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April 28, 2023 - Lionel Nation
22:20
Trump’s Lawyers Can Lose the Carroll Case By Even Appearing to Attack An Alleged Rape Victim
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I'm going to give you some absolute golden legal advice that Joe...
Takapina and other members of the Trump legal team should take into consideration regarding the E. Jean Carroll case.
This is what I am telling you, I am warning you, is going to explode if you don't pay attention to what you're doing.
It's a civil case involving sexual battery, rape.
You can call it whatever you want.
It's a civil case.
Trump doesn't face any criminal penalty.
The judge is getting up to here with references on social media, and there could be, oh, the potential.
This is federal court, federal judges.
You get into obstruction of justice by witness tampering.
I mean, you have got to be quiet.
Let me put it this way.
Shut up.
When your victim is testifying in a case that people may or may not be really paying attention to, don't attack in any way.
Social media or otherwise.
Don't even mention the case.
Don't mention it.
You do not benefit in the least.
You do not, especially if you're serious about running and winning in 2024.
This is the part.
This is the part.
I'm telling you, this is the part where I think Trump either has a political death wish or isn't serious about running or winning.
This is like sabotage.
What are you doing?
This is the part, and my Trump friends, oh my God, they just, you don't understand.
No, you don't understand.
I want the, you, somebody better want the Trump of 2016.
That was like really smart.
Now let me explain something.
Let's get down to brass tacks.
When you cross-examine, cross-examine a witness, what is cross-examination?
Cross-examination means you are questioning the other side's witness.
Direct examination is you're questioning your witness.
Cross-examination is when the other side is done with their witness on direct and then it's your turn.
And the thing that makes cross-examination different is that you can ask leading And if you don't ask a leading question, what are you doing?
What are you doing?
This is their witness.
Get her off the stand.
Get her out.
Use all of your efforts in closing arguments to maybe Discuss how she might not be believable or maybe how the testimony didn't make sense or after she's gone.
First, when somebody's on the stand and you start asking non-leading questions, open-ended questions, who, what, when, where, why, you open up the chance for this victim What it is, the defendant or the plaintiff in this particular case,
to clarify something, to fix, to close a hole, to maybe correct something that you might have been smart just not saying anything, and then during closing, you know, bringing it up.
But no.
No, no.
She's there.
Let me say this again.
You're not going to be benefited by their witness, by the victim.
Now, I'm not in court.
You're not in court.
We don't know how she looks.
Does she look frail?
Do you sit there and say, oh my God, she looks pathetic.
Are you watching the jury?
Do you see, what is it?
Men, women?
And by the way, don't, you know, sexual battery rape charges, this is not about women jurors.
Men have mothers and daughters and wives too.
This is ridiculous.
Sometimes it can be even worse.
It can be, you never know how this thing works.
So, the idea, somebody says, well, how are the women reacting?
How are the men reacting?
Look at their faces.
And so, what is the New York Post today reports?
That his lawyer was basically asking questions about why didn't you scream?
What?
Why did...
What?
This is...
When you're talking about the victim, alleged, granted, The president is presumed innocent.
That's criminal.
This is civil.
Never, ever start questioning, why didn't you do that?
What are you going to do?
Why didn't you scream?
People!
Let me share this with you.
I couldn't believe what I'm reading.
I could not.
This...
I'm shocked.
Shocked beyond anything.
How stupid!
There's no way to put this in a word.
Okay, this is from the New York Post today, okay?
This is from the New York Post.
By Priscilla DeGregory.
E. Jean Carroll snapped at Donald Trump's lawyer Thursday during questioning about why she didn't scream when she was allegedly raped by the former president in a department store dressing room.
I'm telling you, he raped me whether I screamed or not.
And then later on, it goes on, she says, well, I would have come up with a better, if I'm going to lie, I would have come up with a better story than this.
You never do this!
This is the reason why women say, I'm not going to ever report this.
I'm not going to go through this.
You don't know how you're going to react.
Now let me just say something right now.
I have no independent knowledge of the truth of this.
I'm talking to you as a trial lawyer.
And I know what's going on.
This is theater plus psychology plus everything.
You don't...
Unless you've got something where somebody said, you're basically saying, you're lying.
Alright?
You're lying.
That's what this means.
It means you're lying.
You're lying because you should have screamed.
Women who raped are screamed.
People who were attacked are screamed.
It's one thing if you say there was somebody next door and didn't even hear.
Even that.
You're calling into question the way people...
You never know how you react, theoretically.
Theoretically.
People...
I've heard this a million times.
People who...
Especially people who think that, you know, I'm going to get a gun and I'm going to be able to defend myself.
And I've had...
It was the weirdest thing.
When I was a prosecutor, I had...
Like...
Two or three that I remember, these people would say, I would ask them, what happened during an armed robbery?
And I would hear this, the gun was like this, the barrel was like this.
I'm saying, oh my God.
What is this?
Howitzer?
I mean, this big?
And then later on somebody explained a parallax and how distortion and the time dilation and the fear and the adrenaline and the...
It's like another world.
It's surreal.
You don't know what you're...
You just don't know.
You think you're going to know what you're going to do.
You think you don't know anything.
And the jury's listening to this.
What do you think she's going to say?
What?
What would she say?
Okay, you're right.
Okay.
You got it.
No, you're right.
I'm making the whole thing up.
You're right.
Okay.
You don't think this came up?
It's such a...
I mean...
And again, I don't know the other testimony.
I don't know...
There may be something else that I don't know.
I'm telling you that this is the most dangerous, especially kids.
Kids.
That's another one.
Oh, my God.
Oh, my God.
This is almost, this is kryptonite.
Don't ask anything.
Thank you very much.
Goodbye.
Goodbye.
One of the most effective means of cross-examination, I tell people this, and you laugh.
You say, Thank you very much for your testimony and thank you very much for coming today.
No questions, Your Honor.
It throws people off.
Nothing diffuses.
If that's what you want to do, then nothing?
It's...
You don't...
Jurors don't say, Aha!
That must have been a good witness because he doesn't have any questions.
It's almost like, Why didn't you want to ask her a question?
What?
If anything, the point is, it's the other side's witness.
These stories are just...
Again, I am...
They talked about...
According to the New York Post, Takapina attempted to show that Carol's story was unbelievable when he asked her about wearing four-inch heels during the alleged incident.
And finally getting her knee-high enough to get Trump off her.
I can dance backwards and forwards in foreign seals.
What?
Earlier Thursday, as reported, while still in direct examination by her own lawyer, Carol told jurors about how hard it was to face the incessant online hatred that began after Trump publicly denied her accusation.
And it's just...
It's just...
Oh my God!
You're not even, this is the victim?
Why would you ask the victim anything?
What do you seek to gain?
Some glaring?
If you were to say, for example, imagine this.
This would be a good cross-examination.
Ms. Carroll, are you sure you were there?
Yes.
On October the 5th, in Bergdorf Goodman?
Fifth Avenue?
57th Street?
Manhattan?
You were there at 6 p.m.?
You're under oath now.
You understand that, right?
You're under oath?
You sure?
You can take this back.
You sure about this?
Yes.
You swear.
You understand what perjury is, right?
Okay.
And then all of a sudden you say, this is an easy pass.
Imagine they have this.
They don't have that.
But imagine.
This is a camera that was at the Lincoln Tunnel.
Everybody, every picture is everybody's photograph, let's assume.
And this is you driving.
And this is your car.
And there you are.
And this is your phone.
And we know from the geopositioning that you were at the Lincoln Tunnel.
You weren't there.
Now that's a good cross-examination.
You weren't there.
It wasn't you.
He wasn't there.
Trump was in Romania.
Trump wasn't there.
I've got...
Alibi witnesses.
He wasn't.
That's a good one.
That's good.
Do you know one time, I will never forget this.
I've got to tell you this story quickly.
I had a case where, I was a prosecutor, where this guy supposedly went to a liquor store.
He wasn't served.
Correctly or something happened.
I forget exactly what it was.
He went to his truck, got a chainsaw, went to this little liquor store, and started to cut the frame of the door.
Like a Texas chainsaw.
I mean, this was like, oh my God, this is a great case!
Okay.
The defendant, The one charged, the one that I was supposed to go to court with, he was at a, what was it?
Like a National Guard, one of these monthly, you know, where you go or whatever it is.
He was a National Guard.
The fellow who was supposedly with a chain saw, had wild hair.
This guy had hair he was with, and he got into a fight, supposedly.
With all these other people in this chow room or chow hall, mess hall.
What am I trying to say?
I'm trying to remember my Gomer Pile, Charlie Hacker.
Anyway, they all remember him because he was there.
And I had a witness list.
I think there was like a brigadier general.
Yeah, I remember him.
He was there.
Now that's a good cross-examination.
Are you sure he was there?
Yes.
Who are these people?
That's the kind of stuff you want.
Maybe sometimes this is a good one.
Like, for example, if you're going to cross-examination, somebody's mother.
Somebody's mother, let's assume.
And you say, Mrs. Alvarez, yes.
You're the defendant's mother, aren't you?
Yes.
And you love him, don't you?
And you wouldn't want to see anything bad happen to him, would you?
Yes.
Thank you very much.
And that's it!
What if you just said, you're a liar, you're a mother, of course you're going to lie, it's your son.
But you didn't say that.
Maybe, maybe that's, get him off!
Get her out of there!
How are you going to...
How are you...
You're going to sit there and you're going to deconstruct this?
Now let's say you were here, and how tall are you, and where were you, and he did what, and how do you...
You know how many people, again, I don't know anything about this, you know how many people, how many women have said, they don't even remember it.
They're like transfixed.
They're in another world.
They remove themselves.
It's almost like an out-of-body experience just to live through this.
This can't be happening.
This is what rape victims say.
Again, I don't think about it.
There better be some real good reason for this.
And just imagine the closing argument.
Ladies and gentlemen, the arrogance.
Remember, Trump's not there.
He's not even there.
I'm thinking, oh my God, what are you doing?
It just started.
And now, again, I'm going to say this for the millionth time.
I wasn't there.
I, uh...
I could have this article, if the New York Post might be wrong, there may be something that is so different.
I don't think so.
If that was said, I can go on.
Cross-examination is this thing that lawyers think they have to do.
You have to.
I can't sit down.
I can't sit down.
Let me tell you one quick story, true story.
I was brand new doing mass unit prosecution.
And I was really not.
I mean, I had clinical trial stuff in law school, but I didn't know my courtroom.
And it was some stupid, not stupid, it was a simple case.
Nothing.
It was an infraction or something.
I don't know what it was.
But I said, let me do something.
So I had this guy next to me, my second chair.
I think he had like two weeks experience over me.
So I walked up to this police officer, had my yellow pad, and I said, you said the light was yellow?
He said, yeah.
And I went blank.
I completely, I didn't know where the hell I was.
Once I sat there and saw everybody, I looked at the judge and the clerk and the probation officer and all these people walking around.
Because it's like, you know, it's like people are walking around and I forgot what I was going to say.
So it went like this.
And you said you were, you said the light was yellow, yeah.
That's what I thought you'd say.
And I sat down.
No further questions.
And I sat down.
And the second chair, my mentor, the guy who was advising me, again, he had two weeks more experience than I had.
He leaned over and goes, what was that about?
I said, I'll tell you later.
And the judge was like that.
And the cop was...
Everybody was like...
I don't know.
I don't even remember what happened to the gays.
But unless you're going to confuse people...
Don't ask!
Why are you asking questions?
What is he going to...
He's their witness.
Get them off!
Thank you very much.
Show respect.
Show.
Act as though you would act.
If you think somebody's crazy and somebody's not to be believed, like, I know.
You can go.
I don't think you have to go through anymore.
I don't.
No, I don't.
It's like you're almost saying, I just don't have the heart to.
No.
Something.
Anything.
Nobody wants to think this because people, they watch TV and they watch LA Law and they know all about this and after all they get their law degrees online and they know, everybody knows everything.
Cross-examination is like, what are you doing?
Stipulate, put all of your eggs in closing, closing argument.
That's where you go nuts.
Not by allowing the victim to maybe Clarify.
Or, maybe, maybe, maybe, who knows?
Jury's like sitting there saying, I'm not buying this at all.
I'm not believing anything she's saying at all.
What is she talking about?
And then here you come along.
And then they say, now wait a minute.
Hold it.
What if she starts crying?
Oh, God!
Minefields.
Stupid.
Stupid, stupid, stupid.
What do you think?
I want to hear what you think.
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