looking at pure gold and it's a perfect negative image of the front.
If you're really worried about it, again, I would read the serial number through the bill.
So you read it on the front, and then you can read it through the bill on the back.
If we're even more worried about it, I mean, you can do a serial number check and you can authenticate the gold back to see if it's real or not online.
Oh, wow.
Yeah, I see the serial number.
Obviously, it's a reverse image, as you said, but yeah, you can see it coming through.
Okay, cool.
That's really interesting.
All right, next question.
A lot of our listeners are very successful business people, and they might be interested in retailing your gold backs.
How does someone do that?
You know, we started out saying that we really just want, you know, coin stores, metals dealers to be selling goldbacks.
Yes.
And then we didn't really aggressively try to recruit anybody because, again, we were selling out all the time.
Ah, right.
So it didn't make sense to expand the distribution network a whole lot.
Since then, we have piloted kind of more preparedness-oriented stores selling goldbacks, you know, people that are selling, like, you know, dry goods and stuff.
Yeah.
We didn't want every retailer selling goldbacks.
I think we wanted to make it more exclusive.
But we have included, I think at times, like pawn shops and things like that too.
So if you're super interested and you think it would be an amazing fit, you could email us.
You can email info at goldback.com and apply to be a distributor.
I want to say right now we've got somewhere between 50 and 100 direct distributor relationships.
Yes.
And then we've got more relationships, you know, through some of the other wholesalers of goldbacks.
Is there a, like a investment minimum or anything that you want to talk about public?
Like you have to take on $50,000 worth of goldback inventory to begin or something like that?
Not really.
Again, I haven't super emphasized chasing down more distributors for goldbacks just because of the sales problems that we've had.
So we'll let people dip their toes in the water if we approve them as a distributor.
Okay.
All right.
Fair enough.
Very cool.
Well, I guarantee you you're going to have interest after this interview.
You will experience that because, again, we have a lot of successful business people who are looking for ways to augment their existing businesses.
Now, okay, next question for you.
I know you don't mind having tough questions, but I remember covering stories years ago, like there was this one guy who would do unique artwork.
Kind of his own interpretation of what a $100 bill would be, and he would offer them to merchants, and he would say, this is my artwork.
It kind of looks like a $100 bill.
And I think that guy was arrested and charged with counterfeiting, which is absurd because it didn't look anything like a $100 bill.
Have you had any problems with Treasury on this, anything like that?
You know, one thing that I studied a lot before getting into Goldback, and I was extremely nervous about it, was the fate of the Liberty Dollar.
And maybe that's...
I don't think that's who you're referring to right now.
No, but I know what you're talking about, yes.
But there's the whole Liberty Dollar kind of fiasco.
And, you know, the way it was presented to me is, here you have a guy.
And all he did was, you know, made a silver round with a dollar value on it.
And, you know, they went out and got him.
Now, before doing Goldback, I researched it.
I researched the FBI's case against him.
I actually read the 48-page case against Bernard von Nothaus for the Liberty Dollar.
And I learned things like, you know, it was an MLM. Oh, it was?
Oh.
The silver rounds were worth $10 apiece at the time in terms of melt value.
Or no, they were $4 at the time and they had a $10 value stamped on them.
So he was charging an extremely unusual premium for what the product actually was.
And then the most damning thing is he's on video training people To go to stores, and these are, you know, I think like Wendy's, and go in and present these silver coins as, oh, this is the new silver dollar.
Oh, gosh.
Really?
So, you know, I mean, these cashiers were taking them because, I mean, the Treasury makes all sorts of stuff.
You know, they got a stack of Julia coins and numismatic, you know, like it's within the realm of belief that there could be a silver coin.
Uh-huh.
And these people would go back to the bank with their $10 silver, and the bank would say, hey, this isn't a dollar.
And that's where the counterfeiting case against this guy was built up.
I see.
You know, the fact that We really go out of our way with Goldback to make sure that even the dumbest person doesn't think they're a dollar.
No, they're not even the same size, shape, feel, texture, color.
No, the same orientation.
Dollars are horizontally oriented and ours are more vertically oriented.
But also, the value is $4.
Who on earth is going to pass that off as a dollar?
You're losing 75%.
Good point.
Who's gonna believe it?
It's like, hey, you know the Sacagawea coin?
They made it look like a dollar.
I would like to lose 75%, please.
What does that even look like?
We write on these things, not a US dollar, on every single one.
But no, we haven't got any pushback from the Treasury.
We've had 2,000 local currencies in the US. The Goldback is really just a series of local currencies operating under state law.
And we're finding that they're really popular outside of the respective states that there are local currencies in.
Which states are those, by the way?
So we have Utah, New Hampshire, Nevada, and now Wyoming.
And I believe we have business networks in each of these states.
And, you know, to answer your earlier question, because I don't think I answered this very well, I was hoping that about 5% of small business owners would accept Goldbacks' payment.
When we actually went out and talked to small business owners, it was closer to 30% to 50%.
We couldn't believe the acceptance rate for Goldbacks.
You mean that they were willing to accept it?
Yeah, like they wanted it.
I see.
30% to 50%.
Now, go ahead.
Well, yeah, see, so we're, of course, a large online retailer to a lot of preppers, and there was a time when we accepted crypto.
But, of course, we immediately converted the crypto into dollars using a plug-in with the shopping cart.
Now, that plug-in has since vanished because of the crypto collapse.
But as a merchant, we did not want to take any risk whatsoever of crypto valuation volatility.
Whereas, if we could take something that's got gold in it, As far as I'm concerned, there's no risk because the metal's in the bill.
It's there.
You're stacking metal.
You're not taking currency risk.
So, in my view, this would be the ideal currency, or not currency, but the ideal bill to accept.
You know, and that's what we argue.
And the big initial concern was, well, you know, how are we going to allow retailers to turn this back into cash if everybody actually just wants cash?
And, you know, we set up all these systems for that.
And what we found is that in the first year that we were doing this, and we'd signed up, you know, Only three of these businesses had ever come in saying, hey, I want cash for these goldbacks.
Most people just want to keep the gold.
Right, right.
Because the plan is to circulate it, not turn it back into cash.
So you do have a, can I call it a buyback program or something, where people, if they send you these goldbacks, you will give them fiat dollars?
Yeah.
I mean, they're as good as gold, you know.
Of course we're willing to buy them back.
We only get like 1% of them back.
Right.
May I ask you, what's the spread between what you sell them for and what you buy them back for?
You know, for the longest time, we had a spread of 0%.
We didn't publish that.
We just offered that because we didn't want anybody to feel like they lost anything on it.
You know, I think most retailers, though, this is one specific retailer I'm talking about, not Goldback itself, Most retailers are going to probably charge a more regular spread, like 5% to 10%.
Right.
Which is pretty typical in silver, for example.
Sure.
Okay.
But what about your company?
Do you buy them back directly, or do you just send people to your retailers or dealers?
Sure.
Goldback itself doesn't really have to.
We have one dealer that we bought.
So it's kind of weird telling the story.
So they did buy back at zero.
We ended up purchasing that retailer about a year ago.
So they're a subsidiary now, and they buy back Goldbacks.
And that's Alpine Gold.
And then may I ask you, what's their spread?
Or what's the best spread that people can get if they wanted to do this?
I think for walk-in traffic they do 0% still.
I think otherwise it's 5%.
Oh, okay.
Now, changing gears here, what about, I would imagine you must be contacted by other countries, other nations that want, like nations that have had a history of failing currency, you know, that's a long list.
But you would think that if they want economic stability, they would want something like this.
Has any, if you can even talk about it, I don't know, we didn't prearrange any questions here, but has any other nation contacted you with interest in this?
I have to be careful what I say, because I am bound by NDAs.
Okay, yeah, fair enough.
I will say this.
There are foreign central banks that today are trying to circulate their gold reserves, and they're doing it with these crappy bars that aren't very popular that they're looking for alternatives for.
There are other nations that you would know that have expressed a huge amount.
And by nations, I mean foreign central banks here.
Okay.
There are foreign central banks that have expressed a huge amount of interest in goldbacks as kind of like a pilot for what could be done at a bigger scale within their own countries.
Okay.
So, you know, I think the technology is really going somewhere.
I don't necessarily think that the Goldback brand will cover the whole earth in every country.
But I think it's very possible that you could see dozens of foreign central banks offering products similar to the Goldback.
Because what do central banks have?
You know, they have fiat currencies that are falling apart.
But they also hold all these gold reserves.
Now, nobody trusts them on a gold standard because the gold standard was abolished, right?
And all the tokens became worthless.
But if a central bank can circulate gold directly with this kind of technology, that's a huge solution for them.
See, I think this is the future of money because right now around the world, everybody's moving into digital wallets.
Even the Bank of England, we're doing a story on them.
They're going to try to roll out a digital wallet system, and digital wallets are being experimented with around the world.
Those systems are complex, difficult for people to use, and they're vapor.
They're not backed by anything.
They can fail, and they can be hacked.
You can lose everything.
You can be controlled, surveilled.
Whereas your solution, Goldbacks, the gold is in the bill, and the gold isn't spying on you.
It's a key feature.
Yeah, I had a bureaucrat, they asked me, they said, do you have any idea how many goldbacks actually circulate?
And I answered, I said, how could I possibly know?
I put these things out there, and they kind of have a life of their own.
I've heard stories through the grapevines of communities that have adopted goldbacks.
I've heard of them being used in casinos.
I've heard of them being used in buying vehicles.
You hear about stories, but for the most part, people really like the privacy of nobody has to know about their transactions.
It's like cash just like that.
And that's the biggest beef I have with any sort of digital system is privacy.
Well, right.
And also, think about it.
We live in a world where we're constantly subjected to cyber attacks, hacks, power grid failures.
You know, all these things take down digital systems.
I mean, how often does the food stamp system go down, by the way?
It's frequent.
How often does your ATM not work?
It's frequent.
And by the way, banks around the world are starting to really limit withdrawals of your own cash.
For example, Nigeria has a $45 A day limit on withdrawing your own cash.
I mean, it's your money.
They won't let you get it out.
That's not a great solution.
Yeah, that's rough.
I think that as things get scarier, people look for alternatives because they don't want to feel like their money is inside of a giant trap that they don't have access to when they need it.
And that's what these banks are turning out to be.
Yeah, a giant trap.
You nailed it.
Yep.
Yeah, exactly.
Now, if someone takes some of your goldbacks and they burn them up or melt them down, the gold, obviously, which is not flammable, will still be there, but you will lose the utility value of the bill, but you'll still have the actual gold.
Have you handled BBs for a BB gun?
Yeah.
All right.
That's about, loosely, how much gold?
Eh, a little less than that.
There's a little bit less than that of gold inside a single goldback.
So it's like, what would you rather trade with?
Which denomination?
The 50?
The 1.
Oh, the 1?
Yeah, I'm actually thinking it's a little bit smaller than BB. I might have spoken out of turn.
Yeah, it's probably quite a bit smaller.
I mean, 1 1,000th of an ounce.
Yeah, 1 1,000th of an ounce.
Maybe that's, well, like a tenth of a BB? I don't know.
I get your point.
It's a small little thing.
It's a small little thing.
What would you rather have?
Something that's rolled out and has a serial number on it and a weight that's in a format that's extremely beautiful and unlikely to have been counterfeited.
I'd say impossible, but never say impossible.
Or the DD that you don't even really know for sure what it is.
What would you rather be trading with and accepting?
Well, right.
And I'm even thinking, let's say you have a stack of these goldbacks in your safe, and then your house is on fire, and your safe heats up because they do that, and everything melts.
Well, the gold is still there, even though you lost the goldback.
Yeah, you'll lose half, but you won't lose all of it.
Yeah, see, now that's critical for people, because if you have fiat currency dollar bills and they burn up, well, that's it.
They're gone.
You lose 100%.
Sure.
And then if you keep it in the bank, you lose 100% if the bank doesn't let you have it.
Do you know what a $100 bill costs?
To make?
Yeah.
I don't know.
Tell me.
So the cost of labor and materials, it's $0.08.
Wow.
They're pretty.
I mean, they look nice, right?
And they got the security features in there.
It's $0.08.
Now, that includes the labor and the manufacturing costs.
Now, if you were to include the laboring and the manufacturing costs on a single goldback, the company that makes them loses about $0.08 per goldback it makes.
They're produced in a loss.
Isn't that your company?
No, that's the manufacturing company.
Oh, you mean the vacuum deposition company?
Yeah, I was able to convince them to take a loss on the one because they profit off the other denominations a little bit better, so...
Oh, okay, okay.
So, wow, so it's actually a loss on the one.
Yeah, it's a loss.
I mean, how many products, let alone currencies, can you buy at a manufacturing loss?
Right.
Nowhere.
Nowhere.
If anything, I'd argue that goldbacks are grossly undervalued for what they are right now.
But again, we haven't really advertised them a whole lot just because...
Why are you going to dump advertising dollars into something that's sold out?
Right.
Or on the verge of selling out all the time.
What about retailers like us that sell mostly online?
Do you have retailers that are accepting goldbacks in the mail, essentially?
Yeah, you know, I'm sure it's...
I'm not going to pretend that a goldback is going to solve everybody's problems tomorrow, right?
I mean...
At some point, you'd have to have, like, credit unions, or you're going to have to have payment processors denominating things in goldbacks to make it easier for long-distance transactions.
We have a few things that are kind of, like, in the pre-stages of that, but it's not an amazing currency for online transactions.
It's just not right now.
But I think a lot of our viewers believe that as these currently complex globalist systems break down more and more, that things are going to become more local anyway.
Well, I'll tell you what I did.
So I've got a neighborhood where we've got like 100 houses on top of this hill.
I sent a Christmas card with a gold back to every single one of my neighbors.
Right?
So this is Utah.
These are preparedness-minded people.
A lot of them have food storage.
Yeah.
I know for a fact that about a dozen of my neighbors own quite a few goldbacks since then.
So they got them from the other neighbors?
Well, they bought some.
Oh, okay.
So what you've done is you've educated your local community about goldbacks.
You showed them what the money is.
You can explain it to people.
And the people that you think you're the most likely to trade with...
You want them to already have the currency.
Right.
And that way I'm protecting myself because I know that if I have to walk out of my house and trade with somebody with goldbacks, they already know what they are and they already have some.
See, I would like to buy several hundred of the goldback one denomination because when I tip waiters, when I tip people, when I buy things, let's say at a firearm store, I'm picking up a firearm transfer.
I would like to hand these out, which is what Robert Scott Bell did to me, which is why we're having this interview, by the way.
Just hand them out.
Yeah, it's a semi-viral product.
I mean, to sell out over the last few years, I want to say that we've spent under $100,000 in advertising and marketing.
We're talking about millions of dollars in sales a month.
These things sell themselves because people get excited, and it's a cause.
It's a grassroots movement for sound money, and there hasn't really been a whole lot of things like this.
And they'll get goldbacks.
They're extremely beautiful.
They have a huge amount of novelty for their value.
And they'll give them out as Christmas gifts to everyone they know.
They'll give them out as tips to everyone they see.
And when you do it, it just comes with a little 30-second sound money speech.
And now you have somebody that owns precious metal for the very first time.
You supported them on the journey.
Yeah, I was joking in a podcast the other day, you know how California is looking at paying slave reparations to people whose ancestors might have been slaves.
And I said, I fully support that idea if they pay it in honest money.
So to put actual gold and silver into the hands of people of California, that was my observation on that.
But last question, because I want to be respectful of your time.
I don't know anything about how you got into this, and you can keep it short, but what inspired you, if I may ask, to do this?
Because this is a huge project, fraught with some risk, obviously, and some people who don't get it must be critical.
Oh, what do you need this for?
Blah, blah.
What got you into this?
You know, what got me super sucked into the world of sound money initially was Yeah, this is back when I was in college.
I was just really kind of obsessed with it.
I was just grabbing everything I could learn about Sound Money.
It was the Ron Paul campaign in 2011.
Oh, nice.
And Ron Paul talked about sound money all the time.
So that got me really interested.
I started working in the sound money space starting in 2015.
And that's where I worked at kind of like a coin store and a vaulting company.
We did a gold-backed cryptocurrency.
Not a gold-backed, but a gold-backed cryptocurrency in 2018.
And it didn't do super well.
It still exists, but it just wasn't very popular.
And people wanted to hold it.
They wanted to actually have it in their hands.
They didn't trust the digital gold.
So we did gold back a year later.
I'd met the manufacturing company and I helped them raise some money and was able to build a relationship there.
So that really worked out.
It's fun for me because next week, I think it's actually on Tuesday or Wednesday.
It's going to go full circle.
I get to talk to Ron Paul because he's excited about Goldbacks.
Very cool.
So I'm really giddy for that one.
I'll have to not sound like some crazed fanboy, but you know.
Well, it is Ron Paul, and of course we're all fans of him as well, and Senator Rand Paul is doing some great work.
We're trying to recruit him to run for president or something like that.
Okay, well, just to wrap this up, I'll mention...
I'm the author of a book called Resilient Prepping, and it's being published next year by Skyhorse, by the way.
And in that book, I talk about low-tech and no-tech solutions.
Your goldbacks qualify as no-tech solutions in the sense that if all technology fails, this system of value continues to function.
And that's what I love about it.
It doesn't need electricity to hold value.
And it doesn't need blockchain.
It doesn't need computers.
It fits in your wallet.
I mean, we sell gold-back wallets and, you know, I have these gold-backs in my wallet just because you never know when you're going to use them or, you know, introduce people to them or spend them or whatever.
And I put my phone on the other side of them and it actually works as a radiation shield for my phone.
Oh, that's funny.
That's right.
Gold has unique properties, yes.
Yeah, you know, I mean, if you've got a health-conscious, you know, group here, you know, I mean, that's one way to protect you from phone radiation.
Yeah.
Yeah, really great point.
Okay.
I want to encourage our viewers then.
Goldback.com is the website.
Is that where they should go if they want to purchase these?
Or is there some other...
Look at the buyer's guide on goldback.com.
I don't normally warn people.
I will warn your audience.
There are retailers that will charge like $5, $5.50 for a single goldback.
They have reasonable prices for the rest of the denominations.
I wouldn't recommend buying from these guys.
Yeah.
There are retailers that will charge you under $4 for a goldback, and you can find them by going to goldback.com.
Looking at the buyer's guide, anyone in the top four or five businesses on that list are going to be your best bets.
Okay.
All right.
Fair enough.
That's awesome.
All right.
Anything we've left out?
No, I think you...
I mean, we could probably talk about this for another couple hours, but I don't want to disrespect your time either.
No, not at all.
Look, we'll do it again, because I'm interested in us carrying your goldbacks at some point.
Frankly, I can't tell you how impressed I am with this solution, and I don't say that lightly.
And my listeners know that I'm very discerning about what I recommend or promote, but you've just nailed it.
You've hit it You've hit a home run here, I believe.
And this is something that I would like to introduce to all kinds of people.
I'm going to get a bunch of these and hand them out.
That's what I'm going to do.
Okay.
I'll tell you what I'll do for you.
I can get you some Wyoming alphas, probably, if you're going to just hand them out.
Okay.
Whatever works, sure.
That's like a first edition of the Wyoming.
I mean, if you're going to hand them out, you may as well have, you know...
We'll get you some nice ones.
Okay, yeah.
I'm going to light up Texas because I live in central Texas, and I'm going to get these into the hands of a lot of people in Texas.
Well, I think Jim Rickards is giving them away with his book now.
Well, Jim Rickards is awesome, too.
We didn't even talk to him.
He just started doing it.
Yeah, that's the thing.
Well, Rickards gets it.
I mean, he was at long-term capital management, you know, the first too big to fail.
He helped negotiate that bailout in 97 or 98.
Remember that?
No, I was a little kid.
Oh, yeah.
Okay.
Well, anyway, he was there, and that was the first too-big-to-fail, a big currency collapse that almost took out the global economy.
And that's why Rickards knows the importance of honest money, because he also knows that the system is extremely fragile, the fiat currency.
The debt system is extremely fragile.
So anyway, yeah.
All right.
Well, thank you for your time, Jeremy.
It's been an honor, and I really appreciate what you're doing.
Yeah, I'm glad you like it.
I'd love to talk to you about it later sometime.
Well, we will definitely do that.
We'll be back in touch.
I would ask you to just hold on after we stop the interview to let your file finish syncing.
I'll give you my number.
We can keep in touch.
If you have any announcements, we'll help get those out for you.
Sounds great.
Thank you.
All right.
Absolutely.
Okay.
So that's the interview, folks.
Jeremy Corden with Goldback.com.
I'm going to get a bunch of these.
Seriously, I'm going to hand these out.
And folks, you can also share this interview.
Feel free to repost it on your own channels, on other platforms.
And we'll invite Jeremy back on sometime in 2023 as the inflation continues to get worse.
Oh, that should be interesting.
Okay.
Maybe we'll end up buying food with these at some point.
Get your grocery store to take it for ground beef or something.
There's places that already sell food for goldbacks.
We've got hundreds of retailers that advertise themselves as taking goldbacks.
See, there we go.
There's the answer.
We have car dealerships taking goldbacks as payment.
It's crazy.
It's amazing.
It's amazing.
Well, thank you all for listening.
I'm Mike Adams, the founder of Brighteon.com and, of course, HealthRangerStore.com.
And thank you for listening.
God bless you all.
Take care.
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