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Nov. 15, 2023 - Louder with Crowder
50:27
PBD Goes From Atheist To God-Fearing Man | Ash Wednesday with Patrick Bet-David
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All right, glad to be with you.
Ash Wednesday, which I don't know if this is going up on Wednesday because we have to pre-tape with my guest today because he's busy.
He's running like nine companies or something, but he has a new book, Choose Your Enemies Wisely, Business Planning for the Audacious Few, and you can actually pre-order it on Amazon.
It's available December 5th, and I've done his show a few times, and he's been around here.
Mr. Patrick Bette David, how are you, sir?
Very good.
Yeah?
Very good.
Is there some inside lane here that I know?
Is there something that, like, why so very good?
Why very good?
Because, you know, no matter how crazy things may be that, you know, not everybody knows about, at the end of the day, man, if you're living in America, if you can go out there and, you know, voice your opinion to the best of your abilities, live your life, you're in the arena competing You know, getting shots taken at.
You got, you know, allies, enemies.
It's exciting.
This is all exciting to me.
Well, you said things that maybe people don't know.
I feel like you like the inside lane on things.
You're like, some things that maybe people don't know.
In business, that's a big thing, right?
Like, knowing something that someone else doesn't know.
Having a trick.
I think it is.
I think, you know, surprises.
I'm a surprise guy.
You know, it's funny.
Last night, I'm in Glendale at Rafi's place having a dinner with my friend Steven Offal.
And Afua says, I don't know how you do it.
I said, what do you mean?
He says, I can't keep surprises.
The other day I'm paying off my house for paying off my daughter, my sister's house, and I want to surprise her at the house party.
I couldn't hold till the weekend.
I had to tell her on the phone.
How can you hold so many surprises?
You didn't tell us what you're doing with the Yankees.
You're not like that.
My dad is all about surprises.
I love surprises.
Yeah.
And an element of competing in a marketplace is surprise and you know that no one's expecting what to happen.
That's exciting, that's exciting.
Yeah, there's some people who hate surprises.
Like Johnny Boy, you've met him.
I mean, if I come around a corner, he... Not a fan of it.
No, he wets himself.
But guess what, you've got to surprise him even more.
I know, I do it all the time.
If he happens to go in a door, I'm just like, well, I guess I'm hiding behind the door now.
And I just lean out and he's like... It's like gullible people.
Yeah, he's just jumpy.
The best people in the world are gullible people.
Yeah, yeah.
You can practice jokes on them, pranks on them, they're the best.
I mean, you can clear out their savings account by pretending to be a Nigerian prince.
You know, of course, that's a felony though.
Didn't a guy just do that and steal eight billion dollars and he's going to jail for maybe a hundred years or ten years and his mother wrote a paper from Stanford.
She was a Stanford Law professor.
The responsibility, like, you know, we have to not pay that much attention to responsibility.
What's his name?
Sam something, right?
Sam Bankman Freed.
Oh, Sam Bankman Freed.
Yeah, yeah.
No, he didn't fake being a Nigerian prince.
No, he did a whole bunch.
It was the FTX scandal.
Yeah, the FTX scandal.
Yeah, no, the problem with the internet is it's too easy to sometimes, you know, there's a generation gap.
So, I mean, my grandmother, you know, rest in peace now, but she used to have her home office, she would say, this is where I do my forwarding.
I was like, oh, that's why I get 15 emails from you.
Before this, you never walked up and physically handed me a picture of Michelle Obama with what appears to be a penis.
Like, there was a level of propriety that you didn't do that.
Grandma gave you pictures of Michelle Obama.
Well, she's like, you know, she's a man, you know, that kind of thing.
And you're like, she's a forward.
But she treated it like a job.
And because they think, like, this is all news.
And so it does happen on both sides with the fake news.
So you've been around for a long time.
Do you actually, is it nine companies that you run?
Nine companies right now, yeah.
How does that happen?
I mean, how do you run nine companies?
Because I want to get to your origin story, I guess, if you will, but that is something that right away on its face just sounds shocking to people.
So I don't recommend it, by the way.
It's not something I recommend.
When I say nine companies, you don't start like that.
Well, you know, when I went into financial services with Morgan Stanley Dean Witter, I left.
I went to Transamerica World Financial.
I was with them for seven and a half years, and then at the tail end of it, I watched Jerry Maguire, literally.
After Jerry Maguire, I write a 16-page, you know, what we ought to do to take this company to the next level, with nine ideas that I have, and I emailed it.
Nobody responds.
Back then, I emailed it to the CEO of Agon.
And he responds back and he sends it to a guy named Jack and Jack calls everybody that didn't respond to me to fly out to Orange County, have a meeting with me for 7-8 hours and I proposed everything and then nothing happened.
So I went back and I said, okay, no problem.
If that's the case.
If you don't value these ideas, maybe I'll go do it myself.
And I had a meeting in Atlanta with them, in a room with 15 people around the room.
I wish I was recorded, by the way.
All the lawyers are there, presidents, everybody.
I said, I'm here to make one of four decisions.
I'm either going to stay here, be the CEO.
I'm either going to sell my business.
I'm either going to go to another industry, or I'm going to resign and go start my own company.
They said, you'll never resign and start your own company.
I said, you don't think I'll do it?
He says, nope.
For the last 20 years, people like you come here threatening to leave.
They don't.
They want a check, we give them a check, and then they never leave and they had never plans of leaving anyway, so we don't believe you.
I said okay fair enough I think that's a fair assessment so a month later I had an event in JW Marriott Palm Springs called saving America doing the impossible this is 09 and I'm dressed as George Washington you can actually find this picture it's pretty funny my wife is dressed as Lady Liberty this is three weeks after we got married 40-foot Mount Rushmore four or five hundred people in the audience the events called saving America doing the impossible I bring a Larry Greenfield from Claremont Institute to talk about the history of capitalism.
I bring Dudley Rutherford to talk about the Star Spangled Banner.
And then boom, we launch that.
Three months later, I resign.
I start our own company.
Ph.D.
agency with 66 agents, insurance company.
And we grew that from 66 to 45,000 agents.
We sold it last June to Integrity Marketing Group that's Dallas-based and Silver Lake.
Nice exit.
It was exciting.
It was great.
But then throughout that process, I'm producing content with Valuetainment purely for entrepreneurs and business owners.
And the entire time, you know, my audience is small business owners, salespeople, executives, C-suites, founders, and my content is how to raise money.
You want to raise $10 million, here's how I did it, here's 10 things to look out for.
You want to sign a lease, I have a half a million square feet of office space nationwide, these are the 20 things you should be looking out for, this is what that guy's thinking, this is what you're thinking, here's how to negotiate with them, boom.
You want to fire somebody, hire somebody, hire C-suites, so that was my content for 5, 6, 7 years.
And then my interest became, I get a call from somebody from Peru, a booker saying, you know, I heard you on KRLA with Bill Martinez and, you know, I think you need to interview this guy named Michael Francis.
I said, the mobster?
He says, yes.
I says, I'm a business content guy.
He says, I think it'll blow up.
I said, I'm not going to do that.
It's not content for me.
A year and a half later, we do the interview.
It gets 20 million views.
Then I interviewed Samuel Del Bocarano, all these mobsters, Phil Leonetti.
They all started calling me because I always watch Godfather.
It was an always interesting power play, you know, what they did.
And then we did a bunch of CIA interviews, you know, business interviews, bodybuilding interviews, and then we found different niches.
Then my interest was always politics because I started seeing the more money you make, how they abuse you.
Matter of fact, today I was looking at the data, crazy data from tax Foundation.
Do you know what percent of the income tax that the government gets the top 1% pays?
The top 1%?
The top 1%.
I think they pay somewhere around 60-something percent, but I've seen as high as 80.
It's like 20% pays 80% in taxes.
20% pays 80%, but this is specifically 1%.
20% pays 80% but this is specifically 1%. 1% crowder pays 42.3% but do you know what
the bottom 50% pays in taxes? 2.3%.
Yeah well 47% of Americans.
That's what got Romney in trouble.
Yeah.
Or maybe it was 43.
It was either 43 or 47, don't pay any federal income tax.
Yeah.
And he said it in a way that was, you know, obviously wildly unpopular, but it was a fact.
That whole door was open when he made that comment, yeah.
He said, binders full of women.
Where he really screwed up was he said, put the dog on the roof of his car.
That's where it... Yeah, that's when you... That was a bridge too far.
Yeah.
People were like, what?
Well, not this, but, you know... Are you out of your mind?
This is it.
You cannot, you're not ready to be president.
Well, no one likes him anyway.
And then I started noticing how, when we're appointed in 49 states, how, I'm in Texas, but I'm still paying taxes in California, and I'm paying taxes in all these other states because insurance money.
So I'm like, okay, this is interesting what's going on.
More and more and more I got into it.
I said, no, I want to talk about this stuff.
Let me ask you, why do that?
In other words, people will ask, because I've been around some people who are incredibly wealthy, right?
Oh, it's still, I thought you might have to relight it.
the BidDev consulting, then we have a product development site with Manect app and Vault
Drink, then we have the shows, then we have the cigar lounge, then we have the comedy
club.
Let me ask you, why do that?
In other words, people will ask, because I've been around some people who are incredibly
wealthy, right?
Oh, it's still, I thought you might have to relight it.
Incredibly wealthy and then they often still, and I don't think this is the case with you,
but they still want more notoriety or fame.
In other words, you don't need to have a podcast, right, to make a living.
It's not like you were drawn to it because you wanted the big checks.
Why do it?
It makes sense to have a smaller podcast on investing.
A lot of people do that, right, for their investors or their money managers, etc.
What made you say, okay, I want to take this risk?
And that's a lot of work to do.
The podcast or the company?
Well, the more entertainment-centric companies as opposed to insurance.
Oh, there's no question.
That's a whole different story.
You know, a pastor of mine, Dudley Rutherford, who married my wife and I, one time he gave a talk saying there's seven pillars in America to climb.
It was military, family, church, entertainment, media, and he's got a list of sports, all these things he's listed, and I said, the most powerful one to climb is media.
But it's also the hardest one.
And I always thought about this.
He said this in 2009, 2010.
I'm like, media is the hardest one but the most powerful one.
Why is that?
And then you start noticing what's going on with media and what the messaging is, who's giving it, who's telling it, what they're doing, the level of trust in media today, how it's declining.
It's the lowest it's ever been.
The numbers came up last week.
And the trust in U.S.
government and media is at the lowest.
It started off being very high.
Right pre-JFK, we're at 70-72%.
Now we're at 27%.
You don't trust mainstream media when you're watching it.
And if you think about these guys, they got a teleprompter there.
Somebody's writing for them.
These comedians that are doing what they're doing.
The Kimmel's, the Fallon's.
Fallon's actually pretty talented, but you're watching all these guys.
They're reading the teleprompter.
When writers went on that strike, these guys couldn't do anything for four weeks and they came out with a podcast.
And you're watching, you know, mainstream media with MSNBC, with Fox, Murdoch on his way out, you don't know what his sons are going to do, Ted Turner.
At the end of his book, when he writes the book, you know, he claims how disappointed he is with what the product of CNN turned into.
If you've never watched or read the book Ted, highly recommend it.
And at the end there's an interview being done with him that this was not the product I produced.
CNN, the idea wasn't to be this.
Right.
So I saw a very... This is the guy who created the WCW with Eric Bischoff, so it must be really bad.
Yeah, he's disappointed in CNN.
I mean, he's had some misfires.
So that says a lot.
Oh, yeah, he did.
No doubt about it.
But he's a heavyweight in media the last 50 years and he revolutionized the game.
So even he's not happy with what's going on with CNN.
So I saw an opening and I said, OK.
I don't like bullies.
I don't like gamification.
I was a kid that was caught in between a mom and a dad.
Mom's side family, they were communists.
Dad's side family, they were imperialists.
They kept fighting every day.
They divorced twice in 20 years.
Each other, by the way.
They got married.
My sister's born.
They got divorced.
Family pressured for them to get remarried because in Middle Eastern, you know, culture, you don't get divorced.
So they got remarried.
Then I'm born.
Then they got divorced.
Okay?
Every night was a fight over two concepts.
Dad's side said poor people are lazy.
Mom's side, rich people are greedy.
Who's right?
I don't have a clue.
I love both of them.
So I'm going through this process to see, is mom right?
Are rich people truly greedy?
Is dad right?
Are poor people really lazy?
Maybe they're both right.
Maybe they're both wrong.
Let me kind of figure it out for myself.
And then today, from having been in business and watching people that, the more you did for this guy, The more he hated you later on, because you stopped doing for him, he was expecting you to do forever.
The less you did for this guy, and he independently, you gave him a little bit, he won, he was more grateful.
You had a better relationship with him.
So, that dynamic happened over and over and over again, and one time, I'll never forget, one of our guys in our company who was a socialist.
And he hated capitalism and all this stuff, but he wanted to sell insurance because he wanted to make more money.
Every time he would send me a book about the dark side of capitalism, the history of capitalism, slavery, all this stuff he would send me.
One day he got a $20,000 bonus.
And I called him up.
I said, hey man, I just want to congratulate you on your $20,000 bonus, but I got a great idea.
He says, what's that?
I said, did you do this by yourself or was this the help of you and your 50 guys?
He says, no, this is the help of me and my 50 guys.
I said, so here's what I wanted to do.
I'm sure you're going to be in on this one.
I'm thinking about taking this $20,000 that you earned, but you really didn't because it's you and the 50 guys, giving your 50 guys $400 a pop.
And telling him that because you're so noble, you want to give these guys the $400.
He says, that's not fair.
I said, wait, I'm sorry.
He says, that's not fair.
I said, you're right.
It's not fair because you earned it.
He says, I got you.
See, those moments as a... Did he have an Ebenezer Scrooge moment?
Did he turn from his ways?
He did.
He actually did.
He actually, I wouldn't say he's, but at least he came center.
So, business brought him from far left to left to center, where he's sitting there saying no.
There are people that are going to do more than others, and they earn the right to get paid more than others.
Yeah, it's one of those things, they always say it's beautiful in theory, until they actually meet that theory in practice.
And you cannot force someone to do work if they don't want to.
And of course they're probably helped.
Of course people deserve a living wage.
But I have found, in my experience, I was raised in Quebec, which is basically a socialist province.
For lack of a better word, it's like its own country.
A lot of people will tell you this.
Quebec in relation to the rest of Canada.
So I didn't really know many wealthy people at all.
You know, you'd be like, oh, look at that.
That's Mr. Hines.
He makes $100,000.
You know, it's like a big deal.
And in my experience, the most generous people who I've met in my life, and I know this isn't always the rule, have been people who've been very successful and very wealthy.
And some of the most selfish people that I've met and entitled have been poor people.
Where I did realize, just being around these folks, I was very fortunate, I realized, okay, it just amplifies character.
Money amplifies character.
And if you're a bad character, it'll amplify it.
So we, as Christians and as conservatives, are beholden to try and perform ethically.
Like I always say, with what I do, this is business, but it's not just business.
If it was just business, there would be ways to squeeze more money out.
We have to behave ethically, but I have met a lot of wealthy people who have been incredibly generous, where I probably wouldn't be here today if they didn't help.
You know, bring me on to consult early on with social media, you know, when I have a small YouTube channel.
And these weren't donors.
These were people who said, hey, I could use someone like you to help me kind of learn how to do these things and market.
But before we get to that, I think because we're getting into business, a lot of people don't realize, you know, they would think, You're someone who went to, you know, Stanford, or some expensive school of business, you know, Ivy League.
You're a guy, you were originally from Iran.
And English is, you learned English later, right?
Fifth, fifth language.
Your fifth language.
Right, so Armenian first, Assyrian second, that's my dad's, Aramaic.
Then Farsi third, I lived in Iran ten years.
Germany fourth, I lived in Germany for two years, a year and a half.
Then English fifth.
Right, so Aramaic.
So, was the Passion of the Christ anti-Semitic?
Because you know what they were saying.
Did it say the stuff they said that it said?
By the way, I could understand everything that we're saying in Passionate Christ, because you can understand what they're saying.
What are they just saying, like, watermelon, peas, and carrots, like, extra dialogue, and everyone's like, he's anti-Semitic!
Funny, the other day watching a video from Netanyahu from 2001 in a small group setting where he's talking about, don't worry about Americans, we can convince 80% and they're on our side if we want to do anything we want to do, and we're sitting there saying, is this really what he's saying?
We've got to kind of find out, because we're just reading the, you know, captions.
But yeah, no.
So, nine businesses, five languages.
Very quick way to humble brag, but I'll allow it.
And you were, then you were, obviously you moved to Germany, then the United States.
You were in the military for a period of time, then went into business.
But a big part, you know, when we were out at your, I guess, compound in Florida, you told me kind of your testimony, too, about becoming a Christian, that you were an atheist.
And it was almost George Foreman-esque, as far as your conversion.
It wasn't like, ah, I guess I'll be a Christian.
Tell me kind of what that's like, because I think a lot of people may not necessarily know that about you.
They know you're a Christian.
They know that you're more conservative in your values, but they may not know what that transition was like.
Yeah, so when you live in Iran, you have a hard time believing in God.
I would always get kicked out of Bible study.
My dad and mom would come in and say, why can't you just sit there?
I'm like, I don't believe this stuff.
I said, why is it?
Were your parents Christians?
They're Christians, both of them.
I said, why is it that if we're getting bombed in Iran, the parks I'm going to, that building we used to go to, the whistling sound, tabajo, tabajo, alamate kermes, attention, attention, the sign of red means that planes have crossed the border, and boom.
So all of these thoughts that stay with you Yeah, I don't believe in God.
We go to Germany, my parents get a divorce, I even get less, you know, desire to want to have any kind of closeness to God.
12 to 18, zero church, zero anything.
You couldn't get, I was a guy at church making fun of the pastor.
And I go to the army, I'm in boot camp.
And in boot camp and AIT, I had one to hire a PT score, so they gave me and a few other guys the opportunity to go spend time at this one camp for two days.
And this guy had the swing from trees into the lake and pool table.
I'm like, this is great to get away from all the stuff we're doing.
But with one caveat, every night we have to listen to him do Bible study.
And by the way, even then, that's 97, the military, 20, 26 years ago.
So I was sitting in the back and I would play with the billiard balls in the back.
I would just kind of do my thing and he's doing his thing.
And then at the end of it, he comes up to me and says, Hey son, my parents gave me this Bible as a gift in 1974, December 24th of 1974.
I'll never forget.
I have it till today.
He says, I think you need this more than I need this.
I said, I'm telling you, I'm the wrong guy to give this to.
It's a waste.
This is your parents.
It's a gift.
He says, son, I've been watching you.
I've been listening to you.
You need this.
Just take it for me.
Trust me.
So I finally take it.
I leave.
Why is this guy giving it to me?
I don't read the Bible.
But I sit there and started praying three times a day.
My prayer started like this, God, I don't believe in you.
I think it's fake.
I think it's for weak people.
But if you're out there, great.
I want to know something.
But if not, I'm talking anyways.
Here's what's on my mind today.
And I would kind of do my thing.
Fast forward with that, I get out of the army and I'm the one that's going around and, you know, get involved in world financial.
The people I was working with, they were Mormons.
And Scientologists.
So Scientologists are trying to get me to become a Scientologist, and I'm going to their facility in Hollywood, and in Mormons, I'm reading all this stuff about Gordon B. Hinckley, the virtues, all this stuff.
There was actually great things, and I watched Mormons, how united they were.
One day, I'm in the office, this girl comes in, she says, I just watched the greatest movie of all time, this is probably gonna win an Oscar.
I'm like, no shit, yeah.
What's the movie's name?
Napoleon Dynamite.
I said, no point.
Dynamite?
Yeah.
Well, I do think it got like MTV Movie Awards.
I went and watched the movie the entire time.
I am annoyed.
Really?
Because she told me this is going to win an Oscar.
I come back.
I said, this was one of the worst movies I've ever seen in my life.
What was this all about?
And eventually one of the guys that wasn't a Mormon says, the actor is a Mormon, so they support each other.
I'm like, okay.
I respect that.
I didn't despise, but I can understand if you went in, you were expecting the prestige, whereas there's going to be some big moment.
Yeah.
So that's the worst.
So anyways, but then I respected the fact that Mormons were united.
And then, so at this point, I'm like, you know what, whatever.
I start going on a journey.
And I started going to everything I can.
I knew Muslim because I grew up in Iran, so I understood Hezbollah, Muslim, their beliefs, Prophet Muhammad.
I've gone through that route.
I started looking at Scientology, L. Ron Hubbard, Dianetics, you know, what he believes in, what their ideas are.
I started looking at... Did you test your SEDIN levels?
I went through a lot of it.
By the way, ASIST and all these things you got to do, very interesting.
It reminded me of a Freemason model, like you can go up and move up and all this stuff, plus a few other ancillary stuff.
Yeah.
Anyways, and then eventually I became a Christian at 25 years old.
January 21st or some date like that in 2004, I become a Christian.
I go to this church of Shepherd of the Hills.
27 churches I went to.
One church I went to was called the Los Angeles Church of Christ.
This guy sits me down, a guy named Edward, never forget.
I'm sitting there with my girlfriend who's an actress in Hollywood and beautiful girl and he says, so when's the last time you guys had sex?
I said, right before this meeting, he says, you can't come to church if you're not going to commit to, you have to drop sex.
I said, brother, we're good.
Yeah.
Are we good?
And I walked away.
Did he shake your hand or did he ask you to wash your hands?
Well, I mean, he shook my hand, whether he believed what I did with my hand, that's up to him.
That's his risk, not my risk.
Exactly.
All right.
So I walked away, and I'm like, nah, not going to happen.
Anyways, this girl and I, who we're about to get married, I love her, I want to marry her.
Is this the same one you were sleeping with?
Same girl, absolutely.
And I say, listen, I want to test something with you and I. Because if we're going to get married, I want to know if this is more than sex.
She says, okay, what do you want to do?
I said, I want to go one month no sex.
She says, you're serious?
I said, yeah.
She says, do you have someone else on your life?
I said, no.
I just want to know what we're going to do on a Friday night when we're in the Expedition without having sex.
And she says, you sure about this?
I said, yes.
Great.
First night, Friday, we're going out.
By the way, you kind of undersell that.
Like, it makes it easier to say, yeah, one month, no sex in the Expedition.
You weren't necessarily romancing the situation.
Listen, when you're broke, Expedition is a bedroom.
That's true.
It is, yes.
It's a full three-seater.
Best part is when the police puts the lights on you.
It's like, stop, get out of here.
And the steam is like, oh, we're out of here.
Thank you so much, officer.
Appreciate you for not giving us a weird ticket.
Every time you hear a siren, you get flushed.
That's bad conditioning, but okay.
So anyway, so she thinks I'm weird.
We go to church.
She's uncomfortable, and then Billy Graham comes to Pasadena, and he gives a talk in November of 2003.
I go to every single one of his services.
This is after her, except for Saturday.
I missed the service.
I went to three of them, not on the one on Saturday, because I had training.
So we go for a month.
Doesn't happen.
Afterwards, I say, it's not going to work out.
She found another guy.
We had a bad breakup, but we're civil.
We're good, we move on.
And I'm like, you know what?
I don't know what I'm doing here.
So eventually I get baptized, I become a Christian, and then I start doing Bible study Friday nights at Pasnas, Pasadena, from 6 p.m.
to 2 in the morning.
Every other Friday night, we're doing Bible study.
From 6 to 2 a.m.
And we're talking on philosophy, debate, all this stuff.
Eventually, the crazy thing, most people won't even believe this if I say this, I was the guy in Old Pasadena in front of nightclubs at 1 o'clock in the morning holding a John 3, 16 sign at 25 years old.
That was me.
So I just got on fire.
I went 17 months.
I said, I'm not touching any sex, nothing.
That was my thing because I was in Vegas all the time.
I was a very good guy to party with.
Six days a week, I was that guy.
So eventually, I changed my habits.
And that's very typical of Iranians if they're not Muslim.
It's like either they're Muslim or they just love to party.
And like, when I went to your house, I was not surprised at the amount of marble.
But that was it.
And then eventually, one of the nights that maybe it's the story you want to know is my girl and I were at Universal Studios City Walk.
She'll remember this vividly.
We're in the car.
We're having a big fight.
I don't have any money.
I feel like shit.
I'm like, dude, I can't have $49,000 and I can't even afford to pay nine bucks for movies for this girl.
I felt like I was just, I was not a man at that.
My dad would always say, when men don't have money, They're not good for society, so you have to be able to contribute to have your manliness.
We're in the car, we get into a big fight, and then we break it off, and she leaves.
I'm in the car, expedition, this is 1.30 in the morning at this point, we finished the movie, and I say, God, I haven't spoken to my mom for five years, but if you exist, I would love to talk to my mom.
30 seconds later, my next tell, I get a call from a block number.
Brother, this is like a, I've told this story, it's a very weird moment of my, scariest moment for me.
I don't want to answer the phone, and it's one of those flip phones, and I flip it, and it's my mom crying.
I said, why are you crying?
She says, I got the feeling you were in pain.
How'd you get this number?
She says, you know, I just got it six months ago.
I said, but do you know what I'm going through right now?
What are you going through?
I said, no, nothing.
But I don't know how to talk to her.
I hang up the phone.
I sat in that car that night, top of the hills, chills all over my body.
I'm like, oh my God.
Either this is ironic or this is real, but the level of coincidence is a little too real.
I could have chosen to say it's ironic.
I chose to believe it was God and He has my back and He's had my back from day one.
That level of confidence I got from that moment that somebody was watching me and had my back is the reason Why I am where I'm at today.
I make my decisions purely knowing he has my back.
And if you ask me what's one of my biggest fears?
One of my biggest fears in my life is losing his favor.
I can't tell you how much that scares the hell out of me.
Because to me, in life, when you get a person that has your back, And they have your back like you've seen endless times they've had your back.
You take that for granted and you lose it?
You're a fool.
So you've had my back?
You've given me this life?
The four kids, my wife, my dad now living with me, my biggest fear at the time when I was not a Christian was my kids never meeting my dad because I never met his dad, my grandpa.
They are best friends with him now.
They love him.
My son plays violin with him.
My two-year-old daughter's best friend is my dad, where they're together all the time, and now she goes to school.
She was going five days.
We took her out two days, so she can be around my dad all the time.
And my nanny, who's been such an amazing woman in our lives for 14 years, her mom is 85 years old.
She was worried about her mom, so she wanted to retire and go to Mexico.
I said, bring your mom with us.
She lives with us.
We got her a nice place in the house.
And, man, I'm the luckiest man alive, but because I have that favor.
So imagine you have that kind of an untouchable favor.
Do you want to compromise that favor?
So it's such a, it's a unique... That's your biggest fear.
Oh, I can't even describe it to you.
Mine's bull sharks.
Yeah, yours is?
Bull sharks.
I respect it.
They can swim in fresh water.
I respect it.
No, I actually, very similar fear.
But you had the expedition detailed, right, after all that?
Not all the time.
Not all the time.
All right.
Mine is, not necessarily losing favor, but I do understand that, you know, I do have, one thing I'm very fortunate, I can certainly relate with that, you know, you've met Johnny Boy and Gerald.
These are, you know, I've been friends with Johnny Boy since I was 12 years old, and I make sure to never take that for granted.
And Gerald now for 16, 17 years.
I have lifelong friends, but certainly standing, you know, before the throne of God, And at some point he's going to list your talents, right?
We've all read the parable of the talents.
I know it's a different term, talent, but that's the word that's used.
And him showing a list of what I could have done with it.
that I was expected to do with it and I didn't and throw it away. And that's what keeps me
doing it. Look, I don't run nine companies, but there were years I was working 80 hours
for years. And I just thought, I never want to throw it away. Once there was momentum, I thought,
well, it is my duty to do as much with this as I can. This is a very hard business as well.
Yeah.
But I understand that.
You do if you believe that there's accountability, too.
And some of it comes from fear.
Some of it comes from love.
But I'm going to say this as well.
To me, a part of it is not perfection.
To me, it's like I don't set the standard of myself of walking on water and having that.
I'm not that guy.
No.
Because, you know, when I got married, At the end of the wedding, we're in Glendale, California, and I get up and I give, we've got 500 people at the wedding, and I said, hey guys, on one side is all the green-eyed, blue-eyed people, on the other side is all the hairy people, because it's Middle Easterners and Caucasians, because my wife is from Texas.
So, and by the way, one of the best jokes one of my friends told me, one of my groomsmen who was so hammered, he was so hammered it's not even funny.
He gets up, he says, so look, I can tell none of you guys want to dance because you're concerned whether this marriage is going to work out or not.
I am also concerned.
Because he's from Iran and she's from Texas.
Why would this marriage work?
He says, but I finally figured out they have a very good chance of this thing working out.
It's because of two things.
She's Texas, he's Iran.
They have two things in common.
They both love weapons of mass destruction and oil.
This is a perfect marriage.
Everyone laughs, gets up, they start dancing.
But I said something.
I said, listen, two things I want you to know, and I'm talking to my family and friends.
If you ask my wife one time if she's pregnant or not, you will never see us again.
Don't put the pressure on my wife being pregnant or not and saying, does your body work?
Does his body work?
It's none of your business, so don't ask.
Number two, I don't know how long we're gonna be married.
But I believe we can be married at least one year.
And we're going to take it one year at a time.
That's it.
I don't have the pressure of, no matter what, because what if she all of a sudden changes?
Right.
What if all of a sudden life changes?
That pressure, by the way, this is controversial.
Every time I say this in my Christian community, how could you say that?
Didn't you?
Your vows and all this other stuff.
Yeah, they're missing the point.
No, no.
To me, the point is the outside pressure that people want to impose on you to live this
perfect life, that a, you know, perfect, what do you call it, what is that thing, that microscope
that just kind of watching every single move you make, I'm not living for you, man.
I'm living for God.
I'm living for my family.
I'm living for the vision.
I'm living for what's been put on my heart.
At the same time, if we can find people that are good running mates, even go at it.
One thing in a book that we talk about, you said, you know, Gerald, and you said John, Johnny boy.
So one of the things we talk about in the book, because as a person who runs a company and you run a business, you eventually want to have a circle of people you trust.
So one day, one of my guys that wants to be in that inner circle, I'm picking them up from jail.
It's 4am in the morning.
I'm in a parking lot, maybe not the best community, best neighborhood parked outside.
Okay.
I go in a suit.
They think I'm his lawyer.
I'm not his lawyer.
This guy's been in my life for 14 years.
I've known him since he was 18 years old.
He comes out.
I get him out of jail.
He's sitting in the car.
We're driving.
I have nothing to tell him.
He says, how come you're not telling me anything?
I said, brother, I have nothing to tell you.
He says, Pat, I need to hear something.
I said, nothing.
If you haven't heard anything I've told you, what do you think you're going to listen to me now?
He says, I'm telling you, I need to hear something from you.
I said, I'll tell you two things.
One, you lack gratitude.
Two, you lack perspective.
You're not grateful for the people God's put in your life, and you lack perspective to realize you can change.
I can't do that for you, but one thing I can tell you.
There's zero chance you can be in my life if you drink liquor moving forward.
You can't.
You can't be in the inner circle.
You can be in my life.
You can be somebody that's doing this, but you want to be here?
It's not going to happen.
So, in the book, I mapped out six things you've got to look at and then scored the people in your life.
To be your running mates because anyone that ever did anything big look at Musk if you look at Musk would who he
trusts Why does he always lean on David Sachs?
That's one of the guys he trusts if you look at any athlete any coach any businessman any pastor any content creator
There's people behind closed doors that you can go to to say
What do you think and you can pitch put your feet up the documentary about Tiger Woods?
one of the best things about Tiger Woods documentary was when they said how Michael Jordan said how Tiger and and
him started hanging out together and He says Tiger would come and it would be relaxed with me.
Why because goats understand goats. Mm-hmm I understand the pressures of being a goat. He's saying
that yeah, Michael He doesn't say goat, but he says I understand the pressure
comes with being who he is But you need people around you that you can relax with that
You know if you want to do something big specifically you need to choose your running mates
So as you get bigger, choosing running mates becomes a very important thing.
And obviously if you're explaining about Gerald and Johnny Boyd, you need guys like that.
Yeah.
No, it's definitely pivotal.
Especially in an industry like this.
Look, we also live in a world where loyalty doesn't mean a whole lot.
And the thing is, I think sometimes people get it wrong when they talk about loyalty.
That doesn't mean yes, man.
Someone explained it to me this way.
She's a clinical psychologist.
She said, yeah, men or women attempting to do great things.
Didn't use the term goats.
They don't need yes men, but they need corner men.
So they need someone, you know, these guys are out there, they're taking the blows, they're in the fight, they go back into the corner, and if you're winning, if you're doing well, you need a pep talk, great, keep doing what you're doing, maybe some advice, some improvements.
If you're not, they need to put the ice on the swelling on the eye, put some Vaseline in the cut, try and get you back out there.
Because not everyone can be out there actually taking the blows.
Not everyone, there's one prize fighter, but it takes a whole team.
And a yes man is useless, and we saw that, for example, that's what happened with Mike Tyson, perfect example, with Buster Douglas that night.
They forgot to bring the Enswell.
I don't know if you know that story.
They had a surgical glove, and they were putting ice in it, and trying to put it on his eye.
They didn't bring a basic Enswell, you know, the steel that you haven't bought yet.
They didn't bring it because at that point he just had an entourage of yes-men.
Customato, you know, wasn't around anymore.
These people kind of got their hooks in, and it was the most embarrassing corner job.
They spilled ice everywhere.
And when she said that, it clicked.
Because even, by the way, if you're the prize fighter in your company, you know, at some point you're going to be older, and you're going to be the corner man for your son.
You know, we all transition in those positions.
And it made a lot of sense because I think sometimes people think loyalty or someone
who values loyalty wants a yes man.
And they don't.
They need a corner man.
Everyone, sometimes, you know, look, you run nine companies.
I'm willing to bet, outside of the people who you discuss, like who you trust, who you
know really closely, you probably don't get a lot of pats in the back.
You have to give pats on the back, right?
You have to do that as a leader of your company because those people have to feel appreciated.
I'm willing to bet you don't get that as much.
So you need some people around you who kind of give you that feedback so that at least you know what you're doing is either correct or it's not and some, you know, you're not shooting the dart.
There's also part of it where, you know, I'm talking to Brad Lee the other day.
Brad Lee's a good content creator, very good content creator out of Vegas.
And I'm talking to him that as you're moving up, you have to be very careful to filter out flattery.
Right.
Because flattery is actually a terrible thing.
You know, the whole concept with Marcus Aurelius who's sitting there having a slave ride behind him telling him, you know, you're not as important as you think you are.
You're not as important as you think you are.
You need people like that in your life.
But no, I agree.
I agree the people to process with, the insurance company, You've read Meditations, I'm sure.
Marcus Aurelius is fascinating to me, too.
To me, Stoicism is almost practiced Christianity in the absence of grace.
It's about doing the right thing, not for earthly riches, but for doing the right thing's sake.
But at the end of the day, you do it and you die.
And we obviously believe in eternal salvation, and there's a purpose as to why you're also doing the right thing, why you're following that prescription.
But Marcus Aurelius was certainly, by all accounts, a good man, and then became addicted to opiates.
He didn't know.
You know, he said you mustn't consume strong drink.
Like, he really believed in being disciplined.
But that's bad advice.
Someone going, here's a tincture.
It'll make you feel better.
And you read his later writings and see this is a guy who didn't know he became addicted to painkillers.
So great people actively doing good things can still make mistakes.
He's one of my most, to me, fascinating figures in history and a wonderful study.
Yeah, so that takes it to a whole different angle as well.
Almost anybody that does anything very big that we admire, they're complicated people.
They're not simple, boom, in a box.
They're not like that.
They're complicated people.
It takes a complicated person to tolerate the amount of pain and responsibility that comes with it.
The credit you're probably going to get is going to happen when you die, not when you're alive.
Are you okay with that?
Can you imagine like, hey, the biggest credit you're ever going to get is when you die.
And what kind of recognition is that?
Well, that's the best kind of recognition.
You want to do that?
Well, no, I want the credit now.
Doesn't work that way.
Those guys, you know, comes afterwards.
Criticism when you're alive, credit after you die.
Do you think that's why you're able to also get these interviews with these very high profile people because you're empathetic to that?
You're empathetic to people trying to do something big?
Absolutely.
Look, in our insurance company, I'll never forget one thing that happened.
In 2013, one of our guys did something, and he was the face of the company, and he went through an ugly divorce.
Very ugly.
We're in Tuscany, Italy.
And in Tuscany, Italy, moments happens where wife comes out, she hears news, she's crying, this is an incentive trip, and I'm like, you gotta be kidding me.
Here, all this money we spent, this is gonna, oh my God.
So I said, okay, maybe there's a reason why this is happening.
When that happened, people behind closed, I can't believe he's going through this.
I can't believe he's going through that.
I can't believe he's going through this.
And I told everybody, I said, guys, here's all I'll tell you, okay?
Be very careful.
Very careful judging with somebody else's personal life that you don't have all the intel to.
Be very, very careful.
Because when it comes back and happens to you, trust me, you're going to want grace.
No, you don't know da-da-da.
Just be careful.
Boom.
Two years later, it happened to other people in different ways.
And then I sat down with a couple of those guys and said, now you see what I was talking to you about?
By the way, they're still all around the company.
We have an incredible relationship.
They're doing very well for themselves.
My parents, my upbringing, my own flaws, my own big fall in my early 20s, massive fall, and I'm a 21-year-old guy giving speeches on yachts for a billionaire named McNulty who has a $65 million house, and I'm the guy that's giving this, and I'm making money, and I'm like the superstar coming up, you know, poster child type of a guy, and then all of a sudden, boom!
Crash, crash, crash, crash.
And I'm like, dude, I'm going back in the Army.
I was about to join back in the Army in just 20 years.
I would have retired three years ago, four years ago.
Got my benefits.
I was in the Army 20 and a half years.
101st Airborne.
I love the Army.
Great.
Go back and do that.
You'll be a SAR Major.
Worst case, First Sergeant.
You're going to have a good life.
You'll go to DLI.
You'll go to all these other things.
You know, you speak these languages.
You can go to Special Forces, 18 Delta, all these things.
And I know.
And I had grace.
I stuck around that one.
So then later on in my life, yeah, I think interviewing people that will come with me and they'll feel safe talking to us.
What am I judging you for, man?
No one's perfect.
We all have our own issues.
Let's just talk.
We could have a discourse and ideas.
Like Cuomo and I are friends right now.
I can't believe, you know, if you would have told me this, like Chris Cuomo and I are having talks and laughing.
I'm in Sag Harbor having lunch with him.
Then I go to his house with his boys.
They take us to the airport.
Sitting there, he's FaceTiming me with Robert Downey Jr.
saying, hey, I watched the podcast.
I'm like, Robert?
I say, hey, Dylan Tico, come here.
Take a look at who this is.
Oh my God, Iron Man is alive!
He's not dead, because their reaction is different.
I'm like, oh my God, they're getting emotional.
Because kids don't know anything.
When these guys watched him die, they were actually emotional.
So I said, no, guys.
We might need to circle back.
That might be bad parenting.
Santa Claus is alive and they're 24 years old.
He's real.
And he's not Tim Allen?
We're pretty soon going to have to go to Mug Club here.
Did you always mean to go, when you were in the Army, was it always part of the plan to go into business?
Was that your plan?
No, not at all.
I wanted to be a bodybuilder.
My plan was to be Arnold.
The old Arnold, not the new Arnold.
My plan was to be Arnold.
My plan was to go- No one wants to be 75 Arnold!
No, not the old Arnold.
What I mean by that is screw your freedom, that's not the Arnold I admire.
I admire the Arnold that came here, won Mr. Olympia, became a star, married a Kennedy, became a governor.
That guy may have one of the greatest American dream stories of all time, minus The comments you made about screw your freedom.
I wanted to be that guy.
Also screwing Minster out of the 81 Olympia, I believe.
But that's a conversation for a whole other day.
That's a different conversation.
It's an interesting one.
He probably doesn't like that, but that's a different conversation.
But Weider was on his side.
Weider loved him, you know, so he had to do it.
I mean, there's a lot of politics in bodybuilding.
So you wanted to be a bodybuilder.
How do you go from that to, OK, nine businesses?
I mean, because at some point something must have clicked.
Did you just realize, I'm good at this?
Well, no, I'm good at sales.
I'm a good sale.
I was selling when I was in Germany, you know, Super Nintendo comes out, and I can't afford to buy the Super Mario Bros.
2, and I have to find a way to make money.
I go to a local swimming pool in Erlangen with my girlfriend, Katarina Staff, and we go and we say, hey, what can I do to make some money here?
She said, well, you know, can you collect this beer bottle?
Because Germans are famous for drinking.
So I started collecting beer bottles.
That's not the only thing they're famous for, historically.
That's right.
Forgive me.
There's a lot of things they're famous for.
And they're also tough to sell.
They're very skeptical people.
Yes, they are.
Yes, we've heard this.
Okay, you know.
You're not going to fool me.
They're the worst crowds for comedy, too.
Like, mm-hmm, right.
We get to laugh.
If you can make them laugh, you're good.
That's a good point.
But no, I would say, you know, that's the first time I've made money on my own.
I'm like, okay, if I can make this kind of money at 11 years old and go to Kaufhauf and buy Super Mario Bros.
and be the only kid that's got that at a refugee camp, and I'm the coolest kid here because of it, frickin' awesome.
I can make money.
So, that's kind of... Coolest kid in a refugee camp?
That's so sad!
Listen, when you have a Super Nintendo... I'm just picturing all the other refugees like, oh, he's in Patrick Kuhl!
He has Yoshi's Island!
I don't know, they could be white.
No, they were from Yugoslavia, Albania, Czech, Polish, Afghanistan, everywhere.
So you found that out, but then you went in the army after that, so it was in the back of your mind.
So then I meet a girl named Jean Vier who's working at Morgan Stanley Dean where we start dating.
I'm a numbers guy, I love numbers, so I'm like, wait a minute, how can I work at Morgan Stanley Dean?
would say, well, you need a degree and all this stuff.
I'm not going to school.
I'm not going to get a college degree.
I said, I'm going to find a way to get a job there.
Back then when you would fax, I faxed my resume to 100 different places, Goldman, Merrill,
Smith Barney, Morgan, every one of them.
And I put a joke on my cover letter and at the bottom of it, I said, if you like me,
this is exactly how my clients are going to feel doing business with me.
They're going to love me.
If you want somebody like this part of your team, give me a call.
I got 30 calls.
15 of them said it was a very unique approach, but your resume sucks.
Häagen-Dazs, Bally's is not enough for them.
That's my resume.
It's Häagen-Dazs, Bally's, Bob's Big Boy, and Military.
That's all I had.
I couldn't brag about anything else.
But fifteen others asked me for an interview.
Three offered me a job.
Dave Kirby.
From the Glendale branch, gave me a job to be a financial advisor, changed my life, I started a day before 9-11, 9-10, got my Series 7, 66-31, 26 life and health, and boom, the rest is history.
This is Dean Witter?
Dean Witter, yeah, Morgan Stanley Dean Witter.
That's what happened with my dad.
My dad didn't finish school, he was playing hockey.
Sales, numbers and people.
Three things I like.
Stop chasing a hockey puck around, you know.
But he wasn't really into it.
He just happened to be good at it.
And he ended up working at Dean Witter, then EF Hutton, you know, both riddled with scandal.
Or really EF Hutton towards the end of it.
But he just kind of – he was good at sale.
He charmed his way in.
And that is something that they value.
It used to be very performance-based.
But all right, I want to – so that makes sense.
You had a natural inclination for it.
And then you kind of took – Sales, numbers, and people.
Three things I like.
Sales, numbers, and people.
So your book goes, Choose Your Enemies Wisely.
We have it right there.
Yep.
Business Planning for the Audacious Few.
Before we go to Mug Club, why the book centered around... I know you can pre-order it at Amazon.
It's available December 5th though, right?
December 5th, yes.
Why center the book around choosing your enemies wisely?
So, I'll tell you this.
45,000 agents, you do a lot of business plans.
And you watch who makes it and who doesn't make it, okay?
And you'll watch a guy that comes in, one guy came in from Northrop, you know, master's degree, everything proper, looked so good, but I could never get him to go and nothing got him, you know, to go compete at the highest level.
But logically, on paper, everything made sense.
And then I would recruit guys that emotionally, they really wanted to win bad, but logically they had nothing, no substance, okay?
So then I realized, you know, when I'm doing business planning, at first I would only do, don't you want a dream?
Don't you want this and that?
But no plan.
And then I flipped.
I'm like, here's the plan on what you got to do first quarter, and second quarter, and third quarter, and all this other stuff.
And then I realized you needed both.
So eventually it was two blocks, then six blocks, then eight blocks.
It was 12 building blocks to do the proper business planning.
But the biggest factor, biggest factor was the following.
I noticed any of the guys that ever did anything really, really big, and I said this to Tom Brady when I was talking to him at the vault two months ago.
One, they've experienced unconditional love from one person.
From one person at least.
This is a person that no matter what you do wrong, this person's okay with loving you.
Mom, I'm in jail.
You're bailing me out.
But I love you.
I can't believe you're here.
Wait a minute.
I screwed up.
This is my fault.
I'm making your life hell and you still love me like this?
Damn, this is awesome.
This exists, unconditional love.
Number two is a person you loved that you really, really wanted to win over that betrayed
you and backstabbed you.
Because no matter what you do, no matter how much money you make, you'll never win them
over.
No matter how many six-packs, how many houses you buy, how many cars you have, how many
subscribers you have, you're never going to get there saying, hey, good job.
of saying, hey, good job, you're just not gonna get it from him.
You're just not going to get it from them.
So hardcore pain.
So hardcore pain.
But a lot of people have those two.
But a lot of people have those two.
Then you need the last one.
Then you need the last one.
And the last one to me is choosing your enemies wisely.
And the last one to me is choosing your enemies wisely.
Brady, he had his own enemies over his career.
Brady, he had his own enemies over his career.
Jordan has had his own enemies.
Musk has a very unique enemy that's been driving him for 40 years, not just 10 years.
Because some enemies drives you for six months, some it's a month, some it's 30 seconds.
They cut you off, you want to get back at them.
But if you're able to choose the right enemy, it brings out a side of you that's getting
you to tolerate pain in ways others are not willing to tolerate that'll help you compete
at the highest level.
So once I saw this format and I saw which people were the ones that were winning at
the highest level and which ones weren't, the ones that typically won had the first,
the second, and they chose their enemies wisely.
And we put the business plan structure for them, and they were on fire.
So you're almost more so picking like, do you mean like friendly competition or do you mean like animus?
No, not competition.
As you study and everybody else, you do spreadsheet.
Here's 20 channels that are my industry.
You know, Cenk has 4 million subscribers.
I'm at 50,000.
My name is Steven Crowder.
This person's got 2 million.
That person's got a million.
I'm going to kill everybody, right?
That's competition.
Enemy is somebody said something to you.
Like, you know, sometimes we write affirmations of good things about us.
Sometimes the most powerful affirmation is, I'm with Dana White two days ago in Vegas.
I'm in his place.
And it's crazy.
I want to read this from the book.
I tell him, Dana, I got a book coming out at the end of the meeting.
He says, what's the book called?
I said, Choose Your Enemies Wisely.
He starts laughing.
I said, why are you laughing?
He says, look behind me.
We're in his office in Vegas.
A 30 minute meeting turns into two hours.
He says, look at the wall.
I said, I can't see the wall.
He's got this weird picture and he's got to explain it to you what it is.
It's great.
He says, look at the wall.
I come around to look at the wall.
It's a quote.
He says, may God have mercy on my enemies because I won't.
General Patton.
Then he says that and I said, you know, you're quoted in the book.
He says, I'm quoted in the book.
I said, yeah.
He says, what have you quoted me in the book?
He says, when you said, **** bet against me.
Tell me it's not going to happen.
Tell me it's going to fail.
I love it.
I love every minute of it, right?
This idea of Dana taking UFC, he's given the middle finger to boxing, to people that wanted to shut it down with COVID.
That drive that he keeps going and going and going, it's a very unique thing.
I'll read this beginning of the book that'll kind of explain this whole concept.
It says, you have no enemies, you say.
My friend, the boast is poor.
He who has mingled in the fray of duty that the brave endure must have made foes.
If you have none, small is the work that you have done.
You've had no traitor on the hip.
You've dashed no cup from perjured lip.
You've never turned the wrong to right.
You've been a coward in the fight.
Charles McKay.
Okay, to me, Brother, when I read that, oh, if I tell you stories of moments where somebody drove me to go to levels that got the best out of me, sometimes the best... I think we're going to have to go in my office after.
You'll see some plaques that I have in there.
But the point with that is, writing on a piece of paper, not positive, things people said to you, and you just read it.
And you start realizing, wait a minute, this emotion I'm getting, I'm willing to take the rejection.
I'm willing to take this, you know, late night, I got to get my degree for whatever you're working.
I'm willing to go through the six hours after the kids are asleep to take that course online to get my real estate license.
I'm willing to pay the price because I'm going to go out there and do something big, prove the people that believed in me right, and prove the people that doubted me wrong, and then eventually, my dreams are going to become a reality.
Yeah.
Yeah, it is important.
I used to pick my enemies poorly.
I'd just be like, look at this dipshit with a tiny umbrella.
And then I'd usually hit a puddle.
But that was petty.
And now I know to pick them wisely.
Because I pre-ordered the book.
So, all right.
It is Choose Your Enemies Wisely, Business Planning for the Audacious Few.
You can pre-order it at Amazon.
You can go to the website.
I'm sure you can follow Patrick Bet-David anywhere he does his show.
I mean, you're obviously not just on YouTube, but I would imagine Spotify, Apple, all these places.
And we're going to continue right now on Rumble.
Hey, an enemy that I've picked.
Thank you, Rumble.
We're going to Mug Club YouTube.
Piss off.
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