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Jan. 21, 2023 - Lionel Nation
01:02:23
The Prosecution of Alec Baldwin — @LionelNation

Alex Baldwin be acquitted.

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Okay?
Very, very serious.
Very, very, very important that we do this.
Now, one of the first things I want to talk about today is a little bit of background.
A little bit of background and kind of remind ourselves of who we are and how our system works.
And that's a very important thing.
How our American system works, specifically our System of jurisprudence.
How does this thing work?
How do we...
What am I trying to say?
Are you seeing me on this by any chance?
I'm trying to get on.
Okay.
I'm trying to see.
I'm having a bit of a...
I see a possibility, a little slowness here, and I don't know.
As I check to see if we are in fact on...
Do you see...
Let me see this here.
Let me see this.
Let me try this.
See if there's any improvement.
We have been having a veritable potpourri of, I guess, Wi-Fi problems and the like, which is just a whole other story, which of course is of no concern or interest to you.
Hang on a second.
Let's see if this works now.
And let's see if this makes any sense.
I'm showing that we are strong.
I guess we are strong, I guess.
Let me see.
Let me make sure.
Very good.
If I could ask...
Okay, very good.
Five by five.
Thank you.
Thank you.
By the way, five by five is our way of saying that we are on.
Okay?
Okay.
Now, first and foremost, I believe in this crazy cuckoo idea.
Called the Constitution.
And there's a couple of things which I believe in.
First, as a lawyer, as a licensed lawyer, I am not here to apologize for a lot of the problems in the system.
Believe me when I say this.
There are more than you can even remotely understand.
And there are reasons for that, and I don't know what to tell you.
So I'm not one of those people.
When most people think of the legal system, they think for the most part of criminal law.
That's kind of what you see.
You see shows on TV about criminal law and prosecution and that sort of thing.
So that's pretty much the initial mindset of people.
And I understand it.
And I guess it's interesting to many.
And that's good.
But there's a lot that people do not understand.
And the very first thing that people must understand is that we must remain always colorblind and blind, hence justice in the blindfold.
We must be blind to those individuals, and we must apply the law to everybody and anybody.
And as a trial lawyer, I like a case that I think is just interesting or good, irrespective of who the person is.
There have been people before who have had absolutely the best case possible, civil or criminal.
Criminal would be in the defense case.
And by the way, as a prosecution too, but the facts weren't there.
The facts weren't there, the evidence wasn't there, or there's no way to prove it.
But you know it was true, you know it happened, you know it, but there's no way to prove it.
None!
None.
And you've got to keep that in mind.
Sometimes that's good, sometimes that's bad.
I tell young people, young men in particular, to be very careful, because if you're in a position where somebody were to accuse you of something, let's say untoward, if you're on a date, or especially people who meet through dating apps and the like, if somebody claims that you were involved in something which was criminal, how are you going to get out of it?
What are you going to claim?
What?
The system doesn't just stop because, well, there really is not enough evidence here.
You may get the wrong prosecutor or the right prosecutor or the right victim.
Then there are other people who just somehow can't explain themselves.
Or they've got prior records.
Or they're frankly crazy.
But they were the victim of something.
And there were people who have been charged.
Who really shouldn't be charged?
There's a balance.
This is excessive.
This is unfair.
And it goes on and on and on.
And one of the things which is the most important, and I have been telling people, whether you're Joe Biden or Donald Trump or Alec Baldwin or anyone, you look at the case as though you're reading the instrument.
You just look at the facts.
Who cares who he is?
Who cares?
I don't care who Alec Baldwin is.
And I'm going to tell you right now that based upon what I have seen, unless there's something I don't know about, I'm going to go through this, Alec Baldwin most probably, I believe, will be acquitted of everything because of a number of reasons involving his case.
Now, when you tell people this, When you bring this to their attention, the first thing they do is they take either their like of Alec Baldwin or dislike or his popularity as an actress, very good actress, very talented, very good mimic, and they will either use that as a basis to either support him or to deny him because maybe they don't like him.
Maybe they don't like what he said about Trump or maybe they don't like his politics.
I was telling people yesterday, in fact, I did one of the...
Most interesting analyses of the death of David Crosby.
And how that also is...
To me, you have to ask, did you like David Crosby as a musician?
His politics may be one thing, his personal life.
I don't know.
You can like, not like, like, not like, based on a variety of reasons.
But today, I'm sorry to say by virtue of social media, once we don't like someone, or once we like them, that's it.
Now, this may seem as a problem to you, may seem problematic, but I want you to imagine you are in the firm we have been hired to defend Alec Baldwin.
And the first question I have for you, Is under the canons of professional responsibility, is there anything?
Are you able to say that you will represent him zealously?
Is there anything that gets in the way?
Is there anything that gets in the way?
Anything.
You don't have to take a case.
It's better if you don't.
You have to kind of like the case.
You may not like the person, but you like the case.
I've always said, people have asked for the longest time, I don't know why, can you represent somebody who's guilty?
Of course.
I don't know why people ask that question.
They do all the time.
What if you know he's guilty?
Yeah.
Yeah.
What?
Yeah.
Of course.
You're a criminal lawyer?
Yeah.
Most of them are guilty of something or did something or were there.
Well, what are they charged with?
Do you believe this person deserves a day in court?
Yeah, but...
What do you mean defending them?
Stand up and say, hey, it was...
Of course he robbed that bank.
Of course he killed those people.
Hey!
They had it coming.
No, that's not defending.
That's not what you're talking about.
What does it mean?
The things that I would not do, and I make it very, very clear, I would never, and have never, ever cross-examine the victim of a, for the most part, a sexual battery.
I'm not into that.
Not into that.
Let's say you had somebody who was clearly troubled, clearly affected, maybe actually victimized, but there was a real problem with the case, an identity problem, or identification problem, wrong person, whatever.
And you have to get up and sit there.
And let's say you meet somebody who has a history of false accusations in the past.
You can, through something called impeachment in evidence, bring that up.
Some people I don't enjoy and I would have a hard time with and I would have to decline because it wouldn't be very effective if I had to really have somebody during a trial.
Pre-trial is a little different, but...
Depositions or questioning or whatever.
Oh, and a child.
Not interested.
Not interested.
That's the victim?
Yeah.
Get somebody else.
I wouldn't be very effective.
Some people have no problem.
Hats off.
Go ahead.
No problem.
I have no ill feelings about anybody who would do that.
That's just my thing.
Same thing for prosecution.
Prosecution, sometimes there are cases where we have a lot of discretion.
We're saying, I don't think this is worthwhile.
There were cases, and what we did, by the way, we would decline.
There was one case where we basically had a rule.
We just said it, and it became actually a law later on.
I'm not going to prosecute somebody for stealing food.
I'm sorry, I just...
And there was one case.
It's not funny.
Or a man was charged with stealing pampers and baby formulas.
Like, not me.
Sorry.
Sorry.
This is not the best way for us to use our limited resources.
Going after this guy.
So there's discretion.
Let me ask you this.
What is justice?
What does that mean?
I have no idea.
I have no earthly idea what that even means.
I don't know who justice...
To whom?
For whom?
What?
I have no idea.
None.
None!
But let's take Alec Baldwin and let's think about this and let's go through exactly what we are going to go through and how we are going to handle this.
And I have talked about this and I go through some pretty thorough investigations of sorts.
And let me also remind you right off the bat that if you would like to hear that, please avail yourself of my private, exclusive, private subscriber channel.
Okay?
Okay?
And that's the link for that, because I go into much greater detail.
I've got something you'll find very interesting about David Crosby.
In about the 60s, in about the utilization of a particular mindset, which I go into greater, greater detail.
But not here.
And not now.
I save...
I don't want to save the good stuff, but I'll say it.
I save the good stuff for the private channel.
Alright?
Okay.
First of all, what do I want to do?
Alec Baldwin comes in to my office.
What in my office?
Whatever.
There's not going to be any offices anymore.
People are just going to...
What do you want an office for?
Okay, fine.
Whatever.
Come in and sit down.
Mr. Baldwin, how are you?
Good.
We probably...
Should talk a little bit about if there's anything you want to know or I want to know.
By the way, a lot of people that I talk about have done things that I might have not liked or cared for or liked.
It doesn't really matter one way or the other.
But the first question is, what are you being charged with?
Question number one.
Is there an indictment?
Is there a charging instrument?
What is it?
I don't care what you did.
I don't care what you did.
What do you charge with?
What did they say you did?
Here it is.
Involuntary manslaughter.
Involuntary homicide.
Involuntary.
First things first.
This is New Mexico.
By the way, this is interesting.
By the way, the New York Post, the New York Post, That was very interesting.
The New York Post showed that he was charged in federal, breaking federal laws?
Federal?
Federal?
No, there's no federal.
What are you talking about?
Federal?
No, no, no, no, no, no.
There's nothing federal.
There's no...
By the way, federal do not have...
This is a state.
This is New Mexico.
There's no federal grand jury.
He didn't violate some civil rights.
No, no, no, no.
So people, they're kind of somehow fast and loose with, you know, terms and words and they'll say things that they don't think is really important, but they are.
Like one of my favorites was, I'm going to go out and swear out a warrant.
I don't even know what that means.
Citizens arrest.
What is that?
You know, citizens arrest.
I wouldn't recommend that.
Why?
I don't even know what that means.
Good luck trying to say this.
Good luck trying to say, well, you know, holding somebody until the police get there is one thing.
Citizens arrest is another.
So anyway, so there are these things people say.
People always like the term natural law.
Natural law.
What does that mean?
I don't know.
It's what you think it is.
So the first rule is, what do we have here?
Let me see it.
And then we have somebody who says, I want you to give me kind of an overview of these two.
He's charging the alternative.
Basically, Dealing with involuntary manslaughter.
Involuntary couple.
Meaning, negligent death.
Manslaughter.
Man's laughter.
Look at it that way.
Any minimum mandatories?
Let's assume the worst.
Meaning, is there anything if he either pleads guilty or is found guilty?
Is there any minimum mandatory?
And the answer is there might be yes.
In the second case, if there is involuntary manslaughter and they're being charged in the alternative because the jury can find them guilty of this or this.
And in the latter case, since there's some illegal act or some act which involves a handgun.
Now they're talking about a handgun.
And a handgun could impose, could involve a minimum mandatory.
Meaning, you must be, and I hate minimum mandatories, can't stand them.
Why?
Because it takes away the profits from the judge.
Judge should have that.
Don't make it minimum mandatory.
I don't like those.
I don't like that.
I don't like a habitual felony, three toss strikes and you're out.
I don't like any of that stuff.
Let the judge decide.
Let the judge decide.
So I'm going to hold that thought.
Think about this very, very quickly, because At this time, I want to remind you of something.
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Back to this.
Minimum mandatory.
People keep saying, I keep hearing, say, well, there is a firearm involved in something.
Really?
Now, whenever there's a firearm, in some respects, many cases have minimum mandatories, and I can't stand that, as I've made very clear.
But in this particular case, the firearm, he's not robbing a bank.
He's not brandishing it.
It's a movie set.
It is a firearm.
Here's the question.
What is a firearm?
What?
What's a firearm?
Define it.
A firearm is usually defined in most states as an instrument which is designed or intended to or capable of being able to expel a projectile via combustion or explosion.
That's what a firearm is.
Some states have They have exceptions for antique firearms before a particular date.
They're excluded from this.
First thing, make sure we've got a firearm here.
This is a movie prop.
This is a movie set.
Was it a real firearm?
Well, apparently it was, but that's a different story.
Do you know it was a firearm?
Did you realize it?
How does Syenter work into this?
Meaning, knowledge.
Because I'm going to cut right to the chase.
Alec Baldwin did not mean to kill anybody.
Alec Baldwin, perhaps, perhaps, relied on the armorer.
And the real issue is very simply this.
Why was there a bullet, a live round, within a hundred miles of this place?
That's the issue.
Why was there a bullet anywhere near this?
That's the issue.
That's the issue.
Period.
Now, as you know, I'm going to say this, there's civil liability that is so easy to satisfy, to prove a case, and there is criminal liability.
What's the difference?
Well, civil, you look for money, for the most part.
You can also look for things like injunctions, and it's normally money.
Make me whole.
I'm suing.
I want money.
I want money.
I don't want jail.
I want money.
I'm suing the doctor.
I don't want him to go to jail because you left a scalpel in me.
I want millions from the money that you hurt me to harm me to compensate me for my pain and suffering, my lost wages, etc.
That's civil.
No jail involved.
No imprisonment.
No nothing.
No arrest.
Just money.
Criminal.
Ah!
Criminal is involving the pursuit of justice, incarceration, and the advancement, the prosecution of a crime.
What is a crime?
A crime is anything where somebody could theoretically go to jail or prison for.
What's jail?
Jail is up to a year in jail.
Jail is like the county jail.
Normally misdemeanors.
Up to a year is normally jail.
Prison, over a year.
That's it.
What makes a misdemeanor a misdemeanor?
Whatever the legislature says.
Is there something inherent about a felony?
Could be.
I don't know.
In some states, if you steal a fire extinguisher, it's a felony.
300 pieces of orange, of fruit, felony.
Steal a cow, felony.
Steal anything over $300, it's a felony.
What does that mean?
It means you theoretically face the possibility of going to prison for over a year.
Even though nobody's ever gone to prison.
Doesn't matter.
What about a misdemeanor?
Up to a year.
You can charge somebody with, sometimes you'll see during water bans, you water your lawn, it's a misdemeanor.
You can be charged, it's a misdemeanor.
You could go to jail, county jail, 60 days, or up to a year, even though nobody's ever been, but it could be, could be.
Is a speeding ticket a crime?
Nope.
Why?
Not if there's no chance of jail.
Speeding points, civil infractions, little violations, points only, moving violations.
No, you can't go to jail.
However, it can turn into a criminal, like reckless driving, from careless driving, anything that involves the possibility of jail.
That's what a crime is.
That's it.
Probation.
You don't go on probation.
Probation is mercy.
Probation is in lieu of jail.
You don't go on probation for a speeding ticket.
You may have your license suspended.
That's civil.
That's not a crime.
Period.
And when you're charged, you've got to turn yourself in.
You've got to be booked.
You've got a booking photo.
They've got to take physical custody of you.
Now, Alec Baldwin will move in.
They'll probably have some kind of an agreement where he's released on bond.
They worked this out ahead of time.
He's not going to flee.
What's the bond going to be?
He may post something nominal.
They could ROR him, release him on his own recognizance, but he's got to bond in.
He's got to have a booking photo.
Fingerprint.
We got him.
Here he is.
Good.
Now we have exacted jurisdiction on you.
We've got you.
Now we then set it for an arraignment.
It'll be the first level of this.
The arraignment, or as my one client called it, an arrangement.
Which kind of...
And at the arraignment, he's going to plead not guilty.
100%.
I heard somebody read, or they stated that, He's challenging this.
You're going to plead not guilty.
Why?
Because if you plead guilty or no contest, which I'll explain in a moment, your case is over.
Of course you're going to plead not guilty.
Can I find out what it is?
Yeah.
Hey, you know what?
You know that main witness?
He died.
What?
Or he moved.
Really?
Yeah.
Gee, I'm glad I didn't plead guilty.
Because you find out, what do you have?
I get to see.
Your witnesses, your experts, your scientific testimony.
How are you going to prove this case against me?
See how this works?
No contest.
What is that?
No low contendery.
One of the weirdest things ever.
It's a plea that says, I'm not going to contest it.
It means, I'm not saying I did it, which would be guilty.
I'm not saying I didn't do it, which would be not guilty.
I just want this to be over with.
I'm not entering a plea.
I'm not entering a formal statement as to my culpability.
Period.
I've had clients in the past who never got the no contest thing correctly.
They knew what it was, but the phraseology.
One said, please, no context.
Which was interesting.
Kind of a non-contextual thing.
The other one was my favorite.
No comment.
Now, anytime a judge does not receive a 100% clear and absolute statement as to the plea, he has to set the trial, except it is a not guilty plea, and set it for trial.
So the judge would always say, would you sit down and talk to your client?
Would you?
Because I'm not going to...
I know what he's trying to say.
I can't help him.
I don't think he's pleading no context or no comment.
But the best one...
The best one?
No conscience.
Kind of like an insanity defense.
Okay.
So he's going to plead not guilty.
What do you got?
Now what I don't understand is this gun thing.
If they're going to try to load him up with some minimum mandatory because it was a gun, it wasn't a gun.
It was a prop.
It happened to be a gun.
He wasn't using it to threaten somebody.
That's like using a sword in a movie, and you're going to charge him, what, aggravated battery because it was a deadly weapon?
No!
You know what I'm saying?
Do you know what I'm saying?
Whereas my Irish friend would say, do you know what I'm saying?
Do you know what I'm saying, Father?
Hello, Father.
How about a potato?
Anyway, so we've got so many issues here.
Minimum mandatory.
He's on a movie set.
He's on a movie set.
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Okay.
So right now, my first thing is, I want to take any of this minimum mandatory off the table.
I don't like this.
Let's get a ruling ahead of time.
You are not going to seek this.
You cannot possibly tell me that the fact that he used a gun in a scene is what the legislature intended when it came up with a gun offense.
We go to trial.
The armorer is the one.
If anybody.
And remember, You don't want to do this, but the first thing you're going to do is you're going to say, it's not his fault.
Everybody's going to try to flip on everybody else.
You can call it flipping.
It's just called the truth.
You got the wrong guy here.
Now, everybody's making a big deal over the fact that Alec Baldwin said, I never pulled the trigger.
So what if he pulled the trigger?
So what if it wasn't true?
George Stephanopoulos, he wasn't under oath.
How many statements has he made?
That's where we've got to get the investigator.
What has he said?
What has he said?
Why he gave that interview?
I have no idea.
Why?
I didn't pull the trigger.
I would never point a gun.
Wait a minute.
What?
I would never point a gun.
This is my dream.
Okay?
Here's my witness list.
Francis Ford Coppola, Martin Scorsese, Clint Eastwood.
I'm going to bring all these directors.
State your name for the record.
Francis Ford Coppola.
Mr. Coppola, did you ever have the occasion to be a part of any, I don't know, popular movies?
Oh, yes.
Well, there was one called The Godfather, Godfather 1, Godfather 2. Okay, good.
Did you ever point guns?
Real gun?
Yes.
Did you ever point them?
Yes.
What would you do if one of your actors said, I'm not going to point the gun?
They wouldn't work for me.
Is pointing a gun at somebody?
Well, yes.
The late James Caan, who had 147 squibs on him that exploded when people stood there with Tommy guns.
Did they point at him?
Yes.
Why would you want to point a gun?
That's somebody for realism.
Imagine, Dirty Harry, make my day.
They're pointing it right at him.
Remember the guy who says, I've got to know.
You know, in all this commotion, I seem to have lost track whether I've shot five or six.
Well, you know, I've got to know.
Click.
He's pointing the gun at him.
He's clicking it.
It's a movie.
It's a movie.
Saving Private Ryan.
You want to go through this?
Bonnie and Clyde?
Hello?
When they shot the...
I'm not going to go through every gun scene.
So first and foremost, ladies and gentlemen of the jury, I don't care what Alec Baldwin said to George Stephanopoulos.
He's not under oath.
He's not being charged with perjury.
And not only is it par for the course, if you don't point a gun...
It's no scene.
In essence, you're depriving your investors and those you have a fiduciary duty with, you're depriving them of a good movie.
You have to point them out.
What are we talking about here?
Yes!
Now, the next thing is, what exactly did Mr. Baldwin do that was negligent?
Remember, the armorer, this woman, she's got her own problems.
I'm not that familiar with it.
But what did he do?
What is he supposed to do?
Double...
Hang on, give me that.
You're the armorer.
Hang on, give me this for a minute.
Let me look at this.
What is this?
Is this a...
Is this a squib?
Can this shoot?
Can a blank...
Blanks can project...
Can shoot projectiles.
Blanks can shoot wadding.
Those squibs, by the way, that...
James Caan was wearing when he was killed as Sonny.
If you put your hand in front of those, it could blow a hole in your hand.
He was very afraid.
They told him, keep your hands out.
Is it his job?
Is it Alec Baldwin's job to check it before when they say hot, cold, whatever?
Now, normally, you don't want to advance a theory.
Someone called it a conspiracy theory or whatever.
But you might want to say, did anybody, Is there any possibility somebody could have placed a live round in it?
Why?
Were there members, and you've read about this, there were actors who were very upset over the way things were handled, they weren't getting paid in time, there were a lot of dissension on the set.
Could that have happened?
Is that within the realm of possibility that maybe somebody In the movie?
In the, whatever you want to call it?
Could they have possibly been involved in something?
Could be.
I mean, it's hard to say.
But that might be something that gives the jury what?
Which leads me to the most important point.
What am I trying to accomplish?
What am I trying to accomplish in defending anybody, in providing a defense?
I want to create a reasonable doubt.
I want them to say, you know what?
There's a documentary on right now about Phil Spector, and that's what they did.
They asked, they created a reasonable doubt.
That's all.
Whether this was suicide, whether this was negligence, whether this was what have you.
In the first case, it was a hung jury, like 10 to 2 or something.
It was a split.
Second one, it wasn't like that.
I want to create a reasonable doubt.
One person, one doubt stops the train.
It derails the train of guilt.
One doubt.
One.
He acted completely.
And by the way, in this trial, we have expert witnesses.
Experts who have been in the movies, who have stuntmen, armorers, directors who might want to be a part of this.
Not only is this commonplace, this is done all the time.
All the time.
Actors are not supposed...
Actors are supposed to be thinking about their scene, remembering their lines, trying to keep in character, and not saying, wait a minute, Holden, let me see this.
Taking apart, is this, is this?
No!
That's what the armorer does, the armorer.
And the, this is the million dollar question.
Mr. Coppola, Mr. Scorsese, in your movies, in your film, was there ever a live round anywhere?
No.
No.
Was there ever a live round?
No.
Mr. Spielberg, yes.
In Saving Private Ryan, did you have live rounds?
No.
Did you have real grenades?
No.
Did you have real howitzer shells and real mortars?
Well, we had explosives, but no.
No.
No.
Mr. Spielberg, how would you have known if there was a live round in that beach scene in Normandy and Saving Private Ryan?
I wouldn't have known.
Do you have to rely on the armorer?
Yes, I do.
In your opinion, what did Mr. Baldwin do that departed from the reasonable level of care of people in your business?
Nothing!
We do this all the time.
Stunt drivers, guns, knives, fights, pretending where people, you know, turn and...
But they keep saying, well, he said he didn't point the gun.
I would never point a gun.
You're going to have to get around that.
And the jury has to understand.
If this comes up...
This has nothing to do with this.
Are you able to handle that?
He said, I didn't pull the trigger.
Other people say he did.
FBI reports said he did.
FBI reports said somehow they knew this.
What difference does it make?
Mr. Coppola?
Yes.
Mr. Scorsese?
Mr. Spielberg?
Yes.
What happens if there was a scene where The trigger was not depressed, was not pulled.
What would that look like?
It would look fake.
Do you want them to pull?
Yes.
Mr. Eastwood, did you pull the trigger?
Repeatedly.
Look at the scene.
The one famous scene where he says, make my day.
I put it to people's heads.
Mr. De Niro, yes.
I'd like to show you the scene from Deer Hunter.
Where you're with Christopher Walken, and you're putting a gun to your head, and you're pulling the trigger of a gun next to your head.
What happened then?
We have an armorer.
He gives me the gun.
He makes sure.
Did you check this ahead of time?
No!
I'm sitting in a tiger cage.
I'm trying to remain in character.
I'm not doing this.
And after a while, the jury is going to say, Alec Baldwin absolutely complied and comported regarding the rules as to the rules of making movies.
We wouldn't do this.
I would never point a gun at anyone.
I mean, you have no idea.
This is, to me, they are radioactive.
And anybody who knows about them, always downrange.
Never take it out to show.
Never!
This is like, this is, no, no, no, no, no.
But, you're not going to get this commentary.
Why?
Because people either like him or don't like him.
I don't understand this.
I don't understand.
I want to look at this within the blinders of the law.
Criminal procedure.
Fairness.
That's all.
That's it.
Period.
End of discussion.
That's all I want people to understand.
Now, let me stop right now.
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Now, it's very difficult for you sometimes to say to yourself, you know, he deserves Due process.
Everybody does.
Everybody does.
I live in this fanciful world where I think people should be treated fairly.
I think things should be done fairly.
And when it comes to the idea of criminal sanctions, criminal, criminal, That's when I say, wait a minute.
This should be absolutely never, never, ever implemented unless it is absolutely necessary.
Unless society has benefited from the incarceration of Alec Baldwin.
Not because you like or don't like his politics.
That's not it.
And whether it's Donald Trump or Joe Biden or anybody, that's it.
We don't care who they are.
What did they do?
What is involved in this?
Why is this a crime?
Why is this...
We love to say, many of us on a regular basis, we love to say, you know, there should be a law against that.
Let me also tell you, what do people really want?
People really want civil.
They really want...
I'm not sure whether the family has been made whole.
I don't know how much money has been recouped, lawsuits, and the like.
I want to explain something very, very simple to you, which is also critical.
And this is something which is kind of, well, important.
The level of proof.
This is something which a lot of people don't really get.
It's kind of an arcane concept, but I'm going to do my best.
If you ask somebody, What did you have for breakfast today?
What?
Ask him this question.
Say, good.
Can you prove it?
Can you prove it?
Now, the lawyer would say, by what standard?
How much?
What do you mean?
Prove it by the preponderance of the evidence or reasonable doubt?
What does that mean?
Can you prove it?
No, no, no, no.
Do you want to prove it using the standard of the preponderance of the evidence?
Is it more likely that somebody sent a bagel, cream cheese, and coffee?
Okay.
Can you prove it?
Now, here's preponderance of the evidence.
Imagine, if you will, a seesaw.
And you're on it with somebody who weighs exactly the same as you do.
And it is absolutely dead even.
50-50.
In order to win a verdict, a civil verdict, the standard of proof is, is it more likely than not that negligence was proved?
51%, 50.001%, whatever.
If this thing just...
Just budges in the slightest bit towards negligence.
That's it.
That's civil.
It's easy.
People may not understand this inherently, but it's easy.
Criminal is reasonable doubt.
Oh, that's a different story.
That's like this.
So if I were to say to you, what'd you have today?
Bagel, cream cheese, and coffee.
Can you prove it?
Well, I've had that every day from my life.
Okay.
That'll do.
Really?
Yeah.
Because it's more likely than not.
That is true.
And the jury likes you.
Okay, that's it.
Criminal?
I'm not so sure.
I've got a receipt.
Ooh, that's good.
I've got witnesses.
They saw me.
Now we're talking.
There's loads of areas of proof.
Prima facie.
Probable cause.
We use these terms.
Proof evident and presumption great.
Clear and convincing.
I'm trying to think of other...
We act as though there's this palpable, tenable, actual...
Reason.
I don't know.
But whenever we would pick, whenever we try to explain to a jury about reasonable doubt as a prosecutor, I'd ask them one question.
Because we had far greater voir dire and jury selection in the old days.
Mr. Smith, do you promise me and promise the court that if you find the defendant not guilty, you'll have a reason for it?
Not like...
Well, no, you have a reason.
I find him not guilty because I didn't believe the eye of my witness, or I believe the prosecution, or I, whatever.
You have a reason.
I can't tell you what reasons matter, but that's reasonable doubt.
If you doubt, have a reason for it.
That's all it means.
And you can read the jury instructions.
Oh, my God.
A reasonable doubt is not a speculative doubt.
It's not a forced doubt.
It is a doubt you can attach a reason to.
And they're at the end of the case and they're listening to this evidence.
Can we keep notes?
No.
Why not?
Because we want you to remember.
We want your memory.
Sometimes they do, sometimes they don't.
I mean, it's just, you're sitting there and you're...
And for the most part...
Cases are not really...
This 12 angry men stuff, they go in the back.
We don't know because we've never really seen, I've never seen, I've never heard recorded, what goes on and how people deliberate.
Sometimes you can talk to jurors afterwards.
There's a rule that says you don't have to talk to anybody.
Jurors will sometimes come out afterwards to try to sell their story or whatever it is.
So we don't know.
We don't know how this thing works.
But what we do know...
You've got to make sure that before you charge people, you have to ask yourself, is this really within the purview?
Does this make sense?
Have they been charged enough?
Do we really have...
Is this the negligent stuff that we really, really want to talk about?
Is it?
Is it the real...
It's just the kind of stuff that we've got to put an end to this.
You know, drag racing.
Drag racing in the middle of the street.
You know, that's a couple.
That's like, that's the negligent homicide we want to get after.
People who are, how about people who have, normally, sometimes they're strict liability.
Liability without faults.
Explosives.
Wild animals.
That sort of stuff.
That's, that's the kind of stuff we want.
But a movie set?
Do you really think, irrespective of what you think of Alec Baldwin, do you really think That he is the kind of guy who...
I don't know what the word is.
Do you really think, seriously, that he wants to kill anybody?
No.
And the best way for things to be fixed is OSHA.
Regulation.
People are hurt all the time.
You ever hear some poor guy falls into a vat of something at a factory?
You know, he dissolves and all.
You know, terrible things happen, but life is risky and that sort of thing.
You have to look at the circumstances.
Now let me remind you of something.
And this is the most important thing I can tell you.
Please, Apply critical thinking.
Look at the facts of the case, whether it's sedition, insurrection, revolution, whether it's alleged voter tampering, whatever it is, whatever the thing is, look at the facts of the case and don't worry about who did what.
Now, every now and then, something comes up which...
Causes me a great bit of a problem.
And I'll tell you where I'm seeing this.
And that's in the Harvey Weinstein case.
This bothers me absolutely horribly.
But before, I'm going to tell you one more thing here.
Especially with the fact that right now, this is...
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And remember, I'm not pointing fingers at you.
I'm not saying anything.
If we all ate perfectly, we'd be okay.
But we don't.
And we need help.
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Because you've got a wonderful immune system and it's ready to go, but it needs help.
And I'm sorry, I'm going to say it one more time.
Not to point fingers, but we don't eat right.
Well, a lot of us don't.
Okay?
No brow beating.
Just go there.
Use the link.
Okay?
Trust me on this one.
I'm going to say one more thing about Harvey Weinstein.
I don't care whether people are guilty, bad.
It doesn't mean anything to me.
I'm looking at the system.
What Harvey Weinstein did, this is the scariest thing.
It's this prior bad acts behavior.
What does that mean?
What am I talking about?
Who am I?
Where am I?
It means this.
Can I talk about Bad stuff you've done in the past with this case.
Let's say I've got a case, but can I bring up other bad stuff?
What do you think?
You ever got into an argument with somebody and they're mad at you, and then when they realize they don't have anything on you here, they say, yeah, but you know, a year ago.
It's like, wait a minute.
Hold it.
We're not...
Huh?
You know, a year ago at the Christmas party, I'm not talking about the Christmas party, I'm talking about, no, no, but, well, you've not, that drives me crazy.
But let me give you an example of something.
Let me give you an example.
Let's say you have robbed banks in the past, and you always wear this Yankees hat, these wraparound glasses, a pink scarf, and a bowling jacket.
Three, four times you've done that in the past.
You might have been convicted.
You might not have been convicted.
People have been on robbery.
He goes, oh yeah, he does that.
That's what he does.
That's Jerry.
Yep.
Hat, wraparounds, pink scarf, bowling jacket.
That's him.
He does that.
Well, guess what?
That was years ago.
You're on trial for robbery.
And guess what you allegedly were wearing?
That's right.
Yankees hat.
Pink scarf, wrapper on glasses, bowling jacket.
Now, they don't know who you are.
And there's a lousy case.
They've got bad eyewitnesses, but there's a picture.
Somebody says, I didn't see somebody.
So I bring in these people who say, this is exactly, this is his M.O. This is what he does.
That's Jerry.
So this jury's going to say, they're not going to say, well, we've settled this.
Identity issue here.
No, they're going to say we're going to get that SOB because he's done this before and he got away with it and we're going to get him now.
Okay, I can kind of maybe sort of see that but what they did with Harvey Weinstein was they said we're going to bring everybody that he's ever been and I am not standing up for his character or anything like that.
I'm not.
But there's something wrong about him not being Tried on this case involving these facts with these victims now.
If you can't indict him or convict him on this matter, then let it go.
But to bring in other people to say, well, you know, he did one time...
No.
This has got to be revamped.
This is so dangerous.
It's not even funny.
I want to know what...
I am being charged with now.
Can you prove this case now?
Now, try explaining that to most people.
Now, let's say it's a defendant who is kind of, sort of, maybe, I don't know, not that bad compared to Ted Bundy or Phil Spector or somebody else.
If you don't like this person, what if somebody comes in and says, you know, and I don't know how the jury makeup is, and I don't know what New Mexico is in terms of their politics, or if they don't, because boy, do I have to go through, and there may be a change of venue.
We've got to do research to find out whether they don't like Alec Baldwin.
Who knows?
Who knows?
What if I'm saying, yeah, you know, Alec, he's done that before.
When we were doing the movie The Cooler, when we were doing Glengarry Glen Ross, when we were doing this, you know, he was playing Mumbly Peg, and he's real, he's real, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait.
We're not talking about that.
We're talking about this.
You as an American citizen should say, it's not Alec Baldwin, it's Alec Baldwin American.
It's you and me.
It's our system.
I know that sounds like flag waving, but what's wrong with the flag?
It's the way we do things.
And if you don't like it, those are the rules.
And sometimes the rules need to be changed.
I want due process for everybody.
Oh, and I want to get them.
There's nothing better than saying, go ahead, I got unconvicted.
Appeal it.
Knock yourself out.
Please, please appeal it.
Please.
I beg you.
I want to show the world this is how we do it.
There's nothing wrong with it.
You were found guilty because of this.
And by the way, whenever you appeal a case, my favorite line is Michigan against Tucker.
I think it was.
Anyway, the line was, the Supreme Court says, the defendant is entitled to a fair trial.
Not a perfect one.
Which gives you a tremendous berth.
So anyway, that's it.
Alec Baldwin, what you think about Alec Baldwin, his acting or his politics, fine.
Put it over there.
But as a defendant, no.
I would love this case because of the challenges.
Because it would be the chance to defend, not him, the Constitution and reasonable doubt and the notion that you've got to prove this.
And also, Do we really want to charge somebody with this?
I'm not saying this, but people are going to say, oh, this is some prosecutor trying to get a notch on her belt.
And of course, people from the days of Dewey to Rudy Giuliani, people want to be known for the prosecutor that brought down, you know, so-and-so.
Okay, my friend.
Let me also say, let me thank you for the wonderful wishes yesterday regarding Mrs. L. It was wonderful.
Did we have a wonderful day?
We had a wonderful day, and I want you right now to do me a favor.
Please follow her on Twitter this moment, because she has the most important information that is available.
Oh, and I'm doing a whole bunch of stuff on my new favorite subject.
I don't know about you.
This chat GPT, which is, oh my.
God, it's fascinating.
So please, please, please follow Mrs. L. And let me see, where else?
Oh, yes.
Yes, lindswarriors.org.
And donate and support her because she is doing, this is the most important work around and what we need to do to protect our most vulnerable.
All right?
Anything else we should say?
Am I missing something here?
Just thanking for all of those who made donations and reached out to me with birthday messages.
Yes.
Thank you for those of you who made donations, who reached out for birthday messages.
You are so, so kind.
We are a part of a family here.
And I love this intellectual discourse.
I love to discuss it.
And I love, I also love the civility that is a part of this, which is very important.
All right, my dear friends, have a great day.
We'll see you tomorrow.
Same bat time, same bat channel.
I did a very interesting piece on, David Crosby.
And that particular realm and how it's very interesting.
We're going to start to see huge, sad to say, swaths of great, great, and he was talented.
There's no doubt about that.
But talented rock individuals who, by virtue of their age, we're going to start to see them, unfortunately, pass into that concert venue in the sky.
So that's going to be something.
Have a great and glorious day.
Thank you so much for watching.
And remember, as I always end with this valedictory, the monkey's dead, the show's over, sue you.
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