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Aug. 21, 2023 - The Podcast of the Lotus Eaters
01:31:16
The Podcast of the Lotus Eaters #723
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Hello and welcome to the podcast of the Lotus Eaters episode 700 and...
Which one is it?
23!
23!
Thank you very much.
And I'm your host, Harry, joined today by Carl.
Hello!
And we're going to be talking about how our civilization hurts children, how communism is captured, and we'll be answering the question, should we flee England?
Because sadly, this is a question that doesn't want to go away.
It keeps coming up and it's like, okay, well then we'll discuss it, shall we?
Neil Ferguson has similarly become Hitchens.
No, no, it wasn't Neil Ferguson.
It was a guy who was just referencing a Neil Ferguson quote, so we'll get to it.
Okay, we'll mention this a little bit further on as well, but if you check the description of this podcast right now, there is a premium survey that you can fill in if you'd like to give us some feedback about what we're doing, but we'll mention a bit further on as well.
So with that, should we just get on with it?
Yeah!
So I think it's become apparent that our civilization is actually bad for our children.
It's actually making them more depressed.
It's making them suicidal.
It's turning them into the kind of people I don't think we would have wanted to be if we were growing up in their place at this time.
And I think that's actually something that's really worth discussing and we should really be thinking about.
So, before we begin, if you're going to criticize, you've got to provide a constructive alternative.
Call it selling out your principles?
I call it fucking winning.
I pressed the wrong thing.
That was the wrong button.
What's going on?
I'll do it, don't worry.
Thank you.
So yeah, go and watch our Symposium on Nicomachean Ethics because that is, of course, a very, very good alternative to whatever ethical system that the left is recommending at the moment.
So anyway, does this work now?
Let me see if this works.
There we go, right.
So I found this article the other day and it started me going down a bit of a rabbit hole because just what's in it is actually kind of crazy.
And I say this as a father of children of about the age that this uh article is dealing with so they say three uh groups of influential groups of pediatricians and emergency medical providers are pleading for more support and resources as the number of children and teenagers with mental health concerns overwhelm emergency departments nationwide that's mad isn't it that's not good and this is in america Yeah, but we'll get to it.
I'm sure it's not much better in England either.
Yeah, right.
So, America is having a nationwide mental health crisis for children.
We are too, but I'll get to that in a minute, right?
So, the lead author of the joint policy statement from the American Academy of Pediatrics, the American College of Emergency Physicians, and the Emergency Nurses Association released a statement calling for local communities to have increased access to mental health services before emergency care is needed.
It's like, okay, that's interesting, but that kind of seems to be putting the cart before the horse, right?
It's like, look, we need extra care services.
Okay, but why do you need extra care services?
Let's go a bit upriver and see where the source of the poison is.
They say every year in America, approximately half a million children with mental or behavioral health conditions are evaluated in emergency departments.
And that number is, of course, increasing and not decreasing.
Mental.
It's a huge number.
One doctor who is deeply involved with this said that the emergency care in her ER for mental health has grown from approximately 30 a month to 30 a day.
So she says the volume is astronomical.
I don't know that people fully understand how many people are struggling.
Jenkins said that children as young as six are coming in, often talking about suicide.
Six years old?
Well, there's something interesting here, which is that a six-year-old does not naturally come up with the idea of suicide by themselves.
No, you think not.
Who is giving them these ideas?
Is it the parents?
Is it the environment around them?
Are they being exposed to media, which is obviously far too mature for their brains, the maturity that they have?
What's going on?
I mean, I'm surprised that a six-year-old even knows the word suicide.
Yeah, six-year-olds shouldn't be introduced to that kind of language.
But it's not even that.
I mean, OK, fine.
Having knowledge of the concept, fine.
Why do they feel this is the case?
And they said, you know, the crisis is only getting worse.
It's not getting better.
One study in February for the CDC found an unprecedented level of hopelessness and suicidal thoughts among the nation's youth.
The bulk of these children are coming in with depression, anxiety and trauma.
This is mad.
This is a nationwide failing.
To provide a proper and wholesome environmental structure in the country itself.
The whole thing.
The way that it's configured seems to be for adults and not for children.
Well, that's part of it.
I would say there are two things I want to know.
Well, one thing I want to know and one comment I'm going to make about this.
The comment is just that we are in a world that is promoting paradoxical morals right now.
Where children and young immature people are being placed in a position where they're expected to be able to have a full comprehensive understanding of the world around them and themselves.
We're putting increasingly more serious and life-changing decisions into the hands and autonomy of children who, as we know, do not know anything well enough to be able to make those decisions.
Whilst at the same time, we're encouraging adults, young adults in particular, to engage in a very childish, arrested development attitude of behavior where they become the eternal teenage boy.
Yeah, and extended adolescence.
Yeah, the extended adolescence where they're just becoming a Marvel soy boy collecting their Funko Pops on the walls all day, every day, cooming over all sorts of childish nonsense.
So we've got the paradox there of the way that that's been inverted.
We're expecting children to be adults, adults to be children.
The second thing, I want to know, how old are the parents of these children?
Because we're talking about young children, so if we're talking about six years old, chances are these parents are all very young.
And we know that children copy their parents, that children copy the behavior of the adults around them.
Is it that we have a new generation of millennial or maybe even very old Gen Z parents who already come in with a nihilistic material worldview, that already come in with neuroticism and anxiety, and that's all they talk about?
And their children are seeing that and copying them.
Because their parents appear hopeless, the children just naturally assume, I guess everything's hopeless.
Not to say there's not problems in the real world, but when we're talking about kids this young, it's not like children can really comprehend the managerial state and socioeconomic issues and all sorts of things.
Where are you getting it from?
Well, they don't tell us how old the parents are.
There's no doubt that the children are exposed to, at the very least, some apocalyptic doom-mongering about the climate.
Oh yeah.
And this, I think, is not helpful to anyone.
It is probably something to do with the teachers as well.
No doubt.
Um, but anyway, the, uh, the, the group has a series of joint policies that are just, oh, we need extra resources to deal with mental health and say, okay, actually, no, we need to go upriver and find out why the problem is happening and actually change something foundational about this.
Uh, because they're looking at this totally the wrong way around.
And of course we still, we have exactly the same problem in England.
Uh, in England we have, uh, well, 466,250 open referrals to children and young people's mental health services that are active in May this year.
So, massive mental health crisis in England as well.
Christ.
So this is not in any way confined just to America, unfortunately.
What's the solution they're giving to these kids as well?
Especially if it'll probably include, mostly I imagine it'll be young girls, but increasingly it'll be young boys as well, who are feeling hopeless in the world around them.
Yeah.
What are the solutions that these young boys will be given?
They'll be given feminine solutions.
Oh, go to therapy.
We'll get to all of this.
So some of the common problems these children suffer from are anxiety disorders, where they have persistent fears or worries that they find it hard to participate in normal social activities they should be engaging in.
ADHD, which again, we're going to come back to all of these in a minute, where of course children experience inattention, hyperactivity and impulsivity, eating disorders, depression and bipolar disorder and PTSD.
PTSD?
Yeah.
Which it's not, you know, if a child has been traumatized, they can have PTSD.
Well, no, of course, but it's shocking and terrible that these children should be traumatized in the first place.
Well, one thing that is traumatizing is the lockdowns.
There you go.
Let's have a look at some of the reasons why we may have a generation of children that are just literally traumatized by the environment, the civilization that's supposed to take care of them, right?
So we know that the lockdowns are massively damaging to children.
This is definitely one reason.
I mean, this is just crazy, right?
Obviously, we know that the educational development of these children has been massively impacted, but it's also the social development of these children.
And so they are feeling essentially stressed with a remarkable amount of pressure put on them because they can't live a normal life.
They can't blow off steam as kids need to do or couldn't during the lockdowns.
And we're going to be reaping the fruits of this And people are already getting more and more anti-social anyway because they can just disappear into video games and social media and this is going to make it even worse.
Yeah and this I mean there's loads loads of this study has been done.
I mean this this one from just a mental health foundation charity did a study and found direct impacts on children and young people's mental health and well-being were really bad actually.
Essentially, studies increased levels of distress, worry, and anxiety, and increased likelihood of PTSD symptoms in quarantined children.
Increased feelings of loneliness and worries about school in the future.
Brilliant.
So, essentially, if the government is locked us all down for a disease as undramatic as COVID, shall we say, who knows what's going to happen in the future, etc, etc.
But another thing is divorce.
Divorce is really, really bad for children's mental health.
And of course, as we see, I think it's like 50% of marriages end in divorce and something around half of children are in single parent households in Britain now.
And of course, this is way worse in different communities.
I saw some figures this morning.
I don't know where they were exactly from that was pertaining to this.
So I think 50 out of every 100 marriages, so 50% is actually Not on the high side of these rates in some places.
I think the highest one that I saw was something absolutely ridiculous.
I think it was Portugal, was per 100 marriages, 91 of them ended in divorce.
And I was thinking about it yesterday.
I was actually discussing this with my fiancee, how when I was growing up and going through school, most of the people that I knew who were my contemporaries in school, most of them also came from parents who had divorced.
Right, that's interesting, because when I was... It was very shocking.
It was the opposite.
I mean, I... I was probably, I would say, on the... one of the exceptions, having parents who stuck together.
Yeah, when I was in school, I mean, almost everyone's parents were married.
I mean, it wasn't something that came up, really.
I can't think of any of my friends, like my good friends, whose parents were divorced.
Marriage has just become something that you can take on because it makes you feel good at the moment and then the second it becomes inconvenient to you, it doesn't matter if you've got kids or not, I guess we can just leave because it's not that most of these relationships are breaking down because of physical abuse or anything that would actually be excusable as far as I'm concerned.
Well, a good reason for the marriage to... A good reason.
It's just, oh, I just don't feel it anymore.
Yeah.
I'm just not feeling that same spark.
Well, you're never going to feel that same spark for 60 plus years.
Yeah.
Yeah, and I've got to say, I do think this is a thing that a lot of young women are failing to understand, is that the excitement of the initial romance needs to sublimate into affection and a long-standing, deep-seated love for the other person.
But anyway...
Divorce obviously hurts children, right?
So research on this is voluminous, and it's documented that parental divorce separation is associated with an increased risk of child adjustment problems, including academic difficulties, disruptive behaviors, and depressed moods.
Offspring of divorced parents are more likely to engage in risky sexual behavior, live in poverty, and experience their own family instability, and this is a massively increased risk factor.
So, I mean, again, there's nothing controversial about me saying this.
This is incredibly well documented.
And as we've talked about before, Facebook and Instagram, particularly Instagram for teenage girls, this is not good for them.
Two thirds, sorry, 32% of teenage girls said Instagram made them feel worse about their bodies when they already felt bad about their bodies.
And Facebook is well aware of this.
From their own internal research once they had like a presentation and one slide said we make body issues, body image issues worse for one in three teen girls.
Teens blame Instagram for increasing increases in the rates of anxiety and depression.
This reaction was unprompted and consistent across all groups.
So what have they done?
Did they pop the champagne cork when they said, oh, we're giving young girls eating disorders?
Mission accomplished, boys!
Well, they're not stopping using Instagram, are they?
Well, yeah.
As far as I can tell, Instagram isn't doing anything to prevent that.
Yeah.
And the next thing is the feminization of education for young boys.
This is again something that is just there's so much research on this out there if you want to go and watch it.
But I'm just going to read a couple of quotes from this particular article.
The feminization of education is thought to give girls more of an advantage over boys and this is one of one reason is the workforce's general structure organization and construction are female biased.
Since there are significantly more women teachers, especially in the formative years of children's education, there are more female role models that young girls can look to.
Girls may be more likely to listen to and seek advice from female teachers than boys.
Teachers' interactions with their students may also give girls more of an advantage.
Women teachers generally hold higher expectation for girls' abilities and lower expectation of boys' abilities.
Therefore, these teachers may be less concerned if the boys fall behind while the girls may be encouraged to raise their standards.
So half of the children in the school system are essentially being taught by people who have an unconscious bias against them.
It's not the fault.
It's not the female teachers are being malevolent.
You know, I'm sure they're doing their best.
It's that these are things that they just can't really help because they just don't understand the other half of the class.
I mean it's interesting because I learned a bit about this when I was in college.
We were doing an English language class and for some reason I don't remember what the subject was but we were talking about differences in educational attainment between men and women and why boys seem to Rebel more than girls do.
And this was one of the theories proposed in that class.
And at the time I was like, I don't know how serious that sounds or if that sounds like it's a legit thing that's going on.
But no, with experience and looking into the matter since then, no, it's absolutely true.
Especially going into university where overwhelmingly it is for girls, seemingly.
They're the ones going in, they're the ones attending.
They're the ones getting the qualifications and ending up in other media careers and such things, influencing the culture for other girls.
By the time it gets to university, I think the damage has been done, basically.
So, a unisex university I don't think is a big deal.
But I do think in the early stages of their education, actually, it should have sex segregation.
And boys should be taught by men, girls should be taught by women.
Because of the, as I say, like the inability to essentially understand or empathize with or have knowledge of the problem and the fact that girls are more willing to go to women and boys are more willing to go to men.
Why not?
I think you've been through their stage in life.
I say this only half ironically, half sarcastically.
I believe boys should primarily get taught the basics in English, math, science, et cetera, and then mainly taught to plaster and do all the manual labor.
Because their parents aren't doing it.
I mean, if anyone shows any particular academic skill, then give them a different curriculum, right?
Like, you know, if you've got some kid with 130 IQ or something, don't make him do plastering.
He might be a really good plasterer.
Sure, but he probably doesn't want to do it.
He probably wants to do something else.
But for the average person, yeah, that's a much better solution.
But anyway, right, so the consequence of feminized education, as they say in here, the boys are, of course, more likely to drop out of school, they fail to complete the degrees, and they behave more violently.
The number of boys enrolling in colleges and universities has decreased.
Boys are unenthusiastic about the work itself, don't do their homework, don't study for lessons, and receive poorer grades.
Boys disengage from school because they view it as feminine.
They view education as a feminine thing.
It never used to be.
Education, of course, used to be a very masculine thing.
Schools may be too feminized and imposing feminine qualities that the male students cannot relate to.
Again, if it was an all-boys school with male teachers, that would not be the case, and it would be competitive, it would be well-structured, it would be something they could actually find, they could relate to and find sort of a purpose and a path in, right, to go forward.
But if you've got a different environment that's essentially not designed for you, then no wonder you're looking at this going, well, I shouldn't even be here, right?
And of course, they say a lack of real male teachers acting as role models is also believed to create problems for boys regarding motivation, discipline and social interaction.
So there are severe and concrete negative consequences for boys.
And then we get to the final thing, which is a bit more vague, but it's, and I'm representing it in this gender neutral parenting, but it's not really gender neutral parenting that I want to talk about with this, right?
This is just one aspect, one outgrowth of the problem that I think our civilization faces, which is this obsessive devotion to the concept of personal individual freedom, as in freedom from everything, right?
The desire, the drive to become the atomized unisex year zero self-made individual.
the thing that doesn't exist basically right there is no atomized unisex self-made individual you are in fact a person who is who has a gender as a sex who has a history who has network of connections you're born in a particular time and place to a particular culture you come with a lot of cultural baggage and our civilization is trying to sure shear off this cultural baggage so you can be some sort of like perfect self-created individual
I think that's actually really bad for children themselves, because children, and I say this with fore, so I have some experience in this regard, children actually aren't really that concerned about freedom.
because they aren't free, obviously.
They've never been free.
A baby is not free.
A toddler is not free.
In fact, you spend a lot of your time making your toddler as unfree as you possibly can because they will ruin everything around them, especially if they're a boy.
What they want is predictability, right?
That's the thing that makes a child happy and secure and healthy mentally is predictability to know that if they take action X, then they get result Y, you know, and in every realm.
And so say, look, you've got unlimited freedom.
You come into like, I can't remember what it's called, like the choice paradox or something.
If you present people with more than seven choices or something like that, they don't choose anything.
I think that's option paralysis.
That's it.
Option paralysis, right?
And this is the same.
I think that this gender neutral parenting is kind of an outgrowth of this.
Oh, we want them to choose their own gender.
Why?
That's a choice they don't get to make.
You know, they're born with a sex and a sex comes attached to a gender.
And so what you want is for that person to successfully and competently move into the gender role that nature has ascribed to them.
You don't get to choose these things.
That's nonsense.
You know, and what you're doing there is setting them up for failure.
Because of course they're going to go out into the world as an adult and realize, oh no, everyone else is gendered.
Now I can't form a human relationship because everyone has expectations embedded in them about the opposite gender.
And so if I'm not acting like a man or if you're a female and you're not acting like a woman, why would the person of the opposite sex find you attractive?
They're not going to look at you and be like, okay, well, she looks like she's going to be a good wife and mother.
She looks like she's going to be, you know, If this person doesn't display any of the attributes that are expected, and you know, as a male, he doesn't look like a good man, he's not gonna be a good provider, he's not gonna protect me, he's not gonna make me feel safe.
Okay, well if you can't do that, you're not gonna get a wife!
It's just the way that these things work.
And so, I think that underpinning all of this, We've got essentially, this is the consequence of liberalism being applied in a full spectrum to our society, right?
The idea that we are individual unisex atom, atomistic organisms is just not true.
And as we move into this paradigm, it's doing damage to our children.
Whereas in a sort of more traditional sense, actually children had expected life paths that, and There'll be someone who objects that, look, well, this is very oppressive, cloying, sort of weighing you down with these things.
In a way, yes, right?
But also, it is not nearly as bad as you're saying.
There are choices that children have to make.
They're not just the foundational choices about their own existence they have to make.
Because a six-year-old should be choosing the kind of clothes that they would like to wear or Like, you know, do I want to wear a t-shirt or a shirt or something, right?
Or the kind of toys they want for Christmas, right?
They shouldn't be choosing between life and non-life and that's too much of a foundational choice.
Well, when you talk about the fact that kids need boundaries, obviously they need boundaries.
I don't even necessarily know that if I would say it's liberalism specifically Well I think this is liberalism.
Partially, but I think that what's happened is we have a generation of people who grew up consuming media and consuming narratives that told them that to be cool and to be themselves and to be free was to rebel against some form of order that came before them.
And so extending into the eternal adolescent that we mentioned earlier, these people orientate their entire lives around this idea that to be themselves is to rebel against what their parents would have wanted for them.
And when you extend that out into a society-wide culture, then you just get pure chaos.
Yeah, but it's not that.
Because, I mean, the problem is now there isn't that kind of traditional order that was set for them.
Because the boundaries are a way of providing with structure.
It includes things and excludes things, and then provides them with a direction with which to travel.
But these days, it's just, well, go to university.
That's all they get told.
Okay, and do what?
Well, that's the thing, is that the people who raised the generations that we're talking about now were the first ones that really got told rebel against your parents it's really cool if you do that you don't need structure you don't need this sort of stuff and then they raised children without as much structure and it's snowballed from there and now all that they have is the structure that's presented to them by the government yeah and this this began began with the boomers in the 60s you know you didn't get prior to that you didn't get the sort of generational revolts
but now we're at the point where there's just nothing left to revolt against so at least if you okay i'm engaged in like a revolt against traditional order at least you've got the traditional order you were raised by it so you've got all the inculcated assumptions that it came with in your mind so the boomers in some ways are really traditional but in other ways are totally radical Well they grew up in an era where they could still enjoy the fruits of the society that came before them.
And now we're like three or four generations down that line.
And now we've got bloody teenagers lapping as though the 90s and early 2000s were the 1950s.
Exactly.
Or even Victorian England.
Exactly.
And it's so totally off the reservation that the notion of structure and order is going to make a return.
But anyway, I'll leave that there because basically our civilization is essentially designed to maximize the freedom of adults and we're imposing that level of freedom on children where it's just inappropriate.
They do not need that level of freedom.
What they need is reliability and security.
That's what children need.
Um, before we go on, Jack, um, we've left the air con on, uh, and it's really loud.
Is it being picked up on the mic?
I don't even, I mean, even if it's not being picked up from the mics, it's really loud.
Oh, are we going to get a Jack cameo?
Is that what's going to happen here?
Sorry, Jack.
Blare your lats for the camera.
Totally.
To be fair, I can tell you've been working out.
Um, yeah, no, sorry, Jack.
Sorry about that.
I should have remembered.
It's just, it's actually really loud.
I can't believe the mics aren't picking up.
Oh, well, these are very good mics.
They are brilliant.
We're not endorsed by Shure, but if they ever want to.
But every podcast uses them.
I mean, these are just to get into a little bit of nerdy trivia.
These are the same mics that Michael Jackson used to record Thriller.
Really?
They've been around for ages.
Really good mics.
Yeah.
Anyway, before I get too much into that, let's carry on, shall we?
Yes.
So communism has been completely captured.
We know now that the left and communism in general They are just the minions, they're the handmaidens of the state and the establishment.
They think that they're rebelling.
We were talking about, it's basically what we were talking about a moment ago, in that all of these people are lapping thinking that the 1950s was just two years ago, or pre-2014.
These people are lapping as though the fat cat big wig corporate manager is still the guy who's ruining their lives and destroying the rights of the workers, whereas really all that they're doing is they're being brought in every so often by the establishment.
So that they can cause chaos and manufacture consent for things the establishment already wants to do.
But what I love about this is that the communists are starting to realize it.
It's like, hang on, are we just the foils of big business?
Are we just their useful idiots?
It's like, yeah.
Yeah, I do respect those types, really, because I've got to give you credit for this, because you're the one who directed me to the YouTube video that we're looking at.
Navara Media recently did an interview with an author called, let me just get his name up, Dan Evans, and that's what we're going to be looking at in here, because they're part of what I would call the more traditional socialist left, the English socialists, in radicals, what is it, Frauds, firebrands and something or other.
The Roger Scruton book.
Yeah.
He talks about the English socialists as a different class, a different type of socialist, who are much more parochial and care much more about the actual working class.
They're not LARPers like, say, outright Leninist revolutionaries tend to be.
And they're not the sort of people who are entirely motivated by the fact that they still hold deep seated resentments to their parents from when they were a teenager.
They do actually seem to care.
And I think that there's a lot of overlap with their analysis of the problems in the world that overlaps with some of ours but it's when we get to the solutions that they're the fact that they just can't get over marxist class analysis and communism starts to override the sense that they start to make and what they start to understand about the world but what i like about this is essentially they they have to come to the conclusion hang on a second the establishment's left wing and we agree with them on everything How can we be dissidents?
You can see they really struggle with this.
They separate it by, you know, they say, oh, the progressives, and they actually start to use some Burnhamite language talking about the managerial class, which is really promising to hear.
But it's then when they eventually get around to the solutions, it's still all of the old-fashioned.
We just need to strike more.
We just need to support Just Stop Oil, which was the most absurd one for me.
But we'll get into that because I've got lots of clips because it was actually a very interesting interview that Aaron Bastani conducted here and I just want to say before we go any further, hi Aaron.
I know that you're a big fan of the show now after you commented on the Turkish barber segment.
Welcome to the far right Aaron.
Welcome to the far right.
I'm glad that you subscribed.
Gold tier.
I'll see you on Friday.
No, you won't because we're busy on Friday.
No, no, we won't.
Yeah, we are busy this Friday.
But before I get into any further, I'll just talk about some of the premium work that we've got on here.
A new video from Josh on his Contemplation series talking about cults part two.
This one, they're talking about the Osho movement.
I think what they're talking about here is a lot of Eastern mysticism and some cults that are formed around it.
So I'm interested to see because You could make the argument that a cult isn't necessarily inherently a bad thing.
I know he's been doing some research on Scientology and that's not a very good one, I would say.
But I don't know if they touch on Scientology in here because I know Josh has been driving himself a little bit insane researching into cults.
It's taken him down some avenues he wasn't expecting to go.
So just to make it worth it for Josh, you should subscribe to the website and watch these videos because otherwise his inevitable aneurysm won't have been worth it.
And also, just to draw the attention to everybody watching on the website and also on YouTube, at the moment we've got a 10-question feedback survey available that you can find in the description below this video right now.
And if you just take a few minutes to fill this out and give us feedback on what you enjoy about the website, what you think could be improved, what you think could be improved about the presentation and the content that we put out, we would really appreciate that.
Thank you very much in advance for filling that out.
Looking forward to seeing what you say.
So I thought I'd just start off by drawing everybody over to the kind of the quality of Marxist that you get these days because...
I'm gonna sort of echo Paul Gottfried here, which is that saying, at least with the old-fashioned Marxists, you could have a discussion with them.
They weren't entirely insane.
Yeah, they had some insane ideas, but they weren't entirely crazy.
Whereas you get people like Hassan and Walsh, who are the Dumbfounded face of modern progressivism, lapping as what Thomas would have described, if he was still here, as a vulgar Marxism.
And I've got to say, there is some merit to that analysis of calling this vulgar Marxism, because these people are just stooges.
They're establishment stooges who just promote the thing that the establishment wants them to do.
Yes.
With the guise of saying, and also I'm a radical.
Also, I'm a rebel.
Also, I stand against the establishment while pushing everything that they want, just two steps ahead of where they are right now.
Well, this is the Ted Kaczynski observation.
These people, the way that they are radicals is in demanding a higher fidelity to the establishment's own set of principles.
That's the only way in which they're radical.
They have not got the stones to disagree with any of these principles, even if they did.
You know, that's the thing.
They know that they would lose the luxury lifestyle that they It's very easy to go back and find compilations of either of these people, or any of the Twitch leftists, saying one thing and then another clip of them a month or two later going back on it because they've had their latest NPC update.
And then a clip of them saying, I don't care about my principles, I just want to win.
I just want to do whatever the establishment is telling me.
I've got that clip up in a moment.
But it was amusing to me that they do still act in one fundamentally leftist way, which is that a lot of them are just outright thieves.
Yeah.
Hassan has been recently wrapped up in this big controversy on Twitch with them being React content, where they'll just play other people's videos and not add any... He'll just walk away.
Yeah, he'll just walk away so he can make himself some chicken nuggets because his mum's too busy right now.
He'll just sit there and watch people's videos.
I think What was it, Pokimane?
I think she's a socialist or something similar.
She streamed one of the Pirates of the Caribbean films in its entirety on one of her streams and didn't understand why that was breaking the law.
I mean, amazing.
These people are just... This is how they react when told, even by Ethan Klein, who somehow came up better in this scenario.
Even Ethan Klein's like, no, you're not allowed to do that.
He's not a socialist, but he is a leftist.
And in response to the idea that if you didn't just watch other people's videos and did your own content, he's just started doing that.
He just went absolutely crazy.
These people are absurd.
We just have a very poor quality of leftist right now.
You know, I'd respect our opposition more if they were better at being our opposition.
But that's how you know, again, that's how you know that they're losing, right?
They won the victory in the 20th century, and now these are the men who the victory has produced.
I mean, I will and can criticize people like Lenin and Stalin.
They weren't un-serious people.
Yeah, they weren't un-serious people and Stalin is an absolute Chad next to this man.
It's present everywhere, but it's especially present in left-wing thoughts.
I mean, I will and can criticize people like Lenin and Stalin.
Sure, but they weren't unserious people.
Yeah, they weren't unserious people, and Stalin is an absolute Chad next to this man.
Let's be fair.
Lenin's a genius compared to all of these.
Oh, absolutely.
Lenin has political writings that can be utilized by anyone who wants to make an effective political movement.
I'm not recommending anybody, you know, go and commit terrorist acts or violent revolution or anything.
He's a political organization.
He at least was a serious thinker.
Yes.
None of these people are.
And I mean, there's this other one where Ethan is on that stupid podcast he has with Hasan Piker, is sat next to Hasan Piker, insulting XQC for doing the exact thing that Hasan does constantly.
Hasan is sat there awkwardly like, well, you know, it's not always that.
Do you want me to play a little bit of this?
Go on, go on, why not?
So like, I mean, just right off the bat, what the fuck is this editing?
There's 10 seconds of him sitting there like a moron.
Look at this idiot.
Yeah, I mean, it's not high effort.
No, no, no.
This is like that.
That's right, Hasan.
It's not high effort.
No, it's not.
Let me get a taste of this.
Why wouldn't they cut that?
Yeah, you've got an idea.
Hasan's just awkwardly sweating.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
But that's my whole career, bro.
And then you do just get the people like Vaush who just outright say, by the way, I'm an establishment stooge.
There's this one where somebody, I assume he's responding to somebody in his chat saying, by the way, did you notice that everything you say lines up with exactly what Washington wants?
Yeah.
And he responds with- You call it selling out your principles?
I call it fucking winning.
And that's my principle.
To win as a socialist, not to lose as a socialist.
That's not my principle.
I don't give a fuck about principled failure.
Principled failure is worth dog shit.
Average Reddit socialist.
But, I mean, like, okay, that's good.
Because, like, if someone's like, by the way, everything that you want lines up in Washington.
It's like, yeah, but I want to win as a socialist.
Why are they the guys that you win with?
You would think that the imperial capitalist super state... They're constantly complaining about all of this, but then at the same time if you offer any alternative they'll be like, no you need to vote Democrat.
Exactly, because it's exactly as Kozinski pointed out.
It's like, no, no, no, they're just disappointed that they're not going as far as they are willing to at least profess.
Yeah and this is where this comes in which is the interview that you sent me which was very interesting because as much as Navarra media are people that I disagree with because they are socialists and they hired Ash Sarkar which I'm sorry Aaron I know you're watching but that's something I can never forgive you for.
You helped to promote Ash Sarkar into the media eye but it is very interesting to watch The difference between those kinds of socialists, the Twitch, Twitterati socialists, and these people who are much, once again, much more old school.
I can't help but notice there's an American-British distinction here too.
Yes, there very much is.
That's why I wanted to point to Roger Scruton's identification of the old school English socialists.
And it's interesting to listen to them because there are a lot of points of agreement that I can find with their analysis, even if they've based it in Marxian class analysis, it has still led them to being able to identify the way that power works.
Despite the hindrance of using Marxian analysis.
Well, if it's helped to bring them to the right identification of some of the problems, including ideas like the managerial class, then that's fantastic.
I mean, Burnham himself was a Trotskyite.
But, it's where they go into their conclusions.
But, let's listen to some of the analysis they have here.
So, here he's talking about the problems that come with having everybody just go off to university and earn PhDs.
So, was it a waste of time?
Yeah, good question actually.
When you're in the weeds of your PhD and obviously once you've finished it and once you're on the job market and realise how competitive it is, I did think it was a waste of time.
There's a lot of people now who, I mean obviously the debate about Mickey Mouse degrees and things like that, it's hypocritical of me to say that on the one hand because I absolutely loved university and I loved all the fruits of it, being able to study is a good thing in itself.
The thing that upset me and still upsets me about it, because I don't necessarily think I was sympathetic enough to the plight of people who are experiencing downward social mobility in the book, because it is a really awful, awful experience.
You know, when you're sort of, you said about the two paths, you know, in school you're sort of, you know, you're told from a very young age, or you're like academic, you're bookish, you've got to do this thing, you can't, you know, you don't do the DT, you're going to do this.
Without knowing it, you sort of get sent to university and then obviously it turns out that everyone's got a PhD and you get two, three hundred people applying for lecturer jobs and it's very difficult, especially when you see there's no light at the end of the tunnel.
You're just thinking, I'm just constantly applying for jobs and nothing's going to happen and I am going to sort of But I guess a lot of it is about your image you have of yourself, right?
I mean, and we'll get into this a bit more, but the whole point of social mobility in the UK is it's sort of telling people that you shouldn't stay in your small town, that you are de facto, you know, whether it's, you're better than people who, the working class people who stay or certainly you're different.
And so when you sort of work in these What I thought was a dead-end job.
I did start to feel particularly despondent about it all.
It was interesting studying it, but the problem is that the economy has devalued the thing I studied.
It's destroyed the higher education system.
There's now too many people doing PhDs.
too many people doing PhDs.
And I'm not saying I include myself in that, you know?
So it's, you do tend to feel upset by the sort of sunk and the time wasted.
And I mean, you know, me and you have spoken about this, is that you delay your life.
You know, you put off, you're losing years of your life in terms of your earnings.
You know, I'm, you know, I could probably beat my age out, but you know, I'm, I should have had a family by now.
You should have, should have had children.
And there are a lot of people who, you're just delaying these things that you want.
You know, I do want a house and children and, And all those things, but you ended up delaying it because of your PhD under the sort of promise that you're going to get to the professional class and you never end up getting there.
And I think that's unfortunately going to become...
A reality for a lot more people.
As I say in the book, the amount of graduates now in non-graduate jobs is staggering.
I think four million.
And there's no movement.
People aren't moving into graduate jobs.
People are just going to be stuck for longer and longer and longer.
I mean that's the longest clip I've got from it, the other ones won't be as long but I listened to that and I can't find anything to really disagree with what he's saying there and I found it profoundly quite sad that he was saying that he should have had a family by now.
Could I be less sympathetic?
If you'd like to be less sympathetic, go for it!
I watched this and I found this fascinating because his degree was in a small Welsh holiday town.
Yes.
He didn't do the degree there.
His degree was about his, sorry, his PhD was about some small.
I think it's his hometown.
Yeah.
Some small Welsh holiday town.
And he's like, and I am experiencing social demobility because I can't get a job in academia with my PhD.
It's like, that's because your PhD is absolutely worthless.
Why did you do a PhD on some small Welsh holiday town and think, oh, I'm going to be a professor now?
Why would anyone want a professor with that?
It was sociology that he went into.
I mean, he has been able to write a book off the back of all of sociological studies and his research.
This is hardly like cutting edge sociological work, right?
And it's not like there aren't probably millions of other sociologists around the world, you know, who are studying things that may be a little more applicable, right?
And he says, look, I'm one of those guys who essentially has a Mickey Mouse degree.
I have this kind of useless and valueless... It doesn't sound as though he's disagreeing with you there.
Well, I know, I know.
But this thing, like, I'm not very sympathetic to that.
But in the last segment, we were talking about all of these people who receive no structure in life, who then get told that the only structure that they need is to be able to go through the university and then they get out.
Yeah, and he's a great example of that.
He is a great example of that.
But this complaint, oh, I'm experiencing social demobility.
So at one point he says, well, I expected to just go get my PhD and become a professor.
It's like, yeah, but There are other things that you could have done your PhD in.
And you are right.
Maybe I should be more sympathetic.
He is a product of the environment that we were just critiquing.
It's true.
I just find myself not with that much sympathy.
Well, he has managed to... Once again, this is where some of the interesting analysis comes in.
But he's not wrong.
He's managed to identify this difference between, as we talk about, sort of the more classical left socialists with this new progressive class.
Jack, if you wouldn't mind skipping past the next clip and going straight to clip three for me.
This is where some of the interesting analysis comes in.
I mean I always think when you see people on like left Twitter, I don't like to use left Twitter as like a gauge of anything, but you know over Christmas people make the pilgrimage back to their small towns and people always say like I'm meeting my friends from school or I'm talking to my family and there's always this like oil and water culture clash between like progressive sort of young lefties and then implicitly parochial reactionary people from small towns.
Obviously that Graduates are a minority.
Obviously not everyone has that sort of class because not everyone has to leave their small town.
A lot of people stay.
But the sad thing is, and I say this in the book, is that gradually, and I'm sure a lot of people will attest, is gradually you end up falling out of touch with people that you didn't go to, who didn't go to university, and you sort of get split off from them culturally, politically, ideologically, socially.
You learn new ways of behaving.
It's like When your uni friends meet your friends from home or, you know, and vice versa.
And you're always trying to straddle the two worlds in terms of people's expectations and ideology.
And when people end up, you know, one of the biggest forms of migration in the UK is the movement of young people from small towns to university towns or cities.
And a lot of the time that's a permanent move.
You know, they move because they want to be around sort of like-minded people.
And it's led to this situation.
Well I don't say like metropolitan sort of elite or whatever but it's it's it's led to the situation where like-minded people with similar politics similar ideology similar outlook on life which started in university all end up staying in the city.
The way you sort of raised your eyes there you had to check yourself you know am I going to be cancelled for what I just said I don't think that's a particularly contentious point.
You could do it.
Obviously true.
Aaron's actually right there, self-censoring himself, because what he was about to say, metropolitan, liberal elite, he's probably thinking to himself, oh god I'm about to sound like a Daily Mail headline.
But maybe there's some truth in this headline.
That's because he is the content of the Daily Mail headline, right?
Because what he's complaining about there is, look, the university is formatting me into the universalized metropolitan liberal elite, and it's turning me into something that I wasn't.
When I left, culturally, that's what he's complaining about.
And then, you know, oh, I go back and I've got to straddle these two worlds.
And it's like, okay, but why is one world one way and different to the one that produced you initially, you know?
And why is it that when you go back to your home, which is where you should have all of your closest connections, your family are there, the people that you grew up with there.
Why is it that going to that university and going through the brainwashing that university puts you through, when you go back home, ends up completely isolating you from all of those people who should be closest to you, who you should be able to rely on and should be able to rely on you?
Yeah, because I'm thinking of people like Tolkien and C.S.
Lewis, who were professors and who were parochially attached to Britain and England, right?
They weren't universalised metropolitan political elites.
But this, again, was a hundred years ago.
Okay.
So something has changed in the university system and it's producing people like you and you guys want to think of yourselves as better in some way because of the values that you hold, but you have essentially been inculcated into them because you go to university, you get kind of inserted into this metropolitan liberal elite that aligns with all of your progressive socialist values.
And now you find yourselves at odds with the very people that you thought you were trying to help.
I wouldn't say that these two, Dan and Aaron, are these particulars.
As a general archetype.
One of the things that I like about these two is that they are identifying a lot of the problems and recognizing that people shouldn't be going to university and then finding themselves coming home and immediately getting into conflict with their loved ones and friends to the point where Sometimes I've heard stories of it happen.
You end up with people you've been friends or for years or family members, you know, friends who are like family members to you.
All of a sudden you go off to university, you change your entire worldview, you come back and get back and you go into an immediate argument about politics or something and they're never friends again.
That's not how these things should happen.
I don't think that's what these guys are going for.
Where I find that my problems come with Navara and the analysis that they bring is that despite the recognition of all of these problems, they still refuse to acknowledge some of the problems that are brought by their own Progressivism that they still believe in.
They're a part of it, that's the thing.
They are a part of it.
He hired people like Ash Sarkar, who's the, we're winning lads, those types of people.
So they're still unwilling to address, without calling it reactionary, without calling it overtly right-wing, the problems that immigration and other such things bring into their own analysis and the fact that you won't be able to get the proper class analysis without taking that into account as well.
But the thing that I found most interesting about this interview is just literally that they had to essentially come to the conclusion, look, we are the thing that we're complaining about that is causing the problems for the regular sort of Brexit voting constituency of the United Kingdom.
Like they come to that, the very edge of that, and then they have to try and diffuse it by saying, oh, well, hang on a second.
And on Brexit, Jack, if you wouldn't mind skipping to clip five here, there is talk of Brexit because Aaron's talking about how, you know, he voted Remain, but when he was doing coalition building, he recognized that, OK, most of the country has voted to leave.
So if we actually want to win elections, we're not going to be able to try and get a second referendum going.
And his own experience is going out on grassroots and talking to people on the street.
Let's play this one.
Yeah, it's so true.
How can we have a coalition with people?
And I actually think it's very possible, by the way.
I do think it's very... I mean, I know we're going to talk about culture and identity politics and whatnot.
I think you can absolutely build a coalition between the people we're talking about and more socially conservative voters who are left in the economy.
Because they do care about personal freedoms.
They do care about civil liberties.
Sorry Jack, pause this.
It was clip 4, sorry.
I'm getting mixed up between my clips.
Go back to clip 4.
I was canvassing for Labour and I remember just walking along the street and there was a guy in a wheelchair, like kind of rocker, long hair, interesting guy.
Older, maybe 60, 65.
And, um, I said, you know, there's gonna be elections soon.
Cause obviously you had the May elections for the locals and the Europeans, and then you had a general election.
He's like, what's that for?
I'm sorry, it's the European election.
But we've left!
He was looking at me like I was from another planet and I was like, but these European elections, and then, you know, we might want to riffle.
I could have been speaking a completely different language.
He said, we voted to leave.
We voted to leave.
What are you talking about?
And then I'd come to London and there were people, or I got on Twitter.
There's a majority for people and I'm thinking, and by the way, that's never happened since.
This divide in society being so obvious between, like I said, only mobile, or graduate class, professional managerial class, Professionals, and then like the rest of the country, it was so stark.
And that was one of the catalysts for writing the book, you know, it was, you know, obviously I'm from a low middle class background, and then when Brexit happened I was in the university as a researcher, and I did, I got increasingly uncomfortable about the way people who voted Leave were being spoken about, you know, some of the languages version, On like eugenics, you know, like these people shouldn't be allowed to vote.
They shouldn't be allowed to have kids, you know, all this stuff.
Really?
From academics?
Well, people who were sort of progressive, you know, people who consider themselves to be progressive.
There was a lot of, um, a lot of the sort of class hatred that I thought would always be like latent really started to seep out.
But obviously it was always, the language was about education.
People are uneducated.
It's not, they're not there.
You can't really, people wouldn't say scum or whatever, but it was, it was fairly obvious what people were thinking.
Thinly veiled.
Yes.
I think that is what he's trying to say.
But once again, it's very interesting that they can recognize this and admit it out loud.
And then all of a sudden, if we go to clip six, I know that this is the right one.
Don't don't worry.
They still turn around and then go, actually, we still believe in all the progressive stuff.
Don't worry, guys.
Yeah.
Is the audio not working?
Don't worry.
Yeah, basically they just turn around and say, just stop oil.
We still believe in everything.
Net zero is still absolutely fine.
We're still progressives.
Which is very frustrating to hear, because you hear them making all the right steps, you see them taking all of the right steps, and then they turn around and they just can't shed that last bit of the progressive axioms that they believe in.
Well, they would have to admit that they are the problem, essentially.
They are supporting the problem.
And I think that's too far, but to be honest with you, I'm tempted to do like a long podcast just about this interview.
There's a lot to talk about.
There's a lot in there that is genuinely worthwhile, actually, and amusing.
So anyway.
Yeah, I think that's everything that we can talk about there in that case.
I did have a few more clips, but if the audio is starting to mess up a bit and if we're running low on time, yeah, we should move on to the next segment.
So yeah, once again, I still think there's a lot to disagree with, with these guys, the class analysis, Marxist ideas, unwilling to address problems on immigration and such.
But I think it's important also that we recognize where there is some overlap that we can all recognize the problems in society.
Well, this is why Aaron's been trending towards the far right.
Yeah, if you wanna say it that way.
And that's my principle.
To win, as a socialist.
Not to lose, as a socialist.
That's not my principle.
Can you shut him up, please?
There we go.
Thank God.
Okay, right.
So, the question keeps coming up.
Should we flee England for places somewhere else?
No one ever says where we should be going.
As if the problems are somehow located only on our island.
And we can just go somewhere else and everything will be hunky-dory.
Not that I want to flee England, but if we recolonized Rhodesia...
Perhaps.
Maybe.
But the question keeps coming up.
And so I thought we'd just talk about it.
Because this is a perennial problem.
Because everyone can see that the decline is very palpable.
Everything around us is getting worse.
The country seems to be going to hell.
And this is what I wrote a long sort of tweet about that Dan wanted to talk about in more detail in a more recent episode of Brokenomics, which is called De-Civilization, because everything is getting out of control.
It's very clear that the people in charge aren't really in control of what's happening.
They don't really understand the damage that they're doing and they're very remote from the problems.
And so we're going to wake up in like five or 10 years time, things are going to be radically different how they were.
And the question is what happens then?
Um, and so let's move on, uh, to Peter Hitchens point, which is, well, young people just flee.
Denethor posting.
This looks like an older picture of Peter Hitchens.
How long has he been going on about this?
Well, that's the point, isn't it?
This is from, I think it was like 2018.
This was posted two years ago, but I don't think it's only two years old.
Exactly.
It's a few years old.
He's been on this for a while.
And, uh, of course I got into an argument with Peter on this, uh, on Twitter and this spawned.
A number of articles about people talking about this argument, but we'll come back to that later because the most recent example is here in the Telegraph where Sam Ashworth Hayes, uh, decided no people, as he says, you can see from the title of this, if you're under 50, it's time to jump ship time to get out of Britain while you can.
God, that is a disgusting sentiment, isn't it?
It's not one that I support, personally.
Also, so that clears it up.
I thought it was Neil Ferguson who said this.
He was actually just quoting Neil Ferguson.
He was.
That makes sense.
Speaking that if Americans knew what would be good for them, they would all be in the Tea Party.
He is modifying that.
If British people knew what was good for them, they'd leave.
It's like, okay.
All right.
Let's have a look at your argument.
So he begins by saying, look, 90,000 British people a year leave.
These are not the 600,000 non-British people who live in Britain who leave every year as well.
So we've got a sort of net outflow of British people.
And he says, economists think that migration is being driven by a combination of push and pull factors.
Things which drive you away from your home country and things which draw you to your destination.
We've grown used to stories of doctors trading soul-sapping shifts on NHS wards for higher pay and fewer hours in Australia, or finance professionals heading to Dubai.
The risk for Britain is that this trend now becomes widespread as a toxic combination of economic stagnation and surge in growth elsewhere lure young people away.
It's not as if the push factors are lacking.
The housing market is past beyond dysfunction and into catastrophe.
Record numbers of adults still live with their parents, trapped by surging rents and unaffordable house prices.
Those who do strike out can expect to spend well over 20% of their incomes on housing costs, double the proportion that baby boomers spent when they were young.
The average deposit on a family home can take 19 years to save compared to three years in the 1980s.
So yes, we know the problems.
This isn't helped by government taxing us at Scandinavian levels.
We've got the highest tax burden ever at 37.7% of GDP.
The NHS, unreformed and possibly unreformable, seems to be falling apart.
And so basically everything is terrible.
So yes.
No.
Caring for Britain's elderly is set to impose an even greater burden on the working age population.
The record tax burden is going to be surpassed in the future.
And essentially, I mean, you know, social care budgets are going to take up 18% of GDP.
So, right.
Everything's bad.
We know.
So we've got aging population, which is one of the things that they always use as an excuse for why we need more migration.
And so the youth should leave.
I've seen, it was from 2015, I think, there was a NGO that was funded by Bono, I think, of all people, who was encouraging members of the EU Parliament to allow more migration.
And off the bat, purely of the argument that it needs new lifeblood.
What we need is Africans.
What we need is young Africans to be able to man all of the stations, because otherwise we'll just be entirely filled with old people well why don't we create a scenario in which it's better for people to start having families and having children again maybe we should do that but no that's the point isn't it it's like no it's our lives for the nhs not the nhs for our lives you know the nhs should be for us and us for it but uh but imagining aragorn across the line for the nhs
Well, that's essentially where the British government has arrived at.
But he finishes it with this.
He says, the German economist Albert Hirschman framed the choice of consumers facing deteriorating quality as one between voice and exit.
Either stay and try to fix things or leave for a better alternative.
The young people in Britain voice seems to be failing.
There's precious little political impetus to try and fix any of these issues.
Successive governments have found planning to be a political live wire, with the NHS run almost as its own private kingdom, issuing demands for tribute from ministers unable to effectively infer it is running.
No party seriously wants to shrink the state.
That leaves exit.
Those who can go should.
Imagine the absolute state of Britain if we actually did the under 50s just did start mass emigrating.
Well, we've already got a competency and skill crisis going on at the moment, so the entire country would collapse.
Maybe this is a good idea, actually.
The country collapses, all of the migrants leave because they can't leech off the state anymore, and we come back.
Yeah, the country collapses, the state collapses.
All of the things that are underwritten by the state collapse.
The state itself collapses, the tax revenues dry up.
You're starting to sell it to me.
And we've got to start completely afresh.
Yeah, even better.
Rise like a phoenix.
That would be great.
And this prompted YouGov to do a poll.
Of course, everyone's like, well, yeah, I don't think I'll do better in the UK if I stay in the UK.
89% of just adults were just like, no.
Only 11% thought they'd do better.
So I can understand where this comes from as well because we always go on about house prices over here, how ridiculous they are.
There is nothing more black billing as a young Englishman than looking at house prices over in America by comparison.
The mansions, the manor estate houses in the middle of glorious nowhere that you can afford for pittance in certain parts of America.
Good God.
I mean, literally, we were looking at it the other day.
There were just giant houses for like $100,000.
It's like, oh my God.
It's incredible.
And also, no one.
Yeah, no one in the middle of this.
For 100 miles.
It would be beautiful.
And I can buy guns.
Oh my God.
And so I thought we'd go back to my discussion with Peter, because I think that the situation is not hopeless.
It is just that the previous generations don't know what to do.
And there's a great piece, a part in this article in The Critic that I'm just going to read out because I think this essentially exemplifies the difference.
It says, The more I think about it, the less strange the Hitchens-Benjamin interaction becomes.
It marks the ending of one paradigm and the beginning of another.
Where Hitchens existed in an era of information exchange through books, publications, and television, Carl is a creature of the internet and understands its role in the modern political environment.
With his outlet Lotus Eaters, Carl is a platform that can immerse its members in a media environment that provides its members with a political message via podcasts, cultural pieces, written articles, and news.
The Gramscianism of the 20th century was successful, as Hitchens himself notes, because people were immersed in constant political messaging from the institutions they interface with every day.
The Gramscianism of the 21st century will be successful because information flows are so large and people's lives are so integrated with the internet that it is possible to create networks that people interface with every day, removed from those institutions.
Which is really great because this is a fantastic advertisement for the website.
It is!
He gets what we're doing and clearly we're doing it effectively.
Clearly it's working.
And Bo also mentioned something about this in his article against Doomerism, actually.
And again, I'm just going to read out a quick thing here because I really think this is important.
What Bo calls the Boomer Doomers, are in a sense doing our enemies work for them.
They're effectively collaborating with those who wish to grind England, Britain, and the entire Western world to dust.
They are sowing seeds of despair, acting as agents of destruction and harbingers of ruin.
Just because the Boomer Doomers have no more fire in their belly doesn't mean the rest of us share their dejection.
Just because they lack the imagination to come up with solutions to our myriad problems doesn't mean that we don't.
Then they may have no trousers, but there are literally millions of us who do.
Just because they are an empty bag doesn't mean we all are.
They are a room without a view, but there are still many of us who have the vision and will to battle on.
They should step aside and let us get on with it.
They have had their time and they blew it.
Now it's our time.
Down here, it's our time.
And that's the point.
It's like, look, it's our time now.
What are we going to do with it?
And so actually, I think that really the, oh, well, just flee Britain.
We don't know what to do is literally just because they don't know what to do.
But actually, this is what we have been doing.
We've been figuring out, OK, what are we going to do?
And so one of the things that we're doing is conference building, which Unfortunately, this for some reason is not loading.
I shall refresh it.
Yes.
Um, but so this is, this is going to be the content of my speech at the Skildings event this year.
Um, which is brilliant.
Can we scroll down and just see the lineup here?
Cause this, for anyone mystery guest, you'll enjoy the mystery guest speaker.
So Harry and I are both going to the Skildings event this year.
And there are some fantastic things.
There are going to be dozens of others as well, but these are sort of the headline speakers.
Because being online is not enough, right?
We have to move into reality.
We've done everything that we can on the internet.
We have to start actually interfacing with real people in the real world.
And that's what we're going to start doing.
And this is a continuation, essentially, of my speech last year, which was the word in the show, which you can watch on the website, which I mean, the comments, the responses in the comments, it's been amazing.
It's like, this is deeply moving and all this sort of stuff.
And so, yeah, because I really think actually we've arrived at a place that actually has roots now and has legs and actually is starting to grow.
Like the thing is building something.
And so the sort of Peter Hitchens stuck in the position of Denethor, where he's been at the top of a series of institutions.
He gets to go on questions.
He's the token conservative.
Exactly.
He gets to go into the institutions and be like, well, everything's going terribly and none of you have any solutions.
In fact, you're all the problem.
It's like, oh, well, everyone should just leave.
And it's like, yeah.
That seems rational from his perspective, from where he is, but we're not there.
We're somewhere completely different.
And from our perspective, actually, we can feel pressure growing in the realm that we're in.
Well, it's no wonder to me that Peter Hitchens has such a dim view of where the situation is because we joke and say, oh, he's their token conservative, but he really is.
He's the person they wheel out every so often for question time so that he can be laughed at by a panel of progressives and interrogated by a hostile audience who have been handpicked because they know that they'll have shrill NHS henpeckers manning the entire audience who will just disagree with everything Peter Hitchens has to say.
He always demolishes them.
He always demolishes them.
He does, but from his own perspective, and that's why they do it.
Not just for him, to make him demoralized, but also for an audience that chews into Question Time, who'll watch it and go, oh, well, Peter Hitchens is completely outnumbered and I agree with him, so I must be completely outnumbered as well.
And it's also to reinforce the current paradigm as well.
It really is.
They just want, oh, well, you know, we all agree that Peter Hitchens is wrong.
It's like, hey, why can't you disprove something that he's saying?
But when you talk about the sort of spaces that we occupy, you begin to see there is something to hope for.
Yeah, there's actually, there's life.
There's an organic beating heart in what we're doing.
And the fact that, I mean, like so many people have signed up for the website, so many people are coming to, I mean, I think, like, good luck getting tickets.
Sold out.
Yeah, I think it's sold out, the Skildings.
If we go, if we go back to the webpage, if I scroll up a bit, yeah, sold out.
Yeah.
And it's not cheap either, so people are really excited to go.
Exactly right.
There is a significant investment in this, and yet there are lots of people who are invested.
So basically, if you've got tickets for this Friday, this weekend, we'll see you there.
Both Harry and I will be coming.
Um, and I'm genuinely looking forward to it.
But that's the thing, like, and this is the third year, you know, so, you know, it's, it's not like on the third, you know, okay, the first one, maybe you could see it selling out because it's got some names on it and it sounds exciting.
And the second year, maybe it does okay.
And it's, you know, it's not on a downward trend.
It's becoming an institution.
Exactly.
It's becoming an institution.
And it's, I mean, in my opinion, one of the most exciting places, because you actually get to hear a range of genuinely well thought out positions.
But the point is there's something building and growing here.
And so it's making the transition from merely being part of an online space to being somewhere in the real world that is showing that, no, there is something coming.
And in fact, I think maybe actually it can't really be stopped.
So for the sort of doomers in the Westminster bubble going, well, look at this paradigm.
It's falling apart.
Yes, your paradigm is falling apart.
Not a part of your paradigm and we intend to be something that's afterwards.
So I'll leave that there.
Um, but the point being, no, we're not fleeing England.
We're not fleeing anywhere.
You bloody cowards.
Stop saying it.
Just stop saying it.
It's going to be my movement.
Just stop fleeing.
Yeah.
Just stay where you are.
There you go.
Stay at your posts.
Yeah, that's what we're after.
OK, I think we've got one video comment, so let's give this a go.
Yeah, this is a great start.
So in my youth, I had to chaperone for a lot of Bantu children, and they always liked to watch the boondocks.
And I found myself very puzzled by how weirdly red-pilled this show is, despite the fact that it's written by an ethnomarxist.
It's a scene where the main character is complaining to his grandpa about how their neighborhood used to have a pharmacy and a library and now it's a liquor store and a footlocker.
Grandpa tells him, well that's our culture, son.
Then he says, well then the culture's destructive.
For a left-wing show, it drops a lot of fire.
I've never watched Boondocks outside of a few clips.
I've only seen a few clips.
And the one where, I think it's the priest going, READ!
in the guy's face and the guy starts screaming in agony at having to read a book.
I didn't know it was an ethnomarcer, I knew it was made by black guys but it might just be that, you know, there's a lot of truth in comedy.
So in making fun of the culture you're accidentally peeling away and revealing what a lot of it is in the ghettos.
There are some great questions.
Yes, probably nothing that we can say.
In response to all of his decisions that he's made, Clarence Thomas, I saw a lot of people posting the clip of Uncle Ruckus going to heaven and becoming white.
I'm just saying, this is Uncle Ruckus when he reaches Hyperborea.
Incredible.
Alright, let's get on with some of the comments.
So, first one is Ron Swanzy, who says, No Goal Tier Zoom Call on Friday?
Is it being rescheduled?
No, we didn't mean to give the wrong impression there.
It is still going on, it just won't be me and Carl, because we'll be at Shielding's.
So, you'll have to speak to Josh, or Stelios, or Connor, or whoever else is doing it.
Yeah, I'm not sure off the top of my head.
Do you want to read or should I?
You can do it.
Okay, so for the first segment we've got Shaker Silva saying, further consequence of the state taking more interest in atomizing families to raise kids for their cause, when the FBI is investigating parents for terrorism just for questioning gender ideology, and Joe Biden says parents aren't the primary stakeholders in kids development, you know what is the side of evil.
That is really the most evil statement that you can make about the family unit.
The family unit, which has been the bedrock of civilization for as long as we've been able to record civilization, just saying, no, nothing of importance ever done by parents.
That's absolutely.
Is it any wonder with an attitude like that, that children are suffering from it?
Obviously the children are going to be the victims.
Well yeah, because they're being raised by adolescents who decided to replace their own parents with the state anyway.
So how on earth are they going to be raised in a healthy environment by those people?
Vesta Wolf says, Man built a world that made him redundant.
Yeah, that's the product of the Industrial Revolution.
I was going to say, that's the Kaczynski point, isn't it?
Yeah.
Also, we have been made aware that the video upload feature works again.
So I assume that is for the video comments, for Galtier video subscribers.
So before we'd offered a...
Nobody is very good for girls.
email address for you to send them in, but now you can just use the old video upload feature again.
So, looking forward to the video comments that you all send in.
Someone online says, making kids hold still for eight hours a day certainly doesn't help boys.
No, but it's very good for girls.
They're very good at that.
No, they are very good at it, but it does make young boys restless.
Yeah.
I honestly, I think that this is what, I mean, I I'm actually a total throwback when it comes to like ADHD and stuff.
I don't think that real.
I think that this is a product of boys just being put through a feminine education system.
Actually, if they were told to run around a track or something in the morning, like, you know, the first hour of the day being go for a run or something, then this wouldn't be a problem at all.
I agree, to be honest.
So many people around me have started having kids, or have kids who are a few years old, and they're all like, oh, my little boy's ADHD, my little boy's ADHD.
No, he's not.
He's just bored.
Yeah.
He's really bored and restless.
He's an energetic young lad.
Take him to a field.
Exactly, yeah.
Throw a ball with him.
Just do something.
Climb a tree, you know, whatever it is.
Climbing trees is really fun.
Yeah, it is.
It's really good.
Back when I was eight years old, I went around a friend's house and we climbed the tree together and I fell out of it straight into a nettle bush.
It's still fun though, even if it hurt like hell.
Lord Nerevar says, our civilization pretty much hurts everyone now and the kids are downstream from that.
Damaged people raise damaged kids and it's all exacerbated by the broken system that we live in.
Crabs in a bucket spring to mind.
And while that is true, it's a very negative way of looking at it.
It's easy to get downcast thinking about it like that.
The best I can say is that even if you are a damaged person, do your best to give your kids what you were missing when you were growing up.
If you've been damaged by the society around you, or even by parents who may have been negligent or anything.
Arizona Desert Rat says, while working at elementary schools, I've always let the boys talk about wars, fights, cars, sports, etc.
Good.
You're the good teacher.
You're the one that they like.
It almost seems to be a relief for them to have an opportunity to discuss more masculine hobbies and topics.
Yeah, because it's cool.
It's fun.
It's just what's interesting.
I mean, in my primary school, we were taught about the Roman Empire.
Yeah.
Very, very early on.
And we were shown stuff like Jason and the Argonauts.
Just cool things that were fun because it was like, oh, God, they were going out to war.
They were doing what kind of formations?
That's amazing.
That actually keeps you interested as a young boy, not just sat there still for eight hours.
The letter M is maybe the monster we claim to fight all along.
It says you are free from everything, free from chains, free from constraints, free from meaningful lives.
Yes.
And that meaning is literally only found in helping other people.
It's literally where meaning resides.
So to be completely free from any obligations to any other people means you just live a life of hedonism.
There is just nothing else.
And here's another one, because leftists are always squeamish about it, which is that helping people isn't always giving them immediately what they want.
No, this is depriving the heroin addict of his next hit.
Yeah, and that's a great point when it comes to things like structure and order are literally barriers to prevent children from getting access to something.
Right.
And that's what's good for the child.
The child wants ice cream for every meal, every day.
No, that's bad for you.
You're not having the ice cream.
You'll have it if you eat your vegetables.
Exactly.
Sophie Liv says, amusingly, I just read a Danish article this morning introducing the term TikTok brain.
Oh, God.
Oh god, my kids aren't going to get TikTok tricks, I'm damn sure of that.
Where kids are saying they don't want to play with other kids that has TikTok brain.
Oh, so the other kids are recognizing it and saying you've got no attention span, you're weird.
Okay.
And the things that easily identify someone with TikTok brain is someone with short attention span, Don't want to put the phone down and must constantly check it.
Extremely attention-seeking and short-tempered.
Yep.
These are all the negative consequences.
I do think this is indeed a good word to add to our language.
It's kind of funny how it is little children who are not on TikTok that came up with the word to explain their issue.
Yeah, that's really good.
Honestly, that kids can identify and recognize it.
That also means that there is some of these kids not being raised on TikTok, which is really good to hear.
But it shows you that it's a genuine problem that is pervasive and sort of seeping in to the root layers of civilization.
Like this is where the worst place for it.
You know, if it's some 30 year old who gets back from work and then just scrolls on his phone, okay, yeah, your choice.
We should still probably do something a bit more productive.
You know you should.
Even just playing video games is more productive than scrolling.
Exactly, but children when they're like, you know, eight years old or whatever, they don't think like that.
So, you know, you've got to manually and externally protect them from these things.
Kevin Fox says, when I was in school, I was jealous of the one kid in my class whose parents were divorced.
You were jealous?
Okay.
Mind you, my parents had to marry and blamed each other.
Oh, okay.
And my arrival for ending their military careers.
They fought regularly and it always ended with one walking out and driving off, leaving me to face the wrath of the one left behind.
That doesn't sound nice.
I'm sorry that you went through that, man.
Um, I'm not going to say it would have been entirely better if they were divorced, but I can understand with that description why they were jealous.
Sure.
That's not a problem with marriage per se.
That sounds like a marriage, a problem with that.
Yeah.
The, the, the, you know, okay.
There are bad relationships, but like, I don't think anyone's ever denied.
No, exactly.
But that doesn't change the fact that most children, they require married parents.
I think the leftist frame of mind does take it almost for granted that every relationship is rotten somewhere, which is one of the reasons that they're just so against the idea.
Miles Mitchell says a six-year-old shouldn't have a concept of what mortality is.
This is what happens when you have degenerate behavior celebrated openly in society and the destruction of childhood innocence is actively practiced by the education system and or media.
So this is actually not true.
Oh, okay.
Six-year-olds absolutely have a concept of mortality because they encounter things that have died.
This is true.
They encounter, you know, bugs, pets, you know, things in the real world.
If you've given a kid a hamster, they only last about two years.
Exactly right.
So it's, it's not, they shouldn't have a concept of what mortality is.
You, you, you have to, there's just no choice because like I said, something has died.
Uh, so they, they do end up with a concept of mortality and moreover, like, especially with boys, they're often playing war games.
You know, they're running around with sticks, fighting goblins or something, and they know what mortality you're killing the goblin on purpose.
Right.
And so it's not, they, they shouldn't have a concept.
You can't get around it.
You just can't get around it.
I'm going to give a nerdy example here.
So from a very young age I started watching Dragon Ball Z because it was on Cartoon Network and I always watched it.
It was amazing.
It was the coolest thing ever.
They tried to skirt around the fact that that is a really violent show.
It probably shouldn't be shown to kids at the age that I was watching.
But of course I watched it anyway because it's cool.
By having the English dub of it change anytime anyone said died to I've sent them to another dimension.
But even at age six I knew exactly what that meant.
But that's the thing, it's not about not having the concept, it's having a healthy understanding of the concept of mortality.
And when kids first learn about it as well, it does kind of...
They do find it hard.
I mean, I remember my son being like, I don't want your money to die.
I was like, Oh God, what do you say to that?
Right.
And you just say, well, look, it won't happen for a very long time, but it happens to everyone.
And you know, it's just a part of life and you, you just have to take them past it.
You know, it's, it's not that they can't have the concept because the concept, it's a reflection of reality.
They will encounter things that are dead, especially if you've got cats and they bring in dead mice, which we do.
And so we've got, you know, you can't get around them.
My old cat didn't kill it, but managed to drag a full-sized duck through the cat flap once.
Just in the living room, you start to hear quacking come from the kitchen.
What on earth?
Yeah, they are menacing, cats are, as much as I love them.
Brandon Tom says, I was about six years old when I learned to write my name.
Nowadays, six-year-olds are writing suicide notes.
Holy crap!
Maria Manzi says, Harry, you're rather correct in that children are influenced by parents, some of whom are far too adolescent in their behavior and attitude.
Yeah, it's just a sad fact at the moment.
Earl of Crumpet has a rather large comment here saying, regarding your first segment, Carl, my girlfriend works as a welfare officer at a secondary school in a major city.
About five years ago, it was the best state school in the area.
Now, in just the first month of this year, three children were hospitalized.
One had to be resuscitated after an overdose.
One was attacked with a machete and another one had their skull caved in with a sledgehammer.
What?
What?
This is ridiculous.
I mean, welfare officer, secondary school.
So they are old enough to not be actually their children.
But we're talking about like 12 or something.
Most of the gang activity has been due to the new immigrant colonies bringing their ethnic conflicts with them, of course.
Another cause is the lack of concern parents have for their community.
The largest problem, however, is the ineptitude of senior leadership.
The children are not being disciplined for savage behavior.
At that point, if you're attacking children with a machete and caving each other's heads in with a sledgehammer, these children need to be sent to juvie.
They need to be taken away from the general population altogether.
And I'm not going to say that that's going to rehabilitate them.
I'm going to say it's for the safety of everybody else because it's for punishment.
It's not for rehabilitating these people.
The children are not being disciplined and as such are becoming juvenile delinquents that Heinlein wrote about.
A child who stands up to their bullies is punished while those found stealing thousands of pounds of jewelry from changing rooms are not.
To top this off, on multiple occasions when there has been a fight, staff have found the head of behaviour hiding in a store cupboard with his laptop instead of dealing with it like they're paid over £70,000 to do.
Jesus Christ!
I mean, there's not much more I can say about that, so I'll move on to the next segment of comments.
So for my segment, Lord Nerevar says, rare moment of self-awareness for the commies, rich spoiled kids and cushy jobs living in the lap of luxury and lecturing the plebs on how they're all bad people.
Good that they've mustered enough insight to recognize that.
A few years too late, but it's something.
Shake your silver.
The neoliberal hegemony uses the left and right alike to fight amongst each other while they hollow out civilization for their own elite interests.
We just have more cognizance amongst the left, now realizing they no longer represent any populist interest as they cheer for the elite.
That's a great way of framing it as well.
They've abandoned the populist interest in order to cheer for the elite.
And Vaush being like the ura cheerleader of this.
Being like, I don't care, I just want winning a second, but look what you've sacrificed.
You know, any connection to the real people of your civilization.
I mean, what are you winning?
Exactly.
What are you winning?
What are you winning?
You're winning a collapsing failed civilization.
Yeah.
You're winning a world in where people are more comfortable cooming in the street and defecating in San Francisco.
Thank you.
Again, it's the civilization itself that is declining and collapsing in on itself.
You're the winners of the ashes of our entire nations.
Like, good for you.
I don't want to be the winner of that.
It really does feel a bit like, what's the old saying?
Better to rule in hell than serve in heaven.
Yeah, that's literally what it is.
Dante's.
It's so stupid, this attitude that they have.
If I'm king of the ashes, it's better than if I was living in a civilized society.
Under the bourgeoisie, what did they ever do for me?
Exactly.
What did the Romans ever do for us?
No, no, but that's exactly what they're thinking.
You know, I would rather be like, yeah, reigning in hell than serving in heaven.
It's like, okay, well, I disagree.
All right.
Well, that's an evil mindset.
Andrew Narog.
Aaron Bastani is describing the creation of the nowhere people.
Yes, he is.
They leave their homes and then find themselves unable to integrate back after their time at university.
They become only at home with the metropolitan elite, which only welcomes in so many people.
And that's a great point.
Honestly, I just keep going back to the sort of Tolkien, C.S.
Lewis types.
You can tell that they're very enamored with the country that produced them.
As they should be.
As they should be.
And yet modern elite institutions now hate the places in which they reside.
And they format the people who go through them to the same mindset.
It's like, how did this happen?
They want to reproduce that environment that they have to live in, the hellish nowhere environment, the metropolitan hellscape.
They want to reformat that into everywhere.
Every city, every culture, every town, every village must be paved over to make way for hideous, grey, glass skyscrapers.
Fantastic.
That's just what I want.
Also, on the point that you say it only welcomes in so many people, it does only welcome in so many people to the elite point.
But if you're not welcome there, don't worry, you can become the activist underclass.
You can become Antifa.
Could you set up a Twitch stream?
Yeah, there you go.
Kevin Fox again.
There's a lot to be said for military service when it comes to the idea of losing touch with peers.
I haven't spoken to anyone I went to school with in over 50 years, but I'm still in contact with guys I met in basic training only a few weeks after I left school.
I mean, honestly though, sometimes I look back and go, oh God, it would have been really fun to join the military.
Applestan95 says, the problem is that unless you do a trade or an apprenticeship scheme, you really do need a degree as a bare minimum.
I tried to work first without a degree, but mobility upwards for good roles did not exist.
You needed experience hard to get without a role or a degree as the bare minimum.
I wish I'd gone to university sooner so I didn't waste years finding out what to do, but at least I'm now qualifying as a professional now.
And more power to you.
I hope that works out for you.
But for a lot of people who go through that, they still come out the other end going, Oh, I still can't get a job.
And now I've got mountains of debt behind me.
And now I have a PhD in Camarvan or whatever it was.
Yeah.
There you go.
Let's go to the last segment while we've got five minutes left.
Lord Nerevar says, We don't need such people to stay.
We can do this ourselves.
I don't think Hitchens sees it as an economic zone.
Oh no, not at all.
consider abandoning England in her time of need, have no love for her, but those who view her as an economic zone and nothing more.
We don't need such people to stay.
We can do this ourselves.
I don't think Hitchens sees it as an economic zone.
Well, no, not at all.
But there are lots of people, like the guy who wrote the Telegraph article, he's literally just talking about the economics of living in the UK.
He's like, Oh, the NHS is costing us too much.
Look at the tax burden.
It's like, look at what I have to walk past on the way to work.
Well, this is all true and it's interconnected.
We can't dismiss an economic analysis of the situation, but the economic analysis can also take into account that the UK is England is somewhere to be considered more than just a place where you can chart graphs.
Sure, and that's the point.
The economic analysis would actually say, yeah, well, I mean, if actually it was useful to have a hundred billion Bermalian immigrants come in, then we will do that.
We'll go with the Bermami.
We are, yeah.
And then it's like, yeah, okay, but my cultural and aesthetic analysis tells me that no, regardless of what the economics of the situation is, if they can be projected to be good, no, just never, basically.
Charles Ellington says, most English live here in New Zealand now from 20 years back.
They said out loud, if you didn't recognize the place you'd grown up, you'd leave too.
I was young and dumb.
I asked if they were racist.
They put me in my place.
Yeah, this is a conversation I've had with some friends of mine who've spoken to older people talking about Not Salford, but I forgot the name of it.
It's a little town outside of Manchester saying that, oh yeah, I couldn't go back there because it's completely different.
Everybody there is a foreigner now.
It's all just full of Arab shops.
And my friends were like, oh, well, that's a bit racist, isn't it?
And I'm saying, well, okay, you grew up somewhere where there's these demographics.
If you go back and it's completely changed, how would you feel about it?
And they're like, hmm.
They're umming and ahhing because they don't want to admit that they'd be uncomfortable.
Brian Tomlinson says, Peter Hitchens used to idolize the Soviet Union.
He has split loyalties.
A person that wrong should be treated with a big pinch of salt, personally cracked from a Siberian rock.
Now I do find this- That's unfair because he's obviously gone through the process, learned about it, and he's gone entirely the other way.
I mean, I know all of that was wrong.
Yeah, if you want to see a better example of that, you can watch Navarro Media's interview that they did with him where Al-Bastani talks to him, because he really dismantles it.
Absolutely dismantles it.
Kevin Fox, sorry Carl, but I have to disagree.
Not all of those in power are seemingly unaware of what's happening to the UK.
Sadiq Khan isn't, for one.
He knows exactly what's happening because he's pushing it.
Yeah, fair enough.
Okay, you got me there.
Yeah.
Yeah, what we need in London is just more Pakistanis.
More Pakistanis who'll vote for me.
What do you mean this sounds self-interested?
You racist?
Honestly, Sadiq Khan is always like, oh, I need a cap on rents in London, but also I need more immigrants in London.
So look, these are directly connected, Sadiq.
What we need is a Pakistani favela outside of London, just packed to the brim with Pakistanis.
Maybe just tenements.
A grey tower block skyline just full of foreigners.
That you would probably never want to go in either.
I imagine it would be very dangerous.
Ross Stigle, the mental health crisis would put, I would put money on it being an artificial sensory overload.
They need to go outside and explore nature, not spend all day on game systems, social media, and TV.
You had two and a half hours of children's TV a day.
Gaming systems were rare and took so long to load you weren't addicted to them.
Social media didn't even exist.
Take me back.
Take me back.
X, Y, and Z says, depending on who's fleeing and where they want to go will determine where they should go.
If you've been voting for the problem and will continue to do so, you've intentionally est your bed, now sleep in it.
You've intentionally S'd your bed.
Now sleep in it.
Lotus Eaters aligned.
Please come.
Please come where?
I don't know.
But Vulcan's got a point there.
I guess we'll land on.
He says, I'll never leave Britain.
I am one with it is one with me, even if dark times make life near impossible.
And the way I was thinking about that, like, yeah.
Because I'm sure that the immigrants are going to have less grit when it comes to my particular determination here.
They're less determined to stay here than I am, so we'll see what happens.
I mean, they also have somewhere to retreat to.
Yeah, exactly.
We don't.
Exactly.
This is why Cortez burned the boats when he arrives in the New World.
Oh really?
Oh yeah!
I didn't know he did that.
It's conquer or die, okay?
And there are options.
So let's stop talking about this fleeing.
I mean, soon the planes won't be airworthy anyway.
You don't want to know who's piloting them.
Exactly.
We're in a position where it's conquer or die.
We're not leaving.
Stop saying it.
Let's talk about how we can fix the problems.
Yes, and with that, that's all the time we've got for today, so thank you very much for tuning in.
We'll be back again tomorrow at 1 o'clock.
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