Three Stooges Botch Robinson Case: Epic Incompetence & Infighting Exposed
Lionel Nation critiques the Tyler Robinson investigation, alleging Dan Bongino, Kash Patel, and Pam Bondi mishandle the case due to Turning Point USA ties. He predicts Erica Kirk's testimony will collapse the prosecution while Candace Owens' presence causes courtroom chaos. Nation contrasts this incompetence with preferred legal tactics like strategic jury selection and Rule 403 evidence exclusion, ultimately suggesting the administration's infighting obstructs justice rather than seeking truth. [Automatically generated summary]
Transcriber: CohereLabs/cohere-transcribe-03-2026, sat-12l-sm, and large-v3-turbo
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The Charlie Kirk Crime00:14:36
Behold the reckoning.
Behold a transmogrification, a vectoring of issues that no one ever saw coming.
It all started with a very simple idea.
This very, I don't want to say very simple, but this crime, this terrible crime involving Charlie Kirk.
Remember, that is what this is about.
This is not the Erica Kirk hour.
It's not about, it's about Charlie Kirk.
It just so happens that she happens to be this ancillary comical part of this tragedy.
And as we look into it, it starts exploding.
Exploding.
Because remember, I have not in any wise suggested that Erica Kirk is involved in any type of criminal activity.
I've never said that.
I've never intimated that.
Never said it.
Never.
It's not a part of this whole thing.
I've never said this.
At all, period.
What I've said is a different story.
What I've said is a different story.
And what is important to understand is very simply this this is a critical matter that we're going to be addressing.
There is a new level of problems associated, a new level, a new tendency, if you will.
And that is, we're looking at three people that really weren't a part of this.
Number one, it was Dan Bongino that we thought we were just done with.
Then there's going to be Kash Patel.
And of course, Pam Bondi.
The president, I don't know what he was thinking when he picked these people.
I have no earthly idea.
What he was thinking, I have no idea.
I don't know what kind of a vetting process he went through.
I don't know how he allowed this to just.
Same thing goes with Epstein and that matter as well.
I don't know what he's thinking.
Epstein was a very simple thing.
Why did that get out of control?
And why is this now getting out of control?
And let me tell you, as we get deeper and deeper involved in this, deeper in the focus in the situation, I am telling you like you can't believe this is serious business.
Very, very serious business.
And I'm sorry to say this.
And somebody said, you know, what's going on?
This is multi layered.
I hope you understand something.
Somebody messaged before.
Oh, there's Kai.
Kai, how are you?
Welcome, welcome, Kai.
Welcome to the show that never ends.
Kai, a lot of people are going to be saying, What are you talking about?
Is this about Erica again?
It's not about Erica.
It's about something else, which is very serious.
Very, very, very serious.
Now, one of the things which is critical for me.
Hang on, I can't do it right now.
Hank can do it right now.
I'm doing the show.
Bad timing.
I wish I got this.
Is how important it is right now for us to talk.
Big stuff going on outside.
They got to wait.
This is important.
I have been doing this now and I've been trying to wake people up.
And I think Candace, as well as others, have been saying, listen, this is not about some mean girls thing.
This is not about some problem.
This is not about some hatred that we have, some negative talk about Erica.
This is incredible.
Let's get down to brass tacks right now.
This is really something too.
And I want you to listen carefully right now because we're now finding out something which is even more important.
Listen carefully because this is where the story is now taking a turn that no one in the mainstream wants to touch.
And what we are looking at right here, what we are looking at is not some minor footnote or some harmless coincidence.
What we're looking at right now is something very critical.
This is the kind of overlap that raises serious questions about judgment and credibility.
And whether the public is getting anything close to an unbiased process.
Do you understand what I'm saying?
Dan Bongina, we thought he was gone, who was a twit.
He's a weird guy.
He's got a lot of issues and anger and one of these tough guy things.
You might have come across these people in your life.
They feel for some reason, maybe their own masculinity or whatever has been compromised, and he feels he's got to always act tough and remind you what a badass he is.
There's something about this.
When a grown man, Constantly tells you how tough he is, and he has to curse.
Listen, cursing is okay.
We're not nuns, we're not priests, but it happens sometimes.
And what's also important, very, very critical, is simply this this guy, all of a sudden, is raising his head.
So, Dan, who was now serving as or was as the deputy director who just stepped down, he went on his own, I guess, podcast and casually revealed at some point something that should have been stopped.
Or should have stopped people cold.
And this is what other people are saying.
So I'm going to give you kind of a culmination of what's happening.
His wife, Paula Andrea Martinez, apparently, this is what I'm saying, apparently was not loosely connected merely to Turning Point USA.
She worked directly, it is alleged, within that orbit.
Nothing wrong with that.
Scheduling, logistics, daily communications with senior figures.
Not distant, not occasional, but embedded, a part of it.
Again, not illegal.
Nothing wrong with that.
That's okay.
And Bongino himself made it clear that this was not some arm's length relationship.
Okay.
He said they spoke almost every day, according to many folks who were chronicling this.
And it was alleged that they had said, it was alleged that they had something or said something that they have known that they do.
Key figures in the organization for years.
That is not peripheral.
Okay.
Again, let me say something.
That's personal.
That's close.
That is not against the law.
Nothing wrong with it.
Now, Take a step back and look at it this way at the bigger picture.
Bangina was positioned as a central figure tied to an investigation involving Charlie Kirk's demise.
At the same time, his own household, his own deep ties to the very organization, whose narrative apparently is being defended in public, is what we're talking about now.
You don't need a law degree to understand to see the problem with this.
You just need to ask yourself a very simple question, very common sense question.
Very, very simple.
Because here is the issue.
When someone in a position of authority has personal connections to individuals or groups connected to the case, the standard response in any serious situation is recusal step aside, remove themselves, which is fine, which is what he did, which is terrific.
Protect the integrity of the process.
That's how it's supposed to work.
But that's not what we saw.
Instead, what we saw is.
Confidence, public statements, alignment with one side of the narrative, and no indication that anybody thought that this overlap was worth addressing.
So let me explain this to you.
Is there anybody in charge of this who was really looking at a very serious attempt, a very serious attempt, a legitimate attempt to get to the bottom of all this?
What we have been told for the longest time is that we don't have to, that they will do whatever the hell they want regarding Epstein.
We are told constantly, look, do us a favor, shut up, we're in charge of this.
How many times have we been told this?
Shut up, we're in charge, leave us alone.
What was he, what, how do you explain?
And was it a problem that this was going on at the time with Bongino and others in charge?
I don't know.
This is serious business.
The problem I want to tell you about, the problem I want to bring to your attention is very simply this, and this is critical.
We have to ask ourselves something.
Is anybody really going to be involved in this?
Is anybody really going to pay attention to this and to, honest to God, seriously pay attention?
Is anybody going to pay attention?
Please.
I beg you.
We're having a bit of a party here, so don't mind the noise.
I wish I could go into detail, but I can't.
But it's good.
In any event, what happened to Epstein?
Everybody was connected with that.
Everybody's connected with TPUSA.
Everybody now.
And Kash Patel, why was he there initially?
Why was the FBI involved in this hospital?
What were they doing?
This is Parkland Hospital.
Why was old Bug Eyes at the seed?
What was going on?
Are we ever going to get to the bottom of this?
Because here's the thing if you insinuate yourself in something which you really have no jurisdiction over, the federal government had no business being there.
And the fact that Bongina, look, he's out of the picture.
Maybe that's why he stepped out.
Look, he may have done only the right thing of all the people.
Because let me tell you something, I hate to bring up the fact there's stuff going on right now in the Trump administration with Hegseth firing all these, I mean, generals now in a war.
Stop for a second.
Do you see what's happening?
This department will blend into this department.
And if everything's fucked up, the whole thing blends into each other.
What do we see?
We want justice.
And then Pam Bondi, she left or was dispatched.
Why?
What's her story?
What is she trying to do?
What is she trying to say?
Do we have any guarantee that somebody there is not going to botch this up?
Do we have, and I'm going to say this, I'm going to say this, okay?
You know, and I know there are very, very serious political considerations involved in what Charlie, we had suspected, or other people had suspected he was involved with.
I don't want to keep playing this Israel card because I don't think that's as critical.
It's not Israel, but the players in this are.
So if there's something that leads up to this, if we really need to go, let's assume.
That we have to go to the Department of Justice or the feds, the president, and say, We really need for you to unleash the hounds to get to the bottom of this.
Do you think they're in a position with all of these people entrenched?
Do you think people are going to maybe.
Do you think that.
What does Bongina know?
And again, there's nothing wrong with that.
His wife doesn't have to be, you know, she didn't do anything wrong, allegedly, if any of this is true, but you have to recuse yourself.
What I'm trying to say is they're setting us up for another.
Stalemate.
Another another, you know another uh uh, you know foot dragging.
Another joke, look what happened with Epstein.
This was terrific, this was such, this was horrible.
That's why they got rid of one of the reasons why they think they got rid of Bondy.
Remember the the, the Binders and all these other people.
This is, this is wild, and I hope somebody sits down with the defense team and says, listen, I don't know where you're from, and I don't know what your affiliations are, or I don't know any of this stuff, but let me tell you something, my friend.
Listen and listen good.
You better really watch your back with this one, because these people, when they get desperate, you've got a bunch of people who've never been involved in this before, ever.
And you've got people who also are kind of, sort of, maybe still involved in the government.
This Bongina, of all of them, he's such a.
Weird, sniveling, his personality.
He's trying so hard to always be tough to get his podcast going.
He scares me because he can throw something.
He still has connections with the administration.
And somebody, look, if somebody feels that maybe people are heading in the wrong direction, that may be politically disadvantageous, somebody could throw a monkey wrench into the works.
James says, I smile every time you say Don's last name.
YouTube won't let me say it.
Okay.
Well, that's okay.
I have a trouble pronouncing the name, I guess.
This is why I start to get nervous.
I start to get nervous because I see a, how do I say this?
I see right now a weird story that's happening.
I see a very kind of, not the most complicated of, of, uh, Of stories, the most complicated, but I see, how do I say this?
I see a lot of stuff that's making me think, hmm, how does this work?
Hmm.
When I was watching today, when I was listening to people talk about Hexa, I know there's nothing to do with it.
And he's running the Department of War.
I'm thinking, oh my God.
Oh my God.
Now we've got a down pilot.
Federal Mess and Lutnick00:07:05
We need to be 100% cooking on it.
It's like cooking on gas, all pistons firing.
Do you understand how this thing works?
This is one of the things which is the most important.
This is critical.
And I mean this.
And I don't know who's looking.
I don't know who's going to be overseeing this, but I hope that we say, look, look, DOJ, just stay away from this.
Promise me, tell Dan, stay away from this.
Don't get anywhere near it.
Just stay out of it.
Because remember, if Dan says, listen, you got to help me, I've got connections, we've got connections to TPUSA, and this Candace Owens is really causing problems, and Erica is.
They're going to go after Erica, not so much for criminal activity, but incompetence.
You've got to do something.
There's a lot of good people involved here with a lot of money going around.
And if this guy gets off, if something happens to Tyler Robinson and he gets off, we look stupid.
They look stupid.
It looks like we don't know what we're doing.
And we ultimately have to suffer the brunt of this.
You see what I'm saying?
This scares me.
You got that cash?
Kash Patel, this is the biggest case, even though you have nothing to do with this.
This is not a federal matter at all.
This is not a federal matter in the least.
You have no jurisdiction over this.
None.
Period.
So stay out of it.
If you do, if you feel somehow that you're, I don't know what the word is, if you feel like somehow you got to get them out, don't, don't.
Because remember, the only reason, the only reason that I, I think you, we, Candace and others are even concerned in the slightest bit about Tyler Robinson is the fact that if he is convicted,
Erroneously, it will be the conclusion of the story, and all of the people who were responsible for taking Charlie out will walk free.
If he is acquitted, not only is justice served, but there will be a push, maybe on a legitimate form of the Department of Justice, they find out what happened.
Because remember, if he's acquitted, what are they going to do?
Say case closed?
No.
Then they're going to have to find out who was involved.
And of all the suspects who were involved, there's a lot of people that are supposedly our friends and who aren't going to like this.
Are you following this?
This is serious business.
So you've got three.
I mean, you've got these.
Look, I don't know what Pam Bonney's going to do after she's left.
She's going to get pissed off.
She was humiliated, no matter how you look at it.
Humiliated.
He was, the first one was Christy Noem.
Lutnick, they're getting upset with.
Cash is probably next.
I think it was the Department of Labor.
They're going to shit can't hurt, they say.
Commerce.
Why he's doing this now, why it took him this long, I have no idea.
But Trump's in this idea that maybe he figures I've got to exert some kind of control or tighten the reins.
I don't know what's going on.
But we've got to tell these people do not think this thing is about Tyler Robinson.
It's not.
See, that's why I'm saying they want him out.
Either they want him out, they want this case disposed of, either him out of the way, which I think you know what I'm talking about, or convicted or whatever.
If this case is dropped against him, what's going to, what are they going to say?
Okay, FBI, what are you doing?
Nothing.
What do you mean nothing?
Well, we thought it was Tyler.
Well, it's not.
What are you going to do about it?
And then Candace is going to go berserk.
Our good friend Stephen, Stephen Salty says, like foie gras, but we're force fed misinformation.
Sort of, thank you.
Sort of information, misinformation, but not really.
Not really.
They're going to go nuts.
Now, people are going to be talking about a lot of things.
People are back to the story about Epstein being alive.
Some people are saying Charlie's alive.
All this stuff ultimately is, I don't know if it helps Tyler Robinson.
All I know is it makes, in a strange way, him look less involved because he may be stupid, but he's not crazy.
And these people are crazy.
See what I'm saying?
His position may be something to the effect of, I don't want to be, what am I trying to say?
I don't want to be a part of this mess.
Throw the whole thing out, forget it, find him not guilty.
This is a mess.
Who knows?
Question is, who did it?
Who did this?
And I want to know, again, there's too many variables.
What did they find in his body?
What did they find in his throat?
What did they find?
What?
What was it?
Forget Tyler.
What do we have?
They have stopped looking for the killer.
Let me say this again.
They've stopped looking for the killer.
That's it.
They're not interested anymore.
They've stopped.
They think it's this guy because they don't want to find out.
They don't want to find out.
They don't want there to be this list of suspects people who said some pretty nasty things, people who said, oh my God.
Did you hear what they just told Charlie?
Did you hear what Charlie just said?
And when, and when, here's the best part somebody at some point is going to tell Candace, now look, they're going to try to make a deal with her.
Look, what do you want?
Just let this go away.
If she puts together her special and says, let me tell you now what I know, and let me tell you the information that we turned over to the Department of Justice and what they've just, they've just, If there's a way to have an independent litigation to bring all these suspects of people in, that might be interesting.
All I know is this is going to be very complicated because Candace is not, if something happens, if something happens where she feels, which she should now, that the federal government has no interest in trying to find the real killer, she's going to go apeshit berserk.
Letting It Go Away00:06:36
And that's not good for these people.
Big time not good.
And I can't wait to see this.
A lot of moving parts, a lot of plates spitting on signs.
It's wild.
And in the meantime, they're not going to have to.
They're not going to get together.
They're not going to do this.
But the first thing they should do is, speaking of Erica, is to sit there and say, I want you to absolutely just go away for a retreat with your kids.
Go away.
We don't want to see you.
You understand this?
Go away.
Nobody's going to miss you.
No one's asking for you.
Every time you speak, they're running tapes.
They're ready to go.
All of the fleet and other people are ready for the latest incarnation, the latest iteration, the latest version.
She won't do it, though.
She's going to do it.
Somebody's going to ask you something and you won't know what to say.
What if they ask you about Israel?
What if they ask you about the DOJ?
What if they ask you about all this stuff?
What if.
What are you going to say?
You can't do this.
And they're going to try to tell her this, but she won't listen.
You can't go.
You don't know anything.
You don't know anything.
I know we see you're wearing your hair down and you're looking, what did somebody say, more demure?
Whatever that is, that's fine.
But you can't do this anymore.
You can't get near this.
You have embarrassed us.
We now have had to go back, not me, but they, to go back and redo what's going on because of the incompetence that you've been able to show.
It is beyond anything anybody has ever seen.
And beyond any, nobody has seen anything like this.
So stop playing around.
You're not cut out for this.
You are not smart.
You're not a genius.
You're not a spokesperson.
You're not a politician.
You're not a CEO.
Nothing.
You can't do this.
If one more thing goes wrong, one more thing, they're going to say, hey, you're right.
It's not Tyler.
It's this one.
Because now all eyes are on her.
And some of the stuff that she might have gotten away with a couple of months ago or a year ago, whatever it is, months ago, I should say, six months ago.
She can't now because all eyes are on her.
And here's the thing nobody, nobody understands yet what a dunderhead she is.
She's not crazy.
She's just not very bright.
And she wants still that recognition.
Somebody's got to make her go away for a while.
Just go away.
Change the subject.
This is if they were smart.
TPUSA also has to say, we have to back down.
COVID and others, get away.
Now what?
Bongino's wife works for you?
Jesus, we look.
That we look incestuous.
What the hell's going on here?
The public does the public, it starts to hear something, and they don't even know what they're listening to.
It just sounds sinister.
And I got, I got, I'm telling you right now, don't be surprised.
Don't be surprised if Pam Bondi, I have no reason to think, but if she could say, you know what?
I know a lot of stuff right now.
And I think a lot of people in the media would like to know this.
And I'm going to, I'm going to drop a few choice facts here.
Let's see what they think about this.
I'm going to drop them because she's going to be thinking about that.
People are going to tell her, you can't let him do that to you.
Okay.
Well, you know what?
Let's see.
Let's see if I, let's see.
Kash Patel.
Why is that moron there?
He's there and I'm not.
Good.
I'm going to drop some stuff on Kash Patel.
I know some stuff about Cash because I was his boss.
I was the head of the DOJ.
He's just FBI.
I know all about his expenditures.
I've got friends there still, people who are still loyal to me.
I know all about the planes and that girlfriend because he's getting laid for the first time in his life and all that stuff.
I know about him and I know about that batshit crazy Dan Bongino who didn't like anybody.
Remember he was yelling at her?
Remember that?
Remember this?
Which started this?
When you start having this dissension, and then you've got Cash who says, I can't lose this gig.
If I lose this gig, I'll never get laid again.
This is it.
This is my ticket.
You know what I mean?
You know what I mean?
And I can't let this go.
This is it.
There's no way for me to go.
I'm going to be Alberto Gonzalez after this.
Whatever happened to him?
My point exactly.
Oh, this is wild.
This is wild.
And the president who's going to start feeling this a little bit, because let me tell you something.
I don't know who put Pete Hegseth in charge.
I have no idea.
But he's not George Marshall.
Does this make sense to you?
Am I making sense?
Are you following this?
Because it's less legal than it is background.
And it sets the tone for how people are going to be acting.
And if these people get dangerous when they feel kind of desperate, you know.
Nobody stops Kash Patel.
Kash Patel may insinuate, please do throw this case, get a mistrial, be a part of an acquittal.
This is, I'm telling you.
And it's so funny.
I love people who just mosey on up, you know, and they've not followed any of this stuff.
And they say, gee, I'm surprised.
You really got it in hard for Erica.
It's like, that's what you take.
That's your take.
That's your take.
Though I know nobody cares about this guy, I understand this.
But the more and more I'm saying, the more and more it goes by, I'm thinking he didn't do anything.
I mean, he didn't do anything.
Does anybody care about this?
All these other people are getting pardons.
What about he won't do it?
It's a state charge.
Listen to what I'm saying.
This is big stuff here.
And it's going to get even better because the defense lawyer, I would say to them use the chaos on your behalf, use it in your advantage.
Use it.
Go crazy.
Listen to what's going on.
Listen to this.
Victim Impact Statement00:11:55
Watch what's happening.
Because what's going to happen is they're going to be able to say the state, the feds aren't here anymore.
We don't know anything.
See, a lot of times the feds can work in conjunction with the state to get something done, even though it's not officially done that way.
The state's going to want to say, you stay away from us.
Stay away from us.
Over a period of time, there was a time in our country where the FBI really, really, really was it.
I mean, their word, they were the gold standard.
That is over with.
So, what happens next?
They proceed.
And believe it or not, they said they need six more months.
Okay.
My advice the judge is going to say, absolutely grant this.
And listen, by the way, prosecutor, you're going to want this as well.
Let this go away.
Because if anything is going to be, if anything is going to happen, if anything's going to be, if there's going to be any disposition or if the case is disposed of, either because of the facts, either it goes to trial or, or, If something, God forbid, happens to our boy Tyler, if it happens six months from now, it's better.
People will have already forgotten it.
It's too fresh in people's minds right now.
Too fresh in people's minds.
Do you see what's happening?
Do you see how all this stuff works?
Do you see this?
You've got crazy people.
And see, here's the thing in the old days, nobody had YouTubes.
Bongino, you pick somebody.
That's like picking junk yogurt.
To let him come on.
What are you nuts?
This guy screams and yells to begin with, and you want him?
He's a lawyer.
You want him as your attorney general?
No.
That's one thing about the Biden administration.
They never did that.
They never picked celebrities.
Because you see, Trump likes women he thinks are hot or famous or on TV or popular.
He does.
Look at the people.
Alina Haba, whatever her name is, Lindsay from West Virginia, Judge Janine.
I mean, she's powerful.
You see what he does?
He and he doesn't ask himself, Are these people confident or competent?
I should say, do they really know what they're doing?
Nah, look at him.
She's good.
She's hot.
She's good on TV.
He does this.
Somebody the other day last night said, I can't believe that you're a that you defend Trump.
I'm not defending Trump at all, but I'm telling you, I know what he does.
I know what he does, and this is serious business.
And there's another thing you may not care about it, but a lot of folks are worried about midterms and all this stuff does not help.
So, in the meantime, what happens?
Question Let me ask you what happens to Erica?
What advice would you give her?
I'm serious.
I'm dead serious.
If you're TPUSA, if you're the president, if you're DOJ, if you're maybe trying to convict this guy, what happens?
If this trial goes on, You're going to most probably have to have the wife of the victim.
You're going to have to have the wife of the victim.
And if you do, she's going to have to be in the best position possible.
She's going to go through the training now.
Pull her off, put her in some kind of boot camp.
Do you agree?
What would you do, first of all, with her?
And again, and the people who think, oh, you're just being mean to her, she's critical.
She's the most important and critical part of this whole mess.
There's nothing like it.
Nothing.
Don't you understand how politics works?
Don't you know that when Manson was on trial, the stuff that was going on elsewhere outside of the courtroom had more to do with anything else?
It filters in, it sets the tone of the case, it sets the attention that's being spent.
It's really serious, big time serious.
And the problem that people are not understanding or they're not getting right away is very simply this I don't want.
The killer to get away.
And the killer is going to get away if this man is convicted.
You know that's true.
You know, but it's exactly what we're thinking.
The killer is going to get away.
The killer is going to get away with this.
And they don't take it seriously, they don't understand it.
And a lot of these Johnny Cumblatelys, all of a sudden, they're worried more about, they think this is a soap opera.
It's like, no.
No, no, no.
See, normally these people who are involved in this, they kind of either plead guilty, like that lunatic, by the way.
He's an interesting one, too.
The one who pled guilty, the one who had the one at Mar a Lago or the golf course who was planning on taking the president out.
His case kind of went away.
Somebody got him to plead.
Enough with this.
You wouldn't believe how things sometimes keep quiet.
Look at Timothy McVeigh.
Look at Oklahoma City.
You think that?
You think that?
Was happening.
Do you think that's the way it was?
You got to be kidding me.
He went to his maker.
He didn't say anything.
What about the other guy?
What about the other people?
You think, does he not know he wasn't, whatever he did?
I'm not that, that verse with all the facts of the case.
So watch what happens right now.
But the three stooges, the three stooges, I'm telling you, I can't believe it Bongino, Bongina, Cash, and Pambondi.
And they say that she was, well, they say, some people say she was gobsmacked.
I mean, what?
There was a picture, they showed a picture of her photo in the garbage can, which, of course, it was dramatic.
Kate, her name is Kate Woodard, says, I agree with you on one hand.
EFK is critical.
But I believe she is guilty of conspiracy and murder to Charlie.
I have heard you disagree with this.
Erica Kirk?
Conspiracy to murder.
If there is anybody, thank you, by the way, if anybody can show me anything showing evidence, I'd love to hear what evidence, conspiracy, and she will be conspiring with whom.
Because you have to conspire with two or more guilty people to bring about some crime or whatever it was.
I do not believe.
If Erica Kirk is whom you're speaking of, EK, Is going to have to make an impact statement, and all the jury is going to talk about her glitter suites and bragging about merch sales.
I don't know about that.
I think if we were the jury, victim impact is going to come only from, we'll put it this way that only comes into play if he's found guilty.
You don't have a victim impact while the trial is going on.
That's prejudicial.
It's only if he's found guilty.
Then she would, of course, have something to say the statements of her children, how are they doing?
But you see, here's the thing the more serious things get, sometimes the less important victim impact statements work because this is, you don't have to explain to the judge in the case of this political.
Because let's face it, that's what it was.
I don't think people are going to need a lot of impact.
Like, see, I wonder if, I wonder how this affected people.
Here we go.
It says, how long will the grift go after life?
How long will the grift go after life in prison?
Whose grift?
Arrogance grift?
I don't know.
I don't know what that means.
I'm not sure whose grift we're talking about.
But remember, she's she, and by the way, thank you.
She's not gonna make any statement that's, you know, what is she gonna add?
I don't think people are gonna look at her and say, oh, yeah, look, that's Erica Carr.
Yeah, that's the one with all those, with the glitter and the LeMay, and oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Right, right.
We all grieve in our own way.
This is the one who did that phony baloney.
This is the one who lay on top of the casket.
This is the one who was also involved in that horrible speech.
The merch sales.
I don't think they're going to know this.
I don't think they're going to know this.
And I don't think it matters to them.
That's what I think.
I don't think it matters.
I don't think her role in this, put it this way.
If it does happen, remember, victim impact only comes after he's found guilty.
But if they decide to put her on the stand during the trial, for what issue?
If they do, And you know she'll run to that trial.
Can you imagine what she would do to that?
That might be the greatest thing ever.
Just a cross examination.
Because remember, anytime you put yourself in a stand, you put your credibility in evidence.
You put your own evidence, your own credibility into issue.
That's what you do.
Can you imagine that?
Oh my God.
Remember when she said, not, I'm glad he's dead, but I mean, she, she, you can just have a, it's weird because you got to really be careful, really be careful to go after the victim's wife.
But if you put a series of stuff, if you said, okay, folks, give me the best you can, give me the best slash worst.
Of Erica Kirk.
And I'm going to say, which Erica am I talking to now?
Am I talking to the Erica who did the sizzle reel, the one who never drank, the one who never dated, the one who all this other kind of stuff?
Am I talking to that one?
Who am I talking to exactly?
Tell me, who am I talking to?
Am I talking to the person who was the evangelical who learned a few lines, who seems to be saying really nothing?
Are we talking about the professional wife, the Stepford wife?
Are we talking to Laurie Franz's daughter?
Are we talking to the person who co opted one of the worst pictures ever?
And we couldn't figure out was that picture of you astride the casket about showing you how much you've suffered, or was it about showing the tragedy of Charlie?
Complicated Juror Threats00:15:29
Either way, do you understand this?
This is the issue.
This is the issue.
issue.
And you might say, I don't know if you want to impeach her testimony.
You know what?
I'd say, we're going to break all the rules.
Go for it.
Let them have it.
You want to put her on the stand?
You're going to see her in all her glory.
Oh, we're going to give you.
People are going to be so disgusted with her.
They might say, oh, yeah, the guy.
They'll forget all about Tyler.
Oh, yeah, what's he there?
Oh, yeah, he's a murderer.
Sorry about that.
Because she'll be on the stand.
Let her be on the stand.
And just start going through this stuff.
How they used Charlie, they set him up, and they all were like parasites leeching off of him.
Are you aware of the threats against him?
What was his security like?
Why didn't he have some kind of a glass in front of him?
Why did he insist upon this?
Nobody does this.
There are movie stars who aren't even famous who don't do this.
We live in an age right now.
Where you, if you're not into a room with metal detectors and this guy who's been, let's face it, stalked and threatened by everybody, you let him do that?
You let him do it.
By the way, may I ask you a question, Erica?
Are sales higher now after he's dead?
Interesting, isn't it, how that works, right?
Interesting.
Remember Michael Jackson?
Remember the catalog?
Michael Jackson prints after they die, goes through the roof, goes through the roof.
So remember, whenever somebody like that somehow passes away very quickly, ask yourself the question very, very important question who was it who benefited from that particular move?
I can't say this enough.
Do you see how complicated this can go?
There's so many, if this, then this, this, then this.
I see 100 possibilities, and each of the 100 possibilities, there's five versions of this.
So, we're talking like 500 to 1,000 different scenarios, each of them with a different permutation.
Putting her on snap, putting these people on snap.
And say, this is pretty something.
Again, how you get it into evidence, but I guess we could.
I've got a PLC.
What's TPUSA worth?
What's TPUSA worth?
Did anybody ever come to you, by the way?
This week might be able to get in.
Erica, did anybody ever come to you and talk about possible suspects?
How many total times have you met with the FBI, DOJ, local police, state police, anybody?
How many times?
I'll bet you nothing.
Did they ever ask you about who you think was responsible?
Did they ever ask you if anybody threatened Charlie?
How many people threatened him?
How many people threatened him?
How many people threatened?
And then you go through the list.
Were you at that Hamptons meet?
Anything to that?
Was that true?
Because everybody keeps pointing to her.
Are you aware of that one?
Did he ever talk to you about that?
Did he ever talk to you about that?
No, he didn't.
He talked to Candace about it.
Isn't that weird?
They're very close, aren't they?
You don't like her.
Is it safe to say that?
You don't like her.
Why don't you like her?
Here's Texas girl.
Beast girl says, wouldn't that be second information if they.
Question EK about CK?
Wouldn't that be second information?
You mean hearsay?
I'm not sure what second information means secondary?
She's his wife.
Who better to know this?
If I'm trying to show sloppy police work, sloppy, that TPUSA was.
If I'm trying to create some doubt and I bring her on the stand and I ask her all these questions.
What you also, by the way, you can get at is to not really say she's involved in the conspiracy, but make it sound kind of that she was really involved in the nuts and bolts, the daily grind.
See, because normally you would say, don't you ever go after a victim.
This isn't a victim's wife.
This is Erica Kirk.
She's an entity on her own.
This is like Leona Helmsley, this is Meghan Markle.
If something happens to Harry, God forbid, people want to say, put her on the stand.
Why?
Because she's going to say something crazy.
She's going to say something nuts.
That's what they know is going to happen.
She doesn't know what to say.
She doesn't know what to say.
There might be a very interesting way to get people to at least say, you know, it's very interesting.
Sometimes when you look for the people responsible, you look in places you never thought.
Just think about this.
My God, she takes the stand.
Oh my God, she'll go crazy.
And all you have to do, John Douglas, years ago during the Wayne Williams case.
And when Wayne Williams took the stand, John Douglas, who was the FBI profiler, the inspiration for.
Scott Glenn, the character, was if they said to get her mad.
Because if she gets mad, she's scary and she's also bad because she goes, Stop it.
Stop it.
It's like, I'm.
And see, that's somebody stop it.
Ooh, are we getting angry?
Why?
You're telling me to stop it?
Rather entitled, aren't we?
This is a courtroom here.
You're under oath.
You belong to me.
You're my witness.
Can't tell me to stop it.
What is this?
You think this is a magazine interview?
You think, what is this?
Entertainment Tonight?
I'm an Andy Comins girl.
Is this Bravo?
Are you with the Housewives of New Jersey and you?
It doesn't work like that.
Well, you really think you are the star, don't you?
You really do, don't you?
Telling me, telling people, you're a witness to this.
This is the state of Utah versus who do you think you are?
You always want to run the show.
You're not running the show.
This has nothing to do with you.
And the only reason apparently they put you on the stand was to garner some kind of sympathy.
But let me tell you something.
Every time you speak, we win because people, their jaws drop because they can't believe how batshit crazy or stupid you are.
The stuff that you say, you can't be sincere.
You do realize this.
She can't.
She can't correct herself one day, wake up and say, you know what, I've had this.
I'm going to be mean.
No, this is she.
This is who she is.
This is exactly who she is.
She's not, she's a phony.
And it kills their case.
Do you hear what I'm saying?
It kills their case.
You don't get anything like this.
In no instance would you think about cross examining a victim's, the widow.
Now I will with her.
Oh my God.
Bring something up, let her see it.
What about that, and get her pissed off?
Because she'll lose it.
She'll give her those crazy eyes, and that's it.
You following this?
Do you understand this?
You want to make it really good too?
Imagine all of a sudden one day, front row, who walks in?
Candace Owens.
Let me tell you something.
I don't want you to listen to me.
You don't know what Candace Owens has done to this.
See, most of the time they stay within the confines of their show.
Rush Limbaugh, I worked with him in 88.
Yeah, we were there together.
This guy was bigger than anything you've ever seen in your life.
He was bigger than anything.
Anything.
You should have seen the people.
George Bush was there.
The Bush 41 was there.
Everybody was there.
But, but, he stayed there.
He's, I mean, it was within the confines of his radio show.
That was it.
Nothing else mattered.
It was his radio show.
That's the thing that mattered.
That's what was important.
It was the radio show.
Candace could show up.
Forget her.
Her podcast show is everything.
Can you imagine her sitting in the front row?
Joe Lewis did this in the old days.
I told you this during the Gotti case.
Remember, the Gotti people got Anthony Quinn, Mickey Rourke, Jay Black from Jay and the Americans.
They all sat there.
So people say, oh my God, that's good luck, John.
Yeah.
Wow.
He must be a good dude.
You know, Anthony Quinn.
Anyway, do you see what I'm saying?
But if she sits there, oh my God.
It's almost like The Godfather when Frankie Five Angels, Frankie Pendangeli's brother comes from Italy when they brought him back.
Let me ask you, can you imagine what that would look like?
Imagine what this would look like.
All of a sudden, she's taking this hand.
All of a sudden, the door opens up, and who walks in the front row?
Candace.
She'll shit her pants.
She won't know what to do.
I mean, it would be, I mean, it would be, oh, and it was objection.
Objection to the gallery?
This is the public.
Remember, a speedy and a public trial.
Those are the guarantees of the Sixth Amendment.
A public trial so that people can see this.
Can you imagine that?
Oh my God.
And she's basically also telling you, parenthetically, I'm for Tyler.
I'm with Tyler.
Not because I like him, not because I want to have him on my show, but he didn't do it.
Or sure as hell, it looks like he didn't do it.
Oh, this is, oh my God.
Just knock her off her game a little bit.
She'll go berserk.
Then remember, she wanted this, to use Jack Reacher.
She wanted this.
She should have gone home, be a mom, take care of her kids, make sure their emotional and psychological and spiritual health are in order, which means you've got to be there every day to watch them because they need you.
Their father is gone.
And what are you doing?
You just can't wait to go on these shows with Caroline Levitt, the two cool girls.
She wants more than anything else, she is going to be the star.
And that's where it is.
And if you say something, if she takes this stand and somebody knows what her.
Because remember, I told you, that's what John Douglas told him make sure you piss off Wayne Williams.
Just say something about such and such.
He'll go crazy.
But if all of a sudden she says something, if I said, You're not giving me the crazy eye, are you?
Why?
I think you are.
Are you giving me the crazy eye?
And God forbid the jury said, the what?
The crazy eye.
You know, stop it.
Stop it.
You're not doing that, are you?
Oh my God.
It.
Let me tell you what Tyler Robinson wants.
He wants that jury at the end to sit back and say, I hate this case.
I hate all these witnesses.
I don't even care about this stupid kid.
The only one I don't hate is Charlie.
These other people, they're miserable.
I can't stand them.
They're turning against a sideshow, and I've got to be here and listen to this.
Plus, you know, jurors go in, they go back, they have all these matters outside of the province of the jury.
So they're just sitting around and chatting with each other.
This is a huge case.
Bigger than anything you can imagine.
And let me also tell you something.
It's so much.
And let's pray for a weak judge.
Pray for a Judge Edo, somebody who loves the publicity.
Pray for that.
Oh, dear God.
And televise.
Oh, you and I will be on this thing every single day.
I would love to say, stop it.
Did you see that?
Did you see what happened?
This is going to be.
And what would I do if I represented Tyler?
So fast.
The defense is like this.
Got nothing to say?
Do a lot of motion practice, motion to suppress, motion eliminate.
Do not bring up the confession.
Do not bring up the gun.
I, sword of the Lord, says, Lionel, you rock so hard.
Truth prevails.
Thank you, sir.
And happy Easter is very weird.
But happy Easter to you, sir.
Thank you.
Thank you for that.
Oh, I love the truth.
See, truth, truth is, let me tell you something, truth is the problem.
Truth is the problem.
I don't have to shock you with anything.
There are people who go on and they want to just shock you.
Texas Beach Girl says if they won't put cameras in the courtroom, I want Candace Owens there.
She takes excellent notes.
Oh, she's.
See, what I would love more than anything else, just from my own professional point of view, is to be in a situation where I do a duo with her.
And my job is to put her over.
That's wrestling talk.
It's going to be easy to do that, to watch these things together and say, Candace, let's watch this.
You see that right there?
What is that right there?
Can you notice here?
Notice, stop right there.
You see how they're looking?
What's your take on that?
How do you think the jury's reading that?
So I bring up something that's legal, but let her give you the evaluation.
Then she asked me a question.
I know this sounds like I'm gratuitous here, but I just see it.
Because normally, finding somebody, the worst part is that people who were on TV together, they're awful.
You ever see a room full of comics?
That's the worst.
They just laugh like everything's the funniest thing they've ever heard.
Like they're laughing, they're going to split a gut.
That's so disingenuous.
You don't put three, four people in, you're wasting your time.
It's like a morning zoo.
But to sit back with her and say, understand, watch what's happening.
How do you think the jury is being?
How are they reading this?
And I want somebody in that courtroom who says, okay, listen, I can't show you the jurors, but just tell me, how did they look?
What was their reaction?
Picking the Foreman00:06:14
And can you pick the jury?
Can you pick the foreman ahead of time?
Meaning, in the old days, we would always have the jurors would go back, and the first thing they would do was, okay, who's our four?
Man, for a person who's the one who's going to be in charge of it.
Who now in New York they do this.
I think it's a stupid thing.
The first person in the box, he's the foreman because it might be the worst person, but we would always have to guess.
It was a person who was the most, it was a person who showed the most, like together, and we would also find the anchors.
And there's a way in a trial, you can never talk to the jury.
You can't ever say anything until closing argument.
Then you can talk to them.
You can't get too close.
You can't lean on them.
You can't do this stuff.
You can't do it.
You can have a lot of fun during questioning, during examinations.
We used to have this one judge who wasn't paying attention.
When you walk into the courtroom, on this side, on one side is going to be the juror box, left or right, obviously.
And we always would love to get to be that table first.
We want that table first.
I'm going to be right there so I can read and they can see me and they can get to know me and like me and see how much fun we have and all.
Sometimes judges say, no, no, prosecution always sits there, you always.
But in the case where you get there early or whatever, you can decide.
That's one thing.
And also, when somebody's taking the stand, if the other side's testifying, you could take your lecture and we should be able to move it.
Move it over between the jury and the witness so they can't see what the other witnesses are saying.
They just hear them.
So that means nothing.
They don't see any demeanor evidence unless that's a bad witness.
And then we made sure that move it.
Let them see this.
You can't walk up to a witness or the jury.
You can't lean on it.
Oh my God, they'll throw your ass in jail.
Can't do it.
That's contempt.
Can't do that.
Can't get anywhere near it.
And let me tell you, no, get back.
Get back.
That's one thing I love.
You cannot do that.
Ever, ever, ever.
But the only time you can talk to somebody, the only time is either voidir when you're picking the jury and then closing arguments.
And if you get to pick the jury, oh my God.
If they have a liberal voidir, you know, jury selection process, oh my God.
Oh my God.
You can.
This is the most important thing in the world.
This is the most important thing in the world.
This is so great.
And the reason for it is very, very simple.
Very, very, very, very simple.
I mean it so much.
There is a I'm sorry, I had to answer this one.
Boire is the most important part.
V O I R D I R E. VOR DIRE, as they say in the South.
VOR DIRE means to speak or to say the truth.
Let's say you're the, let's say it's a Texas Beach lady.
You're the one.
Let's say it's Texas Beach girl.
And I'm the defense lawyer or whatever it is.
And I read your card.
I say, Oh, is this your card?
He says, Texas Beach.
Oh, Texas Beach girl?
Do you prefer Ms. Texas Beach girl?
What do your friends call you?
I did this one time.
I asked a juror, What do your friends call you?
And the other defense or prosecutor, whoever the opposing side was, they went berserk.
And the judge was like doing his checkbook, literally.
They had checkbooks and they go like this.
And I said, What do your friends call you?
And he said, Objection.
The judge said, What?
Who said what?
He goes, Judge, he asked the juror.
I'm not kidding you.
He said, he asked the juror what his friends call him.
He did what?
He asked the juror, me, he asked the juror what their friends call him.
And the judge, without missing a piece, says, well, what do your friends call you?
No, judge, you're familiarizing himself.
I said, well, I apologize.
And they started laughing.
I said, oh, God, this is great.
I got them.
They love me.
Why?
Because when you laugh with somebody, you like them.
If the person thinks about the person that you hate, think about the person that you hate more than anybody.
If he tells the funniest joke, you're not going to be listening.
You're going to sit there and go, that's not funny.
But if somebody laughs, that means they like you.
Well, you can ask these wonderful questions.
Yes.
Miss Beach Girl.
Yeah, we'll call you Miss.
We'll call you Texas.
TB Girl, Texas Beach Girl.
When you receive your jury summons, did you think to yourself, oh, what is this?
What is this?
A tax notice?
Oh, my God.
It's a jury notice.
And you drop it, and they started laughing.
I got another one.
Objection.
He's making them laugh.
The judge says, I thought it was funny.
Oh, God.
I'm sorry, Judge.
I'm just trying to.
Because this is when you say, Do you know how important your job is right now?
This man, if you think you're uncomfortable, if you think you're inconvenienced, nothing like this man.
And he's counting on you because he knows you're going to pay attention.
Oh, and immediately you're like this.
Courtroom Witness Rules00:16:04
When you ask a witness something, remember this in real life, look what I'm doing.
You can ask somebody, Were you scared?
And they'll say yes.
Did you realize that he had the gun at first?
No.
Nobody's been watching.
You do like this.
You can also read something and they say, Did you?
You said the car was driving, what, 70 miles an hour?
Yes.
What was that again?
Say that again.
It's not a big deal.
It's not a big deal, but you just made them say, Oh my God.
It throws them off.
One time when I was first brand, brand, brand new prosecutor, I had no idea what I was doing.
So I'm second chairing somebody.
I'm just sitting there.
Some, it was that traffic thing.
It was no big deal.
But I said, So I said, Let me cross examine.
He says, Cross examine what?
He said, Come on, let me do it.
I said, Okay.
Sure, whatever.
So I get up there and I had my yellow pad.
I said, So you said the light was yellow, right?
He said, Yeah.
And just then I forgot everything.
I realized holy shit.
I'm standing here in a courtroom in a suit and I'm asking a question.
Wow.
And I can't remember what the hell this has to do with anything.
Nothing.
So it's not going to be this nonsense about, well, you know, when you get older, you forget.
No, no, I was 24.
So I was, you know, I was still, for the most part, I was still, you know, no, 25.
I was still, you know, young, but I forgot.
So anyway, so when I did this, I said, so you said the live was that, all right?
Yes.
And I said, that's what I thought you'd say.
Nothing further.
And I sat down, and people were like, what the hell?
Threw everybody off, and the guy, the person, the older prosecutor, this one I'm second sharing, he said, What was that about?
I said, I have no idea, but just pretend, just nod your head.
Okay, and people were so it threw people off.
I mean, you can do it one time.
I'm not kidding you, I'm not kidding you when I tell you this to show you how courtrooms you never know what's going to happen.
It was Christmas time, and it was a DUI years ago.
It was a prosecutor, and they threw it, they threw us all the regular courtrooms were filled, except we had to go to this old one across the street in the old courthouse.
I never been in there.
And of course, the prosecution, no, whatever it was, defensive prosecutor, they were near the jury box, and I'm on the other side.
And I'm trying to hear the witness.
It was an old court.
The microphones were horrible.
The PA was terrible.
And then I realized, oh, it must be because of the ceiling.
It must be because of the way that, oh, I see.
Okay.
Because I'm noticing there's a scope.
And when I looked over, The jury is like this.
And the bailiff's like this.
And the cop is like this.
And the judge is like this.
And the defense is like this.
So I said, oh shit, oh shit.
So I just looked at him, pretending to write something like, oh, they're going to think I'm doing them off.
But I swear to you, I don't know what it was.
But everybody's looking up like, what are we looking at?
I'm not kidding you.
I'm not kidding you.
Things happen.
Once you get in there, you don't know what's going on.
Somebody doesn't show up.
Or one guy just bails on you, bails on you.
We had a case one time, I'll never forget.
It was defending a woman, and the defense was it was attempted murder.
Why was it attempted murder?
Because the victim didn't die.
Because the victim was shot a number of times in the face three, four times.
I always said five, but I think, could that have even been?
25 caliber, boom, Right in the face.
So I call it the face versus the head later on.
Later on.
But at one particular point during the deposition, this guy says, I will never forget her as long as I live.
I will never forget her.
Okay.
So guess what happens?
From the time of the trial, he, he, this is, this is, I swear to God, this is true.
He shows up with a, with a, uh, the subpoena and there were no, there was no markings on the, on the court rules.
Didn't say division A or B or C. Nothing.
It just said like court is in session, be quiet or people would all be silent.
So, this guy's walking around looking, and she, the defendant who finally got her on bond, the one who supposedly tried to kill him, she's sitting there.
He's a black guy.
She's a black woman.
And I don't want to be racist.
I'm not racist, believe me.
But sometimes black folks talk to each other more than white people do.
I'd be very standoffish.
Black people, how are you?
And especially if they're younger, sometimes more flirtatious.
So, he walks over and he sees this woman.
He goes, okay, you know where this is?
Yeah.
So, you know, they're talking.
And all of a sudden, somebody walks over, sees them talking.
He says, Can I talk to everyone?
Excuse me.
Can I talk to his dad?
He says, You know who you're talking to?
He said, That's a bitch who shot you.
And those are his words because she heard him.
She didn't recognize her.
He didn't recognize her.
They're talking to each other.
He's trying to pick her up.
The woman who tried to kill him.
I'm not making this up.
So I came back from lunch and she's going crazy and the mother's going crazy.
She had the cervical collar.
She had a lawsuit or something.
And I said, What is the man?
I said, Why?
That's the guy.
So, who?
That's, oh my God, I know who he is.
He was talking to you.
He was talking to you?
Did he know who you were?
No.
The man who said he'd never forget you?
So we go back into court.
Wonderful judge, white hair, hoary, venerable.
He says, bring in the jury.
He said, not so fast, Your Honor.
We got a bit of a problem.
He said, what do you do?
I said, I want to make a motion for an in court motion to quash in court ID because it's impermissibly suggestive.
They're going to ask him, Do you see the person today, the person who shot you?
And he's going to say, Yeah, she did.
Not because he remembered, but because of what this other person told him.
They were talking to each other for 45 minutes.
So you can void the witness.
So I asked him, I said, Remember when I talked to you?
Remember, sir, when we had this little deposition?
Here we go, right here.
See this line right here where I said, Will you know her?
And you said, I'll never forget her as long as I live.
Remember saying that?
Here, read this.
You remember that, don't you?
Yeah.
But you talked to her.
There was no jury there.
I said, Because you're kind of a player.
I said, Well, and you talked to her for 45 minutes and didn't recognize her.
But you're going to pick her out, aren't you?
Come on, be honest.
He says, Well, yeah.
Thank you very much.
The judge says, Well, what do we do?
I said, You can testify all you want.
Just don't pick her out.
Okay, fair enough.
When it came time to do, we had closing.
If you only have your defendant as a witness, we had no witnesses, nothing other than the defendant.
You get to do closing, followed by the state, and then you get rebuttal.
So I had two times, I think they changed the rule then, but then it was two.
So I had this, they said, You know who did it?
You know who did this?
I had this chair.
You did it.
And I pointed to this chair.
I know it sounds corny, swear to God.
You did it.
You should be here.
Not this woman.
You did it.
Of course, I can't bring up anything about the gun.
Nobody.
See, that's why I know about this thing with Charlie.
When you, with Tyler, when you don't bring something up, they're asking, what about the.
Nope.
You did it.
And when I sat down, they left the chair there because I dragged the chair in front of the drawer.
They left it there.
So, my final words were, ladies and gentlemen, there was a crime that was committed that night, and we would do anything if we couldn't in our powers to go back and change that, but we can't.
But if you go back and you find this woman guilty, then two crimes will be committed, but this one you can prevent.
Thank you.
Sit down and shut up.
Half an hour later, not guilty.
It was the talk of day.
I mean, what?
Why?
Because God sent me this.
Witness that I never knew about who would be talking.
The victim is talking.
You don't know what's going to happen.
See, that's why when you tee it up, get ready.
Things happen.
People say stuff, they get weird.
Do you know that when there's a courtroom, I always have every one of my witnesses, every single one say, You got to do me a favor.
Come by here.
I'm going to show you where the court, meet me.
I'm going to show after the courts close, I'm going to show you where you're going to come in here.
This is what the courtroom looks like.
Wow.
Because they've never been in them.
They've never been.
It looks like, is it a church?
What is it?
Big thing.
State, you know, the flags and the Box, see, this is it, it's no big deal.
You're going to come in right here and you're going to walk in.
You sit down, they're going to leave.
There's nothing worse than somebody comes in like this.
Where do I go?
Hello, anybody?
Nobody thinks about talking to this person.
They're saying, Here's what you're going to do.
I'm going to be here.
You're going to be there.
You got it.
Show up.
Here's the parking.
Run, and so that when they walk in, they look like they know what they're doing.
And sometimes when you pick somebody out in court, some people like to get out of the box, walk over and say, You did it, you know, that kind of stuff.
Trials are human endeavors.
Trials are not, not, it's not Perry Mason.
Perry Mason never even had a jury.
It's not about that.
It's about things that go wrong.
It's about things that you never knew.
Things, people who just don't have jury appeal.
See, jury appeal is the word.
This is why, look, you know why some people just don't like Erica Carr.
They just don't.
They just don't.
Can't really put a finger on it.
Witnesses are like that.
Sometimes they just, sometimes they work.
Sometimes they.
Sometimes, if you have a policeman there wearing the uniforms, there's a big deal.
There's a big series of case law about what if you have a priest?
Can he wear his habit?
Will that throw you off?
Will that, like, he doesn't seem like a bad guy?
Look at the priest.
Maybe today it's a different story, but at one point it made a big deal.
So, what I'm saying is remember this.
That's why we need cameras in the courtroom.
And I'm going to be there with you every step of the way so we can stop it.
He goes, Stop!
Did you see that?
Ah!
Did you hear that?
That's hearsay.
Ah!
Play it again.
Listen to the question.
Listen to the question.
They're asking leading on the direct examination.
You can't lead the witness on direct.
Should have objected.
She's making a pest out of herself.
Best evidence rule.
Double hearsay.
Hearsay exception.
Invoking the rule.
They didn't invoke the rule.
The rule of sequestration.
First thing you do, first thing out of your mouth.
Your Honor, we invoke the rule.
Everybody who's not going to testify, get out.
You don't want somebody sitting there listening to the case and then they come and testify.
I've seen that sometimes they didn't invoke the rule.
Sometimes the judges do it automatically.
It's just wow.
Sounds crazy.
Doesn't sound like much to you, but this stuff adds up.
And you really, because anybody who says, Do you want the truth?
Yeah, I want the legitimate, I want the admitted truth, I want the acceptable truth.
I don't want double hearsay.
I don't want stuff like that.
See, in real life, we don't.
What did you say?
What did you tell him?
Well, what did you hear?
Well, she said it.
Well, what did she say that she said?
And what did she say that he said that he said?
And I got triple hearsay.
What's going on here?
That's life.
We do that.
Courtrooms, you don't do that.
So I don't want the truth.
I want acceptable truth.
I want reasonable sort of truth.
I want it to be truth that doesn't.
That doesn't in any way affect 403 evidence.
403, whenever you hear 403, that means there is a piece of evidence that is so likely to inflame.
For example, this used to be classic.
You have to ID the body at some particular point in a murder case.
Somebody in court has to say, yep, that's him.
Because you're charged, you're saying on this particular date, that guy killed that person, and that person is the stiff.
That person's got to be dead.
You have to have a medical examiner who has to say he was dead.
This person, I don't know who he was, but he was dead.
And somebody comes in and says that person who's dead was Charlie Kirk or somebody.
How do you do that?
Family member, dentist, records, fingerprints.
But if you get a family member, that's even better.
And what they used to do in the old days, they would say, ma'am, I'm handing you what's marked.
The stakes have been one.
Do you know who that is?
And they have the worst picture of, you know, and they would scream and sob and they take her out.
And the jury would say, Well, you can stop the trial now because that son of a he did, you know, they don't do that anymore.
Now it's 403 evidence.
When evidence is relevant, but its tendency to inflame, confuse, be repetitive.
You can withhold it.
So that's why you can rule it inadmissible, even though it's relevant, even though, yes, identification of the victim is yes, but you can't do it like that, especially for children and people and decomposed.
No, no, no, no.
But that's why most judges, we had this one who said, Show me the death pictures first.
Nope, nope.
Okay, that'll do.
Do you want to stipulate to that?
Oh, no.
I want you to do it in court.
No, You want to see that look.
And of course, the jury is saying, I can't wait to see this because we can see all those pictures in court.
And most people have never seen, you've never seen, you've never seen, maybe you have now, but, and I don't want to see this.
I don't want Charlie's autopsy pictures.
I don't want them to be out.
The public has a right to know, but the man has dignity and he has a certain degree of respect.
We have to balance it.
No nude pictures.
But I want people to know what they did, like Emmett Till's mother.
Emmett Till, remember when her son, she says, I want you to know what they did to my son.
And I want people to see what they did to Charlie because this is about Charlie.
It's not about Eric, it's about Charlie, it's about finding justice for him.
And justice for him means that this kid cannot be convicted and fooling the company, the people in the thinking that he's the God.
Because remember, if he's convicted, then the real killer gets off scot free.
Justice for Charlie00:03:07
And we're not going to have that, are we?
Are we?
No, we're not.
No, we're not.
All right, dear friends.
Great.
Happy Saturday.
Tomorrow's Easter Sunday.
Easter Sunday, if you are a student of religion, A student of religion, you must understand the importance of this.
For Christianity, this is it.
This is what it all is about.
That's it.
Not Christmas.
People, they believe it's Easter.
This is it.
So I wish you and your family absolutely the best.
We'll still meet.
We'll meet.
We'll see how we're doing in the morning, see what we're doing.
I hope everybody is having a great time.
Make sure kids enjoy it.
Let's face it, they're not too young to understand the.
The severity of this, but make sure they have a lot of.
Do any of you have you ever been through this?
For some reason, next to Halloween, Halloween normally is.
I'm not a candy person, but of the candies that I've seen, I think Halloween, the one that nobody really gets is candy corn.
I don't know anybody who likes candy corn.
I don't know anybody who's ever saw it.
I don't even know if it's a taste.
What is this thing?
And then comes Easter.
Where you have some good stuff.
And then you've.
The ones that I recall as a kid that were good were anything involving Reese's.
Reese's peanut butter cups are phenomenal.
If they're frozen, if you freeze them, it takes on a whole different perspective.
Remember Andy's mints?
Remember that?
Freeze those.
I love it.
Cadbury, a weird kind of taste.
Weird.
We have some chemicals in that thing.
Very strange.
But the one I don't get, peeps.
Does anybody.
Actually, eat a peep.
I've never had a peep.
I don't know what it tastes like.
I have no interest in it.
It's like cotton candy meets fructose sugar or something.
Has anybody had a peep?
And what the hell does a peep have to do with the resurrection of Christ?
I have no earthly idea.
It's one of those things.
It makes no sense.
Makes no sense.
Absolutely.
Does anybody like peeps at all?
Makes no sense.
It makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.
So it's one of those things, my friends.
Oh, Robin Eggs, look at this.
Peeps are just decoration.
That's right.
I'm telling you.
Robin Eggs.
Peeps are best stale.
Never had one.
Never had one.
And yet, there must be a story behind them because they make these things.
And every time you walk into CVS, there they are.
There they are.
Never said peep.
All right, my friends, I thank you so much.
Please, please, look at this.
Love stale peeps.
Did not know that.
Did not know that.
Say you learned something stale.
Keep them stale.
How does this artificial thing become stale?
This thing has a half life of a thousand years.
Who can wait long enough for this thing to go stale?
Stale Peeps and Stories00:01:07
But I defer to you.
I'm not a candy person.
I don't really care for that.
But you do.
So, my friends, thank you so much.
Thank you so much for watching.
Thank you so much for following Mrs. L. at Lens Warriors.
Thank you.
We will please like the video, subscribe to the channel, hit that little bell so you're notified of live streams and new videos.
And like this, like this, like this, like this.
We'll see you tomorrow.
Again, my friends, thank you so much.
Happy, happy.
Thank you for the kind super chats.
Thank you for your wonderful donations and support.
I appreciate it immensely.
So we'll do it again tomorrow, okay?
Do it again tomorrow.
Give you some advance warning.
But remember, remember what the day is.
And I wish you from our family to yours, Mrs. Elami, make sure that you know that we tell you happy Easter.
And to our Jewish friends and Jewish fellows, Happy holidays as well.
Passover, whatever it is.
I want everybody to enjoy whatever it is that they claim as relevant.
That's all because ceremony and tradition mean something.