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Oct. 12, 2022 - Lionel Nation
39:39
Should Right-To-Die and Physician-Assisted Suicide Be Legally Recognized?

This is one of the most critical issues to present itself to all of humanity. Pay close attention.

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*Mario*
I have been, for my entire life, fascinated by the notion of death.
It has been something that I think is...
Metaphysical.
It is surreal.
It is something that I have always, always been so interested in.
Especially when we can find, when I find people who thoroughly enjoy to appreciate the issues and who don't immediately answer the issues.
Social media.
Are not the place for that, unfortunately.
What I like to do is to remind our good friends, remind people that there are places and there are times when being able to exchange ideas is critical.
The subject today is should right to die and physician-assisted suicide be legally recognized?
And I cite...
A lot of the very interesting issue out of the Netherlands will also provide you with some legal perspective.
There's a very interesting case in the state of New Jersey, one of eight or nine.
They have the Medical Assisted...
It is called the Medical Assisted...
Excuse me, Medical Aid in Dying, M-A-I-D.
And the Medical Aid in Dying for the Terminally Ill Act, which was written into law.
And it basically works like this.
If two physicians say that you are terminally ill, and you will most probably expire within six months, and it is incurable, two doctors, two physicians, two physicians,
Two examples of you, the individual, going and petitioning them individually at least 15 days apart, orally and in writing, or as best as you can, then they can make the decision and agree that you, the Terminaleo, will be given a potion, solution, whatever you want to call it, an elixir, a suspension.
Which will put you basically into a coma and cause your heart and your breathing to stop.
It's done at your control, at your behest, under your terms.
The physicians who agree to this, in New Jersey at least, and the pharmacists are off the hook.
They are immune from any kind of...
Prosecution, once they've done their job, that's it.
They provide it.
We're done.
It's up to you.
It's supposed to be done.
It's supposed to be administered by the individual.
However, sometimes, in the cases of some neuromuscular diseases and the like, it is most probably done with the assistance of a family member.
And we can quibble whether they're assisting Whether they're carrying out the wishes of the individual, who knows?
But this is a fascinating subject.
Should the medical community be involved in this?
At first, do no harm.
Hippocratic oath.
Do no harm.
Is this harm?
Are you doing harm when you are not killing?
But you are accelerating the inevitable.
Or are you killing?
There's a religious...
And by the way, all of these positions are not at all demented.
They are all logically sound.
It depends upon how you react to them and your particular morality and what you consider to be the case.
Is it their job?
I can see a physician saying, I don't do this.
I don't do this.
Okay.
I can see religious folks saying, you are given life by whomever, the Creator, and you can do nothing to end it.
But I would like to interpose the following objection and suggest to you that again, I refer to it as accelerating The inevitable.
And provided that you've gone through enough care and taken enough safeguards, because the potential for this is incredibly fascinating.
For example, what happens if you have an unscrupulous family?
What if you have family members who are themselves going to be the beneficiaries upon your death?
What if that were to happen?
What if That would happen.
How do we ferret that out?
How do we allow this law to be implemented, to be carried out, and at the same time, simultaneously prevent unscrupulous Interlopers, so to speak, from going in.
And also, how do we prevent somebody who is not depressed?
Now, here's the thing.
The critical factor is whether they are depressed or not.
Whether the family members are going to benefit from this.
The criterion...
That must be reviewed is whether the person has six months to live.
If it's a terminal disease with six months, it doesn't matter.
They can be depressed.
Of course they're depressed.
They have six months to live.
So we're not talking about somebody, we'll get to this later, but for this, you know, medical aid in dying, that's one thing.
That's one consideration.
Six months.
Terminal.
Two doctors.
Two applications made.
Okay.
Now when you ask people, it's interesting, when you ask somebody, they will normally look at it from this perspective.
What about you?
What about you?
How would you feel?
Normally, that changes the calculus of this.
Many people will say, well, I wouldn't want that.
Why is it different from what you want versus what somebody else would want?
Why?
Because it's much easier to be far more stoic and careful when it's someone else than it is with you.
And that's just a fact.
That's just a fact.
A fact of life or what have you.
Period.
Now, We are talking more about death and killing.
And whether it's killing, whether it's the death penalty, whether it's war, whether it's Roe, whether it's right to life, reproductive rights, terminal illness, we talk more.
We have more subjects that are in the news involving death.
Death that is either premature, Unnecessary, one would say.
Or accelerated.
And I love, I wish I could do a, I wish we could have a real, just an excellent kind of a Fred-friendly discussion with clergy folks, medical professionals, family members, people who themselves saw this.
Have you ever seen Day in the Life?
Day in the Life is used.
Lawyers, trial lawyers have used this in trying to assess, trying to explain to a jury damages.
When somebody's been involved in an accident.
By the way, we saw an accident yesterday that if it wasn't fatal, I've got to check on that.
If it wasn't fatal, I would be very surprised.
But, when you explain to a jury, this person is going to live X amount of years, the amount of care that's going to be required is X amount, this is the cost of living, these are all these factors, and then you get into pain and suffering, and what the particular physical and emotional toll of this disease, or what this injury is, these damages.
So you bring in, you have a film crew.
It's called The Day in the Life.
And you show the jury.
This is what they go through.
This is what, from the moment they wake up to the time they go to bed.
This is what going to the bathroom is.
This is what eating is like.
This is what putting clothes on is like.
This is trying to play with children, hold children, watch TV, enjoy their life.
And there's nothing That gets the point across.
You don't realize what you do every single day that you just take for granted because it's just there.
You don't realize it.
So when you also look at what happens when somebody is in the last throes of life, the last throes that are indeed With no chance of recovery, no chance of anything, no chance of cure, no chance of this.
It's not going to happen.
When you see this, it is something which is one of the most compelling things you can ever imagine seeing.
And there's no way around it.
There's no way to explain to somebody unless you just see it.
And it's an issue that is beyond fascinating.
Let me stop right there for just one second.
Because now we're going to get into the non-lethal.
The non-deadly.
The non-life-threatening diseases.
The non.
It's a different story altogether and completely.
It's a different story altogether.
Completely.
And that's the one that really requires our ability to really focus on the issues.
And to wait and to hear and to just sort of think, you know what, this might be a good idea for us to just kind of wait through this one.
Okay?
Just wait through this one.
Because I'm telling you, I'm telling you right now, it's something that I've thought about and continue to think about and I'll tell you what's happened as of late.
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Now, let's talk about something else.
Recently, I don't want to go too, too much into detail, because I just don't want to say too much, but there are people that we have, we are aware of a couple of situations, friends of ours, in the recent past.
One who availed themselves of this ability to accelerate the inevitable, as I call it.
Completely legally.
And it was something that family recognized and suggested was almost liberating.
It was controlling.
It was a beautiful event.
It was done at the behest and with the knowledge and the consent of the very ill person.
And it was done in a way that was so beautiful.
That it just, it's something that I absolutely, 100% believe in as a viable option.
Not for everybody.
Not for all conditions.
Not for all people.
Absolutely not.
Now let's talk about the following.
Now the following situation is a little bit different.
Now there were other countries, and I cited this one.
This is the Dutch, it's a very interesting U.S. news article.
And I request and suggest that you go and you do some research on your own, find out what's going on here.
But what happens if somebody is not terminally ill?
What if somebody says, I'm not terminally ill.
Maybe I have cancer, maybe I have a disease.
But I'm not terminally ill.
I can't say when I'm going to die in six months or a year.
I'm not even sure.
It's a chronic disease.
You heard recently there were some people, very famous folks who went.
And I'm not passing any judgment, but I'm asking this question.
And if you've got the money, you can go to different countries and you can say, listen, I just don't want to.
And I do not know, and I am not expert enough in knowing what kind of a review process they have.
But this is where I say, let's talk about this one.
What if somebody is depressed?
What if somebody is mentally ill?
What if somebody is mentally ill because of a chronic disease?
What if somebody is mentally ill but not dispossessed of their sense of reality?
They're depressed by virtue of, let's say, a disease.
And the disease could be the depression.
There is no lethal disease.
They are not going to die physically, somatically from this disorder.
Let's assume that.
What about then?
As you know, life is about balancing things.
And this is where the alarm bells go off and I say, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, wait, wait, wait, wait, hold it, hold it.
Let's talk about this one.
The two situations, let's review.
Situation number one.
Terminally ill.
Two doctors.
Yes.
You have ALS.
You have some rare form of liver cancer, brain cancer.
You have a glioblastoma.
Whatever it is.
I'm not a physician.
Let's just assume.
Six months maximum.
Two different doctors, 15 days apart.
And you are given this Potion, this serum, this suspension, this solution, in which you take it and you terminate your life.
That's one thing.
Dr. Kevorkian years ago had a device where he would ask people and videotape people who suffered from a variety of different events, different things, and he would run the IV.
But gave them this button to push.
They pushed the button.
Just like the pharmacist or the chemist makes the potion, makes the solution, makes this particular solution that is used to drink, which will cause coma, a suspension of respiration, and death.
It's almost like the cocktail that is used for the death penalty, but not...
At least theoretically similar.
Kevorkian was a different person.
Kevorkian, in my humble opinion, became more about Kevorkian than anything else.
He would do artwork and it would tend to be a tad ghoulish and I do not think he was the best example.
Though, I appreciate what he was saying at the time.
It was a different way of doing it.
It's one thing to say, I'm going to champion the rights of people, and then you can become more, and I'm not necessarily saying this is about him, but you can become more interested in you being the champion of patient rights and letting that get in the way of the actual event itself.
But we've had one particular friend we haven't seen, all of a sudden we look at it.
Our friend is gone.
Went to a different country and we don't know enough about the facts.
I don't want to say it's none of our business, but it's none of our business.
And that one bothered us more than we could ever imagine.
Have you ever had somebody in your life that you knew who died?
You didn't know them that well, but sometimes their death can have more of an impact on you than somebody else.
This one had that effect on us.
This friend was tortured throughout this person's life.
It was sad.
Now remember, 99% of all people who are perhaps similarly Tortured, to use that term, don't commit suicide.
Don't ask for it.
Don't want it.
Because there is something that is in you, this life force that motivates you, that keeps you going.
You look at people who have been in the worst situations, have been in prisoner of war camps, in death camps, people where there was seemingly no chance whatsoever of escape.
Of salvation?
Nothing.
And there were ways in which people could have terminated their own life.
It happened, but didn't happen as much as some people thought.
Because there was this thing, this life force, this thing that gets you up in the morning, that makes you go.
Is there anyone listening, I know for a fact, who has suffered from depression?
Clinical, actual, paralyzing, soul-killing depression.
Not being down.
And recently, oh, I love this.
People are saying, doctors have just figured out there's no such thing as depression.
It doesn't exist.
It doesn't exist.
And again, I'm no expert in this, but I'm thinking, you know, in some cases I would not be surprised if some people have been, in fact, perhaps incorrectly and rather precipitously and gratuitously and celeritously diagnosed with depression when, in fact, they didn't have it.
But then there are other people who I believe most probably had it in ways that just destroyed their lives.
Because when it comes to mental illness, and this is what I was saying the other day regarding Kanye West and others, we still look at it as being medieval.
And this is the worst part also.
People do not do well when you have to do this.
When you have to balance.
Yes, but.
Yes, no.
Yes, but.
Life, yes, but.
Well, yes.
I used to, in legal matters, if you look at probate, if you look at wills and things like that, you know there are DNR codes to not resuscitate, there is healthcare proxies, there's all these things that people can have, which are very important, very critical.
And one of them was interesting, where people could say, well, you can deny, Food.
You can refuse food.
You can say, do not use extraordinary measures.
You can withhold food.
And I'm thinking to myself, what are we talking about here?
What are we really talking about?
What we're talking about is people using these terms as though they're qualitatively different.
If you could say, well, I'm not having you accelerate.
Death.
But in the case of a, I don't want to use extraordinary means, you know, do not resuscitate, do not do this, do not do that.
And withholding food and water, I'm thinking to myself, this is death no matter what.
By the way, sometimes these DNR codes, when you have a frail person, somebody who's old, they couldn't take chest compressions.
And what bothers people is that we get to the bottom line of simply this.
We are this living, breathing machine.
And there comes the point, most of us, in our own loss.
Our sense of loss.
Whether it's a pet, and anybody who dismisses a pet death, pet putting to sleep, this friend of the family, this dog, usually, can be cats as well, can be others, but...
That kept you alive?
That was there for you through all your years?
Probably the greatest human being, to use the term.
That's the most, that's beyond horrible.
And when I hear people say, I held the dog, I say, I don't know if you should do that.
I don't know.
I'm no expert on this.
But this subject matter, no matter what it is, I don't care how.
Sometimes, it's even harder.
For a pet, because you can at least intellectualize in some cases.
The more we as humans emote, the more that we produce, the more that we say, the more that is turned off in the event of terminal illness.
We can say, well, look at grandma or grandpa.
He's not talking anymore.
He's not making eye contact.
Remember how he used to enjoy life?
He can't walk.
He can't play golf.
He can't do this.
And we're able to quantify that which is missing.
By virtue of the disease.
Whereas with a dog, or with a pet, they could say more to us with their eyes than anything else.
You can look at them and you can see more.
It's the greatest, not irony, but it's a paradox.
They can say more to you with eyes.
And people who say, well, you know, dogs really don't have expressions.
They don't?
Well, dogs don't have trigeminal nerves.
Dogs don't have the same facial muscles and they can't smile.
They can't smile, but you can't see emotion in a dog.
Sometimes you see it more.
Sometimes you see it even more.
Sometimes you can see it more expressed.
And as more and more of our fellow humans become emotionally flatlined, you're going to see it even more from dogs.
So we come down to simply this.
In my humble opinion, if I'm the judge, yes, I think this medical-assisted death, physician-assisted suicide, medical aid in dying, whatever you want to call it, for terminally ill, verified as such, witnessed by family members.
Again, terminally ill.
Because remember, That changes the matrix of this completely.
Terminally ill.
Because remember, always think of some unscrupulous person coming along.
That's one thing.
I don't want to say I've got no problem with that, but I can at least intellectually explain it.
I understand it.
And you don't have to have it.
You don't have to have it.
You don't have to do it.
You as a physician don't have to be part of it.
You are certainly entitled to your religious beliefs.
Absolutely.
In fact, that is a critical aspect of this.
Religion is something that cannot be put into words, cannot be explained to someone who either does not share the religion, is not of faith, or is not of faith at that level.
So there's a lot of consideration there.
But that's this situation.
Terminally ill, Number one consideration.
Now, non-terminally ill.
What about someone who is a minor?
Can minors?
Can a minor?
A minor says, I don't want to live anymore.
And keep in mind this.
You can say, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait.
Now, let's think about, What minors are allowed to do medically, surgically, emotionally, what they themselves can consent to, that's over here.
That's another consideration to make this even more fascinating.
But kids today in particular suffer and feel and seem to be, in my humble opinion, they enjoy a sentience, they enjoy this This sensitivity to what's going on to bullying, to online misbehavior, to mocking, derision.
Teen suicide is through the roof.
There is something very, very wrong here.
We've got to get to the bottom.
We've got to figure out what's going on.
Now this is not the story.
So, you're going to have to...
So this is in category two.
Is it adults only?
Will minors be able to?
What if parents consent?
What if a court intercedes?
What if a court intercedes and says, you know what, based upon the totality of the circumstances, we view this as almost a quasi-medical procedure.
You've heard cases before where parents, by virtue of a religious belief, do not believe in surgery or the application of certain medical procedures.
And they have refused.
On behalf of, not in loco parentis, in parentis, as parents, they have refused consenting to certain treatment and the like.
And a guardian ad litem is appointed, a court-appointed guardian.
You go to the court, the court then overrides, overrules.
The parent says, no, your child has type 1 diabetes, adult childhood diabetes, and without insulin, whatever, we're going to overrule you.
Your parental autonomy, your primacy, whatever you want to call it, we're going to overrule it.
Okay?
You heard about that.
What happens next if a court says, we're not going to expand our rights and look not necessarily in terms of medical, but what is best psychiatrically?
Emotionally.
And we believe that based upon the totality of the circumstances, within a reasonable degree of medical certainty, using all of the buzzwords, we as a court believe that this is a case.
Remember Terri Schiavo.
Terri Schiavo.
That, you know, right to die.
She was in a vegetative state.
And that was the most fascinating because I was on the air.
And I was reading the statute in Florida and saying, this is not what you think.
You cannot come and say, hey, I'll take her.
People thought that there was this statutory list of people who were involved.
And people thought Terry Schiavo was like an abandoned person.
You could say, well, you know, I'll assume responsibility.
It didn't work that way.
But nobody wanted to hear because the emotions were so great.
And the religion.
And the people who very vehemently, very, very forcefully, very, very understandably thought this was incredible.
So life and death today is in so many arenas.
And it requires an absolute, careful, deliberate, thoughtful, first exploration of the issues, the sequestering of various...
Cases into different conditions.
Because it's not a one-size-fits-all thing.
And also, listening to people.
And listening to what they say.
And taking it into account.
And weighing.
Because there's no...
This is why I love the subject.
There's no answer.
There's no clear-cut answer.
It's listening to what somebody says.
Your objection is outweighed by this other person, this other faction's objection.
Or vice versa.
Which is the ultimate and the most exciting and the most intellectually not pleasing but gratifying to really hash through.
And I wish social media would allow more of that.
I wish we had more rational, thoughtful times like Fred Friendly used to have.
Alright.
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One more word on this death and the notion of after because of the finality of this.
Probate's a very interesting area of law.
It's the only area of law that kicks in once you kick off, or once you kick.
Everything else, the causes of action do not survive the death.
Libel, things, it's over.
You know, he's dead.
Alright, that's it.
That's done.
Probate's the opposite.
You can't do anything until someone dies.
Title insurance, by the way, is the opposite.
It's an insurance that deals with things that had happened before that we weren't even aware of now.
Which is kind of interesting.
Do yourself a favor.
Spend your time talking to your loved ones, your friends, your family, your clergy.
Read about this.
Ask yourself.
And what's even more important is there's something so interesting in terms of just exploring all of these particular areas.
I find it, without a doubt, some of the most interesting things you can imagine.
Alright.
Now, today is what?
Day of the Woman?
International Day of the Girl.
So, we must promote girls.
And I want you to watch something right now.
This is Mrs. L's piece.
This is her YouTube tutorial that is so good on Monster High.
Are you familiar with this?
Have you seen this?
Are you familiar?
She is...
It's been around, but there are implications of this which we want you to be aware of.
Monster High.
If you are a parent, a grandparent, a caregiver, watch this and think about this.
And again, it seems, hmm...
Yes!
Do you notice, have you noticed that Halloween seems to be exceptionally ghoulish this year?
We love to drive around and we're seeing more and more death and it's always been that.
Funerals, not funerals, cemeteries and death and skeletons.
They used to have jack-o'-lanterns and scarecrows and cornstalks and maybe even a little ghost.
But now, have you noticed, it seems to be very morbid.
In any event, follow that.
Follow Mrs. L at LinzWarriors on YouTube.
And on Twitter, Linz underscore Warriors.
Follow me on Twitter also at Lionel Media.
Please.
I put it before I sign up for my newsletter.
There's one coming out later.
And it is a beaut, a veritable potpourri, a pastiche, a myriad of mosaic, and a mousse-bouche of little thought morsels for you to masticate and consume.
And to assimilate in the light.
Alright, my friends.
Have a great and glorious day.
Thank you so much for being with us.
Keep thinking.
Question everything.
See you tomorrow at St. Bat Time, St. Bat Channel at 9 a.m.
Until then, the monkey's dead.
The show's over.
Sue ya.
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