Lionel Nation - How Trump & His Genius Legal Team Lost Twice to a Lunatic to the Tune of $88M

Sept. 10, 2025 - Lionel Nation

15:10

How Trump & His Genius Legal Team Lost Twice to a Lunatic to the Tune of $88M

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	I don't know how to say this, but Trump's an idiot.
	He's an idiot.
	What's the matter with him?
	He loses twice to this supposed lunatic to the tune of $88 million.
	For what?
	With his genius legal team, what are you doing?
	I love the guy.
	Don't get me wrong.
	I love the guy, but he's a nut.
	He's crazy.
	He's an idiot.
	I mean, Trump did something very few defendants managed to do in high stakes civil litigation.
	He lost twice to the same plaintiff on nearly the same issue.
	How do you do that?
	How do you do this?
	This guy is I I mean, what?
	Twice to the same plaintiff.
	On the same issue.
	And what makes the defeats even even more glaring?
	Is that both verdicts weren't simply about facts and evidence or legal nuance.
	They were about discipline and strategy and self-control, or rather.
	The lack of it.
	Trump walked into two Manhattan courtrooms and gave his opponents precisely what they needed.
	Proof of malice, recklessness, and contempt.
	We're gonna go through this very quickly.
	Oh, you're gonna you're gonna love this one.
	And by the way, if you're a Trump apologist, you're not gonna like what I have to say about this because I speak the truth.
	But I want to speak to you about something also, which is the truth.
	You're talking about stupid.
	Now I don't want to say this, but if people don't pay attention to what I'm saying, I mean I don't want to use the word stupid, but I mean you can sense it.
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	Speaking of disasters, what is this guy thinking?
	You know, I love the man, but he makes it so hard sometimes.
	Oh my god, he makes it so hard.
	Let's look at this.
	The first lawsuit filed by Egene in 2019 seemed like a nuisance case at the time.
	Egene Carroll, a longtime advice columnist, accused Trump of sexually assaulting her in a Bergdorf Goodman dressing room in the mid-1990s.
	Trump, then president dismissed her claim in public.
	He called her not my type.
	And suggested she had invented the story for attention and book sales.
	Well, first of all, do you understand how stupid the she's not my type?
	Meaning I would have SA'd her had she been my type, as opposed to denying such a heinous allegation.
	this is the way the man thinks.
	He's an idiot.
	I love him.
	He's an idiot.
	Egene Carroll responded by filing for defamation.
	And for years the case dragged on in procedural mud with arguments about whether Trump could be substituted as a defendant under the Westfall Act or whether presidential immunity would apply.
	Anyway, Trump's lawyers managed to delay, but they never, they never actually defused the bomb.
	By 2023, the case finally reached a jury.
	What happened should have been predictable to anyone who has, oh, I don't know, ever watched how New York City juries behave towards powerful men, especially this guy in the epicenter of TDS.
	A man accused of wrongdoing.
	Carroll's legal team led by Roberta Kaplan understood the psychology of that jury pool.
	They played the access Hollywood tape, right, wrong, or different.
	They put forward other women, which I think is horrible.
	Horrible, similar fact evidence.
	I can't stand this what they did to Harvey Weinstein.
	But it was there, and it's legal.
	And Judge Kaplan, no relation, said fine.
	And these other women testified about similar encounters with Trump, and they hammered home the theme that this was not a one-off claim, but part of a of a broader pattern.
	Trump's lawyers tried the old school cross-examination playbook.
	Why didn't she scream?
	Why didn't she immediately report it?
	Why was there no DNA?
	How could she have been on high heels or whatever?
	I mean, it was the most stupid thing I've ever heard in my life.
	Now remember, got a prefaces, we weren't there.
	And unless you were there in the courtroom, we weren't there.
	So I don't know.
	I'm going on merely about what I'm reading and what I think.
	So instead of weakening Carol, those questions backfired.
	They made the jury think that the defense was attacking a victim, a woman, a woman, rather than disproving her story.
	So the result, five million dollars in damages, two mil for SA abuse, and three million for defamation.
	Okay?
	Not pocket change, not catastrophic, but a legal and public relations black eye.
	Okay, so for Trump, this should have been the wake-up call.
	Keep your mouth shut, let it go.
	A Manhattan jury, overwhelmingly liberal in composition, already believed Egene Carroll, any smart defendant would have would have retreated, you know, limited his public comments, kept his mouth shut, go on doing his stuff, and let his lawyers do damage control on appeal.
	Well, not all Trump.
	No, no, not our Donnie boy.
	No, instead, Trump doubled down.
	He was on a war path.
	He continued to ridicule Carroll on Truth Social and in rallies.
	He called her claims lies and mocked her age and her looks.
	Oh, that's brilliant.
	Going after a woman's looks and her age.
	Oh, too shay.
	And he repeated the very statements that had triggered the first lawsuit.
	In other words, he kept defaming her in real time, while the jury had already held him liable for defamation.
	It was a strategic own goal of breathtaking proportions.
	And Carroll's legal team didn't need to work hard to justify a second lawsuit.
	The cause of action was handed to them on a platter by Trump's own mouth.
	And so in 2022, they filed Carroll too.
	Carroll do Carroll Redux.
	Focusing on Trump's 2019 comments as president.
	But this second case wasn't about the alleged assault itself, but about his words while in office, words that painted Carol as a liar and a lunatic and a crazy woman and subjected her to waves of harassments and threats.
	You've seen this before, right?
	So in January of 2024, a jury returned an eye-watering 83.3 million dollar verdict, 7.3 mil for pain and suffering, 11 mil for reputational harm, and 65 mil in punis, punitive damages, Exemplary damages, smart money.
	That punitive number was the jury screaming at Trump, teaching him a lesson.
	We know you'll keep doing this unless we hit you with a sum that hurts.
	Why did this happen?
	Partly because Trump couldn't restrain himself.
	He can't.
	He can't shut up.
	Jurors saw a defendant who not only refused to apologize or stay quiet, but who actively mocked the plaintiff during the proceedings.
	His team's tactics, again, poking at credibility and demanding DNA and questioning why she didn't scream, whatever, felt out of touch in the and it's still there, the me to era, and tone deaf to a Manhattan jury.
	Every time Trump or his lawyers tried to tear Carroll down, they gave her side more sympathy.
	And when the case went up on appeal, Trump finally had a chance to argue technical points that immunity should have shielded him and that damages were excessive, that Judge Kaplan allowed prejudicial evidence and a blah blah blah.
	But appellate courts dealed in law, not passion.
	And the second circuit court of appeals flatly rejected the immunity claims as untimely and misplaced.
	And they say the damages were fair and reasonable, citing even even larger awards and comparable defamation cases, like Alex Jones and Rudy Giuliani.
	That's not crazy.
	And they found no trial errors significant enough to overturn the verdict.
	Remember, in Michigan against Tucker, the defendant's entitled to a to a to a fair trial, not a perfect one.
	So as of September now, Trump now owes Carroll 88.3 million dollars across two judgments.
	He can petition the Supreme Court, but his odds are thin.
	SCOTUS rarely is going to take cases like this unless there's a split among circuits or a novel question, maybe some immune, I don't know.
	But here the issues were straightforward.
	Defamation law, evidence discretion, damages.
	Nothing cries out for SCOTUS review.
	Nothing.
	And the irony is that Egene Carroll, whom Trump's defenders painted as some publicity seeking cranks and lunatics, now has two countum, two massive judgments, validated by juries and stamped by appellate judges.
	And if she was supposedly crazy, she now looks like the most effective litigant in modern memory, who's crazy or not.
	And Trump, on the other hand, looks like a coach, like a like a defendant, rather.
	Who couldn't help but sabotage himself, who couldn't keep his mouth shut.
	And the lesson is simple.
	Sometimes the best legal strategy is silence.
	Silence.
	If Trump had stopped commenting after the first verdict, Carroll would have had no grounds for the second.
	Instead, he said his public persona, his combativeness, his defiance, never backing down, translated into devastating evidence of malice.
	And to a Manhattan jury, to a Manhattan jury, every insult he hurled was another reason to punish him.
	And that's what they did.
	And his lawyers also made strategic blunders.
	The fixation on DNA and the decades-old allegation looked desperate.
	The why didn't she scream line or cross-examination?
	Sounded like something from a 1950s courtroom drama.
	Not a modern trial where jurors understand trauma responses, attacking a plaintiff who represented herself as dignified and consistent, played exceedingly poorly.
	Rather than dismantling Carol systematically, the defense amplified her credibility.
	See, that's the thing.
	They gave her credibility.
	And Trump himself, sitting in the courtroom and visibly reacting, gave the jury the impression of disdain.
	Jurors watch demeanor and watch attitude and watch content.
	As much as they listen to testimony, a defendant who sneers, mutters, or uh you know, shakes his head, validates, validates this narrative that he doesn't respect women or the legal process or the seriousness of the allegation.
	And Carroll's team didn't didn't need to say it outright.
	The jury could see it.
	So two defeats later, Trump's pattern is unmistakable.
	He he he's not losing because of airtight evidence against him.
	There's no DNA, no police report, no contemporaneous complaint.
	No, well, there was a contemporaneous validation where she called a friend of hers at purportedly the same time.
	So that that helps for corroboration, but that's certainly not a police report.
	He's losing because he hands his opponents ammunition every time he opens his mouth.
	He's losing because his lawyers chose outdated attack tactics instead of adjusting to jury sensibilities.
	And he's losing because of Manhattan, with its cultural and political climate, this tedious, you know, contagion.
	A wealthy, powerful man named Trump, mocking an alleged victim of SA is never going to get a sympathetic year.
	And that's what this is about.
	So, my friends, I ask you a very simple question.
	What do you think about this?
	What do you think about this?
	Now remember, I uh you you you can call her crazy all you want.
	They were there in that courtroom, they listened, and they believed in something.
	So what do you think?
	Thank you, dear friends.
	Thank you for watching.
	Don't forget, don't forget, prepare with Lydon.com, check out our sponsors.
	And I've got a series of questions immediately following this that I want you to review and go through and see what you what your take is on this.
	As you very carefully, very artfully, very specifically, dear friend, comment.

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